Barbie Ferreira is Not A Background Actress

Summary

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Not Skinny But Not Fat

Episode: "Barbie Ferreira is Not A Background Actress"

Host: Amanda Hirsch
Guest: Barbie Ferreira
Date: April 14, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this engaging episode, Amanda Hirsch sits down with Barbie Ferreira, acclaimed for her role as Kat in "Euphoria" and for her work as a model, producer, and actress. They discuss Barbie’s multicultural upbringing, her unconventional path into modeling and acting, her feelings about industry beauty standards, the viral moments she’s had in fashion, and her transition to leading and producing films. The conversation is candid and intimate, touching on personal identity, online culture, independence, and pursuing creativity over fame.
Barbie opens up about leaving "Euphoria," her relationship with her body, her approach to manifesting her dreams, and two new films premiering simultaneously as "Euphoria" Season 3 airs without her.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Barbie’s Background and Early Life

• Immigrant Roots and Childhood:

  • Born in Harlem to Brazilian parents; lived in Harlem and the Bronx before moving to Astoria, Queens, and later New Jersey.
  • Describes Astoria as an immigrant-heavy, multicultural neighborhood:

    “It was literally, like, all immigrants. Like, I went to ESL school... Brazilian street, Bengali street...” (08:04)

  • First language is Portuguese; she feels more comfortable with Brazilian Portuguese than that of Portugal.

• Modeling Beginnings:

  • Started modeling at 16 for American Apparel after submitting pictures; was paid $10 for shoots, did retail work too.
  • Balanced high school with modeling jobs and shoots; American Apparel experience opened doors to plus-size modeling.

• Early Independence & Family:

  • Attributes tenacity and hands-on approach to her mom’s hands-off, supportive parenting.
  • Lived with mom and grandmother until, at 18, moved to a 200-sq-ft Lower East Side studio:

    “I was, like, emailing, like, agents myself...my mom was a very young, hot mother—very free spirited. Let me do whatever I want.” (38:09, 38:51)

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Navigating Fame, Fashion, and Body Politics

• Name & Identity:

  • Transitioned from “Barbara” to “Barbie” at 18 when she started modeling to control her own narrative.

    “When I was, like, 18, I started modeling. I was like, I'm Barbie now...I changed my Instagram name. I was like, this is—I’m going by one nickname...” (06:59)

• Oscars Fashion Moment:

  • Wore a viral Gap Studios by Zac Posen dress that garnered media attention:

    “I knew the dress was gorgeous, but I was like, this is gonna be so fun. I'm going to the Oscars...And I was one of [ten invited].” (09:54, 10:24)

  • Chosen as part of 'Young Hollywood' invited by the Academy.

• Fashion Week & Body Scrutiny:

  • Recalls headlines about her Paris Fashion Week dresses and ongoing body commentary in media:

    “People are doing it actually at a huge rate...every actress right now is just being put under a microscope of either being too skinny or too big...It's all rage bait.” (15:43, 16:07)

  • Finds the body talk “so boring” and wishes for more normalization:

    “We're still...it's so boring. Yeah, I find it boring.” (16:37)

• Body Neutrality & Modern Beauty Standards:

  • Liebid with “body neutrality,” wanting more representation of real people in media, not just “conventionally attractive” faces:

    “I think what I have done my whole life is just...what I've loved about movies is when I get to see something that's...people look like real people...We're so allergic to people who have features that aren't the most conventionally attractive...”(17:04, 17:23)

• Hypocrisy in Body Conversations:

  • Both host and guest discuss the paradox of "glow up" culture and toxic online body discourse, including for men.

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Modeling to Acting: Euphoria & Beyond

• Pivots from Modeling to Acting:

  • Modeled for Aerie at 18 in a viral, “real” campaign, then started pursuing acting more intentionally at 20.

    “I started...video stuff because I really wanted to be an actress...once I turn 20, I need to start...I did the whole audition thing, and I got Euphoria...” (49:03, 49:39)

• Landing Euphoria:

  • Auditioned 11 times in person for Kat’s role:

    “I did, like, 11 auditions in person...” (51:23)

    • Felt the part was written for her; "I've never been more desperate to get something because I knew I could do it so confidently, but no one else did." (50:28)

• Leaving Euphoria:

  • Addresses rumors about her exit and clarifies it was a long, non-dramatic process:

    “It was kind of the opposite of dramatic, where it was like, long process...trying to figure out how to make Kat a fully fleshed out character. And it just wasn't going anywhere… I don't need to be on the biggest TV show if I’m not acting...I’d rather do indie movies...than be a background character.” (53:40–54:34)

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New Projects, Producing, and Creative Freedom

• Current Projects:

  • Faces of Death (April 10 theatrical release):

    • Horror/thriller; Barbie plays Margot, a content moderator investigating viral violence.
    • Explores the normalization of violence via social media.

    “You see someone's light leave their eyes...the movie really is about social media and the companies that profit off...the constant cycle of violence...” (57:26–58:34)

  • Mile End Kicks (April 17 theatrical release):

    • Indie rom-com; Barbie stars and produces, playing Grace, a music journalist caught in romantic chaos.
    • Set in Montreal with heavy early-2010s nostalgia.

    “I play Grace. She’s this music journalist...falls in love with a guy in a band and then another guy in the band and then chaos ensues...” (59:02)

  • On producing:

    “With indie movies...they want me to produce and star to make the movie happen...I get to really be involved...even like, locations, casting...I love to learn.” (59:44–60:32)

• Simultaneous Premiere with Euphoria S3:

  • Both films premiere as Euphoria’s new season releases.
  • She jokes about “Barbin Mile Face,” a nod to the Barbenheimer meme:

    “Someone said Barbin Mile face, as in Barb and Heimer, and I go, wow, I love Barbin Mile.” (64:12)

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Memorable Quotes & Candid Moments

• "I'm not going to be a background character for nine months—I want to produce and do indie cinema...be creatively asked to do things rather than sit around." (54:34, Barbie)
• “I do watch it a couple times until I get used to how I look—and then I can finally see the movie, not just myself.” (62:24, Barbie on watching her own work)
• “Every time I post, like, a thirst trap, the first person to like it is my mother. I love that she likes when I look sexy.” (38:46, Barbie)
• “I truly was just like, I think since we can’t find anything & we can’t land on anything, let me just go...I want to see my career look different.” (55:22, Barbie)
• “People are obsessed with looks—it’s not good for the psyche for anyone.” (21:51, Barbie)
• “If you’re trying to get the pap pic of you smoking a cig, it’s so performative...” (30:46, Barbie and Amanda on smoking culture)
• “You have to do it. Pave your own way.” (42:10, Amanda summarizing Barbie’s journey)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• 00:55 – Amanda introduces Barbie and sets up the interview
• 06:00 – Barbie discusses her name, childhood, and immigrant identity
• 10:00 – Oscars invitation, viral dress moment, fashion world reactions
• 15:13 – Media scrutiny, body positivity/hypocrisy, Barbie's thoughts on online rage
• 17:04 – Body neutrality, American vs. global beauty standards
• 32:53 – Growing up in New Jersey, working at American Apparel, getting into modeling
• 49:03 – Transition from modeling to acting, pursuing Euphoria
• 51:23 – Euphoria auditions, landing the role of Kat, experience with sudden fame
• 53:40 – Why Barbie left Euphoria, creative goals, valuing meaningful roles
• 56:15 – Faces of Death: Barbie on the plot, experience filming, commentary on violence and social media
• 58:45 – Mile End Kicks: Producing, casting, playing Grace, Montreal as “the best place”, TIFF premiere

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Additional Highlights

• Barbie and Amanda bond over being “octopus” personalities—driven, self-starting, multitasking, and manifesting their paths through action rather than vision boards (40:13).
• Barbie’s family is supportive in a “hands-off, like-every-thirst-trap” way rather than traditional stage-parenting (38:46).
• Barbie quips about “being a grandma now” because no one sends her high school roles post-Euphoria (53:05).
• Discussion about Anne Hathaway’s boundary for “Devil Wears Prada 2” casting, and the nuances of representation in media (64:37–66:13).

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Tone

Conversational, candid, and comedic with moments of earnest vulnerability. Amanda and Barbie chat like old friends, blending hot takes, industry insight, and pop culture gossip in an authentic, relatable way.

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Summary

This episode provides a rich, personal look at Barbie Ferreira’s journey from her multicultural roots and early days in retail and modeling, through her breakthrough—and conscious exit—from "Euphoria", to her current focus on indie film and creative autonomy. The candid discussion covers challenging industry standards, the fickleness of internet culture, the necessity (and messiness) of self-determination, and the joy in pursuing meaningful projects over fame. It’s a warm, honest, and frequently funny portrait of a modern multi-hyphenate making her own opportunities on her terms.

