Dove Cameron Isn't Goth, She Just Grew Up

Summary

Podcast Summary: Not Skinny But Not Fat — Amanda Hirsch with Dove Cameron
Episode Title: "Dove Cameron Isn't Goth, She Just Grew Up"
Release Date: March 3, 2026

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Episode Overview

Amanda Hirsch welcomes actress and singer Dove Cameron for a candid, funny, and insightful conversation covering Dove’s transition from Disney fame to adult roles, her perspective on Hollywood’s changing ideals, her relationship with fame, her personal growth (and turning 30!), and her artistic journey. They touch on everything from managing public perception (especially around appearance), professional challenges, her close relationships, her approach to acting, hair color fixations, love, and finding happiness. Dove debunks rumors about her “goth” image, discusses her romantic life, and gets deeply appreciative about her mother’s support.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Hollywood’s Obsession with Thinness

• Amanda’s Opening Commentary [00:04-04:56]
  • Amanda opens with commentary on body image in Hollywood, the dangers of extreme thinness, and the pressures from the proliferation of weight-loss drugs:

    “This is an epidemic in Hollywood...I'm not against the drugs...but I'm against, like, it being on the verge of unhealthy and really promoting skeletal skinniness to the world.” [03:44, Amanda Hirsch]

2. Dove Cameron on Interviewing and Media

• Podcast Experience and Pressure in Traditional Interviews [05:18-06:44]
  • Dove prefers podcasts for actual conversations over superficial, rapid-fire interviews:

    “I like talking to people. I feel like it's so much better than, like, short form interviews… I do struggle to say everything I want to say concisely.” [05:32, Dove]

  • Both jokingly discuss their mutual inability to produce “specific examples” on demand.

3. Film & Pop Culture Preferences

• Dove’s Taste [07:08-10:18]
  • She prefers creative, high-concept or emotionally resonant films (“Pan’s Labyrinth”) over familiar dramatized relationships.
  • Notes loving Emma Stone’s “Begonia” and appreciates films that are out-of-the-box and sweep her away.

4. Her New Show: 56 Days

• On Playing Ciara [11:01-16:40]
  • 56 Days is described as a “psychosexual thriller” centered around mystery, a timeline countdown, and morally ambiguous characters.
  • Dove is drawn to layered female characters — not just “complex”:

    “I try to avoid the word complex…it feels diminishing...she [Ciara] gets to be morally gray and complicated…and, you know, be immutable and changing around different people.” [13:13, Dove]

  • Discussion of an emotional scene wiring money, with Dove describing acting choices and moral ambiguity:

    “The crying happened organically because it was like this moment of...animal relief. And...it's so inappropriate that she would be crying in that moment.” [15:13, Dove]

5. On Sex Scenes, Nudity, and Body Image

• First Intimate Scenes [17:45-29:45]
  • No chemistry test with her co-star; chemistry is described as unpredictable and not manufactured.
  • Her first time appearing nude onscreen:

    “I always say that if you are afraid of something, that's the very next thing that you should do.” [26:16, Dove] “On the other side…I…kind of broken down a sort of a shame about my body...in Western culture, you know, we're so trained as women to hide our bodies for fear of what it's going to make someone else feel...” [28:14, Dove]

  • Stresses autonomy, comfort, and the value of challenging personal boundaries.

6. Hair as Identity & Public Perception

• The 'Goth' Misconception [30:13-35:27]
  • Discusses how people equate her hair changes to emotional shifts (“sad Dove”, “goth Dove”), which she refutes:

    “If the goths heard you saying that about the way that I present, they'd be so pissed. You're so far from goth, it's crazy.” [34:28, Dove]

  • Reveals that hair color changes are mostly for hair health and practicality, not emotional statements.

7. Disney Days and Transition to Adult Career

• Liv & Maddie, Descendants, and Growing Up Publicly [35:32-42:22]
  • Clarifies no twins were auditioned for Liv & Maddie — the point was for one actor to play both roles.
  • On growing up in the public eye:

    “For me, it's been half my life…there is this weird expectation that you…keep up a brand that you choose when you're like 16.” [32:38/32:50, Dove]

  • Warm, neutral relationship with her Disney past:

    “That was such a good time in my life professionally…no complicated relationship with that, I have a very lovely warm neutrality. Like, I'm just like, that was such a good time in my life professionally.” [36:36, Dove]

  • Wouldn’t do more Descendants without Cameron Boyce:

    “We're not going to do a Descendants movie without Cam. That would just be…impossible.” [42:12, Dove]

8. Friendships with Former Cast

• Sophia, Boo, Cam [50:41-51:31]
  • Friendships from Descendants have evolved — especially close to Boo now, but less frequent contact with Sophia due to busy careers.

9. Turning 30 & Personal Growth

• The Nonchalant 30th [51:31-52:38]
  • Dove didn’t care about turning 30, threw a pajama party at the last second.
  • Prefers small, intimate gatherings over going out:

    “Would rather die [than go out]. Hate it. Hate it.” [52:55, Dove]

10. Romantic Life: Fiancé and Relationship Dynamics

• How They Met, Communication, Proposal [53:38-63:23]
  • Met at the VMAs (twice); started as a music collaboration; details their “accidental” and sweet courtship, her usual role as the initiator in relationships:

    “I'm either the person who is doing the flirting. Like, I'm either asking you out, or I'm, like, deciphering...” [59:12, Dove]

  • Long-distance strategies: voice notes, constant updates.
  • The engagement was meant to be private but leaked due to paparazzi:

    “So we were pretty pissed when that came out…we weren't ready to make the announcement. We wanted to make it on our own timeline.” [62:29, Dove]

  • Reflects on having multiple definitions of love and being a “hopeful romantic.”

11. Living Bicoastal/International & Love for New York

• Lifestyle [64:50-67:33]
  • Splits time between LA, New York, and Rome. New York has her heart:

    “It's just like I land here and I'm like, ah, I'm home...it matches the stimuli in my brain.” [65:44/66:34, Dove]

12. Mother’s Support & Moving to LA for Fame

• Emotional Gratitude [67:49-72:11]
  • Amanda finds Dove’s mom’s blog, underscoring her mother’s immense support and sacrifices during years of struggle.
  • Dove gets emotional recounting their financial hardships and her mom’s belief in her dream:

    “We were flat broke…we were keeping track of how much gas we were spending on the way to the audition…It was really, really, really on a hope and a prayer and a dream…My whole career. I have my mom to thank for because she was so selfless…” [69:21-70:12, Dove]

13. Final Quickfire: Wellness, Music, and Manifesting New Goals

• Routine & Outlook [72:40-end]
  • Keeps track of sleep/health with an Oura Ring (surprising to Amanda).
  • Manifestations include finishing her album, well-being for loved ones, and openness to surprises:

    “I am manifesting that I feel that magical, like it's done feeling…And, you know, general balance in my life, you know, health and dreams coming true…I try not to aim for anything specific…The best things in my life have been great surprises.” [73:59/74:50, Dove]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “If you are afraid of something, that's the very next thing that you should do.”
  — Dove Cameron [26:16]
• “For me, it's been half my life...there is this weird expectation that you, you relatively keep up a brand that you choose when you're like 16.”
  — Dove Cameron [32:38/32:50]
• “That was such a good time in my life professionally…no complicated relationship with that.”
  — Dove Cameron [36:36]
• “We're not going to do a Descendants movie without Cam. That would just be...impossible.”
  — Dove Cameron [42:12]
• “On the other side [of nudity on camera]…I…kind of broken down a sort of a shame about my body.”
  — Dove Cameron [28:14]
• “I'm not gonna go into that honestly. Like, [earlier engagement] it was real. Yeah, but we were never gonna get married.”
  — Dove Cameron [64:06]
• “If you're coming from a place of lacking or like desperation…It never happens. It's always when you're like open palmed...”
  — Dove Cameron [75:58]
• “We were flat broke...we were keeping track of how much gas we were spending on the way to the audition...It was really, really, really on a hope and a prayer and a dream.”
  — Dove Cameron [69:21]

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• [03:44] — Amanda on Hollywood’s weight-loss epidemic
• [13:13] — Dove describes her attraction to “layered,” not just “complex,” female roles
• [15:13] — On an emotional scene in 56 Days: “The crying happened organically...”
• [26:16] — On facing fears: “If you are afraid of something…”
• [32:38] — On the challenges of growing up in the public eye
• [36:36] — On her relationship with her Disney past
• [42:12] — On not returning to Descendants without Cameron Boyce
• [51:34] — On turning 30: “Weirdly, I didn’t care at all..."
• [53:41] — On her fiancé and keeping the relationship strong
• [62:29] — On engagement news leaking before she was ready
• [69:21] — On her mom’s sacrifices and belief in her
• [75:58] — On serendipity and opportunity: “If you’re coming from a place of lacking or like desperation...”

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Tone & Atmosphere

• Conversational, unfiltered, candid, emotional, real, intimate, occasionally irreverent and always relatable. Dove is open, self-aware, gracious, and reflective — Amanda is supportive, warm, and incisive with her questions.

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For Listeners

This episode is a must for Dove Cameron fans, Disney nostalgia lovers, aspiring actors, or anyone interested in authenticity, self-acceptance, and the realities behind the “Hollywood image.” Dove’s personal stories, humor, and wisdom on navigating fame, body issues, acting, and love are not just entertaining but endearing and thought-provoking.

Transcript

[A]

The following podcast is a Dear Media production.

