Aces Flex Their Championship Swagger in Dominant 2-0 Series Lead

Summary

---

No Offseason: The Athletic Women’s Basketball Show

Episode: “Aces Flex Their Championship Swagger in Dominant 2-0 Series Lead”

Date: October 6, 2025
Hosts: Ben Pickman, Sabrina Merchant, Marcus Thompson (with shoutouts to missing co-hosts Zena Keita and Chantel Jennings)

---

Main Theme & Purpose

This episode dives deep into the Las Vegas Aces’ formidable 2-0 Finals lead over the Phoenix Mercury in the 2025 WNBA Finals. The discussion centers on the Aces’ dominance—driven by superstar performances from Jackie Young and A’ja Wilson—contrasts in team depth, adjustments from both sides, and how Phoenix can rally as the series shifts back home. The episode breaks down player performances, pivotal moments, and tactical nuances while also giving Phoenix Mercury fans reasons for hope heading into Game 3.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Game Overview and Turning Points

[02:56] Ben Pickman:

• Las Vegas Aces beat Phoenix Mercury 91–78, taking a 2-0 series lead.
• Phoenix led after the first quarter (27–24); the momentum shifted quickly in the second.
• Las Vegas outscored Phoenix by 12 in Q2 and “cruised” in the fourth; but, as Ben notes, “the final score line... not indicative of just how convincing a win this was.”

Phoenix's challenges with handling Aces’ depth and responding to their stars going off is highlighted throughout.

---

2. Stars Seize the Stage: Jackie Young & A’ja Wilson

[03:39] Sabrina Merchant:

• Jackie Young & A'ja Wilson combined for 60 points.
  • Jackie set a WNBA Finals record with 21 points in a single quarter (Q3).
  • Jackie’s 32 points is an Aces franchise Finals record.
  • “When your best players are that good...I don't really know what Phoenix is supposed to do...” (Sabrina Merchant, 03:39)

[11:22] Ben Pickman:

• A’ja Wilson: 28 points, 14 rebounds (took 23 shots, up from 16 in Game 1).
• If either had two more points, the duo would have made history as the first teammates in Finals history to each score 30+.

[11:52] Sabrina Merchant:

• Wilson is now the only player with three Finals games of 25+ points and 10+ rebounds, passing Breanna Stewart.

[13:44] Marcus Thompson:

• "[A’ja’s] the best player in the world... until you solve for X, you're in trouble." (14:35)

---

3. Defensive Adjustments & Coaching

[05:43] Sabrina Merchant:

• Las Vegas’ defense responded quickly after a shaky first quarter, limiting Phoenix to just 10 points in the second.
• Credit to Coach Becky Hammon for “using a lot of timeouts,” flipping the defensive switch, and not waiting to fix issues.

[06:45] Marcus Thompson:

• “I think [Coach Hammon] just used Jesus. That's what she said in the postgame. She was like, I'm leaning on Jesus...I mean, this team...they know how to win. They know the moment.”
• Strong veteran presence and self-motivation are central to Aces’ identity.

---

4. Jackie Young: Legendary Quarter, Toughness, and Narrative

[07:54] Sabrina Merchant:

• Jackie didn’t practice the day before the game: “She was not in...workout gear. She did not get any shots up.”
• Told Coach Hammon, “didn't have my legs, I'll be fine for game two.” She was—scoring 21 in a quarter.

[08:23] Ben Pickman:

• “21 points is the most points ever scored by any player in any quarter in any finals game in WNBA history.”

---

5. The Chelsea Gray Effect

[08:53] Ben Pickman:

• Chelsea Gray provided “vintage” performance (10 assists, 8 rebounds).
• Her defensive IQ and breathtaking passes set the tone, including a “no look” assist to Alyssa Smith late in the shot clock (09:48).
• The Aces’ offensive fluidity and Gray’s role as “a step ahead” of Phoenix’s defense highlighted.

---

6. Phoenix Mercury’s Struggles and Paths Forward

Key Issues:

• Lack of depth scoring: Only 6 bench points in Game 2.
• Alyssa Thomas locked down by Vegas’ defense; foul trouble limits her impact.
• Satu Sabally forced inefficient shots (2/9 from three).
• Ball movement and shot selection suffered, especially during key Mercury cold spells.

[15:34] Sabrina Merchant:

• Path forward: Up the physicality (borrowing a blueprint from Indiana Fever’s tactics vs. Aces) and “muck up the game.”

[16:20] Marcus Thompson:

• Mercury must “make shots,” find ways to get Copper and Satu inside rather than settling for perimeter shots.

[19:34] Sabrina Merchant:

• Emphasizes Alyssa Thomas’s struggles as a facilitator: “adjustments have taken her out of it.”

---

7. Hope for Phoenix: Adjustments, Home Cooking, and Series History

[21:36] Marcus Thompson:

• “Reserves play better at home, though, right? So that's Phoenix there. There's your hope, Mercury fans.”
• History: Aces lost Game 3 on the road after going up 2-0 in both 2022 and 2023 Finals series.
• Sabrina: “I would expect Phoenix to win Game three, too...with the crowd...they were pissed off after Game 2, as they should have been. And...no, we need to get this done now.” (24:35)

---

8. The Aces’ Greatest Weapon: Versatility and Depth

[25:07] Ben Pickman:

• “The thing that really will stay with me from these first two games is just the multitude of weapons that the Las Vegas have.”

