Co-host (6:04)

Right now?

Matt Hepner (6:06)

No, their whole view, like, their whole conversation was always from, like, the criminal's perspective. Like, my family was, like, just kind of laughing. I'm like, wow, this is crazy. We would just, like, bring them food. They were chilling on the couch. But anyway, they. They were always talking about the evil world, like, the bad world. And so that was always my take, man, was. I was like, well, yeah, that's just because they're not successful in the world, and that's why they're, like, bashing the world. So then I did that for a while, and then I was within another, like, church body of a little bit more of, like, wealthy people and certain way I could get the tissue.

Co-host (6:45)

Yeah, I'll grab one.

Matt Hepner (6:46)

Good. And then I remember just, like, more wealthy people that were just, like, a lot more worldly. Like, they were successful within that world system, and therefore they liked that world system. And I remember, like, one time. Sorry, they canceled church because there was, like, an important college football game on. They didn't cancel, like, the Sunday morning show, because you never cancel that. But it was, like, some afternoon service. I don't remember if it was, like, a Saturday afternoon service or a Sunday afternoon service, but it was, like, a big, important. It was like a very big, important, like, college game. And so they canceled Church for it. And I remember people talking about it and being like, yeah, no, that's wrong, man. Like you can't cancel church for a football game. And I was like, yeah, wait a minute, what is going on? And then it was like, if this matters, it's debatable whether that system matters or not. But like if this matters, like should we be canceling it? Because there's like a really important worldly football game on, which was kind of the thing that happened during coronavirus. If everybody remembers during coronavirus, it was like, well, does this matter? Like, does this format matter? Because if so, like, what do you mean we're just canceling it because of coronavirus? Like what? Like what do you mean? Like church is so important and it's like the body of Christ and it's like the blood flow of the body and like we have to be at church. But like, hey, when the most, you know, crazy event on planet earth is happening, like, yeah, it's not that important. I mean, we can't go to church now. So it's like, okay, well does it matter or doesn't it matter? You know? And I was kind of in all these questions, right? It was like I had seen like these people hated the world. But then I was in like this other church where the people love the world, you know. And so I was kind of in a crux and just trying to understand this whole like world system now and, and understand like what the Bible's talking about when it talks about the world.

Co-host (8:33)

I think that's the dynamic of the balance. Maybe that narrow road that we're talking about. Kind of have to find a nice world between both.

Matt Hepner (8:41)

Yeah, that's a fair assessment. Yeah. I mean ultimately we're not part of the world, right? We just have to really come to terms with like defining the world. And so, you know, ultimately in the Greek there's the two words that get translated. World. In the King James, right? There's a, on a I, O, N which is like an eon, like an age, like a time period. And then there's cosmos, which is like the arrangement or the order or the structure or what we would call like systems. And ultimately what I landed on and what is the world that we are not a part of is like, think about all the systems of the world, dude. Like, name me a system in America that's not a broken system. Like, look at our food system. Look at our so called health care system. Look at our so called political system. Look at our so called pharmaceutical system. Look at our so called judicial system or our prison systems. Like all the systems of the world are completely broken and corrupted and ultimately run by Satan. And like that's the world that we are not a part of, that we're distinct from. And I'm not somebody who thinks that we're going to go reform all those systems. We're going to reform people like, we're going to reform people like we're here to preach the gospel and not even reform people, but preach death to people so that they die, they're born again and they're brought to life in Christ. So it's not, it's not really a reformation. It's not like God just takes your busted up, broken body and then chews up bubblegum and like, like stops up all the holes. That's not what he's doing. His, his solution for us is execution and bring us to new life, right? And so that's what we preach is being born again. So I, hopefully that's like a good breakdown of the world that we are not a part of. I think as time has gone on, it's made me sick to see how much of the world is in the church. There's an old time saying that says a ship in the sea is all right, but the sea and the ship is all wrong. And the ship is a type of the church that kind of floats above all that wickedness and all that evil of the world and is a safe place and is an example to the world. And when it's in the sea, that's right, we're in the world, but we're not of the world. But when this, when the sea gets in the ship, the ship is sinking. The ship is that, that's why the sea is sinking. And I think history's born witness to that. And it's, it looks filthy and ridiculous in the church. When you, when you see the world just being, being mingled with, with the church, it looks ridiculous and embarrassing. So, so let's just pull up a couple passages real quick. This is brutal. Okay. 1 John 2:15, 17. This is kind of like the core of how the Bible views the world. And this is where the rubber meets the road and where you kind of have to come to terms with like, yeah, what is my position with and in the world, right? So look at this. 1 John 2:15. Love, not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him. For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh and the lust of the eyes. And the pride of life is not of the Father, but is of the world. And the world passes away in the lust thereof. But he that doeth the will of God abides forever. So, right, right away, just notice he's contrasting the temporary with the eternal right. The world passes away in the lust thereof, but he that does the will of God abides forever. I think that's one thing to take note of with the world is that it's a thing that's passing away. Ultimately, you have to notice that. And if you truly have faith and your claim is that you want to spend eternity with Christ, then it's very hypocritical to love the world that you're claiming is just going to pass away one day. Right? So I think that's just an easy takeaway from that passage. But it also starts to talk about the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes and the pride of life. I think we all understand, like the lust of the flesh or like the desire of the flesh. Some of these things would be like, for sex, food, drugs, sleep, just laziness, like video games. Just think of, think of whatever you can. Like these things that our flesh just kind of desires. That's just like the easiest path. That's just like the easy animal, like nature that we have sincerely evil in themselves. But we've talked about it before, like, the same way we hunt animals around, like their sexual desire and their appetite for food. Desire, the demonic realm can hunt us in the same way, like over our fleshly and carnal nature. Right. Another thing that gets talked about is the pride of life, which is like, we talk about this a lot, like reputation, concern for what man thinks and just kind of this independence from God. Just like this pride of life that, like, I can do it without God. And we all kind of have this. This desire for reputation and people to look at you and think you're somebody important. Like, I vividly remember that. Especially, like back when I was still trying to come to terms with, like, why the world was bad. I remember during that time I really did like it. If I was like at a party or something and was telling somebody, like, yeah, I live in a 3,000square foot house and I'd have a cool car and got a lot of money in a bank account. Like, I remember that, man. And I remember being at houses and looking at people's houses saying, like, oh man, I wish I had a kitchen like that. Or I wish I had like a backyard like that. Or I wish I Had stuff like this or that. I vividly remembered that in the beginning of my walk with Christ. Like, all this stuff is just like the world. It's all our fleshly desires for these things in the world. And the interesting thing about the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes and the pride of life is it looks like that's exactly how Satan tried to tempt Jesus in the wilderness he operated for through those three realms. But I want to look at this. This passage in Joshua actually, to kind of break down this lust of the eyes thing. I just think it's a great opportunity to. To read this story just because it's a neat story and it kind of, you know, it's a. It's interesting. This part of the scripture, right away, you're dealing with, like, the chosen people, right? You're dealing with, like, the elect, the chosen people. And right away we're going to hear this story where one of the chosen or one of the elect finds himself cursed. And we're also going to find somebody who's not part of the chosen and not part of the elect. Rahab, who finds herself blessed, which is very intriguing, you know, which should make everybody think twice about the way we're viewing, like, predestination and being chosen or being called or any of these things. So if we look at Joshua, chapter six. Sorry, I was doing chapter six in chapter seven. It wasn't. I should have been more clear on that.

Co-host (15:10)

I think we'll pull that up.

Matt Hepner (15:11)

You might have had chapter six, verse seven. No, it's gonna be like a long read, dude. Is that all right?

Co-host (15:17)

Just make it quick.

Matt Hepner (15:18)

Okay, well, I'll read it then. Not you.

Co-host (15:24)

One second.

Matt Hepner (15:28)

