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Mortgage Business Dried Up? How John Farrell Expanded Out-of-State, and Closed $100M
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- [00:00]
Jeff Zimfer
Hey there, it's Jeff Zimfer, host of the Mortgage Marketing Radio podcast and I am coming at you back from my recent trip to Europe. If you follow me on social media, you may have seen me posting some of the trip that I recently made celebrating my wife and I's 25th wedding anniversary. It's a big milestone, was a big trip, my first time across the Atlantic over to Europe and it was absolutely incredible. We started in Paris and then we made our way down to Aix en Provence. We made our way down to the French Riviera, Monaco, Nice and Saint Tropez. And then after that we continued on to Italy and spent several days in Venice and then finished up in Lake Como. And I have to say it was restorative, relaxing, refreshing and I really thoroughly enjoyed it. And I'd be curious to know if you guys listening, if you've been to Europe, I'd love to hear your feedback. So feel free to jump in over and connect with me on Instagram, say hi, let me know you did go to Europe, Italy, France, whatever. What was your favorite part? I'd love to swap notes on that. And I'm going to have an upcoming episode where I do a story on my visit to the Murano glass factory in Venice where we had to take a boat over. Here's a quick little side note is just a week prior to us being there, Tom Brady was in there spending a lot of money buying some pretty cool Murano glass. If you don't know the Murano glass story, check it out, look it up online, it's amazing, it's world famous. It's hand blown works of art glass. And yeah, we did pick up a couple of items. And so I will be sharing that story on an upcoming episode. But today, before we get into my special guest, which you're going to hear from in a moment and I want you to make sure you stick around because today we're going to be talking with John Farrell who last year did over $100 million in 2024 difficult market. And so we're going to unpack how John did that, his book of business, sources of business and so forth. So before we get into that though, I do want to share with you something I haven't done in a while, but I'm bringing back Wins of the week. That's right. You want to know what's working today's market? Well, I can tell you what's working is what always works and that is the fundamentals and a success story I wanted to bring with you. From one of our members in the my agent classes community who is executing well on the fundamentals. Look, there are lots of bright shiny objects you can chase. There are lots of things you could do to quote unquote, be successful, succeed and get engagement, get referrals. One of the things one of the playbooks we know that works is getting in front of your one of the primary sources of referrals at scale and that's real estate agents. And so shout out to Channing Moore. So Channing taught our class, which was leveraging seller concessions, which by the way, I don't know if you saw that stat. That was roughly 30ish, 40% of properties, I believe around the country, right. Had some form of a seller concession on it. So it's a hot topic. And agents need help with seller concessions. Your clients need help with seller concessions. How about you leverage your, your knowledge in a way that puts you in front of these people at scale to attract agents to want to work with a subject matter expert like you. Help facilitate deals, help make deals happen by leveraging your expertise in seller concessions. Now, what Channing decided to do was take our done for you turnkey class where we do everything for you. The PowerPoint speaker notes, the train, the trainer videos, the emails, the tech marketing messages, you name it, soup to nuts, we do it. And Channing said to date it has been the best class that has generated the most referrals for him. And all of the referrals he received were from productive, underlying productive agents that he had been wanting to work with for some time. And what did he do? He followed our proven system and plan for sending out the invites, for contacting people on social media, for making warm calls to real estate agents. And he put butts in seats and he got referrals on demand. Now I don't know if that's for you, but if it's something you'd like to learn more about, we may or may not be a fit for you. But here's the way you learn more. You schedule a call with me, that's right, me personally, you go to the link in the show notes that talks about my agent classes. Or you right now go over to MortgageMarketing Pro and you grab a time on my calendar so we can unpack a little bit more about what we do here at Mygin classes, show you the classes, show you how we automate everything so it's done for you. Show our community and just share with you some of the success stories and results that is happening every single week in the country for loan officers. Once Again, go to MortgageMarketing Pro or check out the link in the show notes. Okay, so back to my special guest. In just a moment, you're going to hear my conversation with John Farrell out of Newport Beach, California, Orange County, California, where I originally cut my teeth in 2003 as a mortgage professional. In this episode, you're going to learn three things. Number one, how John leverages his book of business and strategic financial advisor partnerships for consistent referrals. Number two, why expanding beyond your zip code might be your next best move. And number three, how being curious, not just competent, can transform your business relationships. And there's something really interesting. We'll unpack how one viral Instagram reel led to 9 million views and what that means for mortgage pros like you looking to grow through social media. So if you're ready to stop chasing leads and start attracting them by being more of you, stick around. Listen to this episode of Mortgage Marketing Radio.