[26:28] Marcus Thompson:

• “The Mercury strength is...matchup nightmare...But it just feels like even when they were going like the Aces just have enough, they can go shot for shot with you...That's firepower.”

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “When your best players are that good...I don't really know what Phoenix is supposed to do in that situation.” – Sabrina Merchant [03:39]
• “[A’ja’s] the best player in the world...until you solve for X, you're in trouble.” – Marcus Thompson [14:35]
• “21 points is the most points ever scored by any player in any quarter in any finals game in WNBA history. That's a lot of enies, but that is a lot of history.” – Ben Pickman [08:23]
• “I think [Coach Hammon] just used Jesus. That's what she said in the postgame. She was like, I'm leaning on Jesus.” – Marcus Thompson [06:45]
• “Reserves play better at home, though, right? So that's...your hope, Mercury fans.” – Marcus Thompson [21:36]
• “I would expect Phoenix to win Game three, too...with the crowd...no, we need to get this done now.” – Sabrina Merchant [24:35]

---

Key Timestamps

• [02:56] Game 2 recap, Aces’ victory, score breakdown.
• [03:39] Jackie Young and A’ja Wilson’s dominant night.
• [05:43] Aces’ mid-game defensive adjustments.
• [07:54] Jackie Young’s pre-game condition and record-setting quarter.
• [08:53] Chelsea Gray’s “vintage” all-around performance.
• [14:35] Discussion on A’ja Wilson as the world’s best.
• [15:34] Phoenix’s path to a comeback—more physicality.
• [19:34] Alyssa Thomas’s struggles dissected.
• [21:36] Why Phoenix can have hope as series returns home.
• [24:35] Hosts’ expectations that Phoenix will respond in Game 3.
• [25:07] Las Vegas’ multitude of offensive weapons.
• [26:28] The advantage of Aces’ depth.

---

Tone and Style

The hosts strike a balance of incisive basketball breakdown, wit, and a conversational style, illustrated by friendly banter (“Ninth is a slight exaggeration…” [02:43]) and clever analogies (“They know the moment…this is a different level of how to win a game.” – Marcus Thompson [06:45]). The tone is sharp but enthusiastic, with respect and real insight for both teams.

---

Summary for Non-Listeners

This episode delivers a thorough, engaging “film session” on Game 2 of the WNBA Finals:

• **The Las Vegas Aces have taken a commanding 2-0 series lead backed by star turns from Jackie Young (historic 21-point quarter) and A’ja Wilson (“best player in the world”).
• Defensive adjustments, depth, and versatility separate the Aces from Phoenix.
• The Mercury need to toughen up, find ways to get scoring from bench and role players, and rediscover Alyssa Thomas as facilitator.
• There’s hope for Phoenix—returning home, the crowd advantage, historical precedent, and the promise of “every game a new story” in a best-of-seven.
• Ultimately, the Aces’ array of weapons and composure make them look like favorites, but the series isn’t over yet.

Stay tuned for Game 3 recap—the hosts promise to break down all key developments the next morning, no matter who wins.

---

Transcript

[Amazon Business Announcer]

How can you free your team from time consuming office tasks? Amazon Business empowers leaders to not only streamline purchasing, but better support their teams. Smart business buying tools enable buyers to find and purchase items fast so they can focus on strategy and growth. It's time to free up your teams and focus on your future. Learn more about the technology, insights and.

[Paige Desorbo]

Support [e-mail] Hey, I'm Paige Desorbo and I'm always thinking about underwear.

[Sabrina Merchant]

Underwear.

[Hannah Berner]

I'm Hannah Berner and I'm also thinking about underwear, but I prefer full coverage. I like to call them my granny panties.

[Paige Desorbo]

Actually, I never think about underwear. That's the magic of Tommy John.

[Hannah Berner]

Same. They're so light and so comfy. And if it's not comfortable, I'm not wearing it.

[Paige Desorbo]

And the bras? Soft, supportive and actually breathable.

[Hannah Berner]

Yes. Lord knows the girls need to breathe. Also, I need my PJs to breathe and be buttery, soft and stretchy enough for my dramatic tossing and turning at night. That's why I live in my Tommy John pajamas.

[Paige Desorbo]

Plus they're so cute because they fit perfectly.

[Hannah Berner]

Put yourself on to Tommy John.

[Paige Desorbo]

Upgrade your drawer with Tommy John. Save 25% for a limited time at tommyjohn.com comfort See site for details.

[Sarah Gibson Tuttle]

Raise your hand if you want your nails to look perfect all the time. Me too. I'm Sarah Gibson Tuttle, the founder of Olive and June. And this is exactly why we created the Gel Mani system. We wanted to make it possible for everyone everywhere to give themselves a beautiful manicure at home with our tools and our gel polish that lasts up to 21 days. Each manicure with our system comes out to just $2. That's right, $2. No more 60, 70, $80 salon chips that take hours. Now you can paint your nails on your time and love them more than ever. And by the way, when people ask you where you got your nails done, you're going to proudly brag that you did them yourself. And here's a little something extra. Head over to OliveAndJeune.com and get 20% off your first gel mani system with code DIYGEL20. That's code DIYGEL20. 20 for 20% off your first mani system at OliveAndJune.com DIY GEL20.

[Ben Pickman]

Hello everyone and welcome to no Off Season presented by Amazon Business. I'm Ben Pickman.

