Episode 660: Herbert Mullin: The Killer Hippie (Part 1)

Summary

Morbid Episode 660: Herbert Mullin: The Killer Hippie (Part 1) Summary

Release Date: April 3, 2025
Host/Author: Morbid Network | Wondery
Description: Morbid is a true crime, creepy history, and all things spooky podcast hosted by an autopsy technician and a hairstylist. Join us for a heavy dose of research with a dash of comedy thrown in for flavor.

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Introduction

In Episode 660 of Morbid, hosts Alayna and Ash delve into the chilling case of Herbert Mullin, infamously known as "The Killer Hippie." This episode marks the first installment of a two-part series that explores the life, motivations, and heinous crimes of Mullin, set against the backdrop of the tumultuous 1960s and 1970s in California.

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Early Life and Family Dynamics

Herbert Mullin was born on April 14, 1947, in Salinas, California. His birth coincided exactly 41 years after the devastating San Francisco earthquake of 1906, a coincidence that later played a significant role in his distorted worldview.

Alayna [15:20]: "The most remarkable thing about his birth was that it occurred exactly 41 years to the day after the San Francisco earthquake of 1906. But it comes into play in a big, very big way in his behavior later."

Mullin grew up in what appeared to be a typical conservative American household. His father, Martin, a World War II veteran, embodied mid-century American masculinity—stern and strict but occasionally affectionate. His mother, Jean, was a devout Catholic who heavily influenced the children’s education and spirituality.

Alayna [16:27]: "Jean Mullen was a devout Catholic and she took her faith very seriously. And she literally, like, she was one of those that. I don't want to hear you questioning anything about my beliefs."

Despite outward appearances, the family's dynamics were strained. Herbert's intelligence led him to question his rigid religious upbringing, resulting in frequent punishments from his mother for perceived blasphemy.

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Onset of Mental Illness

Herbert’s mental health began to deteriorate during his adolescence, particularly after the tragic death of his best friend, Dean Richardson, in 1965. Dean’s sudden death from a motorcycle accident left Herbert grappling with profound grief.

Alayna [23:32]: "He had only demonstrated some quirky tendencies and occasional challenges before Dean's death. But after Dean died, his grief and inability to manage his emotions became very apparent."

This loss exacerbated his existing paranoid and conspiratorial thinking. Herbert believed that his parents were sabotaging his social life and that they were part of a conspiracy to alienate him.

Alayna [20:33]: "He believed his parents were sabotaging his attempts at making friends. He even believed his parents were going door to door in the neighborhood, asking people to ignore him."

Struggling to process his grief, Herbert turned away from Catholicism, seeking solace in Eastern religions and New Age spiritual practices. Lacking parental support, he began experimenting with psychedelic drugs like LSD, which further destabilized his mental state.

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Hospitalizations and Treatment

By 1969, Herbert's behavior had become increasingly erratic. His inappropriate actions, including attempting to engage in sexual relationships with his older sister, led to heightened concerns among his family.

Alayna [30:27]: "Herbert would brazenly proposition his older sister for sex, and she would inform her parents each time. Jean and Martin refused to believe their daughter."

Only after four years of escalating behavior did the family take action. In 1969, they sought psychiatric help for Herbert, leading to his first hospitalization at Mendocino State Hospital. Diagnosed with schizophrenia, Mullin underwent multiple hospitalizations between 1969 and 1972, being committed to five different facilities during this period.

Alayna [40:08]: "He was diagnosed with schizophrenia and committed to five different hospitals between 1969 and 1972."

Despite these interventions, treatment during this era was limited. The lack of comprehensive mental health care meant that Herbert's condition remained largely unmanaged, allowing his paranoia and delusions to fester.

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Motivations and Beliefs

Herbert Mullin's actions were driven by a complex web of delusions and a perceived mission to save humanity from impending disasters. Central to his belief system was the idea that mass sacrifices were necessary to prevent catastrophic earthquakes and environmental destruction.

Alayna [43:37]: "He believed that the war in Vietnam had resulted in so much death and destruction that he thought sacrifices were appeasing the gods to prevent natural disasters."

Herbert's fixation on his birthdate tied to the San Francisco earthquake fueled his conviction that he alone could avert future tragedies through his actions.

Alayna [44:23]: "From a very early age, Herbert was struck by the fact that he had been born exactly 41 years after the San Francisco earthquake of 1906, which became warped into his delusion that it was his responsibility to prevent earthquakes."

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The Crimes Begin

Herbert Mullin's murder spree began in Santa Cruz County, a region that had previously been tranquil but was plagued by other notorious serial killers during the same period. His first confirmed murder occurred on October 13, 1972, when he killed Lawrence White, a 55-year-old man struggling with personal issues.

Alayna [49:44]: "Herbert struck him with the bat in the back of the head as hard as he could, knocking him to the ground. The blows shattered the back of his skull and pushed shards of bone into his brain, killing him instantly."

Herbert believed that each murder was a necessary sacrifice to prevent greater disasters. His approach was methodical yet deeply influenced by his distorted beliefs.

On October 24, 1972, Herbert murdered Mary Guilfoyle, a 24-year-old woman who took his offer for a ride. He used a hunting knife to brutally kill her, further cementing his intent to carry out his perceived mission.

Alayna [54:44]: "He plunged a hunting knife into her chest and hit her heart, killing her instantly. He continued driving, stabbed her twice in the back, and laid her body in the woods."

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Attempted Murder at St. Mary’s Catholic Church

Herbert Mullin’s crimes culminated in a disturbingly religious setting when, on November 2, 1972, he attempted to murder Father Henry Thome at St. Mary’s Catholic Church in Los Gatos. Armed with a hunting knife, he entered the confessional booth intending to commit another act he believed would save humanity.

Alayna [58:23]: "When he walked inside, he went through the Catholic routine he'd learned as a child... After finishing this whole routine, he noticed a light above the confessional booth and approached it."

In a violent confrontation, Herbert stabbed Father Thome multiple times, resulting in the priest's death. This act not only highlighted Herbert's deep-seated delusions but also connected his actions to his corrupted religious beliefs.

Alayna [60:09]: "Herbert tried to push the man's leg into the booth to cover up his crime. As he was struggling, he thought he heard a scream. He wiped the blood from his knife, ran out of the church, and drove back home."

A witness, Margaret Reed, saw Herbert during the attack, but the brutality and randomness of the act baffled investigators, complicating the case.

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Investigation and Public Reaction

The murders of Lawrence White, Mary Guilfoyle, and Father Henry Thome shocked the Santa Cruz community. Despite thorough investigations, the randomness of the killings, especially the attempted murder at the church, made it difficult for police to identify a clear motive or suspect initially.

Alayna [63:27]: "Detective Sergeant Jim Shea told reporters that so far, there does not appear to be any motive at all for this killing."

Mary Guilfoyle's disappearance went largely unnoticed by the public, with authorities mistakenly assuming she had run away. In contrast, the murder of Father Thome brought significant attention due to the randomness and brutality of the crime.

Throughout the investigation, Herbert Mullin managed to evade immediate suspicion, allowing his killing spree to continue.

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Conclusion of Part 1

As the episode concludes, Herbert Mullin grapples with the aftermath of his crimes. Despite believing he had fulfilled his mission, he remained uncertain and driven by his delusions to continue his murderous path.

Alayna [65:28]: "He still felt a sense of unease and dread that he couldn't shake. He realized that one sacrifice wasn't enough to prevent the disasters he envisioned."

The episode sets the stage for Part 2, where listeners can expect an exploration of Herbert Mullin's further descent into madness, additional crimes, and the eventual culmination of his killing spree.

Alayna [66:02]: "We will get to that in part two."

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Notable Quotes

• Alayna [15:20]:
  "The most remarkable thing about his birth was that it occurred exactly 41 years to the day after the San Francisco earthquake of 1906. But it comes into play in a big, very big way in his behavior later."

• Alayna [20:33]:
  "He believed his parents were sabotaging his attempts at making friends. He even believed his parents were going door to door in the neighborhood, asking people to ignore him."

• Alayna [43:37]:
  "He believed that the war in Vietnam had resulted in so much death and destruction that he thought sacrifices were appeasing the gods to prevent natural disasters."

• Alayna [54:44]:
  "He plunged a hunting knife into her chest and hit her heart, killing her instantly. He continued driving, stabbed her twice in the back, and laid her body in the woods."

• Alayna [65:28]:
  "He still felt a sense of unease and dread that he couldn't shake. He realized that one sacrifice wasn't enough to prevent the disasters he envisioned."

---

Final Thoughts

This episode of Morbid masterfully unpacks the tragic and horrifying story of Herbert Mullin, a man who spiraled into madness amidst personal grief and societal turmoil. The hosts provide a comprehensive look into how unresolved mental health issues, compounded by lack of support and understanding, can lead to devastating consequences. As listeners prepare for Part 2, the episode leaves them pondering the complexities of mental illness and the societal failings that allow such darkness to fester.

