← More Than Reality with Adam and Danielle
More Than Reality with Adam and Danielle
EP 81 - The Change That Triggered Adam’s Old Depression Struggles
00:58:02
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- [00:00]
A
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B
this was like a, a great example of like, Adam kind of figuring out how he works through change and he doesn't do well and he doesn't like it, which no one does.
- [01:09]
A
Like, no one being a guy in the South. Also, like, you're kind of ingrained to like, just not talk about your feelings.
- [01:16]
B
Yeah.
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A
And there was just a lot of things that I loved in my life that I just didn't care about anymore. And I just felt completely numb to, like, my career wasn't wrong and providing wasn't wrong, but it became who I was instead of something I did.
- [01:40]
B
This is More Than Reality Podcast, where we dive into all things faith, family, and marriage and share that there is so much more than the reality that you see on the surface. Welcome to More Than Reality with Adam and Danielle Busby.
- [01:57]
A
What's up, guys?
- [01:58]
B
Hey.
- [01:59]
A
Today's episode 81 of More Than Reality Podcast. It's been a interesting week. I don't know. Like, I was, I was like reflecting this week on kind of like an argument that we've had just coming in hot.
- [02:17]
B
Guys.
- [02:22]
A
Busby therapy session today. No, I don't know, like reflecting, reflecting on an argument and also like brings me back to like a season of my life. I don't know, it just like opened up like some vulnerabilities there of. I don't know, maybe it's like change like that I struggle with. I think maybe like anything like new big also think fomo and also like fomo, but I don't know, thinking about like, homeschooling and stuff like that. You know, I've been excited about it, but it's also kind of, as we get close to it. And it's like something that is so new to us. I mean, obviously we've never done anything like this before, so everything about it is new and, and the closer we get to it, the more like, real it becomes and like seeing the changes and stuff and, and the home and like work life, home life, balance and stuff like that. Haven't really like processed it all and like thought through every aspect. Well, one thing came up. You know, Danielle, obviously homeschool is completely different and you know, it's different. It's like a lot of hands on, like real world experience, real world teaching through certain things. You know, some days may be like a trip to the zoo and that. It's just, I mean, obviously, or some
- [04:09]
B
days maybe we don't start till 12 and we're finished at 2. Like.
- [04:14]
A
Yeah. So it was a day where like I had to be up, up and early and out the door for like some work meetings and stuff. We have some planning meetings coming up for, for some high level projects going on right now at Good Ranchers. And then it was a day that Danielle and the kids were gonna go to the zoo with like another fam. Homeschool family. And in a sense, like, kind of seeing what a day was like on like an outdoor like project adventure, learning outdoors, stuff like that.
- [04:46]
B
Apparently you thought way too much into me going to the zoo with the kids.
- [04:51]
A
I started to get like all into like my feels.
- [04:54]
B
That's literally what it came down to.
- [04:56]
A
Yeah.
- [04:57]
B
You were upset that you weren't going to the zoo with us and that made you get mad at everybody but yourself.
- [05:04]
A
Because it's starting to hit me. Like the things that, you know from Daniel, being able to stay at home and be at home with the kids, with school and stuff like that. Yeah, it's gonna, it's going to involve me like missing out on a lot of stuff. And it just like hit home that day and I don't know, it just, I don't know, it was tough. So obviously it was a day that like, they didn't, they didn't have to like wake up.
- [05:33]
B
I think people are.
- [05:34]
A
The argument was get ready for school and stuff. And so like, I wake up, I go through my morning routine, getting ready for work, getting out the door. And I'm used to seeing like the kids up and getting ready for school and getting their clothes on, getting breakfast and stuff. And like, you know, it was like a Saturday morning in a sense of what it felt like in the house. I'm like this. It shouldn't feel like this right now because there's. They, they're not full on homeschool yet. And, and so it just affected me in a weird way because like Danielle was sleeping in, she was letting the kids sleep in. And, and so like I walk in and like turned Danielle's alarm off and you know, said some things that I should not have said and out of my own like FOMO and insecurities and stuff and just about, you know, like I have a fear that. I mean, yes, like I've seen a lot of videos on homeschool and stuff and, and have. It's very much so, like at your own pace, obviously you set your own schedule and stuff like that, but you also like want your kids to kind of be self sufficient and like wake up and like get the day started and stuff and, and not be a rush but you know, get up and like take care of yourself and get up and get dressed and, and fix your own breakfast and like do chores and stuff around the house. What, whatever you need to do before like school starts. And like nothing was being done yet. Like Danielle was sleeping in, the girls are sleeping in. And so like I woke up and I like said some things to Danielle about that and.
- [07:14]
B
Let's just stop right there. Who wants to be woken up like this?
- [07:18]
A
Exactly.
- [07:18]
B
You already were starting off on a bed foot and came in with negative words and harsh words.
- [07:27]
A
Yeah. Because I like, I don't want.
