In 'Back After This,' a podcast host tries to find love

Summary

NPR's Book of the Day: "Back After This" by Linda Holmes

Release Date: March 5, 2025

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Introduction

In this episode of NPR's Book of the Day, host Asma Khalid interviews Linda Holmes, a renowned novelist and co-host of NPR's Pop Culture Happy Hour. Holmes discusses her latest romantic comedy novel, "Back After This," which delves into the intertwined worlds of podcasting and modern romance. The conversation explores the creative decisions behind the book, character development, and the deeper themes that underpin the narrative.

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Plot Overview

"Back After This" centers on Cecily Foster, a dedicated podcast producer eager to advance her career. She is presented with a unique opportunity: to host her own podcast show focused on her personal love life. The catch? She must embark on 20 first dates orchestrated by Eliza, a charismatic social media influencer who also serves as a relationship coach.

Holmes explains, “When you see fictional representations of radio and podcasting, they are all over the map. Some of them are a little bit accurate, many of them are not at all accurate. And I really did think that this was a ripe opportunity to kind of let people see a world that a lot of them do listen to every day and maybe don't know a lot about” (04:19).

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Character Development

Cecily Foster

Cecily is portrayed as a hardworking and career-oriented individual who hasn’t experienced a meaningful relationship in four years. Her journey through the 20 dates serves as both a professional challenge and a personal quest for love.

Eliza – The Influencer

Eliza, the influencer and relationship coach, plays a pivotal role in Cecily’s romantic endeavors. Rather than reducing Eliza to a mere caricature, Holmes crafts her as a "full whole person." She states, “She is a human being and she's also intelligent and she just might be wrong about this particular situation, but she is a person who knows a lot” (07:36). This nuanced portrayal prevents Eliza from becoming a one-dimensional antagonist, highlighting the complexities of modern influencers.

Will – The Photographer

Will, the talented photographer Cecily meets in a serendipitous "meet cute," brings chaos and spontaneity into Cecily’s meticulously planned dating life. Their interactions question whether Cecily will adhere to Eliza’s organized approach or embrace the unpredictability Will represents.

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Themes and Insights

Love for Work vs. Love for the Job

A significant theme in Holmes's novel is the distinction between loving your work and loving your job. Holmes articulates, “I love the work I do. I love the value that I can bring to the craft that I know about. But it might be that, you know, companies get bought... but your love for your craft can remain with you no matter what” (09:06). This speaks to the resilience of personal passion amidst the volatility of the workplace.

Navigating Modern Relationships

The novel explores the tension between structured matchmaking and organic connections. Cecily's reliance on Eliza’s curated dates contrasts with her unexpected meeting with Will, prompting readers to consider the merits and pitfalls of both approaches in the search for love.

Humanizing Influencer Culture

Holmes emphasizes the importance of portraying influencers like Eliza with depth and humanity. “I didn’t want her to be a joke... they really are people who hustle. They're not jokes” (07:45). This approach challenges the often superficial depiction of social media personalities, presenting them as complex individuals with genuine intentions and flaws.

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Author's Motivation

Linda Holmes expresses her passion for the romantic comedy genre, stating, “I love, love, love them... I just think sometimes it's write what you love” (10:40). She aimed to create a “super rom com y rom com” that not only entertains but also resonates with readers on themes of career dedication and personal relationships.

Holmes also wanted to pay homage to the craft of audio storytelling. As Asma Khalid notes, “it felt like this was a love letter to audio, to the aesthetics, the intimacy, the power...,” to which Holmes concurs, highlighting her desire to celebrate and explore the world of podcasting through her narrative.

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Conclusion

"Back After This" by Linda Holmes is a heartfelt romantic comedy that intricately weaves themes of love, career, and personal growth within the backdrop of the modern podcasting landscape. Through well-developed characters and insightful discussions on work and relationships, Holmes delivers a story that is both entertaining and thought-provoking. This novel not only appeals to fans of the genre but also to those interested in the evolving dynamics of love and professional life in the digital age.

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Notable Quotes:

• "It's easy to write a punching bag... Linda Holmes does not do that." — Andrew Limbong (00:02)

• "I really wanted to present this as a question where maybe the person... maybe their advice is just not right for you." — Linda Holmes (06:38)

• "I love what you love" — Linda Holmes (10:40)

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About the Author:

Linda Holmes is a bestselling author and co-host of NPR's Pop Culture Happy Hour. Her novels often blend humor with insightful commentary on contemporary life, making her a beloved figure in both literary and podcasting communities.

