← No Offseason: The Athletic Women's Basketball Show
No Offseason: The Athletic Women's Basketball Show
2025 NCAA Offseason: Power Rankings, Star Players + The Transfer Portal
00:43:47
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- [00:00]
Chantel Jennings
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- [01:33]
Zena Keda
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- [03:35]
Sabrina Merchant
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- [05:20]
Zena Keda
Hello everyone and welcome to no Off Season presented by Massmutual. I'm Zena Keda.
- [05:25]
Chantel Jennings
And I'm Chantel Jennings.
- [05:27]
Zena Keda
Today on the show, the NCAA women's basketball season is officially over. The nets have been cut and we all know by now UConn came out on top. But that's not the only story worth Talking about before we switch over to the WNBA draft, which coming up incredibly too soon, we are going to still linger in the college basketball space just a little longer. We're going to look ahead to next year's big teams and big players, check in on the transfer portal and reflect on our favorite moments from this past season. But first, we got to give credit where credit is due and give a shout out to the winner of our no off season bracket challenge. Lavar, Congrats.
- [06:08]
Chantel Jennings
Good job, Levias.
- [06:09]
Zena Keda
You beat all of us. You took all of our notes and put them to good use. You came out on top over 250 people. So hats off to you. Congrats. And also to everyone who participated with us. We appreciated our little no off season bracket family. And yeah, you guys all killed it way more.
- [06:28]
Chantel Jennings
It kicked our butts. I feel like everyone that actually is on this podcast finished in like the bottom 20 percentile, 20th percentile. I forget if it was you or Sabrina that said this. That was like, I'm choosing to look at it as like we were informative that everyone else. Yeah. Well, Xena, I appreciated the way you put a spin on that because that.
- [06:47]
Zena Keda
Was of course, made me feel a little better.
- [06:49]
Chantel Jennings
Yeah. Yeah.
- [06:51]
Zena Keda
Including you, Chantel, because you were writing, I mean, unbelievable stories on Paige and her final 40 minutes. Unbelievable story on Geno. I mean, you've been at it. How are you feeling now post tournament now that you know, you get a little bit of time to rest before the rest of WNBA starts up.
- [07:11]
Chantel Jennings
Yeah. And the off season. And this is going to be a busy off season in college sports and women's college basketball. I think we're already seeing that with some surprising coaching moves and the transfer portal and decisions coming down from government that are going to impact women's sports and women's college basketball. I am tired. I don't know when you got home yesterday, Xena. I don't know if your flight was delayed like mine. Three hours out of Tampa.
- [07:33]
Zena Keda
No way.
- [07:34]
Chantel Jennings
Yeah. I think people that were flying north or east had to go through sort of a storm situation. I think those of you who are flying more west did not. But yeah, it was nice to get home, sleep in my own bed. It's been a minute since that's happened. See my kids, see my dog. Like, that was great. But it's sort of like back to it. This morning I woke up and I always enjoy rewatching the broadcast of the national title game because like you were in the arena and you know this. Like, there's stuff you Miss, like, correct and you can sort it. Like, it challenges the way you saw the game in some ways or, like, validates it, you know, just like watching back and seeing things and they bring on different voices and experts and even interviews and stuff. And getting a chance to see, like, even Holly Rose halftime interview with Az Fudd where I think Holly told Easy. Oh, you know, Sarah has 11 interviews, 11 rebounds. She's like, oh. And it was like, oh, like you were also surprised by that, like, how, how well she played in the first half. Like, so just sort of those things where it's like, you know, we were across the court. I was probably like 20ft away from that interview, but didn't see her face, didn't know what was said, those sort of things. So never that far away from the grind, but sort of taking a moment to catch my breath. What about you?
- [08:44]
Zena Keda
Good. I mean, yeah, I got home with no issues until it came down to finding my car in the airport parking garage. Oh, yeah. I went through all five levels. I did. And then I looked back at the picture.
- [08:56]
Chantel Jennings
Low beeper.
- [08:57]
Zena Keda
Yeah. Oh, I was just rolling around. I think I got 10,000 steps in that hour alone.
- [09:03]
Chantel Jennings
Hey, good for you.
- [09:04]
Zena Keda
I was searching for my car. So the exercise happened, but, man, finally home. Got to watch a little bit of the. Or the full NCAA men's championship game and, ooh, Houston heartbroken for them. It was very different on the men's side in terms of the final outcome. Very close game. Shout out to Florida for winning and coming back. But I'm, I'm happy you mentioned, you know, just the off season, grinding at things. Still going to be very busy this off season. We saw two huge transfer portal updates. Olivia Miles from Notre Dame going to tcu and then Tanay Latson, number one scorer in the country this year for fsu Florida State committing to South Carolina. So that's just a few of the portal transfer updates of all of the transfer portal updates that we're going to have over the course of this off season. But another big piece of news was one of the biggest stories of the day. It's the House vs. NCAA lawsuit and settlement. And this is going to have huge implications for colleges and college athletes. The whole concept of amateurism is about to be annihilated. This is talking about how athletes are compensated and so much more. Interestingly, the final hearing of this case was like, down the street for me in Oakland, California, and it's actually a trio of lawsuits. And this took place in a federal court in Oakland, California, and it was supposed to be decided upon on Monday. But the judge in the case, Claudia Wilkins, basically told the parties, everyone involved, the ncaa, the lawyers behind the defendants of the plaintiffs, like everyone, she had some questions. She wants people to go back, work on them, and in a week come back and present. So, Chantel, can you fill us in on the basics of all of this?
