How International Players Are Quietly Reshaping Basketball

Summary

No Offseason: The Athletic Women's Basketball Show

Episode: How International Players Are Quietly Reshaping Basketball
Date: January 13, 2026
Hosts: Zena Keita & Sabrina Merchant

Episode Overview

This episode explores the growing impact of international players in women’s college basketball and the WNBA. The hosts, Zena Keita and Sabrina Merchant, discuss how global talent is not only changing the style and quality of play, but also contributing to evolving NCAA and WNBA rules. The episode delves into the pros and cons, challenges around eligibility, and the broader implications for the sport, with a focus on both current events and the philosophical questions facing women’s basketball.

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Key Segments & Insights

1. Deal or No Deal: WNBA CBA Negotiations

[02:23–09:19]

• The deadline for the WNBA’s new CBA extension passed without an agreement; the state is now “status quo”—no lockout or strike, but time is tight.
• Visual union solidarity: The WNBPA staged a protest outside the NBA store, bringing a giant inflatable rat to symbolize management’s stance.
  • “This is a large inflatable toy rat… as a symbol of management and how they have treated the players union…” — Sabrina Merchant [04:04]
• Season prep threatens to overlap with NCAA March Madness, risking the WNBA’s media attention.
• Main point of contention: Salary structure.
  • WNBPA proposal: Split gross league revenue 50–50 (project average salary ~$800K—up from $120K currently).
  • League proposal: Split 70–30 of net revenue (after league expenses)—maximum salary could reach $1.3M, but average less than union demand.
  • Quote: “The expenses form a higher percentage of the overall budget… They need to split the net revenue versus gross revenue.” — Sabrina Merchant [08:20]
• Both sides agree massive salary increases are needed, but the union wants more transparency about “expenses” and better alignment with player leverage.

2. College Basketball Power Rankings & Standouts

[09:19–24:20]

• Only three unbeaten women’s teams remain following Texas’ loss to LSU.
• LSU vs. Texas: LSU's win signals their resurgence (Mikayla Williams’s leadership, toughness, rebounding focus).
  • Kim Mulkey used Angel Reese’s “M.E. bounds” mantra to motivate players: “…it was all part of the fabric of ‘no rebounds, no rings.’” — Sabrina Merchant [11:04]
  • Mikayla Williams: emerging as LSU’s fulcrum, “Her shooting… her playmaking has been phenomenal… This could very well be my team.” — Sabrina [13:08]
• Ohio State: Big ranking jump (24th → 12th); new stars like Jelani Cambridge drawing Asia Wilson’s admiration.
  • “She just looks like Kennedy Carter out there…so physical inside, finish[ing] so well at the rim…” — Sabrina [16:36]
  • Impressive development of international players: Elsa Lemola (Finland), transitioning successfully to the U.S. style.
• Other teams: UCLA’s Lauren Betts is experimenting with her game, Notre Dame’s Hannah Hidalgo is delivering star performances.
  • “Since Hidalgo started in her rookie season, she has five 30-point games against AP ranked opponents… JuJu Watkins, Caitlin Clark, Paige Bueckers—the company she’s in.” — Sabrina [24:20]

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3. International Players: Impact & Rule Changes

[28:13–49:06]

a. The New International Wave

• International players have always featured in NCAA hoops, but the NIL era (Name, Image, Likeness payment) incentivizes global talent to choose U.S. college ball over junior professional contracts abroad.
  • “In the NIL era, there’s more incentive for these players to want to come…you can play for some money in college.” — Sabrina [29:15]
• Coaches like José Fernandez at South Florida pioneered international recruiting to compete with elite programs.

b. Rules, Loopholes, and Gray Areas

• NCAA rules have historically been strict about pro/amateur status, but blurred lines now exist due to NIL and international movement.
• Eligibility confusion: Even top coaches like Corey Close (UCLA) admit, “No; everything is just changing in real time…we don’t know what the third party, like, you know, collectives are allowed to do…” — Sabrina [33:51]
• Players can join college teams mid-year after playing abroad—rarely possible before.
• Notably, international players can be drafted to the WNBA and then play NCAA—a “new element” reshaping the recruiting and roster-building calendar.
• MNEMONIC: “Show says no”—the old compliance officer’s mantra about not accepting extra benefits [32:17].

c. Pros & Cons of International Talent

• Pros:
  • Diversifies and raises the standard of play.
  • Fosters cultural connections and new basketball styles.
  • Gives fans the chance to follow international players’ journeys more closely.
  • “It’s awesome…just to continue to globalize the game and foster these connections.” — Sabrina [38:05]
• Cons:
  • Feels more like pro sports; undermines college’s traditional distinctions.
  • Midseason imports (e.g., Alicia Tonabis to South Carolina) feel like trade acquisitions, eroding the “college” identity.
  • Raises equity questions: International players have more flexible pathways to pro basketball compared to rigid U.S. system.
    • “You could decide to just go to college first, then Europe, then the WNBA…There are limited pathways for American players.” — Sabrina [42:28]

d. Is the System Unfair to U.S. Players?

• U.S. prospects must play until 22, while international players can be drafted at 19, or even return to college after being drafted.
• “The lack of clarity in these rules is not necessarily disadvantaging American players, but there are limited pathways.” — Sabrina [44:06]
• “Yeah, I do think it’s a disadvantage.” — Zena [44:52]

e. Notable International Players Reshaping College Teams

• Nastja Claessens (Belgium), Kansas State: Holding WNBA draft rights but opted for college, bringing flexibility and key contributions.
  • “She’s averaging 11.4 points…been a pretty good player for Kansas State.” — Sabrina [46:06]
• Blanca Quinones (Spain), UConn: Ex-pro, now with the Huskies—offering a mature, physical style that complements U.S. stars.
  • “She started the season kind of wild…there’s no better person to get her game in more control than Geno Auriemma.” — Zena [48:42]

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4. Fun & Games: Something in Common

[51:41–56:22]

A lighthearted game segment where Zena quizzes Sabrina on commonalities among prominent WNBA players, e.g.:

• Lisa Leslie, Candace Parker, and Nneka Ogwumike — all first-round picks, Sparks, champions, MVPs, etc.
• Cheyenne Parker-Tyus, Cameron Brink, Brittney Griner, Breanna Stewart — all top 20 all-time NCAA shot blockers.

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• On salary barriers:
  “I don’t know what’s more stressful: this CBA negotiation or planning my wedding!” — Zena Caida [06:26]

• On the blending of pro and college:
  “It feels like I’m watching pro basketball conducted by the NCAA and then pro basketball conducted by the WNBA.” — Sabrina Merchant [40:37]

• On rule confusion:
  “The coaches don’t even really understand what’s happening… everything is just changing in real time.” — Sabrina Merchant [33:51]

• On NCAA tradition:
  “I like that there’s been a distinction, that there’s something fundamentally unique—and maybe a little weird—about college sports.” — Sabrina Merchant [40:37]

• On international talent pipeline:
  “I do think it’s a disadvantage.” — Zena Caida, on U.S. prospects having fewer pro pathways [44:52]

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Timestamps by Segment

| Timestamp | Segment | |-------------|-----------------------------------------------------------| | 02:15–09:19 | WNBA CBA update: what’s at stake, solidarity action, salaries | | 09:19–24:20 | College power rankings, LSU-Texas analysis, standouts | | 24:20–28:13 | Quick hits: standout individual performances (Notre Dame, etc) | | 28:13–49:06 | Deep dive: International players and shifting NCAA/Pro rules | | 51:41–56:22 | Game: “Something in Common” (WBB trivia) |

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Episode Tone and Style

• Conversational, energetic, and informed.
• Mix of analytical breakdowns and candid, sometimes humorous commentary.
• Hosts regularly weave in personal perspectives and audience engagement (soliciting feedback, referencing past inside jokes).

