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- [00:00]
A
Foreign. Welcome to no Ducks. Wherever you're listening or watching, whether it's Apple or Spotify or you're on the stream team here on YouTube, we really appreciate it. Especially while we're undergoing studio renovations. We really, really appreciate it. I'm Tas Melas. I guess during Eurobasket, I'm Tassos Melas. With me, it's the man in the middle, Trey Kirby. Hey, yo. Hey. Oh, Trey. We thought we were doing a Euro basket show today.
- [00:37]
B
Oh, there's an NBA podcast in our Euro Basket podcast.
- [00:42]
A
Yeah. So much stuff going on, so we had to go that route. Should we just jump in?
- [00:50]
B
You know, I love to do a seaball task. So let me step to the edge of the diving board and plunge in deep.
- [00:58]
A
We are plunging because there was a report yesterday that turned the ma NBA blogosphere just upside down because the Clippers are reportedly circumventing the salary cap by paying Kawhi Leonard a secret amount of money over the last few years. Now, this report was really produced by Pablo Torre, finds out the podcast, which did some serious work because it's kind of convoluted, and especially after hearing today all the. The back work that Kawhi was trying to get more money from the Raptors at 2019. Anyway, just to summarize briefly before we jump in, this tree planting company, Aspiration, signed a deal with not only Kawhi Leonard, but also with Steve Ballmer. Steve Ballmer paying money to this company, money being channeled to Kawhi Leonard, specifically a $28 million endors deal from this now bankrupt company. And Kawhi Leonard didn't have to do a thing for it. As Pablo interviewed a bunch of people who said, quote, he had to do nothing. You can hear them on the podcast, which is wild. This company filed for bankruptcy earlier this year and its co founder, Joe Sandberg, was arrested on fraud charges. So, hello, some serious stuff. Will they be penalized? That is the question. Clippers then released a statement both to Pablo directly before the podcast came out and after the podcast came out, basically saying, to summarize, we did nothing wrong. You know, Ballmer invested in this company because they were committed to reducing the world carbon's footprint. And you see that guy who just committed fraud, well, he stole money from so many people. So it ain't Ballmer. But what this is definitely reporting to be is a bomber to aspirate Aspiration to Kawhi. Now the league is investigating, and here we are. Trey, will they be penalized? What to make of all this?
- [03:02]
B
I think this is going to be a long lasting story task. We had one of the most boring months in the history of the NBA off season in August. Literally nothing happened. And then a straight up September bombshell alert. It feels like huge news. This is just the beginning of the story. We're getting Pablo's reporting. We're getting some additional reporting from John Corrales at the Boston Sports Journal that this payment plan could reach closer to like $48 million because Kawhi has had stock options in this company. I suppose that plays into the to everything. We have the Clippers denying everything and we have the NBA saying we are going to have to investigate this. They did some investigations into Kawhi Leonard joining the Clippers back when it happened because the Raptors were complaining that Uncle Dennis was asking for stuff outside of the cba. The Lakers were saying that Uncle Dennis was asking for stuff outside of the cba. So this was at least in the ether around the NBA. Now a few years later, we're finding out that the Clippers may have gone through with this. I suppose they're denying everything at this point because they can. It's unlikely that we'll find a an email from Steve Ballmer saying pay Kawhi leonard an extra $28 million specifically to circumvent the salary cap. But it looks really bad. The optics of it are terrible. It looks like Steve Ballmer gave this company $50 million for then $50 million to go into the pockets of Kawhi Leonard throughout the course of the deal. The deal which by the way only counts if Kawhi stays a member of the Clippers. I think the no show aspect and having his, his contracts tied to his Clippers contract, those to me are like the biggest things that we're gonna have to hear answers from from the Clippers and from the league to see what they actually are able to turn up. Because as we've talked about, like in shorts and as you're seeing everywhere, the penalties could be severe. So I think this is going to be something that stretches out for a little bit here. It took a while for the Minnesota Timberwolves to get investigated back in the day. And this is going to be a huge question mark because you got the richest owner in all of North American professional sports finding a way to use his pocketbook allegedly to bring in players. And that's the exact reason we have this new cba. So the richest owners can't use their pocketbook to bring in anybody they want.
- [05:33]
A
That part that you mentioned, that it is directly tied to Kawai's contract and that him being with the Clippers is a part of it is. It seems like that is just okay, case closed. If that's the case, then it must be a scenario where Kawhi is getting paid through the owner in an indirect way just to receive more money. And hearing that on the Pablo Torre podcast from the, I guess it was the former GM of the Miami Marlins or the former owner of the Miami Marlins, but he basically saying, listen, I'm looking at this document. This is incredible. They don't have this sort of secondary rule with players to say, oh, you still got to be with the team. I mean, it just seems like it's, it's apples to apples. Like the money is going directly to Kawhi. And then you hear about this also. This company that Kawhi Leonard started literally started the KL2 Aspire comma LLC. Now it's called Aspire. And the company that planted these trees, if they planted any trees, was called Aspiration. I mean, come on. And he, he started the company basically as soon as he signed that extension with the Clippers. It wasn't the initial contract, but anyway, yeah, it just, it feels, it feels odd, especially because Steve Ballmer had to know what was going on with this company, which, as I said, is bankrupt, its co founder arrested on fraud charges, and apparently like 90% of the. The letters of intent for their other businesses were all fraud. So the company was kind of bogus. You know, I, I'm, I'm sure as Pablo said he didn't have to do anything. He really, as you said, like, he called it a no show. I mean, I went and did and because everybody was, was tweeting out some things. Yesterday, there was a tweet from the Los Angeles Clippers in 2022 that said for every comment slash retweet, Aspiration will plant one tree for Kawhi's birthday. Happy birthday, Kawhi. I mean, is that Kawhi doing anything? Nah, he didn't have to retweet it. He didn't have to do anything with it. So there's really no tie in. And I mean, there's the Uncle Dennis tie in. It just feels like it's, it's too real to be fake. That's what it feels like from the outside looking.