Transcript

[Andrew Limbong]

Hey, it's NPR's Book of the Day. I'm Andrew Limbong. It's easy to write a punching bag. It's easy to think up a figure in modern society who is easily derided and write a version of them into your book to poke fun and laugh at. Linda Holmes does not do that. If that name sounds familiar. She's one of the hosts of NPR's Pop Culture Happy Hour and she's also a novelist. Her new romantic comedy, Back after this, is about a podcaster who has to go on all of these dates orchestrated by a social media influencer. And it's that character, the influencer, who I think could have so easily devolved into caricature. But in this interview, holmes talks with NPR's Asma Khalid about turning that character into a full whole person. That's after the break.

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[Asma Khalid]

New novel Back after this, we meet Cecily Foster. She's a hardworking podcast producer who's finally offered a big break, the opportunity to host her own show. But there is a catch. The show is supposed to be about her love life, her quest to find true love by going on 20 first dates set up by an influencer who also seems to double as a relationship coach. Back after this is written by best selling author Linda Holmes, who also knows a thing or two about podcasting herself. She's the co host of NPR's Pop Culture Happy Hour and she joins me now in the studios here at npr. Linda, it is wonderful to have you to see you.

[Linda Holmes]

It is wonderful to see you too.

[Asma Khalid]

Okay, so here we are, two audio people, just chit chatting. And I need to ask you at the outset, what made you want to set this story in the world of podcasts?

[Linda Holmes]

Well, as you probably know, when you see fictional representations of radio and podcasting, they are all over the map. Some of them are a little bit accurate, Many of them are not at all accurate. And I really did think that this was a ripe opportunity to kind of let people see a world that a lot of them do listen to every day and maybe don't know a lot about. And to me, anytime you can take a story that is, in this case, a romantic comedy and set it in kind of a real place of work, it gives it a little more color and kind of depth.

[Asma Khalid]

So let's talk a little bit more about the plot itself.

[Linda Holmes]

Yeah.

[Asma Khalid]

Cecily is an overworked podcast producer, editor. I mean, she does sort of all jobs.

[Linda Holmes]

She's a producer and editor. That is right.

[Asma Khalid]

And she hasn't had a real relationship since she was dumped four years prior. So her boss comes up to her, offers her the opportunity to host this new show where she has to go on 20 dates with guys that are selected by this relationship coach. Where did you get this idea from? It is a wild, like, funny idea.

[Linda Holmes]

I was thinking about if you got involved with one of these relationship coach people or a matchmaker, and these people exist, right? If you were working with one of those people. Cause you wanted to change your approach, right? My approach to meeting people isn't working. So I'm gonna work with this person. And then you sort of met somebody on your own. You know, you were trying to meet people in an orderly way, and then you met someone in a chaotic way. What would you do? Would you kind of have the confidence to go with the chaotic way, or would you feel like I should stick to the plan that I have set out for myself? Cause this is claiming to have some expertise.

[Asma Khalid]

You mention if you meet someone, say, on your own, organically, because as Cecily is going through the process of launching this new show and going on these new dates, she has this meet cute, I would say, right? She meets a skull. It is like you're like, it's totally statistically cute.

[Linda Holmes]

Yeah. No, this is a very, very meet cute type of scene. Intentionally so.

[Asma Khalid]

She sees this guy who is running out of like a half done barbershop. He didn't even fully get his haircut. Chasing after a dog. Yes, they meet that way the first time, but also he coincidentally keeps showing up in all these different places. When she's out having dinner, when she needs some headshot photos taken, he is always there. And so you mentioned earlier, like, which way would you go with? Would you go with the organic way or the organized way? And throughout your book, it is clear that Eliza, her relationship coach, does not approve of. Not necessarily the way she met him, but the person himself.

[Linda Holmes]

Yes. So Cecily, because she's a very driven person in her career, she sort of assumes I need a person who's really career oriented, like me and Will. Who is this guy she meets who is saving this dog? He's very brilliantly talented. He's a photographer. She really admires him. But Eliza feels like, well, I don't know if I want. I want you to have like a professional type of guy in your life. And so Cecily is kind of getting the message, like, you should go for someone more settled. Cause Will is a little bit more. Well, I don't know where I'm gonna be in a couple years. I might be in a wide variety of places. And she's trying to figure out whether she needs or wants somebody with like a lot of stability.