- [10:59]
Chantel Jennings
Yeah, so this is, you know, we've been talking loosely about this on the podcast. I think this is sort of the. I don't even know if we'd call it like the game within the game. It's sort of like the backdrop of the game this year, right? Because it's like everything that has to do with nil and pay for play and like you said, amateurism and sort of coming back to that word of like college sports versus pro sports. And I think all of us who are in this space and you work in the NBA and women's college sports, you sort of see both sides of it. Like, women's college sports is, is and has been inching closer and closer to the pro model in a lot of ways. And now we're seeing more teams hire straight out GMs and stuff like that, college teams. And so the House settlement, it's, you know, I was talking to someone, they're like, why is the US House of Reps deciding this? And I was like, no, no, no. It's a former Arizona State swimmer named Grant House. Um, but I can understand why people might be confused. So it is a case, and it's actually a trio of cases that were brought, but Grant House brought a case against the NCAA in 2020, seeking basically back pay, for lack of a better word, for athletes who participated in NCAA sports before they had the opportunity to make nil money. And so understandable that these athletes who are now sort of seeing people that they may have been teammates with, make money off their name, image and likeness and wondering why they missed out on that opportunity. And so the ncaa, it behooved because if they lost this case, they could have owed up to $20 billion. I've seen estimates of. And so they had this settlement. And so it's basically trying to figure out, like, how much is due and to whom and where and, and all of that. But, you know, sort of the broad strokes of it is that nil payments are going to be made to former student athletes dating back to 2016. It'll be over about a decade period. It's going to go roughly. I know, I, I wish that you and your Yale teammates would have been a part of this, although some will.
- [12:51]
Zena Keda
There you go.
- [12:52]
Chantel Jennings
But largely to college football. 75% to college football, 15% to men's basketball, 5% to women's basketball, 5% to other sports. But this also sort of institutes this revenue sharing plan, which is something we've talked about a lot on the podcast that I've been talking to coaches about. In general, I will say my main emotion is like, damn, I wish I would have made it more than a day of econ 101 at Michigan my freshman year, because probably would have been helpful in understanding all of this, But I only made it a day there. But it's like, I've talked with coaches and they're like, do you know what's going on? What are you hearing? How is all of this going to break down? And the long and short of it is that athletes are going to get paid directly by their universities. So, you know, this idea of, like, you know, imagining a world where this all used to happen under the table, and I'm not saying that's going to go away either, but this will now happen out in the open. Colleges will have a chance to spend up to a certain amount of money this year. It's going to be about 20.5 million up to that amount. But as we heard from different coaches, including Gino, like, you know, over the weekend, schools are going to go over that there's not firm penalties yet. Like, cheating has existed in college sports forever. Like, there are going to be people who stretch those limits continued into the future. But basically how all of this gets broken down is something that we're seeing in college sports right now, that those schools that have the big deals for football specifically, because that is the big money driver in college sports. We know that, like, college football is the reason why the Pac 12 doesn't exist anymore. And so it's like the majority of this money is going to go to college football. And so Georgia has already come out and said that they're going to follow the house settlement numbers. So 75%, 15, 5 and 5 for football, men's basketball, women's basketball, other sports. And I think there's an assumption that a lot of other schools will follow suit. I have talked to women's coaches who say that they've been told by their supervisors that they will receive the same amount as their men's programs. So that will be interesting. And sort of this will become an expansion of the haves and haves nots in college sports. And you look at different athletic departments across the country like Ohio State, Alabama, Michigan, Texas, like, these are all programs that their athletic department revenues are above $210 million. Like they will be able to find the money. You look at other athletic departments and you wonder where are you gonna find 20.5 million? You think of and sort of how it all breaks down. Like Yukon, for instance. When we think of UConn, we think of basketball, men's and women's. They've, they've had championships for those programs in the last few years. Their athletic department revenues revenue is 99 million. But is that a program that needs to spend 75% of its rev share money on a football team? Probably not. But their total athletic department revenue isn't that far off. UCLA and Oklahoma State, where it's like, those are programs that are in conferences that might care a little bit more about their college football teams and are spending more money on their college football teams. And you think their revenue share breakup might be a little bit different. So I think it'll be interesting to see how all of this breaks down. We're sort of in this wait and see period. And even once it happens, it will happen. All the coaches I'm talking to are still sort of in that, like, well, we'll see. We'll see how it goes. Like, right. I don't think anyone feels like this is going to be settled immediately or that everyone is going to figure it out immediately. And the last part of this too is that which we had talked about in Tampa, the, the nil part of this, that those, you know, basically the pay to play that has existed in college sports and women's college basketball over the last few years, any deal now over $600 is going to be regulated by the NCAA, which, let's see how that goes. The only people I sort of, you know, trust less to run college sports in the NCAA is the US Government. And so like all of these different sort of things and different actions that are being taken because of lawsuits, I'm like, well, let's see how it goes. It'll be run by Deloitte. I know you and I had talked in, in Tampa that like, at least it's being run by Deloitte, which is a company that has that financial knowledge and an overlap in sports. But yeah, I think we're kind of in a wait and see period. It's a lot. Like I said, this probably feels like an economics lecture at this point, but it's kind of going to feel like that for a while just because no one really knows what's going to happen. And we can also get into it later. Hopefully we can have some of the reporters who've spent more time following these cases and settlements more closely. But, like, roster limits have come up too. That was a big part of Monday's hearing, how that impacts football specifically and baseball actually are more impactful, it sounds than basketball, but it's still a part of the settlement. That's going to change sort of how we, how we look at women's basketball.
