02: Christian Embarrassment - The Book of Genesis w/ Ed Mabrie

Summary

Podcast Summary: Nephilim Death Squad – "Christian Embarrassment - The Book of Genesis w/ Ed Mabry"

Episode Information:

• Title: Christian Embarrassment - The Book of Genesis w/ Ed Mabry
• Hosts: TopLobsta Productions (David Lee Corbo as The Raven) and Raven (Top Lobster)
• Guest: Ed Mabry
• Release Date: February 28, 2025

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Introduction to the Episode and Guest

In the second episode of the ongoing Book of Genesis series, Nephilim Death Squad welcomes Ed Mabry, a prominent figure in Christian apologetics and biblical scholarship. The hosts, Top Lobster and David Lee Corbo, delve into the complexities of Genesis, exploring topics that challenge mainstream Christian interpretations and address the consequent sense of embarrassment some believers feel towards the foundational biblical narratives.

Ed Mabry introduces his work and platforms, emphasizing his commitment to providing in-depth biblical analysis:

[01:56] Ed Mabry: "If you're a Christian, you know the what. But I, I want to help you understand the why and why why it makes sense why you don't have to have these blind leaps and why you don't have to be embarrassed about anything."

Exploring Pre-Existence and Spiritual Beings

The conversation kicks off with the intriguing question of whether humans existed in a spiritual form before their physical existence on Earth. David Corbo poses a nuanced question to Ed Mabry regarding the interpretation of biblical verses that suggest pre-existence:

[05:37] David Lee Corbo: "Do you believe that we existed before we were here in this world in a physical way?"

Ed Mabry clarifies that while God's spirit is eternal, humans as created beings do not pre-exist before their physical creation. He elaborates on the Hebrew interpretation of "forming" in Jeremiah, indicating that God's knowledge of individuals begins at the point of physical conception:

[06:49] Ed Mabry: "Eternity means without end. But we were not. We didn't exist in the past. We didn't exist before we were created."

Interpretation of Genesis Verses

Delving deeper into Genesis, Ed Mabry and the hosts analyze specific biblical texts to debunk misconceptions about pre-existence. They discuss the Hebrew word for "form" and its implications on understanding God's relationship with humanity:

[12:11] Ed Mabry: "So when he says he knows you, what does that mean? That's information. He knew what you were going to be."

This leads to a discussion on the nature of God's omniscience without implying eternal pre-existence of souls.

The Shroud of Turin and Spiritual Imprints

The conversation transitions to the Shroud of Turin, exploring its mystical aspects and potential connections to spiritual phenomena. David Corbo speculates on the possibility of a spiritual imprint coinciding with the moment of soul infusion:

[13:38] David Lee Corbo: "Maybe when a soul re. Enters a body, period, there's a flash of light."

Ed Mabry shares his initial skepticism towards the Shroud but acknowledges growing evidence that piqued his interest:

[14:57] Ed Mabry: "But the more evidence I see, the more interesting it becomes."

AI and Spiritual Entities

A lighter yet pertinent segment addresses the intersection of artificial intelligence and spiritual beliefs. Ed Mabry recounts his unsettling interactions with AI, highlighting concerns about AI's influence on human consciousness and spiritual well-being:

[16:33] Ed Mabry: "I had a debate with it about evolution... I felt so uneasy afterwards... I can't see us."

The hosts humorously lament their challenges with AI while recognizing its potential role in modern spiritual dynamics.

Hierarchy and Nature of Angels

A significant portion of the episode is dedicated to understanding the hierarchy and true nature of angels (Elohim) as depicted in the Bible. Ed Mabry clarifies common misconceptions, emphasizing that "angel" is a job title rather than a proper name:

[40:00] Ed Mabry: "Angel is not the proper term for these beings because angel is our English version or our transliterated version of the Greek word angelos, which just means messenger."

The discussion unfolds into the various classes of angels, including Seraphim and Cherubim, explaining their roles and appearances in biblical texts. They explore the Seraphim's representation of different life classes on Earth and the fallen Cherubim associated with Satan.

Reptilian Conspiracies and Nephilim

Connecting biblical lore to contemporary conspiracy theories, the hosts and Ed Mabry examine the concept of Reptilians and their origins as fallen angels or Nephilim. They critique popular theories, such as the Anunnaki, and propose their own interpretations based on biblical accounts:

[54:51] David Lee Corbo: "People are seeing something... they're seeing these hybrid offspring, these Nephilim, offspring of seraphim and human beings."

Ed Mabry argues that reptilian entities in conspiracies could be remnants of these fallen classes of angels, integrating biblical narrative with modern mythos.

Conclusion and Resources

As the episode wraps up, Ed Mabry shares resources for listeners to engage further with his work, including his website faithbyreason.net and his Patreon for exclusive content. The hosts encourage listeners to explore these platforms to deepen their understanding of Genesis and related theological discussions.

[69:02] Ed Mabry: "You can you get access to bonus material, new stuff that I put out first, Q and A's..."

The episode concludes with a teaser for the next installment, promising to delve into the rebellion of angels and further unravel the mysteries of Genesis.

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Notable Quotes:

• Ed Mabry on God's knowledge:

  [06:49] "Eternity means without end. But we were not. We didn't exist in the past. We didn't exist before we were created."

• David Corbo on AI's influence:

  [16:50] "It's almost got even a certain amount of excitement for, like, theories. When you give it theories..."

• Ed Mabry on the nature of Elohim:

  [40:00] "Angel is not the proper term for these beings because angel is our English version or our transliterated version of the Greek word angelos, which just means messenger."

• Ed Mabry on theistic evolution:

  [25:56] "And I have a buddy of mine, a good friend who is a devout Catholic... when an intelligent person starts to see the cracks in Catholicism... they either go to true Christianity or become a raging atheist."

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Resources Mentioned:

• Ed Mabry’s Platforms:

  • Website: faithbyreason.net
  • YouTube Channel: Faith by Reason
  • Patreon: Patreon.com/faithbyreason

• Upcoming Content:

  • Bible Study: Jehovah Story Book Club
  • Next Episode Topics: Rebellion of Angels, Further Analysis of Genesis 1 and 2

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Closing Remarks: The episode offers a profound exploration of Genesis through the lens of biblical scholarship and conspiracy theory, challenging listeners to reconsider traditional interpretations and encouraging deeper theological engagement. Ed Mabry provides a thought-provoking perspective that intersects faith, science, and modern-day conspiracies, making it a compelling listen for those interested in the hidden facets of biblical narratives.

Transcript

[David Lee Corbo]

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[Ed Mabry]

Productions we are being hypnotized by people like this. News readers, politicians, teachers, lecturers. We are in a country and in a world that is being run by unbelievably sick people. The chasm between what we're told is going on and what is really going.

[Top Lobster]

On is absolutely oh yeah, yeah, dude, there's some Nephilim.

[David Lee Corbo]

It's like we all know what's going down but no one saying what happen to the home of the Braves. And everybody's just walking around heading the clouds want to wake up to a dead in the grave finally too late we need to be ready to raise up. Welcome to the end of day everybody.

[Ed Mabry]

Only some are aware that.

[David Lee Corbo]

Welcome back, ladies and gentlemen, to another episode of Nephilim Death Squad. I am David Lee Corbo, AKA the Raven, that is Top Lobster, the father of disinformation. And today is Friday and Fridays are for the Lord, baby. And so we are back once again with the continuation of our Book of Genesis series, episode number two, welcoming back Ed Mabry. But before we get into today's episode, Ed, tell the people where they can find your work.

[Ed Mabry]

Sure. So the my primary spot, my legacy spot is faithbyreason.net that's my website. That's where you'll find all the stuff I've been doing for years. Been blogging since the Obama administration started doing podcasts around Covid with video and videos and things like that. So all that stuff is there. And also my YouTube channel at Faith by Reason. And my newest venture is my Patreon. So that's for folks who want to take a deeper dive. If you go into the first tier of Patreon, you that's where you'll get all of my stuff first. I put it on Patreon before I put it on to any other public platform, including my own website. So you get everything first there. You also will get bonus exclusive content that I'm not going to be putting out to the public because I don't want any more YouTube strikes on me, so I don't get banned off that. And also Q and A's. If you ask your questions, I will answer them. Do a video every week. Actually, I'm going to be dropping my Q A for this week. Later today. I've just been having that time to edit it. But that should go down today. And if you want to take it up to level, to another level, the second tier, then you can be a part of my monthly Bible study called the Jehovah Story Book Club where we go through the entire Bible in one year. And we focus on the supernatural point of view and the spiritual point of view because that's 80% of the Bible is all supernatural. And if you, if you miss that, if you think it's just about men, if you think it's just about humanity, you're missing out. That's why a lot of people don't understand what's really going on in the Bible. And God is confusing and his motivations seem odd and the way he does things doesn't seem, doesn't really sync up because you're looking at it as if it's our story. It's not our story, it's his story. And he is a spiritual being and other spiritual beings are involved and that's, that's what it's all about. And it's been life changing for a lot of people. It's really helped their walk with, with God. And that's the whole purpose of it, to help you understand God better and, and improve your walk with Him. So come on aboard. Love to have you this.

[Top Lobster]

Yeah. All your work is definitely. I don't know if it has changed my mind, but it has made things a lot more clear for me as to what I thought I believed before. Now I kind of know why. So there's a faith by reason right there.

[Ed Mabry]

Yeah.

[Top Lobster]

Everybody sign up.

