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- [00:00]
Jeff Zimfer
Have you ever had a past client go silent only to find out that they just closed a loan with someone else? You did everything right, but somehow you didn't stay in the conversation. Well, what if you could change that so that your name is the one they remember at every key moment in their financial journey? You're listening to the Mortgage Marketing Radio podcast where we help mortgage professionals grow their business with proven strategies, expert insights in real world success stories. My name is Jeff Zimfer. I am your host. Today on the show, we're asking, how do you stop losing business? You should be winning and instead become the trusted advisor your clients never forget. To help us answer that, today we're talking with Joe Wello, CEO of Total Expert. His platform powers some of the biggest.
- [00:38]
Joe Wello
Players in the mortgage space and helps.
- [00:40]
Jeff Zimfer
Thousands of originators show up at exactly the right moment with the right message. And today we're going to talk about how a loan officer reconnected with a client after nine years and closed a new deal thanks to a simple alert. We'll also talk about Rocket Mortgage and why they can retain up to 80% of their clients and how you can compete, compete and win. And also we'll have a conversation about how AI powered automation is giving loan officers more conversations, better referrals, and yes, more time back in their day. And stay tuned because we'll get into something pretty wild about AI voice agents and how they might be outperforming human call centers in empathy, follow up and consistency. So if you're ready to stay top of mind, stop leaving money on the table, stick around for this episode of Mortgage Marketing Radio.
- [01:36]
Joe Wello
Joe, welcome back to the show.
- [01:37]
Hey, Jeff, thanks for having me, man. Pleasure to be here.
- [01:40]
It's been a minute, Joe. We were talking about that just a second ago. Looking at the last time you and I talked, I was doing episode 17 of this show, which was about seven years ago, man. So long time no see.
- [01:55]
Time really does fly. And congratulations on your journey and a successful show. Sticking with it all. All of it.
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Yeah. Well, thank you for that. And I know you can appreciate the whole theme of sticking with it as well. Building a platform like you've done. A total expert, that's not easy. Lots of headwinds in the market and we're going to talk about a couple of those here today. So let's just jump right into it. I caught that your, if I'm correct, your mission statement is to deliver the perfect customer journey, is that correct?
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Yeah, really deliver the perfect customer journey for every financial milestone is how we think about the mission of the company.
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Right. Okay, so I'm curious then here we are. You know, it's been what, seven years ish. Since we last spoke. There's a lot that that's evolved techno, you know, technology wise from I'm curious, like how do you think the customer journey has changed over the last handful of years?
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So many, so many ways, Jeff. So first of all, the consumer, their expectations for how an organization should engage with them and communicate with them has evolved and the bar has just been raised tremendously. If you think about places like E commerce and retail generally are speaking are a little farther along than financial services in the way they personalize content and communication. So that's really the biggest change is ultimately the expectations and the bar that you have to hit to really deliver an amazing customer journey which you can put customer experience over the top of that with the intention that you're building a lifelong customer. And I would say what we have seen from our customer base and the industry at large is really a focus this past year to two years on the importance of customer loyalty and how much value you can create for your organization and ultimately the value and benefit you can deliver to the customer if you're thinking very long term and not just transactional. So I would say that's some of the biggest changes we've seen of consumers expectations. And then the way a lender or bank looks at and manages that process is really now geared towards lifelong customer versus I got to generate a lead and close a deal.
- [04:19]
And do you think, have you seen the, the attitude or the adoption, the acceptance of that evolve and people are embracing that more than they have in the past?
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Yes, in many cases I would say the most strategic executives and I get the pleasure for best part of my job is I get to spend time with a lot of really great executives and leaders from lenders and banks as well as the technology environment and get to have a lot of strategic conversations about how their organizations are navigating some of the changes that they feel are required. And I would say the thing that really resonates is when you see the data that an average lender only retains 20% or less of their customer base and you have the big rocket at the top of the mountain. Who retains 85%? Well, what's the difference? The 65% difference that compounds every year. And so if you think of I'm a lender and I say I'm going to take my retention and recapture from 20% to 40%, just that how that compounds over two to three year period is profound. Once you look at the data. Yeah. It really resonates and there's like, okay, now how do we really harness this? Because the nature of the beast in particularly retail lending and direct to consumer lending is so focused on the transactional process. You have to take a step back and really have a strategic lens and make sure you have the right team.
