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Not Skinny But Not Fat
LOVE IS BLIND'S LAUREN O'BRIEN ON DAVE, HIS SISTER, AND FEELING SLUT SHAMED
01:10:23
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- [00:00]
Amanda Hirsch
The following podcast is a Dear Media production.
- [00:03]
Lauren O'Brien
Welcome back to the Not Skinny But Not Fat podcast. I'm your host, Amanda Hirsch, and I still can't believe that I get to chat with some of my favorite stars on my very own podcast, where you'll feel like you're just talking shit with your best friends in your living room. Hi. Last week was a whirlwind of a week. I. I needed this. I needed this. You know when you're just, like, feeling down and you need something? Like, you need an exciting offer, you need a cool email, you need a surprising phone call? Okay, that's a lie. When is a phone call, like, an unsolicited phone call ever exciting? I was just, like, down and out. I was feeling. Was feeling. I needed to win. I needed a win. Sometimes you need. You need. You need a little boost. And it came. It came in the form of a let. Okay? In the form of a letter. I was in my bedroom, I believe, and my husband had just brought, like, the. The packages and. And the mail up, and he was like. He was like, I think you got a letter. Like, and he gives it to me, and I. And I see it, and I see, like, an M on it or whatever, and I. And I'm just like, did it come with anything? Like, was it in a box? Like, did it come with a gift? Like, is it an influencer package? Like, what. What is this? No, it's just, like, this letter here. I open it. I don't know what it says. Ripped it. Ripped it. Ripped it open. To be fair, I would have ripped it more aggressively because I'm more aggressive than. Than husband, so let's forgive him. But I was like, what? Like, okay. And I'm, like, reading it, and I'm literally shocked I could read it because I suck at reading script, but. But I. But I read it, and. And. And. And. And I was like, wait, wait, what? And I thought it was, like, a joke, because a lot of the time not a joke, but, like, I thought it maybe was, like, part of some PR thing, because a lot of the time when you get pr, let's say, like, from Poosh, it'll say, like, love, Courtney. And you're not. You can't be sure Courtney wrote it, or Paris Hilton does a fucking collab with, like, Walmart. And it's like, thought you would enjoy my pans, Paris. And it's like, paris doesn't even know this deal is happening. This. That kind of situation. Dear Amanda, I heard you were feeling scared. Don't be this is the best part. Let's enjoy it. As ever, Meg. And which I does it say, Meg? It's like the signature dated March 2025. The most beautiful handwriting you've ever seen in your life. I'm reading it. I'm reading it over. I'm like, what? Then I see the crown on the m little monogram, and I'm like, this is Meghan fucking Markle. Excuse me, Sussex. And it started all clicking. I was like, what is this? And then I was like, wait. I posted. When the trailer for With Love Megan came out, I posted that I am scared for Megan. I posted that I'm scared because we know how people fucking hate on her. And the trailer for the cooking show was giving. It is possible for people to make fun of this, which they did end up doing. They did end up saying, you know, she put. Puts the pretzels and bags and whatever. And that's what I was fearful of. And I even remember many of the comments after me saying, like, I'm worried for Megan. I'm scared you're gonna come for her. A lot of people were coming for me being like, why are you bringing negativity? Like, she used to do this. She did the tig. This is upper alley. And I remember even being happy and posting like, oh, my God, I'm so happy. Like, look at all these stands. Maybe I'm wrong. Look, people are coming for her at her defense and saying, like, why are you worried? And even coming for me where I wasn't. Like, I might have had, like, a little snark, but it was mainly like, no, I'm actually scared for her. This looks like another thing people can destroy. Fast forward to Fast forward. Fast forward to Tuesday. Tuesday to Tuesday to Wednesday. When I get this letter. I put two and two together. You're welcome, my smart brain. And I say, oh, my God. She's referencing the video that I made about her thing. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. I wasn't even taking it as snark at the beginning. Then the Internet, once I posted, it was like, oh, my God, she's being snarky. She's having humor. I literally took it as like, oh, babe, don't be scared. Which, honestly, I could see Meghan Markle doing. Because, like, that's her vibe. Like, I don't know that snark. And, like, that kind of thing is her vibe, which I would love for her. And I'm so happy people are taking it as that and loving her for that. But I have a strong feeling. It was like, she thought I was scared. And she's like, don't be scared, my love. Like, that's how I'm taking it. I don't know. I wonder. I feel like I should do a poll anyway. Obviously, this is a huge fucking deal. I then really did my. Tried to, like, get myself connected to people who might know what is going on, and I did. And it was verified to me that the letter was indeed written by Megan and that she. It was her idea. When she heard about this video, she was told about this video or sent this video, and she was like, oh. She said, like, oh, that's so kind. She's scared. Like, I swear to God, you guys. She was like, that's so kind. She's scared. And. And I should send her a note. Like, she wanted to send the note. She sent the fudgeing note. This is fudgeing real life. I don't think I'm getting it yet. It's one of those things where, like, I'm getting it, but I'm not getting it. Like, I'm excited, but I don't think I get the. Like, she literally had the idea to write this note, wrote the note. I now have a note for Meghan Markle. Like, that's crazy. She would yell at me. Oh, my God. Megan Sussex. A very exciting day for me. It obviously blew the up, like, because everything she does, like, blows the up. You know, different outlets took it differently. Some were like, she was snarking at the amazing, beautiful, talented Georgina podcaster Amanda Hirsch. Not bad. Some were, like, taking it like, she has just a sense of humor, you know? Either way, I feel like a sense of humor has to play into this, right? Because it. Or maybe not. Or if she's literally taking it at face value and is like, oh, she's scared. I'm going to tell her not to be scared. Like, I don't know. I don't know. From what I'm understanding, that's the vibe. Okay? If there's snark, I still fudgeing. Love it. If there is, like, humor, I love it. If she's, you know, I. I would love anything. I honestly love anything. And I love that she even did this. And I feel like it does lean into, like, her whole brand of writing notes and spreading flowers and sprinkling flowers and tagging the pretzels. Like, it all works into this. But it, I will say, very, very thoughtful. Right? It's like a thoughtful thing, which, again, is, like, her. Her brand. But again, Megan, like, I want the jam. I want you to come on the pod. Like, let's take this relationship to the next. Anyway, let me calm down. Let me calm down, let me calm down. It was a big, exciting week for me on today's pod. We're moving right along, you guys. We're moving right along. So this season of love is blind. You know, there's a lot to say about the season. A lot to say about Minneapolis, lots to say about the dudes, lots to say about it all. At least we got one couple, right? I feel like it's nice. Like we got a couple. Like thank the love is blind gods. Like, thank the Vanessa and Nick Lachey gods. Like they're happy. And Vanessa Legay is happy. She's like, oh my God. I feel like there has to be one couple of season, right? Has to. So we have Taylor and Daniel. Super cute. But the really, really, really wild part of this season and the one that made us scratch our heads and just be so frustrate angry were Lauren and Dave. Dave, the sister obsession, the weird obsession with the guy that you hooked up with before the show. Like, what is up with you? What is wrong with you? So I had to talk to Lauren. Lauren O'Brien is so cool. She's smart, she's a hard worker. She's. She's a cool chick that deserved better than this dude that was like basically slut shaming her in a way or his fat ego couldn't get over the fact that she hooked up with the dude before she met him. Just mind boggling. So I needed to talk to Lauren. I needed to see what her take was on this. So she's on the show today and here's a conversation. So enjoy. Well, how are you?
- [08:56]
Amanda Hirsch
I'm good, I'm good. I'm busy, honestly. Maybe or like mostly with work stuff. But this has been a fun added part of my busy schedule too.
- [09:05]
Lauren O'Brien
So like, when work stuff. You mean your real job? My real job, which is educational sales.
- [09:12]
Amanda Hirsch
Yes.
- [09:13]
Lauren O'Brien
Okay. And have you started diving into the social media world of stuff?
