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Andrew Limbong
Hey, it's NPR's Book of the Day. I'm Andrew Limbong. When you're writing historical fiction, what do you keep in and what do you leave out? The freedom of doing fiction is that you can pick and choose what you need, right? Whatever serves the narrative best. But author Victoria Christopher Murray says something interesting about that in today's episode. She is the author of the book Harlem Rhapsody about the writer and editor Jessie Redmond Fawcett and her affair with the black activist W.E.B. du Bois during the Harlem Renaissance. And in this interview with NPR's Ping Huang, Murray talks about trying to write the book without the affair to just focus on Fawcett and her impact on the Harlem Renaissance. But for reasons she gets into, the story just didn't work without it. That's coming up.
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Ping Huang
A new book is a reader's delight for the who's who it features in its pages. Harlem Rhapsody is a novel that serves as a love letter to the heart of black creativity and possibility in the 1920s during the heart Harlem Renaissance. And at the center of that love letter is a love story, the hidden relationship between black activist W.E.B. du Bois and Jessie Redmond Fawcett, writer and literary editor of the NAACP's magazine the Crisis. Victoria Christopher Murray brings all of this to life in her new novel, and she joins me now. Welcome.
Victoria Christopher Murray
Thank you. Thank you for having me.
Ping Huang
So let's start with Jessie Redmond Fawcett. When did you first come across her writing, and when did you decide that she had the potential for her own star turn in historical?
Victoria Christopher Murray
I really kind of took this methodically. I wanted to write about a woman and a woman that I'd want to spend the next two years with. And I thought about where would I want this woman to live? I thought about New York. I thought about the time period, and that got me to the Harlem Renaissance. It wasn't until I started digging in, looking for the women of the Harlem Renaissance that I became committed to this because I couldn't find any. Every time you looked up. And I was just doing surface research at the time, it was always about the men. And it was Langston Hughes, when he was saying she was the midwife of the Harlem Renaissance, that I found Jessie Redmond Fawcett.
Ping Huang
Yeah. The book basically opens as she's about to start her new job as literary editor at the Crisis, which was a job created for her by W.E.B. du Bois. Tell us about their relationship as the book starts.
Victoria Christopher Murray
Yes. So it's really interesting because I never meant to write anything salacious. I never meant to write a controversial novel, but I will always tell the truth. And Du Bois was the editor of the Crisis magazine. He was the founder and the editor. And when he started thinking about maybe perhaps expanding the magazine, that's when he called upon Jesse Redmond Fawcett. Now, he'd known her for over a decade at that point. She was the first black woman to graduate from Cornell University, the first black woman to graduate Phi Beta Kappa. And he knew her because he was acting as a mentor to her. They had kind of, I guess what we call today a pen pal kind of relationship. And they met many years later in 1914, and they were both smitten with each other and began a more intimate relationship.
Ping Huang
I feel like the emotional core of a lot of the novel is this relationship between Fawcett and Du Bois. And, like, what does sort of looking at his infidelities and her relationship with him, what kind of insight does that give the reader into his life and Fawcett's life and the world around them?
Victoria Christopher Murray
Well, you know, there's a question to be asked, like, would the Harlem Renaissance have happened without their affair? It's really interesting because I had considered writing the book without their affair. I said, let me see if I could do that, because wanted it focused on this woman who ignited the Harlem Renaissance. But none of it could have happened without their affair. Their affair was the reason that he brought her to New York. Their affair was the reason he encouraged her in certain ways. Their affair was the reason that she even finished her own first novel. And so I felt that I had to write the book with the affair to tell the complete story, but to tell them as complete people. They were these two extraordinary people who were doing something very ordinary.
Ping Huang
Reading this historical fiction was so fun because it just felt like, you know, who's gonna appear next? There was Langston Hughes. There was Claude McKay. There was Nella Larson. There were so many more. And it's just this revolving door of black writers because Fawcett was so key in bringing them to prominence. As you mentioned earlier, people even called her one of the midwives of the Harlem Renaissance. Can you describe some of these? Between Jessie and the writers that she.
