Naked Beauty Live: The Morning After the Met with Recho Omondi, Sir John, Coree Moreno, and More

Summary

Naked Beauty Live: The Morning After the Met – Episode Summary

Podcast: Naked Beauty
Host: Brooke DeVard
Date: May 11, 2026
Theme: An unfiltered, live post-Met Gala conversation with top beauty creatives, stylists, and cultural voices, unpacking Met looks, behind-the-scenes realities, industry pressures, the changing nature of celebrity spectacle, and the importance of authenticity in artistry and self-expression.

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Overview

This special live episode brings together an impressive panel from the beauty, fashion, and cultural landscape to debrief on the Met Gala. Through candid, joyful, and honest exchanges, Brooke DeVard leads conversations on the creative process behind legendary looks, the emotional and logistical chaos of the event, critiques of the changing nature of the Met, and reflections on the intersection of identity, ambition, and personal branding in the age of social media.

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Segment 1: The Making of the Look – With Corey Moreno & Sir John ([00:08]-[20:00])

Hair Genius: Corey Moreno on Crafting Chase Infinity’s Met Look

• Corey's Client List: La Roach, Jodie Turner Smith, Lil Nas X, Teyana Taylor, Zendaya, and Met first-timer Chase Infinity.
• Approach & Intent:
  • Corey's vision balances celebrating his client's unique cultural identity with fashion innovation:
    • “It’s always important for me to put [Chase] first and take her culture into consideration… not push her in any direction that doesn’t feel authentic.” ([02:41] Corey)
  • Met focus: infusing brightness with a “blonde moment” for contrast and elevation, while embracing natural texture: “A little bit of frizz and texture is okay on the red carpet because that's what our hair naturally does.” ([03:30] Brooke).
• Hair Health:
  • All color came from Bellamy extensions, not from dyeing Chase’s own hair.
    • “I’m not going to color your hair for one night… Achieve this look in the most healthy way.” ([04:48] Corey)
• Prep & Teamwork:
  • Met looks are weeks in the making; stylists (Wayman and Micah) and makeup artist Amber collaborate for holistic vision.
• Realities of Event Day:
  • No test runs: "We get those four hours, and like, it better eat. Like, we don’t get a chance to try it out.” ([06:17] Corey)
• Nerve-wracking Wait:
  • Refreshing Getty Images, worrying about humidity and unpredictability.
• Industry Pressures:
  • Strives for harmony with client and major fashion houses: “Are [the brands] satisfied with my depiction of a black woman in their garments? … At the end, my client is put first.” ([06:33] Corey)
• Energy & Wellness:
  • Corey's holistic approach to navigating the pressure: “You are an energy destination… People are reading your energy.” ([07:02] Brooke)

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Makeup Guru: Sir John Shares Met (and Beyoncé) Lore

• Met Memories:
  • First Met was with Joan Smalls “breaking the Internet with purple lips”; fondest with Beyoncé in the “naked dress” (last-minute ponytail inspired in the car ride over).
• Insider Moment:
  • Beyoncé prepares not in hotels but a private NYC apartment: “It’s her dressing room. All the things.” ([11:27] Sir John)
• Handling Feedback:
  • Social media’s double-edged sword:
    • “If you’re brought up by compliments or likes, you’ll be brought down by criticism.” ([11:41] Sir John)
    • Recalls the “graphic eye” look for Beyoncé getting backlash: “The beehive didn’t like it. They were very firm in their disappointment with me.” ([13:09])
• This Year’s Naomi Osaka Look:
  • Collaboration with movement coach to help Osaka embody the designer’s spirit.
  • Red hands: an artistic touch for visual impact.
  • Industry economics: Dissects Simone Biles’ “$22,000 glam” controversy — most budget goes to styling, not just beauty, and is often offset by brands.
• Creative Value:
  • “I’m not just coming with a brush, I’m creating a lot of value that I know is going to translate really well.” ([16:57] Sir John)

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How Can Fans & Media Support Beauty Artists? (Brooke’s Closing Qs to Corey & Sir John)

• Corey: “Humanize us first… Give me patience and human nature with my clients.” ([18:00] Corey)
• Sir John: Value feedback but stay rooted in culture, not fleeting opinions:
  • “If you don’t like something, please find an artful way to say, ‘this doesn’t work.’ … As long as I’m looking to the culture, I don’t care what any blogs or anybody else has to say.” ([19:17] Sir John)

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Segment 2: The Culture Panel – Darian Harvin, Rachel (Cutting Room Floor), Steven Simeone ([20:33]-[34:42])

Why Does the Met Still Captivate Us? A Dissection of Spectacle & Disillusionment

• Rachel on Culture & Escapism:
  • “It’s harder to believe in fantasy… a lot of the facades… have now broken… there’s a little bit of that magic is gone.”
  • “You can use it as escapism if you need it… but there isn’t the investment there used to be.” ([21:49]-[24:42])
• Sir John: “It doesn’t feel the same… None of us are really like, ‘Oh, my God, I can’t wait to do Met this year.’” ([25:13])
• Darian Harvin: Finds “power” in creative community, connection, and learning, even amid larger cynicism: “If this is an opportunity for me to… talk craft and creativity… That's my power to me.” ([25:37])

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Photo Realities – Steven Simeone

• Pre-Carpet Content: Celebs increasingly prioritize precarpet “controlled” image shoots — sometimes preferred over official carpet shots.
  • “They want their pictures turned around really quickly, sometimes even before the Getty images hit the carpet.” ([27:14])
• Photography Tactics:
  • Lighting and flash matter: using flash is a way to flatter celebs and avoid exposing skin texture.
  • Some photographers “don’t use flash so they can show the texture, and then… those pictures sell.” ([27:48]-[28:07])

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Athletes & Branding – Darian on Sports Stars at the Met

• Celebrates athletes’ unique contributions to the fashion conversation (Serena Williams, Venus Williams, Naomi Osaka) and their overlooked cultural capital.
• “[Serena] is one of the first pop star athletes… Sometimes she nails it, sometimes she doesn’t.” ([28:40])

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Behind the Seats – How the Met Guest List & PR Works ([30:02]-[31:51])

• Rachel clarifies: Designers buy extremely expensive tables, select talent, but final approval is all Anna Wintour.
• Brooke: “If you’re paying $300,000 for a table, you want to… get as much PR coverage as possible.”

