Alisha Karabinus et al. eds., "Historiographies of Game Studies: What It Has Been, What It Could Be" (Punctum Books, 2025)

Summary

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Episode Overview

Podcast: New Books Network – New Books in Game Studies
Host: Rudolf Inderst
Guests: Alisha Karabinus, Carly Kaczurek, Cody Meier, Emma Vossen (Editors)
Book Discussed: Historiographies of Game Studies: What It Has Been, What It Could Be (Punctum Books, 2025)
Date: September 17, 2025

This episode dives into the newly released anthology Historiographies of Game Studies, an open-access collection that critically examines how the field of game studies has constructed its own past (and present), the boundaries it has set, and the potential directions for its future. Hosts and editors discuss issues such as disciplinary gatekeeping, the diversity of approaches and voices in the field, and the practical and personal realities of editing a massive, multi-authored volume.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Challenging and Expanding Boundaries in Game Studies

• Gatekeeping and Professional Identity

  • Game studies, like many fields, has long been defined by what is excluded as much as what is included (04:10, Carly Kaczurek).
  • Developing the field is “a boundary exercise”—distinguishing between what counts as "game studies" versus what does not, often shaped by individual and collective identities.

  “Sometimes it’s not just wrapped up in what they’re doing, but also in what they’re excluding or what they’re saying isn’t.”
  —Carly Kaczurek (04:23)

• Interdisciplinarity and Openness

  • The anthology aims to kick open gates, encouraging broader conversations and including more voices from rhetoric, philosophy, anthropology, and beyond (05:31, Alicia Karabinus).
  • The collection pushes against siloed thinking, urging scholars to “include those voices and making sure that then when we take some of that stuff back to our home disciplines... we don’t feel like we have to reinvent the wheel just so we can study one thing.” (12:53, Alicia Karabinus)

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Surprising and Contentious Discoveries

• Belonging and Exclusion

  • Many early contributors to game studies, even from diverse fields (anthropology, critical race studies), often felt unwelcome and found academic homes elsewhere (06:38, Cody Meier).
  • Interviews reveal that even foundational figures remembered field-defining moments, such as the “ludology vs narratology” debates, in very different ways—reflecting underlying misunderstandings or tensions (07:54, Cody Meier).

  “One of the things that struck me was how many people from different fields felt like they didn’t belong in game studies... I don’t think that those different responses were at all people trying to... misrepresent what they thought happened. But I think in those different experiences and memories of the time, there’s a lot to be gained.”
  —Cody Meier (08:40)

• Hostility and Unexamined Privilege

  • Experiences within game studies are colored by identity: who is considered to "belong" and who must continually justify their presence (09:32, Emma Vossen).

  “Who has to justify that they belong in games culture and who is just sort of accepted as like, ‘Oh, of course you’re a gamer.’ ...Some people might be shocked that... this listserv felt hostile to you—that’s a big surprise—but it’s because they’ve never probably had to fight for their belonging in that space.”
  —Emma Vossen (09:35)

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Imagining the Future of Game Studies

• Globalization & Context Sensitivity

  • As games and their technologies spread everywhere, the field can’t be siloed—“something operationalized in one country... is not the way it’ll be read in another.” More inclusivity and recognition of local contexts and methods are needed (10:49, Alicia Karabinas).
  • Recognizing different values, experiences, and disciplinary positions is essential for collective growth.

• Celebrating Evolution, Not Fossilization

  • There's hope future scholars will “be better” and “do such better work that I look at my work and I’m like, yeah, that is garbage… that’s exciting, that’s what I want for the field.” (12:53, Carly Kaczurek).
  • The field should be vibrant, evolving, and humble about its past limitations.

