MTGM EXTRA! "A third person..."

Summary

---

Podcast Summary: My Therapist Ghosted Me - MTGM EXTRA! "A third person..."

Hosts: Vogue Williams, Joanne McNally
Guest: Joe Atwell
Release Date: December 17, 2025

---

Episode Overview

This bonus episode serves up the trademark blend of raw honesty, irreverent humour, and candid conversation that Vogue and Joanne's listeners adore. Ranging from crime scene clean-up hypotheticals and pop culture gossip, to the realities of sex, relationships, and communication, the hosts tackle everything from tabloids to deeply personal listener dilemmas. The centrepiece discussion revolves around a listener email about opening a relationship to a third person, sparking a lively and insightful exchange about desires, boundaries, and what "normal" means in long-term partnerships.

---

Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Crime Scene Clean-ups & Disgusting Jobs

[00:20–02:18]

• The trio starts with a darkly funny debate about which job would be less awful: cleaning up after crime scenes (Bonnie Blue) or reality TV jungle camp messes (think: animal guts, cockroaches).
• Joanne: “As a woman, I’ve done that already... I put my time in.” ([01:39])
• Banter about horror stories, Instagram crime fascination, and connections to their real lives (“I spent a week in Ibiza. I’ve lived!” – Joanne, 01:54).

2. Pop Culture Gossip: Puff Daddy & 50 Cent

[02:33–06:14]

• Joanne shares revelations from a documentary about Puff Daddy (Diddy), alleging violent behaviour and bizarre stories about collecting semen.
• Joanne: “Apparently he killed Biggie on Tupac, which I did not know.” ([02:51])
• Discussion shifts to contradictions in 50 Cent’s persona and hypocrisy in celeb “revenge” levels.
• Vogue: “If there was a holding a grudge level zero to 50 Cent, I’d be up there with 50.” ([05:36])

3. Books and ChatGPT Observations

[06:14–09:00]

• Book recommendations:
  • Vogue starts “Slags” and loves the cover and vibe.
  • Joanne’s currently reading Kathy Burke’s book.
• They joke about digital signatures and how easy it is to accidentally sign things nowadays.
• Casual digression into ChatGPT: noticing stilted, formulaic language in people’s texts and captions now.
• Joanne: “You're kind of taking the thought process out of a lot of kind of human responses... they're just basically two ChatGBTs talking to each other.” ([08:34])

4. The Lost “Art of Conversation”

[09:00–11:06]

• Vogue and Joanne lament the decline of real-life small talk, especially among younger people.
• Parallels drawn to being skilled, curious conversationalists. They vent about people who never ask questions or deflect by turning all conversation back on the host.
• Joanne: “I was like, oh my god, I’m literally down to asking you about your menstrual cycle and you haven’t asked me a single question about [myself].” ([09:35])

5. Home Security Paranoia and Ghost Chat

[11:09–14:07]

• The group jokes about being afraid to open the door late at night, referencing horror movies (“This is so Scream-coded!” – Joanne, 11:30).
• Vogue: “I’m more scared of the ghosts anyway than the real people.” ([12:46])
• Joanne recounts scary movie scenes involving braces, triggering childhood memories and orthodontic trauma.

6. Family Nostalgia & Irish Childhoods

[14:16–15:43]

• Anecdotes about growing up with stepdad Neil, strict house rules, and stories about family quirks (from head braces to being a “tight ship” runner).
• Joanne: “No child deserves a head brace ’cause they’re sucking their thumb!” ([14:42])

---

Listener Dilemma: “A Third Person...”

[16:07–20:07]

7. The Dilemma:

• Listener writes in after drunkenly confessing to her boyfriend she might like a threesome. He’s keen—on bringing in another woman. She’d pictured another man. Now, things are at a standstill.

8. Honest Reaction:

• Vogue: “I could possibly accept another man in the room…I couldn’t accept another woman.” ([17:13])
• Joanne (joking): “I’d take another woman just for the chats!” ([17:21])
• Jokes about how a “third” could end up becoming an ally against the boyfriend (“Just be sitting there drinking cosmos with her in the kitchen while he’s pulling himself off in the bedroom!” – Joanne, 17:40).
• Concern about what it means for their sex life and relationship—does talking about a threesome mean it’s unfulfilling, or just idle curiosity?