[Sabrina Merchant]

And I'm Sabrina Merchant.

[Ben Pickman]

And today on the show, a very special post Game two WNBA Finals edition. We are joined the third person of our team on site in these Finals, the great Marcus Thompson. Marcus, how are we doing after game two?

[Marcus Thompson]

I am pretty good. Just for the audience to know this is like our ninth take so I'm just happy to get through this part.

[Ben Pickman]

Ninth is a slight exaggeration, a little hyperbolic. Yeah, I would say our setup to this episode was about as smooth as the Phoenix Mercury's night, which is to say not very smooth at all after.

[Marcus Thompson]

That was a smooth transition though, sir. That was smooth.

[Ben Pickman]

Thank you. I appreciate that, Marcus. So as we then just teased, the Las Vegas Aces were the Victor of game two, 9178. They moved to 2, 0 in this series. I'm just going to walk through the big things to know from this game. Phoenix actually played a very good first quarter. 27, 24 lead. But it was really in the second quarter where things swung. Las Vegas outscores Phoenix by 12 in that quarter. Jackie Young took over the third. She scores 21 points. And in the fourth quarter Las Vegas really cruised. This ends up being a 13 point margin. But the final score line, I think we will all agree, not indicative of just how convincing a win this was. So Sabrina, as we get into it, just what were the big takeaways for you? What will you remember most from this game to Las Vegas Aces win?

[Sabrina Merchant]

Well, the Aces won game one because of the depth of their roster, right? Jewel Lloyd, Dana Evans really carrying them off the bench. They won game two because of their star power, because of Asia Wilson and Jackie Young being better than everybody else on the court, combining for 60 points. As you mentioned, Jackie Young sets the WNBA Finals record with 21 points in the third quarter. An Aces franchise record with 32 points in the game. Overall, combined with Asia Wilson, they've got 60 points total. Like when your best players are that good. It's just I don't really know what Phoenix is supposed to do in that situation. And we saw if they're going to play at this level, the Aces are going to win pretty comfortably in this series.

[Marcus Thompson]

Man, I know what they should do, play better, level up. Man, they. Some ballers they did they can't afford unlike. Unlike Las Vegas who does have depth. Right. We saw it in game one. They just can't afford to have off nights from their best players. Like Satu did not have a good shooting night and did not take great shots either. And Phoenix is just struggling offensively. As long as Alyssa Thomas is being swarmed and hounded, they're doing such a good job of just taking away her ability to get in the middle and that's leaving Conicopper by herself out there. I mean, she's getting buckets, but it's not. It's not really effective. I think she was a minus 21 today, which is crazy because she was, like, the best player on the four. So they just need their stars to play well. They need Phoenix. They need the home crowd terribly.

[Ben Pickman]

Becky Hammond said that, you know, that is what makes them so tough. It's exactly what you guys are both saying, that on one night, it can be the bench, Evans and Jewel Lloyd combining to score 39 points, and the next night it's Jackie Young and Asia Wilson combining to score, what, 60 points? Asia was just two points away from 30. Had she scored 30, both, I guess her and Young would have been the first teammates in WNBA Finals history to have ever scored 30 points or more in a Finals game. And she basically joked that she's got to be better. And, yeah, maybe that was the only thing she did not do in this game. Las Vegas, like, I mean, there was no way they were going to play two. We weren't going to see two games that weren't their best games from their stars at home. Right, Sabrina? I mean, there was just no way that was ever going to happen.

[Sabrina Merchant]

Yeah. I mean, Las Vegas in, I guess, to give Phoenix, like, some hope going forward. Like, they have not been the most consistent team during this postseason. It's a weird thing to say because they end the regular season winning 16 games in a row. They, like, absolutely dominate Seattle in the first game of the first round, but they've been very up and down since then. It's not their offense, it's their defense. Right. And it wouldn't have been unexpected to me for the Aces to have, like, a slight defensive hiccup to start this game. And they did, but they just fixed it really, really quickly. Right. Becky Hammond said she's been using a lot of timeouts in her first quarters. Right. They sort of flipped the switch in the second quarter. Defensively, they only allow 10 points from the Mercury. So, like, I'm with you. I didn't think that their offense was going to be any worse than it was in Game one. But, like, I thought maybe their defense might have a little bit of a lag, but it didn't. And I think that's really the key here, is that they were just so locked in on that end of the court.

[Ben Pickman]

Marcus, do we think that Becky Hammond said at the end of the first quarter and in between quarters that she told her teammates, like, at some point, you guys have to play better on defense. She said, let's fix it now, not wait till after the game or halftime. Do we think she used some choice words in that, in the, in the timeouts, or do we think. How, do we think she motivated them in those, in those moments?

[Marcus Thompson]

No, I think she, I think she just used Jesus. That's what she said in the post game. She was like, I'm leaning on Jesus. I think she went in there and she prayed for them. I don't know. Nah, I don't, I don't think she. Does she actually have to say anything? I mean, one of the things I think we see from this team, like they are veterans, like, they know what to do. Jackie's just like, yeah, I'm done. Game one, I'm la, but I'll be fine the next game. And then she's like out there crossing people up and getting to the cup at will. I mean, that's one of the problems Phoenix have. This team knows how to win. They know the moment. I mean, Julie is playing incredible defense. We're talking about one of the great scorers of the league. It's just like locking in on defense. Like this is a team that knows how to win. And you know, Phoenix is good at that, right? They, they're great in clutch games. They're, they're great in the fourth quarter, but this is a different level of how to win a game.

