A Guncle’s Tale with Griff Stark Ennis

Summary

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Normal Gossip

Episode: "A Guncle’s Tale with Griff Stark Ennis"

Date: July 15, 2026
Host: Rachel Hampton
Guest: Griff Stark Ennis (actor, model, co-host of Petty Crimes)

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Episode Overview

This episode dives into the heart of what Normal Gossip does best: dissecting juicy, anonymous gossip—this time with the help of Griff Stark Ennis, co-host of the Petty Crimes podcast. The main theme is how generational dynamics, queer community, and personal boundaries collide in the context of a wild, wedding-adjacent neighborly saga featuring drama, favors gone wrong, floods (literal and metaphorical), and a foursome during a pandemic. The episode explores the nuances of gossip, the nature of “petty crimes,” and the joys and dangers of being a “gunkle” (gay uncle).

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Introducing Griff Stark Ennis and Discussing Gossip

• Rachel introduces Griff as an in-demand guest who fits perfectly with the podcast’s vibe (01:01).
• On relationships to gossip:
  • Griff: "At the end of the day, it's just sharing stories. And I think it's really important to be sharing stories constantly...It helps me get to know who they are, how they are, what they are" (03:30).
  • Both hosts agree that gossip is amoral on its own—like language or any tool, it’s all about intent and impact.

2. Is Gossip a Petty Crime?

• Griff and Rachel debate whether gossip rises to the level of a “petty crime.”
  • Griff: "Petty by nature shouldn't really be that significant. And so I'm inclined to say that gossip is petty and petty is okay, which means that gossip is okay. That's called math." (05:19)
• They discuss the spectrum of harm and intent behind gossip.

3. Griff’s Club Gossip: “Criminal or Minimal?”

• Griff shares a workplace story from a private LA club involving a closeted, well-known straight-acting actor who reveals a different side when drinking.
• Griff tells straight male actor friends about this revelation, questioning their idolization of strictly heteronormative celebrities.
• Rachel rules: “Minimal. Not criminal at all.” She argues that a little queerness awareness is healthy, especially for men obsessed with “not being gay.” (09:42)
  • Rachel: "Sometimes men who are mostly straight, maybe not entirely, focus so much on not being gay, right? That...it almost becomes gay." (09:48)
• Both agree that whisper networks already carry this kind of knowledge, and "it's a privilege to gossip" (12:13).

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Main Gossip Story: The Gunkle, the Wedding, and the Foursome

[15:46] – Setting the Scene: Jim, Carlos, and Lonnie

• Jim and Carlos: married gay couple, early 30s, own a home in a California city.
• Lonnie: their older neighbor (75), retired museum curator, distinctly cultured and openly gay.
• Pandemic brings them into closer neighborly friendship, fueled by cheese plates and wine.

[18:56] – Lonnie, the Pool, and Chosen Family

• Intergenerational queer friendship.
• Importance of queer elders; Lonnie as “intergenerational glue.”
  • Griff: “Everyone needs a Lonnie...especially if you’re queer.” (19:33)

[22:01] – Lonnie’s Hot Young Boyfriend (the Pool Boy)

• Lonnie introduces a much younger boyfriend (in his 20s, formerly his pool boy); moves in after two months.
• Jim & Carlos (and Griff) are supportive, seeing the relationship as bringing Lonnie joy and vibrancy.

[27:07] – The Favor: Hosting Wedding Guests

• Lonnie asks if Jim and Carlos can host out-of-town wedding guests (Patrick's sister, her husband, and 80-year-old aunt) for several nights for his nephew Peter’s upcoming backyard wedding.
• They agree, though hosting strangers while they're absent is awkward.

[31:43] – The Second Favor: Loaning the Truck

• Lonnie asks to borrow Jim’s truck for wedding setup.
• Assurance: “Don’t worry, my boyfriend will drive.” (foreshadowing!)

[33:02] – Disaster Strikes: The Great Flood

• Jim and Carlos return from LA to a series of missed calls—Lonnie is in tears.
• Lonnie, left to do wedding setup alone, backs the truck over their front yard, destroying landscaping, flower beds, a magnolia, and, crucially, the water hose spigot—causing massive flooding.
  • Griff: “You picture worst case scenario...what would send Lonnie into complete hysteria. And there’s something about an uncontrolled amount of water...” (40:38)

[42:11] – Picking Up the Pieces

• Amidst chaos and mounting expenses, Jim and Carlos decide to proceed with the rehearsal dinner and wedding, vowing never to do Lonnie this sort of favor again (43:04).

[43:32] – Drag Queens to the Rescue

• Lonnie’s boyfriend surprises everyone by booking three top drag queens—one from Drag Race—for the rehearsal, as a special gift for the grooms.
• Rachel: “I would forgive anyone if they brought Kylie Minogue to my home.” (46:47)

[47:44] – The Wedding and...Flirting?

• Jim & Carlos, stressed out but tipsy and dancing, are propositioned by Peter and Patrick (newlyweds), who find them attractive and want to “continue the party.”

[50:07] – The Nightcap: Wedding Night Foursome

• After initially declining, Jim and Carlos are visited late at night by Peter and Patrick, who sneak over with a $4,000 bottle of Macallan 25 ("that's a little too much to steal," Griff jokes) (50:38).
• The four have, in Rachel’s words, “an extremely hot four way” until 5am (51:48).
• The next day, Peter’s mother learns of the escapade, and soon, everyone knows.

[53:00] – Lonnie’s Disappointment

• Lonnie, feeling betrayed, lectures them about the “sanctity of a wedding day” and lost generational etiquette:
  • “Back in his day you’d go to several pool parties before doing a four way...But clearly that message has not reached the younger generation.”
• He’s “not mad, just disappointed.”

[54:50] – Game: Criminal or Minimal

1. Moving the hot young pool boy in after two months?
   • Griff: “Minimal...Lonnie deserves that fun. Expediting certain relationships like that, I think is totally fair given his age.” (54:50)
2. Letting your neighbor use your house as an Airbnb?
   • Griff: “Criminal.” (55:31)
3. Having a foursome with the grooms on their wedding night?
   • Griff: “Minimal” since Peter & Patrick initiated. “Their generosity needs to be rewarded. The answer is a capitalized yes.” (49:10 & 56:12)

[56:59] – The COVID Twist

• Jim and Carlos (and nearly everyone present) test positive for COVID. The wedding became a super-spreader event—thankfully all had mild cases.

[57:58] – Epilogue: Awkward Neighbors

• Some months later, Peter and Patrick move into the neighborhood, trying to reconnect; Jim and Carlos have so far avoided them.
• Griff suggests a “sticky note” method for tracking readiness to rekindle, but leaves them to their own boundaries (59:07).