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For those who have not listened to the episode, this summary provides an in-depth look into the life and crimes of Herbert Mullin, capturing the essential points, discussions, and conclusions drawn by the hosts.

Transcript

[Alayna]

Hey, weirdos. Alayna here. If you're looking to kick back and relax with Morbid, Wondery is the way to go. It's like having a cozy seat in our haunted mansion. No ads, just you and early access to new episodes. You can join Wondery in the Wondery app or in Apple podcasts or Spotify. You're listening to a morbid network podcast.

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[Chico Felitti]

Desiree vanishes without a trace, the trail leads to Kat Taurus, a charismatic influencer with millions of followers. But behind the glamorous posts and inspirational quotes, a sinister truth unravels. Binge all episodes of Don't Cross Kat early and ad free on Wondery.

[Ash]

Hey weirdos. I'm Ash.

[Alayna]

And I'm Elena.

[Ash]

And this right here that you're listening to in your car, in your house.

[Alayna]

What'D you say at this moment?

[Ash]

At this moment is morbid? I thought you said at a sporting event. At a sporting event. Why is somebody listening to me morbid at a sporting event? Know speaking of sporting events, Elena took me to my first Celtics game.

[Alayna]

Yay.

[Ash]

It's so much fun.

[Alayna]

It is. I love the Celtics.

[Ash]

I had a real ghost sports moment.

[Alayna]

Yeah, you did. You were jumping up and yelling about fouls by the end of you were. I was so excited for you. I was like she's. She's into it.

[Ash]

Yeah, it was fun.

[Alayna]

I like true.

[Ash]

I used to like going weirdly. I never went to the basketball games in high school cuz I like didn't give a shit. But in middle school I loved it. That's amazing.

[Alayna]

In middle school I love but so hard.

[Ash]

I felt heavy with it.

[Alayna]

Hell yeah. Yeah, it's fun. The Celtics are awesome. And I won't hear anything to the contrary about that.

[Ash]

Never. I Mean, just based off stats alone.

[Alayna]

Yeah.

[Ash]

Listen to me. Look at that number two.

[Alayna]

Look at those stats.

[Ash]

Oklahoma.

[Alayna]

Go yourself. Go.

[Ash]

Go yourself. Look at me talking trash. Talking trash about.

[Alayna]

It's fun. Yeah, it's fun.

[Ash]

Yeah.

[Alayna]

When you get to hear how gnarly Bostonians are.

[Ash]

Oh, my God.

[Alayna]

The crowd at a Celtic school.

[Ash]

The crowd at this one in particular.

[Alayna]

Honey, it went off. It went hard. It did go hard at the pink head. Yeah, it's. It's a lot of fun.

[Ash]

I know. I love it.

[Alayna]

The girls got to do a. A little thing separately during a couple of games. They got. We like, entered them into a thing where they got to high five the players.

[Ash]

Oh, my God, that's so cute.

[Alayna]

And they fucking loved it. It's the cutest thing in the entire world.

[Ash]

Can you enter me into that?

[Alayna]

Yes, you can high five the players.

[Ash]

I want to high five the players. Is it for children only?

[Alayna]

It is.

[Ash]

Is it for new sports fans?

[Alayna]

It's for children only.

[Ash]

I could. I could just crouch.

[Alayna]

Just crouch down, like, good luck, guys. Yay.

[Ash]

Like, what the fuck is that woman doing? You're like, go sports. What a visual that paints.

[Alayna]

I am visualizing it right now.

[Ash]

I just got banned from every Celtics event for the rest of the season.

[Alayna]

You just got put on a list. They were like, no, no, we can't have that.

[Ash]

No, I don't want to do that. But I do want to go back.

[Alayna]

And I love it. My kids call Jason Tatum Jaden Tatum.

[Ash]

It was so hard to not yell that out during the game.

[Alayna]

I know Every time I see him, I want to be like, But I'm like, your name is Jason.

[Ash]

Sorry.

[Alayna]

But, yeah, go Celtics. And. And yeah, I don't think. Is there any other bid.

[Ash]

Nasty, Really?

[Alayna]

I don't know. Ghost posted our episode yesterday unexpectedly. The actual Ghost account. And I died a thousand deaths. So here I am. Hell, yeah. A thousand deaths less than I was yesterday.

[Ash]

You only have how many more lives?

[Alayna]

I have no idea where I started.

[Ash]

You're bigger than a cat.

[Alayna]

I am.

[Ash]

It's so funny, the different places that we were about to go with that. You were like, what else do we have? And you went into ghost. And I was about to say, oh, star is coming up.

[Alayna]

So there's that.

[Ash]

We are different people.

[Alayna]

Equally as important.

[Ash]

It is.

[Alayna]

So there you go, Stara.

[Ash]

Go, baby. Smegs. Yeah, Put some rabbits out.

[Alayna]

Yeah.

[Ash]

Fake ones to.

[Alayna]

Fake ones. Don't just put your rabbits. People just walk outside and put their rabbits out.

[Audible Ad]

I don't know.

[Ash]

You don't Know your fucking life.

[Alayna]

We really don't. And you know. You know whose life? I really don't know. And confirm, who's Herbert Mullins?

[Ash]

Okay, so his life is lawless. Here's the thing. I genuinely don't know his life. I can recognize the name.

[Alayna]

Genuinely.

[Ash]

I genuinely don't know his life. I know. And I know that I've heard probably this case before, but I cannot remember the details.

[Alayna]

I cannot. It's a wild one.

[Audible Ad]

Yeah.

[Alayna]

So it makes sense that you genuinely don't know his life, but that you've heard the name.

[Ash]

Yeah.

[Alayna]

Because he's definitely up there. He's very brutal. He's very prolific in his numbers. And he was committing crimes at the same time as Edmund Kemper. So some. They got a little conflated. It's one of those things where it's like, everyone really knows Edmund Kemper's name for his crimes. But I think this one got a little pushed to the side, which is. When you hear this story, you're gonna be like, I'm sorry, what?

[Ash]

I almost wonder, too, if you mentioned him when we did Ed Kemper.

[Alayna]

I think I did mention him.

[Ash]

Yeah.

[Alayna]

Because I think there was some, like, confusion with victims and, like, what was going on. They were committing their crimes at the same time period in the same area.

[Ash]

Okay.

[Alayna]

So there was a lot of confusion.

[Ash]

Damn.

[Alayna]

Over what the fuck was, like, one.

[Ash]

Of our earliest episodes. I think he's, like, number three.

[Alayna]

Yeah. He's very early. And Herbert Mullen, though, is called the Killer Hippie, which is quite a moniker.

[Ash]

That's such a bummer.

[Audible Ad]

Yeah.

[Alayna]

And he was like, you're not a.

[Ash]

Hippie if you're a murderer.

[Alayna]

And he's a. He's a gnarly guy. Oh, no. But he's also very, very mentally ill. Oh, there's a lot happening in this. Okay. Very scary stuff. It was exacerbated, as we'll see, by, like, psychedelic drugs and Stu. Oh, shit. So that's. When you're already mentally ill. Taking psychedelic drugs can potentially be harmful.

[Ash]

Yeah. Just watch yellow jackets.

[Alayna]

There you go. You should, because it's really good. I'm in season two.

[Ash]

For once, I've turned Elena onto the show and Mikey as well. And I hold the power because I'm caught up and they're not.

[Alayna]

It's true. But we're. We're coming up. We're coming up to being caught up almost. We're getting there. So in the minds of many, the 1960s was definitely a decade that, like, you, you know, you Love a hippie. I do. The 60s was a time that was dominated by hippie culture.

[Audible Ad]

Free love, baby.

[Alayna]

You really think? Yeah, exactly. Free love. And there was a lot of, like, you know, advanced trying attempts to advance progressive ideas. And like, you know, this new generation of young people was trying to make shit happen. There's like a lot. When you go back into the 60s, a lot of shit was happening. There was a lot of interesting cultural changes happening. You know, it's a very interesting decade for sure. But while it is true that the heyday of the baby boomers was one of considerable social and cultural change, it's also an era where some of the darkest parts of humanity became impossible for a lot of Americans to ignore. Like, it really was the time, beginning in the mid-60s, violent crime and homicide rates were spiking in the US and they were honestly reaching, like, kind of shocking heights at this point. Because, remember, this is when suddenly it became like, oh, maybe we shouldn't hitchhike as much as we are kind of thing. And it really reached shocking Heights in the 80s before starting, like a little bit of a downward Trend in the 90s. I miss the 90s.

[Ash]

I long for the 90s.

[Alayna]

The number of violent crimes and murders committed varied by city and state, but few were struggling with the problem of violence. More than, sorry, California.

[Ash]

Yeah, it happens.