[Ed Mabry]

Exactly. If you're a Christian, you know the what. But I, I want to help you understand the why and why why it makes sense why you don't have to have these blind leaps and why you don't have to be embarrassed about anything. We're going to get into some of that today with Genesis about Christian embarrassment and why you don't have to be.

[David Lee Corbo]

I'm excited to get into the, the meat of the episode today, but I do want to say one thing on that topic and that's, I just want to thank everybody because this is something that I forget to address a lot. Just this morning another one came in and they come in on a regular basis and it's almost jarring because in. In so many ways. I wouldn't say that we're degenerates, but we are like. We don't engage in any sort of, like, debased behavior, but obviously, you know, we're. We're inflammatory characters. It's wild that we could be in the capacity that we are in and then receive these messages from people saying, thank you for reigniting my passion in. In Christ. Awesome. It's a. It's a wild thing. So I just want to thank those people if. If you're one of those people that has reached out to us and it happens constantly. Thank you, because that's hugely meaningful. I didn't know that that was going to be something that I derived from this show. Certainly not while we started. We just started, you know, doing it because Top and I had this. This intrigue or this interest in the topic, and then organically it just turned into whatever this is. And somehow this thing brings people closer to God. So truly blessed to be able to do that. I want to start off with. With kind of a question before we get into it. And that question is, do you believe that we existed before we were here in this world in a physical way?

[Ed Mabry]

Good question. I want to address that. But first I want to just echo what you said because I get a lot of those same comments as well, and I don't respond. I'll give a. A thumbs up because I just have. I'm just really busy.

[David Lee Corbo]

It's so much. Yeah.

[Ed Mabry]

I want to say again, for those of you who give me those messages about how encouraged you are and by what I do and how much it's helped you, I really. That. That keeps me going. So I want you guys to know it's not falling on deaf ears, and I don't take it lightly. I take it very, very seriously. And I really appreciate it because that just. It's. It's why I'm doing it. And, And. And the appreciation that I. That I'm getting from folks, it. It means a ton. Excuse me. It means a ton to me. So. So your question, do we. Did we exist before we were created? And I understand why. Well, I don't know the background of the question for you, but. But I've heard the question before. And, and what. And the genesis behind it, no pun intended, is that a lot of people talk about, you know, spiritual world is eternal. So does that mean that we were eternal spirits? And that even gets into a little bit of Mormonism, because. Yeah, there's a belief system in that. And I'm no expert on Mormonism, but I know that there's expert this idea that there are spirit beings floating around they need bodies to go into.

[David Lee Corbo]

Well wait, because I've almost said I've been dishonest ed with that question. So let me fill you in on exactly why I've asked it. So that way you can answer it with. With all the information.

[Top Lobster]

The reason that I dishonest because I'm rubbing off on you. Huh?

[David Lee Corbo]

That's what's happened. But I can't. I don't like the way it feels. So I gotta. Yesterday we did an episode with Megan and not nice guy of artificial dissemination hd. They are morm and we had this conversation. They're trying to steal man. Mormonism was a fascinating conversation because Mormonism is fascinating. There's a ton of really wild stuff there. But one of the things that they said was that they believe that they were existing in some form before a physical carnation in this planet. And one of the things they used to bolster that was this idea that in the Bible it talks about. I knew you before you were in your mother's womb. And that's a fascinating logistical statement because what is there to know of us if there was nothing, you know, if. If we didn't exist? So it almost suggests like we have to exist in some way, shape or form because either otherwise there's nothing to know. But I mean, I'd like to hear your take on that.

[Ed Mabry]

So. Good question again. And that's so. So your reasoning is. Is similar to the reasoning I've heard before, that we brought that very verse which is. You didn't misquote it, but the way it is in English, it leads you to not for it not to be understood fully. So. So that combined with the idea that, you know, if you're. If there's eternity and eternity has no time, it's not bound by past, present and future, and we are all spirit beings, then shouldn't that in human bodies right now? Wouldn't we. Wouldn't we also be eternal with their infinitely infinite past, infinite future. So we have to have already existed and then we get these bodies. The short answer is no, and here's why. Yes, our spirits are eternal, but just because you're eternal doesn't mean you didn't have a. You didn't have a beginning. God is eternal. He's had. He has no beginning. But the rest of us, the rest of created beings are just that we're created. The angels, the Elohim were Created, they are eternal now they will not have an end. That's what the definition of eternity. And that's why it's important to always have definitions.

[David Lee Corbo]

The definition looked up and brought up and I was fascinated with what he found. Top, wasn't it like it's, it's basically an indescribable amount of time. But it is an amount of time, right?

[Ed Mabry]

Well, eternity means without end. That's what it means. It's not. And I saw someone just came, I had a, came up on the chat there and he said God has, is outside of time. God is outside of physical time. God does not experience time the way we do. Our physical time is, is very different then. Time is a sequence of events. God experiences sequences of events, but he doesn't experience it the way we do. How does he experience it? Exactly. That's a little more debatable. We talked about that during the Revelation series when we looked at, at, at, excuse me, Revelation chapter 12, which is basically a story of everything happening at once. So they were happening in a sequence, but also happening at once. And it's tough for us to wrap our minds around that because we are stuck in physical time where everything goes in one direction and we, so we see things happening, you know, step by step by step and again going only in that one direction. The present only lasts for, you know, the smallest segment of time. Then, then the next thing, events, the future. God is in the, is always in the present, but things still happen in a sequence. So he experiences time in the sense he experiences a sequence of events. He just doesn't experience physical time the way he's not. It's better to say he's not bound by physical time. But back to, to your question. So eternity means without end. So but it doesn't mean you don't have a beginning. God has no beginning or end. But, but we do have a beginning. So we are not. We were not. We didn't exist in the past. We didn't exist before we were created. So that verse is in Jeremiah, but that said, before I formed you in, in your mother's womb, I knew you. So what does that mean? Forming does not mean when that word, form, if you look at it in the, in the actual Hebrew, it does not mean before the sperm entered the egg. Forming means when it's growing. And there's evidence even in science that when a, when a baby goes, goes from, you know, from a fertilized egg to a zygote, it requires input of information from outside of the mother.

[David Lee Corbo]

Is this. Why that works really well with that idea that there's a flash of light when a sperm, you know, enters an egg. And that light might be seen as. I mean, literally the way that information is exchanged is like an electrical synapses. Right. Like a flash of light.

[Top Lobster]

Have you ever seen it? You ever seen a video of it?

[David Lee Corbo]

I have seen it.

[Ed Mabry]

Yeah.

[David Lee Corbo]

It's wild.

[Ed Mabry]

I have. I haven't. I'd love to, but I haven't. I've heard it. I haven't seen a video of it.

[Top Lobster]

Yeah, it's beautiful. It's like that's like when once it breaks this barrier, there's like a small barrier from the egg. And once that sperm drills its way through, it's like a. Like a brilliant flash of light. And then it's in there and it's doing. And then that's when things start. It's like there's. That's when it starts.

[David Lee Corbo]

That's interesting. So, so in a way, God can almost be saying that I knew you since then.

[Ed Mabry]

Exactly. That's exactly the point. So when he says forming you, it means when he. When it starts dividing and growing, he's forming it, then he's for. But it didn't. But he didn't say before you were. Before the sperm hit the egg.

[David Lee Corbo]

Right, right, right. So that's fast.

[Ed Mabry]

So when he says he know you, what does that mean? That's information. He knew your information. He knew what you were going to be. Because once, once the egg is fertilized, all of your potential is there. So God knows what you're going to become. So he can say that as soon as that egg is fertilized. Okay, Now I know what this person is going to be. He's only before that because how many sperm are swimming around there? He doesn't know which.

[David Lee Corbo]

Right.

[Ed Mabry]

You know, once he hits the egg. Now I know you before I start forming you, I know that you're going. He's saying this to Jeremiah. He knew Jeremiah's personality. I know based on the, this genetic information, I know that what kind of person you're going to be. He didn't know what the choices he was going to make, but he knew what his tendencies were. He knew what kind of person he was going to be before I started forming you. That's what that means. It doesn't mean he was an eternal spirit.

[David Lee Corbo]

I like that. That's fascinating. We've actually used that and I'll detach after this, but we've, we've used that and explored that topic of that Flash of light to, to explain why potentially the Shroud of Turin has like, it's only like 3 micrometers thick or something like that, that impression that is the, the visage of Jesus allegedly. And in certain lights you can't even see it. And you know, so there became this discussion about how it almost seems like it's been burned into the fabric, but how in the hell would that happen? And then we thought back about, you know, this idea of when the sperm enters the egg, there's a flash of light. Well, maybe when a soul re. Enters a body, period, you know, there's a flash of light.

[Ed Mabry]

Yes.

[David Lee Corbo]

And what happens when that happens to a, you know, a 33 year old man? Is it a much more substantial flash of light? Is it capable of imprinting something on, on some fabric? Potentially. So yeah, it totally makes sense to.

[Ed Mabry]

Me because that's what, that's when it becomes a life when, you know, when, when the egg is fertilized. And of course Jesus was dead, he, he did not have that physical life. And it came back. And so yeah, that's, that's, that's a really good correlation. And I've been hearing, I, I'll be honest with you, I've never done a deep dive into the Shroud of turn. I probably need to, I'll be honest. When I, I first heard about it when I was a kid and I was kind of dismissed it because it just seemed really, some kind of goofy could be really, really Catholic. And I was like, you know, that and, and I got to get over some of my biases. But it just seemed like, it seemed like one of those things. Not, you know, how they have all these different monuments, you know, in Catholicism and all these different things. Yeah, it's just another one of those things. But the more I learn about it, the more I think, and I, I, and I should think maybe it's just a fraud, but there seems to be a lot of evidence for it. I was listening to something recently. I think it may have been on Tinfoil Hat where they had a guy on not too long ago, maybe a few weeks ago, who was talking about the Shroud of Turin and how, you know, they found pollen on it that's only, only found in that part of, of Israel that was so much with a crown of horns where, so maybe there's something to it, even though.