9. Key Insights:

• Joanne: “Relationships are just this huge, giant compromise, aren’t they?...I don’t think it’s a case that they’re both going to go off and start sleeping around on each other. They had a conversation… Fine, let’s park it.” ([19:17])
• Vogue and Joanne both discuss how people may raise “exciting” suggestions in drunken honesty—but it doesn’t always reflect real-life interests or intentions.
• The classic phrase “in vino veritas” is (mis)quoted: “There’s truth us in winness—except it’s in Latin. I just made it English there.” (Joanne, 18:25–18:47).

---

Sex in Long-term Relationships

[20:07–23:34]

10. How Often is “Normal”?

• The hosts discuss societal myths about frequency, referencing sex therapist Dr. Karen Gurney.
• Joanne: “There’s this myth that the usual number is three times a week… She [Gurney] said you’re better off having quality over quantity.” ([21:26])
• Anyone-else’s-sex-life anxiety is common; many people are curious but uncomfortable discussing real numbers.
• Joanne (paraphrasing Dr. Gurney): “Sex is the one thing—the less you have, the longer you go without it, the less you care.” ([22:03])
• Vogue agrees: “Having been away for three weeks, I didn’t really think about it… in the jungle at all.” ([22:30])

11. Consent, Obligation & Desire

• The hosts make clear there’s “nothing worse than feeling like you’re obliged to have sex with someone.” (Joanne, 23:22)
• Joanne: “There’s nothing worse. They’re like, ‘I hate you now too much!’”
• They humorously suggest a third person is just for “taking the afternoon shift” when a partner can’t be bothered.

---

Memorable Quotes & Moments

• “As a woman, I’ve done that already…Who cares really, to that extent?” – Joanne, [01:39]
• “If there was a holding a grudge level zero to 50 Cent, I’d be up there with 50.” – Vogue, [05:36]
• “You're kind of taking the thought process out of…human responses…they’re just basically two ChatGBTs talking to each other.” – Joanne, [08:34]
• “I’m literally down to asking you about your menstrual cycle and you haven’t asked me a single question about [myself].” – Joanne, [09:35]
• “I’m more scared of the ghosts anyway than the real people.” – Vogue, [12:46]
• “No child deserves a head brace ’cause they’re sucking their thumb!” – Joanne, [14:42]
• “I’d take another woman just for the chats!” – Joanne, [17:21]
• “There’s truth us in winness—except it’s in Latin. I just made it English there.” – Joanne, [18:25]

---

Additional Notes

• Light digressions about podcast funding models, Wikipedia guilt trips, and Joanne’s casual approach to signing documents digitally.
• Casual ribbing, nostalgic Irish references, and a running thread about anxiety (both real and supernatural!) provide the signature warmth and relatability.

---

Timestamps for Key Segments

• [00:20] – Cleaning up crime scenes and gross jobs
• [02:33] – Puff Daddy, 50 Cent, and music industry scandals
• [06:14] – Book chat and digital signatures
• [08:34] – ChatGPT’s influence on modern conversation
• [09:00] – Decline of conversation skills in younger generations
• [11:09] – Home security paranoia and ghost stories
• [14:16] – Irish family stories and orthodontic trauma
• [16:07] – Listener dilemma: inviting a third person into the relationship
• [20:07] – How much sex is “normal” in long-term relationships?
• [21:26] – Dr. Karen Gurney on sex myths and quality over quantity

---

Tone & Takeaway

Playful, vulnerable, and mischievous, this episode is a perfect showcase of why “My Therapist Ghosted Me” is so popular. Vogue and Joanne deftly navigate between hilariously crass jokes and surprisingly wise observations about relationships and intimacy—always delivered with unfiltered candour that makes even taboo topics feel brilliantly relatable.

---

Transcript

[A]

This is a Global Player original podcast. Hello everybody and welcome to the bonus episode of My therapist Ghosted Me with me, Vogue Williams, Juan McNally and Joe Atwell.