Yeah. Robert Worf. I. I think it's cool to play video games and talk to people about Jesus. I respect that. I'm not saying, like, if you're playing video games, that's bad. I'm just like. I'm not saying, like, sex is bad or food is bad. I'm just saying, like, there's these things that we have to be mindful of that we're not lusting after. That are just, like these easy paths that lead us away from God because it's not from a disciplined lifestyle, part of the world. But now Jericho was straightly shut up because of the children of Israel. You guys will like this passage. I wanted to bring this up because I think it has to do with. What do you guys call it? With the music weapons and stuff. Like, with the noise weapons. There's like. Oh, frequency. Yeah, frequency, Yeah. I think we got some frequency stuff going on here. Jericho was straightly shut up because of the children of Israel. None went out and none came in. I don't know if Christians do this to cities today, but it'd be interesting if they did. And the Lord said unto Joshua, see, I have given into your hand Jericho and the king thereof, and the mighty men of valor. And you shall compass the city all you men of war and go round about the city once thus, thus shalt thou do. Six days and seven priests shall bear before the ark seven trumpets or rams horns. In the seventh day you shall compass the city seven times in the priest shall blow with the trumpets. And it shall come to pass that when they make a long blast with the ram's horn, and when you hear the sound of the trumpet, all the people shall shout with a great shout. And the wall of the city shall fall down flat frequency. And the people shall ascend up every man straight before him. And Joshua the son of nun called the priest and said unto them, take up the ark of the Covenant and let seven priests bear seven trumpets of rams horns before the Ark of the Lord. And he said unto the people, pass on encompass the city. And let him that is armed pass on before the Ark of the Lord. And it came to pass when Joshua had spoken unto the people that the seven priests bearing the seven trumpets of seven horns of rams horns passed on before the Lord and blew with the trumpets. And the Ark of the Covenant of the Lord followed them. I hope everybody's getting this visual. And the armed men went before the priest that blew with the trumpets. And the re reward came after the ark. The priests going on and blowing with the trumpets. And Joshua had commanded the people, saying, you shall not shout nor make any noise with your voice. Neither shall any word proceed out of your mouth until the day I bid you shout. Then you shall shout. So they're marching around the city. They've got it completely contained and enclosed. Nobody's going out, nobody's going in. And their entire military is marching around it in silence. In silence. So the Ark of the Lord compassed the city going about it once. And they came into the camp and lodged in the camp. And Joshua rose early in the morning and the priest took up the Ark of the Lord and seven priests bearing seven trumpets of Ram's horns before the Ark of the Lord went on continually and blew with the trumpets. And the armed men went before them. But the re reward came after the Ark of the Lord. The priests going on and blowing with the trumpets in the second day, they compassed the city once and returned into the camp. So they did six days. And it came to pass on the seventh day that they arose early about the dawning of the day, encompassed the city after the same manner seven times. Only on that. That day they compassed the city seven times. And it came to pass at the seventh time when the priest blew with the trumpets, Joshua said unto the people, shout, for the Lord hath given you the city. And the city shall be cursed, even it and all that are therein to the Lord. Only Rahab the harlot shall live. She and all that are with her in the house, because she hid the messengers that we sent. And you, in any wise, keep yourselves from the cursed thing, lest you make yourselves cursed when you take of the cursed thing and make the camp of Israel a curse. And trouble it. You know how we talk about who's on your ship? This is like a major example of that, dude. If you go in and you grab the curse thing, you're cursing you, you're cursing your family, you're cursing Israel, like everybody's connected to it. But all the silver and gold and vessels of brass and iron are consecrated unto the Lord. They shall come into the treasury of the Lord. So the people shouted when the priest blew with the trumpets. And it came to pass when the people heard the sound of the trumpet. And the people shouted with a great shout that the wall fell down flat. So that the people went up into the city, every man straight before him. And they took the city and they utterly destroyed all that was in the city, both man and woman, young and old and ox and sheep and ass with the edge of the sword. But Joshua had sent them the two men that spied out the country. Go into the harlot's house and bring out there the woman and all that she has, as you swore unto her. And the young men that were spies went in and brought out Rahab and her father and her mother and her brethren and all that she had. And they brought out all her kindred and left them without the camp of Israel. So that was a person that was not part of the chosen people. And look how she's blessed. And has even brought to her household what we would call household salvation. And they burnt the city with fire and all that was therein. Only the silver and the gold and the vessels of brass and of iron they put into the treasury of the house of the Lord. And Joshua saved Rahab the harlot alive in her father's household. And all that she Had. And she dwells in Israel even into this day, because she hid the messengers which Joshua sent to spy out Jericho. And Joshua juror them at that time, saying, cursed be the man before the Lord that rises up and builds this city Jericho. He shall lay the foundation thereof in his firstborn, and as young as shall he set up the gates of it. So the Lord was with Joshua and his fame noise throughout all Jericho, right? People are somewhat familiar of it. But now you've heard it, like, now you've read it, like, that's the story of the fall of Jericho from the children of Israel. It's interesting, that curse that he lays down in verse 26. Because in first kings there is somebody who goes and rebuilds Jericho and he loses two sons doing it just according to the curse. Now, chapter seven. What? Watch. So everybody just thinks, like, all right, man, we're good. Like, that's it. Jericho's wrapped up, but, you know, here we go. But the children of Israel committed a trespass in the cursed thing. For Achan, the son of Carmi, the son of Zabdi, the son of Zera of the tribe of Judah, took of the cursed thing. And the anger of the Lord was kindled against the children of Israel. And Joshua sent men from Jericho to AI, which is beside Beth Haven on the east side of Bethel, and spake unto them, saying, go up and view the country. And the men went up and viewed it, and they returned to Joshua and said unto him, let not all the people go up, but let about two or three thousand men go up. Labor there for there but few. So they're going to go up against the city called AI. And they say, hey, we don't need a ton of people. You can just send a few. So there went up, there are the people about 3, 000 men. And they fled before the men of AI. And the men AI smote of them about 36 men. For they chased them from before the gate even in the shebarim, and smote them in the going down, whereof the hearts of the people melted and became his water. And Joshua ripped his clothes and fell to the earth upon his face before the ark of the Lord until the evening and he and the elders of Israel and put dust upon their heads. And Joshua said, alas, O Lord God, wherefore have you at all brought this people over Jordan to deliver us into the hand of the Amorites to destroy us? Would to God we had been content and dwelt on the other side Jordan. This is crazy to hear Joshua say this. Because this is like how they bickered against Moses, how they murmured against Moses. It's so wild to hear Joshua talk like that. Oh, Lord, what shall I say when Israel turns their backs before their enemies? For the Canaanites and all the inhabitants of the land us around and cut off our name from the earth. And what will you do? What will thou do under thy great name? So he is like Moses in the sense that he's concerned for the name of God. And the Lord said unto Joshua, get up. You got to be tight with God for him to talk to you like that. Get up. Wherefore, Elias, you on your face. Israel has sinned. And they've transgressed against my covenant, which I commanded them for. They have even taken of the cursed thing and have stolen and dissembled also. And they put it even among their own stuff. He said, you think they just died for no reason, bro? You just went up to AI and you guys just died for no reason? No, somebody in the camp has the curse thing. Therefore, the children of Israel could not stand before their enemies, but turn their backs before their enemies because they were cursed. Neither will I be with you anymore, except you destroy the curse from among you. Dude, I know there's people in the chat that know they have a cursed thing in the house, because I remember when I had cursed stuff in the house. I'm just being honest with you. I had to make like a very, like, came to know the Lord and like, everything I had was, like, tied to the occult, dude. I had even, like, little Buddhist statues and just crap I had picked up at just like, head shops and just like, crazy, like, shows over the years, like music shows and events and stuff. And I had so much cursed stuff in my house tied to the occult. And just like, I remember Jess coming home from trips before. Like, everything on our walls was gone. She came in and was like, what the. Where's all our stuff? And I had just burned everything out back. Like, we bring cursed things into our lives, man, and we gotta be mindful of it, dude. We've got to be very mindful of it. Like, cursed things, like, are a big deal.

Co-host (24:30)

I tell you about the cursed thing that we got.

Matt Hepner (24:32)

Oh, yeah. Well, I mean, I know a little bit about the curse thing that you got.

Co-host (24:36)

Yeah, I can't say exactly what it was. Yeah, no, no, not that thing.

Matt Hepner (24:42)

Oh, okay. What thing?

Co-host (24:43)

A literal curse thing. I'll tell you what it was, what I think it is. But I gave it back to David and he threw it in. He threw it in like the. The sewer.

Matt Hepner (24:54)

Yeah. I mean, in the book of Acts they burned a bunch of their stuff. There was like millions of dollars worth of like books on incant incantations and stuff. It looks like in the book of Acts. Yeah. And they burned it all, man. Like tons of money worth of like witchcraft type of stuff.

Co-host (25:08)

This thing was heavy. Had a bad feeling to it. Never liked it. I'll tell you after.

Matt Hepner (25:12)

Yeah, crazy stuff. All right, so this is what God says. Up. Sanctify the people and say, sanctify yourselves again. I hope I didn't miss verse 12. Therefore the children of Israel could not stand before their enemies, but turn their backs before their enemies because they were cursed. Neither will I be with you anymore except you destroy the cursed thing from among you. That's a big deal. Man. Up. Sanctify the people and say, sanctify yourselves against tomorrow. For thus saith the Lord God of Israel. There's a cursed thing in the midst of you, O Israel. You cannot stand before your enemies until you take away the cursed thing from among you in the morning. Therefore you shall be brought according to your tribes and takes shall come according to the families thereof. And the family which the lord shall take shall come by households. And the household which the lord shall take shall come man by man. And it shall be that he that is taken with the curse thing shall be burnt with fire. He and all that he has, because he has transgressed the covenant of the Lord and because he has wrought folly in Israel. So Joshua rose up early in the morning and brought Israel by their tribes. And the tribe of Judah was taken. And he brought the family of Judah. And he took the family of the tsar heights. And he brought the family of the tsar heights man by man. And Zabdi was taken. And he brought his household man by man. Achan the son of Carmi, the son of Zabdi, the son of Zara of the tribe of Judah was taken. And Joshua said unto Akam, my son, give, I pray thee. Glory to the Lord God of Israel and make confession unto him and tell me now what you have done. Hide it not from me. And a can answer Joshua and said, indeed I have sinned against the Lord God of Israel. And thus, and thus have I done. When I saw among the spoils a goodly babylonish garment, I'm sure you guys can unpack that what that babylonish garment was capable of and what kind of special powers it had in 200 shekels.

Co-host (26:56)

The shekels gets them every time, dude.