- [09:20]
Amanda Hirsch
A little bit. Like I, I do feel like I kind of went from posting like twice a year for my friends and family to now being like, okay, if I want to actually dive into that, I probably need to post more than biannually. So I've been trying to, but then it's just kind of like setting aside certain times of my day to do that and then making sure I'm not doing that during. Like I just need to really like black off my calendar.
- [09:45]
Lauren O'Brien
Oh, wow. Okay. You're so. You're a busy gal I actually love. First of all, you updated your. Your bio on Instagram, too. I cry and say, like, a lot, which I didn't even like. Well, I say, like, a lot, too. So I'm not. I'm not the girl. I'm not the girl to come for you for the likes, but people came for you for the likes.
- [10:05]
Amanda Hirsch
I mean, I honestly, I feel like we're all our own worst critics. Like, I noticed it more than anyone. And even before watching the episodes, I remember asking production, like, do you guys have me crying in every scene? Because I did cry a lot. Like, I had so many tears of frustration throughout that entire thing, which you see. And there's even moments where they probably didn't even include some other crying times. So I think it was more to, like, I was being a little more harsh on myself. But people have commented on me saying, like, a lot. I say a lot. I say, yeah, a lot. I'm a really active listener, apparently.
- [10:42]
Lauren O'Brien
Well, the tears or, like, the tears that you had were so, like, made me feel so much when watching you, because they. They weren't the streaming tears most of the time. They were the. I'm gonna try so hard to not cry. But your eyes just welled up and were, like, sparkly all the time. Like, you were having conversations. And I just felt you in those moments because it was like, I know those tears where you're trying not to. Which, if I was you, my lips would start going, like, I wouldn't. It wouldn't just be the eyes. I'd be like. Like, I'd start looking at two. So for you, that didn't happen. But, yeah, I think frustration seems to be the right word because, like, can you try to describe where you were feeling in those moments where we did see you, your eyes welling up? Like, was frustration the main word? Like, what else was going on?
- [11:38]
Amanda Hirsch
Yeah, I just felt like. So. I don't even know if misunderstood is a better word, but, like, I felt like I wasn't being listened to. And I felt like I was trying to get my point across in so many different ways and trying to explain the same thing, like, multiple times in order to get into his head to try to figure out what the fuck was going on. And so it was just moments of, like, I've never felt so unheard before, and I. I'd never felt, like, so bad at communicating before. Like, I think I was more just being hard on myself. Like, am I not doing this right? Am I not explaining things in a way that Makes sense. Is. Am I wrong? I don't know. I just. I was so in my head, and, like, not being able to come to a resolution was so frustrating. And so I think that.
- [12:28]
Lauren O'Brien
So you wanted. Yeah, you wanted a solo. Like, you wanted to have a conversation, get to a point, have the sister fudgeing, want to meet you, have the friends listen. And every conversation ended with just no resolution, which I'm sure, like, you said that frustrating is. But let's back up. Let's back up.
- [12:48]
Amanda Hirsch
Okay.
- [12:49]
Lauren O'Brien
How did you, Lauren from Minneapolis, get on the show? From. From the Gap?
- [12:56]
Amanda Hirsch
Yeah. I mean, so I've been a fan of the show for years. Like, I've literally watched every season. I've been obsessed. I'm just, like, a big reality TV fan to begin with. But it was one of those things that, like, it was very. I personally never would have saw myself in that position. But the beauty of this show is that it is by city. So it literally just came up in. They do these casting calls, like, on Instagram. And so it was, like, casting call for probably three or four different cities, and one of them is Minneapolis. And I was, like, kind of fresh off of a breakup at the time. It was one of those things that. I don't know, I was kind of like a known single friend. And it came up at multiple brunch tables, like, over the course of a month or so. And I kind of applied. Not, like, as a joke, but just, like, truly not thinking. Thinking anything would ever come from this, because it just felt so, like, distant. And I didn't hear from them for, like, six months. And so I remember a few months after I applied, I was like, well, I probably didn't get picked. Didn't even get a call back. And then six months later, they had texted, and it kind of just started the conversation. And I don't know, one of those things that the. It just kept kind of moving along to the next step. And there were little times where I had to stop and be like, okay, do I actually want to pursue this? Is this actually something that I could see myself doing? But it almost got to a point that it was like, okay, it's the universe. It's in the universe's hands now, right? I'm going to let them decide if I should be doing this or not. And so it got to the very end. Like, I mean, I. A week and a half before, I remember, they called, and they were like, you're an alternate. We're still not really sure. And I'm trying to make Decisions with, like, my company. And my boss was so amazingly flexible about it, thank God. But, yeah, it just kind of got to a point that I was like, I'm gonna let the universe take this one from here.
- [14:46]
Lauren O'Brien
So then an alternate means somebody else was in the running, and then if they didn't want to, it would be you.
- [14:52]
Amanda Hirsch
I think so. But I think it was more layered than that. Like, I think that they did a lot of work to make sure that there were. There wasn't crossover with the guys and the girls. And so it could be also that, like, maybe there was a guy on the other end that I knew and they were waiting for him to say yes or no. I don't know. I think that there's a lot of different layers to it, but the basically gist of it is they were kind of waiting to see if there was a spot for me or not.
- [15:17]
Lauren O'Brien
So how long in advance did you get the final yes?
- [15:20]
Amanda Hirsch
Six days. Like, I flew out on a Sunday, and I found out that Monday before. I was scrambling.
- [15:28]
Lauren O'Brien
Wade, where did you fly to? Was it not filmed in Minneapolis?
- [15:32]
Amanda Hirsch
No. So the pods part is all in California. It's at their stage out there. And then you do Honduras or like, whatever your getaway is. We did Honduras for a week, and then we come back to Minneapolis, and.
- [15:43]
Lauren O'Brien
Then you come back. So you had. You said a what to a Monday. When did you find out?
- [15:48]
Amanda Hirsch
So I flew out on a Sunday. I found out the Monday before. So, yeah, like, six days.
- [15:53]
Lauren O'Brien
Oh, my God. How. So you come to your boss and you're like, I might go on this reality TV show. Did your boss know about the show? Like, that's such an awkward convo now.
- [16:03]
Amanda Hirsch
No, I thankfully, like, my boss is amazing, and she. She also, like, lives in California and she has a daughter around my age, too, so she kind of got it. And I remember when I first brought it to her, I was so. I was worried about just, like, coming off as unprofessional. I had just started this position, and she was just so, like, this is a once in a lifetime opportunity. She's like, we love, love. Like, she was just all. She was excited for me in the best way. And so, yeah, it did get to a point that she was like, you are going to need to give me not a two day heads up. And I was like, very valid, very fair. So I was able to give her a week. And then, you know, I was able to work with people on my team, too, to figure out how that's going to be covered because I got my. I'm sequestered for, like, three weeks as part of that, so I couldn't communicate with any of them. But, yeah, she was amazing.
- [16:50]
Lauren O'Brien
So you get to the pods. Were you excited? Like, what were you feeling? Did you think, like, did you. When. As a watcher of the show and an avid fan of the show, were you, like, people found love? Like, we do have some couples that are still together. Like, did you see the opportunity there to really find someone?
- [17:09]
Amanda Hirsch
Did, and I was, like, excited about it. But I also have known, like, in previous relationships, it takes me a while to fully get, like, emotionally invested in someone. And so I was excited to see what this would look like, but I wasn't 100% convinced I would be able to emotionally get there with someone else. Like, that really was truly one of the most shocking things about this whole experience when I look back, is that I was in a position by the time we got to engagement day that I was like, I want to get engaged to this person. Like, I. I kind of surprised myself that that's how easily I fell into things.
- [17:44]
Lauren O'Brien
Was there anybody else that was your top, aside from Dave?
- [17:48]
Amanda Hirsch
Yeah, I was talking to, actually. It's so funny. Mason. Up until almost the end, which I had no idea that Megan Madison, like, I had. I could tell that he was making other connections and, like, I was making other connections, but I had no idea that that was what was happening behind the other pods. And then Scott, who was another person, he wasn't shown a ton, but those were kind of like my three people toward the end.