- [08:01]
B
Yeah, it seems like there are going to be a few big questions to be answered before the NBA really says anything of substance on it. Like, number one is what did the Clippers slash Steve Ballmer know going into the investment into Aspiration or whatever the name of the business actually is. Yeah, that's unbelievable that they named Kawhi's LLC KL2 aspirations fire. You've seen the Wire. Don't take notes on a criminal conspiracy and don't name your LLC after the scam you're pulling. I would think is kind of like the second part of that. But also, what can the NBA prove that the Clippers knew and and what sort of influence they had over this and how a spot aspiration decided to use their money? I think others have said that having a sponsor have the player's endorsement tied to their contract isn't super unusual. There are similar sort of things, right? Like Jason Tatum has a deal with the same jersey sponsor that the Celtics wear. That kind of thing does happen. But Jason Tatum is making appearances for that brand. He's doing promotional work for that something, some sort of work to get his stipend, whatever it may be. Kawhi, because of his personality and just because of the way this went down, he obviously wasn't doing that. So we got to know what the Clippers knew, We got to know what the NBA can prove. And then the question becomes, what kind of punishment does all of that lead up to? And how much are the other owners going to be pushing for this? Right, because maybe they're going to be mad. Maybe they're going to be upset that the Clippers and Steve Ballmer have tried to circumvent the salary cap and figured out a way to use his deep, deep pockets. Or maybe they're going to say, we don't want you looking into every one of our books because we're doing the same thing. And that's the question that I am pretty curious about because you had Mark Cuban coming to the defense of Steve Ballmer immediately. Apparently he sat down and talked with Pablo about this kind of a thing for three hours. So I guess part two soon come. But also Pablo says he's investigating the way that Jalen Brunson made his way to the Knicks and took that big discount and then suddenly signed deals elsewhere. I don't know what's going to happen, but the NBA has to do a really good job on this because people are going to be questioning the Clippers, Kawhi, and literally any time a player signs a deal for less money than you thought they were going to get, it's going to be like, okay, so where's he making it up for? How is he getting the discount that he's given to the team? There are some Serious questions to be answered.
- [10:41]
A
Yeah, especially smaller markets, smaller organizations who may not be able to pay a Tree Planting Co. $28 million or $48 million to channel it to somebody. So those organizations will definitely have those questions. I just am curious where we are in terms of penalizing these organizations because 30 years ago for Joe Smith it was those multiple first round picks, but now it just seems like it's more of a second round pick type of thing. So where do you think we are in that gamut? How, how far can the league go? Or does it sort of depend on the details? I.
- [11:30]
B
It's going to 100% depend on the details. I think when it comes to the Timberwolves Joe Smith case, like they had literally a smoking gun. Like they found documentation about the whole plan that they were pulling off with him signing one year deals until he was able to get to a bigger deal. So if the Clippers were a little bit smarter with their, with their backroom dealings, maybe they're able to have some sort of plausible deniability and their penalty is lesser than losing five first round picks. But I assume they'll get at the very least a substantial fine and they should probably lose a draft pick. It's all going to depend on what Adam Silver and the rest of the crew can show. Just how much Steve Ballmer and the rest of the Clippers were actually involved in this. And if they can prove a lot, then they're going to get probably the stiffest possible penalty they can.
- [12:23]
A
It's just phenomenal seeing Kawhi, who is the, the Kawaitest guy in the league, not throw out a tweet. I don't even know if he has Twitter. I don't think he does. Or an Instagram post or a Blue sky post. Like not one.
- [12:43]
B
He's like the number one guy you would expect to not say anything. He doesn't say anything, period. Yeah, it's the perfect guy for this plan actually. Except for Uncle Dennis went and asked every other team for the same thing.
- [12:58]
A
Right, Right. And according to investigations years ago and nothing came of it because it seemed like Uncle Dennis was asking. Uncle Dennis wasn't given anything. But then this feels like Uncle Dennis got some stuff. So we shall see what the league does. Anything else to, to add on or we're. We're moving?
- [13:19]
B
Well, I'm just happy to be thinking about Joe Smith again. It's crazy that all of that happened for Joe Smith 25 years ago. They lost five first round picks. They got. Glenn Taylor was their owner at the time he got suspended, Kevin McHale had to take a leave of absence all over Joe Smith. They made him sign a contract with any other team besides the Timberwolves for one year. And then he went back to the Timberwolves and they traded him two years later. Just like the most random guy. At least if you're doing this for Kawhi Leonard and you're the Clippers, you're getting a Finals mvp, a two time NBA champion, you're doing it for a guy who's at the upper echelons. I think I would risk it for Kawhi more than I would risk it for Joe Smith.
- [14:00]
A
Glenn Taylor, who was the owner at the time, needs to be interviewed. There's no doubt he's going to have an opinion, number one. Number two, apparently, you know, according to Pablo Torre, this is a totally separate investigation, but we talked about how Glenn Taylor thought by purchasing a minority owner's stakehold in the Minnesota Timberwolves, he thought he could get control back from Alex Rodriguez and Mark Lore. But he didn't get it. So, you know, there's, there's lots to be had with Glenn Taylor. He must be, he must know some stuff. So anyway, moving on because we'll get to the Eurobasket stuff, but the NBA stuff just kept dropping. It's the best time of year. The NBA All Star format change has been announced, baby. Exciting stuff. The report is the NBA All Star game is going to have two UA USA teams and one world team. Now that I don't think it's a report, I think it's definitely locked and loaded. Shams Sharani reporting that it's going to be essentially like a round robin tournament. The two USA teams and one world squad would play each other in 12 minute quarter games. According to Shams and, and his sources and apparently the NBA and the players union presented the format to the league's competition committee yesterday and the response was positive. So is your response positive to this?