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Rachel on gossip’s morality:
  “Gossip is mostly a tool, almost like language, in that it can be used for whatever purpose you want it to be used, but inherently it's not one thing or another.” (04:49)

• Griff on the club incident:
  "I'm not going around the club, like, duck walking and like, honey, honey, honey. Like, I'm queer, but I'm not, like, screaming it at the, like, top of the roof. You know what I mean?" (08:19)

• Griff (on the foursome):
  “This is a night for fun. Also, Jim and Carlos have been through the fucking ringer with this. Their generosity needs to be rewarded. And, honey, I know how I need to be rewarded in certain situations. So the answer is a capitalized yes.” (49:10)

• Rachel’s “straight voice”:
  Rachel performs a “straight voice” to comedic effect, with Griff laughing:
  “Did you like it?”
  Griff: “I liked it. It actually turned me on a little bit.” (10:36)

• On generational differences:
  Lonnie: “Back in his day you'd go to several pool parties before doing a four way...Now people get freaky at the drop of a hat with no respect for the sanctity of a wedding day or the vicinity of an 80 year old aunt.” (53:47)

• Griff on forgiveness:
  "It's enough to let me forgive. I'm not gonna forget this. How...we're never going to forget the story. It's wild." (44:42)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [03:30] – Griff on the role of gossip in his life
• [07:22] – Club story: Suspicions about a famous actor
• [15:46] – Intro to the main gossip: Meet Jim, Carlos, and Lonnie
• [18:56] – Importance of queer elders in community
• [22:13] – The pool boy boyfriend revealed
• [27:07] – Lonnie’s wedding favor request
• [31:43] – Disaster: Lending the truck
• [33:02] – The great flood and ruined yard
• [43:32] – Drag queen wedding rehearsal surprise
• [47:44] – The wedding night: proposition and aftermath
• [50:38] – The infamous nightcap and four-way
• [53:00] – Lonnie’s reaction: not mad but disappointed
• [54:50] – “Criminal or Minimal” segment
• [56:59] – COVID super-spreader twist
• [57:58] – Neighbors for life: Post-wedding awkwardness

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Final Thoughts

This episode thrums with sparkling, irreverent queer energy and explores everything from club culture speculation, neighborly obligations, and “gunklehood,” to the sometimes messy overlap of community, boundaries, and fun. Rachel and Griff riff comedically and candidly about what really constitutes a crime, and what’s just a little bit juicy. Through each layer of the story, the hosts keep things light, unfiltered, and brimming with empathy—even for neighbors who accidentally destroy your yard.

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For listeners new to the show or this episode, expect:

• Deeply human, queer-positive storytelling,
• Hilarious, insightful cultural commentary,
• The warmth and messiness of real-life community,
• And a reminder: “You didn’t hear this from me.”

Transcript

[Alex Sujong Laughlin]

Try Hard is back with a new season featuring conversations with Ingrid Nielsen, Anna Sale, rishikeshirway, Alexandra Chee, and so many more guests this season. Host Alex Sujong Laughlin is diving into guest Try Hard moments, the big decisions, the pivots, and the leaps of faith that came to define their lives. Alex will be Talking to an OG lifestyle influencer who decided to leave her YouTube career behind her, an author who chose to write the book he wanted to write instead of the one editors wanted, and a fancy pants business consultant who who stepped off the career treadmill to do something radically different. Each of these episodes digs into the powerful stories we tell about ourselves. And what every guest has in common is that they've asked themselves the same question. What if I told a different story? Listen to Try Hard from Defector Media wherever you get your podcast.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Oh my God.

[Alex Sujong Laughlin]

Oh my God.

[Rachel Hampton]

Oh my God. What?

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Oh my God. Oh my God. Oh wow. Oh my God. Oh my gosh.

[Rachel Hampton]

Oh my God. What? Oh my gosh.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

What?

[Rachel Hampton]

Hello and welcome to season 10 of Normal Gossip. I'm your host, Rachel Hampton, and in each episode of this podcast, we're going to bring you an anonymous morsel of gossip from the real world. As you may know, this is our 10th season, our all star season, which means you'll be seeing some old friends this summer. And we have got some incredible new guests that some of y' all have been requesting forever. And this season we're doing something special. We are doing video because we have decided to join the modern world. You're welcome. If you wanna watch this episode, head on over to our YouTube page. Just search Defector Media and it should pop up. And of course we'll be linking in the show notes. But without further ado, I am so, so, so excited to introduce today's guest. When we started planning this season, we wanted to make sure we filled our roster with guests that we knew y' all would be pumping, pumped in jazz for. And I think today's guest definitely fits the bill. Today I am thrilled to be joined by none other than Griff Stark Ennis, co host of the Petty Crimes podcast. I did a guest spot on Petty Crimes back in May, which is when I confirmed what I long suspected, which is that the Venn diagram for the Petty Crimes Normal Gossip audience is just a circle, which is how I know today's episode is going to absolutely whip. Griff doesn't just host Petty Crimes, which by the way, is a Webby Award nominated show. Nbd. Griff is also an actor and model AKA he is professionally hot. We are so honored to be blessed by his presence. Grif, hello. Thank you so much for joining me.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Thank you for having me in the normal gossip. What do you guys call this, like virtual space? Like a gossip corner or the metaverse,

[Rachel Hampton]

I think is what they're calling it these days.

[Alex Sujong Laughlin]

Whoa.

[Rachel Hampton]

Okay, techie, I'm sorry. So honored that you're here. I had such a good time on petty crimes. And I don't know if you know this, but our audience has been clamoring to have you on normal gossip for a hot minute now.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Oh, okay.

[Rachel Hampton]

So you are hotly anticipated.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Okay. I feel like one of the, like Acotar High Faes. The like, pining desperation is something that I'm. I'm here to quell.

[Rachel Hampton]

Well, now that you're here in the normal gossip metaverse, I have to ask you the question that we ask all of our guests, which is, what is your relationship to gossip?

[Griff Stark Ennis]

At the end of the day, it's just sharing stories. And I think it's really important to be sharing stories constantly. Both for, like, learning purposes, entertainment purposes. I tend to be someone that people trust and so a lot of people share things with me. Like, you know, trivial things, I think meaningful things, you know, unless it's a danger to society. I'm really good at keeping secrets. I'm really more interested in absorbing information from people. It helps me get to know who they are, how they are, what they are. It's just storytelling. And if people feel some type of way about it, then maybe they hate stories.

[Rachel Hampton]

And you're right, those are people who actually are anti intellectual. People who hate gossip.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

You said it.

[Rachel Hampton]

I said it. But wait, do you consider gossip to be a petty crime on our show,

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Kira, specifically, I think my definition's a little bit looser. But Kira, my co host, she writes at snl. She's incredible. Super funny. She doesn't consider something petty if the motive behind it isn't intended to be petty. In that regard, if your uncle tells you a story and you accidentally slip that story at the Thanksgiving table that next year, is it petty that that was an accident? She would argue no. For me, it depends on the consequences it has, I guess.

[Rachel Hampton]

Yeah, no, I feel that. I think I've said on this podcast before that I consider gossip to be mostly a tool, almost like language, in that it can be used for whatever purpose that you want it to be used, but inherently it's not one thing or another.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Wow. It's fluid.

[Rachel Hampton]

It's a spectrum.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

It is a Spectrum. And you know what? We have to remind ourselves on our show. And sometimes we get crimes submitted that are a little bit more than petty. They're a little bit too intense or too dark.

[Rachel Hampton]

Yeah.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Petty by nature shouldn't really be that significant. And so I'm inclined to say that gossip is petty and petty is okay, which means that gossip is okay. That's called math.

[Rachel Hampton]

I love that. That's beautiful. Well, that makes me think that the story you're going to share with me.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Okay, so we have a segment on our show called Criminal or Amenable. So I'll start by saying at the end of this, I need you to say if this is criminal or minimal.