- [05:19]
John Farrell
John, welcome to the show.
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What's up, Jeff? Thanks for having me. Appreciate it.
- [05:22]
Thanks for. Yeah, carving out of time your busy.
- [05:24]
Jeff Zimfer
Busy schedule to be here.
- [05:27]
John Farrell
You're in my old stomping grounds, Orange County, Newport beach area. I now live in Vegas, but spent like 30 some odd years in Southern California. It is a very competitive market for mortgage professionals, would you agree?
- [05:38]
Extremely, extremely competitive. I think this was the mecca of mortgage in the early 2000s, if I'm not mistaken. I think every big mortgage company was here in Orange county, so. And every, everyone and their mother was in mortgage.
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So how do you stand out in a sea of noise?
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Just by being myself and hopefully people are attracted to it. And there's going to be some people that don't really like John.
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So what?
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That's cool. Yeah.
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Well, I mean, in Orange county, right, we've got, it's, last I checked, roughly 3 million people live there. Thousands of transactions per month. Obviously, we're in a bit of a different, I mean, Orange county is different. I call it a transaction recession. What are you seeing out there, by the way, for your market? What's happening?
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I'm seeing houses go quick that are priced right and other homes where they're shooting for the stars are sitting and then price reductions. And I, you know, Jeff, you know too, like those price reductions play into the mindset, the consumer and the media more than ever. So educating our clients on why they're seeing price reductions and you know, and educating them on, hey, it doesn't mean the market is actually moving down, but yeah, no, it's been like, you know, we just, we had clients actually not here in Orange county, but up in the Pasadena area right by the fire zone. There was 36 offers on this particular house. So you know, it's the houses that are priced right or really, really desirable are extremely.
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Yeah, so you mentioned Pasadena. And for those listening, they might not be aware. So you're in Newport beach area, lovely area. And then Pasadena is probably about a two hour drive. Right.
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With traffic maybe depending on a good day.
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On a good traffic day, three hours.
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Yeah, yeah, I would say like minimum two hours. Unless you're leaving at six, five in the morning.
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Jeff Zimfer
Right, exactly.
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John Farrell
So it makes me curious then how you. Is that a one off or do you step far outside of your general backyard to get business?
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A lot of our business comes from my book of business. Being in the business since early 2000 or maybe even 99. So we actually, we're licensed in all 50 states. In December we closed 15 units. Seven of those units were outside of California.
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Wow, okay.
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Yeah.
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How does one. So this is an interesting conversation, right, because go, go back to that transaction recession kind of headline. I mean there is kind of overall volume is down and I'm seeing some loan officers that have been around a while, like yourself and others start to expand their footprint, whether with it's within their existing state or outside. Was that some kind of conscious decision you made or like what was behind that whole expansion thing?
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I mean if there was a decision that it was made, it was. And I'm losing track of dates, but the inventory levels at one point here in Orange County, I think it was like 1700 active listings. And I looked at it and I'm like, okay, well this isn't going to work. You know, there's, we're in the mecca of the mortgage business. There's just a lot of loan officers here. It's extremely competitive. I reached out to some agents in other states that we had worked on transactions previously and just said hello, you don't remember me, but so that helped a little bit. And then obviously, you know, we have a lot of clients here in Newport or in Orange county who have kids that are going to college and they want to buy their kids a smaller home versus rent or live in, you.
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Know, in different states.
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In different states, yeah. So. And then a lot of investor, we have a lot of clients buying multi units in Indiana, Ohio because they can cash flow a lot more.
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Yep, yep, exactly. All right, what is your number one source of business?
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I would say our, my book of business would be number one and then realtors, and, and we've got two or three really strong financial advisors that send us clients consistently.
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So by book of biz, you mean like past clients, all that?
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Past clients, yeah.
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Okay, great. So you're pretty proactive then with farming.
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That I could be better or if I'm being honest, I could 100% be better at it. You know, I would love to say that I'm the best at doing that, but there's, there's a lot of room for improvement. But yeah, we, you know, we, we have different processes that we've integrated into our system. The last since COVID that have, you know, been keeping us top to mind. But I could definitely be better.