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Summary Takeaways

• International player influx is already reshaping both the competitive and cultural landscape of women’s basketball at all levels.
• NCAA rules—and their enforcement—are becoming less clear, especially concerning professional experience and eligibility.
• The blending of professional and college norms through NIL, portal, and midseason acquisitions is challenging traditional ideas of what college sports “should” be.
• There are benefits to increased parity and exposure, but also valid concerns about equity, identity, and the “spirit” of college basketball.

For fans, staying tuned to these shifts is crucial—change is the only constant, and women’s basketball is at the global vanguard.

Transcript

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[Sabrina Merchant]

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[Zena Caida]

Hello everyone and welcome to no Off Season. I'm Zena Caida.

[Sabrina Merchant]

And I'm Sabrina Merchant.

[Zena Caida]

And today on the show we're going around the world, y'.

[Sabrina Merchant]

All.

[Zena Caida]

We are diving into international basketball and how it intersects with the college season and wnba. Also asking the questions why international players are allowed to compete, how it's evolving the landscape of the game and whether it's good or not for college hoops. We're also going to look at how the pro game is impacted and some of the rules around it and our thoughts around some of those rules. And we're going to highlight some of the international college players that are making a splash right now on their teams. But first, it's time for Deal or no Deal. CBA negotiation extension deadline has officially come and gone. Man, Friday feels like so long ago and there there's still no agreement. Sabrina, now you've been following these negotiations closely. You just recently wrote on the most recent update. So fill us in. What's going on with this negotiation?

[Sabrina Merchant]

Well, you answered the most important question, which is there is no deal. And unlike previous times that we've had this discussion, there is also no extension. We had, you know, the original CBA opt out was triggered to end on October 31, 2025. The first extension went until the end of November. The second extension, as you mentioned last until last Friday, January 9th. And this time the two parties decided that we're not going to extend this agreement any longer. And that doesn't mean that we're in any sort of work stoppage.

[Zena Caida]

Right?

[Sabrina Merchant]

We've talked about this pretty extensively. There's no lockout. There's no strike. There is a period of status quo which basically resembles normal working conditions.

[Zena Caida]

Speaking of the lines and those, I wouldn't call it picket lines just yet because they're not on a strike just yet. But you are seeing the players union showcase, the fact that they are standing together and apparently they're standing together behind a huge rat. What happened in New York? Please explain this for us.

[Sabrina Merchant]

Okay, so I want to clarify this because it is New York and there are large rats in New York City. But this is a large inflatable toy rat.

[Zena Caida]

Thank you.

[Sabrina Merchant]

Not a real physical rat. The rat being a symbol of management and how they have treated the players union so far, at least in the eyes of the wnbpa. They had this large inflatable rat with them at a protest outside of the NBA store last Friday, which was the day that the extension expired. And I don't think like this is any real news. You know, it's been very clear how the PA feels about the NBA and the WNBA's offers thus far. And to have a visual representation of that on the last day of the extension is it's colorful, sure, But I don't know what it's actually doing to the prospect of the negotiations at this point.

[Zena Caida]

I'm learning that there are inflatable Rats to be had on the market. I did not know that that was a thing until that moment. So there is that. And just as a remind, if and when a deal is done, what are all the things that the WNBA must execute in order for a season and everything to keep kind of going back on track.

[Sabrina Merchant]

So we have first up, the expansion drafts for Toronto and Portland, which as a reminder, the expansion draft for Golden State was conducted at the beginning of December in 2024, prior to the Valkyries entering the WNBA. You also have free agency, which again includes every veteran player in the WNBA other than Kalani Brown and Lexi Brown. You have the college draft, which has to take place in April, and then training camp leading into the course of the regular season. So we're already a little bit behind of what the pace was with Golden State. The longer this drags on, the more we drag into free agency. And keep in mind, technically, there is enough leeway heading into the regular season to accomplish all of these things. But then you're talking about, are we going to have free agency during March during the NCAA Tournament when front offices are potentially at their busy scouting college prospects. And think about all the news that the WNBA could hope to capture during free agency during this massive transformational off season and just going to be buried by NCAA tournament coverage. Or this is something that unrivaled face last year, Right. When its championship game was the weekend of Selection Sunday. Right. So all of these things happening at once, I don't think is beneficial to the WNBASE product because of all of the attention that they could stand to gather during this really fun transaction window. It's just going to get overshadowed by the most important sports property of the year for basketball, which is March Madness.

[Zena Caida]

March Madness, period. I don't know what's causing me more stress. This window of time that the WNBA and the WNBPA are essentially creating for themselves with this negotiation or trying to plan my wedding for this year. I am just like feeling the tension in my body. And speaking of that, the number one tension that continues, the main point of contention between these two bodies continues to be salary structure. Remind us of the latest of where this stands. Cause I know it's evolved a bit and we've seen the numbers grow and people's eyes have gotten wide, but it's still not enough for what the players are looking for.

[Sabrina Merchant]

Right. So the union's proposal is essentially that the gross revenue, all of the revenue that the WNBA takes in, is split immediately between the players and the owners. And their current proposal is that about 30% of the revenue goes to the players and the remainder goes to the owners. And then from there you can draw out a salary cap, which in their current projections is about 10 million in year one of the agreement, which would be about an average salary of $800,000 per player. And again, we're coming from a situation where the maximum salary is $250,000 per player. So an average of 800,000 is a massive jump. The WNBA, the league office, is proposing a system whereby they take out expenses from league revenue first. And there is debate about how much money should be taken out in the form of expenses, if it's all exactly what the league needs to carry out its business. This is a point of contention from the player side, but once they take out the expenses from league revenue, they are saying that 70% of that remaining net revenue will go to the players and 30% will go to the owners. And so that's a jump up from their original offer of 50% of net revenue going to the players. Now it's up to 70%. And that would result in a maximum salary of about 1.3 million in the first year of the agreement, about an average salary of $530,000, which again, massive jump from the maximum salary of 250 that's present, still a little bit less than the 800,000 that the players are suggesting. And the league's contention is that even though it is a smaller league than the NBA, than other professional sports leagues, it still has a very high value of expenses. The amount of money it costs to open Barclays center for a Nets game versus a Liberty game is still the same, even if you're not bringing in the same amount of revenue from one versus the other. So expenses form a higher percentage of their overall budget than they do for a league like the NBA, which is why they need to split the net revenue versus gross revenue.

[Zena Caida]

Okay, yep, I see what the league is saying. I also see what the players are saying. Forex is a lot different than just 2x from where you are in terms of your max.

[Sabrina Merchant]

And again, that's 4x of average salary versus, like the maximum salary. You know, average salary is only about 120 right now.

