Episode Overview

In this episode of New Books in Political Science (New Books Network), host Susan Liebell interviews historian Dr. Blair L.M. Kelley about her new book, Black Folk: The Roots of the Black Working Class (Liveright, 2023). The conversation delves into the overlooked but foundational role of Black workers in American history—centering on laundresses, Pullman porters, domestic maids, and postal workers—while weaving in Dr. Kelley's own family story. Together, Liebell and Kelley explore how Black working people built institutions, transformed unions, shaped public policy, and constructed vibrant communities in the face of exclusion, violence, and systemic racism. The episode brings to light how these individual and collective struggles inform today’s debates on reparations and labor activism.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Book’s Personal and Scholarly Genesis

• Dr. Kelley recounts being approached for the book due to rising interest in the “white working class”—prompting her to reflect on the Black working class and her own family’s migration and labor history.
  • “For me, weaving in the family stories is how I teach. It’s how I think...If real humans don’t fit the theories or the grand frameworks that we as scholars create, who are we talking about?” (Dr. Kelley, 06:47)

2. Research Methods: Oral Histories, Family Stories, Photographs

• Kelley’s family stories (especially from her mother) shaped her worldview and informed the book; archival research and oral histories (e.g., Duke’s “Behind the Veil” project) helped her link personal history with broader trends.
• Graduate students aided in curating photographs and oral history collections, providing poignant images and narratives that amplify the book’s themes.
  • “It was a thrill to get to go to the archival record, to go to the census record and piece those bits and tales back together and see their truths reflected in those archival sources.” (Dr. Kelley, 09:01)
  • Kelley highlights the importance of showing Black workers both as individuals and as members of families and professions.

3. The Centrality of Community and Collective Survival

• Kelley contrasts the mythology of the American individualistic “bootstraps” narrative with the reality of Black collectivism as survival in the post-slavery era.
  • “They were reliant on remaking kin and community because of the trauma of slavery...their mythology...is fundamentally different. And it’s not valuing profit or accumulation in a sort of individualistic way, but really the networks of support, of community, of communication over time and space become so important.” (Dr. Kelley, 16:37)

4. Deep Dives into Professions & Labor Resistance

a. Washerwomen: Agency, Skill, and Resistance

• Laundry became stigmatized Black women’s work but was also a site of autonomy, activism, and power—rooted in home-based labor and mutual support.
  • “Washer women immediately begin to determine that they will do this work in their own yards, in their own spaces, so that they can prioritize their own households...and that they will do it on their own schedule.” (Dr. Kelley, 20:09)
• Early unionization (e.g., Jackson, Mississippi, 1865) highlights Black women’s political consciousness and organizing skill.
• Importance of physical and intellectual labor—“a mix of art and science and physical effort”—and the role of private space in collective empowerment.
  • “They don’t make a lot of money, but they do get to determine the rest of their lives in really key ways to keep them a little bit safer and a little bit more connected to their family than they had been in enslavement.” (Dr. Kelley, 22:03)
• Resistance to workplace violence and exploitation, including sexual assault and lack of legal recourse, led many to choose laundry over domestic work.
  • “The choice to be a washerwoman...provided that space for women to be able to stop on a front step and not get roped into household dynamics that were more and more dangerous for them.” (Dr. Kelley, 24:55)
• Political influence was exercised through strategic labor withdrawal, e.g., Atlanta washerwomen’s strike.

b. Pullman Porters: Visibility, Surveillance, and Organized Power

• Pullman porters, central to Black male employment, were highly visible, tightly surveilled, and purposely denied autonomy (often called “George” or “boy” regardless of their real names).
  • “The entire idea of their employment was to be that man servant...made black workers essential to this employment.” (Dr. Kelley, 28:54)
• Despite surveillance, the Brotherhood of Sleeping Car Porters formed after a decade of struggle, ultimately becoming a springboard for wider civil rights organizing.
  • Pullman porters used their unique role traveling the country to circulate Black newspapers and foster community consciousness.
  • “They were tightly surveilled, spied on even as they organized. But they managed to build a union...” (Dr. Kelley, 29:30)
• The government and white-only unions often excluded Black workers, necessitating separate organizing and advocacy for inclusion.

c. Postal Workers: Pathways to Citizenship and Dignity

• Postal work, at one time legally reserved for white workers, became a platform for Black workers to gain stability, respect, and upward mobility—despite persistent violence, legal exclusion, and discriminatory civil service practices.
  • “Some of them are lynched and killed in the effort. Some of them are attacked as they deliver. The myth of the black male rapist inserts itself into postal work...” (Dr. Kelley, 37:06)
• Postal workers’ efforts ultimately helped to pave the way for civil rights advocacy and contest the myth of fairness in “colorblind” civil service hiring.

