Podcast
No Small Endeavor with Lee C. Camp
Hosted by Tokens Media · EN
What does it really mean to live a good life—in our politics, our faith, our work, and our relationships?
On No Small Endeavor with Lee C. Camp, we explore the ideas, practices, and public debates that shape human flourishing today. Each week you’ll hear thought-provoking conversations with bestselling authors, philosophers, neuroscientists, psychologists, theologians, artists, and political leaders—people wrestling with the biggest questions of meaning and purpose in our time.
Together we ask:
How can religion be a force for healing instead of division?
What does neuroscience reveal about happiness, habits, and productivity?
Where do politics and justice meet the pursuit of the common good?
How do truth, beauty, and goodness help us live well—personally and collectively?
If you care about faith, politics, social justice, science, or the search for meaning, you’ll find courageous, practical conversations here. Because pursuing a meaningful life is no small endeavor—and we’re with you on the road.
Learn more at nosmallendeavor.com.
53episodes
Episodes
Newest firstAll episodes
266: Unabridged Interview: Marisa Renee Lee
1w ago01:02:41Tap to summarizeThis is our unabridged interview with Marisa Renee Lee. How do we learn to live with grief when healing takes longer than we hoped? Author and advocate Marisa Renee Lee learned about grief early, watching her mother move through years of illness before losing her to cancer. Years later, after becoming a mother herself and developing long COVID, Marisa found herself facing a new kind of uncertainty. One that reshaped her body, her work, and her understanding of hope. In this conversation, she reflects on grief, chronic illness, faith, joy, and the healing that becomes possible when we stop pretending we can carry everything alone. Key ideas in this episode: Choose Realistic Hope Hope does not have to mean pretending everything will be fine; it can mean committing to the next faithful action toward a better place. Make Space to Heal Marisa challenges a productivity-driven culture by reminding us that grief, illness, and uncertainty require time, attention, and real support. Ask for Help Healing becomes possible when we name our limits honestly and let other people carry pieces of the burden with us. Let Joy Do Its Work Laughter, beauty, concerts, television, family stories, and small daily pleasures can create room for the brain and body to process pain. Honor the Body’s Grief Loss is not just emotional; grief can affect the brain, weaken the immune system, and make ordinary tasks feel impossible. Show Notes, Resources, and Transcript for abridged episode with Marisa Renee Lee The Wonder Project: Subscriber support makes more great content like I Gotta Ask with Annie F. Downs possible. The Wonder Project subscription on Prime Video is available in the U.S. for $8.99/month or $89.99/year after a 7-day free trial. Visit IGottaAsk.com to learn more! Join NSE+ — our subscriber-only community — for ad-free listening, member-only bonus content, and early access to live show tickets. Your membership helps make No Small Endeavor sustainable. No Small Endeavor: An award-winning podcast that asks what it means to live a good life. Through conversations with leading thinkers across theology, philosophy, psychology, politics, and the social sciences, we explore human flourishing, meaning and purpose, faith and culture, science and religion, virtue and character, religion and spirituality, community, and the practices that help shape a good life grounded in truth, beauty, and goodness. Follow @nosmallendeavor Host Lee C. Camp: Lee has worked as a professor of theology & ethics for more than 25 years, teaching and writing on topics of faith & politics, inter-religious dialog, and human flourishing at the intersection of theology, moral philosophy, and social sciences. Follow @leeccamp Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
Transcribe →
The Subtext: Talking about 'Paradise' & Nuclear War
1w ago00:46:33Tap to summarizeWhen the world feels like it's ending, some people buy bunkers, some people move to Argentina, some people stop reading the news entirely. How should Christians behave in the face of existential dread? Paradise got renewed for a third season, and we're using it as an excuse to ask a question we've all been quietly avoiding: how do you cope when the threat is real? In this episode, Savannah and Lee dig into a Hulu thriller about who gets saved when civilization collapses, Annie Jacobsen's minute-by-minute account of nuclear war, a billionaire building escape routes out of the country he helped shape, and one man in Ohio who decided the only sane response was to stop paying attention entirely. What do we do with existential dread? For those of us with faith, what are we actually supposed to do with it? Things we mentioned in this episode: Kevin Morby Nuclear War: A Scenario by Annie Jacobsen Paradise on Hulu The Truman Show Allison Russell on No Small Endeavor Meditations for Mortals by Oliver Burkeman Follow The Subtext: Instagram | Threads | X | YouTube | TikTok Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter | Lee's Newsletter Follow Savannah: Instagram | Substack Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
