"They Wanted A Bad Guy, So I Became One" - Ryan Garcia - #1097

Summary

Modern Wisdom #1097: "They Wanted A Bad Guy, So I Became One" — Ryan Garcia

Guest: Ryan Garcia
Host: Chris Williamson
Date: May 14, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this deep and candid conversation, Chris Williamson sits down with boxing superstar Ryan Garcia to unpack the complex realities behind sporting greatness, the personal costs of fame and obsession, and the journey through adversity. Garcia opens up about how others' expectations and criticisms pushed him into the role of "the bad guy," the sacrifices made for his craft, mental health struggles, and the thin line between rage and professionalism in elite sport. The discussion traverses lessons on discipline, family legacy, boxing politics, dealing with fame, conspiracy, finding meaning, and the relentless pursuit of personal potential.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

The Fighter’s Mindset: Flow State and Memory

• Flow State Experience:

  • Garcia describes being in the ring: “I'm just picking up on cues, really... there’s these instincts and intuition that are just kind of there... stay focused... but I'm not really necessarily thinking.” (00:05)
  • Williams notes that optimal performance state often impairs memory: “The mental state that humans perform best in is also the one that they can remember the least.” (02:03)

• Levels to Every Craft:

  • Garcia draws parallels between boxing and other skilled professions, admiring the endless depth in every pursuit: “I like the journey of understanding how much levels there actually is to anything.” (03:29)

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Sacrifice, Childhood, and The Making of a Champion

• Early Start & Family Pressure:

  • Garcia’s upbringing revolved around boxing, starting at age 7 and being homeschooled in his mid-teens: “My whole life was just all boxing.” (05:06)
  • He acknowledges missing out on teen experiences, recognizing how that led to challenges later: “I do think it would have helped me... If I went through that...I wouldn’t have got into some stupid shit later on.” (04:28)

• Sacrifice & Faith:

  • Garcia ties sacrifice to his religious faith: “If you want anything in life, it has to require sacrifice in some way... for me, it was my childhood.” (05:06)

• Family Legacy and Pressure:

  • Expectations set by his dad and uncle had a profound impact: “He said when I was born, he was like, all right, that's the one. That's insane... Maybe he's just filling my head so I could think, yeah, yeah, yeah.” (07:46)

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Turbulence, Breakdown, & Redemption

• Self-Destruction and Anger:

  • Garcia recounts a period of spiraling after facing custody issues, his mother’s cancer diagnosis, and divorce: “I just kind of shoved it down with alcohol and just acting out, trying to self-destruct...Let’s just make it all worse.” (13:46)

• Channeling Rage:

  • Feeling maligned by the public and boxing community, Garcia let anger fuel his performance: “They never gave me my credit... I just felt really disrespected...I’ll give you a bad dude.” (15:09)

• Public Perception & Transformation:

  • He reflects on the public’s role turning him into the “villain”: “They wanted a bad guy so I became one. Like I said, I let them change me for a time. I let them break me and become a person that I'm not.” (16:00)

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Obsession, Instinct, and Mastery in Boxing

• The Value—and Danger—of Anger:

  • The fine line between aggression and blind rage: “Maybe a little anger can be good, but rage blinds you... aggression... that's the word I'm looking at.” (26:32)
  • Williamson: “What happens if you turn aggression into anger and into rage, what do you lose?” (27:11)
  • Garcia: “You lose that consciousness of a punch might come back... rage narrows everything down.” (27:41)

• Obsession as Strength:

  • Garcia discusses the relentless mental replay and deconstruction in pursuit of mastery: “I remember going back home and just thinking about it for like two hours...That's how I knew, like, you’re different. Because I could come back the next day and be a whole different fighter.” (69:44, 69:55)

• The Art of Adjustment:

  • He likens boxing to music: “It’s almost like music notes... when something feels off... some note was off... It really is like, a whole level of just, like, beautifulness.” (71:35)

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Controversies, Conspiracies, and Social Responsibility

• Public Outspokenness:

  • Garcia’s comments on child trafficking and conspiracies stemmed from a vision and subsequent research: “I had a weird vision...beast...coming out of the sea...I looked into it, and there’s actually people that come into the woods [Bohemian Grove]... a little freaky.” (18:59-20:26)

• Using Platform for Awareness:

  • Garcia stands by calling attention to sensitive issues, despite backlash: “I brought awareness to it, even though it came out of something ugly in my... how I displayed it... now I teamed up with Tim Tebow and his foundation.” (17:47)

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Boxing, Business, and the Game Behind the Game

• Boxing Politics & Frustrations:

  • On fight negotiations: “That’s how it goes, dude... Boxing’s so complex. Yeah, it is a little.” (32:02-32:06)
  • On the slow evolution of the sport: “Boxing...could become a little more slicker and sleek... but I feel like boxing... we’ve been doing just fine financially-wise.” (38:34)

• The Zuffa/ALI Act Discussion:

  • Garcia expresses cautious skepticism about changes to boxing governance: “I just want to give it time before I even want to acknowledge it too much.” (32:34)

• On Celebrity Fighters and Newcomers:

  • Garcia’s view on Jake Paul: “He has balls, man...the fact that he fought Anthony Joshua is pretty insane... He's definitely earned respect.” (41:28)
  • Guards the exclusivity of boxing: “You don’t get to speedrun this with clout...it’s a sport that you have to earn your stripes in.” (43:56)
  • On gatekeeping in skill sports versus other disciplines.

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Fame, Wealth, and Staying Grounded

• Big Money, Big Challenges:

  • On financial lessons: “I had to learn that lesson early... I already made my first million at, like, 19... taxes is a real thing... all of it’s pretty dumb.” (51:14-52:07)
  • On lifestyle inflation: “I bought every car wanted. And then I realized this is stupid.” (51:37)

• Avoiding Common Pitfalls:

  • Garcia reflects on public figures who burned through fortunes, like Mike Tyson: “I don’t want to end up like that... I have to be focused and keep my head straight.” (52:56)

• The Importance of Companionship:

  • On mental health in lonely, high-pressure environments: “Honestly, that right there, it just keeps things... bearable... You being by yourself just sucks.” (58:42-59:42)

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Health, Obsession, and the Price of Greatness

• CTE and Fighter Health:

  • Garcia’s acceptance: “Honestly...I’ve already accepted whatever happens to me, it’s okay... I just try my best to not look into that type of future. But if it happens, I hope that the people that love me take care of me. That’s it.” (66:01-66:34)

• Mental Health and Edge:

  • Garcia self-diagnoses some degree of anxiety and obsessiveness, linking it to his achievements: “I don’t think you get to the level of obsession and focus without having something in there. You mentioned edge. Yeah, that edge comes from somewhere.” (68:44-68:53, Chris Williamson)

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Notable Quotes

• “They wanted a bad guy so I became one.” – Ryan Garcia (15:09)
• “I should have lost. No way. There’s no way that could ever be replicated... It’s a high-risk strategy.” – Ryan Garcia (14:47-14:59)
• “The mental state that humans perform best in is also the one that they can remember the least.” – Chris Williamson (02:03)
• “The greatest thing that came in this world came through a sacrifice.” – Ryan Garcia (05:06)
• “Rage blinds you... aggression...that’s the word I’m looking at.” – Ryan Garcia (26:32)
• “You lose that consciousness of a punch might come back.” – Ryan Garcia (27:41)
• “My biggest fear in life...is just not reaching my potential and just wasting it because I know I have so much. So it’s like that just scares me.” – Ryan Garcia (77:59)
• “Pressure is a privilege, dude.” – Chris Williamson (78:18)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• 00:05-03:18: The nature of flow state in elite competition
• 04:09-07:44: Sacrifices of a champion’s childhood
• 11:06-14:11: Lessons from a tumultuous period, self-destruction, and humility
• 15:09-17:15: Anger as fuel, public perception, and the making of a villain
• 18:59-20:26: Conspiracy, visions, and becoming an advocate
• 26:32-30:23: Managing aggression, the risks of rage in combat
• 32:02-39:40: Boxing politics, fight negotiations, organizational issues
• 41:28-47:39: Jake Paul, gatekeeping and the spectacle of new-school boxing
• 51:14-53:43: Wealth management, financial lessons, and avoiding famous pitfalls
• 58:42-60:07: Mental health, the value of team and companionship in boxing
• 66:01-67:10: CTE, long-term health, acceptance of risks
• 69:44-74:57: Obsession, deep learning, and the mastery mindset
• 75:14-78:18: The double-edged sword of obsession and the fear of wasted potential

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Memorable & Standout Moments

• Garcia’s honest recounting of personal breakdown and how anger—with all its risks and consequences—became his primary motivation for a period.
• His admission that being a “bad guy” was something he chose, at least temporarily, because it was expected and demanded by external pressures.
• Detailed description of the psychological warfare and intuition that happens at the highest levels of boxing, including how he reverse-engineers problems obsessively.
• Laidback exchanges about the business and spectacle of boxing, including playful jabs at Jake Paul’s legitimacy and the money-driven direction of the sport.
• Open vulnerability about his mental health, hyper-obsession, and the lasting fear of not fulfilling his true potential.

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Final Thoughts

A rich, raw, and unfiltered conversation that goes beyond sport—exploring the human pressure cooker behind athletic greatness, the allure and peril of fame, and the fundamental role that adversity, sacrifice, and obsession play in personal transformation. Ryan Garcia’s story delivers lessons relevant far beyond the ring.