[Ben Pickman]

Let's go to Phoenix in a little bit about what they need to do going forward in Game 3, but let's spend a little bit more on Jackie Young. Sabrina, do you want to tell the listeners what Jackie Young was wearing the day before, I guess Game two, What her attire was at practice and how it compared to the rest of her teammates.

[Sabrina Merchant]

Uh, this is a very long winded way of saying that Jackie Young was in street clothes at practice. She did not practice.

[Marcus Thompson]

She was kind of fitted though.

[Sabrina Merchant]

She looked cut, but she was not in, you know, aces workout gear. She did not get any shots up. She did not do anything physical other than getting treatment on Saturday. And she told Becky Hammond, like, didn't have my legs, I'll be fine for game two. Becky's like, I mean, if Jackie says something, I'm going to believe her. And that's absolutely what happened. Right? I mean, maybe it took her a little while to even get warmed up in Game 2, but 21 points in a quarter, like, you don't see that very often, apparently, unless you're the Phoenix Mercury who have seen 21 points from Jackie Young. In a quarter. But in a regular season game, we.

[Ben Pickman]

Should say 21 points is the most points ever scored by any player in any quarter in any finals game in WNBA history. That's a lot of enies, but that is a lot of history. And that is just how good Jackie Young was in this one.

[Marcus Thompson]

Yeah, no, she was awesome. Becky was talking about this. She's such a, like an athletic guard, right? She's strong, she's quick. If the shots going, you're not guarding her. It's just really that simple. She's hitting her threes and you now have to get out there. You just gave one of the best first steps in the league. Another advantage. So when she's on, she's too tough.

[Ben Pickman]

And she's definitely benefited from a vintage Chelsea Gray performance. I think, you know, we as the media, it took us a little bit of a time to ask about Chelsea Gray in Becky Hammond's postgame presser. And you know, that's kind of on us because she really did set the tone on the defensive end. I thought her hands were so active. Like we saw it from very, you know, the first possession, like any time Phoenix Mercury players were driving downhill towards the rim. If Chelsea Gray had an opportunity to strip them of the basketball, she did just that. And she really does. I mean her basketball IQ is so high. You saw that mastery on full display and you know, there were 3, 4, 5 passes, however many, she ends up with 10 assists that were just like, like breathtaking passes, you know, on a teammate's cutting to the rim or she's just swinging the ball with such pace that she really was a step ahead it like 10, 10 and 8, 8 rebounds. A vintage great performance.

[Sabrina Merchant]

Yeah, there was that one passage you had, I think with two seconds left on the shot clocks and Alyssa Smith just like a no look feed as Smith was cutting to the basket. And I mean if you're Phoenix, you played like 22 seconds of very good defense on this possession and all of a sudden there's Chelsea Gray eyes in the back of her head, eyes just everywhere on her head. Finding Melissa Smith in that moment and you could tell it was a big moment because all of the Aces bench players were doing Chelsea Gray's like trademark doing the camera reel thing. So that's how you know it's a good one.

[Ben Pickman]

That was a third quarter possession, right?

[Sabrina Merchant]

That was a third quarter possession.

[Ben Pickman]

And that possession. Glad that you highlighted because it came right after a Phoenix Mercury timeout. It was, you know, right as Phoenix still was within striking distance of the game. And they just could not get two stops in a row. I want to say for almost all of the third quarter, they were not able to get consecutive stops. Nate Tibbets called timeout. Coming out of the timeout, we saw a lot more defensive intensity from the Phoenix Mercury. And as you said, Sabrina, they play 22 great seconds of defense, and then, boom. Chelsea Gray finds an Alyssa Smith. It's a basket and it's kind of a backbreaker. Yeah, I mean, totally backbreaker. And, you know, epitomizes just the struggle that the Mercury had on that end of the floor.

[Marcus Thompson]

That's what happens when you grow up watching Teacher Pinocchio.

[Ben Pickman]

Yeah.

[Marcus Thompson]

You know, I'm saying dimes out the back of your head. There was one, I think Jackie Young turned into a 3, 4 and play where she's cutting across the lane and she does this really nifty bounce pass. And it looked like for a second Jackie had overran it.

[Sabrina Merchant]

Right.

[Marcus Thompson]

She turns and drops in the hook against the foul. It's like, how does she even see this? She is an elite level player. I would have. I mean, now she's not going to get it because there are some haters. But I had. I had Chelsea Gray, Finals mvp. But I feel like it's going to be Jackie now. Front runner, not going to be Asia Wilson. No.

[Ben Pickman]

Y' all hyper Jackie yet?

[Marcus Thompson]

We haven't even mentioned Asia's name yet.

[Ben Pickman]

We're going to get there next. So Asia Wilson, she scores 28 points in this game, 14 rebounds. She took just 16 shots in game one. She took 23 here in game two, Jackie Young and Asia Wilson, they combined to score 60 points. Asia, if she gets one more basket than her and Jackie Young would have been the first pair of teammates in WNBA Finals history ever to score 30 or more points in a game. I asked her about it post game coming up, just too short. She said, I gotta be better. It's basically the only thing that she needed to be better at tonight. Sabrina.