  “A fundamental thing as an academic is, I hope whoever comes after me is better than me... I hope they’re building, I hope they’re doing new, interesting things... I don’t want a bunch of, like, moribund, like, giants of the field. I want something that’s vibrant and evolving.”
  —Carly Kaczurek (12:53)

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The Realities of Editing a Major Anthology

• Collaborative Vulnerability and Adaptability

  • The project’s scope (over 30 chapters, 800+ pages) brought logistical, emotional, and practical challenges, especially as all editors navigated major life events (moving, surgery, maternity leave, the pandemic) (16:48, Cody Meier; 17:23, Carly Kaczurek).
  • Cohesion wasn’t the goal; instead, they sought a “conversation that could then ideally continue after the publication of the book” (17:50, Carly Kaczurek).

  “It’s interesting, like we worked on the introduction at various points... there’s actually sections of it, we don’t know who wrote it. We’re like, whoever said that, that’s really funny... but I don’t mean in the sense that I think they’re wrong, I just mean like, I think about it differently. So I’m not sure the goal is cohesion so much as a conversation.”
  —Carly Kaczurek (18:03)

  • Recognition that no matter how expansive, the volume could never be fully comprehensive: “There could be another 800 pages… there was a point where we have to pick and choose… we’re not trying to tell a different proper history. We’re just trying to add and complicate the history that already exists.” (19:35, Emma Vossen)

• Personal Acknowledgments

  • Emma Vossen’s organizational skills were highlighted as vital to managing the massive volume, particularly pre-maternity leave (19:14, Alicia Karabinas).
  • The anthology began during the pandemic, with contributors seeking meaningful academic engagement amidst global uncertainty (21:25, Carly Kaczurek).

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Memorable Quotes & Moments

• On Field Evolution and Embracing Change

  “I hope I feel dumb. I hope someone comes along and they’re doing such better work… that’s exciting... that’s as it should be.”
  —Carly Kaczurek (12:53)

• On Openness and Kicking Down Gates

  “Sometimes when we do want to gate off some of these conversations, my natural inclination is to be like, but let’s just kick that gate open and see what happens on the other side.”
  —Alicia Karabinas (05:57)

• On the Anthology as a Living Document

  “We’re not trying to tell a different proper history. We’re just trying to add and complicate the history that already exists.”
  —Emma Vossen (19:35)

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Games the Editors Are Playing (Lighthearted Segment)

• Alicia Karabinas: Enjoys building in post-apocalyptic games, especially Fallout 76 after the new building update (22:24)
• Carly Kaczurek: Playing D&D with theater faculty and colleagues—appreciates the immersive DMing (23:04)
• Cody Meier: Plays Dead by Daylight, appreciating its “memes and strong queer culture” (23:34)
• Emma Vossen: Obsessed with Blueprints, praising it as a truly innovative “notebook game” with puzzles rivaling the best in class (24:37)

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Important Timestamps

• [03:50] – Framing the anthology’s challenge to field boundaries
• [06:38] – Surprising revelations about exclusion and difference in field history
• [09:32] – Intersection of field belonging and social identity
• [10:49] – Visions for a more inclusive, globally relevant field
• [12:53] – On humility and encouraging a dynamic field
• [16:48] – The challenges and rewards of editorial collaboration
• [22:24] – Editors' current favorite games
• [26:33] – Book availability and open access status

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Where to Find the Book

• Title: Historiographies of Game Studies: What It Has Been, What It Could Be
• Publisher: Punctum Books (Open Access)
• Availability: Free on the Punctum Books website, JSTOR, and other academic platforms (26:33, Alicia Karabinas)

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Tone & Takeaways

The conversation balances scholarly depth with warmth, humor, and a sense of humility. The editors emphasize messy, collaborative, incomplete history-making as a strength—encouraging readers and listeners to view Historiographies of Game Studies as an invitation into an ongoing conversation rather than a final word.

For those interested in game studies:
This episode (and the anthology itself) is essential listening/reading for anyone interested in the history, present, and possible futures of the discipline, and especially for those concerned with making game studies more inclusive, reflective, and adventurous.

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Transcript

[Carly Kaczurek]

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Welcome to the New Books Network.

