Karine Jean-Pierre’s new memoir 'Independent' explains why she left the Democrats

Summary

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NPR's Book of the Day: Karine Jean-Pierre’s Memoir 'Independent' – Why She Left the Democrats

Episode Date: November 3, 2025
Host: Michelle Martin (NPR)
Guest: Karine Jean-Pierre

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Episode Overview

This episode features a conversation between NPR’s Michelle Martin and Karine Jean-Pierre, former White House Press Secretary under Joe Biden, about Jean-Pierre’s candid new memoir, Independent: A Look Inside a Broken White House Outside Party Lines. The discussion centers on her reasons for leaving the Democratic Party after the 2024 election, the internal dysfunction she witnessed in the Biden White House, the high expectations and critiques faced as a historic first at the press secretary podium, and her evolving view on American political identity.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Opening: Behind the Memoir and the Press Tour

• Andrew Limbong introduces the episode and frames the conversation: Is the book a vehicle for publicity or a genuine attempt to start needed conversations? He notes that Karine Jean-Pierre claims her intent is not to attack, but to facilitate dialogue. (00:02)

2. The 2024 Presidential Debate and Biden’s Fitness

• Martin opens by referencing the debate that re-ignited questions about Biden’s health.
• Jean-Pierre describes hearing Biden for the first time at the debate:
  • "When I heard his voice, I thought to myself, oh, he was hoarse. He kind of looked like he was sick. So I thought to myself, something is up." (02:51)
  • She emphasizes she witnessed nothing to suggest lack of mental acuity:
    Jean-Pierre: "I stand by that 110%." (03:45)

3. Critique of the Democratic Party: Loyalty and Dysfunction

• Jean-Pierre details her core issue with the party: a lack of unity and loyalty, especially ahead of a pivotal election, contrasting Democrats' inability to consolidate support with Republicans' party discipline.
  • Jean-Pierre: "Republicans are able to do it. They were able to get behind their guy ... and we weren't able to do it." (04:19)
  • Martin references Nancy Pelosi’s and George Clooney’s public criticisms as examples. (04:43)

4. Personal Critiques and Navigating Identity as "Firsts"

• Martin asks about the personal critiques Jean-Pierre endured as a pioneer in her role.
  • Jean-Pierre: "No one has ever looked like me that has been at that podium ... when we are firsts, you are critiqued and looked at differently because people already don’t think you belong there." (05:11)
  • She underscores the unique adversity faced as a Black woman and as an openly queer immigrant.

5. The Democratic Party’s Relationship with Black Women

• Jean-Pierre discusses her chapter, "Sisterhood," noting Black women’s critical role in the Democratic coalition and how they are too often overlooked.
  • Jean-Pierre: "Black women understand. Look, there’s a crisis here. ... We get forgotten." (06:05)
  • She cites efforts to uplift Black women in the Biden administration but stresses more must be done.

6. On Becoming Independent and the Future of Political Identity

• Asked why she now identifies as an Independent, Jean-Pierre shares her concerns about party complacency and a lack of accountability:
  • Jean-Pierre: "I want to show how, how is this person going to fight for my vote, rubber stamping Trump’s appointees? ... We knew this was going to happen. And so I feel like we should have been better." (07:32)
  • She acknowledges the growing number of independents, especially among young people, as a sign of political system disaffection.

7. Call for Civic Engagement and Conversation

• Jean-Pierre insists her book is a call for dialogue and renewed political imagination, not political infighting.
  • Jean-Pierre: "There’s an opportunity to reimagine what politics can be, to reimagine what America can be. That means you can’t stay quiet because silence is complicit." (08:21)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Biden’s Fitness:
  Martin: "You are very clear in the book that you saw no reason to question the former president’s mental acuity... you stand by that?"
  Jean-Pierre: "I stand by that 110%." (03:45)

• On Internal Democratic Party Strife:
  Jean-Pierre: "We couldn’t do it. Republicans are able to do it. ... and we weren’t able to do it." (04:19)

• On Navigating Critiques as a Pioneer:
  Jean-Pierre: "No one has ever looked like me that has been at that podium, standing behind that lectern. ... When we are firsts, you are critiqued and looked at differently because people already don’t think you belong there..." (05:11)

