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- [00:00]
Skeet
I'm not saying I'm obsessed with basketball, but my neighbors definitely know when there's a new doc on prime video because I yell at the TV like I'm coaching the team. And with Amazon Prime, I can always count on fast free delivery when ordering a mini hoop, ankle socks, and three different headbands because style matters even when you're missing layups. Prime is my coach, my hype man, and my gear guy all in one. Whatever you're into, it's on Prime. Visit Amazon.comprime to get more out of whatever you're into. When pro defensive end Cam Jordan isn't running after quarterbacks, he's running his own businesses. He sat down with Microsoft's Jessica Hawke to learn how AI can help.
- [00:44]
Tass
As a football player, we're really focused on the X's and Nos. It's fun because it's a strategy game as well, and I think that transitions well into the business world.
- [00:52]
Trey
There's so much data underlying every single.
- [00:54]
Tass
Thing that you're doing in your business.
- [00:55]
Trey
And having a way to unify all that data.
- [00:58]
Tass
This is like electricity.
- [00:59]
Trey
This is a major platform shift, and I think we're all learning together.
- [01:02]
Skeet
Ready to raise your AI game? Find your winning edge at Microsoft.com challengers.
- [01:11]
Tass
Race the Rudders. Race the sails. Race the sails.
- [01:15]
Skeet
Captain, an unidentified ship is approaching. Over. Roger, wait.
- [01:19]
Tass
Is that an enterprise sales solution?
- [01:22]
Skeet
Reach sales professionals, not professional sailors. With LinkedIn ads, you can target the.
- [01:28]
Tass
Right people by industry, job title, and more. We'll even give you a $100 credit.
- [01:33]
Skeet
On your next campaign.
- [01:34]
Trey
Get started today at LinkedIn.com results, terms and conditions apply.
- [01:44]
Tass
Hot dog. Toilet. Hot dog. Toilet. There's a hot dog in the toilet.
- [01:53]
Skeet
And he's been watching you.
- [01:55]
Tass
Show. Good morning, sweet world, and welcome to the no Dunks podcast, presented by Amazon Prime. It's Thursday, June 12, 2025. I'm JD Skeets here in the classic factory and alongside me, as always, Tas Melis.
- [02:15]
Skeet
Basketball lovers, this is for you.
- [02:18]
Tass
Next to him, it's the bearded one. My top shot, hot boy, Trey.
- [02:20]
Skeet
Kirby Ayo.
- [02:21]
Tass
Hey, yo. And over yonder, making the magic happen, super producer jd.
- [02:26]
Skeet
Hello.
- [02:26]
Tass
There he is. Here we are. If you like NBA basketball, hit the like button. If you're an NBA sicko, subscribe. And if you're a podcast listener, you know what to do. Five star ratings and reviews.
- [02:39]
Trey
There we go.
- [02:39]
Tass
How about the boys? All right.
- [02:40]
Skeet
Levels. There's levels to this.
- [02:41]
Tass
We got a fun podcast lined up here. We got Great Game three to talk about. So Much to unpack from this one. And a little later, we're gonna rank the five potential landing spots for a Kevin Durant trade. Shams gave us the list yesterday.
- [02:57]
Trey
It's gonna be a long podcast.
- [03:00]
Tass
It's gonna be a long one. We're gonna make up for that 35 minute podcast we had earlier in the week. Was that earlier in the week or last week? I can't remember anymore.
- [03:06]
Trey
I think it was this week. It's hard to tell with how rarely they're playing NBA games right now. But it wasn't our fault.
- [03:13]
Tass
No, it wasn't yesterday. We did an hour podcast yesterday, dude.
- [03:16]
Skeet
Oh, yeah? Yeah.
- [03:19]
Trey
Literally.
- [03:19]
Tass
It was after game two. It was after game two.
- [03:21]
Skeet
When was Monday, I guess. Yeah, the show was Monday.
- [03:23]
Trey
The show was. The show was Monday.
- [03:25]
Skeet
Don't worry, Blur.
- [03:26]
Trey
When it's close, the podcast is long.
- [03:29]
Tass
That's right.
- [03:31]
Trey
And look, word of advice.
- [03:33]
Tass
The Indiana Pacers will not go away after being outplayed in game two of the finals. The Pacers took it to the Thunder in game three last night. Good old Canadian boy, Benedict Matheran scoring 27 points off the bench. Tyrese Halliburton flirting. Oh, yeah, really flirting with a triple double. And the Pacers retook the lead in the finals with the 116, 107 victory. It was the Pacers best offensive game and best defensive game of the series. And you can take your thunder and five predictions and rip them up, which was like 90% of people out there. Indeed, because we got a series here. And what a game task. Who do you want to start with? Yeah, from the Indiana side.
- [04:14]
Skeet
I want to start with TJ McConnell, but not just because of the steals, but I think he was the one who got Benedict Matheran. He was the one who initiated a lot of that to get him to 27 points, which they needed every single one. The Beginning of the second quarter, Ben McMatharoon got the ball, didn't really start anything. It went back to TJ McConnell, who set up Pascal Siakam for a nice score. Then immediately, here comes the first McConnell steal. He steals the ball and is able to give it to Benedict Matheran right under the rim for a one foot layup. So he just sees a nice little practice layup. He sees one go through. A minute later, Benedict Matheran gets the ball, just has the time to dribble into the mid range. Chad Holman gives him too much space. He just lines up a shot. It goes down. TJ McConnell a minute later, is able to push it after A make after a make. He pushes it as hard as he can, he gives it to Benedict Matheran in the corner. Another three, another shot made. That's seven points in a mere three minutes for Benedict Matheran. And he just got it rolling and rolling and rolling. And obviously TG McConnell was amazing. And his second steal that he made when he put it off Kayson Wallace. Now was he stepping out of bounds when the ball hit Case when he was throwing it at Casen Wallace? Yeah, maybe that was a very, very tough call to make if he was out of bounds. But either way, yeah, the five steals add up. But listen, it was a four point game for the Thunder in the fourth quarter. I mean, this was not over. But McConnell kept on frickin doing it. And he shook Shea. He had a one foot shot after shaking Shea. Shay went for the block, wins a four point game. McConnell missed a one footer. He missed a very close shot. But then Benedict Matheran, he had a monster hand on the ball to get it to Ben Shepard for an open bucket. Not Ben Shepard, he looks like Ben Shepard for a second out there, but Andrew Nevard for an easy bucket. So Matheran was just there doing other things. And he, he had to, he had to have that dribble trickle down effect of, of T.J. mcConnell just doing everything. And then there's the T.J. mcConnell steal from Alex Caruso inbounding the ball. I've never thought I would say Alex Caruso had a bad game because he did so many good things. But this might be a bad Alex Caruso game. Gave it to T.J. mcConnell. And then even Shea goes to the line at the other side, makes a second free throw. And the Pacers run. They just run. And the Thunder made a mistake. They just gave Benedict Matheran too much space. Bang shot. Another Thunder mistake. Bang. Too much space. So they trickle down, man, the TJ McConnell hustling, gave it to Benedict Matheran. And then you could see it happening. Obi Toppin comes in. No Alex Caruso or Chet Holmgren box out. Bang. Another huge dunk. So the trickle down effect of the T.J. mcConnell speed. He was a demon out there, there's no doubt about that. Dad was happy. He met granddad in the hallway after the game, which was super cool. Pascal Siakam giving love to TJ McConnell's granddad.
- [07:12]
Tass
I now know every member of the McConnell family over the last week or so. Sorry, Mitch for sure. But yeah, McConnell Matheran helping Indy have a 49 to 18 edge in bench points. TJ statline 10 points, five assists, five steals in like 15 minutes. I did love that. I guess it was his last of his 3. 3 steals where he got it on the inbounds where he just put on like the cloak of invisibility. Crusoe was like. He was like he wasn't there. Just went up, snatched it out of the air, put it back in, tied it up. And then Matheren was even better as the reserve. 27 points on ridiculous efficiency.
- [07:48]
Trey
TK I can't deny it. I felt like I was cooking yesterday. My two keys to the game were Benedict Matheran and Obi Toppin, and they both played awesome in this one. 27 points in 22 minutes for Ben Matheran, only 22 years old, plus four rebounds. Like you're saying he was contributing at least as much as he could outside of scoring and then scoring incredibly well. Two three pointers, seven for eight at the free throw line. He's a good driver. And the Thunder were not able to keep him out of the lane. T.J. mcConnell, kind of the same thing. Crossovers getting inside that one footer was weird. He kind of dropped the ball right at the end. Somebody must got a hand on it. But the Thunder needed that rebound. They couldn't get it. And Mhard knocks down a tough shot. Nobody practices a 16 footer from the state of Indiana logo right there. He caught it on a tip out, knocked it down, and then like you're saying, steal right away. That was the turning point in the game. Unless you consider the turning point in the game the second quarter when the bench checked in Cuz Shakel just out or I'm sorry, Halliburton went out 32 to 24. When Halliburton came out, when he came back in 37 to 36 for Indiana and it was Mahen, it was McConnell, it was Obie Toppen running the court. Obie was good again in the fourth quarter. Allowed Pascal Siakam to sit for quite some time. Had that great sequence where he came to the lane with the tip dunk, put Indiana up seven. Then on the defensive end, he's involved in the pick and roll with.
- [09:10]
Tass
J Dub.
- [09:10]
Trey
Yeah, exactly. Got switched on to J Dub, stuck with him, blocked him at the rim. They just made so many plays in the fourth quarter. Meanwhile, the Thunder looks totally gassed in the fourth quarter. They had one basket in the last 5 minutes and 58 seconds of this game. I think a lot of that was Indiana's defense really packing the paint. Also, OKC wasn't trusting their jumpers at all so they were over penetrating, driving into Miles Turner. Miles Turner, what a weird game for this guy. Really struggled through three quarters. We found out he was sick afterwards. I think he was 2 for 10 through the first three quarters. Only one basket in the fourth. That patient drive where he gets down into the lane on Chet and finishes at the rim. That was good. But then three blocks, including that awesome sequence where he stops a pick and roll, then gets out to Chet to block his three pointer. It gets back to Chet, he tries to drive in and then just gets engulfed in the lane by Miles Turner. So the Pacers, they did awesome. You know, we say role players play better at home and that's exactly what happened in this game. But I think this is such an impressive win by Indiana. It's the first time I really feel like they can win the finals here because they won this one with defense. They were 9 for 27 from 3. I mean, Halliburton was awesome. Kind of ridiculous we took this long to get to Tyrese Halliburton, but he was really good in this one. Aggressive from the start. Five mid range attempts in the first half. He had five in the first halves of the first two games combined. So he was looking to score, he was looking to do a lot more. They got Siakam involved early, unleashed him as well. He finally got busy in transition. And then the defense that they brought in the second half, the Pacers, they were putting two on the ball on Shai. Pick and rolls. They were a lot smarter doubling him when he was down in the post. Obi Toppin was really good there as well. Shea was exhausted by the end of this game and that's why you see a lot of mental mistakes from him giving up an offensive rebound to Halliburton. There's that play where Siakam gets the run out, Seals Shea underneath and Shea, super lazy defense tries to tip it from behind. Easy layup for Siakam. I thought the Pacers pace really outdid the Thunder in this one. You could tell in the third quarter the Thunder were getting tired. Anytime they would go down with the foul, they're laying on the ground for 20 seconds and you see their ribs.
- [11:17]
Tass
Yeah.
- [11:18]
Trey
Looking like JD's dog when he comes in from outside. Yeah, it was crazy. They were huffing and puffing and that's why they got outscored 32 to 18 in the fourth.
- [11:25]
Tass
Yeah, I did feel in watching this game three like the first time all series that the Pacers had like taken off the OKC handcuffs or at Least loosen them a little bit because they did have, like, rhythm going. A lot of it was their defense, like turning into some easier offense. But the ball was zipping. They were letting threes fly. Big. Part of it again is Halliburton. He was aggressive from the jump. He was looking, he was taking his little mid range floater. He was letting the three go. Obviously still playmaking and all that. And it was just like, whoa. They actually look like a lot of the Pacers games we've seen throughout the postseason and a lot of the regular season, really. And this is the first time in the finals where it felt like, oh, yeah, they're playing Pacers ball right now and you know, you're at home, crowds going berserk. Like, I was sweating during this game. I have no dog in this race. I can't lose. There's Canadians on both sides. We're coming out with a championship. But I was like so tense because it felt just like the basketball was intense. They're playing their asses off. You talk about the exhaustion where the Pacers did have more left in the tank at the end. And I was like, it's one of those games where you're like, I want to get a basketball in my hand. That's all I want to do. Like go back to being a kid when it's like that exciting. So what a great game.