[Rachel Hampton]

Okay.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

I live in Los Angeles. I moved here to be an actor. Things have changed a little bit, but especially back in the day, eight and a half years ago, when I moved here, being a server at a restaurant was really great. Supplemental income and honestly, a survival job for your pursuits in entertainment. So I've been in that industry for a long time. Now that, you know, our show's growing a little bit, I'm nearing the end of that chapter, which I'm so thankful for.

[Rachel Hampton]

Hell yeah.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Hell yeah, girl. Like, it's about fucking time. But I now currently work at a private members club here in Los Angeles. It's pretty exclusive, Rachel. Like, we see a ton of people who you would for sure know. The person I'm about to talk about, I'll keep anonymous, but you would definitely know this person. So I've always watched this particular man movies and TV shows, and then paired that with his interviews. And the characters that this person plays are extremely, like, quintessential straight man. I have a very hot take that I believe all people are queer. It is a spectrum where you fall on that is like, obviously yours to figure out and be true in any who. I've always thought I think this actor is queer. He seems really familiar to me. I wonder if I'll ever, like, meet him or get a chance to, like, test it out. And again, this is like petty gossip. Nothing crazy happened. But what I did with it is what I need your ruling on. This person, turns out, is a member at the private club that I work at, and that's not identifying. We have, like, hundreds if not thousands of members. About a year ago, he finally came into the club and I saw him walk through the doors and I was like, I'm gonna, like, see if I can hover around him and maybe just like, pick up on vibes.

[Alex Sujong Laughlin]

Yeah.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

And the host brings him right into my section at the table directly in front of me. I run into the bar and I'm like, oh, my God, this person just sat in my section. I've always had this theory that blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And the bartender was a straight male. And he goes, no way. And I was like, bet. Like, I don't know. Let me go suss it out. So I go up to the table, you know, I do my, like, usual. Hi, welcome in. Can I get you started with any water? Filtered, house bottled, sparkling bottled, still?

[Rachel Hampton]

Yeah.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

He looks up from his menu and just stares at me. The look that he was giving me felt like when I was in college and, you know, entering my queerness. And still to this day, when you go into a party and, like, some friend's husband is, like, assessing you, or like some frat boy in college is just, like, assessing you. And it's like, that felt very familiar. It feels like he's seeing me. And it's not. I'm not going around the club, like, duck walking and like, honey, honey, honey. Like, I'm queer, but I'm not, like, screaming it at the, like, top of the roof. You know what I mean?

[Rachel Hampton]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

But I could tell he's like, he sees me and he sees maybe my truth or something. It just felt like that. And I was like, okay, okay, whatever. I take their order. People tend to act a little bit more naturally after a few drinks. And so I was like, this is a good time to test maybe, like, his performance as whatever he thinks he needs to be. And maybe after a few drinks, he'll be a little bit more natural. Three martinis later, he's just completely different. And I'm talking, like, pretty flamboyant. And I was just like, what an interesting swing from going to this very dapper, like, character to just this, like, almost like this older queen. I concluded just from that and kind of how he was interacting. And the people around his table just kind of, like, also clocking the switch. I was just like, this man is fully queer. I've always had this theory he's acting queer now. But, like, what I need you to rule on criminal or minimal is me pettily going up to any of my straight actor friends who idolize certain figures and never watch any, you know, women created content or queer created content and kind of, like, dismantling this, like, idolization of this guy by telling these, like, straight white male actor friends of mine that one of their idols is actually queer based on just that. And Rachel, I mean, like, telling People.

[Rachel Hampton]

Not criminal. I'm ruling. I have my gavel. Minimal. Not criminal at all.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Okay.

[Rachel Hampton]

I feel like sometimes men who are mostly straight, maybe not entirely, focus so much on not being gay, right? That it, like, wraps back around to an obsession with not being gay. And it's like, homie, maybe you don't want to marry a man, but you might want to kiss one.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Right?

[Rachel Hampton]

And I feel like most women, or at least most of the women that I know are like, yeah, of course I'd kiss a woman. It's not that deep. It doesn't really change who I am as a person. It doesn't really impact my identity. But men make not being gay such a big part of their identity that it almost becomes gay. So I think getting more men to realize that being a little bit gay will not change their lives that much, especially in a city like la.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Yes.

[Rachel Hampton]

It's like you're in the Mecca. Just kiss a man. Just see what it's like. At least then you can actually make a judgment rather than being like, no, I'm straight. And that's it. That's my straight voice. Did you like it?

[Griff Stark Ennis]

I liked it. It actually turned me on a little bit. I'm gonna address that off air. It's like, good boy vibes. But that's what it was. It was like you putting on that voice right then was very similar to what the first interaction with this man was. It felt like he was kind of putting on a voice and trying to just, I don't know, just really perform. And it's hard to tell with actors, right? Especially at that level because they're so talented. But just the swing between that to what it ended with was like, what character are you? I believe you're somewhere in the middle of this pendulum swing. But, like, it's just been interesting experiencing that across, you know, two hours, that evolution. And, you know, I'm queer. I respect everyone's identity. I wouldn't, I guess, typically never, like, out someone, and I'm not doing it publicly. This is the closest I've ever gotten. I don't know. The petty part of me is just like, these friends that I have, they also are so worried about, like, their masculinity that it sometimes prevents them from consuming other worlds or work that challenges that. And so when they're just like, oh, my holy grail is this person, this person, and this person, and those people are all the same, I'm like, that's fine. That's who you connect with. But just know one of those three People is gay.

[Rachel Hampton]

Minimal. I feel so comfortable reeling on that. So minimal.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Okay, okay, okay.

[Rachel Hampton]

I don't even really feel like you're spreading something that, you know, the little whisper networks of LA don't already have going.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Totally. I have the privilege of, like, you know, running around la, living my queer life, building out a career in entertainment as a queer person. I think anyone who has clocked in a little bit understands that even, like 10 years ago, it was really hard to have that identity and make a business and public profile. I acknowledge my privilege. Nonetheless, it's a privilege to gossip. And here I am.

[Rachel Hampton]

Well, that's actually kind of a perfect segue into the story that I have for you, Grif. Are you ready? Are you ready for some gossip?

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Totally. I have pen and paper next to me just in case I'm ready. Like, I don't remember names very easily. So here we go.

[Alex Sujong Laughlin]

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[Rachel Hampton]

Today we've got two friends of a friend. Their names are Jim and Carlos and at the time that our story takes place, Jim and Carlos are in their early 30s.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Okay.

[Rachel Hampton]

They've been married for just over three years and they live in a big city in California where they own their own home homeowner.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Anyone who can say that in like a big city in California, it's kind of like finger claps because that's fucking hard. So it's like ooh, good for you. Also like where'd you get the money?

[Rachel Hampton]

Well this is actually really important because our story begins in 2020.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Oh God.

[Rachel Hampton]

And for Jim and Carlos it's honestly a not very exciting year. Besides the impending sense of doom, their early pend pandemic, life is actually pretty easy. I lived in New York for most of the pandemic so I forget sometimes that if you lived in a house with a backyard and owned a car and worked from home, it was honestly pretty easy to social distance.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

I was in LA for quarantine and you know, it was, it was not an ideal year for anyone in the world but it was because of the space that we have and the weather and the access to I think nature. Like yeah, to your point it was much easier to quarantine. So that year was time back and I think just As a country boy who enjoys silence in, like, a slower pace, who can fuck with that? As much as I love a city, I was like, you know what? It could be worse.

[Rachel Hampton]

Well, for Jim and Carlos, this era is defined by three things. The first is Tiger King.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Oh, God.