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Transcript

[Chris Williamson]

I'm fascinated by you saying that you don't think when you're in the ring, what's happening?

[Gervonta Davis]

I'm just picking up on cues, really. And then kind of like, there's these instincts and intuition that are just kind of there, you know, like, oh, maybe like, you kind of get a feeling where, okay, I need to start putting pressure on this man, or I need to, you know, move a little bit. It's just like, kind of momentum shifts that you're kind of noticing a little by little. And then there's obviously times where I'm thinking, like, sometimes I'll just have, like, mantras in my hand, like, that I've done in camp. You know, stay focused. Like, my last fight, the whole time when I was fighting him, I would just say, like, stay focused, stay focused, stay focused. You know, so it was just like, little things that I would say in my mind, but I'm not really necessarily thinking.

[Chris Williamson]

Not thinking,

[Gervonta Davis]

but thinking.

[Chris Williamson]

But yeah, of course. Does that mean when you look back on a fight, how much of it can you remember?

[Gervonta Davis]

The pivotal moments? Like, like my last fight, I remember I started getting comfortable in, like, the 11th round, just messing with the guy, smacking him, looking at the trainer, and then lowering my hand a little bit, and then, you know, tasting a right hand, and I was like, don't do that. And then kind of like stepping myself back in. So I remember those moments. I remember, you know, when I dropped them. But, I mean, for the most part, I have to, like, look back at the fight to really recall most of it.

[Chris Williamson]

And that's strange.

[Gervonta Davis]

It is weird.

[Chris Williamson]

It's so strange. So I'm friends with musicians, comedians, sports people, and I do live stuff, too, these conversations. Once you get into a flow state and you're not thinking that much and things are just happening, that's what people want to get to. It's really enjoyable. It's where your performance is at its best. You're moving quickly. Your brain isn't getting in the way of what you're supposed to do.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

But it's also the thing that kind of robs you of your memory because you're not thinking and you're just doing. Yeah. You're. You. You can't remember. It's so funny. I mean, obviously your job is not to have a good time.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

Your job is to win.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

And winning requires you to be in the best state possible. But it is funny that the mental state that humans perform best in is also the one that they can remember the least. So I wonder how many people that are elite performers, comedians, artists, musicians, sports stars, look back on their career and they go, I'm glad that it was videoed, dude, because I'm. I kind of wasn't really there for it all that much.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah, I mean, it is interesting. But then also you have, like, guys, like. I guess I don't know if it's, like, necessary a sport, but, you know, chess guys like Magnus Carlson and just like all those top chess players, they could memorize games from, you know, when they were like five, and you're like, oh, it's like, you know, where does that come from?

[Chris Williamson]

That's a different kind of sport. Maybe it is.

[Gervonta Davis]

It is. I mean, you have to use your brain there.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, yeah. But I wonder even if in that you go, okay, you know, what the movements were, but can you tell me what you were thinking, how you were feeling, what you were wearing? Can you tell me where people were sat? Can you tell me what emotions were coming up? Maybe not. They're just optimized for one very specific thing, which is what are the exact movements on the chessboard?

[Gervonta Davis]

Right, right. That's funny. Yeah, it is funny. Yeah. Well, I. All I know is I like to win. That's all I. You know, I mean, the joy comes after the fight. Right?

[Chris Williamson]

You've got a job to do. You're a professional.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

I think I like the idea of people treating their pursuits as a professional. Even people that aren't doing it in that way that, you know, you're.

[Gervonta Davis]

I like the. The journey of understanding, like, how much levels there actually is to anything. Right. Like, say, construction or something. That's their profession, but, like, there's levels to it. People that can construct, like, these huge buildings. People are constructing, you know, a little table, but there's also levels to building a table. Some people make a better table than others. Why is that? You know, that's. That's cool in itself. So I find that the fun part of my job is just like, damn, there's so much more. Even when you think, like, you know, I'm a world champion, but I know there's just even more levels to it. So, you know, so I just love that. That part of it.

[Chris Williamson]

I didn't know that you started at 7 years old and got homeschooled so that you could spend more time boxing

[Gervonta Davis]

around, like, 15, that's when 16, I got home.

[Chris Williamson]

Do you ever resent or regret missing out on a more normal childhood, teenage years, teenage experience stuff?

[Gervonta Davis]

Do I regret it? No. But I. I do think it would have helped me. If I went through that, you know, stuff earlier in life, I wouldn't have got into some stupid shit later on, you know what I mean? Because I would already had experienced a little bit of it. You know, it's kind of like a. It helped me get to where I was at, but then I didn't have experience with, with things that came with, you know, money, fame, all those other things.

[Chris Williamson]

You want to make teenage mistakes when you're a teenager, not when you're in your 20s.

[Gervonta Davis]

Exactly, exactly 100%. That's part of where I'm like, ah, maybe that could help me a little bit.

[Chris Williamson]

But strange, the sacrifices that you've got to make in order to get to where you want to be.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah, like that. Yeah. I mean everything in life, the greatest thing that came in this world came through a sacrifice. Right. I mean, I believe in Jesus. So that to me shows that if you want anything in life, it has to require sacrifice in some way. I don't know, you know, for other people obviously it's different, but for me it was my childhood. It was, it was many hours of training as a little kid, running non stop, you know, having to go to a bunch of tournaments and just kind of just my whole life was just all boxing.

[Chris Williamson]

What was a typical week like for you as a kid?

[Gervonta Davis]

Just my dad would, you know, have me train the whole week and then fight on the weekends.

[Chris Williamson]

So that's 200 and something. Amateur.

[Gervonta Davis]

225amateur fights. Yeah. So there's a lot of road trips, a lot of, a lot of gym sessions and a lot of road work. Yeah, but to me it was fun. Like I loved it. Going to the tournaments and hanging, excuse me, hanging out with all the kids, you know, to me that was like the moment I had a little bit of childhood and you know, fun was just those community. Yeah, exactly. The community of the sport. So that was fun. But yeah, everything requires sacrifice, Everything.

[Chris Williamson]

I think a lot of young guys did some sort of sport. I did. I was dedicated to cricket, which is the nice. Some may, some may say the elevated form of baseball, but yeah, it's kind of British pastime. And that was my entire life. From the age of 10 until the age of 18. I would play sometimes five or six matches a week, plus training, plus school games and I get pulled out of school to then have to go and play. And then the only reason I went to university is because I thought that I was going to be able to play full time when I went there. And that like dedication teaches you an awful lot, but you do look back and go, I wonder what I missed. But if it set you up for the rest of life, there's very few guys that I know that have ended up with a. A really great work ethic in later life that didn't have something that they dedicated themselves to as a kid, even if it was academic. Academia.

[Gervonta Davis]

Right.

[Chris Williamson]

Some people just dedicated themselves to school. They wanted to become really good at this thing.

[Gervonta Davis]

It seems, like, extremely hard, but I have seen so many people really dedicate themselves to school, and I'm like, dang, how'd you do that?

[Chris Williamson]

That wasn't your vibe?

[Gervonta Davis]

Oh, no. I mean, I was into math for a little bit, and, you know, that was probably the only thing I excelled in. But other than that, I was kind of like, not my thing.

[Chris Williamson]

Your dad wanted to be a boxer, right?

[Gervonta Davis]

My dad was a boxer for a little bit, like an amateur fighter. It was my uncle that was kind of more, I guess, you know, I guess better. He was. He went to the nationals. He was the only one in my family that went to the nationals at that time. And he lost. But he said, you know, somebody in our family is going to come back here. And, you know, he always. He always. Oh, I guess it was what he told me. He said that, you know, he would always look for when a kid was born, like, all right, this is gonna be the one. And then he said none of the. All the kids came. And, you know, he was like, nope, nope, nope. And then he said when I was born, he was like, all right, that's the one. That's insane. I know. I know it doesn't sound real, but that's. That's what he said. Maybe he's just feeling in my head so I could think, yeah, yeah, yeah,

[Chris Williamson]

you know, and you were chosen and

[Gervonta Davis]

prepare, like, you know, propel me to be like, yeah, I was always that guy. Yeah, exactly. But that's what he said.

[Chris Williamson]

It's a good story.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

So does it. Does it ever feel like, pressure to have, you know, the weight of a dad's maybe unfulfilled career and then a partly fulfilled career, all of this riding on your shoulders? Not only that, but all of the other kids that came and went, it's like, it's not you. It's not you. It's not you. It's like the Hunger Games inside of a single family?

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah, I mean, I still feel pressure, you know, but I think that's why part. Like, partly I dedicated this last fight to my dad for the, like, you Know, my first world title, I really wanted just to win that for him. My whole reasoning for boxing just evolved over time. Always, you know, I was in love with the game, but then it kind of evolved to more spiritual journey of, you know, where I feel I'm being guided to and however that is, you know, a lot of it is because of boxing, you know what I mean? And I don't know what the reasoning is, but I just like to follow that. So ever since I was little, I felt like little nudges here or there, you know what I mean? I kind of trusted that and always wanted to understand what that is and why every time I followed it, good things happen, you know what I mean? Even if I don't get it, then. So that's kind of where I'm at of why I box. That's like, actually, the only reason why I box is just because it's always. That's what's in me right now. Maybe it'll take me somewhere else later, but right now it's like, this is where I'm at.

[Chris Williamson]

There's something pulling you toward it.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah, yeah. So. But, you know, I'm happy I won the championship. Yeah, I'll take it.

