← No Offseason: The Athletic Women's Basketball Show
No Offseason: The Athletic Women's Basketball Show
How the new CBA will reshape the WNBA + Diana Taurasi Interview!
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- [00:01]
MassMutual
Preparation is everything, on the court and off, and a strong financial future starts with a solid plan. Massmutual provides tools to help women plan for stronger financial futures, empowering them to navigate life's challenges with confidence and to achieve their dreams. Whether that's learning the basics, managing debts, understanding the value of insurance, or building wealth, they're in your corner. The right team can help you get ready and stay ready. That's why Massmutual is committed to helping women confidently plan and protect their financial futures, all with the goal of creating better financial outcomes for women everywhere. Visit massmutual.com stayready to learn more.
- [00:41]
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- [01:12]
Aura
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- [02:20]
Ben Pickman
Hello everyone and welcome to no off season presented by MassMutual. I'm Ben Pickman.
- [02:26]
Sabrina Merchant
I'm Sabrina Merchants.
- [02:27]
Chantel Jennings
And I'm Chantel Jennings.
- [02:28]
Ben Pickman
And today on the show, the story that is hovering over this entire WNBA season, the cba, or collective bargaining agreement. It's the document that dictates so much of how life in the WNBA plays out and it's being renegotiated over the course of this season. We're going to tell you what you need to know to really understand what the sides are talking about how it's all going to play out and the impact that it may have going forward. Then Diana Taurasi joins me to talk about Paige Beckers adjustment to the W life in retirement and what might be next in her basketball future. But first, as you might have noticed, Xena is off today, but Chantel is back here. So we've gotten the old trio, I guess, longtime athletic women's basketball staff back together. So Chantel, just how are you doing?
- [03:14]
Chantel Jennings
I'm good. It's good to see your guys faces.
- [03:17]
Ben Pickman
Chantel, you've done a lot over the last couple weeks, not just W but also some college stories as well. You recently spoke with Dawn Staley about her new memoir. I know you've spent a lot of time talking to dawn over the years, but was there anything memorable or noteworthy from that conversation about the book?
- [03:32]
Chantel Jennings
Yeah, I think just the fact that she decided to write a book right now is really interesting to me. I was able to get an advance copy and read it. And you know, she's someone who like sort of in equal ways describes herself as an open book but also a very private introvert. And so it was really interesting to get into a lot of the stories of her life in North Philly, at uva, coming up with the Richmond Rage, the wnba, like the Olympics, like just all of these different stories that she had maybe shared like half of before and to then dive in a little bit more fully and then getting the chance to go back to my previous English major nerd self, like reading a book, coming up with comprehensive questions to dive further and then being able to ask the author questions about their decisions made and all of that. I told her, I was like, this is one of my favorite assignments because I feel like I really got to English nerd out here. So being like, well, why did you, you know, you wrote about your father in this way and getting to ask her about that or asking her about Tara Vandev and her coaching style and what dawn would have done differently in Tara's shoes and stuff like that was really fun.
- [04:36]
Ben Pickman
Does she pick your brain at all about being an author or a writer at all, or are you picking her brain about word choice and phrasing and.
- [04:43]
Chantel Jennings
You know, she didn't. And in hindsight, you know, maybe that says something about what she thinks about my writing that she I think it's.
- [04:50]
Sabrina Merchant
Just because the book is already out chancel.
- [04:52]
Chantel Jennings
Probably, yes. I'll chalk it up to that that she, you know, the words are in print. She was on the Colbert show earlier this week. She's on her tour. Like, she's, she's out there getting the story out. Although I was pretty disappointed she did not play waste paper basketball with Stephen Colbert, which most of the basketball guests do on his show. Asia Wilson did with him, I believe, and so feels like a miss to me. But I digress.
- [05:16]
Ben Pickman
No, that, that does feel like a little bit of a miss. But, Sabrina, you're very good at wastepaper basketball. It's a great transition and we are officially one week into the WNBA season. We've had a lot of games, a lot of games to watch, catch up, rewatch. I don't know what stands out to you. What are your highlights of the week so far?
- [05:32]
Sabrina Merchant
Apparently, setting a goal to play way saber basketball with Stephen Colbert now is number one on the list.
- [05:36]
Ben Pickman
But I look forward to that press tour.
- [05:38]
Chantel Jennings
Sabrina, highlight when your memoir comes out.
- [05:41]
Sabrina Merchant
Sabrina, right? Yeah, that's the one. I'll. I'll consult your written expertise for that one. Don't worry.
- [05:45]
Chantel Jennings
Thank you.
- [05:45]
Diana Taurasi
Yeah.
- [05:46]
Sabrina Merchant
As far as highlight of the week, I know we're going to get into them later, but Minnesota lakes, you know, coming off of a really disappointing end to the 2024 season look awesome even without Kayla McBride. Nafisa Collier right on track for an MVP season. And it's just fun watching really, really good players look really, really good.
- [06:03]
Ben Pickman
I guess speaking of that game, let's just get right into it. I mean, Chantel, you were there on Wednesday night as the Minnesota Lynx defeated The Dallas Wings 85 81. Your glorious return to Target center as well as Paige Becker's return to Target Center. Both of you Minnesota natives, those were.
- [06:20]
Chantel Jennings
The two big storylines going into Wednesday night. Both Paige Beckers and Shantelle Jennings return to the Target Center.
- [06:26]
Ben Pickman
You know, maybe that's where the similarities stop, but I guess, can you just take us into the building? What was the energy like? What was the scene like? What sticks out to you just about the atmosphere from that game?
- [06:36]
Chantel Jennings
I think a lot of people were really looking forward to this game. Just like friends, colleagues, doctors. Like all of these people that I just come across in my daily life were like bringing up Minnesota basketball. Not just the Timberwolves, who are obviously in a really exciting part of the season right now, but the Lynx. And talking about sort of this opportunity that this group has where it feels like they were so close a season ago and now they're back and, you know, they have all of these pieces back, they have all these players back. Cheryl's expectations are higher than ever and now it's like, okay, let's just get them back to Minnesota and get them in front of their hometown fans and sort of have the Dallas game appropriately scheduled, I think, by the WNBA for this game. It just felt really right. Paige talked a lot about what the Lynx meant to her growing up, and you know, I wrote about that after the game. But just to have a player who had their see it be it moment with the Lynx, with a Cheryl Reeve led team with Rebecca Brunson and Lindsey Whelan, who are now on the bench with Cheryl Reeve, like, it was just this sort of really poetic moment of, you know, a Minnesotan coming back to a place where sort of the standard of excellence when she was growing up specifically was the Lynx. There was no other franchise in town, professional or college, that established that level of success that Cheryl Reeve and the Lynx had.