[Rachel Hampton]

The second is the very elaborate cheese plates that they started making during this era, which they still make to this day because they're gay and they have free time.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Gay plus free time equals charcuterie board. Is that how you say it?

[Rachel Hampton]

Yes. Charcuterie board.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Charcoochie board.

[Rachel Hampton]

And the third thing that defines this era for Jim and Carlos is Lonnie. Lonnie is Jim and Carlos's neighbor. And before the pandemic, Jim and Carlos didn't actually really know that much about Lonnie. Like, they were always on good terms. Lonnie was always super chill to interact with. Whenever they were, like, coordinating maintenance for something like the share between their two houses, Lonnie would sign for Jim and Carlos's packages. Jim and Carlos would bring in Lonnie's trash every so often, because the one thing they absolutely know about Lonnie is that he is an older gentleman, like, at least in his late 60s. Okay, so before March 2020, this is basically all Jim and Carlos know about their neighbor. That he is older than them, that. That he seems chill.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Seems chill. Famous Last World.

[Rachel Hampton]

Well, this all changes one fateful night. It's, like, six weeks into lockdown. It's a Wednesday night. Jim and Carlos are enjoying their customary elaborate cheese plate outside with a bottle of wine. They've just popped the cork because it's a Prosecco kind of night, you know, when across the fence, they spot Lonnie sitting by his pool with his own elaborate cheese plates and his own bottle of wine.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Okay, There seems there's, like, one thing

[Rachel Hampton]

to do here, and from there, it's basically history. It helped that Jim and Carlos learned that night that Lonnie is also gay.

[Alex Sujong Laughlin]

Okay.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

I mean, come on.

[Rachel Hampton]

This is very exciting for Jim and Carlos. They're like, oh, my God. Queer elder.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

So important, by the way, queer elders, like that little actor. Not little. That big actor who I think is queer. Not being queer is. There's a reason, like, there's history that comes with what I'm doing today and the freedoms that I take advantage of. And so everyone needs a Lonnie in your life, especially if you're queer.

[Alex Sujong Laughlin]

Yeah.

[Rachel Hampton]

Lonnie is actually in his 70s, 75, to be exact. Lonnie is a retired museum curator and extremely cultured. Like, he has season tickets for the opera. Oh, and he always carries a paisley handkerchief. Like, even when he's gardening, he'll use one to, like, wipe his brow.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Okay, you know that handkerchiefs back in the day in the queer world had different significance based on the colors, right?

[Rachel Hampton]

I did not know that.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Hold on, I'm going to Google. Paisley handkerchief. Gay. Gay symbol.

[Rachel Hampton]

What does it mean?

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Oh, girl, in LGBTQ history, always a mouthful. The paisley handkerchief itself isn't a standalone symbol, but rather the classic pattern used for the hanky code or flagging. This 1970s nonverbal communication system used colored bandanas, like I said, in back pockets to discreetly signal sexual preferences, kinks, and desired roles. So I guess the. The paisley one's just kind of a like the neutral I'm queer one.

[Rachel Hampton]

Yeah. Oh, my God. Now you're adding context to the story. Well, would you befriend Lonnie? And how do you feel about befriending neighbors?

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Like, in general, quarantine was such a, I think, pivotal moment for neighborliness in that, you know, you were trapped in your apartment, not going to work, and so you turn to what made sense and what was technically close, which was your neighbors. And so I felt a shift in Los Angeles with that culture. So I'm very close with my neighbors downstairs across the hall. Yeah, it's like, both for social reasons, but then also like, hey, I have to be out of town tonight. Do you mind coming over and, like, feeding the dog or the cats downstairs or water the plants? So it's, like, huge value and just such a sense of comfort to know your neighbors. To know thy neighbors. I would befriend Lonnie. You saw the cheese board in his yard. You look at the cheese board in your lap. I don't know that there's a more obvious signal to befriend someone than a mutual admiration of cheese boards.

[Rachel Hampton]

And I think you're right. And the thing is, you're agreeing with Jim and Carlos, who are feeling really good about this. They're like, wow, this is community. Look at our intergenerational friendship.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Intergenerational friendship. I love that. Like, more of that, you know, there's always a consequence, too, of befriending anyone, really?

[Rachel Hampton]

Well, about a year into this intergenerational friendship, as the world is starting to open up a little bit more, Lonnie tells Jim and Carlos that he wants to introduce them to his new boyfriend.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

A new boyfriend at 75 years old? My heart.

[Rachel Hampton]

Jim and Carlos are thrilled with this development. Like, they Love hanging out with Lonnie, but they also can't help noticing how much time Lonnie is spending by himself. Like the world was opening up a little bit by 2021, but not necessarily for a 75 year old like Lonnie.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Right.

[Rachel Hampton]

So Jim and Carlos have been worried about him. They don't want him to just be sitting alone in his house all day with no one to talk to but the pool boy.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Queer people at Lonnie's age, it just really, like, pulls my heartstrings. I can't. I can't.

[Rachel Hampton]

Yeah. So this boyfriend development is huge news. The news only gets bigger when a few nights later, Lonnie shows up to their now standing wine and cheese Wednesdays with none other than the pool boy on his arm.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

The pool boy. How cliche, Loni.

[Rachel Hampton]

And listen, the pool boy is hot. Really hot. He is very clearly in his 20s.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

That's a gag, though. I kind of was like, you know, there was a fairly predictable world in which this older man who has money and is established and, you know, maybe doesn't have as many environments to date or, you know, he's definitely, I doubt on the apps, like, whoever comes into his orbit is going to be prime candidate for boyfriend. And it just so happens that this pool boy, by nature of his work, you know, was in Lonnie's life and honestly, mutually beneficial.

[Rachel Hampton]

Yeah. And this gossip has a lot of characters that will show up later. So I'm not gonna be giving the pool boy a name. He will be referred to as Lonnie's boyfriend from now on.

[Alex Sujong Laughlin]

Wow.

[Rachel Hampton]

But just know that Lonnie's boyfriend is young and pretty. And most importantly for our story, Lonnie's boyfriend means really well. Like, yes, he has daddy issues, but who doesn't, right? And Lonnie looks the happiest Jim and Carlos have ever seen him. So you're Jim and or Carlos. Are we happy for Lonnie?

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Yes, absolutely. I'm very happy that Lonnie has comfort and a person. Eye candy. I don't know if Lonnie is sexually active. If there are 75 year old queer men listening to this, let me know if you can still get it up. Like, maybe he's a bottom, I don't know. But like, I'm very happy, period.

[Rachel Hampton]

Jim and Carlos are like, who wouldn't fall in love with the pool boy? He's so hot. And honestly, the relationship seems really good for Lonnie. Like, Jim and Carlos hear Lonnie laughing from across the fence more they start seeing him on walks around the neighborhood hand in hand with his boyfriend. When summer starts, the boyfriend even manages to get Lonnie riding a bicycle on Saturday mornings for his cardiovascular health. When the boyfriend moves in with Lonnie less than two months into the relationship, Jim and Carlos are just like, you know what? Good for you, you crazy kids.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Exactly. At two months is, you know, that in Queer World. I don't know. Maybe that makes sense. It's also, you're coming out of quarantine, so you're raw and, like, uncalibrated in general, so who cares?