- [15:26]
B
Where has the player and committee response ever been negative? It was positive when they were going back to basketball. We're just playing straight up east versus West. It was positive last year when they did this tournament and of course it's positive this time around. I'll be positive for you right now, Tess. The main thing I like about this, a two to one ratio, United States versus world. I think eight slots for the international team is perfect. 12 would be too many. But you look at the last couple of seasons, international players to make the All Star team. Giannis, sga, Jokic, Luka Wemby, Sengun and Siakam. Okay. Those guys will still be in the mix. Other guys that have a chance, Sabonis, Markkanen, Franz Wagner, Zubots, Wiggins. Go Bear. If you want to really stretch, you.
- [16:10]
A
Know, Cat plays for the Dominican. I guess that's going to be the question.
- [16:14]
B
That is going to be one of my questions. Who does Joel Embiid play for? He was born internationally. He plays for Team usa. Who does Towns play for? He was born in the USA and he plays for the Dominican Republic. I don't know. Those guys are two of my hugest questions. And the other thing I'll say that's a positive. This is great for Jamal Murray. He has a chance to actually make an all star team now. I don't think he really had a chance going against all the other guards in the Western Conference, but now he's just going against the international guards. So those are the things I like. The things I don't like is doing a tournament for the All Star Game. It's not going to work. They're going to be playing barely at all. These are 12 minute quarter games. So you're going to have the USA versus the world. You're going to have the USA versus THE TEAM that I'm calling America, which is the other group of eight American players. And then you're going to have the World versus America. So you're not even guaranteed USA versus World in the finals of this tournament.
- [17:10]
A
No, you're not.
- [17:11]
B
And it's not going to happen because the USA is going to completely mop the floor with the international team.
- [17:18]
A
Well, usa, you're going to us play them well. I guess what happens is this is a weird format. There's no doubt we've got these three teams. I guess what happens is both team USAs, let's say, play each other in the first quarter and then team USA will play team World in the second one. And then your team America, the other team USA, will play World, the team World in the third quarter. And then however they calculate, the winners are going to play each other in the fourth quarter. I mean, that that format is. Is weird. There's no doubt about that. I do like how they're redoing last year's tournament format because that wasn't a game at all. I mean, they played that first game to 40 points and then it was a variety show. It was a Kevin Hart, come on up. It was a Mr. Beast, come on up, TNT, we love you. Why don't you come up for 30 minutes so I liked, I like the idea of a basketball game because that wasn't a basketball game. Basketball players don't play like Wy was playing. He got burned by hero in that first game. He recovery was awesome. Blocked him. It was awesome. Actually. That first game was fun. He missed a three. He got back to stop Garland. Like there was good stuff in that first game. And then he was asked to sit for like 45 minutes. I, I don't even remember the minutes now, but man, they were sitting for so long. It wasn't, it wasn't fun. And I'm not 100% sure this will be super fun, but I think they were on a good path. Like we got Joe Dumars on before that all star game last year. And one of the questions was, are they going to take a long time in between these, these games? And he said, oh, they got to figure it out. They did not have it figured out.
- [19:00]
B
And now we are gonna take time between these games and guess what? It's gonna go, oh my God poorly that I leave the NBA front office and go work for a team again.
- [19:12]
A
Joe, Joe Dumars definitely lied, as you're seeing here on Stream team. He's, he's straight up lied to me. There's no doubt. I mean, he wasn't involved. You could tell he wasn't involved. He's like, I don't know. They'll figure it out. When he said that this is just different, you mentioned all the guys that could be on the world team. I think when they end up picking these two teams, like, like I call them two teams now because I think they're just going to pick them from the west and from the east, like normal, right? Like, they're just going to pick 24 guys, like off the, off the top. I mean, what are they going to do? I mean, they're not going to pick all sorts. They're not going to say, hey, assistant coach for the New Orleans Pelicans. Here, here's the ballot. Pick 8 World Guys and pick. I mean, they're not going to do that, right?
- [20:00]
B
That is pretty. How are they gonna do that?
- [20:03]
A
Yeah, so that part's strange. And it would be. I mean, you probably have more than eight world guys you, you mentioned, I mean, like 14. So they're. I don't know what's going to end up happening. Just like what happened last year with the, the international team and then the, the kids team or whatever. Those, those four strange teams, like the young team. I mean, we're just going to have 24 guys that are All Stars and then you may have an extra American or something. If it feels like you think they're.
- [20:36]
B
Gonna put a spare American on the world team, they can't do that. It ruins the entire concept of it.
- [20:45]
A
Yeah, I guess. Or no, he'll be on the American team, but they're just going to have 17Americans and seven world guys. Like, I don't know. You don't, you don't put Larry Markkanen on if he's having the same season as he did last year. But it feels like there's going to be, definitely have more than eight worthy world guys. There's no doubt about that. And you mentioned, when you said that, you said USA versus America, he made me think of the WNBA All Star game that ended up having the Americans versus, like the Olympic American team versus the WNBA All Star team. And that was fun. I mean, they kind of played like, hey, we're playing for the thing on the front of our jerseys and it was intense. So hopefully you get that. And that's not going to happen, but.
- [21:32]
B
Hopefully, yes, it will not happen at all.
- [21:36]
A
Guys won't play hard.
- [21:37]
B
Play hard. It's the All Star Game. They don't play hard anymore.
- [21:39]
A
Well, listen, that first game last year, they were playing hard, except they literally had way too much time to scratch themselves. And literally. It was a joke. I mean, it really was. I got bad Kevin Hart out there again.
