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Guy Elston, "The Character Actor Convention" (Gordon Hill Press/Porcupine's Quill, 2025)
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- [00:01]
A
Welcome to the New Books Network.
- [00:05]
B
Hello everyone and welcome to nbn. I'm your host, Holly Gattery and I'm excited to have a marvelous wacky and whimsical poet join me today, Guy Elston. I should probably say that I think his work is wacky and whimsical. I cannot speak about Guy's personality personally, but his poetry is definitely embodying those qualities. Di Elston was born and raised in Oxford, UK. Since moving to Canada in 2020, his poetry has appeared in the Malahat Review, Canadian Literature Event, the Literary Review of Canada, Grain Geist, the Ex Puritan and other journals. His chapbook Automatic Sleep Mode was published by AnalystRuther Press in 2023. The character actor Convention is his debut full length collection. He lives in Toronto and is a member of the Meet the Presses collective. And we will be talking today about the Character Actor Convention, which was such a wonderful, delightful book of poetry that is also stylistically quite sophisticated, despite its playful nature or because of its playful nature. We're going to get into that. But listeners, first, let's learn a little bit more about this book. A pumpkin writes a letter to his father. A sheep recalls the revolution and loves hydrogen pens A tell all expoj of oxygen the stick and insect orders his tomb Napoleon counts waves and cheats at cards. A sunflower seeks answers. Why son a crow considers children in this cruel, spiky world. And all the while character actors gather for the endless convention. Guy Elston's debut is a curious smorgasbord of Personas, voices and unnatural perspectives through impossible encounters and strange viewpoints as insistent ever shifting eye questions its relation to itself, wist, wit and obsession rise like tides are forgotten and start fresh. Authenticity is always just around the corner. Welcome to the show, Guy.
- [02:15]
A
Thank you, Holly. Great to be here. And yeah, thanks for that wonderful introduction. We'll find out how truly wacky and whimsical I really am.
- [02:22]
B
I guess we will. Your work certainly is though. I mean, it was. It was one of those books that I thought I knew what I would be getting into and I just did not. I was not prepared for this Character Actor Convention. So let's put my first question to you. Where did this book start?
- [02:41]
A
Nah. Well, I guess it started by accident, really. I think five or six years ago now during COVID I wrote one or two poems which were Persona poems, and that was something very different for me at the time. One of them was from the Point of View of an Ant. It's the one called the Life Cycle of a large blue butterfly in the book. And those poems I was quite happy with, and then I fully set them aside. It wasn't really what I wanted to do. I think, like a lot of young poets, I wanted to write about myself, or so I thought. It was only a couple of years later that I sort of realized in the cold light of day that they were perhaps some of my strongest poems. And I decided that maybe taking myself out of my poetry a little would help. And I found that it really did. Writing these kind of dramatic monologues, Persona poems, poems with different characters in and inspired by different kind of quirky science and news headlines. I read things from history. It's really opened things out for me. And I found myself getting a lot more inspiration suddenly in this kind of carnivalesque kind of atmosphere came into the poetry. And then also, conversely, I even found that more of myself actually became sort of bleeding into the poetry. Through these Personas, I was able to access things that maybe I wasn't able to, sort of with more direct confessional stuff. So that's a quick synopsis of sort of how it all came together.
- [04:23]
B
Mm. I'm wondering, like, what you're talking about reminds me a bit of my incredibly fledgling and embarrassing. I'm putting the word career in quotes, as in theater, and how I felt like. I still love theater. I'm just not very good at it. But I like to watch other people who are good at it. But it reminds me of how when you get into a character, it really does reveal something about yourself. And my next question is, are you a theater kid?
- [04:53]
A
I'm kind of. Maybe a little like you, a frustrated wannabe theater kid. I also love the theater. I absolutely love, like, attending plays and operas. I do it a lot. And, yeah, I gave acting a little go myself and wasn't any good at it, but I wanted to be a part of that world and was for a little bit, which was really nice, but ultimately didn't quite belong. Like all writers, I guess, you know, I'm a solo traveler, really, and. And a control freak. You know, to. To be good at theater, you have to be able to get into the. The communal activity. Right. And, yeah, I wanted to do it all myself, but definitely similar. Yeah. As you were saying, I think that love of the theater, of roles and of characters, the. Came into this book in a big way, and it definitely has a theatrical kind of element to it. And I get a kick out of reading these poems because some of them you can really sort of perform.