- [17:32]
Zena Keda
Wow. Wow. Thank you for all that. That's like, this is gonna be huge. I was reading about this in preparation for this and I agree with Chantel. Definitely go check out the site, guys. Stuart Mandel specifically wrote about this and has been following this case since 2014 when the original cases around name image likeness with O'Bannon, a player, a former basketball player from the UCLA, brought this to light in the sense that he was complaining about NCAA basketball video games, were making money off of his name image likelist, and he wanted to make money off of it. And now it has transpired into what we see today. Now there's so many elements about this that were so interesting. So, like, as Chantal mentioned, 20.5 million are allowed to be or will be allowed to be distributed. How do they come up with that number? It is 22% of the Power 5 conferences average athletic income or, like, revenue. So every year, if they make more money, and these schools are already some of them, I think it was Tennessee that's charging extra dollars on concessions and tickets, calling it a talent fee. Right. And so if these schools keep making money, that number will continue to go up, which is great. But one of the things that Stuart Mandel mentioned is that in the first year that this happens, some of these schools might not be able to hit 20.5 million. Right. Because they just don't have that kind of money. But it also is important that, like as Chantal, you're mentioning that 20.5 million is different than nil dollars. So it's not as if you know before. And Chantelle, you explained this to me well in Tampa, which is like if a booster, some random person that is a part of a collective of a school and part of a collective says, I want to pay, let's say if Chantelle plays for my alma mater and I've got got a million dollars to spend on her and I want her to come to my alma mater before I could just do that and say.
- [19:35]
Chantel Jennings
It was through the collective without any.
- [19:37]
Zena Keda
Through the collective without any oversight. Now that has to be ran through and approved by Deloitte. It's over $600. They have to evaluate if that is worth Chantel's value.
- [19:51]
Chantel Jennings
Yeah, the fair market value to be.
- [19:52]
Zena Keda
Paid this amount of money. The fair market value to be paid this amount of money. That doesn't mean that Nike can't go do a deal with Chantel or, you know, In N Out can't go do a deal with Chantel. It just means that those dollars from Nike, In N Out also have to be ran through by Deloitte. So this is, this is huge. And the reason why this is big for women's basketball is because, as Chantelle mentioned, a lot of this has been predicated for years on football teams. How well are the football teams doing? But Chantel, as you know, women's basketball is creeping up in that men's basketball football conversation. Probably never gonna be on the college football level, but definitely higher than the Olympic sports and the non kind of non revenue generating kind of sports. South Carolina making a ton of money. UCLA making a ton of money. So when you think about the growth that women's basketball is having, you know, how much do you think that that growth is going to impact the level of voice they get in this conversation?