[B]

Talking to Red Richardson about it and she's like tagging someone guy and she's like, couldn't do it without this guy. He cleans up all the scenes and your mom's like, hi. Like, it's just so weird.

[A]

Like the one. Well, we're just having a quick chat about Bonnie Blue, which is how we start all our podcast with Joanne.

[B]

I find the whole thing interesting.

[A]

You know, which job would you prefer? Cleaning up the scenes of Bonnie Blue or there are people that clean up the scenes on the jungle when we are trolling through fish guts and awful and loads of like SM old meat and all the other stuff like cockroaches.

[B]

And stuff like that.

[A]

I think I'd prefer V. Lou.

[B]

Well, it would obviously depend on the fee, on the regularity of the would. If.

[A]

If it's same fee, everything is the same. Everything would be the same. It would take the same amount of time, same fee, every.

[B]

She's getting annoyed. She's getting annoyed when you don't play the game. She's like, no, no, same fee.

[A]

Stop looking into it. Yeah, yeah, we're thinking it.

[B]

Just say something.

[C]

Is it just the once or is it every day?

[A]

Guys, it's a fun. It's a full time job. Okay, how a full time job of normal hours that people do nine to five.

[B]

I'd rather. I'd rather clean up the Bonnie Blue crime scenes because. Yeah, I mean, let's face it, as a woman, I've done that already, so.

[A]

Who cares really, that to that extent?

[B]

Ah, yeah, I've lived. I went to university.

[A]

I haven't lived enough, obviously.

[B]

Spent a week in Ibiza. I've lived. I put my time in. And also I'm quite. I think I have the ability to do it because I follow a lot of like, crimes. Well, one main crime scene Instagram account.

[A]

So you think you'd be good at cleaning? Well, do you know what? I'm. I'm considering getting pregnant again. So maybe the only blue job would be right up my street.

[B]

Well, if you want me to gather some of it for you, I can, if that's what you're asking.

[A]

Your kindness knows no bounds, John McNally.

[B]

We'll get you knocked up. Whether it's Spencer or someone else, we'll do it.

[A]

We'll do it.

[B]

If it's me sweeping out Bonnie Blue's bedrooms, that's fine. By the way, just before, if we're talking about mouse seam. And did you, Jo, have you watched the show on the Puff Daddy? The Puff.

[A]

The puff reckoning, the 50 Cent thing? I haven't watched it yet. Is it amazing?

[C]

Is it disturbing?

[B]

Well, firstly, apparently he killed Biggie on Tupac, which I did not know. Now I wasn't. It's not like, you know, hip hop's not my. It's not exactly my sound like my celeb, my celebrity mastermind specialist topic. But I do not know. But anyway, there was a sex worker in it who was hired for years to ride year one that he was going out with three years. The girl that he was very violent with name Cassie.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And the guy, the sex worker was like, they used to collect my semen. And he said for now this was going on years. And eventually, just as folk takes a big gulp for milk.

[A]

There one from a. I'm treating myself badly timed, unhomogenized.

[B]

Look at you, you mad? Listen, you have seen a podcast.

[A]

At 8 o' clock at night, I'm in my bedtime routine.

[C]

She's having it straight from the other. Because it's bedtime.

[B]

Yeah, worms be damned. Like your man Daniel Watson's face. Do you remember someone? Remember that story we read out that someone said they saw him hung over, he woke up, woke up in a field after a heavy night and he was so hung out, you know that hangover thirst, that he sucked the milk straight out of a utter. I heard a rumor you want to.

[A]

Drink the water from an iron. And I thought I'd probably do that.

[B]

Oh, when the hangover curse kicks in, you'd be soaking it from the faucet of a train. You don't care.

[A]

I'd be drinking it from the toilet, so I wouldn't give you shite.

[B]

But anyway, your man, they were collecting a semen and one day he said, he just was like, I know you've. I know you've paid your. Paid the fee and it's not really up to me what you do with the semen, but can I ask what.

[A]

You do with it? And.

[B]

And hopefully got puffy, got very defensive and he's like, we do what we want. We like to play with it and drink it and we do what we want with it. Yeah, no. And then he said after he asked, they never collected it again. Now isn't that one of the strangest things you've ever heard?