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Transcript

[A]

The following podcast is a Dear Media production. Welcome back to the Not Skinny But Not Fat podcast. I'm your host, Amanda Hirsch, and I still can't believe that I get to chat with some of my favorite stars on my very own podcast, where you'll feel like you're just talking shit with your best friends in your living room. Hello, hello, hello, hello. How's everybody doing? Happy Tuesday, or whatever day that you are listening. I hope everyone's doing well. We just got back to New York last night. Damn, LA was good this time, you guys. LA was so good. The weather was perfect, but I think it's, like, always perfect, which is obviously a plus for Los Angeles. Plus, like, we've usually stayed, like, at a hotel or apartments when. When I'm in LA or when I went with the family, and. And this time I was like, let's do an Airbnb. Like, let's take a. Take a house and like, really kind of get the. Get the vibes, get the feel. So we rented a house in the Hills. And like, I'm like, oh, my God. Like, when I saw the Airbnb, I was like, this is gorgeous. But I don't know with Airbnb is I always keep my expectations low. I mean, with everything in life, I do. And I'm like, okay, it's not going to be, like, as beautiful as it looks, right? Like, something's going to be off. Like, it can't be just like the pictures. And then, damn, it was just like the pictures. It was beautiful. Like the view of the hills and the pool and the. Just. Just gorgeous. Like, driving up that road from sunset to the hills and seeing all of la, it's just, like, very different. Very different. And my cute, cute immigrant husband, who he was in the pool with, Noah, like, honestly, 24 7. So he's showing Noah the view and he goes, noah, look here. There are no tall buildings, no. No buses, no cars, no whatever he was saying. And he was like, just nation. And then Noah goes, abba, nature. And we died. Like, we were hysterical. So cute. So funny when Noah corrects him. So we just had the best time. We really did. And, like, you know, I was nervous about the kids because I did say after we flew to Miami a few months ago, and Lenn so awful on the flight. It was like the worst flight of my life. I was like, lenny's not flying till he's 17. And then obviously spring break comes up and you're like, want to do something? And he was already so much better than he was In December. First of all, December could have been a fluke. Like, you're not going to have a terrible flight every time you fly with kids. This was so much better. Like, he's already, like, could watch an iPad, which is a huge step in the right direction. So he's like, either iPad snacking or sleeping. And yes, part of the time, he could be a little like, I like to call it a hot dog on a fucking grill. Like, rolling around in your arms and you're flailing. The. The feeling that I hate the most in the world is like feeling frantic and feeling. Is that the. Is that the. Like, it's like, you know, is that. Is it frantic? The word. It might be another F word. Like just. Just all over the place when you're with kids. Like, I'm in the airport, I'm trying to push a suitcase. Lenny's in my arms. He's rolling around like the hot dog on the grill. Noah is running and that you have to chase after him. You're sweating, you're schwitzing, you're. You're flailing, you're frantic. And the other F word that I can't remember, and you're fucking something else. And if you remember it, DM me anyway. But. But it was still so much better than last time. And it made me, like, confident. Like, okay, could get so much better. Anyway, so it's so great now we're back in New York, back in the grind. I actually, I feel like I do have, like, a busy couple months coming up, which I can be positive about and be like, thank you for all the opportunities and the good and the fun stuff. And I love it. And there's the other part of me, which I'm sure a lot of you will relate to, that having a lot of things coming up can feel really heavy and really stressful and really like, I just want to get through it. I want to be on the other side of it. What do I have coming up? Okay, so I have something coming up that's a surprise. You don't know yet. I know, but. But it's. But it's going to be so exciting. Then I have Netflix is a joke. May 8th live show in LA. If you didn't get tickets yet, get them. I think they're link in my bio. Going to be an LA live show. Surprise guests, fun games pod, bts, like pee in your pants, get together. You're going to love it. That's for LA folks. Then we have Dear Media, the fun live show in New York. And that's May 16, I believe. Should also be in my bio. And lots of other stuff going up. Pods, fun life. Now, let's get into today's episode. So excited about this guest. She is really amazing. An amazing career she's had so far, and she's only 29 years old. It's Barbie Ferreira. Barbie was in one of the biggest shows in our history in pop culture euphoria. She was on season one and two. She famously left after season two. We talk about that as well. Season three is coming out now. It is not with her, but she has two of her own projects coming out this month, which we talk about. And she is so fun and so great, and I loved getting to know her in this conversation. We talk about it all. So I hope you enjoy Lindsay Lohan. I know. Have you met her?

[B]

No. I would remember that.

[A]

And also, like, we're like, Lindsay and I, we're like 10 years older than you.

[B]

Lindsay and I.

[A]

And me. Lindsay and I. Well, no, because now she's looking.

[B]

She's looking like she's younger than me.

[A]

Right?

[B]

She's in her 20s. She's looking great.

[A]

No, she looks great.

[B]

We need. We need to investigate what the heck. I think we know what it is,

[A]

but we did investigate.

[B]

We did.

[A]

We didn't reach a sololo.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah. We want to know the exact coordinates.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

To the person.

[A]

Hi, Barbie. Hello. Do people do that to you?

[B]

Yeah. Hi, Barbie.

[A]

Hi, Barbie.

[B]

Hi, Barbie.

[A]

Or like. Or I was thinking of Aqua. Remember that band?

[B]

No.

[A]

Oh, my God.

[B]

The Barbie girls.

[A]

Just for my youngness. Yeah. The Barbie song.

[B]

Of course. I know. Aqua.

[A]

Hi, Barbie. Yeah.

[B]

Hi, Cat. Let's go party.

[A]

Right? So did you get that?

[B]

Oh, my God. Growing up. Yeah. That's, like, all people said. I mean, but the thing is, my name was Barbara.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And so people took it upon themselves to find their own nicknames for me. Babs. Barbs.

[A]

Babs is crazy for a young gal.

[B]

It. Barbara is crazy for a young guy. I was, like, five years old. Barbara, like, hi.

[A]

Wait, but you're. Is your family from Portugal?

[B]

Brazil.

[A]

From Brazil.

[B]

Yeah. So it's a young, hot name in Brazil.

[A]

I mean, Barbara, it's fucking hot.

[B]

It's like all the young, like, hot little models are named Barbara, you know, right here. Not so much.

[A]

So growing up with that name, did you pick Barbie as a nickname because of that?

[B]

So I always had nicknames. People always, like, kind of called me whatever. And then when I was, like, 18, I started modeling. I was like, I'm Barbie now. Like, you Can't. Like, I changed my Instagram name. I was like, this is. I'm going by one nickname because I. I hated Babs. I hated, like, people going a little too crazy with it. So I was just like, barbie Fitz.

[A]

And then now you introduce your. Like, it's like, dunzo. Like, Mom.

[B]

Mom calls me Barbie when she's speaking English. She calls me Bar when she's speaking in Portuguese. My friends that I grew up with call me B. Barbara. But, you know, sometimes I. I hear them call me Barbie. It's a little weird.

[A]

Wait, you grew up here for how long in the city?

[B]

So I grew up in New York and New Jersey. So I was born in Harlem. 103rd Metropolitan Hospital, I believe that's 103rd. I lived right across the street from it for a while.

[A]

103rd on the west side, like, and third. So third on the east side.

[B]

Yeah, that's where my. Actually, that's where my building was. And then the. The hospital was right across the street, and I could see where I was born. I lived every year. It was really cute. And so I grew up in Queens. I moved to Jersey.

[A]

I went to where in Queensland.

[B]

Astoria.

[A]

Oh, really? Yeah, before it was, like, before it was, like, popping trendy. Astoria.

[B]

No, it's like, it was literally, like, all immigrants. Like, I went to ESL school. Like, every single. Like, we had, like, a Brazilian street. We had, like, a Bengali street. There was, like, a green.

[A]

I thought it was like, yeah, there's

[B]

areas for everyone there. But when I was growing up, so, like, there was like, literally. There's so many Brazilians in a story. I went to a Brazilian church. I went to a Brazilian salon. I went to the Brazilian supermarket. I didn't speak English until I was four.

[A]

Really? So how good is your Portuguese now?

[B]

It's great. It's my first language. It's not, like, perfect, but I.

[A]

By the way, it sounds like such. I went to Lisbon once. It sounds like such a hard language. I remember hearing it and being like, what's happening? Like, it's. Even though I thought, like, I can understand Spanish and speak a little like, that it would be easy. And it's not an easy language, especially Portuguese.

[B]

Portugal, like, they have a very harsh accent. I can barely understand it.

[A]

Oh, okay.

[B]

So, like, a Brazilian Portuguese sounds more like Spanish the way more sing song. So it's okay. I. I can barely understand Portuguese people.

[A]

Oh, really?

[B]

Yeah, it's like that. It's like that. I mean, I think even someone who. I mean, maybe I'm wrong, but I think even people who are Brazilian who speak Portuguese, that's, like, the only language they speak.

[A]

Yeah, it's can be a little tough

[B]

with the Portuguese accents.

[A]

I need to go back for a second. I mean, not back, because we're talking about, like, your birth. So forward. Forward to today. Forward to right this second or not even two months ago, wherever that. Whenever the Oscars were. Yes. You fudgeing looked amazing.

[B]

Thank you so much.

[A]

Like, this was, like, headlines. This was, like, a moment. Like, it was Gap.

[B]

Gap Studios by Zach Posen.

[A]

That's sick.

[B]

I know. I did not expect that.

[A]

Like, like, the commotion.

[B]

I did not.

[A]

You didn't, because, like, usually people are, like, a little commotion over the dress, and you didn't need to do that.

