Podcast Summary: New Books Network — Jessica B. Harris, "Braided Heritage: Recipes and Stories on the Origin of American Cuisine"

Host: Dr. Nikazi Oates
Guest: Dr. Jessica B. Harris
Date: September 16, 2025

Overview

This episode features an engaging conversation with Dr. Jessica B. Harris, celebrated culinary historian and author of 17 books, including the acclaimed High on the Hog. Dr. Harris discusses her latest book, Braided Heritage: Recipes and Stories on the Origin of American Cuisine, exploring the interplay of Indigenous, African, and European influences on American foodways. The dialogue weaves together history, memory, and recipes, positioning American cuisine as a deeply entangled, braided heritage shaped by the creative survival of its peoples.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

Early Life, Journalism, & Literary Path

• Infusing Journalism with Black Arts Spirit (03:05)

  • Dr. Harris reminisces about her formative years in the late '60s and early '70s, engaging with creative peers at PBS’s Soul and producing a supplement for The Black American focused on Black arts.
  • "At that point in time, which was the very late 60s and early 70s, I had some friends from high school who were actually involved with a show on PBS called Soul... We would get together periodically at the offices and talk about this and that..." (03:05–04:45)
  • Her entry into writing was gradual, motivated initially by the chance to receive books for review, which transitioned into broader literary involvement.

• From Book Reviews to Food Writing (05:12)

  • Progressed from interviews and reviews to features at ESSENCE, eventually becoming travel editor. Food writing followed as a natural extension of travel journalism.
  • "I did several feature articles. Always tickled to have been one of the first people... to do a lengthy piece on Toni Morrison..." (06:14)

• Self-Perception as Writer vs. Journalist (07:40)

  • Harris feels more at home with the title "journalist" than "writer," due to her admiration for literary giants like Toni Morrison and James Baldwin.
  • "I am not a writer. When you stack me up with them, at least I’m not to myself." (08:29)
  • Discusses imposter syndrome and how self-doubt remains a constant companion: "The self doubt is probably yesterday or this morning or any point in time... Imposter syndrome is real attainment." (10:54)

Reflections on Food Writing & Achievement

• Power and Role of Food Writing (09:14)

  • Positions herself as a culinary historian, using food as a lens for exploring history rather than focusing on chef-driven work or recipe collections.
  • "What I do is use food to talk about history in a way." (09:54)

• Recognition and Validation (10:54, 12:48)

  • Shares the significance—and her complex emotions—of receiving the James Beard Lifetime Achievement Award and subsequently being invited to host the Beard Media Awards, noting a moving moment on the Lyric Theater stage in Chicago.
  • "I went out onto the stage of the Lyric Theater in Chicago and got a standing ovation. And I’m still thinking about that and wondering about that and parsing that out in my life." (11:54)

"Braided Heritage": Concepts and Approach

• The Magic Number Three (13:45)

  • Drawn from Schoolhouse Rock: "Three is the magic number," symbolizing the three foundational strands—Indigenous peoples, Europeans, and Africans—in American cuisine.
  • "There are these three foundational, if you will, cultures that have built or that are at bedrock...certainly Native American, European American... and then the enslaved Africans..." (14:27)

• Expanding Beyond African Diaspora Foodways (16:21)

  • This book was, unusually, solicited by an editor after a speech—“unique in my books in that it is one that I was asked to do.” (16:45–17:45)
  • Sees the book as an opportunity to broaden her lens from strictly African-American culinary studies to exploring interconnectedness and entanglement with indigenous and European threads.

Defining American Cuisine

• Braid as Metaphor for American Food (20:25)

  • “For me, the braid is...three equal things that come together to form something different that is, in a funny way, stronger than any of the individual parts that went into it.” (20:25)

• Fusion as History, Not Trend (21:06)

  • Argues that fusion is rooted in necessity and survival, rather than restaurant fashion—American food is “one of the first authentic fusion cuisines.”
  • “That is ultimately what all food is...it’s always about a fusion of some sort.” (21:45)

Profiled Figures and Recipes

• Selection of Contributors (22:44)

  • Instead of relying solely on her own interpretations, Harris reached out to friends and colleagues from each heritage to contribute stories and recipes.

