Newt Gingrich (2:39)

Welcome to Newts World podcast on the iHeart podcast network. You know President Trump doubled down on his decision not to send US Delegates to Pakistan for more talks with Iran. He told reporters on Saturday quote we have all the cards we're not going to spend 15 hours in airplanes all the time going back and forth to be given a document that was not good enough. And so we'll deal by telephone. They can call us anytime they want. Again, we have all the cards. They have no military left, practically. They have no leaders left. I have to say I'm not nearly as confident as the President. I think the irgc, which is the core military political group, actually think they're winning, not losing. And I think this game has a ways to go yet. Also, as you know, President Hu really, truly amazing was totally calm and totally comfortable after somebody rushed at the start of the White House correspondence dinner and you had a 31 year old graduate of Caltech who ran through the magnetometers trying to get to the ballroom where he intended to shoot as many people as he could. The Secret Service did a good job, but I have to tell you, it's a very challenging problem. Coming up, I'll be joined by the 30th White House Press Secretary, Sean Spicer, and we're going to be talking about his new book, Trump 2.0 the Revolution that Will Permanently Transform America. That's next.

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Newt Gingrich (7:28)

I am really pleased to welcome my guest, Sean Spicer. He's an old friend, the 30th White House press Secretary and I knew him well before that. Host of the Sean Spicer show podcast, co host of the Huddle on YouTube and his new book Trump 2.0. The Revolution that Will Permanently Transform America is available now. So Sean, welcome and thank you for joining me again on Newts World.

Sean Spicer (7:55)

Always an honor to be back with you.

Newt Gingrich (7:58)

Let's start with some current events for a minute. In the Virginia redistricting, the vote was pretty close. Do you think the Republicans had a messaging problem or just a resource problem?

Sean Spicer (8:08)

Both. The Republicans were late to the game. They had a resource problem and a messaging problem. And let me just sort of say this. This was like Christmas. It's on the calendar. They knew it was coming and they all sat around and I was texting members of the Virginia delegation, members of Congress, state legislatures, what's the plan? What are we doing? And they all to a T. Every single one of them kept saying, well, we hear the White House is coming, we hear that the NRC is coming. And I was like, you do know that you have a campaign account with millions of dollars that you could potentially do something with. I will be honest with you. When the dust dries, I want to look at the FEC reports of the four members of Congress that are lose their seats. Ben Klein, Jen Kaggins, Rob Whitman and John Maguire. And I will bet you that collectively they are sitting on just shy of $10 million that was wasted, that they could have done this idea, that they waited for somebody else to come to their rescue. Everybody sat around saying, somebody else is going to do this, somebody else is going to do this. And I just found it so lackluster. The grassroots. Mr. Speaker, I spent the last Sunday before the election driving down Henrico county to campaign with the grassroots. Every single one of them was raising their hand, saying, I tried to get funding for a door, knocking for phones, and to no avail.

Newt Gingrich (9:36)

I think that was also the view of the Trump people that they said, why aren't you doing your share as opposed to calling us?

Sean Spicer (9:44)

This was the cheapest date ever. Four seats, Four congressional seats. For that money, that would have been the cheapest date all political season. You're well aware of what it costs. I think that that was just good math. But that being said, it wasn't their job.

Newt Gingrich (9:57)

I think they were very frustrated precisely because they would like organizations around the country to actually do their job and not just wait for Trump.

Sean Spicer (10:07)

I like these guys. It's personal in that you don't want to critique your friends and people, you know, but the lack of responsibility of these guys. Now, I mean, Ben Klein did a bus tour, but the problem was that's only 4 of 11 congressional districts. This needed to be a statewide effort and there needed to be some leadership.

Newt Gingrich (10:23)

Yeah. And I get the sense that there just wasn't.

Sean Spicer (10:26)

No, I mean, nothing. And like I said, here's the dirty secret. We are technically at a two seat majority because a Democratic member from Georgia passed away. But beyond that, we're basically at a one seat majority. As I said, it was the cheapest day. Three to five million dollars of grassroots support would have won this.

Newt Gingrich (10:46)

Seth Keshel, who's I think the best student of voter registration in America. I had not seen this phrase before. He wrote me today about online extremism. And I thought that term was a very helpful term, that what we're seeing is the rise of people who manage to get excited and who manage to talk themselves into doing things that would normally have seemed crazy. And we saw that the guy who broke in at the Hilton was a Caltech graduate. I mean, that's about as good a school as there is in the world. And so he wasn't stupid, but he had talked himself into believing that it made sense to attack the president and everybody else.