- [05:54]
B
Yeah, I just I was thinking a lot about, you know, role play and acting and getting into character and as you were saying, about how putting myself in these positions of these characters, whether it was the stick insect ordering its two tomb or like. My favorite probably, and I don't know why I probably need to interrogate this further, is the sheep Revolution poem. And there's the. The sheep speaking. But the one that the sheep that I really connected with was the one who, like, they're talking about in the poem. I'm gonna ask you to read this. It's like, I know that, you know, this isn't Showtime at the Kovacabana and I cannot like yell out requests, but I'm requesting that poem anyway. But I. I thought to myself when I was reading them, like, why am I seeing myself in this revolutionary sheep, the one who fought and the one who is free, presumably, you know, And I mean, I don't know, am I actually that brave or is that just what I want for myself? And seeing these poems, you know, and the. The pumpkin writing a letter to its father. I mean, it really forces you to see the world slant. I mean, that's what all great poetry does. But I've never written a Persona poem in my life. And I finished reading your collection and I tried one. It was horrible. But I think I could. I think I could get better if I tried. And reading your collection has inspired me. So I have a question for you. My next one is I do want to get to the sheep poem, but I'm saying that's my favorite poem. Which isn't to say that there aren't amazing other poems in this collection. If we think about Third Eye Blinds, you know, self titled debut album. I had a favorite track there, but I loved all of them. What was your favorite? Do you have a favorite? Do you have one that really, every time you read it brings you joy?
- [07:41]
A
That's a good question. And I've done, you know, quite a few readings of the book by this point. And you do find it changing. You know, it shifts. You really love one for a week or two. You do it a few times and maybe you get a little sick and you move on, I think. I don't know if this is my favorite, but the pumpkin one you mentioned does come to mind. And that one brings me a lot of joy, I think, in the way that I mentioned using these Personas allowed me to access stuff that I think I wouldn't have been able to otherwise. That was a prime example for me. The pumpkin poem. The speaker is the Pumpkin, a giant pumpkin, like a 1,400 pound prize winning pumpkin. And he's addressing his grower, his owner, the person who grew him. And I didn't know what I was doing or why when I started that poem, I wrote it. And then at the end I realized like, oh, of course this is all about my stuff with my dad. And I think if I had approached that more directly and was like, I want to write a poem about my relationship with my father, it could have been fine. But it, it, I don't think it would have been able to get quite to the meat of the issue as this Persona approach enabled me to. So yeah, that, that's one that, that's one that I like. And yeah, I think it kind of embodies like the aims of, of the book for me on a personal level.
- [09:09]
B
Okay. If I was listening to this right now, I'd be like, I want to hear this poem. So I am going to ask you to read it. But I'm having all these requests for you now. I want this poem and this poem, like I said, it's, I understand this is not a request. Maybe I'm enthusiastic. It is a request. But while you were talking, I was thinking about, yeah, I mean if somebody said to me, oh, Holly, do you want another poem about a son's relationship with their father? I might say like, I think we're good, right? Like I think, oh, but when you know, or Holly, do you want a poem about a pumpkin? I'd be like, I don't know, how many ways can we write about pumpkins? Or like nature in general? Like I, I, how can we do this in a new way? Like sometimes when people start reading nature poems and it's like a three page poem about the rolling hills, I'm like asleep. I'm like, no more. But if someone can show me how a tulip is actually, or how the tulip is their memory of their dad shooting a raccoon who was eating out of bird feeder and everything that did to them, that memory did to them, then I want to hear all about that too. But it's always in the weirdest ways and that's what your poems do is they're always about something that is absurd, but like just gut clenchingly deep as well. And I love that about them. So let's hear that pumpkin poem, if you're okay with that.