- [18:10]
Lauren O'Brien
Do you have any regrets, like, not moving forward with, like, Mason or the Scott guy?
- [18:16]
Amanda Hirsch
I mean, I don't know. It's so hard. Like, I did get a little hard on myself after things ended to be like, I don't know, I chose the wrong person or I chose the person that wasn't ready to be with me or all of these things. But I think looking back, like, I was just making the best decision I could make at the time. And there were a lot of great qualities about Dave that I really, like, fell in love with in the pods and then kind of continued that in Honduras. I wouldn't say I regret making that choice, but I don't know. Hindsight's always 2020 to be like, okay, if I would have leaned into other areas, other guys, what would this have looked like?
- [18:52]
Lauren O'Brien
You know, I heard somebody say something very true about the red flag situation. Right? Like, we use that word so much now, and we're like. And usually it's used like, red flag. Or how didn't she see the red flags? Or, like, you know, or I. Now the red flags are clear. Somebody said something that really, like, struck a chord with me, which was, like, this whole discourse about the red flag really puts, like, the burden on the other person, you know, like, on you in this situation. Right. Which you said you beat yourself up anyway, but it really does. It's like, all the red flags were there, Lauren. You know, like, but. Or any person that. That said to. In hindsight with a breakup or celebs that we delve into their breakups, and it's like, the red flags were there, you know, And I really agreed with whoever said this. Like, it's so just like, you know, piling on the other person and putting the responsibility on them to have this whole other person's issues figured out. Know that it would, like, turn into not someone who's good at a relationship. But speaking of not doing that, were there any red flags in the pods?
- [20:03]
Amanda Hirsch
Okay, and first of all, like, I. I totally agree with that. And I was literally just having a conversation with my mom about this because so many people are quick online and even in person to call out the fact that I didn't see red flags. And my mom was like, okay, when I met your dad, he probably had some red flags. Like, there were things that he was working through. Like, we're not perfect people when we enter into a relationship, and there's things that were probably concerning about me, too. And so, yes, there's definitely an element of maybe I overlooked some things. But also, at the same time, I saw a lot of potential, and I wasn't willing to just completely say no to that because of a couple of things I would say. I really didn't see red flags until we were back in Minneapolis, and his behavior kind of shifted a little bit, and he started to really, I don't know, not be on my team and not hear me out. I think that that was the biggest thing that I noticed that I let go a little bit longer. But then.
- [21:01]
Lauren O'Brien
Wait, Lauren, back up. Talking about you peeing, like, to everyone and everything wasn't like, like, not red flag. Like, let's throw that word out. Yeah, annoying. Like, annoying to mention how fucking much you pee.
- [21:16]
Amanda Hirsch
Yeah, I. I didn't know he was mentioning that everyone until I watched it back. It is a conversation that we, like, Dave and I were talking a lot about our sleep schedules. I don't know why that was, like, a topic of conversation we were, like, coming back to, but it Was. I haven't shared a bed with someone in so long. And, like, he hadn't either. And so we were just like, kind.
- [21:35]
Lauren O'Brien
Of, how much are you peeing? If I can ask that? It's, like, aggressive for him. Okay.
- [21:40]
Amanda Hirsch
I think my anxiety was also, like, I was just not sleeping at all. So it's not even like, oh, my God. I was getting up because I needed to, like, eat five times a night. It was like, I couldn't sleep. I was anxious. I maybe needed to take another dose of melatonin. I was just sticking around, you know? But probably the first night, I think.
- [21:59]
Lauren O'Brien
I got up five times, and he felt that. He's probably a light sleeper.
- [22:05]
Amanda Hirsch
He is. But he was also snoring, which was, like, part of. I remember when we went to bed that night, I was like, are you a snorer? And he's like, no. And then we woke up, and I was like, you lied to me. You also kept me up all night. So it's not all on me, right?
- [22:19]
Lauren O'Brien
I mean, it's not at all on you. Like, if you needed to be, you need to be. I have to be right now. I have to be all the time. We're girls. Like, this is a thing.
- [22:25]
Amanda Hirsch
Five of these.
- [22:26]
Lauren O'Brien
Like, excuse me, how are we not peeing? I don't understand. I know. Men really don't get the peeing thing. Like, my husband has made remarks, like, for leaving somewhere, and I'm like, gotta pee. Like, always have to pee a second before. But. But. Yeah, but as a viewer, I will say it was weird. Like, the emphasis on it talking to you, about talking to everybody. And then there was another thing in Honduras that the emphasis was weird, which was the sex stuff, that he wanted to talk to everybody about, know where everybody else stood, which is, like, kind of immature, you know?
- [23:01]
Amanda Hirsch
Yeah. And I think, too, that that is a conversation that was, like, we were encouraged to have. I think a lot of the other people had the maybe maturity or like, how do I say this? I don't know, awareness to say, oh, I'm not going to put people on blast like that. I think he just was like, oh, we're supposed to talk about this. So I'm gonna. I'm gonna cry a little bit also in a conversation I didn't realize was fully happening in the way that it was happening until I walked back.
- [23:30]
Lauren O'Brien
But was that important to him? Like, did he really want to get there? Like, the intimacy level?
- [23:35]
Amanda Hirsch
I mean, we had talked about it together, too. It's not like we weren't having Those conversations. And it was kind of important to both of us. I would say it was. I mean, the whole point of that trip is to figure out if you are, like, connected, connecting physically in the way that you connected emotionally in the pods. So.
- [23:51]
Lauren O'Brien
Right.
- [23:51]
Amanda Hirsch
We were talking about it.
- [23:53]
Lauren O'Brien
Did you feel like you were connecting physically with him?
- [23:56]
Amanda Hirsch
Yeah, I did. I mean, when. By the time we left Honduras, I was like, I am closer with this person emotionally and physically than I've had with, like, any guy that I dated. I don't know, like, the. The way the experiment is set up, too. I. You can get there. And I was kind of surprised by that part.
- [24:13]
Lauren O'Brien
Did you get there with him?
- [24:17]
Amanda Hirsch
Yeah.
- [24:17]
Lauren O'Brien
Did he tell people or did he stop the conversation once? Like, it happened.
- [24:23]
Amanda Hirsch
I mean, you see him honestly. So we were, like, kind of encouraged to have those conversations. Conversations in the getaways. I feel like it wasn't as much of a topic when we came back to Minneapolis just because, like, there was so much other shit that we were tackling at that. I mean, he does answer. I think he is talking to Molly, and Molly's like, when was the last time you hooked up? And he was like, well, Lauren and I have. And I, like, that's not really what she meant when she was asking that.
- [24:49]
Lauren O'Brien
Say he's a little, like, you know, who made a joke like that? Like, Amy Schumer. And I'm by no means saying Dave is a neurodivergent, but Amy Schumer has a joke that's really funny because her husband is on the spectrum, and she talks about a lot in her comedy, and she makes a joke like, is he a man or is he on the spectrum?
- [25:10]
Amanda Hirsch
So the spectrum somewhere, aren't we? I would assume.
- [25:13]
Lauren O'Brien
Yeah, right. Right.
- [25:15]
Amanda Hirsch
That's so funny.
- [25:16]
Lauren O'Brien
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- [29:27]
Amanda Hirsch
Yeah.
- [29:28]
Lauren O'Brien
So in the pods, did you feel it? Did you have like a thought about it? Like, what was the vibe?
- [29:33]
Amanda Hirsch
So in the pods, I do remember that coming up pretty quickly in the beginning about like, my sister's worried about me being here. My sister was worried about this experiment, wasn't sure if this was like the best thing for me. But then we kind of like talked about that in the beginning and then kind of continued to further our relationship. And I remember by the time we got to proposal day, he brought up the fact that he was like, I don't know why I'm worried about my sister with you. Like, you're so lovable. She's going to love you. You guys just need to meet. And that kind of will take care of any of that anxiety that she has. And so by the time we got there, it really did feel like, okay, yes, this was something that was in the back of his head in the beginning of this experiment, but at this point we've built this connection that it's not going to like derail anything from here. Like, if anything, us meeting and kind of furthering along this process is just going to make us stronger and better.
