A new book from Peter Beinart asks Jewish people to reimagine the Israeli state

Summary

Summary of NPR's Book of the Day Episode: A New Book from Peter Beinart Asks Jewish People to Reimagine the Israeli State

Release Date: February 17, 2025
Host: Leila Fadel
Guest: Peter Beinart, Professor of Journalism and Political Science, Editor at Large of Jewish Currents

Introduction

In this poignant episode of NPR's Book of the Day, host Leila Fadel engages in a deep and thought-provoking conversation with Peter Beinart about his latest book, Being Jewish after the Destruction of Gaza: A Reckoning. Beinart, a respected voice in Jewish American discourse, challenges traditional perspectives on the Israeli state and calls for a reimagining of its role and policies concerning Palestinian lives.

Evolution of Beinart's Perspective ([03:18])

Beinart shares his personal journey from being a staunch defender of Israel to one of its most vocal critics. Raised in a typical American Jewish family where Israel’s existence was a cornerstone of security and identity, Beinart's perspective shifted in his 30s after spending time in the West Bank. An encounter with a Palestinian mother profoundly impacted him:

“What is it like to live with this kind of fear and this kind of vulnerability that there's no army to protect Palestinians in the West Bank. They are at the mercy of the Israeli army that can do these things. And it’s utterly terrifying.”
— Peter Beinart [03:32]

This experience opened his eyes to the trauma and fear endured by Palestinians, something he previously hadn't fully comprehended.

Critique of Israeli Policies and Their Consequences ([05:07])

Beinart addresses the contentious issue of violence within the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, emphasizing that recognizing Palestinian oppression does not justify attacks on civilians. He asserts that enduring peace and safety for Israeli Jews necessitate addressing the underlying conditions that breed violence:

“If one wants to keep Israeli Jews safe, one has to think about the underlying conditions in which this violence... occurred if you're going to keep it from happening again.”
— Peter Beinart [05:23]

He criticizes the blockade and repeated bombings imposed on Palestinians, arguing that such measures exacerbate violence and instability.

Lack of Outrage Within the Jewish Community ([06:22])

Beinart expresses disappointment over the absence of widespread condemnation from the Jewish community following the October 7th attack on Israel. He highlights a tendency within mainstream Jewish discourse to dehumanize Palestinians, which hampers meaningful dialogue and justice:

“One can be outraged by the system of oppression that Israel maintains over Palestinians and still recognize that the lives of Israeli Jews are deeply, deeply precious...”
— Peter Beinart [06:46]

He stresses the importance of maintaining empathy for both Palestinians and Israeli Jews to foster a just and peaceful resolution.

The Core Appeal of the Book ([07:37])

Beinart's book is fundamentally an appeal to re-evaluate the priority given to the Jewish state over the lives of those it controls. He invokes a fundamental Jewish principle:

“States are mere instruments for the protection of human life. And what has happened in mainstream Jewish discourse is that the value of this Jewish state has been elevated above the value of the lives of the people under its control.”
— Peter Beinart [07:42]

He calls for the recognition of the infinite dignity of all human beings, proposing that a vibrant society can exist without a state that privileging one group over another.

Challenging the Concept of a Supremacist State ([09:22])

Beinart delves into the legal and social disparities between Jews and Palestinians, especially in the West Bank. He critiques the dual legal systems that discriminate against Palestinians, labeling the Israeli state as "supremacist":

“Jews and Palestinians live as neighbors under a completely different legal system. Jews enjoy citizenship. Palestinians cannot become citizens. They cannot vote for the government that has life and death power over them.”
— Peter Beinart [09:59]

Despite the controversial nature of terms like "apartheid" and "supremacy," he argues for a frank examination of the realities faced by Palestinians under Israeli governance.