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Okay, so you mentioned Rocket. It was on my list here to talk about. Obviously they hit the news earlier this year. I didn't know that figure. 85% retention, it's something I might be.
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Off by one or two percentage points. It's something ridiculous.
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80Ish, you know, compared to 20. That is unbelievable difference. And you think it's because. Let's just geek out here for a second. Technology wise, they've obviously invested a lot in infrastructure to build out those kind of, to identify those milestones along the customer journey. Let's go back to that. You think they've built a really solid infrastructure for that?
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They have. But here's what I would tell you, Jeff. It's not their infrastructure per se. That is because there's a lot of big lenders that have really great infrastructures and great tech stacks. We're fortunate to be a part of that in many cases. But it's really the combination of things. And let me explain. So company like Rocket and their playbook, they have a lot of data and intelligence, which is a lot of these data sources are available to the industry. Okay. But Rocket does a great job of harnessing data on their existing customers, past customers and making sure they are getting as up funnel as possible when it comes to intent to do a loan or make a move. Right. So they understand that data. But what they do that's magical is they pair that data then with a lot of action on the sales and marketing side. And that action on the sales and marketing side equates to a very disciplined sales and marketing journey that has multiple touch points. It's very rigorous, it's very refined. And they have, because they have a different type of loan officer than a lot of the retail lenders, they have internal call center team. And so their job is to follow that regimented, consistent process. So if you think about the math for a second, if I'm a lender and I surface an opportunity, I'm saying, okay, I'm monitoring my database. This consumer for whatever reason shows a propensity to do a loan in the next three to six months. And my move might be I'm going to go Then send that back to my loan officer, the retail originator, who's busy out in the field. What happens from there? Well, what we've learned from studying the analytics and the data is over half of the conversion, meaning over half of those deals that are recaptured happen after the 12th touch. So 12 touches, 12 calls, texts, emails, whatever it is. And so if you think about that, how many lenders are structured in such a way that they understand the cadence, the timing of those touches and the consistency of doing that every single time. And so it's the intelligence and the data with a very consistent sales and marketing process that brings the magic. Of course, huge branding never hurts, right? So the customer awareness of the brand is magnificent, but that is really, in my opinion, not what makes them magical at recapture. I think it's a great inspiration for the industry and I think that technology has evolved to a point where it's very real that a lender can compete on that level. And I can go into details as to why, because it wasn't exactly possible a year ago.
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Oh, interesting. Well, before we get to that, I want to riff on that for a second, because degree that I am familiar with your capabilities in your platform of total expert, isn't that what you're trying to equip people to do is to be there at the moment of decision, so to speak?
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Yeah, we want our customers to be able to show up in the moments that matter. Right. And we think of showing up as being educating, engaging and advising, giving high quality advice in those key moments. And that is very intentional approach to how we think about it. It's not just sending a marketing flyer, it's what type of content is my customer interested in, how do I use data, equity or value in their home, Maybe debt consolidation scenarios that educate them on a path to better financial outcome. And then I communicate with them when they show intent or interest in a channel that they want, text, phone, voice, email, whatever that might be. And so it's just the combination of those things and our focus every day is we wake up every day and obsessing about how do we deliver an engine, a platform to the industry that allows them to build that customer for life playbook and execute it. And so that's the accumulation of all of our capabilities really lead up to that platform that allows them, enables them to do large parts of that.
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Yeah, well, I mean, really, at the end of the day, when it comes back to like, you know, you described Rockets playbook, you know, how your platform helps people run similar plays, I guess it gets Back to like, are you showing up right when that client or prospect needs you? Are you even in the conversation? Right.