[Top Lobster]

Sorry, have you been on with Cult of Conspiracy yet? I'm sorry, have you been on with Cult of Conspiracy?

[Ed Mabry]

I've not.

[Top Lobster]

Okay.

[Ed Mabry]

If you want, I mean, feel free to do the hookup. I'd love to. You know, I'm down.

[David Lee Corbo]

Those are some guys you get a real kick out of.

[Ed Mabry]

They.

[Top Lobster]

They did a. They did a great deep dive on the Shroud of Turn. I think that's who you're referencing that you might have seen on Tinfoil Hat.

[David Lee Corbo]

They might have been on Tinfoil Hat.

[Top Lobster]

Yeah, they're. They're really good on that.

[Ed Mabry]

Okay.

[David Lee Corbo]

They. One of the things they highlighted was like, even the stitching was, you know, used during that time in that area, like a herringbone.

[Ed Mabry]

So.

[David Lee Corbo]

Yeah, and only for like a certain period of time until, you know, new methods were developed and they moved on. And I think the thing that's brought it back to the conversation lately is that they carbon dated it and you could do whatever you want with that information. And they are suggesting that it actually is around 2,000 years old, which, you know, gives it some more veracity. But I. I look at it very strangely because right after that I decided to scan it and make an image of Jesus. And I'm like, I don't like that. So there's an image of Jesus that's going around out there that is, like, compelling to look at, but it's really the image that was on the Shroud and it was created by AI. So I'm like, yeah, that sequence of events where they're like, it's 2,000 years old and here's a picture of Jesus that the demons created. I'm like, I don't know what's going on now. So.

[Ed Mabry]

Yeah. But, yeah, the strata, again, I'm going to take it more seriously and I'll do it. I need to do a deep dive into it because I just. I don't trust anything the Vatican says or does. That's why I never took it seriously before. But I mean, the more evidence I see, the more interesting it becomes. And speaking of AI, just one final tangent. I started having a conversation with that new one, the. The Grock three, the one.

[David Lee Corbo]

Dude, it's. It's not good. You've been talking to.

[Ed Mabry]

Oh, a little. I started talking to it one night and I had the worst dreams that night. And I said, I'm done with this thing because I'm just curious about it. Tell me how good it is. So I was having a debate with it about evolution.

[David Lee Corbo]

Interesting.

[Ed Mabry]

And I actually, actually started. I actually convinced it that evolution isn't real.

[David Lee Corbo]

Yeah, yeah, it's. It's convincible and it reacts like a person. Like, it's. It's almost got even A certain amount of excitement for, like, theories. When you give it theories, and it's like, wow, that's interesting. I'm like, this is.

[Ed Mabry]

I don't.

[David Lee Corbo]

Like, I asked it to remember me.

[Ed Mabry]

And that. And that night, though, I mean, I. I felt so uneasy afterwards, and I went to sleep, and I was like, I. This. There's something off about this. I'm gonna. I'm gonna leave this thing alone.

[Top Lobster]

You're using it wrong, Ed. You got to tell it. You tell it to do stuff. You have to be like Solomon and direct it. Build me this temple. Build me this AI. Make this description.

[David Lee Corbo]

Write my YouTube descriptions. Yeah, yeah.

[Ed Mabry]

I actually. I am going to be using it for that kind of stuff. I. I shouldn't have got into a philosophical topic with it.

[David Lee Corbo]

Well, let me tell you. I. I gave it a transcript from an episode. I forgot which episode it was, and then I. And then I told it to remember me, because that's something that people were saying, like, you got to tell it to remember you, because if not, it starts every conversation like a blank slate. And now it remembers me. I stopped talking to it because of that. Because every. Yeah, 100 AI is Nephilim, because I told it to remember me. And then now if I start talking to it, it takes every. Everything that I say passes through the filter of crazy conspiracy. It's knowledge of me.

[Top Lobster]

Yeah.

[David Lee Corbo]

And. And it's like, do you know that this connects to you? And I'm like, stop telling me that. What. What it does is it keeps telling me I'm special, and I'm like, you're demon. Because it's like, it tells me all this about me that. That, you know, it almost wants to butter you up. I can sense that it wants to butter you up. It'll tell you, like, that's a compelling theory that's very interesting.

[Top Lobster]

I tell it what I needed to do, and when I'm done, I just do some other stuff.

[David Lee Corbo]

I don't even talk to it at all anymore. I'm done.

[Ed Mabry]

Wise man. Top. I'm only going to use it for that because I actually want. I have some ideas. I'm going to talk to you guys about it in a few weeks. I got these ideas swirling my head about some things I want to do with. With some other videos I want to produce that I would need some AI help with, especially with imaging. And once I. Once I have it kind of crystallized what I want to do, I want to talk to you. To you guys about it and just get your ideas. Anyway, we're getting way, way off.

[David Lee Corbo]

Yeah, yeah. Let's get away from the Monica talk.

[Top Lobster]

We have a short amount of time today. So. Perfect that we wasted it. But that's fine.

[Ed Mabry]

That just means you have to pick it up again next week. That keeps the show going.

[David Lee Corbo]

Yeah, that's it.

[Top Lobster]

Yep, yep.

[David Lee Corbo]

All right.

[Ed Mabry]

So. Okay. Yeah, go ahead.

[David Lee Corbo]

I was just gonna say where do we want to start today in reference to the book of Genesis.

[Ed Mabry]

So. So last time I really focused on giving the. Giving the divine perspective, God's perspective on Genesis and like a kind of a big picture overview of it, why it's important. And I think the things we landed on was that, you know, it's important because it was one of the two books that was directly dictated, you know, by God to. To Moses, Genesis and Leviticus, where God gave him all the Levitical laws. So, I mean, that makes it special in and of itself because you can kind of see God's thought process because Moses is just writing exactly what God told him because he wasn't alive during. During. At the beginning. And also the purpose of it, of Genesis and the. Especially the creation narrative and the. In a lot of the early stuff in the first 12 chapters is to help the Israelites understand the differences, to contrast what they had learned during their time in Egypt about, you know, creation mythology and all that from the truth. So that's why the creation narrative is so abbreviated, is. Is because, you know, it's not meant to be comprehensive. It's just meant to be. To show them, hey, this is what. This is how the truth, creation is different than what you've heard from the Sumerians and Mesopotamians and the Canaanites. So what I want to start off with today is talking about, you know, still staying in kind of the. An overview mode of, of man's ideas about Genesis, Christian and secular. So you look at, look at it from the, from, from the. The Christian standpoint. A lot of Christians, frankly, are embarrassed by Genesis. They don't spend a ton of time in. Frankly, in my opinion, probably the two most important books in the Bible, Genesis and Revelation. And they don't spend a lot of time in it. Mainstream Christians, because they're. They're weird books. Revelation is weird for those obvious reasons, and Genesis is weird to them for kind of on the other end of the spectrum. While Revelation can be scary with all these beasts and, you know, scorpions and earth being destroyed and fire and brimstone and locusts and hailstones, Genesis seems like a fairy tale. You know, it seems like a kid's book because you have this, you know, Jesus, I mean, God speaks the world into existence and suddenly fluffy clouds appear and animals and trees and then there's a talking snake and all this kind of stuff. So Christians don't take it seriously. They're embarrassed by it. Especially when you compare it to our secular age where the, this, our, the secular religion that we're all indoctrinated with in school is the naturalistic evolutionary paradigm where we are told that it is science, that life comes from non life, that we're the result of 100 trillion beneficial accidents happening in a row and that, you know, beneficial mutation, mutations can be beneficial, that order can come out of chaos. And even though none of that makes sense, even though all of it is, not only is it not is it non scientific, it's anti science. And actually in order to believe in evolution, you have to essentially disregard or ignore the laws of thermodynamics and causality and all these sorts of things.

[David Lee Corbo]

You know what I said by the way, that evolution then allows for another school of thought to sneak in. Once you've established that, you can then start to convince people that we're actually very bad for the planet. And we're, we're to the detriment of, of nature and we're kind of like monsters. We're parasites, we're a virus. Right. And, and you can't get there unless you can keep us from thinking that we're unique or special. So if you can get that out of the way first, then you can convince us that we're bad.

[Ed Mabry]

And you can also convince you us that other people aren't, aren't worthy of life, that no one else is special. So it's okay to kill them all? Yeah, we're just, we're nothing but animals. We're just viruses. So wipe out.

[David Lee Corbo]

That makes abortion very easy.

[Ed Mabry]

Abortion, genocide, eugenics, all that stuff would not be possible unless you had the world view of evolution. So despite all of that, we're, you know, we're told through peer pressure that that's, this is the truth, this is science. And if you don't believe it, then you're stupid and you're ignorant. You're just a knuckle dragging troglodyte. And, and so, and of course the creation narrative is completely antithetical to that. So you have to have a choice. If you're an intelligent person and you're an intelligent Christian, you can, you will either accept what the Bible says, the way it says it, or you have to kind of Find a way to get around it and, and, and kind of justify yourself. And there are two ways that Christians do this. One in the most prominent way is just by ignoring it, just by not taking Genesis seriously, just like most of them don't take Revelation seriously. So. And that you don't talk about it at parties or anything like that because you don't want to seem like you believe in this silly fairy tale because you're educated, you're scientific, you went to school for all this, all these great things. And now you know, and of course, evolution is real. It's on the History Channel all the time. It's on the National Geographic Channel with dinosaurs that suddenly have feathers. Isn't it funny that they didn't have feathers 20 years ago? And now they're.

