Modern Love Podcast: "I Tried to Toughen Up My Son. He Had Other Ideas."
Host: Anna Martin
Guest: Sam Graham-Felson
Date: January 21, 2026
Episode Overview
This episode reconnects host Anna Martin with writer Sam Graham-Felson, exploring the challenges and lessons in his attempts to "toughen up" his sensitive, imaginative eight-year-old son. The discussion centers around a cross-country road trip to the Badlands, initially conceived as a journey to build resilience but ultimately revealing deeper truths about individuality, masculinity, and the complex nature of self-confidence. Interwoven throughout are poignant reflections on parenting, vulnerability, and finding new models of strength.
Key Discussion Points & Insights
1. The Motive Behind “Toughness”
- Sam’s Reflections on Childhood: Sam’s motivation to toughen up his son comes from recognizing himself in his boy—“sensitive,” “passionate,” and “nerdy”—echoing Sam’s own struggles with fitting in and feeling excluded due to a lack of interest in sports. (03:42)
- Sports & Social Hierarchies: Sam connects boyhood “toughness” to being good at sports, recalling, “If you're not good at sports, it's kind of a wrap...you're not gonna be cool, you're not gonna make friends.” (04:22)
- Fears of Exclusion and Bullying: His desire isn’t for his son to achieve athletic prowess but to shield him from the pain of bullying and exclusion. He observes, “You have to have a solid sense of confidence. If someone tries to push me around, I'm going to stand up for myself and be like, ‘Yeah, I'm different, and fuck off.’” (05:44)
2. Martials Arts and the Limits of "Toughening Up"
- Karate Classes Gone Wrong: Sam enrolls his son in karate, hoping it will foster resilience, but his son resists sparring and is uncomfortable with both hitting and being hit. “He was afraid of getting hit, but he was also afraid of hitting…It was even worse than playing basketball.” (07:15)
- Violence vs. Resilience: The episode delves into the fine line between teaching self-defense and encouraging aggression. “Can you instill a sense of resilience and toughness and self-confidence…and be against violence?” Sam wonders aloud. (09:00)
3. The Long Shadow of Childhood Experience
- Sam’s Own Struggles: Vivid recollections of his own youth—freezing during a playground confrontation, letting down friends, internalizing shame—surface. “There was this phrase in Teddy Roosevelt’s autobiography...‘I felt like a predestined victim.’ And I just…really related to that.” (13:57)
- Self-Perception and Masculinity: Sam draws direct lines from his physical fears to wider issues of self-confidence, social comfort, and academic performance:
- “If I'm physically afraid to fight, maybe I'm physically afraid to dance. Maybe I'm physically afraid to kiss, too.” (15:05)
- He's haunted by feeling “like a loser, basically, or like a victim. I'm a coward...on the streets, in the schoolyard, on the basketball court, I was not going to rise up and protect myself.” (17:00)
4. The Badlands Road Trip: Aspirations and Reality
- Nature, Teddy Roosevelt, and Strenuous Life: Inspired by his son’s obsession with national parks, Sam plans a father-son trip to Teddy Roosevelt National Park—a site representing toughness, masculinity, and a “strenuous life." (21:56–25:30)
- Fantasy vs. Child’s Reality: While Sam dreams of pushing his son to endure long hikes and embrace discomfort (“let's live the strenuous life”), his son is resistant at first—scared, hungry, and hesitant. (26:29)
- Unexpected Bravery: Surprisingly, after reading about Roosevelt’s transformation from fearful child to rugged man, Sam’s son insists on bolder climbs and leading the way off-trail. “He insisted on being in the front, he wanted to be the trailblazer.” (28:59)
- Pride and Fear Intertwined: When Sam is injured, his son—usually squeamish about blood—calmly reassures him, reinforcing that growth comes in unexpected forms. “He was just like, ‘You're good. You're okay, you're gonna be fine.’” (31:03)
5. The Gray Areas of Role Models
- Learning the Dark Side of Heroes: The trip sparks difficult conversations about Native American genocide and the problematic aspects of Teddy Roosevelt’s legacy.