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Yeah. And that's the, the data would tell us, if you just look at the data that many times they're not. And it's not because they don't want to. But if you think about the nature of the business, when you have the retail loan officer, in many cases, a lot of our customer base, large retail teams who have amazing relationships and visibility in the community, they're on the go, they're engaging, they're doing events, those types of things, and they're getting referrals and they're taking care of those referrals, and that's all consuming. Many times. I was with one of the top teams in the industry last week on the east coast, and, and we were unpacking it, and I think they're exceptional. Right. And we looked at their data and I won't disclose exactly it's more than 20%. It's more than the industry average by far, but it's nowhere near sort of that 75, 85%. And they're like, well, let's break down. Why not? And the why not is really, hey, we're busy every day and we don't have. We're not systemizing, we're not executing that strategy as well as we should. Right. And so, you know, it's fun to have those conversations and then whiteboard out saying, where are the holes? And then where can we put some automation in place? Where can we add some intelligence onto your database? Where do you have gaps and start closing those gaps?
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Yeah, it makes me curious. I know AI has obviously become huge and you guys have an AI play there. And we talk a little bit about that as well, the investments you've made. But it makes me coming back to, you know, this Rocket example, they've got this huge call center, right. Forced to be able to like jump on those opportunities when the platform gives them the alerts, etc. So then maybe some of these other lenders who may not have the same budget or capabilities. Right. Of Rocket, does that mean, can they solve this with. Let's, let's see where AI. We can overlay AI over this to, you know, integrate with a platform like yours and the past client database. Can that be a solution or a road that they go down to solve that problem?
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It, you know, you hit the nail on the head. The advancements in AI over the past year has, has now allowed the technology now is there for a lender to scale a Call center without hiring a bunch of humans and without managing a bunch of teams and have many of the benefits of that call center. And some of the AI advancements are nothing, nothing short of profound and extraordinary. I mean it's, it's the greatest technological shift humanity's ever seen. And I know that sounds crazy, but it's 100% true in my strong belief, after being really immersed in what's happening.
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Well, let's double tap on that for a second because I wrote down a question for you. AI Real versus hype. I mean what you just proposed there is like I can have a call center without having human beings. There's some non believers out there, right?
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Yeah. What would you say to them? Yeah. So we've got an announcement coming up, depending on when the show airs here that's gonna address a big part of that. And the proof is in the results. And I will tell you that we started down the path with the technology late last year, went into some proof of concepts with some very early customers and we're absolutely shocked at, with the right architecture and the right technology ecosystem because there's an ecosystem of different tech that you have to bring together to do it correctly. When you bring that together, the pace of progress and the results were absolutely extraordinary. And we have now seen people be able to stand up AI agents, voice powered AI, human like voice AI that is having human like conversation with a customer prospect and able to do in many cases a better job of having empathy, of listening, of being consistent, of gathering information than a real call center agent. And so that technology is, is existing, exists today and it's getting honed and hardened in the wild and it's going to be transformational for the industry.
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It's kind of comical that you said the AI in some cases have. Has a better empathy and listening skill.
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True. It's true. Yeah. Yeah, it's true.
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That's the fundamental. Better. Go back to the developing your skill set. Salespeople, right?
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Yeah. You know, I think it's. So here's the way I think about it, Jeff. Salespeople do. Somebody said to me, well, it sounds like you think salespeople are going to get replaced. Absolutely not the case. I think mediocre salespeople are going to get replaced without question. And I would say you could take that. If you look at AI and the evolution and how quickly it's evolving, you can say mediocrity in every position will end up getting replaced. Because I can do so many things with agentic AI. Now what we believe is the magic touch is having the humans that can give the advice and there's things that a licensed human still really brings and adds a lot of value. And if you can give them superpowers and make them 10 times more productive and allow them to help more people and have more high quality conversations and not spend as much time calling bogus leads or bad referrals that aren't going anywhere, they can have an AI agent helping them do that and then just teeing up the things that are ready to go, it starts to really shift the business. And so I think the magic is going to be really giving the superpowers to the top producers or the key producers in the organizations that want to embrace that is part of their strategy. And then if you think about what's not going to go away is the need to have really top tier experts, loan officers, advisors in the communities, talking about home ownership, educating first time home buyers, educating the other demographics on reverse lending, older demographic on reverse lending, and how handling mortgage correctly really is going to deliver better financial outcomes to your families. Right. You need the people to continue to do that. And the best already do that naturally.