Sean Spicer (11:27)

But he didn't just come up with this. And that's the dirty secret, right? Here's what you have to understand. He thought this for a reason. Folks on the left, the reality is they created this. When you tell people it's okay to attack conservatives, when you tell people to surround Trump officials that it's okay. In case of Chuck Schumer, we'll get you Gorsuch. They have condoned and encouraged violence. The left believes, whether it's Charlie Kirk or others, that if you are in pursuit of what they deem, quote, the greater good, it's okay. Right? That's the problem. And the left, you know, all weekend, from Barack Obama to Hakeem Jeffries, said we need to all take the temperature down. Sure. But at the end of the day, it's their side that started this. I don't mean to sound like a sixth grader, but we're not calling for anyone to be killed. The idea that people are out there explaining why what Luigi Mangione did to the CEO of healthcare is explainable is

Newt Gingrich (12:23)

despicable, frankly, and very dangerous because it sends a signal to others.

Sean Spicer (12:28)

It's very personal. I've had people come to my home and show up. I've had people go after me in public. I'm sure you've dealt with some stuff yourself, but like the idea that most senior staff, not like appointed and confirmed officials, staff in the Trump White House merit a security detail. Many of them having to live on military basis tells you everything. My successor in the Obama administration, both of them as incompetent as they were Jen Psaki and Karine Jean Pierre, neither of them had to worry about security. We don't do that on the right. Caroline Levitt has to have a security detail because she can't walk in public for being the spokesman because the left has created this situation.

Newt Gingrich (13:12)

It's terrible, I have to say. By the way, your career keeps evolving. I mean, you helped launch Mark Halperin's morning meeting and you and Dan Turntine were big stars. I thought in making that meeting work. Now you've launched the huddle. How does that stuff work?

Sean Spicer (13:29)

So the morning meeting actually evolved I was leaving Newsmax. Like most networks, we have a call every morning that I would get on. Mark Halpern was a contributor at Newsmax, so he'd be on the call. And to be blunt, we dominated the call in the morning. The editorial folks would say, sean, what do you think the White House is going to say? What do you think? And then Halperin would get on and say, my sources are telling me. And reporters and hosts would ask us questions. And we dominated. When I left, I called Mark one day and said. And I had had a conversation with a couple other people and I said, you know, I've always been a big believer that people love inside information. I mean, you know, this people always think that somehow that the rooms that they can't get in, something's happen. So I said, what if we did this call but made it basically public? And so we started a thing called Debate Prep ahead of the 2024 debates, where we get on and give analysis and take some questions from YouTube. And that evolved into what we called the morning meeting, which was again, this editorial call. But anybody could ask a question after we gave our analysis. And then without getting into it for various reasons, Dan and I decided that we had a difference of how we wanted things to go. And we went off and founded the Huddle with Rachel Bade, who had been on Politico. So we start every morning and we do it on YouTube. You can go to my channel or TheDC Huddle, and we go through the top five issues of the day, give our analysis. And what makes it unique is that I worked on Capitol Hill. I came up through the ranks when you were leading the Contract with America in 1994. I've worked in the White House 27 years in the military, Assistant US Trade Rep, 10 members of Congress, the NRCC, the NRSC. Dan was Hillary Clinton's chief fundraiser. Rachel was the author of the. The idea that we wanted is to have people who are true insiders to give a take. And so it's not crossfire. We don't go at each other. We're not trying to score points. We're trying to explain the news of the day. And I love it. It's one of my favorite things that I've done since leaving the White House.

Newt Gingrich (15:26)

When you just think about how things have evolved. I may have overreacted, but I was really stunned by Norah o' Donnell quoting from the would be assassin. Nasty things about the President.

Sean Spicer (15:43)

I was looking around for a second, you think as things evolved, and I'm looking in my little office here, and it's actually right behind me. If we shot the camera. That is the TV Guide Contract With America that I hunted down Newt Gingrich to sign. I am a political hoarder. And by the way, that is the ticket to the post 911 joint session of Congress. But I say that because I remember when I started my career chasing you and Joe Gaylord and just saying, could you sign this piece of political memorabilia? Now here I am quoting you in

Newt Gingrich (16:18)

a brand new quote, your house could become a museum.