Matt Hepner (26:58)

And a wedge of gold, of 50 shekels weight. Then I coveted them and took them. And behold, they are hid in the earth in the midst of my tent, in the silver under it. So Joshua sent messengers, and they ran into the tent, and behold, it was hidden his tent in the silver under it. And they took them out of the midst of the tent and brought them unto Joshua and unto all the children of Israel, and laid them out before the Lord and Joshua and all Israel with him took Achan, the son of Zara, and the silver in the garment and the wedge of gold, and his sons and his daughters, and his oxen and his asses and his sheep in his tent, all that he had. And they brought them under the valley of Acor. And Joshua said, why have you troubled us? The Lord shall trouble you this day in all Israel. Stone them with stones and burn them with fire. After they had stoned them with stones, and they raised over him a great heap of stones into this day. So the Lord turned from the fierceness of his anger wherefore the name of that place was called the Valley of Acorn to this day. Okay, so I know that was long winded, but I just wanted to kind of tell that story well, for one, because I wanted people to know about the cursed thing, man. Because I think it'll be a blessing to you if you get some of the cursed stuff out of your house, man. Like I just. Like I said, I know that because I lived it, because I had that stuff. And I have to imagine just watching the chat and stuff and kind of getting to know everybody. You guys might be in that same position that I was early in the game too, man. There might want. You might want to go through some of your stuff and say, if this is not a thing glorifying God, it may have some, like, wicked and evil attached to it. I don't want this in my home, and I don't want its effects on me and my loved ones anymore. And I want to get rid of it. And for me personally, that was a huge blessing in my life. That was. That was a huge blessing in my life. But the. But the point that I was trying to make about this was this was all about the lust of the eyes. And if you look back at verse 21, he says, when I saw among the spoils a goodly Babylonish garment and 200 shekels of silver and a wedge of gold of 50 shekels weight, then I coveted them and took them. And I just think this is a thing I coveted, right? Like, this is What? We have to be mindful about the lust of the eyes, man. Like I was saying, I remember being in people's houses and being like, oh, I love their kitchen. I wish I had that. I saw, I coveted. You see somebody with a fancy car? Oh, man, I see that car. I like it. I saw, I coveted. Like, we have to be mindful of these things because all of that is, like, the opposite of being grateful. We talk about being grateful a lot, like, looking at things and lusting after them and coveting after them. Like, look at this story. God is providing for them with nothing. He's pulled them out of the most powerful empire on the planet, Egypt. He's brought them out, and he's completely taking care of them. And this guy's basically saying, yeah, but I need a little more. Like, God's not enough. And that's why we had to be mindful about the lust of the flesh and the lust of the eyes and the pride of life. Okay, so we're back to 1 John 2. 15. Thanks for hanging in there. I know that was a long story, but I think it'll be a blessing, even though it took a little while. So 1 John 2:15. I want to pull another thing out of this passage. It says, love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. So let's look at this. Let's look at Matthew 13:1 through 9. Okay?

Co-host (30:05)

Same day when Jesus out of the house and sat by the seaside, and great multitudes were gathered together unto him. So that he went into a ship and sat, and the whole multitude stood on the shore, and he spake many things unto them in parables, saying, behold, a sower went forth to sow. And when he sowed, some seeds fell by the wayside, and the fowls came and devoured them up. Some fell upon stony places where they had not much earth. And forthwith they sprung up because they had no deepness of the earth. And when the sun was up, they were scorched. And because they had no root, they withered away. And some fell among the thorns, and the thorns sprung up and choked them. But others fell into good ground and brought forth fruit, some a hundredfold, some 60 fold, some 30 fold.

Matt Hepner (30:56)

Who hath ears to ear, let him hear. All right, here's here. So this is the parable of the sower. Here's Jesus breaking it down, starting in verse 18. Hear, therefore, the parable of the sower. When any. So he just. He just broke it down, like the seed, how it falls. What happens to each One when it falls. Watch this. When anyone hears the word of the kingdom and understands it not, then comes the wicked one and catches away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the wayside. So this is why we try to make a point of people understanding what we're talking about. Like, it's a big deal to understand what we're talking about, because if you don't understand it just comes and goes, you might be able to repeat it. I think there's a lot of that, actually. There's a lot of memorization and repeating things and people able to parrot things from people they see on YouTube or from commentaries they read or whatever. But that's much different than understanding it. So we always want to make sure.

Co-host (31:48)

People are understanding, sort of apostate teaching people that read it but don't understand the true meaning of it. And then it turns into, sure, yeah, this strange.

Matt Hepner (31:59)

But you can have it in the church, too. In, like, the normal professing church. People who are just parroting things. And then, like, the congregation is never really getting it. Well, it's like the guy preaching it doesn't really get it. You can only impart. What do people say? It's only as real through you. As real as it is to you. Like, if it's not real to you, you can't. It won't be real through you to other people. That's just how the spirit realm works, dude. So you can, like, stand in the pulpit and say stuff that's not wrong. But, like, people are never getting it, right. They're not getting it. Like, I remember especially in the early days when we would go to church and Jess would be like, let's go. I gotta go have a cigarette. Let's go, let's go. I gotta get outside. And it would just be like, she's like, I don't understand what the guy's talking about. And I would be, like, arguing with her and saying, like, no, we're like church people now. Like, we gotta do this. Like, this is what we gotta do. Like, we have to change our old ways. And, like. But she would say that, and I'd be like, damn, she's right. Like, this guy, man. Like, you don't really get what he's saying because he's never getting anywhere with what he's talking about. It's just madness. But I don't know. The longer I live, the more I think, like, because it's not real to him. That's why he can't impart it to anybody else. Dude, you're just sitting in the crowd just like, going, like, you have to.

Co-host (33:07)

Intrinsically understand a thing to teach it to somebody.

Matt Hepner (33:10)

Yes. And if you don't, this passage is clear, that people won't get it, that that seed will just be snatched away. But he that received the seed into stony places, the same as he that hears the Word, and with joy he receives it. The implication is like, with understanding, with joy he receives it. He yet hath he no root in himself, right? This is shallow, people. He has no root in himself. He endures for a while, but when tribulation or persecution arises because of the Word, by and by he is offended. So they've got to develop depth to themselves, right? They got to get a little more gritty. They got to have a little bit more of a story. He also that received seed among the thorns is he that hears the Word in the care of this world. And the deceitfulness of riches choke the word and he becomes unfruitful. Do you see what I'm saying? This is what John's talking about when he says, love. Not the world, neither the things that are in the world. He that receives seed, right? So he's in church, he's in the scripture. He's receiving seed. He's receiving the Word of God. He that receives the Word of God among thorns is he that hears the Word in the care of this world. And the deceitfulness of riches choke the word and he becomes unfruitful. So I was on to something with, like, the poor people that didn't love the world. You know what I mean? And then it wasn't that they were wrong. It just made it easier for them, right? Like, these are these passages where Jesus says, like, it'll be easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than a rich man to enter. It's like people who. Who are successful and thriving in that world system. It's very hard for them to push the world system aside and forsake all of that because they have a lot to lose. Remember, like the guy who's called the rich young ruler, he comes in and says, hey, man, what do I have to do to inherit eternal life? He goes through this whole thing with them. And the last thing, Jesus says, all right, man, there's one more thing. You need to sell all that you have and give it to the poor. Then you can come follow me. And he. He goes away. Why? Because it was so hard. Because he was so rich is what it says, man. Like, if that guy didn't have anything that would have been very easy for him to give up everything to come follow Christ. You see what I'm saying? And so people who are successful and thriving within that world system, it's very hard to reach those people because they don't want to forsake the world. Right. Especially if our message is that you need a savior. You know what I'm saying? If somebody's, like, doing so good at life, they're like, what are you. What are you talking about? Like, I got this great house, I got a great car. I got tons of money.

Co-host (35:47)

Well, this is a discussion that we had the other. I guess maybe I came off a little bit harsh towards poor people, but you just gave the example of the poor person, and there. There are flaws with that person as well, and then there's flaws with the rich man. I think the idea is to be able to become rich but then give it away. You have to have that ability to know and then push it away.

Matt Hepner (36:12)

Yeah. Some people say it just has to be like this. Your hand has to be like this. Right? Like, the money comes in, the money goes out.

Co-host (36:19)

Capable of getting it, though.

Matt Hepner (36:21)

Yeah, yeah, capable. Because the hands open, money can come in, money can go out. It's when it goes in and people go like that. Like, that's where it gets a little ugly. Right. But it's just like, I don't know, if you live in America and you work hard, you're probably. You might have a little money. I'm like, I'm not trying to knock anybody who doesn't or say, like, it's so easy, or say, oh, no, you don't understand. I don't know. I'm just saying if you live in this country and you live within your means and you don't buy a ton of crap and you don't go into debt money for.

Co-host (36:51)

I think that's what I'm talking about with the poor person, the person that is putting themselves in debt. I'm like, this is not a person that should be listened to either, because, like, you're doing this fruitless thing.

Matt Hepner (37:03)

I know.

Co-host (37:03)

That's inside biblical.

Matt Hepner (37:04)

I know. But a lot of poor people struggle with decision making. With money, dude. Yeah. And I'm not. And I don't. I don't want to knock them for that. Like, you watch and you're saying, like, you're making this as hard as possible. Why are you doing this? People get money in their pocket. Like, burns a hole in their pocket. And it's not because they're bad people. It's just some people. It's a skill set, I guess. Like, to me it just seems like you get money, you don't spend it. Like, you get money, you don't spend it. You definitely don't buy things that you don't have money for, right? But a lot of people just don't have that right. And they get. I don't know, maybe it's the lust of the eyes, man, is that, like, they see things and they want it so bad they can't help but spend their money on it. But you see it generation to generation. Our boy Ed Mabry talks about it, man. Like, it happens through generations. That, like, pretty appears to be a curse, man. So there. So we do have to live in the balance, man. We do have to live in this balance of, like, whatever I have. God, thank you. Thank you. And yeah, this, like, whatever money I have, I don't want to spend it. Like, we talk about late in life on going on cruises and going golfing and spending all this money on myself. First and foremost, I want to help my descendants to. So that they can live a life where they can know you Lord, and they're not bogged down by the hardship of poverty. Because poverty sucks, bro. Those of us who have lived in poverty, like, it sucks. And not knowing how to pay your bills and where your next, like, bills are coming from. Especially, like, when you have little kids, like, this is a hard way to live, man. It's a hard way to live. And I'm not even saying, like, other nations where you don't know where your next food is coming from. In this country, we typically know where our next food's coming from. Even if we're, like, super poor, we still know where our food's coming from. But, like, living check to check and just trying to figure out how to make bills is rough, man. It's rough. So I think, like, not loving the world and the things of the world.

Co-host (38:51)

Honestly, those people that are, like, in other countries and are dirt poor, way happier people. Way happier. But even better off, the poor people in this country, they have, like, enough to poison them, which is crazy. Like, you can get a phone that'll poison your brain. You can get food that'll poison your stomach, and that's, like, what you can continue to do in a cycle that's, like, poor in this country. And that's really. That's bad.

