Podcast Summary

Podcast: New Books Network
Episode: Douglas Greene, "In Stalin's Shadow: Trotsky and the Legacy of the Moscow Trials" (Resistance Books, 2025)
Date: January 14, 2026
Host: Stephen Dozeman | Guest: Douglas Greene

Episode Overview

This episode features host Stephen Dozeman in conversation with independent historian Douglas Greene about his new book In Stalin's Shadow: Trotsky and the Legacy of the Moscow Trials. The discussion explores the persistence, logic, and inner workings of neo-Stalinist apologetics within sections of the contemporary left. Greene reflects on the psychological, theoretical, and historical drivers behind defenses of Stalin's legacy, particularly as manifested through post-Soviet scholarship and leftist movements. The conversation also examines Greene’s broader approach to historical analysis and the importance of rational, materialist critique for moving beyond conspiratorial and irrational narratives.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Why Write This Book? The Motivation

Douglas Greene was initially reluctant to write a book refuting neo-Stalinist arguments, particularly those made by figures like Grover Furr.
Mentions a conversation with Harrison Fluss who urged Greene to “do the dirty work” by systematically engaging and dismantling the arguments of the neo-Stalinist left (06:19).
Greene wanted to provide both a thorough refutation and crucial historical context, situating contemporary neo-Stalinism within a wider tradition and showing its persistence and transformation.

2. Neo-Stalinism as Conspiracism

Greene views neo-Stalinism not as simple mistaken fact, but as a “sort of leftist conspiracy theory, one that mirrors much of the paranoia of Stalin’s own time” (02:25-03:40, 09:03).
He argues that this mindset is not unique to contemporary defenders of Stalin, but was present among Communist Party members during and after the Moscow Trials.

"It ends up being almost a type of conspiratorial mindset... Trotskyism wasn't a rival political current ...it was a criminal conspiracy. And that type of mentality has to greater or lesser degrees still been a part of Marxism Leninism."
— Douglas Greene (10:22)

Neo-Stalinist narratives, like those of Grover Furr, turn absence of evidence into proof of conspiracy, mirroring the original logic of the Moscow Trials (34:52).

3. Critiques of Defenders of Stalin

a. Domenico Losurdo

Losurdo is described as "the most intellectually serious" of the defenders but falls into the same binary: Stalin as the tough realist, Trotsky as the messianic idealist.
According to Greene, Losurdo's theory is that revolutions inevitably pass from utopian messianism (Trotsky) to necessary realism (Stalin), validating Stalin’s ‘hard’ choices regardless of moral or factual critique.

"It's a political decision ultimately, since it doesn't actually rely upon the trial confessions, et cetera... it's who represents historical necessity. And for Losurdo that means it’s Stalin."
— Douglas Greene (18:14)

b. The "Trotskyist-Fascist Conspiracy" Trope

Figures like Ludo Martens (and Furr) perpetuate the idea that Trotskyists were in league with fascists, a claim completely at odds with Trotsky’s actual anti-fascist work.
Such claims function to delegitimize all left opposition to Stalinism by conflating principled critique with external attack.

“In their view, opponents of the Soviet Union are basically a criminal conspiracy... If Stalin represents the forces of history... and you’re opposed, you’re no better than a fascist.”
— Douglas Greene (28:38)

c. The “Wrecker” Label

The term “wrecker” was—and is—used to dismiss any left opposition as saboteurs rather than as legitimate critics with material disagreements.

4. The Logic of the Moscow Trials and Confession

Greene explores how Stalinist defenders (chiefly Grover Furr) rest their case on the confessions of the Moscow Trials:
- Furr claims lack of external evidence is actually evidence of the conspirators’ skill.
- He dismisses widespread knowledge of torture, coercion, and lack of corroborating evidence.
Greene argues that this logic is inherently irrational and draws analogies to Holocaust denial and other conspiratorial frameworks.