- [20:54]
Chantel Jennings
Yeah, I mean, I think back, you know, Dawn Staley has really spoken about this a lot over the last few years. Like when she talks about it, she says we are a sport that was intentionally held back. Like everyone else got to start the race and women's basketball was like held back and got a 10 meter, like slow start because of, you know, everything. Go back and read the Kaplan report and just see the ways that the NCAA prioritized. I mean, I think this is a direct quote from the Kaplan report. Prioritize the men's championship overall and that includes women's college basketball. And you sort of see as women's college basketball is given the opportunity long past having earned it, to go out and show what they're worth. And we still haven't seen an individual media rights deal. While we were in Tampa this weekend, both Dawn Staley and Gina Auriema called for that, that it's time to put the women's basketball tournament up for the highest bidder on its own. Don't wrap it with all the other sports. The men's championship is on its own. The women's is wrapped with 30 plus other championships. Like let women's basketball stand on its own so that women's basketball can show what it's worth. And so I think it's just you know, with everything with women's college basketball, like, people are skeptical. And I think that's smart. I think it's prudent. I think if you're not skeptical, you haven't been paying attention, I guess, because to believe that. That everything is going to go well because the sport is on. On the up and up right now sort of feels like, oh, are you just ignoring. Literally, like, let's go back to when women's basketball became an NCAA sport. It became it because literally, the NCAA fought its inclusion for so long to run it as a championship. And so I will say, you know, going back to what we were saying about collectives in terms of legitimate deals, sort of these, The Nikes, the Gatorades, the, you know, state farms of the world, right? When I was talking with Charlie Baker, the NCAA president, earlier last month, he said that, like, he's not worried about those deals. Like, if State Farm wants to pay juju Watkins, they're already partners. If they want to pay her a lot of money, like, he's not worried about that. Or what he's more worried about is sort of the shady dealings, as he described them, like those deals where people are saying, come to my school. And they're, like, talking over social media apps and nothing's ever legit, basically. And. And he said that he had talked to a lot of athletes who had committed to a school or gone to a school under the assumption that these were legitimate people and legitimate deals and they just weren't. And that a lot of athletes, he said, haven't talked about those because they feel embarrassed that they sort of got duped. And so his hope is that with this clearinghouse, those deals will be weeded out. We'll see. You know, I think there's, like, many sides to every story, and I think there are also players and coaches that are sort of, you know, who's to say that Deloitte knows the fair market value perfectly of a women's college basketball player and how that differs in different markets at different universities. You know, a women's basketball player at UConn versus A women's basketball player at a smaller school that doesn't have sort of the history. A women's basketball player at South Carolina versus, you know, I live in Minneapolis, a women's basketball player at Minnesota. But those players that are still the star at a smaller school might have a ton of value or worth in sort of that community, even if it's not seen on a national stage, even if someone from Deloitte might not see that so.
- [24:15]
Zena Keda
Right.
- [24:15]
Chantel Jennings
I don't know. I talk to everyone about this, and every coach is like, that's just gonna end up in a billion more lawsuits. Like, we're like, the NCAA is going to be in court for forever.
- [24:24]
Zena Keda
Yeah.
- [24:24]
Chantel Jennings
So we'll see. We'll see. I think we'll be talking about this for a while.
- [24:28]
Zena Keda
Right. I was gonna say it's a touchy topic. It is. Still, as we mentioned, the settlement has not been approved. And all of this, the $20.5 million, all of that cannot take place or be enacted until it is. So kind of hold your breath on this one. Think about if you're thinking about recruits and things of that sort, it's not gonna just be who can get championships. It's gonna be how good is your football team? And also how bought in is your. Your fan base department and your athletic department as well.
- [24:57]
Chantel Jennings
Xena, that's a great point. Like, I think what I'm. And we can move on soon because again, we don't want this.
- [25:02]
Zena Keda
Yeah.
- [25:04]
Chantel Jennings
We'Re not a. Not a money podcast yet. But I think this is going to be really interesting because there's been a really, you know, there's been a groundswell of support for student athletes to get paid for a very long time. If that means your season tickets are going up, as a fan, are you still going to be as on board with that? If that means that it's your, your soda and your popcorn and your. Your Skittles when you go to the game, like, if those go up. But ultimately it's feeding the program that's paying the players that's generating the revenue. Like, I think we're entering a very, very interesting time in college sports.
- [25:38]
Zena Keda
There you go. We'll leave it on that one. All righty. Now, while the frenzy of the tournament subsides and before WNBA season really heats up, we want to pause and kind of take stock of where things stand for women's college basketball. Um, we've got some already way too early power rankings up on the site. Um, shout out to Sabrina Merchant. She's already got her power rankings. I can't. I don't even know how you start that conversation already, but I love this breakdown, going team by team and explaining why some teams were at the top versus some others. People that are rising in the ranks versus others. And one of the biggest things was the transfer portal. Like thinking about teams that have returners, are returning young talent, are returning good talent, and then people that depleted. Right. So let's start with the ones that are rising and a lot of them are the ones that have young talent that are returning. Of looking at Michigan, Silas Swartz looking at Vanderbilt, Mikayla Blakes looking at Minnesota, I mean these are teams that had some youth last year in Minnesota winning the WBIT shout out to them. I don't know if we've given them that that prop yet, but these are teams that are going to be returning talent. What are your thoughts on some of these teams that are rising through the ranks?
- [27:05]
Chantel Jennings
Chantel yeah, I think like you said, there are those Risers are sort of teams that have been able to keep their players out of the port. There are also some fallers which we will get to which are largely predicated on teams that have lost players to the Portal. But the Risers, it's the Michigans of the world and I think we've said that where it's like if they could keep that trio of freshmen together, they'd be in pretty good shape. I think they still probably I assume that Kimburn's Rico is in the Portal as we speak looking for a big because that sort of feels like one missing piece for them. They lost their big Julia Grabiscaya to the Portal. I don't know if she's committed anywhere yet. I haven't seen anything but she could come back. Going into the portal doesn't necessarily mean you can't go back to your school. You can opt back in if there's still a roster spot, if the coaches will still have you. And they also lost Jordan Hobbs who you know that sort of stretch four for them. But they need to add a little bit more there. But I think that sort of freshman class where it's like, you know, we figured they were on the up and up. Same thing with Minnesota. They'll get Mara Braun back from injury. That's huge. Like to win the WBIT without your best player. We look back at seasons past where you think of an Arizona which the year before they made it to the national championship had a deep run in the wnit. Like these teams that use that postseason experience can retain their core and come back the next year. It's huge. Same thing with Vanderbilt. Such you know Michaela Blakes and Shay Ralph were on this podcast earlier this season to retain Michaela, keep her there. Camille Pierre, like they have a really good core. Like and now they have the tournament experience right? Like yep. And they'll come back hungry or so I think there are those teams where you sort of look at the top of Sabrina's rankings and it's like, yep, basically the Final Four from this year, which all of those teams, you know, lose some players, but bring back a lot, whether it's through the portal or their own players. But there are some teams outside of that obvious grouping that could make a run for the Elite Eight next season.