[Sabrina Merchant]

I mean, but speaking of, like, impressive Asia Wilson stats, this is the third game in her Finals career that she's had at least 25 points and 10 rebounds. That is the only player in WNBA Finals history to do that as she broke a tie with Brianna Stewart. So, you know, good company at the top of that list. But I. I mean, how are we deciding that Jackie Young is Finals mvp?

[Marcus Thompson]

Like, it's going by your own hype. I was just jumping in on it.

[Sabrina Merchant]

She was so good defensively in this one. I mean, you think about, like, what the Aces were able to do on Alyssa Thomas, like, it starts with Asia Wilson as the first line of defense. Like, she's the reason why, you know, the guards can dig in and, you know, get their hands in on her dribbles. But I just thought, like, she was excellent on both ends of the floor, like, demanding the ball in that second quarter. She had 20 points in the first half. I mean, she only had 21 points in the entire entirety of game one. She's just like Jackie Young says this. All of the attention goes to Asia Wilson when you're an opposing defense, and that allows everybody else to flourish because there are openings for the rest of them, right? Like, Asia is commanding the looks.

[Marcus Thompson]

Oh, no question. And then, like. Like Ben saying, second quarter, this thing flipped. And that was the quarter where Asia's like, all right, I got this. We're not gonna have a repeat. Phoenix comes out making all these shots. They get 27 in the first quarter, and then it's like, shut down everything. You're not scoring, and you can't guard me. And when Asia does that, like, there's nothing you can do. Like, I mean, you probably on the other end, maybe hit some threes, like, but if you're not doing that, you're not getting anything in a paint, and you can't guard her. And then Alyssa Thomas has fouls, so she can't really be physical. Like, that was a recipe for disaster. Once she does that, you're just in big trouble.

[Sabrina Merchant]

Think about, like, their big performances, right? Like, Asia goes off in the second quarter. That's the quarter that they win by 12 Old Phoenix to 10. Right? Like, even when Jackie scored 21 in the third quarter, they. It was still the 30 to 24 in that quarter. It wasn't the overwhelming margin as when Asia really exerted her will on this game.

[Ben Pickman]

And the foul trouble, I think, was significant in the first half for Alyssa Thomas, right? She finishes the game with five fouls, I believe. Right. She has, yeah, five fouls in this game, but she picked up her third with 3:30 to go in the second. Nate Tibbets took her out very briefly. And they don't really have another answer for Asia Wilson. Not that any team often has one.

[Sabrina Merchant]

I mean, is Alyssa an answer for Asia Wilson?

[Marcus Thompson]

Yeah, the best one.

[Ben Pickman]

They have certainly the best one. I mean, they tried Dejana Bonner out. They tried Natasha Mack to mix success. I mean, he finally put Kalani Brown in late. I mean, right? And, you know, maybe he puts her in.

[Marcus Thompson]

I'm just saying. Coloni Brown shut her down for that last bucket is all day.

[Ben Pickman]

That was it maybe. That was maybe the only possession that Asia seemingly struggled. But they didn't have a very good answer. And Alyssa Thomas's foul trouble really did not help them. Like, we saw multiple possessions at they would put Jackie Young in Asia in a screen and roll and at would just sag off. And it's just pick your poison. Like, Jackie's going to beat you off the dribble or she's going to draw contact or Asia is then going to roll and post up or just roll and get an easy finish. Like, and again, 60 points between the two. No. Good answer.

[Marcus Thompson]

I mean, she's the best player in the world, like, and that, to me, that's the thing that's very clear so far in the series. Like, whatever, Both teams are good. Both teams have great players. You know, Alyssa Thomas is an MVP finalist. The best player in the series is Asia Wilson. And until you solve for X, you're in trouble. They just have to figure that out. But the options are very scarce. It has to be Alyssa Thomas. She's got to at least match it somehow, and she just didn't do that in game two. They need to play better in game three.

[Ben Pickman]

Let's get into the Phoenix Mercury side of this and what they need to do in game three. So again, this is the first ever WNBA Finals best of seven. So while no team in WNBA playoff history has ever come from down 20 in a series to win it, this is, you know, the best chance that any team has ever had because, you know, the Aces still need to win two games, not just one more. So, Sabrina, when you look forward, I mean, give some Phoenix Mercury fans some hope here. What do they need to do differently in game three when the series flips back to Phoenix?

[Sabrina Merchant]

I think your hope comes from the fact that we just saw a series where the Aces were really struggling against the Indiana Fever, right? Like, there was a level of physicality that Indiana was able to reach that was giving Las Vegas some difficulty. And that was a shorthanded Indiana team like Phoenix. Admittedly, they're not as deep as Las Vegas is, but I think they have as much depth as that Indiana team does. And, you know, considering all the injuries that they were sustained before the playoffs. So, like, they just have to ratchet it up, right? Like, things are too comfortable for the Aces in the half court. And if you can just, I think, muck up the game a little bit more, maybe the. The way it's called changes a little when you get on your home court in Phoenix, I think that's probably to be expected. But, yeah, I think, like, there is a blueprint that was laid out by the fever that if you just bring a little bit more physicality, bring a little bit more pressure, you pick up points a little bit higher. Like, they're just making things a little bit too easy for Las Vegas right now.