Transcribe →
266: Marisa Renee Lee: Grief, Uncertainty, and the Work of Realistic Hope
2w ago00:51:22Tap to summarizeHow do we learn to live with grief when healing takes longer than we hoped? Author and advocate Marisa Renee Lee learned about grief early, watching her mother move through years of illness before losing her to cancer. Years later, after becoming a mother herself and developing long COVID, Marisa found herself facing a new kind of uncertainty. One that reshaped her body, her work, and her understanding of hope. In this conversation, she reflects on grief, chronic illness, faith, joy, and the healing that becomes possible when we stop pretending we can carry everything alone. Key ideas in this episode: Choose Realistic Hope Hope does not have to mean pretending everything will be fine; it can mean committing to the next faithful action toward a better place. Make Space to Heal Marisa challenges a productivity-driven culture by reminding us that grief, illness, and uncertainty require time, attention, and real support. Ask for Help Healing becomes possible when we name our limits honestly and let other people carry pieces of the burden with us. Let Joy Do Its Work Laughter, beauty, concerts, television, family stories, and small daily pleasures can create room for the brain and body to process pain. Honor the Body’s Grief Loss is not just emotional; grief can affect the brain, weaken the immune system, and make ordinary tasks feel impossible. Show Notes, Resources, and Transcript for abridged episode with Marisa Renee Lee The Wonder Project: Subscriber support makes more great content like I Gotta Ask with Annie F. Downs possible. The Wonder Project subscription on Prime Video is available in the U.S. for $8.99/month or $89.99/year after a 7-day free trial. Visit IGottaAsk.com to learn more! Join NSE+ — our subscriber-only community — for ad-free listening, member-only bonus content, and early access to live show tickets. Your membership helps make No Small Endeavor sustainable. No Small Endeavor: An award-winning podcast that asks what it means to live a good life. Through conversations with leading thinkers across theology, philosophy, psychology, politics, and the social sciences, we explore human flourishing, meaning and purpose, faith and culture, science and religion, virtue and character, religion and spirituality, community, and the practices that help shape a good life grounded in truth, beauty, and goodness. Follow @nosmallendeavor Host Lee C. Camp: Lee has worked as a professor of theology & ethics for more than 25 years, teaching and writing on topics of faith & politics, inter-religious dialog, and human flourishing at the intersection of theology, moral philosophy, and social sciences. Follow @leeccamp Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
Transcribe →
265: Unabridged Interview: Hunter Prosper
2w ago01:00:59Tap to summarizeThis is our unabridged interview with Hunter Prosper. What happens when caring for others costs you the ability to feel? During the COVID pandemic, Hunter spent his days caring for critically ill patients in the ICU. Over time, the emotional weight became overwhelming. He found himself pulling away not only from patients, but from friends, family, and even his own emotions. Then one day, desperate to reconnect with the world, he walked outside and struck up a conversation with a stranger. That simple interaction eventually became the viral project Stories From A Stranger, a series built around honest conversations with ordinary people about love, fear, meaning, loss, and what it means to be human. Key Ideas Silence Can Heal Hunter explains why meaningful listening often requires resisting the urge to interrupt, fix, or fill the silence. Connection Requires Vulnerability After COVID burnout left him emotionally numb, Hunter discovered that healing meant risking closeness again instead of avoiding it. Every Person Wants To Be Seen From ICU patients to strangers in the park, Hunter’s work reveals how deeply people long to feel heard and understood. Shared Emotions Unite Us While our stories differ, Hunter argues that emotions like grief, anxiety, love, and hope connect every human being. Authenticity Builds Confidence Hunter reflects on how embracing vulnerability — rather than performing strength — made him more grounded and secure in himself. Conversation Can Restore Humanity Through thousands of