Sean Spicer (16:21)

My wife would like the museum to be somewhere else, to be honest. But let me ask, I thought that I understand why it triggered Trump. The guy's had his life, three assassination attempts. That's beyond the Iranians wanting to kill him as well, and all these other smaller attempts on his life and the lawfare and everything. So I understand why hearing somebody talk about you the way that is in that manifesto is so offensive to him. I wasn't as taken back by Nora's question as some people, only because I think she wanted the President to say, I think that to me, this goes back to the beginning of our conversation. This guy was that radicalized and wrote a manifesto because of people like Hakeem Jeffries and Adam Schiff. And that's how I thought the president should have answered it. To be blunt, to say, if you were called these nasty things, that you're a threat to democracy and Hitler and a Nazi. And he's not alone that, unfortunately, that assassin, or would be these people are being radicalized because of the media and the left and all of the folks in the media who are letting those descriptions. I put a clip on my show of Jamie Raskin. When Dana Bash of CNN asked him, don't you think that the rhetoric has gotten too heated? He literally said, I don't know. Can you give me an example? And I'm like, you've gotta be kidding. So here's the thing. I don't normally give CBS or Norah o' Donnell a pass. I actually thought it was okay to ask the President, what do you think of what happens when somebody comes to think that you're this bad of a person and that they think so much so that they're willing to drive across the country with weapons to hurt you and anyone, quote, in that ballroom. Because, remember, he wasn't just going after the President. He said in that manifesto, anyone in the ballroom is complicit. To me, the answer that I wish the president had given is, that's because of the media and the folks in the left allowing this to manifest itself, I'd accept that.

Newt Gingrich (18:19)

Particularly if he then said, and what you just did is an example. She just broadcast the hatred.

Sean Spicer (18:24)

Yeah. And I think the setup could have been done differently. Which is to say, how scary is it that an individual that's never met thinks that badly of you? I mean, speaker, there are a lot of people that I vehemently, like, viscerally disagree with. I've never, ever would condone anybody taking any kind of physical act. And frankly, I find it disgusting that people will go to somebody else's house or protest. Like in my neighborhood, there's a lot of former senior officials. And in Trump won. It was like everybody's turn in the barrel. Who they would stand out in front. I got kids. Like, I was like, what are you doing? And yet the left encourages this. They set up a legal defense fund for Luigi Mangione. The guy killed someone in cold blood. And their answer is, let's help him pay for his legal defense.

Newt Gingrich (19:12)

Right. No, I agree. I think we're in a very dangerous period. When we come back, we're going to talk about Sean's new book, Trump 2.0 the Revolution that will Permanently Transform America, and how Trump's second term will be the most consequential administration in history.

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Newt Gingrich (22:13)

I love the title. I think it's got a great deal to it. Not sure, quite the most consequential because I keep thinking Lincoln, but certainly on the short list. You're as much an insider as anybody I know, and you draw an interesting and I think correct this distinction between Trump's first term and his second term. Can you talk about that for a minute?

Sean Spicer (22:36)