[Rudolf Inderst]

So hi everyone and welcome back to New Books in Game Studies, a podcast channel on the New Books Network. Here we dive into exciting new releases that explore digital and analog games, their design, cultural impact, and the social and economic forces shaping the gaming landscape today. I'm your host, Rudolf Inders, professor for Game Studies at the University of Applied Sciences, Neuen, Germany. Before we get started, if you enjoy the show, please consider leaving us a five star review on Apple Podcasts or whichever platform you prefer. It really helps others discover us. Also, please feel free to share this episode with your community or gaming group of choice. And now back to today's topic. I am very thrilled to welcome not one but four of the editors of the new anthology Histographies who are of Game Studies what It Has Been, what It Could Be Published by Punctum Books. So welcome to the show. Alicia, Carly, Cody and Emma.

[Carly Kaczurek]

Hi, thanks for having us.

[Emma Vossen]

Hi, thanks for having us.

[Rudolf Inderst]

Full house today. Very glad. Please introduce yourself.

[Carly Kaczurek]

I'm Carly Kaczurek. I am Associate Dean for Academic Programs at IN Lewis College of Science and Letters and a Professor in Digital Humanities and Media Studies at Illinois Tech.

[Alicia Karabinas]

That's a lot of title. I'm Alicia Karabinas. I am an assistant professor of writing and digital Studies at Grand Valley State University in Michigan.

[Cody Meier]

Hi, I'm Cody Meir. I'm assistant professor in Media Study at University at Buffalo, and I'm also the director of the Omitrix Gaming Lab and Studio here, which is a lab that's dedicated to queer feminist and trans game studies and storytelling and social justice projects.

[Emma Vossen]

And I'm Emma Vossen, and I'm now newly, just as of a month ago, assistant professor of Game Studies at Brock University in the Niagara region. And if you read the book and you're like, that doesn't sound familiar, it's because even as the book was coming out, I was at the University of Waterloo. So even my bio on the book still says University of Waterloo, but now I'm at Brock.

[Rudolf Inderst]

So, yeah. The book argues that fields are defined as much by what they exclude, as much by what they include. How does historiographies of game studies actively work to challenge or expand the established boundaries and core narratives of the discipline?

[Emma Vossen]

Yeah, who. Who's going to take that one?

[Carly Kaczurek]

I can't. I'm just bad at my speaker. So I think any, any, any field building is like a boundary exercise, right? Like you're figuring out, like, this is history, this isn't history, or this is what literary studies is and this isn't. And I think, you know, sometimes there's a tendency in doing that, like, those boundaries become contested spaces, as all boundaries are. But there's also, like, a way that people's sense of position, sense of professional identity gets wrapped up in those. Right. And so sometimes it's not just wrapped up in what they're doing, but also in what they're excluding or what they're saying isn't. And like, from my own example, my training's really in history and as a historian, and it's pretty frequent that historians will distinguish between documentary effort and historical research. Right. That those are two separate things. And it doesn't mean that neither is valuable or either is more valuable, but it does mean that they're seen as distinct and separate. And I think there's been a bit of that, particularly in game studies, because it's an interdisciplinary field, because it doesn't fit neatly kind of in a specific space. And so, like, there's a lot of investment in what people aren't doing. Right. Alongside with the investment in what they are doing.

[Alicia Karabinas]

This is one of the things that I think is really fascinating because I love listening to Other people talk about the way they think about these things. As somebody who, you know, might background is in rhetoric, I am really interested in just the way we talk about things. And so for me, even from the beginnings of grad school, some of the hard boundaries that were set in game studies, I was like, why? There's so many interesting conversations around that thing. So when I hear, like, all of these different people from different fields talking about their training and how they approach things, I think it's really fascinating. And it feeds something that's like a rich tapestry rather than a single road. So I love listening to Carly. I love listening to everybody. But sometimes when we do want to gate off some of these conversations, my natural inclination is to be like, but let's just kick that gate open and see what happens on the other side. I think it's cool.