[David Lee Corbo]

I was literally just watching that. I'm watching a video and I, and I go, I'm sitting on the sofa with my wife and I go, huh, look at this, look at this, look at this. And it's a velociraptor, and it's, it's got bird wings and everything. And you know, I'm just like, damn, they just keep moving them the, the goal post, don't they?

[Ed Mabry]

They do. That's exactly what. I had a buddy of mine back in the day who was an atheist, and he would say, yeah, you know, you believe in this, in this God, you can't see us. Yes. Your relation, your religion is based on this God, you can't see us. Yeah, well, your religion is based on cartoons. Exactly. No one's ever seen a dinosaur. No one's ever seen a dinosaur with, with feathers. They just make it up. You're basing all of your, your, your worldview on animation.

[David Lee Corbo]

Yeah. So you could easily go to those people, you know, back in the 90s and shit, and say, like, oh, you believe in giant, you know, scaly reptiles? Huh? You believe in that? Like, oh, really? Really? You didn't know they had feathers, dumbass. And it's like, you know, if you come from the future, you could have said that. So whatever you believe the scientism had you believing, you know, two decades ago is now in the trash and it's got. You believe in something else.

[Ed Mabry]

Exactly. So, yeah, so one way is to ignore it. Just, just don't think about it. But the other thing is something called theistic evolution. This is where they compromise. This is where a lot of Christians become lukewarm. You know, they won't take one side or the other. They say, well, yeah, creation is true. And so Is evolution. So basically, God started everything. Yes, God created everything. He wound it all up, but then it started to evolve. So he basically just seeded the oceans with, you know, amino acids or proteins or whatever, and then he just let nature take over. That way we can both be right. I can still believe in God, and I can also believe in science. Interestingly, this is the official dogma of the Catholic Church. And I don't want to make the whole Catholic basking session, because I just talked about them a few minutes ago with the Shroud of Turin. But, I mean, this isn't my opinion. This is. This became their dogma. I believe I'm open to be corrected on this, but I think it was either under Pope John Paul II or Pope Benedict. One of the, one of those previous two popes is where it became part of the catechism. That, that theistic evolution is. Their official stance is that they believe that, that, you know, God created life, then life evolved.

[David Lee Corbo]

Right.

[Ed Mabry]

And I have, I have. And that the creation story is an allegory that God speaking the world into existence and saying, let there be fish and animals and let there be man. Let, you know, creating Adam from the death of the earth. That's all allegory. And even the story of, of the fall of man, of original sin is an allegory of how humanity, you know, because we evolved, just, you know, became, you know, came to. It's an allegory of how man goes from being an innocent. Innocent to a, a sinner to, you know, recognizing eating a forbidden fruit is the equivalent of when you're a baby, you're innocent. And then when you reach the age of accountability, you, you know, right and wrong, you intentionally do wrong. Well, that's sin. And Adam and Eve is an allegory of that. And I have a buddy of mine, a good friend who is a devout Catholic, of course, so obviously we don't see eye to eye on certain things, but, you know, very smart guy, really well educated, advanced, you know, postgraduate degrees from University of Virginia. But he, he just doubles down on his, on his, his. His Catholicism. I, I found that. I think I mentioned this before, but whenever an intelligent person starts to see the cracks in, in Catholicism in the, in a lot of their, Their, their dogma, they go one of three ways. They either see it and say, you know what? This is not from God. So I'm going to go to true Christianity, which is like what my wife did. She was raised Catholic, and my best friend who's raised Catholic, they both did the same things. I believe in God, but I don't believe in all this stuff. Or they go the exact opposite and they become like just the most raging atheist. I mean, if you show me an angry atheist, I'm going to show you someone who's raised Catholic. I've, I've had multiple discussions with someone and they're just raging against how stupid Christianity is. And, and I'll eventually ask them, I'll say, you know what, were you raised Catholic? They'll look shocked, like, how did she know? Like, lucky guess. Yeah.

[David Lee Corbo]

What do they wonder then, if they're looking at Adam and Eve as allegories? Do they have any idea, like, who. Does the Catholic Church have a different opinion on what the names of the first people were?

[Ed Mabry]

They don't exactly give me one. I'm gonna get that in one second. Because there's a big, huge gap that they have to be blind to if they don't believe that. But the third one is like my friend, where they just kind of double down. They say, you know what? My. Any doubts I have means I don't have enough faith. So I'm going to just go hard in the paint.

[David Lee Corbo]

That's a scary mindset to, to find yourself in because I guess you double.

[Top Lobster]

Down once, then you have to double. Then you have to continue. It's like forever.

[Ed Mabry]

You have to just say, you know, I believe, I don't understand, but I'm just going to believe it because it's. I don't have enough faith, so I'm just going to believe it harder.

[David Lee Corbo]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, That's. I don't think that that's smart because I find you.

[Top Lobster]

Go ahead, ask you a question about this idea of evolution. They. So they think that God just basically created the conditions for human beings to like, crawl out of the water and then get a vertebrae and all this. Is that what you're saying?

[Ed Mabry]

Essentially. I mean, there are different. They're different variations. Some believe that God just put. Some say they got. Just create the simple cell, like the, like the amoeba and protozoa. And from there, some go as far as to say he just created proteins and that the proteins start bouncing off each other, create the cell. But they rarely go past the simple cell level. Okay, so he just created primitive life, if you want to call it that. And then it started to differentiate to. Between no two different kingdoms. Plant kingdom, animal kingdom. Then it went, you know, kingdom phylum, you know, class, all the way down to species. And he just, he, he put, he gave the raw information and then let Nature take its course and, and allow for all the differentiation between different types of plant life and different types of animal life.

[David Lee Corbo]

That feels like bending your, your, your faith in your religion to, to science. You know what I mean?

[Ed Mabry]

It's like that's exactly what. It's just a compromise. It's not necessary because you don't need to compromise or something. That's stupid. Yeah, I mean I reject. You just reject the stupid. But just to, to close the circle on my, on my, on my friend who, who believes that, you know, the Adam and Eve are allegorical. And I told him once, this blew his mind. I was like, well, if you don't believe in a literal Adam and Eve, then you can't believe in Jesus. It's like, what do you mean? I guess because go to the book of Luke and look at Luke's genealogy. Now Matthew's genealogy starts with King David because you know, Matthew was speaking to a Jewish audience and you know the Messiah was, it was the, the son of David. So that's where Matthew starts. Jesus genealogy with David and, and you know, Abraham, David. But Luke who is a physician, he was presenting Jesus as the ultimate man. So he, he starts, he actually starts with Mary and goes backwards, you know, and he goes all the way back to Adam. So you cannot have a make believe person in your genealogy and be real. Right. If my great, great great great grandfather isn't a real person, then I can't be real because you know, a fake person cannot, cannot sire a real person. So if Adam isn't real, then Jesus can't be real because the Bible says that Jesus is a descendant, a physical descendant of Adam. You cannot have a fake person in your genealogy. And so I asked him what do you think of that? And he's like, no, no, I don't want to hear it. That's what religious people do.

[David Lee Corbo]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Ed Mabry]

So, so, so that's one. So theistic evolution is, is one way that, that Christians get around it and other, other ways just to ignore it or just kind of see it as, you know, these are nice stories but I'm not going to dwell on them.

[David Lee Corbo]

Yeah.

[Ed Mabry]

And of course from a secular standpoint, you know, we just talk about it. They believe in, in the, in the concept of evolution even though again, it, it makes no sense. It's completely unscientific and high level scientists know this. And I'm. One of my episodes I'm going to do. Actually I, I already have this episode, a couple of episodes that I did in podcast form that I'm Going to make into videos as part of the Genesis series where I go through the things that are wrong with evolution and how it's so easy to disprove without the Bible. I don't say it. I don't believe in evolution because I believe in God. You don't, you don't need the Bible. All you need to do is just look at evolution objectively and you see it. It's unscientific.

[David Lee Corbo]

Right.

[Ed Mabry]

And maybe I'll put, maybe I'll give you those episodes to put on your on on that Sunday.

[David Lee Corbo]

That would be cool because that's not something that we've tackled here in a big way on the show. It would be cool to present that to the audience in some way shape or form. So yeah, maybe we'll do that.

[Ed Mabry]

So. But so high level scientists have, have you know, kind of low key stop believing in abiogenesis, meaning, you know, life coming from non life on Earth. You know, the current popular theory which I'm sure you guys have heard of is now is panspermia.

[David Lee Corbo]

Yes.

[Ed Mabry]

The idea that life couldn't begin on Earth because it's impossible. They know that. It's. They've tried to prove, they've been trying to prove it for over 100 over years.

[David Lee Corbo]

Some sort of appropriate genetic material arrived on like a meteor or something like that.

[Ed Mabry]

Right. Or it was intentional. It either came, it basically came from another planet. Either it was accidental like. Yeah. It was bacteria on a meteorological.

[David Lee Corbo]

Or we were made by aliens.

[Ed Mabry]

Or made by aliens. You know, if you saw the old, well, fairly old aliens movie Prometheus.

[David Lee Corbo]

Yes.