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The Met as Brand Platform – Using the Gala for Narrative

• Darian: Using the Met for PR moments (e.g., album announcements, visual Easter eggs) is risky but can be effective — but “far few in between… You could use this as an opportunity to really create something around the theme.” ([32:19]-[33:13])

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Favorite Looks of the Night ([33:21])

• Steven: Emma Chamberlain (“The hair, the makeup, the look, everything was perfection.”)
• Darian: Iseult (“French black girl magic, incredible.”)
• Rachel: Anok (emotional), Lala Anthony, Eileen Gu (“the bubbles dress”), Sabine Getty, Paloma Elsesser.
• Brooke: Paloma’s dress noted for “so much artistry.”

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Segment 3: The Style & Wellness Panel – Ivy Coco & Ashton M ([34:56]-[38:17])

Ivy & Ashton on Styling, Self-Expression, and the Internet’s Impact

• Ashton M: “Social media has throttled ambition, fashion ambition. … People are afraid of people on the internet.” ([36:02])
• Brooke: “People are afraid of criticism… Not as confident as they say they are.” ([36:25])
• Encouragement for Expression:
  • Ivy Coco: “Wear the outfit, don’t let the outfit wear you. … Find your word of affirmation and let that be your best accessory.” ([36:46])
  • Ashton M: “I think a lot of people don’t know who they are… Fashion and identity are like this. … Finding yourself and being committed to who you are, you’ll be better off with fashion if you understand your identity better.” ([37:40])

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Notable Quotes and Memorable Moments

• “[With Met hair], it better eat. Like, we don't get a chance to, like, try it out.” – Corey Moreno ([06:17])
• “If you’re brought up by compliments or likes, you'll be brought down by criticism.” – Sir John ([11:41])
• “It’s harder and harder to care about stuff like this, unless it’s purely…like, for funsies and a little bit of dessert after dinner.” – Rachel ([23:11])
• “They want their pictures turned around really quickly, almost even before the Getty images…” – Steven Simeone ([27:14])
• “Wear the outfit, don’t let the outfit wear you.” – Ivy Coco ([36:46])
• “Fashion and identity are like this. … You’ll be better off with fashion if you understand your identity better.” – Ashton M ([37:40])

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Key Timestamps

• 00:08 – Brooke’s introduction, setting the scene
• 02:41 – Corey Moreno on Met vision and respecting identity
• 07:02 – Wellness and emotional labor in beauty, energy management
• 08:28 – Sir John’s Met Gala lore and Beyoncé moments
• 13:09 – The sting and learning from negative feedback (Beyoncé’s beehive)
• 13:54 – Naomi Osaka, movement coaches, and “glam” economics
• 18:00 – How clients and audiences can truly support beauty pros
• 21:49 – Rachel’s disillusionment with Met magic
• 27:14 – Steven on pre-carpet, social media, and photo manipulation
• 28:40 – Darian on athletes’ unique Met place
• 30:40 – How Met’s guest list process works
• 32:19 – Met Gala PR stunts and creative risks
• 33:21 – Panel’s favorite looks
• 36:02 – Ashton M: “Social media has throttled ambition…”
• 36:46 – Ivy Coco: Affirmation, comfort, and wearing the look

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Closing Thoughts

The episode delivers a rare, unguarded insight into one of fashion’s most storied events, highlighting the creativity, pressure, collaboration, and humanity behind every red carpet flashbulb. Whether dissecting the artistry of wigs and wigs, navigating industry hierarchies, or debating why the Met still matters at all, the Naked Beauty team brings sincerity, warmth, and a critical eye—reminding us that authentic expression, individuality, and community outlast even the hottest trends.

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For listeners seeking behind-the-scenes stories, honest industry critique, and actionable takeaways on confidence and creativity, this live episode is a treasure trove.

Transcript

[Darian Harvin]

Foreign.

[Brooke]

Hello, everyone. Thank you so much for being here the morning after the Met. And I could not be more excited for this live episode of Naked Beauty. So I used to do this episode virtually. I would talk to people that did all of the prep for the Met. But I think the Met is fun because we have conversation with each other, and I love hearing people's takes what they loved, what they didn't love. So that's what today is all about. We are going to get into. You're going to hear from the artists behind some of the incredible looks on the carpet and from, like, the culture makers that make the Met worth watching. Because the Met is fun, because we get to all watch it together and comment together. So I am so excited to jump into it and get started. How's everyone feeling? Everyone looks good. It's a very fashionable room in here. Thank you so much. I'm wearing Tangoro, designed by Sarah Diouf, who is based in Senegal, and her clothes are amazing. So very happy to be wearing Tangoro. Okay, I have so many of my favorite people in this room, and the first segment is the making of the look. So without further ado, I'm going to introduce Corey Moreno. Now, Cori, I have this picture here on the bottom right of Cory and I. This was the first time that Corey and I met. We met at Mr. Chow's Instagram didn't event where they would have all of the top makeup artists and hairstylists that were doing the come together for a dinner. I saw Corey walk in with these aviators, this all denim look, and I said, who is that? Who is that? And I need to know him immediately. We connected. We went back to la. We were locked in. You got to do my hair a little bit before you went and ascended onto bigger and better things. But Corey is the visionary behind Chase Infinity's incredible hair look. So, Corey, come on up. We're gonna get into it. Cory Moreno, ladies and gentlemen. Corey has done hair looks for La Roach. Heard of him. The Refinery 29 lookbook, which I was so excited to work on that with you. Jody Turner Smith, Lil Nas X, Teyana Taylor, Zendaya. I mean, the best of the best of the best. And you have your own signature style. So Corey Met Gala. It's not your first Met Gala.

[Corey Moreno]

No.

[Brooke]

You've done Met Gala before. Yes, but it's very high stakes, high pressure. So what was the vision for Chase's look? Because you've been working with her through her whole awards season. Her whole. I mean, we saw you at The Oscars with the braids. We've seen all of these incredible looks that you've done. What was the vision for her Met Gala look last night?

[Corey Moreno]

I think when I work with Chase, it's always important for me to, like, put her first and, like, take her culture into consideration. She's a biracial young lady, and I always want to, like, not push her into any direction that doesn't feel authentic to who she is. For the Met look, I really wanted to, like, push a new narrative, add some color, brighten the story. I feel like sometimes primary colors can make you feel a little bit off and, like, when you're having multiple colors happening. So I'm like, I feel like a blonde. Moment always aids in natural hair feeling so much more elevated. So I wanted to really, like, highlight that and give her a space to, like, be a little more tan and have a little bit more contrast with her hair and complexion. So, yeah, that was the real, real journey with it.

