Scheana Shay: Her Good Side

Summary

Podcast Title: Not Skinny But Not Fat
Host: Amanda Hirsch
Episode: Scheana Shay: Her Good Side
Release Date: August 5, 2025

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Introduction and Guest Background

In this episode of Not Skinny But Not Fat, host Amanda Hirsch welcomes Sheena Shay, a beloved member of the reality TV show Vanderpump Rules and the author of the New York Times bestselling book, My Good Side. Amanda expresses her excitement about finally meeting Sheena in person after previously featuring her virtually on a different podcast episode.

Amanda Hirsch [07:28]: "I think I've done her virtually years ago, but never have been with her in person. And here we are."

Sheena Shay’s Book: My Good Side

Amanda dives into Sheena's recently released memoir, My Good Side, highlighting its candid exploration of Sheena's journey from her early days in Hollywood to her experiences on Vanderpump Rules. Sheena discusses the book's revelations, including behind-the-scenes details about the show's production and her personal struggles.

Sheena Shay [09:46]: "My Good Side actually became a New York Times best seller. So take that."

Sheena opens up about her demotion during the eighth season of Vanderpump Rules, explaining how the production decided not to pay her adequately, which led her to start her successful YouTube channel to share her true story.

Sheena Shay [10:17]: "It's just a part of my story. And I'm now looking back, in hindsight, thankful that that happened, because it forced me to start my YouTube channel."

Pregnancy During COVID-19 and Health Challenges

The conversation shifts to Sheena's pregnancy during the COVID-19 pandemic, a period she initially describes as the "best time to be pregnant" due to fewer social obligations and more time at home. However, Sheena candidly shares her terrifying experience with HELLP syndrome, a severe form of preeclampsia, which nearly led to fatal complications for both her and her baby.

Sheena Shay [19:33]: "It's basically preeclampsia gone wild. So it's terrifying."

Sheena recounts the harrowing 15-hour labor during which she was diagnosed with HELLP syndrome, detailing the emotional and physical toll it took on her.

Sheena Shay [21:07]: "I'm shaking uncontrollably. I'm like, oh, my God, I'm killing my baby because I'm trying to force her out so I can film a TV show."
Amanda Hirsch [22:00]: "So this syndrome help is like, could be fatal."
Sheena Shay [22:18]: "Could be. Yeah. I had several women reach out and say they either lost a friend or a sister or someone to help syndrome."

In hindsight, Sheena is grateful for the medical intervention that saved her and her baby's lives, reflecting on the possibility of far worse outcomes had she not been closely monitored.

Sheena Shay [22:26]: "What if I did just go into labor and I had a stroke and died because we didn't have enough time to monitor my blood pressure and her heart rate?"

Relationship Struggles and Affairs

A significant portion of the discussion delves into Sheena's personal life, particularly her marriage to Brock Davies and the devastating revelation of his affair. Sheena explains the emotional turmoil she experienced upon discovering Brock's infidelity, both publicly and privately, and how it impacted her mental health and family life.

Sheena Shay [45:30]: "And Brock and I went back and forth with this. There was a leak, a blind item on a blog site that. Then when I announced the book, it resurfaced on Reddit."

Sheena emphasizes the importance of authenticity in her memoir, choosing to disclose the affair despite the potential backlash and personal pain, believing that omitting such a crucial part of her story would render her memoir incomplete.

Sheena Shay [46:05]: "I could have taken it to the grave, but then I would have to be lying the rest of my life. I didn't see how I could write a memoir and not talk about one of the most devastating chapters of my life."
Amanda Hirsch [47:02]: "You also say, which is very interesting, which I could totally see happening, and this goes along with your people pleasing is at. Lisa Vanderpump kind of used you as a, you know, as one of her pawns would call you, ask you to kind of like, do things, steer you in."

The couple engaged in intensive couples therapy and deliberated extensively over whether to include the affair in Sheena's book. Brock supported her decision, understanding the necessity of transparency for the sake of their family's integrity.

Sheena Shay [46:57]: "It was really difficult."
Sheena Shay [47:34]: "At the end of the day, I was just like, look, this is a part of our story, and I think we need to tell it because the book would be incomplete without it."

Online Reactions and Public Perception

Following the publication of her memoir, Sheena addresses the negative online reactions, including skepticism about the authenticity of her account and accusations of seeking attention or book sales. She expresses frustration over the public's tendency to doubt her integrity and the personal attacks she faces.

Sheena Shay [53:35]: "To sell books."
Amanda Hirsch [53:42]: "But isn't that I mean, isn't that wild, too, that people think that you would do that?"
Sheena Shay [53:52]: "I was just like, honey, so we're gonna make up that you had an affair. You're gonna get online, but it's going to sell some books."

Despite these challenges, Sheena remains resilient, focusing on her personal healing and the well-being of her family.

Forgiveness and Moving Forward

Sheena shares her journey towards forgiveness, both for Brock and her best friend Tom Sandoval, who also committed an affair. This path to forgiveness was fraught with emotional struggles, including obsessive thoughts that affected her relationship and mental health.

Sheena Shay [49:45]: "I have to release both if I'm gonna be the best version of myself."
Sheena Shay [51:07]: "I said the words, I forgive you. And I remember that moment. It was like a weight lifted."

Amanda and Sheena discuss the complexities of maintaining a marriage post-affair, the importance of accountability, and the difficult balance between personal healing and public perception.

Continuing Presence in Reality TV

Looking ahead, Sheena affirms her intention to remain involved in reality TV, hinting at future projects and ongoing storytelling that remains true to her authentic self.

Sheena Shay [55:43]: "Whatever. That next chapter is. It'll be on your television screens for sure."

Conclusion

Amanda wraps up the episode by encouraging listeners to read Sheena's memoir, My Good Side, praising its honest and comprehensive portrayal of Sheena's life both on and off the camera.

Amanda Hirsch [56:00]: "Thank you. Go read my good side. It's so good. It's out already."

Sheena expresses gratitude for the opportunity to share her story and hopes that her transparency will resonate with and support others facing similar challenges.

Sheena Shay [56:04]: "Thank you so much."

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Notable Quotes:

• Amanda Hirsch [07:28]: "I think I've done her virtually years ago, but never have been with her in person. And here we are."
• Sheena Shay [09:46]: "My Good Side actually became a New York Times best seller. So take that."
• Sheena Shay [19:33]: "It's basically preeclampsia gone wild. So it's terrifying."
• Sheena Shay [45:30]: "And Brock and I went back and forth with this. There was a leak, a blind item on a blog site that..."
• Sheena Shay [49:45]: "I have to release both if I'm gonna be the best version of myself."
• Sheena Shay [51:07]: "I said the words, I forgive you. And I remember that moment. It was like a weight lifted."

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Key Takeaways:

• Authenticity Matters: Sheena prioritizes honesty in her memoir, choosing to reveal deeply personal and painful experiences to provide a complete narrative of her life.

• Resilience Through Adversity: Despite facing severe health challenges and the emotional devastation of her husband's affair, Sheena demonstrates remarkable strength and a commitment to personal growth and forgiveness.

