‘Your Favorite Scary Movie’ and ‘Ready for My Close-Up’ are histories of iconic films

Summary

NPR’s Book of the Day — Episode Summary

Episode: ‘Your Favorite Scary Movie’ and ‘Ready for My Close-Up’ are histories of iconic films
Date: August 29, 2025
Host: Andrew Limbong (A)
Featured Books/Guests:

• Your Favorite Scary Movie by Ashlyn Cullens (F), interviewed by Aisha Rascoe (D)
• Ready for My Close-Up: The Making of Sunset Boulevard and the Dark Side of the Hollywood Dream by David Lubin (E), interviewed by Elsa Chang (G)

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Overview

This episode dives into the cultural history and enduring impact of two iconic film franchises and their representation in new nonfiction books: the Scream franchise, with Ashlyn Cullens’ Your Favorite Scary Movie, and the classic Sunset Boulevard, explored through David Lubin’s Ready for My Close-Up. The hosts and authors provide a lens on the complex interplay between Hollywood, technology, and social change, tracing how iconic films both reflect and shape broader societal anxieties.

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Segment 1: "Your Favorite Scary Movie" — Ashlyn Cullens on the Scream Franchise

Interview led by Aisha Rascoe (D) with author Ashlyn Cullens (F)

[00:02–08:35] Key Discussion Points

Historical & Cultural Context of Scream

• Scream came out at a time when horror was often dismissed by critics and audiences, and filmmakers Kevin Williamson and Wes Craven wanted to both honor and deconstruct the genre.
  • “Both of them brought just a deep, pure love for the horror genre... Kevin…built out this story that was a true slasher, but also brought attention to all of the tropes that had become so exaggerated over the years.” — Ashlyn Cullens [02:36]
  • Wes Craven contributed a profound understanding of human psychology and fear.

Studio Resistance and the Making of an Iconic Scene

• The now-legendary opening scene with Drew Barrymore was initially doubted by film executives who felt it wasn’t scary, until Wes Craven cut together the opening to prove its impact.
  • “They were just seeing Drew Barrymore walking around holding a telephone... So they cut together the opening sequence to show them, and that did the trick.” — Ashlyn Cullens [03:38]

Innovation in Sequel Security

• With the growing anticipation for the sequel, filmmakers took extreme measures to prevent script leaks, inventing nearly uncopyable scripts and embedding secret codes.
  • “My favorite was the paper that they printed the scripts on...impossible to photocopy. It shows up black. They had secret codes written in the margins in case something did get out, that they would know who it was that leaked it.” — Cullens [04:28]

Technological Shifts Reflected in the Films

• The franchise charted technological change from landline phones to the early days of the internet, caller ID, and eventually live-streaming/social media culture.
  • “By the fourth movie, people are starting to become Internet famous, and there's commentary on social media…a little bit ahead of its time.” — Cullens [05:52]
  • Memorable meta-quote:
    • “If you want to be the new, new version, the killer should be filming the murders. It’s like the natural next step in a psycho slasher innovation.” — [06:20]

The Role of Comedy in Scream

• Comedy is a deliberate device in the franchise, making the horror more jarring and the films more rewatchable.
  • “It diffuses the tension. Right. It gives you a little bit of a break from being scared...it disarms you.” — Cullens [06:44]

The Legacy of Wes Craven

• Reflection on Wes Craven’s legacy and how he saw himself beyond just the horror genre.
  • “He was a storyteller...I don’t know that he ever really felt appreciated for how brilliant he was as a filmmaker during his life, because people just didn’t take horror all that seriously. But now they do.” — Cullens [07:44]

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “You never told me your name.” — Ghostface [04:09]
• “I would want to ask him if he's happy with how his career went, because it was a sore spot for him.” — Cullens on Craven [07:44]
• Release excitement for Scream 7, with original creator Kevin Williamson directing [07:09]

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Segment 2: "Ready for My Close-Up" — David Lubin on Sunset Boulevard

Interview led by Elsa Chang (G) with author David Lubin (E)

[09:08–17:11] Key Discussion Points

The Layered Genres and Modernity of Sunset Boulevard

• Lubin was captivated by the film’s mix of genres: “It was a mystery and a horror film and a comedy and a romance and a psychological thriller all wrapped up into one.” — Lubin [11:05]
• The film’s “contemporary feeling” despite its age; it addresses themes still relevant today: fame, cultural obsession, and aging.