- [30:23]
Lauren O'Brien
Yeah.
- [30:23]
Amanda Hirsch
And that didn't happen.
- [30:25]
Lauren O'Brien
Wait, aside though, from him sharing with you that his sister was worried, did he talk about her a lot in general, where it seemed like a bit too much or. No, not any.
- [30:34]
Amanda Hirsch
Not in the pods, I would say. And like we talked about family a ton. I mean, I, I actually talked a ton about my older brother and sister in law and like, they are just a relationship that I look up to so much and would love to replicate in a romantic partner. And so like those conversations were coming up a ton. And then he would respond to something along the lines of his sister too. But like, I, at the time, it did not feel. In the pods, it did not feel excessive.
- [31:01]
Lauren O'Brien
Do you know who his sister is? Because like, we don't.
- [31:04]
Amanda Hirsch
I know of her, but I never, I've never met her, I've never talked to her.
- [31:09]
Lauren O'Brien
So let's delve into that for a second. What the happened? For real? What did he. How did he get this information? What was your actual story with this dude, like, walking? Tell us more about that.
- [31:24]
Amanda Hirsch
Okay. My God, such a loaded question. I could talk about. I could answer that question for, like, two hours. Okay. So I have known this guy. We had talked for, like, a few months before filming, and as soon as, like. Or not. Yeah. As soon as casting started, I had told this guy, like, hey, I know we've, like, went on a date at this point, but I'm starting casting conversations with Love is Blind, and I kind of want to pursue that. And I honestly expected him to be like, okay, then let's not continue talking or anything like that. But he was, like, very chill about it and was like, no problem. We don't need to be serious about this. Anyways. So that's kind of how we went about things the next couple of months and then didn't think a ton of it. I remember, too, thinking, like, going on this experiment. Experiment is almost a nice excuse to end things with this other guy. Like, it was like, okay, sorry, I'm. I'm no longer available, and so I'm gonna leave from here.
- [32:19]
Lauren O'Brien
Because you weren't that into him.
- [32:21]
Amanda Hirsch
Yeah. I just knew that it wasn't someone, like, if he's someone that I genuinely wanted.
- [32:25]
Lauren O'Brien
You wouldn't go on the show.
- [32:26]
Amanda Hirsch
Exactly. Like, I. I wanted to meet. I'm so ready to meet my person and, like, go through this next kind of stage of life. And if he was someone that I thought was the. Had the potential of that, I wouldn't have risked that to go.
- [32:40]
Lauren O'Brien
But you didn't. You were. You were sure about that. That he wasn't your person.
- [32:44]
Amanda Hirsch
Yeah, but.
- [32:45]
Lauren O'Brien
But it was, like, cool to hang out and, like, pass the time.
- [32:49]
Amanda Hirsch
And I remember thinking, like, he's. He was on the same page with that too. And I was like, I kind of respected that. And we had had conversations about, like, hinge dates he was going on or I knew. I knew that he was kind of moving in a very single way as well. Which I was like, obviously, I'm about to go on a TV show where I'm very single, so very fair. Didn't really think much of it. When we are in the getaways, Dave made a comment off camera. I think we were talking about previous relationships. He's like, were you dating someone before? And I was like, no. My last boyfriend was, like, over a year and a half ago. But I was like. And then he was like, were you hooking up with someone before? And I was like, yeah, how do you know that? And he's like, is his name so and so and name dropped him? And I was like, how do you know that? Such a random, small world connection. And he's like, I had heard from, like, a friend of a friend that there was a girl coming on the show who has.
- [33:38]
Lauren O'Brien
Wait, wait, so this isn't. You guys don't have phones, so this isn't real time information.
- [33:44]
Amanda Hirsch
This is what he had heard before leaving for the pads that there was.
- [33:49]
Lauren O'Brien
A girl that came in with a boyfriend.
- [33:51]
Amanda Hirsch
Huh.
- [33:52]
Lauren O'Brien
Okay.
- [33:53]
Amanda Hirsch
And when he first said that, like, my first thought was, oh, my God, I wonder what girl came in with a boyfriend. Like, I'm kind of, like racking my brain to be like, who could he be talking about? Not realizing that he's, like, kind of accusing me of that in the quick moment. And so I was like, no, not me, if that's what you're referring to. And I kind of, like, spelled out the timeline of things with him, and he was like, yeah, I don't love that. That's like a random connection that we have. But it's fine. Like, we're all. We were all single. I. I remember him also being pretty chill about it. In that first conversation off camera, he was like, we were all single going into this. And then the next day we're doing this boat excursion, which is when we go in that little, like, scuba diving thing where you're like, on a little scooter. Anyways, we're sitting on the boat and he talks about coming back, and he. We're on camera and he's like, yeah, I'm like, really not excited to go back. And, you know, we have this connection now with this other guy. And I just remember thinking, like, I really didn't even think that this would ever be a topic of conversation. We would come back to after that initial chat we had the night before. And so I just, like, didn't really love that it was brought up immediately on camera like that. And then.
- [34:59]
Lauren O'Brien
Oh, because the first conversation was off camera. Right, Got you. So he didn't, like, even prepare you, like, by the way, I'm gonna talk about this or anything? No, no, but when you say connection, what does connection mean? Like, he. How close is his connection? Or is it just like a rumor mill? Like, what's the.
- [35:18]
Amanda Hirsch
Yeah, they have, like, one mutual friend in Minneapolis. I think that there's probably some other people, but there's like, one guy that's kind of like, Good friends with him and then good friends with Dave.
- [35:27]
Lauren O'Brien
Okay. So random. That he would, like, know, like. But do you. Did you get to the bottom of why it was said that you had a. That you had a boyfriend? Why it was said that it was a boyfriend? Like, who would. No, we don't know. Did you ever talk to the guy and say, were you saying that we were boyfriend girlfriend?
- [35:45]
Amanda Hirsch
So he's come out since and been like, no, Like, Lauren and I were casual. I don't under. Like, even to this day. And. Yeah, and we did have a conversation.
- [35:55]
Lauren O'Brien
Like, even to this day what? Lauren, what? Even to this day what?
- [36:00]
Amanda Hirsch
Like, even to this day, like, on his social media, he's like, no, Lauren and I were casual.
- [36:04]
Lauren O'Brien
Oh, people found him. I guess I didn't sleuth enough.
- [36:07]
Amanda Hirsch
No, don't. Please don't. It's like he is really trying to lean into this and it's. Oh.
- [36:18]
Lauren O'Brien
Red flag.
- [36:19]
Amanda Hirsch
I know, guys, I need a much better picker than what I have.
- [36:23]
Lauren O'Brien
He's trying to, like, get interviews or something. Like, as Lauren's hookup before the show.
- [36:30]
Amanda Hirsch
Correct.
- [36:31]
Lauren O'Brien
Oh, yucky. Did he make a tick tock? Did he, like, have a green screen? The whole thing all over the socials. He's really leaning in, but I guess it's not working for him because I feel like it's not.
- [36:44]
Amanda Hirsch
Right.
- [36:45]
Lauren O'Brien
Getting as much traction as he might have thought.
- [36:49]
Amanda Hirsch
Right.
- [36:49]
Lauren O'Brien
You know?
- [36:49]
Amanda Hirsch
Right. Especially that way.
- [36:51]
Lauren O'Brien
But it sounds like he is still. He's not being an. Where he's trying to maybe say other things and say you were lying. He is still saying that you are on the same page. At least that. At least that.
- [37:04]
Amanda Hirsch
Right. Okay, we'll give him credit for that.
- [37:07]
Lauren O'Brien
We'll give him credit for that. But gross. Yeah. So he knew. And. And then. Okay. And then he brought it up to you on camera, and all of a sudden you're realizing, wait, this. This is really affecting him. Slash, he doesn't believe you.