• Key Figures:

  • John Barbary (Tunica-Biloxi, Louisiana) (24:25)
    • “He is tasked within his tribe with working at bringing back the language... Cultural Warrior because he’s very much fighting to...remind people of their Cultures and heritage.” (25:30)
  • Peter Rose (Dutch-American culinary historian) (28:10)
    • Translated old Dutch recipes; foundational to understanding Dutch contributions to US foodways.
  • Abigail Rosen McGrath (African American, Northern roots) (29:28)
    • “My great regret because Abigail died in December and never got to see the book...Her recipes reflect it. Recipes like salmon poached in milk and sardine sandwiches...really speak to a Northern sensibility.” (30:24)
  • Leni Sorensen (African American, migration exemplar) (27:00)
    • Her Greek essay recipe closely parallels those from the Tunica-Biloxi, illustrating interwoven foodways.

Defining Ingredients & Signature Dishes

• Foundational Ingredients (30:59)

  • “Anybody who knows me knows I’m going to say okra for the Africans. Wheat for Europeans and certainly corn for Native Americans...pork barbecue is already braided.” (30:59)

• Braided Dishes (32:20)

  • Southern succotash is the paradigmatic blend: “Okra, corn, tomatoes, and there may be a bit of bacon flavoring it...The bacon...is European. The corn is Native American and the okra is African. So you’ve got all three things in one.” (32:20)

Closing Reflections & Works-in-Progress

• Current Projects (33:11)

  • Two new food-related projects, including an exploration of her own family’s food history and, possibly, a novel: “I am working on two new food related projects...and I think I’m going to see on a novel. So we’ll see.” (33:11)

• Words of Encouragement & Self-Validation (33:43, 35:04)

  • Host offers wisdom on self-definition and freeing oneself from external expectations, invoking Toni Morrison’s ethos.
  • “There’s something beautiful about self naming. And you know, you are what you say you are and you absolutely are a writer of a different genre.” (34:24)
  • Dr. Harris replies gratefully: “Thank you so much for that. I will take that much to heart.” (35:04)

• Importance of Being Honored in One’s Lifetime (35:10)

  • Discussion of James Baldwin’s posthumous acclaim highlights the value of being able to receive recognition and flowers while still living.
  • Dr. Harris: “There is a lovely picture that somebody took of me...I look at the picture and the picture makes me smile because the picture is me signaling upon the receipt of all of that love and adulation. Just how grateful I am.” (36:36)

Memorable Quotes

• On writing:

  "I am not a writer. When you stack me up with [Toni Morrison and James Baldwin], at least I’m not to myself."
  — Dr. Jessica B. Harris (08:29)

• On American cuisine as a braid:

  "For me, the braid is...three equal things that come together to form something different that is, in a funny way, stronger than any of the individual parts..."
  — Dr. Jessica B. Harris (20:25)

• On self-doubt:

  "The self doubt is probably yesterday or this morning or any point in time... Imposter syndrome is real attainment."
  — Dr. Jessica B. Harris (10:54)

• On culinary fusion:

  "That is ultimately what all food is...as we start to look at food in general, that’s one of the things that makes food history so compelling is it’s always about a fusion of some sort."
  — Dr. Jessica B. Harris (21:45)

• On the joy of recognition:

  "There is a lovely picture that somebody took of me...the picture is me signaling upon the receipt of all of that love and adulation. Just how grateful I am."
  — Dr. Jessica B. Harris (36:36)

Notable Timestamps

• 03:05 – Harris details her entry into journalism and the Black Arts supplement
• 05:31 – Pathway from newsroom to ESSENCE, and food writing origins
• 07:49 – Harris on self-identification as journalist vs. writer
• 10:54 – Reflection on self-doubt and receiving the James Beard Award
• 13:45 – The inspiration and rationale behind the "three-strand" braid metaphor
• 16:45 – Origin story for Braided Heritage
• 20:25 – Defining the American cuisine braid; survival and creativity
• 22:44 – Selection of contributors and recipe curation process
• 30:59 – Foundational ingredients: okra, wheat, corn, and pork
• 32:20 – Illustration of a "braided" dish: southern succotash
• 33:11 – Dr. Harris on current projects, hinting at a novel
• 36:36 – On receiving flowers and gratitude

Episode Tone

The conversation is warm, deeply reflective, and interwoven with history, memory, and lived experience. Dr. Harris’s humility and insight shine, while Dr. Oates’s thoughtful, supportive engagement draws out personal and scholarly depth.

Listeners unfamiliar with Jessica B. Harris or Braided Heritage will come away with a keen understanding of the book’s scope: not just recipes, but a meditation on the roots and resilience of American cuisine and culture. The episode is a testament to Harris’s legacy and her ongoing journey of curiosity and creation.