[B]

Welcome back to the Not Skinny But Not Fat podcast. I'm your host, Amanda Hirsch, and I still can't believe that I get to chat with some of my favorite stars on my very own podcast, where you'll feel like you're just talking shit with your best friends in your living room. Hey, yo. Welcome back to Not Skinny But Not Fat. I'm your host, Amanda. Amanda is rageful. Like I am. Like, I am almost scared that, like, the premenstrual rage will stick this time and I'll never crawl out of it. And that terrifies me because if it's a few days, and that's one thing, but imagine just being stuck like that. Like, all of a sudden I got. I added that layer of anxiety to myself because I think, like, sometimes it's just worse. Obviously, Like, I don't get this every month. Demi Moore is so skinny. I know we're not supposed to comment on women's bodies, but, like, I appreciate when people are saying in general, like, I did just say Demi Moore, but because I was like, oh my God, like skeletal, I will say I appreciate people talking about it and just saying in general, we're having a thin Hollywood problem right now. Everyone is a real thin. And I know, and I appreciate and I stand behind that. You don't never know what somebody's going through and blah, blah, blah. But this isn't a one case basis. This is a epidemic in Hollywood and we know what, where it's from. Like, we know it's like their weight loss drugs. Now you can get beyond freaking skinny. Mini, mini, mini, mini. Everyone's bones. Like, everyone and people that were thin before are bones, bones, our bones. Our bones, our bones. And it's just like, I'm not against the drugs. I'm not against, like, losing weight, obviously, but I'm against, like, it being on the verge of unhealthy and it really, like, promoting, like, just skeletal skinniness to the world. Like, I'm, I'm like, let's look at like Olympians. And, you know, if we want to strive for any kind of ball, let's try for like an Olympic athletic, strong, fudgeing body and not somebody that looks like they're going to break anyway. Back to my rage. See, that could make me rageful. Like, I, like, literally yesterday, you guys, I was raging so hard that husband I were going to pick up Noah and I really wanted to have time for a coffee before we got him. And all of a sudden there was traffic and I was like. I was, like, seething. And then an ambulance came. And you know how you have to, like, move your car over and make sure they get through? And my husband was, like, sitting. Sorry. Like, this is more important. Like, she needs her coffee. Like, he was so scared of me. Like, he was just like, okay. Because I would blame him. I'd be like, you were standing behind freaking ambulance. Noah literally came up to me yesterday morning, you guys. And don't, like, be sad about it. Like, I doesn't, like, pull my heartstrings. It is funny to me. But he literally was just like, mom, are you mad at abba? Are you mad at me? And I was like, no, I'm just mad, like. And I feel like Noah is so emotionally intelligent and observant because. Not that it's hard to miss my rage, but because I've always talked to him. Like, not an adult, right? I'm not, like, you know, but I. But I. You know, like, let's say if I was Christian, I'd tell him Santa isn't real. You know what I mean? Like, I'm just. That's my vibe of just, like, yeah, I'm really just mad right now. Like, that's the truth. And I'm not going to be like, it's nothing you did, you know, like, just going to be like, I'm just mad. Just mad. Anyway, so Dove Cameron is here today. You probably all know her. We grew up with her. She was on Disney, the Descendants. Now she's in. She. She has. She has music out. She's an actress. And we just saw her kind of grow up in front of our eyes. We talk about turning 30, getting, you know, growing up in the public eye, going from Disney to serious actress. Just her identity with all of that, you know, and hair color, you know, I need to get into the hair. She's really deep. She's really thoughtful. I'm telling you, these actors are so smart. It's like, should we all be growing up on set? Because I feel like they just get so worldly and so, you know, their vocabulary is always banging. Like, she's just deep. She's funny, and she's not what you would expect. I feel like, so enjoy this one. Here's Dove Cameron.

[A]

I read it after I watched. I made it to the next thing. Babe, I'm at a podcast now, and I will be here for an hour, so don't get worried about me if I disappear. I love you so, so, so, so, so much. I'm thinking about you all the time. And I'm strapping in and I'm literally on the couch, and we're about to start filming. I love you so much.

[B]

Okay, Dev.

[A]

All right.

[B]

Hi.

[A]

Hey, dude.

[B]

How are you?

[A]

I'm so good, guys. We're making a podcast.

[B]

We're making a podcast.

[A]

Come on, you guys.

[B]

First of all, you're like a podcast pro by now. I feel like it is kind of

[A]

crazy, right, how many podcasts I've done. Yeah.

[B]

Well, I love that you're a fan of the medium.

[A]

Yeah, I am, because I like talking to people. I feel like it's so much better than, like, short form interviews. I like, panic you.

[B]

Do you get nervous still?

[A]

No, I don't get nervous. I never get nervous for, like, this kind of stuff anymore. But I do struggle to say everything I want to say concisely.

[B]

Oh, okay. So you're saying you're better long form than when you're like a 10 minute. Tell us like, the funniest story.

[A]

Kind of like, oh, my God, my nightmare. Whenever they're like, tell us a funny thing that happened on set.

[B]

I'm like, wait, can I just tell you something?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

My best friend and I literally, the other night, I don't know. You know when you talk to your best friend for hours and you get to the weirdest like things? And we just discovered that we both have this trait that is can't. And we. We described it as we can't think of specific examples.

[A]

I can never think of a specific example of anything.

[B]

So that's why I told him. I was like, that's why I don't ask my. My guest specific things. Because I. If someone was like, tell me. Even if someone's like, who do you want most on your podcast? Like, I can't. I'm like, oh, that's a specific example. I lose it.

[A]

They just asked me. I was somewhere else and they were like, who are you listening to right now? Couldn't conjure it up. Who's your, like, dream co star in a TV show? Like, I'm. I am. And it's stupid because I should have these things ready because these are, like, common questions.

[B]

We have the same disease. My brain drum. I don't know. We'll think about it later.

[A]

My brain goes blank white.

[B]

I see reporters ask celebrities the wildest questions, and I always cringe that are is like, wilder than what they ask you. Like, I saw, like, what Taylor Swift song from her new album would be the soundtrack to the movie or like, what? And it's like, that's the most specific thing. Well.

[A]

And then I get really scared because I'm, like, truly not always plugged into or caught up with everything that's going on in the zeitgeist of pop culture.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So someone will ask me something like that, and I'm like, it's gonna sound like I don't care about these things. And it's like, I do. I'm just, like, I'm slow. I'm late to the party. Like, I just recently finished all of Stranger Things, so.

[B]

Okay. That's not that late, was it? Didn't season five just. Just come. Come out?

[A]

Yeah, but season one was what?

[B]

Like, it's like your show. Do you have. Are you on? Well, we were just talking about Tell Me Lies. Did you watch Tell Me L yet? Okay.

[A]

No, I. It takes me a while to get into, like, a new. New show. Like, I just recently doubled back and watched Maniac with Emma Stone. It was, like, this crazy. I think it's on Apple.

[B]

Movie Show Maniacs.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

With, like, Jonah Hill and Emma Stone, where they get put into this, like, drug trial, and then they realize they're soulmates and all these different idioms of their iterations of their life. So beautifully shot.

[B]

Yeah. So impeccable. So how do you decide, like, what to put on? Are you just scrolling on. On streamers?

[A]

Yeah. Or, like, I keep a running list of, like, these are my favorites. Because I'll forget my favorites. Like, something I've seen a thousand times, I'll not remember. And then I'm like, oh, yeah, I love Down With Love with Ewan McGregor.

[B]

Right.

[A]

But then I'll keep a list of things. Like, I. I want to get to see this, but I need to be in the right headspace for it. Like, I really want to watch Hamnet, but I'm, like, not ready to be ripped apart.

[B]

Yes. I do need to watch that as well.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Did you watch any of the Oscar, like, the award show movies?

[A]

I just watched Begonia.

[B]

I did, too.

[A]

Honestly.

[B]

Why?

[A]

I don't know what anyone's saying about it.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

That was one of my favorite movies.

[B]

Why?

[A]

Because it's. You don't.

[B]

I don't know. I watched on a plane. I freaked out. I was like. I was like, where we go? It was. The ending was wild.

[A]

Well, the ending was wild.

[B]

Was wild.

[A]

We kept making. My fiance and I kept making jokes all the way through. We're like, watch her. I don't give anything away, but, like, watch it be that. Like, watch the lie be the thing that's true. And we were fudgeing. Dying.

[B]

The calculator part was insane. Phenomenal.

[A]

She's so funny, too.

[B]

You love her. I mean, you've been watching all her stuff, it sounds like.

[A]

Yeah, I do love Emma Stone. I do love Emma Stone.

[B]

So Begonia was your.

[A]

It's my shit. I love that director. I love everything he does. I love their partnership. I love anything that is, like, totally out of the box high concept because I. I struggle to find things that make me feel. Feel like. That I feel connected to. Because there are so many stories that are, like, dramas that are near, near, like, parallel paths to my life where it's like, oh, yeah, I have been through that. I know what that relationship's like. I have seen this version of the show a thousand times. So, like, I end up watching things that are like Marvel movies. High sci fi, high concept musicals. Like, big, dramatic sweeping.

[B]

That's so interesting.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So, like, the stuff that's more like real life kind of relationship. Like, you're just like, oh, been there, done. Like, it doesn't inspire you as much.

[A]

I've unpacked it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I. I really love, like, my favorite movie of all time is Pan's Labyrinth. Oh, my God.

[B]

Really?

[A]

So beautiful. It's. It's an early Guillermo del Toro film.

[B]

I know.

[A]

I butchered that. I always.

[B]

I always. Guillermo del Toro, he just met with somebody. That was a big deal. Who did he meet with? I don't know, but he met with Connor's story from Heated Rivalry. Did you watch that?

[A]

No, I haven't see that?

[B]

You need to get on.

[A]

I know. I'm gonna.

[B]

I'm sorry. I'm putting you on the. The pop culture zeitgeist thing that you.

[A]

No, this is relevant because I. It's a show that is right up my alley, and everybody and their mother has been telling me that it's gonna be, like, my thing.

[B]

Oh, yeah.

[A]

But I just haven't had the time to sit down and watch it. We've been doing a crazy press tour, so it's like one of those things that it's like, okay, when this is over and I have a moment, you

[B]

can binge your shows.

[A]

I like to binge everything at once.

[B]

Yeah. By the way, your new show, 56 Days, but I didn't finish it. And I'm dying because I'm up to episode six, I think.

[A]

Oh.

[B]

So I'm. I'm there. I'm almost there. And I'm literally, like. I didn't have time to finish it last night. I Was like, I need to know. I need to know what happens. Like. Yeah, I still don't know at this point who's doing what. Who's doing what. Yeah, if it's a male or how much can we say. Can you. How much can you say about the show and.

[A]

Well, I mean, the show's out, right?

[B]

It'll be out. It'll be out by the time this is out.

[A]

I guess, like, if you don't want to hear spoilers, skip this part. Like, can people still say that There

[B]

could be a synopsis.

[A]

All right, well, I can give you a synopsis, but if you want me to talk about that.

[B]

Okay, no, we're not talking about that.

[A]

Okay, we're not.