• Navigating Public Scrutiny: The episode highlights the harsh realities of living under public scrutiny, particularly for reality TV stars, and the impact of online negativity on personal well-being.

• Importance of Support Systems: Sheena credits therapy, supportive relationships, and her focus on family for helping her navigate through her toughest times.

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This episode offers a raw and unfiltered look into Sheena Shay's life, providing listeners with an intimate understanding of her journey through fame, personal struggles, and the path towards healing and self-acceptance.

Transcript

[Sheena Shay]

The following podcast is a Dear media production.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Welcome back to the Not Skinny But Not Fat podcast. I'm your host, Amanda Hirsch, and I still can't believe that I get to chat with some of my favorite stars on my very own podcast, where you'll feel like you're just talking shit with your best friends in your living room. Hi. Hi, Hi. And happy Tuesday to my favorite people on the planet. I hope everybody is doing okay. I had kind of like a May week. Like, you know, when you. You're having a May week and then you check your, like, menstrual cycle and it says you're ovulating. Like, whatever it says, you're like, oh, that makes sense. Like, if it says you're ovulating, you're like, that makes sense. If it says you're like, pre period, you're like, oh, that makes sense. If it's like you're getting your period tomorrow, you're like, oh, duh, that makes sense. So that's kind of where I'm at. I'm just in this, like, me mood. Maybe it's like, Aug August, like, you know what it is, which could be like, that. I'm literally Kim Kardashian and I'm like a work addict. And because summers are slower in the biz, I'm like, give me more. Give me more happenings. Give me more to do. So maybe it's that. Maybe it's that things are getting to me more nowadays. I miss the simpler days of social media. I miss smaller community. I know it's shocking. I know everybody's dream is to grow and to get more followers and to get more people and all this. And, like, I'm telling you, especially if anybody's listening is starting out or is, you know, there's something so special about having, like, a small community. Like, those were the days. I loved it. I felt like I was talking to just a few people that I could say anything I wanted to, that everyone that was there was, like, part of my friend group. And listen, growth is great, and it comes with a lot of pluses, but it's also, I don't know, there's something about it that feels more detached a little bit at times. And. And, yeah, I don't know. So I've just been in my feels about all that stuff and. And that's. That's the other thing that. Then I'm in my feels about that, and I'm like, I didn't used to get in my feels about social media. It used to be just like, My, you know, part of my day, that didn't ever make me upset, that didn't ever make me spiral, that didn't ever make me feel like, oh, wait, should I not be on here for this amount of time? So I didn't have that. So that saddens me because I know that I used to be. It used to be just so innocent and so pure. I know it's hard to believe, but there was a time and things change and things evolve, and again, it comes with its advantages and disadvantages. But anyway, you know, Jamie Lee Curtis also said something this week that really spoke to me. They're doing her and Lindsay Lohan doing, like, the. All the press for Freakier Friday, which I'm so excited to see and actually love that Lindsay is, like, dressing on theme for these premieres, even though, like, one time she's, like, dressing on theme on, like, a Freaky Friday theme, another day she's, like, being Annie from Parent Drop. So it's like, love it. Like, why are we doing Parent Trap for Freak your Friday? But I'm down. I'm into it. I'm eating it up. And listen, I'll say it once and I'll say it again. She is one of the people in the world which, like, I hope nobody ever turns on her, but that, like, people are just die for her. Anything she does, people are rooting for her. Really, really, really rooting. And it's special to see, especially in this world filled to hate, that there is one person, Lindsay Lohan, that everybody's rooting for. It's really cool. But anyway, Jamie Lee Curtis, you know, they get asked a lot about their relationship, and one of the times they asked Jamie about her relationship with Lindsay and, like, meeting her when she was 15. And, you know, and Jamie said, when I met Lindsay, I told her, listen, this world is very transactional, and I can promise you that I will be the one person that doesn't want anything from you. And then she said, now I. The only thing I'll ask her is, like, to do things for, like, the children's hospital, which obviously is like a mitzvah. But she's like, I won't ask anything of her. And, like, she knows that I'm just there for her, like, as a person, as a friend, as a human, as a colleague. And it is true, this world is so transactional and moreover, not to burst the bubble, fake. And I think for me is, like a real person that tends to have some naivete when it comes to why and how people operate. I Have no problem with it being fake if I can, like, feel the fakeness and, like, observe it, accept it, and move on. But I think the times that I get upset is when I'm kind of duped with the fakeness. So I think for me, it's just learning, really, after all these years, which, again, thank God I wasn't, like, an overnight TikTok sensation. But just learning after all these years, like, really the ropes. Like, you learn, you learn, you learn. And then you're like, okay, this is also part of it. Like, you got to not be duped. And a lot of celebs, you know, they've been in this industry a really long time. So when Jamie said that she knew what she was saying, what she meant was, you're gonna meet a lot of people, and a lot of them are gonna, you know, be nice to you or act like, whatever. But, like, don't trust them. Trust me. Anyway. On to the next on. On to the next. Aside from Ana de Armas and Tom Cruise dating, which is like, should we be concerned for Anna, who loves the older mans? Let's roll into today's episode. On today's show, we are continuing with our reality TV streak. The Valley has been fudgeing crazy this season. Vanderpump is not coming back as we know it. However, Sheena Shay from Vanderpump and OG has just come out with a book, My Good side. I read it. I can no longer say I don't read. I do read. I read this in, like, two freaking days. I love it. She really spills the tea about all the behind the scenes of filming Vanderpump, what she did in Hollywood before she got on Vanderpump, who she did in Hollywood before she became part of Vanderpump. So she really goes there. You guys, you guys. My Good side actually became a New York Times best seller. So take that. Take it, take it. And she's here today to talk. So here we go. Here we go. My episode with Sheena Shay, by the way. Sheena also, like, I think I've done her virtually years ago, but never have been with her in person. And here we are. Me as Shinishai Shishu. Shishu. Shishu. She. Have we done it in person ever?

[Sheena Shay]

Wait, I don't think we have.

[Amanda Hirsch]

No, we have.

[Sheena Shay]

Have we?

[Amanda Hirsch]

I'll tell you when.

[Sheena Shay]

One.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Okay, this was. I. Which. Thank you. Because you had me on yours, I think.

[Sheena Shay]

Oh, yes, we did.

[Amanda Hirsch]

It was at this random podcast.

[Sheena Shay]

1.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Oh, that was their stud. Do you remember where it was in this building.

[Sheena Shay]

It was on Maple in Beverly Hills.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Yes.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

And Janet was doing it with you at the time. Yeah. And I didn't know who she. Because she wasn't on the show yet or anything. And that was. I don't even know what year that was. Probably pre pandemic six years ago. Babies.

[Sheena Shay]

Pre. For sure.

[Amanda Hirsch]

PR Babies. Because I only realized really now, that Summer and Noah are similar because you were talking about being pregnant during COVID So she's turning five also.

