← My So-Called Midlife with Reshma Saujani
My So-Called Midlife with Reshma Saujani
Work-Life Balance Is a Lie with Thasunda Brown Duckett
00:42:14
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- [00:01]
Reshma Sajani
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- [02:39]
Tashunda Brown Duckett
Lemonade.
- [02:47]
Reshma Sajani
Welcome to my so Called Midlife, a podcast where we figure out how to stop just getting through it and start actually living it. I'm Reshma Sajani. So I really needed this episode this week. My conversation with Tishunda made me feel how I feel. Like when I'm sitting in church or when I'm sitting in temple and, you know, the reverend just gets up and just tells you exactly what you needed to hear at that moment. That's what she did for me. I was having a rough week. I needed someone to remind me about what leadership means and what leadership means in this moment. And she did that. She did that by reminding me that, you know, you wrench your title, but you own your values. Whew. Isn't that the truth? She also reminded me about the power of grief. Look like you, and like a lot of midlifers, we're at the age where we're losing people, we're losing our parents, our friends are losing their parents. Things are happening now that we didn't know could happen, or things are happening now that we knew were eventually gonna happen where we just weren't ready. We weren't ready to let go of that parent that we loved. And so Thasunda's vulnerability around losing her brother and the grief that she felt and how she dealt with it and what she did was just so important. And I really needed to hear that lesson. I know you all are going to really need to hear that lesson right now. The other thing we talked about is money. So here's the thing. One of the biggest wake up calls for me in midlife has been around money. Not just how much I have or don't have, but what does wealth actually mean? What was I taught, what I wasn't taught? I mean, I lived with two parents who were refugees, who were always stressed about money. My mother never, ever went to a store or bought anything unless she had a coupon. And so the way I was raised, the stories that I was told, helped shape my security and stress around money. And look, I know I'm not alone in being a little scared and intimidated by conversations about money. If you're anything like me, you also probably didn't grow up talking about wealth building or retirement planning at the dinner table. You were told to work hard, save a little, and just hope for the best. Don't take any risks. But the truth is, women, and in particular women of color, we enter our midlife, but we need a Different conversation. We need a conversation that's about power, one that's about agency, one that's about getting over our fear of risk, one that's about designing a life that gives us freedom. Tashunda Brown Duckett, she is leading that conversation. She's the president and CEO of TIAA, one of the only two black women leading a Fortune 500 company. And what's so powerful about Jashunda is isn't her title. It's how she carries it. She is one of the most impressive leaders I have met in a real long time. And I'm telling you, I literally could have an entire wall full of Tashunda quotes. That's how much she inspires me, because she leads with purpose, purpose and faith, and she has a deep understanding about who we are and who she is. She's a financial visionary who kind of breaks it down in a way that just makes it all just a little more accessible. We talked about everything from the myth of work, life balance, from grief to how to be a leader to that nagging add to the cart impulse every time we're shopping online. Happened to me this morning. And just how to take control over our finances and our own narratives. As Tashunda says, money is just never about money. It's about possibility. I walked away from this conversation feeling so much more empowered about my worth, my wealth, and about starting that group chat about money. I hope it does the same thing for you. Let's bring the money into the conversation. Hello. Thank you for doing this. So we talk a lot, Dashunda on the show about midlife mindset. And it literally varies, like, for everyone. So some people are like, I love this point in my life. Some people are like, worst time of my life. Like, how do you feel? Like, what's your midlife mindset?
- [07:12]
Tashunda Brown Duckett
Jill Scott came into my head, like, living my life like it's golden. I feel exactly. It's. You know, I believe that I'm at the best time in my life. And I think it's because I have the benefit of perspective and knowing, you know, what the twenties meant or childhood. I couldn't comprehend everything, right? And then in my 30s, you're just grinding. But then your 40s hit, and things start to. You start to be okay with who you are. And then, you know, I just hit this new decade, and I'm like, wow, you know, it feels good. And I think part of it is just I'm giving myself a lot more grace. I am so much more confident on who I am. I think I'm Able to operate with a lot more intentionality because I have a lot of lessons that I've learned along the way, and I'm just looking forward to this, this next half. I really am.
- [08:08]
Reshma Sajani
I'm 49, turning 50 this year, and I'm nervous, right? Don't be nervous. You're making me. You're making me feel like you're making me get excited. Because I sometimes, if I was honest, I'm not sure I'm excited, right? But you're making me feel excited because everyone says, like, when you hit 50, you're just like, oh, like something shifts, you shift.
- [08:28]
Tashunda Brown Duckett
You know that saying that we always hear, like, when you're flying a plane, you have to put the mask on, you know, yourself. But the reality is, in our 20s and 30s, and maybe in part of our 40s, we were not putting on our mask first. We were doing everything for everyone. We were, you know, whether it's work for, you know, the company or whether it's all the things we do for our kids and your, your marriage, like, all the things. And I think this latter part of your 40s, heading into the 50s, you're like, this mask is squarely, squarely on my face now. Like, it is so good. And knowing that it has to be. I think that's the learning. Like, it has to be when you get out of bed, it has to be about you stretching or going to Pilates or working out. It has to be self care. It has to be, you know, your girlfriend time. It has to be my time in order for me to show up, well, for all the things that I'm trying to get done. So don't be scared. Do not be scared.