[Rachel Hampton]

Yeah. So everything's going really well. So well that when Lonnie comes to Jim and Carlos in the spring of 2022 asking for a favor, they say yes without even hearing what it is.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Oh, no, no, no, no. Let's, like, be loving and open and flexible, but let's, like, you know, collect details.

[Rachel Hampton]

Well, before I tell you what the favor is, I need to ask. Are you familiar with the term gunkle?

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Yes, I have. In my living room, I have a book called Gunkle. Actually, I identify as queer. Who cares? I can be called gay, bi, whatever, just not straight. I technically would be a gunkle, and so I'm familiar with it. I am it. I don't know that I love the term gunkle. At my core. I'm just. I want to just be your uncle.

[Rachel Hampton]

Yeah.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

But it's also great for, like, a little kid to know that, like, their uncle is gay. And that's built into that word. So complicated feelings with gunkle for the people at home.

[Rachel Hampton]

I feel like you basically described what it is, but what is a gunkle?

[Griff Stark Ennis]

A gunkle is a gay uncle. They've combined the words because we're all lazy these days. And with the label of gunkle, I think, comes certain expectations, which is why maybe I'm just like, I don't need the gunkle label. I would just like to be uncle. Because gunkle sometimes implies, like, you're going to come to Palm Springs and we're going to have so much fun and dress in caftans and, like, do this and do that and, like, pool parties. And it's like, what if I just want to chill? But you're my gunkle. You're supposed to be fun. It's like, girl, I can't be fun all the time.

[Rachel Hampton]

No one can be fun all the time.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

No one can.

[Rachel Hampton]

Well, you see, sweet Lonnie had never had any kids of his own, nor did he ever really want any. Or at least he always wanted an infinity pool More. And from what I understand, you cannot have children around infinity pools.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

You can't have both. Por que no los dos?

[Rachel Hampton]

No. What this means is that Lonnie takes his responsibilities as Gunkle very seriously. One of Lonnie's many nieces and nephews is getting married in May of 2022. This nephew is named Peter. And Peter also happens to be gay.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Okay.

[Rachel Hampton]

Peter and his fiance Patrick have been putting off their wedding for over two years now. Like, it was originally planned for April 2020. And, well, we all know what happened.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Well, exactly. You still could have gotten married, Peter and Patrick. But, like, you wanted the celebration. You're gay. You want it to be a fanfare. We get it.

[Rachel Hampton]

And now it's 2022, and Peter and Patrick don't even want a big wedding at this point. They just want, like, ceremony with their nearest and dearest. And they've asked Uncle Lonnie if they might be able to get married in his backyard, which is stunning. As we all know, it has a very well maintained pool and Lonnie is a talented gardener. So the backyard basically feels like a Garden of Eden. Lonnie, of course, says yes to his nephew immediately. Like, even as he is telling Jim and Carlos about this, it is very clear that Lonnie is very moved by this request of his nephew. This is what being a gunkle is all about. So Lonnie needs everything to be perfect. The plan, Lonnie tells Jim and Carlos is for Peter and his fiance Patrick to stay with Lonnie and his boyfriend, along with the groom's parents.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Okay.

[Rachel Hampton]

But Lonnie wants to know, would it be possible for a couple of guests to stay with Jim and Carlos? It would just be Patrick's sister and her husband and an 80 year old aunt. Now, Jim and Carlos do have the space, but everyone's getting into town a couple of days before the wedding. So this means at least three nights of having strangers as house guests. And of course, Jim and Carlos are invited to the wedding. So you're Jim and. Or Carlos. Would you agree to this?

[Griff Stark Ennis]

I think I would actually. Like, it's gonna be a fairly heavy lift. Yeah, it's definitely an inconvenience. I hear the three day commitment of it all. I see the lift, but I'm actually okay with it, especially because we love Lonnie. He's enveloped us into his world and vice versa. Like, it does make sense because the wedding's being kept small and it's a backyard wedding and I'm for it.

[Rachel Hampton]

Well, some Important information.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Like you're leading me into destruction. Like, I feel like you're tour guiding me, but you're like taking me around dark corners.

[Rachel Hampton]

What do you possibly mean by that?

[Griff Stark Ennis]

I don't know.

[Rachel Hampton]

Some important information is that Jim and Carlos actually already have plans to visit Carlos parents in LA until the day before the wedding. So while this means they would only have to deal with their guests for about 36 to 48 hours, it also means they would have strangers in their house unsupervised for about 36 to 48 hours. Fuck. Does this new information change your mind?

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Strangers is obviously the operative word. Like, I have a friend coming into town from Seattle in July and he may be. I'd have to ask my roommate, of course, be using my room while he's here because like, I'm going to be on the farm for the 4th of July and I won't be here because to Mike, he's basically a stranger. My roommate, they've met a few times, so how does that feel for him? This is a case where these family members of Peter and Patrick are complete strangers to Jim and Carlos. And Jim and Carlos won't be there to play host for the whole time. So I will say absolutely, they can stay here. We'll be there for the first day, for the next, for the last two, they'll be solo. Lonnie, you're going to have to be monitoring both properties. And obviously it goes without saying, but in this case you do need to say it. Anything that happens to the house will be the responsibility of whomever did it.

[Rachel Hampton]

This actually feels like perfect happenstance for Jim and Carlos. They're like, perfect. We only have to deal with them for like a day and a half. So they say yes to Lonnie, who is overjoyed. And then he's like, wait, one more thing though.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Okay.

[Rachel Hampton]

Turns out Lonnie has already rented a bunch of chairs and tables for the backyard. And he would love to be able to borrow Jim's truck while Jim and Carlos are gone so that he can pick everything up. It's too much to fit in his Prius.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

You can't fit shit in a Prius. You can't even fit one chair in a Prius.

[Rachel Hampton]

Exactly. And Lonnie says, don't worry, I won't be driving the truck. My boyfriend will be. So you don't have to worry about a 75 year old driving your pickup truck.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Okay? The truck of it all. Rachel. Oh my goodness. The asks just keep compiling. That's what happens with weddings. And favors. It's like, logistically, there's a lot to take care of with the wedding. The favors keep compiling because the planners go into planning mode. And one world. Borrowing Jim and Carlos's truck does make a lot of sense if they're not going to be using it. But it's like, y' all have already asked for a lot and you're mindful of that, right? Maybe not.

[Rachel Hampton]

Jim and Carlos are like, fine. We're not gonna be using it anyway. So they go to la, they're eating, they're drinking, they're dancing and catching up with family. And every so often, they're getting updates from Lonnie, who texts like you would expect a 75 year old to text.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Got it.

[Rachel Hampton]

But it's fine. It's fine. Cause Lonnie manages to convey the necessary information. The guests have arrived. They settled in. Everyone's having a great time. It's now the day before the wedding, the day that Jim and Carlos are FL from la and the plan is to land with just enough time to change and go to the rehearsal dinner, which is also in Lonnie's backyard. So Jim and Carlos flight goes smoothly. They're looking forward to a fun wedding weekend. Sleeping in their own bed again. They turn their phones off airplane mode. And they are immediately greeted by a series of missed calls from Lonnie and a bunch of voicemails.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Oh, jump. Scare.

[Rachel Hampton]

Jim and Carlos listen to the voicemails as they're taxing to the gate, and it is immediately clear something has gone terribly wrong.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Oh, my goodness.

[Rachel Hampton]

Like, Lonnie is sobbing and begging them to call him back.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Oh, no.