[Sheena Shay]

She turned four in April.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Four in April. Okay.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

So a little bit younger than Noah. But that's wild. When you. You spoke about this in your book, just being. You just said it out loud, like, with no hesitations. But you were just, like, being pregnant during COVID was, like, the best thing ever.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah. I mean, I didn't miss out on anything. No music festivals, no trips.

[Amanda Hirsch]

I mean, for you, it's because you're into that kind of stuff. Yeah, I am not into music festivals. But it was still actually the best time to be pregnant because even eating out, you didn't have to ask, like, the questions about the food and if it's home, the dress. You were just at home all the time.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah. And we were living in San Diego at the time, so we had literal sunset beach walks every single night. It was so nice.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Yeah. I realized reading the book because, you guys, I read the book, Sheena's book, My Good side. I finished it in less than 48 hours.

[Sheena Shay]

I love that.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Which my listeners, my people know. Which I feel like at this point, I can't say I don't read books, because I've been reading books, but I'm not. I don't read many books. So read your book.

[Sheena Shay]

Yay.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Loved it. Loved it. Such an easy read as well, which is important to me. And I love that we just got to hear your whole story. Like, all the behind the scenes, everything from. From birth, literally, until now.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

And all the behind the scenes of the seasons, and you get into the details about. I don't even think we knew about, like, you being demoted, for instance.

[Sheena Shay]

No, it's not anything I ever opened up about. I didn't think I was allowed to talk about it, so I was shocked I was able to keep it in the book.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Well, I feel like with Housewives, you know. Right. Cause it's like the apple. She doesn't have the apple. The cast knows where they're standing. Friend of the. I feel like for Vanderpump, we never thought about that.

[Sheena Shay]

And that's what they said. No one watching the show would have any idea I was still in every episode. I was still in opening credits.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Yeah.

[Sheena Shay]

But they just didn't want to pay me.

[Amanda Hirsch]

It's all about the payment.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

And you went into, like, the day rate versus the. Does that. Does that feel like a knock to your ego to talk about stuff like that?

[Sheena Shay]

No, not necessarily. It's just, you know, it's a part of my story. And I'm now looking back, in hindsight, thankful that that happened, because it forced me to start my YouTube channel. And I would have never done that had I not felt so undervalued at the time, because I felt like you're only showing part of my story now. You're not even paying me for the full story, so you're not getting it. So I'm gonna put it on YouTube. And I don't think I ever would have started a YouTube channel had that not happened to me.

[Amanda Hirsch]

And it took off your YouTube channel and you're still doing it, like, vlogging every Wednesday. Every Wednesday. For the demotion part. You got demoted for the season where there were. The new cast was coming.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah, season eight.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Okay. So that. I mean, they tried the new cast thing, and it didn't really.

[Sheena Shay]

Right. And they. I mean, after season eight, that's when it was gonna split off to what's now the Valley, and the new Vanderpump rules. So I was supposed to be a part of both of them. So I was still at the restaurant. I was integrating the new cast members. I'm hanging out with the OGs, and I'm like, I'm doing twice the work for half the day.

[Amanda Hirsch]

You literally, by the way. So we didn't know this, but it all clicked for me because I was like. I remember you being the only connection because nobody was talking to the new people.

[Sheena Shay]

No, just me.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Just you and you. You got the short end of the stick and that. And then they brought you back as full time for which season?

[Sheena Shay]

Season nine. There was no way I was coming back after a pandemic. Having a B. Yeah. Going back to the restaurant, just being on a day raid. I had already been without the show for, like, a year and a half. We had a full season off meeting with production and whatnot. I was like, look, if I'm coming back days postpartum. Because the day that production was supposed to start was days after my due date. And they put me back up season nine, only to take it away again. Season ten.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Wait. I cannot believe three days postpartum, the cameras went Back up three days post.

[Sheena Shay]

Coming home from the hospital because I was hospitalized for like five days.

[Amanda Hirsch]

That's insane.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

And especially with the birds that you had, though.

[Sheena Shay]

I know. And you don't see any of that story.

[Amanda Hirsch]

It's all filming floor in the hospital going.

[Sheena Shay]

Not in the hospital, but the first scene. Brock and I are in the kitchen talking about what a traumatic birth I just have. I could have almost died going through all of these things. Just how scary that was. Still not even fully processing it. And then cut to. We sit down in the living room. We're eating. It looks like I've clearly been crying. But it was really important to find out if Lala and Katie were being invited to the hibachi dinner for my birthday. Who cares that you almost died last week? Who's coming to dinner?

[Amanda Hirsch]

Oh, my God. That's wild.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

How do you do that? Just disconnect, like, prioritize. What?

[Sheena Shay]

I think it was just all kind of a blur. I was like, you know what? I have a job to do. The job is to film. And so I just showed up and diaper on, did my job.

[Amanda Hirsch]

I can't believe you did that.

[Sheena Shay]

I know. I can't either.

[Amanda Hirsch]

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[Sheena Shay]

We're about to go deep.

[Amanda Hirsch]

This is my first time. I'm kind of nervous. Wait, did you say come together?

[Sheena Shay]

You've been spending too much time with me.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Hey, I'm Erin Daniella, and this is my husband, Abe. Hey. We've been married for over 10 years. We have almost four kids, and we've started and survived more businesses than we can count.

[Sheena Shay]

Some were great. Some, let's just say we learned a lot.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Reality tv, that's just part of our story. But TV has limits. And this show doesn't.

[Sheena Shay]

Our new podcast come together dives into everything. Love, sex, parenting, business, and what it's really like to mix marriage with work. It's raw, it's funny, it's honest. And yes, sometimes it's a little awkward.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Nothing is off the table because let's be real, if you're not coming together, you're probably falling apart.

[Sheena Shay]

Join us every week on Come Together wherever you listen to podcasts.

[Amanda Hirsch]

And we're back hearing more about your birth and help syndrome, is it called.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Which is so scary and often could be fatal. So it's basically preeclampsia leads to that. The high blood pressure.

[Sheena Shay]

Yes.

[Amanda Hirsch]

So basically, help is preeclampsia gone wild.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Wow.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

That's terrifying.

[Sheena Shay]

Really scary.

[Amanda Hirsch]

And you said in the book, too, that, like, you actually scheduled your induction. Yes, because of filming schedules.

[Sheena Shay]

And that was the thing. So when I talked to my doctor, I'm at my 40 week appointment. She's not coming anytime soon. I'm not dilated even. Even the slightest. And he was like, here's the thing, you know, like, yeah, I was perfectly comfortable pregnant. I would have stayed pregnant for 11 months if I could have. Honestly.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Wow.

[Sheena Shay]

I was not ready to get her out. She was safe inside of me. She went everywhere with me, and I didn't have to worry about holding her head up or dropping her. All these fears that I had. And so when I told my doctor, I go, but here's the caveat. I'm supposed to go back to work on whatever it was, like May 2, May 3, and that data is not changing. So we can wait out the pregnancy, see a week or two weeks, but then I could be on camera and my water breaks. Like, they're not going to allow filming in the hospital. I don't want filming in the hospital. So do we induce me or what do we do? And he was like, you know what? He's like. I want you to have as much time as you can getting used to this before cameras are up. So make it to your 40 week appointment. If she doesn't come, I'll induce you a day or two after.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Did you ever wonder if you didn't induce if the birth would have went differently?