- [07:49]
Ben Pickman
And we should say that, you know, Paige records a 12.10 assist double double. It is the first double double of her career. Exactly. Dallas, though, drops to oh and three on the season. Now they've played Minnesota twice in those first three games, but seemingly more competitive every time out. I don't know, Sabrina, what have you kind of observed just from the wings as they've gotten the season going and from Paige and, you know, Arique in.
- [08:12]
Sabrina Merchant
The backcourt particularly, I think it was a good thing that after two games of Paige not assisting Arie, we did get the first assist, multiple assists actually, from Paige to a. During that Minnesota A game. I just think that there's still an understanding of, like, how those two are going to work together. Right. They play at different tempos. I think Arike has been getting hers in transition and Paige is sort of trying to manipulate the defense within the half court. And it's just trying to figure out how the two of them can accentuate each other's strengths because they are coming from such different systems. And in Dallas, with all of this lack of continuity and a new head coach, there's. There's a lot to get into. So it's, it's exciting to see Dallas, like, figure some things out. Right. You know, I think their front court is kind of the biggest question with, like, when is it a Maisha Hines Allen game? When is it Tierra McCowan game? Like, when does Nalissa Smith get in there? And I, I liked like the jumbo lineup that they used against Seattle the other day with Matty Siegris at the three, but there's just a lot of unknown and you know, even when you have a franchise piece like Paige, Beckers with another franchise piece like Arika Gumbawale. That doesn't mean that everything else just naturally falls into place. There's still a lot of work to do on the margins there.
- [09:11]
Chantel Jennings
I think what makes this matchup particularly interesting this season is you have a team like Minnesota that just has so much consistency from last year to this year. And then you have a team like the Wings, which is almost entirely, in almost every way that you can count, and they play three times in the first nine or ten games of the season. And so you sort of saw the improvement with Dallas from game one to game three, and now we'll sort of have another chance. Game three to game nine or three to ten. I. I forget exactly how many it is for them. I know it's nine for Minnesota, but it's sort of like this measuring stick benchmark. And Minnesota, which is a team that is consistent, that has so many pieces returning, like there's not a better team for them to sort of measure themselves against three times early at the beginning of the season.
- [09:49]
Ben Pickman
And I think the measuring stick will be good for them long term because there are a lot of things that I think, you know, there's just a lot of room for improvement for these Dallas Wings. I mean, Sabrina mentioned it. The front court is definitely a question. The three point shooting is a question right now. I mean, Ty Harris was kind of brought in to be their best three point shooter and she has been that. But other than her, like we're still kind of waiting for an efficient three point shooting game for them. I mean, they shot 36% from three against Minnesota. They took 33 threes, which is up from their season average last year too. And then on the defensive end, like I kind of pointed it out after their first game, they were getting cut back door, you know, on slips and different screens throughout the entirety of their first game against Minnesota. And there's just some questions on that end of the floor too. And I think a lot of that comes from as you're talking about Chantel, just like gelling experience, cohesion, just kind of knowing where you know how to read and react off of each other. It's something you hope that they learn in time, but definitely still a question right now. A very tough start to play Minnesota twice in their first three games.
- [10:50]
Sabrina Merchant
But impressive that they got so much closer the second time around, even on Minnesota. Some court.
- [10:54]
Chantel Jennings
Yeah. And just sort of how they executed late, that Arike shot late to pull them within three. Like they executed late, which is something you expect from veteran teams. That have played together a long time, which is why when Minnesota held the line and was able to get the job done, like, you weren't surprised at all. But seeing the Wings this early with this group do the same was pretty impressive.
- [11:11]
Ben Pickman
So, Chantel, that's obviously Paige Becker's a recent former UConn star, but another former UConn star guard has been in the news as well over the past couple weeks. This was a story that you broke, I guess, a couple weeks ago, and it's just kind of continued to be talked about in women's basketball circles since then. It is Sue Bird being named the managing director of USA Basketball, Team usa. Can you just tell people a little bit more about what her responsibilities are, what people need to know about Sue Bird's new role, and maybe a little bit of what that is going to mean for the future of Team USA and usab?
- [11:42]
Chantel Jennings
Yeah, I mean, the truth is, like, we don't know exactly how it's going to look moving forward. There is the equivalent ish on the men's side. The men's Team USA program has been run with a managing director for a very long time. It was Jerry Colangelo, and now it's Grant Hill. So for, like, 25 years, they've had a managing director who basically picks the rosters, handpicks the coaches. You know, there is input elsewhere within the Team USA program, but, you know, Grant Hill especially and Jerry Klangelo are seen as people who are like, when they call you pick up, when they ask you to go somewhere, you're going to go somewhere. You put together the team. And I think Sue Bird coming in is really interesting because Team USA on the women's side was sort of at this, you know, changing of the guards. Carol Callan is someone who helped Run Team USA since 96, and in the last few years, there's been a lot of, you know, whether it's the roster changing quite a bit, Carol Callan stepping down, Bri Weiss coming in. You know, there's just a lot of change in Team usa and the results in France were closer than I think anyone in that program would have liked, and bringing Sue Bird back in as sort of that, you know, managing director. The Grant Hill of the women's side, the Jerry Colangelo of the women's side, to be the person who's making the phone calls that says, like, hey, we're playing in this tournament. We're having this training camp. We want you there. Show up, and then people do. I think that's a big Part of it. And I think getting the rosters they want, having more continuity throughout the Olympic cycles is going to be really big. That was something that as I talked with people, you know, they're going up against these teams in Belgium and France where it's the Same pool of 15 players, tournament after tournament. And the double edged sword of the US Talent is that it's like you could put together three teams that have a shot at gold, but who are the 12 players that you want on that roster? And so I think Subird has a very challenging opportunity ahead of her. I think it's certainly a challenge though to figure out the 12 players, the coaching staff, the fit, and how to get everyone to the place that they need to be to continue this gold medal run that they've been on.
- [13:34]
Ben Pickman
Sabrina, any Olympic team takes.
- [13:35]
Sabrina Merchant
Yeah, well, I mean, I understand on the men's side why you'd want someone like Grant Hill where it's very hard to turn down his phone call, but on the women's side, I don't know that we've ever gotten a sense of like people not wanting to commit to the Olympic team. Right. Like it's more we have so many players who want to go and there isn't a space for all of them. So I do wonder like, what the need is for someone like Steubert when the participation rate is tremendous and it's not like she's going to be the one who's coaching the team or you know, putting together like plans on how to defeat Belgium or France or you know, Germany going forward. So I kind of just wonder like what, what the necessity is. Like. I get that it's nice to have a similar position on the men's side and the women's side just in terms of the structure of USA Basketball. But I'm just interested to see like what it ends up mattering that she is associated with the program when it already has been so historically successful and a thing that everybody wants to be a part of.