[Brooke]

And I feel like you've been so great about embracing natural texture. And not everything has to be perfect. Not every hair has to be laid in place. A little bit of frizz and texture is okay on the red carpet because that's what our hair naturally does. It doesn't want to be bone straight, literally.

[Corey Moreno]

I mean, even with this look, like, I use Bellamy hair extensions. They have a range of new textures and things like, shout out to Bellamy

[Brooke]

those curly clip ins, honey, we love.

[Corey Moreno]

But, like, I intentionally use multiple textures because I kind of wanted to show, like, the range in that texture, and it's just not feeling, like, too perfect, but, yeah, I'm really happy with it.

[Brooke]

Oh, it was so good. You did such an amazing job now.

[Corey Moreno]

Thank you.

[Brooke]

What is it like the day of? What time do you start getting ready? Do you see the dress? First you talk to the makeup artist. How does it all come together?

[Corey Moreno]

I mean, honestly, it was about two weeks before where we're, like, going through sketches. We're, like, having conversation with the stylist team. So it's a full, engrossed. Like, they want to see what I'm thinking. So we're all on a collaborative same page.

[Brooke]

Yes. And it was Wayman and Micah.

[Corey Moreno]

Wayman and Micah did the styling. Amber did the makeup. She's amazing. So it's like, it's a collaborative effort to really, like, bring the whole moment to life.

[Brooke]

Yes. Now, what is a detail that we wouldn't know from just looking at the images?

[Corey Moreno]

Well, she didn't color her hair, so that's all Extensions.

[Brooke]

Love.

[Corey Moreno]

I'm so, like, intentional about, like, hair care and hair health. So, like, I'm not going to like, color your hair for one night. So I really made it my business to, like, achieve this look in the most healthy way.

[Brooke]

Remember when Kim Kardashian, like, bleached her hair blonde?

[Corey Moreno]

Yeah, it didn't look the night before.

[Brooke]

Yeah, it didn't look that healthy. But she got the look. She got the look. She got the look. So you do chase and then what is that moment like, waiting for her to hit the red carpet. Were you at the Mark Hotel?

[Corey Moreno]

I was at the Mark Hotel.

[Brooke]

Okay. I was at the Mark.

[Corey Moreno]

Yeah.

[Brooke]

We should have met in the, in

[Corey Moreno]

the stairwell, the stairs.

[Brooke]

So, guys, so a lot of talent gets ready at the Mark Hotel. I see some people here in the audience that were with me at the Mark. Ace Meachum. They shut down the elevator starting at 3pm they shut down the block pretty much starting at 12pm and then you have to take the stairs unless you're like an approved exit. And there's just so much paparazzi, so many people there. So the Mark is kind of like base camp for the Met gala. So you're at the Mark, you finish everything, she runs out the door, and then are you just waiting for. Are you just refreshing Getty Images?

[Corey Moreno]

When I say it's like so nerve wracking because even like you said, with natural hair, like, it ebbs and flows with like the humidity or like, I'm like, is it hot on that carpet? Like, what's, what's going on? But I think it's, it's one of those things where it's like, I trust myself.

[Brooke]

Yes.

[Corey Moreno]

So I'm like constantly refreshing the Internet, seeing what's going on. And I'm like, I need to see what's happening. But it's definitely one of those super nerve wracking moments until it actually hits the carpet.

[Brooke]

Now, do you do a hair test? I'm always so curious about that.

[Corey Moreno]

No, honestly, like, it's like we pull up, we get those four. Well, Met. We did four hours. Normally it's two. We pull up, we get those four hours and like, it better eat. Like, we don't get a chance to, like, try it out.

[Brooke]

Where does the pressure show up for you?

[Corey Moreno]

The pressure shows up for me, honestly, with like, making sure the other departments are happy with what I'm doing. Like, I know my client trusts me, but I think it's often when I'm like working with like a big brand like Thom Brown, I'M like, are they satisfied with my depiction of a black woman in their, their garments? Like, so it's, it's constantly in my mind to, like, make sure I'm checking off all the boxes and at the end, making sure my client is like, put first. So it's, it's a deep. It's a deep dive into that.

[Brooke]

But I think, Corey, you're so intentional about your own, like, mental health and well being. Like, you're deep into your yoga, your music frequencies. And, you know, Sir John talks about this a lot. Sir John, you're going to come up in a bit. But, you know, as a, as a professional, you are an energy destination, and people are taking from your energy and they're reading your energy. So the energy that you have on a big day, like, Chase can feel, everyone in the room can feel it. So you have to really stay centered 100%.

[Corey Moreno]

I mean, it's. We've. We've been together for a while now, so it's like I've earned her trust. But even on a day like that, like, she's like, I'm nervous. I'm like, girl, it's gonna be good. Like, I'm. I'm there to do hair, but I'm also there to kind of be a guide that, like, calming, calming way.

[Brooke]

Yes. Okay. I love it. I love it. Okay, Sir John, come to the front. Sir John really needs no introduction to the naked beauty audience. Your work has been seen by millions. Something that Sir John has taught me from us doing multiple things together is he's always like, send me a picture of the room. And I'm like, honestly, the venue matters, guys.

[Sir John]

Venues matter. Venues matter.

[Brooke]

He's like, what color is the seat that we're sitting on? What does the room look like?

[Sir John]

What's the height of the seat? Also, ladies, so if you're wearing skirts or things like that, you don't have to. You can be demure. I'll say that. I'll say it that way.

[Brooke]

Sir John, how many times have you done the Met gala?

[Sir John]

I've done the Met. I would say this goes back for me to Joan Smalls, who's been my original muse. Do you guys know Joan?

[Brooke]

Of course.

[Sir John]

So Jones Smalls and Karlie Kloss and Jordan Dunn. And so I would say the first one was we kind of broke the Internet with purple lips at the time. This is when people weren't wearing colorful lips. You remember those days?

[Brooke]

Of course.