[Marcus Thompson]

Yeah. They also have to make shots. I mean, that's a big, big deal. And their defense is impacted by their inability to make shots. To me, it felt like they wanted to repeat the first half of last game, and they just came out firing, just chucking away, and I don't know if that's their best approach. Right. I mean, the difficulty is so much of this is based on Alyssa's penetration. And once they take that away, they did it with zone. They doing it, like, even when they don't go zone, the help is ready. So they're trying to, like, get inside without Alyssa. It's just. They just haven't done that a lot. So they got to figure out a way for Copper to get downhill, to get SATU from. Just stop. Like, oh, I gotta open. Look, let me fire it away. They gotta figure out another way to get in the paint. They can't just make a couple passes over the perimeter and shoot Satsu.

[Ben Pickman]

Really. I mean, two of nine from three, she felt like she ends up scoring, what, 21, 22 points, but, like, forced up a lot of shots. I mean, Nate Tibbets was talking about the second quarter in particular and how their offense just got stagnant. The ball was sticking, that it wasn't pinging from side to side. Their shot diet, their shot profile, I mean, just wasn't very good. Like, and. And a lot of one shot possessions. I mean, it was tough, quick.

[Marcus Thompson]

Yeah, just. I mean, they're just coming down first. Look, firing. I mean, especially with a defense anchored by Asia Wilson. You have to play the long game like you're going to have a cold spell. And if you. If you just get this stretch, they're going to run on you. You got to wear down. You got. You got to get inside. You got to force it in there. That's what you see Alyssa trying to do, but she's turning the ball over when they're. When she's not getting a foul crawl.

[Ben Pickman]

The other thing that I think is, you know, maybe alarming is the wrong word, but Phoenix needs more out of their bench, right? They got six points out of their bench tonight, and I want to say four of those were, you know, in the final few minutes of the game by players who, in Game three, I don't know how much we're going to see Keanu Williams or Kalani Brown, I don't know.

[Marcus Thompson]

They almost came back.

[Sabrina Merchant]

From this being a very interesting fourth quarter.

[Ben Pickman]

I mean, that's true. Cat. Westfield had a three that was almost cut it to nine. We turned to each other. We're like, could this happen? It's a little early. And the three was. Did not fall.

[Marcus Thompson]

And yeah, it wasn't particularly close.

[Ben Pickman]

Yeah. But, you know, Phoenix got eight points from their bench in game two. They got 16 points from their bench in game one. Sammy Wickham's got to give them something. Dwana Bonner's got to give them something on offense. You're talking about, you know, needing to stretch the game out, that cold spells are inevitable. Marcus. But, like, you know, the key to weathering a cold spell is getting production from other players when your stars go cold, and they just have not gotten that at all.

[Marcus Thompson]

I think we saw Copper kind of change it a little bit. She decided to get inside, slash a little bit more because she, you know, she was getting them up, too. She was just making them. Right. Her shots have been really pretty good these first two games. It's feeling good, but they just got to get inside. I feel like they all have to do that. I mean, Bonner, if she makes that corner three in Game one, this thing is probably different. And that just shows you how they just. They got against the other person eventually. I mean, they're here because Whitcomb hit that three, right. Like, they need the other players. I don't. You. They just don't know who it is With Vegas. You know who it is, right? You know who's coming. I think that's their difficulty. It's kind of a crapshoot, which makes him hard to guard, but also makes it a little bit less reliable.

[Sabrina Merchant]

I still think the problem is that Alyssa Thomas just wasn't good enough at facilitating, like, the adjustments have taken her out of it. You know, just her handle wasn't quite good enough in this game. I can't remember if we talked about this.

[Ben Pickman]

I mean, we saw, like, her handle literally. Literally on the first offensive possession of the game, the Las Vegas Aces doubled her in the post, forced a turnover, and they were off and running. It started on possession, one of this game, and it went on from there, right?

[Sabrina Merchant]

Like. And Marcus was saying earlier that their offense is hurting their defense. Right? Like, all those live ball turnovers get Vegas and running, like, that's what Phoenix wants to do, right? They haven't been able to do that. Vegas has been more disciplined in that respect. But I think, like, you can talk about all you want, how the others need to get going. Like, they get going because Alyssa Thomas finds them in outstanding position. Right. And, like, that just wasn't happening because of the way Vegas was taken away the middle of the fight.

[Marcus Thompson]

What does she do, though? I mean, if they're going to put 2, 3 on her, like, what, what. What is the actual violence question? Right after the game, we asked her about it, and she didn't want to say it, but she was very frustrated at the ref. She's complaining about the foul. She gets in foul trouble. You can see it's bothering her as she can't get going, like. But I don't know what she's gonna have to benefit from. A couple of calls to loosen it up, but they're gonna keep doing the same thing.

[Sabrina Merchant]

I was a little surprised that they went away from that middle pick and roll so early. Like, I realized, like, the zone had taken away. Taking it away at the end of game four. But, like, if Vegas is willing to go into his own, I feel like there's other ways you can attack that defense if you just, like, force them to do that, right?

[Marcus Thompson]

Absolutely.

[Sabrina Merchant]

I think the fact that they took away so much of Alyssa Thomas's ball handling at the top of the he was kind of confusing to me.

[Marcus Thompson]

They almost conceded before they had to.

[Ben Pickman]

And we just saw. I mean, Kalia Copper went off again in the first half. But I think to your point, a couple minutes ago, Marcus, like, you know, it was great for them that she had the production, but as a result, it seemed like no one else really got into a rhythm, right? That it was just, you know, copy and caught and getting downhill. And again, she was super productive in this game. She finishes with A team high 23, but like everyone else, very much lagged behind her, and they almost leaned on her. And if she wasn't getting anything going, then they just started to force up shots, and that's how they fell behind the way that they did.