"The best evidence for Furr is the fact that there is no evidence, which means I can prove to you that Darth Vader, the Easter Bunny, Santa Claus, and Captain Picard are all real... It’s a completely form of irrationalism, conspiratorial logic that he somehow twists and unfortunately bamboozles some hapless fools about it."
— Douglas Greene (38:30)

5. Stalinist Defenses as Religious Orthodoxy

Some, especially Bill Bland and "Hoxhaists," turn Stalinist orthodoxy into a kind of secular religion, with Stalin as a martyr or even divine figure.
Greene compares this to traditionalist Catholic attitudes toward church liturgy.

"[Bland’s] view of history: it’s a religious view right out of the Middle Ages, right out of, like, traditional Catholicism... Stalin is basically Christ on earth."
— Douglas Greene (48:10)

6. Greene’s Alternative — Marxist Materialism over Conspiracism

Greene warns against conspiratorial and irrational modes of interpretation, which he sees on both the Stalinist and anti-communist sides.
Advocates for a rational, materialist, and critical Marxist approach that can handle complexity and historical contingency.

"Sometimes history’s not put together that well... there’s all this kind of contingencies we have to take into account. And that’s the thing you don’t get from the Stalinists is they think it’s all like this, master puppeteers playing it. And the anti communists think the same thing."
— Douglas Greene (52:12)

Emphasizes the need for left movements to cultivate collective rationality, self-critique, and materialist understanding to build a truly revolutionary future.

7. The Tragedy and Lessons of Stalinism

Greene reflects on the tragedy that “so many militants who join those parties...wanted to change the world for the better, but...ended up betraying so much of what they set out to do” due to accepting conspiratorial and irrational frameworks (59:43).
Argues for critical engagement with the history and psychology of Stalinism to avoid past mistakes and realize emancipatory politics.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

On the Stalinist Defense of the Moscow Trials:
"Furr basically argues that...a successful conspiracy...would leave absolutely no proof at all...So the best evidence for Furr is the fact that there is no evidence..."
— Douglas Greene (36:25)
On Trotsky as the “Eternal Enemy” for Stalinists:
"For Communist Party militants...Trotsky functioned for them the way Jews functioned for anti-Semites—as this maniacal evil force."
— Douglas Greene (56:30)
On the Religious Nature of Stalinist Orthodoxy:
"Bland is really putting...his view of history...right out of, like, traditional Catholicism. And...Hoxhaism more generally is basically a religious interpretation of Soviet history..."
— Douglas Greene (47:07)
On the Need for Rationalism:
"Because if those type of ideas, those type of thinking is able to fester and take root, then we don’t have objective reality. Then we just have whatever made up crap people are spewing."
— Douglas Greene (58:25)

Key Timestamps for Important Segments

[04:36] — Greene introduces himself, research focus, and previous books
[06:19] — Motivation for writing the book (“someone’s got to do the dirty work...”)
[09:03] — Neo-Stalinism as conspiracy theory and its structural logic
[16:07] — Greene’s critique of Domenico Losurdo as the “most intellectually serious” defender
[26:59] — “Trotskyist-fascist alliance” myth and its persistence
[30:08] — The ‘wrecker’ accusation and its uses against Trotskyists
[34:52] — Grover Furr’s logic: absence of evidence as proof
[39:42] — Greene on the Moscow Trials, confessions, and Furr’s apologetics
[46:10] — Bill Bland, Hoxhaism, and Stalinist orthodoxy as ‘Latin Mass’ Catholicism
[51:04] — Greene’s methodology: rejecting both Stalinist and anti-communist conspiracism
[56:30] — The psychological function of conspiracy theories for the Stalinist left
[61:25] — Greene on his next project (Nietzsche, Mussolini, and Fascism)

Summary Takeaway

Douglas Greene’s conversation offers deep insight into both the history and psychological appeal of neo-Stalinist narratives, arguing forcefully for a revitalized, critical, and rational Marxism that rejects both apologetics and conspiratorial thinking in favor of emancipatory politics. If the left wishes to build a better future, he contends, it must confront the temptations of irrationalism head-on—whether they come draped in red or in reactionary colors.

