#913 - Andrew Schulz - Why Does Modern America Feel So Insane?

Summary

Modern Wisdom Episode #913 – Andrew Schulz: Why Does Modern America Feel So Insane?

Release Date: March 10, 2025

In this engaging episode of Modern Wisdom, host Chris Williamson sits down with stand-up comedian and podcaster Andrew Schulz to unpack the complexities and chaos of modern America. Their candid and humorous conversation traverses a wide array of topics, from celebrity culture and fertility struggles to political disillusionment and the nuances of fatherhood. Below is a detailed summary capturing the essence of their discussion, enriched with notable quotes and timestamps.

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1. Opening Banter and Celebrity Culture

The episode kicks off with light-hearted banter about Meghan Markle's new Netflix series, setting a humorous tone for the conversation.

• Andrew Schulz [00:00]: "With Love. Brand new series."
• Chris Williamson [00:54]: "Looking at all of those X-rated bits, Chris put his sample."

They joke about the challenges of producing a podcast, emphasizing authenticity over high production costs.

2. The Royal Family and Public Perception

Andrew delves into Meghan Markle's influence and the public's ambivalence towards the British Royal Family.

• Andrew Schulz [01:02]: "She's got genitals so potent that America finally managed to take down the United Kingdom."

Chris reflects on America's complex relationship with the Royals, hinting at cultural differences and historical tensions.

3. Andrew’s Fertility Journey and IVF Experience

A significant portion of the discussion centers around Andrew's personal struggles with fertility, offering a rare glimpse into male fertility issues—a topic often overshadowed by female-centric narratives.

• Chris Williamson [05:24]: "Varicocele looks like someone threw up in your ball sack."
• Andrew Schulz [10:21]: "No more sauna, no more baths."

Andrew shares his experiences with mail-in sperm tests and subsequent surgeries, highlighting the emotional and physical toll of infertility.

4. The Emotional Toll of Infertility

Both hosts explore the societal stigmas and emotional burdens tied to infertility, especially for men.

• Chris Williamson [12:56]: "Wow. Years later, Wow. I should have thought about that when I was going through the whole thing."
• Andrew Schulz [20:24]: "It's a slippery slope thinking sorta, like getting pregnant is a trap."

They discuss the isolation that comes with fertility issues and the importance of open communication within relationships.

5. Cultural Reflections and Political Disillusionment

Shifting gears, the conversation moves to broader societal issues, including political fatigue and the state of modern American culture.

• Andrew Schulz [29:21]: "A lot of it is a protest vote."
• Chris Williamson [38:53]: "Hey, make it a class issue."

They critique the current political landscape, emphasizing the need for class-based solutions over identity politics to address wealth inequality and societal discontent.

6. The Role of Media and Conspiracy Theories

The duo delves into the influence of media on public perception, touching upon conspiracy theories and the rapid pace of news dissemination.

• Andrew Schulz [93:18]: "It's the equivalent of, you can't fire me, I quit."
• Chris Williamson [94:14]: "What is the biggest steak? More like Cheesecake Factory."

They express skepticism towards rampant conspiracy theories, advocating for factual clarity and accountability in public discourse.

7. Relationships, Fatherhood, and Masculinity

A heartfelt segment where both speakers reflect on the transformative impact of fatherhood on personal identity and relationships.

• Chris Williamson [55:05]: "She's watching me pick my nose and flick it out of the playpen because I'm playing with my daughter."
• Andrew Schulz [130:14]: "It's a transition that...if you're a high-powered person, like man or woman, and then you pivot into family life."

They discuss balancing personal ambitions with familial responsibilities, highlighting how parenthood can recalibrate one's priorities and sense of self.

8. Time Management and Life Prioritization

The conversation touches on the fleeting nature of time and the importance of prioritizing meaningful relationships over superficial pursuits.

• Andrew Schulz [123:31]: "How can I organize my life so that I can have as many of those moments as I possibly can for the rest of my life?"
• Chris Williamson [128:16]: "Everything you say yes to is saying no to everything else."

They emphasize the necessity of conscious decision-making to maximize quality time with loved ones, advocating for intentional living.

9. Navigating Public Perception and Online Criticism

Both hosts share strategies for handling public scrutiny and online criticism, stressing the importance of focusing on supportive communities over detractors.

• Andrew Schulz [108:56]: "Tilting at windmills… there's gonna be some."
• Chris Williamson [117:12]: "What we need is a lot of that genuine connection."

They highlight the disparity between how close acquaintances perceive them versus the often skewed representations online, advocating for resilience against unfounded judgments.

10. Final Reflections and Moving Forward

In wrapping up, Chris and Andrew reflect on the journey of personal growth, emphasizing the value of authenticity, empathy, and maintaining meaningful connections amidst life's challenges.

• Andrew Schulz [135:00]: "I did something pretty cool."
• Chris Williamson [135:00]: "I love that you did it the way that you want."

They conclude with mutual appreciation for each other's candidness and a shared commitment to fostering genuine human connections.

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Conclusion

Episode #913 of Modern Wisdom offers a rich tapestry of insights into the multifaceted challenges of modern America. Through Andrew Schulz's personal anecdotes and Chris Williamson's thoughtful commentary, listeners gain a deeper understanding of societal pressures, personal struggles, and the enduring importance of authentic relationships. The episode serves as a poignant reminder that amidst the chaos and complexity of contemporary life, genuine human connections and self-awareness remain paramount.

Transcript

[Andrew Schulz]

What a great day for Netflix. Yeah. Meghan Markle's new lifestyle series drops today.

[Chris Williamson]

There's two lives out there. Is that it? Wait, did she have another show? They're not giving her more shows.

[Andrew Schulz]

With Love. Brand new series.

[Chris Williamson]

No way.

[Andrew Schulz]

Drops right now.

[Chris Williamson]

She can't miss, Bro. You only fail up. You really only fail up. This is crazy. This is great. Have we started the pod?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

Okay. We have. This is fire. I just want to let everybody know that, you know, Chris usually spends a lot of money on sets. And I. And I told him, I was like, save it. I said, don't rent out a warehouse or something aesthetically pleasing and have a whole team of cameras. I just have five Serbian guys set these things up here. Throw some fleshlights in the back, and we'll be good. And I think we'll get the same thing across. Okay. You had a hard day. I shouldn't even bust your balls about this, but.

[Andrew Schulz]

Oh, we're living.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Look, it's you versus Meghan Markle today. That's it. She's in next.

[Chris Williamson]

So what's her. What's her thing? What's her, like, story? What's the.

[Andrew Schulz]

Well, she's.

[Chris Williamson]

It's a reality show about her.

[Andrew Schulz]

She's got genitals so potent that America finally managed to take down the United Kingdom. Right. Not with war, not with bureaucracy, but with a woman who literally managed to suck the fucking privilege out of Prince Harry using her magical yoni.

[Chris Williamson]

It is interesting that she's so, so hated, huh? What is that about? Why do people dislike her?

[Andrew Schulz]

If you want to search Meghan Markle.

[Chris Williamson]

Because we don't like, the Royal Family, really. I think we're kind of ambivalent towards them in America.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah. You guys think it's kind of like a cricket or something?

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Like a fucking artifact.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. Yeah. It's not. I heard you were a bowler.

[Andrew Schulz]

I was, yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

For, like, a pretty good school. Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah. That was the only way I got into university. They reduced my entry requirements based because they thought I was gonna come and play sport. Little did they know that they just had a, like, adult infant waiting in the wings who was gonna completely, like.

[Chris Williamson]

So you stopped playing the second you went?

[Andrew Schulz]

Essentially. I mean, I dropped down to, like, just drinking, partying, and running events.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

And they did that thing.

[Chris Williamson]

Why are the Indians so good at that? They're not really athletic people.

[Andrew Schulz]

Well, think about all of the places that good at cricket.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Places that we colonized. Australia, India, Pakistan, Canada. Canada. Pretty good at it as well.

[Chris Williamson]

So do you Give them a thing to, like, beat you at for fun, like. Is that how you keep them?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, you can have that. Don't rebel.

[Chris Williamson]

We'll keep the rubies.

[Andrew Schulz]

Don't rebel again.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. You guys play in the field?

[Andrew Schulz]

For two days, I've been looking forward to telling you this because I saw you do your show here in Austin about a year ago. Almost exactly a year ago.

[Chris Williamson]

That's right.

[Andrew Schulz]

And I went and got a sperm count done.

[Chris Williamson]

Did you?

[Andrew Schulz]

Because of you. Exclusively because of you.

[Chris Williamson]

And how was it?

[Andrew Schulz]

First one. So I got a whole fucking story for you.

[Chris Williamson]

Please tell me. I love this. I love people's journeys. What side shoe are you, bro?

[Andrew Schulz]

That's a US 10.

[Chris Williamson]

You got. Okay, you double digits.

[Andrew Schulz]

All right.

[Chris Williamson]

That's a cute. That's a cute size right there.

[Andrew Schulz]

10. All right.

[Chris Williamson]

You're a big motherfucker to have a size 10. Yeah, well, look, you're a big guy. I don't know if that's a 10.

[Andrew Schulz]

Oh, no, that's a 9. Actually. I wear a 10. I wear a 10, but these are a 9. Deserved.

[Chris Williamson]

I got. Give me that camera.

[Andrew Schulz]

Stop comparing. You've been here for three minutes and you're like, fucking got a pair of Doc Martens up against my.

[Chris Williamson]

You're gonna tell me your sperm is way better than mine.

[Andrew Schulz]

I'm not. I'm not.

[Chris Williamson]

So wait, do you have shitty sperm, too?

[Andrew Schulz]

Let me. Okay.

[Chris Williamson]

I got distracted by my wife's crocs on you. I got a little intimidated.

[Andrew Schulz]

This. This is the. This is my prophylactic, okay? This is my fucking. This is my protection.

[Chris Williamson]

Well, if the sperm is bad, you don't even need it, bro.

[Andrew Schulz]

That's true. I can just wear the croc. That's double protection anyway. So do a Malin one. I do a Malin sperm thing. Have you ever seen how that works? So you put it in system.

[Chris Williamson]

It's done it all.

[Andrew Schulz]

Okay? Done it all. So when I did my mail in.

[Chris Williamson]

I was jerking off. And in my room, while my wife was in the other room, she's like, I'll give you a few minutes to do this. And I was like. And then I was like, can you. And then she's like, I don't know if I don't want to get, you know, any interruption or whatever. And I remember I was jerking off in my bed by myself. I never jerked off in my bed of my home by myself. And at one point, I'm jerking off and I look up and my TV is off. So it's just a reflection. And that is the saddest day of my life right there. That is knowing.

[Andrew Schulz]

Knowing that your wife is on the other side of a wall and watching.

[Chris Williamson]

Myself jerk off into, like, a black screen.

[Andrew Schulz]

The status porno ever.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. And, like, also, you think your strokes are way longer when you're doing it and not being filmed, but I'm not really going that far. It's more of like a. It's like a quicker pump. Like anytime I pantomime. Yes, exactly. Yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

You're having a seizure.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. Whenever.

[Andrew Schulz]

Small vibration.

[Chris Williamson]

Exactly.

[Andrew Schulz]

Right.

[Chris Williamson]

But like, in standup, if I was ever doing it, I'd always be like, yeah, I'm fucking.

[Andrew Schulz]

Nah, not got the length, man. Anyway, mail it in, comes back, that's not so good. I start chatgpt and they're like, well, you have to remember the suspension liquid says, do not shake. Right. This isn't a. It's not a fucking core power. You're not supposed to, like, make sure.

[Chris Williamson]

Oh, did you.

[Andrew Schulz]

No, no, no. But the DPD guy that carried it for 24 hours doesn't know to not shake it. Right. He chucks it in the back with the Amazon returns and all the rest of the stuff. So, anyway, then I go to Austin Urology in Austin, and it's way better, but.

[Chris Williamson]

But still shitty.

[Andrew Schulz]

Varicocele.

[Chris Williamson]

Oh, yeah, of course. I got all that.

[Andrew Schulz]

Did you get your surgery?

[Chris Williamson]

No, because. So I had it since I was young.

[Andrew Schulz]

Varicocele.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, yeah. So explain what that is to people. They don't know what it is.

[Andrew Schulz]

Varicocele is.

[Chris Williamson]

Looks like someone threw up in your ball sack.

[Andrew Schulz]

It's a inefficiency of vasculature around the epididymis.

[Chris Williamson]

So you should. You should just. Everybody listening should just compare how both of us talk about the world. Right there. You described exactly what it looks like.

[Andrew Schulz]

In your balls, and I said, this.

[Chris Williamson]

Is what it looks like. So you're.

[Andrew Schulz]

Between the two of us.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, we got it. Perfect.

[Andrew Schulz]

Exactly.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Of the IQ bell curve. Understood. What's going on? It means. It means that you're not circulating heat away. Actually, heat's the issue.

[Chris Williamson]

Right, exactly. So. So your balls descend when it's hot, and then they ascend when it's cold. Right. And this is why, you know, you're freezing, your balls get all tight, and they're basically trying to, like, monitor the temperature of the ball sac so that your sperm doesn't d. Die. And what some varicoseal is, is you have some veins a lot of times that should be Further up into your, like, basically stomach area, like groin area, and they just fall into your bowls. And I had those for a while. I remember a doctor once said, we can do it, but we won't know if it will do anything. He even said this to me. It's funny, I haven't even thought about this. He goes. He goes, it might affect your ability to get pregnant or it might not. And this is when I was in like my 20s and. Cause I thought I had ball cancer. That's what I thought it was. Because you just see this fucking.

[Andrew Schulz]

Oh, there's like something here.

[Chris Williamson]

Just imagine like a sack of spaghetti, like in your balls. And I was like. And he's like, yeah, it just might affect your ability to get pregnant. And. And I remember thinking like, oh, leave it. You know what I mean? I'm in New York and I'm running around. Yeah. I'm like, whatever. It is what it is. And. And.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

Wow. Years later, Wow. I should have thought about that when I was going through the whole thing. Okay, so you're. You had varicoseal. How was your. Do they swim?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, yeah. The morphology mot, like, all pretty good.

[Chris Williamson]

But they weren't warped at all. You didn't have any?

[Andrew Schulz]

No.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah. But anyway, all of that went through. All of that just because of you.

[Chris Williamson]

Well, I appreciate that. I hope everybody goes out there and does it.

[Andrew Schulz]

I think.

[Chris Williamson]

Save yourself some time, dude.

[Andrew Schulz]

I think that guys especially. It's so easy to just come in a cup.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, it's also there's, you know, there's plastic and everything. Like they were finding what is the microplastics are in your balls. And like, everybody's worried about drinking a Poland Spring because of the microplastics. And like, my buddy told me if a car in a city stops, like, they just hit their brakes. The amount of microplastic that goes into the environment. Yeah, like drinking out of plastic shit is the equivalent of like not using a plastic straw to help the ocean. Like 90% of the up in the ocean comes from the. Was it commercial fishing? You seen this where they just like leave the nets out there? Did you see that doc?

[Andrew Schulz]

Which one?

[Chris Williamson]

It's a documentary called. I'm going to forget the fucking name. It was like a pun, but they did the wrong pun. I wish we had another person in.

[Andrew Schulz]

This room as a fucking researcher. Whatever. We can just get it wrong. We just keep getting everything.

[Chris Williamson]

No, no, no. It was. Are they listening out there? Do any of you guys know what it is? See something? Oh, God. It was a sea spiracy.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yes. Okay, okay. We don't need you.

[Chris Williamson]

We don't need you. Jonathan, Go away.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

And it's like, yes. I don't want to correct people here, but it should have been conspiracy.

[Andrew Schulz]

Very good. Come to Andrew Schultz for your branding.

[Chris Williamson]

Guys. You know what I mean? This is what we do over here. Like, new tonic.

[Andrew Schulz]

Thank you. Yeah, it makes sense.