- [21:54]
B
The same thing's gonna happen. There's gonna be huge breaks in between this year. It's gonna be Drew Ski instead.
- [22:03]
A
I mean, he's a talented guy, so he definitely can have 40 minutes like they had last year with Kevin Hart and Shaq telling jokes. That was unfortunate. But anyway, I think it's. It's time to go. It's. It. We're. We're performing like we're performing at the All Star Game. We've talked about it long enough. One more NBA headline that came about out of nowhere. Finally a restricted free agent signing. No, it's not Jonathan Kamiga. No, no, no, it's not Josh Giddy. It's not Quentin Grimes. It's Cam Thomas, signed to a one year, $6 million qualifying offer with the Brooklyn Nets. He's going back to become an unrestricted free agent a year from now because he's only signing a one year deal. And next year a lot of teams will have salary cap room, unlike this year. What do you think of Cam signing to a one year?
- [23:00]
B
I think it's interesting. This is a major bet on himself. Move the guy did score 24 points per game last season, only playing 31 minutes a game. He was hurt for a lot of the season, only got in 25 games. So I think there's definite, you know, Jordan Poole could lead the league in scoring potential for Cam Thomas because the guy can score and he's gonna get shots up. But I actually don't think he's worth much more than $6 million. Not my style of player at all. All he can do is score, doesn't make his teammates better and doesn't play defense. He kind of is the biggest black hole in the league, I do believe. So. I'm kind of not surprised that this is the deal that was out there for him, considering the cap space situation around the league.
- [23:45]
A
Yeah, it is. It's a low amount for a guy who definitely should be coming off the bench and coming off hot because you can understand that guys don't necessarily love playing with a guy who wants to shoot every single time. But as you said, those are big numbers that he can put up anytime, any day. And now he's playing for himself for a contract next.
- [24:11]
B
I mean, wasn't he playing for himself last year, going into a contract year this year, what's going to be different?
- [24:16]
A
Yeah, for sure.
- [24:17]
B
I need to see that he can do teams with money, teams with money. Though his team has the most money to spend. It's actually. This is good news for Josh Giddy because there's another potential place he could go now. Same with Jonathan Kaminga. There's actually a tiny bit of cap space now in Brooklyn. So maybe the other restricted free agents get done now that this deal is done. But Cam Thomas has to prove that he can do anything else besides get his own shot. And if he can do that, then he'll get paid more next summer.
- [24:46]
A
Yeah, that's what Jonathan Kuminga is trying to show us with his offseason workouts. Look at me. I can pass the ball now. They're not the exact same player, but there is some similarities to Kaminga and Cam Thomas. So, yes, hopefully we see sometime here. I can't believe it's September. And Kaminga and specifically and Giddy, who was, you know, having such a good season. It is surprising, right, that Josh Giddy isn't inked to something.
- [25:14]
B
Well, apparently the Bulls have raised the offer to him. He was getting a $20 million per year offer. Now it's up to 22. This probably will get done sooner rather than later. I think the Kaminga thing is more of a question, but We've seen Kaminga be a scorer in the playoffs at the very least. Josh Giddey was a starter for the entire season on a number one seed in the Western Conference. We've seen him play for at least a decent team and contribute. We haven't seen that from the Brooklyn Nets and Cam Thomas, but I think that's kind of fine for them. They're getting him. They had all the leverage here and they used it the way they wanted to. I think he's actually trade bait. I think a team could convince themselves to trade a second round pick for Cam Thomas and $6 million. You can find that kind of player on your roster basically anywhere. Like the Bucks maybe could be a team that would be interested in Cam Thomas. But yeah, I, I just, I just think it's interesting to take such a big discount because there were apparently other deals that were offered to Cam Thomas for more money, but he isn't really wanted in Brooklyn and it doesn't seem like he wants to be in Brooklyn. So maybe this is his quickest and easiest way out. And from the Nets perspective, they're trying to lose this year. I think they're going to be the worst team in the league and pretty good guy to have leading the charge if that's your goal.
- [26:32]
A
This is true. Along with Michael Porter Jr. Nick Claxton and Terence Mann. Those are the guys who are getting paid on that team. It is interesting as now still the lowest salary in the league as far as team goes, but they didn't want to pay him anymore. Number one, they don't want to sign to a long term deal. They're willing to take Michael Porter Jr. And his big contract this year and next year because they got a first round pick from Denver along with it. And here they are. You're right, they're going to be pretty bad next season. All right, let's move on to why we planned on doing a show today. Because the Euro Baskets preliminary round, group stage, first round, whatever you call it, it's over now. We're moving on to the elimination round. So let's take a look at the bracket. 16 teams. Yeah, we got a fun one here. Fun one from Eurobasket. A circular bracket. You don't see this too often.
- [27:30]
B
I didn't even know you could do that.
- [27:34]
A
Things are different outside of America. So just to fly through what we're gonna see this weekend on Saturday and Sunday, we've got four games on Saturday, four games on Sunday. It'll be Lithuania, Lithuania, Latvia, Greece, Israel, Turkey, Sweden, Poland versus Bosnia, And Herzegovina. Germany. Portugal. Italy. Slovenia. Serbia. Finland. France versus Georgia. Now let's look at what happened, how we got here. The Group A was super, super interesting because they had Serbia in it and they were supposed to be favorites for this entire tournament, but they look so different now. Turkey beat them in one game. So Turkey goes 5, 0. They win the division. Serbia goes 4 and 1, Latvia 3 and 2, Portugal 2 and 3. Those four teams advance while Estonia and Czechia do not. The Turkey beating Serbia to wrap up this. This round was fun. I mean, Shen versus Jokic was freaking awesome.