[Chris Williamson]

Of course.

[Gervonta Davis]

Exactly. So. But yeah, I think this was my dad's. I mean, this is my. It's everything for my dad. He's so happy. He's excited. And my uncle's probably, you know, he's super thorough, so it's cool. It's. It really is amazing to see how much joy that brings, you know, for me, I just. I just think, okay, just continue to stay focused, you know, don't get too high and don't get too low. Just stay. Stay stoic and just keep your.

[Chris Williamson]

You seem very regulated today. Regulated. Chill, you know, just in nice bit of peace.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

I've seen you with varying levels of energy.

[Gervonta Davis]

Oh, I've had that many times.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah. You don't want to get me started, but, you know, it's okay, man. I told you I had to learn a lot.

[Chris Williamson]

So what have you learned recently? Been a tumultuous few years for you.

[Gervonta Davis]

Right. I feel like what I've really learned is your body is literally a temple, and what you put in it is just as important as what you put out. You know what I mean? So just that journey of understanding how my body works and what can propel it to be at its best. Because usually, you know, when I was younger, man, I could put obviously anything

[Chris Williamson]

in my body, and you're made of rubber and Magic. You can bounce back.

[Gervonta Davis]

Exactly. Just like, thinking I'm unstoppable. But God will humble you real quick and thank God.

[Chris Williamson]

Or your liver or your brain. Yeah.

[Gervonta Davis]

Oh, man. It comes in many ways. So. Yeah, I just. Just didn't like that certain things were taking me so much, like, you know, off course that much. And it took a. It took a while for me to really be like, all right, you're not Superman. You just gotta, you know. You are Superman when you put the right things in you. Right. But you could go down just as quick.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, well, everyone's got their kryptonite, right? Yeah, Superman.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah, exactly. You know, you put the wrong oil in the car. I don't care if you have a Ferrari. If you, you know, it's not gonna go.

[Chris Williamson]

You've said. I'm surprised I'm here right now.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

In the past.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah. What.

[Chris Williamson]

Was there a specific moment when you realized that you'd gone too far or did it just creep up over time?

[Gervonta Davis]

I think that when. When. When you could no longer, you know, get a hold of yourself and see the decisions you're making that. That aren't good and you can't see that anymore. I think that you've probably a little too far. You know, there's times where I was moving so fast that, you know, it just didn't seem like anything I was doing was wrong. But it was.

[Chris Williamson]

What's that mean?

[Gervonta Davis]

I just felt like. I just felt like even though I'm not a prideful person, it was displaying as pride to myself, you know? Now looking back, like, no, that. That means it was just being prideful. You know what I mean? Like. Like, it just didn't. It didn't hit me at the time, but, you know, I lost track of. Of. Of myself and who I really am. And then that's when I knew. I was like, oh, this is not. This is not good. You know, and that's why I was surprised. Like, dang, I'm still here. You know what I mean?

[Chris Williamson]

Like, dude, you had one of the roughest runs of form. Like, kid, custody problem, mum diagnosed with cancer, divorce, all basically at the exact same time.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

How does a person even process all that much at once?

[Gervonta Davis]

I didn't. I just kind of shoved it down with alcohol and just acting out, trying to self destruct. Anyway, so I'm like, all right, everything's going bad. Let's sink the whole.

[Chris Williamson]

Let's make it worse.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah. Let's just make it all worse. Yeah. And I just, you know, I had just Knocked out a man and beat him so bad while self destructing. So, all right, I could do whatever.

[Chris Williamson]

I can do this.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah, I can do this. And that's where the humbling came. No, you can't, you know, and yeah, that was a very rough stretch. And it's something. I try not to look back too much because it's like, ah, damn.

[Chris Williamson]

Not so proud of it.

[Gervonta Davis]

It's hard. No, I'm not. But. Well, I think a crash out was coming sooner or later anyways, you know what I mean? So, kind of glad it happened a little earlier.

[Chris Williamson]

If, if Haney beaten you that night, do you think this spiral would have been worse or actually might have just saved you earlier?

[Gervonta Davis]

I have no idea.

[Chris Williamson]

Isn't that funny to think about?

[Gervonta Davis]

I know, it's so weird because I should have lost. No way. There's no way that could ever be replicated. And that's what, when these young boxers were trying to do that. I'm like, no, man, I'm sorry.

[Chris Williamson]

It's a high risk strategy.

[Gervonta Davis]

It's not the right one. Don't do it. And to this day I still don't know how I did it, to be honest, because I.

[Chris Williamson]

What do you remember of that period? Like that, that fight build up and then, then that day.

[Gervonta Davis]

And it's so weird because like when you're drinking all the time, the, the timelines become so mashed up. Sometimes I think it's the other training camp I was in, like in Dallas. So it's so weird. But I remember, I remember that I was feared, fueled with so much anger. That's what it was. I was so angry at the world and at people and how they seen me as a fighter and how they see me as a person. How even when I wasn't sword on, sort crashing out, they still judged me like harshly on everything I do. But other people, there's no judgment. So it's like, dang, I feel like I'm getting targeted with the, you know, with the rolling stick. And then I just crashed out and I was, all right, you guys want to see a piece of? I'll show you a real piece of. I'll drink, I'll smoke and I'll, you know, you know, talk so much. And I was just so angry. I was angry at the boxing community because they never gave me my credit. You know, I've been fighting since I was 7 and I was looked at as some just bum that's gonna just get his ass whipped by this guy. Even though I beat him three times in the amateurs, it's not like, you know, and I was a 15 time national champ, so I just felt really disrespected by people and just life. And I was like, all right, I'm gonna give them what they want. They want a bad dude. Give you a bad dude. And like I said, I let them change me for a time. I let them break me and become a person that I'm not. And I was just filled with anger and I wanted to hurt him bad. That's all I was thinking in my head. I, like when I came with the shirt murder on my mind, I was dead serious. I wanted to murder that man in the ring, but he also wanted to murder me. He said it. He said he actually was the first one to say it. He was like, he's like, we're gonna, we're gonna. This is the death of Ryan Garcia. And then I, I just snapped when he said that. I was like, oh, you want to go, death? All right, let's go. So, yeah, that. I just remember that time as I was filled with anger and nothing was going to stop me. I didn't care. I got in fights with my trainer, my dad, everybody. I was just angry.

[Chris Williamson]

Everyone's getting it inspiring.

[Gervonta Davis]

Like they were screaming and I was like, I don't care, let's keep going. Like, I was just filled with anger at that moment. And anger and emotion. I would cry a lot too. I was crying just so mad about what people were calling me crazy and things like that, you know. And then, you know, a lot of the stuff I was talking about, okay, yes, a little bit, was played into conspiracy and all that, but when it came to like the children and, you know, children's sex trafficking, I was dead serious about that. Like, that was been on my mind since I seen. I mean, I've always known about this kind of stuff. It's kind of always floated around. But then when it's like in your face and then now, like now that everybody sees it, it's kind of different. But back then it's like, if it's a billion dollar industry, like, where's all the money coming from? You know what I mean? And it was kind of that thing that I felt like there wasn't enough said and that there's so many other movements that people get behind. But like kids, like, we can't all come together and be like, hey, should probably look into this. It really did upset me and I was already angry. So all that together, just kind of one big, you know, boom. And then. Yeah, but I don't regret that part. You know, I brought awareness to it, even though it came out of something ugly in my. You know, how I, you know, displayed it. But a lot of people started looking into it, and they're, oh, it's actually kind of true. And now that I teamed up with, like, Tim Tebow and his foundation and we're actually making real steps, I'm happy.

[Chris Williamson]

When were you first exposed to that stuff?

[Gervonta Davis]

And it's weird, man. So, again, might not be believable, but I was, like, in 2021, after I defeated Luke Campbell, I had a weird vision. I don't know how, but, like, I seen, like, it was, like, some image playing in my mind, and I just kind of followed it. I don't know why, but it was like a. A beast or some animal coming out of a sea. And then I seen, like, pretty much a bridge. And I. And in my mind, I was, okay, San Francisco. And then, like, it just showed, like, people in the woods. And then it showed people doing weird things and conjuring up weird things and doing weird things to, like, you dreaming

[Chris Williamson]

or are you awake?

[Gervonta Davis]

No, I was awake. I swear. It was so weird. Just the image playing in my brain. And I looked into, like, is there things in the woods in San Francisco? And it's like, Bohemian Grove. And I was like, oh, that's a weird thing to see. And then I look it up, and there's actually people that come into the woods. That's like, a strange coincidence. So I looked into it, and, yeah, then that's when you see Alex Jones talking about it and all these conspiracy things. But then Ashley was real. They do meet up in the woods and they sacrifice. I mean, it's fake, right? It's effigies, but sacrifice something to an owl or whatever. So part of it is a little freaky that these politicians and people do meet in the woods.