[Zena Caida]

Those players want to maximize, so I completely get it. Okay, well then, Sabrina, it sounds like you still have a lot of work to do to keep up with Deal or no Deal. So we appreciate you keeping us up to date. Uh, and right now we gotta shift to the other part of your job, the Sabrina scale. Okay. This is women's College basketball keeping us up to date with everything. It's been a while since we've seen your rankings. We know Ben has been helping us out as well on that front. But we are down to just three unbeaten teams in women's college basketball after Texas suffered its first loss of the season. It was a slow burn, Sabrina. I ain't gonna lie, that game was a little slow in the beginning. Okay. I remember watching it with my partner. He was like, can anybody make shots? Like, what's going on right now? It was a low scoring game at half, but they picked it up in the second half. But ultimately LSU stepped up to the moment they beat Texas 70, 65 and your latest power ranking, Sabrina, you've got Texas slipping from number two to number three. So not too much ground loss while LSU dropped from number five to number nine. And I know folks have got questions. How do they beat the number two team in the country and still fall? Well, they had all seasons.

[Sabrina Merchant]

That's what happens when I haven't had a rankings published in three weeks.

[Zena Caida]

There you go. There you go. Okay, so explain it to us. Break it down. They did lose to Vanderbilt recently and Kim Mulkey said that the Lady Tigers weren't tough enough. And looking at that game and looking at how Mikayla Williams was playing, Flaje was hitting shots, I mean, everyone was just doing their part to be able to get that win. Mokey said they were tough from start to finish. What did you see in that level of toughness that they displayed?

[Sabrina Merchant]

Yeah, so just to clarify real quick on the rankings, the last time we published a power rankings in the athletic was probably December 22nd that week. So before LSU had suffered any losses. So the fact that they have gone down is more a reflection of the two losses that they had in that point than the two wins that they just, you know, earned over Georgia and Texas. But as far as the toughness component, I think, you know, I mentioned this in story that ran on the Athletic on Sunday. Bob Starkey, associate head coach of LSU, put the M.E. bounds shirt from Angel Reese in the locker of every player this week because, you know, they got out, rebounded pretty heavily against Kentucky in their one loss. And then Vanderbilt was really good on the offensive class in their win over lsu, especially in that fourth quarter when they came back from that seven point deficit. And if there's anybody to signal the importance of rebounding, it is Angel Reese who won once, led the nation in rebounding and twice led the nation in offensive rebounding and of course has coined her own term rebounds. And it was all part of the fabric of no rebounds, no rings. And I think attacking the glass was the most important thing that LSU could have done in this game over Texas. It's something that you saw in their game against Georgia, which, you know, admittedly less of a strenuous opponent than Texas. But you know, I wrote about this in the power rankings. Like there's that one player where Grace Knox coming in from outside the free throw line for an offensive rebound, gets pushed a little bit out of the way by Justice Carl and then does the push ups as she's coming back up. Like, I'm so glad that Rebecca Lowell.

[Zena Caida]

Pointed that out because I would have.

[Sabrina Merchant]

Missed it the first time around. But just the toughness to attack the glass for an out of area rebound, you know, like where she was relative to the basket when the shot went up and then just a little bit of like, hey, I got this. Like I know I was knocked down, but a couple quick push ups and then we're going to jump right back up. That was very much the mentality of lsu, right? You know, you end up rebounding Texas by almost 10, winning the second chance point battle even though they did lose the fourth quarter again, which was a common theme from those Vanderbilt in Kentucky games. At least there was a big enough lead to the point where it didn't all go away in that fourth quarter against Texas. And I think you mentioned Mikayla Williams. I came into the season thinking that Flaje Johnson was going to be LSU's best player. And I still think she's having a very good season. But Mikayla Williams is the fulcrum around all of this because she is their leading scorer. Her shooting is just like it's so hard to get her in a position where she can't get a clean shot off. Like, you think about that three that she hit to put them up, seven with about two minutes left to play. Like those are just the type of difficult shots that she can take. Every jumper she takes just looks so smooth. And then her playmaking has been phenomenal. You look at the way she's able to leverage her scoring into opportunities for other players. I think she has just been so tough in terms of taking control of the offense, being sort of a veteran leader even though she's a junior on this team. Although there's only a couple seniors. So being a junior is pretty old relative to the rest of the roster. I think she has just taken an enormous leap, enormous step forward where she's been able to defer to the likes of Angel Reese and Anissa Morrow, even Flaje over the last few years. And it's like now, yeah, maybe Flaje is still here, but like everybody else is gone. This, this could very well be my team. And I think the way that she is performing has been really impressive. And you saw just, you know, 20 points, I think. Was it five steals in this game? Just a really nice all around performance from Michaela Williams that earned LSU its first win against the top two opponents since 2008. And mind you, they've won a national title in that span, but their first win against an AP top two opponent since 2008.

[Zena Caida]

I don't think I knew that. That's crazy. Yeah, no, it was so much fun watching that game for Mikayla Williams. So poised of a player. And Texas played really great defense. I think in the first half they were getting stopped, they were plugging gaps. They were making it really tough for the likes of even Flauj and my Leisure Wiley, like trying to figure out what decisions to make. You saw a lot of turnovers in that first half from LSU because they just didn't know where to go. And everyone was everywhere. Jordan Lee was everywhere. And then you saw Justice Carlton kind of struggle with foul trouble and making just being really physical. And I think that her absence and even Preston coming back, like it just, they, you didn't feel their impact that you typically have. Um, and ultimately LSU just stood up. Like they stood up. They made tough shots. They, they hit the shots they needed to at the free throw line. So it was a fun game overall, but those were. I don't know if you guys knew, Sunday was crazy when it came to games. It was stacked from the morning to the evening. It was stacked with such good games back to back to back. One of the games on the east coast, Ohio state down Maryland 89, 76. They had balanced scoring, multiple players in double digit scoring, hitting threes left and right. And the funny thing was Ohio State was struggling in the first half. It was all Oluche Okonwa. She was everywhere. She was getting to the basket, she was hitting tough shots. Yarden Garzon also hitting really big threes as well throughout the game. But ultimately when Oconnowa went out for with foul trouble, that's when Ohio State was like, let's capitalize baby. Let's eat. Okay. Their best defender, Sabrina and I's favorite former Duke Devil, was not on the floor. And really Ohio State was just able to capitalize. And in the second half they just out physicaled Maryland. They were on the boards. Maryland typically beats their opponents on the glass by 15 or more rebounds. I mean, they typically have that under control. And Ohio State was like, don't worry, we got this. So you have the Buckeyes ranked number 12 this week, which is a huge jump from number 24. Of course, we have had a bit of a gap since our last ranking, but what was it that, you know, beyond this win? This is a huge win. But what, what are you seeing right now from them that's caught your eye and doubled their value in the top 25 ranking?