- [09:26]
Reshma Sajani
It has to be you, too. So I, I want to ask you, like, what motivated you in this journey to being this amazing CEO, mom and individual? Here's the thing, and I'm just not saying this because we're talking. You are one of the most impressive leaders I have met in a really long time, and I've met most of them.
- [09:45]
Tashunda Brown Duckett
You have. That means a lot coming from you.
- [09:47]
Reshma Sajani
I have met most of them and I've been in rooms where it's like, you're leading with love, courage, and wisdom. And I'm reading this book right now, which. And it reminded me so much of you. It's, you know, inner Excellence by Jim Murphy, where he talks about how, from the perspective of athletes, right, how great leaders are not chasing success, they're chasing their own potential. So they're competing with themselves. I feel like you relate to that.
- [10:18]
Tashunda Brown Duckett
No, I mean, I am chasing purpose. And purpose is uniquely mine. And so I think that is that connection with my own potential. When I think about my journey, I think perspective matters. It's like understanding history, understanding that no matter how awesome I am, there was a time that this access just would not have been afforded to me. And not forgetting that the perspective that I have in recognizing that I am first generation, full integration. You know, just sit in that for a moment, right? Like, my dad grew up in Louisiana, My mother grew up in Alabama. They grew up in the segregated state South. And here I am. The perspective of understanding that my parents, we were short on money, but we were. But we were long on love and faith and vision, you know, and my dad would tell me to dream, to reach for the moon. And so I do think success to me is not measured by the accolades. It's measured by this purpose. This purpose to inspire and make positive impact in the world.
- [11:35]
Reshma Sajani
You say this title that you have is rented. What do you mean by that?
- [11:39]
Tashunda Brown Duckett
So, yeah, I always say, you know, I rent my title. I own my character. And saying it out loud, especially in corporate America, it is this nod to affirming to myself that there will be a point in time, no matter how awesome I am, no matter what results I may yield for the company, there will be a time that someone will need to occupy this seat. There may have been times in my own career or what I tell others, where you had a setback. And if you understand that your title is rented, but you own your character, no matter what happens, when I leave one job and go into another, I may leave that business card, but I walk away with my ownable assets. I walk away with my curiosity, my grit, my tenacity. Those are owned. And so I think the more I have learned to understand, the flex for me is not the rented title. The flex for me is these ownable assets that I have. The more confident I have become and the less beholden that I am, you know, I understand my purpose. And if it doesn't work out in this scenario, there's another purpose for me to get. But my ownable assets stay with me. You don't get them. And to me, that's a real flex.
- [12:59]
Reshma Sajani
You know, this conversation is reminding me a lot of the one I had with my friend Justice Jackson. Same thing. You know, she grew up, right. Her parents, segregated South. Grew up with, like you said, long on love and justice. Like, you know, they say, ketanji, you can be everything and anything. And so she had that sense that, like, there was no mountain that was too high, There was no accolade, There was nothing that was just not obtainable or achievable. Right. And she always has this line where she says, you know, you bloom where you're planted. You know, what is this role of growing up with so much love, growing up with so much. With people telling you, yes, you can be everything and anything that has helped you have kind of the confidence you have today. Because the thing is, let's be real. Like, you are often walking in spaces with people who don't look like you, who don't have the same story as you. And a lot of young girls that I talk to at girls who code, they really struggle with that, right? They're made to feel like they don't belong. What's your advice for them?
- [14:02]
Tashunda Brown Duckett
Well, shout out to girls who code and all the great work that you've done and continue to do. You know, my advice first is that I decided that I never walk in a room by myself. When I walk into a room, I'm walking in with Otis and Rosie Brown. I am walking in with Miles, Madison and Mackenzie, my children. I am walking in with Shirley Chisholm. I am walking in the room with Rosa. Like, I am walking in the room with all of these amazing women and all of these amazing people living or in the past that affirmed through their example, through their perseverance, or through the love that I have, that I belong in this room. And so reminding yourself that you don't walk into any room by yourself, the rent has been paid. You are walking in through a position of ownership that allows me to go, okay, all right, Shirley, what we gonna do today? Okay, Harriet. All right, Madison, Mackenzie and Miles, you know, this gonna be. This is going to be interesting. And I am reminded that I belong in this room. And I would say to young girls, not only do you belong in this room, your assignment is clear. You are to speak, you are to say, you are to bring your perspective. And yes, the reality is that initial, you know, feeling less thin, or do I really belong, is this really happening? All of that, let that breathe and then let it move on. Like I saw in the same breath that my parents were telling me to reach for the moon. At the same time, I opened up the refrigerator and only saw baking soda. At the same time, I saw struggle. And yet they were telling me that you do not own that struggle, you own your excellence. And so pouring into me that you don't just keep those positive affirmations, you keep those lessons and I think keeping them both. And that's what, as you know, I try to do. I bring that perspective, not just look at me. Now. I talk about the source of that and I think bringing both of those together is what allows me to have my shoulders back and to know if I am first generation. Full integration. That perspective and mindset says I will not miss that moment in a room. I do belong in that room, even if I am feeling a little uneasy.