[B]

No, I truly didn't expect that. I knew the dress was gorgeous, but I was like, this is gonna be so fun. I'm going to the Oscars. Like, I have no movie here. I'm just bringing my best friend.

[A]

So how did that happen?

[B]

The Academy invited me. It was really sweet. The AC invited, like, I think, like, I think 10 people who are, like, up and coming actors, and I'm like, up and coming.

[A]

Was this your first time?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Oh, cool.

[B]

It was like young Hollywood. And I'm like. I'm like, oh, I'm like, the youngest. I'm the oldest by 10 years. I'm like, yes, young Hollywood. Literally everyone else was like, teenagers, but it was like, you know, people who are like actors who are like the next generation. And so the Academy invited, I think, 10 people, and I was one of them. Thank God.

[A]

So fun. Was it fun?

[B]

It was extremely fun.

[A]

Like, the. The ceremony.

[B]

I can only imagine it not being fun if you're, like, dominated because you're just scared. I would be scared.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I had a blast because I had nothing to, like, worry about leaving a good table. I was actually in an incredible season.

[A]

Oh, my God.

[B]

What was it?

[A]

What were you seeing?

[B]

It was. I. Thank you. The Academy. They put us on.

[A]

She's doing this.

[B]

Thank you to the Academy. There is so on the floor with all the nominees. There's, like, little balconies that are on the. On the floor, like, on the side. So I was, like, right behind all of, like, Frankenstein people, like a. Oh,

[A]

Jacob, though, he was nomination.

[B]

And then I was, let's say to the side.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I'm watching Guillermo del Toro win, you know, all these things. And. And this. I was like, in that. Yeah, it was really fun.

[A]

Were you rooting for your old pal?

[B]

Of course. I was literally Like, I was like. I honestly was. Every single win was, like, electric in there, in there. It was so cool to see, like, Michael B. Jordan win. Like, right?

[A]

That was such a good moment.

[B]

Just so stood up. Like, it was, like, immediate. Like there was nothing Amy Madigan. I stood up, like, immediately. I was just like, that's so cool. Yeah. It was just really sickening. Barbara style was singing. I was like, hello.

[A]

You're like, babs, Babs, Babs.

[B]

And she was doing the whole antidote about Babs.

[A]

Oh, yeah, I get it. You're like, me too, me too. So the dress was a moment. It was like a T shirt, something

[B]

concept Gap big shirts, like a button down shirt. But then they made it into this, like, beautiful piece on the bottom and, like, tie. I mean, it was obviously crafted, like, specifically, like an artisanal way, but it was like the. The back was like shirt sleeves tied into a bow.

[A]

Oh, the back was the.

[B]

Like, the skirt was like a big shirt.

[A]

I love that color too. It's such a gorgeous.

[B]

I've been really trying to, like, dress in my color palette.

[A]

Wait, did you go to a lady?

[B]

No, I unfortunately have. Well, fortunately, a lot of people just do it for me on TikTok because they're like, what is Barbie Ferreira's palette? Oh, my God. And I'm googling it.

[A]

No, you're.

[B]

And I' their notes.

[A]

Babe, your fan edits are crazy. You know what I mean? Like, you have legit fan. It's like, like transit. More like all this crazy shit that pops up for me. I'm like, no, the fans are fanning.

[B]

I love them. They're so cool.

[A]

So they did your color palette. So a cobalt.

[B]

Well, I'm a deep winter. They say. Okay, they say that I'm a deep winter. Although, you know, sometimes I'll watch some of them. They're like, her body is like a dramatic, you know, whatever it is. I don't actually know the words. And then someone else will say something different. So I'm like, what's the truth? Who do I. Who do I.

[A]

Who's. Who's the real expert here?

[B]

Who's the real expert here? Yeah, but, yeah, they told me I was a deep winter. That makes sense. So I like to wear. I just naturally like to wear clothes that are like deep reds, deep greens, like jewel tones, stuff like that.

[A]

I need to do my colors.

[B]

I would like to do it, like, with a real person, with like a. Like the little.

[A]

You want the things? Yeah, you want the things.

[B]

Let's take a trip to Korea. That's like everywhere.

[A]

Oh, really?

[B]

Yeah, the Korean color palettes are. Yeah, that's what, like, that's where you go to get your like whole life matched.

[A]

So that's our answer.

[B]

It's our answer is to go to Korea.

[A]

Not tick tock Korea. And then you went to Paris Fashion Week.

[B]

I did.

[A]

And you did jpg. Yeah. Like, sick dress too.

[B]

Thank you so much.

[A]

Again, like, headlines over this. I know, right? Like legit.

[B]

But that I also didn't expect that either.

[A]

Do you like it? You like going on the show?

[B]

I do because I was a model before. I was like, I've been to Paris Fashion Week for many years. I guess no one was really clogged in my outfit. Still now I haven't been in a couple years, but I used to. I've been to Givenchy, Balenciaga. I love fashion. I don't love like being like a working model like I was for so long because just because of like my. My thing is really talking. I love to yap.

[A]

Right.

[B]

So that was like a lot. A lack of yapping and modeling that I was not into. So I mean, I tried. I would make them like, do videos of me talking all the time. But yeah, like, I. I'm really into fashion. So it was just really. It's. I love. I love also like, putting on indie designers and like having an idea of fashion outside. And when I get to work with people like Jean Paul Gaultier, literally, I've been collecting Jean Paul Gaultier, like tattoo dresses, slash, like Roberto Cavalli, like all these things since I was like 16.

[A]

Really.

[B]

So it just felt like. So.

[A]

So did you work with him? Was it like a customized to you and everything?

[B]

So the creative director. Well, honestly, I didn't really get to do because, like, there's a creative director. His name is Duron. And I, I got to like, pick. I got to go in the showroom and pick the outfit. And I was like, okay, I'll do this one.

[A]

Eee.

[B]

And it was a little sheer. I usually don't love doing a lot of sheer, but.

[A]

Oh, really?

[B]

But whatever.

[A]

Did you do like.

[B]

No, my tits were out.

[A]

Oh, your tits were. Right. Okay. So that the headlines. That's why they were.

[B]

They love it.

[A]

I'll tell you what, I. Because there were like, you literally Google you. I don't know if you've done that. I've done that for.

[B]

I would never have googled myself.

[A]

And you go to like a news and it's literally like Barbie, like all of your. The Oscars and your Paris Fashion Week. And a lot of people are. Which is wild. Like, still talking about body stuff, you know, like body transformation, body. This body. And I'm like, wait, is this like. And not even just like Daily Mail. Like, literally real people. I'm like, women.com, you know, like, just like the Laco. No, but legit places. And I'm like, we're still doing this.

[B]

People are doing it actually at a huge rate. It's not even just me. I've actually realized that it's almost every actress right now is just being put under a microscope of either being too skinny or too big. I mean, classic. We always have that. But it's like, I feel like it's even more so right now. There's just like, people are like, really into it, I guess. Like, I think the Internet right now is about inflammatory stuff.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

It's all rage bait. So if you can find something to rage bait about. It's. It's so much more effective in the algorithm than like, someone did something nice.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Obviously.

[A]

Like, people have opinions about everything.

[B]

Yeah. And they want to talk. And I feel. I feel like it's just like a lot of angst on the Internet right now.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Angst. But I've noticed, like, I see like all these amazing women that I like, you know, really admire for their work and their art. And it's like, like people are talking about, like, their face and body. And I'm like, okay.

[A]

Like, it surprises you that we're still doing this. In a sense.

[B]

To be honest, my whole career has been people talking about it, so I'm shocked. But I am just like, we're still. It's so boring. Yeah, I find it boring.

[A]

Yeah. Right. Because it's like you. You were saying you were modeling, so it was like you were a plus size model when you started, and then you had cat euphoria and she was very like, body confident. And do you even. I mean, people are saying like, body neutrality now. Like, people aren't saying positive. Where do you stand with that?

[B]

I mean, I agree with body neutrality in the sense that I think what I have done my whole life is just. And what I've loved about movies is when I get to see something that's like European or not American and people look like real people. I'm not saying someone has to be big, small, whatever. It's just like teeth.

[A]

Like everything.

[B]

Everything. It's like we in America are so allergic to people who have features that aren't, you know, maybe the most conventionally attractive. It's like it's. And it's a specifically Americanized thing right now where it's. I mean, since forever where it's like, you know, you're. The actresses are waking up with a curl, like, and an eyelash on. It's like, I just. For me, I've always been so much more into what people look like.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And so, you know, when I was a model, obviously a lot of it was about the way I look because clearly that was like, what I was doing. I was selling clothes and I was like talking on that and I loved talking about how, like, I didn't feel like, particularly like I had this. The most insane, like, you know, activism for just existing. I thought it was just like we should just normalize it, like, Right. And the fact that it even was a problem, like, I looked like this. What I did. I was like 17 and I did like a shoot for Aerie. And like, it was very real, by the way.

[A]

I saw that. I saw that. And it like, could be taken today. Like, first of all, the quality is so good. Like, you look the same. And it's just like I'm. And I saw on the bottom 2016, I'm like, that was area was kind of ahead of its time in a way.