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Of course, yeah. It makes me curious about the intersection between the human touch and the high tech touch because as you well know, there are some correct or incorrect use cases of technology that actually don't help with your brand and building trust. So any notes or words of warning you would want to give around that.
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So let me speak to that. In general, the analogy that I've been using, this wave of AI, it feels and looks a lot like humans just discovered fire and people are going around and lighting everything on fire all the time, every day it's like AI, AI. I'm just going to light this thing on fire with AI and I assume it's going to be better.
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Right.
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The vast majority of that noise is exactly that. It's not necessarily delivering transformational value. You see, a lot of tech providers are just splashing. We've been very intentional about focusing on outcomes for our customers and working backwards and how to apply the technology. And a lot of people are saying, well, we've got to be AI first, of course, let's just throw AI on everything, even if we're not exactly sure where the value is going to get delivered. That's a dramatic oversimplification and there's a tremendous amount of detail of course that matters under that. But that's, you know, generally I think there's a lot of people that are just splashing AI everywhere.
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Yeah.
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And trying to See what sticks, so to speak. And I think there's a much better, more strategic approach. And what we see, organizations will maybe go down and spend some money on some things that are a little bit of hype and then they get more strategic about, okay, what are the outcomes that we want?
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Yeah. And they're also looking for leadership on this as well, which it sounds like you guys can play a role in. That, as you said, is like being intentional. Right. Not just doing it for the sake of saying, oh, we have this AI engine.
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Yeah. I mean, ultimately, I love having conversations with executives, whether they do business with us or not, and just sharing some knowledge on things that I've learned. I always learned stuff from talking to them and saying, I think it's great, it's going to elevate the industry. And I think Varun at Rocket does a great job of this, of saying, yeah, there's a lot of people that compete, but ultimately having a really collaborative industry and a collaborative ecosystem and an inclusive ecosystem between tech and lenders collectively and everybody can win. I think so. The right mindset, that's our mindset. And you know, I give those guys a lot of credit for having that mindset, for sure.
- [20:15]
Unknown
Hey, are you tired of cold calling realtors and feeling like you're getting nowhere? With my agent classes, you don't have to chase agents anymore. We hand you a done for you system of ready to teach presentations, plug and play marketing, and even 200 producing agents to invite. So you can double your agent referrals in 90 days or less. Plus you'll get weekly coaching and a community of loan officers sharing exactly what's working right now. Here's a quick win from one of our members.
- [20:40]
Been part of my agent classes for a little over a year and totally changed my business. I grew at least 25% and that was during a pretty down market and have only grown every single month that I've kept doing it.
- [20:56]
Joe Wello
Community is great.
- [20:57]
Unknown
Show up to the Friday calls. It's awesome. Have fun with it. Teach as many classes as you can. Just do more, do better.
- [21:04]
Are you ready to stop chasing and start attracting agent referrals on demand? Book a call at MortgageMarketing Pro or hit the link in the show notes. Now back to our show.
- [21:13]
Joe Wello
Okay, last question then I guess around the Rocket Redfin, Mr. Cooper situation. How would you. How do you want to respond to that? Is that a threat or an opportunity? Through what framework do you look at that?
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So I think it's both. And let me explain. If I think about the amount of servicing that they now have access to. I think it's like one in six mortgages being serviced. And it's a threat to lenders that have sold their servicing that don't have a playbook or an engine happening to actually make sure they're getting up funnel with those opportunities and making sure they're staying in contact in the right ways. So it's definitely a threat for those folks. But it's also in my mind, an opportunity to elevate and differentiate and to really take some action and make some progress towards just getting better about delivering customer loyalty. So I think it's an opportunity and a threat at the same time. But I largely think it's going to be a net positive to the industry because it has forced lenders to really take a step back and think about that whole customer journey and say, wait a second. The reason these guys are so big, there's lots of reasons, but if you look at the essence of it, the retention of the customer is so magnificent that that is probably the single biggest force multiplier that they have. So maybe we start there as an organization, if I'm thinking as a lender, maybe we start there by just doubling down in that area and then we're going to naturally grow more and more, be more profitable if we do that.
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Yeah. So it's kind of like a call to arms, wake up call.
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Yeah, I really think so.