- [07:29]
B
That was a complete. What the. What in the world? Like, it just, it made me so mad and so hurt because I was like, does he know who he's talking to? That's what I kept saying. So a lot of what he was saying was something he was struggling with that he didn't share that was now coming out on me. But it was, it wasn't really like the words that he chose was a self reflection on how he feels about me in this situation and the, the struggle he has with. This is how it's, this is how life's gonna be. We're just not gonna do anything. We're just gonna sleep in and whatever, blah, blah. And that's only a taste. But so it was just like what, like what is. Like, since when do you control the mornings? And since when do you like X, Y and Z? And why are you telling me these things right now? Like what he just was hitting hard with like, do you even know the plan today? Do you know the time today? And I'm like, I did. I said to you, do you like, do you know who you're Talking to, like, of course I do. And so it just was a miserable morning. And he. Yeah, he left, went to work. And so we got along with our slow morning, which was so great. Adam's in his tantrums out of the house, and, you know, we're just getting ready and, you know, know, lollygagging and just taking our time because we weren't leaving till 10. It was like, jeez Louise.
- [09:10]
A
Later in the day, just apologize. Realized, like, I shouldn't have said that. And. And it's really coming from a place of, like, insecurities, which reminded me, like, the season that I went through with depression that, you know, I've even still to this day, like, kind of fall back into that cycle and struggle with that and stuff. And. And it's probably something that we should hit on again a little bit and just, like, talk through that season of my life and kind of work through that again. And so kind of created, like, an outline of stuff of, like, what I went through then. And in a sense, yes, to speak to you guys, to speak to other dads or other families that are, like, going through that kind of stuff, but also in. In a sense to, like, revisit that, like, in my own life. That's what we wanted to talk about today.
- [10:10]
B
Yeah. And I. I do want to say, like, something relevant to, like, what we're just talking about. I think a lot of the struggle, you know, we're going to talk about some things, like, before the quints and like, what Adam, how his work was, his career, like, all that and walking through, like, that big change of life back then. But to hit on the. The argument and the topic there, clearly there's some unsettled change in emotions that you have not allowed yourself to process or think about. Because, you know, one thing that's hard is that when it comes to the homeschooling, it's not like dad's going to be here sitting down with them and. And doing work and whatnot and those type of things. It's. It's hard to receive at times because I'm like, I feel like the one thing you told me was, like, the weight is going to be on you, meaning me. And so I think because you're like, oh, I'm not going to be doing that, you don't allow yourself to realize what the change is going to. You haven't allowed yourself to realize what the change is going to be. And so I had to tell him.
- [11:26]
A
I'm like, I've had this as a mindset of like, yeah, this is going to be a big change for Danielle and I've like separated myself from it and so I haven't really given myself time to really process like, what that's going to do to me through this season.
- [11:43]
B
Yeah. And there's going to be a lot of things we do fun because I can't just stay home all day with them and need things to do. And so I think you hadn't realized that. You just thought it was going to be stress in the house, chaos, schooling and like homework all day or something. And you just manage your work. Like how un. Like you, you don't see a difference in that. But then the fact that it's like, okay, well, we're gonna go do a cooking class or we're gonna go do an arts class or we're gonna go do the zoo or we're gonna go to the science museum or we're gonna like.
- [12:15]
A
Yeah. I mean, I think ready for, I think of homeschool. Yeah. I've had this idea of homeschool being like, you know, kind of mundane things going on in the house, but. But haven't really thought a whole lot about like, all the other things, like all the other fun things that like, you, your kids get to engage with in like, hands on and real world stuff and that like, I would also miss out on because it's like new experiences or just like fun experiences for the kids that like, okay, like.
- [12:47]
B
And I don't think that you'll miss out on all that. You might.
- [12:51]
A
It just so happened that like, I had a lot going on that morning and, and I had to be at work for some meetings and stuff. And so it's like, okay, this is one of those days where like, I just can't get away and just go do what you guys are doing. And. And then like, it all came crashing down and like, it hit me like, oh, this is, you know, some days are going to be a big change. And I wasn't where. I wasn't ready for it for sure.
- [13:17]
B
Yeah. So I think.
- [13:18]
A
But it, it caused me to reflect on like my past and going through that season like I was in before, before any of the kids. Like, we moved here.
- [13:32]
B
So, so what we're gonna do now is like, this was like a, a great example of like Adam kind of figuring out how he works through change and he doesn't do well and he doesn't like it, which no one does. Like, no one really likes change. It takes a while to adjust, to get used to or how your body how your nervous system, how your moods. Like what? When something drastically changes in your life. And though this context of homeschool is something we've been kind of preparing for, it still is a change that had affected him, and it's going to probably still affect him, which is now identified as.
- [14:09]
A
And not so much in the same way, but. But it's still like a big change.
- [14:13]
B
Yeah. Yeah.
- [14:14]
A
But it. It's like a reminder of the past.