interviews, Hunter has learned that authentic conversation can transform loneliness into community and fear into compassion. Show Notes, Resources, and Transcript for abridged episode with Hunter Prosper The Wonder Project: Subscriber support makes more great content like I Gotta Ask with Annie F. Downs possible. The Wonder Project subscription on Prime Video is available in the U.S. for $8.99/month or $89.99/year after a 7-day free trial. Visit IGottaAsk.com to learn more! Join NSE+ — our subscriber-only community — for ad-free listening, member-only bonus content, and early access to live show tickets. Your membership helps make No Small Endeavor sustainable. No Small Endeavor: An award-winning podcast that asks what it means to live a good life. Through conversations with leading thinkers across theology, philosophy, psychology, politics, and the social sciences, we explore human flourishing, meaning and purpose, faith and culture, science and religion, virtue and character, religion and spirituality, community, and the practices that help shape a good life grounded in truth, beauty, and goodness. Follow @nosmallendeavor Host Lee C. Camp: Lee has worked as a professor of theology & ethics for more than 25 years, teaching and writing on topics of faith & politics, inter-religious dialog, and human flourishing at the intersection of theology, moral philosophy, and social sciences. Follow @leeccamp Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
Transcribe →
The Subtext: America’s UFC Freedom Fight
2w ago00:41:13Tap to summarizeWhen a cage fight lands on the White House lawn, it's worth asking… what exactly are we celebrating? On June 14, 2026 (Flag Day, Trump's 80th birthday, and the eve of America's 250th anniversary) the White House South Lawn will host something it never has before: a UFC cage fight. We're going beneath the spectacle to ask what it actually means when the symbols we use to celebrate a nation reveal something uncomfortable about who that nation has become. Things we mentioned in this episode: Nuclear War: A Scenario by Annie Jacobsen Yesteryear by Caro Claire Burke Meditations for Mortals by Oliver Burkeman Kin by Tayari Jones Follow The Subtext: Instagram | Threads | X | YouTube | TikTok Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter | Lee's Newsletter Follow Savannah: Instagram | Substack Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
Transcribe →
265: Hunter Prosper: An ICU Nurse on Trauma and the Healing Power of Listening
3w ago00:51:32Tap to summarizeWhat happens when caring for others costs you the ability to feel? During the COVID pandemic, Hunter spent his days caring for critically ill patients in the ICU. Over time, the emotional weight became overwhelming. He found himself pulling away not only from patients, but from friends, family, and even his own emotions. Then one day, desperate to reconnect with the world, he walked outside and struck up a conversation with a stranger. That simple interaction eventually became the viral project Stories From A Stranger, a series built around honest conversations with ordinary people about love, fear, meaning, loss, and what it means to be human. Key Ideas Silence Can Heal Hunter explains why meaningful listening often requires resisting the urge to interrupt, fix, or fill the silence. Connection Requires Vulnerability After COVID burnout left him emotionally numb, Hunter discovered that healing meant risking closeness again instead of avoiding it. Every Person Wants To Be Seen From ICU patients to strangers in the park, Hunter’s work reveals how deeply people long to feel heard and understood. Shared Emotions Unite Us While our stories differ, Hunter argues that emotions like grief, anxiety, love, and hope connect every human being. Authenticity Builds Confidence Hunter reflects on how embracing vulnerability — rather than performing strength — made him more grounded and secure in himself. Conversation Can Restore Humanity Through thousands of interviews, Hunter has learned that authentic conversation can transform loneliness into community and fear into compassion. Show Notes, Resources, and Transcript for abridged episode with Hunter Prosper The Wonder Project: Subscriber support makes more great content like I Gotta Ask with Annie F. Downs possible. The Wonder Project subscription on Prime Video is available in the U.S. for $8.99/month or $89.99/year after a 7-day free trial. Visit IGottaAsk.com to learn more! Join NSE+ — our subscriber-only community — for ad-free listening, member-only bonus content, and early access to live show tickets. Your membership helps make No Small Endeavor sustainable. No Small Endeavor: An award-winning podcast that asks what it means to live a good life. Through conversations with leading thinkers across theology, philosophy, psychology, politics, and the social sciences, we explore human flourishing, meaning and purpose, faith and culture, science and religion, virtue and character, religion and spirituality, community, and the practices that help shape a good life grounded in truth, beauty, and goodness. Follow @nosmallendeavor Host Lee C. Camp: Lee has worked as a professor of theology & ethics for more than 25 years, teaching and writing on topics of faith & politics, inter-religious dialog, and human flourishing at the intersection of theology, moral philosophy, and social sciences. Follow @leeccamp Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