[Sabrina Merchant]

Well, I think Jelani Cambridge is playing as well as any player in the Big Ten. Honestly, like, she's definitely the best guard in the Big Ten right now. I mean, I guess Gianna Niepkins is having quite a nice season, but a lot less is asked of her in that UCLA system than what is asked of Jelani. I mean, Asia Wilson comes to watch her against Illinois, you know, her favorite player, and she goes out and scores 41 points and like, closes out the Illini on the road. And then you follow that up with this fantastic performance against Maryland. I had a friend tell me that, like, she just looks like Kennedy Carter out there, right? Like, not much of a jumper really. Although she did hit a couple threes late against Marilyn that helps seal that win. But, like, just at that size, the way she's able to be so physical inside, finish so well at the rim, whether it's the floaters, whether it's getting all the way to the cup, whether it's that short midi. Like, even though you know exactly where she wants to get onto the floor, defenses can't stop her from getting there. And she's so effective scoring inside. And that's a very Kennedy Carter thing. We don't need to get into all the Kennedy Carter things. But the scoring inside is what made her so good at Texas A and M and what made her, you know, a lottery pick in that 2020 WMA draft. And you're seeing a lot of that from Jelan. And you know, we, we talked about the Big Ten last week and like, which team was the second best team in the Big Ten. And we kind of like, you know, just glazed over what Ohio State was doing because, you know, they hadn't played a ton of good teams during the non conference. They only really played UConn. And they got trucked by UConn. And frankly, everybody gets trucked by UConn unless you're Michigan. And that's why we decided on Michigan. But you look at what they've done since they played ucla, pretty close, and then they've won every other game on their schedule. And, yeah, maybe it took a little bit more time to figure out exactly what they had on this roster because they lost an enormously big piece in Cody McMahon, which, again, you can check out the power rankings, all the good things she's doing at Ole Miss. It seems like it's been a win, win for everybody, right? What Ohio State identity has been able to figure out in her absence. And Cambridge has just been just awesome, right? Like, her efficiency has been so much better this season, even with higher usage in Cody McMahon's absence. You look at what you said with the rebounding, right? Like, this is a team that traditionally makes up its possession differential because of its press, right? Like, because of the turnovers that they forced. And they sometimes, like, have a bit of a deficiency on the glass. So for them to go into Maryland, a Maryland team that had only lost once all season, only once. And that wasn't at home, right? So this is their first home loss of the season. Like, winning conference games on the road is not easy, and they made it look very easy. And you mentioned, right, Alucia Kahnwa sort of didn't get to play as much as you probably would have wanted because of the foul trouble. I maintain that college coaches are a little too conservative when it comes to foul trouble. Like, they won Alucci's minutes. They probably could have had her on the floor a little bit more often.

[Zena Caida]

After that second foul. They definitely should have kept her a little bit more because that's really when Ohio State got a little bit more of their confidence. But, yes, continue.

[Sabrina Merchant]

Yeah, totally. So, you know, you look at the Big Ten, and, yeah, Michigan, you know, collected another win, another few wins this week, actually. But I look at how Ohio State's playing and how Jelani Cambridge in particular is playing. And Ohio State is just a team that's, like, consistently in the mix here, right? Like, they've won Big Ten titles in the last few years. Yeah, their team looks different. You know, there's no more J.C. sheldon. There's no more Cody McMahon. The talent is a little bit different, but they still have an excellent perimeter star. They still have a system that they clearly believe in. And now that we're going to see them against teams that contest them a little bit, they're not phased, right? Like, yeah, so they lost to UConn and UCLA. Like, everybody has lost to UConn and UCLA. This is still a very good basketball team. Team in there.

[Zena Caida]

Yeah. I think Ohio State overall has a really great job of integrating their transfers. Kennedy, Cambridge being one of those coming from Kentucky, going over and being able to play with her sister, she was really good in this game as well. If you're missing your Chloe Kits fix, Kylie Kitts has been really good. She was very, very good in this game, hitting her mid range shots and just being active on the glass as well. But overall, Ohio State's, they are in the mix and we will not sleep on them. We will not be sleeping on them. You like a little bit of the perimeter play too, right Sabrina?

[Sabrina Merchant]

I actually like. They're big. You know, there's Finnish girl, Elsa Lemol. I think she's in her second year at Ohio State. She sort of looked a little phased last year just by the transition coming in from Europe. And she's been really good on the glass this season. I thought the way she held up against Lauren Betts really in that UCLA game told me more than anything I've learned from the wins because, you know, they needed a defensive rebounding presence. They need somebody who can just stand tall and give you an option to sort of contain the bigs one on one. That's not as much of a big deal on Maryland because they don't have, you know, that type of frontcourt presence. But I think having a player like that in the Big Ten and for those non conference games is gonna be super helpful for them. And she looks just so much more composed year one to year two.

[Zena Caida]

You did my job for me. Big on bigs. I love that. I love that. Okay, cool. Let's keep it moving. What else did you see? Because there were, I mean this weekend, not the only weekend of course, of big games. There's been a lot that's happened since your last rankings. But anything that popped out to you on the women's college scale.

[Sabrina Merchant]

Yeah, I just want to quickly mention ucla. Like I know there's been a lot of discussion about Lauren Betts. Has she taken a step back from her, you know, fantastic junior season when she was national defensive player of the year into this year, I think the def. Defense still looks as excellent as it was a year ago. UCLA is the number two, you know, offense in the country. They've stepped into the top 10 now in defensive rating and you just look at what they're able to do with Lauren on the court. I mean like teams just don't try to go at the rim when she's there. Like you think about, I looked at this Nebraska game and like the minute Lauren comes off the court, now it's sienna at the 5, like Burt Prince immediately drives to the basket. It's the kind of thing you're just not doing when Lauren Betts is on the court. And you know, I think she's tried to change her offensive repertoire a little bit this season just to sort of expand her game for what it's going to have to look like at the next level. And you know, like one of the stats that really stood out to me is she's taking 32% of her field goals in the mid range compared to 5% last year. And like that's just an enormous jump. And I don't think reflective of where Lauren Betts is best, you know, as an offensive player. But it is about her trying to figure out all of the things that she is capable of doing as she goes to the next level. Because, you know, college, as much as a UCLA fan, just wants Lauren to win games, for ucla, it's all about trying to get better for, you know, what comes next. So I think there just has to be like a little bit of grace understood with her trying to fill out different parts of her game while also being as good as she can for ucla. And I think it makes more sense to try to do that on the offense where UCLA is already so good that they can afford to, you know, experiment a little bit. So that's just one note I had on Lauren bets. And then, you know, it's been a very weird season for Notre Dame. All of the exodus they had with the transfer portal and graduations to the wnba and it feels like it's Hannah Hidalgo surrounded by did we just meet yesterday? And sometimes like Hannah Hidalgo really good with those players that it looks like she just met yesterday. Right. Like that game that she put off against North Carolina. One of the more fun things I think to see in college basketball is just when Hannah Hidalgo turns defense into offense because it's got to be so frustrating just to try to dribble the ball around her. And then she's very good at just immediately taking that and then going in the other direction. She had seven steals against North Carolina to go along with her six assists, eight rebounds. Very casual 23 point win against a ranked North Carolina team.

[Zena Caida]

Right. These are stats you would think she's putting up in the non conference games and the games that you're like those bye games. No, she did that against North Carolina. And the crazy thing is that you started the game, you saw her going, being really aggressive on defense, but I think it had to. When Hull blocked her shot, I think it, something flipped. Like something in her mind was like, oh, your bench was celebrating that bet. She went at them.