Victoria Christopher Murray
Worked with, not only did Jesse discover all of these writers, not only did she edit them, but she mentored them. Countee Cullen was about 16. Langston Hughes was 17 when he first reached out to her. Nella Larson had just gotten married. Gwendolyn Bennett was in college when she met Jesse. And I could go on. The list goes on and on and on. Like Langston Hughes came to New York wanting to. But he. He was at Columbia University in their engineering program because that was the only way his father would pay for it. And Jesse was really instrumental in his life and helping guide him through the racism that he experienced at Columbia. And it was that way with all the authors. They had different issues in their life, but she was always there to help them, guide them through the next step.
Ping Huang
Let's get a taste of that literary world that Fawcet helped create. Here is a clip of Langston Hughes reading one of his early poems. The Negro speaks of rivers.
Langston Hughes (poet)
I've known rivers. I've known rivers ancient of the world and older than the flow of human blood in human veins. My soul has grown deep like the rivers. I bathed in the Euphrates when dawns were young. I built my hut near the Congo and it allowed me to sleep. I looked upon the Nile and raised the pyramids above it. I heard the singing of the Mississippi when Abe Lincoln went down to New Orleans. And I've seen its muddy bosom turn all golden in the sunset. I've known rivers, ancient, dusky rivers. My soul has grown deep like the rivers.
Ping Huang
How much of a poetry buff were you before diving into this book?
Victoria Christopher Murray
That's a very good question. I can't say that I was a poetry buff at all, but I became one afterwards because these poets told such complete stories in 4, 5, 6 lines. I need 400 pages to tell a story. And I was just amazed because I had to study their words. And I also wanted to study the timing of this. Like, for example, this poem was the very first poem that he wrote that was put into the Crisis magazine. They didn't do this on purpose, but it came out at the same time as the Tulsa riots. And so that was just such an interesting situation where he was talking about his soul is as deep as the rivers and what was going on in Tulsa at the time. And people were going to read his poem as they were also reading about the riots.
Ping Huang
Yeah, for sure. One of the things that I loved from reading the notes in the back of your book is that you said that you've read every issue of the crisis from 1919 to 1925 to get the language of the times right. What did you find and what did you use in the novel from that?
Victoria Christopher Murray
Oh, I mean, everything. I also wanted to read it because those were the issues that Jesse was the editor and I used all of their language. They were also very formal. You know, they didn't think about things, they pondered things. My friend said after they started reading this book, they were flabbergasted all the time. And those kinds of they had to sit back and ponder a few things themselves. So I really wanted people to be drawn back into 1920. That was very important to me. I wanted people to feel like they were in Harlem. I wanted people to feel like they were really listening to these people, speaking to these people.
Ping Huang
That's Victoria Christopher Murray. Her new novel is Harlem Rhapsody. Thank you so much.
Victoria Christopher Murray
Thank you, Pen. Thank you so much for this.
Ping Huang
I've got Harlem on my mind and I'm longing.
Andrew Limbong
And just a reminder that signing up for book of the day plus is a great way to support NPR's book coverage and public media. And you'll get to listen to every episode sponsor free. So please go find out more@plus.NPR.org BookOfTheDay.
Victoria Christopher Murray
Foreign.
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Podcast Information:
In this episode, NPR delves into Harlem Rhapsody, a novel by Victoria Christopher Murray that intertwines the lives of Jessie Redmond Fawcett, a pioneering African American writer and editor, and W.E.B. Du Bois, a prominent black activist. Set against the vibrant backdrop of the Harlem Renaissance, the novel explores their personal and professional relationship and its profound impact on black creativity and cultural movements of the 1920s.
Ping Huang opens the discussion by highlighting the significance of Jessie Redmond Fawcett in the Harlem Renaissance, referring to her as one of the "midwives" of the movement.
Victoria Christopher Murray shares her journey of uncovering Fawcett's legacy:
"I really kind of took this methodically. I wanted to write about a woman and a woman that I'd want to spend the next two years with... It wasn't until I started digging in, looking for the women of the Harlem Renaissance that I became committed to this because I couldn't find any."
(02:01)
Murray emphasizes the scarcity of recognition for women like Fawcett in historical narratives dominated by figures such as Langston Hughes.