- “My son…starting to realize…that the thing he loves more than anything else has this kind of problematic flip side.” (34:43)
- “Dad, was Teddy Roosevelt a bad guy or a good guy?” his son asks. (37:48)
- A New Hero Emerges—Pee Wee Herman: Seeking comic relief, Sam introduces his son to “Pee Wee’s Big Adventure.” The child is captivated by Pee Wee’s playful, non-traditional masculinity—“a really wimpy guy…he kind of gets by on his wits…not by punching people in the face, but by giving people…trick gum.” (38:00)
6. The Power—and Perils—of Being Different
- Pee Wee vs. the Real World: Sam admires his son’s new hero but worries about real-world consequences of such pronounced individuality. “Wouldn't that be amazing if my son could be a total idiosyncratic weirdo and proud of it…But, in the real world, wouldn't Pee Wee get his ass beat?” (42:41)
- Balancing Authenticity with Safety: Anna notes, “You're watching him become obsessed…you're telling me…you think it's wonderful. And you also are like, this is not the real world.” (45:03)
7. The Role Play Experiment: How to Handle Bullies
- Sam’s Attempt at Preparation: Concerned about future bullying, Sam “role-plays” as a bully, encouraging his son to stand up for himself. The exercise feels wrong—too harsh, unproductive—until his son subverts expectations. (48:52)
- Trick Gum as a Third Way:
- "He goes, 'Well, I'm glad you feel that way. I'd rather be friends with you than fight you. Can I offer you a piece of gum?' And so he...hands me a pretend piece of gum…I have news for you: it’s trick gum!" (51:42)
- Anna: “I'm very moved by the trick gum—because...what did you see him doing there?”
- Sam: “He was saying, like, you're way bigger than me…I'm not going to be able to beat you with brawn...I'm going to use my wits to beat you…he was actually offering a third way.” (53:15)
- “What I want for my son…and all the people I love is just to walk around with a sense of freedom, that you can be yourself. That's the quality that I care about.” (55:53)
Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments
-
On the roots of his worry
"My fear of violence in that moment led to me doing the wrong thing for my friend...I abandoned my friend because I was afraid of violence."
— Sam Graham-Felson (13:39) -
On what really matters to him
"The last thing I want to do is have a normie as a son. Right? ...I love the fact that he's different. And he even says to me...I'm different. I'm not like the other kids. And I love that."
— Sam Graham-Felson (46:23) -
On Pee Wee as a role model
"Pee Wee doesn't really get bullied...he's just Pee Wee. Everyone loves Pee Wee, right? He's completely himself...But in the real world, wouldn’t Pee Wee get his ass beat?"
— Sam Graham-Felson (44:44) -
Sam’s son's trick gum response
"Well, I'm glad you feel that way. I'd rather be friends with you than fight you. Can I offer you a piece of gum?...I have news for you. It's trick gum."
— Sam's son (51:42) -
On letting go as a parent
"I saw in that moment, I'm like, he actually already has it. When you see something like that, your job as a parent is to walk away and just let him do his own thing...the most important thing I think you can do is believe in your child and know that they got this."
— Sam Graham-Felson (54:15)
Important Timestamps
- Sam’s motivation & son's personality: 03:42 – 06:56
- Karate class and questions about violence: 07:10 – 10:36
- Sam's childhood experiences and lingering shame: 10:40 – 16:10
- Parenting philosophy—self-esteem & resilience: 17:46 – 19:46
- The Badlands trip set-up & Teddy Roosevelt as hero: 21:45 – 25:30
- First hike and initial struggle: 26:29 – 28:13
- Surprising shift—son becomes the “trailblazer”: 28:45 – 31:04
- Conversations about Native land and problematic history: 34:43 – 37:43
- Pee Wee Herman emerges as a new hero: 38:00 – 42:16
- Concerns about being “different”: 42:41 – 45:03
- The “bully” role-play and trick gum reveal: 48:52 – 52:07
- Sam’s realization and parenting conclusions: 54:15 – 55:53
Tone and Language
The conversation is warm, self-aware, and often humorous—even at its most vulnerable. Both speakers move fluidly between tenderness, self-deprecation, and deeper questions about masculinity, identity, and parental purpose. Sam’s storytelling is disarmingly candid, while Anna gently teases out emotional truths and broader cultural questions.
Summary Takeaways
- Parental efforts to instill resilience are complex and freighted with their own history, anxieties, and shifting cultural scripts.
- True confidence can take many forms, and the ability to be one's authentic self—idiosyncratic, creative, even eccentric—may be the most important strength of all.
- Sometimes, the most meaningful growth comes not from pushing conformity or toughness, but from celebrating difference and trusting children to develop their own "third way" of handling life’s challenges.
- The episode’s arc—moving from attempted toughness to creative self-assurance—offers hope, humor, and an invitation for all parents to reconsider what it means to raise kids who are truly strong.
For listeners who missed the episode, this conversation is an honest, funny, and heartening meditation on what it means to parent a nonconformist—and what being “tough” really means in a world that doesn’t always reward gentle, imaginative boys in bow ties.