- [28:41]
B
Yeah, it was super cool. I saw on Euro Basket's Twitter page they put out just the highlight tape of the two of them going against each other and they said, not baby Jokic. Call him daddy Sengun. I don't think I'm ever gonna do that. But the dude was straight up balling in this game. 28, 13 and 8 for Sengun, 22, 9 and 4 for Jokic. Sengun was taking it to him like he was saying it was an honor to go against the best players player in the world. The guy that he clearly models his game after. And both Sengun and Jokic are just perfectly made for the FIBA game. Not that they're not dominant players in the NBA as well, but they just are so awesome to watch playing for their national teams. Turkey is impressive. Outside of Germany, I think they've been the best team there. Germany, like stomped through their field. They didn't really have much competition. Obviously Turkey had a harder path going up against the favorites in Serbia, but once Bogdanovic went down with a torn hamstring, I feel like that cracked the door open a little bit for Turkey. I would not be surprised. I honestly don't know which side of the bracket they're on. Looking at the circle, I don't know which quadrant they're on, but I could very easily see Turkey making it to the finals. They are clicking. They look huge. And Sengun is playing on another level right now.
- [29:59]
A
They are on the better side of the bracket, there's no doubt because now Serbia, Germany and France, the three teams that were likely favored to win all three medals, are on one side of the bracket while Turkey's hanging with Lithuania. Lithuania. I can never say Lithuania. Maybe I got to say Latuva instead. Lithuania, Latvia, Greece, Israel, Sweden, Poland and Bosnia and Herzegovina on their side of the bracket. So they got a way better path now. I talked about them likely being the bronze medal favorite after one game. I said France does. They're good. They're Deep. But I. I started to feel Turkey was. Was better and that's. And I thought I was being bold saying that, but now it feels like. Yes. Just the way the brackets have fallen, it looks like they can get to the finals. You could see Sengun definitely wanted it a little bit more on the Turkey side. That entire team wanted more against Serbia. Serbia doesn't look right. They don't look like themselves. You mentioned Bogdan McDonough. She's out for the tournament. And then Abramovich. We always see that guy in international competitions. The old lefty comes in and helps out. He got hurt and he was up the second half. So there was a lot of guys that weren't right. Even Vasa Micic, who's leaving the NBA. He's been injured and he was kind of on a bike for a lot of the game. Then he got into it in the. In the fourth quarter and he stepped in for Stefan Jovic and probably shouldn't have been there with a really bad turnover. They're trying to get him going here and get over his injury. So it looks weird. And I think Serbia just knows it ain't right. I don't know if Jokic feels like, well, this is like playing with the Denver Nuggets. I don't have enough help. It feels that way. And he dropped like 39 versus Latvia in the first round. And still here. They're. They're here and there, ain't they? They're just not themselves. So it doesn't feel like. Doesn't feel like they're going to get super duper far. Now they got to play Finland in the next round, so they're going to go five out. They play market in at the five. And I heard the guys on the DNVR podcast say, you know what? In 2022, Serbia won every single game in the first round. Then they got to the round of 16 and they lost to Italy, who had shooters and they compared it to Finland. So I will be interested to see how they try and guard on the perimeter. But it's. It is different. You know, when we did this show a week ago, we thought Serbia, Germany, as you mentioned, who's been rolling. Those two teams seem like they would be destined for the final, but it ain't happening because they're on the same side of the bracket. Weird stuff. Also in this group, I know you love that Portugal Estonia game because it was pretty fun.
- [32:47]
B
I was telling everybody. I know that. I love that Portugal, Estonia. I thought it was over Tas when the Mish K picked up his second technical file and they said, get out of here. I thought, there's no way the Portuguese team could do that. But thanks to Lizboa and Keros making big shots and big plays, plus 17 threes, Portugal. This was a fun game. It was also killing me that there was a guy on Estonia whose last name is Tas. T A S S. They kept saying it, but back and forth all game ended up being a nice win for Portugal to advance.89,83. Afterwards, one commentator said to the other, you always say every game is like a melon. What kind of melon is this one? And the play by play guy was kind of stunned to be asked that question. And everybody, it's like, it's like a big sweet watermelon. And it was, it was a delicious, tasty game down to the last drop.
- [33:37]
A
Well, so they're only like three types of games. I know there's more melons than three, but for me it feels like it's a honeydew. It's cantaloupe or it's a watermelon.
- [33:49]
B
Those are the big three. There's no doubt.
- [33:51]
A
So Portugal gets through. I can't believe Keda was ejected. It was so strange. He yelled after dunking and the referee right in front of him on the baseline didn't kick him out. The guy on the sideline waited a beat, waited a beat and said, you know what, you can't yell. You're out of here. This. That's the point where I don't feel so bad for NBA or I do feel bad, I should say, for NBA referees. Like there's, there's just no winning. It's just hard. And they're just bad around the world at times and sometimes guys get ejected for no reason. Anyway, Portugal is through. They got to play Germany. So that's going to be tough in the next round. But it is interesting to see Latvia get through and they get to go play at home. This next round. Every single game will be played in the same arena in Latvia. So they're going to be playing at home against Lithuania that also don't look like themselves. And just a note on Latvia because I was interested to see Kristaps Porzingis and what he looks like compared to last year. He does not look like the same guy. He looks a lot more normal, a lot more Kristaps. Like, I mean, he was having some fun out there. He was in a pick and pop where he was playing a one man game. He did a step back through his own legs. And then, you know, it didn't really get rid of the defender, so he stepped back again and he missed a shot. But he still looks like the old Chris Staps. He was even playing defense. He kicked his leg out and that's when the broadcaster said, whoa. Extended his leg like he's a handball defender. Sure. But anyways, he looks better. Latvia, Lithuania will be interesting to see. Let's move on to group. Be where Lithuania is a part of this group. They finished second to Germany, who is 5 0. They look awesome. They are definitely the tournament favorite. Lithuania finished second, Finland third. Sweden gets through at 1 and 4. Crazy. They get through to the next round. While Montenegro and Great Britain do not advance. Montenegro doesn't advance. Vuchovic does not get through. Trey, it's over.