[B]

That video went. And I'm. Mind you, I'm like 18 years old. Like, I just started modeling. Like, I didn't think anything of it. I like, did a string bikini. I was like smoking cigarettes and like my supreme tracksuit, like, on the, on the side, like, being like, I don't even know what this is. I did the shoot and it went so viral and I was super young and I remember being like, oh, like, why? And it was about my body. And I look at those pictures now and in the context of society now, like, no one would ever even bat an eyelash.

[A]

What do you remember what you said? Because you said something. You were just funny. What did you say?

[B]

I'm sure.

[A]

Yeah. You didn't say anything. You're right. It wasn't like an act.

[B]

I think I kept saying, like, do you want me to wear a potato sack or something? I kept saying like that.

[A]

I mean, I was just so funny.

[B]

Like, not media trained at all. So people would ask me questions. I'm just like. Which I still love. I'm still not media trained so.

[A]

Well, just going back to what you said, like, what annoys me recently is like, you know, I like telling people they look great and I think that's okay to say in general and whatever, but I hate the hypocrisy of the Internet. Because on one hand, if you tell someone or you lost weight or you know, whatever, postpartum or whatever, it's like, no. But then people will talk about people's glow ups. And the glow up is like a weight loss journey.

[B]

They won't say it, but they'll never say it.

[A]

And it's like, happens. I don't know if you watch the Mormon wise, but it's like the, the girl from Mormon wise just did Dancing with the Stars. So she lost so much weight, got so fit, and everyone's like, her glow up her glow up her. And I'm like, like, you got like, you guys know you're talking about like that she lost weight. So that's what bugs me. Like, the hypocrisy of the industry. That like. And even the body positivity movement, it's like, yeah, you went 10 years screaming about it. And then we're like, we go kind of back in time as if it didn't have in the skinny talk of it all. It's just like, where, where are we living? What are we doing? Like, can everyone just.

[B]

Also, men are having eating disorders. It's like, I mean, it's like, it's pervasive. It's like, what the. The, the conversation about all of this more and more. I don't know. It's like for me, the I. The talking about weight loss or glowing up is so boring because I'm just like the. I think if people are just obsessed with that right now. They're just obsessed with like, you know, it'll be even like a young person who just grows up and it's like the glow up or like the glow down. It's like everyone's obsessed with that.

[A]

And is it Buchal fat removal or did she lose her or did she just.

[B]

She was 16, now she's 25. You know what I mean? It's like, like people just really. I think that's my best friend who is like always like kind of seeing these things. He's like, people are just so comfortable talking about people. That's really what it is. It's like you would never say, you would never like say any of this stuff to people because it doesn't even. It's not even true. And it's all just like start. I don't know, I've been, I obviously have been like the butt of like lots of like gener. Like this generation's like ups and downs about body politics.

[A]

Because you like grew up. I was 16 years old when I

[B]

was, like, literally, like, taking pictures of myself. And so for me, I feel like I have, like, always have, like, like, the perspective of what's happening, because I'm, like, the first person that people always like. I'm, like, the punching bag of everything. And so it feels like a different place that we're in. In society. I feel like a few years ago, it felt like a little bit easier, felt like a little bit less of, like, a conversation, and now it's like, all people talk about. I mean, whether it be clavicular, whether it be, you know, that guy who's like, looks maxing like. Like, boys are doing it too. It's like, people are obsessed with, like, looks.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And it's. It's not good for the psyche for anyone.

[A]

We'll be right back after the break. Everyone knows that when you're a parent, one of the hardest things for me is feeding these kids, okay, three meals a day. Get it going. You want to make sure every meal they have is as nutritionally packed as you can. And it's hard and it's rough, especially on weekends if they're home and you don't have a second to yourself. So listen, I have an option for you. I have something for you to stack in your freezer and, you know, have a go to when you're juggling too much, and that is Little Spoon. Listen, when I decided to try Little Spoon, and after I tried it, I was like, I'm not turning back. Okay? It's a trusted place to shop meals and snacks for babies, toddlers, and big kids. It's all made with real ingredients, and you don't have to think about every choice or lower your standards at each developmental milestone. Little Spoon has got your back, shows up at your door, takes one decision off your plate, and you're not compromising on anything. 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I've told you guys about Minnow and how much I love their kids swimsuits. Noah and Lenny wear them now and it is just so adorable. I love, love their prints, I love, love their quality and I get asked about them all the time. So if you don't know about Monow, it's a family lifestyle brand that really embraces clean lines, simple details and crisp seaside breezes. That's the vibe. And above all else, they put value, quality, comfort and style first. So this is a timeless, fresh, playful and polished brand that creates premium products. Products that inspire family experiences. So this is like Laguna beach vibes. So go to Mino and explore their children's swimmer collection that has such an elevated approach. Sunkissed color palettes, purposeful details, custom prints and high quality hand finished production. Noah had the gingham print first. Now we got another one as well. I think what we got now is more like stripes. We got a matching one for Lenny. Minnow's best selling products are their girls rash guard one pieces and their boys boardies that are the shorts I was talking about. And they also have unisex rash card shirts. So freaking adorable. You're gonna love it. Really thoughtful collections and prints that people will stop you on the street about and you could just tell its quality from miles away. Inspired by the French Caribbean, Minot presents its spring collection. A complete family vacation wardrobe designed to be worn on island from arrival to departure. Anchored by their largest women's assortment yet and refined styles for kids. Kids. The collection is captured in Saint Barts and designed to be worn all day, every day. Shopmanow Spring 2026 [e-mail] and enter the code. Meet Minow 15 at checkout to receive 15 off your first order. Again, that's shopmanow.com code is Meet Minow 15 for 15 off. Yes. So you know what yasa means in Greek? You literally break a plate with it. I don't know what it means, but you break plates and that's the vibe. You guys, it's time to ditch the freezer frauds. Yaso is the real deal. I love a sweet tooth and Yaso just took everything that we love about ice cream and upgraded it with creamy frozen Greek yogurt. So the best of both worlds. Delicious ice cream tastes and better for you. Nutrition. I felt so much better about seeing the nutritional information after I finished the full jar of Yasso. Okay. But then I saw that it has 400 calories and 19 grams of protein per container and I felt much better. Bar. So the tub that I finished was Yaso's new spoonables which have just launched. But they also have bars. They have chocolate crunch bars, sandwiches and poppables. And Yaso just launched new spoonables which each have around 400 calories and 19 grams of protein per container. So super good, you guys. I just had the cookies and cream and also the cookie dough, and it is beyond delicious. And now through April 30, Yaso is giving away 40,001 of their new spoonables. So to get one, head to yaso.com Amanda to enter and upgrade your freezer. That's Yaso. Y-A S S O.com Amanda to enter and find full giveaway details, rules and regulations. Find new Yaso spoonables at a grocery store near you. I told you guys before that I don't do great, great, great with taking my supplements, but what I do great, great, great with is taking my prenatals, like if I'm pregnant or postpartum postnatals. I'm also really good at anything that has to do with like my body being able to carry a baby or sustain whatever happens after having that baby, I'm good at because I recognize that that's really important. Okay. So when I was choosing a prenatal, like, I, I didn't have another option in mind. It was always, always ritual. I just felt like when I did my research, that ritual was the best. And they're just so transparent. Each capsule, you can like see through it. You can, you can see what's in it. Okay. Also, it's delayed release, which I love because it makes it gentle on your empty stomach, which, you know, my stomach is a sensitive one. Every bottle also includes a citrus essence tab, so it doesn't have that gross feeling. It's also third party tested, which is super important. And their entire line of pregnancy support, from their multis to their protein is clean label project certified, which we love. When it comes to pregnancy and postpartum support, you want products backed by research and transparency. Mom founded Ritual puts in the work and shows you the proof. Save 25 on your first [e-mail], not skinny. That's ritual.com. not skinny to get 25 off your first month. And we're back. But listen, I'm pro. Everyone wanting to look, do whatever, feel good, do it, don't do it. Work out, don't work out.

[B]

Agree with you 100 where it's like, I also like the conversation of, like, working out and like, weight loss me. So, like, I live in la. It's like, that's like, what.

[A]

I know, I know.

[B]

Isn't that like.

[A]

Like, literally it's every conversation in LA and like, everyone's going to work out. And you're like, stop.

[B]

Oh, my God. No, Literally, I go to Pilates studio. My friend Anna shouts out to Anna. She owns this incredible Plaza series. Women only. It's, like, so sweet and so cool and like, I love going there for,

[A]

like, the community isn't there because I heard he does Pilates.

[B]

No, Glenn Powell's not there.

[A]

It's all women.

[B]

It's like the cutest girls ever. They're all like, you know, they're just. It's. It's a sweet. I think, honestly, I do it because it's like, I get to like, make friends. So I do work out. And I'm like, you know, I've. And I love doing things for my health because I'm like, I'm also. I'm turning 30 and like, I have just been so unhealthy my whole life. Like, I smoked so many cigarettes in my life.

[A]

Did you quit?

[B]

No, I'm vape, but I've just put

[A]

the cigs onto the vape.