- [14:21]
Chantel Jennings
I think there are times that, you know, you have seen it's less about the Olympic call up, right. Like, I think those are the call ups that are easy to make. It's those other tournaments, right. The America for the college players who are maybe in the middle, right. Like, or the training camps that people don't necessarily want to attend because they're not at the greatest time and they might opt to do things. There have been examples of senior national team players or prospects opting to not do those sort of things. Like anyone who gets the Olympic call is going to say yes, but it's everything in between. And I think that lead up specifically and having that Olympic four year cycle, the run up, the continuity, the consistency that really matters. I think when you look back at the start of this run to eight gold medals, like it started with the 96 team that played 50 plus games in one year. And Tara Vandiver and Carol Callen asked players to sacrifice a year of their life to come on this tour with them and create a real team rather than a group of 12 players. And I think, you know, they're not going to do that. Obviously that's impossible in today's day and age of basketball with all the commitments. But I think sort of getting back to a place where, you know, every invite is basically an assured yes.
- [15:23]
Ben Pickman
I mean, what you're talking about is again, a change over time throughout women's basketball and through the USAB system. And if we're thinking about other kind of changes over time in the WNBA context, there's another piece of news that actually I broke on Thursday morning related to the New York Liberty and franchise valuations and that the Liberty, you know, they raised capital from a group of investors at a record valuation for a professional women's sports franchise of $450 million, almost half a billion dollars. And that's a huge chunk of change. You can't kind of overstate what that valuation is means for women's sports. Last year, the Dallas Wings sold 2/2% stakes at a $208 million valuation. That was a WNBA record at the time. And earlier this month, Chelsea Women, the soccer team over in England, Alexis Ohanian, the entrepreneur, he paid $26.5 million for an 8% stake in that club, which values them at 326 million. So again, this is $125 million more than that in terms of evaluation. It's again a new benchmark for the wnba, for professional women's sports reflects kind of a, a changing moment overall in the sport. And I guess kind of speaking of changing moments, when we get back after this break, we're going to talk a little bit more about the wnba, CBA and changing economics and what it all means, what this very important document is going to mean for the sport going forward.
- [16:55]
MassMutual
Preparation is everything, on the court and off. And a strong financial future starts with a solid plan. MassMutual provides tools to help women plan for stronger financial futures, empowering them to navigate life's challenges with confidence and to achieve their dreams. Whether that's learning the basics managing debts, understanding the value of insurance, or building wealth, they're in your corner. The right team can help you get ready and stay ready. That's why MassMutual is committed to helping women confidently plan and protect their financial futures, all with the goal of creating better financial outcomes for women everywhere. Visit massmutual.com stayready to learn more.
- [17:38]
Aura
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- [18:30]
Dane Brugler
I'm Dane Brugler. I cover the NFL draft for the Athletic, spending the whole year working on a draft guide. I'm looking at thousands of players putting together hundreds of full scouting reports. All the nitty gritty details, the testing data, the stats, but extensive background research as well. Every journey is a little bit different. I'm on the phone with a lot of these guys. Hey, when did you start playing football? What other sports did you play? Tell me about your family. You know, learning more about these guys as people. Our draft guide picked up the name the Beast because of the crazy amount of information that's included. I have no idea how to quantify the hours I've spent putting it together. I've been covering this year's draft since last year's draft. There is a lot in the Beast that you simply can't find anywhere else. You can get the Beast and all the great coverage my colleagues do by subscribing to the Athletic. You can do that@theathletic.com subscribe.
- [19:33]
Ben Pickman
All right, it is time to talk CBA, the Collective Bargaining Agreement, a document that is surprisingly very, very interesting and very, very important despite it being a legal document by nature. I've got a piece up on the site that serves as a little bit of an explainer on where things stand right now. Entering this season. And we're going to get into a lot of that through this conversation. This is a big topic again. It's one that is hovering over the season. It's one that we've talked a little bit about that we're going to come back to over the course of the next several months as this agreement gets renegotiated. So let's just jump in. Sabrina, let's start with you, like go back to 2020. That is kind of the last CBA or you know, the current one that players are being signed under. What can listeners, what should they know about that document, its importance at that time, the impact it has made on the WNBA and just like the importance of this text overall.
- [20:26]
Sabrina Merchant
Yeah, so that was the first CBA that was negotiated with the WNBA having a commissioner. And Kathy Engelbert previously, like the structure of the league was a little different. So she took on the job in 2019 and the CBA came into effect in January of 2020. So it was her first foray into the league and the first time the players have been working with this sort of representation. And I think the big takeaway from that CBA was doubling the maximum salary. You know, previously the WNBA was in an agreement where a max salary was like basically $20,000 more than a minimum salary and you could have seven players on an individual roster that got a max salary, so to speak. So this obviously increased the amount of money that the best players in the league could get, even if it did make for some more challenging cap gymnastics for the rest of the roster. Also included some improved benefits like players getting their own hotel rooms on the road if they had a certain amount of experience. Family planning where if you had a certain amount of experience in the league, you could get a stipend to freeze your eggs or help with that process. It introduced the Commissioners cup, you know, the in season tournament, which has been a big boon for players wallets. I've heard a lot of people around the WNBA say that they've never heard of locker room as loud as when players win a commissioner's cup just because of the $500,000 purse that comes with that. And it also just expanded on like marketing agreements in and out of the season so that when players are not playing during the off season, they can, you know, do work for the league or for their teams in market to earn some extra money as opposed to having to go overseas necessarily.
- [21:44]
Chantel Jennings
I think it also the way it changed free agency really mattered. If I remember correctly, it was Candice Parker who was kind of the first domino to fall under that new agreement, when she went from the spark to the sky in terms of, under this new agreement, in terms of her free agency and how it gave players more freedom and opportunity in that and specifically limiting the number of times they can be cored. So again, just sort of giving players more freedom and movement, you know, was it a perfect agreement? No, I don't think anyone in the league would have said that. But did it lay the foundation for what they can possibly get in this one? I think so. I think players, I think they can say that.
- [22:17]
Ben Pickman
I think that's definitely true, Chantel. I mean, I talked to Terry Jackson, who's the head of the wnbpa, the players Association, a few weeks ago for this example explainer story that I wrote. And she said to me that I think what we did last time was right for the time. And that's kind of the emphasis there. Exactly as you're saying. But this has to be different. Was what she said, that this has got to be seen as a moment that the, you know, is building on those wins was was her phrase, that's still pushing the league forward. And again, not just the players, she stresses, but the players and the team and the league. And there's a lot of things that the players are pushing for that I think, you know, yes, they certainly benefit the player experience and the players themselves, but they view that side of the table, again, going to push up the league as a whole.