[Rudolf Inderst]

Right. So with over two dozen chapters and interviews with figures like Henry Jenkins and Lisa Nakamura, the book covers immense ground. Could you highlight one particularly surprising or contentious revelation about the field's history that that emerged during the project?

[Cody Meier]

Yeah, we can definitely do that. Hi, everyone. I'm Cody Mere. I did one of the interview chapters in the collection, and we were really excited to have those interview chapters because they have such a variety of different experts and, like, foundational people in the field. But kind of answering the last question a little bit too, one of the things that struck me across a lot of different chapters and especially the interviews, was how many people from different fields felt like they didn't belong in game studies or they weren't welcome there and ended up sort of finding their academic home elsewhere because they were like, well, I don't think that game studies, even as an interdisciplinary field, I don't think it necessarily cares about what I'm doing. And people from areas as diverse as, like, anthropology, critical race studies, just to name a couple off the top of my head and a bunch of others, all had this common experience of, like, I went to game studies, and it felt like they didn't like what I was doing, so I left. And you can read about that in, you know, multiple of the interview chapters to, like, pinpoint something that I like. I think actually all of the others, once we, like, saw this in the interviews, kind of found it a little surprising was a lot of the interviews were with people who were in game studies in, like, the late 90s, early to mid 2000s. And so, like, they were very present at that time when the infamous lidology and eratology debates were happening. And so even if they weren't necessarily asked about it. They often mentioned it in their interviews. And the surprising thing for us there was how different their experiences and memories of that debate were. Like, if you asked Henry Jenkins, as opposed to Espen Arsath, how they thought about that time period, there were very different responses to that question. And I don't think that those different responses were at all people trying to, I don't know, misrepresent what they thought happened. Like, I got the sense that they were sincere and honest sort of feelings about this is how I thought that went. But I think in those different experiences and memories of the time, there's a lot to be gained there in terms of, like, how we talk to each other across disciplines, how we might have misunderstandings about how each other are understanding a certain concept or term and. And also just how we treat each other in discourse too, that we might sometimes treat each other in ways that, like, we think are, like, oh, well, I'm, you know, I'm challenging you. But the person on the other side of that might not actually experience it that way. They might experience it as well. I think that you're just really antagonistic to me and my ideas, and I don't want to be here anymore. And so I think that that was, yeah, sort of a key thing that came out of multiple of those interview chapters.

[Emma Vossen]

Yeah. If I could just add on to that quick. I think that a huge part of it is, I don't know how people perceived their experience as an academic within games that use being either hostile or not hostile. And I think a lot of that comes down to similar issues that we see in games culture. Right. Who has to justify that they belong in games culture and who is just sort of accepted as like, oh, of course, of course you're a gamer. And I think that we see that as well in game studies is that I think some people might be shocked that it's like, oh, this conference or this experience or this listserv felt hostile to you. That's a big surprise. But it's because they've never probably had to fight for their belonging in that space. The way that someone who English isn't their first language, someone who's a woman, someone who's trans, someone who's queer. It's going to be a very different experience.

[Rudolf Inderst]

And now the key theme, or one of the key themes, seems to be not simply asking about the past, but potential futures for game studies as well. So, based on your work, what do you see as the most critical steps the field must take to become more inclusive and sustainable build itself collectively.

[Alicia Karabinas]