Matt Hepner (39:15)

Yeah, yeah, man. I don't know. But the world is just. We don't need the world's goods you know, there's another level to this too, man, which kind of. Which kind of got unveiled during coronavirus, which was like, I was in shock. I know I've said it before, like, how many churchgoers, like, rush to get the injection so that they could go on cruises and so that they could go to restaurants and so that they could fly on airplanes to go places? And I think, man, a lot of people need to really come to terms with, like, how much do I love the world? Am I like. I just remember so many Christian people being so willing to inject this thing into them. We had no clue what it was at the time, just so they could go on cruises and just so they could go to basketball games and just so that they could go into restaurants and stuff. And I remember being in shock by it. And I remember thinking, like, keep your basketball games, man. Keep your airplanes. Keep your. Keep your cruise ships, dude. I don't need the world's goods. You're gonna, like, lure me in and make me put. Inject something in my body. I don't even know what it is, because I love the world's goods so much. And then that was very telling and staggering to me that how much of the church was in that place that loved the world's goods so much that it was willing to do that.

Co-host (40:25)

It's a blessing in a way, when you think about it, because it revealed things that otherwise would have never been able to have been revealed. Like, people would never be faced with that. That type of a strong situation, and. And you wouldn't be able to sit back and see what's what. We just kind of be going blindly in this.

Matt Hepner (40:44)

I don't know how many people learned from it.

Co-host (40:46)

I did so. And a bunch of people, I'm sure the chat did.

Matt Hepner (40:51)

And it was wild to me. Here's another reason I've had this long thing with the world, dude. Another thing is, like, in 2013, about 2010 to 2013, like, in that time period, the Lord really started to open my eyes about the wickedness of the world and how we don't. Because I. Because I figured out that I love drugs. But then I started figuring out I loved money more than I love drugs. And I never thought that before I got close to the Lord, I thought, yeah, like, drugs is my number one issue. I love money as much as the next guy. But, like, drugs is my main issue. And the Lord showed me I loved money more than I even love drugs. And I had, like, some pride because I got kicked out of my House as a kid. And I was like, yeah, I'm self made, you know, I'm like this self made person and my wife doesn't have to work and I take care of a family and little kids and look, I'm somebody important. And I loved money. And all my thoughts all the time was always about money. It was about drugs too, but like it was always about money. It was always, always thinking about getting more money and doing more stuff with money, money, money. And the Lord had to like, slowly but surely like show me how wicked the world was. And if you look at anything under 2013, all this stuff was about the wickedness of the world and being coming out of the world and not being part of the world. And I think sometimes, dude, the Lord is like, the Lord will do this like of you starting to know and understand all these things. My construction career kind of started to skid and skirt off the path, dude, and kind of like just go off a cliff in several doors for like where I was going to work at. Closed in a very bizarre turn of events. A very bizarre turn of events. Door closed, door closed door, closed door closed. And the only open door was this sales job for the tile company Trinity that I've always, that I was working for. And it was like a sales role. And I was incredibly like embarrassed to be a salesman. But it was the only door open. And I knew it was the Lord, but I was so baffled of how could this be the Lord. Like, why would the Lord call me to be a salesman? I'm gritty and I'm rough and people know they can trust me because I'm not a salesman. I'm not trying to like sell anything or convince anybody of anything. Now this is going to like ruin my witness because I'm going to be a salesman. And I just felt so conflicted and so crazy. But I knew it was the Lord. Like I know his guiding hand and I know he shut, shut, shut, shut. And then open this thing right here. And I was like, what? And I would just be so conflicted. And I went into this job and it was the most worldly job you could ever have. And it opened up this whole sphere of the world that I never had access to before. Sitting courtside at like basketball games, being in VIP events, like having several thousand dollar dinners, like at the Bellagio where the, where the fountains go off in Vegas, like on that platform with like hundreds of guests and stuff, taking customers to Italy, like going to trade shows in Vegas and Chicago and Atlanta and like just huge expense Account, like unlimited, unlimited expense accounts. Spending money like left and right was like. The Lord was like, hey, that's a nice little theology you have, bro. The nice little doctrine you've got. Oh, the world's bad. Let's see if you really believe it, bro. And like threw me into this thing where I was like in a washing machine.

Co-host (44:02)

Damn, you really fell off, Matt.

Matt Hepner (44:04)

No, I didn't. That's the thing that like, I mean, I probably did in some ways, but I always was like crying out to God and saying like, God, what are we doing? Like, yeah, I'm doing all this stuff. I'm expected to do all this stuff. I'm expected to go to several thousand dollar dinners and take people to several hundred dollar lunches and I'm expected to sit courtside and like be at basketball games and do all this stuff with people. And like, I'm doing it for my job. But like, am I going astray? God, like, how much of this stuff can, can somebody's soul take of all these riches and luxuries and luxurious living until it does start to affect them, until it does start to take them away? And like, is this just dragging me away from you? Like, am I deceived right now? Am I in delusion about this? Because I'm like doing all. Whether I want to or not, I am doing all this stuff. Like, where am I at with this? And I just think he drugged me through a trial to like show me. Like, it's one thing to say I don't love the world because I didn't have access to all that stuff, but it was another thing to be like, I don't love the world even though I do have all access to all that stuff. And I was very grateful to get out of it.

Co-host (45:03)

That's the rich man giving away his riches, I guess.

Matt Hepner (45:06)

Yeah, well, the riches that we accumulated in that process, like by the grace of God, we didn't spend it, we saved it all and we opened the Christian library. So in the end I felt like I did understand why the Lord did what he did through that whole time. And through that process was like a two for one. One was to see, do I really not love the world? Or is that just talk is cheap and I just didn't have access to it because it's really easy for the poor person to say, I don't love the world. But he never had access to all the goods of the world. It's another thing if you had, if you played in that world and you said, no, no, no, I Don't want that. I don't want any of that.

Co-host (45:37)

Did you have the ability to continue doing what you were doing?

Matt Hepner (45:39)

Yeah.

Co-host (45:40)

But you made the conscious decision to do this now?

Matt Hepner (45:43)

Yeah, they were, they were not happy when I left it, but it was not. People were definitely not happy. I was like the stupidest person, I'll tell you.

Co-host (45:55)

It's a similar thing happened to me where I kind of gave up everything to move here and start from, start from zero. Not everything. You know, it wasn't like courtside, but starting from zero. But now I'm in a situation again where it's like, well, there is this obvious necessary evil of money. And it's like, well, if I got to do this thing, then I have to get money and I got to figure out how to get in. Now I'm in this. I feel like I'm in a trap again. Does that make any sense? Like, whereas, like, what am I chasing money now? Like to, to build this platform? It's, it's, it's contradictory to what I started and how I've been operating.

Matt Hepner (46:29)

Just remain true then. I think that's the main thing, man. And if you remain true and you're like, your goal from what you set out to do, you continue in that. And then money comes. That's okay. That's okay. It's when we like, we set our mind on like the money and the benefits of money and the goals of money, and it starts to overwhelm all of our thinking is really what it's about, dude. It's really what about like what you're going to do in your free time? Right? Because you sleep eight hours, you work eight hours. You got eight hours every day of free time. Like, what are you doing in that free time and what are you doing in your mind? Like, where does your mind go? Like when you wake up, when you're going to bed, when you have free time, is it always about revolving around these things of the world or is it revolving around God?

Co-host (47:13)

Yeah, it's revolving around the things of the world because I'm trying, because I have to build something else. You understand?

Matt Hepner (47:18)

Yeah.

Co-host (47:18)

And it gets crazy.

Matt Hepner (47:19)

Yeah, it's hard. It's hard.

Co-host (47:20)

Yeah.

Matt Hepner (47:21)

I wish I had like a one liner answer. But the reality is to stay grounded in God. That's why it's good to cultivate a habit of getting up first thing in the morning and reading scripture, like setting your alarm clock an hour early. Get up, get with God. Know that like, he's going to guide your day as you get with him. Because you're. You're crying out to him in that first hour, too. As you're reading through the scripture, you're saying, lord, guide me today. Keep me on track. Don't let me go astray. Don't let me trust myself. I know all these warnings in the scripture about the world and my. I've just keep me on track, Lord. Then you just go about your business throughout the day. But you cultivate that habit and you cultivate that discipline for him to keep you on track. I mean, that's how I look at it. Watch. Look at this. Matthew 16, 24, 26. And just notice that, like, over and over, it's this choice between one or the other. Then said Jesus unto his disciples, if any man will come after me, let him deny himself and take up his cross and follow me. For whosoever will save his life shall lose it. And whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it. For what is a man profited if he shall gain the whole world and lose his own soul? See how they're always in, like, direct conflict. Or, what shall a man give in exchange for his soul? Like, what's your soul worth? And I think we have to keep that in mind as we're doing our business throughout the day. Like, you're saying, like, you want to build this thing and you're working on. You want to build this thing. What. What good is it going to be to you if you build the most giant thing in the most giant podcast? You gain the whole world. World. Keep that context of like, all right, the context here is God. Context here is, like, my relationship with and in him. And then within that. Within the reality of that. Yeah, I'm doing this thing with the podcast and hopefully glorifying him. Hopefully. That's your goal. You know what I mean? Through all of this, look at Matthew 6, 19, and 21. We're just gonna rifle through a couple passages that, like that, do this.

Co-host (49:21)

Lay not, lay not up for yourselves treasure upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal.

