Madeleine Thien's new novel 'The Book of Records' is a story that traverses centuries

Summary

Summary of NPR's Book of the Day Episode: Madeleine Thien's New Novel 'The Book of Records'

Release Date: June 9, 2025

In this engaging episode of NPR's Book of the Day, host Andrew Limbong delves into Madeleine Thien's latest novel, The Book of Records. The discussion explores the novel's intricate narrative that spans centuries, intertwining historical philosophies with a poignant father-daughter journey.

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Introduction to the Novel

Andrew Limbong opens the discussion by posing a thought-provoking question: "Which books would you take with you if you were stranded on a desert island?" He emphasizes interpreting this as not just a preference for favorite books but as a selection of works that can sustain and nourish one's intellect over an extended period.

"Author Madeleine Thien's new novel, The Book of Records, takes this question very seriously." [00:02]

The novel centers on a seven-year-old girl named Lena and her father, who embark on a prolonged journey after arriving at a transient settlement known as the SEA – a waypoint for those fleeing to establish new homes elsewhere.

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Setting and Premise

Madeleine Thien elaborates on the novel's setting, describing SEA as a temporary haven where individuals linger briefly before continuing their quests for new beginnings.

"That are a way station for people who are fleeing one place and trying to make a home elsewhere. And usually people just stay there for a day or two, enough to touch land and then begin their journey again." [01:05]

This backdrop serves as a unique environment where different eras and historical figures converge, enriching the narrative with diverse perspectives and timeless themes.

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The Three Books

A pivotal element of the story is the father's selection of three books to accompany him and Lena on their journey. These are not random choices but are deeply rooted in Thien's personal intellectual journey.

"He grabs three books that he tells her looked like the most unread, the ones that might withstand a thousand readings, something that maybe she would be able to live within for a longer amount of time." [02:04]

The chosen books are by Hannah Arendt, Baruch Spinoza, and the Chinese poet Du Fu. Each represents a different century and cultural backdrop, reflecting Thien's intention to infuse the novel with enduring philosophical and literary insights.

"I chose them because they were thinkers I had lived with for a long time who had taken root in me. And probably their ideas had flowed through me in ways I could see and couldn't see." [02:04]

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Themes of Love and Resilience

The conversation shifts to the recurring theme of maintaining love for the world amidst challenges such as authoritarianism, betrayal, and societal collapse—elements that resonate both historically and in contemporary times.

"In some sense, these three people from different centuries each faced authoritarianism, betrayal, societal collapse. And I've heard you say that all three of them still tried to hold on to love for the world. What do you think the secret is to holding on to love for the world? In the face of all that." [03:06]

Thien responds by highlighting love as a fundamental necessity—a prerequisite for preservation and survival.

"I almost think it's a necessity. You know, there's a famous Hannah Arendt line, you know, why is it so hard to love this world? But this world is also our only home, our deepest belonging. And so to face what we are within it, what it gives us, what it brings us, how it shapes us. I think all three understood that if they were going to preserve what was most dear to them, to hold everything dear, they had to love it first before knowing how to survive it as well." [03:27]

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Intellectual Influence and Personal Growth

Andrew Limbong inquires whether Thien naturally embodies this capacity for love or if her engagement with these thinkers has been instrumental in developing this trait.

"Does that come naturally to you, or is one of the reasons you turn to these writers and thinkers so often is that they have been able to do something you struggle to do?" [04:05]

Thien acknowledges the latter, attributing her ability to perceive the world differently to the profound influence of these philosophers and poets.

"I think you've named it. Yes, I think that is the gift they gave me in the nine years of writing this book. It really taught me how to perceive differently... And probably their ideas had flowed through me in ways I could see and couldn't see." [04:15]

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Relevance to Contemporary Society

Reflecting on the decade-long journey of writing The Book of Records, Thien draws parallels between the historical challenges faced by her chosen thinkers and the current global political climate, marked by rising authoritarianism and diminishing democratic values.

"I spent almost a decade writing this book, and the world has changed a lot in that decade... authoritarian governments around the world have gained power. Democracy has receded." [04:49]

She connects these observations to the moral and ethical inquiries presented in Spinoza's Ethics, emphasizing the continuous nature of moral choice and personal responsibility.

"It's never a fixed state of being. It's about choices. And everyone has a choice at every moment to speak, to not speak, to protect another, to look away, to hold something dear. To not hold things dear." [05:14]

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Conclusion

The episode concludes with a reflection on the enduring impact of The Book of Records, underscoring its relevance in today's socio-political landscape and its exploration of timeless human values through the lens of literature and philosophy.