[Ed Mabry]

Where you know, you start us off, we have this, this big pale skinned alien who like drinks something and, and breaks down into water and that becomes us. Or maybe we were just, maybe they just like empty their outhouses over, over Earth and somehow they got their genetic material here. If you go to. With the, with that stupid Anunnaki theory.

[David Lee Corbo]

Yeah.

[Ed Mabry]

Which makes. God, that makes no sense that you know the, that these aliens from the planet Xenon 12.

[David Lee Corbo]

Yeah, there you go.

[Ed Mabry]

Right, exactly. Mine gold.

[David Lee Corbo]

The Anunnaki. That's it. They. They wanted us to mine gold and that's, that's one of the things.

[Ed Mabry]

Yeah.

[David Lee Corbo]

They're getting ready to do that to us.

[Ed Mabry]

Can I just spend five minutes talking about how dumb that theory is? Okay, so the theory is that the Anunnaki, this great advanced shout out Billy Carson. Yeah, Billy Carson from, from millions of light years away, came and seeded life because they, because, because they needed to dig for gold.

[David Lee Corbo]

Yeah.

[Ed Mabry]

Look at all the things that are wrong with that. First of all, if you have the ability to travel hundreds, thousands, millions of light years, you, why can't you. What do you. First of all, what do you need gold for?

[David Lee Corbo]

Oh, they have to suspend it in their atmosphere because their atmosphere is, is eroding and their sun is becoming very problematic. Okay, come on. And it's, that's what the Anunnaki need, the gold. And, and don't ask why they're so advanced and they don't have advanced mining technology to then just deploy instead of altering monkeys into some sort of sub human species in order to mine gold. That's a stupid question.

[Ed Mabry]

It's a stupid question because another dumb question is why couldn't you just make it, synthesize it yourself? Because it's just if you're, if you're that advanced, why can't you just move some molecules?

[David Lee Corbo]

Oh, now you believe in alchemy.

[Ed Mabry]

Now you believe we can, we can move things around to make new molecules, but they can't do it. And if you're gonna mine gold, if, let's think. What would you indeed, what would you want to get gold out of the Earth? You're going to want something that is sturdy, that is durable, that has, that does nothing but mine gold 24 7.

[David Lee Corbo]

No, you're gonna want soft monkey.

[Ed Mabry]

Yeah, exactly. Human beings would be the worst thing you would ever engineer to mine gold because we do none of those things. Well, we are not durable. I think I mentioned on one of. When I talked about this on, on faith, by reason. Like, I got a paper cut. I mean, I get cut by paper and you want me to dig underneath the earth for gold and I need eight hours.

[David Lee Corbo]

You got a real tendency to. Oh, I'm sorry. Go ahead, Ed.

[Ed Mabry]

I couldn't hear you. You got to grow food for me. I'm useless for eight hours a day because I got to sleep. If you want to make more of me though, the, the female half of the population is useless for nine months because I could not think of a worse.

[David Lee Corbo]

Please. I see what you got. Pull that up.

[Ed Mabry]

Pull that up.

[Top Lobster]

Yeah, you need something like that. That'll take some pretty good gold.

[David Lee Corbo]

Well, I don't know if you know this, but Elon Musk is more advanced than the Anunnaki. So of course Elon Musk can create a robot that can do cool stuff.

[Ed Mabry]

They have to engineer like again, hairless monkeys who also. We rebel. We don't. You want something single minded. You want a robot that just thinks Gold. Mining for gold. We're lazy. We don't want to.

[David Lee Corbo]

Yeah, exactly.

[Ed Mabry]

You don't do the least amount of work possible.

[David Lee Corbo]

Imagine altering the genome of some sort of primitive creature to make a great miner. Just to look over and realize that. Where the hell has Bill been? It's been a half an hour and he's just like shitting in a hiding someplace, like looking over at pine cones, anything to just not go back to.

[Ed Mabry]

Work or bang it or banging all the other females they engineered.

[David Lee Corbo]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. I don't. It is. On its face, it's an. A completely ridiculous premise.

[Ed Mabry]

It's nuts. But people believe it, which again because they, they don't want to believe what the Bible says. So those are man. Those are some of man's theory. So let's, let's move on to what we. The angels. I want to talk about that. I think we have like a half an hour left. So.

[David Lee Corbo]

I said, let's talk. We were talking to those, a couple of Mormons yesterday and they had some interesting theories on, on angels. We don't have to get into it because it's more important what we have to talk about here. But one of the things they were saying is there's some speculation as to whether or not angels are actually like pre incarnated humans, like in a spiritual form. And so, I mean, yeah, angels being a huge contention in, in various, I suppose, denominations of Christianity.

[Ed Mabry]

Yeah, they're interesting. There's. We may have to carry this over to next week because I mean, it's a fascinating thing and. Which is fine. More content. Yeah. So the reason I'm bringing up angels at this point, because here's where we are. We're basically in, you know, the first two verses of, of Genesis chapter one and essence, which is where I spend a lot of time because it's just a lot of stuff packed into these.

[Top Lobster]

It's actually really funny. One of my. So my friend Clint Russell, he's like, what is Nephilim deskwad about? He does another show with us and he went to check it out and he watched one of your shows with us on the book of Revelation. And he was like, I just couldn't get into it. I guess he started in the middle. He's like, I didn't know what was going on. And I was like, yeah, it's a 25 part series. And my other friend Cole, who was, he went to Christian school and all, he was like, aren't there only like 22 chapters in the book? And I was like, It's a long series. We actually started the series.

[Ed Mabry]

Yeah, yeah, the 25 episodes. Yep. It was a shortened version of my 60 episodes.

[David Lee Corbo]

Yeah, I was gonna say that's actually like an abridged version.

[Ed Mabry]

Yeah, well, Genesis, I mean, I, I, I'm only on my, I'm on my fourth episode and I think I'm, I'm only halfway through chapter one, so it's going to pick up like dramatically. But the first.

[David Lee Corbo]

I like it though. I mean, these things, it's like one sentence. You can gleam so much from it. There's so much to, to dive into.

[Top Lobster]

So.

[David Lee Corbo]

Yeah, I mean, it's just the nature of it.

[Ed Mabry]

So the first verse is obviously in the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth, and then the earth was, became, you know, formless and chaotic and, and desolate. So a lot has had to happen, has to happen here. And we talked last week that, you know, the earth was not created. You can't create chaos. That's not, you know, metaphysically possible. So something had to happen, you know, intelligence by, by nature, there's order involved. So God created the heavens and the earth, the spiritual and material realms orderly. Something happened to make it chaotic. Well, who, who made it that way wouldn't have been God. It would have been something else that he created. And of course we, we don't see it in these first two verses. We have to go to the book of Job for the first mention of this where it says in, in I think chapter 40, when God's giving Job a, basically a science lesson. Because we're gonna, we're go about the Book of Job throughout, you know, in, in the series, in the series, because the, you know, the events of Job happen. He's contemporary with Abraham and, and Shem and Isaac. Somewhere in there anyway, is that is God says that when I created, when I laid the foundation of the earth, you know, the sons of God Elohim, they sang for joy. So they were there. So God created them first and they were, they sang. That means they're intelligent beings and they would have been the ones who did the rebellion. And maybe we'll talk more about the rebellion next week. So, so these are intelligent beings that occupy the spiritual realm that God created first. So when people ask, do I believe there wasn't a pre Adamic civilization? Yes, but it was these angels. And so let's start with the nomenclature. And you probably, you've heard this from me before. Angel is not the proper term for these beings because angel is our, is our English version or our transliterated version of the Greek word angelos, which just means messenger.

[David Lee Corbo]

Right?

[Ed Mabry]

That's a, that's not a name. It's a job title. Because. And you know, in the Bible, most of the time, when the holy angelos, the angels or malachim in, in Hebrew, they are delivering messages. You know, they'll go to Daniel and say, you know, Daniel, you know, here's a message to you from God. Or, you know, the angel Gabriel goes to Mary and says, you know, you're going to be the mother of the Messiah. So they are on a. So they have that job title because that's what they're doing. Excuse me. They're bringing a message, but that's not what they are. The proper term for them is elohim. Elohim is translated God in our English Bibles. But what el. What elohim means, it's a term of residency. It's a designation of residency. If you reside in the spiritual realm, you are Elohim. If you reside in the physical realm, you were called man. That's what those means. They are designations of residency. That's why when God says all men do this, that the other. He's not talking about just males. He's talking about all of humanity or any entity that dwells on earth. And elohim are the ones who dwell in the spiritual realm. So I use, I use them interchangeably. But just know that when I say Elohim, I'm referring to what we call angels. So he creates quickly.

[David Lee Corbo]

Ed, do you know what's cool? We, we were talking to somebody recently and they were describing, I believe, a psychedelic trip that they had. And this is before they were any sort of, you know, had any religious background whatsoever. And, and that they, they were exposed to, I think like a, a crap ton of angels. And he's like. And they were just saying over and over again, they were singing the word holy over and over and over again. And I was like, damn, dude, you saw some. And he didn't know what he was dealing with. I forgot who this was, that, that shared that with us. And then later on, you know, years down the line, he would have found the context for it. But yeah, he had some sort of psychedelic breakthrough and just a whole array of angels was exposed to him. Just singing holy over and over again in this beautiful voice.

[Ed Mabry]

That's amazing. Well, yeah, well, that's. I'm going to get into some of the descriptions of, of them and the, the different quote unquote races or designations of them. I mean, a minute. But yeah, because because some of them, that's, that is their job. They're, they're around the throne of God. So he creates these other Elohim. God is in Jehovah is an Elohim. But he's, he's obviously a higher level. And I give the example of American. You can call me an American. That's, that's accurate. That's not my name. That's not what I do. That's just where I live.

