← Next Comes What
Next Comes What
A Movement That Can Stop Trump
00:25:14
Millions hit the streets last weekend to secure democracy and change America. Read the post that inspired this episode: Subscribe to Andrea Pitzer’s Degenerate Art newsletter to support Next Comes What: This week "Next Comes What" focuses on...
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- [00:00]
Andrea Pitzer
You're listening to. Next comes what from Degenerate Art. Each week we'll look at one aspect of authoritarianism to figure out how we got where we are and how to fight back. This is Andrea Pitzer. No Kings Day last weekend was a huge success. As many as 5 million of you showed up across the country, and a truism in journalism says that if you have three examples, you have a trend story. In the US spanning 2017, 2020 and 2025, a series of mass protests have taken place against authoritarian rule, encompassing national and local repression. Today I want to talk about what happened on no Kings Day last Saturday, how those three clusters of massive protest events came to be, and how we have already built on the shoulders of many who labored without thanks in hundreds of locations across the US the bones of the 21st century protest movement. We need to liberate the country. And really, we're just getting started.
- [01:06]
Jason Sattler
Today, no Kings. Tomorrow, freedom.
- [01:09]
Andrea Pitzer
The only mistake at this point would be to think that using political power ever falls into the category of one and done.
- [01:17]
Jason Sattler
We will not be moved. We will stand, we will march, we will sing, and we will speak peacefully, powerfully and persistently. Your justice rolls down like waters and righteousness like a mighty stream.
- [01:39]
Andrea Pitzer
But before we get into that, I want to take a moment to address Next Comes what and its parent newsletter, Degenerate Art. We have thousands and thousands of reliable viewers and readers every week, which is great, but fewer than 300 are paid subscribers. I won't ever include ads in the written or podcast versions of these essays, but that necessarily limits my reach because wider audiences rarely hear about what I'm up to. If you find the work here, audio, video, or text on these episodes interesting or useful, I encourage you to sign up as a paid subscriber. Your funds go not just to me, but also to Jason Sattler, better known online as lolgop, who produces the podcast and spends a lot of time on it each week.
- [02:28]
Jason Sattler
You've got to get your butt in.
- [02:31]
Andrea Pitzer
Gear and do it. You can find the newsletter link@Andreapitzer.com in order to subscribe. Now back to last weekend. What a spectacle. What a turnout. Independent data journalist G. Elliot Morris estimates, based on crowdsourced materials, that 4 to 6 million people came out in the US to stand against the repressive policies of our current president and his lackeys.
- [02:54]
Jason Sattler
I'm out here because I was willing to die for the things we have in our Constitution, and right now I think our constitutional rights are being violated. Stepped on, trampled on and disregarded by a president commander in chief, which would be Donald Trump. I mean, everything looks unlawful to me at this point in America.
- [03:16]
Andrea Pitzer
Morris reported this number as a significant expansion of protests over those done in the first year of Trump's first term as president, with protests doubling in 2025, over 2017, and even tripling this weekend. What we have seen is this huge volume of events and it's much more geographically dispersed. So we're seeing many more events in small towns and we're seeing many more events happening on a regular basis, sort of generating a sense of regularity, continuity, momentum and capacity and commitment here in Falls Church, Virginia, which is just four miles outside Washington, D.C. i went to both the morning and afternoon protests in town. The morning one had amazing turnout, though. I saw multiple parking spaces open just a block from the heart of the gathering on which told me it was pretty much all town residents who had shown up. Along the main road there was a continuous line of demonstrators running block to block as far as the eye could see down Broad street. It's also Northwest 7. There was apparently another demonstration just a little ways down the road at Columbia Pike. People where I was were waving their signs to drivers and drivers were honking in response. A semi driver joined in. I did a postman on the delivery truck. The whole thing was really well beyond my expectations. One of the demonstration marshals, or peacekeepers, was standing on the corner of the main intersection at the center of Falls Church. She told me about signups for the event, saying that 433 people had RSVP'd as of the night before, and the crowd by then looked like well over a thousand to me. And later it grew even bigger. I came back at 4pm that afternoon for the second Falls Church event. Knots of people had gathered on each side of the street on each block, lining the main street running more or less north south through town. Attendees had signed up for each particular spot so that the two mile stretch would have people with signs all along the route. This dinnertime demonstration was not as wall to wall, but I went the length of it on both sides of the street and people were in great spirits. A friend who had joined a similar demonstration in nearby Arlington, Virginia, noted how many Latino families had taken to waving the American flag from cars instead of joining in on foot, perhaps for safety reasons. Northern Virginia was one of five threatened areas run by Democratic local politicians where it was announced last week that ICE would be deploying tactical units. So cars wound up being an integral part of both demonstrations, with support on the road via honking. Honestly, being so constant, it was often difficult to carry on any conversations. Instead, people mostly just smiled and waved at each other. There was no actual parade, but with the interaction between the drivers and those lining the streets, the day had a beautiful celebratory feel of an event where the whole community had turned out for a parade. It felt very unlike what took place soon afterward in dc.