- [22:59]
Chantel Jennings
Ben, I'm curious, especially in light of your reporting with these valuations that are being put out about different franchises and especially how many teams right now are publicizing how much they're spending on facilities and how their numbers are going up and the TV numbers are going up. Like, how much do you think that is going to be a part of what the players present in order to push specifically salaries forward or revenue sharing or whatever it is that what impact will that have in the negotiating room?
- [23:24]
Ben Pickman
Well, you actually first mentioned facilities, and so I think that's an important thing to hit on right off the top because one of their key priorities is that they want to codify some of these minimum professional work environments, these standards that currently is not in the cba. Right. So that includes like facility and travel accommodations. It includes support staff minimums. It's just like very simple things about what your practice environment should be like, what your arena environment should be like. Again, travel, how you're flying. And there are some of these details in the current cva we should say, like Sabrina mentioned, the hotel rooms I think in the current cva, like, every player for the first time is entitled to their individual hotel room instead of a shared room. That was a big change in the 2020 CBA.
- [24:09]
Chantel Jennings
And if you have a kid, don't you get two? Right. You get two rooms. As the representative parent on this podcast, I just want to say, like, that is a huge win as someone that has traveled with a child and, like, been in the same hotel room with my 2 year old who goes to bed and I'm like underneath the covers at 7pm Trying to, you know, pretend that I'm not playing games on my phone.
- [24:28]
Ben Pickman
Right. No, I mean, exactly. Like, those kinds of things were really important then. And I think right now, you know, there's definitely an arms race in terms of facilities across the league for teams. And the PA really wants to make that the standard, like put it into writing that you have to provide this. And obviously teams can then go above and beyond and try and treat their players as best as they see fit, but they just want to establish some baselines which don't currently exist.
- [24:56]
Chantel Jennings
Yeah.
- [24:56]
Sabrina Merchant
Just to add on to that parental part of it, the current CBA includes a clause for maternity, but that doesn't include parents who did not actually give birth to the child. So that's just a huge loophole that applies to a lot of parents in the wnba. And what happens to the kids during the games? There aren't codified playrooms during games that kids can sit in and be taken care of while their mom is theoretically going to work and playing basketball. So there's just a lot of elements of that family planning experience that are another priority for the players?
- [25:26]
Ben Pickman
Serena, what are some of those other priorities that you've learned and we've reported on that are important to the players?
- [25:32]
Sabrina Merchant
Money is a big part of it. They want an increase in salaries. The current maximum salary is about $250,000. And you look at the revenue that's coming into the WNBA through tickets, through media rights, through all of the sponsorships, all of the change makers, you know, at the WNBA level that Kathy Engelbert has talked about so lengthily. So I think that's a big part of it. The players also just want a stake in the growing business of the league. Right. There was a revenue sharing component introduced in the last cba, but because it is a cumulative target, and the CBA took effect in 2020 and 2020, there was a bubble season in 2021. There were barely fans allowed back in the stands. They just have never been able to catch up to all of the revenue lost in those two years. So they've never been able to hit this target even with the massive growth that the wnba. So they want a more, I guess, reachable revenue sharing system that allow them to benefit from all of the gains that the league is experiencing as a whole. And then they want a seat at the table when it comes to big decisions that are made at the league level. Like we've talked about the media rights deal that the NBA and WNBA just agreed to with espn, NBC and Amazon. And that was a deal that was largely conducted by the NBA without WNBA specific representatives, I would say, or what I should say is that the WNBA players were not informed of the process as it was going along. And so they want just more control in those higher level decisions that affect the business of the entire league.
- [26:56]
Ben Pickman
Along those lines, in terms of again, players wanting more agency, I guess, at the table. Chantel, you've done a lot of reporting on the college game, obviously, and it feels kind of significant that we've seen a parallel change in the college landscape as this negotiation is now being, this document is being renegotiated, I guess. What impact do you feel like the nil era or some of just what is going on in college maybe has directly or indirectly on player perspectives, the negotiations themselves and just how people are approaching these talks?
- [27:30]
Chantel Jennings
Well, I think it's just sort of this perfect storm of the timings lining up in a way where you had this group of players in college right now who maybe had an extra year because of injury or Covid or whatever it might have been that they had this bonus year that they could opt out, they could opt opt in or because of their age perhaps. But also this is a really interesting moment in college basketball because it's post collectives nil portal opening and pre house settlement and I think specifically the house settlement getting bumped back by the judge opened up this moment as I've talked with college coaches over the last few weeks, where it's like the unregulation of that space just like ballooned. And you have all of these programs that are front loading nil deals right now because there is no regulation yet that doesn't have to go through the Deloitte Clearinghouse. And so you have players, you know that I'm hearing these numbers where it's like if you were a post player in the portal this year and you average three or four points a game and you're asking for $200,000, like that was not out of the question. And it's like you compare that to a rookie salary, it's not necessarily apples to apples. Right. And so I think it's just created this, you know, this moment that feels highly specific to right now. I don't think it's going to happen again because. Because the house settlement is supposed to come down, literally could come down like before this podcast airs tomorrow. But like the regulation is going to exist and the front load, even contracts at the college level in the way that it has specifically over the last few weeks, specifically with this last portal opening, like it's not going to happen again in this way necessarily on a large scale. Certainly people always find other ways. But you know, where there's a will, there's a way. But like, by and large, you know, you're not going to have a thousand players in the portal that are sort of all sorts of seeing the same sort of world out there that we're seeing right now with it. But I wanted to throw it back to you, Ben, because as we look at this contract specifically with the cba, you know, one of the things that coming out of the 2020 bubble season that a lot of players talked about was how being in one place together really allowed for them to find cohesion on topics and unity and like present themselves at the bargaining table with this, like, this is what we want and this is where we're holding the line. Not everyone was that unrivaled in Miami this offseason. But I'm curious about what you feel like that experience, A, all of the players being together. But B, also having a league that was like player led, player driven, where they do have stakes in it, where they do have a voice in it. How does that change how players approach this, this negotiating table?