[Marcus Thompson]

Yeah. Reserves play better at home, though, right? So that's. That's Phoenix there. There's your hope, Mercury fans. Your. Your reserves are going to hit some shots at home. You won't be 3 for 19 to start the game.

[Sabrina Merchant]

Your other hope is that Vegas in 22 and 23 won the first two games of the finals at home and then proceeded to lose game three on the road. So in pretty like alarming fashion.

[Ben Pickman]

And I do think, I mean, as we all know from watching a ton of basketball like game to game, we see a lot of changes, right? And we see each game and Becky Hammond acknowledges each game is its own story, so to speak. Not to use a corny analogy, right.

[Marcus Thompson]

Especially in the seven game series.

[Ben Pickman]

Especially in a seven game series that, you know, game one we're having this conversation about just how close the Phoenix Mercury were. That if Alyssa Thomas makes those two free throws among a gazillion other plays, if Sasu Sabli doesn't pick up a technical foul late in that game to give Las Vegas a free point, DB hits that corner three that Marcus mentions. Like if any of those things happen, the Mercury win game one, and if things happen the way that they do in game two, then suddenly it's a one one series. We are a, you know, we are prisoner of the moment, reacting to what we have just seen.

[Marcus Thompson]

Can you imagine if the Mercury win game three? We're going to be like, the pressure's on Las Vegas. They got, they gotta win.

[Sabrina Merchant]

I'm gonna call this out ahead of time. If the Mercury win game three, I'm not gonna do that.

[Marcus Thompson]

It like it has shifted to Asia.

[Ben Pickman]

Most important, we're going to get this down in one take in game three. Marcus, when you join us in Phoenix.

[Marcus Thompson]

But yeah, let's hope I have an actual microphone with xlr. I'm using like the jerry rig hood hook up right now. But you know, next time we're gonna be all right.

[Ben Pickman]

We are going to be all right. We'll see if the Phoenix Mercury. All right. I mean they certainly say that they still believe in themselves. I think they're going to get out of here on Sunday right after this game. Like they left to go back to Phoenix. Certainly it is helpful that. Well, how long is the flight, Sabrina? An hour, an hour and 20. So they're going to be home by west coast live.

[Marcus Thompson]

That's how we do it exactly for you guys.

[Ben Pickman]

I'm excited to do it as well for this one series. They'll get home, they'll get comfortable. Nate Tibbett said pre game that he's going to watch the film where he usually watches the film the next day to approach her with fresh eyes. They also now have Monday to prepare. They have Tuesday to prepare. Wednesday is an evening game. It's a five o' clock tip. More time to prepare. They're hoping to flush it, get back in front of their fans and then write the Ship. I mean, that's what they're really holding onto here.

[Marcus Thompson]

Yeah, I feel like Alyssa Thomas will play better. Yeah, like that's. She's just too good for that. She's too smart. She'll figure something out. If she plays better, they'll play better. And at least I do think game three, especially knowing how. I mean, this is. This is a must win game for Phoenix, right? You go down three, zero, like, you're done. That's it. So you'll get a desperate Phoenix team. You get a better Alyssa Thomas, you'll get a crazy crowd like that. If Asia pulls this off, like, it's just. Just crown her. Because this you're gonna get. You're gonna get the best of Phoenix. And if they can't beat Las Vegas, then. And I think they're gonna win. I. I do think Phoenix is gonna win game three. I want Phoenix to win game three because I want a series.

[Sabrina Merchant]

I would expect Phoenix to win game three, two. I mean, depending on how they look then. And we'll talk about game four. But I think with the crowd like Marx was talking about, just the players, like, they didn't seem that disappointed after game one even I feel like they should have been more. Because they let one get away.

[Marcus Thompson]

I agree 1,000%.

[Sabrina Merchant]

Right. But they didn't seem that disappointed. But they. And they were like, so overwhelmingly confident coming into this game that they could make enough tweaks to figure this one out. They were pissed off after Game 2, as they should have been. And I think that there is going to be a requisite level of, like, internal reflection and like, no, we need to get this done now.

[Ben Pickman]

I think the big thing, though, that I've, you know, I don't think we talked enough about it heading into the series. Sabrina, when we were thinking about the series or writing about it was just Phoenix seemingly has not one way to win, but the roadmap for them to win four games. I think it will be very similar. Game two game. Yes. SATU might have a big game here or AT might have, you know, a transcendent game there, but it's going to be the three core players. Yeah, producing. It's going to be ET Getting downhill, scoring in transition, opening things up for, you know, SATU and Copper on the perimeter. The thing that really will stay with me from these first two games is just the multitude of weapons that the Las Vegas have like that, you know, we saw Jewel Lloyd, what, she scores 18 in game one. She scores nine in, you know, a normal nine in game two. On her birthday. On her birthday. We should add her 32nd birthday. Had never played a game on her birthday before. She told me pre game. How's that for a little fun fact?

[Marcus Thompson]

Yeah.

[Ben Pickman]

Late in the season. Yeah, but she's playing some finals games.

[Sabrina Merchant]

I think she meant like high school and stuff too.

[Ben Pickman]

Yeah.

[Marcus Thompson]

Just never in this crazy late. Right?

[Ben Pickman]

Yeah, that's October. I mean, whatever.