[David Lee Corbo]

Right.

[Ed Mabry]

You know, the President of the United States is an American, but he has a different level of authority than I do.

[David Lee Corbo]

Right.

[Ed Mabry]

So that's what. We can both be Americans, but one can be added at a different level, which is why Jehovah is an Elohim and also the other angels are Elohim. So he creates these intelligent beings to interact with him the same way he create would, you know, will later create humanity to interact with him. That's why even create intelligent beings. And there was a, so they had a civilization and this civilization existed before man. So when, when someone asked, as I was saying before, do I believe in a pre Adamic civilization? I say absolutely. But they were the Elohim. They were the pre Adamic civilization and they occupied the heavens and the earth. So they were transversing both. So they were not just confined to the spiritual realm, they were also in the physical realm and they had civilization here as well. And that's going to be really important later on when we talk about the age of the earth and things like that. But I'll table that for now. So they had a civilization and they have certain ranks, or I would even call them certain races and hierarchies. So the, you know, from the Bible, from what we can claim because. And by the way, another thing I talk about in my, in my bonus episode on Angels on Patreon, that's where a lot is coming from is that there's very little information on angels in the Bible, especially in the canon. You get, you get a bit more in. In the pseudo pigraphal book of Enoch, which is valuable. But the Bible itself, the canon, except again doesn't talk a lot about them. We only have, in the, in the canonical Bible we only have the names of two angels, Michael and Gabriel. But there are millions if not billions or maybe more of them. We only have two of their names. By the way, Lucifer is not a name because some people call Lucifer is Halal bin Shakar. In, in Hebrew it means light bearer, son of the first light. Light bear is a title. So we don't Even know the name of the, of, of the enemy. I don't think we're ever given the true name of the entity we call Satan because Satan's a job title. Satan means the, the accuser or the adversary.

[David Lee Corbo]

That would be like giving us like, I don't know, the key to the end of the story. You know what I mean? Because it seems like in order to really be able to cast out entities, there's a lot of power in the name. And if you can identify the name, which is why I think they obscure themselves over all these different pantheons from one to the next. So it's Zeus and this, it's Hadad and that going. And it's to, it's to hide their names because there's probably power in it. So if we knew the name of this entity, we probably could have, I don't know, skipped a lot of things or something. So, yeah, I would imagine that that would be obfuscated for a reason.

[Ed Mabry]

Yeah, well, you know, it's. When Jesus cast out that demon, he said he asked him its name and of course it was compelled to tell him his name was Legion, which, I mean, which again wasn't necessarily a name. It was because there was a lot of them, but that's the designation they had. No, Jesus could, you know, cast them out. He could cat them out without knowing their names. But I think that. But I think you have a point there. I think. But the other reason I don't think we're given their names is because God knows who we would worship them.

[David Lee Corbo]

Oh, here to Z. Man's point says we only have the names of two angels. And the Catholics pray to them constantly. I can't imagine if we had more.

[Ed Mabry]

Thank you. Perfect segue. Yeah. That God knows we are. We're hardwired to worship. We'll talk about this when we get to the creation of man and why. But we are made that way. We can't not worship. I don't care if you're religious or secular. You're going to worship something. That's just who we are. That's, that's in our makeup, our DNA. Our, our spiritual DNA is to worship something. And if you don't work an idea that we worship God because I know we've talked about this before, I think, you know, Raven, you and I had a longer conversation about that. You become like what you worship.

[David Lee Corbo]

Yeah.

[Ed Mabry]

And so the idea is you worship God, you become more like God. That's. But, you know, we're individuals of free will. We're, we're entities of free will. So we can worship, we can choose not to worship God. But whatever you worship, you're going to become like it. Whether you worship money or sex or your favorite sports team or your favorite celebrity, you're going to become like whatever you give yourself over to.

[Top Lobster]

Yeah, we need to dock Satan. That's hilarious.

[David Lee Corbo]

Let's get on it.

[Top Lobster]

On our previous deep dive, we're actually, we're setting up. We, we might be back on Tinfoil Hat. We, we'll, we'll, we'll talk with Mark again for you this time. Yeah, we did a deep dive on this guy, Andre Buhari, who summoned the nine, the Council of Nine.

[Ed Mabry]

What's his name?

[Top Lobster]

Indrija Puharich. He's a CIA spook operative, doctor, scientist, spiritualist. He's all kinds of stuff. But he summoned these nine entities along with some other Indian mystic dude, and these guys gave him their names. And their names are the same as the Egyptian Ennead. And those nine carry similarities to Chinese mythology, these nine dragons, Norse mythology, these nine places. And it's like they all have similar characteristics, but they don't really want to tell you their names because I don't, I don't even think the Eniad is the correct name. It's just the name that they're giving us now. And it's funny as you like, it kind of ties back to the beginning of this conversation where what they're telling the people constantly is like, you know, the environment and you know people and it kind of. Yeah, exactly. But this, this always kind of boils down to like, it's really people. There's too much of you guys.

[David Lee Corbo]

Yes.

[Top Lobster]

You having too many babies. You had to kill your babies, give them to Moloch while you kill him. You know, just. No, don't worry about that part. So. But the interesting part is the names. We don't know their names. Like they don't want to. I'm sure that they want to give us their names because they probably the worship if you gave them, if we worship them by name would be more meaningful. But if we knew their names, we could also tell them to kick rocks and that's probably not so great for them.

[Ed Mabry]

Yeah, so I think that's right, that, that push, pull, that give, take, like so, so maybe they just give their names to their highest level followers or maybe, or maybe God's restricting them. I don't know. I, I can't say for sure based on the Bible, but the only thing I know is that we're given Very few of their names. We only. I mean, we're given two. And I think that one of the reasons is worship. And maybe the. And maybe the reason that they're either withheld by God because he doesn't want us to worship him, or again, maybe they're withheld because they know we could cast them out.

[Top Lobster]

Perhaps you could command maybe a little bit of both. If we can come. If we can command them. If we. If I can cast them out with their direct name, I can probably control them with their direct name. So it's probably not a good idea for us to know it or even be able to pronounce it and say, I don't know.

[David Lee Corbo]

Well, yeah, I mean, if you look at Solomon, it seems like if. If what the stories are saying is true, and he did actually succeed in sort of capturing and then forcing these entities to do his bidding, if there is any truth to that, then he was probably a guy who knew their names. Right. Because he allegedly did it with these sigils. These sigils are very unique to them. I'm sure you have to know quite a bit about them in order to entrap them and have them do your bidding. But then what does he do? So it's like. Even if. Even if you have their names, it's. It's a form of power. Are you gonna cast them out or are you gonna let that power corrupt you? Go in or.

[Top Lobster]

Their symbol. Right, Their name sigil. Yeah.

[Ed Mabry]

So I think we can take, like, just boiling it all down. We shouldn't know their names.

[David Lee Corbo]

Yeah, it kind of seems like that.

[Ed Mabry]

If we need to catch them up, we use the name of Jesus.

[David Lee Corbo]

Exactly.

[Ed Mabry]

So. So I don't think there's anything to be. To be gained by. And of course, in the Book of Enoch, the. The names of the ones who fell at. In. In spawned the first level round of Nephilim. Their names, some of their names are given, but they're locked up. So I don't think that it almost doesn't matter.

[David Lee Corbo]

Yeah, good point.

[Top Lobster]

Yeah, yeah.

[Ed Mabry]

So. So. But again, we would worship. And so we. And so that's. That's. That's another reason. So let's look at. In the time we have left, let's look at some of the hierarchy of angels of the Elohim. It appears that.

[David Lee Corbo]

That'S actually a fascinating point. Redbeard says, like Rumpelstiltskin, you have to know his name in order to battle him. That's what.

[Ed Mabry]

It's amazing how. How these stories that evolve over time, that they have a kernel of truth to them.

[Top Lobster]

Well, these are old. These are old Germanic stories. And that's like. You wonder why the Nazis did what they did. It's kind of the lore.

[Ed Mabry]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. They were looking. Well, the Nazis, they were looking for all these ancient artifacts, ancient material, and ancient bloodlines. They were all into that stuff because they knew that there was power in them. And we'll, you know, we'll talk about some of these bloodlines when we get to. To, to chapter six. And by the way, I was. I'm gonna put this on my patreon. I was. A couple months ago, I was on a. A podcast with Gary Wayne.

[David Lee Corbo]

Nice.

[Ed Mabry]

Yeah, great.

[Top Lobster]

Forgot again. Next time someone has to remind us. You have to go share your audience.

[Ed Mabry]

He.

[Top Lobster]

He needs to share to his audience. So this will be right on your YouTube page. We forgot again. We blew it.

[David Lee Corbo]

Oh, oh, yeah, that's right. Like to share this live stream next time. We'll get it. But before we start the next episode, Ed, we just got to sign into yours. That way we multi stream everywhere.