- [29:49]
Ben Pickman
Yeah, I mean, I think it goes along the lines of what you were just kind of talking about, where the timing has kind of worked out for the players. And again, this like parallel track, that unrivaled launch when it did, because unrivaled at its core, as you said, Chantal is a league that is kind of run by players for players. Right. You know, it's co founders of Brianna Stewart and Afisa Collier. It has, you know, given equity stakes to all the players who participated in its inaugural season. And it's obviously like pushed the limits for what I think a lot of professional players thought they could receive certainly financially in a WNBA winter or, you know, winter when they're not playing in the WNBA and staying here in America. Right. We've talked about about this at length some, but Again, as a reminder, it's like it's a 10 week season, but they averaged $220,000 of salary per player. It had a six figure TV deal right off the top. I mean, players had equity, as I said, they had, you know, this facility that was really a first class facility that they built in a matter of weeks and months that, you know, not only had a fully stocked weight room with everything you'd kind of want to see in it, but it had numerous childcare options the players could use at any time. Like there were just a lot of benefits and amenities that the league presented itself. And so look like, do I think that players are sitting down at the table bringing up that, you know, we had this in Unrivaled, so we should have this in the wnba. I don't know if they're having those talks when they are literally sitting down at the negotiating table, but I do think Unrivaled has continued to kind of inform to players like what is possible and for some, like what they should be asking for. It's just given them more detail, more information and more context, both of player experience and I guess I should say too just the business of women's basketball. I mean, that goes back to what I was talking about when I mentioned the Liberty valuation news. Just like the business has changed and Unrivaled is another example of that. I mean, I have in this, this explainer, like I reported that the league made $27 million in revenue last year and nearly broke even in its first year. Now, we are not privy to WNBA official financials, so it's hard to exactly compare those two points. But certainly I think Unrivaled was a financial success, a business success as much as it was a basketball success. So the timing has really worked out between, you know, that league and just renegotiation. Sabrina, I guess speaking of the negotiation itself, and maybe we should just give people a little bit of a peek behind the curtain, like just on a granular level, like who is negotiating, who is involved here? We've obviously mentioned the players in the pa, but like what do we kind of know about who else is at the table? And maybe a little bit of timeline too of how it's been going.
- [32:24]
Sabrina Merchant
Right. So the agreement will take place between the players association, which represents the players, and the wnba, which is represented by the commissioner and the owners. The ownership structure of the WNBA is a little wonky in that the owners of the 13 WNBA teams only own about 42% of the league. 16% of it is owned by the investors who participated in the capital raise back in 2021, 2022, and the remainder, 42% of the league is actually owned by the NBA. So there's a lot of interests on the other side of the bargaining table. But I would imagine that the WNBA owners and the commissioner are the ones who are taking the primary role in this process. The players association has suggested that they want to have a deal done by October, by the end of the WNBA season. And that makes a lot of sense because there has to be an expansion draft before the next season and you don't want to interfere with free agency, which starts in January, because that's obviously a big part of the WNBA season and it affects a lot of things that happen heading into the next 2026 season. So that's sort of the timeline that they're working with. They've been canvassing the players for ideas of what they've wanted dating back to 2023 and even before, just before they decided to opt out and what was going to be important for this particular round of negotiations. But I do think that we saw last time they didn't come up with an agreement until January of 2020, which pushed back free agency and ultimately didn't end up mattering all that much because Global Pandemic pushed back the season. So that affected a lot of other things. But this time around, because of all of the off season things that have to happen with Toronto and Portland and the increasing importance and complexity of free agency, I would imagine that they want to get everything done by at least November.
- [33:58]
Ben Pickman
You mentioned free agency. So let's kind of maybe talk a little bit about the impact this document could have on free agency. What do you think this all means, Sabrina, for player movement in the league for 2026 and beyond? And yeah, what implications might it have right away?
- [34:14]
Sabrina Merchant
Yeah, I mean, we've talked a lot about player priorities. I would imagine one of the owner priorities is retaining a certain amount of player control. You know, like if you draft a player, you want to be able to hold onto her for as long as possible. And that means that, you know, we still have restricted free agency after a player's rookie contract and you still have the opportunity to core players, you know, which means you retain their exclusive negotiating rights for as many times as you're allowed to core them. Currently, you can apply the core designation for two seasons on a player, potentially more, if you core them and they sign a longer term contract. But nobody really does that because why would you subject yourself to more team control? So I wonder if that's going to be a sticking point in the negotiation of whether the players want to get rid of the core or the teams hold on to it for dear life because that's their best mechanism for holding on to star players. And then that'll just obviously affect how player movement works across the league. But just with regards to free agency, too, another priority that the players have expressed is a softer salary cap. And just for reference, the WNBA has what's called a hard salary cap, where you cannot exceed the salary cap for that season for. So like, it doesn't matter if you are trying to retain a player or, you know, somebody gets injured and you need to replace them. Like, you cannot go over this certain number. And it makes transactions during the middle of the season like the trade deadline, which is why it's generally a pretty inactive.
- [35:26]
Ben Pickman
I was going to say. Sabrina, Sabrina, can you. What's your favorite trade deadline moves? It feels like historically we haven't really had some trade deadlines.
- [35:32]
Sabrina Merchant
I mean, I think Marina Maybury going to Connecticut was like a massive thing last year because that kind of thing doesn't normally happen during the course of WNB regular season. So. So I think creating more exceptions to make movement possible is something that the players are interested in and that might behoove the teams and the owners, honestly, because that allows them to be more creative and flexible during the course of the regular season when traditionally it's harder to improve your team at that point of the year.
- [35:52]
Ben Pickman
And we should say too, on the salary front, salaries are expected to significantly increase and that goes along with the kind of changes in the business that we've kind of been talking about all episode. I mean, some people around the league throw out maybe three, four times, potentially more like X what it is right now. And so the max salary salary currently is $250,000 or around there for a player. Like it wouldn't be crazy when this document gets signed. I think if, if the max salary was suddenly around a million dollars or, you know, more or less still obviously remains to be certain. I guess on the free agency front, we should also say, you know, it will be interesting to watch and see if there are developmental roster spots that kind of get added. And so that would kind of require another salary framework. Like I talked to Brianna Stewart for this story and she said she'd like to see, you know, at least two spots added for practice players who are not on teams active rosters in the new agreement. I mean, that's obviously something we've talked about. Here the last couple weeks about players getting waived. There's a clamoring for again expanding rosters, keeping players on rosters, keeping players around if they get cut. Like that is something that the WNBA currently does not offer. And we often see already right off the bat, week one teams playing with nine, 10 players and you're like, like, why couldn't we just have larger rosters? So that is definitely another point of conversation here too.