[Sir John]

I think this might have been a really humiliation. When Naomi told Coco Rocha about the Lip. And so Joan was like, now we're going to do a purple lip. So I don't know if that was anything, but long story short, we did it. Beauty editors, this is when back in the day. Can I give you an idea of the landscape down. Everything was about. You know, the next morning, you did an exclusive with the lore, or people shout out to Jackie and all those girls. And so all of these journalists had this idea of what would it look like to. For everyone to get the look the next day. Now, everything is not diffused, but we live in an era where, you know, no one really has to tune into much. E is gone, you know, or all of the ways that we used to absorb the information. So inspiration is not as linear in the same way it used to be. So I would say yes. To answer your question, it started with Joan. And of all of the years that she's went with Tom Ford, with Olivier, with Peter Dundas. I think my favorite match was with Beyonce in 20, when she wore the naked dress. And it wasn't supposed to be a ponytail at the time. I'm not sure. Yeah. And so it was. I'm sorry, did you have a question?

[Corey Moreno]

No, no.

[Brooke]

Please. This is. This is the lore that we want. So please tell us. Let's talk about this ponytail look, because I know it kind of came together.

[Sir John]

Last moment, Last moment. So shout out to my boy Neil, Neil Farina, who's in Brooklyn. And so we were getting her ready. So the day of the Met, you want to make sure that sometimes we try by doing two clients, right? And when we do, it's. It's. Everybody loses. So if. If anybody who's a young makeup artist or hair stylist, stylists can do that because they don't necessarily have to be there in the same way. But I. I remember leaving Karlie Kloss, and then I went straight to her B. And so she's the last person on the carpet always. So I felt a little. I felt safe knowing that I wasn't going to have her, you know, and they're not going to close the carpet if she doesn't show. So I think that was one of the. We had a really good time. It was a bun. It was like a chignon at the top. She felt it was too contrived. And so in the Sprinter on the way there, she just sort of took it down and sort of brushed it out. And she does that.

[Brooke]

She kind of has Neil, like, cool with that, or was he, like.

[Sir John]

He would have to be. He's going to have to be. But, you know, she has an apartment for her glam, like, so we don't, you know, we get her ready in her.

[Brooke]

Wait, I'm sorry, say that again.

[Sir John]

Is this an exclusive? Am I. No one heard that?

[Brooke]

Okay, so let me say. So you know how Beyonce says, everybody on mute. We need to have cameras down. This is like really insider NDA.

[Sir John]

This is. This is nothing that I don't think anybody. I know.

[Brooke]

We just got to be careful. We got to be careful. Okay?

[Sir John]

But, yes, I've been media trained, so you can never throw a bad question at me. But I would say that. So we get her ready and in another apartment so she doesn't have to,

[Brooke]

you know, just be at the mark. Like be at a hotel amongst other people.

[Sir John]

Yeah, no, she's not.

[Brooke]

Okay, so she's got an apartment, like by the Met, where she just gets ready.

[Sir John]

She is. She has an apartment in the city.

[Brooke]

Yes, Just to get ready.

[Sir John]

It's her. It's her dressing room.

[Brooke]

Amazing. Is that where all the wigs are?

[Sir John]

It's. It's where all of the. All of the. All the things. All the things.

[Brooke]

Oh, my. A new dream, a new goal in life. An apartment to get glammed in. I love it. Okay, so you're at the apartment.

[Sir John]

So. So that happened with that one. The one. I got to tell you, I'm going to keep it real with you guys. And I'm not sure if you guys know, like, the work that I've done over the years, but you have to also be. You have to listen. You can't be in this space. You know, when we look at social media and we look at how this makes us feel about ourself, at times, if you're brought up by compliments or likes, you'll be brought down by criticism. So if you are, if it matters, or if it moves the needle for you and to you to get all this applause, I mean, it's nice when you. When the team wins. It's nice when my client is winning, when it's. When it looks like there's harmony on the carpet. But when you take any of that shit and really take it to heart, if you do get a negative review, it doesn't feel good. So let me tell you about a negative review I got. I remember. So the next year she went with Ricardo Tisci. This is when he was at Givenchy those years before Burberry. And this is the pearl dress. So we. So mind you, I have to say this, and I'm keep It quick because I know you guys have so much other stuff to talk about, but we. When you ever. You're working on a carpet that you know is going to be lit in the daytime, a daytime carpet is a very unforgiving 100% nighttime carpets because of the flash. The flash illuminates you. A flash is like concealer. Guys. Don't ever let people take photos of you without a flash. Always give me a flash. Give me something that's going to build me up. So I knew it was going to be tough, so I gave her this graphic eye. She liked it. Ricardo liked it. We're all in the house and the beehive. So I go, I do my thing and I leave. I open my phone and I'm getting attacked by the beehive when I say attack.

[Brooke]

So editorial and chic, but people didn't. But maybe didn't expect it from her.

[Sir John]

If you saw the. The graphic shapes were symmetrical. They were even, you know, the color payoff was beautiful. It was a beautiful metallic green, you know, and so it looked really great, I guess, in photos or how we. When we captured it. But the beehive didn't like it. And they let me know they were very firm. And they're in their disappointment with me that day.

[Brooke]

Oh, well, we love it. We love it. And you've given us so much over the years in terms of just beauty culture. We have to talk about last night's look you did Miss Naomi Osaka. And I have so many questions for you, because I want to know about the hands being read. Like, did you do that? So take us through it. What was the whole experience like?

[Sir John]

Yeah. So Naomi is really amazing. Amazing, gentle, human. And so the first thing I did when I got the call, and this is like, public knowledge, I can say this. I call it Stephen Galloway. So Stephen Galloway is an amazing movement coach. Do you know who? Does anyone know who Stephen Galloway is? Legend. You guys should know this. Everybody here should know.

[Brooke]

You should explain to everyone what a movement coach is.

[Sir John]

So everybody, it doesn't matter who you are, Rihanna, Beyonce, everyone has either a choreographer or movement coaches are people who actually. He's been with Diana Ross, you know, Naomi Campbell. They're on set. They're helping you either capture the essence of the designer, they're helping. Helping you tap into your body or helping you tap into the spirit or the mood that we were trying to evoke at the. At that time. He's. He's legendary, bro. Black man. And so I was like, stephen, we have Naomi. She's doing this thing. Jason Woon, his amazing designer. She loves him and she's worn him before. But I know she's not an actress or she's not a supermodel in a sense, where they just go and they do that thing and they turn it on editorially. So do you have an idea? Are you in New York? Would you love to come through and help her with movement or feel, you know, her way around these garments? She's also gonna change three times for the evening. Cause she's going to after parties. He's like, damn, I just landed in la. You know? Cause we both live in la. I moved from Harlem to la. And he said, I have someone else. His name is Jacob. He's a principal dancer at Martha Graham, the ballet company. So I brought in. I brought in basically a principal ballerina to help her, you know, just find her movement or find herself. And that is why I noticed this talk about, you know, why paying so much or why, you know, this whole thing.