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Yeah. All right, let's pivot for a moment, if you don't mind. I know we have some actual loan officers, mortgage loan originators listening, and those are a lot of the folks are in your platform on a daily basis. And I've been in it as well back in the day when I was at Movement for a period. But what for those listening, whether it's Total Expert or any CRM, any quick hits on. So based on what we've laid the groundwork so far on showing up at the right time. Right. And being there, engaged with the client over their life cycle. Any quick hits on best practices that they should be using regardless of the platform?
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Yeah. So I think ultimately the platforms, there's good capabilities in all of the platforms. It's a question of how has your company or how are you adopting it and architecting it and what are you trying to accomplish? We've got many, many millions of investments that are enhancing our platform based on the feedback of our users over this last couple of years. We've been really deep in the R and D space and the whole purpose of that is to help they Want enablement. And they want really to have technology that can make them more productive. At the end of the day, that's not how they describe it always. But if I'm a loan officer listening today, I'm like, how can you just make me more productive? And probably the simplest way is to say I'm going to actually put my arms, metaphorically speaking, around the database that you have, your realtors and your customers leads and prospects, past customers leads and prospects. And I'm going to make sure that I have a customer journey, or whatever you want to call it. We call it a customer journey that is set up with a combination of good intelligence to tell you when you should be communicating and then automating as much of those communications as I can, but then setting up my systems so that when a consumer responds or wants to engage, I can be on it very quickly. And so as a best practice, I'm going to make sure that I have a underlying customer journey automation in place as a baseline, because that's going to really be my growth engine. And then from there, there's tremendous variability in how people want to work. You know, one of the examples we're investing very heavily in sort of that lead to app workflow for loan officers. If I'm thinking about, I want to really be able to manage that opportunity. And so making sure that the system that you're using is set up to not you don't want to overcomplicate it, but you want to be able to run a process and be consistent, have a consistent sales and marketing process. And I would say as a best practice, consistent sales and marketing process and overarching customer journey automation for as many of the touch points as you can. Nothing's going to bring more value than that.
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Yeah. I think, you know, because I interface with a lot of loan officers, I just, what I hear is just missed opportunity in that they're not aware that the customer's at this stage. Right. And so whatever they can do to build that in, bottom line, just, you know, more frequent touches, like you said earlier.
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Yeah, yeah. You have to really have. I mean, the way we've described was on an investor call a couple weeks ago and they were asking me to walk them through how we think about our platform. And really the industry needs a system of intelligence combined with a system of action and engagement. Right. I believe we've done a really great job of assembling many of those components together. But as a loan officer, I'm like, what intelligence do I need? We have products and services that do this, but there's many companies that do. I want to have as much intelligence on my database as possible so they make me aware in those moments that actually matter. And then ideally not just make me aware, but there's action being taken appropriately so that they can get the person to the moment of actually they're ready to go. And then I'm on having high quality conversations and appointments and I'm not spending my time chasing my tail every day. Right.
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Yeah, exactly. You know, I'm on your website right now and preparing for our conversation. I wanted to look at some content and I'm looking at one of the success stories. Hear from Steve Kick at Lake Michigan Credit Union. And I don't know if you're familiar with that story, but that's something about a listing alert that has hit his inbox. Yeah, you know that story.
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Yeah, I do, yeah.
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Jeff Zimfer
I'm not putting down the spot, am I?
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Joe Wello
Just like.
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No, no, no, no.
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Do you want to share that briefly? Because that's an example of like I wrote down. This is probably an extended answer to the question I wrote down. How does a. How does the CRM go from being just data to a true growth engine? And that might be an example to jump off from.
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That's a great. So I don't have the detailed case study in front of me, but the essence of what he experienced was our customer intelligence. Surfacing an opportunity, engaging with the customer and making him aware and actually bringing a deal back into his hands that would have otherwise been lost had he not had those things.
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A past client had listed their property.
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That's just one piece of intelligence, right? One data point. And that's obviously if somebody is listing their property, they're going to be moving. And if they're moving, good chance if they own a home, they're going to buy another home in many cases. And so it's a very basic use case that gets missed all the time. Organizations even that have the data don't necessarily pair it with the automation and the workflow. And that's usually where the breakdown happens. And this case study was just a showcase of that. And he's a great guy and love having loan officers like that really take part in our platform.