- [37:09]
Chantel Jennings
I just feel like it's going to be like the season is going to end and it's just going to go crazy because it's like all of basically the entire league is going to be free agents next year minus people who are on rookie scale contracts and like all the salaries going up. And you're really going to have a chance to see, like you said, perhaps this document is going to establish minimums for what teams need to do for players in terms of facilities, travel, et cetera, et cetera, staff members. But like again, there are ways to make your franchise look even better. And we have seen owners do that over the last few years, whether within or with outside of the rules. Hello, Clara Usai with some specific flights for your team. But like we're going to have a chance to really see player control, player option and opportunity. Like where are the places that people want to be? Because if all things are equal in terms of salary and sort of the minimums, where are the places that are investing the most in their players, trying to make them a destination within the league? And those are the people that are going to sort of be able to, you know, get a head start in the arms race of this next era of the wnba.
- [38:09]
Ben Pickman
No, that makes a lot of sense. And you've actually said owners and we, I guess haven't talked enough, I think, about the owner side of the table here. And so as we start to close out the CBA conversation, I mean, Sabrina, what do you, what do we know about team owner priorities here? Because obviously this is a document. They are sitting down at a negotiating table, whether it's in person or virtually to have these talks. And so this is two sides very much at play. What do we know about the owner side?
- [38:33]
Sabrina Merchant
Well, in addition, you know, to those roster mechanisms we talked about earlier, just like maintaining team control over players as much as possible. Something that came up in the 2020 CPA that I imagine will continue to be a sticking point this time around is prioritization, which is essentially that WNBA teams want their players to be in camp by the start of camp so that they can you know, perform their duties as a WNBA player for the course of the season. And that historically had not been the case because WNBA players made so much more money overseas that they would finish their seasons overseas and then come to the WNBA when the schedule allowed for it. So I think prioritization and having WNBA players continue to prioritize this league as the expense of other leagues is still a big factor for the owners. Just making sure that if they're going to put money into, you know, investing in the facilities and investing in the amenities for the players, that the players are going to be here to take advantage of all those things.
- [39:22]
Chantel Jennings
I think the natural question here then on the owner's side is obviously if, if the salary cap's been around 1.5 million for their team, and Ben, you're talking about things might increase by two, three, four times that. Like, where is this money coming from? Yeah, where is the money coming from?
- [39:38]
Ben Pickman
It's a good question. There's definitely some, a little bit of uncertainty, I guess, or not as much clarity as I think some people want on that front. I mean, some of the key places. Media rights changes, right. So there's a new media rights deal that is coming into effect. Expect next year in the wnba. The main tranche, the first kind of round of the negotiations is worth around $200 million annually to the WNBA. That is what they are receiving. That's up from, I want to say, around what, 40, 50, 60 million in the current agreement, Sabrina?
- [40:06]
Sabrina Merchant
Right, about 60 million. Yeah.
- [40:08]
Ben Pickman
So, you know, obviously that is a big jump of again, three or four times more than what they're currently receiving in media rights. We've also seen an uptick in sponsorships. You know, that's a big one. You think about gate receipts. Just think about all the ways that the wnba, you know, and their teams respectively have seen increases over the past couple years. Like that is where we're kind of allowing for these increases. Plus also you see it like with this valuations, what franchises are now worth to owners has skyrocketed. Right. In the case of the New York Liberty, you know, the size Claire Wu Tsai and Joe Tsai, they bought the team in 2019. Claire Wu Tsai told me last October that when they purchased it, it was a distress best asset. I mean, when Mark Davis, the owner of the Las Vegas Aces, bought the team, I think that was a purchase for around $2 million. Like that's kind of what we're talking about not that long ago for what WNBA teams were worth, are worth. And now it's again, hundreds of millions of dollars and a franchise like the Liberty is kind of resetting the standard it all kind of leads to. What's this up to be like? Obviously this is such an important document, but as players juggle playing with the season, you know, there is this possibility of a, of a work stoppage. So maybe we round up the conversation here. Like, what do we actually think the chances of that happening are? Sabrina, what have players said about that? Yeah, how do you think this gets resolved come fall when again, the season comes to an end? And there's a question about how this negotiation also comes to an end.
- [41:31]
Sabrina Merchant
I mean, every negotiation comes with the possibility of a work stoppage, right? It'd be silly to not consider that as part of the, you know, negotiating platform. But, but I would imagine with the type of momentum that the WNBA is currently experiencing, to go dark and let other leagues, like Unrivaled, for example, take up the oxygen if the WNBA would not be very smart in terms of a business perspective. So as much as I wouldn't necessarily count out the possibility of a work stoppage, it doesn't seem to be in the best interests of either party. One, because the players want the league to continue to benefit from their ability as basketball players and the owners, for all of their commitment to the players and investing in the league, it would be very silly if they did all that and then said, oh, we're just not going to fund the league over what are probably rounding errors for a lot of these NBA owners. Right?
- [42:18]
Ben Pickman
I think that is a good way to end it, Sabrina. And speaking of important stoppages, Diana Taurasi joined us on this show earlier this week. Obviously no longer an active WNBA player, but she still has a lot going on. So coming up in our next block, my conversation with DT.
- [42:39]
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- [43:53]
Ben Pickman
Welcome back to no off season. We are joined by six time Olympic gold medalist, three time WNBA champion, the league's all time leading scorer who was voted as the goat in 2021. It is the Diana Taurasi DT. Thank you for taking this time with us. How are you doing?
- [44:07]
Diana Taurasi
Thanks for having me.
- [44:08]
Ben Pickman
I guess the place I wanted to start is just the broadest question that I'm sure people are most curious about. Just what has retirement been like for you? What's taken up most of your time? What's your day to day like?
- [44:18]
Diana Taurasi
Yeah, you know, retirement is, it's a funny thing because you think you're gonna have all this time to do all the things you've wanted to do and next thing you know you're just, you know, you're driving the kids around everywhere. Soccer practice, school basketball practice, tennis, birthday parties, end of year graduation parties. So you know, I've been busy, I've been busy with the family and it's been wonderful. Really. It's been so nice to be present. I forgot how much of a mental toll getting ready for a basketball season is and being in a season, you know, it takes up so much of your mental space physically, mentally. So it's been nice to be on the other side.
- [44:55]
Ben Pickman
When you take your, you know, your kids to basketball practice or soccer practice, are you. Do you get any urge not to play? Obviously. But just to be like, how was this coach running a practice? How would I run this practice differently? Look at this kid. What are they doing out there? Do you have those feelings that cp.
- [45:13]
Diana Taurasi
You know, I try to go and I try to just let the kids have fun. You know, I think that is the one thing that I learned early on is when you let them decide to do it, that's when you get the best outcomes. And to be honest, at seven, if you get to the, you're good, right?
- [45:33]
Ben Pickman
At eight it's a different story though.
- [45:35]
Diana Taurasi
At eight now we're doing drills, right?
- [45:38]
Ben Pickman
Exactly. Have you, I know WNB season obviously just kicked off. Did you watch games on the opening weekend or did you fully detox?