[Brooke]

We saw the Simone Biles, so. Who saw the Simone Biles?

[Sir John]

It's value. When you create value. Guys. I'm not sure what you guys do or what you're into, but we should explain the level of value.

[Brooke]

We should explain what the controversy was, though, for people that aren't familiar. She said that I. I paid $22,000 for Glam, and she was upset about it.

[Sir John]

She didn't say glam. She said overall.

[Brooke]

Overall, okay. Rachel's asking a good question in the front. She says, does that not feel high? Now, my interpretation of that is that there was at least like, a $10,000 dress included in that.

[Sir John]

I think that.

[Brooke]

Or flights.

[Sir John]

Flights. I think that has so much to do with styling. Styling takes up skys. We just work around stylists. Stylists are the main character.

[Corey Moreno]

They eat the budget up.

[Sir John]

They eat the budget up. So they're the ones. They tell us what to do. To a certain extent, I keep.

[Brooke]

Really? So you guys take your cues from.

[Corey Moreno]

From wardrobe 100.

[Sir John]

No, because you know what? The talent takes their cues from wardrobe more or less, because they want to be seen as a fashion star. So they come in and they are. And they're with the talent maybe weeks prior. You know, the dress kind of leans into the day, and we get. We're the bippity boppity boop at the last minute. Or we get a brief, like, two or three days before. But all shout out and respect to my stylist. But they do have so much power to influence how a woman wants to see herself and how she does see herself, you know, and they have the relationships, like law with these major designers, and they can make you a fashion star. That being said, that budget was not just hair and makeup, Right? That budget was, you know, wardrobe or some. And my whole thing is this. You know, there might have been someone underwriting this. So she's not paying out of pocket necessarily, always. And if she did, I would look at her team. I'm looking at, you know, who else is sponsoring this. There has to be a skincare company involved. A hair company.

[Corey Moreno]

Yes, 100%.

[Sir John]

So a lot of that was a little bit smoke and mirrors. I have to say. That was some bullshit. I do want to say that, but I'm going to say this, and I'll be done. You have to create value. So when I say I'm not just coming with a brush, I'm. I'm creating a lot of value that I know is going to translate really well. So she had a beautiful dress. We had a movement coach. The hands were, like, painted on. So all of this was something that I just came in and saw, and I just wanted to figure out, what can I add to this? You know, So I knew it was really hot under that. So for me, it was like, how do I control the oil? Or how can I control the fact that she's going to be burning up and not have a fan? So, yeah.

[Brooke]

Yes. You did an incredible job. And I see you were at the Mark Hotel, too. Content idea just popped into my head. Someone take a reality TV crew and just go to each floor of the Mark and capture all of the chaos. Cause it's like, you know, the NDAs

[Sir John]

that would be involved.

[Brooke]

I know, I know, I know. Well, my last question for you both, because I think we're in a room here of people that love beauty, we love the artists. What can we do to be supportive of you? How do you want us to show up for you all and champion your work?

[Corey Moreno]

That's a great question. I think humanize us first that often feel like a worker, even at that high level. So, like, just to, like, really give me, like, patience and, like, human nature, I always, like, start there with my clients. So that would be my answer for you.

[Brooke]

Beautiful. And, you know, we were all collectively very upset after the Oscars when they called Chase Infinity's braids undone for sure. And I texted you immediately. I was like, please come talk to us at Refinery29 about it, because we have to set the record straight. But, yes. So often, even the. The culture behind the looks isn't understood in. In terms of mainstream media.

[Corey Moreno]

So, yeah, I mean, I feel like as a black artist, I'm like, I'm putting myself on the line and my client on the line, and I want to, like, represent them the best. So it's just like, we. We're in it together. So it's like, I don't ever want my client against me or pulling in the wrong direction because it's like, we have to, like, present this. Well, honey.

[Brooke]

Yeah.

[Corey Moreno]

So, like, my goal is to always just, you know, shine properly.

[Brooke]

Yes.

[Corey Moreno]

Yeah.

[Brooke]

Sir John, what about you?

[Sir John]

What was the question again?

[Brooke]

Sorry. What can we do to show up for you, to support you?

[Sir John]

So there's two different ideas. When you say we, for me, I'm thinking, does we mean talent? Does we mean.

[Brooke]

We mean the people in this room?

[Sir John]

So the people is different. The people don't really have to do anything else. They stay rock steady, like, still be the supportive regardless if they come, and also continue to keep it a buck with us. You know what I mean? If you don't like something, please, polite, politely find an artful way to say, this doesn't work, or hated it. And I think as long as we. You know what Dapper Dan says something so key. I was presented Danessa with an award recently, and so he said, as long as we follow the culture, we won't need any inspiration. So as long as I'm looking to the culture, I don't care what any blogs or anybody else has to say about anything that I'm doing, as long as people are feeling it from a sonic level or a spiritual level.

[Brooke]

Yeah. Incredible. Incredible. We are so lucky to have you both. Thank you so much for sharing so freely.

[Sir John]

Give it up for Brooke. Give it up for Brooke.

[Brooke]

Amazing. Thank you, guys. All right, now, the theme of the Met this year was costume art. And I think one of the things that gets lost when we talk about the Met Gala is that it is a fundraiser for. For the Costume Institute at the Metropolitan Museum of Art. But I'm going to introduce our next panel. Racho, Darian, Steven Simeone, come to the front. Please. Introduce yourselves.

[Darian Harvin]

My name is Darian Harvin. I am a beauty and culture writer and the host of Full Coverage. We break down beauty looks, interview the beat artists who constructed them on the carpet. We had our show last night.

[Brooke]

Congratulations. One of my favorite writers and longtime friend. Yes, Rachel.

[Rachel]

Oh, me. Hi, my name is Rachel. I am a podcaster. I host Cutting Room Floor.

[Brooke]

Yes.

[Rachel]

And that's it.

[Steven Simeone]

I'm Steven Simeone. I'm a beauty and fashion photographer. I've been working with Brooke for the better part of, like, three to four years at this point.