[Alayna]

It was rough out there. Beginning in the 60s, California and the Bay Area more specifically became a real mecca for hippies and other young people that were drawn to the culture that rejected conservative standards and morals in favor of more permissive behaviors. Unfortunately, it wasn't long before the state, who was, you know, which was once synonymous with free love, became known for producing some of the nation's most notorious serial killers. Yeah. Beginning in the mid-60s, a man who would eventually call himself the Zodiac started out on a series of murders that would keep the region locked in a grip of terror for nearly a decade. And then they just simply vanished. As we know to this day, we are the year of our Lord 2025. And we still have no fucking clue who the Zodiac Killer is.

[Ash]

Yep.

[Alayna]

A few Years later, in 1968, you might know this name too. Charles Manson and his disciples committed a series of crimes that culminated in a horrific mass murder, effectively ending the era of free love and bringing in, kind of ushering in an era of fear, paranoia and suspicion. To the south, in the LA area, Juan Corona went on a four month killing spree that claimed the lives of 25 men. Oh, wow. The same time that that was happening, another serial Killer, who we just recently covered. Rodney Alcala, the Dating Game Killer, committed the first of what would be many, many brutal murders. And the so called Southern California strangler, Randy Kraft, who we have not covered, set out on a rampage that claimed the lives of at least 16 people. Wow. And this was all in like a very short period of time. It was just mayhem. Over the course of the 70s, the list of LA area serial killers would grow to include some of the most notorious in the nation's. But maybe the most shocking and perplexing murders of the era were taking place between the state's two iconic cities in a largely suburban area, Santa Cruz County. Santa Cruz is also, I think is supposed to be the influence of Santa Carla in Lost Boys.

[Ash]

Yeah.

[Alayna]

Being like the murder capital of the world. That's Santa Cruz.

[Ash]

Yeah.

[Alayna]

So. Located about 60 miles outside of San Francisco, Santa Cruz has long served as a more suburban commuter city for those working in but not wanting to live in San Francisco. In 1970, it was home to a wide range of people, from unemployed college students to the highest paid surgeons. Essentially like everything in between. And within a few years, unlike nearby San Francisco, Santa Cruz was becoming very quiet, very peaceful. It was like a very nice place to live. But then within a few more years, it feels like it kind of just happened in like a slow burn. At the other end of the spectrum, it became known to many in California and the United States as the murder capital of the world.

[Ash]

Yep.

[Alayna]

Or Santa Carla. Now, for the most part, residents of Santa Cruz thought of crime as something that happened, you know, elsewhere in places like San Francisco. This is before it became known what it was known as. You know, they were thinking San Francisco's where that happened. You know, where the Zodiac was killing young couples and terrorizing residents with, you know, threatening letters to the press and cryptics and all that. But on the night of October 19, 1970, murder came right to Santa Cruz when Dr. Victor Oda, his wife and their two young sons and the doctor's secretary were found murdered in the family swimming pool and their house was set ablaze.

[Ash]

Oh my God.

[Alayna]

On the windshield of Oda's car was a typewritten letter threatening violence again, quote, against, quote, persons who misuse the natural environment. And it was signed with several hand drawn tarot symbols. What?

[Ash]

Tarot symbols?

[Alayna]

Yep.

[Ash]

Okay, that is not at all where I thought we were going.

[Alayna]

No. And about a week after that, Santa Cruz Police arrested 24 year old John Lindley Frazier, a local man known for his very erratic behavior and a passion for environmental causes. And his obsession with the Bible. And it would turn out that the murder of the Ota family was just the beginning. In the three years that followed, a number of young women from the Santa Cruz area went missing. And their bodies were discovered months or years later, showing signs of extreme violence. The murder of these young women would eventually be a tribute to Edmund Kemper. We know Edmund Kemper, if you listen to the episode. But he was a local man who was. You know, one of the things that was very interesting about him is that he was very friendly with the local police. Yeah. Hung out with them at the bars, wanted to be a police officer. But he was literally too big to be a police officer.

[Ash]

Like, too tall is insane.

[Alayna]

But he also had a history of violent, antisocial behavior that eventually culminated in a horrific series of murders. Now, in the cases of, you know, Fraser and Kemper, each had a particular victim type that, upon consideration, made sense, given their pathology, when you could attribute it to that. This hardly made residents of Santa Cruz feel safer, but it did kind of suggest that some people were safer than others.

[Ash]

Yeah, that makes sense.

[Alayna]

Which often happens with these things. And it gave the illusion that as long as residents avoided certain behaviors or activities, they could maybe avoid danger.

[Ash]

It reminds you of the Son of Sam case where girls were going out and dyeing their hair.

[Alayna]

Yes. Like, if you see any kind of pattern happening, you were trying to get away from it. Yeah. Now, unfortunately, while Fraser was killing those he believed to be polluters and harming the environment and Kemper was killing young women, there was another killer, or, you know, perhaps killers at work in the Santa Cruz area. And unlike the victims of Fraser and Kemper, these victims seem to be completely random.

[Ash]

Okay.

[Alayna]

Like, chosen completely. Just like luck of the draw. Although it would take time for investigators to realize they were dealing with more than one killer because there were several going on at once. By early 1973, at least 13 basically unrelated murders committed in Santa Cruz in the preceding year would be now attributed to 26 year old Herbert Mullen.

[Ash]

26 years old?

[Alayna]

Yeah. 26 years old.

[Ash]

That is so young.

[Alayna]

Right?

[Ash]

Yes.

[Alayna]

Isn't that crazy? And that's. At least 13 were attributed to him that they thought were totally unrelated because it was. There was no pattern here. Right. It was just mayhem.

[Ash]

Just that whimsical.

[Alayna]

So let's talk about Herbert Mullen a little bit.

[Ash]

Alrighty.

[Alayna]

Born in Salinas, California, on April 14, 1947, his early life was, by most accounts, fairly ordinary and unremarkable. The most remarkable thing about his birth was that it occurred exactly 41 years to the day after the San Francisco earthquake of 1906. Oh, seems kind of like random to mention that. And you're like, what? Cool. But it comes into play in a big, very big way in his behavior later. So hold on to that little nugget, okay? At home, the Mullen family seemed to be the picture perfect conservative American family. The dad, Martin, was a veteran of World War II. He was stern, he was strict. Definitely met the definition of, you know, mid century American masculinity. Oh, good. Yeah, awesome. According to author Ryan Greene, quote, Martin did show his son affection where he could. He shared stories with him about his experiences in the war, taught him how to fire a gun, and even engaged in playful boxing matches with the young boy in the kitchen while their dinner was being cooked.

[Ash]

So he sounded like he was like a pretty alright dad. Yeah.

[Alayna]

So Martin Mullen was definitely the head of the household because that's the way it was back then. But Herbert's mother, Jean, was responsible for much of the children's education and their spirituality.

[Ash]

Okay.

[Alayna]

Jean Mullen was a devout Catholic and she took her faith very seriously. And she literally, like, she was one of those that. I don't want to hear you questioning anything about my beliefs.

[Ash]

Yikes.

[Alayna]

Like, don't question it. Believe it. Take what I say as the word and that's it. Whether you have questions or not, I want to hear it.

[Ash]

That's just not the way to teach anybody anything.

[Alayna]

Yeah, that's not great. You have to. You have to. Because if people have questions about something, you should be able to answer them.

[Ash]

Yep.

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[Chico Felitti]

Everyone has that friend who seems kind of perfect for Patty. That friend was Desiree. Until one day I texted her and.

[Ash]

She was not getting the text. So I went to Instagram. She has no Instagram anymore. And Facebook.

[Alayna]

No Facebook anymore.

[Chico Felitti]

Desiree was gone. And there was one person who knew the answer.

[Alayna]

I am a spiritual person, a magical.

[Chico Felitti]

Person, a witch, a gorgeous Brazilian influencer called Kat Torres. But who was hiding a secret from wandering. Based on my smash hit podcast from Brazil comes a new series, Don't Cross Cat, about a search that led me to a mystery in a Texas suburb. I'm calling to check on the two missing Brazilian girls.

[Alayna]

Maybe get some undercover crew there. The family are freaking out. They are lost.

[Chico Felitti]

I'm Chico Felitti. You can listen to Don't Cross Cat on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Alayna]

Now according to Green, she portrayed the outside world as a dangerous and unhappy place where anything could happen. And she was insistent upon bringing the children to church every Sunday.

[Ash]

Okay.

[Alayna]

Which that you're like, you know what she's, you know, she's trying to keep safe.

[Ash]

For real?

[Alayna]

Yeah, she's. And she believes in, in Catholicism. So she's bringing the kids to church every Sunday. Like okay, but you don't need to.

[Ash]

Teach like your little tiny kids how unsafe and unhappy the world is.

[Alayna]

That's the thing. You gotta let em have a little bit of imagination. Rose colored glasses on for a little while. Right. So young Herbert followed his parents rules, but he was also pretty smart. Like he was a very smart child.

[Ash]

That tends to happen.