- [45:46]
Diana Taurasi
You know, I didn't watch. I didn't watch as much as I wanted to. You know, I kind of chimed in here and there, but it was a busy weekend so I didn't get to Watch a lot of it. But, but you know, like anything, opening weekend is the best. You know, I think there's so much fan anticipation. You haven't seen your team in six months. You haven't seen these players. And from the player side, you know that is the best night. It is the kickoff to like the best summer you'll have. And your team is, you know, whether it's a returning team with a lot of veterans that you've been around together for a long time or a new team. But opening night really is, it's so much fun for everyone.
- [46:20]
Ben Pickman
Did you watch the Phoenix Mercury's first game or no?
- [46:23]
Diana Taurasi
You know what, I didn't even watch the Phoenix Mercury for opening night. It had to be their night and I'm so glad we won. Satsu played amazing at, had a great night. Once we get KA back, I'm really excited for this new team. I love what they've done. You know, that's my team for life. I'm always rooting for them. I'm going to be cheering them on all summer.
- [46:39]
Ben Pickman
I guess to your career. Two questions on it. I mean, Satu, obviously she scores 27 points in her career. You mentioned it. It's a bit more than the 22 that you had during your debut back in 2004. The schedule is also growing though. And so now obviously 44 games a record, just how do you feel about players now getting 44 games, some records potentially being broken, A little bit of a bigger sample size than what you had when you were playing. Do you have any thoughts on that?
- [47:04]
Diana Taurasi
Just if you're good at math, all the records will be broken now. I mean, there's just more games or more playoff games now. I think they've added a couple games to the series now. So I mean all the numbers, they're going to be broken, you know, whether it's, you know, points, games, minutes, assists, three point field goals made and you know, that's the beauty of records. They're there to be set and to be broken and to set the next mark for the next generation to break and you know, like anything, that's what they're there for. But you know, what are you gonna do? They've added more games.
- [47:33]
Ben Pickman
Absolutely. And I guess on the topic of change, I mean, obviously there's an ongoing CBA negotiation. I guess when you kind of step back, no longer being in it, you know, what do you kind of hope comes next? Are there, do you have thoughts on what you think the players should prioritize or when you think about their priorities that are already stated and out there are the ones that you think, you know, especially resonate with you, I guess, as you look to the future.
- [47:56]
Diana Taurasi
Yeah, I mean, for the longest time, I. I've always been a big proponent of player salaries. I. I think once you start increasing player salaries and all the other things fall in line for a long time, you know, we've tried to subsidize all these things underneath player salaries, but at a certain point, you have to pay the best players in the world and the best league in the world what they deserve. And I think now with viewership and the new media deal, I think all those things are in play now. And like anything, it's negotiation. The players want certain things, the owners in the league want a certain thing. And, you know, at the end of the day, you have to come to the table and you have to negotiate and you have to give and take on certain things. And I'm sure, you know, with this new cba, that's what it'll be. You know, and like anything, our league's at its best when we're lacing them up and playing.
- [48:42]
Ben Pickman
If you were going to be in Terry Jackson shoes or Neca Gumike shoes or any of your former colleagues in the wnba, I mean, do you have a number in mind that you think they should try and hit or you're gonna leave that?
- [48:52]
Diana Taurasi
I mean, I think that million Dollar mark is always a sexy one.
- [48:55]
Sabrina Merchant
Right.
- [48:55]
Diana Taurasi
I think that's when you feel like, as a player, you're making what you should make. And I think that number has always been the number overseas that has made people go there for. For a long time. And, you know, like anything, there's so many things that go into a negotiation. You know, I can say a million dollars, I could say $2 million. But at the end of the day, once they get into the books and they see what the league is generating and, you know, the revenue from TV and games, and then those true numbers will really come out. And, you know, there's obviously other things, too. As a player, you want to be in situations where it's an average playing field for everyone. It's fair. And I think practice facilities and the everyday welfare of a player should be at a certain standard across the league. And I think we're getting there. There's certain, you know, franchises that are. That are still working to get there as well.
- [49:43]
Ben Pickman
I mean, you mentioned standards, and you talk about some of the things you dealt with throughout your career. I mean, something you had to deal with throughout Your career that I don't think most fans know about was, you know, you're dealing with eczema or aware of your situation with eczema. Just how did that affect you while you were a player on the court?
- [49:57]
Diana Taurasi
Yeah, I mean, eczema, it's something that I've battled with my whole life. You know, ever since I got to college, you know, it started getting out of control and, you know, I would have flare ups and, you know, it's the one sport where you really can't hide it. You know, when it, it flares up, it's really noticeable, it's uncomfortable, you know, and for a long time I really didn't know how to manage it. I would use, you know, all the lotions and the steroid creams and all these things that keep it at bay, but, you know, nothing really helped me get it under control. And, you know, lucky enough I got to partner up with Sanofin Regeneron, you know, and I went to my dermatologist and I was like, I need something different. I need something that's going to work and really change the way I look at eczema and the way it affects me. And I started Dupixent and it's really changed my outlook on an everyday basis on how eczema and I have this long lasting relationship.
- [50:49]
Ben Pickman
But it was something even going back to your UConn days you were thinking about or dealing with then.
- [50:52]
Diana Taurasi
Oh, for sure. Yeah. I look back on some of those Connecticut pictures and old highlights and I'm like, wow, I was really struggling and I was a young kid. The last thing I wanted to tell anyone is I had eczema. Even as a 30 year old, you're always finding ways to ignore the problem. And you know, as I got older, I needed a solution. And you know, it's different for everyone, but there is a treatment that's right for you and once you find that sweet spot and once you, you're okay with it, then that's really when you can, you know, change the way you, you feel about eczema and treating it.
- [51:28]
Ben Pickman
A certain way makes sense, I guess. Speaking of the University of Connecticut, obviously Paige Beckers makes her debut. It's now played two games to start. I know you've been asked the question of what advice you would give her, but do you see similarities about how do you think she should approach getting started? And having lost two games to open her career, what do you just remember about that adjustment period that might inform what she's going through right now?
- [51:49]
Diana Taurasi
You Know, the best thing about playing in Connecticut is that you don't lose a lot of games. And the worst thing about playing at Connecticut is you don't lose a lot of games. And, you know, the wnba, as I've said before in other platforms, it's a different beast. There's different challenges, you know, as an individual, as a team. You know, obviously, when you get drafted, number one, you're usually going to a team that's rebuilding, that's starting to try something new. You know, Dallas has had some great history. They have some great players. Last year, their year didn't go as expected, and that's why they got the number one pick. So there's a lot of challenges when you get to a team in a franchise that's rebuilding, and, you know, you kind of have to change your outlook on wins and losses. You take the wins as far as getting better every single game. And as you can tell already, Paige, from game one to game two, she was a different player. And from game two to game ten, she's going to be a different player. And that's going to go for their team as well as they learn each other on the court and off the court as well. So, you know, the one thing I know about Paige is she's so grounded, she's so patient, she's so prepared. And I think she's learned that in the last four or five years. And all those things that she learned at Connecticut, you know, they're going to change the way you look at that team. And, you know, one day she's going to end up being the best player in the league for sure.