- [16:36]
Reshma Sajani
It's beautiful. You're literally making me cry. Such a tribute to our families and our ancestors and our elders, right? That we are here. Often when we say yes to others, we're saying no to ourselves. And trust me, neglecting our needs for too long can lead to resentment and burnout. You know the deal. You have to put your oxygen mask on first before you help others. If you're looking for ways to say yes to yourself and have more energy, less resentment and better relationships, I know something that can help Calm Calm is the number one app for sleep and meditation, giving you the power to calm your mind and change your life. Everyone faces unique challenges in their daily lives, and mental health isn't a cookie cutter approach. 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Calm puts the tools you need right in your pocket and can help you dedicate just a few minutes each day to live a happier, healthier life. Stress less, sleep more, and live better with Calm. For listeners of our show, Calm is offering an exclusive offer of 40% off a Calm premium subscription at calm.com medlife Go to C-A-L m.com midlife for 40% off unlimited access to Calm's entire library. That's calm.com midlife I want to tell you about a podcast you should check out. It's called Climbing the Walls this six part series investigates why women with ADHD have gone undiagnosed for so long and how that changed dramatically during the pandemic. When the diagnosis of ADHD in women skyrocketed, the show asked why women? Why now? How has this under diagnosis impacted women's mental health? This is such an important podcast for women to listen to. So many midlifers are experiencing late in life diagnosis of ADHD and trying to understand what this means and how it impacts our everyday lives. I checked out the first episode and it's such a beautiful, thoughtful conversation on understanding your diagnosis and how it has ripple effects on your mental health. Also, it tackles the ever growing question of how so many women go through their lives without knowing they have adhd. It's a must listen for everyone out there who had their late in life diagnosis or who think that they may be experiencing ADHD symptoms. To listen to Climbing the Walls Search for Climbing the Walls in your podcast app. That's Climbing the Walls Vacation season is nearly upon us and I cannot wait for my upcoming trip this summer. This year I'm treating myself to the luxe upgrades I deserve with Quint's high quality travel essentials at fair prices so I don't have to break the bank to look and feel good. My favorites are their lightweight European linen styles that start from $30, washable silk tops and comfy lounge sets. They even have premium luggage options and stylish tote bags to carry it all. 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Quins.com midlife I wish I could have learned how to be more financially mindful when I was younger. I mean, who didn't blow their allowances away over toys or a day in the mall? If I could go back in time, I'd tell myself to start saving young. So it's been my mission as a parent to teach my kids how they can be more financially responsible starting today. This is why I'm happy that today's episode is sponsored by Acorns Early April is Financial Literacy Month, the perfect time to start teaching your kids the value of money. And Acorns early makes it easy with their Smart Money app and their debit card for kids. Through the Acorns Early Chores Tracker, you can teach your kids that hard work pays off. Just set up tasks in the app, set a payment amount, and tick the chore off when it's done. Their Savings Goals feature helps kids turn saving into a habit. They can even choose their own target dates and turn on the optimal autosave feature to help them get there. With Acorn early, kids get a new sense of independence when they spend what they earn with their very own debit card. Plus, kids can build up their money knowledge and their confidence with bite sized financial lessons. The Acorns early app has tons of fun, interactive courses that help kids learn about all things money. It's never too early to teach your kids about financial literacy. These are skills that they will carry with them their whole lives. Being able to teach them how to be more responsible with their money gives me peace of mind that they're going to be okay. And I can see how much more confident they've become with their new financial responsibility. Ready to help your kids grow money? Skills that will last a lifetime? Just head to acornserly.com midlife or download the Acorns early app to get started. Sign up now and your first month is on us. Acorns Early Card is issued by Community Federal Savings Bank Member FDIC Member pursuant to license by MasterCard International. TNCs apply monthly subscription fee starting from $5 per month unless canceled. Why Money? What about that then drove you to finance?
- [23:30]
Tashunda Brown Duckett
Why Money one Looking at it through the rearview mirror, money insecurity was always there and I felt it. And then Mr. And Ms. Patterson, who were family friends, told me about a program called Inroads. And Inroads is a program for minorities to get exposure into corporate America. Remember, talent is created equally, opportunity is not.
- [24:01]
Reshma Sajani
That's right.