I was channeling my inner Newt Gingrich when I wrote this. The reason I wanted to write this book and the reason I make the case is because. What I like to say is the why, right? Trump is the first person in modern history, the second in our history, to have two terms that weren't sequential. So you know this. Members of Congress get reelected all the time and Monday becomes Tuesday becomes Wednesday. Same chief of staff, same project that you're working on the day before. You take a few minutes, out you go, raise your hand, you get re sworn in. Life goes on. The point that I wanted to get at in Trump 2.0 is the why. Why is it different? There's actually in the intro to the thing, there were groups that basically when Trump left office, formed or got involved and said, how do we learn lessons? It was very military, like, what did we learn from this? What did we do right? What did we not? And this is what I write on this page. At the same time that AFPI America First Policy Institute was working on As a blueprint for the next administration. Newt Gingrich had another group, America's New Majority Project, led by Joe DeSantis, that was testing and polling issues. He noted. He meaning you, what you have here is the people who are really not dug into enough. Is that when Trump was forced into the wilderness for four years, the entire team at the America First Policy Institute had four years to sit down and think. Think. As he explained, that's Newt Gingrich. They had decided early on that you're only going to get to the scale of change if they wanted. You're very tough and determined in every chance you get to take the opportunity. Getting outside, stopping and thinking, what if I get back? What will I do different? What people will I bring in? What will people will I keep out? What policies will I pursue? How will I pursue those policies? Is like a team playing an opponent at the beginning of a season and the end of the season, right? You think about the game very, very differently and how you're gonna approach it. Let me give you one anecdote. Jim Mattis comes to Bedminster to meet with Trump. They interview for about an hour to talk about becoming the Secretary of Defense. They leave that meeting. President Trump has a rally in North Carolina on December 5th. We pick up General Mattis and one of his aides, fly down to North Carolina and announce him. He had known Jim Mattis for exactly one hour prior to landing in North Carolina and announcing him as the Secretary of Defense. He has known Pete hegseth for about 15 years. To the best of my recollection, he's known Susie Wilds for at least 11, Caroline Levitt for probably seven or eight. She served in the first administration. Steven Chong, the communications director, worked with me on the campaign in 2015, worked in the communications staff with me in 2016. He's known him for 11, 12 years. You go down the list. How long has he known Jeanine Pirro for probably 20, 30 years. All of these people in Trump 2.0 he has a relationship with, they understand the agenda and what they're supposed to be doing. In the first administration, we had people that didn't know Trump, didn't really familiarize themselves with the agenda, and to be frank, in many cases, actually tried to undermine his agenda. And so part of the reason that I wrote the book is so that everybody understand, why is this different? On day one, when Tom Holman started to go do raids, it wasn't like he was throwing darts at a board or a map saying, let's go to Boston. Let's go to Chicago. They had mapped it out. They knew exactly where to go, what to do, what levers of government they could pull, what was at their disposal and not. And also what forces were going to be against them in terms of the courts, the leftist, et cetera. But if you don't understand that, then you're missing the point. And part of the reason that I wanted to write Trump 2.0 is that people kept pocketing. It's Trump's second term, and here's what he's gonna do. And it's like, yes, but why? Why is it going to be more effective?

Newt Gingrich (26:28)

I agree with almost all of your analysis. The challenge, I think, for him, in part, is that he. This is just my interpretation. I think having almost been killed in Pennsylvania, I mean, literally, it was a miracle that he turned one second before the bullet would have killed it. I think that led him to believe that God had spared him in order to do what he thought was right. And I think he thinks that taking on the Iranians before they get nuclear weapons and start destroying American cities is a significant part of doing what's right. But in consequence, and you sort of get at this a little bit in explaining, Trump, unlike most politicians, is actually requiring the country to go through some difficult decisions as a country in a way which in the short run will lower his ratings and lower his party's ratings, but in the long run, profoundly change history. How do you balance that?

Sean Spicer (27:39)

It's a great question, because I have these discussions on the huddle once in a while, which is about the politics of Iran. And let's face it, there's no political upside to Iran. Like, no one's going to get a bump out of going into Tehran and destroying these military capabilities they have. There's no political upside, which is what I try to remind people all the time, that Trump did this because it's the right thing to do, not because it was gonna give him some political bump. And I know that's very unwashington. Like, everyone always assumes that whatever you're doing, what are you making money off of this? Are you getting something? Like, what are you getting for? And every once in a while, it becomes obvious that sometimes you're actually doing the right thing for the right reasons. And I believe that Iran is one of those things. But as I note in the book, think about just Iran. How many leaders, both parties have said, Iran is an existential threat, they're trying to get a nuclear weapon. Hillary Clinton, in fact, said, if I'm president, I will attack Iran, I mean, thank God she's not. But George Bush said it, Barack Obama said it. They've all said it. Trump acted. They've all talked about NATO not being fair, and yet Trump was the only one who acted. They all talked about how we're getting a raw deal on our tariff policy because our farmers, ranchers, service providers are being tariffed to go into other countries and yet we have virtually no tariff, no non tariff barriers coming into the United States. Trump's the first one to say, well, that's not fair, let's do something about it. Everybody else wants to complain about it. He's the first one to do something about it. I think that's what's unique, is that it's easy to kick the can down the road. If Trump really wanted to deal with Iran, he could have said, I'm going to say some harsh words and penalize them economically. And then hopefully my predecessor deals with this and nothing happens on my watch. But he actually is willing to take the political hit and to do the right thing. By the way, the one thing that I would fault him on, if anything, is when we talk about how quick it can be solved. I think if somebody presents a threat to you, and I'm one of those guys that when you chant Death to America, take you seriously, that we need to be willing to commit ourselves as a country to know what that threat is and be willing to say, okay, this may take six months, it may take eight months, but it's going to ensure that America is safer going forward for decades.