- [06:27]
Jason Sattler
Go ahead, have your parades and your pomp and circumstance. We don't care.
- [06:31]
Andrea Pitzer
We don't pay attention to it because at the end of the day we.
- [06:35]
Jason Sattler
Know we are stronger than that. There is an obligation for people locally to stand up and show out and show that we are here to support the people who are being downtrodden by this regime.
- [06:51]
Andrea Pitzer
The parallel event downtown was a Sadder affair. The D.C. celebration was ostensibly for the 250th anniversary of the U.S. army, but taking place on Trump's birthday, it was understood to be the fulfillment of a years long dream that he had tried but failed to stage during his first administration. A day long series of events on the National Mall with physical fitness competitions and weapons manufacturers holding a kind of open tent expo.
- [07:20]
Jason Sattler
There was family fun everywhere. I'm talking cornhole howitzers, kids with machine guns.
- [07:25]
Andrea Pitzer
The DC Celebration was capped by an evening parade and fireworks.
- [07:30]
Jason Sattler
A Special thanks to Scott's Miracle Bro.
- [07:32]
Andrea Pitzer
And all of the terrific America 250.
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Jason Sattler
Sponsors that helped make this monumental event happen.
- [07:37]
Andrea Pitzer
Troops marched down Constitution Avenue, marching out of step enough to leave onlookers wondering whether it was fatigue or a silent protest by troops of having their mission politicized. Soldiers in tank or lounging atop them waved at roadside attendees like it was a small town Shriners event, which honestly might have been the most authentic part of the day. The top brass seated next to Trump on the podium seemed bored and tired. Rubio yawned at one point. Thousands did attend the festivities across the day, but in scattered bunches, with some parts of the parade route eventually empty. All of it rarely achieved the critical mass that might provide a jolt of joy or adrenaline and evoke the sense of any national party. What else made it all seem so sad? Reportedly, tiktokers and some blue skyers had reserved tickets for the event with no plans to attend, driving down. Crowd size and weather reports for days had threatened. Thunderstorms would take place all evening, which wound up holding off really until events had wrapped up. But maybe the prospect of being struck by lightning kept some people away or led them to leave early. Along with these dampening effects, I suspect a Lot of Trump supporters have bought the propaganda against cities in general and D.C. in particular. I know that my Trump supporting extended family have never liked to go to the nation's capital because of its status as a majority minority city. And I suspect that this tendency has only grown under Trump. And through deliberate sabotage of what Trump was asking for, or through minimal compliance, the army seemed to refuse Trump what he wanted. A spectacle like those in police states or like the one he saw in 2017 when France was celebrating Bastille Day, marking the abuse of prisoners and the revolution against monarchy in France. In the end, Trump's birthday party lacked any feel of a party at all. But the no Kings protests may well have been the largest unified national protest in the country's history.
- [09:51]
Jason Sattler
If they weren't the biggest in U.S. history, were awfully darn close. We had about 5 million people out, which is 50 or probably 100 times as many as Trump had out at his birthday parade or whatever that was.