- [10:35]
A
Oh yeah, let's do it. So the poem is called Produce noun and it has a short epigraph, Minnesota Man's 2,749 pound pumpkin sets world record. Dear Father, I've prepared my defense. Your love has made me ridiculous. Small fortunes spent on my ballooning. To what end? Family tradition. I never asked for a certificate. Spring temps swing wildly. Frost on fresh buds. Secondary vines clipped to focus energy, cut tips buried. Good habits win prizes, not friends. Not that you'd know. Man of science, perfectionist. Upscaler. What if I were tiny but delicious? What if I burned internally through carved teeth? Not an extension of your august achievement, but all I have to defy you is rotten. From the podium I see leaves turning, colors birthing skulls and ghouls strung up. You bought the best mulch, lured bees, mapped out the year, kept slugs off and wrapped me at night. You fed your life into mine. Poor Father, couldn't you ever see, just once, the future?
- [11:54]
B
Thank you so much for that. And like, this is it. This poem is completely ridiculous, but also so sad. So sad like I'm. My heart is breaking for this fruit. A pumpkin's a fruit. I think. I can't remember. I think it is. There was a great debate here about this recently and I can't remember. I live out in agriculture countries I don't know. I should know this. I can see all the neighboring farmers hanging their heads in shame at me. No, I love that. My next request is that you. You read to us from your sheep poem, which I believe is called the Great sheep panic of 1888.
- [12:30]
A
Yeah, absolutely. The great sheep panic of 1888, which was an event that occurred on the 3rd of November, 1888, actually, near where I'm from in Oxfordshire. And on this particular night, it's like one night of kind of mass hysteria among these sheep, where tens of thousands of sheep were recorded fleeing from various fields across, like, large parts of Oxfordshire. And it's a mystery as to why. But, yeah, I'll read it now. The Great sheep panic of 1888. It's that word panic I take offense to. Like you show your true self for one moment and everyone says, are you feeling okay? Do you need a snack? So lonely. You're telling me you've never felt penned in? Just waiting for something terrible? Panic can't last a lifetime. I remember we were organized. Word was spread. We had to preach the new thinking over and over. The old ways were just that. We needed a figurehead and big horns suited our purpose. But Benny wasn't the real brains or brawn. Ruby with her wolf sharp hooves with her rabbit pellet eyes, leading the herd. Ruby was something. And foot rot. Leon, he believed more Than anyone. But belief in moors, in meadows was not enough. What kind of faith fills you, drives you, becomes you, leaves you in ditches in thin winter light, panting Perhaps I should have gone that sleepless night like Ruby Angelic on the tracks near Didcot. But like the rest, I took the paddock. And like the rest, only sometimes so lonely. Thing is, it's not just the fence, the dogs, the whistles, the shearing. There was something else. Whatever got compromised. I know she had a final epiphany. She just never told us what it was.
- [14:29]
B
Oh, literal goosebumps. I feel like if there needs to be a poem of the revolution, this should be at which I will fight someone off. That. That is so amazing. And talking like who. Who fights who? Like, who truly has the courage of their convictions and who doesn't? And I think that's an incredibly timely question. Right now. Everyone can sit around and for any age, but I feel like right now, either I'm more aware of everything, I'm more porous to everything, or maybe the world really is just boiling over like everyone says it is. Although I think everyone of every time would argue the world maybe always felt like this for different reasons, but I really was thinking about, you know, the. The. The revolution and how, you know, how many of us would really do the right thing. We all like to think we would, but how many of us would? And this poem is just so laden with these deep questions, but then adorable characteristics like foot rot. Lean like that is like, okay, I have goats, so I know what foot rot is. It's not pretty.