"Madeline Thien's new novel is The Book of Records. Thank you so much." [06:08]

Madeline Thien expresses her gratitude, encapsulating the collaborative spirit of the discussion.

"Thank you. Thank you so much." [06:15]

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Key Takeaways:

• The Book of Records intertwines historical philosophies with a contemporary narrative, offering deep reflections on love, resilience, and moral choices.

• The selection of three seminal thinkers—Hannah Arendt, Baruch Spinoza, and Du Fu—serves as a foundation for exploring complex themes across different eras.

• The novel's relevance is heightened by current global trends towards authoritarianism, making its message both timeless and urgently pertinent.

• Madeleine Thien's decade-long dedication to crafting this novel highlights the profound influence of philosophical thought on contemporary literary expression.

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This episode serves as a compelling introduction to Madeleine Thien's The Book of Records, inviting listeners to contemplate the enduring power of literature and philosophy in navigating the complexities of human existence.

Transcript

[Andrew Limbong]

Hey, it's NPR's Book of the Day. I'm Andrew Limbong. You know that question, which books would you take with you if you were stranded on a desert island? You can interpret that as oh, what are your favorite books? Or you can interpret it as what books have the most to give? What books have enough juice in them that they can continue to feed your thinking mind for days on end. Author Madeleine TN's new novel, the the Book of Records, takes this question very seriously. In it, a father picks up three books before embarking with his daughter on a long journey, and they are books that Tien herself has spent years reading and wrestling with. She talks to NPR's AR Shapiro about what she inherited from these writers. That's ahead.

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[Madeleine Tien]

That are a way station for people who are fleeing one place and trying to make a home elsewhere. And usually people just stay there for a day or two, enough to touch land and then begin their journey again.

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Author Madeline Tien told me she wanted to set her novel in a place that is not a natural home. Somewhere different centuries might converge. Three historical figures eventually enter the story. They come from different places and different eras.

[Madeleine Tien]

There were many, many people I hoped would come and accompany Lena and her father. Her father only takes three books all the shelf they have to leave in a hurry. He grabs three books that he tells her looked like the most unread, the ones that might withstand a thousand readings, something that maybe she would be able to live within for a longer amount of time. And they happen to be these three Hannah Arendt, Baruch, Spinoza, and the Chinese poet Dufu, all from different centuries. And I chose them because they were thinkers I had lived with for a long time who had taken root in me. And probably their ideas had flowed through me in ways I could see and couldn't see. And I know when I wrote it, I wanted to face what those ideas meant or what I thought, what I believed I had learned, or what I believed I had inherited.

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In some sense, these three people from different centuries each, each faced authoritarianism, betrayal, societal collapse. And I've heard you say that all three of them still tried to hold on to love for the world. What do you think the secret is to holding on to love for the world? In the face of all of that.

[Madeleine Tien]

I almost think it's a necessity. You know, there's a famous Hannah Aunt line, you know, why is it so hard to love this world? But this world is also our only home, our deepest belonging. And so to face what we are within it, what it gives us, what it brings us, how it shapes us. I think all three understood that if they were going to preserve what was most dear to them, to hold everything dear, they had to love it first before knowing how to survive it as well.

[Wise Ad]

Does that come naturally to you, or is one of the reasons you turn to these writers and thinkers so often is that they have been able to do something you struggle to do?

[Madeleine Tien]

I think you've named it. Yes, I think that is the gift they gave me in the nine years of writing this book. It really taught me how to perceive differently. And it was demanding in terms of the thinking that went into it and the grappling with their ideas, their work, their philosophies, their questions, and also where they hit contradictions. There was a gift of thinking with them that also brought me to another kind of love of our world across time.

[Wise Ad]

As you mentioned, you spent almost a decade writing this book, and the world has changed a lot in that decade. One way it's changed is that authoritarian governments around the world have gained power. Democracy has receded. And so, as you wrote these stories of people who lived in eras of history where that was the case, where authoritarianism was on the rise, what did you learn about the world that we're living in right now?

[Madeleine Tien]

You know, Spinoza's most famous work is Ethics, the Ethics, this sort of exploration of the consequences of consequences about human freedom and free will and perhaps some of the illusions of those things, but also what it means to have a moral life, what it means to choose, what it means to observe how we respond to things. And I think what I carried from these three is not that there is a moral person. It's never a fixed state of being. It's about choices. And everyone has a choice at every moment to speak, to not speak, to protect another, to look away, to hold something dear. To not hold things dear. And I think that's what they gave me, is the recognition that at every moment there is a choice to be.

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Madeline Tien's new novel is the Book of Records. Thank you so much.

[Madeleine Tien]

Thank you. Thank you so much.

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