- [28:59]
Zena Keda
Absolutely. And you talk about Michigan's core three. I just want to make sure we say their names, too. For those that are kind of new to the space, like Olivia Olson, Mila Holloway, and Sailor Swartz, like, just phenomenal, phenomenal athletes. And then I love the way you said that. The top four that were at the Final Four this year, of course, UConn, South Carolina, Texas and UCLA, UCLA returning a lot of their talent. Some interesting thoughts going into next year, considering the way that they performed at the Final Four this year. Texas definitely having a solid crew. You saw Jordan Lee go off in the Final Four game when her team needed her the most. Of course, Madison Booker has been a phenom for them overall. Right now, it's. They. They need a shooting presence. I love the way Sabrina put it with, when it comes to South Carolina, they don't re recruit. They reload.
- [29:50]
Chantel Jennings
Right.
- [29:51]
Zena Keda
Each year, they reload.
- [29:52]
Chantel Jennings
Well, her ranking came out. She has the GameCocks at number two, and that came out before T'ni Latson committed to the Gamecocks.
- [29:57]
Zena Keda
And there you go. I was just gonna mention. That's huge. That's huge.
- [30:01]
Chantel Jennings
Yeah. The strong get stronger.
- [30:03]
Zena Keda
The strong get stronger. Okay. And so now, you know, I'm gonna put this out there. This is my speculation, but I'm looking at T'Niya Latson, number one scorer, coming into South Carolina. Where does that put Mylasia Fu'wiley I don't know. And that's a question of Now I'm like, is Full Wiley gonna stay and find her space alongside of Tanai Ladson, or does she want to go and kind of run a show elsewhere? So that's going to be interesting to see for South Carolina, but they've got, you know, tons of talent outside of that anyways, so.
- [30:37]
Chantel Jennings
Well, and we had talked on our championship show about the fact that, like, what they were lacking this year was sort of that go to score, and every championship team that Don Staley has had has had that go to score in the form of a post player. Like, we think of South Carolina like post post. You like, they've just turned out those incredible post players. But now you come into the back court, and this makes me feel like Raven Johnson is gonna stay. She walked at senior day, I believe, but has her medical red shirt, you know, that she can use. She and Tanaya played high school basketball together for a bit. You'd have to think that relationship really played into Tanaya's decision to go there. So at this point, just like putting two and two together, it'd feel weird for Raven to leave to, you know, if Tanaya came, if that was part of her decision. But yeah, I mean, I think the Malaysia question is a good one. Like, you know, South Carolina has done an excellent job of, of players sort of buying into the process, understanding the process, loving the process and then, you know, developing through the years. And Mylesha is someone that, you know, I, I thought before Tahina Powpow had made a decision about this season, like, oh, she'll be in the starting five next year. Like she should be in the starting five next year. Tahina comes back. It's a more veteran group out there now you're bringing in Tenia Latson, the nation's leading scorer. This is a group that needed like that go to Bucket and my leisure was that at times for South Carolina, but at other times was not as consistently as Don Staley would have wanted. Hence the sort of up and down minutes that Mylesha got this year. But yeah, it'll be interesting. I mean, I think both her and Tessa Johnson sort of those dynamic guards coming off the bench for South Carolina. We'll see. We'll see sort of how everything shakes out with minutes there.
- [32:17]
Zena Keda
And then you think about teams that were in that Elite 8 conversation and are dropping. USC of course is expected to be without Juju Watkins for a significant portion of the year.
- [32:30]
Chantel Jennings
And they lost Heckle and Howell to the portal.
- [32:32]
Zena Keda
I think that's just going to say. And they lost a huge shooter in Avery Howell and you know, Heckle, like, I mean that was a floor settle for them. So that's going to be interesting to see how USC bounces back from that. Jazzy Davidson saw her during the McDonald's All American game. She's phenomenal. Don't know if that's going to be enough. Then you know Notre Dame, that's the spookiness. We don't know what the heck is going on over in South Bend. They're big time names. Obviously Olivia Miles signs to TCU or commits to tcu, but they've also lost Kate Covel and that was supposed to be the next generation, big after Maddie West Belt. And so you're looking at them fallen and then tcu. The reason why they did so they're tbd. Of course they get Olivia Miles, but there's like, nobody else left. Like, they lost a lot of senior talent. Of course, Donovan Hunter is still going to be there alongside Olivia, but this is.