Newt Gingrich (30:01)

You know, Churchill had a great phrase. He said, it isn't enough to do your best, you have to do what is necessary. And I think that's where we are in that. How do you compare what Trump is doing to reshape the federal government with what Eisenhower, Nixon and Reagan tried?

Sean Spicer (30:21)

So each of them tried in a very different way. And I would actually add even Clinton to that. Right. So reinventing government. Al Gore led that. We talk about it in the book the Grace Commission. There's a common theme that I think has to happen if you want to be effective. You have to have a leading figure that has the authority to walk into an agency or department that says, I have a relationship with the President, I have top cover, and I'm going to do some stuff. And Elon Musk had that. So that's, I think, the right thing. Where I think they made a mistake is that Elon, frankly, wasn't the softest touch, but I think he exposed a lot of inefficiencies it wasn't just, you know, waste and fraud. I mean, he really exposed some serious inefficiencies in how we operate and how silly it is. I mean, he talked about, you know, you can only retire, what, like 5,000 federal employees at one time because in order to actually retire from the government, you have to send the paperwork to an old limestone mine in Pennsylvania. It has to go down and come up. That's how antiquated the system is. It's ridiculous. I think there's some similarities, but there are some lessons about, like, if you're going to be effective in trying to reduce government, you have to have somebody that has the ear of the president, the authority and the stature to execute it, because no department wants somebody else telling them how to do their business.

Newt Gingrich (31:38)

That's a lesson learned painfully.

Sean Spicer (31:40)

Right. But I mean, you know this. I always use your example and it's in the book. You used the ice bucket. And I remember this. In the 94 election, ICE delivery to members of Congress at a time when they had refrigerators and freezers was like a couple hundred grand every day.

Newt Gingrich (31:54)

There were three deliveries of ice.

Sean Spicer (31:56)

Right. And it wasn't the fact that it cost 200 grand. It was more emblematic of the fact that if you're going to treat taxpayer money like this, what else are they wasting money on? And everybody could identify with that. Right. And that's what I think sometimes. I had this conversation with Kevin McCarthy a while back about, you have to make it so that the average person says, wow, that's stupid. You're delivering ice three times a day to an office that has a freezer. And by the way, you leave it outside their door in an ice bin to melt. That might make sense in the 1890s, but not in the 1990s.

Newt Gingrich (32:30)

Coming up, we talk about how Trump's presidency can create lasting change that the next administration can't undo and the challenges Trump faces for the rest of his term.

Public Ad Narrator (32:42)

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Public Disclosures Narrator (33:29)

Investing Brokerage Services by Open to the Public Investing Inc. Members, FINRA and SIPC Advisory Services by Public Advisors, llc. SEC Registered Advisor. Generated Assets is an interactive analysis tool. Output is for informational purposes only and is not an investment recommendation or advice.

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Newt Gingrich (35:49)

From your perspective, if Trump 1.0 is about disruption, what's the key word for Trump 2.0?

Sean Spicer (35:57)

Permanency. Like how do we do this to make sure it doesn't get undone. What can be done by executive order can be undone. And one of the things that the big beautiful bill did was it created legislation which locked in a lot of these things. And they've got to be careful because I think Democrats are going to make D.C. a state and pack the court, do all this stuff. Virginia, where I live, is the test case. Look at what Abigail Spanberger and those guys are doing. They're not kidding around. They're changing Virginia fundamentally because they get what's at stake. So that's what the Trump team needs to do, is to make sure that they prioritize things that matter and get Speaker Johnson and Leader Thune to lock them in, which I think, frankly, is part of the reason they care about the Save America Act. But they've got to create such a strong headwind, like, I don't know, that someone could open the border again the way that Biden did after Trump showed how quickly presidential action can actually lead to a closed border. So some of this is pure leadership. When Biden said, we can't do this without legislation, we now know that that was a lie. So some of what he's doing politically would be hard to undo. But I don't put it past the Democrats to do a lot of it, which is why I believe that the reality is if we want to lock in some of these things culturally, policy wise, we need to make them a legislative priority.

Newt Gingrich (37:13)

That also means that the 26 election is potentially unbelievably important.