[Chris Williamson]

I was chastised for drinking new tonic the second I sat down on this tonic. Chastise said, any time. Oh, wow, guys. John, we need to clean the tops of the new tonic before we put them on the podcast. Okay? I understand we're in a CIA bunker that USAID has been funding in Pakistan that we're doing this podcast, but I need the top of the Nutanic cleaned. Can we get a shot of this? I think this is where Chris put his sample.

[Andrew Schulz]

The fucking difference in volume, dude.

[Chris Williamson]

Oh, what?

[Andrew Schulz]

You warned me. The fucking sperm sample thing.

[Chris Williamson]

Oh, yeah, it's brutal. It's like. It's so humbling. You know what's funny is when I first did. When I first did it, I joke around in the special. There's one thing I didn't say in the special, but, like, first of all, when I first got the results, your ego plays so much, and they're like, it wasn't that good. What I said to my wife was, she was like, yeah, we got the results, and they weren't that good. And they were like. And some of them are, like, morphed. Like, there's, like, an issue with not just swimming, but they were, like, shaped weird. And I dead serious, said to my wife, I was like, well, maybe it was the force that they hit the cup. So car wreck, straight velocity. Exactly. It was 9, 11. Like, boom. Just smacking into that cup. Yes, somewhere. Exactly, Exactly. But no, dude, I hit up Huberman. I was like, what should I do? And him and a bunch of other doctors gave me all this.

[Andrew Schulz]

Like, put you in a group chat. Andrew's struggling, guys. It's like, whoa, hey, Andrew. I just fucking. Just me and you.

[Chris Williamson]

He was really sweet. He was really sweet, actually. He gave me, like, a list of things to do. He gave me these pills I got to take. I started taking the pills. He's like, and. And the doctors I spoke to say the same thing. They're like, you got to ice your balls every single day.

[Andrew Schulz]

No more sauna, no more baths.

[Chris Williamson]

No more sauna, no more baths. You got to wear baggy underwear so you can't wear, like, the tight ones. Stop. Smoking, stop drinking. I did that for two months. My sperm got worse. The doctor, like, literally goes, we've never seen this happen before. So I was like, what should I do? He goes, you might as well just go back to drinking. I was like, all right, fine.

[Andrew Schulz]

They've obviously become fucking accustomed to it. They've got, like, Stockholm syndrome in the body. Exactly.

[Chris Williamson]

Like, I'm one of those professional athletes that was, like, better when you could, like, drink and, like, do coke.

[Andrew Schulz]

Like the John Daly.

[Chris Williamson]

That's what my sperm is. My sperm is John Daly. You want him on a case of Bud Lights, and then you're going to see him do 18 holes. You've never seen anything in your life.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, dude. I, I, I genuinely think that it's one of the most, like, meaningful standups I've ever seen.

[Chris Williamson]

Oh, thank you, man.

[Andrew Schulz]

I think it's. I watched it again in the car right here, and I managed to not cry in the back of the car.

[Chris Williamson]

That's cool.

[Andrew Schulz]

When the Uber driver was in front of me. But I didn't manage to hold it together when you did it live.

[Chris Williamson]

Oh, God.

[Andrew Schulz]

So I want to ask, how does it feel getting this personal on stage? You know, it's presumably one of the most difficult periods, by far the most.

[Chris Williamson]

Difficult time in my life.

[Andrew Schulz]

Just, like, by far. Like, what's it feel like?

[Chris Williamson]

Cathartic when I started talking about it, because it's very isolating when you go through any, like, fertility stuff, because the assumption is it's your wife. We all. And I talk about in the Special, but, like, that you never assume it could be you at all. So in the beginning, I was, like, hesitant to talk about it because I didn't want to embarrass her. And she was, like, heartbroken by the whole thing. Like, she, she, you know, you, like, you start thinking of reasons why your ovaries are up, and her ovaries were perfect, but she didn't know. And she would be like, I know it's because I used to watch, like, movies on my laptop on my stomach. And, like, she, like, she starts coming up with all these solutions as to why she did it. And, and I, like, prayed the night before we got our test results, and I was like, if there is a problem, just make it me. That's how confident I was that it was her.

[Andrew Schulz]

Like, I was so confident, Spare fertility that I can take the fucking.

[Chris Williamson]

I go, do me a favor, God, like, just make it. She can't handle this. And then the doctor tells God's like, I gotcha. Bet yeah, so, yeah, it was. But it was nice to talk about because it's so isolating. And then when I found out it was my issue, it was then I really felt more comfortable sharing because I'm not embarrassing her in any way.

[Andrew Schulz]

You get to own your own issues. Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

And it was the first time in my life I've ever been personal or told stories really on stage. Like, I've never been. I always thought my life was boring. I thought that, like, my opinions on things were more interesting than my actual life. And so I was excited for the challenge of like being personal and being like a storyteller. And yeah, I was like, maybe I can turn this into something. I always try to do something different every special I put out. And so I started reading all these books about, like, storytelling and like, trying to understand, like, what that is. And it was really cool to learn. You know, it's. It's really our oldest form of digesting information. Before we had like a notepad or before we had the ability to just like remember statistics or facts, we just told each other stories. There's a reason why, like, the most important texts are not, hey, this is the information you need to know. They kind of like build it into a story. Hey, this is why you should have faith. Because look at this outcome. They don't give you, like, the statistics of the people that pray every single day. And this is how long they live. It doesn't hit us the same way as, hey, he built the boat and he was the one who lived, you know? And yeah, it's interesting. Even like in the special, like there's some joke parts of the special and then you kind of. I almost like trick you into getting into the story. And I can feel a difference when we're in the story in the way that the audience is invested. It is this innate human instinct. If somebody comes in the room right now, they go, guys, the craziest shit just happened. We'll give them 15 seconds, even if they're a complete stranger. I don't know what that is. You'd probably be able to figure that out. But there's something about it. We're hardwired to be interested in them, interested in stories.

[Andrew Schulz]

Is it even fair to sort of call it like a comedy special when you get to the stage where you're referring to archive footage and sort of interacting with shit that's behind you and there's entire five minute blocks where no one's laughing?

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, yeah. It's like there's. There's a, The Way I looked at it is like, when I was touring it, I didn't tell anybody that it was about this because I think sometimes what happens when you do like a one man show, you almost like, ask the audience to reduce their comedic expectations. Like, if somebody's like, here's a one man show, it's going to be this like, thought provoking thing and then will also kind of be funny. But you're there for the kind of thought provoking thing. And I'm a standup, I'm not a oneman show. So I didn't. Nobody knew this was what it was about the entire tour. And I never positioned it in that way. I didn't even talk about it on the pod until I announced the special. So I wanted the highest comedic expectations. But then I wanted to see if I could almost like trick you into listening to this. So the first, like, chunk is just like hard hitting stand up. That is related. And if you, like go back to it, you're like, oh, okay. And then like, this is like little shit that nobody will pick up. But like, even the first joke that I tell is. Ties into like the last moment with her. Not even the Staten island thing. Like, the first joke I tell about the. And I wonder if anybody would pick this up. Like, the first joke was about, like, you know, we are pregnant. And then I go, you know, this is what guys always say, we're pregnant or whatever. I forget exactly the joke. These guys are like, we're pregnant. It's like, no, she's pregnant. It's like ridiculous to take credit for that. It's like when my wife says, we made a lot of money, right? And then it sets up this idea that, like, it's not really we. And then when my wife is in like the toughest moment of her life, she says, it's not your fault. We'll figure it out. We do this together.

[Andrew Schulz]

You don't have problems. We have problems.

[Chris Williamson]

Exactly. And it's just, I don't know, for me, it's like this cool little. Hey, that part that you thought was completely unrelated to this part. Everything is a seed that's going to be harvested later.

[Andrew Schulz]

Can you. What were the books that you read.

[Chris Williamson]

If you can recognize William Storr? I think it's just called Story the.

[Andrew Schulz]

Art of Storytelling or the Science of Storytelling.

[Chris Williamson]

There's another one, the Science of Storytelling. Maybe that's the William Storr one. And then there's Hero of a Thousand Faces. There's like a bunch I bought, like, cards on Instagram. Anything I could get my hands on. It was called, like, storytelling tactics. And those weren't that great. But it was like anything I could get my hands on about story. I was just like, I just need to understand what makes it compelling, what grabs attention, what is like a 3 arc structure, how is a movie written? And I kind of wrote it like a movie without you knowing.

[Andrew Schulz]

And what did you, or what have you come to learn about the most important basics when it comes to telling a good story?

[Chris Williamson]

I think stakes are really important. Problems are really important. It can't be. It can't be. And then it has to be like, so we had to do this and then it's just. I'm telling you another thing.

[Andrew Schulz]

This problem caused this, but then this happened.

[Chris Williamson]

Yes. So. So you're not just going, here's this series of events. Each event has to be a catalyst for the next one. This thing pushes. And luckily or unluckily, however you look at it, you know, I want to look at it with a positive perspective. Is like, you know, this story kind of unfolded in a way that was, you know, kind of traditional in that story. And it worked. You know, it worked out. God bless. You know, not all the time.

[Andrew Schulz]

It does.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

There's a good use of omission, which is something I learned from Mr. Ballin. He's a strange, dark and mysterious. Sorry. Huge YouTube channel. Like 10 million, 50 million person YouTube.

[Chris Williamson]

My bad, my bad, my bad.

[Andrew Schulz]

It's all, you know, like, scary, spooky story shit that people listen to. And one of the things that he taught me on the POD last year was omission is really important.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

So continuing to set stuff up but leaving out very key pieces of information would kind of beg the question or get there. And, you know, there's things where you could have told a story within 15 seconds, but you can make it interesting for three minutes by not the payoff is at the very, very end.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. Holding that attention.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

People want to know, you know, or the people who relate to it. I think that's the. Yeah, the. Yeah. The coolest thing about it, about the tour and I mean, outside of doing fucking arenas and shit. That's awesome. It's like what you dream of. Like what I wrote down on little pieces of paper when I first started comedy, but was all these people who had come to the show and they were like going through it. And again, it's really isolating. Your best friends are probably going through IVF and they don't tell you. The women who are going through it. And if the issue is theirs, you definitely don't talk about it. Because fertility is this, like, really volatile subject for women. Right. Like, they're pushing their baby making time back because they want to do these careers that they've been told that they should do, but some of them don't even really want to do it. And there's all these, like, weird societal expectations that we could get into, which I think kind of interesting. But so if it's their fault, they are, like, just mortified to have to share and they feel like there's maybe something wrong with them and less of a woman. Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Or less of a man.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, 100%. And you go through that for a second. I never felt less of a man. What I thought was, did I do something wrong that I'm being punished for? Like, why should I not? Yeah, why should I not have kids? Like, why does God not want me to have kids? Like, and I'm not like a religious person, really. But we. We started going to church a bit. I'll tell you how comic. But say what.

[Andrew Schulz]

It felt comic. Yeah. Some way there's like, yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

I was like, did I do something to deserve this? Because you're trying to justify it, Right? You're like, I'm a good person. I take care of my friends and my family. Like, what the. What is this?

[Andrew Schulz]

I work hard. I don't think I've mistreated my body that much.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. So you try to find the justification for it, and then you got to switch that perspective to, like, no shit is hard. Life is hard. And you could either fold or you could get after it.

[Andrew Schulz]

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[Chris Williamson]

It's hard for them. It's hard for. Yeah. Like. Yeah. I mean like when they're on. My wife reacted pretty crazy to the drugs. Like they. I mean, I talk about the special, but they shoot them up with all the hormones and like, you know, I didn't. We got into like an argument, like a full out argument in a Japanese restaurant. You don't realize how quiet Japanese restaurants are until like you are full out arguing like elbow to elbow in a small New York City Japanese restaurant. And the only thing that interrupts it is what a new person walks in and Shamana says. Everybody stops. And then we're back to fighting as they're slurping udon. It is a yeah. It's a yeah. You get into it. You definitely get into it. But my wife was good. She didn't like resent me for it. And she could have, she could have been like, you're the reason why I'm doing this. And in no way did that come out so. A lot of credit there.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, the. That line about you don't have problems. We have problems where a team was sort of taking on this battle together. It must be very reassuring. I have a friend whose wife went through IVF. She was 42. So she was really toward the end.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

And I think you can actually do this where you get to kind of. This is the last harvest of eggs that you have. This is a squeezing the very last few drops out of the sort of sponge of fertility and two stories. Lovely woman, very smart, very balanced. One day threw a grapefruit at him so hard that it bruised his ribs. When. When she was going through the ivf.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

And then a couple of days later she opened the front door and there was 30Amazon boxes on the front porch.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Like, what the fuck is this? And they were all addressed to the house. It wasn't somebody else's thing. Brings them inside and starts opening them up and it's like pink lace doilies and, and curtain ties and little coasters and. And bit like knickknacks and stuff. Like Dolores Umbridge from Harry Potter. Yeah, nicey nicely. And in some hormonal fugue state fever dream thing. She'd just gone on Amazon and ordered the most. Literally. She, like, got wasted on progesterone.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

And just gone crazy on girly shit.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

What the fuck?

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

It is wild.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. She started nesting, probably. They do that shit, too, once they're deeper into the pregnancy.

[Andrew Schulz]

How so?

[Chris Williamson]

Hey, you just start, like, buying furniture and you start to create your home. I think it's biological. Like, they say this about women, but that's when you know it's taken curating the space. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's amazing to see them. Yeah. I don't know. I hope it's something. I think pendulums have to swing. Obviously. You know, you see it politically and I think you see it culturally, and I hope. Yeah, maybe it swings back to the point where we start to value being a mom and, like, only being a mom as a societal benefit and not as somebody who's, like, taking the easy way out. I think that.

[Andrew Schulz]

Well, someone who's been conned by the patriarchy into being a domestic prostitute somehow.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Oh, sweetie, what a shame for you.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think a lot of women who never had kids pushed out that ideology. And it's a. Yeah, it's a. Yeah. It's a tricky thing, and it is something that's, like, distinct to places like this. Like, very, I guess you would say, modern places. And keep in mind, like, my mom worked. My dad worked for my mom. My mom had a dance studio. They taught ballroom dance lessons, but it was my mom's studio, and my dad kind of, like, eventually came in and ran it. You know, he was a journalist, and then he came in. And so I'm used to, like, women working and killing it, and. But there is this thing, like, my. My wife is, like, very high performing. You know, like, she got her mba and. And then she, like, worked for Apple. She was, like, running AI projects at Apple, and then she was. She had to, like, grapple with this thing where it's like, I don't really want to do this. This doesn't make me happy. I'm kind of doing it because society wants me to do this, and I want to prove that I'm. Just because I'm. A woman, I. It doesn't mean that I have to be this domesticated person. And I can go out there, I can compete with every guy. Yeah. And then she had to just be like, I really want to be a mom. That's what my dream in life. I've always wanted to be a mom. And I would See her when she would bump into people she used to work with on the street and they'd be like, so where are you working now? And she'd be like, she would say, oh, I'm. Yeah, I'm just a mom. And the just would kill me. Yeah. It's like you would hope that we could set something up where you're like, I, I quit, man. You know, my baby was born. I was able to stay home with the baby, actually.

[Andrew Schulz]

I'm a mom now.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, I don't work. I'm a mom now.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, I do work. I'm a mom. And we're lucky enough that we get to do it.

[Andrew Schulz]

I got promoted.

[Chris Williamson]

Exactly. Yeah. And I think society should value that and I think more women will choose that if they can. It's a luxury. It's a privilege.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yes.

[Chris Williamson]

But I think probably Texas values that a little bit more. New York is, it's not very family oriented and I was born and raised there, which is an insane thing. But you go to New York to make it, you know, and. Yeah, I'd like to see that. I'd like to see that switch up a little bit.

[Andrew Schulz]

There's a mimetic sense to this, I think that you kind of do what you see the people around you doing.

[Chris Williamson]

Oh, brother. Yeah. I mean, four people got pregnant during this tour, so we got pregnant.

[Andrew Schulz]

We.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Gotcha. Lord.

[Chris Williamson]

Fuck. You did catch me. Yeah. So, yes, we got pregnant. Both of my openers got pregnant.

[Andrew Schulz]

Mark.