- [33:25]
Chantel Jennings
And they got silver from Kentucky. So in terms of that, like, high pick.
- [33:29]
Zena Keda
Oh, yes. Okay, I forgot about that. That's big.
- [33:32]
Chantel Jennings
Okay, so they have six, seven. So they do. They retained a presence. Clara didn't play a ton at Kentucky this year. She played behind Claire Stratford, but, you know, she is 6, 6, 6, 7. She's. She's tall, she has an inside presence. Didn't play a lot, but like three years of eligibility remaining with tcu, you know, they've got a. They've got a decent group there. And in terms of the. Kate Kovalda, lsu, I did want to say, you know, it didn't. When she went into the portal, LSU had been a finalist for her before. And having gotten to know her and her family really well over the last year, I was like, her older brother is at lsu. And I think as well, like the post development that LSU has, like what they have done with Anissa Morrow, Angel Reese, obviously dating back further, but to work with Bob Starkey and Simone Augustus and that staff. But you know, her older brother's there and you can hear more about sort of her story. But I think sort of that connection to home was big, of course.
- [34:23]
Zena Keda
All right, well, now let's talk about the fact that there's not going to be a Paige Beckers playing college basketball next year. And for a significant portion of the year, no juju Watkins. So we gotta look at the star power around the ncaa. Of course, Sarah Strong comes to mind. But Sarah Strong's game speaks for itself. She doesn't do much speaking. And when you think about stars and you think about swagger, you think about who you want to kind of lock in with. It is usually someone that has more of a voice. Paige Beckers was one of the most vocal players that we've seen in a long time in terms of not only being vocal and articulate and eloquent about how she played about basketball, but who she was as a person. Her being an ally, telling her story, just telling her story. That's been the case for all of these superstars, Angel Reese and Caitlin Clark. Like, that's what makes you gravitate towards these folks. And so I'm looking at Sarah Strong, I'm looking at az, I'm looking at Madison Booker, Hannah Hidalgo, Lauren Betts, Flauje still in the mix, Malaysia we just talked about, like, when you think about stepping into that void, what sorts of qualities and attributes do you need both on and off the court to try to get to the level of the Paige and the Juju's.
- [35:40]
Chantel Jennings
I don't think of juju as being a super huge extrovert, nor do I think of Paige being that way. So I don't think like with someone like Sarah Strong, it's not as though she needs to completely change her personality in order to become an nil star. And frankly, like what we talked about with, with the settlement, like she might, you know, whatever she's receiving from UConn in terms of rev share, she might not need to sort of think into that nil space. But stars drive the game forward. So when we're thinking about who is sort of the face of women's college basketball next season, like you said, Flage has been a face of women's college basketball. Like she was all over our TVs through March. Not just every commercial. Every commercial I'm like, oh my gosh, like we should have her on to talk about finance, finances because she has like talked about it in the commercial. She definitely would be able to school. Yeah, she'd be able to school us on that for sure. And she's more extroverted, obviously she's a performer so she has that going for her. She's got great stage presence. But juju isn't like super extroverted. But she definitely talks more than Sarah Strong just in terms of her post game press conferences. And I think that's part of it is that Juju has and during her freshman year shared her story, story a bit more than Sarah did this year. You know, I, I went to stores at the beginning of the season and sat down with Sarah and was like, oh, this is going to be a challenge to like, you know, you like sit down sometimes with players and it's like you're asking the first few questions and it's like, you know, it was like a press conference with her where I'm like, tell me a little bit about, you know, your story. And I'm asking her questions and it's like five word answers and I'm like, okay, got it. Like I, I need to work harder here. I need to be better here at my job. But I think there will need to be a level of that And I think UConn is a pretty good place to help a player sort of come into that, you know, suber to someone that wasn't quite like her freshman year. Wasn't going to sort of take over the mantle and it was a different era, but like finding your voice, sharing your story, showing who you are, you know, you don't have to like be totally out there 100% of the time. But I do think, you know, she will have to, Gino will have to coach her up a little more like as he was in the press conferences or CD or someone on that staff and just in terms of sharing her story a bit. And, and maybe that's not, you know, maybe that's not a part of her college story. Maybe it's, it's not. But I do think Flage is big. I'm curious with T. Latson going to South Carolina, you know, this is right.
- [37:56]
Zena Keda
That South Carolina hiding in the bottom corner of the country like, like that platform. They should, right?
- [38:03]
Chantel Jennings
Right. By being a Gamecock, having more of her like ACC vs SEC, having more of her games televised on like ESPN and ABC with that South Carolina schedule, you know, sort of having that one year with the Gamecocks being a scorer, sort of thinking about the highlights that she will be putting on and we don't know their schedule yet but like against those opponents, like I think Tanaya is someone that I'm really excited about. I, I, you know, we were sort of hearing like South Carolina or usc. I thought both could be good fits in different ways for her. But I think Tanaya and Flage sort of feel like the two front runners with Sarah Strong and AC Fudd. I mean AC has her, her friendship and her men with Steph Curry. And I feel like that's going to continue to blossom over this next year and she'll be put in more positions to sort of have opportunities with NIL as well.