Well, I think that one of the. Sorry. There's so many things that we could point to as coming out of this book that are really rich. And I think that Cody and Emma in particular have just highlighted several things. Just the way that people remember things, the way that these histories do get constructed. But I think as we're looking forward, really considering the fact that games are ubiquitous now, it's like everywhere, so many things are attached to game technology, so many of the technologies that are used in games are being used in other experiences that we can't really silo things to a single field or a single approach or even like a single handful of approaches. We have to be cognizant of the way something gets operationalized in one country, in one region, is not the way it's going to be read in another. There's so many different things to consider. And so as we are thinking about the future, like finding ways to be more inclusive of these stories, to recognize that there are different things based on perspectives, based on position, based on discipline, based on value alignment, and that all of that may not be under an umbrella of something that we attached the phrase game studies to, but it's still games research. It's this wider landscape of people engaging with games, around games, and all of the things that games touch. And so one of the things I think we wanted to do by telling all of these stories, by letting people tell these stories, is to highlight that. But if we do want to build a future that privileges these different voices, we have to do that explicitly. We can't just say, oh, it happens over here sometimes, or we've given you a place to talk about that here, but it's very siloed. We have to always be thinking about ways that we can include those voices and making sure that then when we take some of that stuff back to our home disciplines or our home regions or whatever, we don't feel like we have to reinvent the wheel just so we can study one thing. It got studied over here. What can we learn from them that can inform what we're going to do?

[Carly Kaczurek]

Yeah, and I'll just add just briefly as, like, I very rarely see this as the senior person here, but I think, like, a fundamental thing as an academic is like, I hope whoever comes after me is better than me. Right. Like, I hope they're smarter than me. I hope they're building. I hope they're doing new, interesting things. And so, like, you can't. Or you could, I guess, but I would prefer not to define a field by, like, what we've been doing. Right. Like, I don't want the boundaries and the restrictions to be based on what we've done in the past when, like, ideally, like, we're learning more, we're growing more, we're thinking in a more sophisticated, nuanced way. The landscape's changing. So, like, in some ways, like, yeah, I hope I feel dumb. I hope someone comes along and they're doing such better work that, like, I look at my work and I'm like, yeah, that is garbage. Right? Like, that's exciting. Like, that's, that's, that's what I want for the field. Like, I don't want a bunch of, like, moribund, like, giants of the field. I want something that's vibrant and evolving. Um, and I know that that means at some point, like, I'll be part of, you know, what's passed over, and that's fine. And that's as it should be.

[Alicia Karabinas]

More people need that attitude.

[Rudolf Inderst]

Yeah. Actually, yes. Yeah.

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Learn [e-mail] so before we continue, there's a little message for you. Dear listeners, if you are involved in running an academic program in game design, development or game studies, this podcast might be just the right place for you to share your vision. Our listeners include engaged scholars, educators, students, and professionals across the field. Consider placing a short promotional segment to highlight your program and connect with a thoughtful international audience passionate about games and research. And now back to the show. So editing an anthology with so many different voices is a huge, huge, huge. I can only imagine undertaking. What was the most challenging part of weaving these diverse perspectives into a cohesive narrative? And what was the most rewarding aspect?

[Cody Meier]

Carly, did you want to jump in on this one? Because to speak to the more challenging part, I'm remembering that time when this was a massive project. I think my comment on social media was that this book is chonky, but it took four to five years to work on. And there was a period in there where we were all very overwhelmed with different things going on in our lives. And it was getting really hard to work with a massive collection that was over 30 chapters. And so, Carla, I wondered if you wanted to maybe talk about how we got through that point.

[Carly Kaczurek]

Yeah, I mean, I think in some ways, like, any project, like, any collaborative project is like, going to be exceptionally vulnerable to all the, all the things that happen in people's lives. Like, I had major surgery in the middle of us working on this. Right? Like, and so there were like two months where I was like, sorry, can't bring, like, you know, like, I'm, I'm holding myself together and that's all I can do. But, you know, so that kind of thing becomes more complicated the more people are involved. Right. And so this, this project definitely had some of that. It's interesting, like we worked on the introduction at various points, right? And there's actually sections of it. We don't know who wrote it, right? Like, because we had, oops, sorry, I've got a cuckoo clock. But there's parts of the introduction that, like, we don't even know who wrote it. And we're like, whoever said that? That's really funny. They're like. And we're like, I think it might have been. Maybe it was like. And none of us know. Right. And so in that way, I think there was, like, really strong resonance across the editorial team. But I'll also add, like, there's stuff in chapters that in some cases, I just disagree with. But I don't mean in the sense that I think they're wrong. I just mean, like, I think about it differently. So I'm not sure that the goal is cohesion so much as a conversation. Um, but it also means, like, you know, sometimes we're just, like, fumbling through things. And, like, I. I'm sure all of us at some point hit a chapter we were editing. I'm like, I can't do this one. I need someone else to do this one. And so that gave us a lot of room to kind of hand things off, like, complicate things. Like, you know, I don't. I don't think. I mean, there's definitely places where we all agree really strongly, but I don't think the. The goal was necessarily like, that it would be so cohesive in that way, but more that it be kind of like a conversation that could then ideally continue after kind of the publication of the book among other people.