[Rachel Hampton]

He's barely coherent and he does not sound much better. When Carlos calls while Jim gets their bags, Lonnie can barely speak. He's so upset. He just keeps apologizing and saying something about insurance. Finally, Carlos is just like, it's fine. Don't worry. Whatever happened, we'll figure it out. Just focus on your nephew, okay?

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Only because this happened to a family friend of ours in upstate New York. And that's what first comes to mind when you say kind of tragedy and insurance. I'm gonna guess flooding, because that's just like, a lot. It's intense. It's also. It's just like the water of it all is just like, it sends you into a craze. Lonnie is like, crying. So it's gotta be something serious and, like, hard to control. A flood in the house is like, I think, a really good potential. I don't know.

[Rachel Hampton]

Yeah. So Jim and Carlos have a nice long Uber back from the airport to just ruminate on what's awaiting them at home.

[Alex Sujong Laughlin]

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[Rachel Hampton]

I'm admitting that here to y' all and the world.

[Alex Sujong Laughlin]

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[Rachel Hampton]

So apparently Lonnie's boyfriend was not around to drive the truck to pick up the table and chairs as planned.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Okay. Oh no, no.

[Rachel Hampton]

He was working on a surprise for the grooms that took a little longer than he had anticipated. Jim and Carlos don't find this out until later. All they know when they get home from the airport is that for some reason, Lonnie was the one driving the truck. So it was Lonnie who picked up the table and chairs and Lonnie who managed to get the truck onto the pathway between his house and Jim and Carlos'. And to Lonnie's credit, the unloading actually goes pretty okay. It's when Lonnie is trying to back the truck out from between the houses that everything goes wrong. To this day, nobody knows exactly what happened. Like, not even Lonnie knows. All they know is that Lonnie somehow managed to not only back out into Jim and Carlos front yard, destroying all their landscaping and flower beds and mangling their magnolia Trees. Lonnie also somehow managed to crush the spigot for Jim and Carlos water hose, which caused a geyser of water to shoot up into the air. Lonnie, in his distress, was not able to find the valve to shut off the water. So it wasn't until his boyfriend got home an hour later that they found the shut off. Which means that the broken spigot not only flooded the yard. Oh, it also flooded the sidewalk and the street. There is a retaining wall separating the yard from the sidewalk that Jim and Carlos can see is visibly bulging, which means the fix is going to be thousands and thousands of dollars. And both the truck and their yard are an absolute fucking disaster.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Oh, girl, hold on. Just because I did predict the flooding of it all.

[Rachel Hampton]

You said that. And I was like, is he psychic?

[Griff Stark Ennis]

You picture worst case scenario. And I think I did myself justice in being like, what would send Lonnie into complete hysteria. And there's something about an uncontrolled amount of water that you just don't know what to do with. That almost pairs well with the tears that come. It's just very beautiful.

[Rachel Hampton]

Yes.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Yes. It's just like. It's the truck I forgot about. That was. I should have. My petty little brain should have seen that.

[Rachel Hampton]

Yeah.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

It's a flood.

[Rachel Hampton]

It was a flood and you were right. So you just got back from la, your yard is ruined. There are at least three Midwestern people you don't know inside your house, including an 80 year old woman. What do you do?

[Griff Stark Ennis]

I take a walk around the cul de sac for a second.

[Rachel Hampton]

Doing breath work, Doing some deep diaphragmatic breaths.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

You know, the benefit of this situation, which is actually kind of the. Also the detriment. There's so many people here. It's. It's a little bit chaotic. You're planning for a wedding.

[Rachel Hampton]

Yeah.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

But there's so many people here. You've got your partner, Jim or Carlos, depending on who I am. You just have to start delegating. Like, the wedding, I think maybe should still happen. Like have a certain amount of people, the bare minimum amount of people figure that out. And then we need a few other people to help, like I guess calm down. What can be immediately fixed and then table what can't. Like the flooding damage. I don't really know much about floods. I'm not a fire person. But like, get it as under control as you can.

[Rachel Hampton]

Yeah.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Focus on what you can rectify right now. Do it with the manpower that you have and the woman power. And then have the wedding I don't like, what else are you gonna do?

[Rachel Hampton]

Yeah. Carlos is like, I'm gonna have an aneurysm.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Right, right, right. You could also have an aneurysm.

[Rachel Hampton]

Carlos is like, why was Lani driving? Meanwhile, Jim is just tallying up all the work that will need to be done. All the calls to insurance, he's gonna need to make all the calls to repair people, he's gonna need to make all the calls to his therapist. He's gonna need to make all the money this is gonna cost. And then Jim has to stop calculating because then he starts feeling like he might have an aneurysm, too. Finally, they decide this is too much to think about, especially when there are strangers in their home. So they're like, let's just get through this wedding, and then we'll figure everything else out later. The one thing they do both immediately agree on is that they are never doing a favor for Lonnie ever again.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Okay, maybe. Maybe never. A favor at this, like, magnitude. You know what I mean? We said it from the beginning. Like, it is a heavy lift, you know, dramatic, to not say, you're never going to do a favor for Lonnie again. Like, homeboy is 75. So let's, like, you know, I get that in the moment. That's what it feels like. I think Lonnie's probably cashed in his favor chips for a year with this. But, like, yeah, you know, we'll circle back to a place of, like, peace at some point.

[Rachel Hampton]

We'll circle back in 2024.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Yes, exactly.

[Rachel Hampton]

So Jim and Carlos, they get showered and dressed. They walk across their muddy, fucked up yard to Lonnie's house for the rehearsal dinner, which is, as promised, small and cozy. The table and chairs actually look really good. So, you know, at least it was all worth it.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Yeah.

[Rachel Hampton]

And Lonnie immediately corners Jim and Carlos to apologize again. And Jim and Carlos can immediately tell that Lonnie is. Is going through it like, this is the oldest they have ever seen. Lonnie. Look, he is clearly trying to put on a brave face, but he's leaning on his boyfriend for support. He doesn't even have his paisley pocket square and his suit jacket. Lonnie keeps saying everything is a disaster.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Aw.

[Rachel Hampton]

And he's being, like, way more twitchy and Type A than usual. Like, even though everything looks perfect, Lonnie keeps adjusting. Like, flower arrangements and champagne glasses.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Right.

[Rachel Hampton]

His eyes even fill with tears as his boyfriend apologizes to Jim and Carlos for not being there to drive the truck. Lonnie's boyfriend explains about the surprise for the grooms. And then he and Lonnie both promise that they will help Jim and Carlos fix their yard. Lonnie's boyfriend even offers to wash the truck the very next morning. Is this enough to make you forgive and forget?

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Oh, you're so mean. It's enough to let me forgive. I'm not gonna forget this. How? Like, none of no one, including all of your listeners. We're never going to forget the story. This is so. It's just wild. It. But you have. You have to forget. I'm, like, stuttering, like, you have to forgive and get past this. Like, this will all be solved. There is a world in which for the next few months, Jim, Carlos, Lonnie, pool boy, they just. Instead of the, like, Wednesday wine and cheese nights, they have, like, Wednesday yard work nights, you know? And so, yeah, it's not fucking ideal at all, but it's. It's not the end of the world.

[Rachel Hampton]

Well, right at this moment, Peter and Patrick are grooms into the rehearsal dinner. They stop to thank Lonnie first and assure him that everything looks perfect. And then they introduce themselves to Jim and Carlos. And to everyone's surprise, given the events of the day, Peter and Patrick and Jim and Carlos hit it off immediately. So things are looking up for Jim and Carlos. They're like, at least our yard was not ruined for a bunch of losers, you know?