Transcribe →
264: Unabridged Interview: Norman Wirzba
3w ago01:17:11Tap to summarizeThis is our unabridged interview with Norman Wirzba. How does the pursuit of independence distort our understanding of the good life? Before Norman Wirzba became a theologian, philosopher, and public intellectual, he was a farm boy in Southern Alberta, waking before sunrise to tend to the land and animals in his care, and he says that these early experiences working with the natural world taught him one essential lesson: life does not exist on our terms. Now a professor at Duke University working at the intersection of theology, philosophy, and agrarian studies, Norman argues that modern culture has trapped us in an illusion of self-reliance, when the key to a good life may simply require a deeper understanding of our place in what he calls the meshwork world. Key Ideas: See Beyond Self-Sufficiency Norman challenges the modern myth of the isolated individual and invites us to recognize how deeply our lives depend upon others. Let Care Shape Your Life Farming taught Norman that flourishing begins with patience, attentiveness, and responsibility toward living things. Rediscover the Sacred Ordinary Everyday realities, from baking a pie to tending animals, become windows into gratitude, beauty, and shared human creativity. Resist the Culture of Control The pursuit of frictionless living and technological mastery can erode our capacity for compassion, humility, and wonder. Practice Rest Rest is not just about stopping work, but making time to cherish one another. Show Notes, Resources, and Transcript for abridged episode with Norman Wirzba The Wonder Project: Subscriber support makes more great content like I Gotta Ask with Annie F. Downs possible. The Wonder Project subscription on Prime Video is available in the U.S. for $8.99/month or $89.99/year after a 7-day free trial. Visit IGottaAsk.com to learn more! Join NSE+ — our subscriber-only community — for ad-free listening, member-only bonus content, and early access to live show tickets. Your membership helps make No Small Endeavor sustainable. No Small Endeavor: An award-winning podcast that asks what it means to live a good life. Through conversations with leading thinkers across theology, philosophy, psychology, politics, and the social sciences, we explore human flourishing, meaning and purpose, faith and culture, science and religion, virtue and character, religion and spirituality, community, and the practices that help shape a good life grounded in truth, beauty, and goodness. Follow @nosmallendeavor Host Lee C. Camp: Lee has worked as a professor of theology & ethics for more than 25 years, teaching and writing on topics of faith & politics, inter-religious dialog, and human flourishing at the intersection of theology, moral philosophy, and social sciences. Follow @leeccamp Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
Transcribe →
The Subtext: Yesteryear and the Trad Wife Movement with Beth Allison Barr
3w ago00:43:19Tap to summarizeWe have a substitute teacher on today's episode! Lee is out of town, so Savannah called upon All the Buried Women co-host Beth Allison Barr to step in. The trad wife dream might look beautiful on camera, but what if you actually have to live it? What happens when a woman who sells the fantasy of "traditional" womanhood wakes up and has to actually live it? Using Yesteryear as a jumping-off point, Savannah sits down with historian and author Beth Allison Barr to dissect the trad wife movement, what it promises, what it erases, and what women actually lost before they had the legal right to say no. Things we mentioned in this episode: All the Buried Women podcast For All Mankind on Apple TV A Rome of One's Own by Emma Southon Yesteryear by Caro Claire Burke Meditations for Mortals by Oliver Burkeman The Five by Hallie Rubenhold Follow The Subtext: Instagram | Threads | X | YouTube | TikTok Follow Lee: Instagram | Twitter | Lee's Newsletter Follow Savannah: Instagram | Substack Join our Email List: nosmallendeavor.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
Transcribe →
264: Norman Wirzba: The Myth of Self-Sufficiency and the Good Life