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah, I do think about that often while I was in labor, about 15 hours in, when they tell me I have preeclampsia, they need to put me on this magnesium.

[Amanda Hirsch]

You never had high blood pressure throughout your pregnancy?

[Sheena Shay]

Around maybe like my 20 week. It was like at the beginning of my doctor's appointment for like the whole anatomy scan and all that, it was high. Then they took it again after and it was.

[Amanda Hirsch]

So they were like white coat syndrome.

[Sheena Shay]

Exactly. And then the day of my 40 week appointment, my blood pressure was high. I had protein in my urine, but they chalked it up to nerves. And what I ate for breakfast didn't think anything of it. So now I'm 15 hours into labor and her heart rate's dropping. They need to put me on this magnesium drip. I'm just blaming myself.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Sounds so scary.

[Sheena Shay]

It was so scary. I'm shaking uncontrollably. I'm like, oh, my God, I'm killing my baby because I'm trying to force her out so I can film a TV show. What is wrong with me?

[Amanda Hirsch]

I know, but it's. But first of all, obviously it wasn't your fault. And who would know if you would have given birth, you know, if you wouldn't have induced if it would have happened?

[Sheena Shay]

And in hindsight, but it's still, thank God they did induce me because what if I did just go into labor and I had a stroke and died because we didn't have enough time to monitor my blood pressure and her heart rate? Like it could have gone so much worse if I wasn't being monitored for so long, so carefully.

[Amanda Hirsch]

So this syndrome help is like, could be fatal.

[Sheena Shay]

Could be. Yeah. I had several women reach out and say they either lost a friend or a sister or someone to help syndrome.

[Amanda Hirsch]

And that really terrified you. You talk about in the book as well, like, your debates with baby number two. Sounds like you and Brock are at a place where it's kind of sounds like off the table until it's on the table. Yeah, it gets on the table.

[Sheena Shay]

When it comes back on the table, it'll be with the surrogate.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Yeah.

[Sheena Shay]

So next step is fertilizing my eggs. I said I already put the work in. I froze them twice seven years ago, so. And this is where I don't. And Chloe, I'm trying to remember if you talked about this when you had her on your podcast, but it was one thing. Yes, it was one thing that I wish they covered on the show more. Having a natural pregnancy and then having a surrogate releasing that control, but then struggling to bond with her baby.

[Amanda Hirsch]

She. I mean, she talked about it a lot on. On the show, which I think is so great that she did because.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah, it skipped like a whole season. And I was like, where is this storyline? I want more of it. And then I feel like the last one, it kind of came back to it, but I felt like we missed that first year. I want to have like a. Not my actual sister, but like a surrogate sister. You know, where we have our surrogates pregnant at the same time and can go through the motions together.

[Amanda Hirsch]

You love doing something together, Sheena.

[Sheena Shay]

It was so fun to have three of my closest friends pregnant at the same time. Lala, Stassi and Brittany.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Oh.

[Sheena Shay]

And I mean, I. Other friends that, like, people don't even know. It was just like so many.

[Amanda Hirsch]

I know. It is wild that you all ended up pregnant at the same time.

[Sheena Shay]

I know. And that was not planned.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Yeah, that wasn't.

[Sheena Shay]

Not my part, for sure.

[Amanda Hirsch]

And you, are you friends with Sassy today? You mentioned her in your book a couple times.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Just about your differences. It sounds like there's something in Stasi that, like, maybe you wish you had a little bit of maybe a chutzpah or like, her. Because you talk about being a people pleaser a lot in the book and she's not that obviously. So is that the thing that you're, like, would want from her?

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah, I think just that confidence that I had. Season one, that season after season was just beat down and kind of taken away. I'm trying to get that back in.

[Amanda Hirsch]

My 40s to get, like, the confidence.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Do you Feel more confident today than you did in your 20s?

[Sheena Shay]

No, 20s. I was the most confident. Yeah. 20s Sheena. Yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

She slapped Cigar Club Sheena.

[Sheena Shay]

30S was Rocky. Yeah. A roller coaster and, you know, 40s. I've only been in it for two months.

[Amanda Hirsch]

So how was your 40th birthday?

[Sheena Shay]

It was iconic.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Yeah.

[Sheena Shay]

It was so fun. We had a house party at my friend's house. They have this beautiful oasis of a backyard, two levels. We had massages, we had magic, we had a s' mores bar. We had a private show.

[Amanda Hirsch]

We threw, like a party. Party.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Did you invite the cast of VPR Valley?

[Sheena Shay]

Most, yeah. Not all.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Who wasn't invited?

[Sheena Shay]

I did not invite Sandoval. I did not invite Jax. I did not invite Jesse Lolly. Everyone else, I think, was invited.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Really?

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Showed up.

[Sheena Shay]

No, everyone didn't show up. But also Kristen, Andia were pregnant, right? Very pregnant.

[Amanda Hirsch]

That is exciting. Turning 40, though, I feel like it's gonna be your decade, I think so. So back to 20s, Sheena. Cigar club Sheena. Which, by the way, that. That portion of the book. So interesting because you really take us through the motions of what it's like to move to la, work in this kind of a place that you intentionally worked at to make connections. Right. And then you actually, like, meet all these famous people.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Including Eddie Cibrian. Okay. By the way, he's very handsome. Like, when you. You don't think of Eddie every day. Okay, I don't think of Eddie every day.

[Sheena Shay]

I certainly don't.

[Amanda Hirsch]

But I was thinking of Eddie in this chapter that you write about him.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

And then I might have gone and, like, stalked him and just trying to remember those dimples, and I'm like, damn, he's cute. Yeah. Like, is cute. Aged well.

[Sheena Shay]

Totally.

[Amanda Hirsch]

And was cute.

[Sheena Shay]

I know.

[Amanda Hirsch]

So he walks into the cigar club you're working at. Was it like, what? One of the hottest guys that walked.

[Sheena Shay]

In there by far.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Really?

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

And you don't recognize him from anything?

[Sheena Shay]

No, not at all.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Because he wasn't like, he was in.

[Sheena Shay]

The one movie I did see was say It Isn't so with Heather Graham. But I didn't recognize him from that movie. It was just when I eventually looked up his IMDb, I was like, oh, my God. I remember thinking, the boyfriend or husband.

[Amanda Hirsch]

What year is this? Like 2000. What?

[Sheena Shay]

This is 2006.

[Amanda Hirsch]

2006.

[Sheena Shay]

Okay. Almost 20 years ago, I met him.

[Amanda Hirsch]

I know. So you meet him and from the beginning, he's flirty and you're like.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah, I'm like, You're cute.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Yeah, but don't Google him. No Googling everybody, then. No, we weren't.

[Sheena Shay]

I didn't even have a laptop. I had to go to, like, the Internet cafe to print out my auditions, so my phone. I don't even think I had a BlackBerry yet when I met him. Like, I still was on, like, a trio.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Yeah, a trio, which I don't even.