[Alayna]

Yeah. And he also asked a lot of challenging questions because as a smart kid you ask a lot of questions about the world around you because you want to understand more. And he was really questioning when it came to religion. The result of this challenging personality was almost always punishment from his mother who deemed her son to be blasphemous for asking questions.

[Ash]

I don't understand what's blasphemous about that.

[Alayna]

Yeah.

[Ash]

Especially if he's trying to understand. It's not that he's questioning it like to be a dick. He's just like, I'm trying to get this.

[Alayna]

He's just trying to understand it better. Like you should have the answers for him. Right. And help him understand. According to Green, this is where Mullins, kind of like disordered and paranoid and conspiratorial thinking came from Here is Her. Because he basically says he had discovered the truth about the world and he was being punished for it. So him questioning things that he's seeing, he's being punished for that. So of course he's gonna sit there and be like, what are you all hiding?

[Ash]

And of course. Yeah, that's gonna create paranoia.

[Alayna]

Of course. Now, in truth, it's pretty unclear when he started showing signs of mental illness or paranoia. Like, nobody knows exactly when it started, but it does appear as though his personality definitely started changing when he entered adolescence, which is pretty common. Yeah, things really come out at that time, but particularly when it came to his relationship with his parents. So Herb started to believe his parents were sabotaging his attempts at making friends. He even believed so far that his parents were going door to door in the neighborhood, asking people to ignore him.

[Ash]

Oh, that's really sad.

[Alayna]

Yeah. But. And this is wild, things were very different at school because he was very well liked by his peers, and he was regarded as a generally good student by his teachers. So he was super successful at school. He was even successful in after school sports and, like. So he was good at academics and sports.

[Ash]

Yeah.

[Alayna]

And he became one of the school's top athletes. Wow. So he's killing it at school and doing really well in sports. His peers like him, and then he goes home and he's being treated like an asshole for asking questions.

[Ash]

And he doesn't think anybody likes him.

[Alayna]

Yeah.

[Ash]

Even though he's, like, having positive experiences.

[Alayna]

And I don't know if it's like, he didn't think anybody liked him in the neighborhood or like, people like, you know what I mean, like, school and gets, like, a little more, because I'm not really sure.

[Ash]

That's interesting.

[Alayna]

But as he entered his teen years, his conservative worldview that he'd kind of been. Had been forced upon him by his parents started to fade a little bit. And it was giving way to more liberal and progressive perspectives of his friends. Like, you know, he was becoming a hippie in the 60s. You know, it was one of those. And he attended San Lorenzo Valley High School in San Francisco. He had definitely always been a little suspicious of his parents ideologies, like, as evidenced by him constantly challenging them and questioning them. And this new ideology that he was starting to adopt was only leading to more fights at home, I'm sure. And in turn, this further fueled his belief that even his parents disliked him. But his success at school did, you Know, make these stressors at home a little easier to cope with. Cause he was starting to see, like, I am getting positive stuff at school. So, like, I can't be all bad.

[Ash]

And he can kind of escape at school.

[Alayna]

Yeah. And in fact, by the time he was 16 years old, he was voted most likely to succeed in school.

[Ash]

Whoa.

[Alayna]

Yeah.

[Ash]

That's chilling.

[Alayna]

Isn't that wild?

[Ash]

Yes.

[Alayna]

Now, any pride that he had in his academic and social performance at school was cut short in 1965. And this is when his best friend, Dean Richardson, died unexpectedly.

[Ash]

Oh, that's awful.

[Alayna]

He was only a teenager.

[Ash]

Yeah.

[Alayna]

During the last couple years in high school, they had become nearly inseparable, and they had even been accepted to the same college. Then in early September, Dean, his best friend there, was riding his motorcycle with his sister on the back when he was cut off by a driver who crashed into a tree. The driver of the car and his girlfriend were killed instantly, and Dean was transported to the hospital, but ended up dying of his injuries on September 9th.

[Ash]

That's really sad.

[Alayna]

Yeah. And Dean's sister Mardine would be the only one that survived that whole crash.

[Ash]

Wow.

[Alayna]

Which is lucky for her, being on the back of that bike. Yeah.

[Ash]

That's not something that you would expect.

[Alayna]

No. Now, until Dean's death, Herbert had only demonstrated, you know, some quirky tendencies and, you know, occasionally a challenge. What was seen as a challenging personality? Yeah, Nothing that would really indicate any kind of chronic mental health issue or anything like that. But after Dean died, his grief and inability to manage his emotions became very apparent. According to Greene, almost overnight, his bedroom was converted into a vast shrine for his dead friend. So to me, it sounds like he was just not given the tools to process this and was not given, like, an open line of communication to process it.

[Ash]

Well, it's probably hard, too, because he's questioning his religious beliefs.

[Alayna]

That's the thing. Like his spiritual body.

[Ash]

His friend dies, and he's probably just wondering, like, where's my friend?

[Alayna]

Where do I. Yeah, where do I put this grief? Where are they? Somewhere else? Are they just gone? That's hard. Yeah.

[Ash]

Especially at any age, but especially at such a young age.

[Alayna]

Yeah. Well, in his inability to manage his grief and process it and just to, like, move forward with his life was taking a toll on his relationships with friends and even his girlfriend at the time. He had a girlfriend at the time, and she apparently, quote, complained about his obsessive behavior over some dead boy. That's like his best friend. So rather than confront his ongoing difficulty in accepting Dean's death, Herbert explained to his girlfriend that he was, quote, becoming homosexual.

[Ash]

Okay. It doesn't work like that.

[Alayna]

Which in his mind was the only possible explanation for his intense emotional reaction, because he just wasn't.

[Ash]

That's so sad.

[Alayna]

Taught differently.

[Ash]

And you also wonder if that was, like, projected at home.

[Alayna]

Well, that's. I wonder if that was part of some of the things he would challenge or question and wasn't getting answers for and was kind of being taught that.

[Ash]

Only because he made his bedroom like a shrine. Who knows how his parents felt about that.

[Alayna]

Yeah, I think there was a lot of probably confusing things being taught to him. So he was just like, oh, well, that's what's happening.

[Ash]

Right.

[Alayna]

Like, which is because you can love.

[Ash]

Somebody but not be in love with them.

[Alayna]

Exactly.

[Ash]

Like, he was clearly confused about his feelings.

[Alayna]

Exactly. And he wasn't getting somebody to sit him down and say, like, it's okay, like, you loved him. And that doesn't mean you were in love with him unless, you know.

[Ash]

And if you are.

[Alayna]

Feel your feelings, you know. But in reality, he was a teenage boy who was forced to confront the existential crisis of death in a particularly cruel and unexpected way. Like, this came out of nowhere, and he was lacking the emotional tools or support that he needed to manage this. So it's like, of course he's gonna come to some, like, random conclusions because of it. And so his emotions just got away from him, basically. And within a few weeks after the funeral, he started seeking a religious or spiritual path to understand death. So that really was part of the issue, was like, I just don't understand this.

[Ash]

That makes sense.

[Alayna]

Unfortunately. And much to his mother's disappointment, he didn't turn to Catholicism. Instead, he turned to Eastern religions and New Age spiritual practices that were growing in popularity with young people at the time. Not surprisingly, the idea of reincarnation was particularly appealing to him because of, you know, the recent loss.

[Ash]

Yeah.

[Alayna]

In the mid-1960s. And honestly, like, pretty much today, too, Western audiences had minimal insight into non Western religions and tended to understand them through the lens of Christianity. The result was essentially a spiritual practice that looked decidedly foreign and mystical, but was otherwise fairly Christian and bad practice. Also, the lack of insight or any kind of, like, real information into these practices typically meant that white practitioners of these took it upon themselves to just kind of, like, fill in the gaps with their own ideas and beliefs, whitewash it, which, like, you know.

[Ash]

Yeah.

[Alayna]

So for Herb, the lack of available information simply meant that he needed to go to Asia to learn more about the Practices that he had become so taken with.

[Ash]

Wow, okay.

[Alayna]

Yeah. Which, like, at this point, you're like, okay, go to Asia. Learn about that. Like, whatever makes you feel good for you. But his parents were not thrilled about his interest in Eastern religions and refused to help him travel there or learn any more about it.

[Ash]

That's dumb.

[Alayna]

Instead, his father encouraged him to join the military. That will not help, because he was arguing, well, you could travel and learn more about the real world. But to Herbert, a hippie with an interest in progressive ideologies, the idea of joining the military during the ramp up of an immoral foreign war was pretty incomprehensible.

[Ash]

And especially somebody already struggling with their emotional stability.

[Alayna]

Yeah, I don't think it's not a.

[Ash]

Great time to join the military.

[Alayna]

Definitely not. Instead, he turned to drugs and started experimenting heavily with LSD and other hallucinogens just to try to expand his mind, man.

[Ash]

Also not a great time to do psychedelic drugs.

[Alayna]

Not a great time. Yeah, I don't think that was the answer that we were looking for here.