- [10:06]
Andrea Pitzer
I want to talk about where that comes from and what it means going forward. Looking back. Black Lives matter rose in 2013. The phrase black lives matter was first coined by three African American women in response to George Zimmerman's acquittal. But the term didn't gain widespread use until August 9, 2014, when Michael Brown was shot and killed by a white police officer in Ferguson, Missouri. Donald Trump has a very long history of racist rhetoric and actions and direct attempts to dishonestly portray black Americans as criminal.
- [10:40]
Jason Sattler
A well educated black has a tremendous advantage over a well educated white in terms of the job market. I certainly don't agree with that garbage that Donald Trump said. Trump took out a full page ad in four major New York City newspapers calling for the state to adopt the death penalty and use it on the teens.
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Andrea Pitzer
As soon as he emerged as a national political figure, his candidacy played out in direct opposition to the Black Lives Matter movement.
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Jason Sattler
He's a race baiting, xenophobic religious bigot.
- [11:10]
Andrea Pitzer
A man that chooses not to disavow the kkk. That is not a part of our party. That's not who we want as president. We will not allow that in our country.
- [11:21]
Jason Sattler
Look at my African American over here. Here, look at him.
- [11:24]
Andrea Pitzer
In November 2015, nearly a year before Trump would first win the presidency, a half dozen of his supporters attacked a demonstrator at a rally who shouted Black Lives Matter.
- [11:34]
Jason Sattler
Maybe he should have been roughed up.
- [11:36]
Andrea Pitzer
Because it was absolutely disgusting what he was doing. Trump told Fox News about the attack. The man who was attacked, Mercutio Southall, later told reporters that the group who attacked him had been a lynch mob and that his grandparents had crossed the Edmund Pettus Bridge. On the civil rights march from Selma to Montgomery in 1965, we made a.
- [11:56]
Jason Sattler
Decision to march in selma, Alabama in 1965. Only 2.1% of blacks of voting age were registered to vote. The only place you could attempt to register was to go down to the courthouse. You had to pass a so called literacy test. And they were told people over and over again that they couldn't pass the literacy test. On one occasion, a man was asked to count the number of bubbles in a bar of soap.
- [12:19]
Andrea Pitzer
The demonstrations that took place On Saturday, nationwide, 60 years after Selma, reveal a movement marked by a series of massive demonstrations of its own. First, the eruption of disapproval after Donald Trump's first election victory in 2017. Next, the grief and fury of 2020 protests against the murder of George Floyd, which made it even to the small West Virginia town where I grew up.
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Jason Sattler
No justice, no peace. No justice.
- [12:48]
Andrea Pitzer
No peace.
- [12:49]
Jason Sattler
No justice, no pe.
- [12:51]
Andrea Pitzer
Ripley High School student Leo Mollahan organized.
- [12:53]
Jason Sattler
This protest because he believes the community needs to be educated about the issues.
- [12:57]
Andrea Pitzer
The African American community faces. No Kings Day protests were also held here in New York, in San Diego, Chicago, Seattle, and other communities large and small. In Lyons, Colorado, a town of just 2,100 in the foothills of the Rocky Mountain national park, hundreds join the protests. I want to assert that the long period of time over which these have happened show that Trumpism is. Is the dominant danger in America and that the public is mobilizing against it in ways that are increasing over time. We now have the bones of a nationwide movement that can stop him. It is important to say, however, that before and between those three public events, a series of smaller, critical protests provided the neural network and the spine of that movement. Protests across the country in the wake of infuriating deaths were critical to keeping police overreach and killings from front and center. Sandra Bland, dead in her jail cell three days after a traffic stop in 2015. Elijah McCain, detained by police and injected with ketamine by a paramedic before his death in Colorado in 2019. Breonna Taylor, shot by police at home in Louisville a year later. People publicizing these deaths helped keep a resistance to oppression alive in America.
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Jason Sattler
Nobody is free until all of us are free. That's the end goal.
- [14:19]
Andrea Pitzer
Disability protesters have likewise risked their lives to shame lawmakers on Capitol Hill and preserve health care for everyone. They did it in 2017 to save the Affordable Care act, and they mobilized again in the face of drastic proposals that would cut health care to millions of vulnerable people. Under both Trump and Biden, Latino communities have organized to demand farm worker protections. More recently, those fighting deportations and raids have educated immigrants about their rights and funded representation of those detained. Meanwhile, there are people demanding the right to hold drag queen story hours and those who have long been refusing to vanish in the face of government erasure of any celebration of queerness or difference.