- [14:18]
B
It reminded him that season. Yeah. Whenever we had the quints. Why don't you just talk about, like, who you were back then? Like, before we had all these kids. What was your work like? Who. Who was Adam? What did you do? What was your career? You could be drinking water all day and still be dehydrated. And I didn't realize that until recently.
- [14:40]
A
Which sounds wrong, but it's not.
- [14:43]
B
No, it's not. Without electrolytes, your body cannot actually absorb the water you're drinking. And that's something I've been really focused on lately with the nutrition and health.
- [14:54]
A
And this is where Cure came in.
- [14:56]
B
I started adding cure packets into my first glass of water in the morning before coffee, and I generally noticed a difference in the energy and my focus.
- [15:05]
A
And you're actually drinking your water now consistently.
- [15:10]
B
But Cure is plant based, no added sugars, no artificial ingredients, and is formulated using the same science behind IV hydration therapy. So it's not just water. Your body actually uses it.
- [15:23]
A
And it tastes good, too, and that definitely helps.
- [15:26]
B
It really does. Watermelon and lemonade are my favorites. And the stick packs make it so easy. I keep them in my bag, in
- [15:34]
A
the car, everywhere, which, honestly is perfect for our life because we're always on the go.
- [15:41]
B
Staying hydrated isn't just about drinking more water. It's about your body actually using it. That's what cure does. Clean ingredients, real science, and it actually tastes good.
- [15:52]
A
Use our code more than for 20 off@cure hydration.com or you can find it on Amazon. Real ingredients, real hydration. Thank you, Cure, for sponsoring this episode. Yeah, so, I mean, that. That was the whole reason we moved to Houston was initially for stepping into a new role, a new career. And like, oil and gas, like petrochemical sales and rentals and stuff, you know, in like, oil and gas refineries. And, you know, it. It was a big change from obviously going. We moved to Houston six months after we got married. And so, you know, everything was kind of new, but it was just you and I at that time. And so it was just kind of new. And fresh and exciting. Scary. Very scary. Moving from Lake Charles, Louisiana, which is like a fairly small town probably at the time, I mean, the entire town of Lake Charles was probably the size of Lake City and like population wise or close to it, you know, and that's just like a small suburb of Houston.
- [17:07]
B
Yeah. So like, what did you.
- [17:08]
A
So we're moving to this massive city and I was doing at the time, before we got married, I was in. I was working in like a dive shop and. Which was a fun job and stuff and did really well in this dive shop, managing this dive shop, but, you know, taking the jump to like a big boy career and a big job in oil and gas and. Yeah, it was scary because it was like something completely different and. But it like challenged me. It pushed me and you know, very early on in that we, you know, did really well. Got a really big initial contract just a few months after. After I started working there and. And then the career took off.
- [17:56]
B
Yeah. So what was your day to day like?
- [17:57]
A
And so like, day to day, I mean, it was like calling on and visiting and just meeting people inside of the oil refineries, people like contractors that would work in turnarounds and stuff. And a turnaround is like. And turnarounds in like capital projects. And typically, like what happens in an oil refinery is, you know, all these processing units that process the oil into different types of chemicals or different. And breaks down the oil in certain ways so that they can have byproducts that create certain, like gas and oil and plastics and like all these different things. You know, these processing units that are refining the raw crude. They only. They have like, you know, just like your vehicle, you know, they. They can run for so long before they have to be maintenanced. And so. And that's what they call a turnaround, which they kind of, in a sense, like tear down the unit and overhaul it. And so they want to bring that unit down and bring it back up as fast as possible. And so, you know, you'd have these contractors that would come in that do specific things, specialty things and. But they would bring in anywhere from 200 to. Depending on the size of the project. Maybe it's like multiple units. Maybe it's the half of the refinery depending on what's going on. So anywhere from 200 extra workers to 2,000 extra workers. And so our company would go and either meet with these individual contractors or we would set up a contract with the refinery with. Where we would provide communications for all of the. All of the additional workers that were Coming in so that everybody could communicate for the project. You know, that's not something that the refinery just keeps on hand because it's a very high dollar item. And, and so, and usually the projects are only just a couple months and so.
- [20:02]
B
So your day to day besides a turnaround is you're meeting customers like, like it's the sales part of the job.