5. Nuances in Government Role and Labor Protections

• The New Deal’s landmark labor protections largely excluded Black workers (domestics and agricultural workers), cementing racial divides in labor rights.
  • “By not pushing to include domestic and agricultural work, it was basically creating a racial divide in the protections in the country.” (Dr. Kelley, 32:40)
• Kelley points out that narratives like “Rosie the Riveter” only told a partial story:
  • “Rosie the Riveter had a black maid cooking dinner and tending to her children while she was gone, and we’ve never told that story on that national level.” (Dr. Kelley, 35:10)

6. Reparations, Historical Memory, and Contemporary Labor Activism

• Reparations are threaded throughout the book, with Kelley urging readers to see both the collective scale and “individual human costs” of these labor histories.
  • “Having someone’s labor intergenerationally could really make on a family...slowing that question down for me is a really powerful way to think about it and to remember the real cost for today’s workers.” (Dr. Kelley, 41:09)
• The book’s historical narrative is also intended as inspiration for modern labor resistance in contemporary settings—Amazon warehouses, supermarkets, nursing homes.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Black Collectivity:
  “The American mythology of lifting oneself by the bootstraps...I found the opposite for black Americans, that they were reliant on remaking kin and community because of the trauma of slavery...”
  Dr. Kelley, 16:37

• On Methodology:
  “If real humans don’t fit the theories or the grand frameworks that we as scholars create, who are we? Who are we talking about?”
  Dr. Kelley, 06:47

• On the Agency of Washerwomen:
  “I see the organization of women in 1865 into a union in Jackson, Mississippi, which was just bowled me over. Such a reminder...workers have a consciousness, have a sense of what difference their labor makes.”
  Dr. Kelley, 21:42

• On Labor and Political Power:
  “[Pulling] out of that labor market gets those policies taken off the table and really reminds the city that there’s no alternative. And if we don’t consent, this is not going to work for you.”
  Dr. Kelley, 26:52

• On Federal Government’s Role:
  “By not pushing to include domestic and agricultural work, it was basically creating a racial divide in the protections in the country.”
  Dr. Kelley, 32:40

• On the Overlooked Story of Domestic Labor:
  “Rosie the Riveter had a black maid cooking dinner and tending to her children while she was gone, and we’ve never told that story on that national level in the way that we should.”
  Dr. Kelley, 35:10

Timestamps of Important Segments

• 03:35 — Introduction: Framing the Black working class as central to American history
• 05:10 — Kelley discusses her entry to the topic and the importance of family stories
• 09:15 — Family history and use of oral histories and archival photos
• 16:32 — The myth of the American working class vs. Black collectivism
• 19:26 — Washerwomen’s labor: autonomy, skill, and early unionizing
• 24:52 — Violence faced by domestic workers; leverage and resistance
• 27:30 — Shift to Pullman porters: public presence, surveillance, union organizing
• 32:22 — Exclusion of Black workers from New Deal protections
• 35:07 — The real story behind wartime women’s labor ("Rosie the Riveter")
• 36:54 — Postal workers: overcoming exclusion, building citizenship, and dignity
• 40:29 — Reparations and contemporary relevance

Final Thoughts

This episode demonstrates Dr. Kelley’s blend of rigorous scholarship and personal storytelling, offering an accessible yet nuanced narrative of Black labor history. The conversation highlights how the history of Black working people is not only foundational to American society but also instructive for current and future labor struggles. The episode closes with Dr. Kelley’s hope that the book will reshape the national conversation about work, dignity, and justice:

“We have a narrative that’s not true, and this is a really great effort at refocusing it and rethinking this.”
Susan Liebell, 42:38

Recommended For: Historians, labor activists, students of race/class/gender, and anyone interested in re-centering narratives of American work and identity.