[Sabrina Merchant]

And like obviously helps Hidalgo when you have a teammate like Vanessa DeJesus who's hitting five or six threes in the course of a game and opens up the floor a little bit. Cass Prosper had a really nice game. If KK Bransford can come back, that helps, you know, sort of with the ball handling duties for Hidalgo. But just, just to keep in mind, like since Hidalgo started in her rookie season, she has five 30 point games against AP ranked opponents. And the other players on this list who also have 5:30 points against AP ranked opponents in that time, JuJu Watkins, Caitlin Clark, Paige Beckers.

[Zena Caida]

Yes.

[Sabrina Merchant]

So maybe we haven't talked a ton about Notre Dame this year and there's good reason for that because there's a lot that has to go right for Notre Dame to win games. But Hannah Hidalgo still as good individually as she has ever been. And even if the team hasn't been the same around her, I think it was just worthy to point out that like she is capable of doing some very, very special things.

[Zena Caida]

I'm very happy you did that. And I also, on that note, want to point out that the North Carolina teams have questions to ask themselves because UNC had five points in that third quarter. Five points in that third quarter. And it was so frustrating to watch. Like they couldn't hit sh. They couldn't get into the paint. You don't necessarily think of Notre Dame as like this defensive stalwart. So it was just like what's happening with the offense, unc, what's going on? They gonna have to figure some things out. But shout out to Duke, they did beat Sanford. So you know, we'll give them that. Okay, let's keep it moving. On the other because you just talked about Lauren Betts adding a part to her game which is always going to be great for helping us ucla, it's always going to be great for helping her in the tournament, but is specifically going to be great. We're talking about all of these international players that she's going to be going up against not only in the college level but eventually in the wnba. And on the other side of this break, we're going to talk about international play and how it's infecting. Infecting that might have been a pseudo, a little bit of Freudian slip there. How it's affecting the game on both levels.

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And we can port Your existing numbers over for free. Quo no missed calls, no missed customers. All right, let's get into it. International play is really changing the game for us Women's basketball from the college courts to the wnba. When you're competing with top talent from around the world, it's going to raise the bar. You're seeing people's skills go up, you're seeing the strategies out on the floors change, you're seeing the schemes overall just be different. And we're seeing it in the wnba. It's definitely bringing some fresh perspectives, some new coaching, some new approaches to the sport. So what does this mean for women's college basketball and the Wood? Sabrina, before we dive into the impacts, let's just start with what's happening right now. What is the scene of international play? We're starting to see some names. They're a little different, a little bit more culturally different from us right now. And I love that overall for the game. So break it down for us.

[Sabrina Merchant]

Right? So international players have always been a part of the NCAA system. You know, we had Jose Fernandez on the show in December and he talked about how one of his recruiting advantages at South Florida when part of a mid major school, they had to differentiate themselves by getting international players, by expanding the pool of talent because they weren't recruiting the normal four stars and five stars because they were going to the bigger programs. So bringing in international players always been a part of the NCAA game. It's just now in the NIL era, there's obviously more incentive for these players to want to come because they don't have to think about, oh, I can play a professional contract in Europe or I can play for no money in college. Now you can play for some money in college. And that's why we're seeing, I think, a greater wave of players coming to the ncaa. And they're not just coming from overseas, they're coming after having played professionally overseas. So you look at a player like BLANCA Quinones for UConn, you know, and she has played professionally in Europe and now Gino Oriema has talked about like her habits are just different than high school players who are coming in, even transfers who are coming in, like she conducts herself like a pro. And that raises the level for, you know, her. It raises the level for the rest of the UConn players, you know, and it just makes it even more challenging for players to play against UConn because now in addition to Sarah Strong and AC Fudd, you've got this former professional player as the third leading scorer also putting up double figures every game. But, yeah, I think the finances of college basketball, which we mentioned a little bit last week, are just continuing to evolve, and that makes this a more desirable place for, you know, players all over the world to want to join, because you can get the. The developmental component of playing in college basketball. You can get the popularity component of playing in college basketball. Right? Like, I mean, as much as we talk about the growth of the wnba, college basketball, still the most famous women's basketball, you know, program, shall we say, in the United States, and then you get the financial benefit of, like, nil and collectives and all the other sorts of monies that are coming into college basketball.

[Zena Caida]

Right? Which is great. Which we're all happy for, making sure that these women are valued and get their share of the value they're creating. Now, the question has always been, like, now with international players, the rules, what's allowed? How does this work? Right. You just mentioned Blanca Quinones, who I think is a perfect example of someone that played pro and then now has the opportunity to play in college. And we know that even. Remember, my college kind of compliance officer would always say, her name is Shoshana. So she would say, show says no. That was the rule. If somebody wants to offer you something, if somebody wants to do, you know, you had to say, show says no. And what we had was a lot of folks, especially at Ivy League school, where a lot of folks end up playing in not just basketball, but in rowing, in international sports of that sort. If you played and competed in international competition, you could only play in a manner where you were not getting paid. Right? You had to be an amateur so you could. You could play for your national team. You just could not, you know, accept endorsements or things of that nature just to keep it clean. Now, it has been a while since I've played. If you guys want to go do the math, go look it up. You have too much time on your hands. But it's just been a while.

[Sabrina Merchant]

It's a very easy basketball reference, Church. Yeah, it's very easy to find.

[Zena Caida]

But you can know that I did not play in the nil era, right? Damn it. But I did not. So with that, knowing that it's changed so much in terms of what's allowed of international players and what's allowed, and with the nil aspect and no longer having that, it's still vague, but the line of demarcation between pro and amateur has now been. Been a little bit blurred. What are the rules? What's allowed in terms of who can come and who can't and what they're allowed to do. How does this impact or how do the rules impact the college system? And then also, what are the rules for the WNBA and when they can come in from an international space?

[Sabrina Merchant]

Yeah, it's a great question about what are the rules? Because I had a chance to talk to Corey Close about this over the weekend. You know, we had this big story in the men's college basketball side where a player who was drafted previously by the NBA and played in the NBA G League, which is a professional domestic league, went back to college and is playing for Baylor now. James Najee. It's a little different than what's happened on the women's side because we only just have one player in women's college basketball, Nastya Klassens for Kansas State, whose draft rights are currently held by the Washington Mystics. And she's playing, you know, for Kansas State. But historically, players who have played professionally in the US don't then get to go back to college in the US like, it's only very new that we're seeing players professional play professionally elsewhere and then come play college in the US but we can get into why the rules are different internationally versus domestic. That's a whole other conversation that we need to have. But essentially, if I sound a little convoluted talking about all these rules, it's because all of the rules are very convoluted.

[Zena Caida]

Yes.