4w ago00:51:54Tap to summarizeThis is our unabridged interview with Norman Wirzba. How does the pursuit of independence distort our understanding of the good life? Before Norman Wirzba became a theologian, philosopher, and public intellectual, he was a farm boy in Southern Alberta, waking before sunrise to tend to the land and animals in his care, and he says that these early experiences working with the natural world taught him one essential lesson: life does not exist on our terms. Now a professor at Duke University working at the intersection of theology, philosophy, and agrarian studies, Norman argues that modern culture has trapped us in an illusion of self-reliance, when the key to a good life may simply require a deeper understanding of our place in what he calls the meshwork world. Key Ideas: See Beyond Self-Sufficiency Norman challenges the modern myth of the isolated individual and invites us to recognize how deeply our lives depend upon others. Let Care Shape Your Life Farming taught Norman that flourishing begins with patience, attentiveness, and responsibility toward living things. Rediscover the Sacred Ordinary Everyday realities, from baking a pie to tending animals, become windows into gratitude, beauty, and shared human creativity. Resist the Culture of Control The pursuit of frictionless living and technological mastery can erode our capacity for compassion, humility, and wonder. Practice Rest Rest is not just about stopping work, but making time to cherish one another. Show Notes, Resources, and Transcript for abridged episode with Norman Wirzba The Wonder Project: Subscriber support makes more great content like I Gotta Ask with Annie F. Downs possible. The Wonder Project subscription on Prime Video is available in the U.S. for $8.99/month or $89.99/year after a 7-day free trial. Visit IGottaAsk.com to learn more! Join NSE+ — our subscriber-only community — for ad-free listening, member-only bonus content, and early access to live show tickets. Your membership helps make No Small Endeavor sustainable. No Small Endeavor: An award-winning podcast that asks what it means to live a good life. Through conversations with leading thinkers across theology, philosophy, psychology, politics, and the social sciences, we explore human flourishing, meaning and purpose, faith and culture, science and religion, virtue and character, religion and spirituality, community, and the practices that help shape a good life grounded in truth, beauty, and goodness. Follow @nosmallendeavor Host Lee C. Camp: Lee has worked as a professor of theology & ethics for more than 25 years, teaching and writing on topics of faith & politics, inter-religious dialog, and human flourishing at the intersection of theology, moral philosophy, and social sciences. Follow @leeccamp Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
Transcribe →
263: Unabridged Interview: Joe Vukov
4w ago01:13:16Tap to summarizeThis is our unabridged interview with Joe Vukov. What if AI’s greatest revelation isn’t about technology at all — but about us? Philosopher Joe Vukov joins Lee C. Camp for a conversation about artificial intelligence, human dignity, and the spiritual dangers hidden beneath our technological optimism. Drawing from philosophy, theology, neuroscience, and Catholic social thought, Vukov argues that AI exposes how modern culture has already reduced human beings to data processors, forgetting the importance of bodies, relationships, and rooted human presence. To hear more on this topic from Joe, along with other scholars and experts in the technology space, listen to our two-part series: The Human Cost of AI Part 1 - Money, Sex, and Tools https://pod.link/1513178238/episode/NjgzOWVkY2MtMmQzOC0xMWYxLTkzOTYtY2Y0MDMzMjMyMTVh?view=apps&sort=popularity Part 2 - What Is It All For? https://pod.link/1513178238/episode/MWE5OGRlOWEtMzJjNy0xMWYxLTlhNzEtYWI0YzMzZDZjOWI2?view=apps&sort=popularity Show Notes, Resources, and Transcript for part one of our AI series Join NSE+ — our subscriber-only community — for ad-free listening, member-only bonus content, and early access to live show tickets. Your membership helps make No Small Endeavor sustainable. No Small Endeavor: An award-winning podcast that asks what it means to live a good life. Through conversations with leading thinkers across theology, philosophy, psychology, politics, and the social sciences, we explore human flourishing, meaning and purpose, faith and culture, science and religion, virtue and character, religion and spirituality, community, and the practices that help shape a good life grounded in truth, beauty, and goodness. Follow @nosmallendeavor Host Lee C. Camp: Lee has worked as a professor of theology & ethics for more than 25 years, teaching and writing on topics of faith & politics, inter-religious dialog, and human flourishing at the intersection of theology, moral philosophy, and social sciences. Follow @leeccamp Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
Transcribe →