- [35:57]
B
Vuch mode was on for a little bit. 31 points, 11 rebounds, 7 assists. This guy was carrying Montenegro against Great Britain, but then Vuch Mode was off. Great Britain gets their first win in euro basket in 12 years, and Vuch immediately retired from international competition. He's like, hey, if we can't beat Britain, I'm out of here. I'm 35 years old. It ain't happening. You're not going to see me go in Skola Mode out there. All gray, but really cool win for Great Britain. Hessen had 25, Yoboa had 23. They were making a bunch of shots. This was just a pretty brutal loss, I thought, for Montenegro, considering they had the best player on the court in Vic. I know they got some other guys who have, like, had a cup of coffee in the NBA, but, yeah, not great for them. Germany, though, dominant in this group. They won their games by 33, 3, 22, 1963 against Great Britain and then 30 in their final game. So, yeah, they haven't really had a challenge yet. It'll be interesting to see who they. Who they're taking on in this bracket here.
- [37:00]
A
Yeah, they got Portugal coming up and then the winner of Italy, Slovenia as their quarterfinal game. And then that would be potentially Serbia or France in the semi finals. Yes. Yeah, they are. They are absolutely rolling. They got too many guys. Even Tristan de Silva is looking good for them, along with your Franz, your Tyson, your ost. I love how everybody's telling us how to pronounce ost. However, it is. I could be wrong. Your bongas, your. Your Schroeder floater, as they're pronouncing Dennis Schroeder like Schroeder. But I've. I actually went in and I tuned in to How Dennis Schroeder pronounces his own name and it was like a Schroda. That's a tough one, man. That is a super duper tough one. I will say though. Yeah. Out of this group, Lithuania also lost a couple guards in two different games. They lost Yokobitis and then they lost the guy sort of replacing Yokobitis and Normantas. So they had two guys out. So they played eight guys in their last game against Sweden. They've just got so many injuries. Although Jonas Valentunas looks fantastic and I guess he's not going to play in the Euroleague or in Europe, I guess he's going to be the Nuggets backup center this year because he does look awesome and I'm sure Nuggets fans are excited about that. So. Yeah. Germany versus Portland, Lithuania, Latvia, Serbia, Finland. That will be an interesting one. As I mentioned, to get into the round of 16 here and Turkey versus Sweden should be easy for Turkey. Now moving on to group C. It was fun ending here. Greece was able to take down Spain, so they win this division at 4. 1. Italy also 4 and 1. They finished second. Bosnia and Herzegovina finished third 3 and 2 and Georgia gets in at 2 and 3. While Spain eliminated because they lost to Greece here. And what was a free throw battle down the end where Spain just kept missing free throws along with Cyprus. Those two teams are eliminated here.
- [39:06]
B
Yeah. Spain eliminated before the knockout stage of Euro Basket. I think for the first time ever. That was pretty shocking.
- [39:13]
A
I mean, they're defending winners.
- [39:15]
B
Yeah.
- [39:16]
A
2022.
- [39:17]
B
The talent isn't what it used to be, for sure. They don't even play their NBA guys the entirety of the game. I thought their younger guards were kind of who brought them back into it in the fourth game, but. Or in the fourth quarter. But then when it came down to it, they missed four straight free throws while down four and just got lucky to keep even getting to the line with the way things were transpiring and couldn't knock it down. So a disappointing finish for them. Great win for Greece. Lucas making a huge layup late and then Giannis. Man, this guy's just dominant. It's like there are other big guys out there on the court, but when he's playing, he looks like he's playing literally higher than everybody else out there and anytime they get close, close to him, they just go flying as he goes in for a dunk. He had three guys on him all game and was still finding ways to score and then finding teammates as well.
- [40:07]
A
A monster out there. Yeah. The Yanis Vision Goggles were on to start this game. He was just firing it around because like you said, just guys all over him. Tyler Dorsey was, was hot. 14 points in the first quarter because Giannis was, was finding him. So that was fun. Giannis ended with nine assists as Spain came back with those kids that two 19 year olds playing at the end of this fourth quarter. So maybe the pendulum is swinging because it feels like, yes, Spain ain't the same team, although Rudy Fernandez is. He's hanging out in the crowd in this one. But the young guys hopefully are taking the torch here. Sergio De La Ra, I think, and Mario Saint. Superb. The two 19 year olds playing. That's a pretty cool name.
- [40:57]
B
Yeah, Super Mario. Very cool. He has no sideburns at all. He's got the cool mullet look that the youngsters are going with. And I think that that is the next step for Spain. They've got some decent big guys, they've got okay wings, but their guards I thought were pretty inexperienced and not that great up until the fourth quarter. But you know, they're only 19 years old. The next time we're talking about Eurobasket, maybe they're looking good again and looking like the same Spain team that we're used to seeing.