Matt Hepner (49:31)

But do lay up for yourselves treasure in heaven, where neither moth nor rust is corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal. For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also. This is what it's all coming back to, man. Like, where. Where is your treasure? Your treasure? Here is your treasure in heaven. Do you see what I'm saying? So another thing with God and with Christianity is like, don't, like, refrain from those things. And then Just go sit back at church and twiddle your thumbs. That's not what he's saying. I think a lot of people run into that. Like, what do I do now that I'm a Christian? Okay, don't say cuss words. Eat at chick fil A. Say things like, be blessed. Like, but what am I doing? No, no, no, no. Be just as aggressive for things pertaining to the kingdom of God as you were for the things pertaining to the world. Do lay up for yourself treasure in heaven. That's what he's saying. Focus on the eternal realm now. Go hard the same way you went hard for, like, drugs, money, all the stuff in this life, your career, whatever it was you were going hard for, don't lose that. Just. Just flip that switch and take it to things pertaining to the kingdom of God. Do not lay up treasure for yourself on earth, but do lay it up in heaven. That's two commands. That's two commands from Jesus. All right, let's look at Hebrews 11:13 through 16.

Co-host (50:51)

These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off.

Matt Hepner (50:56)

This is all the heroes of faith in Hebrews 11 that came before verse.

Co-host (51:00)

13 and were persuaded of them and embraced them and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on earth. Shout out Matt Hepner.

Matt Hepner (51:07)

No. Strangers and pilgrims. That's how we are on the Earth. That's what I'm trying to say. We're. We're in the world. We're not of the world. We're kind of mingling. We're in. We're out there doing our thing, but we're not part of that. We're just pilgrims and strangers just passing through. Like, our citizenship is in another realm. It's another kingdom that can't be seen. Our citizenship isn't here. I know you're like, no, I'm an American first. That's okay. That's okay. But as time goes on, you more and more cultivate the citizenship of the kingdom of God. And then whatever nation you live on on the planet, that's secondary.

Co-host (51:39)

For they that say such things declare plainly that they seek a country. And truly, if they had been mindful of that country from once they came out, they might have the opportunity to return. But now they desire a better country. That is heaven. That is in heavenly. Wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God, for he hath prepared for them a city.

Matt Hepner (52:02)

Yeah, God is not ashamed to be called my God, because I have openly said I'm forsaking this world. I'm just a pilgrim and a stranger here. My sights are set on God. My sights are set on this heavenly city, this heavenly kingdom that I belong to. So. So that. That's our thing in the Earth. There's this really rad movie. Me and Jess love it, called Valerian. And there's like. It's like a space movie. You know what I'm saying? There's, like, all these different cultures from, like, different space places. And there's, like, this one group of the people that they have these little animals that drop these pearls, and that's, like, what kind of rebuilds their country and stuff, their planet. It's a rad movie. But anyway, some stuff goes down and these people kind of live with, like, hoodies on, and they live in the shadows of society until they rebuild their society. And I just feel like it's like a good type of, like, Christian living is like, I'm not out there trying to change all of society. I'm not trying to turn Hollywood Christian. I'm not. I'm not trying to make Christian movies, Christian politics, Christian whatever. I'm not trying to do all that. Like, we kind of live in the shadows. We kind of have the hood on. We're just pilgrims and strangers. Like, this is not our home. We're not trying to reform the world. Right? We live in the shadows. We're kind of in the cut. But we bless wherever we go. People don't even know it, but we bless wherever we go. Like, it blesses our sphere around us. The sphere around us. People do better at life. People begin to thrive. People begin to know the Lord, because we have this impact on the world around us, but we have no desire to be a part of that and have the world's goods. Valerian. It's a rad movie. There's, like, this love part of it, too, where the dude and the chick kind of, like, fall in love. It reminds me of me and Jess, too. There's like, a really cool love story in it. It's a rad movie.

Co-host (53:42)

I'll check it out.

Matt Hepner (53:43)

Okay, so how about in 1 Corinthians 7:31, it talks about using the world but not abusing it. I think. I think that's a good picture, too. Was that in the notes?

Co-host (53:55)

No.

Matt Hepner (53:56)

Okay, watch this one. Corinthians 7:31. It says, and they that use this world is not abusing it. For the fashion of this world passes away. I think that's a good description of what we're doing. Like, we're using the world, but we're not abusing it. We're not really part of it. Like, we don't have a choice. We have to live here. We're not leaving. We have to reach the loss. We have to be in the mix. But we are not getting comfortable in abusing this world and making it part of who we are. It's not part of who we are. Okay, let's look at Matthew 17, 1 8, because I just want to. I want to say something crazy right here. And after six days, Jesus takes Peter, James, and John, his brother, and brings them up into a high mountain apart and was transfigured before them. His face did shine as the sun, and his clothes were white as the light. And behold, there appeared unto them Moses and Elijah talking with him. Then answered Peter and said unto Jesus, lord, it is good for us to be here, if you will. Let us make here three tabernacles, one for you, one for Moses, and one for Elijah, while he yet spake. Behold, a bright cloud overshadowed them. And behold, a voice out of the cloud which said, this is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. Hear ye him. And when the disciples heard it, they fell on their face and were sore afraid. And Jesus came and touched them and said, arise, be not afraid. And when they had lifted up their eyes, they saw no man save Jesus. Only now I just want you to hold that story in your heart. And now let's look at Romans 12:1 2. Just kind of keep. Keep that whole thing you just read.

Co-host (55:26)

I beseech you, therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies, a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service. And be not comforted to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind that ye may provide what is. What is that? Good and acceptable and perfect will of God.

Matt Hepner (55:46)

Okay, what it really says was, be not conformed to this. I can't do this.

Co-host (55:52)

What did I say?

Matt Hepner (55:54)

Be not conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind.

Co-host (55:59)

Well, that's what I put. I put the, the words up so people could fact check me.

Matt Hepner (56:03)

But the whole. But the whole thing that I wanted to get at was that same word where it says that Jesus was transfigured that we just read in Matthew 17. That's the same words it says right here where it says, be not conformed to this world, but be transformed. Like as radical as that change was to Jesus when he was transformed, when he was transfigured. That's what our life is supposed to be like. And, dude, in a weird way, I feel like the longer I'm doing this, I'm like, that did happen. Like, that did happen to me. Like, I'm. I'm drastically. As much as Jesus was, and then he was so bright like, that I had. I've had that much of a change. I feel like, man, I feel like that word, it's metamorpho. Like, metamorphosized or whatever. Like, it's a metamorphosis.

Co-host (56:43)

Like there's, like a butterfly.

Matt Hepner (56:45)

Yeah, like there's that much of a change. Dude, it's saying be that. It's saying, be not conformed to this world. I forget which translation it is. It says, don't let the world form you and press you into its mold. Isn't that wild? And isn't that exactly what the world's trying to do, bro, if you think about it, as you watch the TV shows and you go on the tweeter or the X, I'm gonna start calling it the X now because it's called the X. And as you just do this stuff in life, it's just the world is just trying to form you into its mold and press you. And, like, you know, when you're making cookies at Christmas time, they press into this thing, and then here's the shape of it, and the world is just pressing you into this mold to make you a certain way. Don't let it do that. Don't let the world do that, man. Be not conformed to this world. Don't let it press you into its mold. But be transformed by the renewing of your mind. Be transfigured by the renewing.

Co-host (57:36)

Pretty sure this says, be comforted, but.

Matt Hepner (57:39)

No, be conformed, it says. It says, be not conformed to this world. Right? So these are clear directions from the scripture. That's why we're bringing this up. We really want to bring this up. Look at Psalm 1. Do we have Psalm 1 in the notes?

Co-host (58:00)

Blessed is the man that walketh not in the council of the ungodly, Nor standeth in the way of sinners, nor sitteth in the seat of the scornful. But his delights in the law of the Lord, and his law doth meditate day and night.

Matt Hepner (58:13)

Okay, so look at the. Look at the contrast, right? When you see the law of the Lord like this. This is not the law of Moses. Right? I know. We've gotten sideways on that the last couple weeks. This is talking about, like, the eternal word of God, the scripture. Blessed is the man. That doesn't walk in the council of the ungodly. How? Like, I don't know. Now that I'm in this sphere and in this realm of, like, the people on podcasts and stuff, and I get sent these things of, like, what got said on the X, and, like, I don't know, just all these things and all this. Like, this guy said this and that guy said that, and I just read these things and I'm like, how much? How much are people getting their counsel from the ungodly? Like, oh, no, no. But this guy's cool, though. Like, he's cool on the X. He's really cool on the podcast. Yeah, but he's ungodly. You know what I'm saying? And, like, at some point, we've got to get that balance back. Dude, look at this. Blessed is the man that walks not in the council of the ungodly. I, Dude, I love listening to, like, Joe Rogan, like, as much as anybody, bro. Like, I, like, I, I, I'm so grateful to him, especially for, like, the different scientists he's had on the health people like Dr. Rhonda Patrick, Andrew Huberman, or even just, like, wild people, older dudes that stay in good shape and they motivate you to do good, like Laird Hamilton or Goggins or Cam Haynes. Like, I'm so grateful for those guys, but I have to keep a balance that I'm not getting counseled by the ungodly. Does that make sense? Right?

Co-host (59:36)

Yeah.

Podcast Advertiser (59:36)

Yeah.

Co-host (59:36)

Don't walk in his council. Like, I made that mistake with Jordan Peterson for a while, and then I withdrew from it. Because they're just men.

Matt Hepner (59:44)

Yeah.

Co-host (59:44)

And they're, they're really not even. They don't really have good doctrine at all.

Matt Hepner (59:49)

But it's like, within this world system, they're, like, the best within the world.

Co-host (59:52)

System, but still take what you can, I think.

Matt Hepner (59:55)

Sure, sure. But we just want to make sure we're not walking in the council of the ungodly and we're having a balance in this. Like, yeah, there is a lot of good things to learn, especially I. It's been a blessing to us, to me and Jess, both older people living in good health, because we do want to be mindful of, like, living healthy and being healthy. And there has been a lot we've learned, like, older people. Yeah. From, like, even ungodly. But they have things of the world. They have some wisdom of the world that does help us a little bit. That's okay. But we have to keep a balance. And I think For a lot of people, there's just no balance, dude. Just all. Everything they're feeding, their spirit is stuff from the ungodly. And there's got to be a balance, man. But look at the opposite. His the blessed is the man that walks not in the council of the ungodly, nor stands in the way of sinners, nor sits in the sea of the scornful. But his delight is in the law of the Lord. And in his law does he meditate day and night. He thinks about it and he talks about it day and night. Like, this is what's in his heart, this is what's in his mind. This is what comes to his mind. To his mind. Stories from the Bible come to his mind. Like concepts and metaphors and like stories and parables come to his mind from the kingdom of God. Like that. Like, that's how he operates.