- [12:34]
Skeet
You and Reggie Miller. You and Reggie Miller must have been sweating. We'll get to the photo of him in a sweater and a jersey courtside, clapping for everybody. Everybody. And looking extremely tanned as well. So maybe sweating from the sun, but all of that to be said, the Thunders made some mistakes down the stretch. You know, when. When we saw that last McConnell steal. And it ended up Shea went to the free throw line. He had a second free throw, and then he was the one guarding on the perimeter as the Pacers brought the ball up. And I was kind of puzzled by that. She on. On ball defense when he was obviously gassed. You had Lou Dort sitting in the corner when those guys could have swapped positions. And that ended up being the Matheran three there, you know, midway through the fourth because Shea gave him a lot of space. I was a little confused by why Shea would be on the ball in that situation. Didn't really make a heck of a lot of sense to me. I mean, a minute later, the Pacers push again. Halliburton with the ball. Wallace goes under the screen. Hartenstein doesn't go out. Pacers score again for another shot. So I was A little, little confused by those little mistakes. And they all added up to the. Hey, what's going on here? Why doesn't anyone box out? Obi Toppin. I mean every, it was a great trickle down effect of every single role player. I'll be toppin comes in. Miles Turner had those bad three quarters and then boom, boom. You could see he was one who sucked the life out of Chad Holmgren. Being able to block him multiple times down the stretch.
- [14:00]
Tass
When he blocked his three pointer and then Holmgren like sort of panicked because he's like, he got it back. I know the shot clock was going down, but he could have made a player, given it up maybe to a guard. But he had tried to attack Turner off the dribble, got stonewalled again. But it's like I was like thinking, in all honesty, how many times has Chet Holmgren had a three pointer blocked in his life? It's gotta be like a handful of times. And this is like a high stake, big pressure game. Great play again with a weird Turner game where it's like there was times I'm like, oh, Turner. I mean he's clanking these threes like he's getting good looks. This guy's like gone ice cold for them, but obviously stuck with it. Carlisle goes to him defensive purposes, he makes a big play. And then I wanted to bring up another defensive play from a guy who I keep saying is probably the best conditioned athlete in the league or one of them. Siakam. It was still a six point game. There was like a minute 30 to go. SGA brought it up. Siakam got switched onto him and he like stayed with him on the first attempt to drive. SGA does his little step back, tries to pump fake him. He stayed down, stayed disciplined, didn't bite on it. SGA had to give up the ball. Got it right back. And Zakam played defense like a hard ass defense for another like whatever. It was 10 seconds, tough, tough jumper. Like he was all over him. He's obviously a lot taller. And then they. And then he screams the other way and score. And that was sort of like the ice the game to me. Right?
- [15:16]
Trey
That was when she gave up on.
- [15:17]
Tass
Yeah, exactly. But that was what awesome defense in like, you know, 47 minutes into this game. That's high intensity. And he was like down like looking like Kevin Garnett, like, let's go mvp. Like, I'm going to stop you here. That was awesome too, along with the Turner block.
- [15:30]
Trey
Yeah, Siakam was great in this game. They made it A point to get him involved really early. He scored the first six points for the Pacers and they were smart about getting him the ball on one side of the court, posting him up anytime he had a mismatch. They got him the ball a lot of the time. Siakam likes to play at the free throw line so he can go either way. That's not as smart against the Thunder. Then they can just double from either side of the court. When he's playing on one side, he knows where it's going to come from. He's able to score. And then he was actually getting some transition points at definitely felt like this was the first time the Pacers felt a freedom of movement in this series. And that was just really, really impressive. Shay's gonna have to play better in the clutch this series. He hasn't had a good clutch series so far. The Pacers have obviously won the two close games in the series and Shea really hasn't been a factor. I thought he was pretty non existent, really down the stretch. He made that jump shot with what, maybe three and a half seconds, three and a half minutes left. I think he took one shot afterwards and it was just standing in the corner. It was J Dub. Jdub was awesome in the second half. I thought he played a great game. You know, the Pacers were doing a good job of getting the ball out of Shai's hands for sure. Nemhard was all over him when he didn't have the ball, but also they got to get him the ball. He's got to make some shots. If he makes the shot at the end of game one, Halliburton doesn't even get a chance. This guy's the mvp. He's held to a high standard and this was his first bad game in this series at least. But I thought this was a pretty inconsequential game from sga. He got completely taken out by the pace of the game. A lot of that is because there's a lot of reliance on Shai and on J Dub. There's nobody else who's really going to make a play for the Thunder. So it was all on those guys taking turns. J Dub was able to be successful. Shai was not.
- [17:12]
Skeet
Yeah, Holmgren tried to be that guy at times, but Miles Turner got the best of. I thought the strategy of taking Shay out of the game with full court pressure must have tired him out to some degree. Whether it was Nemhard Nismith just pressuring him every single time. And as I said, you could have moved him off the ball defensively at times, I think that would have been the thing to do. But, yeah, they lost his minutes by three points, and they lost his minutes on the bench by six points.
- [17:40]
Tass
And in the fourth quarter, sga, three points, one of three shooting to illustrate your point, tk and even that, even that one he hit, if you go back and watch that, that was nem hard. Making it hell, like, you know, taking the hits, obviously still challenging. It was a great shot from sga. It was not easy by any means. It was taxing. So, like, even the one he hits in the fourth was like, oh, God, I had to really work for those two points because that's just a credit to like. That was an amazing defensive performance from all of those guys. They were on a string. They obviously, the pressure, like you said, picking up full court. And it seemed to have an effect, at least the tiring of OKC and SGA as the game went on.
- [18:16]
Skeet
Yeah, it sure seemed like it. And whether or not it was just going home and doing this one time, we will see game four if they can do it again. But still, the bet makers have the Pacers as the underdog. They're still the underdog. And it's hard not to think about this team like the 2011 Dallas Mavericks, especially watching Benedict Matheran drop it. Like Jason Terry out there. That was 27 points off the bench, the most scored by a reserve in the finals game since Jason Terry in 2011 when he was awesome. And, yeah, those Mavs teams were kind of, you know, sort of a flip of the coin in terms of being a favorite in the first series against the Blazers, just like the Pacers were against the Bucks. Then they were the underdog against the Lakers in the second series, like the Pacers against the Cavs. Third series against the Thunder, like the Pacers against the Knicks. Many people taking the Knicks. Not everybody. Many people taking the Knicks. And then in the finals against the Heat, the Mavs again were the underdog. So here we are. The Mavs won that series four games to two. Whoa, whoa. Are we saying that the Pacers can win the next two games in this series? Game four is obviously. It's everything, baby. It is. It's the whole series.
- [19:28]
Tass
Friday night.
- [19:29]
Skeet
Friday night.
- [19:30]
Tass
We'll have a show on Saturday here from the Classic Factory.
- [19:32]
Trey
Only one day off.
- [19:33]
Tass
One day. Yes, thank you. Yeah, I know. Yes, exactly. Let's keep the good times rolling here.
- [19:38]
Skeet
I'm not saying I'm obsessed with basketball, but my neighbors definitely know when there's a new Docker on Prime Video because I yell at the TV like I'm coaching the team. And with Amazon Prime, I can always count on fast free delivery when ordering a mini hoop, ankle socks and three different headbands because style matters even when you're missing layups. Amazon Music that's my pump up playlist for driveway dunks and imaginary crowd cheers. Prime is my coach, my hype man and and my gear guy all in one. Whatever you're into, it's on Prime. Visit Amazon.com prime to get more out of whatever you're into. Prime One membership endless assists I'm not.
- [20:24]
Trey
Trying to brag, but I just got a daybed for my porch and I can already tell my outside space game has been changed. Sitting, snoozing. I'm doing it all and I'm doing it outside. Because when the weather turns nice, a brave man likes to feel nature on his face. Wayfair's got everything you need to level up your outdoor space. They have patio sets and lounge chairs, outdoor bars and hot tubs, fire pits, gazebos, and of course, daybeds. No matter your decor style, Wayfair is an easy one stop shop where you can get a resort feel without a resort price tag. You want a gazebo? Wayfair's got it. You want some Adirondack chairs? Wayfair's Gotem? From pergolas to planters, Wayfair's huge selection of outdoor items makes it easy to find exactly what's right for you. Wayfair makes it easy to tackle your summer home goals with endless inspiration for every space and budget. Plus you get free and easy delivery. Even on the big stuff. Wayfair will literally ship you a hot tub or a trampoline for free. That's crazy. Don't wait. Make your outdoor space your dream oasis today with Wayfair and enjoy it all summer long. Head to Wayfair.com right now to shop a huge outdoor selection that's W A Y F A I R.com Wayfair Every style, Every Home.
- [21:49]
Skeet
When pro defensive end Cam Jordan isn't running after quarterbacks, he's running his own businesses. He sat down with Microsoft's Jessica Hawke to learn how AI can help.
- [21:58]
Tass
As a football player, we're really focused on the X's and Nos. It's fun because it's a strategy game as well, and I think that transitions well into the business world.
- [22:06]
Trey
There's so much data underlying every single.
- [22:08]
Tass
Thing that you're doing in your business.
- [22:09]
Trey
And having a way to unify all that data.
- [22:12]
Tass
This is like electricity.
- [22:14]
Trey
This is a major platform shift and I think we're all learning together.
- [22:17]
Skeet
Ready to raise your AI game? Find your winning edge at Microsoft.com challengers.
- [22:28]
Tass
I will say though to that I saw a stat going around like the lower seeded team in the finals over the last very long time if they're up 21 have not actually won the series. Now it is a little funny because I think in the last two incidences they were the warriors teams with Steph Curry. It was the 22 finals where they're down two one. Then we have the Steph Curry game four and they obviously come back. And then it was the 2015 Finals back when the Cavs were up 2:1. That's obviously the start sort of of the warriors dynasty, if you want to call it that, or their really great run. And they came back. Now this is not the warriors, but Thunder, a great team and I don't think that's why I think they are still the favorites here. But yeah, it comes down to game four. They were in the same position against the Nuggets. They were down two one.
- [23:09]
Skeet
Yep, yep.
- [23:10]
Tass
With a huge game four and obviously got that to seven and to win it. But man, like as long as the basketball is just like these teams are just playing so damn hard. And there was a stretch at the end of the first half, I guess it was where obviously Indy goes into locker room up 4. But it was like the playmaking from all of the stars was like amazing to watch. Sga, he had a stretch where he just took over the game. Little small, little window there. At the end of the first half, J Dub started attacking the rim. Halliburton started hitting floaters. He was hitting a three. Siakam was scoring in transition off an OKC make. He tried to dunk on J Dub, you know he didn't, but he gave it a go. It was like all of the stars were like going here. And then in the start of second half, I have to admit, after an awesome first half from Indy, their bench all contributing, them having the lead, I was like, holy crap. It felt like they outplayed the hell out of OKC. They're only up four. And then what happens at the start of the second half? It was like an immediate 60 run for OKC. J Dub drived and scored. J Dub drive again. Big bump on Niecemith. He went flying, he hit a jumper and then SGA went left, stop popped, hit his jumper. Timeout from Indy because you know he had Siaka missed a Bunny Turner missed a wide open corner three. There was. The first play was SGA blocking me, Smith. And I was like, oh, it didn't look good again. I know. I keep doing it with Indiana. I was like, oh, man, they've played so well here. But the Thunder took the punch and they're going to roll now, especially because JDub's got it going. But nope. Then we got to the bench, coming back for the Pacers and completely flipping the game once again.
- [24:37]
Skeet
Yeah. Going to the fourth quarter though, it felt like both teams were exchanging punches and OKC was still up four points.
- [24:45]
Tass
I know.
- [24:45]
Skeet
I mean until, you know, the. The McConnell shake of Shay and then end up getting the offensive rebound to have a four point run there to tie the game. But the first few minutes of the fourth quarter, I thought both of the benches, both of the role players were awesome. I mean, Shay's on the bench. Benedict Matheran, double screen, the spin and one. Beautiful. Then Kayson Wallace across his body, hitting a shot, going the different direction. McConnell scores at the rim. Isaiah Hartenstein, a running layup. Didn't expect that to happen. Benedict Mathurin with a beautiful lefty. TJ McConnell.