[B]

Synopsis.

[A]

Well, okay, so you know this already, but basically 56 days is an adaptation from a novel of the same name. It's a. I guess I would call it a. They're calling it a psychosexual thriller.

[B]

Psychosexual.

[A]

I think that's what they're calling it. Yeah, I guess I would call it an erotic thriller. But it's. It centers around this relationship between these two characters, Oliver and Ciara. Oliver played by Avanjogia. And they meet in a grocery store in the most, like, innocent, sort of like, oh, no, you go first, you go first kind of way. And then within. They begin today. They go to the movies. It's all very cute. They have like, nice, easy chemistry. And within 56 days, one of them is dead in the bathtub of Oliver's apartment. So then the whole thing is about finding who's dead, who did it, who done it, and then the where the crime is also being solved in a parallel timeline.

[B]

Right? It jumps back. Yeah, yeah, it jumps back. And it's like today. And then day one, day two, day three, day four. Yeah, yeah, yeah. How was filming that? I mean, it sounds like that's what you were looking for. You were saying before like you're looking to do stuff that is stuff you haven't experienced. I'm assuming you haven't experienced, have not

[A]

been murdered in a bathtub.

[B]

Yeah, I. Oh, no. Did you spoil. Oh, no, you didn't. Okay.

[A]

No, I didn't. Don't worry.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Don't worry. Even if I said it, it wouldn't make any sense to you at this point. Yeah, but I. I was really attracted to the show because Ciara's character was just really like. She was very layered. I try to avoid the word complex when I'm talking about female characters because I feel like it's so dead. Done over with. It's like. It's kind of like the. I don't know, it's like the participation prize. Like, it's like, oh, she's complex. It's like, you know, it feels diminishing.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But I. I think that particularly Ciara is so layered and she is so traumatized, and she has such a rich lore and background, and she gets to be morally gray and complicated, and she gets to, you know, be immutable and changing around different people. And I just thought that that was, like, a fun challenge. And to make also someone like her more human and more relatable, I thought was a really fun challenge because I'm always really attracted to those characters that, like, at first glance, you might be like, oh, no, you know. Cause everyone in the show is kind of a good guy and a bad guy, so I'm really not giving anything away. But everybody in the show has done something morally gray that we might be, like, bad person. But the more you open them up and, like, unthread them, you know, the goal is to hopefully convince the audience that they're worthy of empathy and they're human. So that was something really attractive to me.

[B]

There was one scene where your character was. And this isn't giving anything away, but you were wiring money to the account. And it really, like, was striking to me that you cried. Like, it was trying to be as dove. You know what I mean? I was like, wow. Like, it's not like you were crying in this, you know, really sad or, you know, in other movies where there is crying. I was shocked at, like, oh, my God. Like, she's the. The. Like the minute that the transfer is complete, you look and you. We see your face throughout the whole process of doing this wire transfer. And the way, like, your eyes, like, just welled up. I was like, damn, she good.

[A]

Thanks, dude.

[B]

Yes. Was that. Was that a scene where, like, it said, like, cry, or did it come up for you or what was going on?

[A]

No, that's a good question. I'm actually. That's also stands out to me as a moment on set where, like, I. I think at that point, we've been shooting for so long, and, like, I know that there's a world in which that character is like. Like, did it, you know, killed it got what I wanted. But I think that what's so interesting about the character is that she really is so convinced that everything she's doing, she's on the right side of it and she's the good guy. And So I think, like, I, I, I wasn't planning on crying. I think it was just kind of like a natural impulse because she really, really cared to make that happen for her. And I don't want to give anything away, but, like, that was, that was like, on a soul level important for her. She was convinced she was the good guy in that scenario. And so I think that the crying happened organically because it was like this moment of, like, animal relief. And I think that that's kind of the fun thing about a character like this is that, like, you know, it's so inappropriate that she would be crying in that moment. And it's so almost like, I don't want to put any labels on her because I don't know and I can't diagnose a character. But it is so, like, sociopathic adjacent that you would be or, like, you know, some kind of something where, like, you really believe, like, that something that anybody else would think is a terrible thing is a good thing. There's something definitely morally left about her. And so to have that, yeah, like, innocent reaction, I thought was, no, that

[B]

was so good fun.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Yeah. And another scene I really like, enjoyed here was obviously the sex scenes. No, you and Avin, by the way. Avin, like, can we talk about him? Like, he also is a nickel. He's Nickelodeon. You're at Disney. Did you bond on that? Like, did you have share similar experiences?

[A]

You know, we weirdly. No. I mean, not to be too, like, dismissive of, of that, because it's so a part of our lives, for sure, but we didn't really, like, it was so long ago, do you know? Like, there's been so much life since we both stopped doing that. And I think both of us, I'm speaking on his behalf, but, like, we were both such little adults when we were filming those shows that it wasn't like, those were the before times and these are the now times. And like, how did we get here? It, like, was just one long kind of continuation. I think the thing that we have in common with our, like, teenhood acting is that it just, like, really made us professionals, like, it just really trained us well. So there's not a lot of things, I mean, at least for me, there's not a lot of things that can,

[B]

like, throw me on set, like, in

[A]

a long way or, like, long days or, like, okay, now we're doing this. And like. Cause, you know, on Disney, it was like, now you're over here, you're riding a unicycle. Now you're speaking in French and now you're singing. It was just, like, always something to adapt to, you know, so. So it's really. I see that in him. Like, he's a consummate professional and he's. He's very, like, down to work and play.

[B]

We'll be right back after the break. Okay, so we're well into 2026, which is wild. But we still have, like, New Year's resolutions in mind. Mine, you know, I'm keeping the year of yes going. And also I'm sticking to my wellness goals of, like, getting more fiber, making a habit of taking, like, you know, vitamins and things that are good for my body. And that's where Bloom Greens comes in. So I've been taking greens for years to help curb bloating. Like, I really believe in it. Like I said, like, it alkalizes your stomach. So I definitely like to do that before I drink coffee. Bloom Greens, adding that to your everyday routine can keep you energized without a caffeine overload and really regulate your bowel movements and know that you're getting greens in your day. So then if you don't have, like, a salad or plate of spinach, you're like, it's cool. I got it. Okay. Bloom Greens and Superfoods is the OG Greens brand and the number one greens powder in the US For a reason. I love that with Bloom Greens. They don't compromise on taste to fill the nutrient gaps in your diet. So if you want to really, like, hike up that wellness routine, but in a super easy way, Bloom makes it simple and convenient to get your vitamins and minerals in with one daily skill Coop and you're done. Right now, Bloom is offering their best offer anywhere exclusively for my listeners. Use code not skinny for 20% off your first order@bloom nu.com. that's B L O O M N U.com and enter the code not skinny to jumpstart your wellness journey. I know you're sick of me saying it, but I'm not. I'm not going to stop saying it until there's an IQ bar movement. Until everyone isn't like, having IQ bar in their I bag. Listen, you guys know I'm a bar girl. You know I'm a snack girl. Maybe Noah gets it for me, but I really do need snacks in my bag. Curb my hunger. Really avoid those blood sugar crashes that you can get. So having a bar in my bag, like in between podcasts or when I'm on the go, is just a staple for Me. And I'm always looking for a bar that is clean and high protein and low sugar. And that's IQ Bar. Like IQ Bar products are clean, label certified. They're entirely free from gluten, dairy, soy GMOs and artificial ingredients are packed with clean, delicious ingredients. They have magnesium in their lion's mane and more. They are really the smartest snack choice. They have plenty of plant protein, tons of fiber and no added sugar, like Amazing. They also have IQ Mix, which is a zero sugar drink that hydrates with electrolytes. And they have IQ Joe, which is a mushroom coffee designed for mental clarity and has 200 milligrams of natural caffeine. The bars are really my go to to you guys. They have amazing flavors like mint chocolate chip and my personal favorite is banana nuts. Right now, IQ Bar is offering my special podcast listeners 20% off all IQ Bar products, including the ultimate sampler pack, plus free shipping. So to get your 20% off, this is different than usual. Okay, you got a text Not Skinny to 64,000. So text Not Skinny to the number 64,000. Again, the message is not skinny combined. Okay? No space to the number 64,000 message and data rates may apply. Guys know this. You guys know this if you follow me. But, like, I struggle sometimes with kids and their food. You know that I'm not a cook. You know that. Like, I'm going through a phase with Noah when he doesn't eat. But Lenny, Lenny, Lenny, my. My baby prodigy, please stay like this. Stay eating, baby. It's just easy. Eggs, chicken, potato. Like, he's fully eating. But, you know, I still don't always feel like making him food or, you know, on the weekends and you don't have help and it's just like. So I have a little spoon stocked up in my freezer and it is God send. Okay, so Little Spoon makes food and snacks for babies, toddlers and big kids. They make this food with real ingredients. They make it with hidden veggies and they make ones that you can just microwave for freaking a minute and your kid has a meal. Okay? Lenny actually loves the Mac and cheese with hidden veggies. It is just such a staple in my house. They also have pouches, snacks, they have baby cereals. So they really, really, really take you through the whole journey from baby stage to toddler stage to big kid sage snacks and beyond. Feeding the kids doesn't have to be complicated. Little Spoon makes it easy with real nutritionally balanced meals and snacks designed for every stage. It shows up ready to go. Takes the pressure off and somehow still gets devoured, veggies and all. No artificial dyes, flavors, or sweeteners either. And you know what? That's a win. I'll take get 30% off your first online order@Little Spoon.com. knots skinny 30 with code not skinny 30. That's Little Spoon L I, T T L E S p o n dot com. Not skinny 30 with code not skinny 30 for 30 off your first order. 30. And we're back. How did you guys find the chemistry?

[A]

We didn't. Like, we met on set. We didn't chemistry test, which, like, I was.

[B]

You didn't? No.

[A]

Which we honestly, we should have. Like, honestly, that would have been the right thing to do, right, For a show like this that so hinges on chemistry. But I guess they just felt so confident in their choices that, like, maybe they'd seen us have chemistry with other people in the past and they were like, they're going to be able to bring it. Because chemistry is. I find this such an interesting thing to talk about. I keep talking about it because, like, it still kind of blows my mind. Chemistry is an invisible, unpredictable, like, chemical. It's not anything that you can cultivate, I don't think. Like, maybe there are actors out there that have, like, tips and tricks. Like, maybe they're doing stuff that I. That I don't know about. But, like, there's that whole famous thing of, like, if two people are actually dating or they have something, their chemistry is awful, right?