- [53:07]
Ben Pickman
Do you think she'll end up being the best player in the league one day?
- [53:10]
Diana Taurasi
Oh, absolutely. I mean, Paige's instincts on the court are just incredible. You know, there's a special skill and talent when you can galvanize a group of people. And I've been, you know, around her long enough to know that once they get the right group around her, you know, and with her skill set to be able to distribute and score, you know, Paige just has tremendous talent. And once it's unlocked, you know, I'm going to be excited to watch her play.
- [53:36]
Ben Pickman
I guess, as we close this out, you know, on the other end of the spectrum, your old, I guess your current friend, your old College teammate at UConn, Sue Bird, she's obviously taken on a new role in the basketball space with USA Basketball being the managing director, I guess. One, do you ever see yourself getting back into basketball, professional Olympic team ownership in Some kind of capacity.
- [53:57]
Diana Taurasi
Yeah. I mean, what Sue's doing is incredible. There's no person better than sue to do that role. You know, why wouldn't you take the best point guard of all time to lead our USA Basketball team into the next generation? Just tremendous accomplishment in so many ways for her. And you know, as far as myself, I don't see basketball not being in my life in the next 10 to 20 years in a different capacity. Ownership is something that I've always been passionate about and, you know, I'm working towards that and, you know, having different conversations. I think, you know, when you can get to the point in your life where you can actually make decisions to change things, you know, I think that's really impactful, especially when you've been in the trenches and you know, what it takes to put together a winning team and a winning culture. You know, I'm going to use all those things that I've learned in the last, you know, 20 years of my professional career and even before that to hopefully one day lead a team.
- [54:52]
Ben Pickman
But that is something on your table, on your radar currently as we speak, too.
- [54:55]
Diana Taurasi
Yeah, absolutely.
- [54:56]
Ben Pickman
Gotcha. Last two quick ones for me. You know, obviously we need an heir to the slick back bun. Who in the W is going to be the heir to what? You, your trademark?
- [55:05]
Diana Taurasi
Look, I don't know is anyone, but I mean, there is one special young lady from Los Angeles, Southern California, that is one of my favorite players of all time already by juju. So by all means, I will pass the bun torch to juju today.
- [55:21]
Ben Pickman
That is, I think, I think she will take that and run with it for the next 15, 20 years or so. And last one, I know you've probably been asked to make a lot of predictions heading into the season, but who do you think will lead the league in technical fouls this year? Another category near and dear to your heart.
- [55:34]
Diana Taurasi
Well, technical fouls, I'm going to go. I have two great candidates. Either my girl Natasha Cloud and you know, sneaky one. I'm going to go with Caitlin. Caitlyn's sharp. Caitlin's sharp. I got you, Caitlyn. I know, I know. Yeah, those two. Those two are going to compete.
- [55:50]
Ben Pickman
Nobody does it like Diana Taurasi on the court, in college, in the wnba, in the Olympics, and now post career firing off takes, drawing technical fouls, I'm sure, even with comments like that. So, dt, we appreciate you joining no offseason and making a little bit of time.
- [56:05]
Diana Taurasi
No problem. Thank you, guys.
- [56:07]
Ben Pickman
Okay, so before we go, it is Friday, which means we've got a weekend of games, a long weekend. Happy Memorial Day weekend to everyone. Coming up. So it is time to set your screens. Presented by BetMGM. These are just games we are watching have our eye on. So Sabrina, I don't know, how are you setting your screen?
- [56:28]
Sabrina Merchant
I'm really excited for New York Indiana on Saturday, a big CBS game. We'll have a good national TV game for the WNBA and mostly just, you know, we saw New York get off to a roaring start against Las Vegas and Indiana has had a little bit more mixed results, obviously with that loss to Atlanta in the middle of the week. But these are two teams that I think we both expect or we all expect really to be contending for WNBA semifinals and potentially further. So it's good to see just a sort of a table setting, right? Like what do they look like at this point of the year against one another?
- [56:58]
Ben Pickman
Chantel, anything that you have your eye on?
- [57:00]
Chantel Jennings
Aces Storm in Seattle Sunday night at 6pm Eastern. The Jewel Lloyd bowl should be an exciting game as Jewel returns to Seattle with the Aces, who are obviously looking really good right now.
- [57:11]
Ben Pickman
Should be a very, very exciting game and we will see how the Seattle Storm continue to rebound from their slow opening night lost to the Phoenix Mercury. But that is it for today. Coming up on Tuesday, we've got our mailbag episode. Xena will be back answering your questions alongside me and Sabrina. We got so many incredible questions, so thank you all for writing in and we are ready with answers so be sure to check it all out. If you haven't yet, hit that follow button wherever you are listening so you never miss an episode. Also, come check us out on YouTube. Let us know what you think of the podcast. Podcast in the comments give us a rating only if it's five stars. It really does help new people find this show and as always, there's more to read and watch over at our partners the Yahoo Sports hub. So check it out at sports.yahoo.com women-sports on behalf of the Athletic, I'm Ben Pickman. Thanks for listening and we will see you next time.
- [58:10]
MassMutual
No Off Season is hosted by Zena Kada with Chantelle Jennings, Sabrina Merchant and Ben Pickman. It's produced by Tanika Perot. Our executive producers are Andrea B. Scott and Cassius Fleming. Our theme music is by Marcus Bagala. Brenna Haupt is our video editor. Shannon Ryan is managing editor of women's basketball at the Athletic. Jesse Burton is our head of audio and Tim McMaster is our director of audio operations. Preparation is everything, on the court and off, and a strong financial future starts with a solid plan. MassMutual provides tools to help women plan for stronger financial futures, empowering them to navigate life's challenges with confidence and to achieve their dreams. Whether that's learning the basics, managing debts, understanding the value of insurance, or building wealth, they're in your corner. The right team can help you get ready and stay ready. That's why MassMutual is committed to helping women confidently plan and protect their financial futures, all with the goal of creating better financial outcomes for women everywhere. Visit massmutual.com stayready to learn more.
- [59:30]
Ben Pickman
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- [59:32]
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Ben Pickman
We were made to package flights, hotels and hammocks for less. Expedia made to travel.
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