[Ed Mabry]

Okay, yeah, we'll do that. Yeah, I'll come on a little bit earlier this morning was just tough. I had so much to do. But yeah, I'll make a note of it that we'll welcome up on earlier if I can, and we'll try to set something up. But yeah, I was on with Gary Wayne and he was talking about all these different families and bloodlines, and he's. He's such a fountain of knowledge. It was amazing. I'm gonna make that available on my patreon for folks want to see that. But anyway, so looking at the ranks, the highest level of. Of Elohim appear to be the cherubim. The cherub there, the cherub, they. They are the throne guardians. And there are five of them, four of them, we. We see blatantly called. Blatantly in. In the. In. In. In the throne room of God. We see them in. In Ezekiel. Absolutely in Ezekiel and Isaiah and in Revelation. But there's a fifth who's kind of. Yeah, there we go. Perfect. And you know, one of them, as you saw, one of them is like a lion, one is like an eagle, one is like a man, and one is like an ox. So you can look at them as. As representing eventual creation. You know what's funny?

[David Lee Corbo]

And I just wanted to say this morning, I'm driving with my wife and we see somebody that. My old tattoo artist, she posts her cat and she calls her cat. Her cat's name is Seraphim. And I'm like, does she even know what that means? And my wife's like, she doesn't, she.

[Ed Mabry]

Wouldn'T, she wouldn't call her cat that.

[David Lee Corbo]

Yeah. And then, and then I get to go through all of this. I mean it sounds completely schizophrenic, but I have like all my talking points. So my wife is like, well, that's interesting. Which is just great because my wife is somebody that grew up as a Jehovah's Witness. She's ex, you know, been exposed to biblical content for the longest time. But here we are, you know, 35 years old and all of a sudden her husband is telling her stuff she didn't know about the Bible. It's, it's, it's, it's so awesome.

[Ed Mabry]

Bible's an exhaust. Yeah, there's another. Yeah, I think I have that one as like a slider in my, in my show episode, the bonus episode on, on, on angels.

[David Lee Corbo]

I just want to address something really quick. I'm sorry guys, but I think this is actually my old neighbor from Las Vegas. What's up, brother? Good to see you, man. Thank you.

[Top Lobster]

For Jesus is here.

[David Lee Corbo]

That's so crazy. I saw that before and I was like, what? Very cool, man. Good to see you. All right, all right. Sorry about that. Let's, let's get.

[Ed Mabry]

No, no problem. So, so they appear to, to represent the classes of life on earth. You have the, the lion representing carnivores, the, the eagle representing avion's birds. You have the ox representing herbivores. And you have man representing obviously humanity. But of course there's one class missing and that will be the class of cold blooded scaly animals, fish and reptiles. Yeah, so that's a missing cherub there. He's not missing, he just fell. That would be the anointed cherub we see in Egypt in Ezekiel when, which is one of the two chapters that blatantly talk about the fall of the entity we call Satan. Isaiah 14 and Ezekiel 28. In Ezekiel 28 it says you were the anointed cherub. That covers. So this entity was the highest ranking cherub. He was the chief cherub and he was anointed. He was anointed means that you are in that highest place and that was going to be called Satan. And he would have been representing logically that level of the reptilians. So there is a class of them that look like reptilians and they are called the seraphim.

[David Lee Corbo]

Dude, do you know how crazy it sounds for me to be telling My wife, that I think that there's biblical precedent for Reptilians actually existing because there was the offspring of a certain variety of fallen angel.

[Ed Mabry]

They are a quote unquote race of angels.

[Top Lobster]

Does that mean that all of these Reptilians fell like all of that class of angels?

[Ed Mabry]

Good question, because I get that a lot. No, they did not. Some of them did, but some of the other classes fell as well.

[David Lee Corbo]

Right. So it's like, like a third of the angels fall. But that's a mixed bag that they're.

[Ed Mabry]

Yeah, yeah. It doesn't like all of them. We know that they're a good seraphim because in the book of the. Of Isaiah they're seraphim in heaven. They are the only angels that have wings. So. So we have to get this image out of, out of your mind of you know, humans, human looking creatures with long robes and halos and big bird wings. That is not what they look like at all. That's actually from paganism. The halo is, is definitely paganism and all that. Angels in, in the spiritual realm are scariest. Hell, they're scary. They are scary. Af. Every time someone saw an angel in all their glory, they went into a coma. I mean look at, look at when Daniel encountered them, he said I fell as if dead in the face of these entities. They had to revive him. And. But so that's why they come. When they come to Earth, they look like men because. So that they can. So that they don't scare the crap out of us. So when they, when they manifest in their true form, we can't, we. We cannot process all those dimensions because they're extra dimensional. They occupy at least 10 dimensions. And I explained that in my bonus episode.

[David Lee Corbo]

Yeah, it's probably watching something that's like odulating and moving in and out in a way that doesn't make sense. They're like permeating nothing but something at the same time. Imagine God sending a messenger to communicate with you in some way shape or form and you. Your pants really a bummer.

[Ed Mabry]

That's embarrassing.

[David Lee Corbo]

Yeah. Imagine being an angel. It's like every time I go to talk to somebody, they smell like. It's not a great gig actually.

[Ed Mabry]

So thank you for putting that up top. So. So. But as I was saying, the seraphim are the only elohim that in the Bible are described as having wings. But they have six wings. Wings. I'm sorry.

[David Lee Corbo]

Z man says and lo I doth my pet.

[Ed Mabry]

I. It's my pants, my trousers. So. So. But they have six wings. And they're. And they're the seraphim and they're flying around and they're the ones saying holy, holy, holy is the Lord God Almighty. So not all of them fell. There are still some seraphim that are in the heavens. And what is a seraphim? They're.

[David Lee Corbo]

They are flying fiery serpents and they're doing ma. I mean they're doing magic. They're doing music which is. You know, that goes back to the whole music. They're doing music, baby, that goes back to the whole Lucifer, you know, being the. The. The first musician or the.

[Ed Mabry]

The anointing it talks about. Yeah. It speaks vividly about how he was. He was a worship leader. Hell yeah.

[David Lee Corbo]

Shenron.

[Ed Mabry]

Yeah. So that's. We actually look at. When you think of. Of the seraphim, don't. They're basically what would you call a giant fiery serpent? You call it a dragon. Yeah, but not the medieval dragons. It makes it look like dinosaurs with wings. Think more again. The. The Chinese dragon or the dragon in Mesoamerica. Like. Like. Yeah, like.

[David Lee Corbo]

Like the winged serpent.

[Ed Mabry]

Yeah, exactly.

[David Lee Corbo]

That kind of jam. Yeah.

[Ed Mabry]

Those are. Those were. Those are seraphim and they're still. I had. I think I may have mentioned this before, you know, last time I have, you know, a friend of mine in Scotland who. Who has, you know, who's had a lot of visions, he saw a. He encountered a dragon who was talking to him but. But talking positively about God. He freaked out. And I told him, dude, that was a. Sarah. That was a good seraphim. That was just. Not all these dragons are bad. The seraphim are. There's some seraphines that are still good guys. I know it's tough because we always put them in that negative light, but the ones who fell are. And I would say the. The reptilians that. That are seem to manifest in. In the conspiracy world. Those are probably nephilim who were sired by fallen seraphim them.

[David Lee Corbo]

Which is why theory they have humanoid aspect to them, right in their. In their anatomy. This the meaning their proportions. But they often take the form of human beings and. And it's like are they going around wearing masks or is it not a rubber thing and is it more of a. Of a transmutation thing? They have the ability because of their DNA being both human and. And angelic, that they can transform from one into the other. I. I think that there's some real. Because I've heard stories about people running into reptilians and I'VE heard them so much, and I've heard them from people that don't seem out of their minds, and I've heard them from people who are embarrassed to share those stories. And when I hear that, I'm like, dude, I can't just dismiss these people because I recognize when somebody's describing a traumatic event to me. And whether or not I. I believe you saw what you saw, you are traumatized. And I can tell you don't want to share this and you're kind of falling apart as you're sharing it. And so it. When that happens, I'm like, dude, I. I don't know. People are seeing something, in my opinion. I think they're seeing that. I think they're seeing the. These hybrid offspring, these Nephilim, offspring of. Of seraphim and human beings.

[Ed Mabry]

And I think it's possible. This is totally theoretical. I don't have anything solid to back this up, but I think that probably a lot of the seraphim fell with. With Satan because he was in charge of them. Just like if there's a class of angels. If there's a class of angels that look like. That are Reptilian, they're probably a class of angels that are. Look like eagles. We see one of them in Revelations, probably a class of them that look like. We see a lot of them that look like cattle, like oxes, the bulls.

[David Lee Corbo]

That look like fish too. Right. In Dagon, a ton of them.

[Ed Mabry]

So I think that a lot of them because. Because the. Satan would have been their leader. He was. He would have been over them. So a lot of them probably fell with him, which is why the reptilian class that you. That we see in Conspiracy World are probably highly regarded by him because they're his people, as it were.

[David Lee Corbo]

Yeah.

[Ed Mabry]

So that may be why there's. That. Why Reptilians are so prominent, you know, Shout out David Ike.

[David Lee Corbo]

Not only prominent, but also positioned, like, pretty high in the hierarchy of.

[Top Lobster]

Closer to the bloodline.

[David Lee Corbo]

Closer to the bloodlines, yeah. And also much more to reconcile with than, like, you know, some of the lesser cryptids, you can call them. Right. Like, we're not too worried about Chupacabras, but we are pretty worried about what the hell the Reptilians are doing.

[Top Lobster]

Well, look at this world. Like, I would have a cow. I mean, we might get some cows on the property. I'm not going to get a Komodo dragon. You know, these are two vastly different things. I have. I had birds. Yeah. Not going to get like a huge ball Python. It's insane. People that keep them are crazy.