- [41:22]
A
Yeah, they were, they were kitties out there, but yeah, that Slukas that you mentioned, he's the opposite of a kid. He's an old man. But it was great to see him out there. The 35 year old. Him and Dorsy were starting in this backcourt and as we said last week, them in place of Nick Kathis and Thomas Walkup who were playing for them last year in the Olympics, that just wasn't right. These guys have taken, they've helped out big time. Just spacing the floor for Giannis. It was, it was interesting to see Giannis didn't play in the second game versus Cyprus because they, they rested him. They said, all right, we're playing Georgia tomorrow. We'll rest you against Cyprus. They won without him and it was just too quick a turnaround. 17 hour turnaround from end of game to the starting of the next game. So you sit. And then he missed the Bosnia game with knee discomfort and. And they lost that one. It was interesting to see at the end of that game because Yusuf Nurkic for the Bosnians had said in an interview, you know, you guard Giannis like you just give him space and it works. It used to work. And then Nurkic went up to Giannis after to talk to him, I guess about what he said, because that was making the headlines like, oh, it's, it's easy to Guardianus, essentially what it kind of was being twisted as. So Janice is going to dunk on his ass next season, I'm sure plenty of times. But it was fun watching Nurk get out there and, you know, he looked good, man. I mean, when they played Georgia, he was literally on the floor diving for balls. I just, I couldn't envision. I don't. I couldn't remember one moment. He did that last year for Charlotte.
- [43:05]
B
I can't remember one moment for Charlotte, period. But definitely not him diving on the ground. I think the way the Bosnian team is built is pretty interesting. Nurkic is their best player. He's their only NBA guy. But unlike a lot of these other teams that are in Euro basket, I don't feel like they play through Nurkic all the time. They're really balanced. Everybody touches the ball. In their win against Georgia, they had five guys in double figures, two more with nine points as well. So the ball just moves like Nurkic is their leading scorer. But it's not just we're giving him the ball and he's going to go to work. It's much more of a team based approach. And that was different, I thought, from the way the Georgian team played. They're trying to play through Mamu for the most part. Gogo was pretty much invisible, I thought, in the fourth quarter. So credit to Nurkic there. But you can tell that there's a little bit of chemistry at least for the Bosnian team that pulled them through after the Georgians made a comeback.
- [44:02]
A
Yeah, you're totally right. They weren't just playing through Nurkic. He looked like he could just play as a member of a team out there. He was definitely into it. So we'll see how he plays with the Utah Jazz next year. I definitely had to triple check.
- [44:16]
B
He's a Jazz. He's on the Jazz.
- [44:18]
A
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Traded for Colin Sexton. Had to remember that. That was a tough one. But yes, some fun broadcasters in this game as well. In the Bosnia Georgia game because the ATIC is the. How you spell the guy's name. I teach had a block on Shingalia. So the broadcaster said, attic goes to the attic. Or he said, I teach goes to the attic. He could have said to clean up the shingles because it was on Shingalia. You know, I'm just adding on. We're working here, but it was fun. Also. I will say just one thing about Italy seeing Salu Niang who was drafted by the Cleveland Cavaliers. They now have another Niang ain't George. It's Salu Niang. He was a second round pick. He's probably a stash guy for a year at least. He's 21, but he was really, really, really good for the Italian team. That was. That was a fun team to watch. Also fun. We had a Eurobasket wedgie and we've got to take credit for it being called a wedgie worldwide wide. Here it is.
- [45:23]
B
So Gelia wants it.
- [45:27]
A
Fires it up.
- [45:27]
B
Cuz of the shot clock and we get a wedgie is what I call that one. You got another term for it? It's the universal term. But they're lucky.
- [45:37]
A
That's the universal term.
- [45:39]
B
Hey, man, that's impact.
- [45:41]
A
Yeah, man.
- [45:42]
B
Literally. Hashtag, make your mark. We did it, buddy.
- [45:47]
A
We did it.
- [45:47]
B
Yeah. This is. This is a. A different continent and they can't even come up with other words for what this is called. It's called a wedgie now. There's not another word for a swish. You know, people don't call it a pure ball. So we. We've vanquished the neck ball and wedgie is all that remains.
- [46:07]
A
Yes. Ralph Lawler started it, but we took it worldwide. We are the pit bulls of NBA slang. We are international. We did it. All right now. Yes, baby. You get to see wedgie here on. On YouTube. Now I will say just to wrap up group C and take us into group D, the round of 16 games for these four teams that advanced in group C are going to be taking on the group D teams. It'll be Greece, Israel, Italy, Slovenia, Bosnia Herzegovina and Poland taking them on. And Georgia versus France. So it's going to be. It's going to be fun. So let's get to that Group D because it was. It was a good one. France winning the division 4 and 1, Poland was second. Bit of a surprise. 3 and 2, Slovenia 3 and 2 and Israel 3 and 2. So three teams ended. 3 and 2 is a tight division. Belgium did not advance. Iceland did not advance. It was fun, though, here on the last day to see Slovenia versus Israel. Luca dropped 37 and Denny dropped 34 in the same game. That's the best Denny game I think I've ever seen. He was just freaking awesome. While Slovenia started 0 and 2 and they won their last three. And before we get to breaking down what Luca looks like or what Denny looks like is Luca Magic. Luca magic. A good nickname for Luka Doncic. Like Luca magic. I mean, they kept saying on the broadcast. And I know it's. It's been said in the NBA, but I don't know, everybody sort of just looks for a nickname, I guess, for Luca just because they don't want to call him Luca. Yeah, the Don or whatever. But it just feels so. I think it's good, right?
- [47:48]
B
Not great. It seems a little low effort along the lines of, look, Nikola Jokic has J O K in his name. We're gonna call him Joker Doncic. It ends in ic that's pretty close to Magic. But some of the things he does is Magic, and I feel like it kind of plays off of Larry Legend in a way. Not to mention, just calling him Luca is a perfect nickname. He's got a great one name guy. So I would probably give Luca magic, like a seven and a half out of 10. You know, we could probably do better, but he's been around for so long and we haven't, so I think it's gonna stick.