• On the Neglect of Black Women in Politics:
  Jean-Pierre: "Black women understand. Look, there’s a crisis here. Not only is it gonna affect me and my family and the community that I love, but it’s gonna affect everyone. And we feel like it is our duty ... and we get forgotten." (06:05)

• On Her Hope for the Book:
  Jean-Pierre: "I’m not looking for a fight with Democrats or Republicans. I’m looking to have a conversation." (07:09)

• On Going Independent:
  Jean-Pierre: "There is a growing number of people who see themselves as independent ... We have to question why is that? There is a fundamental problem here." (07:32)

• Call to Action:
  Jean-Pierre: "There’s an opportunity to reimagine what politics can be, to reimagine what America can be. That means you can’t stay quiet because silence is complicit." (08:21)

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Important Segment Timestamps

• [02:51] – Behind the scenes at the pivotal 2024 debate and Biden’s health
• [04:19] – Breakdown of Democratic Party infighting and lack of solidarity
• [05:11] – Facing criticism as the first Black, queer woman press secretary
• [06:05] – The Democratic Party’s treatment of Black women and the “Sisterhood” chapter
• [07:32] – On choosing to be an Independent; growing dissatisfaction with two-party politics
• [08:21] – Jean-Pierre’s hopes for inspiring political engagement and dialogue

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Tone & Style

Jean-Pierre is measured yet candid, simultaneously proud of her service and openly critical of her party’s failures. She positions her book as neither a partisan attack nor personal grievance, but as an invitation to deeper civic reflection and reform. Martin’s interview is probing yet respectful, drawing out both personal and structural critiques.

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Conclusion

Independent offers a rare, insider’s look at public service, party politics, and the cost of breaking political molds. Jean-Pierre’s story resonates not only as a memoir but as a challenge—to political gatekeepers and would-be participants alike: Reimagine what American politics can be, and claim your voice in shaping it.

Transcript

[A]

Hey, it's NPR's Book of the Day. I'm Andrew Limbong. Last week for the NPR Books Newsletter, I wrote about the big press tour Karine Jean Pierre was on. She's the former press secretary for President Joe Biden, and she's got a new book out called A Look Inside a Broken White House Outside Party Lines. And it's about her reasons for leaving the Democratic party after the 2024 election. And my piece for the newsletter was essentially asking, do you go on a press tour like this to get people to buy your book? Or is writing the book a vehicle for a press tour? Because there's a moment in this interview with NPR's Michelle Martin where Jean Pierre lays out her reasons for writing the book. And she says it's not to start fights with Democrats or Republicans, it's to start a conversation. But to me, it seems like that conversation is happening more in interviews like this and not in the book. But you give it a listen and see what you think. That's after the break.

[B]

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[C]

For almost three years, Karine Jean Pierre served as White House press secretary, meaning she was the face and voice of the Biden Harris administration during daily White House briefings and trips around the world. In a new book, Jean Pierre argues that Democrats knew what was coming ahead of their defeat in the 2024 elections and not only didn't do enough to stop it, but also helped it along by being disloyal, shambolic and insufficiently committed to its stated values. This led her to ask herself if this was still the party for her. Her answer? No. Jean Pierre says she no longer identifies as a Democrat. The title of her new book and her new political stance is Independent. And she's with us now to tell us more about Karine Jean Pierre. Thanks so much for joining us.

[D]

Thank you so much for having me.

[C]

Michelle, you opened the book with your experience behind the scenes of the June 2024 presidential debate, a date that's, you know, seared into a lot of people's memories. And it was there that questions around then President Biden's kind of health and mental acuity really seemed to take off. So tell us a little bit about what you saw behind the scenes.

[D]

So I had not seen the president because he had been in debate prep and it was on the political side. I was not invol in the campaign in any way. So the first time I actually heard him speak was while he was debating. So when I heard his voice, I thought to myself, oh, he was hoarse. He kind of looked like he was sick. So I thought to myself, something is up. And so what I started thinking from that moment was, oh, goodness, this is what it's going to be used for. Everything that I've been pushing back on his age. Is he fit? Like, automatically, anytime he would sneeze or have a runny nose or something would happen, that would be where the questions would go.