[Alicia Karabinas]

And I want to add on just to shout out Emma, who I think I just cut off, but I want to shout out that Emma is super organized. And I appreciate that. I think everybody had very unique skills. It made the team feel much more cohesive than it might have otherwise. Like, the team in a way that the book may not. Uh, but we really leaned a lot on Emma's organizational skills, so.

[Emma Vossen]

Thank you, Emma. Yeah, I was just gonna say that I feel like early on, I did, like, a lot of the. The heavy lifting of, like, organizing things and getting things ready. But then I got pregnant, and then I gave birth, and then I had a newborn. So, you know, in the second half of the project, there was this period where I was on maternity leave where I just, like, was. You know, fell off the face of the earth for. Understandably. And, you know, I don't. It was. I don't know. It just. I felt so Comfortable doing that and knowing that it was okay to do that. And, you know, I think that we all sort of did a bit of, like Carly said, you know, having surgery, people moved this sort of thing. So it was like dipping in and out of, like, how heavily we're involved and then how. And then completely moving back in, like, a really effective way. Like, we've worked really well together. And then the other thing I was going to say is that even with the book being, you know, 800 pages, it. I felt it was so rewarding to see so many different perspectives in those 800 pages. But I kept just thinking about, like, there could be another 800 pages. Like, and there could be, you know, you could have a chapter from, you know, every different country, every different method, every different whatever. And so I do think one of the biggest challenges was knowing that even in 800 pages, even covering as much ground as we did, there was still going to be people being like, well, how come there's no chapter about this? Or, like, oh, how come this person is incited? Like, you know, because there was a point where it was like, we can, you know, we have to pick and choose. And, you know, just being able to acknowledge in the introduction that, you know, we're not trying to, like, tell, like, a different proper history. We're just trying to add and complicate the history that already exists.

[Carly Kaczurek]

I also just briefly want to add, we started this during the pandemic, like, idiots, like, during lockdown. We started this project, I think, because, I mean, at least for me, like, I felt really professionally adrift, and it felt really detached and kind of like all my work was very instrumental and not an intellectual. And so it was really exciting to have this project. But also it meant, like, we took on this huge, ambitious thing while, like, the ground was, like, literally shifting around us, and that was hard.

[Rudolf Inderst]

So, first of all, thank you so much for today for joining us since we now have a little bit of time left, actually. So maybe you can tell us, because at least we're talking about game studies, but we need to talk about games as well. So maybe. Maybe this is not something we actually prepared, dear listeners, but maybe our guests can tell me about their. The games they actually playing right now, but not right now at the moment, because, of course we're recording, need to pay attention. But in general, what are you playing at the moment?

[Alicia Karabinas]

Oh, pick me, pick me. I'm so excited. So I love building in games. I'm a huge build nerd, and I especially love building in any kind of Apocalyptic scenario. Because I want to write all of the wrongs. Like, oh, things are messy and chaotic and destroyed. Let me fix that. I don't do this in my own house, by the way, much to my family's chagrin. But I will correct the virtual Mess. And Fallout 76 just released their big building update. So for all my building nerds out there who like the apocalypse, if you have left this world, come back. Because they finally decided to give us menus that break things down so you don't have to scan for 35 seconds to find one item.