- [24:02]
Tashunda Brown Duckett
What Inroads has done for me and for so many others was brought the talent to the opportunity. And what's crazy about this story is that the power of information was the program inroads. I never heard the word corporate America, but then the power of advocacy, when I didn't even know what advocacy meant. A woman by the name of Valerie Mann Manning had one job, and that was to find one intern on that day. And she interviewed a bunch of students. And Valerie Manning went back to work and said, I found our intern. Her name is Sarah. My name's not Sarah, but Valerie Manning, for whatever reason, said, but there's this other girl. And if you know, you do not get a bonus by adding a second intern. But for whatever reason, Valerie Manning said those words. And I started my career at Fannie Mae. And those two moments, those two disruptors in my life connected my story around financial insecurity, the fact that my parents did not own a home to this dream of home ownership in corporate America that then led me down a path of understanding the impact and the imperative of financial dignity. I was able to connect to the life lessons I learned along the way. And that is why I can bring this different perspective into corporate America and into the C suite, is because I choose to stay connected. So that's how it started.
- [25:38]
Reshma Sajani
So now you're this huge advocate for retirement savings, and I want to talk about women in retirement because I think a lot of us right now, we're not even thinking about it. You've highlighted that 40% of Americans are at risk of running out of retirement savings, with women and black Americans being particularly vulnerable. That's scary. And when you look at the numbers for women, it's even more alarming. So, as you know, women retire with 30% less than men. Why do you think that is? Like, what are the factors that are contributing to that? Okay, let's go.
- [26:14]
Tashunda Brown Duckett
Let's go. First, I have to tell you this, like the fact that I am leading tiaa. When I graduated from college, I happened to be looking at my dad's statement, Otis Brown. And the daughter is telling the father, who at the time worked probably over 30 years, dad, you don't have enough to retire. And by the way, you have a 401k plan. He had not $1 in it.
- [26:43]
Reshma Sajani
No, not even a dollar.
- [26:44]
Tashunda Brown Duckett
He had not one dollar. Now, my dad worked in the warehouse. He scanned boxes. And for the daughter to tell the father that you have access to this really, really great 401k plan. And for decades, he never contributed a dollar. That lit me up. Because all he did. Because here's the thing. He worked in the warehouse so many times. You know, we have, as leaders at companies, we have great brochures, we have great seminars. The question is not do we have all the things on paper? The question that we have to ask ourselves, is it reaching the person furthest from us? And the reality is, no one went to Otis Brown, no one went to the people in the mailroom to say, you have this benefit that you are entitled to that can change the course of your family's life. If someone said that to Otis Brown, the man who moved around, that relocated in a car with everything we own, that man would do anything for us. And the moment I told my dad, he immediately started to catch up. And by the way, I was making $26,000, so it wasn't like I had no idea what I would become. But the point is, that is also when you say, what is the issue? It is not that there's not the things. It's that the things are not reaching the people who need it the most. And then when you layer that on, when you talk about women or people of color, you have to go back to structure, structure that had exclusions, exclusions to really good jobs. And so part of that is you start it behind. Women did not have access to the same type of jobs. This is why you do girls who code. We also know there's the pay gap. So if you're making less on $1, it's going to compound less over time. We also know that women exit the workforce, whether that's you have a baby or to take care of our family or all the things at a much higher rate than men, which means that's less contribution to catch up on. We also know divorce happens. And so all of that compounds in a way that we end up with less. And. Or as people of color, we end up with less because we started with less. And we don't have different access points to be able to soften the blow. So in a retirement plan, you hear the stories where people will take money out to help their child go to school. And that I get the problem is we don't get back on track. And now you're 50, 60, 70 years old and you're not able to work two and three jobs to catch up.
- [29:37]
Reshma Sajani
That's right. Someone had said to me, it's the reason why, Reshma, you see so many more women in senior citizen homes because of all these structural things, right, that leave him with less money, less empowerment, less kind of autonomy over their own decisions, even when it comes to Social Security. If you. And if your husband ends up dying, you don't get all of it. You get like, half of it or something, Right.
- [30:00]
Tashunda Brown Duckett
It's all these. And women live longer than men, right? We live longer than men, which means that's a longer time to try to figure it all out. You're spot on.
- [30:09]
Reshma Sajani
Yeah. So outside of policy, what are some steps that you would advise women to do kind of in midlife, knowing this, knowing that this is all kind of likely to happen. What can we do now to prepare?
- [30:20]
Tashunda Brown Duckett
This is why I love this question, especially when you say we're at midlife. You know? You know, it's the quote by Maya Angela. When we know better, we do better, and we do it without judgment. And money is emotional. So the first thing we need to acknowledge is, yes, money is emotional. Take a breath and forgive yourself. I think that's really important. It is absolutely okay to bring the sisterhood into the conversation to be able to say, all right, we're here at our midlife. How are we going to change the outcome of all the things we talk about and actually make it happen and do it together? I think it's important to be okay, looking at that balance sheet, pulling up that credit score, you know, pulling up that savings account, looking at your retirement plan. And then when you know better, you do better. So here are some simple things. One, check your company and make sure. Are you at least maxing out to the point of their match? If not, you're leaving coins on the table, you're leaving compounding on the table, and you're leaving the benefit that comes with retirement plans on the table. Secondly, if you're like, well, okay, I. I don't see the money to do that. You might have bought that Venti Starbucks. Buy a Grande and move the money into your savings account.