- [15:37]
A
I love goats. Yeah. It's a horrible thing. Yeah. Some of my experience growing up on a farm is coming through there a little. Yeah. Or I should say growing up with ponies and stuff more than on a farm, but. Yeah, I know. I think this poem, yeah, it definitely gets at those feelings you're talking about from my end. But, you know, we all feel complicit. We all see the world around us and terrible things happening and, you know, we all wonder, am I doing enough? And, yeah, I think it's. Again, it's something that I would maybe have struggled to approach more directly if I didn't realize I was going to write a poem about those feelings of political kind of apathy and complicity in systems. But, yeah, through the sheep. Through the sheep. It came out for me. The other thing I'm proud of about this poem, in hindsight too, is it sort of became a love poem in the end a little bit as well. There's a Little love story buried in it. I think that the speaker, the narrator, was in love with the sheep Ruby, who sort of followed her heart and died leading the revolution. So, yeah, I like that about it, too. This episode is brought to you by FX's Love Story. John F. Kennedy Jr. And Carolyn Bessette join host Evan Ross Katz on the Official podcast for FX's new series Love Story. John F. Kennedy, Jr. And Carolyn Bessette. And go behind the scenes with cast and special guests featuring Sarah Pidgeon, Paul Anthony Kelly, Grace Gummer and Naomi Watts. FX's love story. John F. Kennedy, Jr. And Carolyn Bessette, wherever you listen to podcasts.
- [17:20]
B
Absolutely. And I have a theory that absurdity is perhaps the best clarifying agent. And everything we were just talking about supports that theory that you take something like sheep planning their escape and failing for the most part. And these, you know, rabbit pellet eyes, the wolf, sharp hooves, like that. These are, you know, it's absurd, but it's also saying something incredibly clear and powerful. And I was. And a lot of your poems do that. There's the one where I believe it's King Arthur going on a date. That's what I want to talk about next, because it's hilarious, but it's also saying something a little bit disturbing about dating culture.
- [18:07]
A
Yeah, I'm glad you brought that one up, because I did have that page folded over to potentially read. Um, so shall I read it, or would you like to talk about it first?
- [18:18]
B
Let's have you read it first, if that's okay.
- [18:20]
A
Absolutely. So this one's called First Date. King Arthur can't stop checking his notifications. I just want to see what they're saying. He keeps saying. Also, this Sword in the Stone stuff is doing numbers, and I have to admit, it still is not bad for a guy who didn't even really exist. He says, putting his phone down, fiddles, picks it up, holds it at face height, squints. He shows me his bio. The Union Jack is his pick. Isn't that kind of anachronistic? I don't say just a bloke, proper jokes and a grail. It reads no wokes, no Mordreds. He leans closer, but talk to me. Tell me, what's your myth? Later, I read his Wikipedia. While eating shawarma. I learn Arthur might be a composite character, also that historians can as yet say nothing of value about him. My screen greasy with garlic dip. I'm so tired of being better than other people.
- [19:23]
B
I want to know, where did this little juicy brain nugget start for you, guy.
- [19:30]
A
Well, I guess the first thing I say is there's a few poems in the book that are a little like this, as in their meetings with historical figures. Figures, semi historical, semi mythical, whatever. And they're these little kind of dialogue based poems. And I think this was the last one of those I wrote, and it came out pretty fully formed. King Arthur was maybe an obvious one for me to tackle as an English person. You know, I grew up as a boy and King Arthur is a big figure. He, you know, I had a little King Arthur outfit and a book and everything. And it's like any classic, kind of mythical historical figure. As you grow up, it's not so wholesome anymore, you know, like, what does King Arthur sort of represent to the British? He's a guy who kind of dies fighting, protecting Britain from invaders, invading hordes kind of thing. So he probably doesn't represent something all that positive, really, in the modern British mindset. Um, so I think that was where the initial kernel of this date idea came from. But it's like a bad date. You're on a date and you realize you're with this, like, slightly chauvinistic guy who's, I don't know, you know, talking about stuff. You realize quickly your values aren't aligned. He's also got some kind of phone addiction problem, which, I don't know, I think it's the idea of the elderly parent on Facebook kind of thing getting somewhat radicalized, which is a facet of our modern world. The twist that I think came at the end of this poem that I really think is what made the poem worthwhile, was that maybe a lot of these dialogues with historical characters, they're slightly poking fun of at the historical character. And here I wanted to, like, turn that on its head a little bit with the last line of I'm so tired of being better than other people. It's easy to go through the world pointing fingers and feeling better than other people and feeling superior. And I think I wanted to point that finger at myself a little bit at the end. This slight absurdity of sort of pointing your own finger at King Arthur. Yeah, So I guess that's where the brain nugget came from, if that helps clarify anything at all.