[B]

And then if people hate each other.

[A]

And then there are some people that if they hate each other. Like, I've worked with people that, like, I didn't hate. I've never hated anyone. Honestly. No, I could never say that. I don't think I have. But I've worked with people that, like, we didn't have a good rapport. Like, we just were different. And like always it was like, okay, like co worker vibes, you know, and we would have insane chemistry.

[B]

Really.

[A]

Like, we'd get on camera and it would just be like. And. And platonically too.

[B]

Like, oh, you're not saying. Only making out. It could be just like good, good

[A]

French chemistry or like people like, you know, just anything. Like women, men, anyone? Anyone. And so really it's like this, this thing that, like, everybody else can tell you you have chemistry, you don't really get to know. Like, you just do the action and then you're like, okay, fingers crossed. Like that.

[B]

And what, that it looks good? That it comes across, that we make you feel something? Yeah.

[A]

That we make you believe. Because that's the whole goal at the end of the day, is we want you to believe that it's happening and make you feel, you know, so. So that was something. That was a huge risk. I guess the only thing I can think of, like, because this was my first time doing intimacy, anything, and I was really.

[B]

It was your first time?

[A]

Oh, my God. Yeah.

[B]

Like on. Okay, so you. You. Do you show breasts?

[A]

Yeah, and some ass, I think.

[B]

And some. There's some writing and so you're saying you haven't done anything intimate on. On camera before? No. Truly?

[A]

No. I've been in, like, bathing suits.

[B]

Okay. You know. Wow. So this was a big.

[A]

I mean, I've kissed people. Like, I. But I've not been naked in this way. Yeah.

[B]

So how. How was that? Was that something that. That was a big deal to you? Did you feel.

[A]

It wasn't a big deal? When I accepted the role, I was kind of like, Billy Big British. Like, who am I? I'm from the 60s. I was Billy Big Bridges. But I was like, you know, I accepted the role and I was like, yeah. I was like, I'm ready. I feel adult enough to do this. I love the character. Like, I was scared of it as an idea, but I also. I've said this on a million things. People are going to, like, meme it, but I. I always say that if you are afraid of something, that's the very next thing that you should do. And it was something that I was, like, definitely apprehensive about. And then I was like, well, okay, if I want to. If I look back, all the things that I was scared to do, but I had to. I grew so much from that. Right. And I didn't have to take this role, but I wanted. I was interested in seeing, like, who I became on the other side of a challenge like that, or how you

[B]

felt actually doing it. Because you actually don't know until you.

[A]

You don't know. Yeah, you totally don't know. Again, I electively took this role, and then when I got to set and it was time to do it, I was like, all right, let's go.

[B]

Woo.

[A]

And then I got there, I was like, I, like, clammed up and freaked out. And I was like, oh, my God, this is so intense. It's. It's really intense. And I. I really commend other actors and actresses who've done stuff like this because. Because it is. It's just. It's an inherently weird beard. It's weird because you're also like, you know, it's mechanical. It's. It's not only are you nude and it's. That's a scary thing for the lab.

[B]

Move to the lab and move to the right.

[A]

Like, no, no, they weren't doing that. Which, like, some part of me kind of wishes that, like, someone would have been like, give us more this. Because then sometimes I look back and I'm like, oh, like, when you wait,

[B]

you watch it, it's hard for you to watch.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Your body is banging dove, dude.

[A]

That's so kind.

[B]

It really is.

[A]

Thanks.

[B]

All of it. Thanks. But I can understand. It's just like seeing it on a. On a big screen.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Feels bizarro. But how you said, like, do what scares you. How does it feel to be like, after it?

[A]

I feel good.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Yeah. I actually feel more in my body. It was like, it. It was like, for me personally, like. And this is again, like, part of why I like this job and part of why I continue to do it is because I consistently learn so much about myself. Throwing myself into this, like, deep end kind of experience where it's like, well, I have to figure it out, like, right now. And then doing it again and again, or sometimes not doing it, and then you're like, fuck, okay. Like, gotta learn a little bit more before I do that again. I really felt on the other side of it that I had, like, kind of broken down a sort of a shame about my body. I don't know if that really makes sense or translates to anyone else, but I feel like in Western culture, you know, we're so trained as women to hide our bodies for fear of what it's going to make someone else feel or. Or for our own safety or for some weird purity complex that, like, I don't personally ascribe to, you know, and. And I had adopted so much of that just being in this sort of, like, nudity, fearful culture. Whereas, like, in other cultures, it's. It's not a big deal. You go to. You're in Europe and you're on the beach and all the women are topless.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

No one's looking at them. No one's, like, following them home. No one's taking pictures. Like, it's just normal. And I. I didn't realize how much of that I had internalized until I got to set and I was like, oh, fuck. Like I'm scared. And then when I did it on the other side, I. I just felt more. I felt like I owned myself more. It's so weird. It's like, I'm not even trying to project a message here. Like, it was just my personal report.

[B]

Everyone get naked.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And film yourself.

[A]

No, no, that's not what I'm. Right. Everyone should do what they feel. Right?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

That's really what I think. Like, if you want to be, you know, topless and free the nipple or wear as little or as much clothing or cover yourself to whatever degree you want, everyone should be able to do that. I just think, like, the days of policing people's bodies should be so far gone, it's fucking weird, you know, it is weird, but I realized I had some of that left is what I'm saying. And I felt like this was a good exercise in letting it go.

[B]

And I have to talk about your hair a little bit. I know that we, that you said somewhere that sometimes people take your hair changing as like something's going on with her. Right?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Like, so the dark hair. We're committed. We're, we're not, we're, we're not looking back.

[A]

I mean, for now, like, I see my, I have like a fever dream where I'm like, like platinum, platinum, like see through white blonde.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And then I have like a little cunty bang and like short hair. So I like throw it up in a pony and it's like messy.

[B]

Oh, cute.

[A]

I see girls.

[B]

Kristen Stewart, she did that for a minute.

[A]

She do that.

[B]

I feel like she did. What is your natural hair color in between?

[A]

It's like an Amanda Seyfried blonde, brown, bronze.

[B]

Did you ever just like, let it, let it go? Natch.

[A]

Damn. Not since I was a kid, no. Because I just like, there's nothing wrong with it. I actually think it's really pretty. And when it grows out, I'm always like, I should just let it grow, but I just don't have the patience. And yeah, it's such an impossible color to color match. So like dyeing this bottom, right, Always going to look green. So, like, really what I need to do is like shave it and let it grow. But I, I, I like the brown for now because honestly, the switch was entirely motivated by hair health. I was just like, I have got to stop bleaching it. Because the real issue was that when I was dark brown before, I had this crazy again fever dream where I went to my hairstylist and I said, I want to be cherry red. And so at the top of 2023, I think I was cherry red. Like black widow early days red.

[B]

And to get, to get rid of. Right.

[A]

Well, the Problem was I was so dark. And then we had to lift it and bleach it and then go red. And then I was like, this is too hard to maintain. We went back dark and then I went blonde for a hair campaign and my hair was destroyed because under it was another round of bleach.

[B]

Yeah. So I was like, well, it looks super healthy now. Now saying you went dark to get it, like healthy.

[A]

Yeah. And when I died at light for a while it was like really working and it was light. But then it was just like, it was just too hard because I wanted to keep bleaching it. And the more that I did, it was like cutting itself off.

[B]

Like, dude, does it feel weird that people like associate it with like Disney was like blonde, like, you know, you know, perky, like preppy Dove. And then now it's like dark, like cat eye, like mysterious. Like is it. Does it feel like too two worlds?

[A]

Yeah. But I think that's also just what happens when you come onto everyone's TV when you're like 16 and now you're 30. It's like it's. It's been a crazy long time that I've been in the public eye. For me, it's been half my life.

[B]

Right.

[A]

So. So yeah, like, you know, the person that you are. It's so funny because, like I see people's tick tocks being like who I was in High School versus who I am at 25 and it's like so disparately different. But like in the public eye, there is this weird expectation that you, you relatively keep up a brand that you choose when you're like 16, you know,

[B]

and that you don't really choose too.

[A]

No, I mean, like I was, that was who I was. You know, like it really. I. I guess I have to be careful with how I say this because I've said this so many different ways that it's going to start sounding like I'm contradicting myself. But it was who I was at a time and then I started to perpetuate it because I knew it's what people expected and then that's what Disney knew I was. And also perpetuated because I was branded and they were a brand and it just got bigger and more. Like Dove Cameron wears white, is blonde, doesn't wear eyeliner, pink lip gloss. And like I was so like, hi guys. And yeah, and that was who I was when I was a teenager. And. And the funny thing is that, like, I actually think I'm very personality wise similar to that now. I'm just not like a child.

[B]

Right.

[A]

That's really the thing, is that when people are like, she changed so much because she got so sad, it's like. Like, a lot of the trauma that people perceive me having now I already had when I was that age.

[B]

Right.

[A]

So it's not like there was pure dove, and now, like, I'm so sad all the time, and I have dark hair and I wear eyeliner. Like, it's really not related. It's just that, like, my sense of.

[B]

Wait, you see you. Sorry to cut you off. You see people saying sad dove. Like that's a thing.

[A]

Yeah, definitely. Oh, yeah. It's like before she got sad, before she got dark, before she went goth. Which is also funny because it's like, if the goths heard you saying that about the way that I present, they'd be so pissed.

[B]

I'm so. The goth community is offended.

[A]

You're so far from goth, it's crazy.

[B]

Wait, that's so funny.

[A]

Yeah, but it's like, I get it.

[B]

Like, but you think it's like, dark hair, black eyeliner. That's what makes you goth to some people.

[A]

Yeah. I mean, I literally can't figure out anything else. Like, I wear, like. Yeah. Like a smoky eye and dark hair, and I'm pale. So, like, I get the connection, but, like, you know, like, the contrast, which is not to say all goths have to be pale, but, like, the dramatic contrast between those two things is, like, you know, it's. I get that there's, like, an association, but it's not. I don't think it's accurate. And I would say I'm actually, like, extremely happy now. I think that it's just. It's not as overtly coupled with things that we associate with, like, girlishness. And, like, I would say I'm extremely friendly and happy.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But I think I just give off this kind of, like, darker vibe now. By comparison.