- [31:47]
Reshma Sajani
Take that spare change, period.
- [31:49]
Tashunda Brown Duckett
And also, here's a big one, especially for women without judgment. You know, this online thing can get a little ridiculous, right? You go online, you're shopping, it's a sale, or it's just, you know, good pricing. Click, click, click. I want you to click until it is almost laughable how much you have in the cart. Like, you know, you can't check out. Just keep clicking and then wait a day. Never check out. So click all you want and wait a day, and then you go back. I promise you, if you wait a day, you've got the fix of the energy of all the things, and then you go back and you just don't click checkout. And instead you move $100 into your savings account, you move $50. So the point is, get your fix. Click away. Shoes, outfit, purse, all the things, wait 24 hours, go back, and then move $50 or $100 or whatever it is into your savings. You do that, you'll start to see the power of compounding the power of saving, the power of then contributing to your retirement plan. You'll start to see it and do it with some girlfriends. Like every time you go shopping online, send that screenshot to your friends like it's laughable at 50 items in the cartoon. And we all laugh and go 24 hour rule. And then send them the picture back of you moving money into your savings or moving money into your retirement. That will be so much fun and it will be so crazy how expensive that car got. 10,000. It doesn't matter the amount. It just starts to get ridiculous and to the point that you start to save.
- [33:25]
Reshma Sajani
I love this. So also, you've taught me that, like, barely half of American women have an emergency fund. Again, worse for people of color, right? Worse for black and Latino American women. What could we be doing to build this emergency fund?
- [33:41]
Tashunda Brown Duckett
Well, you have to start small. And I think, you know, this is why I talk about the coffee or the, you know, shopping, because most people can't see $400. Like, I just don't have it. And so the key is to start small. To start small, to start smart, meaning you take action, you know, and then I think if you start small and you start, if you start now and you start small, over time you can get to that $400. I mean, if you think about it, that's one less happy hour you go to. Instead of getting your nails done once a week, get it once a month. That's $35 right there. Look at your financial habits. And if you say, what are some of the everyday financial habits that I will just move over into my savings, you will see that $400 sooner than what you could imagine. And I think for women in particular, we do so much on autopilot. Your child had a good day at school, you want to reward them. You take them out to eat. Your mother calls you and says, I need something you give even when we don't have. That's just who we are. And I think taking that pause and say, have I done something small for myself first? And so if I was going to buy the three boxes, I'm going to buy the one, and I'm going to move the other two into my account because I need to have that $400, those are those healthy habits, small habits along the way that can help you get going and start to see that you do have a little bit more liquidity than you thought. And I think it's just practical and pragmatic. Until you get to that next job or that next promotion, there's things you can do. And I think so many of us wait and say, well, when I get that next job or when I get that next promotion, I'll be able to. And I just want to encourage us to find those small moments to reward ourselves, to get to that emergency fund.
- [35:43]
Reshma Sajani
So it's interesting, you keep talking about the sisterhood almost like this group chat, right? And it's funny because I see Nahal do this with his guys, oh, you gotta check out this stock, see what's happening with Nvidia. Dah, dah, dah, dah, dah, dah. And I got a lot of group chats on a lot of things, but I don't want to have one on money, you know, so have you seen good, like, communities of women coming together? Yeah. Tell us how to create one, you.
- [36:06]
Tashunda Brown Duckett
Know, five friends that you truly trust. The ones that you talk about, the things, you know, the things. These are women who you trust. And I think especially in every circle, you have the friend that is all about her business. You have the friend that will make you laugh about our business. You have the friend who is working on her business, and you have the friend that talks that business. So we all play a role, but I think you look at the smile. We're talking about money, and we're smiling. So I think if you sent a note out to five friends today and you said, hey, y'all, my money is funny and very interesting, but, you know, I have goals and ambition, and I have a girls trip that I really want us to go to. How about we get together and just make sure we're all aligned about money? I guarantee you. I guarantee you the real talk. And there will be tears when you get together with the wine, because what happens is we'll start to tell our real story, Will start to say, you know what? When I was in college, I made these really bad decisions and this happened, and I got real into credit card debt or you know, what I was doing okay. And then someone got sick and I had to max out. And so I'm struggling, or, you know what? I'm overwhelmed. And then by having those stories, we start to do our research, which is what we do to say, oh, there's a woman like Lynette Kilfani Cox, the money coach, who we can reach out to and ask her to pop into our little chat and give us some tips. This is how we do it. The guys do it their way. This is how we do it. We do it with wine, we do it with tears, we do it with laughter. And then we do the research and we get going. That, to me is the power of sisterhood. And I think we have to bring finance to the sisterhood chat.
- [37:52]
Reshma Sajani
I'm doing this, Tashunda, like literally after we're done, I'm gonna like go do my, create my, my, my group chat. I'm thinking about what I'm gonna name it, so that'll come to me.
- [38:03]
Tashunda Brown Duckett
Midlife money. Midlife.