- [20:09]
A
Yeah, I mean some days are like going around cold calling, knocking on doors, going and trying to meeting, meet with decision makers some days or just going and playing golf with people that you meet and you're just trying to build relationships and stuff. And then you know, during a project, during a turnaround or a capital project or something, especially early on, whenever we were a very like small and scrappy company, like we would work the project like we, we would bring a trailer in inside the unit and we would actually spend time, 10, 12 hours a day where we're actually, you know, programming and checking out handheld two way radios and stuff like that and organizing that and keeping logs and tracking, you know, all that stuff for the project and designing and building systems that were adequate for the project. And you know, and it was fun, you know, for a certain, and there's certain aspects of that that was very fun and I loved, I loved like the team building aspect and then, and then the relationship aspect of it. Me and my brother in law Nick, early on it was just me and him for a while and like we, we very much so like complemented each other. He was more of like the, you know, no nonsense, get to the point, try to make the sell. And I was more like the relationship guy and like I would build these deeper, stronger relationships with people and, and so that kind of worked. We would work as a team for a lot of things, especially for some big high level stuff. But I like I, I felt like a lot of enjoyment and a lot of gratitude, not gratitude, but a lot of fulfillment through that where you know that it's this new thing in my life, it's this new career and you know, you're getting some success with it and you're doing very well and you know, started to make pretty decent money and like commissions and stuff like that. And so you know, doing that for long enough, it just somewhat became like my identity. We did, I did that for years. And then we had Blake and then Danielle was also working on her own project. Daniel was actually working for an oil and gas company as well, which ended up, you were doing a lot of traveling and so, you know, we had Blake. The way things Would work was, you know, a lot of times. I mean, Turner turnaround season was only, like, a couple seasons out of the year. It's usually like, spring, sometimes summer. But they don't like putting a turnaround, like, right in the middle of summer because it's so hot, and people have to wear, like, fire retardant clothing and all this kind of stuff. So it's like spring, like, fall, winter. Every now and then, you would have something in the summer, but. And those were the times, like, whenever we were out of turnaround, I could kind of set my own schedule. And so it made it easy for, like, if Daniel had to be out of town, like, I could manage Blake. And, you know, and we would spend a lot of time together, and we would get to do a lot of things together. Danielle would kind of struggle with that too, because, like, you know, I would try to, whenever mom's away, try. I always did try to do fun stuff with Slake.
- [23:39]
B
Yeah. Which.
- [23:39]
A
So that she wouldn't have to. She wouldn't think about mom being gone. Like, okay, every day we're gonna go do something fun while mom's out of town.
- [23:45]
B
Yeah. You get off work, and it's like, go to Dave Butter. So we get off work. Let's go to here. Let's go to the. You know, it's, like, all the time.
- [23:52]
A
And so that was a fun season. And, you know, then we started, you know, trying to get pregnant for baby number two. And then the quint hit and. And then through that, obviously, once we got the news of having quintuplets and one older child, you know, your. Your mindset as a dad, you know, you feel like your entire world just got flipped upside down, and you start thinking about the future, thinking about, like, all these things, but also, like, especially once the babies come, like, your entire life, all your thoughts, all. Everything, like, revolves around, like, these babies because it's such a drastic life change, you know, trying to manage it all through that, it was. It was tough. Especially, like, once the babies were home and, you know, whenever I would go into. It would be okay for a little bit then. But then we'd go in, like, turnaround season. We're like, I'm just gone. And sometimes the turnarounds were local. Sometimes they were, you know, three, four hours away where I'm staying in a hotel. And then just knowing and getting updates and text messages and phone calls and stuff from Danielle throughout the day of, like, what's going on with the babies and. But I felt like going through that time, like, I felt trapped, you know, like I'm in this job that we need because everything in our life just got dramatically more expensive. You know, we. The size of our family just grew exponentially. But everything in our life we needed to upgrade, you know, upgrade our cars, upgrade the house, upgrade everything. And thinking about the future and. And so it's like, well, you know, now my career is even more important. But also, you know, whenever you're out and you're working out of town and stuff like that, I felt like I wasn't helping and. But you're stuck. Like you're. I felt trapped. There was nothing that I could do. Like I couldn't step away from my job at that time and just to come home and just help Danielle, but also, you know, and I couldn't just.
- [26:18]
B
So what did you. So when you say you felt trapped, like you'd wake up in the mornings knowing you had to go to work, but you didn't, like, what did it feel like? So you just, you say you felt trapped. So like, if you think back to those days of like Quince being babies and you going and turn around and you know, what was there?
- [26:41]
A
I mean, it was such a new thing in our life and it was like so exciting and like, you know, you have five babies at home that like, you don't want to miss a single moment.
- [26:55]
B
Did you ever feel like. Because very early on it's the very mundane. We were on a two hour schedule. Two and a half hour schedule. Yeah, for 24 hours. So there was no, you know, morning. I remember, like you, when you were in the seasons, it was like you'd help with that last feeding, like 10, 11 or whatever, and then you would sleep through and you'd get up at 5 or 6 or whatever time it was, and if we fed that at that time or whatever, and then you go to work. But like, did you ever feel like going to work was like a, a breakaway, like, like in a sense, like of those mundane things? Or did you feel like you still needed to be home?
- [27:40]
A
I just, I felt like I still needed to be home just because I knew, you know, from that little time that I did take off work whenever the babies first came home. Like, I knew how hard it was and I knew how much was going on and I knew how, how difficult it was. I mean, it was like Groundhog Day, you know, whenever you would, you know, wake the girls up, give them their medicine, change them, feed them, possibly change them again, put them down. You had about a 45 minute break before you're doing it again 24 7. And like, I knew how hard it was for you, and then I'm just walking out the door and like leaving you to it for like half, I mean, most of the day, not even half the day. I mean, it was like a good 12 hours. I'm gone, completely out of pocket. Couldn't, couldn't come back check in at like lunch time. I was like gone. And, and I felt like, for one thing, I was missing out on a lot because, like, just how much, you know, babies grow and develop and like thinking how much I'm just like missing out on with these babies, but also like how much I'm feel like I'm putting you out.