- [25:18]
Tass
That was pretty too.
- [25:19]
Skeet
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Awesome. Then TJ McConnell steal and he throws it out of bounds. Now we gotta review that. Did it go out of bounds? Off the Pacers, off the Thunder. What?
- [25:27]
Tass
That was a weird one.
- [25:28]
Trey
Just. That was a terrible call. That's one you're really upset if you're the Thunder, you're like, we have to use a challenge for this.
- [25:33]
Skeet
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [25:34]
Trey
I mean, it didn't end up mattering at all, but.
- [25:36]
Tass
No, but it was like it was not even close.
- [25:38]
Trey
It was brutal. Richard Jefferson was like, what? That's one of the worst reviews we have ever seen.
- [25:43]
Skeet
Yeah, yeah. And then Shea set an off ball screen for that homegrown cut where Caruso passed it to him. Pacers shot clock violation again. OKC's still up four. So their bench performed.
- [25:53]
Tass
I know.
- [25:53]
Skeet
And then boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. The Pacers bench was monstrous. McConnell slash Matheran. Those two dudes. Yeah, I mean, the math. There's pretty place. Just pretty, pretty place.
- [26:05]
Tass
Mathura enjoying a pretty impressive list here. Players this century to score 25 plus points in a finals game when they're 22 or younger. Because, man, this guy is still very young. Mathurin, Kawhi Leonard, LeBron James, Tony Parker.
- [26:19]
Trey
Kobe Bryant, hall of Famer, you're saying?
- [26:22]
Tass
I guess so, baby. Wow, what a game. And you're right. You were talking about he's got a. He is the one guy that can create and load those ones that you just went through. Tass a couple of those at the start of the fourth quarter. Keeping them alive. Tough shots like both that left hand layup over. Over guys in that one where he spun and hit the little fade away big shots.
- [26:40]
Skeet
I'm giving all the credit to TJ for getting them going in the second.
- [26:43]
Tass
They went hand in hand. No doubt. Obviously the spark plug energy of TJ McConnell. But Matheran, the one scoring.
- [26:51]
Trey
Matheran carried him. And then like you said specifically that.
- [26:53]
Tass
That 32nd OB top and takeover where it's like big defensive rebound, huge put back dunk or his head's like a foot above the rim. And then the big block, it was like that was like in a 30 second window, but it was like instrumental in this victory.
- [27:06]
Trey
They made all the plays as they have for their entire playoff run here. Meanwhile, I thought OKC was just lacking attention to detail. 19 turnovers on the game. They missed seven free throws, allowed seven offensive rebounds for the Pacers looking in the fourth quarter, kind of a microcosm of the game. Five turnovers, four missed free throws. When they were trying to come back, like the game was kind of there for them to steal, you know, because the Pacers for whatever reason just kept fouling the thunder really quick, like sending them to the line. And J Dub was missing. They kept missing three offensive rebounds and yeah, they just could not trust their shots. And they were going into four or five guys just waiting for him in the lane.
- [27:49]
Skeet
Yeah, yeah, I think we can question the officials. I know we've got a call that we'll get to a little bit later. But I do think the officials definitely treated the, the home team as the home team a little bit. I mean, Chad specifically Chet Holmgren getting fouled twice when it was debatable as to whether or not he was going up for a shot attempt and it was deemed that he was on the floor twice. I thought those were odd calls. Then you get into, yeah, the Benedict Matheran getting into the lane. Jalen Williams kind of didn't foul him. I think I'm calling that one right where Alex Caruso throws his hand up. They give him an and one situation there in the middle of the lane. Anyway, all that to say.
- [28:31]
Tass
The story of this final at all though. I mean that's why it's been, you know, they are letting them play a lot, a lot more physicality and yeah, I mean obviously we say all the time, not an easy job. But I don't think it's like, no, it's not.
- [28:43]
Skeet
Oh, God, it is.
- [28:43]
Tass
Ruined it. And why are we talking about them now?
- [28:45]
Skeet
He plays harder, gets the calls. That's just how it goes.
- [28:48]
Tass
I think JD does have the one clip that people are going, whoa. This was interesting after they reviewed it and kept the call as was. But it was the fourth quarter. It was like 235 left. Caruso, awesome steal on Halliburton. Now they are running out of time here, so it needs to be sort of perfect from here on out for OKC to come back. But you see him on the fast break. He's ahead of Neesmith. Niecemith from behind with the two arms down, sort of across the shoulder, into the arms, and then I guess even into the Dickens there at the end. And it was called a foul, of course, but reviewed it and a lot of people thought broadcast included, you know, this might be a flagrant. You know, they might get two shots here on the ball back and again, they. They would need that. That would help their chances come back in the end. It's old James Capers coming over looking into the camera telling us, you know, no wind up, no follow through, lots of contact. But that sort of was his explanation. TK I'll start with you. Did they get this one wrong or at least you shocked that they didn't give that a flagrant one?
- [29:47]
Trey
I was more surprised than anything. I thought for sure this was going to be a flagrant. I thought there was wind up. Maybe not as much follow through, though. I'll say. Like Neesmith goes to wrap him up. This is not a basketball play. Yeah, Caruso is jumping at the rim already when he gets wrapped up, but he does kind of try and save it, you know, like, he's not malicious about the way he goes down. He doesn't land on top of Caruso or anything like that. So I don't know. They woke Steve Javi up after a three hour nap.
- [30:16]
Tass
Hey, Steve.
- [30:17]
Trey
Steve, we haven't talked to you for two games. He's just been hanging out in the replay center. He comes in there like, nah, this is not a. This is not going to be a flagrant call. And he was right. Breen couldn't believe it. R.J. couldn't believe it. But Chicken Piccata himself, James Capers comes to the score. He's the most delicious ref out there and made the call. So, like, I think that that's probably a regular season flagrant foul, but I'm happy with that being a hard Playoff foul. That looks like a hard playoff foul.
- [30:48]
Tass
What do you think? Were you shocked?
- [30:52]
Skeet
Oh, I've got something for my child to watch. She's gonna love that. You said chicken piccata. That's what she loves eating. Chicken picada. She loves capers some way somehow.
- [31:00]
Tass
Wow.
- [31:00]
Skeet
Didn't know it'd be past which.
- [31:02]
Tass
Which girl? Oh, okay.
- [31:05]
Skeet
Capers.
- [31:05]
Tass
Amazing.
- [31:06]
Skeet
They were debating on the desk as to what is a wind up. That was the funny part about the broadcasting. Like, well, how much of the wind up was it? And I was surprised to hear Javi come on, you know, before Capers makes the call and say, nah, nah, nah, I'm not doing that in the playoffs. We're not calling that a flagrant now. You're right in that he wasn't going for the basketball. He was going for bod. He was going for the body.
- [31:28]
Tass
So it wasn't a block trying to stop a dunk.
- [31:30]
Skeet
Yeah. And he did hold him and he did get him below the belt for sure. I don't know. It was, Was it three minutes left in this game?
- [31:39]
Tass
It was like two and a half.
- [31:39]
Skeet
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [31:40]
Tass
So, I mean, it was important. If they had called a flagrant, they would have again, I think it would have still been pretty far fetched for OKC to come back and win the game. I thought the pace was playing better. They looked well, you know, more conditioned. They had gas still left in the tank. But they would have had two free throws in the ball. So it would have been a chance to make it. Well, I guess you could have got it to like a four point game.
- [31:58]
Skeet
Yeah. Caruso made it a six point game with two free throws. But they could have had the ball. I, I need to know. More importantly, I was, I was okay with them not calling it with two and a half minutes left because Caruso was fine, but he was lying on the ground. I need to know why was he lying on the ground. Was it the arms or was it the shot to the penis?
- [32:16]
Tass
Well, that's, that's my frustration with it. Okay, first off, that's an OKC that is guaranteed call the flagrant one foul. So, you know, whatever. That's home cooking. I get it. The other part is, and this is, drives me nuts is Caruso did lie on the ground. I think he's tired. He did sort of say at one point, like, ah, my back hurts. Maybe it was just from landing on it. He sort of like reached at it. But like, because he was not injured, I think they were like, he's okay. He's ready to shoot the free throws. Let's go. And it's like. It's like almost. I hate to say this, but it was like, it's almost in your best interest if you really are trailing in a game late and you want to get those. That flagrant to get the free throws and the ball back. It's like, man, you gotta act like you just got shot, man. Like, you gotta really sell it, because I think it's more likely than they call it.
- [33:00]
Skeet
He was lying on the ground for a while.
- [33:02]
Tass
Yeah.
- [33:02]
Trey
But, like, think if he's holding his groin.
- [33:05]
Tass
I mean, that's my point is I hate when they do that. But that's why, to me, that was a flagger. One foul.
- [33:11]
Trey
It does seem like had they called it a flagrant, we wouldn't even talk about it.
- [33:15]
Skeet
Right.
- [33:15]
Trey
Everybody be like, oh, yeah, yeah, but it's June, baby.
- [33:20]
Tass
Yes, it is June. Yes.
- [33:22]
Skeet
That's why I'm okay with not calling it. It's June.
- [33:25]
Tass
Okay. Anything else from the game? I know we have more. More random notes, but anything game specific or moving ahead in this series that you want to address before we get to it?
- [33:35]
Skeet
I mean, quickly. Tyrese Halburn hitting a floater in the eye of Isaiah Hartenstein, who is the king of floaters. I think, you know, in the back of his head saying, oh, yeah, this was early when we were all looking for Tyrese Halburn to get going. I think in the back of his head, he was saying, I'm the king of floaters.
- [33:51]
Tass
D. I don't consider what Hartenstein does a floater.
- [33:54]
Trey
I mean, it's a push shot.
- [33:55]
Tass
Yeah, it's more of a push shot.
- [33:57]
Skeet
It's a pusher. It's a pusher. Yeah, but. But Halle was also a pusher.
- [34:00]
Tass
He was. He was seeking that out when you had that space.
- [34:03]
Skeet
Yep. And he was doing a great job.
- [34:04]
Tass
Yeah, he had a fantastic game. Like, we. We. I hope we didn't, like, gloss over.
- [34:08]
Trey
Him, but a little bit.
- [34:09]
Tass
22 points, nine boards, 11 assists, nine to 17 from the field. And the four threes touching. Pain as well, though. McConnell was doing a lot of that. And Matheran, and he was active on defense, too, big time. Hallelujah. So really locked into that game. And they are now 9 and 1 in the playoffs when he takes at least 15 shots and a much more, you know, mediocre record when he takes fewer than that. So again, it is this idea he does, and he's kept saying it. It wasn't just us. He was like, yeah, I gotta. I gotta just be more locked in here from the jump.
- [34:35]
Trey
Yeah.
- [34:35]
Tass
And not. Not taking 40 shots, not taking 30 shots like your SGA. Not that. Just on the ball movement. Get it back. Go take those floaters when they're there.
- [34:44]
Trey
Exactly right. Take some shots that you don't necessarily want to take. People are like, oh, should he force up shots? No, he should take the shots that are there. He just doesn't usually take. I think the shot attempts slash 20 point record is kind of a funny stat. Like you're saying 9 and 1, but then you look at the assists. He's got 11 or more assists in six of those games. The other ones he's got 7 and 9 and 8. Literally averaging 11 assists per game in those games where he scores 20 or more points. It's not that he's looking to score more. He's just doing more, period. Like he's taking over in these games. He hit that huge cross or sidestep three at the top of the key in the fourth quarter. Like Halliburton was feeling it. You can tell when he's contributing on defense. Nine rebounds, two steals, one block. He thought he had another block where he jumped on top of a guy and then smacked it down. But at least you could tell he was giving an effort on both ends. And honestly, when he's rebounding like that, nine boards, that ignites their transition attack, which was kind of alive for the first time in this game.
- [35:41]
Tass
Yeah. And man, he was the king of the jump. Passes are good last night too. Holy crap. He was doing it a lot last night. He does it. He does it all the time. It was like noticeable than games one or two that I can remember. So he had that going too. He was just in the field last.
- [35:54]
Skeet
Night and I didn't mind the thunder going after him, trying to get to him defensively. But he stepped up and was monstrous. Who? Also a guy who also stepped up is Lou Dort. Again, the guy is splashing threes. One of those threes was a fricking moon ball.
- [36:07]
Tass
I mean, they get higher and higher, I swear.