[A]

I find, I find the whole thing strange, but I also find 50 Shant 50 Cent going on about how much he despises Puff Daddy, and he's like this sexual predator and this awful person, but he went to Conor McGregor's publisher after all the allegations happen, and I'm like, which side are you on, pal? You are interesting.

[B]

Listen, I didn't know.

[A]

And I used to love 50 Cent, and then I saw him do that and I thought, oh, I don't love you anymore. I wouldn't even go to your concert now.

[B]

Oh, no. So when I read the other day, it was like, what are your revenge levels from the scale of zero to 50 cents? Maybe. Laughs.

[A]

There's.

[B]

What are your petty last pettiness levels on a scale of 0 to 50 cents?

[A]

If there was a. If there was a holding a grudge level one, a zero to 50 cent, I'd be up there with 50.

[B]

Yeah. It's just the way he just keeps grinning. I just. I. He's just grinning just so.

[A]

He loves every single second of it.

[B]

He is the cat who got all the cream. And they're like, what do you think Sean would think about this series? He goes, I think you'd think it was the greatest thing he's ever seen.

[A]

I haven't watched it. Is it out yet? I actually haven't watched.

[B]

Yeah, it's out. It's out and about living its life.

[A]

Oh, my God.

[B]

It is very good. It's very. It's really good. It's like, it's. You know, he was proper. He's a proper baddie.

[A]

Oh, yeah, of course he is. I actually. I just started a new book and I'm always going on about books, but I did just start a new book, so now I'm not reading anything. And it is the coolest front cover and the coolest name of a book. It's called Slags.

[B]

Oh, yeah, I know.

[A]

Oh, I just love the COVID and everything like that. I'm like, that's just so perfect.

[B]

The color, a great name.

[A]

Yeah, it's really, really good. So I've just started reading that, and it's pretty good for anyone who's looking for a Christmas gift. Give. Give a slag. Slags.

[B]

Give a slug. Give it gift. Gift yourself a slag for Christmas. I'm reading Kathy Burke's book now.

[A]

You're reading that last week.

[B]

Oh, was I? Jesus. I'm sorry. Sorry. I'm so sorry. Always Sarah Jessica Parker. 60 bucks a day for the Pulitzer.

[A]

Calm down, John. I want to be Richard and Judy, and you're just not playing ball. Take that back. Sorry, Kathy. Okay, Sorry.

[B]

Oops. Sorry. Well, I'm also writing a book in my defense.

[A]

Don't bring that up again.

[B]

Just that. Is that okay? I'm making art folk. Oh, fair.

[A]

I just can't wait to read it. It will happen. I know it will happen.

[B]

I know it will. It'll. Legally. It has to anyway.

[A]

Legal mumbo jumbo.

[B]

I haven't signed anything. They're like, you signed loads of.

[A]

Oh, did I?

[B]

Okay. This is the problem with digital signatures. It feels like it's nothing. It's like Apple Pay. You signed everything. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[A]

Who's checking this? I'm doing my management. I'm like, who's that person? Am I meant to sign this? And they're like, yes, you can sign that one or no, we don't know who that is. I was like, well, I nearly signed that. Whatever that was. What? Well, I get. I get loads of things. I'll sign this for, like, release forms and stuff for TV and that.

[B]

Like, I'm just like, oh, I'd sign anything.

[A]

I know. We shouldn't really say that. We wouldn't sign anything. We get our lawyers to check over.

[B]

Sorry.

[A]

It's what we do.

[B]

I'm like, chat gbt. What's this?

[A]

My favorite thing about Chat gbt, and I know everyone uses it for different things, is when I notice that people have used it for a caption or for a response to a text and I'm like, oh, that's my favorite.

[B]

Yeah. Because they don't take the dashes out. It's saying that it's a proper problem because you're kind of taking the thought process out of a lot of kind of human responses and stuff. Like, we're a bit older. The tooth now. We're. We will use it, I'm sure, and we should use it because it's not going anywhere. But they're saying that like the kind of. The couple of generations behind where we were forced to make contact, small talk ourselves, that they're really. They're just. They're just basically two chachi.