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Is homebot one of those? I know I got the shirt on. We were talking about that earlier.
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Yeah, yeah, homebot. Homebot is one of those. Homebot's one, like one of the generic ways, I would say it's not really a personalized way, even though I've done some videos on there. But we've got. I use. I switch from Jungo, my CRM from Jungo to Bonzo. And Bonzo has been actually really helpful in creating campaigns, post closing campaigns or hey, I haven't talked to you in a long time. Campaigns to past clients. So that's been helping out too. But just picking up the phone is like a good, A good thing too, or sending a quick text.
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Well, and I want to go back to something you alluded to a moment ago of like, you know, could get better all the time. Because what people don't know is before we hit record Record, you know, is that you did in 2024, $108 million. And one of the things you said to me is, you know, the inner critic was the voice you used, right? Which was like that whole voice of like, shit, man, you can get better. What about this? What about like that? No Annoying little thing. Right? And I just want to point that out to everybody listening and acknowledge you for the, I guess the, the humbleness. Right. And the willingness. Because, you know, when you get so.
- [11:27]
Jeff Zimfer
High, like if you think you're, you're.
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John Farrell
All that, that's when you start that, that.
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Jeff Zimfer
What do you call that word?
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John Farrell
The pride takes over. Yeah. That's when it starts to undermine.
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Yeah, I was sharing with you, Jeff. Like, I'll be quick on the story, but when I was younger, I didn't. My parents really, I love my parents. They didn't give me much, but my first job was picking up cigarette butts at a 711 in Kirkland. Washington. I was making $2.75. That's a job. That was a job. And everyone was smoking back then. So you can imagine the parking lot of the seven destroyed and that I'd carry a five gallon bucket, pick up cigarettes. By the time I thought it was done, There was another 100 cigarettes on the ground. But I hated that job so much. But then there was this Italian restaurant. I think it was Tony Moroney's or something in Kirkland. But I. I saw these waiters and waitresses, and they're all dressed up nice, and I'm like, man, they're making a lot of money. So I went to the. The restaurant. I'm like, hey, I really want to be a waiter here. They're like, do you have experience? And I'm like, no, I'm only like 15 years old. They're like, well, no, you can't do that. You can be a dishwasher, though. So I was a dishwasher. The amount of just like, trash I got noodles and everything else. These waiters and waitresses disrespected me so much, and I was just trying to hustle back there, and I would get out of there and I'd be all marinara sauced out. So the reason why I share that with you is because when I finally made it to a waiter the new dishwasher respected so much, and I would treat them, you know, like they're a human being. I wasn't throwing stuff on them and all that. I think that kind of carried through into my later years. So, like, 100 million to me doesn't really mean much. I'm still the dishwasher, you know.
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Then what about this business? What keeps you engaged? Passionate, right? Kind of getting after it. I mean, after all these years, you're not jaded.
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What's firing me up and to do it? I mean, I have three kids. Two in college and a preschooler.
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So life, baby. There you go.
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Yeah, the debt's definitely our motivator. I don't know. I just love people, you know, I love, you know, working with people. And I shared with you, like, the word that stuck with me this year. I'm good friends with Jeremy Forsey, and he. He gave me advice on, like, hey, choose one word every year. Like, I know. I think last year his word was impact. This year for me, it was curious. Be curious. So curiosity has really helped me.
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Does that help you, you think, with. With meeting people, whether they're potential clients, referral partners?
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I think so, because it's not, you're not coming off. Like if you get a broker preview. Right on. I don't know if broker previews exist everywhere but where the realtors are showing their new listing. You know, you used to walk in and you're like, I mean, I was guilty of this too. Hey, we got 30 year fixed rates at 2.375% and they're like, yippee ki yay. You know, like, get, get out of my house. Right? So I, I think just having curiosity and curious in the top of your, your brain gets you to come off differently. And it's not all about making the sale or, you know, what can this person do for me, but it's ask getting to know them and finding out what problems they have and you know, eventually being a solution provider to them. You know, sometimes it doesn't work. I mean, sometimes they tell me to get out of the house and that's totally cool. But for the people that I gel with, it works.