[Sheena Shay]

Think had an Internet browser. No, I did have. Even before the trio, it was. I had Verizon, so I didn't get to have a sidekick or, like, a razor. The cool other.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Why? What is it? Why?

[Sheena Shay]

That was, like, a T Mobile thing.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Okay. Okay.

[Sheena Shay]

And so I remember I had this one. It looked like a Sidekick, but it kind of like the screen, like, twisted.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Yes, I had that. I had that.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Oh, those were the fucking days.

[Sheena Shay]

I know.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Okay, so you meet him, you flirt with him, you kind of start hooking up. Didn't know about his wife.

[Sheena Shay]

No, not at all. Ring. Why would I think this guy who doesn't wear a wedding ring, who goes out and has pda. Yeah, why would I think he was married?

[Amanda Hirsch]

And then you do mention that somebody at the club came up to you and tried to tell you, but you kind of chalked it up to, like, it not being true.

[Sheena Shay]

Well, because I confronted him. Oh, so wild.

[Amanda Hirsch]

And he just literally told you. No.

[Sheena Shay]

Like, that's crazy. Like, so gaslighting. That's crazy. Why would you believe that? Why would you think that? Oh, this person doesn't know what they're talking about.

[Amanda Hirsch]

And you still didn't Google.

[Sheena Shay]

No, I didn't. It never crossed my mind. Call me naive, but I just. I never even thought about it. I took his word for it. So in this trusting, as we've learned.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Yeah. Wait, in this cigar. He was PDA at the cigar club.

[Sheena Shay]

No, not at. Okay.

[Amanda Hirsch]

When you went out. Out.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah, we would go out after my shifts.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Okay, so here's the thing that people might not realize about that time, basically, he was having two side women, Right?

[Sheena Shay]

Eventually, yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Eventually. Yeah. At the point where. Where Brandy found out already, like, he was with you and with Leanne. Rhymes. Which, by the way, they're thriving still together. I've done the stalking. She's.

[Sheena Shay]

At least they made it through, you know?

[Amanda Hirsch]

I mean, yes, yes.

[Sheena Shay]

Leave your spouses for each other. It's.

[Amanda Hirsch]

It's a big deal. Yeah, but still, do. Did Leanne get the brunt of it as well, in the public, or do you feel like.

[Sheena Shay]

I think so. I feel like it was just me and Maybe because they worked out. I don't know. I mean, maybe she did.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Yeah.

[Sheena Shay]

It was so long ago. That was like 2009.

[Amanda Hirsch]

I know, but it was kind of your intro as you talk about two vanderpump rules, and you kind of also talk about how maybe you were kind of tricked into it in a way by Lisa VanderBM.

[Sheena Shay]

I just felt like I didn't have the full story when I was going into this. When I agreed to work this party at sur, I knew they were gonna be filming for Housewives. I did not know that Brandi Glanville was new on the show that season. I had no idea. I just thought, okay, I'm just gonna be there, background, pass my goat cheese balls and go home and collect my check.

[Amanda Hirsch]

And you felt like maybe they were trying to have a situation.

[Sheena Shay]

I mean, totally.

[Amanda Hirsch]

But you didn't end up having a situation. You went home.

[Sheena Shay]

I mean, it became a situation. Yeah. And then I got sent home.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Right.

[Sheena Shay]

And then time and time again when I was working at the restaurant, both on and off camera, if Brandi was coming in, it was like I had to go home. I'm like, but I need to make money. So now I can't make tips because she's coming in. Can't I be in a different section?

[Amanda Hirsch]

Do you think there was a conversation that went on when Lisa was trying to, like, sell the idea for the show? Like, listen, we have one waitress who hooked up. You think that was, like, the seller, a selling point?

[Sheena Shay]

It's kind of been confirmed to me now that she did know all along.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Oh, right. At the. What was at the vpr at the dog gala. Somebody a producer told you. Yeah, that. What?

[Sheena Shay]

That she was worried in the beginning that the Disney girl who had a connection to Eddie wasn't going to join the show. But then she did and she did.

[Amanda Hirsch]

And this whole. What do they used to call you in the first season?

[Sheena Shay]

A home wrecking whore?

[Amanda Hirsch]

Homewrecking or. But that wasn't even you. No, you didn't wreck the home.

[Sheena Shay]

I didn't. He wrecked his own home. Why is it always on the woman?

[Amanda Hirsch]

No, and secondly, like, you didn't successfully wreck the home. No. Like Leanne. Sorry, Leanne. Love you.

[Sheena Shay]

Love you.

[Amanda Hirsch]

But like, she. The wrecking the home means the man, you know, you end up. Up leaving. You start a new life, which he did with Leanne. Now with you. No, but you got the home wrecking horror. And looking back and. And remembering just those times and all the girls calling you these names, it reminds me kind Of. Of, like, Internet culture now, which is even worse than back then, which is like, you hate somebody and you do everything in your power to find out anything bad they've ever done to take them down. And I'm always like, like, those people don't care about the bad thing that person did. They just hate them and want to take them down. And I feel like this is kind of true to that. Where, like, did they care about Brandy Glanville and Eddie and ruining their marriage? No. They just didn't like you or you rubbed them the wrong way and they had this thing on you.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

To use against you. You know what I mean?

[Sheena Shay]

Absolutely. And then it was like, oh, well, if Sheena's trying to steal Brandy's man, she's gonna try and steal our man. No, Stassi, I do not want Jax Taylor. You can have him.

[Amanda Hirsch]

I mean, that's wild that that was about Jax. Yeah. But how did it actually feel?

[Sheena Shay]

Like Kristen thought I wanted Tom Sandoval. Back in the day. She would sit at the bar at Villa Blanca and just, like, watch us bartend together.

[Amanda Hirsch]

And I'm like, and you never had a flirty thing with Sandoval?

[Sheena Shay]

I think I naturally have flirty energy. And so I could see how that was maybe taken the wrong way. But I was fully in a relationship with Shay when I was working with Sandoval.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Right.

[Sheena Shay]

So it was never like that at all.