[A]

Beats talking to each other. I have met somebody recently and they are younger than me. And I thought to myself, you sound.

[B]

Surprised that anyone's younger than you.

[A]

Do they look younger than me? But. But they just didn't ask any questions. Like, just had. And not just to me, to other people. And I thought, I wouldn't want to sit beside you at a dinner party because, you know when people are not that. And it's like you just have no interest in anybody else. And it's actually. It's not endearing in the slightest. I'm not going to try and prize you open like a locked chest, like, give me something here, pal.

[B]

Yeah, I know. It's called the art of conversation. It's supposed to go two ways. Although I don't know if that's a generational thing. I have been in the company of people where. And I'm not. I don't think I'm a greedy conversationalist. Like, I'm happy to contribute and talk about myself, but I'm also curious and I like asking other people and. But I was. I had a similar situation recently. I was like, oh my God, I'm literally down to asking you about your menstrual cycle and you haven't asked me.

[A]

A single question about.

[B]

I know, it's crazy.

[A]

It takes a while before you pick it up. And then you're like, hang on a second. But then there are those people who don't. Who, who flip the conversation on you the whole time because they just don't want to talk about themselves at all. And it's like, okay, come on now.

[B]

Because I find conversation tiring as well. You know, like you're, you know, are you tired now? I talk for a living.

[A]

That's.

[B]

So I'm happy to take the. Take the, like, put. Take the foot off the gas in the evening times when I'm happening with friends and like Grace, you tell me about your.

[A]

Yeah. To have a. Relax. And I also think that people think our lives are more interesting than are. And so they're like, oh my God, tell me about that. And I'm like, well, like, tell me about that TV show. I'm like, well, it's a lot of. It's a lot of hurry up and wait is. Is what? Yeah, yeah. I would describe tv quick. We're late. We're late. And then you're like, oh, why am I sitting here for three hours? I know.

[B]

Yeah, I. My thing is that I find some friends. They're like, well, I wouldn't ask cuz you're so busy. I'm like, I'm not that. Like, yeah, I'm busy, but I'm busy and I'm on my own a lot. I still want my friends to, you know, check in, invite me to things.

[A]

Yeah. So you can politely. Oh my God.

[B]

No, no.

[A]

I go, it's a door ring. Is it weird that I'm too scared to answer it at 20 past 8?

[B]

Do you not have a Google doorbell?

[A]

No, I'd have a drone.

[B]

Like, what you should have to cure.

[A]

I'm not answering that. I'm too scared. It's not weird to be scared. Spenny's away tonight. I'm not answering that. God knows who it could be.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

If I don't come back in two minutes, you know, I'm dead.

[B]

Oh my God, this is so scream coded.

[A]

I love it.

[B]

Don't run upstairs. There's no way out.

[C]

Yeah, they always run upstairs.

[B]

Yeah. Don't lie to me.

[A]

Do you know I don't feel comfortable. I'm not doing it. I've decided. I'm sorry, I'm not. It's 20 past 8 at night. There's no way I. When I was growing up with Neil, if anyone rang our phone after 9 o' clock at night, they were getting it in the neck and I'd be there and I could hear it and I'm like, actually. And I'm like, oh no, Ashley's going down tonight. Yeah.

[B]

Poor Neil. He ran a very tight ship. My God. Well, I keep a giant kitchen knife, a Tria's Transformation kitchen knife by the door in case any delivery drivers get a little fresh. I'll stop them. Yeah.

[A]

Last week coming. Last week we were coming, talking about them coming in with a flaccid penis and now we're talking.

[B]

Were we talking about that?

[C]

I can verify.

[B]

What can I say? I'm hot and cold. Hot and cold. It's up in time.

[A]

Bury on and off.

[C]

John, Any poor delivery driver who heard last week's podcast and thought, well, you know, it could, could be on. Yeah, stabbed in the face.

[B]

Yeah. I wouldn't, I wouldn't go in the face in case there was a breakdown in communication. There's often no which barrier. But if they were maybe just trying to use the bathroom or something like that and, but I would stab them right in the chest.