[B]

I don't know. By comparison. Is probably that what it is? Does that feel like. Do you think there's a stage. Are you there where you, like, graduated the Disney? Like, because you said you and Avenue even, like, you didn't vibe over being child stars. Like, that wasn't one of the points. Do you feel like you've. Because you said it was so many years ago, that, like, it's in the past?

[A]

I mean, I. I will say with, like, honesty and love and confidence that it never comes up in my life. Like, we sometimes will watch it to be like, oh, like, you know, when I Was first starting to date my partner. Like, we went back into, like, you know, like, dust off the relics and like, bring them out and be like, this is like, where I started. And I have so much fondness and like, for my birthday, like, we put descendants on and like, I interact with people online when, like, something goes viral and I'll be like, you're killing it. Yes. So, like, I don't. I never forget.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

It's still like, in my life in cute, charming ways. Like, people will ask me to sign dolls and like, I have some dolls. It's not like I'm like, it's so far away, you know, like, it's fine.

[B]

You don't have a complicated relationship with that.

[A]

I have a very lovely warm neutrality. Like, I'm just like, that was such a good time in my life professionally.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I had so much fun on those sets. I have zero regrets. I look back with, like, great pride for, like, what they are. I think they're cool for what they are. I love the kids are still finding them, but, like, in my day to day life, I have zero correlation with. With any of that. You know, it's like I'm in my house, I'm cooking.

[B]

Yeah, well, obviously you're not.

[A]

Like, I'm working on music, you know, it's like, it's. It's just so not a part of my life in any sort of, like, mainstay way.

[B]

So for people that don't know and may just know you now. Right.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Dove was. You played two characters live and Maddie on a Disney show for how many years was that?

[A]

It was four seasons, so I guess. Yeah.

[B]

Four years.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And you started that at what age?

[A]

My mom was just correcting me on this the other day. I think it was 1606.

[B]

10. And that was your first, like, acting gig?

[A]

My first lead acting. Well, no, I did a. I did a movie with. With Disney before called Cloud 9 that is like, you want to talk about, like, something I do not want to see again? It's that fucking.

[B]

Why?

[A]

Oh, because it was my first time ever having the lead and I was like, you know, I had no idea what I was doing and I was. I had no eyebrows. Like, I plucked off all my eyebrows and I had these.

[B]

We've all been crazy.

[A]

Individual extensions that were like, curled to the gods and you know, this snowboarding movie, it was actually. It was so fun. Again, it's just like, it's hard for me to watch myself on. On anything.

[B]

Yeah, I get it. And then with Liv and Maddie, you Played two characters.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Which is which? You're like, I don't need a twin. I'm. I'm. I'm not. I'm just doing two. You always.

[A]

Something's funny that I've never said in an interview before, but I want to clear up.

[B]

I have a twin.

[A]

Can you imagine? I'm like, raven, come out. Not Raven's mom. Dove and Raven. But I. I have seen over the years so many people saying, I can't believe she stole this role from two actual twins that could have been paid. And I wanted to respond so many times being like, please, please understand. No twins auditioned for this show. It was always about making one actor play two. And so, like, I wanted to clear this up. There were no actual twin actors who were harmed in the making of Liv and Maddie. Nobody else auditioned for this. It was purely created for itself, which is crazy. They just told me I was doing it after we did a totally different pilot. So it just happened. Yeah.

[B]

So people get upset. You see that for.

[A]

I think it's probably old, but I used to see it a lot.

[B]

I used to be like, I swear. Yeah, I swear. How hard was that to do? Were you new at. You were doing a community theater when you were growing up and stuff like that, but playing two different characters at kind of the same time?

[A]

Yeah, no, I was pretty green. Like, I'd done some other guest starring roles, like, barely, like, one episode of something network, you know, and then I did that Cloud 9 movie, and then I started on Liv and Maddie. I think, like, it was a challenge in the sense that it was more of a technical challenge because I. I so have those two sides of my personality anyway. Like, people are always pointing that out to me. And I think it's very true that, like, I can be extremely femme and I can be very bouncy and, like, very easily, like, excitable and. And over the top. And then I can also be, like, incredibly, like, I guess, Matty. I don't even know how you would call that, like, laid back. Like, bro. Yeah, bro. Y. It's kind of my two, like, modes of expression. And I do switch back and forth a lot, so that wasn't hard for me, but it was. It was definitely, like, we worked to set it up in a way that was, like. We did a lot of work, me and my lovely director, Andy Fickman. Shout out Andy Fickman, my love of my life. We sat in his office, like, for a couple weeks, and we were trying to decide, like, key differences between the girls, because Disney was basically like, good luck. Like, they were like, you're gonna go play twins. Figure it out.

[B]

One likes sports, one is more like.

[A]

Exactly. One plays basketball and one's an actor. And then it was just like, so you can decide all the rest. Because I didn't audition and they didn't have character descriptions.

[B]

Wait, you didn't audition?

[A]

No, because we had done a pilot that was like a totally different thing.

[B]

Oh, and then. So you did a pilot for someone you did audition for, and. And they saw that and they were like, we're just gonna make this.

[A]

We shot the pilot. We shot the whole pilot. And then they came back and they were like, we're not doing the show that you shot. We're doing this. And there's no character description or anything. So, like, basically, yeah. One plays basketball, one's a movie star. The rest is up to you. And so, like, we worked on. I wanted to make sure that their voices were different. There's a couple times that you can probably notice that, like, one was left handed, one was right handed, but sometimes I couldn't get away with that because of, like, camera angles and also just like, I actually am right handed. But, you know, there were things like, you know, they wanted me to come up with a catchphrase, which we came up then with. Then with, like, with the Maddie thing that Maddie says. Yeah, it was just like a bunch of, like, funny enough, a lot of character prep for that little show.

[B]

That little show. And then you. You won like, an Emmy for it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Was that. Was that. Was that a big deal for you at the time?

[A]

Oh, yeah. I mean, it'd be a big deal for me now. Like. Yeah, it's so. It was so cool. Like, it was such a big moment in time, I guess, for.

[B]

For.

[A]

Because it was hard, like, playing twins all the time. It's double the amount of shooting time. And it's like, you know, you're cutting into your lunch breaks to get this done. Like, transform your. Like, switch wigs. Because wearing wigs.

[B]

Right.

[A]

So. So yeah, it was a beautiful, beautiful thing. Like, you know, to win a. To win an Emmy for that and Descendants.

[B]

Huge. Would you ever do another one? No, no, no, no.

[A]

Because our stories ended and, like, to be honest, not to get into anything heavy, but, like, you know, we're not going to do a Descendants movie without Cam. That would just be. That would be impossible.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Like, it wouldn't be the same thing, and it would be, like, really deeply sad. So. So, yeah, whenever people are like, why won't you do Descendants? Whatever. It's like.

[B]

Because you won't do it without Cam.

[A]

No, of course not. Like, you know, I think, yeah, it just wouldn't be the same. And, like, those times, those years were so special and so, like, crystallized in my mind. I know for sure in Boo and Sophia's minds that it wouldn't be. It wouldn't feel the same. It's almost like opening a book and then, like, writing in it. Like, the book's done. I don't want to, like, scribble on it, you know, it's like our story, our relationship with that franchise was so personal, and it so wasn't about the end product. It was like our bond and our. Our relationship and our closeness and our forming. Like, we grew up together, you know? So to go back there but have it be with one of us not, it's just. We're not gonna do that. Like, I. It's not gonna happen, you know?

[B]

We'll be right back after the break. You guys know I've always been a low maintenance makeup person. Like, I was, like, doing the no makeup makeup before anyone was in. No way I was doing no makeup. Like, not no makeup makeup. Just no makeup. And then when I was like, okay, girl, I got to put something on your face, I really looked for, like, the best brands clean. And I remember when Merit came out, I was so excited, and it delivered. The whole thing about merit is that it's minimal, it's easy, and they have everyday products that make you look put together in, like, five minutes, which is what I need in my life. One of my favorite products of merit is their complexion stick. Like, quick coverage. They kind of call it something between a foundation and a concealer, but neither, but also both. I'm also obsessed with their blushes. Just love their blushes. It melts in and makes you look alive. A little cold and alive. Like, if you're looking for makeup that feels elevated but effortless, Merit is it. It's the clean girl. It's the minimalist girl, and they're the proof that less is more. I also love their great skin serum, which I love putting on for a no makeup day, but also underneath makeup. And it really hydrates, plumps, and just makes you look fresh and dewy. Right now, Merit Beauty is offering my listeners their signature makeup bag. With your first [e-mail] you need a merit signature makeup bag. Okay. I have a few, and you should be jealous. It's meritbeauty.com M E R I-t beauty.com and you can get your first free signature makeup bag with your first order. That's meritbeauty.com be sure to check out the minimalistic and their flush bomb blushes. This is so important to me because, as you guys know, Leo, my dog, is super important to me. I might not show him that much at all, and it's kind of sad. He's 13, and my new way to show him love is through food. My husband is so emotional about it. He thinks it's beautiful, but it's really true. Like, he's getting older. He was eating, like, the same hard food every day.

[A]

And.