- [36:09]
Skeet
And so he splashes home another four threes in the finals. He's hit multiple threes. Three of the four games. He's shooting 58% from three.
- [36:19]
Tass
The only problem is they, they. He, like, he uses them all too early in games.
- [36:22]
Trey
Yeah, unfortunately he missed the biggest one.
- [36:24]
Tass
Yeah, Eddie. And that happened in game one as well. Like he was on fire. And then like he got good looks in the, in the fourth and he couldn't Knock them down. I mean, look, you're. I'm. I'm.
- [36:32]
Skeet
He was four or five joking here.
- [36:34]
Tass
These are. These are incredible three point percentages from here. But yeah, he's getting these still looks in the fourth. It is a little bit like. I guess we gotta live with this.
- [36:42]
Trey
Yeah. That's what willing give up threes.
- [36:44]
Tass
Yeah.
- [36:44]
Trey
He made 3 for 3 in the first half and then took two shots in the course of 90 minutes in the second half. That's just hard to do.
- [36:51]
Skeet
Yeah. Again, I do mention that one play where Dort was caught in the corner. Defensively, you got to use Lou Dort for what he can do. And to see Shay on the ball after he makes a sec. His second free throw. And the Pacers are going and he has to be on the ball. And Matheren is able to get into his three point shot with Shade, you know, kind of falling under the screen, which was, you know, the idea. And Chet was supposed to be up. He didn't come out A wide open three. While Dort's just sitting there in the corner guarding off the ball. He's guarding Nemhard or. Yeah. Or. Or is it Ne, Smith or Shepherd one Is somebody in the corner? Well, you know, you got to use them. I think there's. That's just strictly a mistake when Shea is obviously gassed. You could see when the ball was coming up by the Pacers on the other end, Shay, if he was in the corner, hands on the knees. Oh, yeah. He was a little strictly tight.
- [37:45]
Tass
Well, let's get into maybe some of the sillier stuff or stuff maybe you missed in random notes.
- [37:51]
Skeet
Random.
- [37:56]
Tass
TK Why don't you get us started? What's your first. I guess, random note.
- [37:59]
Trey
Tuck it in, guys. We're looking at Reggie Miller. Reggie Miller was catching some eyes courtside in Indiana last night wearing a Mark Jackson jersey over a hooded sweatshirt, all of which was tucked in to his tight jeans. Yeah. And a pair of Jordan, I think 19s that he. I think he wore when he was playing.
- [38:20]
Tass
Yeah, like he pulled.
- [38:22]
Trey
Pulled him out of sword. I'm throwing these on. Pretty cool. Maybe. I don't know, maybe he wore them in the finals. Actually, now that I'm thinking about it.
- [38:29]
Tass
That sounds right.
- [38:30]
Trey
19 Jordan would already been retired. It could be. That'd be interesting if he actually had those on when finals time.
- [38:38]
Skeet
Relive it. He's trying to.
- [38:39]
Trey
This was a crazy look.
- [38:40]
Tass
Oh, an absolutely insane look. Yeah, I mean I just. There's. I'm just like. I guess you could say that's a thin type of hoodie. Right? You know, not. Not a chunky one or a heavy one, but still, that's a lot of fabric going into the front of those jeans.
- [38:56]
Skeet
Standing up, getting into the basketball club. He must have been sweating. No.
- [39:02]
Tass
Yeah, he had to have been. If I was sweating at home watching it while sitting down. This guy's like living and dying with every play courtside, standing and clapping with all that fabric on.
- [39:11]
Skeet
Since we got to get into every single element. I mean, you can see the white trim on the. On the sleeve. I guess that's just the way it looks like on the actual end of the.
- [39:18]
Trey
Oh, yeah. Like the piping on his cuffs.
- [39:21]
Skeet
Yeah, I guess that's like. I was like, does he have a long sleeve shirt under there? But, nah, it's. He couldn't be doing that well.
- [39:26]
Tass
And then there's other great things from this photo that is. I believe that's Reggie's son rocking his dad own shirt with like the choke. Obviously iconic image. And then to the other side of Reggie, we got hall of Famer Oscar Robertson with the crossbody bag.
- [39:44]
Trey
I know.
- [39:45]
Tass
What.
- [39:47]
Trey
What in the world is in that bag? What you got in that bag? Big. Oh, I didn't know he was hip to the 2015 trends.
- [39:54]
Tass
So, yeah. What a look there from. From Reg. Mark Jackson in attendance. A lot. A lot of Pacers legends in attendance. A couple I wrote down Al Harrington, Austin Croshir, Dale Davis. You saw in the background of Mark Jackson when they showed him up in the suite. We later saw Lance Stevenson, Metal World Peace, slash Ron Artest. I'm sure I'm forgetting some other ones, but did you have. Did you have a favorite?
- [40:16]
Skeet
You're like, yeah, well, Rick Fox, not a Pacers legend, was in the second row there.
- [40:21]
Trey
That was him.
- [40:22]
Skeet
Yeah.
- [40:22]
Trey
Nice.
- [40:22]
Skeet
He was looking. He's growing the long gray hair. Looks older than he is. Yeah. Big beard. He's 55, actually. Surprised.
- [40:32]
Trey
He's literally a silver fox.
- [40:33]
Skeet
Yeah, he is literally.
- [40:35]
Trey
He's an Indiana guy. You don't think of him as an Indiana.
- [40:37]
Tass
No.
- [40:37]
Skeet
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But he picked the Knicks in the last series over the Pacers. But he's.
- [40:42]
Tass
How do you know that?
- [40:43]
Skeet
I went to his Twitter. I went to his Twitter account just. Just to see what's up. Okay. Yesterday. You know, he's also building this. This natural cement is a company that's like sustainable cement to build homes which is pollution free. Very, very interesting in the Bahamas. Anyway, there were one of those Pacers was Riding a bus with some of the other Pacers. He basically. I forget who it was. Now I'm. I'm forgetting who was. He was like, I'm riding the bus here with these legends. So it was, you know, I. Non legend pacer. One of them. I don't know if it was Travis Best or somebody, but somehow there's like a quick bus ride. I guess that they're all right.
- [41:27]
Tass
They put them all up. They put them all up in a hotel.
- [41:29]
Skeet
Exactly.
- [41:30]
Tass
They fly them all in, or at least. I don't know. I don't know how that works. Somebody literally venmoing Mark Jackson muddy or. Probably not. It's probably like, here's your flight, here's your access, and come on out. You could even see the one shot because a lot of them were in the suite. You could see, like, the nice, like, loot bags for them in the background.
- [41:50]
Skeet
Yep.
- [41:51]
Tass
That's just a nice touch there.
- [41:52]
Skeet
Absolutely.
- [41:53]
Tass
From Indiana. I don't think we have a photo of it, but there's a lot of commentary on John Halliburton's jeans.
- [42:00]
Trey
Oh, yeah, Johnny jeans.
- [42:01]
Tass
We got pre game, got some Halliburton mic'd up, and he was basically clowning his dad's pants, saying that you're out of pocket with those jeans. Dad out of pocket. And then. And then it came up at the end of the game when Helliburton was getting interviewed, and, you know, he's like, making fun of his dad's jeans again. I did. I did see them. You know, they were like.
- [42:21]
Trey
Like alternating looks.
- [42:22]
Tass
Yeah.
- [42:22]
Trey
Like you got a dark denim with a light denim pocket.
- [42:25]
Tass
Yeah.
- [42:25]
Trey
And then the opposite on the other side. Yin yang jeans.
- [42:27]
Tass
Yes, I guess so.
- [42:29]
Trey
Courtside, though, for Johnny.
- [42:30]
Tass
He was. Had the towels.
- [42:32]
Trey
They said, you're not coming to any more games. Wait a second. We're going to the conference finals. You can sit in the suite. Wait a second. We're going to the finals. You can sit courtside and I didn't mind it.
- [42:40]
Tass
No, right.
- [42:41]
Trey
Like, it's cool for him to be sitting courtside. That would be terrible. They actually go to the finals. They have a finals game for the first time in 25 years. They're like, nah, man, you got to watch at home. Even Giannis is happy he's there, I'm sure.
- [42:51]
Tass
Yeah, it is great he's there, but he has the ability to do the funniest thing ever and just do it again and come out and talk trash. Start trying to fight somebody again. That would be funny.
- [43:05]
Skeet
It could happen. They got to win it. They got to win it.
- [43:08]
Tass
Yeah.
- [43:08]
Skeet
You can't do it after going to one that's not allowed.
- [43:12]
Tass
Any other notes from this one?
- [43:13]
Trey
Not Bocca Port side.
- [43:15]
Tass
Yeah, he was.
- [43:16]
Trey
Was that a Canada 95 jersey?
- [43:18]
Tass
He was definitely rocking a Canada jersey. Yep, Yep.
- [43:20]
Trey
Sitting next to the hard hat guy.
- [43:21]
Tass
Yeah. Yeah. You got. You got a bit of camera time. I mean, he's in a good spot. Yeah, all the time. But yeah, hard hat guy that comes with like his 10,000 signs.
- [43:30]
Trey
Yeah, that guy's got a lot.
- [43:31]
Tass
He's literally like Carrot Top going through all this stuff. Like, all right, what sign? Like, he has a sign for everything. TJ McDonald McConnell was going off. He's like, oh, it's TJ time. He's got that sign. It's incredible. Pretty good. Every play he's got a sign. So good for him. But yes, it's nice seeing off there.
- [43:47]
Trey
Is he pulling for the Pacers, you think? Like, is this a Siakam based.
- [43:50]
Tass
It's gotta be cheering again. Maybe it's a little bit like us Canadians. They got a bunch of Canadians on both sides. So he's. I'm sure he's cheering for those guys, but I would guess. I would guess it's a little more Pacer centric because of Siakam, but I have no idea, to be honest. I don't know who he's tightest with of all the Canadians or honorary Canadians.
- [44:07]
Skeet
I think it's Pascal because I think somebody on OKC made a shot and was right up in front of him. He didn't high five him or anything. He was like, I'm cheering for the other dudes.
- [44:15]
Trey
Okay.
- [44:16]
Skeet
I think.
- [44:16]
Tass
Okay, well, it's great to see him there.
- [44:18]
Skeet
It was great.
- [44:19]
Tass
I did write in my notes. I thought we got to go back to the officials. I thought we got one of the louder and cleaner versions of ref you suck that we've ever had in an NBA arena. That was well done by the Pacers crowd. It was in unison and it was loud. Like, it was so perfect. Sometimes you get these. And man, you know, not everybody's in sync. Gets a little muddled. It's not coming through on the bracket. Man, this one was so good. I thought.
- [44:46]
Trey
Nailed it.
- [44:46]
Tass
It was so good. I took a note of it. So good job. Way to tell those refs you suck.
- [44:50]
Skeet
Yep.
- [44:50]
Tass
Capers, you suck.
- [44:52]
Trey
What else we got?
- [44:53]
Tass
Tony brothers. Oh, yeah. Tony brothers, too. And Tyler Ford. Tyler Ford.
- [44:56]
Trey
His first game. That's his first finals game.
- [44:58]
Skeet
I thought. I didn't Even know if it was the fans. I thought it was just Pat McAfee on the mic just yelling because he was in the house again.
- [45:04]
Trey
Yeah, he was.
- [45:04]
Skeet
He was doing it.
- [45:06]
Trey
Living the sweet life.
- [45:07]
Skeet
He's living the sweet life. Also had a shirt which was Tyrese Halliburton doing the the Big balls dance, which said overrate Ds. Yes.
- [45:17]
Tass
Nice.
- [45:17]
Skeet
Yeah, very nice.
- [45:18]
Trey
He's the right age for a guy to like a D's nuts joke, as in our age. Also, somebody tweeted me last night that James Jimmy Goldstein ate a hot dog with no toppings on it.
- [45:31]
Skeet
Unbelievable.
- [45:32]
Trey
Just so you know, the more you know, we're talking about the fans that are there. Jimmy Goldstein was there eating a hot dog. I can't even imagine that. I'd like to imagine him eating.
- [45:39]
Tass
I'm actually starting to get concerned because we've talked about Jimmy Goldstein flying coach to all these games. Now. I guess he's just eating straight up hot dogs with no toppings. Like, he just spends all his money on NBA tickets and has no money left for everything else.
- [45:55]
Trey
He's always buying the ticket that has, like, the buffet alongside it. I need the club access.
- [46:02]
Tass
I'm starving. I didn't actually notice where he was last night. Usually he didn't see him. Usually. Oh, there he is. In a crazy couch.