Sean Spicer (37:19)

Oh, just to be clear, Trump 2.0, we've seen the movie. We know what happens day one, they've already said it. There's a whole story in Axios last week. They are going to impeach him. Day one, not day two, not in six months. Day one, they will impeach him. Okay? And then we'll have investigation after investigation after investigation, and that's it. Can they still get some stuff done through administrative action? Sure. But they're going to tie these guys up in knots and make sure that they get as little as possible done. I will tell you this. I had about eight or nine conversations with members of the House Republican Conference last week, and I asked every single one of them, do you think, like, tax say, just happened? You guys passed the big, beautiful bill. No tax on tips, no tax on Social Security, no tax on overtime, credits for buying American cars. You name it. Great things that Americans are actually especially blue collar workers. People who are working in restaurant industry, the hospitality industry are feeling the effects of our policies. Do you think we're doing a good enough job of effectively messaging our accomplishments and the real impact that they're having to a t every one of them, except for Steve Scalise, who is just a very positive person, said, no. This gets back to the Virginia stuff, which is you guys can't just wait for President Trump to carry the message in the water for everything. Do your job and go out there and sell this stuff and talk about it and be relentless during the entire DHS shutdown. I mean, we just had an assassination attempt on the President of the United States. And there are no consequences for Democrats who refuse to fund the Secret Service, fema, Homeland Security, the Secret Service, you name it. Because Republicans are not doing a good enough job of pointing the finger where the blame should lie.

Newt Gingrich (39:04)

I think that you have to start with an assumption that the liberal media will always smother your message and will always lie about who you are. And then you design a winning campaign. You can't whine about it or feel bad about it.

Sean Spicer (39:19)

Well, you know what? I'm so glad you said that, because I do my fair share of whining, just to be clear, so that no one thinks I'm above whining, but I'm so tired of listening to people on our side as if they're hopeless. Like, at least I'm not elected. But for these guys who are elected, I said to a bunch of them last week, and I was talking to August Pfluger, who is a congressman from Texas, chairman of the House Republican Study Committee, who he's hosting this event where he brought in a bunch of content creators, independent media folks. And I was like, why is this so important to you? And he was walking me through it. And a study came out within the last 10 days that showed 70% of Republicans get their political news now online through shows, through creators, through TikTok or Twitter. And the point is, I watched this in Virginia. They took all this money that they raised and put it up on cable news ads. And that's great if you want to reach a bunch of 60, 70 year old people. But everyone below that is getting their news online. And so I get consultants don't get a cut, which is what sucks. They don't get their ad buy cut if they go out do this. But where Republicans need to be is where voters are. And I think President Trump did this really effectively. I write this in the book that part of the reason Trump 2.0 is successful is because the campaign and the tactics they use were to meet voters where they are. They went out and they did Joe Rogan, the Nelk boys, Patrick bet David. The list goes on and on. They didn't just sit there and put up a bunch of ads.

Newt Gingrich (40:41)

If we didn't have Trump and we didn't have Susie and the team they built, I would be very worried. But I actually think in the back of Trump's mind around the Fourth of July, he becomes pure candidate and from that point on they spend about a billion dollars.

Sean Spicer (40:59)

I hope so.

Newt Gingrich (41:00)

And all of it is Trump like rather than Republican.

Sean Spicer (41:03)

This is the problem is that everybody stares at that bank account that he has and says, okay, here comes the white knight again. And this is what happened in Virginia. Everybody assumes I don't have to go work out. I mean, it's like getting healthy. Someone else can't do it for you. He can help, he can run some ads, he can help raise you some money. But all these guys have to remember that they have to lead the effort themselves.

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Newt Gingrich (44:10)

I have to ask you about your political memorabilia collection, which may be among the largest and most comprehensive of any Republican in the whole country. When did you begin your collection? And what was the very first piece?

Sean Spicer (44:26)