- [37:19]
Amanda Hirsch
Right, Right. And then things get, like, the worst when we are in the airport in Honduras, they're giving us our phones back. I'm so excited to, like, text my girlfriend's group chat, call my parents, all that stuff. And his group chat is just like, absolutely exploding. And I didn't find this out until later, but apparently that's when, like, all of his buddies were in their group chat being like, you just got engaged to someone with a boyfriend. And he immediately was like, what the fuck have I done? So that's kind of how things went downhill from there. And, like, I really do. If I'm looking back, I do think in that moment, he was like, I'm out of this. I can't. I'm not gonna.
- [37:59]
Lauren O'Brien
The ego. It's the ego. It's the inflated. Even if he believed you, which, like, the moments, like, it did look like he believed you, and he knows, like, even if you fucking were with this guy, you're not now. So, like, what does it matter? But he. And as with a lot of men, have the ego of, like, a. Like, country, the size of a country, and they can't. It's like, I cannot. It's like, I cannot. I cannot. Because this is more important for people to not think that I'm a loser for. But you're this girl that he picked, that he got engaged to behind a wall, all this. And you're looking at him with your welled up eyes and saying, I'm telling you the truth. This was nothing. And he's saying, what? Like, I believe you. I can't. Can't believe you. Like, what?
- [38:53]
Amanda Hirsch
He just kept being like, I just don't understand the timeline. I just can't get past the timeline. And, like, I think at the time, I thought he meant, like, the timeline of me and this other guy. And so that's why I kept being like, what else do you want from me? Like, how clear can I be about this?
- [39:08]
Lauren O'Brien
Which was. Lauren, which was what? Like, you had seen him the week before the show. That's what really bothered him.
- [39:15]
Amanda Hirsch
Yeah.
- [39:16]
Lauren O'Brien
Like, your last time seeing the guy was like, before you left, Basically before.
- [39:20]
Amanda Hirsch
I even knew that I was officially on it, too. Like, I didn't. Like, we had hooked up before, and then like, a few days after, I got the call that I was officially on it from there. Not that that even matters. Right? Like, that's semantics at this point.
- [39:33]
Lauren O'Brien
Yeah, but he.
- [39:35]
Amanda Hirsch
I think looking back, he meant the timeline of, like, we're supposed to get married in two weeks, and he can't work through this in two weeks. He can't decide if he's gonna marry someone while listening to his, like, college buddies over his fiance. And, like, I think that's the timeline that he was really struggling with the most.
- [39:54]
Lauren O'Brien
Okay. And the sister. Like, it was the buddies and the sister.
- [39:58]
Amanda Hirsch
Yeah.
- [39:59]
Lauren O'Brien
Maybe the buddies and the sister are friends.
- [40:02]
Amanda Hirsch
I think they might have been talking. Honestly, I. I was really, as you saw, like, in the dark and all of that. I didn't know what conversations were happening. I just knew that every time, like, almost every day, he would come with new false information or A new.
- [40:17]
Lauren O'Brien
Like what? Like, what could have changed? Like, what, what kind of stuff?
- [40:21]
Amanda Hirsch
Like, even things being like, well, I heard that you guys spent the night together the night before. I'm like, I didn't spend the night with him once the entire time that I was even talking to this guy. Like, well, I heard like, just like random little shit like that, that I'm like, I don't know where you're getting this from. And that's why I kept being like, can we go to the source? Like, I don't understand why I'm having to speak through. I'm having to play a game of telephone with you right now. And you're not even letting me get to the source on things. So that's. That was frustrating.
- [40:49]
Lauren O'Brien
And if you got the opportunity to talk to the boys and his sister, like, why you would have sat there and again said, hooked up with this guy, like, that's what you were planning on doing. On giving the timeline.
- [41:02]
Amanda Hirsch
I would have given the timeline and been like, what more information do you need? And also, like, what I kept saying to Dave is, I'm like, I'm picking you in this. Like, I don't understand this guy. Doesn't matter. At the end of the day, you're the person that I want to be with. And whether that's an engagement or a marriage or a relationship, like, I'm picking you.
- [41:18]
Lauren O'Brien
And even that this was before I even knew you. Like, this was before I knew you. That's where it's like, the ego. Because, like, nothing else should be bothering you about this aside from your bruised ego, which is like, did he seem like a jealous or possessive guy in general? Like, did he want to hear about your past relationships? Is that something that like, triggered him?
- [41:41]
Amanda Hirsch
I don't think that I got like, past relationship jealousy. I think I do think that an ego was part of it. I think he's going to have to, like, defend this girl over his buddies. And he wasn't maturity wise prepared to do that. Like, that was just too much for him. I think that was the biggest factor in all of it, is him having to, like, make some big kid decisions about this person that he just got engaged to in front of his friends and family. And that's hard to do.
- [42:09]
Lauren O'Brien
And sister, sister, sister.
- [42:12]
Amanda Hirsch
Exactly.
- [42:12]
Lauren O'Brien
So at that point, when he's bringing up your sister a lot, his sister a lot, you said in the pods you didn't feel it. Did you start to feel it then that like, whoa, this sister seems to be kind of either controlling his life or by the way, a lot of the audience thinks, which. I don't know my personal. If that's my personal opinion, Some people thought that he was, like, kind of using her as a scapegoat and that. That, you know, like. And people are making fun, like, does the sister exist? You know, blah, blah, blah. But, like, did you feel in those moments, like, whoa. Or were you thinking, is he using this as an excuse to get out? Like, what were you thinking?
- [42:49]
Amanda Hirsch
I definitely. I didn't say that to him at one point. Like, if you need an out, this is a really good out to use, because it's really dumb, but it's something that you can be able to, like, pinpoint and say, like, this is the reason. I think I noticed it too, when it's not even. We're all from the Midwest. There were a lot of families that were having a tough time with the cameras part of it. And I had, like, family and friends be like, we want to meet the guy. We want to get to know him. But cameras are intimidating. And so that part wasn't even the thing that bothered me. But I wasn't even having a phone call. Like, he wouldn't call her if I was in the room, or he wouldn't put us on speaker. And I was even doing that with my people. Like, my older brother was like, I don't really want to film, but can I call you later? Will you put us on speaker? I'd love to talk to Dave. And, like, it started to be a red flag when none of that was even happening on his end. He. And again, I don't think that that is on his sister. I think that Dave is the one in this relationship. Dave is the one who made this commitment and got engaged. And so he should be the one to say to his family, like, you're either in or you're out. But, like, this is my relationship and kind of do the work to bring us together. And he wasn't doing that.