[Ash]

No.

[Alayna]

Now, under the best of circumstances, hallucinogenic drugs are unpredictable and can have lasting, very bad consequences. For Herbert Mullen, a person who'd been showing signs of an early onset psychotic disorder, they almost certainly hastened his downward spiral into complete instability. In the years that followed Dean's death, his behavior became increasingly bizarre and inappropriate, all while his friends and former classmates put more and more distance between themselves and Herbert. In one instance, following his breakup with his high school girlfriend, he approached his older sister to ask for sex.

[Ash]

Whoa. Yeah, that. So there's happened so fast.

[Alayna]

Oh, yeah, that really.

[Ash]

It just really popped off right there.

[Alayna]

So what? Herbert's sister told their mother about what had just been asked of her. And Jean Mullen refused to believe that such a thing could be true and decided her daughter was being spiteful in trying to get Herbert in trouble.

[Ash]

That's not the stance you should take on that matter.

[Alayna]

That's fucked up in a way I can't even describe. Gene Mullen.

[Ash]

It's fucked up that that happened to her. And that.

[Alayna]

Yeah. And then her mother was like.

[Ash]

Her mom was like, you just want to get her burned.

[Alayna]

You're being spiteful.

[Ash]

It's like, damn, you really assume the worst in people, girl.

[Alayna]

Well, and what's worse is in the months after that, the scene repeated itself several times.

[Ash]

Oh, no.

[Alayna]

Herb would brazenly proposition his older sister for sex, and she would inform her parents each time. And Jean and Martin refused to believe their daughter. Why would she Keep saying this, right?

[Ash]

Why would she ever say that? Nevermind. Continue to.

[Alayna]

And after so long of this, she was like, I can't handle this anymore. I can't be in this house anymore. So she convinced her boyfriend to marry her so she can move out with him and not piss off her parents. You know the religious thing of like, you can't move out unless you're getting married.

[Ash]

Oh my God.

[Alayna]

So she convinced her boyfriend, please marry me so I can get a good.

[Ash]

Get out of here. That is so awful.

[Alayna]

Now, between his inappropriate sexual behavior, the increasingly bizarre thought patterns, and his growing obsession with reincarnation, one would assume it would have occurred to either one of his parents that, like, something was wrong here. Like, he's not entirely mentally sound right now. But at no point did either parent up till this point attempt to get help for their son or even speak to him about his mental health.

[Ash]

What the fuck?

[Alayna]

Despite him obviously, like, devolving balls, losing.

[Ash]

His mind and sexually assaulting his sister.

[Alayna]

And in fact, it took until 1969, after four years of his obvious decline, that anyone would do anything to intervene.

[Ash]

Wow.

[Alayna]

They just ignored him. Before that. One afternoon, in anticipation of Herbert's older sister and her new husband coming back for dinner to the house, Gene Mullen asked him to help clean up the house before anyone arrived. And he didn't mind this. Like, he always liked doing that stuff. He said he found it calming, like cleaning, you know, and not a lot of things were calming him at this point. So he was fine, he did his job, he was happy to do it. And when his sister and her husband arrived a few hours later, at first he was totally fine, like very docile, very, you know, totally normal. But then his demeanor totally switched because again, he was very polite in greeting everyone as they entered the house. And then all of a sudden, Martin noticed that while Herbert was acting normally with everyone else, it appeared that he was perfectly mirroring his brother in law's behavior when they interacted.

[Ash]

Oh, that's so fucking creepy.

[Alayna]

Isn't that like, beyond chilling?

[Ash]

That's chilling, yes.

[Alayna]

Oh, what the lady.

[Ash]

And as his sister, first of all, his sister was probably losing her mind. And then the brother in law there.

[Alayna]

Is probably like, what the.

[Ash]

What is.

[Alayna]

Yeah. And it's. Later, Martin Mullen would describe his behavior not as malicious or mocking, but as compulsive. And he said, quote, almost supernatural to observe. Now, Herbert mimicked his brother in law's every move in mannerism, no matter how small, with almost no delay, like he could anticipate them before it happened.

[Ash]

What?

[Alayna]

And over the course of the dinner, everyone at the table was picking up on this, but it was his mother's reaction that seemed to snap him out of it. Because unlike everyone else at the dinner table who reacted to the display, like, just kind of like. Like they said, like, literally with, like, uneasy, like, chuckling, kind of like, okay.

[Ash]

Like, what you doing?

[Alayna]

Yeah. If they. If they even acknowledged it at all, because some of them were just not gonna even bring it up.

[Ash]

Yeah.

[Alayna]

Jean Mullen went into a near hysterical panic and said her son was possessed. Girl. Babe, he's mentally ill and he needs help.

[Ash]

Sounds like she's also mentally ill. Yeah.

[Alayna]

Now, the next day, Gene contacted the family doctor and explained the symptoms that she had seen the night before.

[Ash]

She said, I think he's possessed by the devil.

[Alayna]

Yeah. And what kills me is, like, she calls the next day and talks about the. What had happened at the dinner table the night before. And then she starts talking about, like, yeah, actually his. You know, this has been happening since his final year of high school. And, like, after his best friend died, it really got bad. And it's like, why are you just telling the dog? So you have noticed.

[Ash]

Yeah.

[Alayna]

Like, it's like, so you're not in this blind blur haze of, like, not seeing it. You've seen it. You just didn't want to acknowledge it.

[Ash]

That generation loved to ignore things.

[Alayna]

Oh, they did. The generation of ignoring.

[Lindsey Graham]

Hey, weirdos. I'm Lindsey Graham from the podcast American Historytellers. And if you're still reeling from Ash and Elena's episode on the Boston Molasses disaster and you want to dive even deeper, you're in luck. My show doesn't usually venture too far into the spooky or creepy, but we've dedicated two full episodes to uncovering fascinating details about this bizarre molasses catastrophe, from the company's negligence to the victims. Harrowing stories. We explore how this strange event reshaped industrial safety laws and left an indelible mark on Boston's history. And the Boston molasses disaster is just one of many fascinating stories waiting for you on American Historytellers. We take you to the events, the times, and the people that shaped our nation and show you how our history affected them, their families, and affects you today. Follow American Historytellers on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. Wondery subscribers can listen to both American Historytellers and Morbid early and ad free. Start your free trial in the Wondery App, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify today in.

[Jesse Weber]

The early hours of December 4, 2024, CEO Brian Thompson stepped out onto the streets of midtown Manhattan.

[Alayna]

This assailant pulls out a weapon and starts firing at him.

[Jesse Weber]

We're talking about the CEO of the biggest private health insurance corporation in the world. And the suspect he has been identified.

[Alayna]

As Luigi Nicholas Mangione became one of.

[Jesse Weber]

The most divisive figures in modern criminal history.

[Lindsey Graham]

I was targeted, premeditated, and meant to sow terror.

[Jesse Weber]

I'm Jesse Weber, host of Luigi. Produced by Law and Crime and Twist. This is more than a true crime investigation. We explore a uniquely American moment that could change the country forever.

[Alayna]

He's awoken the people to a true issue. Finally, maybe this would lead rich and powerful people to acknowledge the barbaric nature of our house care system.

[Jesse Weber]

Listen to Law and Crime's Luigi exclusively on Wondery Plus. You can join Wondery plus on the Wondery app, Spotify or Apple podcasts.

[Alayna]

The doctor agreed that this was. This behavior was definitely strange. And he was like, you know what, there's definitely a diagnosis here. But he said he couldn't be certain until Herbert was admitted to a psychiatric hospital for observation and evaluation. Okay. Now to Jean, the doctor's suggestion was actually. Which I was surprised by, was a comfort to her because she was like, you know, what a solution to the problem. He's gonna agree to the evaluation. We'll get him diagnosed and get him medicated.

[Ash]

Okay.

[Alayna]

And like every. Which I was like, okay, yeah, yeah, okay, Jean, you should have done this a little before this, but okay. Martin Mullen, on the other hand, was a much harder sell on the idea of having his son brought to a hospital for somebody who was mentally ill. How he saw it. Yeah. In a relatively more conservative era, such treatments were heavily stigmatized. And those who were diagnosed with a mental illness were often treated as completely dysfunctional by society. And, you know, we still see that.

[Ash]

Yeah.

[Alayna]

For that matter, Martin wasn't even convinced that his son was mentally ill.

[Ash]

He definitely is.

[Alayna]

Which is like, babe, if he's copying.

[Ash]

Your every fucking move of your son in law at the dinner table, something's up.

[Alayna]

Well, and you can see it in his response later when he says that the mirroring almost looks supernatural. Yeah, that's a very religious way of looking at it where it's, I think he was possessed and no, he wasn't. He is suffering from a mental illness and needs a lot of help.

[Ash]

Right.

[Alayna]

And the thing is, if Martin didn't believe that Herbert was mentally ill, Herbert did not believe he was either. Because if his father is Saying he's.