The Power of Comeback Narratives

• The making of Sunset Boulevard was a professional and personal comeback for director Billy Wilder and for Gloria Swanson, the former silent film star portraying Norma Desmond.
  • “So the whole thought of obsolescence or being irrelevant was a very powerful draw to her.” — Lubin on Swanson [12:57]
  • Swanson initially resisted doing a screen test: “I'm Gloria Swanson. I don't do screen tests.” [13:33]
  • Director George Cukor convinced her: “If you don't take this role, I’m gonna shoot you. This is the best role you’re ever gonna find.” [13:36]

Iconic Dialogue and Silent Film Legacy

• The film’s script delivers some of cinema’s most memorable lines and performances:
  • “I am big. It’s the pictures that got small.” — Gloria Swanson as Norma Desmond [10:00, 13:59]
  • Swanson’s unique acting style intentionally bridged the silent and sound eras: “She acts in silent film rhetoric. Nothing like the style of Hollywood at that time...she just explodes that.” — Lubin [14:53]
  • Elsa Chang describes the monologue as “one of the top speeches ever delivered on film.” [14:44]

Hollywood’s Crisis and Context

• Lubin explains how Sunset Boulevard reflected instability in post-war Hollywood: the collapse of the studio system, the rise of television, and political targeting of the film industry.
  • “By 1949, when Sunset Boulevard was shot, people wanted to stay home and watch TV…So the film is on the precipice. They know something is going to happen, something's got to change, but they don't really know which direction it's going to fall in.” — Lubin [15:24]
  • Parallels drawn to today’s industry upheaval via streaming and AI.

Why Sunset Boulevard Endures

• Lubin posits that the enduring appeal of Sunset Boulevard is its deft handling of uncertainty and transformation in both art and society.
  • “It is about those transformations in personal lives and technological lives that is occurring right now and leaving us sort of afraid because we don’t know where we’re going.” — Lubin [16:34]

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “There just aren’t any faces like that anymore. Maybe one Garbo. Those idiot producers, those imbeciles…haven’t they got any eyes? Have they forgotten what a star looks like? I’ll show them

Transcript

[A]

Hey, it's NPR's Book of the Day. I'm Andrew Limbaugh. What I love about film criticism is that if you look closely enough at any movie, you can see fingerprints of history. You can see what was going on in Hollywood at the time, what was happening in the broader culture. You can see what audiences were really responding to, but also what they weren't really feeling. In a bit, we'll hear about a new book that goes deep into the creation of the classic movie Sunset Boulevard. But first, entertainment reporter Ashlyn Cullens has a new book exploring the history of the Scream franchise. It's called you'd Favorite Scary Movie. And this is a franchise where the main prop in the first movie's most iconic scene is a house phone, multiple house phones, actually. And by the middle of the series, they graduated to live streamers. And Cullens talks to NPR's Aisha Rascoe about how technological change shaped how Scream filmmakers decided to scare us. That's ahead.

[B]

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[D]

Sidney Prescott is on the front porch, wireless phone to her ear with the antenna up.

[E]

Nice try, Randy. Tell Tatum to hurry up. Okay? Bye now. If you hang up on me, you'll die just like your mot. You wanna die.

[D]

Sidney Ghostface appears almost immediately after, and then again and again and again through a series of Scream films that's still ongoing. Ashley Cullens has written a new history of the Scream franchise called you'd Favorite Scary Movie. And she joins us now. Welcome to the program.

[E]

Hi.

[F]

Thanks so much for having me.

[D]

Kevin Williamson and Wes Craven created Scream. What did each of them bring to this movie and then to the series?

