Nonprofit Lowdown Episode #356 Summary

Episode Title: The Trust Crisis in Major Gift Fundraising with Greg Warner
Host: Rhea Wong
Guest: Greg Warner (CEO of MarketSmart)
Release Date: September 22, 2025

Episode Overview

In this candid conversation, Rhea Wong sits down with major gift fundraising expert Greg Warner to dissect the growing crisis of trust within donor relationships—especially in the realm of major gifts. Together, they explore shifting donor behaviors, the pitfalls of data-driven fundraising tactics, the nuanced role of technology, and the pivotal importance of transparency and empathy in building lasting donor partnerships. The episode is packed with practical insights, bold critiques, and memorable strategies to move beyond transactional fundraising and foster genuine, trust-based relationships.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Erosion of Donor Trust – Why It's Happening (03:29–05:33)

• Changing Demographics: Donors today, especially Gen X and Boomers, are inherently less trusting due to overexposure to marketing and broken promises by various sectors. Technology plays a significant role, making it easier for donors to research and be skeptical.
  • "We grew up being told that Frosted Flakes are part of a complete breakfast. We don’t trust anybody." – Greg Warner [04:18]
• History of Bad Actors: A few organizational scandals have corroded collective trust, impacting the entire sector.
• Transparency & Technology: Increased ability to research charities via technology magnifies scrutiny and suspicion.

2. The Double-Edged Sword of Wealth Screening & Data (05:33–11:08)

• Extractive Data Use: Wealth screens and marketing data often lead organizations to treat major donors like “targets,” rather than people with nuanced financial lives and needs.
  • "None of the donors have granted permission. I get it, it’s publicly available information, but… would they like it if they found it?" – Greg Warner [09:14]
• Inaccurate Narratives: Wealth data is often misleading or incomplete, making premature or ill-informed approaches common.
• Cost vs. Consequence: Easy, cheap access to data fuels shortcut-taking, creating “hunting” mindsets instead of relationship-building ones.

3. Transactional vs. Relational Fundraising Models (11:08–15:08)

• Multiple Business Models: Nonprofits mistakenly treat all donors with the same tactics, when transactional, mid-level, and major gifts each need distinct approaches.
  • "The transactional aspect of the business is the gateway drug… The few who will be capable of making a major or legacy gift—you have to think about their experience across the entire relationship.” – Greg Warner [13:28]
• Flawed Pipelines: The classic fundraising pyramid and point-A-to-B thinking ignore the non-linear ways donors actually engage.

4. The Myth of the Fundraising Pyramid & Non-Linear Donor Journeys (16:13–18:59)

• Surprising Data: 25% of major gifts over $5,000 come from new major donors each year, often without a typical cultivation path.
  • "For gifts over $5,000, 25% each year come from new major donors on average across thousands of organizations… and then they’re gone.” – Greg Warner [17:07]
• Implication: Fundraisers must recognize and create opportunities for sporadic, non-linear major giving—often from “invisible” fans.

5. The Role of Transparency in Building Donor Relationships (20:49–25:35)

• Transparency Is Just the Start: True trust comes from transparency plus delivering value aligned with donors’ identities and motivations.
  • “Transparency is just one small component of trust building. Trust is the foundation… for anything else to happen in a relationship.” – Greg Warner [20:50]
• The Donor’s Desired Outcome: Donors seek enhanced identity—a sense their giving reflects and reinforces their story, values, and community standing.
  • “The victory is the act of giving… the enhanced identity is the afterglow.” – Greg Warner [22:40]

6. The Fundraiser as Guide, Not Extractor (25:35–31:52)

• Donor Inclusion: The podcast pushes back against both donor-centric and community-centric extremes, advocating a mission-centric but donor-driven model.
  • “Your role as a fundraiser is… you are the guide, you are the Yoda to their experience.” – Rhea Wong [25:35]
• Community-Centric Critique: Many organizations exclude donors from their mission, viewing them with suspicion, rather than as integral community members.