- [44:01]
Lauren O'Brien
We'll be right back after the break. You guys know that I have an issue with cooking. I'm. I'm honest about it. I don't pretend you'll never see me make a freaking meal, film it, and show you to cook it. Like, I'm sorry, what I will film show you how to cook and show you that I did is something that came as a meal kit. Users of leading meal kits have rated Home Chef number one in quality, convenience, value, taste, and recipe. Ease Home Chef knows the struggle is real and delivers fresh, delicious meal kits that respect your time. I always love the 30 minute ones. So streamline your dinner time with Home Chef and also doesn't break the bank. Guess what does Dining out all the time. And you guys, they have classic meal kits with pre portioned ingredients, quick 30 minute recipes, oven ready options, microwave meals or a dedicated family menu. Home Chef has everything you and your family need for hassle. Free delicious dinners. And let me tell you, when I have Home Chef husb is all over that is he's like this is so good. I'm like, you're welcome. You have Martha Stewart in the kitchen for a limited time. Home Chef is offering you guys 18 free meals. 18 plus free dessert, faux life and of course free shipping on your first box. So go to homechef.com not skinny. That's homechef.com not skinny for 18 free meals and free dessert for life. Homechef.com not skinny must be an active subscriber to receive free dessert. This episode is supported by FX's Dying for Sex, a new show starring Michelle Williams and Jenny Slade. Oh my God, I love them both so much. Inspired by a true story, this series follows Molly who after receiving a terminal cancer diagnosis, decides to leave her husband to explore the full breadth of her sexual desires. Love that she gets the courage and support to go on the sex quest from her best friend Nikki, who stays by her side through it all. FX's Dying for Sex all episodes streaming April 4th on Hulu. I don't even think I need to be telling you this, but I'll will tell you again. I will tell you again to get Quints items because really, like, I shop at Quince so often and I just love it. It feels like I'm treating myself without, you know, breaking the bank. And they have the best vacation edits. Like they just have high quality travel essentials at fair prices. Including like the suitcase you need to get there that will look exactly like those overpriced suitcase you see your favorite influencers with. They also have lightweight European linen styles from like 30 bucks. They have washable silk tops and comfy lounge sets. I literally got my bed from Quince, okay? By partnering directly with top factories, Quinn's cuts the cost of the middleman and passes the savings on to you. Quince only works with factories that use safe, ethical and responsible manufacturing practices and premium fabrics and finishes. So I'm going to treat myself without breaking the bank because I do have some upcoming travel plans during spring break like the rest of the world, okay? And Quince just has the best first quality suitcase at an economy price tag that will just upgrade your next trip. So for your next trip, treat yourself to the luxe upgrades you deserve from Quince. Go to quince.com not skinny for 365 day returns plus free shipping on your order. That's Quince Q-U-I-N C E.com/not skinny to get free shipping and 365 day returns as a full year. Gwen Stocks not Skinny. And we're back. So all these scenes that you're filming, talking about it, what's happening in the off hours, like, are you good? Are you going about your day, hanging out, eating lunch? Or like, is it always the topic?
- [48:04]
Amanda Hirsch
No, like, that's the thing. You are good. And like, that really was only a topic that was brought up when the cameras were rolling and we needed to talk about our relationship. Otherwise we were like. We were both working remotely. So we're kind of in and out. We had a couple nights where we weren't filming. So we, like, got drinks and, like, hung out either with us or even with just the other couples. It really felt like a very normal relationship outside of when cameras would roll and we would talk about all of this.
- [48:33]
Lauren O'Brien
So then he just started talking about it and then it would take him. That's so. It's such a bizarre situation. I feel like, you know. Okay, so in this, though, he's not able to get over it. How didn't you get to a point of like, if you can get over this, like, I'm walking. Like, you did actually get, like, it gets to that point, but it was kind of more him being done.
- [48:57]
Amanda Hirsch
Yeah.
- [48:58]
Lauren O'Brien
But like, were you ever thinking, like, I'm not having this conversation again. I'm not explaining myself again. This is ridiculous amount.
- [49:04]
Amanda Hirsch
Yeah. And I actually say that. I wish they showed me saying this too, but when we were at the cycling studio, that was like the first.
- [49:13]
Lauren O'Brien
Time with your friends.
- [49:15]
Amanda Hirsch
Yes. Yeah.
- [49:16]
Lauren O'Brien
That was so. That was crazy. That was crazy.
- [49:19]
Amanda Hirsch
Such a good job on that. Like, they even didn't know a ton, but they just handled it so well. And. Oh, my God, I was so impressed by them.
- [49:26]
Lauren O'Brien
Yeah. Though you're the other. Are they your good friends?
- [49:29]
Amanda Hirsch
Yeah. Yep.
- [49:31]
Lauren O'Brien
Yeah, they were writing for you. And like, he was just like, Yeah. I don't know what to tell you. I heard from this guy that, like, she saw the guy and I'm like, what is actually happening? Okay, so at the cycling studio.
- [49:43]
Amanda Hirsch
Yes. And like, so we bring it up and we're talking and I say to him, like, I need you to decide how you feel about this. Like, if this matters to you, you need to tell me. If it doesn't matter to you, then we need to move past this. Because I remember we kept having these conversations, and we're getting closer and closer to our wedding date. And I remember thinking, I still have questions about him. I still have things that I need to figure out about this guy if I'm going to marry him or even go to the altar. And all we're doing is spending time talking about my sexual history. Like, I just remember being like, when are we going to get to things that actually matter in terms of a relationship? And that was just not happening. So I do say that at the cycling studio. And then I think I just have this emotional whiplash. And I probably stuck around longer because we weren't tackling this outside of cameras. Like, outside of cameras. It was in our relationship. We're, like, living our normal lives. There's even a point that he says to me a couple of days before we break up off camera, like, I don't really give a shit you slept with. Like. And then we would come back to the same topic. And so I do think that a part of it, too, is, like, I was just almost getting different vibes and different.
- [50:53]
Lauren O'Brien
Because again, I think. I think maybe again, it's the ego. Like, I don't want to look pathetic. I don't want to look like the guy that stayed with the girl who hooked up with someone before going on a show. Like, what else could it be? But what did you see in Dave that maybe we didn't, as the audience that made you, you know, ride for him for such a long time, get engaged to him?
- [51:20]
Amanda Hirsch
Yeah, I mean, I think, like. And you're seeing a little bit more of this character now. Like, you saw a little bit more of it at the reunion, and I think a little bit more, like, in kind of the way he's handling, I do think. I don't think deep down, he's a malicious bad person. I really do think, deep down, he loves his people. We talked so much about the closeness we had with our friends and family. We talked a lot about what we wanted our futures to look like. And they really aligned in terms of, like, family values, financial goals. Like, we really dove into all of that. And I do think that deep down he is a good person who was trying to do his best. I think, like, where he was lacking is putting his ego down, the emotional maturity, being able to be fully ready for an actual mature, romantic relationship.
- [52:07]
Lauren O'Brien
And also he was kind of. I mean, there were. Do you know the truth about these situations? Like, one, you were getting the apartment ready for people to come over. Last minute, he tells you they're not coming. As far as you knew until that point they were coming. Then it's like the letter with the sister. He said you were like. He came home with it. Then at the reunion, he says, no, I gave it to her, but I came back with it. Like, what's the truth? Like, do you know the truth? Did the sister see the letter?
- [52:33]
Amanda Hirsch
So I. I think the truth is that she. I'm kind of speculating, but, like, I think he told his friends not to come that night. I don't think that they, like, backed out or they, like.
- [52:42]
Lauren O'Brien
Could you imagine. Could you imagine his friends being like, we will not see this woman who Dare had hooked up with. Like, it just is, like, crazy, like, thinking like that. Like, no guy like, any. I mean, maybe the Midwest, it's different. I just don't know. But, like, a dude would be like, who? Like, who cares? Like, what she did before. So our speculation tell me if I'm wrong is that he was kind of using the friends and the sister as a scapegoat, saying, nobody wants to meet you or hear from you because you're the devil. But, like, he was. The rumor was happening. So I think maybe he was Just didn't want that situation because, like, he didn't want to be, like, the loser fiance who is staying with this girl who hooked up with a guy. It just. It's just too crazy. But it. I can't imagine a world in which his buddies. I could imagine a world in which they were teasing him on messages which you said it was blowing up, but in which they wouldn't want to, like, come hang out, like, be on a TV show.
- [53:50]
Amanda Hirsch
Like, I remember him saying, like, well, they don't want to be the bad guy. And I'm like, I'm the bad guy in this situation. I'm the one that's going to sit here and defend myself for being the, like, Minneapolis whore and on national television. And, like, I'm willing to do that. And so, yeah, I.
- [54:06]
Lauren O'Brien
Do you feel like, slut shame, like, whatever. That word sucks, too. But did you feel, like, shamed in a sense?
- [54:12]
Amanda Hirsch
Yeah, I just, like, didn't understand why it mattered. I. And yes, so I did feel a little slut shame because I'm like, I think it's BS if you're going to sit here and tell me you haven't slept with someone in the past six months, because you've been having casting conversations with Love is Blind.
- [54:27]
Lauren O'Brien
And did he say that he wasn't, though?
- [54:29]
Amanda Hirsch
I don't know. I. I didn't explicitly. Like, Molly, I think, was the only one that said, when was the last time you had sex?