- [38:05]
Reshma Sajani
Oh, girl, that's a good one. All right. Midlife Money. When was the last time you listened to your gut? In the new year. There's a lot of misleading information floating around about food and weight loss. Did you know there's a lot of misleading information about ultra processed foods trying to frame them as healthy. That's why now is the best time to look into Zoe. Backed by one of the world's largest microbiome databases and most scientifically advanced at home gut health tests, Zoe gives you proven science whenever you need it. Your Zoe membership starts by testing your gut health and making smart food choices. From there. Zoe is science led and proven to work in a randomized controlled trial. Trust your gut. Trust Zoe. Go to Zoe.com to find out what Zoe membership could do for you. And because you listen to my so called midlife, you can use the exclusive code ZOE20 to get 10% off membership. As a Zoe member, you get an at home test kit and personalized nutrition program to help you make smarter food choices that support your gut. That's z o e.com use Zoey20 at checkout. As a midlifer, sometimes you wake up with new symptoms. You have no idea where they came from. Like a swollen, itchy eye, a tight pain in your neck or a cold that won't go away. And if you're like me, you probably immediately googled it or searched TikTok to see what's wrong. We've all gone down that rabbit hole. But it's time to get the help and care you need with ZocDoc. ZocDoc is a free app and website where you can search and compare high quality in network doctors and click to instantly book an appointment. We're talking about booking in network appointments with more than 100,000 doctors across every specialty from mental to dental health, primary care to urgent care, and more. You can also filter for doctors who take your insurance, are located nearby, are a good fit for any medical need you have, and are highly rated by verified patients. Once you find the right doctor, you can see their actual appointment openings. Choose a time slot that works for you and click to instantly book a visit. Appointments made through Zocdoc also happen fast, typically within just 24 to 72 hours of booking. Finding a good doctor has never been easier. As I've gotten older. I really wanted to find a good dermatologist who would listen to my concerns and help me stay on track with taking care of my skin. With Zocdoc, I was able to find one that works with my busy schedule and accepts my insurance. So stop putting off those doctor's appointments and go to Zocdoc.com midlife to find and instantly book a top rated doctor today. That's Zocdoc.com midlife Zocdoc.com midlife looking for a new cookbook to add to your collection? Look no further. Half Baked Harvest Quick and Cozy is the latest New York Times bestselling cookbook from Teagan Gerard. It's become my newest staple in my kitchen. Filled with over 120 recipes for delicious, soul warming comfort food, this book is the perfect gift for Mother's Day. Many of these recipes are doable in one pot or pan, most in under 45 minutes, and all with a more is more focus on flavor but not ingredients. It's easy to find a recipe that works best for you without all the hassle and cleaning. You'll find recipes for Maple Bacon Pancakes with Bourbon Maple Syrup, Garlic Butter Steak Bites with Bang Bang Sauce and Sheet Pan Mac and Cheese with all the Crispy Edges. One of my personal favorite recipes from the book is the One Pot Skillet Garlic Butter Chicken in Zucchini Orzo. It's so easy and delicious. And for dessert, I always make sure to include the Strawberry Oatmeal Cookie Cobbler. Trust me now, there isn't a day that goes by without my family asking for dessert. If you or anyone in your life ever needed a belly full of comfort and a plate bursting with fresh, unexpected flavors and wanted it all right now, Half Baked Harvest Quick and Cozy is for you. Available wherever books are sold. I'm always looking for ways to make drinking more water easier for my family, so having safe, clean water is the last thing I want to worry about. But according to extensive research by Environmental Working Group, virtually every home in America has harmful contaminants in its tap water. That's why you gotta check out Aquatru. Aqua Tru Purifiers uses a four stage reverse osmosis purification process and their countertop purifiers work with no insulation or plumbing. It removes 15 times more contaminants than ordinary pitcher filters and are specifically designed to combat chemicals like PFIs in your water supply. PFAs are found in almost 45% of US tap water, which is why I'm grateful that Aqua Tru is certified to remove these contaminants. Plus, Aquatru has water purifiers to fit every type of home from insulation free countertop purifiers to higher capacity under sink options. They even have a WI fi connected purifier and mineral boost options. If the environment is one of your top concerns. Their filters are affordable and long lasting. These no changing filters every two to three months. Aquatru filters last from six months to two years. I can truly taste the difference compared with my old water filter. It makes my tea taste so much better. I even noticed my kids drink so much more water Since Aqua Tru. Aquatru comes with a 30 day money back guarantee and even makes a great gift. Today my listeners received 20% off Aquatru purifier. Just go to Aquatrue.com that's a Q U a T r u dot com and enter code midlife at checkout. That's 20% off any Aquatru water purifier. When you go to Aquatru.com and use promo code M I D L I F E I want to talk to you about being a mom and you're a very hands on mom. I love following you on ig, seeing what you're up to with your family and your kids. One of the things I love is hearing you talk about what you really think about the term work life balance.