- [46:11]
Trey
Out of pocket with them leathers. That's right.
- [46:13]
Tass
I didn't see him. I don't know where he was, but good to have him there.
- [46:16]
Trey
That was a great game, man. Oh, my God. I like basketball. It's cool.
- [46:20]
Tass
Basketball's great. Anything else?
- [46:22]
Skeet
Anything else, Randos? No, I think I maxed out.
- [46:27]
Tass
I do have one sort of back to basketball plays. I saw Jared Weiss tweet this. One of the best plays of the night was when Halliburton ran that double screen action with three minutes left, up five. And instead of trying to, like, slip a little pocket pass to Chet in traffic with Turner on him and playing defense, Halliburton just whipped it cross court and it hit Neesmith right in the numbers, and Neesmith let it go and splash the three. And you go back and watch it. SGA was the helper off of Nismith, but he wasn't that far away. It was an incredible pass that it got there and then Neesmith, obviously, no hesitation, banging it home. That was a huge, huge play. And Halliburton is like, we talk about Luka, we talk about LeBron. Jokic does it in different ways on different sort of areas of the court. But these guys that can just throw like the perfect cross court passes. Halliburton's amazing at it too. Yes, that one was so. Yeah, I noticed that as well, Jared. So it was an awesome play.
- [47:23]
Skeet
And speaking of cross court passes, Jalen Williams getting into the lane with 30 seconds left in the third quarter when I was just thinking, wow, the Thunder support players are taking over here at the end of the quarter. He got into the lane and made a left handed pass to Chet Holmgren on the baseline. Not quite cross court, but he's dribbled his left hand is able to fire it. Baseline cut for a dunky dunk. As Holmgren gets a dunk. Ben Jaylen's had a pull up shot to end the quarter and they're up 5. And I thought, okay, here they come as the sport guys finishing off a fourth quarter. Like that was not enough.
- [47:57]
Tass
So look, it's the NBA Finals. Every game take on, takes on its own identity. But do you have any sort of predictions or expectations what will happen on Friday night in game four here back in Indiana?
- [48:08]
Trey
Let my dad take my prediction for me.
- [48:10]
Tass
Okay, go on.
- [48:10]
Trey
He called last night's game. He said the Pacers are going to win the first quarter. They did it.
- [48:16]
Tass
They did it.
- [48:17]
Trey
But he left himself a hedge. So if you wanted to cut it for a social clip, it would have been perfect. Nonetheless, they did win the game. He says OKC blowout game four.
- [48:25]
Tass
Oh, wow. Yeah. Okay, a big strong response here.
- [48:28]
Trey
Strong response from okc.
- [48:31]
Skeet
I'm going to hedge. They're going to win. Maybe not a blowout. Not quite a hedge, actually. I take it back. Anyway, I do think that I'm just going to be stubborn and just roll with OKC to win game four. That's it. Done, done and done again.
- [48:50]
Tass
I mean, we brought this up on yesterday's podcast. I mean, you guys agreed with me. It's like we are talking about this series, like, oddly like it's 30 OKC when it was 11 and now it's 2 1. Indiana.
- [49:00]
Skeet
Now people.
- [49:01]
Tass
Yeah, now people are joking. It's like thunder up 1 2. I was like, okay, that is pretty funny. I don't know, man. This Team of Destiny thing, it might be real. Pacers halfway to winning the what would be one of the most unlikeliest championships that we have in NBA history when you're looking at preseason odds to win this thing. And then their odds once we hit the playoffs got even longer. That's the crazy part. They were like plus 6600 in the preseason start of the Playoffs. They were like, plus 8,000. That's what wild. Yeah. And then I saw a CBS Sports Brad Botkin in. I love how he worded it in all of recorded history. Sounds very dramatic. But only three championship teams across any of the four major American sports have ever started with longer preseason odds than the Pacers. It's like, whoa. I mean, I could ask you if you wanted to guess, but I think I'll just tell you the three other teams with longer preseason odds. You take a guess if you want. Give me a.
- [50:03]
Trey
Give me a Minnesota Twins.
- [50:04]
Tass
Yes, sir. Yes.
- [50:06]
Trey
Worst.
- [50:06]
Tass
The first beat the Braves. 91 Twins is one of these teams. They had.
- [50:11]
Trey
How about that Kirby Puckett, Robin guys at the Metrodome wall.
- [50:16]
Tass
The tarp.
- [50:17]
Trey
The tarp, yeah.
- [50:18]
Skeet
It was running into that plastic wall.
- [50:19]
Trey
That's right. I got it right on the very first guess.
- [50:23]
Tass
Good. Good stuff. So 91 Twins. They were plus 8, 000 preseason odds. Another baseball team. You know, take a crack at it in the 2000s. Early 2000s.
- [50:32]
Skeet
Diamondbacks.
- [50:33]
Tass
No, but like, that type of team, to me, at least.
- [50:38]
Trey
A weird team.
- [50:38]
Tass
I think this team won Marlins 2003.
- [50:42]
Trey
Oh, 2003.
- [50:43]
Skeet
Yeah.
- [50:44]
Tass
So the 03 Marlins were plus 7500 preseason odds. And then you got to go to the. To the gridiron for the team I'm looking for. They were plus 15,000 to win the championship in late 90s.
- [51:01]
Trey
I'll give you late 90s. San Francisco 49ers won a championship. They probably were favored, though.
- [51:10]
Tass
You're in the right state.
- [51:12]
Skeet
What? You said The Rams.
- [51:14]
Tass
Yes.
- [51:15]
Skeet
Yeah.
- [51:15]
Tass
99 Rams were that long of odds.
- [51:18]
Trey
Kurt Warner.
- [51:19]
Tass
Yeah.
- [51:19]
Skeet
Yeah.
- [51:19]
Trey
We didn't even know about him.
- [51:20]
Tass
That. So there you go. So, I mean, and then if the Pacers can do this and win two more, they're like, you know, on this list as +6600. So it's pretty. It's. It's unlikely, is my point here. It's pretty amazing, this run.
- [51:31]
Trey
It's quite the run.
- [51:32]
Tass
It is special.
- [51:33]
Trey
I can't believe their odds went down. Start.
- [51:35]
Tass
I know. I know, because a lot of the. A lot of the other ones that had maybe like crazy long shot odds in the preseason, well, then the team got better. They impressed. The odds got shorter. Hit the postseason gods got even shorter. But, like, they're one of these weird cases where they weren't. I guess it's just like you looked at, like, how the hell are they going to get there? Okay. Wow. Okay. You got to beat Giannis in the bucks. Okay. Okay. But then a 64 win. Cavs team, obviously a Knicks team that had home current advantage as well. Really good team that's higher seated. And then maybe a whole part of this equation is like, well, whoever comes out of the east ain't winning anyway.
- [52:07]
Trey
Probably.
- [52:08]
Tass
Yeah, that's probably part. It is crazy. Now they got two more to go.
- [52:11]
Trey
I didn't realize I have three more production notes.
- [52:14]
Tass
Okay.
- [52:14]
Trey
Number one. Finals was on the floor. Just the script the whole time.
- [52:17]
Tass
And it looked better.
- [52:18]
Trey
It looked better.
- [52:19]
Tass
Yeah.
- [52:19]
Trey
It's easier with, you know, black and red than it is with glowing yellow. For sure.
- [52:23]
Skeet
Also, it's also in the little score bug. Just the tiny little score bug.
- [52:28]
Trey
They're trying to beef it up.
- [52:28]
Skeet
For sure. Yeah. Showing my girl. You can see that. You can read that cursive, right?
- [52:32]
Trey
Check the bug.
- [52:33]
Skeet
That's a capital F. Yeah, yeah.
- [52:34]
Trey
Then I like these two lines. After Shay Gil just Alexander traveled at the free throw line. Richard Jefferson said he knew he traveled. Guilty feet ain't got no rhythm. Great line. The careless whisper from Richard. And then very soon after, there was like, a skirmish on the ground. The ball goes out on Siakam. And it was just weird to hear. Mike Breen said it hit his butt.
- [52:56]
Tass
Yeah.
- [52:59]
Trey
Never thought I'd hear him say, but.
- [53:01]
Tass
Breen dropping a butt on us. That's his new bang.
- [53:06]
Skeet
He dropped a bang.
- [53:07]
Trey
He did.
- [53:07]
Tass
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [53:09]
Skeet
On an Aaron Neesmith shot.
- [53:10]
Tass
But we've got no double bang here yet in the finals.
- [53:13]
Skeet
No.
- [53:13]
Tass
No breeding. No.
- [53:14]
Trey
You didn't need, like, a game winner or something.
- [53:16]
Tass
Exactly. That's why. Yeah. He didn't even say bang for that one. Not one single bang.
- [53:20]
Trey
Only threes, he said.
- [53:21]
Skeet
Yeah. That's why it was weird to hear it on a Neesmith shot.
- [53:24]
Tass
Yeah. Big shot.
- [53:25]
Skeet
That was not a game winner. No, no, no, no.
- [53:27]
Tass
Big shot.
- [53:30]
Skeet
When pro defensive end Cam Jordan isn't running after quarterbacks, he's running his own businesses. He sat down with Microsoft's Jessica Hawk. AI can help.
- [53:38]
Tass
As a football player, we're really focused on the X's and Nos. It's fun because it's a strategy game as well, and I think that transitions well into the business world.
- [53:46]
Trey
There's so much data underlying every single.
- [53:48]
Tass
Thing that you're doing in your business.
- [53:50]
Trey
And having a way to unify all that data.
- [53:52]
Tass
This is like electricity.
- [53:54]
Trey
This is a major platform shift, and I think we're all learning together.
- [53:57]
Skeet
Ready to raise your AI game. Find your winning edge at Microsoft.com challengers.
- [54:04]
Tass
Does it ever feel like you're a.
- [54:05]
Skeet
Marketing professional Just Speaking into the void.
- [54:10]
Trey
Well, with LinkedIn ads you can know.
- [54:12]
Skeet
You'Re reaching the right decision makers. You can even target buyers by job title, industry, company seniority skills. Wait, did I say job title yet?
- [54:21]
Tass
Get started today and see how you.
- [54:23]
Skeet
Can avoid the void and reach the right buyers with LinkedIn ads.
- [54:26]
Tass
We'll even give you a $100 credit.
- [54:28]
Skeet
On your next campaign.
- [54:30]
Tass
Get started at LinkedIn.com results terms and conditions apply. Hi, I'm Richard Karn and you may have seen me on TV talking about the world's number one expandable garden hose. Well, the brand new Pocket hose Copperhead with Pocket Pivot is here and it's a total game changer. Old fashioned hoses get kinks and creases at the spigot, but the Copperhead's pocket pivot swivels 360 degrees for full water flow and freedom to water with ease all around your home. When you're all done, this rust proof anti burst hose shrinks back down to pocket size for effortless handling and tidy storage. Plus your super light and ultra durable pocket hose. Copperhead is backed with a 10 year warranty. What could be better than that? I'll tell you what an exciting radio exclusive offer just for you for a limited time. You can get a free pocket pivot and their 10 pattern sprayer with the purchase of any size Copperhead hose. Just text water to 64,000. That's water to 64,000 for your two free gifts with purchase W A T E R to 64,000. By texting 64,000 you agree to receive recurring automated marketing messages from Pocket Host. Message and data rates may apply. No purchase required. Terms apply. Available@pocket host.com Terms all right, we are very excited for game four Friday night. Like I said, we'll be back here in the Classic Factory on Saturday morning. But let's pivot to something else here. According to Shams, the Phoenix Suns and Kevin Durant. Kevin Durant's team have met multiple times over the past week as they work through various trade scenarios. So, and we knew this. It's not if Kevin Durant is being dealt, it is now just a matter of when he's being dealt and where he's being dealt. And there are five teams on the KD list. Again, according to Shams, here we got the Houston Rockets, the San Antonio spurs, the Miami Heat, the Minnesota Timberwolves and the New York Knicks. Now Shams did say several wild card suitors have emerged. We'll get to that a little bit later. So just, you know, keep that in your pocket. The wild card suitors, didn't you say like, have emerged in the last seven to ten days? Oh, I love it.
- [56:33]
Skeet
We need our wheel. We need a wheel to spin like we had in the starters days where we did it for the draft lottery.
- [56:39]
Tass
Okay.