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Well, I just think that's a great example. I'll hit that phrase again, growth engine. Because a lot of people have a CRM, which is, I think the bigger frustration with people when they complain about CRMs is like they use it as a data repository, like a fancy Excel spreadsheet, you know, and there's got to be. What we've been talking about here all along is there, there has to be intelligence and then integration between these various, you know, life events that go on. And I think that's. So you guys knowing from when you and I talked originally, like seven years ago, you've come a long way and really built that capability.
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Jeff Zimfer
From what I can say.
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Joe Wello
Yeah, yeah, we have. And I think there's amazing loan officers in our industry and we're very, very grateful for the opportunity to partner with them and build alongside of them. And I would say where we're at in our evolution is really building. We built tremendous amounts of infrastructure, enterprise grade infrastructure that can do things at massive scale. And then now we're really going in and obsessing about how do we help loans officers just be more productive with little things, you know, UI enhancements and sort of, sort of those little things that really matter to them day to day, you know, so our team's actually sitting by and we're pretty excited about some of the things that, you know, that we're, we're doing here. Most of this feedback has just come from, you know, hearing from the loan officers who are in the trenches every day. But what's exciting, Jeff, is the conversations that we're having. You know, maybe two, three years ago, it was, well, I want the button to be blue and I want this drop down to be here. They're asking better questions. They're saying, here's what I'm trying to accomplish, right? Here's the outcome that I'm trying to get. And many cases, and it's inspiring that you get to work with these people because they're very forward thinking, but in many cases they're saying, yeah, the way that such and such team has done it for the last 20 years, I'm not necessarily concerned with that. What I am concerned with is, is there a better way? And what's the way. What's the, where's the industry going so that I can be on the bleeding edge of how to build this growth engine correctly. Not just, hey, I want to manage a lead, they're asking better questions.
- [30:40]
Yeah, exactly. And I'm going to close out on that question in a moment about where the industry is going. But before we get to that question, I got to ask this one hot take on how loan officers in today's.
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Jeff Zimfer
Market can be more valuable to real estate agents.
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Joe Wello
Yeah, very simple. I had the opportunity, one of the best in the business, Shant Bonozian. You may know who Shant is. I think he's just an exceptional loan officer, advisor, expert. He's now president of a large lender because he's put such a great team in place. His goal every day when he's out doing what he does is educating the real estate partners and consumers as well. But specifically speaking about real estate agents, the value that he brings to them is collaboration and really education on how they can close more business, how they can grow their business. And he approaches it from that perspective versus just this transactional relationship. And I think that's really, ultimately it is be more strategic in your relationships with realtors. Sometimes quality over quantity, right? So I don't need to touch a thousand of them. I want to find the 50 or 20 or even 10 that I believe match with my business and where I want to do business. And then I want to figure out how to be a valuable partner to them. And I might start by making them aware of how to close more buyers or how to feed their, you know, how to. To how to help their team grow. Right. Those types of things.
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100. Yeah. Sean's awesome. He's been on the show twice. He does something. His playbook is similar to what we help LLs do, which is lead with education. Right. What we're talking about here, teaching classes, events, all that kind of stuff.
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Yeah, Educate, engage, advise. Man, it's those three.
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Go. Do you have that trademark? Because I might swipe it.
- [32:33]
Yeah, I think we're supposed to have it trademarked, but you can use it, buddy, anytime, whatever.
- [32:38]
We'll work that out later. All right, so the closing question then will be soon, as you just referenced that a second ago, what will be significantly different, you think, in this industry, marketing wise, two years from now, that's.
- [32:51]
People need to prepare for, so they're ultimately agentic. AI is going to be augmenting, enhancing and replacing certain parts of the process. Right. And so I'll speak to the part that I'm closest to, which is I'm going to, as a loan officer, have AI agents that can call my past customer database for me, can schedule appointments on my behalf, can text every single person in my pipeline and let them know when there's a movement in rates. All of these things can be done automatically by AI. Right. And so if I think about just how that transforms that customer journey, it's going to be a dramatic shift for dramatic benefit, in my opinion, for many, many loan officers and producers that think this way and embrace it. So the industry is still going to be about getting people into home ownership, educating the market, the differences are going to be in some of the machining and the systems and how it's executed.