[A]

I'm more scared of the ghosts anyway than the real people. So that's a real concern of mine. It's only because I, I, I've been shown these things on Instagram now, you know when your algorithm. And it's like, look at what was behind her. And I'm like waiting for it.

[B]

I won't do that.

[A]

Obviously. I think you're for that business.

[B]

I think it's, I think it's cute to be spooked, but I'm definitely more fearful of real things.

[A]

Yeah, I know I should be. You know, I'm nice.

[B]

No, you're not.

[C]

I feel like a ghost doesn't need to ring your doorbell. That's not, that's not A thing ghosts need to do.

[A]

So you obviously are the things I'm watching on Instagram. You don't have to buzz them up. Yeah.

[B]

Why did I buzz that spirit in? I should have known.

[A]

Excuse me, are we forgetting poltergeists that have to be invited and. And sorry, what are they called? Demons. Demons must be invited.

[B]

One of the scariest scenes ever was poltergeist when your one's braces attacked her. Do you remember this, Joe? You're probably a bit young. I've not seen her braces like came out all over like. And it's every teenager's nightmare because like it was the. You know, braces are a little. Well ching ching. Remember the bank of Ireland dad brace our ching ching. No, it doesn't work. Anyway, so her braces came out and like covered herself and locked her all in this like metal. It was awful. It was horrific. It stuck out my mind for a very, very long time.

[A]

I used to have braces. But. Did you ever know me when I had a big gap in my front teeth?

[B]

No, I don't think so.

[A]

Rage and I ever got rid of it. My mom told me not to get rid of it. But I actually had to get the thing that attaches your lift to your gum. You know that bit of sk. I had to get half that removed so that my. My teeth would close. Yeah, Amber had a head brace and everything. Cuz she used to suck her thumb. So she was like. Honestly, she was knocking people out with those teeth before Neil stepped in and got the old head brace. Couldn't afford it before.

[B]

Sorry. Now I. I've heard enough. You know what? I'm going to say it. I'm ringing Tuzla. Tuzla is the Irish social services. No child deserves a head brace cuz they're sucking their thumb. There is no sense to that.

[A]

Do you know what the. The difference in Neil is? I went to Te's school because obviously they reminding Tea and Gigi for a while and all the like. Oh my God. Met your stepdad. The nicest man. And not just off one person. My mom was like, did anyone say anything about me? I was like, I'm sorry mom. They were just all talking about Neil and I was like, you didn't grow up with him. He didn't used to be this man. He's turned. He's changed into the. Sorry.

[B]

A head brace. That's like a scene out of misery. You're one clubbing your man's feet in. Why would you need a head? I stuck my thumb Is Neil gonna put me in a head brace?

[A]

John, if he gets his hands on you, yes, I think he will.

[B]

Well, tell him I'll stab him with the knife that I have at the door with the delivery drivers. He comes anywhere near me was better.

[A]

Than the alternative for me, actually.

[B]

A head brace.

[A]

Meet Mommy. Joanne. No.

[B]

Should we go around like that?

[C]

Horror.

[B]

Remember Jigsaw? Remember the little guy in the. In the little tricycle cycling around.

[A]

Oh, please. Alads. We have to stop with it. And then this chat. Come on, this. I'm a bit frightened. I'm here on my own. I already told you that now.

[B]

Terrifying.

[A]

Oh, God. You know, I'm just about to open the email. Okay. Threes Company.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Dear Vogue and Joanne, please, for the love of God, don't say my name on the podcast. Is this your mother?

[B]

Helen. Hiya.

[A]

This sounds like that.

[B]

God. What's. What?

[A]

I got drunk. Oh, no, it doesn't. Actually. I got drunk with my boyfriend recently and we had a really nice night. We had fun, we were silly and we were honest with each other about our sex life. We have great sex. Oh. But I confess to my boyfriend that I feel for opening the relationship to a third person in the bedroom.

[B]

A bit of spice in the drawer.

[A]

Okay, go on, play. To you. It was a gamble because I didn't know what he'd say. To my surprise, he said that he'd be up for it.