[Brooke]

As soon as I moved to la. And my Naked Beauty podcast artwork is shot by Stephen.

[Steven Simeone]

Yes.

[Sir John]

Yeah.

[Steven Simeone]

And the fragrance.

[Brooke]

Oh, and the fragrance campaign and my headshots.

[Steven Simeone]

And we did the refinery with Sir John.

[Brooke]

Yes. And I are locked in.

[Steven Simeone]

All of my best stuff is with you.

[Brooke]

Oh, thank you. Well, some of my favorite people on this couch. Rachel, I'm going to start with you because I have a. I have a bigger question about culture at large. As someone who really looks at the fashion world, but also, you know, you study people, and you study people's reaction to culture. Why do you think the Met Gala is something that, you know, people at home, living wherever in their sweatpants are so tuned into? What is it about the Met Gala that draws people in?

[Rachel]

Well, that's such a tricky question, because I think some of it is organic, and I think some of it's manufactured. So, like, nowadays, I feel like you can't ignore it, which isn't even a choice. Like, it kind of invades. I mean, invades my social feed in a way that I would prefer to be able to opt into, and I can't, really. So I think that's what it used to be versus what it is today, I think are two very different things. But I guess what's the question? Like, why people care?

[Brooke]

Why they watch people care with all that we have going on in the world? Some people would say this is very superficial, unimportant. There was a lot of discussion about even protesting the Met this year. I think a lot of people don't.

[Rachel]

I think a lot of people don't care.

[Brooke]

Yeah.

[Rachel]

And I think the ones who don't care, first of all, are nowhere even near this conversation. They're, like, living their lives somewhere else. Like, they're just. Maybe they know of it and they've heard of it. I have a lot of good friends from where I'm from who really don't know anything about this world. They don't know about brands and celebrities and, like, they don't know about any of this. So they might know the word Met Gala and be like, okay, cool. But then there's also the part. I just think it's harder to believe in fantasy today than it used to be. When we were growing in the 90s and the 2000s and celebrity culture, all that stuff felt so titillating and exciting. And the Met Ball felt like this kind of Esoteric, faraway place that, I mean, it was called a ball. And like, as an amer, as Americans, we don't really have, like, an aristocracy in that way. So, like, that, I think symbolized something that was very elite and hard to get into. And I think as the years have gone on, it's become a lot more commercial and it's been cheapened quite a bit. And I also think it's more mass, in a way, commercialized. And I think, again, like, it's hard to believe in fantasy because a lot of the facades that we have known of or grown up on have now broken. And that's from government, politics, Hollywood, celebrity, the food industry. Like, there's a lot of smoke and mirrors that have been, you know, we're all quite disillusioned. So I think when it comes to things like that, you know, even the idea of, like, BTS has something that's been stripped out. So now, like, we're behind the BTS and we all have phones and we all know see everything in real time. So I just think there's a little bit of that magic is gone. This is just my opinion. I guess I can't speak for everybody else, but I think to your point, like, people care. And we watch for rooms like this, like, where we can just, like, enjoy it and take away the sociopolitical concept and be like, I love that look. I love that glam. And all of us are probably here because we love fashion and stuff like that, but then. And then obviously there's, you know, the investment into the fundraising for the museum and for the costume and. Which is all very valid, but. Yeah, I mean, for me personally, it's harder. It's harder and harder to care about stuff like this, unless it's purely from the perspective of just like, for funsies and it's a little bit of dessert after dinner and you're like, okay, I like that look. But it's. I'm not as bought into any of this stuff as I was, you know, growing up. And I just think life is too hard and too real now that you can use it as escapism if you need it. Yes, but I don't know that there's that, like, investment the way there used to be. I think people. I think that's why people are protesting. And it feels very like, let the meat cake.

[Sir John]

Sure, we've all lost a bit or we've been stripped away of what used to make it special, what we used to be in it for, what we wanted to get the girls, you know, to aspire to. It doesn't feel the same. And so even being in it. And I'm not. Not. Listen, I'm grateful to, you know, be in the room with you guys or even have this conversation with you, but it doesn't. I'm not my. I don't think any of our heads are in it the same way. I'm talking about all of the makeup artists who are known by first names. The hairstylist, you know, the stylist. None of us are really like, oh, my God, I can't wait to do it at Matt this year. No, we have not.

[Rachel]

I don't even think the talent feels that way. I think some of them are there because they're coming with the brand, and it's a job and it's a gig, and they gotta show up and clock in the way the rest of us do. I think there's a mass disillusionment in general, but people keep. They keep going the same way. All of us show up to our jobs. We're like, okay. Like, it's not because people don't know what's going on in the world. They're like, I'm going with Saint Laurent. I'm under contract. I need to be there where time is a glance. Like, you know what I mean? Everyone's just kind of going through the motions. I think.

[Darian Harvin]

And I'll just say at this point, I think that for me, it is about these moments at very least, or no, at very most, and at very least now being a moment for, like, connection and creativity. Like, if this is an opportunity for me to, like, sit here with these incredible, talented human beings, I can meet new people. I can see people who I haven't seen in a long time. We can talk craft and creativity. I can hear from Sir John about his approach. He can give me some things that I've never. That I've never thought about before, or he can give me more of an understanding of, like, other ways that, like, you can operate and bring a look to life. Like, I will. Like, I feel like I'm monopolizing off of the Met for that or the Oscars for that. That's, like. That's my power to me.

[Rachel]

And also, this is very fun. Like, this is so smart. This is so genius, Brooke. Like, to be able to do it with other people, because I do it on my phone and in the DMs and be like, girl, this is a mess. But to do it in community, this is, like, actually what makes it really enjoyable, I think. Yes, so congratulations.

[Brooke]

Thank you. Thank you. And, Steven, you as a photographer, I think one thing that that's really interesting is, like, there's the. The red carpet, Getty images photos, which, you know, there's not as much control. Even though I learned from you. Getty is retouched, y'. All. We have been lied to.

[Steven Simeone]

People say Gettysburg depends on the client.

[Brooke]

It depends on the client. Yeah. I had someone looking out for me on a Getty thing, and I was like, oh, yeah, just retouch that a little bit. But the images that the talent wants to post on their Instagram feed, and there's a whole, like, shoot before you even get onto the carpet. Can you talk a little bit about that? About how photographers basically set up to capture the look before? Because that's as. That becomes almost as important as the red carpet image.