- [44:22]
Tashunda Brown Duckett
Work life balance is a lie. I think we just all have to say it. And I had to learn that the hard way, right? Because again I'm in my 30s and I have two kids and I'm working and driven. And I remember I would literally drive to a bus stop to then take the bus commuter to New York to then either walk to the office, which is like 25 minutes, or catch a cab every day and do it in reverse. And I remember I was at the Port Authority in New York and it was the last bus and the last bus. Everyone is going to the casino. There's no more commuter. People from work And I look around and I see an older man cleaning the Port Authority and I break down and I called my husband and I said, when I wake up in the morning, I don't see my kids. And when I get home, I don't see my kids. And I am just failing. Now my husband, as you know, is a stay at home dad. He's a marine and an engineer. And he says without hesitation, then quit. And I was like, that's not the point, right? But his point was, if this is not working, we'll pivot. Now we'll need to make some changes, but we'll pivot. At that moment I started to realize that this work life was never going to reconcile. And so I was never feeling great. I never felt like I was a great mom, great at work, great spouse, great. This because it never reconciled. So I shifted my perspective and I am into finance. So I said, I'm going to live my life like a diversified portfolio portfolio. And what that means and everyone, it's game changing. You tell yourself the truth, you only have a hundred percent. How many times we tell ourselves it's 120. No, you don't. It's 100, it's a hundred. You, you do not have 120%. That's a lie. You have a hundred. And then think about everything that matters to me. Being a mom, an executive, a philanthropist, a mentor, a friend, an auntie. And you allocate. And the reality is that my children only get 30% of my time. By telling myself that truth, I became a much more present mom. How many times our kids are around, we're doing five things and I'm texting and yep, mommy here. Yeah, that's cute.
- [47:03]
Reshma Sajani
All the time.
- [47:04]
Tashunda Brown Duckett
All the time. Until I realized they only have 30%. And when I realized that, I became a more present moment. And here's the point. If you allocate everything that brings you joy into your portfolio, even if it's just 1%, just like your money, you want it to be diversified. There will be market volatility, there will be life volatility. Sometimes you have to short the stock. You just gotta let it go and reallocate. When my brother died, I had to reallocate my portfolio to being a sister, to being an auntie, to being a mother. When I got my new CEO job at tiaa, I had to allocate more time. So it's giving myself grace to respond to market needs. And here is the flex. If you live your life like a diversified portfolio, over time you will outperform this thing called life. And so I know that my kids don't have 100%, but within that 30%, they now get 100. I know that I may not be a great mom when I'm traveling like crazy, but over time, I'm a really good mom. There's times I don't feel like I'm a good daughter because my parents live in Texas and I'm on the east Coast. But over time, I'm an amazing daughter. So I am living my best life because everything that brings me joy is in my allocation. If not, you sell it.
- [48:29]
Reshma Sajani
I love that. I mean, I think one of the things that's helped me do that is I'm ruthless about my schedule. Like, ruthless. And I just don't have the same guilt. Like, I'm like, I don't need to go to that event at night, you know, because I kind of rather be on the couch watching Peppa the Pig with my kids. And I think when you're ruthless about your schedule, but that means I spend a lot of time looking at it. I spend a lot of time moving things around. I spend a lot. Like, everybody on my team knows, and then you put in blocks of time. But I love this. It's like you're honest about the time you have and where you're gonna put it, and then you're fully, fully present.
- [49:04]
Tashunda Brown Duckett
No. It gives you the ability to say no. Because if I've allocated 5% to be a mentor and everyone's still asking, do you have 15 more minutes? I can say no, because I now have language to say. If I give you those 15 more minutes on my mentor allocation, I'm taking away from my family time because I will be under allocated in another area that brings me joy. And that has helped to be okay saying no.
- [49:32]
Reshma Sajani
Can I ask you something about grief? Because I do think in midlife, we're all experiencing a lot of loss that comes from different places. You lost your incredible brother Jamal in 2022, and you said something in your tribute that really stuck with me. You said, yes, I am a leader striving to make a positive difference, But I'm also a sister carrying a broken heart. And it's important to me to not just share what's awesome, but what also.
- [50:02]
Tashunda Brown Duckett
Hurts, you know, grief is love. With no place to go, and going through this grief journey, it's like the show this Is Us. It's like there were eight different scenarios happening at the same time. I saw the grief of my younger brother who couldn't even drive to the hospital because the anxiety was just overwhelming. I saw the strength of a mother trying to reconcile it all and leaning on her faith to the point that it was scary to see the grief of a father, grief of his children. His youngest child was a senior in college. The truth is, life was never promised to live to a certain age. So there was nothing to say. You promised me something that you did not give. The truth is that if God told me, I will give you 49 years of an amazing brother who is your biggest fan, who would check on you. Sis, you do everything. How you doing? Like, so suave and make me laugh and just so proud of you. And he set such an example in so many ways. I'll give you that for 49 years. And I'm going to take them from you. Do you want it? Because when it happens, it's going to gut you. I'd say give me those 49 years. And so what I am learning in this midlife is life. Be lifeing. Joy comes in the morning. I grieve him and will forever grieve him. But the joy of what he means, the joy of being able to count my blessings every day has compounded this passion of purpose, has intensified this level of taking a breath. All of it are the lessons that are available through grief. And that to me, is what I'm holding onto and knowing some days I can say those things to you, and some days I will be a hot mess, crying. And I'm crying because I loved. The gift is that I got to experience an amazing brother. The gift is that he's forever in my heart. And the gift is that he is always available for me whenever I need him.