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Yeah.

[Rachel Hampton]

And things start looking up even more after dinner and drinks when everyone is encouraged to get into Lonnie's pool. But then, at some point around 9pm, the music suddenly stops. Loni's boyfriend emerges wearing a long feathered robe with a microphone in his hand. Attention, ladies and gentlemen, he says it's time for the party to get started.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Wow.

[Rachel Hampton]

This is when Jim and Carlos learn just what Lonnie's boyfriend was up to while Lonnie was ruin. You see, Loni's boyfriend had secretly booked three of the city's top drag queens to do a secret performance just for Peter and Patrick. Like, one of the queens had even been on Drag Race.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Oh, work.

[Rachel Hampton]

Peter and Patrick are thrilled. Kylie Minogue is pumping.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

I thought you were gonna say, she's there. I was like, whoa.

[Rachel Hampton]

Can you imagine?

[Griff Stark Ennis]

It's like, everything's forgiven. Everything is forgiven.

[Rachel Hampton]

I would forgive anyone if they brought Kylie Minogue to my home. Jim and Carlos tip the queens, and they head back home, too. They love a drag performance, but it has been the longest day of their life.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Right.

[Rachel Hampton]

So Jim and Carlos spend most of the next Day on the phone with various insurance companies, trying to figure out who and how and where to file claims.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Right.

[Rachel Hampton]

And around 5pm they head back over to Lonnie's for the wedding. The grooms have ridden their own bow. Everything goes perfectly. And Loni honestly looks a lot less stressed after a night of sleep. Right after the ceremony, there are cocktails and then dinner and then more dancing. And by midnight, most of the older guests have left. So it's just like the immediate family and the young adults who are still dancing. Loni is splashed out for an open bar. So everyone's feeling really good, especially Jim and Carlos, who started drinking while they were on the phone with the insurance companies. Cause they're like, this is the only way to get through this day.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Yeah, exactly.

[Rachel Hampton]

Jim is dancing with Carlos. Carly's Warm Blood is playing. When Carlos feels a hand on his ass.

[Alex Sujong Laughlin]

Oh.

[Rachel Hampton]

And he can see Jim's hands right in front of him.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Oh.

[Rachel Hampton]

Carlos turns around to see Peter, one of the grooms, standing there looking just a little mischievous.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Okay.

[Rachel Hampton]

And a whole lot drunk.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Peter, on your wedding day. My God. Kris Jenner works fast. The gays work faster, honey.

[Rachel Hampton]

Jim and Carlos dance away. They're whispering about what just happened. Like, did that really, like, they dance away from them? Yeah, they're just like, exactly like that. Literally, they're like, did that really happen? And right as they decided that it really did happen, Peter and Patrick dance right up to them. And Patrick does that thing drunk people do where he thinks he's whispering, but he's. He's definitely yelling. Patrick's like, we saw you from across the bar and really liked your vibe. Or like, that's basically what he says.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Rachel Hampton]

Patrick says that he and Peter think Jim and Carlos are super hot and that he thinks all four of them should go back to Jim and Carlos's house for a drink. It's his and Peter's last night in the city. And what happens in the city stays

[Griff Stark Ennis]

in the city, stays in the city.

[Rachel Hampton]

Griff, are you down to clowns?

[Griff Stark Ennis]

The answer is yes. Like, you know, we're queer people. Open relationships are very prevalent in our community. They're not for everyone, but they're for a lot of people. And I don't know, this is a night for fun. Also, Jim and Carlos have been through the fucking ringer with this. Their generosity needs to be rewarded. And, honey, I know how I need to be rewarded in certain situations. So the answer is a capitalized yes.

[Rachel Hampton]

Unfortunately, Jim and Carlos are like, Rachel, I know they're like, we're at your wedding. It's probably not a great idea. And also, your 80 year old aunt is staying at our house.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

She can't hear,

[Rachel Hampton]

so Peter and Patrick just kind of shrug and dance away. About an hour later, Jim and Carlos decide to head home. It's almost 2am the house is quiet. All their guests have long since gone to bed. So Jim and Carlos are in the kitchen, just chugging water and debriefing the night, when they hear a soft knock on the back door.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Wow. Wow. Persistent.

[Rachel Hampton]

Standing outside so clearly delighted with themselves is Peter and Patrick. Peter and Patrick explain that they pretended to go to bed in Lonnie's house and then snuck out once they saw the light on in Jim and Carlos kitchen. And now here they are. And wouldn't Jim and Carlos like a nightcap? And they've also stolen a bottle of Macallan 25 from Lonnie's Bar.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Word.

[Rachel Hampton]

And for those who don't know, that is a $4,000 bottle of whiskey.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

That's a little too much to steal. Peter and Patrick. Let's like maybe sell that bottle to help with the yard work for Jim and Carlos. But they're drunk. They're not clocking that. But we are.

[Rachel Hampton]

So do you have a nightcap?

[Griff Stark Ennis]

It's funny. Cause, like, you know, first of all, no means no, right? Make sure everyone knows that. But this is a wedding. They're knocking on the door. I don't find it to be that like, intrusive or like aggressive. It's kind of just like a. We asked once. That was then we danced away. We didn't pressure you. Now we're here with a bottle. I'm just asking for a nightcap.

[Rachel Hampton]

We're not like, it's a nightcap.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Yeah, just a nightcap. What could that lead to?

[Rachel Hampton]

I don't know. What could that possibly mean? Who knows?

[Griff Stark Ennis]

At this point it's just like having like doordash, you know, it's like it's so conveniently delivered to your door. It's like, why not have a little. Have a few fries?

[Rachel Hampton]

Honestly, Jim and Carlos are in the exact same spot at this point. They're like, you know what? Fuck it. We ball.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Yep, we ball.

[Rachel Hampton]

They bring Peter and Patrick down to the basement so they don't disturb any of the houseguests. They break open the Macallan.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Jesus.

[Rachel Hampton]

One thing leads to another, and honestly, there is no point in being delicate. On this podcast, these four commence to fucking. Carlos and Jim and Peter and Patrick have, and I quote in extremely hot four way. Whoa. At 5:00am, Peter and Patrick sneak back out of the house. Jim and Carlos crash into bed and pass out. And after the longest day of their life, they sleep in the next day and miss all the post wedding drama. Apparently, Peter's mom was already up and making coffee when Peter and Patrick tried to sneak back into Lonnie's house. And you know, a mother always knows, I guess.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Also, I'm an adult, Ma, so like, let's, let's just like continue making coffee.

[Rachel Hampton]

Patrick's mom grilled them about where they had been, why they were still dressed in their wedding suits, and Peter and Patrick were too drunk and quite frankly, too well fucked to come up with a lie. So by the time Jim and Carlos do wake up, everyone who was at the wedding knows about their foursome.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Yes. Yep, that's expected.

[Rachel Hampton]

How would you feel if you were Lonnie and you learned that your neighbor friends hooked up with your nephew and his new husband on their wedding night?

[Griff Stark Ennis]

I'm so sorry, but if I were Lonnie, I would have zero judgment to pass around at this point. So I would keep my thoughts to myself. I'd be intrigued and maybe be asking for details about the encounter. It sounds like it was a very hot and spicy one. But I'd also look at the yard outside of Gym Carlos and say, you know what? I'm gonna let people do what they wanna do because I did what I wanted to do. And sometimes it gets messy.