[Chris Williamson]

But we'll get back to talking in just one second. But first, tell me if this sounds familiar. You train regularly, you eat reasonably well, maybe you even supplement. You feel fine, but you're just kind of going off vibes. Most people have absolutely no idea what's going on inside of their body. Which is why I partnered with Function. Function gives you access to more than 160 advanced lab tests spanning hormones, heart health, metabolic markers, inflammation, thyroid nutrients, liver and kidney function. It even detects early signals linked to more than 50 types of cancer. To put that in perspective, your typical annual physical might test about 20 markers, and function runs over 160. And this isn't just numbers dumped into your inbox. Every result is reviewed by clinicians, Abnormal markers get flashed, and you get clear explanations and a personalized protocol with actionable next steps so you can actually do something about what you learned. Best of all, you test twice a year. And everything lives in a simple dashboard. You can just track trends over time, make sure that you're moving in the right direction. Normally, this level of testing would cost thousands through private clinics. With function, it is $365 a year. That's $1 a day to know what's actually happening inside of your body. And right now, you can get $25 off bringing it down to 340. Get the exact same blood panels that I get and save that additional $25 by going to the link in the description below. By heading to functionhealth.com modernwisdom and using the code modernwisdom at checkout, that's functionhealth.com modernwisdom, and modernwisdom at checkout. Some of the different stories I've heard, I don't know whether it was Alex Jones's retelling of it or maybe somebody else's that I've listened to. Sometimes I. I see stuff online and I hear stories. Conspiracism or bad behavior, nasty behavior, immoral behavior. Okay, that's, that's someone doing something wrong. And then there's other stories that I hear and it sounds. I can't think of a better word,

[Gervonta Davis]

like cursed, like, like almost forbidden.

[Chris Williamson]

Yes, yes, yes. You go, okay, that's something else. And the bohemian grub story, whether how much of it's true or not is one of those ones where I've just wanted to lean back a little bit further when I'm listening to it. I think, I really don't like this. I really, really, really don't like this.

[Gervonta Davis]

I'm not too sure why I feel that too. At times you're just like, o. And it's like, is it all just a distraction? Like, do we even need to be paying attention to this? You know what I mean? How much is it even relevant to. To like, can we make a difference if even if they are doing something crazy wrong, you know? Well, that's how I think of it sometimes.

[Chris Williamson]

Certainly what seems to be happening at the moment, if you were to think about how little disclosure there was about this sort of stuff 15 to 20 years ago compared with now. And let's say. Let's say that there is some nasty stuff going on behind the scenes with people that are in power. Yeah. For the last 200 years, up until 20 years ago, you had a pretty clean run. Deny control. The media, do it in different sorts of ways. Have people killed off or pay people off or do whatever. That's not as easy to do because everyone's got democratized access to just, hey, I saw this thing, and this is really fucking weird. And here's some evidence. And everybody else can go, that is fucking weird. Yeah, that is some evidence. And it's. If I was a person in power that was doing loads of gnarly shit for the last 50 years, I'd be like, okay, we need to change our tactics. This can't. We can't do this anymore because things are going to appear. People are going to be able to do research and tie little bits of red string together and realize, oh, this thing's connected to this?

[Gervonta Davis]

No, for sure. And you see the. You see how now there's so much access with phones and so much access to, like, anybody could make a video

[Chris Williamson]

about any secret recording devices.

[Gervonta Davis]

It's just so crazy now. Yeah. And I think that. I mean, look at. You hear talks now. They want to disclose all the UFO knowledge. It's like a lot of knowledge is like, all right, you guys can have it now. Like, but we can't.

[Chris Williamson]

We can't keep it.

[Gervonta Davis]

We can't keep it together. Yeah, yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

Well, I mean, dude, look at the. Look at the. The Trump Assassin assassination attempt. Three.

[Gervonta Davis]

Number three.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, exactly, the three, Pete.

[Gervonta Davis]

And then everybody dying, too. All the scientists. Like, that's.

[Chris Williamson]

That's.

[Gervonta Davis]

Is that real?

[Chris Williamson]

There's definitely NASA scientists that are dying. I don't know what they're working on. I mean, give it a week and a half. I'm sure Rogan's gonna have someone on that'll explain it all. So I'll just wait. I'll wait for the. I'll wait for the Rogan episode to come out. But I was thinking about the videos that came out of the correspondence dinner where Trump's getting rushed off stage and stuff. Every single different angle of that that you need. Someone's got a fo. I saw this. I don't know if you've seen these two. So there's one where everybody's being rushed out of the room. And there's some old boy, looks like he's maybe in his 70s or 80s, just sat in the corner, just finishing his food, doesn't give a single fuck. And then there's another one of some lady, nicely dressed lady, and everyone's being Rushed out of the room. And she gets up to sort of go away from her table. And before she leaves, she goes. Leans back over and grabs a bottle of champagne. She's like, I must take the champagne with me before I leave. I was like, just to have that composition. Homeboy's finishing his chowder, and she's. I'll take the Veuve Cliqueau with me before I leave. That's going to be important for me later on. It's like, fair enough, man. But we've got every single angle. We've got the angles of the people still eating their food. We've got this. So if you're trying to do some secret shit, like, eventually somebody's going to uncover. I mean, do you see the guy that snuck onto Epstein's island recently?

[Gervonta Davis]

That was insane. The vlog? Yeah, the vlog got on a.

[Chris Williamson]

A jet ski got on there. A drone above. Unreal.

[Gervonta Davis]

That was crazy. I did see that. That. That's insane. And it's insane that they release it, then take it back.

[Chris Williamson]

Yep.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah, that's insane, too.

[Chris Williamson]

You said. You said for a good while that you were angry. Yeah. Does anger help you as a boxer?

[Gervonta Davis]

Not necessarily, but you do need an edge. You need some type of grit. And I don't know if that could come through anger or just motivation, but you need something that is fueling you. But I wouldn't say, like, rage is not good. Maybe a little anger can be good, but rage blinds you, and then you make mistakes and just, you know, not focus. But you need some type of, like. All right, sharpness. Yeah, yeah, a little. A little bit of, like. Yeah, a tad bit anger, but more of aggression. That's the word I'm looking at. You need aggression A little bit. Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

What happens if you turn anger into aggression? Sorry? If you turn aggression into anger and into rage, what do you lose? Because for most people who don't fight or fight at the level that you do, they might look from the outside and see two people that are trying to hurt each other and think, well, hurt is fueled by rage and anger and aggression.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

But it seems like you must lose something as you move down that line toward sort of greater levels of extreme. Extreme aggression.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

So what you lose.

[Gervonta Davis]

Well, what you lose is that that consciousness of a punch might come back. You know what I mean? Like, when you're focused and a little bit angry, you could still, you know, you could still read a punch. You could still, you know, counter react. When you get angry and like that, it's overtaken you. Then you've lose sight of what could come back to you. It's like when you get too raged up and you want to push somebody. You didn't see that, you know there's a car about to pass by. You just pushed them into a car. You wouldn't necessarily wanted to kill him, but your anger, rage pushed you and you didn't even see the car coming.

[Chris Williamson]

So it's kind of like that narrows everything down.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Too much, you know, and then now you don't see what's coming at you on the other side, you know, oh, I'm mad. Boom. Crap.

[Chris Williamson]

It's interesting because you see, I don't know the. Do you know Nikki Rod? Do you know who he is? Nikki Rodriguez, He's a Brazilian jiu jitsu guy. I went to cgi, the Craig Jones Invitational a year and a half ago. We sponsored it with new tonic and it was single, two weight categories and the guys just worked up on a bracket style event all the way up to the final. And in between each round most of the fighters were going back to a coach. They're talking tactics, they're getting hydration, they're doing whatever. Nikki just decided to sit in full lotus, like with his hands like this, like a samurai with his eyes closed. And then they'd ring the bell and he'd stand back up and go again. So you've kind of got this. It was kind of a bit of a larp, but it was sick. It looked sick to see Nikki Rod's a beast.

[Gervonta Davis]

But did he win?

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. And he won a million dollars in one day. So it's pretty in one weekend. Sorry. That's nice to see that on one side you think this is the almost like that samurai energy. Very, very, very calm. But it seems like you're saying that there is edge. An edge comes with aggression, that's still important. And to completely let go of that, you're actually losing something there too, that there's a middle ground that's good for you.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah, I think just like if you have a, you know, a tad bit of that, it just gives you, it keeps you, it keeps you, I guess in the fight, like into it, you know. I say like if you kind of get too, you know, too calm and too like too peaceful, then, then it's just you lost that bit of you that, you know, I'm a killer, I have a killer instinct. So it's kind of. You lose the killer instinct in you,

[Chris Williamson]

you do want to hurt this person.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah, yeah, of course. You're in a fight.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah. And he's hitting you, it would be

[Chris Williamson]

nice to try and hurt him.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah, it would be nice. And, yeah, I just. I know for me, it helps a little bit. Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

What's happening with Connor, Ben, talk to me.

[Gervonta Davis]

Oh, yeah, that's. That. That is being worked on. You know, me and my team trying to, you know, finalize it and make it happen. Stuff like that, I really want, but there's also other options, you know, so if it doesn't get done, you know, we're also looking at Rolly Romero and other, you know, opponents that we can fight. But that fight, I would love to make happen. I. I want that one bad. He's been a little too long. He actually came in, confronted me at an event while I was with my wife, and it was just crazy recently, about a year and a half ago, and I still remember that. It's like, bro, we're on suits. Calm down. What are you doing? Like, be professional, buddy. This is like. It reminded me of the movie Southpaw, you know, when he gets confronted and she ends up getting shot. Like, bro, you need to chill. But, yeah, I would love to make that happen, but it's not done yet.

[Chris Williamson]

What do you make of him as a fighter?

[Gervonta Davis]

I think he's a good fighter. He's too aggressive. A little too aggressive?

[Chris Williamson]

How so?