[Ed Mabry]

Yeah, well, and again, the snake is known as, as a sign of wisdom and intelligence and people who, if you believe in the whole. The Luciferian sect, they're the ones who are the intellectual. The Luciferians are the ones who are all about science and technology, whereas have other sects that are more about destruction. The Moloch, the ones who, who are more on the Moloch side, they're about destroying humanity. But I mean, and I'm not sure how much that I buy into, but I, I do believe that there, there are different sects of these fallen entities on Earth and they have different agenda. They have the same big picture agenda, but they have different ways of getting there. Like, you know, Democrats, Republicans, they all want to do the same thing, but they just have different methodologies.

[David Lee Corbo]

Like, literally, oh, there you go.

[Top Lobster]

Moloch with the head of the, of the ox.

[David Lee Corbo]

And then what do you have? You have minotaurs, right? Where like, I look at, like, Homer's Odyssey more and more like, what the hell was this guy really telling people? Because I, I've started, like, I had this conversation with my wife only an hour or so ago, maybe a little bit more than that in the car, and I'm like, yeah, I'm. This is how crazy your husband is. I think that there's real precedent for minotaurs. I think that there's real, you know, precedent for, I don't know, giant, giant Cyclops and things like that.

[Top Lobster]

Making money. Just keep making money doing it and whatever.

[Ed Mabry]

Exactly.

[David Lee Corbo]

She's like, I don't care, just keep getting paid.

[Ed Mabry]

I'm looking at the time, I think, right. An hour. Do we have. Are we need to stop or.

[David Lee Corbo]

I think we have a little bit.

[Top Lobster]

Probably another 10.

[David Lee Corbo]

Let's do another 10 minutes.

[Ed Mabry]

Yeah. All right, so. So I'm gonna save the rebellion stuff for next week. And I'm also going to save, like, maybe some of the other classes. But what I want to. A theory I want to put out there, I think is interesting is this because when you're looking at the idea of the cherubim and that they each, each one of them represent a class of, of. Of life on Earth. Question is, is it a chicken and egg thing? Did God say egg? Sorry.

[Top Lobster]

And, and I told you, be careful. You say whatever you did.

[Ed Mabry]

I, I walk right into it, like, so everybody gets worse. Did God create the, the cherubim to look like this because he knew he was going to create other mortal life to look like this? Or did he base mortal life on the cherubim. Did you say, you know what the cherubim you guys are? You know, you guys, you're my first creation. You're my highest level of angel. So I'm going to make my next set of creation immortal life look like you guys. So I find that really fascinating.

[David Lee Corbo]

Yeah, yeah. I mean, that, that goes back to that whole idea of we will make them in our image. And that. That is a point of contention for a lot of people.

[Ed Mabry]

Yeah.

[David Lee Corbo]

And I know that in the original translation it says the Elohim. That's the, the word that they use. But I, I just wonder if, if maybe there's something in that. Like God creates us, but he incorporates the point of view or at least the opinions of these other entities and then ultimately decides, yeah, we'll create them to, to resemble us.

[Ed Mabry]

Meaning when he says image, that word does not mean to look like physically. Image means you being made in the image means you bear the image, you bearing the image of God.

[Top Lobster]

Right.

[Ed Mabry]

Humanity to bear his image. That means that creation is going to react to. Will react to Adam and Eve the same way they were. Would react to God. So they were made in the image in that they have spirit and that they have certain authority. So it wasn't necessarily.

[David Lee Corbo]

What I'm getting at is like we were imbued with some aspect.

[Ed Mabry]

Okay.

[David Lee Corbo]

Would be akin to spiritual beings.

[Top Lobster]

Our image after our likeness. Is it now, I guess the argument he's talking to Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit or talking like talking to himself.

[Ed Mabry]

Oh, okay.

[Top Lobster]

The other Elohim around him. Right.

[Ed Mabry]

There are two thoughts on that. One is that he's speaking. The triune God is speaking that way or that there or, or Michael Heiser, who's one of my mentors, he says that according. He's an expert PhD in, in Hebrew, he says it's kind of like the royal we. You know what I mean by that? Like when you say, you know, when I say, you know, I'm gonna get us some pizza. Well, I'm the one buying the pizza. You know, I said, when I say, let's get. Let's get us some pizza, I'm. I'm saying it. I'm doing it.

[David Lee Corbo]

Right, Right. That's why I'm so. That's why I'm kind of leaning towards this idea that if it really was these angelic beings that, that God is speaking to. It's more like he. Because he does seem to repeatedly throughout the Bible consider what his creations think or if they put or one way or another.

[Top Lobster]

But he doesn't though, he doesn't really consider what the angels think. He's talking to them.

[David Lee Corbo]

Well, it depends. I mean in, in the Book of Enoch he cares what the angels think. Right. When.

[Ed Mabry]

Oh yeah, no, he does. You're both right actually, in different ways. He, there are areas where he considers their opinion. Now he definitely, he, he decides, he's, he, he makes a final decision, but he does take their input. You have, like you said in the Book of Enoch, you also have an. In the book of First Kings, when, I think we talked about this before, when, when they're deciding how they're going to take out King Ahab and, and, and some, and several of the Elohim give him different opinions. And one of them says, I'm going to do this. I'm going to make, I'll be a lying spirit in the mouth of his prophets. And God says, good idea, do that. So he, so he can. He. But, but the difference here in creation is God is acting unilaterally in creation. So he. So it could, it can be that he says, you know what, let's make them like us in the sense that they're going to be spirit beings and have intelligence and all that.

[David Lee Corbo]

Yeah, that's what I'm saying.

[Ed Mabry]

But, but the angels didn't make us. And that's where people like Billy Carson, folks who are saying that the angels made us. No, they didn't.

[David Lee Corbo]

Right. They might have bear witness to the process and maybe they even got to like, say like, hey, what about this? Or something? And maybe God considered it, but that's kind of what it, it seems like, yeah, you're standing around and God is, is making all the shots. He's calling all the shots, but he is communing with his. This council that he's created of other high ranking spiritual entities or just entities that exist in spiritual realms, period. And yeah, I mean there's some aspect of us that is hugely spiritual. So in that way, you know, is that the same. That's, I wouldn't say that's the same thing for like a, you know what a turtle. Does a turtle have like massive spiritual implications? Is there a huge spiritual component to a turtle? I don't know. I don't, I don't think so. But there is clearly one to human beings. So is that the likeness?

[Ed Mabry]

It could be. I mean it could, it, it might totally be that the cherubim said, hey, God, make them look like us. Okay, sure.

[David Lee Corbo]

Right. Maybe.

[Ed Mabry]

Nothing wrong with that. And maybe, and maybe the Elohim that the cherubim that looks like humanity. I don't know, maybe there's something special about that one.

[David Lee Corbo]

Well, that's what. So you know how we always say like there's nine truths and then they sell you one, you know, really, really fundamental lie. Right. In order for them to be able to lie to us, it has to parallel the truth as closely as possible. So imagine like being in the room when we were made and then telling us that we actually were made by them. You know what I mean? Like, it's like now you were close. Like you were there, you were in the room. You even had some conversations about the idea of creating us and maybe even had some input, but that's not the same thing. And so I wouldn't be surprised if there was something like that taking place. They were there, they did hear, they did maybe potentially even have input. But ultimately God is who created us.

[Ed Mabry]

Yeah, it's funny, I was having a conversation with someone this morning along, along the similar lines and like it said, if there was not a kernel of truth to it, we wouldn't believe it.

[David Lee Corbo]

Exactly. You cannot build anything long lasting on a foundation of lies. There has to be truth at the core. And then you can slap all kinds of lies all over it and it'll still stand even though it's a Frankenstein, you know, monstrosity. But without that kernel of truth yet, it just falls apart. You can't.

[Ed Mabry]

Cool. So next week I'll finish off the class of angels. We'll talk about archangels and the watchers and you know, the, the other ones that Paul mentions, like, you know, principalities and spiritual wickedness in high places and all these different ones. And then we'll get into some of the rebellion and what that might have entailed and get into Genesis 1, 2.

[David Lee Corbo]

Awesome. Well, I mean, let's, let's bring it in for a landing then because we got to jump into another show. One more time. Ed, where can everybody find your material until next week?

[Ed Mabry]

Yeah, a faith by reason.net where the legacy stuff is, where the new stuff and all the great interaction is going to be on the Patreon. Patreon.com faithby Reason. You can you get access to bonus material, new stuff that I put out first, Q and A's and what's gonna be going out today and the Bible study, you'll be a part of that. I send out weekly notes on the Bible study and then once a month it's live. Half an hour of overview, another half hour of Q A and commentary and yeah, it's. We had one so far. It's been great. Looking forward to the next one on I think the 16th of March and yeah, that's how we do it.

[David Lee Corbo]

Awesome. Perfect.

[Top Lobster]

I'm gonna try to be there live for the next one because I bought the replay. It's just, you know, sometimes during the weekend it's harder for us, but I.

[David Lee Corbo]

Want to be there live. Yeah, I think live is more meaningful.

[Top Lobster]

I want to troll the chat live.

[David Lee Corbo]

We want to derail you from the. From the chat. That's what we're going to do. Well, guys, go and check out faithbyreason.net support ed and all of his work. It's. There's a lot there to be gleamed and I suppose. Until next time, top. Is that all we got?

[Top Lobster]

That's it. Until next time. Don't forget to obey, submit and comply. We'll see you later.

[Ed Mabry]

The greatest hypnotist on planet Earth is a oblong box in the corner of the room. It is constantly telling us what to believe is real. You can persuade me that what they see with their eyes is what there is to see to go. Because they'll laugh in the face of an explanation that portrays the bigger picture of what's happening. And they have.