- [48:21]
A
Yeah, I'm with you. Something else that sticks to me because I'm a sucker for blue jerseys as I wear this grease one here. You're. You're seeing a grown man in a jersey. If you're on YouTube, no sleeves needed. I will say the blue jerseys for Slovenia are freaking sweet. Now they got a couple blues. You can. You can dabble which type of blue you like. They. They pull them out, different ones each game, but there's some sweet jerseys that they pull out with patterns on them. Yeah, they look great. And Luca, I don't know, he's. Luca doesn't need to play in FIBA tab to be FIBA Luca. But he definitely. He's getting into these games and he's with his guys defensively and he's motivated, man. He just. He looks like he's going to be a. A tough game as we get to this weekend when they take on Italy.
- [49:15]
B
Yeah, Slovenia hasn't been super impressive to me as a team, but Luka has been awesome. I think he's at like 33 points a game, and he's pretty much unguardable in the NBA, and he seems to be just as unguardable here in the Eurobasket tournament. So they have like a 1% chance of beating anybody, including the best teams like Serbia and Germany. Just if he's having a great shooting game. He was into this game as if it was a game seven of the NBA Finals. Counting down, his made three at the end to put him at 39 points. He was great. Denny has been awesome. And this group, Group D has kind of Been about the individual performers for me. Luca first and foremost. Denny has been great, like I said. And then Jordan Lloyd, or as they're calling him for the Polish team, Jordan Lloydinski, this guy has been awesome. He's at like almost 30 points per game as well as their import kind of guy, naturalized citizen. And he has been the perimeter spark they need to fit in with everything else that they've got going on. So those three guys are like, I mean, we'll see who advances in the tournament before they. If and if they do, I assume they do name an all tournament team. I could see any of those three making it.
- [50:25]
A
Yeah, they get Poland gets Bosnia on Sunday, which will follow up with after all the games are done through sun Saturday and Sunday, likely a show on Sunday night. But that is a winnable game for them and they could advance to the quarterfinals for sure. But as you said, yeah, the individual performances here from Luca or Denny, I mean, Denny was literally stepped back in threes all day. No problem doing that. He just looks so good handling the ball. You know, he could be a primary ball handler at times or secondary the passes. He's doing it all out there. And even though he got, you know, he had a bad game from Roman Sorkin, who is their big guy, that he can dunk it, and Yamadar, who's usually a showman, the no looks behind the backs hang time, but he was, he was stinky out there. He wasn't himself. So this, this division and this type of tournament where it's one and done, you could see any of these teams advancing. When it comes to the Saturday Sunday games, which again for these teams in this division, it's France moving on, no problem. They'll take on Georgia, you know, which is not going to be easy. Poland, Bosnia, Slovenia versus Italy and Israel versus Greece, which will be a banger, there's no doubt this weekend. Anything else on this D group here?
- [51:52]
B
I think I'm out of D group. Notes.
- [51:54]
A
Yeah. Just to say, just to say because it's. It happened. Gershon Yabuzeli dropped 36 versus Poland and he had six threes. I mean, that's a freaking huge, huge number. And watching Israel, they can play really, really good D. So against the Greek team, they may probably just copy what they did against France to beat them. They had a fourth quarter, they won 27:13 just because they were playing zone. And that's what you do against Giannis. So we will see how they perform this weekend. I think that's it. We shall be back. Most Likely on Sunday and then after the quarterfinals, games on Wednesday, then the semifinals games on Friday and the finals on Sunday. So that's our sched. And just so you know, we've been dropping some stuff. Trey made a great list of Mellow's 10 best games of his career. Which highlight why this dude is a hall of famer. This was fun.
- [52:55]
B
I gotta come clean. There's more than 10 games in here.
- [53:00]
A
I saw that comment.
- [53:00]
B
Yeah, yeah. So sorry. Sorry for giving you extra games about a guy who's good at making basketball shots. So he played like 1200. I don't know. There's probably like 15 in here. At least one, one. One of the games is four months worth of games, so who knows.
- [53:19]
A
Ah, that's true. Yeah. Yeah. Also, our Jurassic Pals continues. We watch Jurassic World, Fallen Kingdom. Of course we did. That's dropping tomorrow, Friday, September 5th. Did I like that one? I guess nobody did. I mean, it's all post one. Post one. They all blend together. Not all of them.
- [53:45]
B
This one's. This one in. It's called Jurassic World, Fallen Kingdom. But for me it's called Jurassic World. Dino in a house. That's just how you got to remember. You got to remember, like one interesting thing that happened. The dinosaur goes in the house.
- [53:59]
A
Yeah. And they. That's the. Where they break through the glass at the end, right?
- [54:02]
B
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You know. You know the. The Indoraptor, I believe it's called? It's triggered by a gun. Spoiler alert. You can aim it. You can aim a thing, and somebody bought it for $48 million, even though it was just a prototype.
- [54:19]
A
So that drops tomorrow on Friday. You know, drop us a. Like, if you're in that kind of mood, drop us a review. If you're in that kind of mood. Join us. We'll be back here on Sunday live on the tubes or get it as a podcast afterwards. But for now, Clipper Bros. You heard it here first.
- [54:38]
B
Have a great time. Turn up. Love you guys. Awesome. Thanks for joining us. And remember, wedgie is the universal term for wedgie.
- [54:46]
A
Very nice. Nice then. Threw that at you. Didn't know if you had a quote, but that's the quote.
- [54:52]
B
I had a second one. Pass. Throw it at me again.
- [54:54]
A
Okay, for now, are we gonna do Clipper Bros. Again or just.
- [54:58]
B
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [54:59]
A
Run it back.
- [54:59]
B
Do Clipper Bros. Again.
- [55:00]
A
Clipper Bros. You heard it here first.
- [55:02]
B
Have a great time. Turn up. Love you guys. Awesome. Thanks for joining us. And remember, no, baby Tassie, it's Daddy. Kirby.
- [55:18]
A
Sa.