[Steven Simeone]

Yeah, totally. I know a lot of these artists, they want their pictures taken before. Last year, I was with Mary J. Blige, and the year before, I was with Kris Jenner. And they want their pictures turned around really quickly, almost even before these, like, the Getty images pictures hit the carpet on their website.

[Brooke]

They want that to be the first look at. They're.

[Steven Simeone]

Exactly. And, you know, these people are so big. They want to turn anything into a moment, and you can control the lighting more. So, like Sir John was saying, like, most people don't use flash on the red carpet. When I was working for Getty, I was using flash. I think a lot of people did appreciate that.

[Brooke]

Wait, Getty doesn't use flash?

[Steven Simeone]

You know, you kind of have that choice of whether you want to use it or not. And I think that maybe some photographers want to be a little shady and maybe don't want to use flash so they can show the texture, and then, you know, those pictures sell.

[Darian Harvin]

Oh, true.

[Steven Simeone]

When you.

[Brooke]

Wow, fascinating. So this is fascinating. You use that almost as a tactic.

[Steven Simeone]

It's kind of more of an unspoken thing, I think, because, like, I never felt like I was going to be working for Getty for the rest of my life. I knew that I wanted to kind of pursue beauty and fashion a little more professionally. I always use flash, but a lot of these people who make royalties on their photos, like, don't really care.

[Brooke]

Wow.

[Corey Moreno]

Yeah.

[Brooke]

Wow. Wow. Okay, Darian, I want to talk to you about athletes on the carpet, specifically Angel Reese as well. I think we now also see the Met Gal as this opportunity for personal branding, and we're seeing more and more women in sports become part of the conversation. How do you think about the way that athletes show up in this fashion space.

[Darian Harvin]

I love to see the different ways that athletes decide to show up in the fashion space, because I think that it has also become, like, this experiment for them. When we're looking at, like, Serena Williams, Venus Williams, and then also Naomi, it's, like, interesting because they're sisters and they represent a specific era, but, like, Naomi is kind of in her own as well. They're both also tennis players. And so even though I don't love Serena Williams, look here, I think it's still really, really important to remember that, like, she is one of the first pop star athletes. We saw her in music videos. We saw her on red carpets when she got to, like, a specific place within her career. And so sometimes she nails it, sometimes she doesn't. But I think that, like, when we're talking about these two, they are two women who have, like, been within the pop culture lexicon in the same way that, like, Michael Jordan had been, but we just don't really give them their flowers in that way.

[Brooke]

Yes. Rachel and Steven, what did you think about the way the men showed up?

[Rachel]

This is no shade, but I, like, rarely pay attention to the men. They have to do something, like, really extraordinary, or they have to, like, stunt, like, for me to note, like, a bad bunny, like, looking 53. Like, I don't know. I just. I'm always paying attention to the girlies, but this is good.

[Darian Harvin]

But Colman does show out. I feel. I feel like I do pay attention to Colman. He's an exception.

[Steven Simeone]

He always, I feel like, gives it.

[Brooke]

I'm gonna pause and ask you guys two more questions, and then I'm gonna move on to the next section. Rachel, could you talk a little bit about the relationship between the designers, the role Anna plays, and the talent that's selected? Because I think a lot of people maybe don't understand how it all works in terms of, like, a designer is chosen, they get a table, then they get to choose their people. But then Anna still has to approve.

[Rachel]

I don't know that I'm the best person to speak on this, because this could be my understanding. I can tell you my understanding, but I don't know. I've never been. And I'm not sure if this is accurate, but the designers have to buy a table.

[Brooke]

Yes. $300,000.

[Rachel]

Yeah. Or an individual could buy a table as well, I think. But those are, like, upwards of $100,000, I think, too.

[Brooke]

Yes. Very expensive.

[Rachel]

And then the designer brings talent on behalf of their brand to come sit at the Table. So you're going on behalf of a designer you're attending, and then if you're, like, under contract, then obviously you're going with that brand.

[Brooke]

Yes.

[Rachel]

And then Anna approves the guest list. I mean, that's the one and twos of it, right?

[Brooke]

Yes, but. But I think there's a really interesting push and pull also around pr. Right. Because this is an investment. So if you're paying $300,000 for a table, you want to make sure that you're getting as much PR coverage as possible. So that's when you have to think about, okay, who do I want wearing my look to get the right amount of press coverage? So it becomes a little bit competitive, which is interesting. Yes, Shawn.

[Rachel]

So a few of my friends have

[Sir John]

taken certain girls to the Met, and it's not who they wanted to take because they had so many.

[Rachel]

A few of your who?

[Sir John]

Friends.

[Brooke]

Designers.

[Rachel]

Yeah, designers. Okay.

[Sir John]

So, like, they were taking talent or they were going to the Met, and then Anna chose who they were gonna

[Rachel]

take, and they didn't really have a say in it. So then they had to make a

[Sir John]

look for somebody that they necessarily didn't care to take to the Met.

[Rachel]

Yeah, she has a lot of power over the Met and who's gonna be there.

[Brooke]

Yes. Yes. Darian, question for you. How do you think people use the Met Gala as a moment for their career? I know that, like, last year, Damson wore the F1 helmet on the carpet, and people were like, he's never gonna be invited again. I think about Andre 3000 wearing the piano on his back. That was also the same as the album cover. How are we seeing celebrities use the Met Gala to. And everyone thought that Beyonce was going to announce Act 3.

[Rachel]

Yeah.

[Darian Harvin]

They were looking for signs and also symbols. And I saw one thing where it was like, the skeleton rock turns into rock.

[Brooke]

Yes, rock. Act three is act three.

[Darian Harvin]

And I was like, I am actually too deep into this conspiracy theories, lore breakers world of Beyonce right now. But if I'm being honest with you, what's interesting, that it does feel to me like far few in between. I don't feel like I see it very often. So it's almost like when you decide to. I do. My personal take on it is almost, like, boring. It's both, like. It's like, daring in the sense of, like, is this the moment where you want to do it? And also, it's like you resorted to that versus it's like, actually you could use this as an opportunity to really create something that you nail around the theme to, like, bring attention to who you are.

[Brooke]

That. That.

[Darian Harvin]

That's actually how you do pr.

[Brooke]

Yes, yes, yes. Bring attention to who you are. I'm gonna ask you guys final question. Your favorite look of the night.

[Steven Simeone]

For me, it has to be Emma Chamberlain.

[Brooke]

Yeah.