- [28:53]
B
Yeah, I don't ever. I never felt like I was, I never felt like I was missing as far as like the help in that way. I mean, if anything, like, you had to work. And so that was just an understood thing. I look back at those days and I just think like, how, how much God provided and God just, even on the level of strength and energy and presence from, for my own self, like, I would not be making through those days without, you know, him carrying me through those. So those early days are definitely, I don't remember too much about it because it was just such a routine. It was like this cycle over and over and over again like all newborn moms feel. But just this was, those season was a lot longer and a lot more intense in those moments because there was five. But you know, I, I, I would have thought and, and back then we, we barely were having a lot of time together. And so like, we didn't really, we weren't really sharing emotions and whatnot. I mean, we were still doing like, we're just in survival mode. And so I would have thought at those points you felt, you felt okay leaving because there were people coming over at certain points of the day or, or whatnot. Like, that was a relief. But also that kind of goes back to what we were saying earlier. Is that like, there still is this level of like something special about you because you are the dad and you want to be there. Because not all dads are like that. They're like, ugh, get me out of this, I'm going to work. And you have something special in your heart that we've known since I fell in love with you. Is that like you are that dad that wants to be there and wants to be seen and, and so, you know, not being able to realize that in the moments because it was always chaos. I mean, People. I might have been dealing with babies all day, but someone else was coming in and maybe, like, you know, helping wash bottles or like, whatever it was. And so there was very few times that I was seldomly alone by myself. But also when I was by myself, I felt like. I felt like empowered at that moment. Like, okay, like, I've been trained up for this. Let's see if I can make it a day, you know? But, yeah, I mean, it's. It feels so long ago, but yet explaining the process of, like, what change in like a big life adjustment does, you know, how. How long do you feel like you were when you were aware that you were struggling till the fact, like, when all it.
- [31:44]
A
Everything kind of came to a head.
- [31:46]
B
Yeah.
- [31:47]
A
Yeah. I mean, because if you got from. You got also gotta remember that through this whole time, we were also filming a TV show. Yeah.
- [31:56]
B
And then we also.
- [31:57]
A
And so moved.
- [31:58]
B
We also.
- [31:58]
A
Yeah. And so it was like these huge life changes, these huge things in our life that were completely different that we weren't used to. It was just so much change going on. But knowing that, you know, I've been. I'm being pulled in these multiple directions. And then also, like, whenever I am home, I can never turn it off. Like, I'm. I'm at work, I have to put on this Persona, this, you know, this sales guy hat, this, you know, and just be upbeat and, like, keep providing for my family.
- [32:30]
B
You're like, I just want to take a nap.
- [32:32]
A
And. And then you come home and like, you don't really have any moments to, like, process anything. It's like I'm pulling into the driveway, audio guys walking out to give me a microphone. Like, I couldn't even. I feel like I didn't even really have time to like, decompress or even just like, think about what I'm going through, even to you, much less to myself. And. And then it's just like filming mode, dad mode. But also, like, you're filming a TV show, so you're having to keep up. Like, you know, in a sense, like a Persona, you keep everything happy and light and stuff for say, like, what
- [33:14]
B
are we doing today?
- [33:15]
A
Yeah. And. And then you're doing that until the babies go to bed, and then you're completely just cooked, exhausted. And then it's like next day you're just doing it all over, so you have no time to really, like, decompress. And so, like, it was those. It was those moments of, like, being especially, like, whenever you wait. I wasn't in turnaround, so it was like more like easier going days or whatever, but you know, just like around town or kind of setting my own schedule, but still having to be out and work in a way, you know, I would fall into these like, patterns to like, man, like I. I slowly started to dip into this depression of like, just becoming lethargic about just my work. You know, I always like, wanted to be active and, and fit and stuff. And so like, honestly, like gym and going, going and working out and stuff, that was a huge part of my life also. And I would try. I would try to keep it up and I would get to the gym, you know, a lot of days and I would spend maybe 15 minutes. Like, I didn't even care about that anymore. Like, there was just a lot of things that I loved in my life that I just didn't care about anymore. And I just felt completely numb to. And then so it's like everything that, like I was good at, everything that I loved, like my, my career, my just wanting to like, excel in my career, everything just started to decline. And.
- [34:47]
B
Well, and then even. Even the things that you want it most too, to be at home and be present and stuff. Like those days even started change because you just then started to hide in a sense. Like you were hiding in your office and like you were just crumbling without being aware of it. And I wasn't even aware of it until a point where when people around you that were with you daily would say something to me or they'd see you at the gym, they're like, because work out.