- [38:53]
Zena Keda
And I think that that's why, and I hate to say this, but there is some, I don't know, there's truth in this. With AZ having that relationship and Malaysia having that relationship with Curry, it expands the visibility, right? So when Steph is wearing Malaysia Fu Wiley's jersey as he's walking into his NBA games, that's a big deal. As Kevin Durant is calling out Madison Booker who wears number 35 at Texas, like Kevin Durant did. Like that adds another level of visibility in terms of making them these big time stars. And AZ Fudd is already the people's princess on top of already having this relationship and this connection to, you know, Steph Curry. So I think that that level of transcending women's basketball into the basketball sphere in general is gonna be huge. But do you think it really matters to have one superstar like Caitlin Clark was and Caitlin versus Angel or Paige? Like, does it matter to have one? No.
- [39:54]
Chantel Jennings
And there's a lot of oxygen in the room, and I think it can go to a lot of places. So you think to sort of those, like the documentaries last year, full court press, it was Caitlin Clark, Camilla Cardoso and Kiki Rice. Only one of those players came back this year, next year, or, you know, coming back next year. But in this year's documentary, it's Flage, Hannah Hidalgo and Kiki Iriafen. So two of those players will be coming back. So I think people will have an opportunity to sort of see these journeys of both Hannah Hidalgo and Flage, which, you know, we haven't talked about Hannah yet, but she's someone that, like, dynamic on and off the court, sort of. You can't take your eyes off her. Those big plays, the highlights, normal Notre Dame will have a good schedule. Lots of games on NBC, nationally televised, so. And I think Notre Dame, like we said, with sort of the exodus of players, will be an intriguing storyline heading into the year. People have questions, and I think when people have questions, they tune in. So I think those, like, those aspects too, where it's like, people will have a chance to get to know Flashe and Hannah as well through this documentary, which can carry into next year and sort of give them that extra boost in their, I guess, platform, if that's how we wanna call it.
- [41:03]
Zena Keda
Yeah, yeah. No, Anytime there's a little drama, things are just elevated. I think that. That I feel like I've seen that clip a million times of Hannah Hidalgo saying, I hate losing more than I like winning. And it's like, ooh, okay, you just wanna tune in because there's a little bit of, like, a drama around it. We talked about, you know, Tanai Latson, you said that this is an opportunity for her to potentially jump up into the atmosphere of basketball. The star, the stratosphere. But Olivia Miles at TCU could also. You think about what happened with Hayley Van Lith and her redemption arc that played out at tcu. What are some other names that are in the portal or just came out the portal in the sense that they committed. Any ones that you. You know, like I said, I have my thoughts on Mylasia I didn't even mention out loud, but thank you for saying that. The Kate Covel to LSU that is official. Any other big names that have kind of jumped out to you regarding the transfer portal that are still in there? You're kind of looking and waiting to see what they're going to do.
- [41:56]
Chantel Jennings
I think Cody McMahon comes to mind. First and foremost. Ohio State star from the state of Ohio, went there because she wanted her mom to be able to still come to a bunch for games. So really curious, you know, like, I can see her fitting in at a lot of different places. Like USC needs a big lsu, very fun fits, but not necessarily close to Ohio. So we'll see if that sort of remains three years later, sort of something that tilts the scale for her. Also, Sarah Williams is a name that people might not know as well because she played at Wisconsin. So not a team that has regularly or ever been in the top 25 over the last few years while she's been there. But 2024 Big Ten defensive player of the year, athletic, six four post who can be, you know, just the anchor of the paint for a program. And I think of all those, all those teams that might be looking for literally exactly that or how they can add to it, like literally take your pick of any of these, any of these programs that are in the top 10. I've got to think they're in on Sarah Williams. And so those are two people that, when I think about how they can tilt a program in terms of becoming a riser, is like, if you can land Cody, if you can land Sarah, it's a pretty good place to start.
- [43:09]
Zena Keda
Yeah, Cody's an interesting one because it will depend on how she's used. Cody could be a big, she's 6ft tall, she has unbelievable post moves, but she also could be just the stretch wing too. You know, she developed her three point game a little bit more than just.
- [43:23]
Chantel Jennings
Her shooting got a lot better.
- [43:24]
Zena Keda
Yeah, her shooting got a lot better. So very interesting to see where she lands for sure. Now, Chantel, you've been on the road all season. You get a little bit of a pause this offseason to finally just be at home and chill for a second. But I know you've racked up some really great memories while you've been on the road and you've observed a lot. And so I just wanted to talk and ask you, like before we close out college basketball space and dive right into WNBA season, what are some, let's say, your top five moments this year? Whether it's lessons learned or things you observed or interviews you were a part of, like, what were some things that were highlights?