[Chris Williamson]

Mark and Derek, Derek's wife is now pregnant and our, the person who does our visuals and lighting, Rob, who I think you met, Rob and his wife Cheryl. They got pregnant with their second.

[Andrew Schulz]

Fuck pumping them out.

[Chris Williamson]

I mean, what does they say that there's some like, some, you know, biblical term about like the power of the tongue, but it is the community that you keep and like, and you're seeing this thing happening. So crazy to see four of us, everybody on the dominoes fell. Isn't that nuts? So, yeah, it was just this beautiful. Yeah, it was beautiful. Beautiful thing to see it happen.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah. I, I, I do wonder what can be done to kind of pedestalize motherhood again.

[Chris Williamson]

I think it will happen naturally. Like, I think a lot of times, like, we see things that we think are, like, wrong societally and then we try to, like, push that, you know, progress or regress, whatever it is, like.

[Andrew Schulz]

Speed, run it back to.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. And you kind of can't. This, this guy, Lil Duvall is like a huge mentor of mine comedically. Like, he would always speak about This. I mean, he's just like a brilliant philosopher that you wouldn't realize, but he's just. He's so. He's brilliant and. But he would always say, this is like, you can't push people into things. They have to learn on their own and then react to the errors of their ways, if it is even an error. But we're reactive, you know, and it's just like. Like, even politically, like, what's happening right now, it's just reaction, you know, like, this election is reaction. It's. No, it's not going on podcasts. Everybody's like, oh, he went on, you guys and Theo and Rogan, and that's what changed the elections. Like, we didn't have zero impact on the election. Zero. Everybody had already decided, and it might have made them feel more comfortable with their decision, but I think that those decisions are. Are made way before, and it's just society reaction. Everybody thinks that, like, every person that voted for Trump is this, like, ride or die Trump guy. I think they're actually. The majority of people were rejecting a societal push in a direction that they didn't feel comfortable with. And I. Yeah, I think that's.

[Andrew Schulz]

It's. A lot of it is a protest vote.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Against. It's not. I'm not voting for this thing. I'm voting not for that.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. And I think that's what happened with Trump when he lost. Right. It was like, oh, this is too chaotic. I don't want to deal with this shit anymore. Give me the old guy. And it's like, it was a vote against Trump. Nobody was like, for Biden. And I think, like, the administration. You could com. It doesn't matter. Everybody's like, all right, this is too much. Like, I don't. I'm not feel comfortable with my. With my life right now. Let's try something else. So, yeah, I think it was the protest.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah. I think that was one of the reasons that you're special again. When I saw it last year and then again now was really important to give people something that feels a bit more grounded, real and meaningful and within that control.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

As opposed to coming out and going, you know, Zelensky, Trump was the Amber Heard Johnny Depp of fucking 2025, which, by the way, I think is actually true. Like, that really should have fucking been done behind closed doors. Like, why are the. Why are the press there watching this bullshit?

[Chris Williamson]

Well, they didn't think that's what was going to happen. They thought it was going to be a big announcement for a Mineral deal, blah, blah, blah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

And then it didn't go that way. And I think that. Yeah, that's my assumption at least. I don't think Trump would ever put something out there where it could potentially look foolish. Right.

[Andrew Schulz]

Like, if it didn't account for the wild card that is J.D. vans.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. I don't even think it was J.D. i think Zelensky was just like, he should have just never agreed to it. He's like, hey, I don't like this deal, so let's not get in front of the cameras and do it. And I liked JD Going, why are we litigating this in front of the American public? Like, that felt a little subversive. And I could see, like, a negative reaction on it. Like, we're here to have a hurrah, let's high five moment. And this turned into not that.

[Andrew Schulz]

So maybe let's not do it here. Yeah, more.

[Chris Williamson]

And jd. JD you gotta. Hey, watch out for that. Yo.

[Andrew Schulz]

He's gonna be around for a while, yo.

[Chris Williamson]

It's like, I don't even. Again, I don't react to, like, people based on their, like, political leaning. Like, I don't really care about that. Like, culture is way more interesting to me. I don't, like, like, jumping on a side with these things. I understand that, like, people who don't know me at all and, and are like, this guy's some right wing MAGA lunatic. It's like, yeah, I don't. I have empathy for even thinking that. Like, you just see headlines, you see some crazy joke I told. Like, I'm totally. I. I'm totally fine. I understand the world we live in. Right. But for me, like, I just kind of look at, like, people and ideas and I try to react to how. What public sentiment is to that. Like, I'm always reacting to feeling. I don't really react to a specific event. And I'm not trying to, like, explain logically the event, but, like, I'm more interested in, like, the emotional reaction of things. So, like, when Mangione shot the dude and then the Internet kind of didn't really feel that bad. They were, like, joking around about it. I'm like, oh, this is like, rich people, you gotta pay attention to this because they don't care about y'all anymore. Like, any one of y'all could get killed and it would be fine. And if you're the billionaire class, you gotta be very aware that your life is not valued by the rest of us. That's a. And I'd imagine very rich. People, if we're going to look at this into, like in a microcosm, I imagine they. Let's just assume. I don't think they're bad, by the way, but let's just assume that they want as much money as they possibly can. This is like an unfair assumption, but let's just play with this little thought experiment. You also want comfort. You want as much money as you can get, but you also want comfort, right? So, like, if you're living in some third world country and you're like the richest person there, it's not really comfortable. Because you know at any point in time these people in fucking sandals could storm your house and they take out the five security guards and then they kidnap your whole family. It's not comfortable. One of the nice things about America is, like, being rich is comfortable, right? The first World, like, being rich, you can be comfortable. You have to worry about, like, your kid getting kidnapped. Like, fucking Canelo Alvarez. I think his brother got kidnapped, like, the week of his fight once, and nobody knew it. It was just like a normal thing that happens. He's the box.

[Andrew Schulz]

It's just a Tuesday. It's like getting your flight delayed.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. And he had to, like, work out the fucking payments, like days before the fight. So this is a normal thing that you have to accept. So in order to make sure your life is comfortable, you have to make sure that the poorest people have enough to eat and get a roof over their head and provide for their family. They. They probably don't need that much more. There's a lot of interesting distraction that goes on in America. There's a lot of things that they can take part in. They're, like, beautiful and amazing and it will pa. But the second they go below, I can't feed myself. And they have no hope of upward mobility. They'll kill you. And then when someone else kills you, they'll laugh about it and they'll be like, good. So when I saw that, I was like, wow, Americans are very disillusioned. I knew that they were disillusioned with institutions. I knew that there was issues, obviously, with the medical industrial complex or whatever these terms, they start building up. But that right there, that is a point of concern. And if you're the really wealthy, you either gotta beef up security or you gotta be talking to Donald and you gotta be talking to these senators and go, we need to do something for these people. Eggs gotta be affordable. You push. It's. You're squeezing them right now and you can only squeeze em so far before you get the French Revolution, you know, you can't, you can't be like, all right, well, they don't got bread. Give them cake or whatever.

[Andrew Schulz]

That lady said meat, eggs. Yeah, it. I was really, really surprised by that as someone who. I didn't have any health insurance in the US until the start of last year because I didn't have a Social Security number, pages to get it set up and blah, blah. And I didn't know how many medical claims aren't verified or accepted or rejected. I don't know how long it got pushed back for. How long people have to wait. Well, you can't go to that. Provided the one that you want, you can go to the one that we say, and then you can't do this. And it's going to take six months and then so on and so forth. You get to the end of this thing and sorry, you're out of pocket. The number one reason for bankruptcy in America is medical. Medical debt.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. I mean, dude, you see the same reaction to those California fires. The, the second people started to hear was like, celebs, houses, they're like, ah, they'll figure it out. Like, they didn't really care. Like, Californians were really concerned about it outside of California. The sentine was kind of like, ah, you guys will be all right.

[Andrew Schulz]

If not outright applause.

[Chris Williamson]

And you gotta pay attention to that culture. Like, these are the things that if you're a politician, you really gotta listen to. And I feel like, I feel like that's what the Dems. And I'm a lifelong. I come from a dance family in New York City. Like, what do you think? My political leanings have been my entire life. I grew up in the arts, going to ballet. A dance family in New York City, right? So you gotta look at this. Like, Dems gotta look at this and they gotta start going, okay, what are we missing here? We're not listening to the people. I think sometimes there can be a little bit of a pretentiousness with, with the Dems, like, where they're like. Because the party is kind of ruled by these like, Ivy League elites that, you know, pat themselves on the back for, like, caring about the oppressed and the ostracized. And they're so detached from them that they're just like, we know what you guys need, so we'll do it. And look, look, we're doing it, right? There's this pat on the back. And I mean, like you, they, they literally need to look at Bernie. You like her politics or not. But aoc. Like aoc if you want to look at data. Like she, I think polled the same as Trump in her district. Now why is that? These are polar opposites.

[Andrew Schulz]

I don't know. There's. It wouldn't surprise me if we see the pendulum swinging back. I can already see some of, you know, the anti woke stuff that was like super cool for the last eight years. Something like that.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, that's over.

[Andrew Schulz]

So woke was over for a little while, but anti woke was lagging behind it. Right. And now when I see this crazy bathroom pronouny thing online, it just feels like, dude, this was maybe how much are eggs, yo? This was maybe interesting and cool when you were speaking truth to power as a rebellious anarchist. That was outside of the system, but now you're inside the tent pissing out.

[Chris Williamson]

Sure, there's one thing about the inside the tent, but most people aren't even in the tent. Caring about your bathroom experience is way later after I could afford eggs. Do you know what I mean? Like, if I can't afford eggs, I don't care where you go to the bathroom. I don't care what your pronoun is like. I don't care. Like it. Those things don't matter to me if you got a house or you're a fucking fourth generation Nepo baby from like a this like incredibly wealthy family. Of course your life is so good. I should figure out how I can make all these, you know, ostracized groups. Comfor. But somebody that can't afford eggs and is about to default on their loan, forget it. They can't even pay their rent. Owning a home is like a completely different. They don't care. Like even right now, everybody's like, oh, the economy's tanking. What's going on? Okay, housing prices are going to come down and then the stock market's going down. Right. Do you think that Trump's supporters have money invested in the stock market? Do you think they own homes? It's the LA fires again. It's. They're just watching rich people lose some of their rich. They don't give a. You know what I'm saying? Like so. So you have to be like really tuned in to like how people are emotionally reacting to this stimulus. And I think that's, to me, the advice that I try to give Dems is like, you make it a class issue and you win every single time. There's a reason why people with Bernie Sanders and AOC for that.

[Andrew Schulz]

It cuts across all of the other groups.

[Chris Williamson]

Yo, he's saying rich people got a lot of money, you don't got a lot of money. We need to get you money. The only way to get it to you is by taking them from doesn't.

[Andrew Schulz]

Matter about who you're having sex with, it doesn't matter about the color of your skin.

[Chris Williamson]

Hey, make it a class issue. The reason they don't is because a lot of them are in bed with these billion dollar corporations so they can't make it a class issue because the people paying them are that high class, so they're like trans bathrooms. They have to make it about these identity politics issues because they can't target the real fucking issue, which is huge wealth inequality in America. I don't know how to solve it. I'm not smart enough to figure that shit out. But I do know what the problem is and what exists and what resonates with people. And that's aoc. She like her politics or not. Doesn't fucking matter. Every day she's going, hey, them rich people are trying to fuck you. Amazon's trying to not pay you. And the people in her neighborhood, the people who are voting for her going, I do feel like she's trying to help me out. And they also feel Trump is trying to help her out. So where is that Venn diagram hitting? That's it.

[Andrew Schulz]

Being a podcaster isn't always as glamorous as it seems. For instance, I just took a three hour Uber ride from Houston, Texas to make this episode and seeing that it is currently midnight and I just down the equivalent of four cups of coffee, falling asleep will be at least a bit of a struggle. But thanks to Momentous magnesium L Threonate I should be able to sleep like a corpse because L Threonate is uniquely able to cross the blood brain barrier, boosting memory, focus and cognitive function, all while also improving sleep and reducing stress. And if you're still on the fence, Momentous offers a 30 day money back guarantee so you can buy it and try it for 29 nights. If you do not love it, if it doesn't help your sleep, I'll just give you your money back and they ship internationally. Right now you can get 20% off everything site wide and that 30 day money back guarantee by going to the link in the description below or heading to livemomentous.com modernwisdom and using the code modernwisdom at checkout that's L I V M O M E N t o u s.com ModernWisdom and Modern Wisdom at checkout you did a bunch of shows in the uk.

[Chris Williamson]

Oh, yeah. That was fun.

[Andrew Schulz]

This last tour, talk to me about what you learned. Differences. Similarities. Uk, US.

[Chris Williamson]

Similarities. Like. Oh, you know, it was really interesting to find out, like, how, like, culturally distinct the little towns in England are. That's really cool, like, to. To know that, like, Liverpool and Manchester are 30 minutes apart, but they're two completely different, like, ethnic groups. So to me, like, going to the uk, I think a lot of times we just treat white people as a monolith, and the UK is a perfect example of, like, why you can't even do that in a tiny little country. And these, like, little idiosyncrasies of these. These two cities that are 30 minutes away from one another and don't sound anything alike.

[Andrew Schulz]

Different lifestyles.

[Chris Williamson]

It's crazy.

[Andrew Schulz]

Different football teams.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. And it's so. To me, that was really exciting going into these little places. And whenever I go into a place, I. I just really, like, I'm. I don't know, I'm curious. You know, my dad was really curious guy and I. I always want to learn a little bit about something and, like, try to write some jokes that reflect that. And, you know, maybe for a few minutes in the set, they get to feel really seen or kind of recognized by someone they might not think would do that. And. But, yeah, I love that. You know, going to Scotland was awesome. My mom's born and raised in Scotland, so doing that show there was really great.

[Andrew Schulz]

But you do the hydro Glasgow?

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. Is it the Hide sse? It looks like a armadillo.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

And. And also just the way that they react to stand up, like. Like, with the Scotland show, I could have just talked to them for three hours. Like, they just wanted to be in the room and, like, telling stories, like, on some bonfire. And it was like, I'm just happy you're there.

[Andrew Schulz]

You know, it's miles away from everything.

[Chris Williamson]

It is that. But there's also, like, this. I think there's, like, a cultural sentiment. It's like this. And I think you also get another place in it. There's this, like, pub culture where we're all hanging and here's this thing and I'm going to share with you and you guys are involved and there's going to be some quip and we're going to have. I also think there's a little catharsis for them because, like, it's a little bit more censored out there. So then when I come and I'm Saying these jokes that are kind of wild, they get to. They get to have this experience that's kind of more similar to their everyday lives. Like, there's a public Persona you have to put on, and then when you're at the bar with your boys, there's a very different version of you. So now they're in public, but they get that same version. So I think that was cool. Ireland was just great. Yeah, it was awesome, man. I will say that the Middle east was more aware of American culture, though, than the uk.

[Andrew Schulz]

That's interesting.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Why do you think that is?

[Chris Williamson]

I think that they're all educated here, and because of that, they're acutely aware of our stuff. And also all their TV and stuff comes from here because they're not producing their own. You guys are producing your own, right? Like, you have all your own TV shows. You love Island. Like, everybody knows these, like, things that you don't really know about our Real Housewives of Utah or whatever. But in the Middle east, they're getting all of our. Because they're not producing a lot of their own yet.

[Andrew Schulz]

Well, you don't know what's going on actually, in the Middle East. That's exactly.

[Chris Williamson]

We need to not look into that at all. Yes. Give me Housewives. Yeah, so. So that was. That was really fun, too. Yeah, it was great, man. It was great.

[Andrew Schulz]

James, the other half of New Tonic went to go.

[Chris Williamson]

I love James, man.

[Andrew Schulz]

James is Australia. And he was like, they just had.

[Chris Williamson]

A baby, didn't they?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yep.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Congrats. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He's holding it down. He did fucking 15 minutes on Aussie. It's like, where the fuck did he get 15 minutes on Aussie?

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. That Aussie run was fun. Usually I'm only in town for a day, but I got to be in Australia for, like, a. Almost like a couple weeks. So by the time I got to I think it was Sydney, I had.