[Amanda Hirsch]

We'll be right back after the break. I was thinking of posting this last night, but I had a gazillion stories, so I'm gonna tell you right here and right now. One of the things that really became a staple in my routine is protein powder, and let me tell you why. One of my favorite protein powders is Clean Simple Eats. It's clean and it's the best tasting. Okay. Their protein powder is always grass fed. No seed oils, no artificial ingredients. Third party tested, non GMO and gluten free. Clean Simple Eats protein powder has 20 grams of protein per scoop. It's incredibly creamy and smooth. What I love to do sometimes, like last night I made literally a hot chocolate with the chocolate brownie. One delicious, like, okay. Hot cocoa with 20 grams of protein. This morning I made a smoothie with some berries. I used the vanilla this time I added some nut milk, some cashew butter, and some flaxseeds and it was delicious and nutritious. Clean Simple Eats has amazing flavors to choose from. They have a protein powder variety pack, so you can try individual servings or multiple flavors. I love that by the way you should check that one out. So visit cleansimpleats.com and use my code not skinny20 at checkout for 20% off your first order. That's clean Simple Eats.com the code is not skinny20 for 20% off your first Order. The link will also be in my show notes. Okay Moms, let's talk about postpartum. Nobody really prepares you for how much your body goes through after giving birth. You're healing, you're exhausted, you're trying to keep a tiny human alive, and taking care of yourself can feel impossible. One of the things that you really need to be on top of is getting your vitamins in. And that's why I love Ritual. They actually have a postnatal multivitamin that's specifically made to support your body in recovery, especially if you're breastfeeding. It's got things like DHA for brain support, vitamin D, iron, and all the nutrients your body is craving during this crazy time. The best part about Ritual is they're traceable so you know exactly what you're putting into your body and why. Honestly, I struggled with remembering to eat full meals in those early days that honestly seem like a blur. Taking Ritual every day made me feel like, okay, my mind is at ease. At least I know that I'm covering my bases nutritionally. Plus, they have delayed release capsules that are easy on the stomach. Super important to me. They smell minty fresh, which is a lifesaver when you're already feeling queasy or run down. When it comes to pregnancy and postpartum support, you want products backed by research and transparency. Mom founded Ritual puts in the work and shows you the proof. Get 25% off your first [e-mail] not skinny. That's ritual.com not skinny for 25% off. These statements have not been evaluated by the FDA. The product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease. You know that feeling watching Project Runway and suddenly thinking, like, I could totally design a gown out of like paper towels and duct tape. Until you remember that you cannot even draw a stick figure and that those designers are actually geniuses and talented. And you're not. Anyway, Project runways back in dramatic fashion and the icon Heidi Klum returns to the mother of all fashion shows. Now on Freeform, Hulu and Disney plus, Project Runway is a place where dreams can come true. World renowned fashion designer Christian Siriano will mentor 12 designers in the ultimate competition of creativity and passion. Fan favorite judge Nina Garcia is not easy to please. Per us and New judge La Roach, our pod friend, will be your new obsession at the Runway show. The designers better bring their best in front of law or he's gonna let them know, like only he can. Project Runway is back, you guys, and it's going to be better than ever. There's drama in the workroom. There is jaw dropping looks on the Runway, and of course, there are iconic judges, including Our pod friend, LaRoch, our girl Heidi Klum, Christian Siriano, which you know and love, and more. Project Runway Thursdays at 10pm on a freeform stream on Hulu and Disney. And we're back. You dated a lot of actors. You mentioned a few of them. J.C. chase, Jesse McCartney, which, by the way, had a huge crush on him. Did you? Were you dating him during the time of Beautiful.

[Sheena Shay]

Okay, so I would like to clear this up. When it's not dating, there a lot of these were hookups. Some were once, some were multiple times. Like Jesse Metcalf fully dated, like, yes, we were dating, but most of the other ones I rattled off. I mean, it was. It was more of a.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Was it a hookup? Yeah, we're all like hookup hookups, but.

[Sheena Shay]

Some of them, I mean, it was like over a year, it was over two years that there were several consistent ones on the rotation.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Who was like the best hookup? Jamar Shamar. Okay, so I wanted to ask you about John Mayer a little bit.

[Sheena Shay]

Okay.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Because John Mayer is the reason you ended up getting fired from the cigar club. You could tell I read the book, can you not?

[Sheena Shay]

Yes.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Is this insane?

[Sheena Shay]

I love it.

[Amanda Hirsch]

I know. Because it's so many details. You guys, look at all these deets. So you. Nobody found out about you and Eddie. Like, you didn't get fired for that.

[Sheena Shay]

Eddie wasn't a member, so that was okay. You weren't allowed to fraternize with the members. And John also wasn't a member of the Beverly Hills Club, but apparently he was a member of the New York club.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Yeah.

[Sheena Shay]

Which I didn't know about and honestly wouldn't have cared. I still would have done it. John Mayer.

[Amanda Hirsch]

So, like, with these celebs that you hooked up with, is what turned you on, that they were famous or did you actually like them?

[Sheena Shay]

Both. I mean, Jesse Metcalf, like, I had a crush on him just from watching him on TV when I was in college.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Yeah.

[Sheena Shay]

The hot gardener on Desperate Housewives. And then John Tucker, you know, so that, I mean, when I met him, it was like, oh, my God, this is Jesse Metcalf.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Right.

[Sheena Shay]

But then I Mean, he was just a normal guy who liked to play the guitar for me and take me on dates and stuff. So there was definitely that appeal back in the day. Yeah, but they all were genuinely nice guys. Like, there's not one guy I named in there who was an asshole.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Really? None of them, like, narcissists? Just.

[Sheena Shay]

No, not that I can really about. Of the ones I named, I. I left some.

[Amanda Hirsch]

You left some out? I know. You said, like, two actors from the Notebook.

[Sheena Shay]

I was like, what?

[Amanda Hirsch]

These are the. This is. We're not mentioning, like, who was in the note, but two. Okay, let's say Ryan Gosling. She's not confirming or denying.

[Sheena Shay]

Not confirming or denying.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Another one.

[Sheena Shay]

Yes.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Oh, I know.

[Sheena Shay]

E. Not confirming or denying.

[Amanda Hirsch]

How did you decide who you're naming and who you're not?

[Sheena Shay]

Because I thought for that it was when I watched the movie that I realized I was like, oh, yeah, I hadn't seen the movie in years.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Okay.

[Sheena Shay]

And so I was like, that would just be funny to put in the book, like, two actors from the Notebook.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Oh, that was like a choice.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Just not to name it.

[Sheena Shay]

And I didn't need to rattle off all of the athletes because there were quite a few. And I'm like, we're already dropping a lot of names.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Maybe.

[Sheena Shay]

Maybe there's another book one day, you.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Know, and you don't need to get, like, approvals or anything. Like, with. With like, mentioning people in a book.

[Sheena Shay]

No, if they're a public figure, it's fair game. But I was careful with what details I shared, what details I didn't share because I did want to be respectful. I'm not trying to write a tell all book about anyone other than myself.

[Amanda Hirsch]

That's true. That's. That's. That's nice of you.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Is there a celeb that really wanted to hook up with you that you didn't give a chance to?

[Sheena Shay]

Ooh, trying to think.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Someone at the cigar club Villa Blanca in the dms.

[Sheena Shay]

I mean, there were several that it was like and everything, but, like, I didn't fully want to have sex with? Yeah, there were some of those.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Yeah.

[Sheena Shay]

But not that I can think of off the top of my head.

[Amanda Hirsch]

And did you end it with any of these guys? Like with Jesse John?

[Sheena Shay]

I feel like they all kind of naturally just fizzled out or, you know, I had someone new in the rotation, so that one went out or this one went on tour, this one was filming or whatever.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Did you ever see Eddie around again?

[Sheena Shay]

No. How insane that I've never Ran into him. LA is so small.

[Amanda Hirsch]

If you ran into him, though, would you say hello?

[Sheena Shay]

I feel like at this point, I mean, we would have to have a laugh. Like.

[Amanda Hirsch]

And what about. I mean, Brandy.