Final Message and Call to Action ([10:46])

In concluding the discussion, Beinart emphasizes that his perspectives are personal and not representative of all Jews. He urges listeners to critically assess the current path and envision a future where Palestinians are treated with dignity and afforded equality:

“Imagine that if Palestinians are treated with dignity and have the equality that they deserve, that that actually can be a better future for us... many of the greatest moments of the 20th century came exactly when people rethought the supremacy that they had become accustomed to and began to imagine lives as equals.”
— Peter Beinart [11:06]

He encourages a courageous reimagining of societal structures to achieve true safety and prosperity for all parties involved.

Conclusion

This episode of NPR's Book of the Day offers a compelling exploration of Peter Beinart's critical examination of the Israeli state and its impact on Palestinian lives. Through personal anecdotes, historical analysis, and a passionate call for justice and equality, Beinart challenges listeners to rethink entrenched perspectives and consider the profound implications of maintaining a state structure that privileges one group over another. His book, Being Jewish after the Destruction of Gaza: A Reckoning, serves as a catalyst for necessary conversations aimed at fostering a more inclusive and equitable future.

Notable Quotes:

• Peter Beinart [03:32]: “What is it like to live with this kind of fear and this kind of vulnerability that there's no army to protect Palestinians in the West Bank.”

• Peter Beinart [05:23]: “If one wants to keep Israeli Jews safe, one has to think about the underlying conditions in which this violence... occurred if you're going to keep it from happening again.”

• Peter Beinart [07:42]: “States are mere instruments for the protection of human life. And what has happened in mainstream Jewish discourse is that the value of this Jewish state has been elevated above the value of the lives of the people under its control.”

• Peter Beinart [09:59]: “Jews and Palestinians live as neighbors under a completely different legal system. Jews enjoy citizenship. Palestinians cannot become citizens.”

• Peter Beinart [11:06]: “Imagine that if Palestinians are treated with dignity and have the equality that they deserve, that that actually can be a better future for us.”

Additional Information

For those interested in exploring the themes discussed in this episode further, Peter Beinart's book is a profound resource that delves into the complexities of Jewish identity, statehood, and the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. His call for introspection and reimagining societal structures is particularly relevant in today's geopolitical climate.

Transcript

[Andrew Limbong]

Hey, it's NPR's Book of the Day. I'm Andrew Limbong. What is the point of a state? What is its function? That's a question at the heart of today's interview. It's with writer Peter Beinart, who's written a book titled Being Jewish after the Destruction of Gaza. And in the book, he wrestles with being a proud Jewish American who is also horrified at Israel's actions against the Palestinian people since the hamas attack on October 7th. He speaks with NPR's Leila Fadel, questioning the value of a Jewish state if, as he puts it, the state is elevated above the value of the lives of the people under its control. That's ahead.

[NPR Sponsor]

Support for this podcast and the following message come from Lumen when your metabolism is working properly, you will feel the benefits. With the Lumen device, you can measure your metabolism through your breath and on the app. It lets you know if you're burning fat or carbs and gives you tailored guidance to improve your nutrition, workouts, sleep, sleep and even stress management. Take the next step to improving your health. Go to Lumen Me NPRbook to get 20% off your Lumen. This message comes from NPR sponsor Shopify. No idea where to sell? Shopify puts you in control of every sales channel. It is the commerce platform revolutionizing millions of businesses worldwide. Whether you're a garage entrepreneur or IPO ready, Shopify is the only tool you need to start, run and grow your business without the struggle. Once you've reached your audience, Shopify has the Internet's best converting checkout to help you turn them from browsers to buyers. Go to Shopify.com NPR to take your business to the next level today.

[Leila Fadel]

Over his lifetime, Peter Beinart went from being a fierce defender of Israel to one of its fiercest critics. In his latest book, the professor of journalism and political science makes an appeal to other American Jews in the wake of the war in Gaza. It's called Being Jewish after the Destruction of Gaza A Reckoning. The book begins with a note to his former friend.

[Peter Beinart]

I know you believe that my public opposition to this war and to the very idea of a state that favors Jews over Palestinians constitutes a betrayal of our people. When I enter a synagogue, I am no longer sure who will extend their hand and who will look away. Maybe you feel a similar anxiety in progressive circles where you once felt at home. Jews have always quarreled, and we should. But I worry that given the trajectory of events in Israel and Palestine, we may be moving past mere disagreement toward hatred.