- [15:05]
Give me a sense if you could. And I know this has changed over time, but obviously a lot of us are listening right now. Is, is, is probably a lot of people are in the place of, you know, they want to grow their business. Right. They want to add units. And I don't know if you, you know, you said, mentioned Jeremy Forcier. You're probably in certain groups and coaching and you have conversations with people. But let's just say today I'm an ello. I've been in the business three years, right. And I, and I need to grow. Like what would you advise or what would, what would John do today?
- [15:34]
I would have more conversations.
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Jeff Zimfer
Okay.
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John Farrell
Make more phone calls, like, go out, whatever you like doing. Like I, the pictures of it. I used to love riding motorcycles. I don't anymore. My wife put a posh to that, but whatever. If you like playing pickleball, get involved with pickleball. Because whatever you love doing, you're going to meet people that have similar interests and you'll enjoy having conversations with them. And I love working out now. So I'm at the gym. Well, everyone at the gym knows I'm in mortgage. Not that I'm pitching mortgage to them, but they know that I do that. And from that I've had people come out from the gym and they're like, hey John, we're buying a house or we want to buy a house. We don't know what to do. So my, I think my advice would be whatever you enjoy doing, like get out in the community and, and just start asking questions, talking to people.
- [16:25]
Okay, give me. Do you have anything that's more scheduled? Such as give us a glimpse into how you structure your activities, your biz, jet biz, gen biz, development generation activities.
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Jeff Zimfer
What does that look like?
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John Farrell
Well, if I, if, if I'm being totally honest, my day is still add like it's chaos. So. But I do, I do make sure that I set aside at least an hour and a half a day of reaching out to past clients or referral partners and you know, generating sales and business and leads. I think that's important. It's, you know, it's hard to do day in, day out. But I would definitely have conversations with, you know, if you're getting back to your question, if you're brand new in the business, you've got to be out there or if you've closed, you know, you're three years in the business, you've got closed transactions. Reach out to those agents, whether they're on the listing side or the buy side. Say, hey Mr. Mrs. So and so. You know, I closed that deal for you a while back. I want, you know, I wanted to, you know, connect with you and yeah, follow up with your book of business because your book of businesses are going to be your biggest cheerleaders. If you're doing a, if you're going above and beyond with them, they're going to be the easiest ones to get new business from.
- [17:40]
Hey, are you tired of cold calling realtors and feeling like you're getting nowhere?
- [17:43]
Jeff Zimfer
With my agent classes, you don't have to chase agents anymore. We hand you a done for you system of ready to teach presentations, plug and play marketing and even 200 producing agents to invite. So you can double your agent referrals in 90 days or less. Plus you'll get weekly coaching and a.
- [17:59]
John Farrell
Community of loan officers sharing exactly what's working right now.
- [18:03]
Jeff Zimfer
Here's a quick win from one of our members.
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Channing Moore
Been part of my agent classes for a little over a year and totally changed my business. I grew at least 25% and that was during a pretty down market and have only grown every single month that I've kept doing it.
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John Farrell
Community is great.
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Channing Moore
Show up to the Friday calls. It's awesome. Have fun with it. Teach as many classes as you can. Just do more. Do better.
- [18:29]
John Farrell
Are you ready to stop chasing and.
- [18:30]
Jeff Zimfer
Start attracting agent referrals on demand?
- [18:32]
John Farrell
Book a call at MortgageMarketing Pro or hit the link in the show notes. Now back to our show.
- [18:38]
Jeff Zimfer
Tell me.
- [18:38]
John Farrell
Let's transition a little bit if you don't mind. I want to you kind of really stressed you've got two or three financial advisors that are significant referral partners for you. Makes me curious, what type of firms are they at? You know what I mean? Are they like boutique firms? Are they the biggest?
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Yeah, they're not at Merrill Lynch.
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I'm trying to think of the other one. The big insurance guys. I can't remember them right now. The big insurance guy. Northwestern, Northwestern.
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Northwestern, no. Yeah, so they're a boutique. Seth Davis is one of my biggest ones. He's actually out of Denver and I met him on a transaction in LA for a big celebrity at the time who doesn't use him anymore because he's made so much money. But we had a really good conversation during that transaction and then he's been referring US business ever since. The thing that he likes and that my other financial advisor likes is that, not that we use Mortgage Coach. They don't like, oh, I use you because of Mortgage Coach. But we use Mortgage Coach when talking to their clients because a lot of clients will want to put more down. So we're looking at, well maybe if you put less down but keep the money invested with R and B capital is one of them. Here's how your net worth would look versus putting larger amount down. So we're just having those conversations versus just like here's your rate, here's the payment.