[Steven Simeone]

I think she did great. The hair, the makeup, the look, everything was perfection.

[Darian Harvin]

Iseult.

[Brooke]

Yes.

[Darian Harvin]

French black. Yes. I thought that she looked incredible. On full coverage last night. We had Naivasha, who did her hair. She ended up wearing a hat that she did end up taking off, But I think that she is an incredible force. Nye told me that she actually, when she came, she had her own materials and her own hair. Nye brought things as well, and they did, like, a choppy, Tina Turner inspired look, But I just thought she looked really incredible.

[Brooke]

She did, yeah. Rachel, your favorite?

[Rachel]

I think mine is a knock. I thought I was very emotional over that, but I just have a couple of other honorary mentions. I thought Lala Anthony looked amazing. She was like, hosting this kind of, like, wooden dress and then.

[Brooke]

That's interesting.

[Rachel]

You didn't like it?

[Brooke]

I didn't love it.

[Rachel]

Really? I thought it was so pretty. I. And the red bombshell, like, I'm also comparing it to, like, how I've seen these people show up before. So this is, like, better than I've seen Eileen Goo. I don't know if you guys know who that is. She's an athlete. She wore the bubbles dress. That was fantastic. And Sabine Getty, she had this, like, painting. Paloma Alcesa as well.

[Darian Harvin]

Oh, yeah.

[Brooke]

Paloma's dress was amazing with the silver ear. So much artistry. Thank you all for taking us on this journey through fashion as craft and culture. I really appreciate you guys.

[Steven Simeone]

Thank you.

[Brooke]

Amazing. And with that, I'm going to introduce our final panel. Ivy Coco Austin M. Come on up. Hello, hello, hello, hello.

[Ashton M]

Hi, people.

[Brooke]

My favorites. I mean, Ivy, you do these incredible looks for your mom. Cheryl Lee Ralph.

[Ivy Coco]

Thank you.

[Brooke]

Incredible. And you always kill it on the red carpet. We've been talking so much about wardrobe and styling and what a big part of creating looks that is. So I'm so excited to get your expertise. And, Aston, you know, I'm such a huge fan of your videos. If you guys don't follow Aston on every platform, you need to please introduce yourselves and what you do. And we're going to get into it. Yeah.

[Ivy Coco]

I'm Ivy Coco. I'm a stylist, but I'm also a community organizer, so I always say I serve looks, but I also Serve my community.

[Brooke]

Yes.

[Ashton M]

Hi, my name is Ashton M. And I'm a content creator that roots for everybody black. So. Yeah.

[Brooke]

So, you know, I think it's interesting, you as someone, as a creator who gives commentary on looks. I think some people are afraid to take risks because they're worried about being ripped to shreds on a green screen by someone like you. So how does talent find that balance between wanting to take it there and create a look, but then also saying, I don't want to end up on the worst dress list?

[Ashton M]

It was actually my critique last night. I think people, social media has throttled ambition, fashion ambition because instant you see the looks, instant. So people are coming up with an opinion very fast. I think social media keeps people from trying and last night was a key sign of that. I think it's just people are afraid of people on the Internet. People are afraid of criticism.

[Brooke]

Yes.

[Ashton M]

And they're not as confident as they say they are.

[Brooke]

Yes. Well, before we wrap this panel, let's give some words of encouragement for people to try things with their look. You know, you are someone that is so immersed in style and expression through clothing. What words of encouragement would you have for people that just want to take some of this, like Met Gala magic and bring it into their everyday life? Question for both of you all.

[Ivy Coco]

I mean, wear the outfit, don't let the outfit wear you. Because I think we saw that a lot yesterday. I think also one thing that I do within, like my wellness practice and as a stylist, I'm very affirmational. So I think a lot of the times when you see on these carpets, sometimes people look uncomfortable. They don't really feel like they're engaging with their dress or if they really, really like it. So it's like, I know for me, I'm always like, I need to have an affirmation, some words of wind or just doing some easy breath work before I work on these, you know, go on these red carpets. This is something that I implement with my clients as well because I wellness and being in a high volume space like fashion, beauty, entertainment, like we need to have a level of grounding because you're not going to be grounded on these red carpets. So the most important is feeling good, but also from the inside out and being intentional with that. So find your word of affirmation and let that be the best accessory.

[Brooke]

I love that.

[Ashton M]

I think a lot of people don't know who they are, identity. When they say be yourself, that's easy to say. But like when you have to hold on to things that make you uncomfortable about yourself, things like that. I think identity plays a lot like fashion and identity are like this. And most people don't realize that. I think when you, I was looking at a, you know, it was like watching on the street pages where they, like photograph. And I realized a lot of people, I think they think it's individualistic, but it's just their algorithm speaking to them. I think finding yourself and being committed to who you are will be better off with fashion if you understand your identity better.

[Brooke]

Absolutely. What an incredible note to end on. Thank you so much for being here. Let's give them a round of applause. Thank you.

[Ashton M]

Thank you.

[Brooke]

And a round of applause for all of the incredible, incredible panelists. I was so grateful to be able to spend this afternoon with you all. So thank you all for allowing me to be here with you all. Go inside. All you find is inspiration.

[Darian Harvin]

Your dreams will open the door.

[Brooke]

It makes no difference if you're black

[Darian Harvin]

or white, if you're a boy or a girl.

[Brooke]

If the music's popping, it will give you new life. You're a superstar. Yes, that's what you are.

[Darian Harvin]

You know it comes.

[Brooke]

ACAST powers the world's best podcasts.

[Corey Moreno]

Here's a show that we recommend.

[Brooke]

Do you want to know the best part about being married to a woman? That there's no man involved. I mean, true, but I was gonna say that it's a sleepover every single night with your best friend. Oh, yeah, that part is cute, too. I'm Taryn, she's Cami. We're married. And staying up is our weekly pillow talk out loud with you. We're giggling, we're gossiping, we're arguing. Classic marriage stuff. Just having fun being wives while we navigate growing up and building a family together. Then our sleepover grows. Our listeners call the pee pee hotline with their own gossip, burning questions, late night spirals, all the stuff they'd only tell their best friends. So it's a private sleepover, but you are invited. Staying up with Taryn and Cami. New episodes weekly follow Wherever you listen.

[Steven Simeone]

Acast helps creators launch, grow, and monetize their podcasts everywhere.

[Corey Moreno]

Acast.com.