[B]

And then I discovered Ali, which is an amazing pet food brand that they make amazing meals for pets with the highest quality ingredients, Literally. Ali has fresh recipes. They're developed by real chefs, backed by vet nutritionists. Like, this is like the real stuff. Okay. Now that he has Ali, like, I give him his breakfast in the morning and then his dinner at night, and it's just so nice. And it's so nice. And we're just all so happy about it, and especially because we were so fearful of a sensitive gut. And I'm telling you, and like, accidents and stuff, it was a seamless transition. They have amazing fresh recipes, like I said, developed by real chefs, backed by vet nutritionist. Leo loves the turkey and the chicken. He's just so happy and he's obsessed with the food, and I highly, highly recommend it. Get ready for both you and your pup to be obsessed. Head to ollie.com not skinny and tell them all about your dog. And you can use my code not skinny and get 60% off your welcome kit when you subscribe. So again, you guys, ollie.com not skinny, you fill out a thing about your dog. Use code not skinny. Plus they have an obsession. Guarantee if you're not obsessed, you'll get your money back. Okay, so that's O L L I e.com/not skinny. Enter code not skinny to get 60 off your first box. Ali, feed the obsession. I am such a sweet tooth kind of a gal, and I am always trying to eat healthy and not eat a lot of sugar and carbs and whatever your girl gotta look out. And unreal snacks have been such a huge part of my journey. Okay, Obsessed. The dark chocolate coconut bars. I keep them in my fridge or in my freezer. You're welcome. The dark chocolate peanut butter cups and the dark chocolate caramel peanut nougat bars, which literally are snickers. Like, are you okay? Unreal is so unreal. Okay. Literally the taste isn't compromised and they are better for you. They are way less sugar, simple ingredients, no artificial anything. You don't have to feel bad about eating it. Okay? Listen, my mom used to call me Cookie Monster. Like I'm a candy girl, okay? And I'm all about the nostalgia, nostalgic candies. And Unreal is all about reinventing nostalgic chocolate classics with only good stuff. Like I said, they use simple ingredients, way less sugar, and just craveable, mind blowing snacks that just taste amazing. Made from real ingredients and not overly processed sugar. I love making a nice cup of tea at night, getting my little unreal coconut bar or peanut butter cup. And I don't feel bad for a second because I'm a vision of health. You can find Unreal products anywhere. Cravings hit, including at Whole Foods, Target, Costco and other grocery stores. As a special offer for my listeners, visit unrealsnacks.com not skinny and you'll get $2 off a bag of Unreal. Terms and conditions apply. You guys, I've been trying to limit the amount of like traditional soda that I drink just because obviously it's not the best for you. And I do. I am good at drinking water, I really am, but I just feel like I'm such a, like, soda with a meal slash in between meals kind of gal. So switching to Olipop for many of those times that I want a soda has been life changing because Olipop is the better for you soda. If you are not aware, it not only has low sugar and high fiber, it also has a unique blend to support your digestive system. And I'm like, okay, thank you. Because you know, I'm all about gut health, which we should all be. So in every can of this, you got fiber, you got low sugar, and you got ingredients that you can pronounce. The better for you soda. I also love that they make like really nostalgic flavors. This is cream soda. I love it. What I also love is that they don't compromise on the taste. Like all that good ingredients, all that low sugar, low sugar, lack of sugar, and like every sip and you're like transported back into your childhood. So flavorful. It's like, how do they even do it? I'm like, how do you do it? So much flavor, so little sugar. Like, I don't get it. And it really just helped my soda cravings so much. And it also feels so chic. Like every time someone comes over, I'm like, would you like a water and Ollipop? Like, it's just a chic thing to have in your home because you know that even the health girlies will love it. Anyway, Olipop is offering a really cool promo right now, which is you can buy any two cans of Olipop in store and get one of them for free. Yep, it's like a buy one, get one free with Olipop. So what you do is go to drinkolipop.com not skinny, and they'll tell you how to go about this. Obviously, Olipop is available on Amazon and at their website, drinkolipop.com however, if you go into the store and you buy any two flavors, you're gonna get paid back for one of them. When you go to drinkalipop.com notskinny and like I said, it's available at, like, every major retailer, like Walmart, Target, Costco, Whole Foods. Cheers. And we're back. Are you still close with Sophia?

[A]

We really don't see each other very much. Like, she's working so hard.

[B]

She's working. Yeah, she's. She's doing a ton of stuff.

[A]

She's booked and busy. She's always working. But she also, like, you know, we were. We were like, friends, but we were never, like, none of us all. We all had individual relationships. Like, we would all hang out together after shooting, and together. Like, we would be at dinners and go out and hang out, the four of us. But, like, Boo and I didn't even get close until after we were done shooting. Like, I didn't see Boo one on one forever in filming and neither Sophia. Like, I would hang out with Cam one on one once in a while, but, like, it was really about the four of us, you know? So the fact that Boo and I have remained like, bestie besties has more to do with the fact that, like, we did that final press run together, and then we were like, wait, have we always been best bros? And then we just, like, never stopped. But Sophia's always off. She's doing movies. She's busy.

[B]

And you turned 30, like, a couple months ago now.

[A]

Yeah, January.

[B]

How was that for you? Because I remember. I remember my dart. 30, for some reason is like an age that a lot of people are scared to turn because you're like, my 20s are over. Like, how did you feel?

[A]

Weirdly, I didn't care at all. Like, I was sort of worried about that too, because everyone kept being like, watch out. Yeah, you reminded me, Ernie. And I was like. And I was like, oh, shit. Like, maybe I should be fucking worried. And then I just. It, like, came and went. Like, I Just didn't care.

[B]

Did you do, like, a big party? Did you, like, celebrate?

[A]

Yeah, I did. Like, I had. I wasn't gonna. I wasn't gonna. And then my friends were like, you're so dumb. This is your 30th birthday. You want to look back and have done something. And I was like, but it's too late to plan, and I hate celebrating myself and whatever. And then, like, literally the day before the party that I ended up throwing, I was like, fudge. They're right. So I, like, rallied the troops, and I was like, who's in town? You want to come over tomorrow? And I just got.

[B]

So you throw. You threw yourself a bash?

[A]

Yeah, like an impromptu.

[B]

Oh, I'm just letting anyone call it a dirty 30.

[A]

No, I was a slumber party.

[B]

Oh, cute.

[A]

I just got everyone pajamas and wigs, and I was like, don't wear anything cute and don't do your hair, because that will be supplied.

[B]

That's like. Your hangout vibe is like, yeah, silly. Silly.

[A]

Chilling. Playing games, watching movies, eating. Eating snacks.

[B]

Like, you don't love going out.

[A]

Would rather die.

[B]

What? Hate it. Hate it.

[A]

I mean, it depends because, like, in. In, like. Like, with my partner, like, in Rome, there's, like, one restaurant that we always go to because he's, like. He gets recognized everywhere he goes. So we have, like, a friend's restaurant that we always go to. That's a really good time because it's, like, small. We know everyone. It's nice to be out in the world every once in a while. Like, I mean. And I mean, like, once every three, four, five, six months, I'll end up at a club somewhere because it's like. Well, that happened when we were on tour with his people a lot, because it would just be like, we're in a new city, and, like, someone booked a room in a club, and it was like, all right. Like, are we awake enough to go? You know, so. So, like, sometimes. But it's really nothing I'm ever gonna choose for myself.

[B]

Let's talk about your fiance.

[A]

My fiance?

[B]

Because when you sat down right before the interview, I'm assuming you were recording a voice note to him. Yeah, that we. I felt like I should be doing something else because I felt like I was listening in on, like, such an intimate moment. But you, like, recorded him. A whole sweet thing. You're like, I'm starting a podcast. I'm not gonna be able to answer for an hour. I love you so much. I miss you. It was so sweet. You're so in Love.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah. We are so in love. It's just like.

[B]

You're like, yuck.

[A]

No, no, it's like. It's just because it's like. It's kind of like, you know, it's funny that we are. It's, like, embarrassing. I'm like, okay, I'll be back in an hour.

[B]

You hang up first. So that.

[A]

Dude, it's so that. But it's when we. Because he's not. He's obviously not here right now with me. He's back in Rome.

[B]

He's Italian, guys. If you don't know, he's Italian.

[A]

And he had to go back and I had to stay. And so, like, when we're apart for a week, it's, like, awful. And so we just, like, you know, we keep each other updated on our day. We're sending endless voice notes, texts, whatever, because it's like, that's what you got to do. We're not like. At the end of the day, how was your day? Like, that would drive us insane. So we're.

[B]

You just keep each other posted. That's. That's so refreshing. Because I feel like with, like, Hollywood relationships, a lot of times, like. Like normies, we don't know how to picture it. Oh, you know, we're like, they're shooting over there. They're over there. Do they even see each other?

[A]

Do they.

[B]

You know, and now it's like, true.

[A]

I. I even do that with people. I'm like, but you're doing so many movies. How are you seeing each other?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And it's like, no, you're literally keeping him up to date of, like, I'm going, and I won't be able to answer my phone for an hour.

[A]

Yeah. It's also. It's also because, like, to be honest, like, we're not usually apart. Like, we spend. We live together. We spend all of our time together. So then when we are apart, it's especially like, you know, like, you got. You got ripped apart. It's.

[B]

Does it do good for the relationship A little bit. Do you think? Like, do you see that? No. Need it. You don't need it.

[A]

We're so chilled and compatible.

[B]

How did you meet?

[A]

VMAs.

[B]

The VMAs.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

When you won.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You won that year.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But.

[A]

But there's. There's confusion about this because that is technically when we, like, nice to meet you. We didn't even shake hand. We were just like, hey, technically, that's the first time that, like, we said anything to each other, but Then we didn't, like, meet again until a year later when, like, the world was entirely different and changed and. And he was. Everybody was single and all that. So that's when.

[B]

Oh, you weren't single then?

[A]

He wasn't.

[B]

Oh, he was in a single.

[A]

But I didn't know anything. I didn't know that.

[B]

Okay, so that's why you're. Okay. So you met. Shake hands. A year later, you meet again.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Where?

[A]

The amaze.

[B]

Oh, the VMAs again.

[A]

When I say. When I say, like, we met at the VMAs, I'm not talking about that first time because we literally didn't even register each other that first time. Like, it's the same amount that I met, like, anyone else that night. You know, like, in passing. Like, I guess I. Technically, that was the first time I met that person.

[B]

Right.

[A]

But we didn't meet in the way. That was like, we're going to date until VMAs 20. 23 3. Because, like, why else would we be in the same room? Honestly, like, he's.

[B]

Aside from the VMAs.

[A]

Yeah, because he's living in Rome and I'm living in New York and la and, like.

[B]

So you. Did you know the music? Were you.

[A]

I did, yeah, I did. Well, I did. Only after I saw them perform at, like, the iHeartradio Music Awards. And I was like, whoa, these. These guys are so cool. And I went home and, like, downloaded, like, honestly, I'm not. I'm not gonna lie, I downloaded, like, their two most streams, right? Because I wasn't doing a deep dive. I wasn't like, I'm gonna listen to every. I was just like, oh, these songs are cool. And then I, like, went about my life.

[B]

But. So you. When you met him at the VMAs the second time, was it like, love at first sight vibes or second sight?