- [22:03]
B
Well, yeah, no, I love that answer. And what I was thinking about when I read that poem is how I'm tired of other people's opinions a lot. And I'm not talking about through poetry. I'm talking about on social media. Like somebody else will. Somebody will get on Social media and. And share their hot take on something. It's like, yeah, you know, that would have been fine if you just kept that to yourself. But it's that people think they're better than everybody. And I think, like, a little humility might go a long way to that. Maybe check us about when. When we're really an expert on something and have something valuable to add to a conversation, and when maybe we just shouldn't or don't need to. And that's what I thought of immediately when I read that last. I'm like, yeah, isn't that it? So many of us think we're so much better than everybody else, and our opinions need to be heard about and.
- [22:54]
A
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. But, I mean, there's a lot of certainty in the world. It's easy, you know, there's a lot of. We prioritize having clear values and opinions and having a take, which is understandable because, you know, there's a lot of, you know, political division and a lot of instability in the world. So you like to know where people stand. But, yeah, I think that. That recognition of our own limitations, the limitations of our own knowledge and ability to form a correct opinion. Opinion sort of instantly on someone or something goes a long way, I was gonna say.
- [23:32]
B
And also just giving yourself time to form opinion, like, you don't. I know the algorithm moves fast, but you really don't have to move that fast. You can actually, like, get informed and form an opinion. Like one that you can stand behind and not regret if you give yourself a little bit of time and maybe listen to people who are, you know, actual experts about things.
- [23:57]
A
100%. I think that was more generally about the book, something that doing Persona poems really helped me. I think, in general, like, there's a lot of pressure as a young poet, or I felt it, to sort of find your voice. People say that, you know, try and find your voice. And I think that is obviously great advice. Like, don't just imitate. Right. Like, delve into yourself. But, yeah, then it maybe turns into a pressure to have a voice, have a clear voice, like, very young. And I felt like I didn't have that. And moving in this direction of, like, oh, okay, I can have different voices. I can have different. Adopt different Personas in different moments. I think, like you say, it gives you a bit more time. It felt like it gave me more time and more air to breathe in rather than. Yeah, like, that clarity and certainty of, this is who I am. This is what I think, and this is how I Speak.
- [24:59]
B
Yeah. Because when you put on a mask, you can. I think it will create a wonderful sense of empathy. Like you said about the King Arthur poem is, hey, here's this character who, you know, is problematic, but also we are problematic, and, you know, pointing fingers at everyone, having fingers pointed at us. So I think that's. I think it's a really fantastic way to do it. But all of this said and creating identity and finding your voice and all of that, like, do you feel now, because so many people loved this book, Guy, like, you've gotten some amazing reviews. I think all your reviews actually have been fantastic that I've seen. I've never. I haven't seen one that it's even remotely less than favorable. Do you feel, like, pressured now to keep writing Persona poems? Like, you can never just write about Guy directly, or is this something you're not particularly concerned with?
- [25:51]
A
No, it's a good question. Or laying. It's a perceptive one. I mean, definitely, yeah, that. That has come a little bit recently. I think, with the book being out, obviously, your brain tries to move on quickly to the next thing. You always want a new project, and you have to slow down and just enjoy and stay in this moment. But, yeah, I am exploring ways that maybe I can do something a little different and bring a little more of myself to the center of my writing moving forward. That said, I do think I will definitely continue to work in this sort of realm of masks and shadows and different historical nuggets coming in and maybe the odd bit of, like, science like that. I think that kind of texture is very appealing to me. But, yeah, I think it's safe to say there won't be as many Persona poems in book two if I'm lucky enough to have that. But, yeah, we'll see.