[C]

Let me just be clear here, because you are very clear in the book that you saw no reason to question the former president's mental acuity, his fitness for the job. You stand by that?

[D]

I stand by that 110%.

[C]

I do want to say that you realize that a lot of people just don't believe that.

[D]

Look, all I can tell you is what I saw with my own eyes and what I experienced myself to that end.

[C]

Your beef is not with journalists asking questions about.

[D]

No, my beef is not with journalists asking questions.

[C]

The core of the book is about the Democratic Party and what you experienced at the White House. You write about what you call bickering and backbiting. So say more about why you say that that backbiting is what opened the door for you to think about other alternatives.

[D]

Yeah. So Joe Biden objectively had a very successful four years, and here we are on the cusp of an election of a lifetime that we all need to get behind our person, and we couldn't do it. Republicans are able to do it. They were able to get behind their guy. How however flawed their guy is, and they say, yep, this is our guy with all the flaws and everything, this is our guy. And we weren't able to do it.

[C]

I mean, by that you mean like, for example, the former speaker of the House, Nancy Pelosi, sort of letting it be known that she was concerned or George Clooney and this piece in the New York Times. Is that what you're talking about?

[D]

All of it. And I talk about that in the book.

[C]

One other thing you write about, which I really found was interesting is, like, the snippety sniping directed at you. Apparently, there are people who felt you weren't very good at your job. They said you were too wooden at briefings, that you didn't really understand policy. How do you understand those critiques now that you have some distance from it? Or do you?

[D]

Well, look, in the moment, I was quiet. I didn't defend myself in the moment because I was focused on a job that I was honored and privileged to have had, which is the White House press secretary, because the president believed that I can do this. What I can do is state facts, which is, no one has ever looked like me that has been at that podium, standing behind that lectern. And when we are firsts, you are critiqued and looked at differently because people already don't think you belong there in that position. And, you know, look, I had a job that was coveted, and the people who wanted my job didn't think I deserved the job for whatever reasons, Right? And so I understood, as a black woman, that things are just different for people who look like me.

[C]

You write at length about how you feel the Democratic Party has particularly failed black women.

[D]

So I have a chapter on. It's called Sisterhood. It's kind of a love letter to black women. And I feel like if you look at black women and how they come out and vote no matter what, because they understand what's at stake. 92% for Kamala Harris. Black women understand. Look, there's a crisis here. Not only is it gonna affect me and my family and the community that I love, but it's gonna affect everyone. And we feel like it is our duty to try to save and try to really speak out, and we get forgotten. And one of the things that I respected from the Biden Harris administration is we didn't forget them. And you see that in how we made sure black women's voices were everywhere within the administration. I do believe, and I wanna be very clear about this, that I meant a lot to people because of the communities that I represented. They felt seen when they saw me at the podium behind that lectern. Whether it was women of color, black women, queer community, LGBTQ community, immigrant. They felt seen, and that mattered to me. And I wrote this book because I truly believe in what I'm saying. And I want to start a conversation. I'm not looking for a fight with Democrats or Republicans. I'm looking to, well, I'm looking to have a conversation.

[C]

Okay, so let's have that conversation. What does identifying as an independent solve the problem that you have identified?

[D]

Right. Look for me, I'm not telling people, hey, you go become an independent. That's not my role. There is a growing number of people who see themselves as independent, including young people. We have to question why is that? There is a fundamental problem here. For me, it is, I want to show how, how is this person going to fight for my vote, rubber stamping Trump's appointees? Let me tell you, that is not the way that that should have gone. We knew what was about to happen. Project 2025 Anti Dei was like one of the first things we knew, immigrants being attacked. We knew this was going to happen. And so I feel like we should have been better.

[C]

So you said you wanted to start a conversation. The book is just out. What are you hearing from people?

[D]

I hope people are inspired to continue to either be in the fight or get into the fight. There's an opportunity to reimagine what politics can be, to reimagine what America can be. That means you can't stay quiet because silence is complicit.

[C]

Karine Jean Pierre is the author of Independent A Look Inside a Broken White House Outside the Party Lines. Karine Jean Pierre, thanks.

[D]

Thank you, Michelle. I appreciate it. Thank you for the opportunity.

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