[Sabrina Merchant]

And the coaches don't even really understand what's happening. Like, I mentioned with Corey Klose at ucla, she says, you know, I asked her, like, do you have a sense of, like, what the rules are at any given moment? And she said no, like, everything is just changing in real time. And, you know, we don't know, like, what the third party, like, you know, collectives are allowed to do. We don't know, like, how revenue sharing is going to work. We don't know if these players are going to be eligible. And like, as you're managing a program, you have to consistently keep up to date with all of the different possibilities. And, like, you're basically being negligent to your program if you're not taking advantage of all of the different loopholes. Right. Like, maybe people on the men's basketball side are upset that Baylor found this player who, again, was a former pro and is now playing in college, but they are doing what is legal under the NCAA rules. And so, again, it would be, you got to do your due diligence and make sure that you are Canvassing all of the potential talent in the college basketball world and the professional basketball world, you know, to play for your team in the ncaa. So, no, I don't really think I know all of the rules. I don't really know who's eligible for all of these, you know, programs. I mean, we just saw Texas Tech bring in a player mid season. We saw, you know, South Carolina bring in their center from France mid season. And neither of those players have actually stood up for the team yet, but the expectation is that they will soon. And that just is a very new element to college basketball. Right. Usually you start your season with your roster, and that is the roster that you end the season with. And every so often, you have a high school player who classifies a little bit early, enjoys the team mid season, and maybe they do a gray shirt where they just hang around the program for a few months and then start to play as a freshman. Or maybe they start playing a little bit earlier. We mentioned Chloe Kitz earlier. She did that at South Carolina. But this idea of just, like, poaching talent from across the universe and, like, bringing them in mid season, that's a very new thing for college basketball. And it's kind of exciting. It's a little different, but it is significantly changing the fabric of how we think about college sports.

[Zena Caida]

Yeah, if you guys were watching the South Carolina game versus Georgia, which was a blowout, you might have seen a peek or gotten a peek at Alicia Tonabis, who is the new French transfer to South Carolina. And it was so fascinating because we know that South Carolina is so well known for their bigs. Right. And so you're looking on the court and you're seeing Medina Cot, and then you're looking on this bench and you're seeing Alicia Sunabees, and you're seeing, okay, Don Saley. We see you internationally recruiting. We're seeing you, like, kind of changing.

[Sabrina Merchant]

Up, as if it already wasn't hard enough to recruit against South Carolina because they get the Joyce Edwards, you know, and all of these great players. Now you also have to worry about them getting the best French players.

[Zena Caida]

Pretty much, this is what Don Saley wakes up and does. She's like, team usa, let's just look down who's in the younger camps. Cool. And let me just also check all of the other teams across the world and just be like, let me just see who's available big specifically. But yeah, so you might have. You got. You might have taken a peek and maybe saw a resume. Her mom got into the FIBA hall of Fame in the year like 2000, I believe. And I mean, this is a. This is not a quiet player. Blanca Canyon is a quiet player. Like, these are not. These are like big time talents that we still have not seen. Texas Tech, Stephanie Okachikwu. We'll see what happens with her. She's not like, actually eligible just yet. We've seen the rounds of the film 7:1. Yeah, yeah, we notice. We notice these players could be changing a lot of things. Whether they're changing the makeup of a team and what they're capable of doing. They're sealing. Right. Any 71 player comes into the league, that's probably going to change a little bit of things from a college perspective, for sure. But what it could also change is how we look at eligibility overall, what's possible, what's okay. Should transfers between schools be a thing? Like, could this completely change eventually how we look at college personnel and acquiring them preseason in the off season, but also mid season. So first I just want to ask you, Sabrina, let's. Let's talk it out. Like, what are the pros and the cons of having international play injected into particularly the college game?

[Sabrina Merchant]

Well, I think it's great that there is a wide variety of talent that is coming to play college basketball. It just.

[Zena Caida]

I agree.

[Sabrina Merchant]

You know, diversifies the player pool. You know, it brings in new styles of play. We've talked about, like El Salemla from Finland. I think all of the great teams in college basketball right now, most of them have some sort of international element, right? Like, you look at UCLA and they've got Charlie Sledger Walker from New Zealand and you look at UConn and they, they've got Blanca Quinones and you know, we're going to bring in Canada, right? Yeah. Still counts, right? All of these great players who want to play in the NCAA system. Because this, like, for so long has been the dream when you turn 18, right, it is to go to an American college and to play D1 college basketball. And for that dream to be extended beyond the boundaries of North America. Right. Because Canadian players have been coming in for a little bit longer. It's pretty cool, right? Just to continue to globalize the game of college basketball and foster these connections and bring in different styles of play, I think it's awesome. I think it gets weird when you start changing the time that these players join the team. It kind of feels like the addition of tornabies for South Carolina was like, oh, Chloe Kitts got hurt. Ashlyn Watkins is not playing this season. We Kind of need another big, let's see what we can do. And then they bring her in in January, and. And, you know, we had this conversation on the podcast about a month back about college basketball doesn't have a trade deadline. Right. Like, you can't improve your roster mid season. What you have is what you have, but apparently it's not. Right. Like, you can't. That will change your roster. Exactly. This is very new. So to me, it's more of, like, a headspace kind of wrapping my brain around this new concept, because there have always been these fundamental distinctions between pro basketball and college basketball, and now the lines are just starting to meld, and it's fine that the players get paid. That's great. But I think there's something. Something unique about the fandom of college basketball. And, like, the, you know, the way fans latch around a certain school and, like, that community, it's just different than professional sports. And there's just so many things, like, with these transfers and, like, basically college basketball free agency and players, you know, moving around at all times, that makes it feel a little bit too much like pro sports. And that's, again, I love the wnba. It's a great thing. I love a lot of professional sports, But I like that there's always been a distinction like that there is something fundamentally unique and maybe a little weird about college sports, that it is so rigid in its rules, but it's what it is. Right. And it's like this institution. And I've. I've always enjoyed, like, the. The oddities of it. Right. So I'm personally just having a hard time, like, grappling with all of the distinctions because, like, it just feels like I'm watching pro basketball conducted by the NCAA and then pro basketball conducted by the wnba.

[Zena Caida]

Ooh, that is a really good way to put it. And I think that this is the issue that is going to happen across college sports. We're obviously seeing it in NCAA football, men and women's college basketball, where the line is being blurred between almost looking at the NCAA as like, a de facto G league for, you know, these professional leagues. And I'll say this to add to the part about, like, the pros. I do like the fact that when you're bringing in international players earlier than what we've typically have, sometimes you do get to have the same journey with them that you typically have with American players. Right. Like, there's a reason why in the pro leagues, there are international players that people do not know well. Right. Whether it's historically they don't know their journey, they don't know their stories as well. It's because you didn't get to grow up with them the same way that you get to grow up with these homegrown products. And so I think that's a really nice point to it is like, oh, we know we're going to get to know these players before they get to the league and get to be a part of their journeys. And we won't have to be someone that's really into FIFA basketball or really in the weeds. We won't have to be Ben Pickman to be able to know what is happening with these players. So I think that's a really big pro. But I'm with you. I do like the fact that there was a distinction between how the NCAA worked and how the pro level worked in the W. Um, and now the lines are a little bit blurred. And I don't know. I, I'm very curious to hear what our, our listeners have to say about this. And I'm gonna also put out a call. Paul, if there's anyone listening to this pod that has a connection to someone at the NCAA that understands these rules, come on over. No offseason@the athletic.com we would love a breakdown because it is confusing. And the fact that you've got a coach of one of the top programs in the country still being like, don't really quite know how this works. Yeah, there's something to be said about that. So NCAA is almost like you just.