[Sheena Shay]

Brandy, I keep in touch with. Yeah, we. Last time we saw each other was probably BravoCon. But she texted me maybe about five, six months ago. She was with a mutual friend of ours and she was like, oh, so. And so says hi and da, da, da. So I try to keep in touch with her, but, I mean, we're not like best friends, honestly.

[Amanda Hirsch]

I mean, that's better than I would think.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

A lot of Vanderpump rules revelations on. On. In the book, like we said. You said that Kristen revealed on a podcast that they had a meeting about pushing you out.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

At some point during the season, how did that make you feel?

[Sheena Shay]

Like, I mean, I knew that they didn't want me on their show, but to find out years later that they all had this secret meeting of. How can we not include Sheena in scenes and get her kicked off of our show? I'm like, who was the first scene with? It wasn't any of you?

[Amanda Hirsch]

Sorry.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

I mean, Sheena, how do you deal with it for so many years? Like, just the constant berating from other cast members or wanting to be friends and not wanting to be friends or trying to ice you out. Like, what kept you so strong all these years?

[Sheena Shay]

For some seasons, weed. For other seasons, therapy. And overall, just not giving a fuck. You know, just living my truth. Knowing that me being on reality tv, even if you're only going to show one side of me, you're still showing a side that people can relate to. I'm still getting to share lived experiences with the world and. But, you know, that's what we have podcasts for, and that's why I wrote a book.

[Amanda Hirsch]

And you also say, which is very interesting, which I could totally see happening, and this goes along with your people pleasing is at. Lisa Vanderpump kind of used you as a, you know, as one of her pawns would call you, ask you to kind of like, do things, steer you in. In directions. And you mentioned that there was something that happened that you didn't kind of follow through with and that you feel like after that the relationship between you changed. Like when you didn't follow the orders.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah. I mean, there was no way I was gonna say that. I think James should continue working here when he's insulting women's bodies. That is not okay.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Right.

[Sheena Shay]

I tried to chime in and be like, well, Katie, what if you don't work on Tuesdays? And she was like, no, it's me or him. I was like, I agree. That was it. I was like, nope.

[Amanda Hirsch]

And you feel like after that, what?

[Sheena Shay]

Lisa Vanderpump, she knew that she couldn't completely convey the story she wanted through me anymore.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Yeah.

[Sheena Shay]

Because at the end of the day, something may come out of my mouth. That's not my original thought, but if I repeat it, I have to be accountable for it.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Right.

[Sheena Shay]

And after years of doing things that sometimes felt out of character, which also I think I even did more recently on season 11. But.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Like, what? Season 11.

[Sheena Shay]

You know, with.

[Amanda Hirsch]

With Sandoval.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

You think you went too hard for him?

[Sheena Shay]

I think that I could have done things a lot better.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Yeah.

[Sheena Shay]

But when someone who is an authority figure is coming to me and telling me, this person who you've cared about for 15 years is suicidal. And I felt like essentially after that conversation, it was like, there's gonna be blood on your hands if he does anything. What am I supposed to do? Just say, oh, well, like, no.

[Amanda Hirsch]

So then, I mean, you were also very emotional this season, which now it'll make sense. Now that the book comes out, it all makes sense. Like, okay. Projecting.

[Sheena Shay]

Absolutely. Yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

If you guys don't know what we're talking about, it's the bombshell revelation in your book that Brock cheated when you were pregnant. Big thing to. To tell the world about.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah. And, you know, I could have taken it to the grave, but then I would have to be lying the rest of my life. I didn't see how I could write a memoir and not talk about one of the most devastating chapters of my life and how I came out on the other side of it. It felt like the whole book, it would be inauthentic.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Yeah.

[Sheena Shay]

It wouldn't be a piece of work that I'm truly proud to stand behind because it just wouldn't feel like the whole story.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Yeah.

[Sheena Shay]

And Brock and I went back and forth with this. There was a leak, a blind item on a blog site that. Then when I announced the book, it resurfaced on Reddit. So I'm like, okay, well, there's already this. Sure. We can lie about it and just say like, no, that's bullshit. I think people wouldn't have believed it anyways.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Right.

[Sheena Shay]

You also involved another person here, and at any point in time, this woman can come forward.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Yeah.

[Sheena Shay]

So I'm not willing to hide this anymore and not put it in the book because it just didn't Feel right. I needed to tell our whole story. As hard as it was to write, to read out loud on the audiobook, I mean, it was really difficult.

[Amanda Hirsch]

But, I mean, you mentioned the book, that he supported us. But what were those conversations like?

[Sheena Shay]

Oof. Not good. Lots of tears. Couples therapy sessions. And ultimately we weighed the pros and the cons. We talked about, you know, what could be the backlash. But at the end of the day, I was just like, look, this is a part of our story, and I think we need to tell it because the book would be incomplete without it.

[Amanda Hirsch]

And he accepted that.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah. At the end of the day, I mean, it was probably eight months of going back and forth, really, the first.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Time, like, if to include it or not to include it.

[Sheena Shay]

Ye. I. The book sold without it. Oh, they had no idea when they bought the book. And the book sold very quickly after my meeting. So the fact that it sold with a very vague description of what chapter 16 could look like, I'm like, I think the book's good enough without it. And so I was way leaning more towards, let's not put it in. Protect our family. Summer's gonna find out about this one day if we put it in the book. But then after going back and forth and just thinking about, okay, so then say this gets brought up on whatever season of whatever show we're filming, I'm just gonna continue to lie.

[Amanda Hirsch]

You would be a liar. Yeah, I'm.

[Sheena Shay]

I'm not a liar. I am an open book. And I can't write a memoir and not talk about this, because also, I'm really proud of myself for having the strength to stay, to forgive and to keep the family together, because that wasn't an easy decision to make. It wasn't.

[Amanda Hirsch]

We were debating for a long time.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah. And that's why I didn't bring it up. Season 11. I wasn't so ready to.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Now, looking back at season 11, you guys, and. And remembering Sheena riding for Sandoval, deciding the, you know, being Team Ariana, but wanting to forgive him, like, all of that. And how long before you're filming did you find out about this affair?

[Sheena Shay]

Two months.

[Amanda Hirsch]

So, like, do you understand now that you were, like, the whole season was probably fueled by that.

[Sheena Shay]

Oh, yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

I mean, you were literally projecting your situation onto this. You say in the book, too, like a line that's like, if you didn't forgive Sandoval, then, like, how could you forgive. Yeah, Brock. But you also say that you kind of regret a lot of your actions in season 11. So what do you. What do you wish the most that you. You would have done differently?

[Sheena Shay]

I think that the affair wasn't even my biggest issue with Sandoval. It was the lack of accountability. And I kind of wish that I. What is it called, like, held his feet to the fire a little harder. You know, I think that because I so badly wanted to be able to forgive my husband for an affair, how could I not forgive my best friend of 15 years who did the same thing? Not to me.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Right.