- [26:54]
B
Now, here's a style question for you. Did you ever write a poem and then, you know, first, second draft, look at it and go, okay, I'm gonna have to dial down the absurdity. And what I mean by that is, I have a tendency to write things and lean very heavily into it, Very heavily into whatever I am trying to achieve. Like that. The most extreme version of what I'm trying to achieve. And then I look at it after and realize that I have to have to fix this. I still remember one editor circling entire poem, and they want me to remove it. And all they wrote in the margin was, this is silly. I was like, ouch. I mean, oh, okay, that's right. But I mean. And I did lean very hard into a certain Feeling then and it. It was silly. That's correct. So I'm wondering about you. Is this something you have to like dial back or do you have to turn it up in subsequent drafts or does it just depend on the poem?
- [27:49]
A
Usually I'm seeking to turn things up. I think in my like day to day life I'm a pretty sort of boring, steady, steady kind of chap. Like it's not like I'm actually that off the wall. So it's not like a huge flood of absurd poems came out of me but were then yeah really needed dialing down. Usually I'm always trying to reach that up a little further. I have since found that limit, I think yeah I've written one or two but did reach into that silly level. And when you find it, you sort of know. Like you mentioned with an editor though, I think that this is where, you know, editors are worth their weight in gold. Shane Nielsen was my editor for this book and he. Yeah, there were one or two that I got the big red line through and. And those were yeah, some of them more like off the wall pieces but maybe didn't have that grounding in say emotionality or some kind of, you know, relevance to how we live. Some larger point at play. The ones that are a little more like absurd pieces for absurdity's sake he wasn't interested in. And once I'd found that boundary it was yeah like clear where that was. So that was a big help.
- [29:07]
B
I've had Shane as an editor too. It is a intense process but I mean it's an opinion I also need. It's a. It's feedback that I'm desperately in need of. So I'm. I'm in. I'm delighted actually to hear that he was your editor for this. I wasn't sure if it was him or the wonderful Jim Johnstone. So that's so cool. My next question for you, and this is a request actually is if you would read before my last question one more poem. Dealer's choice. I already had like three go to go through my head. I wanted you to read and I was like, no, we're going to let die choose this time.
- [29:45]
A
Okay, yeah, I do have one I'll do here. So this one is called Automatic Feeder and this is inspired simply by cat sitting for my friend who has one of these automatic like kibble dispensers for his. His two cats. So Automatic Feeder. I'd spend every minute of my life below you, mouth open, hoping, gaping for the glitch that brings the growth of kibble descending ecstasy for 25 seconds or 33 grams, whichever's first. It feels so modern, they contend, as if a compliment. It reduces food anxiety, they insist. Whose black cylinder mounted USB C plus battery backup, three set sessions of sustenance. Timely. So this is how it ends. My prowl, my sleuth. I trust every soy protein missive. You spit, you are the answer. Unthinking. I am the ship's cat, the captain is going down with singing hymns or purring a plastic.
- [30:53]
B
So I love that poem and you reading it reminded me that I actually have two more questions for you because I completely overlooked one. One of them and it's tangentially to do with what you do and who you are as a poet is what is the Meet the Presses Collective for people who don't know? I would really love more people to know about it.
- [31:17]
A
Yeah, absolutely. So the Meet the Presses Collective is a volunteer organization and we simply work to support and promote the work of small presses in Canada. So probably the main reason people may have heard of us is that we ran the BP Nickel Chatbook Award, which is for the best book of English language poetry in chat book form published in Canada. And we also, yeah, run various events through the year, including our indie lit market in Toronto.
- [31:52]
B
Yeah, I love the events and I go there, I'm always like, I'll just buy a few things. And last time I was in Chinatown in Toronto and I had to send my partner out to get me one of those trolleys that you can like pull behind you because by the time, time I remember that, yeah, I thank.
- [32:10]
A
God you won the raffle as well. You'd already bought a lot and then you got the raffle prize.