[Ash]

Not, he's not, and his mom's just hysterical.

[Alayna]

Exactly. And in fact, as far as Herbert could tell, he was the one person in the house with the greatest clarity, while everyone else seemed to be the ones with the psychiatric issues.

[Ash]

Oh, that's so scary.

[Alayna]

Yeah. In the few years following his graduation from high school, his paranoia seemed to have kind of faded for a little while, especially when he was doing well and had other stuff to focus on. He needed something to focus on. The talk of hospitalization, which was invariably, you know, heated and intense, brought the suspicion and paranoia back with full force. It's. This was not. Whenever this got brought up, it just made him more and more questioning everything around him.

[Ash]

Yeah, that makes sense.

[Alayna]

He quickly surmised that his parents weren't interested in his mental health and well being, and instead they were conspiring with his doctor to have him committed and removed from their home. That's, that's how he viewed it. Now, despite his suspicions, he did eventually consent to seeing a psychiatrist. Basically, he was doing it just to prove to his mother that he wasn't mentally ill so she would leave him alone. After all, he believed he was the more enlightened one and everyone else around him was just bonkers. And as soon as the doctor saw that, you know, she was going to put Jean's mind at ease and we were going to put this all behind us and everybody will be fine. But of course, things did not work out that way. Almost immediately, the staff at Mendocino State Hospital recognized that his behavior and disordered thinking were symptoms of schizophrenia. I was one and he was committed for observation. What followed was several years of very frustrating treatment. Doctors were never certain whether Herbert was trustworthy, like when he was reporting things, or whether his paranoid personality was causing him to provide inaccurate information.

[Ash]

Okay.

[Alayna]

It was very difficult, especially at that time. It was difficult for them to like, weed through what he was reporting to them. You know what I mean? They do become. These kind of patients can become an unreliable narrator of what's going on. Especially back then when it was very.

[Ash]

Like, there's a limited understanding.

[Alayna]

Yeah. Like it was unknown, like the ins and outs and deep things about this particular illness.

[Ash]

Yes, that makes sense.

[Alayna]

Now, the extent of Herb's treatment during this period is not super clear, but between 1969 and 1972, he was committed to five different hospitals. Each time he would be discharged once doctors determined he was no danger to himself or others. Damn. That's a lot of hospitalization, a lot of hospitals. And while we may not know exactly what transpired during all of these periods of hospitalization. What is known is that while he was hospitalized at Mendocino State Hospital, he first reported his concerns and paranoia around earthquakes. That's when it first came out. During the first hospitalization, he casually mentioned his certainty that there would be another earthquake in California in the near future. At the time, hospital staff were like, okay, whatever, and like, you know, we're not going to pay attention to this. But years later, many would wish that they had. Now, during. And we'll get back to that. Don't worry. During his period of repeated hospitalizations, Herbert Mullen was mostly compliant. And he was pretty honest during most of those. But he also loathed being confined and being accountable in any way, shape or form to authority. And the longer he was hospitalized, the more defiant he became. He started compliant, became defiant, and the more experience he gained in the hospital system, the more he learned about what he needed to say in order to convince the psychiatrist that he was no longer a danger to anyone.

[Ash]

Yep.

[Alayna]

This meant that while he continued to describe symptoms of schizophrenia, he left out descriptions of command hallucinations. Oh, particularly any that might result in a long hospital stay.

[Ash]

That's really scary.

[Alayna]

Now. After being discharged in the later spring of 1972, he went to San Francisco and tried to join an art collective there. But his behavior made the others uncomfortable and he was asked to leave.

[Ash]

Oh.

[Alayna]

So he went back home to his parents house in Felton, and everyone, you know, behaved as though nothing had ever happened to disrupt the family.

[Ash]

That's such a good way of, like, coping with things. Just pretend that never happen.

[Alayna]

Just sweep that under the rug.

[Ash]

Yeah, it always works.

[Alayna]

We don't need to talk through it. It's cool.

[Ash]

Yeah.

[Alayna]

Quietly, however, Herbert once again became fixated on mysticism and the concepts of reincarnation and sacrifice. I hate that.

[Ash]

Yeah, reincarnation, great. Sacrifice, not great.

[Alayna]

So what he believed was the war in Vietnam had resulted in so much death and destruction that he believed the gods had been appeased by that sacrifice.

[Ash]

Oh, no.

[Alayna]

Thereby, that's how they had avoided any major natural disasters.

[Ash]

Oh, wow.

[Alayna]

That. That kind of, like violence and destruction was stopping the natural disasters from happening again.

[Ash]

That is some disordered thinking right there.

[Alayna]

But by late 1972, the war was showing signs of slowing as the American public, you know, grew weary of a losing battle. To Herbert, the end of the war meant the end of voluntary sacrifice. And he became certain that unless more sacrifices were made, an earthquake would wipe California off the map completely.

[Ash]

Oh, my God.

[Alayna]

So you can see how he got there.

[Ash]

Oh, my God.

[Alayna]

Now, it wasn't just fears that led Herbert to believe California was in danger of mass destruction. The voices in his head had for some time been telling him that.

[Ash]

Yeah.

[Alayna]

From a very early age, Herbert was struck by the fact that he had been born exactly 41 years after the San Francisco earthquake of 1906, which was a natural disaster that destroyed nearly all of San Francisco and killed thousands of people. It was a horrible, horrible disaster. Over time, that fascination of him being born at that, like, you know, 41 years after to the day, it became warped and worked into Herbert's delusion so that he came to believe that it was his responsibility to prevent earthquakes. Like, it all fell on him because of when he was born.

[Ash]

I'm also like, dude, what significance would 41 have?

[Alayna]

And he believed in order to do this, he had to make sacrifices.

[Ash]

Oh, I hate this.

[Alayna]

Yeah, I never. Yeah.

[Ash]

I'd never heard this case before. Like, I know I've heard the name, but now I know I have never heard this case.

[Alayna]

Now, his killing spree was largely driven by, you know, delusions. Yeah.

[Ash]

Mental illness.

[Alayna]

But that didn't mean he didn't want at least some recognition for the quote, unquote, project he was planning to undertake.

[Ash]

Not a project.

[Alayna]

Yeah. However, Herb knew if he told his parents or doctors about his thoughts and hallucinations, they would send him back to the hospital and he wouldn't be able to fulfill his mission, which to me, like, I have to wonder if that shows some sense of. He knows what he's doing is wrong and that he will be sent back to the hospital for it.

[Ash]

I feel like it's so hard when it comes to things like that because I think it's like he knows what he's doing is wrong by society's standards, but he doesn't hold himself to those standards.

[Alayna]

Yeah.

[Ash]

Because he's here for a higher purpose.

[Alayna]

There you go. So that's the thing. That's why this is an interesting one.

[Ash]

Yeah.

[Alayna]

So he didn't want to tell anybody about it, and instead he started sending rambling letters to anonymous recipients around California, making vague allusions to what he planned to do, and then would sign each letter, quote, a human sacrifice. Herbert Mullen.

[Ash]

Huh.

[Alayna]

And, like, that signature is definitely unsettling, like a human sacrifice. But apparently the contents of the letter must not have been too alarming because no one reported them to the authorities.

[Ash]

Anybody signs off a letter, human sacrifice, you're getting reported.

[Alayna]

Yeah, you're getting reported, buddy. Now, on the afternoon of October 13th, Herbert got in his car and went out for a drive. And he wasn't headed anywhere in particular. But by then, he had spent months thinking about his plan to save California, and it was finally time to put the plan into action.

[Ash]

I hate this.

[Alayna]

So he decided to just let the road take him wherever he was meant to go.

[Ash]

Oh, Christ.

[Alayna]

And he left Santa Cruz in the direction of the mountains, believing that his first sacrifice would definitely be found there. And as he drove casually down Highway 9, the voices in his head grew stronger. And by the time he entered Rincon, I believe it is, they were practically shouting at him. Because that's when he saw what appeared to be in, you know, what he thought to be a homeless man walking down the side of the road. To Herbert, who had let the voices and the fates guide him thus far, there was no question that this man on the side of the road was his first sacrifice.

[Ash]

Oh, no.

[Alayna]

So he drove past the man on the side of the road, then rounded a bend in the road and pulled off to the side of the highway, got out, opened the hood of his car and gave the impression of car trouble.

[Ash]

Oh, man.