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Jason Sattler
I think they're grossly misunderstanding what's happening here. I'm just here reading to children.
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Andrea Pitzer
Immediate responses to Trump's first attempt to impose a Muslim ban on foiled that.
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Jason Sattler
Effort Travel ban backlash Protests are erupting at airports across the country following the.
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Andrea Pitzer
Executive order from President Trump until the courts helped him launder it all. These responses to abuse and intolerance made it possible for bigger events to coalesce around the country. And of course, demonstrations in prior decades by countless groups including Occupy, Abortion clinic Defenders and HIV activists paved the way too, keeping protest traditions and knowledge from the 20th century alive and passing it along to us.
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Jason Sattler
Act Up's Inside Outside strategy paired in.
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Andrea Pitzer
Your face attention grabbing protests with deeply researched policy recommendations. ACT UP members delivered their findings directly.
- [15:54]
Jason Sattler
To employees within the government agencies and then held them accountable through demonstrations outside the building gates.
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Andrea Pitzer
Most of the protests on Saturday became community parties where police didn't act to stir up violence. They remained rallies more than protests, but in some places the day did turn dangerous. Journalists were reportedly fired on with rubber bullets. In Los Angeles, Mario Guevara, an Atlanta based journalist reporting on immigration raids, was detained and may already have been targeted for deportation. In Culpepper, Virginia, a man was reported to have driven into a crowd of no Kings Day protesters, hitting at least one person. 21 year old Joseph Checklik Jr. Drove his SUV into protesters as they were crossing a business parking lot. A confusing picture emerged at Salt Lake City's demonstration in which event peacekeepers fired on an attendee who was carrying a weapon, killing another attendee who had nothing to do with either of them.
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Jason Sattler
Police, citing witnesses, have said Gamboa had his rifle in a firing position and was running toward the crowd. But neither Tuesday's video nor the new footage shows that. Tuesday's video showed Gamboa's rifle barrel pointed down and he doesn't begin running until the shooting starts.
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Andrea Pitzer
I think that one is still being sorted out in terms of the timeline. Most horrific were the deliberate political assassinations that took place the night before in Minnesota. Not at any demonstration, but at the.
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Jason Sattler
Target'S homes In a statement, Sophie and Colin Hortman say they are devastated and heartbroken about what happened to their parents and that their love was boundless. They also want to remind everybody who reads their statement, love your neighbors, treat everyone with kindness and respect.
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Andrea Pitzer
The gunman, a Trump supporter who had a company called Praetorian Guard, had compiled a list of Democratic lawmakers and methodically tried to kill several of them.
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Jason Sattler
It's pretty clear from the evidence that he's been planning these attacks for quite some time.
- [18:01]
Andrea Pitzer
A lot of people were infuriated by politicians responses to those deaths, which seemed to imply some overall culture of violence for which the right and the left might be equally responsible, despite data showing that's just not the case. Media coverage of Saturday's nationwide protests further frustrated other observers. The New York Times coverage reported thousands as showing up, when the number had clearly been somewhere in the millions. The paper had a map of confirmed protests, with only fairly large towns and cities included, when any group of interns could have tracked and vetted locations for them to confirm protests at thousands of sites nationwide within a few hours. The Washington Post coverage of the president's parade itself was worse, with a decidedly organ of the state feel to some of the stories. But there were bright spots, too, where reporters emphasized what was really going on.
- [18:54]
Jason Sattler
Today's events in about 2000 cities and towns were organized by the no Kings.
- [18:59]
Andrea Pitzer
Movement, which calls the administration's actions authoritarian. The truth is that the mainstream press tends to be kind of behind when it comes to understanding and reporting on popular protest. They've evolved to respond to and interpret institutional actors rather than the needs of the public. Yelling at them is good and can lead to accountability. But make sure you point out the specifics of where they screwed up, because that's where you might actually get them to change. In the end, however, the message of the protests is bigger than the press. What having thousands of locations, rallies and demonstrations around the country does is bring the issues at hand home to people who will never read the New York Times or perhaps any newspaper ever. Tens of millions of people in the country avoid politics entirely and consume little or no news. But protest signs and gatherings in their community provide a chance to focus public attention in atomized ways that can educate.