[Rachel Hampton]

I thought Lonnie was gonna be pretty chill about this. Like, a wedding night hookup is definitely unconventional, but it's for consenting adults and no one was woken up. Lonnie, though, does not agree. He sits Jim and Carlos and Peter and Patrick down for a lecture and tells them they all completely undermine everything he was trying to do at the wedding.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

What?

[Rachel Hampton]

Lonnie said that back in his day you'd go to several pool parties before doing a four way, and that his own queer elders taught him how things were done. But clearly that message has not reached the younger generation. Now people get freaky at the job of a hat with no respect for the sanctity of a wedding day or the vicinity of an 80 year old aunt. Lonnie isn't mad, he's just disappointed. He expected his nephew and Jim and Carlos, who he considered to be like his nephews, to have better judgment. And in fact, Jim and Carlos know that to this day, Lonnie remains not mad about the wedding night foursome.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Right. Don't worry, I'm not mad.

[Rachel Hampton]

And that is basically the end of our story. I do have some updates, but before I get to them, I did want to actually steal a bit from your show, Petty Crime. So we're gonna play a little bit of criminal or minimal based on the story that I just told you. Criminal or minimal. Moving the 20 something hot pool boy into your house after two months of dating.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

That's a good one. You know, I see Lonnie's 75 years of age and I'm trying to make an appropriate ratio between the two months of dating and not to be morbid, but the time he has left on this earth. Listen, and I'm like, I'm saying minimal because. Because Lonnie deserves that fun. And I think expediting certain relationships like that, I think is totally fair given his age and like, you know, his time with us. It's like crazy to say.

[Rachel Hampton]

Okay, so minimal. All right.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Yeah.

[Rachel Hampton]

Criminal or minimal. Allowing your 70 year old neighbor to use your house as an Airbnb.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Rachel, I'm in a pickle here. Just the responsible part of me is gonna say criminal.

[Rachel Hampton]

Criminal or minimal. Having a foursome with the grooms on the night of their wedding.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

That is the juiciest criminal or minimal I've heard in a while.

[Rachel Hampton]

Oh, love that.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

You know, though, in our story, those grooms initiated it. Right. It would have been a completely different story if Jim and Carlos were like, oh my God, this is crazy. We deserve a little. Yeah. Should we. Okay. And they walk up to them and propose that.

[Rachel Hampton]

Yeah.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Peter and Patrick, newly married within the last few hours, came to Jim and Carl.

[Rachel Hampton]

Not even dry on the wedding.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Not even dry. It's smeared and like, I think, I think minimal. The. The couple who I think would have the most sensitivity with this criminal or minimal was the one who initiated Jim and Carlos, obviously, as we heard capitalized on that night. I'm trying to put myself as a single person at a queer wedding, where, I mean, rightfully so. If they're not blind, I'd be propositioned to hook up with a couple. And depending on my relationship to them, I probably would just do it for the story, which is exactly what these two did for us.

[Rachel Hampton]

And then.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Exactly.

[Rachel Hampton]

They sent it into normal gossip, which is what everyone listening to this show should be doing. Do it for the bit. Absolutely. And then send it to me.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Yeah.

[Rachel Hampton]

Well, the updates are the day after the wedding, Jim and Carlos wake up with scratchy throats. And they both just assume that they partied a little too hard over the weekend. It's Chlamydia Well, Carlos mom texts from LA with the picture of a positive COVID test. Jim and Carlos test themselves, and sure enough, they are positive. And over the course of the next week, Peter, Patrick, Lonnie, Lonnie's boyfriend, Patrick's sister, and her husband all come down with COVID So not only did Jim and Carlos fuck Peter and Patrick on their wedding night, they were also responsible for turning their wedding into a super spreader event. Luckily, everyone, including Lonnie, had a relatively mild case. Like, no one is hospitalized.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Oh, that's good to highlight.

[Rachel Hampton]

Mm.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Yup.

[Rachel Hampton]

Once Lonnie fully recovers and is back to gardening and biking, Jim and Carlos kind of consider the score between themselves and Lonnie to be even. Oh, and then one final update.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Okay.

[Rachel Hampton]

A few months ago, Peter and Patrick finally left the Midwest. They moved to the big city to spend more time with their beloved gunkle Lonnie, and even moved into the same neighborhood as Lonnie and Jim and Carlos. And since they moved, Peter and Patrick have reached out to Jim and Carlos several times to set up a little get together. But thus far, Jim and Carlos have found every possible excuse to avoid them.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Whoa.

[Rachel Hampton]

And that is the end of our story. Do you think Jim and Carlos should let bygones be bygones and fuck Peter and Patrick again?

[Griff Stark Ennis]

You know, like I said, open relationships aren't for everyone. Maybe Jim and Carlos just that night, given that they were asked once and then the second time they were literally at their door, maybe it's just not part of their, like, their relationship setup. Right? Like, we'd have to hear from them. Maybe it was truly, like, a treat yourself one off thing. But I don't know, maybe, like, work towards it. But also, I don't want to pressure a couple. Run it back if it's not your thing, if hooking up outside of relationship is not your thing, don't do it. But, like, you know, keep a little, like, sticky note on the fridge that just says, like, Peter and Patrick. You know what I mean?

[Rachel Hampton]

Question mark. Question mark.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

You know, it would be cute to, like, like, have like, a sticky note or something on the fridge that, like, you both can kind of look at. And then whenever one of you is kind of ready to maybe start exploring it, you, like, flip it upside down or something. And that, like, initiates the conversation.

[Rachel Hampton]

That's, like, turning.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

That's kind of hot. But, you know, I'll. I'll leave them to make their own decision. Like, their journey is their own. Obviously, these two hotties are down the street. They're there, I guess whenever they need them. So you do you boo boos.

[Rachel Hampton]

Thank you for listening to Normal Gossip. If you have a gossip story to share with us, email [e-mail] or you can leave us a voicemail at 2679, gossip. If you love this podcast and want to support us, become a friend or a friend of a [e-mail] youm can follow the show on Instagram and and TikTok ormalgossip. You can follow me on all social media eydanae. Subscribe to our YouTube channelizerMedia to watch today's episode. Normal Gossip is written by me, Rachel Hampton and jtolviera. This podcast was produced by Sierra Spragley, Ricks and jtolviera. Our audio engineer is Samantha Gatzick. Emily Cherish is our video editor. Theme music composed by rishikeshirway the co creators end Dowager Queen of Normal gossip are Kelsey McKinney and defector supervising producer Alex Sujong Laughlin. Justin Ellis is Defectors Projects Editor. Jasper Wang is Defectors Business Guy. Tom Ley is our Editor in Chief. This season was made in memory of Dan McQuaid who ran our merch store which you can find at normalgossip store. Tara Jacoby designed our show. Art thank you to Brandi Jensen, David Roth, Katherine Shue, Sabrina Embler, Chris Thompson, Dave McKenna, Patrick Ren Redford and Ray Rattle for your help with this season. Thank you to the rest of the Defector staff. Defector Media is a collectively owned subscriber based media company. Normal Gossip is a proud member of Radiotopia. I am your host Rachel Hampton and remember you didn't hear this from me.

[Griff Stark Ennis]

Radiotopia

[Alex Sujong Laughlin]

from pr.