- [56:40]
Skeet
With all these teams because these, there's literally 20 teams that Kevin Durant could reportedly be trading.
- [56:45]
Tass
Well, maybe, maybe. But I want to focus on the five teams that Shams did report on and I thought we could rank the possible landing spots from least likely to most likely for the Sun Superstar. And in doing so, we can talk through like, oh, what type of deal would that look like and why you don't think it'll happen or why you do. A few notes on Kevin Durant before we dig in here, just to refresh everybody's memory. He is turning 37 years old. He'll be 37 on opening night of next season. He's getting up there. He's played forever. Then again, he was still awesome this year. He made his 15th All Star Game. He averaged, if you're rounding up, 27 points per game, six boards, four assists, played 62 games. So he was injured for a little bit. He had still like, he's still one of the best just straight up shooters in the league, especially you know, in the mid range game and off the dribble jumpers like he basically leads the league in those categories still with his stats and efficiency. His contract, 54.7 million for the upcoming 25, 26 season, but it's expiring. Okay, so that does give him in theory some leverage maybe in deciding where he wants to go with the idea of signing an extension. Because once he's traded, he's eligible to sign a two year contract extension after July 6th worth as much as 112 million. But he could also wait six months after that trade and then he could sign a two year extension worth up to 124 million. I mean, so that's the ballpark and you have to almost assume wherever he's dealt, I guess he's signing this extension if he wants to continue to keep playing basketball.
- [58:20]
Skeet
It's a real Jimmy Butler situation.
- [58:22]
Tass
Exactly, exactly. So you're paying a lot of money here for a guy, like I said, that will be 37, but is still obviously has an elite skill still in this league. Okay, so let's get to those five teams. I'm going to start with the least likely that he gets dealt to from those five teams that have been mentioned. Durant to the Knicks. Now I say that because there's been a lot of like, like counter reporting from people plugged in to the Knicks. Stefan Bondi of the Post, he's saying the opposite of sort of what Shams is saying. He's saying New York will not be dealing for the future hall of Famer. And there's been a few other reports that they're actually, the Knicks are not in the Katy business. That's why I put them there. And then the other part is I think if you're not trading Karl Anthony Towns for kd, then it gets really difficult to get a package that makes sense for the Knicks. Even I could see it from the sun side, but like, I don't. Okay, you're not trading Jalen Brunson. I don't think you're trading OG and an ob. They're how important he is sort of defensively. So it's like you're getting to Bridges and Hart and Mitchell Robinson and, you know, little draft capital to make that happen. Your thoughts on the Knicks, you're saying.
- [59:27]
Trey
They wouldn't trade Towns? I think he would have to be in it.
- [59:29]
Tass
Yeah.
- [59:29]
Trey
For it to make sense. Especially because, you know, him and Devin Booker are like best buds. So that would be the allure for Towns to be like, okay, I'm fine with this. And for the Suns to be like, maybe he will be. I mean, Carl Anthony Towns, an all NBA player. He has his warts for sure and they usually show at the worst possible times. But the Suns didn't make the playoffs, so maybe they should worry about that rather than if he's going to be able to hold up defensive in the conference finals. It just seems unlikely where these two teams are at salary cap.
- [59:56]
Tass
I'm saying I agree with you from the sun side of things. I think they're more likely to do it, especially if it's Cat, even maybe if it's the Bridges heart and other pieces to get to the salary. I think the Knicks, I guess I'm saying I think the Knicks would be damn silly to do this that much personally. And I would not trade Cat for Katie at this point.
- [60:14]
Skeet
Yeah. With where they're at, Kat just lines up with the ages of everybody on that team. It doesn't seem to me to make sense.
- [60:22]
Tass
Okay, let's go.
- [60:23]
Trey
What did you say Katie's contract is going to be though?
- [60:25]
Tass
55. Right. About just for one more year. Yeah, one more year.
- [60:29]
Trey
Yeah. But then he's eligible for what kind of extensions?
- [60:32]
Tass
Basically call it 60.
- [60:34]
Trey
I mean, I Mean, that's making.
- [60:36]
Tass
Yeah, yeah. But if you're the Knicks, would you trade Cat for kd?
- [60:41]
Trey
I don't know.
- [60:42]
Tass
Yeah, I'm not. I guess I'm.
- [60:43]
Trey
No, but I don't think it makes them that much better. But I also don't think it makes them that much worse. I'm saying I would trade Towns for the right guy. I think I'd rather trade him for Giannis, though.
- [60:53]
Tass
Right, Right. Well, and this is a huge difference. Giannis is 30 and still a top, what, five, at least maybe three player in the league. And. And that is. I guess I should have said that, like KD every other time he's been traded. Katie was still top five all these other times. But we're not saying that now. Like, I don't know where you rank them, but. But he's much further down. He's somewhere in the 10 to 20 range, I would assume for most people. Maybe on the lower end even of that. Yeah. So, okay. This is a lot different than Yanis, is my point. All right, number four, Durant to the Heat. The Heat always come up when there's a big name to be had. Right. They're always attached to a star that's potentially on the trade market. Now, do they ran. Do they land them all that often? Not really. But in terms of a return package, couple ways you could go about this, but I guess it starts with, are they including a hero, a Bam or even a Khalil Ware who they're pretty high on as a rookie center? Let's say they're not. Okay, so what could they get? Suns would get Terry Rozier, Duncan Robinson, and then what makes the deal, like why you would do it? I guess jovic, the number 20 pick and then a future first round pick in the future. Future 2030, you're leaning more into draft capital. You're getting some picks back because you're not all excited about Terry Rosier, I assume.
- [62:13]
Trey
No, I think this, to me is easy. Yes, for the Heat, easy. No for the Suns.
- [62:19]
Tass
The other way you could do it. This one from CBS Sports, three team deal. Durant goes to the Heat, Suns get Andrew Wiggins, and then the blazers are the third team here. Robert Williams the third, Jovic comes from Miami. Still couple future first round picks, 20, 30, 2032. And then the Blazers would get Duncan Robinson in this three team deal. So they would just get some shooting there and obviously lose Robert Williams iii, but Kevin Durant would still go to the Suns. In this hypothetical, how do you feel about Kevin Durant Would still go to the Heat. Thank you. Yeah.
- [62:49]
Skeet
Yes. What were the Blazers get out of this? Just getting off of Robert Williams.
- [62:54]
Tass
Yeah. Just the idea of getting some shooting if you believe in Duncan Robinson.
- [62:58]
Skeet
Yeah. I think we're reaching a point here with the Kevin Durant scenario is what are these packages? Because basically we're getting to draft picks for Phoenix. Really? I mean, yes, Jovic, solid guy, but we're getting to. How much are people going to pay for Kevin Durant?
- [63:14]
Tass
We'll get to some better deals here.
- [63:16]
Skeet
That ain't good enough. Really?
- [63:17]
Trey
Yeah.
- [63:17]
Tass
That's why I have them low. I don't think they have. These teams don't have all that exciting of offers. Really.
- [63:22]
Skeet
Yeah.
- [63:23]
Tass
If you want picks, I mean, and Windhorse was reporting.
- [63:26]
Trey
If you're putting rebuild type packages into your trade machine, start over. The Suns don't want picks.
- [63:32]
Tass
Yeah.
- [63:33]
Trey
Players more so than anything.
- [63:34]
Tass
Right.
- [63:34]
Skeet
Ashby is not that type of guy. Devin Booker just okayed the Jordan coaching because he wants to be there, I suppose, but he doesn't want to. Hey, let's just rebuild this thing.
- [63:46]
Tass
And then from Miami side of this whole thing, like, I mean the fundamental question is like would you. Are you going to mortgage your future here for Durant even if you're keeping your hero and bam. And you think that's good enough? Like is those three good enough to obviously compete in the Eastern Conference and go super far?
- [64:04]
Trey
I think they would. I think they would do it. The Heat often trade away their future and their future draft picks. The Eastern Conference likely to be down next season with the Tatum injury, the Lillard injury. Those two teams probably take at least a minor step back. It gets the Heat out of the play in tournament most likely. I think they would and should do it. I don't really think like Jovic and Hawkes is a future. Really. Those are role player guys.
- [64:28]
Tass
Third on the list. Durant to the Timberwolves. Mutual appreciation between Kevin Durant and Anthony Edwards. We know this, everybody knows this, but it gets like tough to make this trade. You probably got to get a third or fourth team involved. One going around making some waves here is the Wolves get Kevin Durant, the Suns get Julius Randle, Mike Conley, Gogo Patazi and his wig. Terence Shannon Jr. And the number 25 pick, the Magic get a shooter, get some shooting in Dante DiVincenzo and the Nets because they're helping everybody out here. They get Gary Harris and they get like a second round pick. So Durant to the Wolves.
- [65:09]
Trey
Thanks for the help. Here's Gary Harris.
- [65:11]
Tass
Well, here's the pick.
- [65:13]
Trey
Second rounder, second rounder. Nobody goes into the second round anymore.
- [65:16]
Tass
Oh, hey, look.
- [65:19]
Trey
Well, that's the thing is that all of these guys who would be good second round picks are now going to go back to College and make $3 million. It's happening. They're leaving the draft.
- [65:27]
Tass
Yep.
- [65:28]
Skeet
Yeah, but they could get lumped into a draft eventually, you know, like, because they're making money eventually there'll be 35 good basketball players out there.
- [65:37]
Tass
But anyway, what do you. What do we think of Durant going to the Wolves in some sort of deal again? Again this. It does get tough for Minnesota to make this happen and because then there's like things you gotta do with like retaining Nas Reed and Nikhil Alexander Walker and so on. But your reaction to Katie, to Timberwolves.
- [65:53]
Trey
I like it. I think it's too complicated for it to actually happen with the two main teams being second apron teams. It just gets hard to do the trade. You're throwing in four teams here and the Nets, yeah, they're helping, but they're not getting really anything out of it. Maybe they find somebody in the second round. Maybe. But I mean Gary Harris ain't changing their future nor is it making them that much worse for what they're giving up. But I love the idea of Kevin Durant on the Timberwolves as somebody else who can get a shot off with the ball in his hands. A lights out playoff player though he hasn't really won anything since leaving the Nets. I mean they won one playoff series when he was at the Nets though circumstances were against them at the time. But I do love the idea of getting somebody else next to Ant who can go get a bucket.
- [66:40]
Tass
Yeah.
- [66:40]
Skeet
On the Minnesota side I would be extremely excited.
- [66:45]
Tass
So you'll be excited really to like what I get. I know it was like a lot of information there, but like that's. That was like three rotation players. I did say that you're sending out.
- [66:54]
Skeet
Really being the big one.
- [66:55]
Tass
Yeah. Randall and I know Mike Conley's getting up there in age, but obviously still contributed and then divincenzo a key piece of their bench. So three rotation players going out for Kevin Durant.
- [67:04]
Skeet
That's true. But yeah, the defenseo hurts. I know Mike is important at this point and they don't have somebody to replace him immediately. They, they actually do not. But Kevin Durant is a special guy doing more than Mike Conley as. Yeah, a secondary type of guy. There would be a lot on Anthony Edwards shoulders. But as far as Basketball goes, it's Kevin Durant.
- [67:25]
Tass
A lot of people say, I mean you could trade, you could get into trading Rudy Gobert too, but he seems like such an important piece to obviously the Wolves and what they do. I don't think that's likely, but pitching that one as well.
- [67:39]
Trey
It does seem to me though that the Timberwolves so far are in win now mode compared to. I mean the Knicks and the Heat are too, but like the Timberwolves, it feels kind of weird to put 37 year old Kevin Durant next to Aunt Edwards. But they're so far over the aprons now with the McDaniels deal with Rudy Gobert's gigantic contract that it doesn't really bother me to get a guy who would fit really nicely on their team as a wing who can score, who can play the 4 can play a small ball 5 next to NAS Reed. If they wanted to do that kind of thing, they're probably would be able to get some minimum veteran guys that are going to be trying to chase a ring playing next to KD and Ant as well. So like I'm saying, I don't think it rally will happen just because so many moving pieces, but I see the fit.
- [68:23]
Tass
You see the fit?
- [68:24]
Skeet
Oh yeah, that's. Yeah. Kevin Durant provides space for Anthony Edwards who is struggling to find it because he would be replacing Julius Randle primarily right. Although Julius Randall was good. But it's still, they're still looking. We're talking about age and yeah, maybe he's too old, but Mike Conley was too old in the playoffs. They need somebody else at the guard spot. So these are multiple things that they'd have to do. The trading of Rudy Gobert is an interesting one because are they going to rely on Nas Reed as their center who's damn good, but would he be the guy that they signed to play 30, 35 minutes per game? That's a huge question though for Tim Connolly because he is a free agent. Let's go potentially anyway.