[Gervonta Davis]

He's a little reckless in the ring, but I do think that he has a lot of tenacity and he makes for a good fight, an entertaining fight, every time he steps in the ring. But, yeah, I will show him that there's definitely levels to this. And. Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

Is he one?

[Gervonta Davis]

I mean, he's number. He's number one, so he's my mandatory, right? So.

[Chris Williamson]

But there's so many fucking politics and so much red tape in boxing that the number one contender and the number one title holder somehow can't make a fight work, right? Easily.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah, I mean, that's what. That's how it goes, dude.

[Chris Williamson]

Boxing's so fucking complex.

[Gervonta Davis]

It's so complex. Yeah, it is a little.

[Chris Williamson]

Does the politics get frustrating? It get frustrating for me as a fan.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

No, I mean, like, this guy should fight that guy because it's the coolest fight.

[Gervonta Davis]

He's number one and the world champ. We should do it. You know, I'm. Like I said, I'm all up for it. It's just. There's some things that need to be figured out, but I'm all for it. I. I'm sure he's all for it, and I'M sure it's gonna happen. I'm pretty positive.

[Chris Williamson]

What you make of the Zephyr deal?

[Gervonta Davis]

Ah, that's. It's a little weird. I don't know. I don't know exactly what kind of changes they're trying to make to the ALIAC to benefit Zufa, or I don't know what they're trying to do. And I'm not saying I'm against Zufa at all. I just want to give it time before I even, like, want to acknowledge it too much, because I don't know if it's going to make us not get paid as much. I don't know if it's going to make the sport better. So I kind of wanted to sit back and watch what kind of unfolds there.

[Chris Williamson]

It is a funny sport from the outside to look at boxing. And I think what's particularly interesting is to see it when compared with other organizations, especially the ufc, but also stuff like one championship, like even bkfc. Well, there seems to be so much. I'd tell you a story. So I did a couple of degrees in the UK and I went to what's called a Russell Group University, which is kind of like Ivy League, similar to the equivalent of an Ivy League in the us. So these are very long established old universities. And each time that I graduated, there's graduation ceremony and everyone's parents come and you wear your silly robes and stuff and you get your little certificate. I remember being there and watching this parade come in and it was 5, 10, 15 people who were all the different. The dean of the university and the vice chancellor. And one of them had a mace. Like a medieval weapon, like a symbolic version of a medieval, but an actual medieval weapon. They all had to doth their caps to different people in different orders. I remember looking at it and going, this is what happens when you have a country that's not been invaded for a thousand years.

[Gervonta Davis]

Right.

[Chris Williamson]

Like when you have properly invaded, like, it's just one culture that's been able to accumulate loads and loads of weird traditions.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

And then the second time, which was a Masters, was even more weird. There was more people, weirder outfits, more stuff going on. It'd be like a academic Bohemian Grove.

[Gervonta Davis]

Right, right. Some type of rituals.

[Chris Williamson]

And when I look at boxing and the world of boxing, I do see some of that. It's such a established sport that there are. I mean, the first five minutes of any press conference or the start of any fight is this weird land. Acknowledgement. We must say thank you to the person from this thing and this thing and that other thing and this person's father and I've got athlete's foot and I could do with a back rub and a. You know, and now we can start to talk. And then you look at something which is newer, which doesn't have quite so much of the baggage that's come along with it, and you look at something like a one championship, or you look at a ufc, you think, huh, from an audience standpoint, this is a slicker experience. It's quicker.

[Gervonta Davis]

Right.

[Chris Williamson]

You get from the thing that people don't want, which is the bullshit and the credits to the movie starting. I just want the movie.

[Gervonta Davis]

Right, Right.

[Chris Williamson]

And I kind of feel the same thing when I hear about, we couldn't make the fight work, like, how many, I guess, Mayweather, Pacquiao were getting that to be run back. So that's kind of hilarious. But that almost didn't happen. That was supposed to happen 5, 10 times. Should have happened when they were younger. Should have happened when they were in their prime. Should have happened. Should have happened. Couldn't make it work. Couldn't make it work. Couldn't make it work. You think, how, like, why? Why can't there be a way? But it's because there's all of these different territories, basically different countries inside of a single sport who are all competing for dominance. And one person's got this and one person's got another, and it's the wild, wild West.

[Gervonta Davis]

You think, yeah, it is. Everybody's like, yes, there's like. Like you said, it's very established and has a rich history, and, you know, the major players are the major players, but everyone's pretty much, it's free for all, everybody's out for themselves, and it's like, hopefully the business makes sense, that two entities just come together. All right, let's do it.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Gervonta Davis]

So, you know, a bit of it is. Is kind of fun because, like, everybody gets a chance to make something huge happen. But, you know, the sad part is that a lot of the fights don't happen because a lot of these promoters become greedy and they want to get more. And then, you know, before we continue,

[Chris Williamson]

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[Gervonta Davis]

Disagreements, I would say splits money and some of these fighters overvalue themselves sometimes or they act like they really want to fight, but they really don't. So they hide behind the promoter and

[Chris Williamson]

say, oh, we couldn't make the deal work when secretly I just didn't want

[Gervonta Davis]

to step in the ring. So a lot of it's that I do think that boxing could become a little bit more slicker and sleek like you said, with the, you know, ufc, like we could cut out a lot of the, you know, there's new ways to, to promote a fight than the standard, you know, I mean, but I feel like boxing, like a lot of people were trying to say it was dead and stuff, but I mean, we've been doing just fine, you know what I mean, financially wise. So I mean, it must be making some type of money because a lot of these boxers are getting paid pretty well. But shoot, I'm all up for change, but as long as it makes sense, as long as it's like, all right, we're evolving in the right direction and not like I don't want it to become the ufc. That's what I'm saying. Like, Zuf is cool, but like it looks too much like the ufc. That I'm like, not my vibe. And then you can't wear your own shorts.

[Chris Williamson]

Like, bro, sponsored. Money is going to go away.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah. You won't get that out of me yet. You know, you don't have to. I don't know what you would have to pay me, but I don't. I like the style of boxing. I like, you know, shorts. I like the walkouts. I like the. The grand entrances that you could do. You know, UFC is just the guy walking down. Like, I like the whole spectacle. I like the entertainment part of it. You know, it's fun. And they took that away. I'm just gonna be.

[Chris Williamson]

There's a difference between getting rid of the. But keeping the heritage.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

And respecting the tradition. Right. You don't need to get rid of everything, but we can all say there

[Gervonta Davis]

could be some fat cut off for sure.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Gervonta Davis]

But don't. Don't lose. What makes boxing. Boxing.

[Chris Williamson]

What is the Ali act? What are the changes? I haven't. I don't know this.

[Gervonta Davis]

I don't know exactly what changes, but I know that. I don't know if it's Dana White or. I know Nick Khan spoke at the Congress, and Oscar did for Oscar on the side of not changing anything. And then Nick was trying to change things. That's kind of what I got out of it. And then something about how it helps everything be transparent. I know the Aliag, like, they have to show the numbers, and it's a financial decision. Exactly. And then I guess I don't know if they're trying to change it where we don't get it. Be disclosed the numbers. I can't. I don't want to speak for it because I don't really necessarily know.

[Chris Williamson]

Interesting.

[Gervonta Davis]

But that was Oscar's point. Oscar's point was this was made to protect the fighters and make sure that everything's just transparent. But who knows?

[Chris Williamson]

Talking of the money thing, a couple years ago, you said that Jake Paul's not a real boxer.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

That changed after his Joshua fight.

[Gervonta Davis]

No, he's definitely a real boxer. For sure. He has balls, man. I mean, the fact that he fought Anthony Joshua is pretty insane, knowing that he's not even a heavyweight. So now he's earned. He's definitely earned respect. But I think it did humble him just a little bit.

[Chris Williamson]

Like, give me a jaw shot. It'll typically humble somebody.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah, I made a broken jaw would probably be like, all right, maybe I should shut my mouth because I can't even move it.

[Chris Williamson]

But, dude, I mean, the people who saw that happen and also saw his response, like, say what you want, dude. That was a elite response to having your jaw cracked by a guy who's. What did he say when he was on the ground?

[Gervonta Davis]

Oh, he's.

[Chris Williamson]

He was like, whoa, that was hard. Yeah, Yeah, I bet it was.

[Gervonta Davis]

Dude, that is funny. Nah, Jake's always been that type of dude, man. He. He doesn't miss a moment. For sure. Yeah. You remember he's hyper aware of that too.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, yeah. Well, it's kind of like the first assassination attempt for Trump where immediately he's like, I mean, I have just been shot a little bit, but this is a great opportunity. The same straight. It's like, I think I might have broken my jaw and I'm definitely knocked down. But this is a great opportunity.

[Gervonta Davis]

Right, Right. This is probably, you know, a clip farm moment.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, yeah. That awareness is. But I mean, he's got that deal now with Netflix, so.

[Gervonta Davis]

Money, his own promotion.

[Chris Williamson]

Yes.

[Gervonta Davis]

That's pretty sick.

[Chris Williamson]

As somebody who's not a boxer.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

Right. To come in and do it, you

[Gervonta Davis]

got to give credit. You know, at the time, obviously people and myself included were just. I was just annoyed how he would always talk about me, so I found my ways to talk, you know. But we've always been cool here and there and I think now, I think we're. We're on a better page now.