[Sabrina Merchant]

Try things and then tell the NCAA to tell you that you're wrong. Right. Like the whole adage. And it's for you. Exactly. For forgiveness rather than permission. Right. And I think about just how this continues to like, further divide between the options that American born prospects have and the options that international players have. Because if you are an American player and you want to play in the wnba, you go to high school, you go to college, you go for four years because you can't get drafted until you're 22. Maybe if you're a little bit older, you have an early birthday, you can get drafted after three years, but you still have to like be on track to finish your degree. And then you can go to the WNBA and by the time you get to the WNBA, you're about 22 years old or turning 22 at the end of that year. And if you're an international player, you could put your name in the draft when you're 19 years old and join the WNBA, then you could put your name in the draft when you're 19 years old and then go to college after that. Like Nastia Classens with Kansas State. You could decide to just go to college first, you know, and then like, oh, if that doesn't work for you, maybe I can go back to Europe and then reenter the draft pool even before I turn 22. Right. Like, there's just so many different avenues that exist for international players in a way that like, there's only one pathway that works for American players. I'm not saying that, like the system is rigged against American players. Like, obviously the college system has worked very well to prepare American players for the WNBA and all of the great stars. Like you mentioned, the homegrown machine works very well to produce like these massive names in women's basketball. But there is a little bit of lack of agency. Right. Like I think about Paige Beckers and Caitlin Clark and like, you know, they're in this, the start of their WMA career, but they're already like 23. I think Paige turns 24 this year, actually. And Dominica just turned what, like 20? Like, I think she's still 19.

[Zena Caida]

19 still, actually. Yeah.

[Sabrina Merchant]

So it's another way where I think like the, the lack of clarity in these rules is sort of not necessarily like disadvantaging American players, but it is continuing to showcase that, like, there are limited pathways. And as we talk about, you know, the CBA and all of these rule changes that are coming to the wnba, I think it is worth examining, like, are they limiting the rights of American born players when it comes to professional basketball? Especially as we see all of these international players taking advantage of all of these new routes in the ncaa. And maybe you could argue that, oh no, the NCAA is just professional basketball. They're doing just fine. They'll get to the WNBA when they get to the wnba. But it is interesting that all of these rule changes and special examples that we're talking about exclusively involve international players, at least on the women's side.

[Zena Caida]

Yeah. You know, Sabrina, I know you got a job to keep and you've got journalistic integrity and I respect that. But yeah, I do think it's a disadvantage. I'm just gonna go ahead and say that opinion. I do think it's a disadvantage. Amanda Zawi B. I think back to her decision to declare and leave early and how much pushback she got on that, like how much everyone made it seem like it was just such a problem for her to make the decision that she wanted to go, go sooner to the league. And Amanda's IB also has an international background and I hate that that's a feeling, whether an American has that feeling or an international player has that feeling. Like you don't know what people's circumstances are. You don't know who they have to support. You don't know what their situations are with their teams. I wish that people could have that freedom, especially if they don't have that clarity of what they exactly want to do. So I look at Anacia Clausens and her ability to come back and be able to play for this team. Like, what do you make of her contributions to Kansas State? Has it been a good decision for her to not have gone pro? And I also want to talk a little bit about Blanca Quinones also being able to do that same or have a similar decision making and playing for UConn and not continuing her pro career overseas. Like, what do you make of these two players and the impacts that they've had on their teams so far?

[Sabrina Merchant]

Yeah, Clausens is the second leading scorer for Kansas State. It's been like a tough season for Kansas State with all of their departures. You know, Aoka Lee, Serena Sundel, like a lot of of very high impact seniors who left via graduation last year. So a middling season, but a couple good wins thrown in there. I always think about that win that they had over Ole Miss earlier in the year, but she's averaging 11.4 points per game, four rebounds. Assistant of steel thrown in there. She's been a pretty good player for Kansas State there. 2 1/2 points per 100 sessions. Better with her on the court. I think if you wanted a developmental opportunity, playing in the Big 12 is probably pretty equivalent to playing in some of the lower league leagues in Europe. You know, she's from Belgium. Like I imagine, unless you're playing in like France or Turkey, like you're not getting that much better basketball than you are in the U.S. and again, I don't want to be dismissive of European leagues, but it's just a different opportunity if you want to come to the US if you want to try it out. Right. And again, the Mystics still have her draft rights, so, you know, when she finishes college she could join the pros. Personally, like, I don't know why you'd want to develop in college versus developing in the wnba unless you think you're not going to stick in the wnba. It sort of just delays that process. But also, so a team might be more inclined to keep you when you're 20 years old versus when you're 24 out of college. So I think what it highlights is, like, she just has a choice. Right. And she decided, I want to play college basketball. I want to go to an American university. Maybe I wanted to get a degree out of it. Right. Like, there are all these reasons why you could choose college basketball, and none of those are closed off to her because of the fact that she was drafted by the wnba, which, again, is very, very weird.

[Zena Caida]

It's weird, and I'll say it. I don't know if it's unfair. It's not unfair as in, like, she has found herself in a way that she's gotten an advantage, but it's a disadvantage, I think, to the American players that don't have the same option. And then quickly, on Blanca Quinones, I mean, I've been obsessed. She started the season kind of wild. She had to be tamed a little bit. And there's no better person to be able to get her game in more control than Ginoriemma, who. I appreciate that earlier this season, he was like, the mistakes that she's making, I get why she's making them. She's trying some stuff. She's. She's trying to be aggressive, and he didn't take that out of her game, which we know when you have the likes of Jinoriemma, that can be. Sometimes his MO Is like, break you down, build you back up type of thing. So you saw Blanca Keno in this game still be within the same ranks of just her being so fast to the basket and going downhill and just using her scythe to create space and such. But it just seems a little bit more within the system of what UConn wants to run, and obviously allowing Azy and Sara to still be the dominant figures that they are.

[Sabrina Merchant]

Yeah, I mean, I think you hit all the notes right there. It is very funny to see her with her, like you said, sort of wildness paired next to Sarah Strong, who is so disciplined, like, so perfect in executing just the dichotomy between the two of them, because they're obviously both so talented and so skilled and so capable of doing so many things. Just Blanca is, like, a little less, you know, careful with the turnovers and things like that. And that's fine when you have all of the talent on the team and, like, the ability to grow. And that's.

[Zena Caida]

Yeah, that makes sense. All right, well, we have a lot of questions still around international play, but I think that was a really great dive just to be able to know what the landscape is right now, what the possibilities are right now that call for the ncaa. If you want to come on, we would love to have you. But as for right now, we're just enjoying the basketball. We're enjoying the diversity of the game and all the new names that are coming into the mix. All right, let's close the show out. I got a fun game for Sabrina on the other side of this floor. Break. Thy ticket, lady Jennifer of Coolidge. Well, many thanks, good sir. Hereth my Discover card. They accept Discover at Renaissance fairs?

[Sabrina Merchant]

Yeah, they do.

[Zena Caida]

Here. Discover is accepted at the places I love to shop. Getth with the times. With the times. You're playing the. Yeah, and it sounds pretty good, right? Discover is accepted at 99% of places.

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[Zena Caida]

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[Sabrina Merchant]

So download Royal Kingdom now on Google.

[Zena Caida]

Play or App Store. All right, Sabrina, we are going to do a nice, fun little easy one of something in common. I know you guys have heard this game. You guys like this game. Just putting some names together and seeing what is it. That is the Common thread. Now, Sabrina, do you have a little bit of. A little bit of love to start for you on the first question? Okay. It's a little bit towards your corner of the woods. Question is, besides playing for the LA Sparks, what else do these players have in common in the wnba? This is Lisa Leslie, Candice Parker and Neko Gwymake.