[Alayna]

Now, this man who was walking down the road was Lawrence white. He was 55 years old, and that year had not been great for him. Yeah, he had struggled to get himself, you know, back on his feet, try to find somewhere to live, trying to find work, and he often found himself on the wrong end of the law for one trivial reason or another. Just a few weeks earlier, in mid September, he had been in custody at the Santa Cruz County Jail when a riot broke out among the inmates. And, you know, shit was destroyed, mattresses were burned. It was a crazy riot, and several of the guards and inmates were assaulted. Later, the county jail representative, George Foster, told reporters, you get a young guy who shoots off his mouth, and the other inmates nail him. They take out their frustrations in the only way they know how with violence. Now, during that riot, Lawrence was struck in the head and lost consciousness. So he had spent the last couple of weeks once he got out of the jail, because he was in there for, like, trivial reasons. It's not like a law for, like, murder, right? So he had spent the last couple weeks at a rehab center near La Selva beach before being discharged just back onto the street. Despite all his recent troubles, though, he wasn't one to turn away someone in need. Oh. So when he saw, you know, Herbert's old Chevy station wagon pulled off to the side of the road, he approached and said, Can I help? Like, what's going on? As it turned out, he actually knew a thing or two about cars, and especially Chevys in particular, so it was helpful. So he introduced himself, and he's like, let me take a look under the hood. And, you know. And so Herbert was like, you know what? In exchange for your help, I'll drive you wherever you need to go.

[Ash]

Oh, no.

[Alayna]

Now, at first, Lawrence checked, you know, all the usual spots, making sure the engine had enough oil, all that stuff. And while he was continuing to look under the hood, Herbert crept around to the back of the car and got a baseball bat. He'd stash it in the trunk. His plan was to knock Lawrence unconscious, then stab him in the heart. And the reason he was gonna do this was because that's how he saw sacrifices happen in movies or books. Stab him in the heart.

[Ash]

Okay?

[Alayna]

That was always his, like, I need to stab them in the heart. Apparently, he wouldn't need to go through all that trouble, because when Herbert returned to the front of the vehicle, Lawrence had just about finished under the hood and was, you know, about to tell him, like, I didn't find anything wrong with it. And Herbert struck him with the bat in the back of the head as hard as he could, knocking him to the ground. Herbert struck him in the head three more times while he was on the ground. And the blows from the bat didn't just incapacitate Lawrence White. They shattered the back of his skull. Oh, my God. And it actually pushed shards of bone into his brain, and he was killed instantly.

[Ash]

Oh, my God.

[Alayna]

Now, with Lawrence dead, Herbert had prevented, apparently another catastrophic earthquake, and in his mind, saved millions of people.

[Ash]

No.

[Alayna]

So he felt confident that he had done the right thing. Wow.

[Ash]

This is insane.

[Alayna]

Yeah. So he threw the bat back in the trunk, closed the hood, and then he dragged Lawrence White's body into a nearby brush and got back in the car and just headed home.

[Ash]

Jesus Christ.

[Alayna]

Now, a few days later, Lawrence White's battered body would be discovered in the woods along the side of Highway 9 that he was discovered by a passing driver who reported it to the police. The death was labeled a homicide, the results of several blows to the head by, quote, a narrow, blunt instrument. But it would be several months before they learned any of the details of Lawrence's death. With no next of kin or state to contact, Lawrence's remains were interred at Oakwood Memorial park at the expense of the state.

[Ash]

That's so sad.

[Alayna]

Which is so sad.

[Mr. Ballin]

You know those creepy stories that give you goosebumps? The ones that make you really question what's real? Well, what if I told you that some of the strangest, darkest and most mysterious stories are not found in haunted houses or abandoned forests, but instead in hospital rooms and doctor's offices? Hi, I'm Mr. Ballin, the host of Mr. Ballin's Medical Mysteries. And each week on my podcast, you can expect to hear stories about bizarre illnesses no one can explain, miraculous recoveries that shouldn't have happened, and cases so baffling they stumped even the best doctors. So if you crave totally true and thoroughly twisted horror stories and mysteries, Mr. Ballin's medical mysteries should be your new go to weekly show. Listen to Mr. Ballin's Medical Mysteries on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen early and ad free right now by joining Wondery in the Wondery app or or on Spotify or Apple Podcasts.

[Alayna]

Now, after Lawrence's murder, Mullen expected to feel some sense of relief. You know, he had lived up to what the voices in his head were telling him to do. He had fulfilled his end of the bargain to say, you know, to stave off the impending earthquake. But he said he still felt a sense of unease and dread that he couldn't shake. And then he realized why. He was like, oh, well, the Vietnam War had cost hundreds of thousands of lives, so it really doesn't seem reasonable that one sacrifice is going to be enough to do this.

[Ash]

Oh, man.

[Alayna]

And there was another new concern too. Because since killing Lawrence White, his delusional thinking had come to include the frightening belief that the earth was being rapidly polluted and that now he had to go after people for that.

[Ash]

Okay.

[Alayna]

And he was believing that, like people, their bodies were polluting the earth. Dear God. Which. This next one is horrific. Okay, they all are. But this one is particularly gruesome. On October 24, just 10 days after the murder of Lawrence White, Herbert was out for a drive along May Avenue in Santa Cruz and he spotted 24 year old Mary Guilfoyle hurrying down the sidewalk. Apparently, Mary had an appointment at the Cabrillo. I think it's the Cabrillo College Department of Human Resources. And she was running late. So she was so relieved when Herbert pulled up beside her in his station wagon and offered her a ride. It was becoming risky to hitchhike at that point. Like known to be risky to hitchhike. But he looked pretty ordinary. He just looked like a hippie. Like he didn't look like particularly frightening. Yeah. And you know, she had taken rides before from like older men who had stopped. And those were much scarier. Yeah. So she decided to take a chance. The two drove, apparently in silence for a short time. And then she started to talk nervously. And, you know, Herbert just kind of continued to drive, kind of appearing to like he said, he was kind of like, ignoring her. And then he was fumbling with something down by his side.

[Ash]

Okay.

[Alayna]

And Mary had just opened her mouth to speak when his right hand shot up from his hip towards her and he plunged a hunting knife into her chest and hit her heart. Immediately. Killed her instantly.

[Ash]

Jesus.

[Alayna]

He continued driving. As you know, she's bleeding profusely because he hit her heart. Yeah, bleeding profusely in the front seat. And he pulled the knife out of her chest, and she slumped forward and he stabbed her twice in the back as well. And she fell to the floor. Now, with Mary now dead, Herbert drove out to the mountains and found a turnoff where there appeared to be no cars and no evidence that cars had been there for some time. After parking the car, he dragged Mary's body out about 125 yards into a wooded area, laid her on the ground beneath a bunch of trees, and then decided that sacrificing her would slow the rapid pollution of the world. So he decided he needed to go a step further to make sure that occurred, because she was going to be the sacrifice that would stop the pollution of the world. So to make sure that this sacrifice was correct, he sliced open her body, expecting to find evidence of pollution inside of her.

[Ash]

What the fuck?

[Alayna]

When he didn't see any immediate traces of pollution, he began digging with his hands, first into her intestines, then in her chest cavity.

[Ash]

Oh, my God.

[Alayna]

And eventually he accepted that there was no pollution. So he stood up, wiped the blade of the knife clean, and returned to the car and thought, well, this will keep us safe for a little while.

[Ash]

Oh, my God.

[Alayna]

Holy gruesome. Like so brutal.

[Ash]

And didn't find any quote, unquote, evidence of pollution.

[Alayna]

Still felt like it was fine. Yeah. Now, for months, Herbert Mullen had been certain the voices in his head were guiding him on a mission to save mankind from disaster. And no one could convince him otherwise. But after the murder of Mary Guilfoyle, he wasn't as certain in his divine guides as he'd once been. Cause again, he didn't find what he was thinking he would find.

[Ash]

Right?

[Alayna]

Because if Mary had been the one responsible for all the pollution in the world, should he have not seen evidence of that in her body? Now, the tension between what he believed to be true. And what he saw around him was causing him to grow very anxious and frustrated and irritable. He had killed two people. Sacrifices to prevent the end of mankind. And though he was now less convinced that he had done it correctly or done the right thing.

[Ash]

Okay.

[Alayna]

So those tensions and frustrations led to more arguments with his parents, because, remember, he's still living at home, which in turn led to further drug use, which in turn led to worsening mental health.

[Ash]

Yeah.

[Alayna]

When he asked his mother what she thought he should do to calm his unrest, she gave the same answer she always gave him, turn to the Lord.

[Ash]

I don't think that will always help.

[Alayna]

This ended up being a statement that is so chilling when you find out what happens.

[Ash]

Oh, no.

[Alayna]

Because she said, turn to the Lord. And in the past, whenever she would, you know, that's. She would give that answer. He would dismiss the church and Western religion as another tool to control the masses. But this time, he decided, yes, I will turn to the Lord.

[Ash]

Oh, God.

[Alayna]

Now, on the afternoon of November 2nd, just one week after the murder of Mary Guilfoyle, Herbert went to St. Mary's Catholic Church in Los Gatos. He later claimed he had gone to the church simply to confess his sins. But he also went there with a hunting knife tucked inside his jacket pocket. So you take what you will from that.

[Ash]

Probably not just confessing sins.