[Chris Williamson]

It's interesting, right, because so many people, especially with boxing, I'm not sure whether what would be an example of a sport that people could do when they could start as an adult. Maybe something like distance running, endurance racing, triathlons, most skill based sport. You're not going to start tennis at 20 and become a legitimate professional tennis player. That'd be very hard. I think Deontay Wilder started boxing relatively late.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah. He's one of the few. Bernard Hopkins, Sergio Martinez, those are the ones that come to the top of my head.

[Chris Williamson]

Realistically though, it's a sport that you start as a baby kid Floyd, me,

[Gervonta Davis]

really started at three.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. At Tiger woods, with golf at two.

[Gervonta Davis]

Two.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Gervonta Davis]

And he was actually. Was hitting the ball good.

[Chris Williamson]

It's better than me.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

Better than both of us.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah. Combined.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. And I think that there's a. There's a kind of appropriate gatekeeping that happens where it's like, you don't get to speedrun this with clout. That this is a sport that you have to earn your stripes in. It's to do with being hurt. And that means that. And everybody knows that there's ways to piece fights together with fuckery and red tape and weight classes and experience that allow you to have a wonderful record without actually having done anything that's that impressive.

[Gervonta Davis]

For sure.

[Chris Williamson]

All of that together allows you to create the illusion of being good at it without not. I don't know whether the same thing is true for winning a triathlon. What, you're going to get the entire field of other people to not be that good, Even that your pace is compared with somebody else's.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah. There's no.

[Chris Williamson]

As opposed to. In boxing, it's just, you better than that guy, and now are you better than the next guy and are you better than the guy after that?

[Gervonta Davis]

And the crazy thing is, a lot of the casual people can't tell the difference. They can't. They don't know if Jake Paul is not a world champion or is he. Or is he world champion level. They. They can't. They could only see him beating Anderson Silva, who's not a fighter. Like, he's not a boxer, but he's a UFC champ. So all they see is Jake Paul

[Chris Williamson]

is beating these fighters.

[Gervonta Davis]

Fighters that are names. You know what I mean? He beat Nadia. So it's like, it was a little frustrating because Jake was good at writing that and making it seem like he was like Muhammad Ali and like, with troll. Like that. But like you said, boxing is one of those things that, like, you have to be in the game for a long time. And that sacrifice is like only boxers truly know. Like, we had. You have to go through a lot to even get to that moment.

[Chris Williamson]

You know, there's also a level of skill, I think, that you access from doing it for so long. I mean, you were saying before that you're doing a couple of hours of pad work a week, and the rest of it's just. I want to feel good. Yeah. Because those rhythm grooves, those movement patterns are. You know, you could get, like, Alzheimer's, dementia, everything. You could get set on fire, and the thing that would be left in your brain would be how to dodge your. Yeah, exactly. You'd still be. That would be the last thing that would go right.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

Just because it's been done for so long.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

You know, more than pretty much anything else. And the question I always had in my mind with Jake was how much can someone speed run learning skills that usually the time that you need, just like the literal, like, eras of duration that you need.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

Is longer.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah. I mean, the thing is, you know, people. I don't know because they didn't care that he Lost to Tommy Fury and Tommy Furry is not even good. You know what I mean? I'm just saying. Nope, sorry for taking a shot. But like, he's not like high level at all. So people ignored the fact. So I don't think, you know, he was speed running. The. The fact that he was giving these huge events that were like getting paid the number, you know, that people don't even dream of and they, you know, work your whole life. So I think that upset a lot of people. I think that's where it was.

[Chris Williamson]

Well, people want to sell tickets, right? But you talk about pay per view, gate numbers, rah, rah, rah. There's two ways to get there. One of them is to be really, really good. So good that people want to watch you. And the other is to just have another way to make people want to watch you. Yeah, it's like, what's that thing, like love me or hate me, you're going to buy it.

[Gervonta Davis]

Exactly.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Gervonta Davis]

And I watch all Jake Paul's. I ain't. You know what I mean?

[Chris Williamson]

How many people have come to boxing because of that?

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah, you know, we don't know, but we do know that people like to watch them, you know, and that's just the facts of it. And, you know, if it was making boxing, you know, bigger in a way, I'm all for it. I love boxing, so if good came from it, I'm all for it.

[Chris Williamson]

What do you make of the Mayweather Pacquiao fight?

[Gervonta Davis]

It's ridiculous. It's truly ridiculous. Like, I mean, I don't really want to see that. You know, the first fight was kind of boring. The second fight should be even more boring. You know, they're not even close to their prime. It's kind of sad. Like, why do they feel like they need to do that? Like, are they broke? You know, there would only be like a couple reasons why they would want to do that.

[Chris Williamson]

Didn't Pacquiao just buy Mayweather's gym and take a photo outside of the.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah, I don't know if that was. I think he bought his franchise.

[Chris Williamson]

Right.

[Gervonta Davis]

You know, but.

[Chris Williamson]

And Pacquiao is essentially royalty.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah. Oh, people.

[Chris Williamson]

I mean, so I just don't get the sense that he's broke, but I

[Gervonta Davis]

don't think Pacquiao's broke. I don't think he can go broke because people love him in Philippines. Like, they'll always take care of him.

[Chris Williamson]

Correct. He's essentially the king.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah, exactly. Mayweather, I've heard things, but I don't know if he's dude.

[Chris Williamson]

I've watched a couple of YouTube videos that break down the burn rate that Mayweather's got. And I just.

[Gervonta Davis]

I mean, it's really probably his security. I mean, to have. Because I had. I used to have 24 security for, like, three months. And I seen the check. I'm like, okay, no, absolutely.

[Chris Williamson]

How much is three months of 24. 7 security for somebody like you?

[Gervonta Davis]

I mean, in the six figures, because it's 24 7. And I was like, bro, this is ridiculous, because I. I needed security. I forgot why some was just going down. And I was like, all right, I'll pay for it. But then I'm like, I look after the three months, I'm like, no, I

[Chris Williamson]

look after myself, dude.

[Gervonta Davis]

And I'm like, yeah, I'll just never use security. Like, I'm cool, okay? Like, if people want to hurt me, I. I guess. Why. I don't know why they wouldn't. I don't wear jewelry. I don't walk around crazy.

[Chris Williamson]

That young LA top.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah, exactly. So I'm like, they want to run up on me. I'm like, bro, you're hitting a little sweetheart. I don't want. No problem. You could take my shoes. Yeah, but, yeah, so, yeah, that's. That could be a reasoning. I mean, he's taking private plan. I know those cost a lot, but then again, like, he always talked about investment, so who knows? I really don't know if he's.

[Chris Williamson]

I think, in terms of athletes that have generated money. I think that Mayweather must be up there. I mean, with. I don't know who they tell.

[Gervonta Davis]

They said that he made like, maybe a billion in his group.

[Chris Williamson]

I don't know whether that's gone to him or whether that's money generated across the board, but whatever it is, it's lots, right? The number is lots. And I suppose, yeah, you're right. There's. The worst position to be in is to be somebody who has all of the challenges of fame but not the money to be able to deal with it. So imagine if you needed security, but whatever it was that you were doing that got you loads of attention didn't really pay that well. You'd be like, oh, fuck. Like, I really could do with being protected from my fame, but my fame didn't make me any money, so I can't pay for the protection. That would really suck. But the next thing is like, well, maybe it's just. You just get this lifestyle inflation. I got assistant, two assistants, three assistants. I got a house. I got a holiday. Home. Aspen Jet. Second Jet. Car.

[Gervonta Davis]

Car.

[Chris Williamson]

Fleet Car manager. Wealth manager. Where's the fucking money going? Before you know it, you're like, jesus Christ, this is so big and unwieldy. And how do you think about that? How do you think about avoiding getting the financial thing too messy? The team growing too much. People who don't have your best interests at heart. This aided by the fact it's a family matter.

[Gervonta Davis]

I got lucky because I had to learn that lesson early. You know, I mean, I got paid a lot of money. When I was, like, 20, I started getting paid, like, I already made, like, my first million at, like, 19 and 20. So I learned quick how fast money can go, and you're just like, wow, I had a. No, I don't.

[Chris Williamson]

I was like, I had a million.

[Gervonta Davis]

They definitely said that in my account, but now it's gone. Yeah. You just realize taxes is a real thing, and you're like, ah, God. Like, I can't really be buying all that. You know what I mean? I was like, about every car wanted. And then I realized this is stupid. And then. Then I went through a little gambling type of thing I like to do, and then I was like, this is even more stupid than the car thing was stupid.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, yeah.

[Gervonta Davis]

And then you kind of just realize, like, all of it's pretty dumb. Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah.

[Gervonta Davis]

This is a waste of money, and nobody really even cares.

[Chris Williamson]

And.

[Gervonta Davis]

And it's just like. It's just like, all just, like, stupid. At the end of the day, it's like, all material, materialistic things that you don't really get anything out of it. I mean, unless you're trying to impress a girl or whatever, that's maybe it. And most girls, like, the ones that

[Chris Williamson]

are impressed by that stuff are probably.

[Gervonta Davis]

Are you. Probably not the ones that you want to be. Be around, but, yeah, I kind of learned all that quick. And then. And then I just have a good, good, good squad. Good, good team around me that cares, and they don't want me to go broke, and I don't want to go broke one day. It's too many stories like that Mike Tyson ran through 100 mil and. And he ran it back in the 90s, so.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah. What's that worth today? 200? 2:50? Something like that?

[Gervonta Davis]

Yes.