- [32:15]
B
Yes. I was like, thank God we were somewhere that had like decent shopping. I could go and maybe had to walk a bit back to our car, we parked so far away. So I was very. And I, I had a bunch of kids with me, but I did not want them touching my books or to trust them with them. They'll put them down at a stoplight and never pick them up again. So, yeah, I, I loved them. And I think going to these events, these in person community events, I'm not necessarily talking about the AWP and the big things, but there's such a great way to connect with the people creating the books, of course, to meet authors. But if you're a writer yourself, I mean, it's really helpful to get to know the publishers and the editors and see what they are publishing. Because one of the most bizarre Things I notice is when people submit their work to publishers who do not publish work like theirs, it's like, yeah, every press has a fingerprint and if you read a few of their books, you can usually figure out what that is and whether you'll be a good fit. So anyways, if anyone's listening, you're in Canada, definitely look up Meet the Presses. Where can they find you guys?
- [33:28]
A
Yeah, find us on Instagram or. Yeah, if you Google Meet the Presses, you'll get to our website too. Yeah.
- [33:34]
B
Okay, that's great. Now my final question is more directly related to you and I believe you said you're working on something now, but could you tell us a little bit more about what you're working on?
- [33:44]
A
Yeah, so I think I've got an idea for a project which is. It's in its pretty early stages, so not quite sure if it's gonna work out yet. I have a bunch of poems kind of stashed up and then it's about maybe trying to, you know, see what the themes are there. I'd love to give something a book length feel as opposed to just sort of 40 or my 40 most recent poems kind of book, which is very valid in itself. Of course. I love poetry collections like that, but I would try like to give a kind of book length project of poetry a go. And something I'm particularly interested in is the pre Socratic philosophers. So these are really ancient Greek philosophers, pre Socrates. So these were kind of just emerging from the era of myth and just touching into the sort of era of what you might call rational philosophy that is often seen as beginning with Socrates. And yeah, that's the idea so far. Whether it's enough, whether it'll really flesh out into a coherent booklet whole, we'll see. But the most important thing right now is I'm really enjoying the project like researching it and seeing what I can do with poems I have that may or may not fit them into that theme. It's giving me a lot of inspiration for new poems as well. So I'm enjoying that at the moment.
- [35:14]
B
I feel like this is the universe sending us a sign is as we're talking, I'm sitting in my Queen's University philosophy shirt for my philosophy classes and yeah, and on the back it says how rigid is your designator? So for people who are not into philosophy, it just sounds dirty, but actually I want to give full credit to Queen's University. They refuse to be associated with our sweaters and we had to go as the philosophy students out and get them ourselves. So we weren't even allowed to put the logo on or anything. Like we will have nothing to do that. But I love that and I, I would love to hear about that through your, the lens of which you think the prism of, Guy, to, to encounter these priests, these, these philosophers. Because, you know, when people hear philosophy, they're like, g, not every time. Probably not a lot of people, the people listening to this podcast, maybe, maybe you don't have that reaction, but I, I'd argue that in gen pop that you're going to get a lot of kind of deer in headlights looks when you mention philosophy. I certainly do. But through your lens, through your prism, I'm sure it could be pretty fun.
- [36:27]
A
Yeah, we'll see. I mean, that is a concern I can acknowledge. It's like poetry is a hard enough sell already and now adding philosophy to that, it could be impossible. But yeah, it's very early stages. So we'll see.
- [36:41]
B
I think if anyone can do it, you can. If it could be, you know, the poetry of metaphysics with Guy Elston, I feel like I'd pick that up. I'd pick it up. Okay, well, thank you so much for joining me today, Guy on nbn, everyone. You are listening to Guy Elston talk about his marvelous book, the Character Actor Convention, which was published by Gordon Hill, the Porcupine Squill, and is now available wherever books are bought or borrowed. Again, Guy, thank you so much for joining me and I look forward to having you back on sometime.
- [37:15]
A
Thank you, Ellie. Thanks so much for having me. It's been great. When you host with Cutwater canned cocktails, expect company. Entertain effortlessly. Cut water, Real cocktails, perfectly mixed. Copyright 2026 Cutwater Spirits, San Diego, CA Enjoy responsibly.