Podcast Summary

Episode Overview

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Why Write This Book? The Motivation

Douglas Greene was initially reluctant to write a book refuting neo-Stalinist arguments, particularly those made by figures like Grover Furr.
Mentions a conversation with Harrison Fluss who urged Greene to “do the dirty work” by systematically engaging and dismantling the arguments of the neo-Stalinist left (06:19).
Greene wanted to provide both a thorough refutation and crucial historical context, situating contemporary neo-Stalinism within a wider tradition and showing its persistence and transformation.

2. Neo-Stalinism as Conspiracism

Greene views neo-Stalinism not as simple mistaken fact, but as a “sort of leftist conspiracy theory, one that mirrors much of the paranoia of Stalin’s own time” (02:25-03:40, 09:03).
He argues that this mindset is not unique to contemporary defenders of Stalin, but was present among Communist Party members during and after the Moscow Trials.

"It ends up being almost a type of conspiratorial mindset... Trotskyism wasn't a rival political current ...it was a criminal conspiracy. And that type of mentality has to greater or lesser degrees still been a part of Marxism Leninism."
— Douglas Greene (10:22)

Neo-Stalinist narratives, like those of Grover Furr, turn absence of evidence into proof of conspiracy, mirroring the original logic of the Moscow Trials (34:52).

3. Critiques of Defenders of Stalin

a. Domenico Losurdo

Losurdo is described as "the most intellectually serious" of the defenders but falls into the same binary: Stalin as the tough realist, Trotsky as the messianic idealist.
According to Greene, Losurdo's theory is that revolutions inevitably pass from utopian messianism (Trotsky) to necessary realism (Stalin), validating Stalin’s ‘hard’ choices regardless of moral or factual critique.

"It's a political decision ultimately, since it doesn't actually rely upon the trial confessions, et cetera... it's who represents historical necessity. And for Losurdo that means it’s Stalin."
— Douglas Greene (18:14)

b. The "Trotskyist-Fascist Conspiracy" Trope

Figures like Ludo Martens (and Furr) perpetuate the idea that Trotskyists were in league with fascists, a claim completely at odds with Trotsky’s actual anti-fascist work.
Such claims function to delegitimize all left opposition to Stalinism by conflating principled critique with external attack.

“In their view, opponents of the Soviet Union are basically a criminal conspiracy... If Stalin represents the forces of history... and you’re opposed, you’re no better than a fascist.”
— Douglas Greene (28:38)

c. The “Wrecker” Label

The term “wrecker” was—and is—used to dismiss any left opposition as saboteurs rather than as legitimate critics with material disagreements.

4. The Logic of the Moscow Trials and Confession

Greene explores how Stalinist defenders (chiefly Grover Furr) rest their case on the confessions of the Moscow Trials:
- Furr claims lack of external evidence is actually evidence of the conspirators’ skill.
- He dismisses widespread knowledge of torture, coercion, and lack of corroborating evidence.
Greene argues that this logic is inherently irrational and draws analogies to Holocaust denial and other conspiratorial frameworks.

"The best evidence for Furr is the fact that there is no evidence, which means I can prove to you that Darth Vader, the Easter Bunny, Santa Claus, and Captain Picard are all real... It’s a completely form of irrationalism, conspiratorial logic that he somehow twists and unfortunately bamboozles some hapless fools about it."
— Douglas Greene (38:30)

5. Stalinist Defenses as Religious Orthodoxy

Some, especially Bill Bland and "Hoxhaists," turn Stalinist orthodoxy into a kind of secular religion, with Stalin as a martyr or even divine figure.
Greene compares this to traditionalist Catholic attitudes toward church liturgy.

"[Bland’s] view of history: it’s a religious view right out of the Middle Ages, right out of, like, traditional Catholicism... Stalin is basically Christ on earth."
— Douglas Greene (48:10)

6. Greene’s Alternative — Marxist Materialism over Conspiracism

Greene warns against conspiratorial and irrational modes of interpretation, which he sees on both the Stalinist and anti-communist sides.
Advocates for a rational, materialist, and critical Marxist approach that can handle complexity and historical contingency.