- [44:08]
Chantel Jennings
Gosh, top five. I'll just go like a group of five or maybe like five thoughts that I'm having sure. One I will always think of this year as sort of the year that I thought a lot of about money in terms of basketball. Like, sure. We had conversations about nil rev Share this feels like a year of nil for me. We talked about, you know, with the CBA changing for the wnba, there was finally a conversation of like, are players going to stay at the college level? Are they going to wait a year to go to the wnba? And you know, sort of the. Those conversations I will think about a lot. I will think about the Final Four this year. How you know, it. It didn't put up the numbers of last year overall, but it still in my mind took like, it's still on the up and up. It's still on the upswing. It's still moving forward. A South Carolina UConn final was sort of this like perfect ending to a season that, you know, to see Don and Geno on the sideline in that game, it was having been at the Minneapolis 2022 final felt very poetic to sort of see it come back again and knowing sort of what Paige and AZ have been through in that time since. Gosh, what other moments stand. I mean, I think I'll remember the season sort of like it'll be the post season of like, what if with Juju, like, what if she hadn't gotten hurt? Like, how does that change things? But also everything she did up until that point, like how basketball in la, maybe that's my number three, like LA basketball. I'm so jealous of Sabrina that she gets to be there. Like to have the epicenter, I guess, multiple epicenters of women's college basketball. But like to have UCLA and USC in the top four to five throughout basically the whole season and to both be in LA is pretty dang cool. What about you? Anything else that I'm missing?
- [45:47]
Zena Keda
No, I think. I think conference realignment was really interesting for me this year. Pac12, like those teams heading into their new conferences and doing relatively well. I thought that was pretty cool to see. For me. I have a lot of personal moments. Like I got to cover my first Final Four this year. I thought that was really special and just be able to be a part of. Got to sit in the same spaces as some of the greats of, you know, of basketball. Listening to Geno and Don in their post game preference conferences. I was kind of like having a pinch me moment of like this is awesome. I think this is also going to be a year for me of like, was it parody? Because all season long we got duped. We got tricked into thinking that things might be just a little bit more spread out than it actually was, and that tournament told us completely different. So I think that was really, really cool overall. But. Well, I think this was a great year overall for women's college basketball and appreciate all of you guys that have been listening and commenting and letting us know what you guys want to hear about and things of that sort. I still remember, like, one of our very first comments this season, like, can you talk a little bit more about Michigan? And just like, I think we have.
- [46:55]
Chantel Jennings
She's like, yeah, I think we have.
- [46:57]
Zena Keda
We absolutely have. But, no, we appreciate all of you guys that I've been reading and listening all season long. So that is it for today. We will be back on your feed on Friday to get you guys ready for the WNBA draft, which is literally on Monday. Y'all. This is crazy.
- [47:14]
Chantel Jennings
No off season. No off season.
- [47:16]
Zena Keda
There's no off season, right? Exactly. That's what the show means, y'all. This literally, uh, if you're new here, hit that follow button wherever you're listening so you can stay up to date with us. And if you want, come find us on YouTube. And please, please reach out to us. As I mentioned, we do read the comments on Spotify, on Apple, on Twitter, on blue sky, Twitter, YouTube, whatever. YouTube, leave them. We will be reading, we'll be listening, and we'll be making sure that we talk about things that you guys want to talk about. And also, you can leave us a rating, you know, let us know. Five stars, nothing less. Thank you. And all of us, you know, know it helps us help other people find us. So, like, do your job. Help us get to more people. As always, don't forget, there's always more to be found at the Yahoo. Sports hub, so check it out. Sports.yahoo.com women-sports on behalf of the Athletic, I'm Zena Keda. Thanks for listening and we'll see you next time. No off season is hosted by Zena Keda with Chantelle Jennings, Sabrina Merchant and Ben Picked segment. It's produced by Tanika Perel. Our executive producers are Andrea B. Scott and Cassius Fleming. Our theme music is by Marcus Begala. Brenna Haupt is our video editor. Shannon Ryan is managing editor of women's basketball at the Athletic. Jessie Burton is our head of audio, and Tim McMaster is our director of audio operations.
- [48:55]
Chantel Jennings
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- [49:20]
Unknown
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- [50:14]
Zena Keda
ACAST powers the World's best podcasts Here's.
- [50:19]
Sabrina Merchant
A show that we recommend.
- [50:23]
G
Hey folks, it's Marc Maron from WTF. It's been more than 15 years now, and I'm still talking to all kinds of people in my garage every week. Sometimes it's Bill Burr, sometimes it's Ariana Grande. She just looks at me because she's always going like, dad, it's not that big a deal. Yeah. I go, sorry, I lost my temper. I go, I still love you. You know, Daddy has issues.
- [50:44]
Unknown
Are you afraid of it?
- [50:46]
G
Of death?
- [50:46]
Chantel Jennings
Well, I don't.
- [50:47]
G
I think about it all the time.
- [50:48]
Zena Keda
How are we here already?
- [50:50]
G
Listen to WTF with Marc Maron twice a week on your favorite podcast app. Or get more WTF with a WTF plus subscription. Just go to wtfpod.com and click on WTF Plus.
- [51:05]
Chantel Jennings
Acast helps creators launch, grow and monetize their podcast everywhere. Acast.com.