[A]

You know, the funny thing was we had worked on a collab without seeing each other in that time because I think his manager sent it to my A R. And then he DM'd me and was like, can't wait to work on this with you. And I was like, what the fuck is this guy talking about? Like, I don't know you what song? Like, he was like, can't wait to hear you on the song. And I was like, excuse me? Like, I did you DM the wrong person? Like, that's what I thought. And so then I messaged my A and R Rainey, and I was like, hey, what the fuck is this guy saying? Like, what song? And she was like, oh, yeah, Maneskin wants to do a song with you. I was like, oh, cool. They're cool. I remember liking them. And so I went in and recorded. I went in and rewrote some stuff and recorded my half. And he had already done his half in Rome. So by the time we saw each other at the VMAs again, he had a reason to be like, hey.

[B]

Oh, because you collaborate.

[A]

Because we collapsed.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And we hadn't seen each other. And so he was like, hey, like, you sound great. And I was like, thanks. Like, can't wait to perform it with you, like, if you end up using it in your set. Right? And he was like, we. We're doing our world tour. Like, do you want to come to the show at msg? And I was like, yeah. Like, why not? And then. But then there was like a sort of like a. I kept looking. We got in the car and I looked at my friends, and I was like, was he hitting on. And they were like, I think, very obviously. And I was like, really? Because I felt like he, like, wasn't looking me in the eye, like. And so then, like, I was confused about what the night was. I was like, did he ask me out? Like, he just asked me to concert. Yeah. So I was like. And I also wasn't dating anyone. Like, I was super, like, I don't want to do that. I'm not interested in anyone. Like, I would just started dating. I started sort of, like, casually thinking about talking to this girl and like, then that. Then I met Damiano, and that was like, kind of like a freight train.

[B]

So you get to the concert alone or did you get a plus one? Or did you. Were you backstage when you came to.

[A]

Backstage? No, no, we were just in, like, the section of people that was, like, you know, guests, I guess.

[B]

So you came in not knowing, like, if this is a day, if this is.

[A]

Well, it definitely wasn't a date.

[B]

Right.

[A]

It was a concert. But I came in not knowing if what.

[B]

Like, what the intentions were.

[A]

I honestly was like, maybe he's naturally flirtatious. Like, I also just was. I'm so blind to that shit. Like, I'm so. Like. Cause I'm. I'm either. Like, I'm. I'm either the person who is doing the flirting. Like, I'm either asking you out, or I'm, like, deciphering and being like, I don't know what that was. Yeah, so I'm the move maker, so. And he was shy.

[B]

Oh, you're the Move maker, usually.

[A]

Oh, yeah, definitely.

[B]

Really well.

[A]

And this was the first time that I wasn't, like, he was really doing the move making.

[B]

So what? So that night, you go to the show, it ends.

[A]

They. Yeah, they had me backstage. The whole band invited me backstage, and they, like, were popping champagne because they just played msg and it was, like, so beautiful. And I was just, like, fly on the wall for this thing. They were celebrating. It was super cute. I was with my friend Matt, Shout out to Matt Bernstein, and we were hanging out, and I was looking at Matt like, what am I doing? Like, am I supposed to be here? Like, this is so. I can't tell what this is. And then I was like. I just went up to him because he was the one who invited me. And I was like, hey, like, I'm going to head out. Like, you guys did amazing. And he was like, no. Like, please, I would like it if you came to the after party. And I was like, okay, so, like, you're hitting on me. I was like, I think you're hitting on me because we keep, like, it keeps extending. Yeah. And then, like, I won't go into the rest of it, but, like, you've

[B]

been together ever since.

[A]

Been together ever since.

[B]

And so it's been three years.

[A]

No, two and a half. Two and a half, yeah.

[B]

And he proposed.

[A]

And he proposed.

[B]

How long has it been since the proposal?

[A]

Well, he proposed in October, and then it.

[B]

I read that you didn't want it to come out, and then it came out.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. We were gonna keep it to ourselves.

[B]

Really?

[A]

Yeah, yeah. But then. I'm not joking. It was like something out of a movie. The. The paparazzo. Which is the correct term for a singular paparazzi, by the way. Paparazzo.

[B]

Okay. Oh, now I know.

[A]

Yeah. So I thought that the other day and someone was like, are you drunk? I was like, no, no. That's what we're saying. But the paparazzo who was in Australia when we landed, he's, like, the one guy, and he happened to get us, like, the one time we went out with the ring, because also, the ring was, like, too big. And I had, like, that ring extender from, like, Michael's. So I, like, had it on my hand, and I. And we were gonna go to lunch with our friends, and I was wearing it literally, just to go show our friends. Like, he did it. It happened. We're engaged, and the guy got us from, like, blocks away. Blocks away.

[B]

And so can you. Like, the prep. Somebody bought it, right? That's how it works. The paparazzo sells the picture to media, but then media don't. They have to confirm it.

[A]

I just looked at my publicist who just put her phone down in stress because.

[B]

Oh, there's a thing there.

[A]

No, it's not a thing. It was just this funny thing where, like, we were trying our hardest to keep it to ourselves because I had people who were very important to me texting me in my life being like,

[B]

why am I finding out about this?

[A]

Yeah, we didn't tell anyone yet because also we were in Australia. So it was the worst case scenario because we were on an opposite time zone. So, like, and we got on the plane, like, within. We left to get to the plane like an hour or two after he proposed. So, like, we didn't. We had to finish packing. We didn't time to call anyone. And then we get to Australia and, like, everybody's in the opposite time zone. So we called obviously, like, our, you know, immediate family, like mom and. And parents.

[B]

Wait, so it came out. That happened even before you had time to do that? It was that.

[A]

Well, it came out a few days after it got. It got taken. But the tour was so intense that it was like, any time that we had a free time to call someone, it was like three in the morning for them. Do you know what I mean?

[B]

Yeah, yeah.

[A]

I don't want to say that over text.

[B]

Right.

[A]

And like, it was just. It was just. Because also Australia was either right before Japan or right after Japan. It was, like, coupled together in his tour. And so, like, the time zones were just fucked. So. So we were pretty pissed when that came out. And then everybody was yet calling Jamie, my best friend Jamie. And she was like, I don't know what you want me to say. Like, she was like, we're gonna have to, like, confirm. It's like, pretty obvious. And I was like, just do your best, please, to. To not confirm, because it was obvious, but we just. We weren't ready to make the announcement. We wanted to make it on our own timeline. So there were like a couple months where it was like, basically everybody knew, but we were pretending that they didn't.

[B]

And was it a surprise, the proposal?

[A]

Kind of yes and no. Like, I knew it was coming. I knew it was coming, but I didn't know when. So, like, the way he did it surprised me, I guess.

[B]

So you're ready. You're ready for the. The married life?

[A]

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. I think when you find your person, like. Because I wasn't sure I was gonna get married, honestly, Like, I. You know, your. Your. Your experience of love changes as you get older. Because there were people that I probably felt I wanted to marry at the time that I was with them. But then I got older and I was like, oh, I didn't know what I was talking about. Like, that's not someone that you can marry. Or that's. That situation was not love even, or that was unhealthy or whatever. So, yes, I'm very aware that I was saying things about, like, I.

[B]

You were engaged when you were, like, 20. No. Is that not real? Kind of. Kind of engaged? Like, pretend engaged?

[A]

No, no, we were. We were engaged. He got down on one knee and he proposed.

[B]

But now that you feel what a real engagement is, you're like, that was.

[A]

I'm not gonna go into that honestly. Like, he was not. It was not. It was real. It was real. Yeah, but we were never gonna get married. Yeah, no, we were never.

[B]

But you sound like. Have you always been a romantic?

[A]

Definitely. Yeah, definitely. But I also, like. I also am, like, deeply traumatized. So I. I am, like, I'm, like a hopeful romantic, not hopeless. Like, I'm. I'm. I love love. I love other people's love. Oh, my God. I'm constantly clapping on the sidelines for everybody else.

[B]

Love, love, love, love.

[A]

I love love. I love hearing about it. I love watching it. I love, like, real authentic connection. Like, I see people holding hands and kissing on the street, and I'm like, no. Is pressed to the window. Like, I love it. I don't understand how you couldn't feel that way.

[B]

Are you spending a lot of time in. In Rome now? Like, are you going back and forth?

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, I mean, I guess it's relative to, like, I spend. I spend a lot of time in New York and la. More time in New York this year than I was last year. But, like, I have a place in both New York and la, so it.

[B]

That's so fun. You're in New York. How did that. Yeah, how did that happen? Like, is it because he's in. He's Rome. You're la. So is New York just. You like to hang out here or.

[A]

Well, we have a place in la, so. So we live together in la. That. So now I guess we are la. He has a place in Rome, obviously. And I have a. I have my place in New York. I had my place in New York. I moved to New York in, like, 2021. Oh, yeah, 2021. And then I moved to the place I'm at now. So this is my second New York place.

[B]

Was it for work then? Or were you just like, feeling a change?

[A]

It's just my favorite city.

[B]

Oh, yeah.

[A]

It's just like I land here and I'm like, ah, I'm home. Like this city. Like, what's that line from Sex and the City? Where at the end, like, it's. It's during like the week where all of the.

[B]

The sailors.

[A]

The sailors come in and then at the end of the episode, she goes. Because nobody talks about my boyfriend.

[B]

Nobody talks about.

[A]

Because New York is like. It feels like I personify it so much. It's my. My friend, it's my person, it's my parents, it's my. I don't know, I just.

[B]

I love that you love New York.

[A]

My God, it's the best. I honestly think is the best city on the planet.

[B]

I know. I feel like people that live in la, like, always love New York, but they just maybe couldn't see themselves here, like, full time.

[A]

It's harder. I mean, it's hard. It's. They're both hard in different ways. But like, New York is just like a lot like, it's, it's. To me, it matches the stimuli in my brain. So, like, I'm always like at a 10 in my brain. And so New York being at a 10.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Makes me kind of balance out.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

You know, whereas, like, LA is so quiet, so all I hear.

[B]

Oh, my God. I feel like that really makes sense to me and it's probably why I couldn't live in la.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Like, you feel crazy and everything's like, quiet and everyone's too chilled out and wow.

[A]

Too relaxed.