[Marcus Thompson]

Early high school.

[Ben Pickman]

Dana Evans, you know, she has what, how many score? 21 in game one, five in game two. Like, there's just so many options on this Aces team. That is. That's the takeaway for.

[Marcus Thompson]

That's a. That's a big deal. I mean, the Mercury strength is just. They have mat they're matchup nightmare. Like matching up with those three is so tough. We saw, we saw Minnesota just have a hard time when one's going, you gotta adjust to that. Another one gets you. But it just feels like even when they were going like the Aces just have enough, they can go shot for shot with you. And I think we. There's a part of us that maybe forgot about that after watching that Indiana series. Because, you know, obviously Sims is cooking you like, yo, why is this so hard? Right? But they can go. They're going every time they make a run. The Aces hit just enough shots. Whether it's Chelsea or Jewel, somebody's making a shot to keep them from getting away. That's firepower.

[Sabrina Merchant]

Yeah. I think I believed in Phoenix's defense too much after that last series when the matchup is just different here.

[Marcus Thompson]

Yeah, absolutely.

[Ben Pickman]

We'll see how much the Las Vegas Aces experience matters as this series flips back. We'll see whether or not or to what degree the Phoenix Mercury can rally. But those are big questions. The one thing I can guarantee is that we will be there after game three to break it all down, both on the site and on this podcast. So, Marcus, Sabrina, that is all we have for you today. We will be back after game three Thursday morning with all of our game three reactions. Remember, our cadence is changing a bit during the 2025 WNBA Finals for however long it goes, we'll be dropping episodes the morning after every game. So stay tuned to that. Please follow us and on Instagram. I know we normally don't plug our Instagram ta no off season. Our great social producer, Bri. I can't say it enough. I said it after game one. I'll say it again after game two. She's doing a great job posting behind the scenes press conferences. Anything you want to see from this series and while you're at it. After you follow us on Instagram, please follow us on YouTube. Please subscribe. Tell your friends to check out the show. Wherever you listen, your shows give us a rating. Drop a comment we want to hear from you. And of course, head on over to our partner, the Yahoo. Sports Hub for more [e-mail] womens-sports on behalf of the Athletic, the great Marcus Thompson and Sabrina Merchant, I'm Ben Pickman. Thank you for listening and we will see you next time.

[Amazon Business Announcer]

No Off Season is hosted by Zena Cato with Chantelle Jennings, Sabrina Merchant and Ben Pickman. It's produced by Tanika Burrell. Our executive producers are Andrea B. Scott and Cassius Fleming. Our theme music is by Marcus Bagala. Monica Compton is our video editor. Shannon Ryan is managing Editor of Women's Basketball at the Athletic. Jesse Burton is our head of audio and Tim McMaster is director of Audio operations. How can you free your team from time consuming office tasks? Amazon Business empowers leaders to not only streamline purchasing, but better support their teams. Smart business buying tools enable buyers to find and purchase items fast so they can focus on strategy and growth. It's time to free up your teams and focus on your future. Learn more about the technology insights and Support [e-mail] Morning Zoe.

[Paige Desorbo]

Got donuts Jeff Bridges why are you still living above our garage?

[Marcus Thompson]

Well I dig the Matt and I want to be in a T mobile commercial like you teach me.

[Paige Desorbo]

So Dana oh no, I'm not really prepared.

[Ben Pickman]

I couldn't possibly AT T Mobile get the new iPhone 17 Pro on them.

[Paige Desorbo]

It's designed to be the most powerful iPhone yet and has the ultimate pro camera system.

[Marcus Thompson]

Wow. Impressive. Let me try. T Mobile is the best place to get iPhone 17 Pro because they've got the best network. Nice.

[Paige Desorbo]

Jeffrey, you heard that them T mobile.

[Marcus Thompson]

Is the best place to get the new iPhone 17 Pro on us with eligible traded in any condition. So what are we having for launch?

[Paige Desorbo]

Dude my work here is done.

[Ben Pickman]

The 24 month credit is on experience beyond for well qualified customers plus tax and 35 device connection charge credit sending balance due to payout for earlier Cancel Finance agreement. IPhone 17 Pro 256 gigs 1099.99 and new line minimum 100 plus a month plan with auto pay plus taxes and fees required. Best mobile network in the US based on analysis by Oaklove Speed Test Intelligence data 182025 is@t mobile.com hey I'm Paige.

[Paige Desorbo]

Desorbo and I'm always thinking about underwear.

[Hannah Berner]

I'm Hannah Burner and I'm also thinking about underwear, but I prefer full coverage. I like to call them my granny panties.

[Paige Desorbo]

Actually, I never think about underwear. That's the magic of Tommy John.

[Hannah Berner]

Same. They're so light and so comfy. And if it's not comfortable, I'm not wearing it.

[Paige Desorbo]

And the bras? Soft, supportive, and actually breathable.

[Hannah Berner]

Yes. Lord knows the girls need to breathe. Also, I need my PJs to breathe and be buttery, soft and stretchy enough for my dramatic tossing and turning at night. That's why I live in my Tommy John pajamas.

[Paige Desorbo]

Plus, they're so cute because they fit perfectly.

[Hannah Berner]

Put yourself on to Tommy John.

[Paige Desorbo]

Upgrade your drawer with Tommy John. Save 25% for a limited time at tommyjohn.comfort. see site for details.