- [52:45]
Reshma Sajani
And he's with God, cheering you on every single day.
- [52:48]
Tashunda Brown Duckett
He is too easy. That's what he would always say. Like, jay, can you go check in paint? Mom's too easy. Too easy. So, you know, that's the thing. He was just like, whatever I would ask him to do, he would just go, too easy. Sis, I got you. And he still has me. But grief. And I will tell you, at work, sometimes when we're going through something, we try to keep it all together and show up at work as if nothing happened. The reality is, it's like back in the day, there was a saying. My mom would say, your slip is showing meaning. You think you have it all together, but the slip is just trailing this cute outfit. And so with grief, or when you're dealing with family and issues, trying to keep it all together. Because you know, I don't want anyone to think I'm weak. Your slip is showing anyway. Everyone knows something is wrong and so what I have chosen to do is even with my board, while I was in the height of the grief and I had a board meeting when I came back I said to them, I don't know how I'm going to respond. I might break down and cry. It is not the feedback you're giving me, it's this grief. But I shared it. Do you know so many people came back, the number of people that added their beneficiary went up. And so my point is when your life is lifing, there's also space for a testimony. There's space to remind people I am human. That to me is another lesson that I've learned through grief.
- [54:09]
Reshma Sajani
Such a powerful lesson to share because I think a lot of us don't do that. Right? We try to like again, let the show.
- [54:16]
Tashunda Brown Duckett
It's showing.
- [54:17]
Reshma Sajani
Yep.
- [54:17]
Tashunda Brown Duckett
You walking around being all proper looking cute, slip showing. Everyone is seeing your mess.
- [54:24]
Reshma Sajani
This conversation was like everything and more. Thank you, thank you, thank you so much for your honesty, your vulnerability and your wisdom.
- [54:34]
Tashunda Brown Duckett
This was such a pleasure. Thank you so much for reminding me that I am living my best life, scars and all. So wonderful. Thank you, thank you, thank you.
- [54:56]
Reshma Sajani
Tashunda Brown Duckett is the President and CEO of tiaa. One last thing, thank you so much for listening to my so called Midlife. If you haven't yet, now's a great time to subscribe to Lemonada Premium. You'll get bonus content like Dr. Mary Claire Havertz talking about resistance training and walking with a weighted vest. Just hit the subscribe button on Apple Podcasts or for all the other podcast apps, head to lemonadapremium.com to subscribe. That's lemonadapremium.com thanks and we'll be back next week. I'm your host Reshma Sajani. Our associate producer is Isara Acevez and our senior producer is Chrissy Pease. This this series is sound designed by Ivan Kurayev. Ivan also composed our theme music and performed it with Ryan Jewell and Karen Waltok. Our VP of New content is Rachel Neal. Special thanks to our development team, Oha Lopez, Jamila Zara Williams and Alex McGowan. Executive producers include me, Reshma Sajani, Stephanie Whittles Wax and Jessica Cordova Kramer. Series consulting and production support from Katie Cordova. Help others find our show by leaving a rating and writing a review and let us know how you're doing in Midlife. You can Submit your story to be included in this show@speakpipe.com midlife follow my so called Midlife wherever you get your podcast or listen Ad free on Amazon Music with your prime membership. Thanks so much for listening. See you next week. Bye.
- [56:39]
Tashunda Brown Duckett
Want more from your favorite Lemonada Media podcast? While supporting the shows that help make life suck less, subscribe to Lemonada Premium today. As a subscriber, you'll unlock exclusive bonus content like never before heard interviews, behind the scenes moments, bonus episodes, and so much more. It's easy to sign up no matter what podcast app you use on Apple. You can just click the Lemonada logo in the Apple Podcast app and hit subscribe. For all other podcast apps, head to Lemonada supportingcast FM to subscribe. That's Lemonada supportingcast fm.
- [57:16]
Reshma Sajani
Why hello there. This is your pal Sarah Silverman. You know, the standup comic that's not afraid of a diarrhea joke. Oh my God, I'm so brave. I hope you're enjoying this podcast that you're Listen, I am just dropping in here to let you know about another podcast I think you'd like and it's called the Sarah Silverman Podcast. Each week listeners from all over the world call in and they ask me for advice or they talk about something going on in their life. Anything. Their silliest, grossest, deepest, darkest situations. And then I respond, whether I'm qualified to or not.
- [57:47]
Tashunda Brown Duckett
Go ahead.
- [57:48]
Reshma Sajani
Search for the Sarah Silverman Podcast wherever you get your podcasts. Bye.