Podcast Summary: New Books Network – Emily Adrian, "Seduction Theory" (Little, Brown, 2025) Host: Chris Holmes | Guest: Emily Adrian | Date: Sept 12, 2025

Episode Overview

In this engaging episode of Burned by Books, host Chris Holmes interviews novelist Emily Adrian about her upcoming novel Seduction Theory. The conversation explores the campus novel as a genre, the subversion of its tropes, the boundaries between autofiction and fiction, and intimate depictions of marriage, desire, and power. Adrian reflects on narrative strategy, unreliable narration, and the shifting terrain of storytelling itself, all while offering insightful literary references and recommendations.

Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Rethinking the Campus Novel (04:13–09:22)

• Adrian’s Subversion of Genre Expectations

  • Adrian intentionally omits traditional “campus world-building”—the familiar leafy, autumnal imagery—in favor of focusing on characters and narrative artifice.
    "It doesn't really evoke that sort of collegiate, nostalgic, you know, autumnal campus covered in falling leaves vibe that you see in a lot of books like Donna Tartt's The Secret History." (04:52 – Emily Adrian)
  • The campus operates more as a backdrop for examining writing, the lives of semi-public intellectuals, and the performative nature of academic "celebrity."

    “I wanted it to be about writing. And you know, who is more concerned with the artifice of the novel than somebody immersed in it for a few years?” (05:47 – Emily Adrian)

• The University and Marriage in Crisis

  • Holmes and Adrian discuss how the campus novel resonates in an era of institutional uncertainty and shifting social norms, drawing a parallel with cultural preoccupations about the “death” of marriage and academia.

    “I feel like every hot take article I read now is either about the death of the American university or about the death of marriage.” (10:01 – Chris Holmes)

2. Gender, Power, and the Dynamics of Desire (10:20–16:13)

• Role Reversals and Stereotype Play

  • Adrian discusses intentionally reversing the "hot professor" trope by making Simone, not Ethan, the charismatic and powerful writing figure.

    “Simone, who’s the hot professor and the icon of the writing department, the real talent and the brains rather than Ethan. But that also gives Simone the reins to harness Robbie’s attraction to her in ways that appear to cross all manner of power imbalances.” (10:20 – Chris Holmes)

  • The blurred boundaries between sexual and non-sexual intimacy––demonstrated in scenes like Simone and Robbie’s shared, fraught post-workout showers—underscore shifting power and desire.

• The Nature of Seduction

  • Adrian elaborates on how seduction, unlike simple courtship or lust, is inherently about shifting power, sometimes contrary to the wishes of those involved.

    “In a really sexy partnership between two people... the power imbalance is there, but it’s always shifting. So people really take turns having power in their relationship and sort of wielding it over each other.” (20:02 – Emily Adrian)

3. Meta-Narrative, Unreliability, and Autofiction (21:47–26:07)

• Fiction About Autofiction

  • Adrian’s protagonist, Roberta (“Robbie”), is herself writing an autofictional master’s thesis, complicating the boundaries between truth and narrative invention.
  • Readers and even interviewers sometimes conflate Adrian with Robbie, blurring reality and fiction:

    "Robbie is the one who wrote autofiction... I’m not a 23-year-old graduate student. How these boundaries get blurred is a little bit lost on me." (23:44 – Emily Adrian)

• Unreliable Narration and the Limits of Truth

  • Robbie’s candid unreliability and awareness of her own narrative limitations cast doubt on all depictions, prompting questions about whether fiction, memoir, or autofiction can ever truly capture reality.

    "When you've taken on the task of translating life to the page, accuracy is unattainable and is kind of beside the point because what really matters is... the conclusions that you are writing your way toward." (25:53 – Emily Adrian)

4. Marriage as Narrative—Private Intimacy vs. Public Story (26:08–30:57)

• Unconventional Depictions of Marriage
  • The central couple, Simone and Ethan, defy typical “marriage-in-crisis” arcs: they remain deeply in love and sexually active despite infidelity and external pressures.

    “These two people have not lost interest in each other at all… they are having sex all the time, and yet they still find themselves straying… caving under pressures that are external to their marriage.” (26:57 – Emily Adrian)

  • The novel distinguishes between the private truth of their marriage and the public narrative they present, as well as raising questions about how much of their story can be trusted as "real" when filtered through Robbie’s writing.

5. Reading Recommendations (31:08–33:11)

• Emily Adrian’s Recommendations
  • Loitering With Intent by Muriel Spark: Adrian praises its warmth, humor, and meta-literary themes.
  • Reboot by Justin Taylor: A novel structured as the ghostwritten memoir of a child actor.
  • The Ten Year Affair by Erin Somers: An upcoming marriage novel about the fantasy of infidelity transforming into a parallel life.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Resisting Campus Nostalgia:
  "It really just kind of takes the campus setting for granted... The appeal was to make it about writing." (05:24 – Emily Adrian)
• On Academic Micro-Celebrities:
  "They are kind of living life in the public eye on a campus... It's a really sort of almost claustrophobia inducing environment." (05:44 – Emily Adrian)
• On Power Games and Gender:
  "When Simone does the same thing, on one hand it's really familiar...on the other hand, it's so bizarre and absurd to even think of a woman behaving this way toward her own graduate student." (12:15 – Emily Adrian)
• On the Nature of Seduction:
  "Seduction has a driving purpose that even sometimes goes against the desires and wishes of the person on the other end... definitely implies some sort of power, power imbalance." (19:22 – Chris Holmes)
• On Reliability in Autofiction:
  "What fiction does, regardless of whether it has no resemblance to the author's life... accuracy is unattainable and is kind of beside the point." (25:53 – Emily Adrian)
• On Marriage’s Public and Private Faces:
  "They almost have two separate marriages. They have the truth of their own intimacy... and then the story of their marriage that they have sort of presented to the world." (27:39 – Emily Adrian)

Timestamps for Key Segments

• Opening & Introduction to Seduction Theory – 01:20–04:11
• Campus Novel Discussion & Deconstructing Genre – 04:13–09:22
• Breaking Gender Roles: Simone’s Power – 10:20–13:12
• Excerpt Read by Emily Adrian (Department Party Scene) – 13:48–16:13
• Seduction, Power Dynamics, and Bad Lust – 16:52–20:02
• Metafiction and Unreliable Narrators – 21:47–26:07
• Marriage as Private/ Public Story, Meta-Narrative – 26:08–30:57
• Reading Recommendations – 31:08–33:11

Tone and Style

The conversation is lively, insightful, and laced with humor. Both Holmes and Adrian discuss serious theoretical and ethical questions about fiction, power, and marriage while maintaining a conversational, accessible, and sometimes self-deprecating rapport.

Closing Recommendation

Seduction Theory is celebrated here as a boldly subversive campus novel, a nuanced portrait of marriage, and a witty meditation on the labyrinth of fictional truth. Emily Adrian’s writing is recommended not only for its narrative innovation but also for its ability to challenge our understanding of storytelling, desire, and authenticity.

For more on this episode, Emily Adrian’s work, and the titles discussed, visit burnedbybooks.com