[Andrew Schulz]

Kind of worked out some stuff.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. Like, I was like, oh, I got a nice little chunk. And that was. Yeah, that was. That was really cool. And it's a cool thing to give them, you know, it's. I think a lot of. I guess a lot. I think a lot of Connors can go to wherever and just do their set, and I have my set. But it's also a nice thing to go to, like, a completely different country and, like, tap into little specific things there.

[Andrew Schulz]

Was there anywhere that you went, how many dates do you do?

[Chris Williamson]

Oh, God, I don't know so much. I was on tour for two years. I was probably developing it for. This whole process is probably three years in the making from like building the hour and then touring it and. Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Was there anywhere that sort of sticks out in your mind as being holy? The reaction, sort of emotionally, the MSG was the craziest.

[Chris Williamson]

That just felt like the whole city was rooting for me and. Which is like the greatest honor. It's like, if there's one thing I identify as this, a New Yorker, like, I'd probably identify that as before. Before having a kid. I identified that as before anything. Before being like, oh, yeah, before I'm American, I'm a New Yorker. Like, so just to see the whole city, like, excited for me, it was like one of us did it. Like, I don't even know how many New Yorkers have done msg, you know, and so.

[Andrew Schulz]

Hometown hero.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. It just felt like I did something good for the city. And I'm so. I just love New York. Like, I. I'm even annoyed now. There's like this push about, like the liberal cities are falling apart. It's like, none of you want to live anywhere else. Shut up. Shut up. Like, I know you moved to Austin, but come on, you don't want to be here. Like, you know what I mean? It's okay. It's. It's okay. Like, I tell people, like, it was like, Austin's so amazing. I go, okay, stop. Do you want to be a stand up comedian? Okay, yeah, move to Austin. The opportunities for you, like Rogue and Kill Tony, all these things where you see young comics exploding are here. I get it. But like, you're not moving here for this, like, rich cultural experience. Do you know what I mean? There's like two restaurants. Everybody say the food is so good. It's like, yeah, because you are from Montana. You know what I mean? Like, you have a fucking pf Changs. And then you move here and you go to Uchi and you're like, oh, wow, this is fucking good. Yeah, there's 17 UCHIs in a three block radius in New York. Like, why are we even having this conversation? So it's. I think that the coastal cities need to get back to our elitism a little bit. I think we're a little like sad or like insecure or something like that right now. And it's just like, all right, there's.

[Andrew Schulz]

Still some hangover from COVID I think. You know, of course New York and LA put their. Both of their feet inside of their mouths for two years straight horse, of course.

[Chris Williamson]

And it was bad and it sucked the way they handled it, you know what I mean? And it's a very different thing to handle. Obviously, when you're living on top of each other and you're all going on subways to get dense, Just a different problem to solve. Like, everybody lives in their own house and you live a mile away from each other. Yeah, you can make a little bit less restrictive, you know what I mean? But when you live in an apartment building, you need some rules, you know what I mean? Like, the Puerto Ricans got to turn the music off at 10. That's a rule. That's government overreach, and I'm happy about it. And you don't understand it because you don't have an entire Puerto Rican family above you blasting bad bunny at 11 o'clock while your baby's trying to go to sleep. So there's certain things where you start to appreciate government overreach and where they come from. And then there's some where you're like, okay, this is ridiculous. I can't renovate my home without going to 15 different government agencies to get permission to put a mirror in my bathroom. It gets a little ridiculous. But in terms of, like, the great established cities in America, like, like, what are we talking about? Like, if the tax break, the tax rates were the same in Austin as they were in New York, none of y'all would live here. So stop acting like this is this amazing play. It's like, you want to save money. You're millionaires. I get it. It's millions of dollars. I get it. And none of you are, like, from New York, so you don't have any connection to it. But, like, to get me to move out of New York, do you know the deal I would have to sign? And I would do it if it was the right number, but, like, it's a tax saving thing. I. It's just. Say you're saving money. That's my thing. Like, and save the money. Do it. But don't give me this shit about all. This city is so amazing. Your plane couldn't even land because of the wind. What is that? Fucking wizard of Oz? What are we talking about? You know what I mean? I'm eating a salad today. A tomato flew off the salad, hit me in the chest, and I'm like, this is a city. Like, people choose to live here. The wind is taking tomatoes off of my plate. Right. So let's just. Let's just have an honest assortment assessment of what's going on here. Will you pay 12% more to not live here. I will, but I'm from New York and I love it. If you, if you're from another city and you just went to New York to make it and it looks like there's more opportunities here, then move here. Were you crazy? Why would you not do that?

[Andrew Schulz]

I think you need a very particular type of nervous system to live in New York. You need to be okay with chaos at all times. Like that doesn't seem to be much. And I guess you can be in different areas. New York is not just one thing.

[Chris Williamson]

Right.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, you can go fucking like upstate and whatever, but if you're talking anywhere around Manhattan, it's like you need to be able. You're in cocaine, first line, cocaine energy at all times.

[Chris Williamson]

All times. I mean, yeah, I'm, I'm just, I'm used to chaos. Chaos is comforting to me. I get more comfortable the more chaotic is.

[Andrew Schulz]

I asked Samarill about this and he said, what was it? That you can walk down the street, bump into somebody and think to yourself, I hope that guy dies. But later that night you think to yourself, good day.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. Yeah, that's funny. That's funny. Yeah, yeah, it's Shout out, Sam, man. Yeah, that is. Yeah. There is just a unique energy. It's. And I guess you, I think, I think growing up with it obviously makes it much easier to handle. I think it's probably daunting for people to move there. And that's why I say, like, you shouldn't move there unless you want to make it. It doesn't matter what you want to make it in. You want to make it in finance. Okay, do that. You want to make it in, you know, you want to be a doctor. Whatever the you want to do, do it. But like, just moving there for comfort is a stupid thing.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

You're going to spend tons of money and you're not going to be comfortable. There's no comfort. It's not comfortable.

[Andrew Schulz]

But there is opportunity.

[Chris Williamson]

It's opportunity. And you'll be the greatest at what you do. It's like the greatest of what they do come from there. Simple as that.

[Andrew Schulz]

Well, you have to be in order to survive, or else you just get chewed up.

[Chris Williamson]

And you're not the greatest unless you've lived in New York. Nobody who's the greatest at what they do in America has not spent time in New York. And you could say anything, like, I, I'm just trying to think anything like who. Just let's say it, like, whatever, any comedian. They lived in New York I'm sorry. They lived in New York. Anyone that is the greatest lived in New York. You gotta pass through. You gotta. Because if you wanna be the best, you gotta be with the best, and that's where they are. Any banker, you lived in New York. Name any chef, you lived in New York.

[Andrew Schulz]

It's a right of passage.

[Chris Williamson]

You gotta. It's not even. Like, how can we even know you're that good unless you can do it here? Like, if you can make it here, you make it anywhere. That's. That's a real statement.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah. The energy of New York kind of reminds me of what the news feels like at the moment. It's, like, unrelenting. And I was talking to Segura about this, that it's been, what, two months now? Less than two months Trump's been in office.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

And I've already got such fucking news. And, like, Trump fatigue.

[Chris Williamson]

I thought we were over this shit. It's so exhausting. I thought this time around, people would be like, okay, whatever.

[Andrew Schulz]

Seen it, done it.

[Chris Williamson]

But no, it's getting really, really.

[Andrew Schulz]

Like, I just. I can't. I'm checking out so much. And I'm aware this is a position of privilege, not need to care about what politics is impacting your life. Like, in some ways, maybe not needing to listen to the news.

[Chris Williamson]

Once you have kids. Bro, none of this. You don't care.

[Andrew Schulz]

You.

[Chris Williamson]

You care about, like, big ticket things that could affect them, but your life becomes so small. That's the other thing. It's like, people aren't having kids until, like, later. So that's why you get all these people that are, like, really active on the Internet because they're just bored. They have nothing to do. They want to, like, feel part of something. They want to make change. They don't realize it. Right. This is, like, something that's happening internally, but, like, everything just feels like the biggest deal once you, like, you don't see, like, a mom with three kids at, like, a protest during the week. Do you know what I mean? Like, she's trying to get them to nap. You know what I mean? You never see a mom with mayonnaise on her sweater at some fucking random protest for Tesla.

[Andrew Schulz]

How have you changed since you've become a dad?

[Chris Williamson]

Just the outside stuff doesn't matter as much. Like, I just care about, like, how my wife, my. My. My daughter think about me. Like, if my wife and my daughter are happy with me, like, my daughter's happy with me. I can even deal with my wife being pissed. Like, and then you know, everything just gets a little bit smaller. You, you're, you know, it's like. Yeah, it's just amazing. It's like the only thing you think about all day pretty much, you know? Yeah, just that little, you know, that little, little girl. It's just really awesome. And you've become like a real person. I'm not saying you're not a real person, but like, you just. There's a difference. Like once you have a family, like you're invested in the world in a way, different way and you become like a real human being. Like, even on stage, the second I mention that I have a kid, like, my relation to the audience is completely different. I'm not just some asshole with a fucking part in my hair, like, talking shit about all these things. Like everything actually impacts me.

[Andrew Schulz]

Publicly masturbating, like, look at how great I am.

[Chris Williamson]

What an asshole. What an asshole to do that. But now that I have a kid and like, anytime I bring up some trans shit or some vaccine shit, it's like, no, I have an actual reason to do that. You know what I mean? Like this.

[Andrew Schulz]

I've got skin in the game beyond just my own sense of being important.

[Chris Williamson]

Exactly. You know, so it's a beautiful thing. Like, I think it brings out like the best version of people I see the best version of people with their kids.

[Andrew Schulz]

I've got this theory that because people are having kids later, especially guys, that a lot of the stuff that people invest themselves into, the personal development, the self growth.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

The business, the muscle gain, all of that stuff. A lot of those projects are surrogate families because you haven't had one yet.

[Chris Williamson]

Oh, wow.

[Andrew Schulz]

And all of the energy that would be put into protect baby, protect wife or protect baby, protect husband. Like do the thing. Homemaking is. Well, I don't have that, but I've still got this sort of sense to be agentic and make something happen in the world.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

But I, I don't have this. The thing. I don't have a little thing. So I'm going to put it into a business or I'm going to put it into a side project or into my body or into my mindfulness or into my political party or whatever it might be.

[Chris Williamson]

Which is great. Like, especially where you're putting it into your body. I think that's great. Like, I love the longevity stuff. You know, you have a kid, you want to live longer, you know, naturally. Yeah, I like, I like that. But I think that you're right because there's no way that my wife would be like, hey, could you change the kid's diaper? And I'd be like, I have two minutes left in my ice bath. I'm sorry, you know, I need my ice bath. For the next two minutes you'll have to change the diaper. Like that doesn't exist, you know. So you have to manipulate and change your life.

[Andrew Schulz]

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[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, like I would say, like any kind of longevity stuff is just so I can play paddle. Do you know, paddle the sport? Yeah. Like so, like anything about me, like I go to like PT and I do all this up is just so I can continue playing this one thing, which is like a beautiful moment of distraction that takes me away from the, the lovely anxiety of, you know, bringing a human being into this world, you know, but yeah, it's, yeah, yeah, there's this thing. And also like every single day you feel purposeful. That's the other thing about having a kid that you don't realize. It's like you feel Proud of yourself by like, three. You know, like, when you don't have a kid and it's like a weekend and you're like, partied the night before, and you're just like, hungover and shit. And like, you partied the night before, and then you have a kid and you're up and taking care of it by, like, noon, you're like, I'm the man. Like, I should party. Some line. Yeah. Like, there isn't this, like, guilt and shame that you put on yourself. Like, what am I doing with my life?

[Andrew Schulz]

Why am I endless lead to always be creating stuff in the world? Because you've already done the creation thing.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, Like, I probably drink way more now, but I'm looking after my kids, so I'm like, I'm a responsible human being. Like, this is.

[Andrew Schulz]

Or a functioning alcoholic.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. Whatever it is. You know? But yeah, no, it's. It's cool, man. Do you want them?

[Andrew Schulz]

I can't wait to be a dad.

[Chris Williamson]

And what's your process with that? Like, how is it hard to meet people? Like, you're obviously, you know, successful, handsome guy, charming, smart. Like, do you find it difficult to connect with the women?

[Andrew Schulz]

It's weird dating when you're a little bit older. Like, I'm 37. I was 37 last week. And that's an interesting one because the longer that you wait, the kind of higher that your bar gets, and it's this sort of sunk cost fallacy thing where you think, well, I've waited this long. What's the point? You know, things you want to settle. Yeah, the things have to become more perfect, which, you know, in itself is a difficult circle to square because you also know, well, fucking clock's ticking, dude. Well, hurry up.

[Chris Williamson]

Think about that. So the older you get, the higher your bar is, and the older a woman gets, the lower her bars because she's running out of time. So it puts you guys in very difficult situations. Right. And there's this crazy societal expectation. Like, women's moms really put on women, like, get. You got to get married. Like, the second they're 11, they're like, you got to get married. You got to have kids. You got to, like, this pressure, pressure, pressure. So I think women are. I think women's greatest fear is being alone, not being with the wrong person. And our greatest fear is being with the wrong person. Like, I didn't meet my wife until late for the same reason I was like, I don't want to settle. I don't want to be with somebody, you know, Like, I figured out more or less how to, like, date. And like, I. I figured out, like, kind of, like what that person wanted, and I can kind of, like, be that version of that, but it didn't make me happy. Right. Which I imagine you've probably gone through in your life. Like, you know, you probably had tons of different girls. You're like, oh, this girl needs a listener. Oh, this girl needs this. And. But you're not being you, so you're not going to connect with that person. But the tricky thing is that women, because they're so afraid of being alone, I think a lot of them, they end up being with guys they don't really like. And that's what I think this, like, ick red flag culture is. Have you heard of women all on the Internet talking about their icks and the red flags? When you're with someone you don't like, everything about them is irritating. So you don't actually have the ick. You're not there aren't actually red flag. Oh, I don't like a guy when it's raining, he raises his shoulders. You know, I don't like a guy who, like, yawns without his can in his mouth. Like these stupid things that really would never impact how a girl feels about you. You just hate the guy you're with, but you're terrified of being alone.

[Andrew Schulz]

Because if you like the guy, that would be cute.

[Chris Williamson]

Everything we do is cute. The amount of, like, my wife watches me pick my nose ball up the booger and just flick it out of the playpen because I'm playing with my daugh and she's just like, that was disgusting. And it's fine. It doesn't impact how much she loves me at all. I'm farting left and right. I'm doing all these disgusting red flag ick things. But she loves me, so it doesn't matter. You know what I mean? And I think that. I think that, yeah, like, I. I never understood this, like, ick red flag culture. I was like, are women just, like, annoyed with us? What the fuck is going on? No, they don't want to be alone, and they're with guys they do not fucking like. It's a big. It's a huge issue.

[Andrew Schulz]

Well, there's a problem. Someone gave me this piece of advice not long ago as I. They said, do you want to be a dad? And I said, yes, I can't wait to be a dad. They sort of waggled their finger in my face and they said, make sure that you fall in love with the girl, not the institution. And the point being, if you want to be a dad or if you want to be a mom, a lot, great advice. You can. What was it they said with rose colored glasses on, red flags, don't look red. Like, if you just want the thing. Yep, I want to be a dad, I want to be a mom, I want to be married, I want to be not alone. Whatever the thing that you want, you're able to, ah, not so big of a deal. And it's like, you're not getting married to marriage, you're getting married to a person.

[Chris Williamson]

Yep.

[Andrew Schulz]

You're not having a baby with the process of childhood. You're having a baby with another human.

[Chris Williamson]

That's a great piece of advice. Dude. That is like, yeah, that's magnificent. And it's so true. You gotta find that connection with that person where even if you didn't have kids, you would be happy. You just love that person. And then kids are these blessings because that irritation will build. I'm sure you've dated people that like, you thought you liked in the beginning and then eventually it wasn't there. And it's just like every little thing drove you fucking crazy. And that we hopefully at that point we start going, I don't want to be with you. Or we just treat them shitty. Which is the worst version of it.