- [69:02]
Tass
Let's go to Texas for our final two teams here we'll put at number two Durant to the Rockets. They've been connected to Durant here for a while. I mean you can maybe even go back to last summer. They have several young players that in theory could maybe entice the Suns and more importantly, they hold several of Phoenix's future first round picks. Right. You could get your own back and actually have control of them. So what would it take? There's a couple versions, but what they usually come down To. Is the Rockets getting Kevin Durant. Of course, the Sun's getting Jalen green, Jabari Smith Jr. And then I've seen Jock Landell thrown in there and a number 10 pick. You could take out Lando as well. If you do that, you're going to have to get into waving guys and declining options, but you could make it work. But the core is. Let's call it Jalen Green and Jabari Smith Jr. And a pick which is theirs. And they do have another one in the future, too, for Kevin Durant to Houston tk.
- [69:59]
Trey
If I'm the Suns, I would only do it if they're giving us back both picks.
- [70:02]
Tass
Okay.
- [70:03]
Trey
Yeah.
- [70:03]
Tass
And so then you take on the Jalen Green, even though you maybe don't love that fit with Booker.
- [70:07]
Trey
But no.
- [70:09]
Tass
Yeah, right.
- [70:10]
Trey
They'll be there.
- [70:10]
Tass
But you're. You're doing it because you're getting your actual draft capital back. And Jabari Smith Jr. Who maybe is a good player for you in the future.
- [70:17]
Skeet
Yeah.
- [70:17]
Trey
I think Jabari Smith Jr. Would step into the starting lineup right away, and it's. You know, he's kind of in and out of the starting lineup with the way things went for the Rockets, so I think maybe he would welcome that as well.
- [70:28]
Tass
How do you feel about it from the Rocket side of things? You know, they didn't do anything aggressive. They sort of stood pat and obviously turned into a really good team. Number two seed in the west, got there to the playoffs and had some experience, at least. Growing pains. But. But are you, like, sort of blowing that up, or you think this is adding to their chances to continue this role?
- [70:48]
Skeet
Well, it would mean Fred Van Vliet would come back as the ball handler. I imagine. So It'd be Fred Durant and Alper and Shen Goon as your Core 3 with Amend Thompson. Call it a Core 4, I'd be Super excited. This is. I know he is, again, 37, and maybe he seems a little too old for Houston, but I. I don't know.
- [71:08]
Trey
He seems like he's gonna play forever.
- [71:10]
Skeet
Like. I know. I know there's. We. People are flashing back to Paul George last year, that was an All Star season he was coming off of, and look what's happened to him. I don't see the comparison at all. Like, Kevin Durant is too good for that.
- [71:22]
Tass
Okay. Okay. So you guys seem in on this one. I mean, this is one we've talked about for a while here. It's.
- [71:27]
Skeet
They have so many parts, so many parts to offer the Phoenix Suns. Right? They Just they're so deep. Houston is so deep. So just to make something work. But the picks are important. But you could be working both sides here. You could be getting both things.
- [71:42]
Trey
What picks would the Rockets have left? Like, other future picks? I think that would be key to me because having these two Suns picks is pretty good for their future right now. Like, they're getting a number 10 draft pick right now. Who knows if the Suns are going to be any better for the next time it comes around. So if they still. I don't actually remember what they're.
- [72:01]
Skeet
Their.
- [72:01]
Trey
They have assets are looking like here.
- [72:03]
Skeet
They have the number 10 pick in this draft. 2026.
- [72:07]
Tass
Okay.
- [72:07]
Skeet
Yeah, 2026, they have their own pick.
- [72:13]
Trey
Then 2026 goes to.
- [72:15]
Skeet
Oh, that's okay. Or Washington. It's. They could. They would have their own pick if it was one through four because it's protected.
- [72:23]
Tass
Okay.
- [72:24]
Skeet
Then 2027, we get into Brooklyn's pick. Pick.
- [72:26]
Tass
Yeah.
- [72:27]
Skeet
And then their own pick and Phoenix's pick. And then 2028, they have their own pick, Dallas's pick and Phoenix's pick. Excuse me. Then in 2028, they have their own pick and it's complicated. In 2029, they have their own pick and Dallas's pick.
- [72:40]
Tass
Okay.
- [72:41]
Trey
Now I think I would do it.
- [72:42]
Tass
They have a ton.
- [72:43]
Trey
If the main thing they're giving, I wouldn't want to give away.
- [72:45]
Skeet
I just lied. I just lied. They had Phoenix's pick anyway.
- [72:47]
Trey
But if they're still going to have these additional picks that you can use for trades in the future, maybe keep them to use them as draft picks.
- [72:53]
Tass
They.
- [72:53]
Trey
They would still have young guys on their bench. Reed shepherd couldn't really see the court this season. Still a little too young. Who knows what Cam Whitmore becomes during the season. I was like, there's no way the Rockets should do this.
- [73:06]
Skeet
Right?
- [73:06]
Trey
But then they went through the playoffs and I was like, jalen Green looked like Jalen Green in the playoffs. And if that's the main piece you're giving up, I don't think the Suns would do it because that's the main guy they're getting back. But if that's all the Rockets really have to give up, I would hate giving up Jabari Smith Jr.
- [73:19]
Skeet
But I would.
- [73:19]
Trey
Would think it's a massive upgrade to go from Jalen Green to Kevin Durant.
- [73:23]
Tass
I tend to agree. I tend to agree. I think they're in that. That camp where you don't have to. You're not giving up everything. You still have draft capital. They Definitely are going to want one, if not both of their picks or two of their picks, but you can play hardball with them. Like, nah, we're only giving you this. We're giving you a young guy, too, and that's it. And you gotta take Jalen Green. I like you. I'm with you. I like you, too, but I'm also with you on this one. There's something there there, if they want. I mean, this goes back to, like, it's a risk. It is. I'm sorry, you say he's gonna age well. Yeah. But, like, it's also Kevin Durant. He can be a little moody at times if things aren't going well. And I think he can sort of. Sometimes he can change the dynamics or the locker room, so to speak, of, like, the vibe of the team. I know, I know that sounds silly, but we. There's a little history of that. But then again, maybe it works flawlessly. And the guy's a bucket still.
- [74:13]
Skeet
So with the Rockets, though, because, you know, I mentioned they have so many guys. Who are the guys that they won't trade. They won't trade Amen Thompson.
- [74:19]
Tass
No.
- [74:20]
Skeet
They won't trade Alperin Shankoon. It feels like.
- [74:22]
Tass
I don't know.
- [74:23]
Skeet
Yeah.
- [74:24]
Trey
That depends on. For who.
- [74:25]
Tass
Yeah. Not for Kevin.
- [74:26]
Trey
They would trade him for Giannis.
- [74:27]
Tass
Yeah.
- [74:28]
Skeet
Right. And then the third guy would be Jalen Green, essentially. And so that's. That's the kind of the line. If you're getting rid of Jalen Green, it sort of makes sense that that's. That. I mean, yeah, Kevin Durant will perform in the postseason. He will perform final one. I can give you all the picks again if. No, that was. That was wrong.
- [74:49]
Tass
The point is they have a lot of theirs. They have a lot of Phoenixes. You threw in the nets. One for sure. If not, maybe multiple. So, yeah, they're. They're looking pretty good. They made a lot of these deals, and they have a lot of draft capital.
- [75:00]
Skeet
Raphael Stone is ready.
- [75:03]
Tass
But number one, as maybe the. Or, excuse me, most likely place to make this Kevin Durant trade. And the odds makers agree. Durant of the Spurs. Right. They are the heavy betting favorites to land kd. He has a connection to Texas. He played at the University of Texas. There's. That makes sense. If you're looking, you know, at Katie, like, hey, man, I could team up with Victor Wembanyama. This guy. This guy's a monk right now. That's the energy I need in my life. So that could be a smart business. Move. And then for the Suns, spurs have a. It could obviously make a pretty good return package. The one that you've sort of pitched before. A lot of people pitching it. Devin Vassell, Jeremy Sohan, Harrison Barnes and then the number 14 pick. I don't think they're going to trade the number two pick. I don't think they should. I don't think they need to trade Castle either. But what do you think about Vassell, Sohan, Harrison Barnes and then the later pick for Katie? Send it in or no way.
- [76:00]
Trey
That's it.
- [76:01]
Tass
Yeah.
- [76:02]
Trey
Yeah, I would do it.
- [76:03]
Tass
Yeah.
- [76:03]
Trey
I think that's an easy yes for San Antonio and I think it's going to get done. It's what it seems like before the draft even. I love the idea of Kevin Durant and Victor Wembanyama next to each other. You think a seven footer who can shoot threes is cool? How about a 7 foot 5 guy who can shoot threes and they're on the court together. I love it.
- [76:19]
Skeet
I think it makes sense. I think that the line of who you would get rid of kind of starts with Den Bissell. If you're the Suns, you want them to sell.
- [76:28]
Tass
Yeah.
- [76:29]
Skeet
And you don't. You don't want it to drop to Kelvin Johnson, even though they have, they have a deep roster. But yeah, you're getting back two players to complement Devin Booker and you're getting a pick. I think that is the one that makes the most sense, the Vassell line. Although he is, you know, similar to Devin Booker. Starting to buy it. I don't know if I want to read into Jeremy Sohan's tweet. Beautiful day today. Sun emoji. Hope everyone has a good day. Exclamation point.
- [76:56]
Trey
Oh, interesting.
- [76:57]
Skeet
Suns. Is it the Suns? Does he know? Does he know? That was just yesterday.
- [77:01]
Tass
Okay. No. You saw the rumors. I'll tell you that. He's having some fun with it. Okay. Yeah. That's why. I mean, it does make sense. That's not. I think it's the perfect amount. That's like, I think like, best case scenario, if I'm being honest with what Phoenix is sort of going to get back here. A late lottery pick a talented young guy and then some other like flyers and then Harrison Barnes or like who knows if he's rerouted or whatever. But a locker room guy, at the very least he's in there for make the contract work. Yeah. That's why they're the favorites to get them here.
- [77:31]
Trey
Wow. Upgrading from Harrison Barnes to Kevin Durant. It's worked before.
- [77:36]
Tass
Give it a go again.
- [77:37]
Trey
Yeah, man. Would Phoenix do it? I don't know.
- [77:40]
Skeet
Yeah, that's what I'm starting.
- [77:41]
Trey
Those three guys can play at least like Vassal can play alongside Booker and Beal. I mean, that's kind of weird, too. That's a pretty weird no defense, defense team from the perimeter, but that's what they are. They're not getting a center back, which clearly they need a center. They tried the Nurkic, Plumlee, Nick Richards, Triumvirate last year and it didn't go all that well. They also aren't getting, you're saying these future picks from Atlanta, from Minnesota. I think the spurs have as well. That's a disappointing return, I would say, for Kevin Durant, but if they're looking to get back what they traded for him, it ain't gonna happen.
- [78:13]
Tass
No, that's. That's the thing. So which one do you like more? The hypothetical deals here. If you're the Suns, you like Jalen green, Jabari Smith Jr. And the number 10 pick and we'll call it there. Or do you like Devin Vassell, Jeremy Sohan, Harrison Barnes and the 14th pick in the draft?
- [78:30]
Skeet
I like the Rockets better. The Rockets trade better. I think it complements Devin Booker a little more rather than mirroring him with Devin Vassell. They're starting to overlap there with those two guys and Bradley Beal. I think the Rockets just have more of a variety of talent. Although, yes, Kevin Durant and Wemby is enticing. That is no doubt. But I don't know. I don't know about this. The vessel, the cell is obviously solid. Very solid. It's too Booker. Like I, I think in the end.
- [79:01]
Trey
Maybe so I'm kind of. I'm a little more out of the cell than I have been. He's. He hasn't really developed as a defender and like, I'm not even convinced he's a starter for the spurs long term. So we'll see.
- [79:14]
Tass
Okay, well, let's hear from you out there ranking these potential destinations for Kevin Durant. But let's circle back to the wild card suitors because Sean did say that and I just want to end with this. Do you have a favorite wild card team that could like, obviously sneak in here and maybe put together an enticing package for Kevin Durant?