- [20:02]
Jason Sattler
We can inspire one another, we can establish community, and we can be there for each other when these bad things happen.
- [20:09]
Andrea Pitzer
It's important to realize that opposing authoritarians and reactionaries is rarely welcomed, but the more we can make it an activity that the people with the most privilege are part of, the harder it is for vulnerable groups to be smeared as undeserving of free speech and protection of the laws.
- [20:26]
Jason Sattler
They come for you. They come for me. Reply in solidarity.
- [20:30]
Andrea Pitzer
I was talking this week to Jason about decades ago when I took my black belt test. And of course it's a huge moment when an hours long examination that is pretty exhausting is over and you get that belt and it's meaningful. Who shows up to fight you that day? Who shows up to be part of the event, and who is the person tying the belt on your waist? But in the end, anyone can go online and order a belt for a few dollars. So it's. It's not about a strip of polyester cotton blend. It's about what you do with the knowledge. It's about showing up each day to do the work of maintaining skills or sharing knowledge. And democracy is the same, except more important.
- [21:13]
Jason Sattler
We make a new friend here today and we do something with them tomorrow. We meet somebody we admire today and we do something with them tomorrow. We meet somebody who's a little more courageous than us today, and we do something with them tomorrow.
- [21:29]
Andrea Pitzer
A victory in a national election or a protest that includes millions is a huge win in the face of authoritarianism. But it doesn't eliminate the need to win the next race or to do the work to change the system itself. In between entrenched interests, whether they're cultural reactionaries weaponized by corporations or institutional media deeply suspicious of popular movements or political actors seeking to impose dictatorship, they don't just vanish or suddenly become moral actors. So show up, support one another, and pace yourselves. It will get harder before it gets easier, and then it will get harder again.
- [22:11]
Jason Sattler
There is a better America out there. There is a better America underneath. There is a better America that we can see. There is a better America that we can make. History is in our hands.
- [22:28]
Andrea Pitzer
But what happened Saturday is huge. It shows that if we keep at it, we are really gathering the means to defeat Trumpism and the repression that came before him. With all its ice, lawfare, targeting trans people, DHS overreach, politicians who would rip away the tiny bit of a safety net grudgingly built in the prior century and more, we are bigger than all of it.
- [22:52]
Jason Sattler
There's a woman named Mariam Kaba. K A B A Mariam Kaba. And she argues that hope is a discipline. So hope is not something that you just pull out of the air or that you can simply feel or not feel. It is something that you have to work at.
- [23:21]
Andrea Pitzer
Look at all these court victories that show that even our flawed system recognizes the vast abuse being inflicted on the population. A judge who was a Reagan appointee ruled against the government on Monday, saying it was palpably clear that the current administration's cuts at NIH were due to racial discrimination and discrimination against America's LGBTQ community. Another judge ruled late last week that the president calling up the California National Guard was illegal. Even with setbacks, we can see the tide turning against Trump's egregious actions. We just have to keep pushing too. Don't wait for the next big demonstration to join in again, or to do your part from home by supporting those who get arrested or deported. Organize more events close to home to stand up against censorship against your municipality collaborating with ice, against targeting trans people, against cutting funding for projects that benefit women or black people. The administration came in and started a million wars against nearly every group of Americans, even its own base, apparently in the hopes of exhausting us into surrender. Instead, make them fight those wars they've started and make them fight those battles on every single front. They don't have enough power yet to make it work. Meanwhile, we still have more than enough freedom to fight back. As a country, we showed this weekend that we are stronger than they are and we can win. And that's it. Thanks for listening to Next Comes what?
- [25:01]
Jason Sattler
Please share this with anyone who's looking.
- [25:03]
Andrea Pitzer
For ways to help each other survive this mess.
- [25:05]
Jason Sattler
To support this podcast, Please subscribe@Andreapitzer.com and consider giving Next Comes what?
- [25:10]
Andrea Pitzer
A five star review where you get your podcasts.