7. Board Members: Donors Too (29:35–31:52)

• Underappreciated Board Relationships: Board members are often a nonprofit’s biggest donors but are stewarded poorly after joining the board.
  • "Let us not forget your board members are your top donors." – Rhea Wong [29:21]
• Solution: Understand what board members themselves want to gain from serving.

8. Donor-Driven, Not Donor-Led (31:52–35:54)

• Responsive Fundraising: Fundraisers should ask permission, co-create giving experiences, and act with the curiosity and partnership of a professional advisor.
  • "You have to stop being an Extractionist and you have to become a partner, counselor, and guide." – Greg Warner [34:24]
• Practical Approaches:
  • Ask exploratory questions: asset types, giving intentions, motivations beyond finances.
  • Mirror the trusted advisory model of lawyers/CPAs to unlock honest, open conversations.

9. Creating “Disney-Level” Donor Experiences (35:54–37:17)

• Memorable Giving as Retention: Organizations should strive to create magical, holistic experiences that keep donors coming back, paralleling Disney’s customer experience journey.

10. Year-End Sprint: Practical Tips for Building Trust Now (37:17–39:07)

• Small Mindset Shift: Move from "How can I get your money?" to "How can I make this a rewarding experience for you?"
  • “Instead of calling someone up just to ask for their renewal, what can I do for you? I would love to help you see your impact…” – Greg Warner [37:47]
• Authentic Curiosity: Approach donors with genuine interest in their stories and needs. This is the path to larger, repeated gifts with less prospect churn.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the state of trust (04:18):
  "We don’t trust anybody. And boomers don’t either. It’s just they’re still trusting Walter Cronkite and the news a little bit and whatnot. But even they are breaking away." — Greg Warner

• On wealth screening (09:14):
  “I always wonder if you dropped like a folder and the wealth screening fell out in the kitchen of your major donor and they picked it up, would they like it?... No.” — Greg Warner

• On the fundraising pyramid's flaws (17:07):
  "For gifts over $5,000, 25%… come from new major donors each year… What’s funny is then a lot of them, after two or three years, are gone." — Greg Warner

• On donors’ desired outcome (22:40):
  "Everybody who gives, especially at the larger dollar amounts, wants to gain a victory that enhances their identity." — Greg Warner

• On the fundraiser's true role (25:35):
  "Your role as a fundraiser... you are the guide, you are the Yoda to their experience." — Rhea Wong

• On approaching donors as partners (34:24):
  "You have to stop being an Extractionist and you have to become a partner, counselor, and guide." — Greg Warner

• On meaningful stewardship (37:47):
  "Instead of calling someone up just to ask for their renewal, what can I do for you? I would love to help you see your impact..." — Greg Warner

Timestamps for Key Segments

• [03:29] — The erosion of trust & what’s changed in donor behavior
• [06:13] — The donor perspective on wealth screening/data misuse
• [11:08] — Dangers of a transactional, “burn and churn” model
• [16:13] — Why the fundraising pyramid and pipeline model are wrong
• [17:07] — Stunning stats: Major gifts from first-time donors
• [20:49] — The true role of transparency in trust-building
• [25:35] — Fundraisers as guides, not extractors; including donors in the mission
• [29:35] — Board members deserve donor-level stewardship
• [34:24] — Shifting to donor-driven, partnership-based fundraising
• [35:54] — Making giving “magical”: Lessons from Disney
• [37:17] — Practical ways to build trust with donors this year-end

Final Takeaways

• Trust is the foundation of major gift fundraising; lose it, and it’s nearly impossible to recover.
• Modern donors, armed with more information and skepticism, reject extractive, transactional approaches.
• Fundraisers must become guides—curious, empathetic, and donor-driven—moving beyond data mining to authentic relationship-building.
• Transparency, identity enhancement, and memorable stewardship are indispensable to donor retention and growth.
• Begin donor conversations with service in mind: ask “What can I do for you?” instead of “What can you do for me?”

You can learn more about Greg Warner and access the Fundraising Report Card free tool at fundraisingreportcard.com.

This episode is a must-listen for any nonprofit leader or fundraiser who wants to build real, lasting relationships with major donors—without losing their soul (or their donors’ trust) in the process.