- [35:20]
A
The people that I see the most, it was like most of the people that I see the most or like people that I would work with. And so those are the people that I'm trying to hide it from.
- [35:29]
B
Yeah.
- [35:30]
A
Of like. Like, I can't do this anymore. Like, I don't. I just don't have the drive right now. And like, those are the people that I can tell that to.
- [35:41]
B
Yeah. What do you think would have changed if you would have vocalized some of this to somebody?
- [35:48]
A
I think it'll probably changed a lot. I mean, just to be able to like process it and like download that to someone.
- [35:57]
B
This has me thinking about.
- [35:59]
A
But every, every friend, I feel like every friend at that time in my life were like people from work and even like Nick that I was like, closest to, he was still like my partner at work. And so I was like, I. I was trying to hide that from him as well. And you know, so like, I'm struggling with this thing going on in My. My mind that, like, I have nobody to talk to and I have no time to talk about it, really. And, like, I didn't want to put that on Danielle because that would just add stress to Danielle's life that's already super stressful.
- [36:40]
B
But that right there, too, is one thing that I've learned, like, over the last couple of years is that you cannot assume someone else's response.
- [36:50]
A
Yeah.
- [36:52]
B
And a lot of this comes with, like, maturity and growth and, I mean, 20 years of marriage and stuff, too. But, like, back then, we're even. Even when we are struggling or even this past couple days with, like, the whole, like, go to the zoo and you're not there. It could. We have to learn to have a simple conversation of, like, I'm feeling off today is different, and I'm struggling. Like, we have to be able to be vulnerable about those might. About those moments because it then has the option to turn into a complete downfall fight or argument or hurt or wherever it's going to be. If we just think it's going to be too hard for the other person, they don't want to hear it. They're not going to understand. And. But you also have to say, okay, this is life together. We must talk about these things and share where our. Where we are feeling. And as I look back at these days, no one knew what a feeling was back then because we were straight up survival mode and, like, keep the babies alive, keep ourselves alive. Right.
- [38:02]
A
But also it was going through being a guy in the south also. Like, you're kind of ingrained to like, just not talk about your feelings.
- [38:12]
B
Yeah.
- [38:13]
A
And I've never heard the stigma. Yeah, there was just like, the stigma of that. And I've never even heard of a guy that would just, like, go and talk to a counselor. It's like, you don't talk about your feelings. And. And so many people, I mean, even whenever I did finally open up to that on the. About everything on the TV show, once everything came to a head, I mean, so many negative responses from people saying, man up. Yeah.
- [38:42]
B
I have two comments about this. So one being talking about, oh, from the South. So many people can relate to that. And I remember that season, people saying, we get it. My husband's just like that. Yeah. Men from the south, we. We put our big boots on and we, like, work and we don't share whatever, talk, whatever. Well, to me, that's weakness in a sense, because if you can share your vulnerability in your heart, then that just shows you're even stronger than what you physically can sustain. The second thing is. Okay, I'm gonna. Might have three things. The second thing is, is that the Bible says, do not lean on the past because it will only hurt you from the future. You can't heal from anything if you keep dwelling on the past. And so it was like Philippians 3, 18, 17. Like, press on, press on, go forward, go forward, forward, go forward, press on, and go forward. And so, you know, these are life lessons that we've walked through and learned that we can reflect on and share and say. But the. The third thing I wanted to say was hearing you talk about. We've talked about this tons of times, but hearing you talk about this today for some reason has made me realize that you never really had a proper paternity leave. And how. How that has changed, I think a lot in certain business. And at times you're like, oh, that I'll even might even say, like, in my own mindset, even from when we had Blake, I didn't necessarily think that was necessarily a need. Like, you maybe, like, took a week off or whatever, do some PTO time or whatever. But, like, hearing you talk about this for the 20th time I've heard just clicked to me. Like, you needed to leave. You need it. You needed some major time off, and you weren't getting it at home because you just had all the babies, and you had. You got two weeks off. And I had said, like, I don't want you to take off until four more babies are home. But we got four, and then the fifth one a month later. But, you know, in that season, like, it just wasn't enough. Like, there was a lot of change. There was.
- [41:03]
A
Especially with that kind of change. I mean, it wasn't just one baby coming home. It was five. Yeah.