[Chris Williamson]

Serious money.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah. Yeah. I don't want to end up like that, so I just kind of. I just know that I have to be focused and keep my head straight and. And just try my best to. To not make any big financial mistakes anymore.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, again, you Know, in some ways, I suppose, learning that lesson, going from lots to not so much. Yeah, on a million. That's a good lesson to learn when you go, ow, I. I'm not broke, but I'm like back to basically baseline right after I had a lot. That's a good lesson to learn on a million.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

So worse lesson to learn on 100 million.

[Gervonta Davis]

Exactly.

[Chris Williamson]

So the same way as you said, you know, there were some lessons that I missed in my teenage years that I had to learn in my 20s. Well, there's some lessons people learn in their 40s that you managed to learn in your 20s.

[Gervonta Davis]

That's why I feel blessed. I'm like, dude, I learned a lot of all this shit, like pretty early. Like, everything I wanted in life came pretty quick. Like, I wanted to be a superstar fighter and it became quick and I wanted this and it came quick. But then you're like, oh, like I'm actually happy it came quick because if it didn't, then like I said, you would learn it. 30, 35 years old. 40.

[Chris Williamson]

And you're just like, with more money,

[Gervonta Davis]

with bigger problems, with less opportunity to make more too correct.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, I can't fix it in the same.

[Gervonta Davis]

You can't fix it. So I truly am blessed. But, you know, you could always make a mistake. You know what I mean? You could always go back down on that road. You know, your vices could take you there, your ego, your pride. Why I got this much money now, I could really fuck off before we continue.

[Chris Williamson]

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[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah. 100. I have my whole. My whole squad pretty much live with me. And yeah, honestly, that right there, it just keeps things, you know, it just makes things bearable. I mean, there's no other way to put it. You're with your boys, at least you can talk to them about things or anything. Hey guys, let's play some video. It could be anything. Honestly, you being by yourself just sucks. You know, a lot of people say, oh, you can't be by yourself. They always tell me that. And I'm like, I don't really want to be by myself. Like, I don't know, like, I'm cool to be by myself, but like, like, why is that a flex? You know what I mean? It's like, I love companionship, I love, you know, my brothers. I love talking to people, I love conversating. I like picking people's brains. No matter who they are. You know what I mean? I just like, I just love conversation. I love, you know, I love that.

[Chris Williamson]

It's just because you can do it on your own doesn't mean that you should.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

And it's all the intangibles. You. Maybe it would be quicker or you wouldn't need to compromise as much. You're certainly be cheaper. There's lots of different advantages you can see that are really obvious. But all of the ad. The disadvantages that you would miss are like, well, I'm going to be lonely and I'm going to be in my head and that probably means I'm just going to be scrolling my phone and that's going to suck.

[Gervonta Davis]

And oh, dim scrolling is the worst, bro. If you wake up, start scrolling. I, I swear that is ruined. Days ruined. You get it? It's. The day is ruined before it started. Like, I need to play my, my, like my just like meditation type of sounds before I even get close to the phone because, oh my God, it'll ruin my day because I'm just like this and I'm like, I catch myself. Like I already told myself in bed for an hour, what is going on here? What is this phone doing to me? Why do I magnetically want to go and do that every time? So weird.

[Chris Williamson]

Every time. I'm interested in what you think about Conor McGregor's trajectory because you're both guys who fight. You're both guys that have partied and that like to party. What's your perspective on his journey?

[Gervonta Davis]

It's, it's a, it's, it's one of those ones that, you know, did he learn too late? You know, you know, obviously we were talking about how, like, I'm happy that I learned, you know, as, you know, younger person, it seems that, you know, I want him to be back, though. I want him to be back. But I also know that, like, how old is he?

[Chris Williamson]

30? Probably five now.

[Gervonta Davis]

Something like that's a little tougher to rebound, you know, but he's one of those people that, you know, he, he's an icon to his sport.

[Chris Williamson]

He's a man.

[Gervonta Davis]

He's just the G. You know what I mean? And I want him to really be like, I want what path he's on to be like, I want that to be real. Like if it's, if it's his path with God and if he's found faith and, and that's where, you know, he feel like his, his motivations drive me. Hopefully it's real, you know, I want it I want. Whatever he's gonna do, I want it just to be real. I want him to fight. Keeps on talking about a comeback. It doesn't happen.

[Chris Williamson]

How long has that been going?

[Gervonta Davis]

Three years, four years. Right. Or, I don't know, longer.

[Chris Williamson]

It might. It might be. You could tell me it's been five years since he fought.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah. I wouldn't know. Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

I can't remember. And it's not as if the last few fights have been exactly drenched in glory either. One stoppage, like injury stoppage or whatever it was. And then Khabib. And then. I don't know. It's just. Yeah, just.

[Gervonta Davis]

I don't know. It's just.

[Chris Williamson]

It's such a shame, dude. It's such a fucking shame. And the more that I think about it, the more it's just sometimes I think about different versions of the universe where one thing happened or didn't happen, and the. The version of the universe where McGregor kind of didn't get lost in the source.

[Gervonta Davis]

Right.

[Chris Williamson]

It's like, oh, my God. More of those Aldo moments of him just being like a. Like a samurai, Zen master type thing.

[Gervonta Davis]

Maybe it happened for a reason. What if. What if he did do that and he was that guy? How much crazier would he.

[Chris Williamson]

Maybe. Yeah, yeah. And he learned a lesson at 50.

[Gervonta Davis]

Right? Right, exactly. We'll never know. I. I just wish the best for that guy. I hope he. Hope he could make. I want to see him win one more good fight.

[Chris Williamson]

Yes.

[Gervonta Davis]

If he just does that, I'm cool. Legacy saved.

[Chris Williamson]

Agreed. I think he's got one fight left on his UFC contract, and, yeah, man, I hope it. I hope it happens, but after a while, there's a little bit of, you know, all of the bravado, it becomes harder and harder to do the longer since you fought and the older that you get. Right. You're able to do this because you've still got bags of career ahead of you if you want to, and you can.

[Gervonta Davis]

Well, I feel like there should have been evolution in it. Like, you start off this young guy, like Connor, bravado, talks a lot of shit. Then you become this, you know, legend, and you come this og, and the OG has to be more calm, more stoic, more. Don't worry, I got this. Like, I've done this long enough. Watch what I do, you know, with a little. The opposite happened with a little bit of tragic, but then it just kept on going, you know, There should be some type of evolution there.

[Chris Williamson]

Well, I guess what actually happened because,

[Gervonta Davis]

like, Mayweather stopped kind of being so

[Chris Williamson]

very true, you know. That's a good point. Yeah, that. Yeah, that is a really, really good point. As somebody that was one of the biggest shit talkers. And then it, toward the end of his career was just, I'm gonna beat you.

[Gervonta Davis]

And you're not gonna beat.

[Chris Williamson]

You couldn't. You couldn't fucking face the guy.

[Gervonta Davis]

No, he already knows the game too much. Like, when you know the game too much, it's like, all right, talk and whatever. Like, he already knows all the entertainment shit. He's just there to be Floyd Mayweather. I'm gonna come.

[Chris Williamson]

I'm a profession. I'm here to do a job.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah, exactly. So I think he missed the evolution. The evolution, yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

Yeah, he did. There was a fucking firmware Update. I know iOS update didn't come. That's something that is kind of scary to see. You know, you were talking about aggression, rage, anger, different components of how, how a fight is sort of put together. There is something really terrifying about somebody that just sees you as like a job to be dispatched. Like if you were to, if you were a plumber and you were to look on your day and you said, I need to replace this toilet at 11:00am you go, okay, you're just the toilet I'm replacing at 11am this is just a standard day in the office for me. Thank you very much. I'll see you on the other side. Like, I'll see you once the toilet's fitted. That's like, oh, my God, I'm just a fucking task. I'm just, I'm just on the to do list for today. I'm not even an event, really. I'm just like something that I'm moving through. And when you see that with people, you go like, holy, that is like,

[Gervonta Davis]

what am I getting myself into? Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

Are you worried? Are you conscious around long term health stuff? We talk, we hear a lot about cte, about tbi, about brain health. Yeah. How much does that factor in? As if somebody that's been doing this since seven years old, this talk. I imagine when you were the CT talk would have only come in in your teens, like, to have been really high levels of awareness.

[Gervonta Davis]

Honestly, once it kind of got big with the football, I forgot what year that was. That was kind of the year that everybody started questioning, oh, like, we should probably all start thinking about our health. But it's also like, look, man, I've already accepted whatever happens to me, it's okay. I just try my best to not look into to that type of future. But if it happens, I hope that the people that love me take care of me. That's it.

[Chris Williamson]

You're just happy for that to be a side effect of your chosen career?

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah, because I, I try to put all my decisions and let it be guided by God. So if that's just the nature of what I've chosen to do and what I felt like was the right thing to do, that's just what it is. And there's really nothing I could do about it. I mean, but boxing, avoid getting hit

[Chris Williamson]

would be a good start.

[Gervonta Davis]

Oh, yeah, for sure. Um, and I try my best to, you know what I mean? Obviously I'm still feeling clean. Never broke my nose, thank God, you know what I mean? So I'm doing pretty good in that, in that aspect. But like I said, if it happens, it happens. But I hope not.

[Chris Williamson]

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[Gervonta Davis]

I don't know. No, I just feel like I've always had mental health problems. I don't know if it comes from boxing, but you Know, a little, you know, anxiety sometimes a little bit of, like, bipolarness. But I've always kind of been that way. Like, I don't know.