So my first paid campaign was the Republican revolution that you led. The Contract of America. I don't know why or what it was. I mean, I was 22, 23 years old, something like that. 24. Somewhere in there. I told you before, behind me is the TV Guide. People don't even know what that is anymore. That was what you guys put the 10 planks of the Republican Contract with America. I saved one of those. I have the buttons that say, promises made, promises kept. There was an event, if I'm not mistaken. It was at the Hilton in the basement. Big rally at the 100 day mark. I kept all that. So at that point, I was interning for the House Ways and Means Committee. And as you get invited to something where I'd say, oh, I gotta get a copy of this, or I'd get a pencil and I'd go up to the dias, they'd say, can you go set that up for the hearing? And these pens and pencils would say, U.S. house of Representatives. And I'd steal four. Statute of limitations I think is passed. I was like, this is super cool. The desk that I'm sitting at right now is a United States Senate surplus desk. They had this thing in the Hart Building. They'd sell the furniture. And I went one Saturday, and they were like, it's 20 bucks. This is a hearing room table that I'm sitting at. I've had it refinished. It's got the stamp underneath made 1964. I like to Tell people that the Kennedys sat at it. I don't know that that's true. I've just been enthralled with collecting. So now it's in crates. I have all of Frank Lentz's polling. I have all of Joel Gaylord's books. There might be some napkins. I've got M and Ms. That are probably not fit for consumption from the White House. I think I have every Newt Gingrich book. I have the polling that your old com director, Tony Blankly, did when he worked for Ronald Reagan. When Tony passed, and he was a great, great man, his wife Linda said, somebody said that you collect stuff. And I've got all of this polling that Tony did in the memos that he wrote. And I was like, sure. And it's fascinating to go through and see what he was telling Reagan. How to reach out to Hispanics, how to overcome some political obstacles and the parallels between now and then. So I have a basement that doubles as a museum. I keep telling my wife, if anything ever happens to me, there's a lot in there. Oh, my God, I've got the best story ever. That I've almost buried the lead. So I remember talking to you in the lead up of writing this book, and you gave me a piece of advice. Do you remember what it was, what I should read? You said to me, you know what? You have to read the Art of the Comeback. Everybody reads the Art of the Deal. You said to me. So I go online to get the Art of the Comeback because Newt Gingrich told me to get it. And these things aren't cheap. They were 3, $400 for a copy. So I buy it because I was like, you know what? Newt Gingrich said I needed to read this if I'm going to write about Trump 2.0. He said, you got to read the book. So again, I take my marching orders. Well, I suck it up. I go, I'm a cheap guy, frugal guy by nature. I go on ebay, I find a deal, great copy of it. I buy it for $300. I take it to the Oval Office. This is what you don't know a couple weeks ago, And I said to the President, we were talking about the book. I showed him the COVID he was under, and he goes, what's the other book that you have there? And I go, that's Art of the Comeback. He looks at me like, why are you. I go, so I'm writing the book. Speaker Gingrich says, you gotta read this book. So I said, I bought it because he said, this is how you really have to understand the comeback mentality that he has and why. So I said, but I gotta tell you a funny story. I think to go out and buy this book, and it's gonna be 15, 20 bucks online. It was a few hundred dollars. And so, of course, what's the first thing that Trump does? He looks at the side of the book. He goes, which one is this? Who was the publisher? Swear to God, it's the New York Times. He goes, oh, God. Then he goes, I tell you what, you want me to sign it for you? I go sign it. So he signs it, and then he hands me the White House pen. So I'm keeping this just for the audience. I don't sell any of the stuff I have. But I told my wife the book signed with the White House pen, and I photograph things when I do this. So I posted online because that authenticates it. So now go online and look at what a signed copy of Art of the Comeback with the White House pen. I bet you we're looking at one year of college education for my kid. But the president got a kick out of the story. I love keeping it. I don't sell it, but I've got all the president's coins displayed. So it's not good. It's a very unhealthy habit.

Newt Gingrich (48:40)

I was gonna say, no wonder your wife has this sense that maybe you've gone overboard. I'm told you have a collected full set of Go Pack tapes.

Sean Spicer (48:50)

Yes. Not the full set. I did at some point. I've probably lost a few, but I do. I have all of them. You, Haley, Barber. Yeah. I used to listen to those my first campaign, Connecticut to 1994 with Ed Munster. Was one of the contract planks that you flew up, signed. Never forget that lunch. I always tell people the greatest lesson. Everybody wanted to sit with Newt Gingrich, right? I was a staffer. I knew I wasn't sitting with the soon to be majority leader. All the donors, that's what they do. I was a staffer. But what I was smart enough to do was to sit at the table in the back next to Joe Gaylord. And I went back there and I said, you're Mr. Gaylord, aren't you? And he said, of course, yeah. And Joe was doing what consultants do, and they sit in the back of the room waiting for the boss to talk. But I was like, I know who this guy is. I've listened to the tapes, and so I still have those. I know exactly where they are too. So I have the go pack paraphernalia flying upside down, all of the flying right side up.

Newt Gingrich (49:43)

What is the rarest item you've managed to add to your collection?