- [41:07]
B
And so that's what I'm saying. Like, I see, like, a value of. There's. We've. We've got hitting a lot of flack with, like, male postpartum depression and stuff when you go through these. But it is true, there is this level of, like, life is just much adjusting for the dad as it is for the. The. The mom. And, yes, the mom is physically going through these changes in hormones and emotions that can. The whole reason postpartum retention can come on. But we've kind of walked through where, like, I've seen that the opposite side of it. Like, I don't feel like I ever personally walked through postpartum depression in a negative way or I just was. I don't know. I don't feel like I ever struggled with it, which, thank the Lord, I don't know how that would have. How we would have managed that whole season of life. It would have been complete. Complete downpour. But I think there's something there to say, like, you know, their dads need an adequate amount of time off from whenever their world is drastically changed, too. And that is when you have a child, when you are growing a family, no matter how many kids you have or whatnot or at a time, I feel like it's important that, you know, women get paid off maternity leave, like, in their careers. And then I think it's also important that dads have a time off where they can also, you know, it adjusts to that because, like, you know, there is. It. It's just so hard in these days of, like, you know, work life. Mom works dad, dad works. Mom gets time off work because she's having a baby, but dad still goes to work. And then. But it's like, okay, if mom is just at home and dad's working and mom has a baby, mom never gets time off. Right. But dad, too, is now having to now adjust and take care of wife and mom. I meant wife and kid, which that's a big change for him, too. Like, he. He just as much as we were every day praying for our kids to continue breathing and make it through another night, I guarantee you every new dad feels the same way when they bring that baby home. Like, what on earth do we do? Even though you think, you know and you've gone through these parenting classes and whatnot, like, when you have your own child in your home and you take them home, you're like, wow, like, what? This is on us. Like, we have to now help this child to survive. And so, I don't know, I just felt like that was kind of important to say. Like, I respect. And I think that businesses need to be more inclined to having maternity leave but also paternity leave.
- [43:53]
A
Yeah.
- [43:54]
B
So that was kind of, like, off your yeah. List, but that was important. Say so.
- [44:02]
A
And so, like, everything, you know, just steadily got worse and worse and worse to the point of, like, you know, you have family members and friends, like, going to Danielle, like, behind, like, my back, so they don't, like, offend me. But, like, or going to her, like, with concerns, like, okay, like, Adam just isn't Adam anymore. Like, even, like, whenever we'd have, like, get togethers or whatever, I'm just, like, lethargic and just not, like, the fun, upbeat person that I was. And, you know, especially, like, I Mean, obviously Nick was like, a big one because me and him work together and saw that, like, my performance and stuff just declining, you know, and it took, you know, them like, coming and, like, sitting down together at one point and then coming and confronting me about it, like, what's going on before? Really, like, I could, like, stop and like, think about. I mean, yeah, you're right. What is going on with me, because it's true. Like, I'm not the same person that I was. And so, like, that kind of became like my. My point of, like, starting to seek and find help and answers and somebody to talk to and, you know, all those things. You know, I feel like God does put people in your life that will speak to you at the right moments. And God puts people in your life and. And circumstances in your life for, like, such a time as this. And, you know, at that time, it was like Jared Wilson and just randomly he started reaching out to me and checking on me regularly and like, it was like that person that I could just, like, unload on. And he was just like, hear it and listen to it and like, pray, pray for me and stuff like that through that time and, like, we've developed, like, a really good relationship through that. And he was just that person that I could just like, unload on and. And start to work through. Started to go see, like, a counselor and like, started to go see, like, professional help as well as, like, pastoral help through that time to really, like, start processing that. You know, it was like, through that time that I, you know, obviously we had all that going on as well as the TV show and, you know, we had some other stuff going on in our life at the time where it really started me thinking of, you know, my identity and like, what. What I put my identity in, which was my career, which was suffering, which was taking me away from the thing that I wanted the most was to be at home with Danielle, to help Danielle. And so all that was affecting me and really started to see that, like, you know, God was showing me that, like, my identity wasn't what I do. Like, it's who I am in him. And, you know, I believe that God does, like, put new desires in your heart and, and lead you in. In the direction that he wants you to go. And, like, he's writing a story for you. And everything in me was like, yes, wanting to hold on to that identity that I had, even though it was like, crumbling around me at the time, but I was, like, gripping on it tightly.
- [47:44]
B
Well, it was all you knew and was 13. I mean, it was probably 11, 12 years of your career and job that, like, that's what you knew and what you did, you know?