- [34:00]
Well, I think that's a positive message for us who are, you know, sales oriented where, you know, those are some of those tasks that are time consuming and those can kind of pick up or capture those missed opportunities where we might be too busy or, you know, working on more strategic things, deep work, those kinds of things, but ultimately lead.
- [34:20]
Jeff Zimfer
Back to us having a conversation with a prospect or client.
- [34:23]
Joe Wello
And you know, not to go too, too down the rabbit hole on this, but ultimately I think it has the not. I think, I know it has the potential to really elevate the quality of life for a lot of salespeople as well. Right. What gives you energy, probably gives you energy is not calling leads, looking for opportunities or calling databases or calling my aged pipeline. It's actually having really meaningful conversations with consumers and realtor partners and so on and so forth. And if I can do more of that, my quality of life better is better. I'm happier. And by the way, you're going to produce more because you're doing high value activities.
- [34:58]
Yeah, I like what you said though, like better quality of life as well because, you know, there's some emotions attached to this whole AI thing bubbling up and some people have different reactions to it. But I think ultimately I like to give the example. Joe, this is funny and I know you can appreciate this is every technical, technical advance has, has usually met with some bit of resistance early on. And I was reading an article that said when electricity was invented and starting to be used, there were people who rejected it and wanted to maintain gas land.
- [35:27]
Yeah.
- [35:28]
Because they thought it was possessed.
- [35:31]
It's 100% true. That's just the way it is in every innovation cycle.
- [35:35]
Jeff Zimfer
Yeah.
- [35:35]
Joe Wello
This one's no different.
- [35:37]
Jeff Zimfer
Yeah.
- [35:37]
Joe Wello
So embrace change.
- [35:39]
Yeah. It's just going to be, there's going to be people who are going to resist that and you know, my strong opinion is I wouldn't want to be in that camp because I ultimately think it just elevates so many things. There's so much potential and it's, it's happening everywhere in every industry and very quickly.
- [35:59]
Well, Joe, this has been awesome conversation. Great to catch up after seven years. For those who want to learn more, I think two places perhaps we talked about they could connect with you on LinkedIn number one.
- [36:08]
Right, of course, yeah, on LinkedIn. Absolutely.
- [36:11]
So we'll link up your profile link in the show notes and then of course they can go to totalexpert.com there's all kinds of great content in there. They can request a demo, they can go to your blog. Any other direction you want to give them as far as connecting with you?
- [36:23]
Yeah, yeah. Reach out and engage with us, our teams, at a lot of the conferences and things like that. We'd love to have a conversation, show you what we're up to if you haven't been in the system for a while, educate you. We've invested many millions of dollars in R and D this past year and a half to two years and a lot of that's now coming to market. And so there's a lot of really great things happening inside Total Expert with.
- [36:44]
Our customers and a big announcement coming soon depending on when you're listening.
- [36:48]
So yes, very soon.
- [36:49]
We'll be looking forward to that. Joe, appreciate your time. I know you're super busy and listeners, you know what to do. If you like this episode, share it with somebody who you think might find this conversation relevant. Leave us a review and we'll see you on the next one.
- [36:58]
Jeff Zimfer
Bye for now.
- [36:59]
Joe Wello
Okay, that's it for today's episode.
- [37:00]
Jeff Zimfer
Before we wrap up, I just wanted to remind you about my agent classes. Your proven system to double your agent referrals in just 90 days. Imagine never having to cold call again. Instead building real lasting relationships with top producing agents who want to send you business with done for you presentations, marketing automation, weekly coaching. It's all designed to make growing your business easier and fun. So if you're ready to take control of your agent referrals and grow your income, visit MortgageMarketing Pro or check the link in the show notes. And while you're there, don't forget to check out the success stories from other mortgage bros who've already seen incredible results. Thanks for listening and I'll see you.
- [37:38]
Joe Wello
On the next episode.
- [37:47]
Jeff Zimfer
It.