[Sabrina Merchant]

All I can think of is that they played for the Los Angeles Sparks.

[Zena Caida]

Right.

[Sabrina Merchant]

They were. Well, Lisa Leslie wasn't a number one pick because she was part of the allocated drafted players, so that wouldn't be it. I don't know. They all won a title for the Sparks. They were all MVP for the Sparks. Those are all correct.

[Zena Caida]

They're all correct. Exactly. You're all correct.

[Sabrina Merchant]

So what else am I supposed to say that they haven't got?

[Zena Caida]

You were on the right track with that very first one, but you veered off. They were all first round draft picks, so you just hit all three. There you go. They're all. So that's. So we kept. We kept it easy to start. Okay, let's keep it going to the next one. Similar concept of a thread. The question is, what does Erica d' Souza and Veronica Burton have in common? Super simple.

[Sabrina Merchant]

There's only two players.

[Zena Caida]

Yeah. Just keeping those two.

[Sabrina Merchant]

I gotta tell you, I do not know a lot about Erica d'. Souza. What do I know about Veronica Burton? Did. Did they both go to Northwestern? I don't know. Were they both taken in an expansion draft?

[Zena Caida]

Yes. Ding, ding, ding. Look at you. See, you know what you're doing. You know exactly what you're doing. Erika d' Souza was taken to the Atlanta Dream from the Connecticut sun, and then Veronica Burton was taken from the Connecticut sun to the Golden State Valkyries way back when, when the Atlanta Dream was starting up in 2008, that's when Erica D' Souza was part of but.

[Sabrina Merchant]

The last two expansion drafts.

[Zena Caida]

So yeah, quite literally. So there you go. Okay. Okay. Now last but not least, besides having WNBA careers, what do Cameron Brink, Brittney Griner, Brianna Stewart and Cheyenne Parker Tyess have in common?

[Sabrina Merchant]

Okay, so we've got Brink, Stewie BG and Cheyenne Parker Tyus.

[Zena Caida]

Yes. Besides having WNBA careers, what do you.

[Sabrina Merchant]

Think I was going to say, like National Defensive Player of the Year before we got to Cheyenne Parker Tyus. You're on the right track. Disrespecting her as.

[Zena Caida]

You're on the right track. You're on the right track. Keep it going.

[Sabrina Merchant]

Let's see. I don't even actually know where Shine, Parker Tyce went to college.

[Zena Caida]

Middle Tennessee. Tennessee.

[Sabrina Merchant]

Middle Tennessee. Okay.

[Zena Caida]

Definitely think defense.

[Sabrina Merchant]

Yeah. Did they all, like, average, I don't know, like two plus blocks a game in college or something or they might have, but. Okay, basically.

[Zena Caida]

Actually, no, I'll. I'll let you keep going. Okay, let's close. It's not necessarily a number, but it is something of a ranking.

[Sabrina Merchant]

Are they like. I mean, I can't imagine Stewie's the leading shop blocker at UConn because they've had like, centers there, but actual people to do this. Yeah, I don't know. Yeah, maybe. Maybe they were the leading shop lockers at their schools when they graduated.

[Zena Caida]

Well, they were leading shop blockers in the country and. In the country.

[Sabrina Merchant]

In the country.

[Zena Caida]

Wow. Okay. In the history. In the history. Their top 20 all time career blockers leaders. In women's college basketball, Brittney griner is number one at Baylor, she had 748.

[Sabrina Merchant]

I was not familiar with her.

[Zena Caida]

Number 15 at Sanford, she had 424 during her time. Cheyenne Parker Tyus at middle Tennessee had 417 blocks. And Brianna Stewart, she came in at number 16. And Brianna Stewart, number 17 at UConn came in with 414 blocks. So very impressive block leaders. I wonder who else. Who do you think could get into that list or in the top 20 from right now? Anybody come to mind?

[Sabrina Merchant]

I mean, I think of Lauren Betts when I think of shot blocking, but I don't know that she's played enough her freshman year to really get on this list.

[Zena Caida]

We'll see.

[Sabrina Merchant]

That's fair.

[Zena Caida]

That's fair. All right. We'll see. We'll see. Well, great job, Sabrina. I think you, like you not only got the answers, you blew it out the park for something in common.

[Sabrina Merchant]

Just provided all sorts of different answers.

[Zena Caida]

I love it, but that's exactly why you're so that. This is your job. This is what you do. Appreciate you doing it. I hope you guys were playing along. Maybe you were able to get something that Sabrina got out of the full list. And let us know what else you want to hear from us, because that's going to be all for today. We got to close this show out. We're going to be back on Friday, and if you haven't already, do your job, y'. All. You got to follow the show, okay? If you're on YouTube, make sure you're subscribed. Make sure you leave a comment. Tell us you like us. Tell us you like my hat. Isn't it pretty? Thank you. If you're watching. It's a, it's a beautiful New York Yankees hat. You might not be a Yankees fan. Sorry, Sabrina, that might be a. I can find.

[Sabrina Merchant]

I have no problem with the Yankees.

[Zena Caida]

Oh, okay, okay, okay. Cool, cool, cool. You know, Dodgers fans, I didn't know, I didn't know how it worked out.

[Sabrina Merchant]

But we did lose to the Yankees.

[Zena Caida]

You're right. You're absolutely right. You're absolutely right. I just felt like it was a west coast, east coast thing. But you're listen, as a person that is affiliated with neither, I just like the fashion. So either way, leave a comment. Make sure you tell your friends, tell your mama, tell your cousin, tell your coworkers, tell your boss. Actually, they might give you a promotion to come listen to no off season and drop us a comment. Drop us a five star rating. We love to hear it. And then head on over to our partner at the Yahoo. Sports hub. I've been doing that. They've had some really great game recaps if you like, you know, miss anything. So definitely check out the Yahoo. SportsHub sports Yahoo.com womens-sports and on behalf of the Athletic, Sabrina Merchant and I, Zena Kada, we appreciate you listening. We'll see you next time. No Off Season is hosted by Zena Kada with Chantelle Jennings, Sabrina Merchant and Ben Pickman. It's produced by Tanika Burrell. Our executive producer is Andrea B. Scott. Our theme music is by Marcus Bagala. Monica Compton is our video editor. Shannon Ryan is managing editor of women's basketball at the Athletic. Jesse Burton is our head of audio and Tim McMaster is director of audio operations.

[Sabrina Merchant]

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[Zena Caida]

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[Sabrina Merchant]

So here are some tips.

[Zena Caida]

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[Sabrina Merchant]

If you want to enjoy an unlimited.

[Zena Caida]

Plan with a price that never goes up, do not mistake a wasp nest for a pinata.

[Sabrina Merchant]

If you want to enjoy an unlimited plan with a price that never goes.

[Zena Caida]

Goes up, do not microwave a hard boiled egg.

[Sabrina Merchant]

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[Zena Caida]

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[Sabrina Merchant]

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[Sabrina Merchant]

We deliver and set up phones.

[Zena Caida]

It's not a tour.

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[Sabrina Merchant]

Introducing store to door switch and get a new device with expert setup and delivery wherever you're at.

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[Sabrina Merchant]

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[Zena Caida]

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[Sabrina Merchant]

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[Zena Caida]

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