- [47:58]
A
Yeah. Like, I had written down here is, like, what I thought God was, like, taking from me. Like, he was, like, taking this, like, identity away from me. He was actually pulling me out of something that I wrapped up my identity too tightly in. And, like, my career wasn't wrong and providing wasn't wrong, but it became who I was instead of something I did. And. And God didn't want that for me, and he wanted to show me, you know, this bigger picture. You know, we're at church the past few weeks and just talking about perspective and, like, God's ways and God's views of us and our story are so much higher than ours, you know, and just analogies of people, you know, being down, like, in New York City or whatever, and being on the street level, and you have this. This very narrow view of what you can see ahead of you, but somebody up at the top of a skyscraper can see for miles and see the bigger picture of life. And, you know, God was, like, pointing us in a certain direction. God was giving us this story to grow and to share and to steward in our life. But all I was seeing was this one thing that I'm, like, holding on tightly as best I can, not doing a very good job of. And he's trying to show me, like, no, that's not who you are. That's something that you do, but that's not who you are. And he, you know, he had so much other plans for our life at the time and still does. And. But it was just through that season, it was like, me wrestling with that and trying to grip and hold on so tightly of, like, this one thing. Like, okay, I have to hold on to this. I have to do this. This is who I am. This is what's providing for my family. But it was also like, fighting sometimes the things you hold on to, the bigger picture of what. Of what God had for me at that time. But just talking about, like. Like this passage in Second Corinthians, it just talks about how God's power is made perfect in weakness. And, you know, I was too scared to be weak. I was. I was taught not to be weak, not to share my vulnerabilities and stuff. And, like, what I'm really going through. And I used to hate the idea of showing weakness, but that season where, like, I did feel trapped through that, feeling like I was failing, feeling like I was disappearing, that's exactly right where God met me, like, in that moment where I did let the guards. The guard down and did let that wall down. And that's where God started to work, like, in my heart and in my life and really, like, started to light my path and show me the direction that he wanted me to go, which ultimately led to me, like, stepping away from my career. He gave us some opportunities in our life where we were to make. We were able to make money and enough money elsewhere where I didn't have to do that. I didn't felt, like, feel like I was bound to that. And, you know, God gave us these opportunities to be able to, like, so that I could spend more time with my kids, with Danielle, with our family, and. And still make a living through that. Because he gave us this story. He gave us, you know, something so much greater to where we could make a difference in this world, make. Make an impact in other people's lives as well. And. And that's what I felt like he was trying to show me through that whole season of, like, no, I've given you this new story, but you're holding on to what this identity was so tightly that you're not allowing me to. To grow you through this process. But it was hard. It was. It was a hard season to, like, work through and to wrestle with and, like, Because I held so tightly of, like, this. No, this thing is who I am and not, like, my identity is not what I do. I mean, even to this day, I mean, that's, like, one thing that I still struggle with. And I mean, one thing that I would say is, like, speaking to other moms and dads or if you're a wife listening to this and, like, you feel like your husband may be going through that, or if you are a dad and going through, like, a season like this where you feel like you're losing something, just know that God may be. If you feel like you're in a season where God. It feels like God's taking something from you, he might be trying to show you who you really are without it. And. And I think that's what he was doing for me. He was. He was showing me who I was without this. This one thing that I'm gripping so tightly in my life. It forces you to. To be vulnerable and to talk to other people and to let those walls down and to show that, like, okay, this is not who I am. And, you know, that was, like, the biggest takeaway through that season of my life.
- [53:33]
B
Yeah. And, you know, if you're In a marriage, listening to this, like, God has called us to be community and to have people in our lives. And if you're walking life in a marriage with your spouse, and, you know, there are things that we have to just straight up say, God wants this for our marriage. Therefore, I must be weak in a moment so that I can better our conversation. I can better, you know, the strength between us by being vulnerable, by feeling weak. But really, if you can be vulnerable and share your heart, there's no. To me, there's no stronger courage than that. Like, just laying it out there with your spouse, you might not know how to say it. You might not know what the answer is. But knowing that marriage is together and that you can walk through these together, I think that's kind of a lesson learned too. Like, looking back and just saying, like, it didn't need to be a life, did not have to be about what your career is. Life is about us people and the love and raising our kids and doing life with others and stuff. It's not. Yes, we need careers, yes, we need finances to survive and all these things. But that doesn't identify you.
- [54:55]
A
So, yeah, I mean, and probably the biggest thing that I took from that and honestly, like, what happened to us very recently and. And it revealed something in that and through that that I still need to work on is, you know, the people that I probably. I probably needed to talk to the most through that season and even now, like, talking about, like, what my fears are with this, what I'm feeling personally with this. The people that I needed to speak with the most, I was hiding it from. And, you know, just like, you. Instead of, like, coming to you and talking to you about, like, man, I'm kind of struggling with this, or, like, I just. I'm just now starting to process this, and this is how I feel about it. Instead of doing that, I hit it, and it came out in a way that it was hurtful.
- [55:54]
B
Yeah.
- [55:55]
A
And so I got work to do. I got work to do.
- [56:00]
B
Don't we all?
- [56:01]
A
And so it's just. It revealed that in me and. And then it was a reminder of the past. And, you know, God does things in your past. He's writing this story for you to learn and grow. And, you know, sometimes it creeps back and just know, like, your life is a work in progress and God is continuing to work in you and mold you to this person that he wants you to be. And so don't hide from it. Like, lead through vulnerability and lead. Don't think you're a tough guy and think you can just hide it and not not share your emotions or not share your feelings and especially hide it from the people that you need to be speaking with, like, the most about it, which is obviously your spouse. And so, or at the very least, you know, find a friend that you can, like, really talk to, that you can be vulnerable with, and that you can share those fears, you know, if you're not quite ready to, like, unload on your spouse.
- [57:00]
B
Yeah.
- [57:00]
A
So good.
- [57:02]
B
Thanks for sharing.
- [57:03]
A
Yeah. So thank you guys for tuning in to episode 81 of more than Reality Podcast.
- [57:10]
B
Thanks for listening, guys.
- [57:11]
A
All right, we love you guys. We'll see you in the next one. Sam.