[Carly Kaczurek]

I. I actually. Most of my gaming right now has been D and D. One of my colleagues, who's a theater professional, like, agreed to DM for some of us because, like, a couple of my colleagues had never played before, despite working in a games program. And they were like, I just. I just want to know. And so Kat volunteered, Kat Evans, she's an incredible volunteer to dm. And so, like, everyone's super into it because she does all the voices and she has all the tabletop pieces. It's incredible.

[Alicia Karabinas]

I love that for you.

[Emma Vossen]

Cody, do you want to go next?

[Cody Meier]

I told you that this Midwestern politeness thing would come in. We're all like, you go first. No, you go first. Yeah, I can. So the game that immediately comes to mind to me, that me and a group of friends play pretty regularly, I would say at least a couple nights a week, is dead by daylight. The game where, like, classic killers are hunting a group of survivors, and the survivors are trying to repair generators and escape. And I think that we love the game so much because of its, like, meme culture. It just has so many, like, stupid, ridiculous moments in it. And it has such a strong queer culture to it, too. Like, there are so many queer players, and there are drag queens that play and stream the show regularly. And I don't know what there is to say. Like, I've been thinking about this. What there is to say about a bunch of queer people wanting to play a game where we get murdered. I don't know what exactly to say about that intellectually, but it's ridiculous and it's a lot of fun. So, yeah, I've been enjoying that.

[Emma Vossen]

You gotta laugh at the horrors. And then I was just gonna talk about. The past couple months, for me have been completely eaten by blueprints, which is just such. Is one of those games where, like, every once in a while I get to this point where I'm like, I don't know. I just get really frustrated with games. Everything Feels so same same like nothing feels new and different and it really just innovates on, on so many genres incredibly well. You know, sometimes it feels like a point and click adventure game. Sudden it's, it's procedural. So sometimes it feels more like playing Slay the Spire kind of. Imagine you're doing a deck building game but instead of cards in a deck, you're adding rooms to a house. And then on top of that it's got this very like mist style puzzle system that's built into has I'm like a, you know, my games thing is like I'm a big puzzle nerd and it has in my opinion, some of the, if not the best puzzles I've ever seen in a game. And most importantly, it's people are calling it like a notebook game. Like you actually literally can't play the game without writing things down and keeping a notebook. So for months I've been carrying around my Steam deck with this huge, bulging, messy notebook alongside it that if someone just came across this notebook it would probably look nuts. And yeah, I just, if anyone in game studies hasn't picked up blueprints yet, I really encourage you to play it. And don't be discouraged by the fact that the game makes you try to do algebra. I played a lot of the game well, just bypassing the algebra because I didn't want to do that part.

[Alicia Karabinas]

I just bought it. So I'm very excited now.

[Emma Vossen]

Yeah, you should be.

[Rudolf Inderst]

So once again for our listeners, what again exactly is the title of your book and where can our readers get it?

[Alicia Karabinas]

It is Historiographies of Game, what it has Been, what it could be. And it is an open educational resource. Open access resource. Oh, I just did the wrong thing. You can get it at the punktom Books website. You can also find it in lots of other places. Like we're in jstor, we got a shout out from JSTOR which is very nerdily exciting.

[Rudolf Inderst]

So, dear listeners, I hope you enjoyed this episode. If you're an author or editor in game studies and would like to discuss your latest work, reach [e-mail] you can also find me on LinkedIn and Blueskyamestudies. Don't forget, head over to gamestudiesmerch.de for a game studies hoodie if you want to support the show. Dear guests, thank you very much for your time today and it was a very interesting conversation and a very interesting read and this book is enormous. So thanks for all your great work here. It had so many different perspectives. They were so interesting to read and couldn't wait to get us all here together to talk about it. Thank you very much.

[Carly Kaczurek]

Thanks for having us.

[Emma Vossen]

Thank you so much.