Co-host (61:02)

This is, this is an interesting scripture because when we're talking about meditating, like, this is a. Like a New age practice, you'll see this with yoga a lot and things like that. And they're like, meditate, clear your mind, empty your mind. But he's saying, meditate here on the things of God.

Matt Hepner (61:15)

Amen. That's the difference. Yeah, we've talked about that before. Where the people want to do meditation in the back. And I said, no, no, we don't do meditation. Like Eastern style meditation here. They said, why not? I said, because then if you open up your spirit to anything to come in, then anything will come in.

Co-host (61:29)

Yeah.

Matt Hepner (61:30)

They said, yeah, that's what we're trying to do. And I said, well, yeah, we don't do that here because then entities will come in.

Co-host (61:34)

Not in this casino, exactly.

Matt Hepner (61:36)

They said, what do you mean entities? I said, demons. And she was pissed. Like, she was so mad, she said, we're not summoning demons, we're summoning light. And then I almost said, yeah, Satan, you know, disguised himself as an angel light. But I didn't. I just let it go. And then all those boomers were nasty to me from there on out. But I had warned him already that, like, they could use the room for some other stuff they were doing. And they just kind of just wanted to take over and do, like New age stuff. So. But watch what the dude's like. So anytime you see the scripture talking about, like, meditating on the word of God, it doesn't mean, like clearing everything out. First off, it means meditating on the word of God, not nothing. But then it means talking about it as well. It's not Like Eastern meditation, where it's just silent and shut your brain off. It's like taking in the word. Discussing it like this would be a form of meditating on the word of God, discussing, talking through it. Do you see what I'm saying? Those people. Those people will be like a tree planted by the rivers of water that brings forth this fruit in his season. His leaf also shall not wither, and whatsoever he does shall prosper. Biblical prosperity. Not like the prosperity gospel with jets and, like, hosing people for their money. Not. Not that. But biblical prosperity is like this lovely, flourishing, thriving life. It's a tree that's like, next to a river in nutrition and water for all of its needs. And it fills up this tree and it's loaded with fruit and it's healthy. It's got fruit and leaves and it's just this healthy branches going everywhere. Like, that's what our life can look like if we don't sit, if we don't walk in the council of the ungodly. But we do delight in the word of God. The ungodly are not so, but they're like the chaff which the wind drives away. They just blow away. Therefore, the ungodly won't stand in the judgment, nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous. For the Lord knows the way of the righteous, but the way of the ungodly shall die. There's only two options, man. Like, we're going to go the way of the righteous or the way of the ungodly. And we just need to be mindful of this. We just need to be mindful of this. All right, let's start breaking down. Like, what kind of. What is the issue within, like, this world system? Right? Let's look at 1 Corinthians 2, 11, 14.

Co-host (63:48)

For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of a man which is in him, even so, the things of God knoweth no man but the spirit of God. Now, we have received not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God.

Matt Hepner (64:01)

Two, two options. Now, we have received not the spirit of the world. So there's a spirit of the world. There's an actual spirit of the world. We haven't received that man. That's why, like, it's in contrast to us. When we see it in church, we don't like it. We get cringy about it. We're like. Like, oh, they're like. Like the worldliness in the church. We don't have the spirit of the world. So when we see that spirit of the world in the church. Oh, it. We just think, oh, this is terrible. This is awful. To see the spirit of the world in the world is one thing in a Super bowl halftime show. To see it in the church, you just go, oh, oh, this is brutal. We have received not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God, that we might know the things that are freely given us of God. Which things also we speak not in the words which man's wisdom teaches. Remember, the world is based on man's wisdom. Which things also we speak not in the words which man's wisdom teaches, but which the Holy Ghost teaches. Comparing spiritual things with spiritual, we can only. Like when we compare scripture with scripture, we're comparing spiritual things with spiritual. But the natural man receives not the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness unto him. Neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

Co-host (65:15)

We brought this up in the. The Jude study. This scripture, I think we're talking about brute beast, right?

Matt Hepner (65:22)

That they just can't get it.

Co-host (65:23)

Yeah, this is. This was the scripture that we. That we had read in the cross comparison of that.

Matt Hepner (65:28)

Yes, spiritual things are spiritually discerned. We're not part of the world. We're in the world. Sorry, but we're not of the world. And the point that I'm going to kind of build to is to maybe not be so rough on people who don't get it, because they can't get it. They can't get it. These things are spiritually understood, the things of God. Like, it's foolishness to them. So just keep that in mind. I'm drawing this distinction between where we live and where they live and how different it is. And then I just want to kind of build towards this thing of like, be mindful of the situation that the world is in before we're like, so quick to. I mean, for one, of course we're not taking advice and counsel from them. Of course we're not. But then on the flip side, we're also not being so nasty, demanding that they see things our way. Right?

Co-host (66:17)

I mean, nasty. What's wrong with that?

Matt Hepner (66:18)

You know what I'm talking about? All right, look at 2 Corinthians 4:1:4. This is going to make it a little bit clearer. Therefore, seeing we have this ministry, as we have received mercy, we faint not, but have renounced the hidden things of dishonesty. Not walking in craftiness nor handling the word of God deceitfully, but by manifestation of the truth commending ourselves to every man's conscience in the sight of God. But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost, in whom the God of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

Podcast Advertiser (66:54)

Them.

Matt Hepner (66:55)

So this is loaded. This is loaded. The people that we're dealing with in the world, they're lost. And why are they lost? They're lost because the God of this world. So now we're going to introduce everybody to this phrase, the God of this world. Oh, you didn't know there was a God of this world? A lowercase g God of this world. Just like there's lowercase g gods that rule over territories, that rule over, like, nations. We talk about principalities and powers and rulers in high places. We talked about, like, the Prince of Persia in the book of Daniel. Remember, Gabriel couldn't get through because the Prince of Persia held him up. Yeah. There's all these things that rule over territories, and there's one that rules the world, the God of this world. And he's blinded the minds of them which believe not. So just keep that in mind. You're dealing with blind people before you just go off the rails with people. Like, there's a blind chick that comes in. She's like the sweetest lady, too. This old Catholic lady. She's like this sweet. And imagine, like, how rough you could be to her if she says, oh, what pastries do you have today? And I go, oh, what do you mean? You can't see the cinnamon rolls there?

Co-host (68:00)

Use your nose.

Matt Hepner (68:01)

You can't. You can't see the cheese danishes. Do you see what I'm saying? I don't do that. I don't do that with her. I go, well, we've got the cinnamon rolls. They're, like, really big. You might even need a bag because you might be able to eat half of it, but not the whole thing, because they're huge. And we got the cheese danishes. And sometimes when I talk to her, just put my hand on her hand. She's like the sweetest Catholic lady. She's really, like, so sweet of a lady. But she's blind, right? You have to act different with them than you would with, like, a normal boomer at the. At the register, like, asking for stuff, going, what pastries you got today? She's not doing that. She's blind. You see what I'm saying? You have to be mindful. You have to care about People, when you're dealing with them like that, these people have been blinded, their minds have been blinded by the God of this world. Okay? So just keep this in mind that, like, we're dealing with the God of this world. And I just want to start to get to this point of where, like, hurtful it is to the heart of God to pledge allegiance to the world. Do you see what I'm saying? Because there is a God of this world. I want to read a story from 1 Samuel 8 about, like, I just. Like, this is the ultimate grieving the heart of God in regards to, like, loving the world instead of loving his kingdom. If you don't know this story, this is like a good story for everybody to know. This is another hard one to me. This is another one that's like the story of David and Bathsheba. And I'm just like, oh, this is another one that. I hate reading it. But it has to be read, man. It has to be understood. And I think this draws a stark contrast because I think you have to understand that the entirety of the Bible is God telling his covenant people, his called out ones, his sanctified, his separated ones, his anointed ones that he pulls out of the world. And he says, you're not like the nations around you. You are not like everything you see around you. I've pulled different. You're separated for a purpose. You're something different. You are no longer like the world. And so if you screw up, you screw all of them too, because they're your own. You are their only example to see who I am. Okay, watch this. 1 Samuel 8, starting in verse 1. And it came to pass when Samuel was old that he made his sons judges over Israel. Now, the name of his firstborn was Joel, and the name of his second, Abaya, they were judges in Beersheba. And his sons walked not in his ways, but turned aside after lucre, that's money. And took bribes and perverted judgment. So now these guys are in charge of the religious institution of their day. And I know it sounds shocking, but they want the money and they take bribes and they pervert judgment. Then all the elders of Israel gathered themselves together and came to Samuel under Rama and said unto him, behold, you are old, and your sons walk not in your ways. So Samuel was a righteous man, but. But, oh, I hate this story. He raised ungodly kids, man. I don't. It's so crazy. Like, you read the life of Samuel. Kids said unto him, behold, you are old, and your sons walk not in Your ways now make us a king to judge us like all the nations. This is staggering because God is supposed to be their king. When we talk about the law of Israel, the law of Moses that was given to Israel, yeah, they had religious law, they had ceremonial law, they had red light and stop sign law. They had civil law because God was their king. God was their king. And here they come and saying, make us a king, like, like, give us a human king so that we can be like all the nations around us.