[B]

Is this a strike? Sorry? Is this a strike up a man woman? Yeah, I think so. Okay.

[A]

We had sex and went to sleep. Great. The next morning, he brought it up again and was clearly keen, but we hit a snag. He said he'd only wanted to be another woman, and of course, that I'd only pictured it being another man. We went back and forth, but basically just dropped the subject. So now what?

[B]

I thought, there's an affair coming.

[A]

I could possibly accept another man in the room. I couldn't. I couldn't accept another woman. But I wouldn't be a hundred percent against another man in the room.

[B]

I take another woman just for the chats.

[A]

Yeah, you see that? That's what would happen. You'd end up having drinks this ages, huh? I wouldn't bother with him if I was.

[B]

Yeah, yeah. Run now, honey, run.

[A]

Can I come with you? You'll be back in your bag. What would you put in there? The delf and stuff again?

[B]

I'd be just. I'd just be sitting there drinking cosmos with her in the kitchen, holding hands there while he's pulling himself off in the bedroom.

[A]

I am worried if we do nothing about it, that we're basically admitting that we are unfulfilled sexually. To be honest, I'm not that bothered in the cold light of day, but I'm worried now. I know what he wants and I don't think it's something I can give him. How do we fix it? I wish I had said nothing now. I don't think that, that like he could be thinking the same as you. And it's also just like drunk chat. Like, oh, like, wouldn't that be interesting to do? And, and then you might wake up the next day and you both have completely different ideas of what you want. Like, fair, fair enough to him as well. He obviously doesn't want to be wanking off another boy. And that's fine.

[B]

You know the Latin saying, there's truth us in winness. Except it's in Latin. I just made it English there.

[C]

I'll do a little Google.

[B]

Do a little Google there, Joe. Something, something.

[A]

I'm reading a poetry book. That was really beautiful. Thank you.

[B]

I can't take credit for it. It's an old saying.

[A]

I. Of course there. When the truth comes out when you're drunk.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

There is vino veritas.

[B]

Exactly. That's what I said, Joe.

[A]

Yeah, that does sound better.

[B]

And in that. And that is the truth.

[A]

But at the same time, Joe, don't let her privately text you off this pod to take out the first bit that she says.

[B]

Back.

[A]

And I'm like, what the hell? He cut out all the other. She said.

[B]

Let'S keep things clear and highbrow.

[C]

Yeah, I said that on the first take.

[B]

Yeah, I said that on the first take. But also, at the end of the day, relationships are just this huge, giant compromise, aren't they? So you've both decided, okay, we can't really have to agree to disagree on this one. We can't come to a solution. So I don't think it's a case that they're both going to go off and start sleeping around on each other. I think they, they had a conversation. They. They realized, oh, we're interested in the concept but not the details. Fine, let's park it. But also, I would say, I would think that she. I think it's more. There's more chance that she will come around to another woman than him coming around to another man. I would think I could be wrong. But you know what, you know what straight lads are like when they're. Most of them are gay anyway, but they're so they're very concerned that will the mask.

[A]

Listen, if you get another bloke in there, you might. You might be the one that's getting ditched and they won't be drinking wine.

[B]

I genuinely think that that is a concern for a lot of men.

[A]

You know what I find exciting about this conversation? Like, Spenny and I are obviously in a monogamous relationship, but who knows, 20 years down the line, just smash everywhere with the excitement. Twenty years down the line.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You never know what you would, like, turn into now. In fairness, I probably would highly doubt that. But like, it's exciting to think. I think, my God, you never know.

[B]

I think most people accept now that in long term relationships, sex, you know, changes shifts, potentially dwindles, maybe comes back around, whatever it is.

[A]

You know what I always find interesting? I wonder how much sex people you're having a week in relationships. Like in long term relationships, how much sex are you having a week? Because I think that's such a triggering conversation for some people. I don't really like to say what I'm having, but it is an interesting question. So, Joe, how much sex are you having a week?

[C]

I could honestly. You telegraphed it from five miles back.

[B]

Yeah. There was that last discretion. We could see that coming a mile off. There's A doctor called Dr. Karen Gurney, who I am a fan of and she talks about.