[B]

It's always a battle. It's like, it's like a cigarette. Zen now that vape now it's just like one couldn't stop. It just.

[A]

I know.

[B]

I love nicotine. So it's just like, that's.

[A]

What age was your first sig?

[B]

16.

[A]

I was 12.

[B]

12. Yeah. That makes sense. My mom smoked. Smoked while she was pregnant with me.

[A]

You're gonna be like. Because I said 12. That you're gonna be like, my mom started at nine.

[B]

Yeah. And I just was like, I need to be able to move my body.

[A]

I love how the. The. The solution is, like, not to quit smoking.

[B]

No, no, no.

[A]

But to do Pilates. So, like, walk to Pilates.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

With a cig. And then, I mean, and smoking, too, is being so glamorized now. Which to me. Have you seen, like. Yeah. So, like, I love the occasional seg.

[B]

Who does?

[A]

Well, I loved it, like, since 12. So before, like, people thought it Was cool.

[B]

Oh yeah.

[A]

No, it was like, like now. And now like everyone like wants to be like seen smoking and it's like it's only cool if like you're hiding it. You know what I mean? It's not cool if you're like trying to get the pat pick of you. Like smoking say, it's so performative.

[B]

You can tell when someone's a real smoker and real nice babe performance Barbie, if you don't have a voice, I don't want you smoking a cigarette. I don't. I want to hear the rest. No, I want to hear the years of dance.

[A]

I want to hear your cough ups and plan. But yeah, I've seen and well, we won't name names but I'll name them later of just like so performative either. It's behind the ear and it's like, calm down, you're not Sean Penn. You know that you can go like

[B]

men are doing this.

[A]

Yeah, like

[B]

cool guys that want to be cool.

[A]

Yeah, it's want to be cool. And it's even when I can really tell. Like when even the holding, the holding, you can tell, right? The fuck.

[B]

But when I'm watching, when I'm watching a movie, I could tell when someone doesn't smoke.

[A]

That's what I'm saying. 100 and it's so lame.

[B]

Even old movies, like there's a lot of old movies where you can tell some of the actresses don't smoke cigarettes. And they're doing it and it's just like the way they hold it.

[A]

Yeah, I think it's very like.

[B]

Yeah, there's a way to do it. Like, I mean there's a casual way to do it fantastically such as this if you guys are watching on video. But I think for me, what really, but really it's like the, it's like the, it's like not quite. You're not comfortable with it, you're not comfortable, you're not used to it.

[A]

And it's, I mean they have to work on the, on the inhales. But so we're. You could be healthy when we're not promoting smoking.

[B]

No, it's my biggest, it's my biggest problem. It truly is.

[A]

Like, what's your goal? Is your goal to quit or your goal is to lessen?

[B]

Eventually I have to quit. I don't believe in lessening. I believe in quitting.

[A]

Yeah, like, like, yeah.

[B]

I'm like kind of a girl. Like extremes. Like, I like, I'm like, I believe in quitting. I believe that I can Quit one day.

[A]

Could you ever be like, house of cards one at night, out the out the window kind of girl? No. Like, you're all in on your nada, babe.

[B]

It's not in my. It's not in my genetics. That's not in my genetics.

[A]

Okay, so let's go back to. Even though we could talk about things all day. Let's go back to. Okay, so there was Harlem, Queens. When did you end up in New Jersey?

[B]

Probably 8, 9, 10.

[A]

Okay, so that was like.

[B]

So I was like a little kid in Queens. I went to PS1 66. And I grew up, like, school.

[A]

What's up?

[B]

It was public school.

[A]

Oh, baby.

[B]

Public ass school for me, baby. And no private school for me. And that wasn't my tea earlier in my life. So I went to. I went to school there, and then I moved. And then I moved to Jersey. I moved to Maywood, New Jersey, which is like, this really small town next to, like, Hackensack High. So I went to Hackensack High. Shouts out. Worked at the Garden State Plaza, New Jersey.

[A]

Wait, what's the Garden? The Garden?

[B]

It's the nearest mall you can go.

[A]

The mall?

[B]

The mall without taxes. Because in Jersey, sales tax.

[A]

So what store did you work at?

[B]

American Apparel.

[A]

Wait, I modeled for them and then you modeled for them?

[B]

First I modeled for them, then I got a job. They did that. That was their whole shtick back then. They were like, we're Gonna pay you $9 to model for us so that you can also work in the store.

[A]

How did they find you?

[B]

I sent pictures in, and I was sick. They had an email that was just like, send pictures.

[A]

So what age was that?

[B]

16.

[A]

So 16. You already knew, like, I want a model.

[B]

No, no, no, no, no. I also didn't know that I could model because I was not skinny, but not fat. Not skinny, but not fat. So I didn't think that one could be a model if you're not skinny. And so I really. I opened up the world of, like, oh, plus size modeling. And that's what I knew after American, because American Pearl, they were just getting girls who, like, were of the, like, had the aesthetic and who wanted to work in the store and be part of, like, American Apparel world. That's what they were looking for. And so it wasn't like, models. But yeah, I ended up getting a real agent, like, modeling for real, because it became a thing after.

[A]

So American Apparel was like the. The introduction to all this?

[B]

Yeah, I was, like, doing shoots and then going to high school and then, like, getting paid like, $10 for it and thinking it was the best thing in the world.

[A]

American Apparel was so cool.

[B]

Oh, it's so cool. I still have so much American Apparel stuff because I just did my line kicks and I'm wearing American Apparel in the entire movie. Stop.

[A]

Because the. The. The movie is, like, 2011.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

When did American Apparel close?

[B]

Like, they closed their doors? I would say 2017. 2016, I would say. Because I think I was right at the tail end. I was working there in 2013. I remember there was a big, Like, a big rise in their popularity just again. And then I think it all fell apart.

[A]

Wait, how did you get the clothes for the movie?

[B]

You're Courtney, who did the costumes. Like, found dead stock, like, disco pans and stuff. She really found it all.

[A]

It's cool. Wow, that is so cool.

[B]

Because there's still, like. I guess there's, like, Los Angeles Apparel, but it's not quite the same, I don't think. But maybe I'm wrong, but, like, they don't have the same stuff.

[A]

It's probably not the same.

[B]

No, but it's like, the T shirts are the same, but not.

[A]

So there was American Apparel modeling for them. Then you sent in the thing for Harry.

[B]

No, no. By then I got. So I started. Did so much random stuff in between.

[A]

That's how you getting. Yeah.

[B]

Signed.

[A]

You were just shooting in all directions.

[B]

Yeah. Like, I had a lot of friends who were artists, so I would pose for them. They would, like, paint me or do. No, no. Because I was young.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

So I didn't do any new.

[A]

I love how you have to remember, like, not that.

[B]

No, no.

[A]

Later in.

[B]

I was in 18. Yeah. No, I remember because I. I was like a. Like an art model, and I would be like, sometimes show up, and they were like, you're not 18. Well, yikes. You know, like, what are we supposed to do? But I would model for a lot of artists. I remember, like, posing like John Curran, who's like. Like, a modern artist who's, like, in the MoMA. I had no idea. I was just, like, a stoner who was just like, I get cash for.

[A]

For weed. Where are you finding these gigs? My.

[B]

My friends were all artists. I like, literally just befriended a bunch of artists. Like, I. Friend of Petra Collins who started shooting me.

[A]

Oh, yeah. For.

[B]

For shoots, like, when I was 16.

[A]

We are on. You had a Tumblr account? Was this, like, Tumblr connection?

[B]

No, we met in real life because she used to do an American Apparel collab. She had these, like, these Shirts are like bloody vaginas. It was such of the time, such a vibe. Such a vibe. And so I kind of like snuck into all her art shows. And then I like.

[A]

Were you going into the city a lot? From Jersey. Oh, so you were like coming.

[B]

When I turned 18, I like fully moved to the Lower east side. Oh, you did, like a shitty apartment, like so loud. No, with my friend Cody. Two. Two girls in one studio apartment. That's about 200 square feet.

[A]

With the dream to like make it.

[B]

To make it, baby.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Well, also just get out of my family's house, you know, I was like, my mom love her, love her to bits, but I needed to flew the.

[A]

It was you, your mom, and my grandma. Your grandma?

[B]

Yeah. Grandma moved as soon as I turned 18. Moved back to Brazil. She didn't have time. She's like, she was here until. From the time I was born until I was. I turned 18. She goes, I'm out.

[A]

Like, she. She was like, I've done it, I've done it.

[B]

I hate it here.

[A]

So then you left your mom in New Jersey by herself?

[B]

She was actually in Mount Vernon, New York.

[A]

Because I'm like shaming you. I'm. I'm daughter. Don't worry.

[B]

We bought her a house two years ago. Don't worry. She got. She got the mid century architectural masterpiece house. Better than my house. Okay.

[A]

So.

[B]

But I did, I did leave her in Mount Vernon for a second and I was like, oh, can't leave mom there. The carpeted floor, like, you know, one bedroom apartment that has no, like, natural light. Couldn't leave mom there for very long. But we finally, finally got her out of there.

[A]

This mom. Did mom always support your, like, endeavors and dreams and stuff?