[Andrew Schulz]

Hoping that they'll like, it's the equivalent of, you can't fire me, I quit. But it's trying to get the other person to realize that, I'm not going to fire you, I'm going to make you quit.

[Chris Williamson]

I'm going to be a coward. That's. Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

I had a conversation with a friend a little while ago and he had this sentence where he said, all my life I was worried that I was a coward. And then he had a bunch of a sequence of really, really tough events happen to him. And he said, you know, I always surrounded myself with hard men. I always thought I was a bit of a hard man. And you know, I did martial arts and you know, I was like around people that were ex, like special Forces and stuff like that. It's like. But I never really, really tested myself. And then one day, like the world came and it wasn't discomfort that I'd chosen, it was discomfort that was forced on me by the world. Maybe like having a fertility.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Or whatever. And he said, all my life I'd heard my better self clearing his throat in the room next door.

[Chris Williamson]

Mm.

[Andrew Schulz]

And one day this thing happened and he was Like, I wonder if he's gonna kick the door in and fucking stop coughing and come through. He was like, he did.

[Chris Williamson]

That's good.

[Andrew Schulz]

And. But courage. Yeah, I think you can pretty much, like, life. Your. Your life is kind of restricted by the amount of courage that you're prepared to deploy. And, I mean, how many. How long have everybody listening to this stayed in relationships because they were terrified of breaking somebody else's heart that was dependent on them or losing the love of somebody that they felt it was unrequited and they needed the validation of. And, yeah, you're like. Like, it's noble and understandable and sensitive and largely driven by fear and cowardice.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

And if you had, like, you know, a cool question to ask yourself would be, what would I do if I had three times the bravery? Like, what would I do?

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

What decisions would I make?

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

If I was, like, three times as brave as I am?

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. Well, yeah, a lot of times we think that it's not a lack of bravery, but it's a. It's a. It's too much compassion, you know, like, breaking up with this person would be too hurtful for them, and we don't realize that, like, being with them when you don't like them is actually way more hurtful. And we don't even realize it's this bravery deficit. We're like, ah, I'm too calm, too nice. I'm just too nice.

[Andrew Schulz]

I don't want to hurt her.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. You're being a. And we've all been pussies. I've been tons of times. And then we'll, like, retrofit justifications. We're like, no, man. It's about being loyal and committing to something. It's like, yeah, you do that when you find the right girl. When you find the right girl, you commit to it and you work everything out. And that is another thing, too. It's like marriages you look at in movies and shit like that, and you think it's just, oh, this is just going to be super sweet and perfect in every single thing. No, no, it's fucking hard when you do it with the right person. You're willing to work through all those difficult times, and then you get confidence in your ability to work through difficult shit.

[Andrew Schulz]

You two against the hard. Not you two against each other. Yeah. What changes in a relationship or sort of. What have you noticed about stuff that's interesting to navigate once there's a third participant?

[Chris Williamson]

So, like, there's this part of you that you want your kid to know how loved they are. Like, I don't ever want my daughter to even understand what it is to be, like, adored because it's so normal. You know what I mean? Like, I like my. My friend. So my friend Jamil, he reminded me this recently. Like, my dad was just the best. He was just the. He. He was at every single basketball game, whatever, and he goes. And he was like. It was almost like a surrogate dad to a lot of my friends, you know? Like, he was just, like.

[Andrew Schulz]

He had so much dad energy that he had it spilling over around the cup.

[Chris Williamson]

Loved it. He just loved it. Like, he was just whatever they needed. Like, I remember one of my boys got into, like, trouble on some gang shit. And, like, my dad, I was like, yeah, I think he can't, like, leave his house. Like, they're like, there's this gang that's kind of, like, after him or whatever. And I was like, yeah, we gotta help him out. And my dad was like, well, yeah, why don't we just go get the car and go pick him up? And I was like, are you sure you feel comfortable doing this? Yeah. So we, like, drive a Toyota Sienna minivan into the fucking heart of the Bronx, and we're, like, picking up my boy so he doesn't get murdered by this gang. And it's just the typing. Like, he didn't even think twice about it. It's just kind of who he is. And so you. There's all this focus on, like, okay, I want her to feel loved. I want her to feel supported. I want. Anytime she shows excitement around me, I want that to be met. I don't want her to feel, like, ignored. And I notice. So I'll call my wife to FaceTime. Like, and around the baby's naps. So if I'm, like, at work or something like that, like, I'm just. I know when the baby's up. Boom, the call. And I called my wife, I think it was today. And she was, like, in the car, coming back from, like, a class or something. And then she's like, oh, I know you're calling to say hi to Shiloh, but I'm not home just yet. And I was like, oh, fuck, I gotta call to say hi to you more, too. Like, it's very easy to just put all the focus on your daughter. And they cannot resent you for that because they love that you're so committed to this childhood.

[Andrew Schulz]

You're being a good dad. Yes, but not necessarily a great husband.

[Chris Williamson]

You gotta also. I realize I gotta also Be making those calls when it's just her and just talking to her and putting that time in.

[Andrew Schulz]

Is it challenging to keep the romance alive?

[Chris Williamson]

I mean, yeah, I mean, like, of course. You know, it's really the sleep that is the challenge over everything. It's. Once you have a baby, there's no real sleeping, especially if your wife breastfeeds. Like, they're up every two hours, even in the night. Like, so there's no, like, you, like, scheduling, you know, like, you're like, okay, we got to do it around this window, and this is the window. And, like, maybe sometimes you guys go out and you let it rip, but, you know, you gotta be up every morning, 6:45. We're up every morning, 6:45, whether we want to sleep in or not. It's 6:45. That baby's waking up around, like, 6:30. They kind of look up in the sky for a little bit and then they're like, all right, it's time for some fucking titty. And then it's go time. So it's. It's more just about, like, creating those moments and, like, scheduling them, but not really making it feel scheduled, if you will, you know?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah. Well, I imagine I've heard you talk about this before. The role of thoughtfulness.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Relationships.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

And how difficult it must be to be thoughtful because all of your fucking attention and energy is just being put into this tiny thing that's totally. This blob.

[Chris Williamson]

Right?

[Andrew Schulz]

It's a blob. It's a big blob of stuff.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

You and her and what thoughtfulness have you got? Trying to keep it alive.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, yeah, it's. It is. But you gotta do it. You gotta do it, because the better you guys are, the better that baby is at, you know, having a shot at life. You know, fractured families, they fuck kids up. They fuck kids up.

[Andrew Schulz]

I listened to the first half of Andrew Tate on Patrick Bet David's podcast.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, how was that? How do you feel about Tate coming back?

[Andrew Schulz]

Interesting one, dude. I mean, he's currently being subpoenaed, investigated. Something by the state of Florida just opened up, some warrant type thing for him. I think it's a bit of a brave call from the US to do that at like, this time, to be like, yeah, yeah, yeah, come on over. When we're talking about worries about trafficking and migrant. The UK's got lots of concerns about grooming gang. You can say what you want about the validity of the case around Tate, optics are optics.

[Chris Williamson]

So, yeah, you're speaking on something That I really like, which is there are facts and then there is emotional reactivity. Optics is what you're talking about. And people are emotional. They just react emotionally to whatever they see. And it's important to meet them there. Do you know what I mean? Like, there's gonna be an idea of who you are from people who don't really know you. Casuals on the Internet that might see a single clip. And that idea that they have, maybe it's wrong, but just going, oh, you're wrong and writing it off isn't how you're gonna address a bigger problem.

[Andrew Schulz]

This is where Ben Shapiro gets it 100% backward. He says facts don't care about your feelings. Yeah, this one in particular.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

It's like feelings do not give a single fuck about the fact.

[Chris Williamson]

But he's like an autistic robot. Like, he doesn't understand. He caught a great grift off, like the Christians. And now that he no longer has societal utility, he's like really struggling. Like, societal utility is oftentimes what can make people, like, really powerful. And he rose to fame at a time where, like, conservatives felt like, really scrutinized just for their beliefs. And a lot of them just didn't have the arguments to defend their positions. Right. They grew up in cities and states where it was normal to be a conservative. And then all of a sudden they're in these other places where like, can I even share this? That can I say I'm a conservative, like really radioactive to be conservative. Then all of a sudden he's like this, like really obviously smart, Harvard educated arguer. He's like a really good arguer in developing ideas and bits and putting together these arguments. They're like foolproof. And he handed them off to those people. But now being conservative is more popular, super mainstream than being Democratic.

[Andrew Schulz]

This was the point I was saying earlier on about, you know, you can speak truth to power and be that sort of. It was almost like, like rock starry, like kind of like rebellious anarchistic type thing. It's like, it's just the kind of position that most people hold now around a lot of the. Yeah, we probably should be careful about what we're doing to teenagers.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Hormones we should probably be a little bit concerned about.

[Chris Williamson]

So now that it's the norm, he no longer has the same societal utility.

[Andrew Schulz]

That's interesting.

[Chris Williamson]

And then Israel, Palestine happens, and now the base doesn't agree with him. And now they're like, well, we don't need you for the arguments. It's like normal to be conservative now, it's like, if anything, Democrats need the arguments, right? So now like, and we don't agree with you on the Israel, Palestine thing, man, the fuck out of here.

[Andrew Schulz]

But yeah, I mean when you think about the.

[Chris Williamson]

So he caught a good grift, but you know, the Griffs only last for so long.

[Andrew Schulz]

Would you make it the Tate thing? I'm coming back.

[Chris Williamson]

I mean, he's an American citizen. You have to protect American citizens. And just because he hasn't been convicted of anything, so on. He hasn't been convicted of anything. He's an American citizen. We have to protect our citizens. And you're allowed to say whatever you want as an American. This is free speech. We believe in all those things. So like there's no question whether you have to let an American back. Of course you have to let American back. Now the emotional reaction is you were talking crazy about America and then when you get clipped over there in Romania, now you're coming back to daddy. So I need, I need you to acknowledge who the goat is. I don't need you talking about the west this and America's that and the west is falling. Well, why are you coming back to the fall? Like when it got rough and they were locking you and your brother up, probably wrongfully, I don't know. He's not convicted. Like if there was enough to convict, they would have convicted, right? But you came running back. So I need you to at least acknowledge why you came running back.

[Andrew Schulz]

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[Chris Williamson]

That's the thing. I think that's the thing right there. Like, obviously, he's a phenomenal communicator, and he really. He understands culture. He understands, like, trends that are popping up. I'm not talking about, like, a trend, like wearing clothing. I'm talking about, like, ideological and emotional trends. Like, what people he can fucking tap in. There's no question. But there is a part of me that is like, you talk crazy shit about America, and now you're coming back because you got in trouble. I need to know, like, everybody, a lot of people gave Brittney Griner shit when she got arrested in Russia, right? They gave her a lot of shit for, like, kneeling for the anthem and then asking America to help her to get back. Where's the Brittney Griner treatment? Where's the Brit? Like, where's this Brittany Griner energy now? People are emotional, so it doesn't really matter. They're like, I can look past that because he's satisfying these other concerns that I have emotionally, and he's voicing in the most eloquent way, and he really makes me feel seen and heard. So they'll look past this other shit. But to me, I'm looking at this Britney Griner now. I want Britney back. You know, should she have had the weed in her thing? No, don't bring a weed pen into Russia. You know, that they might try to use this as for some political leverage in this situation that we're in. It's a. It's annoying. You shouldn't have fucking done it. And you put America in a position where we got to give you Back. The. The Nicholas Cage guy from the movie. Right. We. To give you Nicholas Cage back to get Brittany Griner. Right. But the end of day, she's an American, and if American gets clipped, we're going to ride for our boys, our girls.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's going to be interesting to see what happens, man. Holy fuck. Like, I just can't. This goes back to what I said before about the pace of the news.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Like, every single hour. Remember when Trump got shot in the ear? Were you online? Were you like. I mean, everybody kind of got dragged online when it happened. I remember I was in Montana. I was in Bozeman, Montana.

[Chris Williamson]

Of course.

[Andrew Schulz]

Sat at dinner. You know, every single person is just like, glued. Fog of war. No one has any. And I remember thinking, this is the quickest I've ever seen news move.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

And now if you're offline for four hours, you come back on and you're like, holy. What that happened? What in how long?

[Chris Williamson]

Dude, I took a nap today. I woke up, and he's doing the press conference for, like, the Doge Cuts in front of, like, the whole Senate, and there's, like, they're kicking out hecklers. I thought it was, like, one of my shows. It was like, I think Al Green got, like, escorted out of the Senate. It was amazing. I mean, and then the reactions on the Internet was, yeah, it's. It's a lot. But that's the thing that. This is the tricky thing about the administration right now. Understanding the mechanism of politics, being a good politician. As much as we go, oh, I hate politicians, it is valuable in that you want to be able to disseminate information that Americans already support in a way where they feel comfortable continuing to support it. I don't know if there's any American out there that's like, I like waste, I like corruption, I like fraud. All of us unanimously are like, yeah, I think the government's got some waste, corruption and fraud, and we should get that out of there. Those should be a bipartisan victory for America. And I think that the way that's kind of being positioned and there's, like, a little antagonism in it, and there's not. Maybe. And Elon's on this, too. He's like, he's responsible for this, too. It's a little bit antagonistic. Yes. No need to twist the knife. It's like, you already got everybody on board, and then when you, like, fire some people and have to rehire them, it's okay to be like, hey, we made a Mistake. We're humans. We're gonna make mistakes and we're gonna.

[Andrew Schulz]

Do our best as opposed to sort of sticking it in the nose of everybody else. Look at how useless this is. Yeah, I had this. I had this insight a couple of years ago that if you really care about changing people's minds, you'll dial back the sort of aggression of your argument, because very few people are patronized or shamed or passive aggressed into changing their mind. So this sort of soft signal of effectiveness, dude, if you really, really care about changing people's minds, you'll actually go more gently, not more aggressively. And I don't think it's a really astute point to say that. I don't think that we're seeing that. And what did you expect? Like, you positioned yourself as the adversary to this other side and then said, they should be on board. They should take me, like, whipping them and scorning them and laughing at them and mocking them, and they should still come begging back to Daddy.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, it is. It is tricky also, because obviously the opposition is going to campaign against whatever the decision is, because I think Democrats are still, like, they don't. They still think that if you just paint Trump and Elon, all these people as bad, that that will allow them to win. When you don't even have to paint them as bad. Like, you just need to give us hope and abundance. Like, all Americans want is abundance. Americans are kind of simple. I'll be honest with you. Like, we're very simple people. What is more, you know, like, buffets are popular here. That's more. What is the biggest steak? More like Cheesecake Factory? Just more. Give me more. Like, so when Trump goes up and he's like. And also, you could just say shit without doing it. And we like it. Like, when Trump goes Greenland, I think that might be ours. We go. That seems more. That seems like a lot more. I like it. If that never happens, it's fine. What Democrats need to do is, in my opinion, just start saying the things that you want to do that give me abundance and be radical about it. Stop being concerned about, like, pissing every little group off. Be radical. I need an outsider Democrat to go, eggs are a dollar. We're capping it. We're subsidizing it. Like, we subsidize corn. If all these corn and dairy farmers get their money, why can't the egg farmers get theirs? It's a dollar for eggs. That's what it is when we get in. It's a dollar for eggs. I Guarantee you saying, hey, we're taking that land over there. We're building 10,000 affordable housing units and we're going to drop the price of rent by 30% in this city. And then saying, I don't give a fuck about what these fancy developers think they're going to do with it. It's saying, we're gonna drop. Say some shit. Be risky. We liked Bernie because he was, like, taking shots at all these billionaire corporations. Like, who the fuck is this guy? Like, I need you to be brave, but understand who the bad guy is. They're looking at Trump and Elon and going, those guys are the bad guys. No, the majority of the country voted for them. They don't see them as bad yet. You could try to make them radioactive, but they don't really see them as bad. You know who they do see as bad is the people stopping them from getting eggs and the people stopping them from paying rent. Bad. It's. I don't know. Do you understand what I'm saying? Like. Like, I feel like this is like. If you actually listen to people, it's not really that difficult to.