[Chris Williamson]

I don't think you get to.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

The level of obsession and focus without need, without having something in there. You mentioned edge. Yeah, that edge comes from somewhere.

[Gervonta Davis]

My edge is that I am an obsessive thinker of, like, situations. Positions are. I'm here. Like. Like, I'll study one position and, like, where I'm at for, like, a long period of time. Because I'm like, all right, I know there's something more here. You know what I mean? I'll get to that. But it really is. It's a lot of. It's just with boxing and. God, like, I don't really like to obsess over too many things, but, like, boxing, for some reason, I could just, like, think about that moment so many times. Like, okay, that's where it was. Okay, he threw that. But that's like, I could. You know, if I shift here. Foom. I could catch him quick, and he might not notice. Like, there's just a lot of, you know, with my brain, with that. It's just. I love it so much that I just want to study that.

[Chris Williamson]

Can you remember a position? Is the one that comes to mind that you spent a long time thinking about that, then ended up being an unlock. Is there a particular sequence that you. That you spent?

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah. Even when I was, like, young, I remember this. I was sparring this kid, and he kept catching me, catching me. And I was like, I remember going back home and just thinking about it for, like, two hours, three hours. Like, why is he catching me with that? And then I. I had remembered. I overthought about it so much that I was like, all right, Dad. I called my dad to the room. I said, call him back. Like, I have something for him. Let's go. And he goes, are you sure? Like, he was pretty much whooping your ass. Like, let's just wait a little bit. I was like, no, call him. The next day, I figured something out, and it was a. When he would step forward, he would show his jab. So, like, he would step and then show the jab. So I had caught onto it in my brain when I was replaying it. So I told my dad, every time he makes that move, I'm gonna cut to the. To the right and hit him with a right hand. And I guarantee you, he won't stop that because he can't stop doing this. So every time he came in And I would catch him. And my dad was like, how do you figure that in a day? I was like, I don't know. I just kept thinking about it. Like, he kept on catching me with that shot. But there has to be something that, like, I'm doing wrong or I'm not reading or something. And my dad's all. He always thinks about that story. He's like, that's how I knew. Like, you're different. Because I would. I could come back the next day and I'll be a whole different fight. Like, I don't know how, but I just, like, the next day, like, the guy, if he thinks he got an edge, like, bro, I'm thinking about this all day. That's why I try to tell my little brother, like, after sparring, you need to just think. I go in your room and just think, think, think. Like, why did this happen? Why did that happen? Like. Like, what was he doing that was throwing me off? There was a couple instances like that in the ring. It's like, there has to be something here. You know what I mean? So, yeah, I've. I've learned so much things in boxing. Like, just the whole aspect of it, it's like. It's almost like music notes. I started learning that like. Like, and when you're in the ring, it's like, boom, boom, boom, boom. And then when something feels off, that means because some note was off. You know what I mean? Like, some movement. Okay. Oh, I read that wrong. That's where it was. Okay. Boom. So it's like. It really is like, a whole level of just, like, beautifulness. Like, that's why I said I really love boxing. There's so much little things in it that, like, get me excited and so fun.

[Chris Williamson]

Have you been able to do that during any of your fights as a professional, or have they been. How often are you surprised by that? You say, most of the time, presumably, you're studying tape. You're thinking you're bringing fighters into the. The gym and the camp that replicate the style that you're probably going to face the whole game is to not be surprised when you get in there. But presumably that's what the other guy's doing, too, which means that they're trying to come up with something that you don't yet know, which might surprise you, which means that you need to go back and you've got forget two hours in a day. You've got a minute in the corner to be like, why is that thing happening? Have you ever had that happen as a Pro.

[Gervonta Davis]

No, honestly, I haven't. It's been more so like when I'm on point and like when, you know, I'm in a good mental space, nothing will surprise me because it's like I've already been thinking about, like I've been looking at every scenario. Like the times I've lost, I literally, it comes from a place of like self sabotage and like I wasn't even in the camp. I was just kind of letting the day go by and just kind of like not being there. And I know it probably sounds like an excuse, but that's just what it was. Were they the better fighters that night? For sure, and I always give them credit on that. But you know me at my best is when I'm thinking like this, when I'm paying attention to every day, when I'm. Everything is like intentional. Like when I wake up, how I woke up was intentional. Not on the phone, not on the phone. And I'm breeding things. I'm letting you know that inner wisdom just kind of flow me through the day, you know what I mean? I'm on track. When it's like that, it's hard to surprise me because I've been paying attention to everything, so. But now when I fight somebody, it's like what surprises me is like, oh, wow, they're really talented. Like they're fast. That's cool. You know what I mean? Like it won't be like a move or like a, a shot that will surprise me. Just be like, oh, this guy, he's on top of his game. That's cool. You know what I mean? But as far as like a technique or anything, it's kind of. It'd be hard to surprise me, but I feel like I've surprised people because a lot of people, they'd be seeing that move, they're like, where do you even come up with that stupid move? Hey, I look stupid, but am I getting hit? Because I've been thinking about this. I've been like, Mayweather, he does a shoulder rope, but he hides behind it a lot. And people think like, they call me over turning my back, but I'm just giving them the side. And then you can't really hit me on it. But everybody makes fun of me on it, but I have not got hit once doing it. So guys, come on. You call. You called the silly show. They called the silly show, right? It's all good.

[Chris Williamson]

You'd have to do a job, dude. Yeah. And if you dispatch someone. Yeah. It's so funny to think about obsession Obviously it's, it is very much a double edged sword. It's the sort of thing that can cause you to be obsessed with politics or porn or your ex or drugs or gambling or partying or status or money or how people see you.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

But it can also, if you direct it in the right angle, be the thing that causes you to completely change your game in the space of two hours as a professional sports star. It's this sort of thing that can cause you to obsess over how well you write or tell stories as a writer.

[Gervonta Davis]

That would be cool now that like I would want to learn how to do that like writing. For some reason it just seems so like, like if you could get a high level where you could make somebody feel something just by a sentence and you know it's going to hit, that's pretty sick.

[Chris Williamson]

And what my housemate at the moment is just finished the first draft of his book, which is going to be amazing. And I'm watching him. All he does every single day is in the spare bedroom in the house that we live in. Every wall is covered in post it notes. Everything. He's just living and breathing this book. You know, in, in AI and ChatGPT and stuff like that, there's an idea of a context window. And it means how big is the sort of world of information about what you're talking about that the AI has reference to? So if you have a real long chat, the context window is super huge. If you start a new chat, the context window is a little bit smaller. His context window for his own book is like three galaxies big. Right. He's got all of these different stories and he'll come downstairs and tell me, I just learned this story about Phil Collins and how he wrote like in the Air Tonight or how he wrote this song and it's so fucking cool. And I'm watching like you did. I'm watching somebody who is so obsessed. My point being most people go through their lives without ever getting an obsession that's worth anything. People can reach the end of their lives having either never been obsessed or only being obsessed about stuff that wasn't worth anything. So if you're the sort of person who has an obsession that's pointing in a positive direction, you really shouldn't waste it. No, it's a fucking wonderful thing. It's free motivation. It's free discipline. It's not that you as a kid had to be forced to train. You couldn't not train all that you wanted to. It wasn't like someone went into your bedroom after you lost that fight to that guy, that kid, and said, you need to think about this for two hours. If you told me to go and play video games, I couldn't. I can't not do this thing.

[Gervonta Davis]

That's very true.

[Chris Williamson]

Free discipline, free motivation. And that doesn't last forever. And what you need is while the. While the tide, while the current's with you to sort of ride down now. Okay, I'm going to do what I'm called to. And I think that's what you were talking about up top. I, like, I get little whispers sometimes. These fleeting thoughts, these nudges that move my life in different directions. I'm going to follow those because in future, they might not be there. And you missed them. You missed them.

[Gervonta Davis]

It's like the neon sign kind of just went past it, like.

[Chris Williamson]

But I could have seen. What was it?

[Gervonta Davis]

What was it? Yeah, it's cool. Just to see what it was. You know what I mean? Yeah. And just, you know, kind of see where that goes. But, yeah. I always told people my biggest fear in life when they asked me, like, is it death? Is? I was like, no, it's just not reaching my potential and just wasting it because I know I have so much. So it's like that. That just scares me.

[Chris Williamson]

Pressure is a privilege, dude. Hey, I appreciate you. I'm fired up to see what the rest of this year has for you.

[Gervonta Davis]

Thank you. You're the man, sir.

[Chris Williamson]

Appreciate you.

[Gervonta Davis]

Pleasure.

[Chris Williamson]

Till next time.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yeah.

[Chris Williamson]

Goodbye, everybody.

[Gervonta Davis]

I'm going to try this.

[Chris Williamson]

Get it in you.

[Gervonta Davis]

Yes, sir.

[Chris Williamson]

When I first started doing personal growth, I really wanted to read the best books, the most impactful ones, the most entertaining ones, the ones that were the easiest to read and the most dense and interesting, but there wasn't a list of them. So I scoured and scoured and scoured and then gave up and just started reading on my own. And then I made a list of 100 of the best books that I've ever found. And you can get that for free right now. So if you want to spend more time around great books that aren't going to completely kill your memory and your attention just trying to get through a single page, go to chriswillx.combooks to get my list completely free of 100 books you should read before you die, That's ChrisWillX.Com Books.