[B]

Yeah, my mom was like a very. My mom was like a very young, hot mother. And so she and that, like, really, like, I don't know why.

[A]

That's what I want my kids to say about me, by the way.

[B]

Yeah, like, yeah, she was a young, hot.

[A]

She's a young, hot mother.

[B]

My mom is young and hot and she's like a very like, like free spirited woman. She never cared about anything I did really good for good or for bad. She just kind of was like, you good? All right.

[A]

You're sending in nude pics. Okay?

[B]

My mom, my family, I'm not kidding. Whenever I do a sexy shoot or any sexy picture, they're the first ones to like it. My grandma, my mom, my aunt. And they like it and then they repost it. If the sexier it is, the more Likely they'll like it. I don't understand. It's. It's h. I make this joke to my friends that I'm like, every time I post, like, a thirst trap, the first person to like it is my mother. I love that she likes when I look sexy. Sexy.

[A]

I love that.

[B]

Yeah. So she was very supportive.

[A]

She.

[B]

And in her own way, where she was just like, not like, she was hands off my mom, like, let me do whatever I want. I was like a little, like, I was like a little boss at like 12. I was like, emailing, like agents myself. Like, that's the.

[A]

What you have to do. You.

[B]

And I still, like, spiritually do that now, so.

[A]

But it is crazy because there's so spiritually do that. There's so many different types of, like, actors and how they made it. You have, like, people that had their parents, you know, either get them into it without them even knowing, or people that had told their parents, I want this, and the parents moved them. I mean, we hear that so much, that story of, like, parents moving to LA with only the car.

[B]

They don't have immigrant parents.

[A]

I see.

[B]

And I'm not trying to pitch that to my mom. She was like, bavida what? She goes, you think I'm going to quit my job for you to maybe get a job at 10 years old?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Hell no.

[A]

Yeah, but so. But I. There's like, different types of support. Like this where your mom showed you, which is like, go do your thing.

[B]

She just truly just always was like, yeah, I just was doing whatever I want. And she was kind of like, okay.

[A]

And now is she so fucking proud of you?

[B]

Very proud. Very proud. I think she. She always says that. She's always so amazed by me that everything I say is, like, comes true.

[A]

Like, manifesting.

[B]

Everything I say comes true. It's like, I want to be an actress. I did it. Like, I want to be a model. I tell her things. I don't even, like, like, manifest anymore. I just kind of, like, say it and then it comes true.

[A]

I'm like, I mean, my thing about manifesting is, like, it doesn't have to be. I mean, I don't think of it as the, like, writing vision board Pinterest for me. It's like, oh, my God. You. You said. And, okay, I found yesterday. And I'll tell you the story because I'm the same way as you. Like, my mom calls me an octopus because I'm always, like, sending emails since I was 12 also. So I've literally. Yesterday, you know, when you search your email for, like, like, something. I was like, trying to find a receipt for something, and I ended up on a book pitch I sent in 2013. Okay, loser. Nobody knew who I was. Obviously I was nobody, nothing. But I always, you know, wanted to do things. And I sent a book pitch and this agent answered me, which is so kind, like, thank you, IMDb Pro for getting me an agent email. And at Ind DPP, I was sending.

[B]

Oh, yes.

[A]

Yeah. So all that and. And I sat in the book pitch and he was like, listen, like, since you don't have a platform and like, nobody knows you, you should think about self publishing the book. Like, who cares about my book? And then I read the book. What I wrote was like, yikes. And one of the chapters was, like, my obsession with Lena Dunham, because I love girls. And. And I wrote about, like, the dream I had of her. And since I was always, like, not skinny, but not fat, like, what that meant to me. And. And then, you know, I had Lena Denham on the pod, like a year and a half. I was reading that and I was like, that's manifesting to me. You know what I mean? Like, that the fact that I was, like, so obsessed with everything, like, everything. I take it to the next and

[B]

then you bring it into your life

[A]

and you bring it into your life and like, that bitch who's like, I dreamt about Lena and. Or was it Hannah? Like, whatever the fuck I wrote and. And who would have thought. Who would have fucking thought in this way and in this. So I love that. And I.

[B]

Sometimes it's not the way you think it's going to happen, but it's the way that it plays out.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Which is the coolest thing.

[A]

And I just think it's so amazing to be someone who, like, paved their own way and just. You went after what you wanted and you fucking did it.

[B]

You gotta do it.

[A]

We'll be right back after the break, you guys. Now everyone's talking about minimalist makeup. Everyone's talking about quiet girl, soft girl. Makeup is no makeup. No makeup makeup. But let me tell you who did it first. It's merit. Beauty. And let me tell you who knew about it among the first.

[B]

Me.

[A]

I've been loving merit for such a long time. Just because, as you know, I'm not a huge makeup girl. I don't. Like, I can do my makeup well, but, like, if you see me do it, you're gonna be like, that's an unprofessional makeup applier. But I also don't like to have an absurd amount of makeup in my house. I like really delicate, to the point products that can be like multi use. You know what I mean? So with Merit, it's just perfect. Like they have the minimalist, which is a stick that's like a concealer slash foundation. I love their flesh bomb, which it's a blush, but I also love to put some on my lips, some on my nose. They have amazing shades that I love. It's creamy, it's great. And if your motto is like, less is more, then your routine should feel that way. And with Merit Beauty, their lineup is so thoughtfully edited that it's 5 minutes easy to use products and the result is natural looking put together and in just a few swipes. You don't need a makeup artist to look your best, okay? You just need great makeup that works. Right now, Merit Beauty is offering my listeners their signature makeup bag, which I have don't be jelly. And you need to with your first order at meritbeauty.com so you go to meritbeauty.com M E R I T to get your free signature makeup bag with your first order. That's meritbeauty.com so I've known about Peak for years now. If you guys remember, I had gut issues and I could not drink or eat much of anything. Of course not coffee. So I switched to Matcha. And the matcha that was recommended to me was Peak, not only by everyone, but also by Kourtney Kardashian. I'm like, if she's drinking it, that's what I should be drinking. And I loved it. I love the texture, I love the feel and I love the taste and I loved how it made me feel. So that is my go to home matcha. Which by the way, when I say home matcha, it's the only matcha I would drink because I hate to match outside. I only liked my Peak packet kids in my house. I also took them with me when I traveled and I was like, I need, you know, the, the hand frother, blender thing. And that's all I need. It just make my Matcha with my peak. And Peak just makes so many good products. Like now, you know, they're very into our liver and how our liver really controls our whole body. Like, you know, who knew? I thought just like liver has to do with alcohol, right? No, not only that, our liver governs our energy, hormones, digestion, inner mood, but stress, toxins and modern foods overload it. So you don't need harsh, restrictive cleanses. You need daily Gentle support the Solution Peaks Liver Detox Protocol so this is a daily duo that is so powerful and it offers sustained support for your body's most critical filter liver. This year. Ditch the quick fixes and commit to the routine that actually delivers lasting clarity and energy. Peaks Liver Detox Protocol is the solution. It is simple, it is powerful and it uses ancient Ayurvedic and TCM formulas to support the detox pathways to promote gentle, better digestion, clear energy and emotional clarity from the inside out. So this is the duo, the Activate and the Flush and you are going to love it. Redefine the standard of health, secure 20 off your order and begin your intentional wellness journey [e-mail] not skinny that's peak P I Q U E life.com not skinny listen getting dressed isn't easy. Like it could be one of the most frustrating things to go in your closet, see a bunch of clothes, sometimes messy. Or if you're organized person and nothing to reach for, nothing to pull as stylists say, okay. And then you're like, okay, I should go shopping. But guess what? It's not as easy or fun as it sounds. You go to a store, you don't know what to take off the rack. Then you do. The lighting is always awful or online. 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Shipping and returns are always free and there's no subscription required, which I love. Get a free try on for your first fix. Get started today at stitch fix.com not skinny. To get $20 off your first order, that's stitch fix.com not skinny, but not fat. To get $20 off your First Order, that's stitch fix.com not skinny but not fat. Who doesn't know Wayfair? Who hasn't ordered from Wayfair? Who doesn't have Wayfair items across your house? If it's a couch, if it's a bed, if it's a a lamp, if it's an end table. That's where you go when you're looking for good, affordable pieces for your home. And now it's Way day at wayfair. So from April 25th through the 27th, you can score the best deals in home. So this is up to like 80 off with free shipping on everything. As you know, Wayfair makes it super easy to find exactly what fits your style and needs, from furniture and decor to home improvement and outdoor essentials. And it's on sale during weigh day. 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So the acting part. So you thought modeling and then when did like the acting come in?

[B]

Well, I've been acting since I was a little kid. So the thing I wanted to do most was acting. That's why I modeled because I was like, I don't have, you know, family in the industry. I, you know, my grandma cleans houses, my mom, like, is at school while I'm like, you know, a kid. So I. And I was like, I'm gonna do this Like, I'm gonna figure it out. And obviously it's almost impossible. And so I had a big kind of platform on the Internet at the time with Tumblr and Instagram, and I was. And when I was modeling, I really got, like. I mean, I had like 400, 000 followers as a model.

[A]

Well, you did.

[B]

Yeah, back in the day. Yeah, back in the day too. That was, like, hard.