[Andrew Schulz]

Such an addiction to purity, though. Inside of the left. Right, like, everybody's done the why I left the left thing, right?

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Sort of classic Dave Rubin arc from.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Disaffected leftists to now person that's on the right because they. I didn't leave the left. They went away from it. Whatever version of that you want to do. Has anybody. Can you think of anybody that's gone in the opposite direction? That's gone from, like, right of center and then being. I am now a spokesperson for the left?

[Chris Williamson]

Wow, that's a great question. I'm sure there are people.

[Andrew Schulz]

There probably are, but they don't come to mind in the same way. Right. You don't have the same. Like, rfk, Tulsi Gabbard, Elon Rogan, you know, and those are. That's just like the fucking biggest names in the world of this.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. Wow, that's a really good point.

[Andrew Schulz]

And it's because there is such a level of purity that you need to reach in order to be accepted by the left. The right will take you, flawed as you are. This sort of political leper coming in with like, a foot missing and fucking your ears hanging off, and they're like, you kind of. All right. I mean, we don't fully agree with you on that thing, but we'll take it. You know, the perfect example of this. Remember when Nicki Minaj, for like, two weeks during COVID was anti vax and the right was like come here fucking anaconda. Like bring the fucking BBL our way. And they were like she's a fucking darling, we'll take her.

[Chris Williamson]

That's true.

[Andrew Schulz]

But if your coalition is held together firstly by finding people who do not have sufficiently pure opinions, pointing at them as scapegoats and saying that they're part of the out group.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

That's like fucking seppuku or Harry Carrie or whatever it's called. That's like the most self immolation because you're just finding an increasingly small number of people that meet an increasingly high bar of purity.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

That's. You're like, all you're doing is shrinking your fucking coalition over and over until it's like one person left.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

And the right doesn't have that problem.

[Chris Williamson]

Well, because they weren't in power. When you're in power you start to become very drunk on your own.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

It's just like, like a country club is hard to get into. Those are the people in power.

[Andrew Schulz]

Interesting. So you're saying that sort of the elitism, the exclusionary thing is it's enabled by being in power.

[Chris Williamson]

It's queers for Palestine. You know, it's like anybody who's down.

[Andrew Schulz]

To help we're going to take because we need it.

[Chris Williamson]

We need it. So you take anybody's help, you don't fucking care if you're struggling, whoever's going to help you. And then when you're in power you get very specific about the people who want to help you.

[Andrew Schulz]

Well, maybe you apply. Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

Let's see. We're going to look in and see your total beliefs and how you feel about the entire world.

[Andrew Schulz]

I do. That's, that's it. I will be fascinated to see if that sort of right of center permission increase amount of permission that they have to accept people. If that gets reversed.

[Chris Williamson]

That will happen without a doubt. Over the next few years you will see these like Stephen A. Smith types who will proliferate Democratic circles who are in no way the like ideal version of a Democrat from four years ago or six years ago. But what they will see is salvation in them. And they'll be like this is he has enough of our values and he could potentially win or at least he could espouse the shit that could make.

[Andrew Schulz]

Our party look body joy behard the other day. That was incredible.

[Chris Williamson]

But that's, I mean, but that's kind of what you need.

[Andrew Schulz]

You know what else I think if I was to just chuck a little Bet on for something that's very, very reliably going to happen over the next three years before the end of this administration. The mother of all blowups between Elon and Trump.

[Chris Williamson]

So how do you see that happening? I've heard a lot of people, Charlemagne talks about this all the time. Trump thinks that. Sorry, Charlamagne thinks Trump is going to put him in prison.

[Andrew Schulz]

Okay, that's a take that I hadn't heard before.

[Chris Williamson]

But yeah, but what do you now, you know, Charlamagne is very Democrat. Like obviously he's going to have some bias that goes into this. But, but what do you, what is your take and how do you see that relationship going?

[Andrew Schulz]

I just think that when you've got two people with so much power and ego, and I do, from what I can tell, Elon's ego and that sort of self focused self belief, like, it's me, it's me. And like I'm going to be the center of all of this. Seems to be ramping up. That is probably a pretty dangerous cocktail based on some stories and stuff that I've heard about behind the scenes from, from Trump about some levels of vulnerability and then sort of like flimsy senses of. He doesn't like to be shown up, doesn't like to be sort of upstaged and, and I don't know if, I.

[Chris Williamson]

Don'T know if Elon has the emotional intelligence of JD Vance to be able.

[Andrew Schulz]

To tiptoe around and yes, sir, no sir, three bikes full, sir.

[Chris Williamson]

JD and why I say do not treat that man lightly. I think he has like, he came from like poverty. I think his mom was like a drug addict. Like, and then he ends up going to Yale and then he becomes the VP of a guy that he campaigned against and said was horrible and like a tyrant. Do you know the level of emotional intelligence it takes to go from like a broke middle America, broken family to an Ivy League institution to then VP for the guy who does not, he doesn't always keep in it. Like, you can say things about Trump, but if, if it's advantageous for whatever his plan is, he will forgive you. You know, he's kind of like Vince Mann in that regard. Like, whatever works for the thing, but like that takes high eq. Even in that moment with Zelinsky, he's managing Trump. Like he's, he did have a moment for himself, but everything he said was, and you show respect to Trump and Donald Trump's office and what, so he.

[Andrew Schulz]

Knows the game he's playing.

[Chris Williamson]

Oh, that what I'm saying is don't treat him lightly. What our coastal elites, we always do is when someone has a kind of Southern accent, we think they're idiots, and we don't even really pay attention to them. And that man is someone I see a problem with JD Before I see Elon.

[Andrew Schulz]

But what do you think's gonna happen with Elon long term? With Trump?

[Chris Williamson]

Nothing.

[Andrew Schulz]

Do you think that he's gonna dance through the minefield?

[Chris Williamson]

I think he's acutely aware of his limitations in America. He cannot physically be president, but if he could be president, I think there is a concern, because eventually he'll go. When they have an impasse, he'll just go, well, I'll just run against you. He cannot. The laws dictate he cannot.

[Andrew Schulz]

So inevitably, you're going to have to bow down at some point.

[Chris Williamson]

This is the highest. You're as high as you can go.

[Andrew Schulz]

That's only based on the fact that you can put the outcomes that you want for your project behind your ego.

[Chris Williamson]

Yes.

[Andrew Schulz]

And I'm not sure which one is going to be a priority.

[Chris Williamson]

The only other thing he could do is leverage the Democrats, which have already made him radioactive. Like, no Democrat can side with Elon. So Elon is as far as he can go in America. He can't go any further. Like, this is outside of being present. Like, there's that great line in Game of Thrones where, like, Cersei is talking to Littlefinger, and Littlefinger is like, you know, you know, Littlefinger, the character. And Littlefinger goes, you know, what I've learned over the years is that, you know, knowledge is power. And there's all these guards around her and them. And she goes, guards, slit his throat. And they all walk up and put a knife to his throat. And then she goes, guards, stand down. Guards take two steps back. Guards, take six steps back. And then she goes, power is power, and it's just so fire. And it's like, Trump has power. Power's power. That is the closest Elon can get to power. And I don't think there's another president that will allow Elon to have that access to power. So Elon either has to hope there's another person that he could ride with and establish relationship, and maybe that's JD but he have to wait to the next administration anyway. So what he can't do is sour all the Republicans on him. Like, I, I, I cannot see the situation where they get into trouble because there's nowhere else for him to go. He'd either have to jump parties which is very difficult after chastising the left all the time. Like, he's kind of made his bed and he's high. He has access to all these things. And I think it does benefit him the most if America is successful, because all his businesses are tied up in America, he could jump ship to another country. But that's not the thing I worry about because I think he's smart enough to understand the position he's in. Eventually you hit the. This is what happens with all rich people that actually want to move weight around. You hit the impasse of government and you have people who are way less successful than you, way poorer than you, telling you whether you can or can't build a factory or do whatever you want to do. And in that moment, they go, fuck, I just worked my ass off. I got fucking yachts and everything. And now I got to go kiss this guy's dick. Like, you saw them all lined up behind Trump during the inauguration. Zuckerberg, Basil, everybody went to kiss the ring. And he set him up, letting everybody else know they're kissing the ring. And I think Elon goes, I got the best seat. It don't get better than this. And this guy trusts me and believes in me. I can't fuck this up. And he's dealt with governors, mayors, and all this other shit that he doesn't respect at all. So he's like, it's not going to get better than this. I don't think he can ruin it. If they change the rule to let non citizens become president now we have an issue. But Trump would never change that rule because it's as a security blanket right there. It's actually kind of like brilliantly done by Trump. It's ride with me against the left. Now Elon can't go to the left, so he has to be loyal to you. It's like he's Zelensky.

[Andrew Schulz]

Well, everybody that's associated with Trump is so unspeakable and toxic that they're never going to be allowed back.

[Chris Williamson]

So now you got the loyalty built right there.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

Can I ask you a question about Russia? Do you feel an existential threat? Threat? Do you feel Russia is an existential threat? As a European?

[Andrew Schulz]

That's an interesting question. So no, at least. But the UK and Europe feel like very different places. Forget Brexit, forget the fact that we actually left the European Union. Yeah, we just don't think about that. I think that people in the UK feel that they are much closer to America and are under the on, maybe not quite on par, but that they're in that circle much more than we are with Norway or Finland or Switzerland or some. Yeah, but I, I understand that a lot of people are worried about in Europe. What does the potential support of Russia or lack of support for the Ukraine mean? It's Russia just going to keep on bowling through. It's Donbass, Paris and then London.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Like, what's going to stop? I don't know. I think, to be honest, I think that the UK has got such huge domestic problems at the moment that they're.

[Chris Williamson]

They're not even worried about. I was speaking to comedian named Ari Matty and he, he's from Estonia and he grew up, like, feeling Russia as an existential threat. And. And he's like, yeah, like, we get taught all the time that, like, they could come invade. And he's like, yeah, they're teach him in Russian schools. Like, Estonia is actually part of Russia and one day we'll get it back. Like, so Americans were so far away from this idea of, like, Russian invading. I was trying to understand Zelensky's, like, confidence going into this meeting with Trump. Like, I didn't understand why he, he felt comfortable pushing back. Because I think the American perspective is like, you guys can't survive without us. That's the perspective to any country we kind of give weapons to. It's like, you can't do it without us. Right. And I think that's a lot of times, like the, the hotbed conversation, even with Israel, Palestine here, is that, like, the perspective for Americans is like, Israel cannot defend itself without American weapons. So applying pressure to America is what actually stops the war right now. I don't even know if that's true. I don't know if maybe Israel can. I'm not sure. But that's the American feeling. Right. So when he said that to me, I was like, oh, shit. Maybe that's why Zelenskyy had so much confidence in that meeting, because he's like, oh, yeah, everybody knows that Russia will just steamroll into Europe. And then. So all these European countries won't let that happen. And we're the heroes fighting at the front line to make sure that Paris is not part of Russia. So they would never, like, I wonder if he walked in with the confidence of, like, they would be crazy to not keep funding this because next it's going to be, Germany's taken over. Of course they're going to give us the money because that's the only thing that could justify the attitude in the room. Does that make sense?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, absolutely. Well, you've definitely got. It feels like you've got an ace in your pocket and you think, what the fuck is that?

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Like, why is it that you're not that worried? I don't know, man. I mean, how quickly we forgot about the issue of Russia and Ukraine because everything kicked off in Gaza, and then how quickly we'd forgotten about Gaza now that Russia and Ukraine are back in the headlines. Wow.

[Chris Williamson]

Isn't that. Yeah, we stepped away from it completely. I used to see people's windows change in New York. It was a Black Lives Matter flag. Then it got taken down, and then it was a Ukraine flag and it got taken down, and then it was a Palestine flag, and then it got taken down probably back to a Ukraine.

[Andrew Schulz]

It's like, what do you think's going on with the Epstein list? You see this? It's been treated like the fucking longest album drop of all time. People holding it like it's the fucking Wu Tang Clan's unreleased mixtape. They're like, George R.R. martin, when are you going to release the next Game of Thrones? Like, Jesus Christ, dude.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. I don't know. My suspicion is that most of these things are far less interesting than we build them up to be. And that, like, I think in our brains, when we build out justifications for them for these things, we remove the idea of incompetence. Incompetence never exists in a conspiracy. Right. As conspiracy is always like this nefarious intent that was thoroughly plotted and executed. Even the 911 is an inside job thing. And I think that there's been a lot of details on this. My suspicion is that there was probably American intelligence agencies that were aware that a plot was being planned. And this is where the. The arguments. Did they purposely let it happen so that this could. Or were they pushed to let it happen? Or did they not take it seriously? And then it happens, and then everyone at that agency is in a position of power, is going, oh, this is my fault. I let this. Okay, we got to find a way to make it seem like this is not on. And my suspicion is that is most conspiracy stuff where it's like, there's some incompetence and then someone trying to cover up incompetence, and that leads to this insane conspiracy because this person's trying to protect a lie. So the Epistine thing.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, well, I mean, look, people hold two very contradictory thoughts in their mind at the same time. One being government is so useless that we need this South African guy to come in and rip it apart. And they couldn't run a piss up in a brewery. And they're all spending all of their time speaking to donors. And also they are the overlords that are creating the new world order. And we need to be very concerned about them. The CIA and the NSA and the FBI and the three letter agencies, and they're trying to trans the kids. And you go, well, which one is it?

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, it's nowhere. It's neither. It's in the middle.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, it's like this. There's gonna be some. Sure, there'll be some really, really competent, really nasty, mean spirited people trying to get stuff done. And even if. Let's say that that's like a significant portion, who are the foot soldiers that are trying to do it? These, like, employed retards that have managed to, like, stumble their way into fucking government. And you go, okay, are you really gonna trust him, John? John's gonna deploy your master plan to, like, new world order. The global vaccine passport.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Really?

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. Yeah, it's. Yeah, it's tricky. I mean, the thing that I would like to do for the Epstein list is I don't know if we ever get a list, but I would love to hear Lex Wexner. Les Wexner. Is that his name? The guy who is the. So Epstein managed one guy's money and his name is Les Wexner. The guy, I think he lives in, like, Ohio. He's the guy who started Victoria's Secret. Yeah. And he only managed one guy's money, so that's where he was able to leverage all these relationships and do all this other shit with this one guy's mic. And I don't think Victoria's Secret is what it used to be. I don't think girls are buying Victoria Secret lingerie anymore. I think the business is kind of. It will be in Target soon or something. Right. So now he does, and he's also, like 90 years old. Give him immunity and just tell us what it was. What's going on? Were you compromised? Was it Mossad? Was it CIA? Was it both? Like, just tell us. Give somebody immunity and tell us what happened. Like, even the Ghislaine, I can't trust the immunity because her dad was all fucking mobbed up or whatever. So this guy is the guy who's the money guy. Just. He's fucking 90. Like, who cares? Yeah, give him immunity and then what you'll get is at least like, we're. We're dying to figure out what the fuck happened. Just give us Enough nutrients where we can move on. Right. Like, now, it is delicate. Obviously, you have. There's a lot of, like. They're like, release the list. And it's like, okay, well, there's a lot of, like, girls who are teenagers probably on this list that are like, Nate. Like, so I get that, like, you have to talk to them to make sure that's good before you redact it. But if you got a bunch of senators who are out there or like, these tech people, like, yeah, release it.

[Andrew Schulz]

Run it.

[Chris Williamson]

I just don't know if we ever get it. But I think he is the key. So I would like to know. I think you can.

[Andrew Schulz]

A really strategically smart move.

[Chris Williamson]

Just. It trickles down. You need money to be qualified to be in all these circles. They only trust you because you're managing this guy's money. He's got to know something. And he gave you the money instead of Jamie Dimon. He could give anybody the money. So just tell us what the fuck is going on, Les, and then you get to die. Not a complete shithead. Like, you're still a shithead, but at least people will be like, all right.

[Andrew Schulz]

You go to last breath. You did something pretty cool.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. I mean, I don't know. What would you do? Do you think we'll ever see it? Do you think?