[Sheena Shay]

And in. I know people like to say I try to make everything about me, but I was trying to not make this about me, but also figure out how I can work towards a path of forgiveness and so I can sleep at night so I can have some peace. And hating Brock, hating Tom, that was not bringing me peace. So it was like I had to release both if I was gonna be the best version of myself. Cause there were many sleepless nights, so many tears. I have an extremely empathetic daughter, and every time she would see me cry, she would get tears in her eyes. And I was like, I. I can't do this anymore. Like, I just need to have some peace in my life. And if that means I give you some grace because you're suicidal, then I'm gonna give you some grace. But it was a little too much, maybe.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Yeah, a little too much. You know, how didn't you slip up like that whole season of filming or in Interview, I mean, just talking about cheating and cheating and cheating.

[Sheena Shay]

I was pre. At the. It was easy because I was protecting my daughter. I wasn't even protecting Bra. I was protecting her. And that's the easiest thing in the world.

[Amanda Hirsch]

And what about writing about that and knowing that she'll read it one day?

[Sheena Shay]

Thankfully, I think we've got several years to figure out how we're going to.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Like, just flipping through the book.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah. There's a lot of things I think about, you know, how are we going to explain her half siblings? How are we going to explain this? If you do a surrogate, that's going to be the soonest. How do we explain? Yeah, so I don't know. She's only four right now. I'm just trying to figure out where she's going to go to kindergarten.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Did you forgive him? Can you say I did.

[Sheena Shay]

I said the words, I forgive you. And I remember that moment. I remember exactly where we were. And it just. It was like a weight lifted. It was like I needed to say those words because I was so angry for so long. And I don't even remember how long it was until I said, you put.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Him through the gauntlet for a while.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah. He slept in the guest room, which honestly is a really comfortable bed, so it should have been the couch. But, yeah, we were not good for a very long time.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Like, you feel like you're not going to be bringing this up in. In a fight. Like, how do you move past. You know how. Like, there's that thing that you can bring up in a fight. Like, you did this. Like, how do you move past that? Like, but you. Like, that's probably part of the work really hard.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah. I mean, it does. It takes a lot of work. There were times where he would leave his Apple Watch at home and not take his phone because he's going on a run. And I'm like, are you really going on a run? And then it's like, I have the intrusive thoughts already from my ocd. But then that took them to another level.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Yeah.

[Sheena Shay]

And then everyone wants to say, when I told Sandoval, like, he made me have these thoughts about Brock and Lala that I already had insecure thoughts, obviously, about Brock because of what he did.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Right.

[Sheena Shay]

But then when the Internet started noticing away, Brock and Lala looked at each other on one of my vlogs. And then I'm like, oh, my God. Well, if Tom and Rick Held was like, that did put that in my head as well. I know Lala never would. I know Brock never would. But then I was like, but what if?

[Amanda Hirsch]

But what if?

[Sheena Shay]

And so.

[Amanda Hirsch]

And we didn't even know the. The part that, like, he actually had.

[Sheena Shay]

Exactly. So, I mean, my mind would go crazy. We live next door to each other in Palm Springs. When he would go over there to, you know, check on the girls, I'm like, is that what he's really doing? Are they, like, it just. My mind went so insane because I'm like, how could Tom and Raquel have.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Done this for so long and lied so blatantly to everyone's faces, to our faces? So where do you go from here? Now that you talked about the affair publicly, everybody knows. What has been the response online? I feel like.

[Sheena Shay]

Couldn't tell you. I've, for one, stayed out of the comment section.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Really.

[Sheena Shay]

I know my sister who helps do my Instagram is.

[Amanda Hirsch]

I mean, the only thing I kind of saw people say, which is so. I mean, you're already used to this is some people think you're making it up all right.

[Sheena Shay]

To sell books.

[Amanda Hirsch]

To sell books or for attention or. But isn't that I mean, isn't that wild, too, that people think that you would do that?

[Sheena Shay]

Right? I'm like, hey, honey, so we're gonna make up that you had an affair. You're gonna get online, but it's going to sell some books. Who in their right mind would agree to that?

[Amanda Hirsch]

Where did it come from that people think that you want to make everything about you? Like, I mean, it's become kind of funny. Probably not to you, but at this point, the joke is like, no. How does she not feel?

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah. Has anyone checked on Sheena?

[Amanda Hirsch]

Right? Anyone? How does that do? It makes you.

[Sheena Shay]

I mean, it. It doesn't make me annoyed or upset or anything. I'm just like, yeah, whatever, now I've embraced it. I like to be checked in on. Okay. Ask how I'm doing. Ask how my daughter's doing.

[Amanda Hirsch]

It's like, somebody has huge news and they're like, check on Gina. You're like, like, thank you. I'm doing well. Everything's good.

[Sheena Shay]

But I think that came from a moment when I was in Tahoe with Lala. I'm lying in bed with her. I am going through just emotional turmoil in my head. I can't even talk to my husband in Tahoe about it because there's mics and cameras everywhere. So I'm just literally, literally suffering in silence. Like, I think I was, like, texting him certain things.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Like, Right.

[Sheena Shay]

Because I just. I was, like, screaming. And then when I found out about Dancing with the Stars, it was just like the icing on the cake, finding out about it publicly and not from my best friend. And I'm like, that something that she knew Tom and I always wanted to do, and she wanted to do this show and whatever.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Right. You mentioned in the book that you.

[Sheena Shay]

But I'm like, two things can be true at once. I was so, so thrilled for her. I was there night after night after night, cheering her on.

[Amanda Hirsch]

By the way, what's up with Dancing with the Stars? Have they ever talked to you?

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah. It's the same casting director as Masked singer.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Okay.

[Sheena Shay]

And she does a lot of other shows, so, you know, that was a dream of 20s and 30s Sheena. It's not a dream of 30s Sheena. No, I. I mean, that was a.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Dream of 20s and 30s Sheena, not a 40s Sheena.

[Sheena Shay]

It's not a dream of 40s Sheena.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Okay. But you never know.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah, you never know.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Do you feel like you're gonna stay on reality TV in some way, shape or form?

[Sheena Shay]

Yes.

[Amanda Hirsch]

You do.

[Sheena Shay]

Definitely.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Definitely.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Okay.

[Sheena Shay]

Whatever. That next chapter is. It'll be on your television screens for sure.

[Amanda Hirsch]

I'm excited.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Thank you for coming, Sheena. Thank you everyone. Go read my good side. It's so good. It's out already.

[Sheena Shay]

Yeah.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Such a good read. Thank you for sharing everything.

[Sheena Shay]

Thank you so much.

[Amanda Hirsch]

Thank you guys so much for listening to this episode of Knots Can Eat but Not Fat. Follow me on Instagram at Not Skinny but Not Fat. Subscribe to the podcast so you don't miss any episodes. Rate the podcast that you love so much on Apple Podcasts and write a little review. If you tell me you did, I'll give you a big virtual smoocharoo. Thank you guys so much for listening and I'll see you next Tuesday.

[Sheena Shay]

Please note that this episode may contain paid endorsements and advertisements for products and services. Individuals on the show may have a direct or indirect financial interest in products or services referred to in this episode.