[B]

Like, it work. You're. You're right. Like, I walk down the street here and like sirens and like, noise and it doesn't. I don't flinch.

[A]

Honey, that's a sound machine. Yeah, I'm asleep. I'm asleep. You're like, ah, someone's like screaming down below at somebody. And I'm like, oh, good night, guys. Like, I'm just fucking. I love New York. I love also, like, the amount of times that since I moved here, it's been like I'm doing one thing and someone. Either I see someone in person that goes, oh, we're going here next, and then I'm going there and it's like an art gallery. It's an opening, it's a. Oh, we're going to the opening night of this thing. Like, when I'm in New York, I am moving. My social life is bustling.

[B]

It's healthy, it's happening.

[A]

I'm doing stuff every day. The time goes by fast. I'm tired at night. It's life.

[B]

Does Damiano like it here?

[A]

Not as much as la. He prefers la. He prefers LA because he likes the quiet, which, like. Fair enough.

[B]

Yeah. I had to just tell you this because when I was, you know, doing some research on you and reading up, I came across your mom's blog.

[A]

My mom still has a blog?

[B]

Well, it's still there.

[A]

Okay. I was like, it's over.

[B]

Yeah. And it's called Hometown to Hollywood.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

That's so cute.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And what she wrote in it, it, like, made me emotional, you know, because I, you know, even me, to me, I look back at, like, you know, how I started this or, like, where I came. You know what I mean? And how much I wanted something. And here you are now. Like, I love those. Kind of how you look back and kind of appreciate that. So when your mom, I think it was like the. 10 years ago, she wrote like a 10 year thing about. I guess it was 10 years when. When. When this post happened. So, yeah, she wrote this thing that was, like, about moving to LA. You were 14. You brought a resume. It was a long shot. She wrote, what is easy in the moment is often hardest over time. I couldn't bear to look back someday and ask, what if I was okay with trying and failing? It was just so moving. Had it been easy? Of course not. Had been worth it Without a moment's hesitation. Yes. Dove is now 24, and the adventure continues. She lives about 15 minutes away. I'm doing work that's aligned with my purpose and sharing a beautiful home. You know, it was just like, I loved it so much that I came across this.

[A]

That's so cute. You're gonna make me cry. I'm about to text my mom right

[B]

now because, you know, like, I. One of the questions I would have asked you if I didn't come across this and get the answer is like, how much your mom supported you in. In your career and in your desire to do this. And just, like, reading that, I'm like, okay. She believed in you.

[A]

Oh, my God, dude. Like, we were. We were flat broke. Like, I'm talking, like, we were keeping track of how much gas we were spending on the way to the audition and me being like, I'm gonna pay you back one day. Like, you know, it was really on a hope and a prayer and a dream. It was. It was really, really. Because also my parents had had a company, but my dad decided to buy her out. Like, he was like, I'm gonna, I'm gonna own this company. And the company wasn't doing well either. So, like, there was no money. We, like, drove from Los Angeles and like, brought the. Her, like, little car that she had at the time, broken down, old little car. And I remember her saying something to me, like, we have this much money for this many months of rent. If you don't book anything in that time, like, we might have to go back, but if we don't, like, I will be, we will be living in our car to make this happen for you.

[B]

And, and it happened for you, dude.

[A]

It's like, I really, I really, like, I really have, I mean, like, my whole career. I have my mom to thank for because she was so selfless in that time. And, and she was not a stage parent. That's the other thing. Like, my mom couldn't give a. What I was doing. She was proud of everything I was doing, but she was like, if I wanted to be doing anything else, like, if I wanted to be studying archaeology, if I wanted to become a school teacher, if I wanted to be, you

[B]

know, she just supported you.

[A]

Anything, anything, anything. And so the fact that I was so hell bent on this and she was so, like, all right, like, clearly you're never gonna stop talking about this. So, like, let's see, let's see. And just the fact that it worked out is like, I don't know, it's like, it's weirdly a retrospective relief for that belief that she had. Like, it's like, I would have felt so terrible if I, like, had this, you know, these delusions of grandeur of like, I can do it, I can make it happen. And then she sacrificed, like, you know, two years of her life to try to make this happen for me. Three years, you know, And I had a very special moment the other day actually, because I, I booked something that I was so excited to book because I, you know, I don't know when this project is happening and I can't say anything about it. And it's like, not slated for any time. So it could be six months from now, a year from now, two years from now. But there's. There's a project that I am attached to that is working with someone that I like was on my bucket list. Yeah, no, he's also on my bucket left. Would also elicit the same reaction for me. That tells you how much I was excited about this. And when I got that call that I had booked it, I I had this, like, very childlike reaction where I was like, I need to call my mom. And I was like, mom, like, this is only made possible because of everything you did. Yeah. Because of your sacrifices. And, like, almost like we did it. Even though she. Again, like, I do not want to paint a picture of my mom pushing for this, you know, this life for me, because she didn't. She actually fought it sometimes. Like, she was like, are you sure? And so the fact that, you know, she believed me when I said, I believe in me, and then now we're here is like, it's really moving.

[B]

It's so special. That is so special. No, I love that. I think obviously parent support is so important.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But this is on a different scale of like. No, it's not only support. It's actually do move. Like, it's really believing in your kid.

[A]

Yeah. And it's a risk. It's a huge risk.

[B]

And letting them follow their dreams, which obviously paid off. You know what is so interesting about you and the duality is, like, you having an aura ring doesn't track for me.

[A]

Really. I'm a Capricorn.

[B]

Okay, girl.

[A]

What I'm all about.

[B]

You need this data. No, I love the, like, tattoos, the snake, whatever, and, like, the aura. She needs to know. She needs to know what's going on.

[A]

You know what it is? It's more for me about my sleep.

[B]

Huh.

[A]

Because I am such a bad sleeper that, like, if I look and I'm like, I'm tired, I will wake up every morning tired. So if I see on my phone that it says, like, no, you actually slept well, grow up. I'm like, okay.

[B]

It keeps you in check.

[A]

Yeah. Because every morning I wake up being like, I'm so tired. I can't do this. Like, whatever it is.

[B]

It's like nine hours and it's like, not even.

[A]

I'll never get that much sleep. But it. But it is like. Like, it'll be like, you slept for seven hours. There was no movement. You had great amount of deep sleep. I'm like, okay, so I literally need to get over. Also, I do, like, I like the idea of getting 10,000 steps a day, you know?

[B]

And do you get them in la?

[A]

Not in la. I have to go walk. I've never been a treadmill person because I'm doing strength training. I've been doing strength training, which is, by the way, life changing. But I will start my workout now with just 20 minutes walking uphill to just to get like 2500 steps or something.

[B]

Yeah. Get something in there.

[A]

Something in there.

[B]

So what are we manifesting next? You have music, by the way, boyfriend love your music. Your music is so good. Your voice is so incredible.

[A]

Thanks, dude.

[B]

What. What do you. Where are you at, like this project? We don't know what it is.

[A]

What are the goals I am manifesting because my album is so close to being exactly what I want it to be. So like perfect by my own definition, you know. And I am manifesting that I feel that magical, like it's done feeling in the very, very, very near future. That's not what I'm waiting on, by the way. I'm waiting on a bunch of other like, technical stuff to release it. So I actually have the time to do that. So I'm not holding anything up because I know everybody's gonna be like, just be done with it. Yeah, I actually could be done with it today, but because I have extra time, I'm playing, I'm manifesting that. I'm manifesting, you know, good health and good well being for all the people that I love and know, manifesting a better political climate, manifesting free health care for all, mental health care included. And, you know, general balance in my life, you know, health and dreams coming true. I get. I try not to aim for anything specific.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I guess I'm realizing in this moment, like. Yeah, I've always found that the best things in my career, in my life have been great surprises.

[B]

Yes. Like, you never know what's an email away. You know what I mean? Refreshing that you never know.

[A]

Say that so many times. Like this show, 56 days, actually, I was doing a photo shoot, I was doing a Cosmo cover shoot. And I was in New York for something else, I think the Met gala. So it was like a chaotic week.

[B]

No big deal.

[A]

But it was like, I'm saying that for context of like, it was not about. I was in no means auditioning, booking, anything. Like there was all this chaos going around and I was not, I was not present to like anything, you know, admin related. And my manager called me randomly and was like, you just got this insane offer for like a straight to green light series Amazon show where you're the lead. And I was like. And it's always stuff like that.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Like, it's always something where I'm like bopping around. It's always also like when I'm like, I want to do this and I'm acting out of like, I've heard that

[B]

before, that it doesn't happen.

[A]

I mean, it's. It's the same theory that when you're looking for love, you can't find it.

[B]

Yeah, yeah.

[A]

It's like if you're coming from a place of lacking or like desperation, which I've done it. Been there, I've done it. When it comes to like all kinds of different things, I've been like, I just want this. I want this thing or I want this to go this way. It never happens. It's always when you're like open palmed and like, I'm good how I am in my life right now and like, if everything went away today, it would be fine.

[B]

And Right. When you're content. Yeah.

[A]

When you're just like in the moment, when you're present and then randomly.

[B]

So that's how you got it. Well, I love that.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Piece of knowledge.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. There was other things involved as well, but that was essentially what happened. Yeah, yeah.

[B]

No, I love that. And it's so good. It's. I'm dying to see how it ends now. Like, again, I'm an episode to eight episodes, right?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Does it come out all at once?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Okay. So it's a binge worthy show. It's hot. It has the thriller vibes that we love. I'm such a thriller girl. Tough. You're just a beautiful person inside out. Thank you so much for coming.

[A]

Thank you, Everybody.

[B]

Go watch 56 Days. It's on Amazon Prime.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And we're going to wait for that album. We're going to reread you. You know how everyone comes at RIRI and it's like, drama. What are you doing? Stop raising babies.

[A]

We live for people protesting outside of my record label's office with this huge sign as though they can like just press a button and drop it. Yeah, like, I live for that. Do it.

[B]

Come out with it already. Thank you guys so much for listening to this episode of Knott's Kenny, but not follow me on Instagram at Not skinny, but not fat. Subscribe to the podcast so you don't miss any episodes. Rate the podcast that you love so much on Apple Podcasts and write a little review. If you tell me you did, I'll give you a big virtual smoocharoo. Thank you guys so much for listening and I'll see you next Tuesday.

[A]

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