- [54:36]
Lauren O'Brien
Answer it, by the way. Molly. Yeah. You didn't care because why would you.
- [54:41]
Amanda Hirsch
Care for someone the night before he left for the pods? And I still wouldn't have been like, wow, crucifying him for that.
- [54:47]
Lauren O'Brien
Wow. Speaking of Molly, I didn't really love her during the pods. I was like, whatever. Did start loving her when she really rallied for you. And it seemed very genuine how she was talking to Dave and, you know, mind everybody, she's his ex. She wanted to get engaged to him. Meanwhile, she's sitting there and grilling him about you and saying, like, are you dumb? Like, what are you doing?
- [55:13]
Amanda Hirsch
Yeah.
- [55:14]
Lauren O'Brien
Did you form, like, a friendship with her after?
- [55:18]
Amanda Hirsch
Yes. And honestly, like, I remember, I. There's just so much that happens in the lounge anyways. It's not like we weren't friends. I just, like, started to gather that she was talking to Dave, too. And I was like, I just don't want to hear about it. Like, she can have a connection. I just don't want to, like, you know, be part of that conversation with her. But I think when she came in after they had broken up, and I remember the way she was talking to me about, like, things with her and Dave, she was already kind of protecting me and Dave's relationship more than her own relationship or her own, like, ego, almost. Like, she could have told me a lot of the promises that he made or, like, the things that he said to her that really validated her that would have discredited David and I's relationship. And she purposefully chose not to. To kind of protect, like, my heart in a way. And I, like, looking back, I just thought that that was so admirable. And I'm so. I don't even know if I would be strong enough to handle things the way that she did there and then we had had conversations about the conversation she had had with Dave at this group hanging, but I just had no idea she killed it that much. Like, she really did ride so hard. She was so direct with him. She was so Team Lauren. And that was just. Oh, I was so impressed.
- [56:31]
Lauren O'Brien
Is anybody not Team Lauren from the cast? Like, is anybody, like, writing?
- [56:35]
Amanda Hirsch
I'm getting some comments in my. Some DMs. You know, everyone has an opinion.
- [56:40]
Lauren O'Brien
You did say, like, on your Instagram that, like, the block button. Like, you're easy on the block button these days. What I can't imagine, like, what kinds of things are said to you that are not nice.
- [56:51]
Amanda Hirsch
So the first drop of episodes, obviously, we're dealing with the Molly thing too. And I say to Dave, like. Like, Dave asked me, like, what do you want from this? And I was like, I would want you to pick me and, like, for us to be together from this. And I was a huge pick me after that. Like, I had so many comments like, pick me. Desperate. Like, I had to put those in my hidden words for a couple weeks because of how crazy people were being about me being such a pick me after the first drop of episodes.
- [57:21]
Lauren O'Brien
Wait, pick me. Somebody that says pick me.
- [57:27]
Amanda Hirsch
Like, pick me. Energy is different than the words pick me. But I don't need to, like, explain that to people on the Internet. They can have their own opinion about.
- [57:35]
Lauren O'Brien
It, but that was the only thing. Nobody. Nobody. You didn't feel he. Because of the actual situation with the dude or how you handled it with Dave.
- [57:44]
Amanda Hirsch
I mean, there are definitely people out there that have made comments about me not taking this seriously, sleeping around beforehand, but those are so few and far between.
- [57:54]
Lauren O'Brien
And those are probably, like, you know, mothers that are, you know. Yeah, yeah, that's. It's. It's a wild situation. Do you see a world, if you can picture it, that this didn't come up? Everything was fine with Dave. Were you planning on saying yes at the altar if that wouldn't have happened?
- [58:15]
Amanda Hirsch
I mean, I think I was willing, like, and kind of what I had said to date. Probably why I stuck around more longer than people would assume is, like, so much changes in a day, and there is so much growth and so much, like, furthering along in this relationship that happens in a day and. And in a week. So I was willing to continue seeing what that growth looked like. And I did feel like there were a lot of times that our relationship was really progressing. I think I probably would have gotten to a point of kind of similar to what my friends and family were saying at the time, like, can you guys just date? I probably would have wanted to see where things continued to go with him. I feel like other little signs would have come up about him maybe not being fully ready for marriage that I would have picked up on, but I still had so much love for him at the time.
- [59:03]
Lauren O'Brien
When you left that movie theater or wherever you were talking, was that the last time you saw him before the reunion?
- [59:10]
Amanda Hirsch
Well, okay, so we had the group we had, we broke up, and then.
- [59:14]
Lauren O'Brien
Like, right, right, right where he asked if he could hug you.
- [59:19]
Amanda Hirsch
Yeah.
- [59:20]
Lauren O'Brien
Yeah. Is that awkward? You handled it really well at that point.
- [59:24]
Amanda Hirsch
I remember going into that night, like, I think I had mourned the ending of our breakup, like, throughout that past week. And so by the time he'd kind of put the nail in the coffin there, I was, like, so done. And I remember the next night, producers were like, do you want to have a conversation with him? Like, do you have anything you want to say? And I was like, no, I don't need closure. I don't need clarity. He's made his decision. I feel good about it. And so there really wasn't anything that I needed to say to him. So when he came up to me, it was more of like, what are you. What do you have to say? Or, like.
- [59:57]
Lauren O'Brien
And what did it feel like his intentions were? I mean, what does he have to say at this point?
- [60:02]
Amanda Hirsch
I mean, I don't know. I remember him making the comment about, like, it kind of felt like he started to take a little ounce of accountability for his actions in this.
- [60:13]
Lauren O'Brien
Oh, yeah, yeah. I get what you're saying.
- [60:15]
Amanda Hirsch
And I remember thinking, like, I just don't know if you fully believe that, and if you fully believe that you would.
- [60:20]
Lauren O'Brien
Like, he kind of said, I wish it didn't get to me the way that it did, but it had. But almost like he can't control it. Like, I wish I. Yeah, like. And you said about not believing him a couple times where he spoke about his love for you. And I like that you, you know, immediately said back, like, I don't know if I believe that, because you. It seemed like your stance was if you, like, loved me or had this love for me, like, you would act differently. You would defend me, you would this, you would that. Do you think that he loved you?
- [60:52]
Amanda Hirsch
I do think that there was love there. I do. Like, I think that that would be hard for. Yeah, I. I could tell that he was genuinely struggling with how to tackle all of this information and all of this. I don't think he loved me enough to.
- [61:09]
Lauren O'Brien
Right.
- [61:09]
Amanda Hirsch
Like, put me above the ego or above, like, how difficult it was at the time. There was love there, just not enough to actually, like, work through a relationship.
- [61:20]
Lauren O'Brien
Okay, so you saw him at the group hang, and then from there until the reunion, did you encounter each other? Because from what you guys said at the reunion, Minneapolis is tiny. Or. And. Or you guys go out a lot to bars.
- [61:35]
Amanda Hirsch
Yeah, so I had seen him, like, we had run into each other, but, like, it was never, like, we never, like, met up to, like, he never reached out to be like, let's talk, or, like, let's. I have some things I want to say. I have some clarity. Like, he never reached out in that regard.
- [61:51]
Lauren O'Brien
Yeah. And. But you run into the other cast all the time.
- [61:56]
Amanda Hirsch
Yeah. And I'm close with, like, a small group of us. Like, there's like six or seven of us that hang out a lot. And then, of course, there's like, six bars and downtown Minneapolis, so we also see each other a lot in that way.
- [62:08]
Lauren O'Brien
We see each other a lot. So. Okay, give us some tea about what's happening right now. I mean, from the season, we really only have Daniel and Taylor. Right. That, like, there are winners.
- [62:20]
Amanda Hirsch
Yeah.
- [62:20]
Lauren O'Brien
Is it rumors right now about Joey and Sarah, which, like, are neither here nor there? Do you know anything?