Sean Spicer (49:48)

There are some things from the Trump White House that I will not confirm. The only thing going for me is that Marco Rubio is the archivist right now. So I might catch a break. But there are some things that the president has handed me over time where he said here, and I sort of recognized, oh, my God, this is him saying, go do X and X fill in the blank. I'm not admitting anything on tape is probably a pretty historic thing and those are all preserved.

Newt Gingrich (50:15)

Is there a Holy Grail piece that you're still hunting for?

Sean Spicer (50:19)

No. Sitting right next to me. I have the letter that was written post Articles Confederation saying that these Articles of Confederation are not working. We need something different. We should meet in Philadelphia. I just bought that this week, so it's mind blowing. And then the other one that I bought, again, because I can't help myself, is I bought a commissioning document of the first Italian admiral ever to be appointed and commissioned by Lincoln, and it's signed to him. Now, I'm always on the hunt, and when I recognize something that's historic, I go, holy smokes. I'll tell you the other fun thing, by the way. If you walk into the RNC right now ever, you'll see my handiwork. So every two years, there's a new chairman or every four, depending on when they run, and everyone cleans out everything and there's nothing. And so I said, this is a shame. So I did this for the speakers of the House and the presidential candidates. So there's a Newt Gingrich sign, but I said, why don't we. And I will take this upon myself going back to Reagan, and obviously not Reagan himself, but it started with George W. Bush. I collected every campaign sign going back to Reagan, and I bought a lot of them online. I found collectors, and then I had them all signed. So when you walk in the RNC right now, on the first floor right now and take a right, you will see every sign that is the actual yard sign that they had up signed by the president and the vice presidential candidate, winning and losing, going back to Reagan. And on the Reagan one, I just got George W. Bush, but it was really cool. Got to go to Dick Cheney's house, got to have him sign it. McCain obviously signed it. Sarah Palin, Bush, Bush, Dole, the thing that I love. And I did two copies, one I kept for myself one I did for the rnc, honest to God. It's the only collection of Republican nominees and vice presidential nominees going back to Reagan.

Newt Gingrich (52:04)

What an amazing story.

Sean Spicer (52:06)

And it's just fun because you realize if you don't do that, right? So think about it. Vice President Cheney has passed. Senator McCain has passed away. George Bush 41 has passed away. Obviously, Senator Dole has passed. And so to have this, you can't recreate this stuff. And so for me to have this, and I love being able to do it for the rnc, to make it historic, so that when you walked in, you got to see it all on their actual campaign signs. And then I did every speaker of the House. So I have Gingrich, Hassert, ryan. I believe McCarthy. I didn't do Johnson. Not that I wouldn't. I'm no longer there. I'd hoped somebody else would pick it up.

Newt Gingrich (52:43)

It's always, to me, enormously fun to talk with you and interview you because you are a real professional. You've had a remarkable life, both in the military, in government and in politics. And you have the very rare ability to not start with whatever your prejudice was yesterday, but to actually try to learn what today's about. And I think that's a very unusual ability.

Sean Spicer (53:11)

I learned from the best.

Newt Gingrich (53:12)

I want to thank you for joining me today. Your new book, Trump 2.0. God, I wish I made this up. I wish this was my title.

Sean Spicer (53:20)

When I came up with this idea, I said to the publisher, we need to get up on Amazon quick.

Newt Gingrich (53:25)

You're right. Trump 2.0, the revolution that will permanently transform America. It's available now on Amazon and bookstores everywhere. Our listeners can follow all the great work you're doing, and it's really, you're one of the best. By subscribing to your substack@sean spicer.com and I'm really delighted that you took this

Sean Spicer (53:47)

time to be with us, as always. And just a quick reminder for your listeners, if anyone is a political hoarder like me and likes memorabilia, if you take a screenshot of your purchase from Amazon and email it to, contact Sean spicer.com, i will send you a personalized book plate to add into the book.

Newt Gingrich (54:05)

Thank you to my guest, Sean Spicer. Newtsworld is produced by Gingrich360 and iHeartMedia. Our executive producer is Garnzi Sloan. Our researcher is Rachel Peterson. Special thanks to the team at Gingrich360. If you've been enjoying Newt's World. I hope you'll go to Apple Podcast and both rate us with five stars and give us a review so others can learn what it's all about. Join me on substack@gingrich360.net I'm Newt Gingrich. This is Newt's World.

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