[A]

That's hard.

[B]

And so I had, like, I was like, pretty popping as a model. And, like, I kept, like, just doing more and more video stuff because I really wanted to be an actress. So, like. And I had a. In my head, I was like, once I turn 20, I need to start. Like, really? Because I started around 16. I was like, I do this for a couple years and then I figure it out, like, and it. It ended up happening exactly that way. Like a 21. I had an agent. I was like, auditioning. I did like, the whole audition thing, and I got euphoria. Like, 21. So it was like, exactly the time. And it was time to get something. Because modeling, I was like, this is not gonna go anywhere for me anymore.

[A]

Really? You felt. You think that it just is, like,

[B]

you know, I just felt like it wasn't going anywhere.

[A]

Well, were saying you're also a talker and you love, like, yeah, I'm like,

[B]

I can't just be. I can't just shut up and put on clothes. Like, that's not my vibe.

[A]

So when you got the scrub for Euphoria, did it scare you at all, or were you. No.

[B]

I remember reading and being like, was this written for me? I literally thought that you're like, it, me, it me. And so I was literally like, I've never been more desperate to get something because I knew I could do it so confidently, but no one else did. And they also made everyone audition, like, every plus size model. And, like, they had, like, signs in the subway that was like, if you're a plus size.

[A]

Like that. You saw that? You saw.

[B]

Yes. I'd be there, like, on my third audition. Like, keep coming back.

[A]

Keep ripping them down.

[B]

And I'm like, ripping them down at the club. I'm like, you're putting at the cool people club. I'm like, I'm taking this off. Like, this is mine. Oh. Every single one of my friends auditioned for it. They were like, I don't even act. I've never even acted. Would you help me with this audition? Like, girl, you know, and.

[A]

And you felt like it was yours.

[B]

I did, but I didn't know if they were going to agree with me.

[A]

Was it back then? Was it back then? Back in the day? Was it self tape or was it in person?

[B]

In person. So I did, like, 11 auditions in person.

[A]

11 auditions?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Oh, my God, it was so tough

[B]

on my anxiety and indigestion, my digestive system that was so anxious. I was like.

[A]

And then what would it feel like when you got it?

[B]

I was in therapy, literally crying to her being like, how am I supposed to do this? I don't know. My life could change. It can't. And then I got. I got three missed calls. And she's like, answer it. And then I answered, and she. She gave me a hug. She never gave me a hug before.

[A]

And you're like, yeah, I have to leave. You know, I have to leave.

[B]

I did that, and I left. And she's like, go ahead. And I just, like, went down the street and just screaming.

[A]

Did you have a inkling that it would be what it was? I mean, for It. It, like, shaped a culture. It shaped rising stars, the whole cast. Like, you know, I didn't.

[B]

I thought it was gonna do really well, but I. I could never have, like, envisioned the impact it had on, like, the culture, because it's also like, the Internet and everything is just so different. So I was like. I didn't. I knew that it was gonna be good because I really loved it. And I remember, like, being really proud of what we were doing and, like, being like, this is so different than anything else has been on tv. But I didn't know at first. I was also like, are people gonna think. Think it's too nasty? And, I mean, they did. That's why they like it.

[A]

Because people are nasty.

[B]

They're nasty.

[A]

How does it feel now when the third season is coming out? You're doing your own thing. You have two movies you're leading coming out the same month.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Coincidentally. Right. That the third season is airing. So how does that feel?

[B]

I mean, I just saw the trailer yesterday. It sounds so. I haven't seen. I mean, because the last time we did it was like, what, four years ago? Must have been three. Something like that.

[A]

That season it came out or since you.

[B]

Since we shot, it must have been three or four. So it's.

[A]

It's.

[B]

It's interesting to see everyone grow up and, like, where the show is going, because obviously, like, we're not high school students anymore. I know. Like, I've also been processing that, like, wow, no one sends me high school roles anymore. I guess I'm Just grandma.

[A]

You're like, young mom grandma now.

[B]

Not young mom yet. I want to be young mom. But yeah, I'm like, I'm curious to see how are you going to watch? Yeah, for sure.

[A]

Really? And I mean, you've addressed it so many times, but you leaving the Internet, going crazy. I've read that you said made up thin air like, that it was like a dramatic leaving situation.

[B]

Yeah, it wasn't dramatic. In fact, it was kind of the opposite of dramatic, where it was like, long process of, like, being like, I don't know if this is it for me, and then, like, having conversations with people and us trying to figure out how to make Kat like a. A fully fleshed out character. And it just wasn't going anywhere. So I just think I. I truly was just like, I think since we can't find anything and we can't land on anything, I'm like, let me just go. Like, let me just go do my thing. Because it's a long time and you can't, like, leave. And the thing is, I don't need to be on the biggest TV show on earth if I'm not, like, acting, you know, so I'm like, I would rather do an indie movie where, you know, I'm acting, I'm flexing my muscles. I'm like, being creatively, like, you know, asked to do things rather than kind of sitting around to be, like a background character. I don't know. I mean, and some people are like, I would do that. I'm like, good for you.

[A]

Like, you want to be a background

[B]

character for nine months, that's like, totally fine and cool. But I just. I was like, I want to do other stuff. I want to produce, like, indie cinema.

[A]

I don't have time to do what you're doing.

[B]

I do. Yeah. I do indie movies that, like, literally, like, are made on a shoestring budget, but it's, like, cool and, like, real stories. And I'd rather that than kind of be a second thought. I think, think.

[A]

And you feel like you seem like such a decisive person. Like, once you decide something, you're. You're. You don't look back. Huh?

[B]

Yeah. How'd you know?

[A]

Well, I feel it, like, everything that you made happen for yourself, you know, and, like, decisions that you feel. It's hard to make decisions like. Like, I don't know what to, like, eat for my next meal, bro.

[B]

I'm not going to decisions either. It feels like, you know, especially in this world, it just feels like it's. I feel like with work, it's like, the hardest thing.

[A]

Oh, my God.

[B]

It's because you're like, you have to weigh the pros and cons and stuff. And, like, I may have, like, a different perspective on things than other people, and I had, like, a lot of conversations about it. It wasn't like I woke up one day angry. It was. It was a very long, arduous process of processing and weighing the pros and cons, seeing what was gonna happen, and being, at the end of the day, being like, I believe in myself as an actress, and I want to see my career look a little differently than this. And I'm like, it's okay if it's not like, the hit TV show. Yeah, it's fine. You know, I did that. Thank God.

[A]

Like, this is the last season, right? This is.

[B]

Oh, I have no idea.

[A]

Oh, they didn't say that when they announced it. Oh, I thought they did.

[B]

Oh, I have no idea.

[A]

I have a feeling, maybe. I have a feeling. So. Okay, so like we said, coincidentally this month, April, you have two movies that you're leading. Like, you're lead actress in Faces of Death, which is a remake. Right.

[B]

It's like a reimagining, I would say, because the original is like a gore tape. It's not like a plot driven.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

No.

[A]

By the way, the trailer, Like, I was scarred. Like, the trailer looks like it's scary. It's like snuff, right? Like, what was that? Like dipping your feet into, like, horror.

[B]

It was so fun. And we did it, like, three years ago in New Orleans. And I got to. I'm, like, trying not to spoil it, but it got to be so fun because I got to be, like, real physical with it. And I don't think with my acting I've ever done anything physical. I got to, like, do my own stunts and, like, do, like.

[A]

No, not like picturing you doing backflips.

[B]

No, backflip. When I say stunts, I mean, you know, fighting. Yeah. Normal stuff like that. Not jumping off of a building. I'm not.

[A]

You play. We'll give the. You play like a. I play a

[B]

content moderator, Margot, who, like, goes on a quest. Quest to find this man who she believes is recreating Faces of Death. And chaos ensues. Baby.

[A]

Yeah. She gets into it.

[B]

She gets into it. And so there's a whole thing that happens there. And. Yeah. And she. She goes. Me trying to be so vague with no spoilers. I'm like. And then she gets into a little bit of a pickle, and you gotta get herself out of the pickle.

[A]

Well, there's like, there's like murder on

[B]

tape and murder on tape. We're bringing that in.

[A]

Which is, is so freaky because like, obviously with social media and everything, like, like you, you're like not far fetched.

[B]

You know, we see people dying in real life on social media all the time. It used to be something that no one watched. Like you watch people fake dying. Real dying all the time. Anyone can watch it. That to me is so sick and disappoint.

[A]

Where do we watch real people dying?

[B]

People will post like videos of like, you know, some, some, some. Some building falling with a baby coming out.

[A]

You know what I mean?

[B]

Like, like. Or assassination or this. Like you're just seeing and you don't, you don't even get to Google it.

[A]

Like, it's just, it just, it pops up for you. It's on your feet a lot.

[B]

What the movie's about.

[A]

Get ready with me.

[B]

The amount of exact. It's. That's what's.

[A]

Del.

[B]

Del. It's like you're like watching like, get ready with me. This is how I do my bagel. And then it's like extreme violence. You see someone's light leave their eyes. And so the movie really is about social media and the, and the companies that, that profit off of the constant cycle of violence that's being perpetuated. It only has gotten in the past three years much more relevant.