Co-host (71:24)

Do you think that the, the 501C3 church is that that modern king that we're asking for? Because we. We had this discussion on a previous episode. We were like, with Pastor Zach. We're like, well, what do we do? And you, you were saying, we need to, like, kind of hold ourselves accountable. The body of Christ. But how do we hold ourselves accountable? There has to be something at the top. And right now, that structure at the top, that weird church. So it's almost like we've asked for the king and then we've gotten that 553.

Matt Hepner (71:57)

Something incredibly offensive. This is, like, much more offensive.

Co-host (71:59)

My bad. I'm just putting together.

Matt Hepner (72:01)

No, you're saying that basically that thing has set itself up as God, is what you're saying then.

Co-host (72:07)

Yeah, in the Catholic Church, definitely.

Matt Hepner (72:11)

That's Antichrist. The thing that sets itself in the temple as God is Antichrist. That's in the Thessalonian letter. So it's, it's a. It's an incredibly valid and astute observation that in some ways that system sets itself up as God. I'll give you an example. You go to church in the 501C3 lobby, and you tell somebody, yeah, man, I'm doing the best I can, but I'm still shooting heroin. They'll say, it's okay. You have grace, man. It's okay. I'm glad you're here. You go in the next week, you say, yeah, man, I'm doing my thing, trying to be a Christian, but I'm cheating on my wife. It's okay, man. You have grace. Now. If you say to that same guy a month later, like, yeah, I'm not really going and watching the show on Sundays anymore, he goes, oh, man. Yeah, there's no grace for that. You're backslidden. Do you see what I'm saying? It's almost like that system itself has set itself up in people's hearts as God. It's a wild observation you're making. I don't like that you're making It. Because I don't want to be like, associated with that. Because I feel like you're going like a little wild right now.

Co-host (73:12)

He loves that.

Matt Hepner (73:12)

But.

Co-host (73:13)

But no, I'm just saying. Yeah, it's something that I've noticed. Never verbalize, but when I do go there, that's how I behave. Like, this is not God. This is a. This is a place where stuff happens, but it is not.

Matt Hepner (73:25)

Jesus is the head of the body.

Co-host (73:27)

Right. This thing here is some sort of a tool. I don't know if it's useful or not. Yeah, never mind. Sorry. Continue.

Matt Hepner (73:35)

Yes, sir. Okay, now verse six. But the thing displeased Samuel when they said, give us a king to judge us. And Samuel prayed unto the Lord and the Lord said to Samuel, hearken unto the voice of the people and all that they say unto you. So Samuel goes to the Lord, he says, God, only kingdom on the planet where you're our king. All the other nations have a king. And now they're saying they want a king. Surely that's not okay, Lord, what do you want me to tell them? The Lord said unto Samuel, go ahead and hearken unto the voice of the people and all that they say unto you, for they have not rejected you, but they have rejected me that I should not reign over them. Oh, I cried the first time I read it. I still cry sometimes when I read. I'm not gonna cry now because I'm like on the show. But if I was alone right now reading that, dude, I get teary eyed. I mean, I hate that that got said. I hate that God says they haven't rejected you, man. They've rejected me that I should not reign over them. And if you read all of this, part of it, that's why it matters, to read the whole Bible in context, you just go, man, he's been through so much with these people. We read all this, this whole story of the creation of this nation and bringing them out of Egypt, and then it comes to this and they reject God that he should not reign over them. And they just want to be like all the other nations. And that's like us when we want to be like the world, man. It's the same thing. And it grieves the heart of God. God, he says that I should not reign over them according to all the works which they have done since the day that I brought them up out of Egypt, even unto this day, wherewith they have forsaken me and served other gods. So do they also unto you. Now therefore hearken unto their Voice how be it yet? Protest solemnly unto them and show them the manner of the king that shall reign over them. And Samuel told all the words of the Lord unto the people that asked of him a king. So all the people say, we want a king. He says, okay, okay, but just so everybody's on the same page, this is what the king is going to be.

Co-host (75:26)

Like, you know what's, what's crazy. So the problem that the people had here was with the system because God set up a system and the system was, all right, judges, right, they're going to judge you, but I am the king. And they're, they're infallible. So the judges falter and then they ask for something different. It's just, this is a constant thing. But we need a system. Or at least we, I don't know, we need some sort of guidelines as people.

Matt Hepner (75:53)

Yeah, we have the Bible, we have the Holy Spirit. Like that's the thing as we try to set up man made structures. It's, this is what happens every time. Yes. And he said, this will be the manner of the king that shall reign over you. He'll take your sons and appoint them for himself for his chariots and to be his horsemen. And some shall run before his chariots. That's slaves. He'll appoint him captains over thousands and captains over 50s, and will set them to ears ground and reap his harvest and make his instruments of war and instruments of his chariots. That's slaves. And he'll take your daughters to be confectionaries and to be cooks and to be bakers. That's slaves. And they'll take your fields and your vineyards and your olive yards, even the best of them, and give them to his servants. That's a thief. And he'll take the 10th of your seed and of your vineyards and give to his officers and to his servants.

Co-host (76:37)

That's a tides, isn't it?

Matt Hepner (76:39)

Yeah, but that's a thief, man. I mean, he's just taking your stuff to give it to his officers and to his servants.

Co-host (76:44)

You're gonna take a tenth of it. It's biblical.

Matt Hepner (76:46)

Stop. And he'll take your men, servants, and your maid servants and your goodliest young men and your asses and put them to his work slaves. He'll take the 10th of your sheep and you shall be his servants. And you shall cry out in that day because of your king which you shall have chosen you. And the Lord will not hear you in that day. Is everybody clear on this? God's saying, okay, you want a King, that's fine, but let's just make absolutely sure before we put this in place. If you guys change your mind and you cry out to the Lord, he will not hear you in that day. There's. You've gone past the point of no return. He will not hear you in that day. Are we all clear?

Co-host (77:23)

The Samuel. Samuel says this to the people as well. God says this to Samuel and he.

Matt Hepner (77:27)

Tells them, yeah, he says, go tell this to the people. Nevertheless, the people refused to refuse to obey the voice of Samuel. And they said, no, but we will have a king over us that we also may be like all the nations and that our king may judge us and go out before us and fight our battles. And Samuel heard all the words of the people and he rehearsed them in the ears of the Lord. And the Lord said to Samuel, hearken unto their voice and make them a king. And Samuel said unto the men of Israel, go every man unto his city. Do you see what I'm saying? You see how ugly and filthy this is? To turn from God to pledge allegiance to the world. Does that. Does that story kind of, kind of lay that down. And now we know that we just read in this last passage, we read about the God of this world, right? Do you see how. Do you see how, like, loving the world and pledge allegiance to the world could grieve God's heart so much?

Co-host (78:20)

Now what I see here too, is like, time, time being this thing that God operates outside of, and he does it on his time. But the people and I feel like this way a lot. You feel like this has to get done in a certain time because things are, you know, this political system with these judges is corrupt and we have to justify it within a certain time period. We need a solution. This is the solution that we think, and then they do it. But God seems to be saying, like, just chill out. Like, don't. Don't do those things in that time period. Does that make sense?

Matt Hepner (79:01)

Yeah, yeah. Like, don't worry about it. You guys are all operating in the way the world's thinking. And yeah, this guy in the world came up with this problem. We need to hurry up and make a solution, a worldly solution according to this guy's solution. He's from the world. He's got a solution for this guy's problem.

Co-host (79:17)

Yeah, but because we exist in the world in the constraint of time in. In which, like, we feel like we have to make these solutions, because I'm not going to be satisfied with an answer that with the solution that will come in my children's time. I'm like, I kind of gotta help this before they, they take. You know what I mean?

Matt Hepner (79:34)

That's the difference between me and you. I'm a bit of a time traveler as far as biblically speaking, and so I don't really get caught up in all that. I just trust the Lord, like, he's going to deal with my kids, he's going to take care of my grandkids, he's going to take care of all my descendants. Like he loves me and everything's good and I'm not in a rush to like, oh, they got Maduro, we have to do something else. Like I like, whatever, whatever. They're gonna do this. Next thing you know, they're gonna get Cuba and Mexico. What, whatever, whatever. They're just doing their thing in the world. I'm in the world. I'm not of the world. Like I'm from another kingdom. They're doing whatever they're doing. That's how. Why would I even think that within that world system, in the so called like media, they're feeding me anything that's true through, like, who knows what they're doing at those levels, like on the, in the world stage. Like, who cares, bro? It's not my thing, man. Okay, watch this, watch this. We're talking about like grieving God's heart. This world system we're in. Luke 4:1 through 8 and Jesus, being full of the Holy Ghost, returned from Jordan and was led by the spirit into the wilderness, being 40 days tempted of the devil. And in those days he did eat nothing. When they were ended, he afterward hungered. And the devil said unto him, if you're the Son of God, command this stone that it be made bread. And Jesus answered him, saying, I can miraculously turn stones into bread or make miraculous, make bread out of nothing. But I only do that with the crowd of 5,000 or the crowd of 7,000 at a later date. I won't do that for personal gain. He doesn't say it like that right here, but that's really what happens. He's saying, miraculously make bread. And Jesus has to be smiling because he knows, like in a couple months or years, however much later the story is, he does miraculously make bread for crowds, but he won't do it for personal gain. Do you see what I'm saying? Like today you got people with like spiritual gifts that just hijack them and prostitute them for personal gain, man, just to be rich, just for whatever the world's goods are Jesus won't do that. Okay, sorry. Let me read it.

Co-host (81:34)

Right.

Matt Hepner (81:34)

And the devil said unto him, if thou be the son of God, command the stone that it be made bread. And Jesus answered him, saying, it is written that man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word of God. And the devil, taking him up into a high mountain, showed unto him all the kingdoms of the world in a moment of time. And the devil said unto him, in the glory of them, for that is delivered unto me, into whomsoever I will I give it said, if thou therefore will worship me, all shall be thine. And Jesus answered and said unto him, get thee behind me, Satan. For it is written, thou shalt worship the Lord thy God. In him only shall thou serve. But notice what Satan says. He says, all this power will I give thee in the glory of them. For that is delivered unto me. He is the God of this world. That's Satan. All of these things that have been delivered unto me and that were delivered. It's a Greek word, paradidomi, and it's the same word that means betrayed. Like when Judas betrayed Jesus, that same word delivered. Yeah, like Adam betrayed the kingdoms to Satan. In betrayal, they were given to Satan. That. It's the same word.