[A]

She's basically doing yolks.

[B]

The sex doctor.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

She studied the last art of burning. Yeah. She travels around with the Prodigy exclusively now.

[A]

Doing TED Talk. Oh, God, yeah.

[B]

In how to Pass it off as a Stroke for Less Drama. She. She talks about. And I was only watching a. She did a really good podcast episode recently. I was watching, actually watch the whole thing on YouTube and she talks about this and the myth that is that there's this myth that you're supposed to be having the usual number is three times a week. That that's kind of what's normal. She's like, nothing's normal. Everything's normal. It's all to play for. It's like some couples have sex twice a year and it's mind blowing. She said you're better off having. It's quality over quantity. For when it comes to kind of intimacy and connection and all that jazz, that you could be having sex five times a week with your husband, but the chances are you're not like, I.

[A]

Don'T know, I'm just.

[B]

I'm just spouting when she was spouting that you're not. It's not necessarily Good sex. She's like, you're better off having regular or irregular and better sex. She also said. Which I found interesting as a single person. She was like, they call it sex drive. Which. She's like, it's. It's actually not a fair description of it. She's like, sex is the one thing the less you have, the longer you go without it, the less you care. So it's different. If you're, like, hungry or thirsty, you'll seek out food and you'll seek out water. Sex, you won't.

[A]

Yeah, I would actually agree with that. Having been away for three weeks, I. I didn't really think about it.

[B]

No.

[A]

In the jungle at all because it just wasn't for me. But one of our friends is convinced that I just have sex all the time. Like, he sent me this voice notes right away. He was like, oh, how many times have you done it? He's like, if there's one thing I know about you is that you've never had enough. I'm like, I think you've got the idea of him here.

[B]

So who's sending you that?

[A]

Who do you think?

[B]

Neil? That man needs to mind his own business. But I would recommend Karen Gurney.

[A]

It's.

[B]

It's. She's really, really interesting. She's. She's obviously like, you know, she knows.

[A]

What she's talking about.

[B]

And. Yeah, it was like a very kind of realistic take on sex and kind of the ebbs and flows and. Yeah.

[A]

Yeah. Well, I think. I do think that you're right. I think it's just very different for. For very different people. And people have different needs about how much they want it.

[B]

And then there's nothing worse than feeling like you're obliged to have sex with someone. And you're like, there's nothing worse. They're like, I. I hate you now too much.

[A]

Fine, I'll do it. But I'm not happy about it.

[B]

Yeah, you're like, I'm not happy about it. And they're like, I don't care. You're like, yeah, wow. Thank you. Thanks a million. Nice to know my desire matters, you know? They're like, I don't care. That's a lot of luck. I don't. I don't care.

[A]

Just. I'll still do it, but I won't even like it. I'll still do it.

[B]

We're not even talking at the moment. We're in the middle of a massive fight. It's like, I don't care.

[A]

Yeah, okay, fine.

[B]

That's why it's useful to get a third in because you're like, look, I'm not speaking to you. But she'll.

[A]

She'll do it.

[B]

She'll take the afternoon shift.

[A]

She's fallen out too.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's true.

[C]

Actually.

[B]

That's it for the bonus. Thanks for listening. And I do think we should put more time. Like Stephen Bartlett does every week, he goes on the podcast and asks them to support him and that. It makes the podcast better. And we don't do anything like that.

[C]

You do. You say.

[A]

We actually do. You do it sometimes.

[C]

You say we should do this and then you never do it again.

[B]

I love the way Stephen. Steve brought us, like, wicked Wikipedia. Does Wikipedia message you every now and again? They're like, please, we've no money. That's kind of what Steve Bartlett's like. It's like, steve, I think you have a couple of quid.

[A]

Oh, he's. He's making some money in the potting game. Wikipedia, it does do that, actually. You're dead right. I'll tell you what, if you change my picture. If you change my picture, I'll consider it.

[B]

Oh, yeah, Fair.

[A]

Fair.

[B]

Yeah. I. I set up a direct ad because I do feel it is important. I'm an angel.

[A]

This has been a global player original production.