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Right. You're being an advisor.
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Yeah. And we're also, we're having conversations with clients that don't have advisors. And if they don't and they meet the requirements of these particular fas, we're connecting with them.
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Are you doing the thing? Go ahead. Sorry.
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Oh no, I was just going to say like these two particular firms are high net worth clients. Like they're, they're big. But I would highly recommend getting, if you're new, to get to know some other financial advisors that have been in the business maybe three to five years because they're going to take on a smaller net worth client and you can, you guys can grow together. And then you know, you guys could get on social media and talk about how to grow your net worth. And like, you know, everyone wants to grow their net worth and they want to make more. So I don't know. Financial advisors though are a great source resource.
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Are you, are you actively, you know, there's, there's, I'm sure a lot of people listening are familiar with this script perhaps, which is, you know, on the 10 03. Right. You're asking them do they have a financial advisor? Right. Et CETERA looking to get that connection. Do you do that repeatedly or. Not really.
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Not as much. Not as good as Ryan Grant can do it. But we're doing it. Yeah, we're doing. Yeah, it's definitely coming up because that's being curious. Right?
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Right. Yeah.
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You know, like, so where, you know, where I'd really like to do that better is on a lot of our clients have trust and a lot of clients don't have trust and they don't really know enough about trust. Connecting with a trust attorney is if you can. I think that's a really viable source. I haven't had the success of connecting with a trust attorney that's been reciprocal and sending us business, even though I've sent them business. But there's so many avenues you can go down with getting new referral sources.
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Yeah. It comes down to the activities. It makes me curious. Have you ever done like events, classes, lunch and learns that type of stuff either early on or ongoing?
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I don't like lunch and learns. I don't know why, but I will tell you. We hosted a. Or I hosted. There was 15 agents that came to my house and I had this trust attorney, this trust attorney, that trust attorney at the house. And that was really beneficial. But the cool thing with doing it at my house was everyone was kind of casual. It wasn't like going to a network mixer where everyone's uptight and all that. It was like a very cool setting and that I do like doing. And in fact that I need to. I have on my goal to do four of them this year because it just provides a different setting than a lunch and learn.
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Jeff Zimfer
What would you say?
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John Farrell
And I know this is all off the cuff, so I apologize if you feel like you're being put on the spot for everybody listening. This was not rehearsed or planned, but any idea of roughly what your balances of purchase to refi is?
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It's I. I'm in October of last year, we obviously probably did 50% refi purchase, but I'm predominantly right now 98% purchase, 2% refi.
- [23:16]
Jeff Zimfer
Interesting.
- [23:18]
John Farrell
Yeah. And I mean if that says anything to you, what I could do a better job at is probably reaching out to my book of clients that need to do debt consolidation and that would lead to more business and help them out. But majority of our clients are jumbo too. So when you're talking to clients that have 50,000 in credit card debt and they've got a million two note at 2.875 rate, doing a blended rate analysis is not Going to be very beneficial. We're doing a lot of second mortgages right now too.
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Interesting. Okay, let's. Let's transition a bit to social media now because I know you're pretty active on social. Your Instagram. We'll link it up in the show notes. But it's John E. Ferrell, if I'm correct. You're pretty active with posting. Some of your reels have just taken off. I'm curious, like, what would you want to share about your journey on social so far and any commentary in terms of getting business there, you know, for example? Sure.
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Yep.
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Mm. Right. You wouldn't be you. Yeah. Polished. Yeah. Mm. That's awesome. Yeah. Just be you. Just be you.
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Jeff Zimfer
Yeah.
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John Farrell
So how much then goes. Because if you know, when people go to check out your Instagram, you've got some. Some reels that are banging. I know you know that you got one that's 9 million views, top 20 highest paying jobs. And so, you know, I've done a fair amount of studying and I could recognize why you're getting 9 million views on that, but it's a pretty wide right audience target there any things you want to share about your content strategy other than be real, be yourself, don't be overly polished. But what about the actual, you know, topics and things like that are you trying to be you mixing up mortgage specific versus more broad? What do you want to say on that? Really? Really? To get people to comment. Oh, yeah, Negative. Yeah. Pillars as in what? Family finance, fitness, that kind of stuff.