The core of Harlem Rhapsody revolves around the intimate relationship between Fawcett and Du Bois.
Ping Huang inquires about the dynamics at the novel's outset:
"The book basically opens as she's about to start her new job as literary editor at the Crisis... Tell us about their relationship as the book starts."
(01:52)
Murray elaborates on their connection:
"Du Bois was acting as a mentor to her. They had kind of... a pen pal kind of relationship. And they met many years later in 1914, and they were both smitten with each other and began a more intimate relationship."
(02:58)
This mentorship evolved into a profound romantic affair, shaping both their personal lives and professional endeavors.
A pivotal discussion revolves around the necessity of the affair in the narrative and its broader historical implications.
Ping Huang probes the significance:
"Would the Harlem Renaissance have happened without their affair?"
(04:12)
Murray responds thoughtfully:
"I had to write the book with the affair to tell the complete story, but to tell them as complete people. They were these two extraordinary people who were doing something very ordinary."
(05:05)
She underscores that the personal relationship between Fawcett and Du Bois was instrumental in fostering an environment where the Harlem Renaissance could flourish. Their collaboration was pivotal in bringing together and mentoring key literary figures of the time.
Harlem Rhapsody doesn't just focus on Fawcett and Du Bois but also highlights Fawcett's role in nurturing emerging black writers.
Ping Huang remarks on the novel’s rich tapestry of literary figures:
"There was Langston Hughes. There was Claude McKay. There was Nella Larson... it's just this revolving door of black writers because Fawcett was so key in bringing them to prominence."
(05:29)
Murray details her mentorship role:
"Jesse discovered all of these writers, not only did she edit them, but she mentored them... Langston Hughes was 17 when he first reached out to her... Gwendolyn Bennett was in college when she met Jesse."
(05:29)
Her guidance helped shape the voices of some of the most influential poets and writers of the Harlem Renaissance, ensuring their talents were honed and their works gained the recognition they deserved.
To immerse listeners in the era's literary atmosphere, the podcast features a poignant clip of Langston Hughes reciting "The Negro Speaks of Rivers," a poem emblematic of the Harlem Renaissance.
Langston Hughes (Poet):
"I've known rivers. I've known rivers ancient of the world and older than the flow of human blood in human veins..."
(06:37)
Following the recital, Ping Huang engages Murray in a discussion about the interplay between poetry and historical events:
"For example, this poem was the very first poem that he wrote that was put into the Crisis magazine. They didn't do this on purpose, but it came out at the same time as the Tulsa riots... people were going to read his poem as they were also reading about the riots."
(07:22)
This intersection of art and history highlights how literary works were both a reflection and a commentary on the societal issues of the time.
Ping Huang praises Murray's dedication to authenticity:
"You've read every issue of the Crisis from 1919 to 1925 to get the language of the times right. What did you find and what did you use in the novel from that?"
(08:17)
Murray explains her meticulous research:
"I used all of their language. They were also very formal... I really wanted people to be drawn back into 1920. I wanted people to feel like they were in Harlem."
(08:33)
Her commitment to authentically capturing the dialogue and ambiance of the era allows readers to experience the Harlem Renaissance's vibrant atmosphere firsthand.
As the interview wraps up, Ping Huang expresses her admiration for Murray's work, while Murray shares her gratitude for the opportunity to shed light on an often-overlooked figure in literary history.
"I've got Harlem on my mind and I'm longing."
(09:21)
Harlem Rhapsody emerges as a compelling narrative that not only celebrates the Harlem Renaissance but also underscores the indispensable roles of Jessie Redmond Fawcett and W.E.B. Du Bois in shaping this cultural epoch.
Victoria Christopher Murray's Harlem Rhapsody offers a rich, immersive experience into the lives of pivotal figures of the Harlem Renaissance. Through meticulous research and evocative storytelling, the novel brings to life the struggles, triumphs, and intricate relationships that fueled one of America's most significant cultural movements.
For those seeking to delve into the depths of the Harlem Renaissance or uncover the untold stories of its key players, Harlem Rhapsody stands as a testament to the enduring power of literature and its ability to illuminate history.