[Leila Fadel]

Why did you open the book this way with this note to your former.

[Peter Beinart]

Friend, because the book really came out of my struggles over the last year and a half, in some ways longer, with a community that I love, that is at the center of my life and where I have many of my closest friendships, but from which I feel sometimes profoundly at odds, because people who I respect and love seem to me to be able to look away from the horrors of what Israel is doing to Palestinians and justify those. And so I wanted to write to those people.

[Leila Fadel]

Now, you've been a very public critic of Israeli policies, Israel's occupation, for many years. Can you talk about the way your views changed later in your life? Really?

[Peter Beinart]

Sure. I grew up in many ways not differently than many, many American Jews in a family in which Israel's existence gave us a sense of comfort and security. But it was only late in my life, in my 30s, that I, for the first time, I wish it hadn't taken so long that I went and spent time with Palestinians in the West Bank. And one of the things that always has stuck with me was when I was talking with a Palestinian mother, she had had two girls, and then she had a boy. And she told me that when she had a boy, her daughters started to cry. And she said that they were crying because in their town, boys throw stones sometimes at Israeli soldiers. And the Israeli military comes in in the middle of the night to people's homes. They don't really necessarily know who threw the stones, but they know if they're teenage boys there, and they'll take the teenage boys screaming out of their homes, hold them often in solitary confinement for a day or two or even more, and that her daughters didn't want to have that experience in their home. And I just thought, what is it like to live with this kind of fear and this kind of vulnerability that there's no army to protect Palestinians in the West Bank. They are at the mercy of the Israeli army that can do these things. And it's utterly terrifying. And I have been raised to think so much about our fear and our trauma as Jews, and I really hadn't thought about the kind of trauma and fear that Palestinians experience.

[Leila Fadel]

Now, you address this in your book, but there are going to be people that listen to what you said who bristle at this and say, what about the violence that Jewish people in Israel have suffered. Suicide bombings, the October 7th attack on Israel?

[Peter Beinart]

Sure. I want to make it clear that when I talk about the conditions that exist of oppression for Palestinians, it does not justify attacking civilians and taking civilian life but to me, if one wants to keep Israeli Jews safe, one has to think about the underlying conditions in which this violence, the terrible violence that happened on October 7th occurred if you're going to keep it from happening again. Yes, Hamas was authoritarian and often incompetent. But when you block people off from the rest of the world in a space roughly the size of an American city, you are imposing tremendous, tremendous violence on them. And then you bomb them repeatedly. And I believe that countries are safest for everybody when everyone is represented in government and has a nonviolent mechanism through the vote to get their needs met.

[Leila Fadel]

You also write about right after October 7th and the attack on Israel, scouring anti war essays and speeches for outrage over the murder of innocent people, hundreds of Israeli civilians, and you don't find them was that hard? I mean, that's also a community that you belong to and are a part of.

[Peter Beinart]

Yes, I think that sometimes there's a way in which in mainstream Jewish discourse, Palestinians are often dehumanized. But there is also a way sometimes in, in leftist discourse or anti Israel, anti Zionist discourse in which Israeli Jews are dehumanized and people say, well, they're just settlers, so they have what's coming to them. I think if this movement for Palestinian freedom is to be a great movement for justice, it cannot use that language. One can be outraged by the system of oppression that Israel maintains over Palestinians and still recognize that the lives of Israeli Jews are deeply, deeply precious and that the horrifying act that was committed against them on October 7th was the wrong way for Palestinians to resist their oppression.

[Leila Fadel]

This book is an appeal, right?

[Peter Beinart]

Yes.

[Leila Fadel]

What is the appeal?

[Peter Beinart]

The appeal is to recognize something which I think is basic in Judaism, which is that human beings are created in the image of God and human beings are all human beings have infinite dignity. States are mere instruments for the protection of human life. And what has happened in mainstream Jewish discourse is that the value of this Jewish state has been elevated above the value of the lives of the people under its control.