"Sometimes history’s not put together that well... there’s all this kind of contingencies we have to take into account. And that’s the thing you don’t get from the Stalinists is they think it’s all like this, master puppeteers playing it. And the anti communists think the same thing."
— Douglas Greene (52:12)

Emphasizes the need for left movements to cultivate collective rationality, self-critique, and materialist understanding to build a truly revolutionary future.

7. The Tragedy and Lessons of Stalinism

Greene reflects on the tragedy that “so many militants who join those parties...wanted to change the world for the better, but...ended up betraying so much of what they set out to do” due to accepting conspiratorial and irrational frameworks (59:43).
Argues for critical engagement with the history and psychology of Stalinism to avoid past mistakes and realize emancipatory politics.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

On the Stalinist Defense of the Moscow Trials:
"Furr basically argues that...a successful conspiracy...would leave absolutely no proof at all...So the best evidence for Furr is the fact that there is no evidence..."
— Douglas Greene (36:25)
On Trotsky as the “Eternal Enemy” for Stalinists:
"For Communist Party militants...Trotsky functioned for them the way Jews functioned for anti-Semites—as this maniacal evil force."
— Douglas Greene (56:30)
On the Religious Nature of Stalinist Orthodoxy:
"Bland is really putting...his view of history...right out of, like, traditional Catholicism. And...Hoxhaism more generally is basically a religious interpretation of Soviet history..."
— Douglas Greene (47:07)
On the Need for Rationalism:
"Because if those type of ideas, those type of thinking is able to fester and take root, then we don’t have objective reality. Then we just have whatever made up crap people are spewing."
— Douglas Greene (58:25)

Key Timestamps for Important Segments

[04:36] — Greene introduces himself, research focus, and previous books
[06:19] — Motivation for writing the book (“someone’s got to do the dirty work...”)
[09:03] — Neo-Stalinism as conspiracy theory and its structural logic
[16:07] — Greene’s critique of Domenico Losurdo as the “most intellectually serious” defender
[26:59] — “Trotskyist-fascist alliance” myth and its persistence
[30:08] — The ‘wrecker’ accusation and its uses against Trotskyists
[34:52] — Grover Furr’s logic: absence of evidence as proof
[39:42] — Greene on the Moscow Trials, confessions, and Furr’s apologetics
[46:10] — Bill Bland, Hoxhaism, and Stalinist orthodoxy as ‘Latin Mass’ Catholicism
[51:04] — Greene’s methodology: rejecting both Stalinist and anti-communist conspiracism
[56:30] — The psychological function of conspiracy theories for the Stalinist left
[61:25] — Greene on his next project (Nietzsche, Mussolini, and Fascism)

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Douglas Greene, "In Stalin's Shadow: Trotsky and the Legacy of the Moscow Trials" (Resistance Books, 2025)

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Summary

Podcast Summary

Episode Overview

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Why Write This Book? The Motivation

2. Neo-Stalinism as Conspiracism

3. Critiques of Defenders of Stalin

a. Domenico Losurdo

b. The "Trotskyist-Fascist Conspiracy" Trope

c. The “Wrecker” Label

4. The Logic of the Moscow Trials and Confession

5. Stalinist Defenses as Religious Orthodoxy

6. Greene’s Alternative — Marxist Materialism over Conspiracism

7. The Tragedy and Lessons of Stalinism

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

Key Timestamps for Important Segments

Further Reading & Greene's Next Project

Summary Takeaway

Summary

Podcast Summary

Episode Overview

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Why Write This Book? The Motivation

2. Neo-Stalinism as Conspiracism

3. Critiques of Defenders of Stalin

a. Domenico Losurdo

b. The "Trotskyist-Fascist Conspiracy" Trope

c. The “Wrecker” Label

4. The Logic of the Moscow Trials and Confession

5. Stalinist Defenses as Religious Orthodoxy

6. Greene’s Alternative — Marxist Materialism over Conspiracism

7. The Tragedy and Lessons of Stalinism

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

Key Timestamps for Important Segments

Further Reading & Greene's Next Project

Summary Takeaway