[Andrew Schulz]

I don't know, man. I mean, I love the idea that we just need to close the loop so that we can stop talking about it.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

So that there's no more speculation for this. It's, you know, it's the fucking. It's the 911 inside job thing. It's just this permanent, like, who was DB Cooper? Was it this person? It's like, dude, just. Can someone give us a definitive answer so that we can stop asking the question?

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, like, that's what we need to do. Like, everybody, like Joe has exposed so much, like, amazing information about the world that has completely, like, blown our minds about what reality really is. And it would be awesome if each one of them went on the pod and just confirmed it all. It's just like, okay, yeah, we shot jfk. This is what happened. And then somebody from NASA goes, now we really did go to the moon, and we faked the video because it was hard to get the video for, but we did really go. And just imagine, like, Imagine a series of, like, 20 Rogan episodes where you get confirmation on all the alternative, like, history.

[Andrew Schulz]

It's not conspiracy theories. These are conspiracy facts.

[Chris Williamson]

Yes.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

Like, how awesome would that be? And they. They gotta go on Joe Though, and it has to be the ones that he's, you know, brought to light. Oh my God, would that not be.

[Andrew Schulz]

Amazing on Alex Cooper? The real arbiter of truth, isn't she? Speaking of that, did you see Brian Johnson on Keeping up with the Kardashians?

[Chris Williamson]

I saw a clip randomly. You know, we had him on the pod.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I saw. He's a sweetie.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, he is a sweetie. He's got some dark shit. Yeah, I told him when I, when we were there. It's like, I think he's replaced like being Mormon with living forever. And so maybe dark is the wrong way to put it, but it is a very radical. Like how radical is Mormonism that like you could do that?

[Andrew Schulz]

Well, him and Human had a big bust up on Twitter.

[Chris Williamson]

Ooh, what'd they say?

[Andrew Schulz]

Brian was flexing his leg. Press numbers. And Huberman replied and said, friends don't let friends do half reps. Like kind of the range of motion being a thing. And then that caused loads of blah, blah. But I've got to assume. I didn't know Andrew is friends with the Kardashians. The scene where Brian's in there has got all of the Kardashians but also got Huberman in there. But this must have been filmed months and months and months ago, I have to assume. And it's only just come out. So I was watching that thinking this is like my Zelensky Trump moment. That this is these two people that have had fucking massive beef online finally coming together. And I'm thinking I'm getting to what they're going to like, fucking. That wasn't a quarter rap. That was actually me doing. It's actually £1,000. It's not £950.

[Chris Williamson]

Like why do they beef? What's the.

[Andrew Schulz]

Because Andrew replied to Bright's like the most fucking middle school thing. Andrew applied to Brian and criticized his range of motion on A one.

[Chris Williamson]

No, but like they must have some other beef that that even happened, right?

[Andrew Schulz]

No, that was just a. It was just a passing comment.

[Chris Williamson]

And then Brian took it really seriously. Oh man.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

And you know he has no excuse to do that because we know you have a perfect sleep score. You can't even be like, dude, I was exhausted. I had a. It's like, no, you slept 14 hours yesterday.

[Andrew Schulz]

You stopped eating at 11am so you could get good sleep. Yeah, yeah. I don't know. I mean the only thing that could have made that table better between all of the Kardashians, Brian Johnson and Andrew Huberman would have been like, coked up Conor McGregor. Just the fucking wild card that gets thrown in there.

[Chris Williamson]

Who the fuck is this guy?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, I think that Conor McGregor's arc should be studied by like fucking anthropologists or something as just what happens when a guy who really wanted to be rich and famous gets exactly what he wanted and turns out was completely unprepared to deal with it all.

[Chris Williamson]

You wanna know something interesting? So he came to meet up with us one night in New York and he was fucked up. He had some drinks. But he was the nicest, most humble guy. He. When you, A lot of times when you meet famous people, like, they're not really used to asking people their thoughts on things. You know, they're just like, in this. Yeah. And it's, it's. I don't even. Like, I have empathy for it because people are just asking them questions because it's hard to like, share your opinion on the world when you're with this incredibly successful person. So they just get into this system where they, they, they basically go, oh, people want to know things about me, so I will share.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, I'll just cut to the chase and give him other one.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, I'll give you what you want. He was like, curious. Like, we were talking about fights. He was like, well, yeah, what'd you think about the fight? Like, you're asking me what I thought about the fight? Like, you're professional fighter. You're like probably the most prolific. Not probably you are the most prolific MMA fighter in history. Like, you're synonymous with fight sports. Like, you're asking me my opinion on it. Like, and we were having a conversation like a couple guys at a bar. And as wild as I see him in all these things, I'll never forget that moment where he was curious about what I thought. And ever since then, I look at these things as. Is he stirring up moments. Is this like wrestling? Does he just really get into the. The vibe and the attention of it? Like, I also understand, like, you reach a certain amount of success and you are clout. I'm sure you've experienced this. Like, you get over a certain amount of followers and now somebody making a video about you is currency. They can pay their rent on it. And whether what they say is true or not, you exist as a form of payment. Right. Attention. Cash it in or dollars. Yeah. And I have, I have. He must experience that. A hundred, a million, fold for me or you. I know. It happens with me all the time too. And it's like. And nobody really understands where, what that life is until you're in it. And that is the cost of success. I'm not complaining about this. The cost of getting to live the lives that we live is that you're going to deal with scrutiny and you're going to deal with criticism. That's totally fine. Frustrating. When people make things up about, yeah, sure, that's fucking annoying. But I, in a human to human moment, he was curious and cared about what I had to say about his expertise. And that's more than I can say about a lot of people.

[Andrew Schulz]

What it makes me think, and that's a really beautiful story and very insightful. What it makes me think is that there's an error somewhere. Because if that's who you truly are, why is that not being put out online? Like, why is that not a part of your personality?

[Chris Williamson]

Dude, you know what? I actually wanted to talk to you about this because you talked to so many people. You've cultivated your universe, right? So the people that know you and love you know the idiosyncrasies about you, they actually like, know your opinions about the world. And then there are people that just consume you casually that just see you as whatever that version that exists in a clip online. So it's like what I realized. I thought that if I had a bunch of like diverse guests on my pod, that people would, it would not one. I'm just curious about this. Like, I like seeing diversity of thought. I'm just really interested. So the people who know me know that about me. The people that don't know you only know the version of you that they want to consume. So if there's like a really awesome poignant piece that's like written about you, they're like, I don't want that guy to be poignant and awesome. I want that guy to be this or me, same thing, right?

[Andrew Schulz]

Or vice versa.

[Chris Williamson]

Exactly. If they, if they do, they love you, but the people who love you know you already. You don't need to convince them. So what I realized is like doing this press run is that I gotta talk to way more people that you might think I disagree with because I have to go. If I care about the perception of me, which I can't say I don't, I'm a comedian. At the end of the day, I can live with people thinking different things about me. That is fine, I can accept it. That's totally cool. But I realized the way to, to, to alter that perception is not bringing people on my podcast. It's going to other People's podcasts, especially people that I. You might think that we disagree on. And then we get into, like, a cool, nuanced conversation, and you realize. And I see it happen in real time. They're like, oh, wow. Actually, yeah, that kind of does make sense. And, oh, wow. I didn't think that you would have that perspective. It's like, yeah, of course you didn't.

[Andrew Schulz]

Like, the Venn diagram overlaps way more than we thought it would do.

[Chris Williamson]

And I don't. And I have empathy for it. I get why you thought that.

[Andrew Schulz]

Like.

[Chris Williamson]

Like, you just consume content about me in the same way that I consume content about Ben Shapiro. Like, I'm sure Ben is way more nuanced than I just described him earlier on the pod. Like, I'm sure there's people who, like, really know him and understand his beliefs, and it's not. There isn't this, like, rigidity that he puts out online when he's, like, scolding a college kid. You know, maybe there's moments where he has a lot more empathy for that college kid who's, you know, battling with his identity or battling with, you know, wanting to make the world a better place. And his opinion is a little different than Ben's, but if I only get that version, I only consume, you know, that's what I think. And we have to kind of live with that because we are what we put out in the world. And if what we put out in the world can get clipped up and put into these different things, that is.

[Andrew Schulz]

The cost of be ready for that to happen. Yeah, there's this idea called tilting at windmills. An online stranger doesn't know you. All they have are a few vague impressions of you too meager to form anything but a phantasm. So when they attack you, they're really just attacking their own imagination. And there is no need to take it personally.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

So that tilting at windmills things. I wanted to ask you this, actually.

[Chris Williamson]

The concern real quick is, is, like, you would hope that that doesn't become a trend. Well, like, I've seen that happen with me. Like, people, like, start, they like an idea, like, creates about me. That's just, like, not true. And then anybody that doesn't like me, for whatever reason, maybe you have good reasons to not like me. It just becomes another justification for not.

[Andrew Schulz]

Like, they hold on to the phantasm. Right. And then that become. But what did you say before? That feelings don't care about the.

[Chris Williamson]

Exactly. It doesn't matter.

[Andrew Schulz]

And unfortunately, what did we also say before? Optics really are sort of the most important thing. And if you have a story that fits people's priors, there is something that gets a particular cohort of people who are all distinct and separate, but they coalesce around their mutual distaste for a particular person. And there is a very nice, cohesive, neat narrative that explains why they should not like this person. They go, oh, that's our new culture. That's our new thing. So I wanted to ask, you know, not everybody deals with the same level of scrutiny or criticism that you do.

[Chris Williamson]

Sure.

[Andrew Schulz]

But what have you learned about how to care less about the opinions of other people, how to sort of take criticism?

[Chris Williamson]

Well, I think that, like, again, I think the care is more about, like, you're like, okay, I hope this doesn't, like, shift perspective and, like, never negatively impact my ability to, like, provide for my family. That's really where they care. I'm fine with people thinking that I'm a certain way. And, like, this thing, like, you know, the Kendrick thing comes out. Like, it's. They turn into, like, racism within it. Like, I'm like, what the fuck? You know, it's how what. You know, like, it was just whatever. It doesn't matter. And then. And. And I'm like, okay, I'm fine. Like, the Internet just moves on. Eventually you just let that kind of. So you just hope that, like, it doesn't lock in and then affect your bottom line. But the thing that makes me okay with accepting criticism is that all the people I admire are the most criticized people. So, like, everybody I look up to and I aspire to have, you know, the level of success that they have are the most criticized. Like, I mean, Taylor Swift is like, there's no more criticized. Like, she's getting booed at the super bowl, yet it takes 220 dudes to sell out that Super Bowl. She could do it by herself four nights in a row. You know what I mean? So she's sitting there getting booed, but she's also like, this is cute. I remember doing this. I remember doing this little stadium. You know what I mean? Like, so there is this version where I'm okay with the criticism. I'm fine with it. My concern is more like the false narratives catching heat because there is, like, an attention or currency that you could build around it. And I have. I don't really know how to, like, thwart that. I wish I had, like, some people, like, really good at, like, addressing narratives strategy.

[Andrew Schulz]

Like Dave Portnoy.

[Chris Williamson]

Maybe Portnoy is just like, he's Portnoy. 50 Cent is amazing. Like, anything pops up, he's on that ass. And I'm probably a little more passive because I'm. I'm like, I'm just going to put out the art, you know, I'm going to put out my special, and you'll get a sense of who I am, or I'll. I'll talk to people on the pod and I'll do these things. And. And also, you can't respond to people who don't really have a face. You can't respond to ideas. Like, I can respond to Kendrick because Kendrick is the biggest rapper in the world. Can't respond to, like, some YouTube video, you know, it's just in my mind, I'm like, okay, now I'm just blowing that thing up. I'm just adding gas to it, you know? Yeah. The Kendrick thing was interesting. That was a. That was wild. Does that even hit your radar? Like, I'm. I'm so confused about who knows about these.

[Andrew Schulz]

I didn't see this happen.

[Chris Williamson]

Oh, wow.

[Andrew Schulz]

I didn't see it. I did when I started doing a little bit of prep for today.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

And I was like, oh, Sean's got in some super bowl beef.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. So it's like. It's just so. This is so, so funny, too, is like, whenever you go through something, you think it's the biggest thing. That's another thing I learned. It's like, no one really cares. Like, it doesn't really matter. Like, you think it's big, but, like, the reality. Most people don't. And we exist in these little bubbles. So, like a bubble cares about it for a second. But when I go out to dinner, nobody cares.

[Andrew Schulz]

If we can forget about October 7th because Zelensky sat down with Trump and forget about the Super Bowl.

[Chris Williamson]

That's a great way. That's right. So I need another tragedy.

[Andrew Schulz]

Just sow the seeds of another fucking international incident.

[Chris Williamson]

That's what they say. You kill a story with a story.

[Andrew Schulz]

I remember this was AS level sociology or AS level media studies before I went to university. And AS. So in the UK, 16, 17, 18, you go to what we call college, which is before university. Got it. And you do AS level, and then you do A level, as is the first year, A level is the second year. And that's what gets you your grades for uni. And I was told this story about the day after. So September 12, the media manager for a PR company who ended up losing a job because of this quote.

[Chris Williamson]

Right.

[Andrew Schulz]

Was caught saying the words Publicly, it's a good day for bad news. And if you go and you look at the newspapers, September 12, September 13, September 14, page 64, page 74, toxic spill, accounting error, fucking recall for dangerous product building.

[Chris Williamson]

Seven very good.

[Andrew Schulz]

People just dumping this stuff out there. But yeah, I think I heard this really interesting sentence the other day. I just don't care about people misjudging me anymore. And I really love that sentence. So I don't care about people misjudging me. And I think a lot of the time when it comes to criticism, what we're worried about is this person has an incorrect perspective perception of me. I don't like that. Let me go and fix. Because I know I'm not that. So let me go and manage their perception of me. I'm going to step in, I'm going to fix this thing. You go, I don't think you can, dude. And if you. If you try and play that game, if you want to try and fix everybody's erroneous expectation of you or interpretation of you, and the other side is as well. It's often people that don't like you, don't understand what you're doing, don't have your best interests at heart. They don't like you, and they're not nice people. And you're saying that person, that particular individual or group of individuals misjudged me.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

And I feel bad.

[Chris Williamson]

It's like. Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

It's insane.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. Yeah. It's like you ever. You ever get an argument with your girl and then not even an argument, like, you'll do something, and your intention was not for that to hurt her. Like, you seem like a good guy. I don't see why you would, like, want to hurt someone you care about. But it did hurt her. And what I used to do is I would try to explain her out of her hurt. Right. I would try to explain to my wife why she shouldn't be hurt. Right. Because I want to be a good guy, and I can't.

[Andrew Schulz]

Let me tell you why you're wrong.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. Yeah. Let me tell you why your feelings are wrong. And it's just like, oh, no. What I meant by it is this, Right? And like. And why we're doing that is because we don't want them to think we are the type of person that would try to do something to hurt them. I'm actually feeling insecure that you might feel differently towards me if I'm the type of man that would do that to make you feel that way. They don't want that. What they want is their feelings to be acknowledged and just going, I'm sorry that what I did made you feel that way. I'm really sorry. And then if they go, why did you do it? And go, well, actually, this was my thinking, then they're asking for the why. And I think the exact same thing applies to what you're saying. It's like, these people feel a certain way. I'm sorry that that made you feel that way. I am sorry. But in terms of caring about the perception, anybody who's ever, like, felt a certain way about me that I've had a conversation with, I feel like has left not feeling that way. And so I'm not really concerned about, like, the misjudgment. The concern is only, like, how could it negatively impact opportunities to achieve my dreams? And that's the beauty of, like, financial success, is that you get to really not care. Like, if you're at a number, right? Like, if you hit the number where you, like, I could stop doing all this and I'm good and my daughter can eat and my wife is safe and. And you don't even have to address any of it. You know what I mean? Like, if you get to a certain number where you're just like, I'm just creating the shit that I want to create. I don't even care if it makes money. I just love creating things. Who gives a fuck?