- [25:10]
Jeff Zimfer
Eight.
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John Farrell
I hear you. Okay. Yeah. Personal development. Yep. Well, speaking of vulnerable, you did post some videos about your recent child's birth. Like that's pretty vulnerable. Oh, really? Very interesting. Okay, what are you focused on this year? Here we are entering April almost 2025. What's got your attention this year? Doubling volume, by the way. How many transactions would that be? Sorry to interrupt you, but knows the numbers.
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Jeff Zimfer
There you go.
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John Farrell
Nice. Are you taking the loan apps yourself over the phone? You got an online app? What does that look like? Yes, of course, man. Okay, so you might have like a pre call or whatever, right? Just go. Okay. I'm going to send you my link. Yeah, better for conversions. Are you running into. You got a lot of fence sitters and are waiting for rates to drop or whatever. Yeah, it's interesting. It's top of mind. You know, you mentioned mortgage coach and I use both that and be MBS highway and you know, each of them have their own version of tools to demonstrate a cost of waiting. You know, with the Equity appreciation and all that fun stuff. Even if the rates to come down a point. I was just curious if you did anything like that for people listening. And to your point about the strategy call, I think that is a huge differentiator. Every top producer, 100 million, almost every. Okay, I know not nothing's 100, but I don't know of a highly effective. I'll underline that word mortgage professional today. That's not using some type of a visual scenario conversation to move people forward in the process. Yeah, please, go ahead. My camera comes back online. Sam, baby. Hell yeah. Sam and I talked last week. We're talking again on Wednesday. I know where you're going. Go ahead, plug it. 100%. Hell yeah. Hell yeah. I mean, I had Mortgage Coach when it was a CD that I had to buy and load it on the laptop. 2003. That's when I entered 2003. Countrywide Home Loans. Orange County, Mission Viejo, the Fast and easy. Oh, yeah, for sure. They're both awesome. Sam's product looks great as well. Okay, cool. So we've talked about your number kind of top sources of business, which is your book of biz realtors and then these kind of two mega financial advisors you have. That's awesome. We talked about the activities, which is. Surprise, surprise, fundamentals, baby. Block and tackle. Like have converse, you stressed. Have conversations daily, weekly.
- [27:38]
Jeff Zimfer
Like there's no.
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John Farrell
Wait a minute, wait a minute, John. Where's the magic wand? The magic pixie dust that people want? The easy button, man. Yeah. What about. All right, let me. Let's try this. What about early on in your career when you're building, you gotta eat a lot of shit, right? Just to be like, okay, I got a deal. Well, the lesson there, though, is true colors, like, you know, how somebody treats you is kind of exemplary of how somebody's going to treat you. Right? Good, bad or indifferent, no matter what the situation. Good. Set your standards. For sure. And know your worth like. Like know your worth. Like if you're doing a great job and you're busting your ass and you're helping facilitate that transaction at a service level that is exemplary. There's the word twice. Then you deserve to hold yourself to a higher standard and who you work with and not put up with crap. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. All right, well, listen, I know you're busy. You got to double your volume this year, so I gotta let you go. But give us a shout out. What is your Instagram account, John? For sure. Well, there are definitely some nuggets we got from this conversation. John, I appreciate you making the time and look forward to connecting with you soon. Man. And listeners. You know what to do if you like this episode.
- [28:55]
Jeff Zimfer
Hey, leave us a review.
- [28:56]
John Farrell
Check out John's Instagram link in the show notes. If you got like one idea at least or more from this conversation, DM them. Let them know on Instagram. Appreciate you guys tuning in.
- [29:03]
Jeff Zimfer
See you on the next one. Okay, that's it for today's episode. Before we wrap up, I just wanted to remind you about my agent classes. Your proven system to double your agent referrals in just 90 days. Imagine never having to cold call again, instead building real lasting relationships with top producing agents who who want to send you business with done for you presentations, marketing automation, weekly coaching. It's all designed to make growing your business easier and fun. So if you're ready to take control of your agent referrals and grow your income, visit MortgageMarketing Pro or check the link in the show notes. And while you're there, don't forget to check out the success stories from other mortgage bros who've already seen incredible results. Thanks for listening and I'll see you on the next episode. It.