Co-host (82:42)

This is what Albarino's book is about, in a way. Although maybe he misses it.

Matt Hepner (82:47)

No, Albarino doesn't miss it. That dude's on it.

Co-host (82:49)

I mean. No, I mean, the book implies that we still have the birthright.

Matt Hepner (82:54)

Well, we do. We do. We come out from under the authority of Satan by pledging allegiance to Christ being born again. Now we're part of that kingdom, and now, boom, we've come out from under that, and we do have authority now. But to those who have not come out from the. From the authority of the God of this world, they're still under his rule. That's why we would never go back and love the world like our enemies. Me is the. Is the God of this world. But he says. He says, all this power will I give thee in the glory of them. For that is delivered unto me. For that is betrayed unto me. It's a. It's. If you go back and look at the Greek. It's intriguing. It's implying. Yeah. That Adam, like, betrayed it the same way Judas betrayed Jesus.

Co-host (83:31)

Yeah. God gave it to him.

Matt Hepner (83:32)

Betrayed into Satan's hands. But anyway, the point we're making is simply that he is the God of this world, and this is why it's so heinous. And we don't want to grieve God's heart to love the world anymore, like we're not part of the world. And when we do love the world, we're pledging allegiance to the God of this world of how heinous it is. Look at Ephesians 2:1 5. And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins. God brought you to life even though you were dead in trespasses and sins. We're in. In time past, you walked according to the course of this world, in time passed. How dare we go back and walk according to the ways of this world again, according to the prince of the power of the air. You know, there's the two Greek words for air. There's like the one that is air and the other one that's like ether. And it looks like this one isn't like the ether, like the space, but it's like the air around the earth. Some would say like the airwaves, like the way how like media is done now, like through the airwaves. It's intriguing that he's the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now works in the children of disobedience, among whom also we all had our conversation in time past, and the lust of our flesh fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind. And we're by nature the children of wrath, even as others. But God, who is rich in mercy for his great love, wherewith he loved us even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ by grace. You are saved. Right? So. So I'm just shaping up this picture of the world, man. There's this, this. There's this entity that. He's the God of this world. He's the prince of the power of the air. Let's look at John 12:28:32. Just be real clear who you're pledging allegiance to. If you love the world.

Co-host (85:20)

Father, glorify thy name. Then came there a voice from heaven saying, I have both glorified it and will glorify it again. The people therefore, that stood by and heard it said it thundered.

Matt Hepner (85:32)

This is Jesus praying and God responding from heaven. And boom. This voice thunders.

Co-host (85:36)

Others said an angel spake to him.

Matt Hepner (85:38)

Jesus answered and said, this voice came not because of me, but for your sakes. I wanted all you guys to hear it. Now is the judgment of this world. He's about to go to the cross, is what he's talking about. Now is the judgment of this world. This world be cast out. And if I Be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me. You see what. You see what we're saying now? They're like those who come out from under the authority of Satan. I will be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me. So those are the people who have come out from under the rule of the God of this world, right? So we've heard him be called the God of this world, the prince of the power of the air. And here he's called the prince of this world, right, in verse 31. Also in John 16:11 is another place where he's referred to as the Prince of this world. Right? Let's look at John 14:30. I can just read it real quick. This just says, hereafter, I will not talk much with you, for the Prince of this world comes and has nothing in me. So this is Jesus getting ready to go to the cross, and he's talking about how the prince of this world, Satan, is coming for him, but he can't touch him because he has nothing in him. And this is what I'm talking about. We have to be mindful that he can't have get any hooks in us. We can't have anything in us that draws us to the world. The things that we love in the world. Like, if we don't have those things, we forsake all those things. Then when Satan comes along, says, you have to get the injection. If you want to go on a cruise, you go, I don't need the cruise. You got nothing in me. I have no desires for the things of the world. What I have is in heaven. What I want is in heaven. My rewards in heaven, my rewards not on the earth. There's nothing here that you can, like, dangle in front of me because we have to be mindful. Satan's like that fish, you know, that fish that's like this. And then he has, like, the dangly thing like this. And then the little fish comes up here and he's like, dangling the thing. And then the little fish is like, oh. And the little fish is, like, bedazzled by the thing. Like, oh, man. Yeah. This is like Satan and this is like the world. He, like, dangles the world and little fishes. But, oh, Taylor Swifty, you're the coolest. Oh, I want to be cool. Boom. And then he's just eating you. Do you see what I'm saying? Like, that's how Satan operates. He has things. He has the world. He tries to bedazzle you with it. You go to it and Then, boom, he's got you. He's got you. Jesus says, yeah, not my case. He's got nothing in me. He's got nothing in me. And you have to be intentional to set your life out like that. Like, look at Lot's wife, right? Like, they're getting rescued out of Sodom and Gomorrah. And the one rule is, don't turn around and look back. You better be mindful there's not something in your life that you're going to turn around and look back for. You better be mindful about that. Like what? Like, what if it's the end and you're looking back? Oh, but I really love my 401k. Oh, man. I really love my car. Oh, man. But I built up this reputation. I built up this big business. I built up this big thing, and I don't want to leave it, man. I don't want to go to the eternal realm. I'm like, look at how hard I work. I want to look back, and I want to have these things. Or in Lot's case, I think it's even her children, is why she looked back. Dude, we got to be mindful that we definitely have our children knowing the Lord and walking with the Lord. Like, we just have to make sure we're setting everything up ahead of time to not be locked in or to be entangled by the things of the world and by the things of Satan, to be very mindful of that. That those aren't the things that move us. We're Almost done. John 16, 32 and 33. We're just, like, right here. This says, behold, the hour comes. Yea, is now come, that you shall be scattered. Every man to his own and shall leave me alone. Yet I'm not alone, because the Father is with me. These things I have spoken unto you, that in me you might have peace. In the world you shall have tribulation. But be a good cheer. I have overcome the world. All right, so we're talking about this world system that we're not a part of. We. We're not in the world. We're in the world. We're not of the world. We don't love the world. But our king and our Savior and the author and finisher of our faith has overcome the world. Right? Let's look at. For us, let's look at 1 John 5:4. So we're kind of going back to where we started. We're back in one John.

Co-host (89:53)

Victory that overcometh the world. Even our faith.

Matt Hepner (89:56)

Even our faith. So our Faith is the victory that overcomes the world. Remember, faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things unseen. It's the opposite of the lust of the eyes, right? Because it's the evidence of the things unseen. We talk about this a lot. It's the substance of things hoped for, it's the evidence of things unseen. We have a substance that overcomes the world. It's faith. It's not, it's not a made up thing. We have a substance. We have something real and tangible in us. To us, faith. Like we have faith and that's what overcomes the world. Jesus overcame the world and now we can overcome the world. Whatsoever is born of God, that's us. We're born of God. We've been born again. For whatsoever is born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that overcomes the world. Even our faith. It was kind of lovely. Even what the Raven was saying about his testimony. And like that's all he's got, you know, in the beginning, like at least you got that, you got a testimony, passages. Maybe you don't read scripture every day, but in the beginning you've been saved from something, right? And you've got this testimony. We have our faith. It's the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things unseen. And that's how we overcome the world. Because we know there's something beyond this realm. So this temporary goods of the world has no pull on me, has no draw on me. I don't care. I don't need it. All right, let's just wrap it up with this then. James 3:13 through 4. 4. And then this is just going to be the end right here. I can't believe we made it with like not a crazy coughing episode. Or maybe there was a bad coffee.

Co-host (91:28)

There's a couple we got to edit out. My brethren, be not many masters, knowing what we shall receive, knowing that we shall receive the greater condemnation. For in many things we offend all.

Matt Hepner (91:40)

Wait a minute, wait a minute. Can we get in the right passage?

Co-host (91:44)

This is the wrong passage.

Matt Hepner (91:46)

James 3:13. Oh, I got it.

Co-host (91:55)

Right and it's wrong.

Matt Hepner (91:57)

Who is a wise man and endued with knowledge among you, let him show out of a good conversation his works with meekness of wisdom. But if you have bitter envying and strife in your hearts, glory not, and lie not against the truth. This wisdom descends not from above, but is earthly, sensual, devilish. Remember, this whole thing we're laying out, that we've been laying out this whole time, is there's a way of the world, right? There's a way of the kingdom of heaven and there's a way of the world. There's a wisdom of this world, but it descends not from above. It's earthly, man. It's sensual, it's devilish, but it seems so good on the earth. The guy wins all the tweeter wars, man. He wins all the X wars because he's got all this wisdom of the world. He's making all this cool stuff in business because he's got all the wisdom of the world. We're not. We're not part of any of that. We don't pledge allegiance to anything in this world. We've already said that. If we're pledging allegiance to the God of this world, to the prince of the power of the air, to the prince of this world, we've laid out all these passages that the world is Satan's realm and we're not part of that anymore. Anymore. We're in that system, but we're not of that system. But the wisdom that's from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle and easy to be entreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality and without hypocrisy. And the fruit of righteousness is sown in peace of them that make peace, from where come wars and fightings among you come they not hence even of your loss, that war in your members. Now we're back to that beginning, right? The lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes and the pride of life isn't this was what's causing all this conflict in your own self and in the church. You lost and have not. You kill and desire to have and cannot obtain. You fight in war, yet you have not because you ask not. You ask and receive not because you ask amiss that you may consume it upon your loss. You adulterers and adulteresses, know you not that the friendship of the world is or therefore will be, A friend of the world is the enemy of God.