[A]

And you're like the protagonist, like, yeah, girl. Saving the. Trying to save the day.

[B]

Yeah, girl.

[A]

And then at the same time you have a completely different movie coming out, which I feel like your is your baby. Feels like. Right?

[B]

Yeah, that's why I produced too.

[A]

Yeah. Mile End Kick. So I saw the, the trailer for that as well, and it looks like. Right. Even the music for the trailer, like, it just brought me down.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Yes, because you said 2011, so it's tracking. So there. You play Grace, right?

[B]

Yeah, I play Grace. And she's this music journalist who moves from Toronto to Montreal to write her big book about Alanis Morissette. And then she falls in love with a guy in a band and then another guy in the band and then chaos ensues and she's in a pickle.

[A]

So it's like a romantic. It's like when you were talking about like indie, like this is giving indie, right?

[B]

It's like a rom com, like Nick and Nora's Infinite play. Shout out Kat Dennings. I love. It's like very. It's like very indie. 2000s vibes. It's really cool. I, like, really enjoy it. I thought it was such a fun.

[A]

So how did it work with producing it? Because, like. So did you get the script and then you wanted to be, like, a bigger part of it?

[B]

Yeah, so I thankfully, with, like, a lot of these indie movies, like, it's like something that people want, like, from the beginning. They, like, they want me to produce and star in it, to make the movie happen, because that's kind of what I've been doing the past couple of movies. You know, I get a script that perhaps doesn't have the funding or doesn't have, like, a cast, and then we start building it from, like, bottom line,

[A]

they need your star power.

[B]

Oh, thank you, darling.

[A]

To get it off the ground.

[B]

Yeah. And to also build it up. And, like, I. I'm very creatively involved in, like, the casting and depending on the, you know, the director and how. And. But when I'm producing it, it tends to be that way where it's like, you know, I get to really be involved in a lot of things. Even, like, locations, like, during, like, we're doing insert shots, like, you know, I'm talking to the crew. It's like, it's very fun. I, like, love to learn.

[A]

Did you shoot in Montreal?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Oh, that's cool.

[B]

That was really fun.

[A]

How long were you there for?

[B]

So. For like, two and a half months. A whole summer.

[A]

Oh, that's so fun. It wasn't last summer.

[B]

The summer before that. It was so freaking fun. It was. Honestly, Montreal's like, the best place I can imagine.

[A]

I mean, probably in the. Not in the winter, though.

[B]

Not, you know, not in the winter because the snow tall.

[A]

My dream was actually to go to a college in Canada. Specifically McGill. Specifically.

[B]

Oh, my God. That's mentioned in the movie about a thousand times.

[A]

I didn't get in you, Miguel. They're so harsh, these Canadians. Like, they don't look at the whole picture. They just want your SAT scores. Wow. Yeah, like, those over. Yeah, I'm like, essay. It's sappy and it's good, you know, like, get me in. But you know why I wanted to go there? Because I was, like, drinking ages 18. I don't want, like, solo cups and frat parties, you know, Like, I wanted French. I wanted French Jazz bars. Happen for me.

[B]

It's. Well, I'm sorry, because that sounds, like, really fun.

[A]

And it was. It was. It was a great. For you. That's.

[B]

It was. It was kind of that way for me for two months. Except I Also, like, had to work the whole time. Which, of course, was like, I don't get to, like, drink every night at the bar.

[A]

Right.

[B]

I mean, the boys did. It was fun. They got to, like, really party and have fun. And, you know, the old me who's in every scene had to go to bed and. And learn my lines. My 15 pages of lines every night.

[A]

So how is it? Did you feel like you related to Grace's character?

[B]

Yeah, I feel, like, desperation of, like, being in your early 20s and trying to figure out, like, men and, like, dating is so real. Like, I remember reading these scenes. I'm like. I'm cringing so hard because it's too real. I mean, the sex scenes in it are so cringy in the best way. Like, you're like, oh, I've been there.

[A]

Fuck.

[B]

I try to forget that.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah.

[B]

It's really like that. And so even being the scenes, I'm like, oh, I felt bad for. It's, like, disgusting.

[A]

Yeah. And watching it back, do you, like. Do you. Can you watch yourself, or are you like.

[B]

I watched. So I have this thing where I like to watch my movie or the show a few times because I need to get over the way I look and the way I sound, because, like, you don't ever know. And so, like, the first few watches, just me, like, getting over it and being brave. Right. And then the last time I watch it will be like, oh, I can, like, watch this movie or show. And I'm understanding that this is a movie and a show that I can kind of see it, and then I stop, and then I never watch it again.

[A]

And, like, objectively look at it, not at yourself. And then I think the fourth, fifth time.

[B]

That's usually when I can, like, watch it objectively. So I.

[A]

How was it premiering that at Tiff?

[B]

It was so fun. Yeah, it was so fun.

[A]

I heard Tiff is, like, a really fun, fun place to be.

[B]

So great. Tiff is really a fantastic, like, festival. Also. It's Canadian boots, and we are all Canadian here, spiritually.

[A]

Yeah. I was like, wait.

[B]

No, I'm like, the movie's just so Canadian. And I'm, like, the only non Canadian.

[A]

Love Canadians, though, right? It's true what they say, right? They're so nice.

[B]

They are so sweet.

[A]

I'm so excited to see both of them, by the way, you guys. April 17, mile and kicks is out in theaters. In theaters. And April 10th is Faces of Death.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Also in theater, also in theaters. Get to experience, like, two completely different.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Versions of did you know that these would. Because you feel. This is the thing about this industry, like, is wild to me. Like, this is why I love to know about the producer producing it. Like, you film these years ago.

[B]

I did not know Face of Death was even gonna come out because what happened was we shot it. It was amazing. It was, like, testing well. Like, everyone loved it. And then, like, the Hollywood powers that be, like, all the conglomerates, like, changed the way that, like, people sold off stuff. And then all of a sudden, it was like, I was like, oh, this. I'm never like, showbiz, baby. I just shot this movie. I'm never gonna see it. No, I. There is no world in which I thought these two movies were to come out at the same time.

[A]

But how does it. Is it overwhelming that they are feeling.

[B]

Yeah. I get to. Someone said Barbin Mile face, as in Barb and Heimer, and I go, wow, I love Barbin Mile.

[A]

I told you your fan edits are crazy.

[B]

Thank you, Barb. And my face rolls off the tongue. It's gonna. I think it's gonna hit.

[A]

Don't choose one when you can see Barbinheimer face.

[B]

No, Barbin. Barbin Myelface.

[A]

Barbin. My old face, y'. All. Barbin my face. I also saw that you're a huge fan of Devil Wears Prada.

[B]

Oh, wait.

[A]

Yeah, I am. So how excited are you for number two?

[B]

I'm extremely excited. I love the Devil Wears product.

[A]

I saw. Watch it three times.

[B]

I watch it three times a year. There's, like, a few movies that I do that like White Chicks is one of them. Devil Wears products I need to watch again. It holds up. I was actually watching 40 year old Virgin yesterday. It really holds up, too. Some. Some. Some don't. But yeah, Devil Wears Pride is a perfect movie. I think. The perfect film.

[A]

Did you see that? What Anne Hathaway said? She said to producers not to put models in who are so skeletal and alarmingly thin in the movie.

[B]

I mean, per. I feel like that's great. I feel. Yeah. Her. I think that that's. It's great because also, it's like you're. This is a movie that by people and young women and all sorts of people. So, I mean, I feel like. I wish that was, like, the standard in general.

[A]

Yeah. Except then I have this, like, social media voice in my head. Like, the. Like, the things that I know would come up that are, like, justice for skeletons, you know, it's like.

[B]

And you guys know what we're talking about, though. And you know and you're just trying to do a little Twitter talk and they know what they're doing because they love to chat.

[A]

No, I think it's. I think Anne Hathaway is.

[B]

I think she's on the right.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

If I think, like, since that is the standard and it is so normalized and like, that is what you have to do to be a fashion model, like, for it to not. For someone like Anne Hathaway, who's also a thin woman, she's just like, hey, just don't be too, like, so visibly unhealthy, of course. That then you got yet to be like, what does that mean?

[A]

What does that mean? Someone is naturally that thin. Right.

[B]

Yada yada. And so. Yeah, that's complicated.

[A]

Woo.

[B]

Good luck, Anna Hathway with Twitter.

[A]

Good luck, Karma. Thank you for coming. Thank you for having me. You're so fun. I'm so excited to see both of these films and for this exciting month for you. Thank you.

[B]

Thank you for having me.

[A]

Yay. Woohoo. Thank you guys so much for listening to this episode of Not Skinny but Not Fat. Follow me on Instagram at Not Skinny but Not Fat. Subscribe to the podcast so you don't miss any episodes. Rate the podcast that you love so much on Apple Podcasts and write a little review. If you tell me you did, I'll give you a big virtual smoocharoo. Thank you guys so much for listening and I'll see you next Tuesday.

[B]

Please note that this episode may contain paid endorsements and advertisements for products and services. Individuals on the show may have a direct or indirect financial interest in products or services referred to in this episode.

[A]

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