- [62:28]
Amanda Hirsch
I like that. So not my. There's a lot of stories being told right now, and I think, if anything, I would just. Things are not as black and white as I think the Internet shockingly thinks that they are. There's a lot of layers to that. But I don't want to speak on anyone.
- [62:47]
Lauren O'Brien
Is Sarah one of the people that you're close with?
- [62:49]
Amanda Hirsch
Yeah.
- [62:50]
Lauren O'Brien
Okay.
- [62:50]
Amanda Hirsch
Yeah.
- [62:51]
Lauren O'Brien
Okay. Yeah, copy. Copy that. So who else? You said it was six, so you, Sarah.
- [62:56]
Amanda Hirsch
Yep.
- [62:57]
Lauren O'Brien
Madison Taylor.
- [62:59]
Amanda Hirsch
Yeah, me, Sarah Taylor, and. Okay. Scott, Joey, Daniel, and Tom, which you didn't see Tom and Scott a ton in that, but we're like. And I am really close with Molly too. I don't see her. I mean, as much, but I. I'm close with her too.
- [63:14]
Lauren O'Brien
What did you think about Megan Mason having that cheesy little reveal moment and trying to make it work?
- [63:22]
Amanda Hirsch
I remember they showed us that at the, like, group hang thing, and I just thought I was like, this is a cool way to almost, like, do this experiment in your own terms. Like, of course, they had already seen each other on Instagram and, like, texted a little bit, but I don't know, I thought that that was so fresh. And I remember being like, this is a cool new approach to things and they have a such a good friendship now. Yeah, they're. They're really fresh.
- [63:46]
Lauren O'Brien
What do you think about people saying about this season that it's boring or saying about this season that Minneapolis seems like the worst place to date?
- [63:55]
Amanda Hirsch
It is the worst place to be. I close eye on that. I kind of agree, like, it's not. It is a little bit boring. I was thinking about this too, like, as A viewer and a fan of love is blind. One of my favorite parts of watching it is, like, the first group hang in the getaways. When you meet people who had, like, previous connections, and you're trying to, like, feel out people's values and compare them. And, like, we just didn't have that. Like, Molly wasn't on the Honduras trip, or, like, I'm trying to, like, BDOT wasn't on the Honduras trip with, like, Devin and Virginia. So we just, like, didn't have that kind of dynamic. And so that makes it a little, like, less exciting, right?
- [64:31]
Lauren O'Brien
That moment where you're like, oh, she's hot. Or, like, you're jealous because they're this. Or you're right. I mean, Dave tried. He tried to talk about the sex. He tried to get this can't. Dave tried. Okay, he did try. Okay, I get what you're saying. So where are you now? Out with the dating?
- [64:49]
Amanda Hirsch
I. So I've dated a little bit in the last year from, like, Hinge or. So I kind of talked about this in another podcast, too, but I did kind of date Scott a little bit, like, six months after Dave and I broke up. And that was. It was definitely a conversation. Like, he had reached out. He was someone that I had connected with in the pods. And honestly, the whole. When they bring people onto this, we take all of these compatibility tests with the goal being there are multiple people that you're compatible with in the pods. It's not like you just show up and there's one person that is there for you, and hopefully. And so I remember at the time being like, okay, I owe it to myself to also explore this connection and same with him. And we talked for a little bit. We kind of were like, okay, is this something that we even want to bring to the group or to Dave and, like, have this conversation. We kind of explored it a little bit on our own first and then decided to bring it to him. I thought it wasn't, like, the most fun thing to deal with in terms of. Because he and Dave were our friends and there were a couple group hangs that we were all together. But, I mean, at the end of the day, Scott and I just ended up being very good friends, and he.
- [65:54]
Lauren O'Brien
Wait, so you guys came to Dave and told him? How did he take it?
- [65:58]
Amanda Hirsch
So Scott reached out to Dave, and Dave, I think, was like. I think said to Scott, like, it's, you know, all good. Like, you guys are great. But then I think there were some, like, other comments to other people about how it might have been too soon for me, which, at the time, I was like, this was. We broke up six months ago, and it's not like you and I have been chatting or anything. Yeah, I didn't feel like there was anything wrong with that.
- [66:20]
Lauren O'Brien
I wonder how his bros and sister feel about that, though. So Scott wasn't the one, but you tried. You wanted to see it out you want. But you're still able to hang out with him in, like, group settings and it's not weird.
- [66:36]
Amanda Hirsch
Yeah, like, we honestly got, like, closer friends from that, and I just thought.
- [66:39]
Lauren O'Brien
Like, nothing, which is a Midwestern thing apparently, too. Megan Mason. Like, you guys are just so nice and polite or something. I don't know that you still like beefing with people.
- [66:50]
Amanda Hirsch
Like, even now with everything with Dave. Like, I. Yes, I hated how he handled things a year ago, but, like, I'm not with him. Like.
- [66:57]
Lauren O'Brien
And also, you're not talking, like, you genuinely throughout this podcast. Even, like, you know, you could have been harsher, and you're a class act, and you've chosen not to. Did you. Speaking of the. The. The cringy guy you hooked up with doing tick tocks, there is another cringy guy doing tick tocks from your season, Ben. Lots of green screens, receipts. Can you tell us anything about how the group is responding to it? Are people icked out? Like, what. What's the vibe around town?
- [67:29]
Amanda Hirsch
So the thing that I don't love so specifically about that is that we just had this whole weekend in Austin together, the south by Southwest, where we, like, watched the reunion, and they flew out, everyone from the cast. And so we were together a lot throughout this weekend. And at that point, Ben had heard these, like, rumbling rumors of Joey and Sarah, and he talked to Joey about it, and they were like, good. And they're like, we're buds. Like, it's fine. Like, no hard feelings. If there's anything there, like, really nothing but good vibes between Joey and Ben. And then we come back and a few days later, Ben is making these tiktoks, like, exposing Sarah and, like, giving her shade about it. And I just. Like, that's where. I just don't understand the disconnect. Like, if you're cool with it, but then you need to, like, bring it online to put Sarah down for your own benefit. Like, that's where. That's where I'm struggling with. I think that's where some other people on the cast are struggling with, too. Everyone's allowed to work through their own shit and, like, have feelings about the way that their ex treated them, but then to, like, bring it directly to social media for the purpose of just, like, their own personal gain. That's where I just don't buy it.
- [68:38]
Lauren O'Brien
Wait, Lauren, remind me who, which one from the cast consulted with Jimmy about what to say at the reunion?
- [68:44]
Amanda Hirsch
Ben.
- [68:45]
Lauren O'Brien
Oh, Ben.
- [68:46]
Amanda Hirsch
Yeah.
- [68:47]
Lauren O'Brien
Oh, my Jesus. Like, like, you think it went so well for him. You won pointers. No, that was insane. I mean, that's when I guess, like the true colors slash, you know, bachelor style. Real intentions of people kind of come through when you're like, when they're so concerned about the TV aspect of it.
- [69:11]
Amanda Hirsch
Totally. They're like, edit. And I, I. That is so something that I'm kind of seeing now is the way people are moving on social media. It's just interesting. I'm like, gathering a lot of new information.
- [69:20]
Lauren O'Brien
I feel like, well, keeping you and moving the way you do because it's perfect and you're gonna find. You're gonna find the one that, you know, doesn't make you tear up every conversation.
- [69:35]
Amanda Hirsch
I hope so. I can't do that again.
- [69:38]
Lauren O'Brien
Well, thank you for coming on, Lauren. It was so good to meet you.
- [69:41]
Amanda Hirsch
Yeah, thank you. This was so fun.
- [69:43]
Lauren O'Brien
Thank you guys so much for listening to this episode of Not Skinny but Not Fat. Follow me on Instagram at Not Skinny but Not Fat. Subscribe to the podcast so you don't. You don't miss any episodes. Rate the podcast that you love so much on Apple Podcasts and write a little review. If you tell me you did, I'll give you a big virtual smoocharoo. Thank you guys so much for listening, and I'll see you next Tuesday.
- [70:12]
Amanda Hirsch
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