[Andrew Schulz]

Isn't it interesting how most people's projects have this, like, odd Paulo Coelho's the Alchemist. Like, you leave the place to come back to where you started. So what is that?

[Chris Williamson]

Explain that to me.

[Andrew Schulz]

You read the Alchemist?

[Chris Williamson]

I've heard of the Alchemist. I haven't read it.

[Andrew Schulz]

It's a really beautiful book, and it's a fiction book. It's super easy to read. It's not a flex to say that you've read it, but it's kind of a bit trippy to read. It's this beautiful story about Santiago, this Spanish boy who goes on a journey. And he comes back and spoiler alert. If you haven't listened to it yet, skip ahead 30 seconds. The treasure that he's looking for is in the backyard of the place that he started. And the story's takeaway is, going on a journey to end up back where you began is not the same as having never left. And, yeah, wow, I love that. My point being with something like stand up or podcasting or writing or whatever it is that you're into, you start off doing the Thing the way you want to because you love it and you've got this passion. And yeah, you start modeling from other people because you want to learn from those that have gone ahead of you. And then after a while, different incentives come in and maybe you've got saf or you've got obligations, or you've got competition, or you've got momentum and you start to sort of get skewed away from this a little bit. And then over time, maybe you begin to get expectations from people and you've kind of got to. You're playing up to your own enigma, your own Persona, and you're like, you've got to go, I'm going to go from infamous to doing life. And it's like a real change and scary to the fucking difficult second album, right? Do I just repeat what I did last time or do I try and pivot? And then after a while, you know, hopefully you're still stripping this, you're still trying to be true to yourself. But I think a lot of the time people end up in that post money world or, you know, post fame world, whatever it is, you end up back at this place where you're like, I can just say you, yeah, I'm gonna do it the way that I want. And I had this idea I wanted to teach you about. So you've heard of fuck you money, right?

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

So I realized that I think there's three levels to saying fuck you. So the first one is fuck you money, which is you're not really that beholden to an employer. You maybe kind of can own things in a way that makes you not have to adhere to laws in the same sort of a way. There's fucky freedom, which is actually more accessible than fuck you money. Because you can just like, if you've got enough, you can live off grid. Maybe you don't even need to be reliant on supermarkets. You don't need to really like listen to laws if you've got a little bit of land or whatever. But then the third level is you family. And I think a lot of the time people are playing these games, they want to be requited and validated, external success and all the rest of it. But I get the sense, and I see this with you and a lot of my friends that become young dads, that they kind of look back on a lot of the ways that they got validation and self esteem as like real juvenile, very immature. Like, look at all of these people who, I don't know, who I don't give a fuck about. And I cared about their opinions about me. And really the only people whose opinions I care about are the ones that are inside of this household.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

And that fuck you family thing is the most accessible to everybody.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

And yeah, it's a transition that, you know, if you're a high powered person, like man or woman, and then you pivot into family life. I wonder how many have like a retrospective existential crisis about like, what the fuck was I doing?

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, who was I?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, I did all of that. And okay, yeah, cool. Like I just didn't know. But, but holy shit. Like that my eyes have been opened and I see the actual game that I was playing, bro.

[Chris Williamson]

It is so cliche. So much about having children is cliche. But like the hardest day, the most stressful day, the most difficult day, when I open the door and I get back at 6:00 every day, my daughter is in the playpen, usually with my wife, and she hears the door open and like she slowly turns around and then I watch her face crease into this beautiful like six toothed smile and everything, nothing matters at all. It's so cliche. It's, it's actually difficult as a comedian who like tries to have like unique takes on things, how normal my reactions to having a child is. Right. Like, but it is just nothing really matters in that moment. And then for the next, we're getting after it, for the next hour, we're just get nothing matters. And you're 100% right. That is like fuck you, family. Now you need things to get there because you feel obviously like a responsibility to make sure she's safe and she can go to the school she wants and we can live in a nice place and experience these cool things. But yeah, I love that. I love that.

[Andrew Schulz]

I saw this quote earlier on today that said it's not okay to work your life away, but it is okay to work your 20s away. And yo, I like this, keep going.

[Chris Williamson]

On this because time is something that we should discuss.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, I think, you know, again, I said for me and I really, I just want to like re highlight the fact that I think the new special from you is probably the most culturally penetrative explanation of male fertility issues that I've seen. You know, you said before we always assumed that the problem's the woman. And we have big, we have lots of stories about that. We have archetypes, right? The struggling woman, whether it's struggling to find a partner and the biological clock is ticking, trying to get pregnant, going through The IVF and the pain of the process and then the pain of it not taking. And, you know, all of the stuff that you can learn about if you spend a bit of time on this. And we don't have a cultural story about what it's like to be a man who is really desperate to be a dad but can't find a partner or has a partner and is trying to be a dad and has fertility issues.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

And that doesn't exist. Yeah. And time for both men and women, even more than that. Like, I think about this now. So I'm 37, right. Like, let's say that I managed to make the family in three years. Let's say I have my first kid when I'm 40. Like, I'll be 65 when my first kid's 25. Kids weren't on my brain at 25. Okay. So I'm 75 when my kids are 35. So I'm gonna be, like, 77 when my kids are my age.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

I'm like, chop, chop. I want to be a granddad.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Like, well, you didn't give your parents that same. Like, where was the chop chop when you were doing this thing?

[Chris Williamson]

So I didn't meet any of my grandparents. I mean, I met, like, when I was, like, one or something like that. One of them, I think. But, yeah, that happens. And that is the cost. Time. The first thought I had when I saw my daughter is that I wish I did it sooner so I would have more time with her. And that's the first thought I saw when I saw her. Like, I was like, what did I do now? I'm not regretful of my life. I love how it turned out. And I met the woman that I want to create a family and have a life with. But, yeah, you think about it constantly. Time. I. I always heard people talk about it. And you see. I mean, it is. It's cliche, but time. Like, how do we get time every. I don't buy expensive, really. Like, I think when I first got money, I got some, like, watches or whatever. I think it was this, like, form of validating myself. I think it was this, like, outside. And it was like, yeah, I've. I've achieved some success. Let me get a watch. And, like, I retrofitted this justification. I was like, oh, the gears are so nice. It's not about that, but, like, time. Everything. I'll spend my. It's like a trip, but the trip is soaking up this undivided time with family and friends. Everything is how Can I spend time with my family? I'm lucky. I work with all my friends. My guy who does all my partnerships I've known since I was 13 years old, is my first friend in high school. My manager, who's just my partner, is my first friend from college. Everybody is family in the group, so I'm very lucky in that regard. But how do we spend time? What do we do? And, like, even I'm going to do press for this. And I'm like, okay, you gotta. You gotta go and you gotta get the word out. Okay, that's gonna be probably a month of going to get the word out, you know, okay, that's time away. How can I get that back? Can. Okay, can I take a month off in summer and just lock in how do I spend? Everything I've ever heard from parents is. It goes fast. Old people talk about time in the way that young people talk about success and money. People don't really talk about success. And when they do, it's like, kind of weird. Like, they're not like, oh, I killed it in the market today, or something like that. You're just like, oh, is that what you're excited about? Nvidia went up, like, who gives a fuck? Like, oh, I'm taking a trip with your mom and we're going to her favorite place, you know, and, like, everything is this reminder of time. You know, my. My wife's mom has a, you know, disease. This is slowly killing her. It's this reminder of time. My dad has dementia. This reminder of time, and it's fleeting. And, like, the memories that I'll have of my dad exist forever, but we'll never make new memories together, you know? And it's like, this is like, how much time do I have with him? How many actual days do I have with him? And, yeah, I haven't fully processed, like, this, the importance of that, but, yeah, it's just this amazing. It. Yeah. As I reflect back, like, I think I have lived a life where, like, I. I was able to soak up things with my friends. But, like, I. I worked. I don't think I've ever not worked seven days. But, like, my 20s, I didn't celebrate a birthday. Like, I was just doing comedy on the road for no money. Like, anybody would let me go on stage. So I get better at the craft. Like, I. I still had fun. I went, I had good time with my friend, but I wasn't like, partying, partying. Like, some of my friends were, like, I would say when I was like, on tv, I was like, my friends have way better sex lives. These guys are on Tinder doing, like, you know, having fivesomes. And. And I'm just, like, trying to write. It was that. That decade was sacrifice, you know, I didn't drink for, like, 10 years. I was like, I need to lock in. I gotta. Gotta get good at this shit. But, yeah, how can I. I'm fortunate enough to, like, get a couple bucks and, like, have a family at 41 years old. All right, maybe we wanna have another kid. How can I organize the rest of my life so that I can just spend time so I can go out to have a dinner with my wife? And we're just joking around and, like, looking at silly pictures of our daughter and busting balls. Just, how do we have as many of those moments as I possibly can for the rest of my life? How many times can I, like, peak die laughing with my friends? Like, every once in a while, you hit that moment, something stupid happens, and, like, we are just on the floor laughing. Can I have a hundred more of those? Can I have a thousand more of those? How can I organize my life so I can have as many of those as I possibly can? And how can I not waste time with people I don't really care about? I think it goes back to what you're saying. It's like, am I going to waste time on trying to deal with what this person on the Internet is saying, or should I just read the same book to my daughter 20 times in a row and I should do that. Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Time. Everything that you say yes to is saying no to everything else.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

So by committing to the argument on Twitter, that's a yes. And you have said no to every other experience that could be possible.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

At that moment.

[Chris Williamson]

And you're ignoring all the people that are supporting you. You're ignoring all the people that are riding for you. You're ignoring all the people.

[Andrew Schulz]

Like, to focus on the people that hate you.

[Chris Williamson]

I could message back, like, the amount of people that send me, like, DMS about coming to the show having no clue that it was about the IVF journey, and they're, like, struggling to get pregnant. And then they'll message me a year later and be like, hey, we just had our first kid. And, like, it was really cool to see that, and it made it a little more normal for us. Or the people who went through and felt stigmatized, and then they. They realized it was. It's like, actually something you can kind of laugh at. I should be. And I try to respond to every one of those before I respond to a single person reacting to some fake shit about me on the Internet.

[Andrew Schulz]

They should be the bottom of the barrel.

[Chris Williamson]

They are.

[Andrew Schulz]

So I've been again, as somebody who, as of yet, hasn't reached the finish line with family, but is still in the race.

[Chris Williamson]

You'll get there, and then everything you know will go out the window. I just want to let you know, because you've got the whole world worked out. I know you've done a lot of work on figuring it out. And the second that baby comes, it does. It's.

[Andrew Schulz]

It's.

[Chris Williamson]

None of it makes sense.

[Andrew Schulz]

I am ready for the exit.

[Chris Williamson]

I can't wait to that pod. Once you have the baby, we got to have another.

[Andrew Schulz]

Run it back. But I've been thinking about this, that how does somebody like you or, you know, somebody, maybe even more somebody like me, who hasn't got to that finish line yet. How do you make sense of what you did to yourself for a couple of decades? You know, because I did something not too dissimilar with my work rate, and it's still going, and the grind and the drive and all the rest of the stuff. Stuff. And I do get the sense that even if you retrospectively think, God, if I know what I know now about what's most important, I could have done that. Woulda, shoulda, could have done that earlier. But then there's another bit of you that goes, how much did I develop into the person that can be the sort of parent that I want to be financially, emotionally, in terms of closing all of the loops of life and saying, like, I did the thing. I did the things. I fucking toured hundreds of dates for this thing about you. About you.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

And I got to not only create this beautiful tribute to you on stage, I also got to, like, fucking work it out of my system a little bit.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, no, I. I don't think you should regret a single thing in your life if it. Well, the only thing I would say is, like, if you had a relationship that you thought had, like, a lot of promise, and you're like, hey, I need to focus on work, and you let it go, that I would go, that's potentially a regret. I didn't have any of those until I met my wife. And I was like, okay, this is it. We're gonna do this 100%. And so if. If you're not. There are some people that do that, though. They meet the person that might be, like, the one for them. I don't know if there's like a one, but there. There's somebody that they really connected. It was beautiful and it would have worked. I always tell people that, they're like, I don't know if I'm ready to have a kid yet. I'm like, that's fine, that's fine. But if you do, it will work out, you will manage it, and it will make everything in your life that much better. I cannot impress that upon people more so if you are, and I get the feeling of, let me just make myself safe and protective. But you will do that naturally. There's an instinct. Like, what do they say? Every baby comes with a basket of bread? Is that the saying? Like, I mean, yeah, I think it's a biblical saying, but it's like, like you have a baby and all of a sudden, like, you start to make way more money than you used to.

[Andrew Schulz]

Abundance comes. It doesn't restrict your ability to do stuff. It actually enables it.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

So interesting.

[Chris Williamson]

But yeah, like, it seems to me that from our conversation that, like, you haven't had that relationship in the past that you've shunned. So I wouldn't regret a single thing. Matter of fact, like, when that relationship does present itself, hopefully it's the one you're in now. Who knows how that, you know, flourishes or blossoms into something. But, like, if it is the thing, go, go and go and send it and then have kids and just. They're awesome. And I would love that to be part of, like, the masculinity conversation. I feel like.

[Andrew Schulz]

Me too.

[Chris Williamson]

I think I'm. I saw you writing some stuff. Maybe it was right. Maybe I was watching you something. But it was something about, like, there's a lot of talk about masculinity and, like, what we need to do and how we need to better ourselves. And oftentimes kids aren't put into that equation. Did you. Was that you posting about this? And I think that's a great take. Like, I would love fatherhood and like, what it means to be like, a good active father, to be part of this idea of, like, the modern male. And because I know the. The fathers I see out there that are really invested, I feel like they would really love to see that represented that it's not just about, like, fucking, you know, your squats are a quarter or whatever. You know what I mean? Like, who gives a. How much you can squat?

[Andrew Schulz]

You know, the bank account or the follower number.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, it's like, yeah, none of that matters. Like, when you see a dad that sucks with Their kid, you know, you're not envious that they have a boat. You're just like, you're a loser. And then when you see those kids that hate their parents, you know, I mean, you're not envious of those parents.

[Andrew Schulz]

At all, regardless of what they've got.

[Chris Williamson]

No, but when you see, like, the dad walk home and these videos of, like, the three kids run to the door, it's like, impossible to not want a million kids.

[Andrew Schulz]

Did you see? Dude, this video fucking made me tear up the other day. It's a ring doorbell or maybe like the inside of a house thing. And this little daughter must be three or something. And she says, daddy, are you going to the gym? And he says, yeah, Daddy's going to the gym. And she, like, turns away from him and she goes, wow, I'm so proud of you. And the dad just freezes.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

And he, like, picks her up and I'm just like, hol.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

What are we doing? What are we doing? That isn't just. Yo, this is the most pronatalist.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Podcast.

[Chris Williamson]

We need that. I think we need a lot. I mean, you know, Elon's got his version of saying, and he's, like, very brutalist about it. He's like, oh, the population numbers or whatever. That's not. Yeah. Some of people react to, like, a video on the Internet. I don't know if you saw the one where, like, the guy opens the door and he knows there's all these cups that were placed in front of the door by his kids, but he doesn't walk into them because he sees the cups and then he realizes that that was the ring. So then he, like, makes some noise or knocks on the door so the kids are ready. And then closes. Then he closes the door. Then they kind of like knocks in or something like that and then opens and they see him, like, fall into the cups and the kids are going fucking crazy. And you're like, that's. Yeah. If there's one thing that I would love to love to promote, it is. It is. Is that.

[Andrew Schulz]

Well, you've. You've. You've done it, man. I really, really am so proud of what you did with, with. With this new special. It's. It's. It's really special.

[Chris Williamson]

I'm proud of you, man. It's awesome to see what you've built, and I was really stoked to. To have this conversation with you. So thank you so much for taking the time, brother.

[Andrew Schulz]

Me too. Life stream on Netflix right now.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Appreciate you. If you are looking for new reading suggestions, look no further than the Modern Wisdom Reading list. It is 100 books that you should read before you die. The most interesting, life changing and impactful books I've ever read with descriptions about why I like them and links to go and buy them. And you can get it right now now for free by going to ChrisWillX.com books that's ChrisWillX.com books.