[Leila Fadel]

There's a lot of people that will hear that will not like that. You know, you talked about going to Israel and feeling this moment where you're not the minority, there are other people like you. There is a place that feels safe and people will hear this as, but we need this state and we need this place to be safe and it needs to be for Jewish people.

[Peter Beinart]

Yes, but I really believe that there can be a flourishing, vibrant, Jewish, Hebrew speaking society in Israel, Palestine, without a state that gives Jews rights that Palestinians don't have. And we stake our children's safety in the United States on the principle of equality under the law, irrespective of race, religion, ethnicity. And yet we can't imagine that Jews in Israel could be safe under a condition of equality under the law. You know what's the most dangerous place for Jews in the world today? It's Israel, because its supremacist political system imposes tremendous violence on Palestinians. And that makes everyone less safe.

[Leila Fadel]

When you say a supremacist state, break that down. I mean, this is also something that is quite a controversial thing to say. A human rights report from Amnesty International says that the practices of the state make it an apartheid state. It is something that Israel vehemently denies and still terms itself as a thriving democracy.

[Peter Beinart]

Yes, for Jews, Israel is a thriving democracy, no question about it. But I know these terms like apartheid upset people, but let's just.

[Leila Fadel]

And supremacy. Yeah, supremacy.

[Peter Beinart]

And supremacists. Right, Supremacy, which was a term that B'Tselem, Israel's most prominent human rights organization, used itself in its writing on the subject. But let's just look at the legal realities in the West Bank, Jews and Palestinians live as neighbors under a completely different legal system. Jews enjoy citizenship. Palestinians cannot become citizens. They cannot vote for the government that has life and death power over them. I would say to people who don't like terms like apartheid and supremacy, what language would you use to describe that? Even in Israel proper, where 20% of the citizens are Palestinians, sometimes called Arab Israelis, they are citizens. They do have the right to vote. That is important. But they are citizens of a profoundly second class nature.

[Leila Fadel]

What would your sort of final message to somebody who's listening to what you said and feeling like, you know, there might be people who say, well, Peter, why do you get to speak for the Jewish community? And why don't you understand the fear that I have and the reasons that I can't see a solution in which people live together in the way you're describing.

[Peter Beinart]

I only speak for myself. I certainly can't claim to speak for all Jews. I guess I would say to people who believe that Israel is on the right path, I would say, how well do you think this is working for us? Be willing to actually look at what has happened in Gaza, the destruction of an entire society, look at what's happening in the West Bank. Is this the path we want to go on? Or can we imagine something different? Imagine that, that if Palestinians are treated with dignity and have the equality that they deserve, that that actually can be a better future for us. And I try to suggest at the end of the book that although this is a very difficult path, it is a path that's been walked before, and that many of the greatest moments of the 20th century came exactly when people rethought the supremacy that they had become accustomed to and began to imagine lives as equals and that we can that as well.

[Leila Fadel]

That was Peter Beinart, a professor and the editor at large of Jewish Currents, on his new book, Being Jewish after the Destruction of a Reckoning.

[NPR Sponsor]

This message comes from Schwab At Schwab, how you invest is your choice, not theirs. That's why when it comes to managing your wealth, Schwab gives you more choices. You can invest and trade on your own, plus get advice and more comprehensive wealth solutions to help meet your unique needs. With award winning service, low costs and transparent advice, you can manage your wealth your way at Schwab. Visit schwab.com to learn more.

This message comes from Best Western Hotels and Resorts. If you love a good podcast, then you must love a good story. And the best stories start with a great trip. That's where Best Western comes in. Whether you've been planning a getaway for weeks or just got the itch to go, Best Western has you covered with over 4000 hotels worldwide. Wherever your story takes you, make it memorable. Life's a trip. Make the most of [e-mail] this message.

Comes from HubSpot, where you can create content fast, get better leads and crush reporting all in one place. Visit HubSpot.com com marketers to see how companies like yours are generating 110% more leads in just 12 months.