- [79:34]
Skeet
I think it's the Milwaukee Bucks to play with Janice De Koopa. Now. They don't have a lot to trade.
- [79:38]
Tass
What are they trading, man?
- [79:40]
Skeet
Yeah, they have picks there that's where the, the third party, fourth party, fourth team thing needs to happen. And that's the scary part here, because the Brooklyn Nets are the most interesting one to partake in this. But what are they willing to. To give up? Like, I don't think they're willing to give up Cam Johnson. Maybe they will.
- [80:01]
Tass
You're saying they need to be involved.
- [80:04]
Skeet
They need to be Brooklyn, because you're.
- [80:06]
Tass
Not saying Kevin Durant would go back to the Brooklyn Nets. I don't think.
- [80:08]
Skeet
I don't think that's the case.
- [80:10]
Tass
No.
- [80:10]
Skeet
He's not going to Brooklyn. He's not going to Utah. I know everybody hot about Toronto. I don't buy it. I think him and Giannis paired.
- [80:19]
Tass
Wow.
- [80:20]
Skeet
Makes a lot of sense. Now, there needs to be things that have to work out because they don't have a lot of assets. But, but, but we're not sure exactly what all these other teams are offering. Like, that's, that's the problem here in that it is Kevin Durant. It is an all time great. What are these teams willing to offer in comparison to Milwaukee, plus a Brooklyn or some other team? There's pick, there's picks to be had and one of these maybe. I don't know if Brooklyn's really just willing to empty the cupboard and say, say we're gonna be bad again. They're kind of already bad anyway. Whether it's.
- [80:56]
Trey
They weren't bad enough.
- [80:58]
Skeet
Yeah. Cam Johnson, Nick Claxton, are the names out there to be included for Phoenix?
- [81:07]
Tass
Milwaukee Bucks are definitely a wild card.
- [81:09]
Skeet
Yeah. I just think Kevin Durant, looking at each other, they love each other. They would love each other. They are, you know, the past of the NBA. They, they got, they got a few more years together. Okay, I know, I know I'm a little high on Kevin Durant being healthy. I ain't no freaking doctor, but I do think, I do think he will be.
- [81:25]
Tass
Okay. So you got a wild card team for me.
- [81:27]
Trey
I'm not as worried about the health for Durant, but the teams haven't been that great that he's been on. I think he's won two playoff series since he left Golden State. He's not able to carry the team the way he was, but if he's alongside Giannis, maybe that works nice. The wild card team is the Toronto Raptors. For me, they got an easy trade to make. RJ Barrett, Jakob Poeltl, the number nine pick or their 20, 26. First like that gets it done. Money wise, obviously a big time upgrade. RJ Barrett to Kevin Durant. Would be weird to see Kevin Durant next to Brandon Ingram, who I sometimes forget is a Toronto Raptor because they traded for him but somehow he missed two months with an ankle sprain.
- [82:02]
Tass
Yep. Haven't seen him play.
- [82:02]
Trey
Yep. Haven't seen him play. Purdle would be a great center for the Suns. They need a center. They're getting a draft pick. Maybe they want both of them. I wouldn't want to do that if I'm Toronto. But you know, the Raptors have been chasing Kevin Durant for a long time. They might bring Gas Vasquez back to try and get this deal done.
- [82:20]
Tass
Best buds, right?
- [82:20]
Trey
Yeah, exactly.
- [82:21]
Tass
Right. It's funny you brought up the Raps because going back to like, what type of deal are the Suns actually getting here for a 37 year old KD? They're not getting what they gave up to get him in the first place. You said it. Trey and I go back to the Raptors and trading Siakam to the Pacers. Like I'm like, is it going to be. To me it's going to be worse than Bruce Brown, Jordan Noira, Kira Lewis and three first round picks that were like two in the one class and then another one like or might be comparable or I think it's gonna be worse than that because of obviously a huge age difference and Siaka maybe a bit more of a two way player but you know, Katie an all time great, but I don't know, like it's not gonna be that good. And I was, I was livid with that trade. I was not happy with the return the Raptors got. But there's also like, you know, it was like contract coming up and stuff like that. So. So now I know Raptors fans are going, well, they spun around and turned it into Brandon Ingram. Okay, well, yeah, a little bit save face, but that's not a good return. The guy's now balling out in the finals for crying out loud. Point is, I'm just curious to see what Suns get here for Katie. I think it's going to be extremely underwhelming and which is why a lot.
- [83:32]
Trey
Of teams are in the running for it right now.
- [83:34]
Tass
Exactly.
- [83:35]
Trey
They're like, hey, we can make this happen, right? We gotta throw in one pick. We can figure out a way to finagle our salaries.
- [83:41]
Skeet
Right, right.
- [83:42]
Tass
That's true. And I mean, and then again, like Katie does have to like sort of sign off on this like a little bit. I mean, I know there could be a team, they're like, who cares. Just bring him in here for a year. Try and do what the Raptors did with Kawhi. Let's just see if that works. And then he goes. He goes. But I think you like, he's going to sign this extension wherever he probably gets traded, which is why he's working with Phoenix to like, okay, let's make this work. You guys are happy and then I'm happy wherever I go.
- [84:08]
Skeet
Yeah. That's why the Clippers one that's out there, I don't buy that one. I do think the Clippers are willing to go for it. And the, the Drew Holiday from Boston rumors are legitimate to me. To add a guard while Kevin Durant, that would just be totally, just totally mirroring, you know, Kawhi to some degree. But anyway.
- [84:27]
Tass
But what are they trading? I mean, Norman Powell and Donovich.
- [84:33]
Skeet
Yeah, they have, they have Sixers pick again. They. It ain't sexy. There's not a lot of sexiness. But yeah. Dan Book, you want to play with Derrick Jones Jr. We got you, man. So.
- [84:50]
Tass
I like Derek Jones Jr. But come on, man.
- [84:52]
Skeet
Looking at these packages.
- [84:53]
Tass
Hey, Devin Booker. I got good news and bad news. What do you want first?
- [84:57]
Skeet
Yeah, yeah. Well, we're good.
- [84:58]
Tass
I don't know which one that would be.
- [85:00]
Skeet
Well, we're getting at Jabari Smith. Very, very solid role player.
- [85:04]
Trey
Yeah.
- [85:05]
Skeet
Derek Jones Jr. Frickin NBA finalist a mere year ago.
- [85:10]
Trey
It's a great, great pitch.
- [85:12]
Tass
What was the best player in all these hypotheticals I threw at you, like realistic trade packages? It's probably Julius Randle.
- [85:21]
Trey
Yeah, it is.
- [85:23]
Tass
Like if the Suns are now we don't want to be blow it up and because then Booker's eventually going to go like, we actually still want to compete here. Like it. That's. That is the move. It's to get Randall because he's the best of everybody. I've mentioned not, you know, not that some of these guys, these future guys couldn't like turn into All Stars and stuff like that, but right now it's him over, you know, Devin Michelle or Jalen Green. Right.
- [85:46]
Trey
So, yeah, team that I think should try the Kawhi method for Kevin Durant. We're going to trade for him. Who knows if he's actually going to sign here. But again, gives us a chance to win the championship this year. Cleveland Cavaliers, it would be Jared Allen in the trade. It's kind of hard to make the salaries work because the Cavs are pretty cap heavy as well. But you can do it with like Allen, DeAndre Hunter and Dean Wade, I don't know that KD would want to stick around in Cleveland, but he gives them a pretty solid chance.
- [86:18]
Tass
Okay, I hadn't thought of that one.
- [86:20]
Skeet
He'd have his career in okc, then he'd go win a championship with the team that knocked him out. And then LeBron's old team, if they win. Be weird. That would be weird, but it makes sense. Yeah, I'm definitely leaning towards these teams that can just try and get there to the top. That's why the Clippers kind of, you know, those teams that are willing to do it right here, right now, super aggressive teams. The Wolves sure Rockets to some degree trying to do it. Spurs, I know. They haven't been there at all.
- [86:51]
Tass
Yeah, that one, they're like, you know, in theory, you're convincing yourself they take a huge jump. Different season if wembanyama doesn't get hurt and all that. Now you got Fox in there. You got a good, talented team. If you threw KD on it like you said, if you're basically upgrading, I guess, Lacelle and Harrison Barnes to kd. That's good. That's good. Everybody's healthy. All right, well, let's hear from you. Your favorite wild card team for Kevin Durant. Where you think he's going to go, what the package is going to look like? Drop them in the comments. Dropping them in the chat right now. Love to see it. We'll be on high alert for the Kevin Durant trade. How many times have we done an emergency Kevin Durant?
- [87:24]
Trey
Oh, my goodness.
- [87:25]
Tass
It's got it. This will be the third or fourth if the timing works for us. It's been a lot.
- [87:31]
Trey
We've done a ton.
- [87:32]
Tass
I'll have to go check the thumbnails, but I know I got a lot of Kevin Durant thumbnails. Big emergency podcast.
- [87:38]
Skeet
You're ready to go, man.
- [87:39]
Trey
Emergency.
- [87:40]
Tass
Do you want me to get around? Ready to go right now.
- [87:43]
Skeet
He's going to be dope.
- [87:45]
Tass
He's looking it up.
- [87:46]
Trey
I see three. I think we've done three.
- [87:49]
Tass
That's what I thought.
- [87:50]
Trey
The funniest one is emergency pod. Kevin Durant to remain with Brooklyn Nets for now. We did an emergency podcast for a non trade request.
- [88:00]
Tass
Yes.
- [88:01]
Trey
And then he brought it back later.
- [88:02]
Tass
Oh, geez.
- [88:03]
Trey
That's fun.
- [88:04]
Tass
All right, let's call it there. So no show tomorrow unless Kevin Durant is traded to the San Antonio spurs or there's other big, big news. Then we'll jump on and hit you in the podcast, but we'll be back on Saturday morning, 10:00am Eastern, here from the Classic factory, breaking down game four. We're either going to be tied two two and have a best of three NBA finals or the Indiana Pacers. We'll do what we all laughed at the other day. Somebody's like, hey, what do you think the odds are the Pacers going back to OkC? Up 3:1. I was like, the good fellas. But they could. They absolutely could. But we'll be talking about it here on Saturday. Hope to see you then. Hit the like button. Subscribe.
- [88:39]
Trey
I told the people, if this live stream gets to a thousand likes, I'll do the Saturday show not wearing a shirt. I don't know if that means I'll wear a tank top.
- [88:48]
Tass
I didn't know you said this.
- [88:50]
Trey
You know, it was just chatting pre show. I was late because I forgot a shirt at home.
- [88:54]
Tass
Yeah.
- [88:55]
Trey
People said, do the show shirtless. And I said, give us a thousand likes and I will.
- [88:58]
Tass
So we need a thousand likes.
- [89:00]
Trey
A thousand likes.
- [89:01]
Tass
Okay, hit the like button.
- [89:03]
Trey
No, I want walked a thousand likes. Just to show you my shirts. Do it.
- [89:11]
Tass
You got two shirts on?
- [89:12]
Trey
Yep.
- [89:13]
Tass
What are you. What are you? Reggie Miller? All right, we will see you on Saturday until that Clipper Bros. You heard it here first.
- [89:22]
Skeet
Have a great time.
- [89:22]
Tass
Turn up.
- [89:23]
Trey
Love you guys. Awesome.
- [89:25]
Skeet
Thanks for joining us. And remember, Pat McAfee wears a tank top, Right. All the time or did he change it up?
- [89:33]
Tass
Now, the odd time you see him not in one, but generally, that's his wardrobe.
- [89:38]
Trey
That's his black tank.
- [89:40]
Tass
Yeah.
- [89:40]
Trey
I think he's got like a cartoon character closet where he just goes in and it's like 40,000 black tank tops hanging up on yours.
- [89:48]
Tass
Sort of has to be.
- [89:50]
Trey
Doesn't want him wrinkled.
- [89:51]
Tass
Oh. Or do you think he wears a different shirt to the Thunderdome and then puts it on when he's at work? Are they all at work?
- [89:58]
Trey
Wow. Kind of the opposite of what I do.
- [89:59]
Tass
Yeah.
- [89:59]
Trey
I show up in a tank top, put on a work shirt.
- [90:02]
Tass
Yeah.
- [90:02]
Trey
You think he shows up in a workshop?
- [90:04]
Tass
Yeah. Yeah.
- [90:05]
Skeet
I got to get in costume.
- [90:06]
Tass
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