[Alayna]

When he walked inside, he went through the Catholic routine he'd learned as a child. You know, dipping his hand in the thing, crossing himself with the holy water, and then kneeling to pay tribute to the altar.

[Ash]

Okay.

[Alayna]

After finishing this whole routine, he noticed that there was a little light glowing above the confessional booth. And so he went towards it, but he was hesitant to go inside and, you know, take a seat opposite a priest. He's a little nervous. Now, inside the confessional, St. Mary's assistant pastor Father Henry Thome could hear, like, a little bit of what was going on. He's like, somebody's out there. So he was wondering what was happening. Father Tomei slipped the lock on his side of the confessional and swung the door open to find a very disheveled Herbert Mullins standing before him. Now, before Father Tomei could even open his mouth, Herbert pulled the hunting knife from his jacket and thrust it upward into the priest's chest.

[Ash]

Oh, my God.

[Alayna]

The force of it sent both of them tumbling backwards into the open confessional, where Father Tomei desperately struggled to get out from underneath Herbert Mullen. Now, Herbert didn't understand what was happening because he had stabbed this man in the chest, just like he had stabbed Mary Guilfoyle a week before and assumed he'd stabbed him in the heart. But he didn't just die. Like, why is he struggling? So he pulled the knife from the priest's chest, and Herbert lost his grip on the knife, and it fell onto the floor. And as he leaned down to pick it up, he felt something in his head because Father Tomei kicked him in the side of the head as hard as he could, just above his ear. But unfortunately, Herbert Mullen was too quick. And as Father Tomei tried to get up and flee, Herbert rushed at him again, bringing the knife down for a second time, and then a third, and then a fourth. And finally, the priest was dead.

[Ash]

Oh, my God.

[Alayna]

Father Tomei lay half in and half out of a confessional booth.

[Ash]

Oh, that's so disturbing.

[Alayna]

So Herbert tried to push the man's leg into the booth to cover up his crime. And as he was struggling to get Father Tomei's body inside of the confessional booth, he thought he heard a person scream. So he turned around, and no one was there. But he was like, he was certain that he heard footsteps running out of the church. So he decided he shouldn't waste any more time, and he wiped the blood from his knife, put it back where he had gotten it, and he quickly ran out of the church and got to his car and drove the 20 minutes back to Santa Cruz. Now, at the time, Herb had wondered whether the scream he'd heard, followed by the footsteps, had been in his head. Yeah, because he knows that something is awry, Right? But what he had heard was a real scream of terror from Margaret Reed, who'd walked into the church and caught a glimpse of Herbert trying to force the priest's dead body back into the confessional.

[Ash]

Oh, my.

[Alayna]

Can you imagine seeing that?

[Ash]

Cannot. Will not.

[Alayna]

The footsteps were because Reid ran the fuck out of the church to the rectory, where she pounded on the door of the senior priest, Father Richard Hollywood. And Reid explained what she'd just seen, and Holly instructed his secretary to call an ambulance. While that was going on, Reid and Holly returned to the church, and Father Hawley administered extreme unction, which is last rites, to Father Tomei, who was his friend, you know, like, which is really sad. The ambulance arrived a few minutes later, but it was too late. Father Tomei was pronounced dead a few minutes after 4pm he's just out here doing his job. Well, and it's even worse because what we find out is that I don't even think he was supposed to be there that day.

[Ash]

Oh my God, I hate when things like, when you hear something like that.

[Alayna]

Oh, it's awful. Now, in Southern California, the unsolved murder of, you know, this, this man, Lawrence White, who didn't have any next to kin, had been dealing with like, kind of like a tough time and was in and out of, you know, incidents, very trivial incidents with the law. It didn't get a lot of attention with the press, unfortunately. And honestly, weirdly, neither did the disappearance of a young co ed college student, Mary Guilfoyle, has not been found. Right. Because a lot of people thought she had just run away voluntarily.

[Ash]

It was the time.

[Alayna]

Yeah. But the brutal murder of a priest in the day in a church confessional, I mean, that's got a lot of elements that's gonna. I get that, I get that. It definitely caught everyone's attention. I mean, that's one you're gonna go, what?

[Ash]

Very sad that the other two things didn't. But I very much understand why this, why this would.

[Alayna]

I'm not saying the other two shouldn't, but like this one definitely makes sense.

[Ash]

Right.

[Alayna]

The next day, the Associated Press reported on the Death of the 68 year old French priest. According to Margaret Reed, she'd entered the church just in time to see, quote, a young assailant kicking and striking the priest.

[Ash]

Oh.

[Alayna]

Now, as expected, Father To's death prompted a large investigation as investigators combed the city looking for anything that pointed to a suspect. According to Father Thomei's housekeeper, like I said, he hadn't planned on being at the church that afternoon. He had only stopped in to see if anyone was there waiting to give confession.

[Ash]

Wow.

[Alayna]

So this is both. It's two things, it's very sad, and two, it made it clear that the killer hadn't expected him to be there. Right. So this wasn't planned. Detective Sergeant Jim Shea told reporters. So far, there does not appear to be any motive at all for this killing. And they also hadn't found a murder weapon or identified even a potential suspect. And a few days later, detectives and attendants at Tomei's funeral started scanning the faces and body language of more than 700 attendees at his funeral. So he was obviously well loved. Yeah. And they were hoping that the man's killer might be among them, because that does happen, but they didn't find anyone suspicious. Like the murders of Lawrence White and Mary Guilfoyle, the murder of Father Henri Thome appeared completely motiveless and baffled investigators who simply couldn't fathom who would Kill a priest in the daytime in a church and stuff him in a confessional. But while they may not have understood the killer's motive, they did understand the dangers of having a killer on the loose, and a vigorous investigation was then launched. At the same time, Mary Guilfoyle's parents had hired a private detective to track their daughter down, who was still missing.

[Ash]

That's so sad. Cuz the police thought she was the wrong way.

[Alayna]

Now, investigator Bill Tubbs said it appears that she probably was picked up as a. As a hitchhiker. There's just no logical place she could have gone except for her stated destination, but she just never arrived there. Now, between the intensification of the investigations and Herbert Mullin's growing discomfort with what he'd done, now because he's still not feeling like he's doing what he's supposed to, he decided to slow down and develop a strategy. He knew he still needed to offer sacrifices to hold off the impending disaster and gain the approval of the voices that guided him, which had come to include his father's voice. He said what? But he thought there had to be a more morally righteous way other than murder. And we will get to that in part two. Elena.

[Ash]

Elena.

[Alayna]

He is scary.

[Ash]

Yeah, this is scary. And it's also just really sad that.

[Alayna]

This all so sad.

[Ash]

Could have been avoided had he been properly medicated.

[Alayna]

He needed to be hospitalized. Medicated. He needed intensive help. Yeah, for sure.

[Ash]

Yeah.

[Alayna]

Because also this entire time he's sitting here saying, I don't know if I'm doing the right thing, but he's still doing it because he has this, like, intense belief that there's voices telling him. Yeah, it's. It's such a. It's a very interesting case because of how layered it is.

[Ash]

Right?

[Alayna]

It's so sad, though.

[Ash]

It is really sad.

[Alayna]

I mean, these people were just. Lawrence White was just walking down the street and stopped to help someone when he was down on his luck. That's the thing. Like he was down on his luck.

[Ash]

Was still gonna help.

[Alayna]

And he still took time out of his while walking down the street, not even to a home to stop and help somebody. And it's like Mary Guilfoyle was just running late to an appointment. Her whole life in front of her.

[Ash]

Oh, that's. It's like we were saying, it's so sad, like when somebody's not supposed to be there. It's like if she. She was just running late, like she.

[Alayna]

Was on time, you know, and then Father Tomei not even supposed to be at the church, but he stopped in case people needed confession. Wow.

[Ash]

Ugh.

[Alayna]

Like, it's really sad. Awful. Yeah, it's awful.

[Ash]

Well, we'll hear more of the awful in part two.

[Alayna]

Yeah.

[Ash]

And we hope you keep listening.

[Alayna]

And we hope you keep it weird.

[Ash]

You know not to keep it this weird.

[Alayna]

Bye, SA.

[Ash]

If you like morbid, you.

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[Ash]

Now by joining Wondery plus in the.

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[Mike Corey]

Hey weirdos, I'm Mike Corey, and like you, I'm drawn to true crime, creepy history, and all things spooky. If you particularly enjoyed Ash and Elena's coverage of the USS Indianapolis, where 900 sailors battled rough seas, sharks, dehydration, and madness in the open ocean, you need to check out my podcast. Against the Odds. We dive deep into this survival story across four full episodes, revealing details you haven't heard yet. Each week on against the Odds, we put you in the shoes of real survivors. From the Thai cave rescue to Somali pirate hostages to the Donner Party, these aren't just headlines, they're incredible stories of human endurance. Follow against the Odds on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. Wondery subscribers can listen to both against the Odds and Morbid early and ad free. Start your free trial in the Wondery app, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify today.