[Asma Khalid]

Can we talk more about Eliza, this influencer slash relationship coach? She has a huge social media following. She has a lot of collaborator companies who she deals with. And it does seem, you know, as a journalist, you could have been snarky about her character and make her into a total caricature. And I didn't think you did. I actually thought that I learned things from Eliza. She gave advice to Cecily, which I will say she doesn't always necessarily take, but I thought some of it was sound advice.

[Linda Holmes]

Yes.

[Asma Khalid]

Be judicious, be thoughtful about who you're going to.

[Linda Holmes]

And absolutely part of her messaging is also value yourself and figure out what it is that you want. And she really stresses that to Cecily. And it was really important to me to present this as a question where maybe the person that you're getting your advice from in a situation like this, maybe your life coach, your relationship coach, whoever it is, maybe they are a well meaning person, but maybe their advice is just not right for you. Obviously there are. There is some humor about her and some of the sillier things that she.

[Asma Khalid]

But you humanized her, I thought.

[Linda Holmes]

But she's a very. She is a human being and she's also intelligent and she just might be wrong about this particular situation, but she is a person who knows a lot. She makes some significant mistakes along the way, but she's not a joke and she's not a bad person. And I wanted that to be the case because making her a cartoon would have been the easiest thing in the world. And I don't think most people who are working in these kinds of gigs, like influencers, are hardworking people. In many, many cases, they really are people who hustle. They're not jokes. And I didn't want her to be a joke.

[Asma Khalid]

I feel like I was initially expecting this book to be like a total rom com, right? A romantic comedy where the guy is the central focus. But it felt like this was a love letter, not necessarily to a guy, but. But like a love letter to audio, to the aesthetics, the intimacy, the power. All the things that I will fully acknowledge as someone who loves this craft. I am obsessed with. Am I reading this right?

[Linda Holmes]

No, I think you're right. I think it is in part a love story. It is a romantic comedy. My goal in writing this initially when I started it was I wanna write like a super rom com y rom com. That's what I want out of this. That's why you have that very meet cute moment you have that they keep running. These things are all the kind of tropes of romantic comedy that I love. But the more I worked on it, the more I really also wanted it to address itself to, you know, what it means to really love the work that you do and care about and value it. How you keep your passion for the work that you do without it becoming all about your job. What it is like to try to still love the work and the craft, as you say, and sometimes realize that your job may change and the people who are in charge of your job may change, but your love for your craft can remain with you no matter what.

[Asma Khalid]

I mean, it also felt like a story to me on a related note about how you can love the work and you can maybe even at times love your job, but your job doesn't necessarily love you back or your workplace doesn't necessarily love you back.

[Linda Holmes]

Well, right. That's the difference between what it means to love your job and what it means to love your work. And I think sometimes the whole your job can't love you back, which is absolutely correct, can get to the point where it feels like people are saying, don't care a lot about the work you do. And I think that's not fair. I think what you want to do is you want to separate out. I love the work I do. I love the value that I can bring to the craft that I know about. But it might be that, you know, companies get bought and We've seen that in audio. We've seen that in lots of places. Right. I was writing this book while there were a lot of layoffs and a lot of contractions around audio. You can still be yourself and you can still care about your work. And that's a conversation I've had with people across lots of parts of media who feel like without this job, I don't even know who I am practically. And I think you can still love what you do without sacrificing yourself too much for one particular job or workplace.

[Asma Khalid]

One final question for you here. You say you set out to write a rom com. Why did you want to write a romantic comedy?

[Linda Holmes]

Because I love, love, love them. And they have been such an important part of my world of, you know, not even just escapism, but just pleasure. You know, the pleasures of a romantic comedy are very precious to me because I love the idea of that something can be funny but also sweet. I love back and forth banter very much. That's been kind of my favorite thing in dialogue forever. So it just happens to be something that I love deeply. And in some ways it's easier to, you know, people say write what you know. I think sometimes it's write what you love.

[Asma Khalid]

That is author and pop culture Happy hour host Linda Holmes. Her new book is back after this. It comes out next Tuesday. Linda, thank you so much for coming in.

[Linda Holmes]

Thank you.

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