[F]

Both of them brought just a deep, pure love for the horror genre. And this was coming at a time when people weren't really taking horror seriously. And so Kevin, when he wrote this movie, was essentially trying to just write the kind of movie he wanted to see. So he built out this story that was a true slasher, but also brought attention to all of the tropes that had become so exaggerated over the years. And then Wes Craven, who actually declined several times to make this movie, he brought his understanding of human psychology and how to scare people, and the combination of their two talents just created something absolutely brilliant.

[D]

Scream was an enormous success, but at first, the big wigs were hating the direction of the movie, including, like, that classic first scene with Drew Barrymore. Talk to me about that.

[E]

Yeah.

[F]

So anytime they're making a movie, right, the executives who aren't on set get sent dailies, which is just raw footage, so that they can kind of keep tabs on how things are going. They're just seeing Drew Barrymore walking around holding a telephone. And so Wes Craven knew what he was building. Everyone around him knew what he was building. They could feel it was going to be great. But the studio was a bit like, this isn't scary. So they cut together the opening sequence to show them, and that did the trick. They were like, okay, we see it.

[E]

You never told me your name.

[F]

Why do you want to know my name?

[E]

I want to know who I'm looking at.

[C]

What did you say?

[E]

I want to know who I'm talking to.

[D]

I was really struck by the lengths the team went to to avoid leaks when it came to making the sequel.

[F]

Yep. There were no expectations when they were making the first movie. Right. And so when you're shooting a sequel out of a canon, not only are there expectations, but there's also fandom wanting to know everything and wanting to know the mystery. And they came up with some really creative solutions. My favorite was the paper that they printed the scripts on. There's actually a picture of it in the book. It was this, like, maroonish brown stripe down the middle. So when you're looking at it in person, you can just barely read it, but it's impossible to photocopy. It shows up black. They had secret codes written in the margins in case something did get out, that they would know who it was that leaked it. It's just so fun to think about how that must have felt at the time. Probably ridiculous and, like, a bit of a headache, but also a little bit like being a spy.

[D]

Yeah. This coincided with the rise of Internet fan culture. Right. And the rise of the Internet. Is that the way that the Internet kind of shaped Scream at that time, or were there other ways that it kind of had an impact?

[F]

Well, when you just look at sort of the way that Each of these movies examines culture. In the second movie, she gets a prank call because people have heard her story, and she looks at the caller id.

[D]

Yeah.

[F]

And caller ID was, like, just becoming a thing.

[D]

Yeah.

[F]

And then by the third movie, they're making movies about the movies. And by the fourth movie, people are starting to become Internet famous, and there's commentary on social media. And that actually was like, a little bit, maybe two, ahead of its time, because they, you know, they were live streaming things, and the killer wanted to be famous for being a victim. And that time period that was, you know, like the early 2010s was just before everybody really went nuts with social media.

[E]

Well, if you want to be the new, new version, the killer should be filming the murders. It's like the natural next step in a psycho slasher innovation. I mean, you film them all real.

[B]

Time, and then before you get caught.

[E]

You upload them into cyberspace, making your art as immortal as you.

[D]

Not to implicate him, what do you think about how the use of comedy in the movie shaped it as a scary movie? And just like, you know, as a.

[F]

Movie overall, it diffuses the tension. Right. It gives you a little bit of a break from being scared, which makes it more rewatchable. Also, it disarms you. You're not tense, waiting for something to happen, and they catch you out of nowhere, and it makes the scary part scarier.

[D]

Scream 7 is set to be released in February. What are you hoping for out of that one?

[F]

I am just so glad to see Kevin Williamson directing it. No spoilers here, obviously, but I was able to visit set, and the atmosphere felt a lot like what people had described to me when they talked about being on Wes Craven sets. There was an energy there that gives me very high hopes for this movie.

[D]

You interviewed so many people involved with the movies and fans of the movies, but obviously you weren't able to talk to Wes Craven because He died in 2015. What would you most want to ask him?

[F]

I would want to ask him if he's happy with how his career went, because it was a sore spot for him. He saw himself as a director, not as a horror director. He was a storyteller. He, you know, Music of the Heart starring Meryl Streep was, like, his passion project. And I don't know that he ever really felt appreciated for how brilliant he was as a filmmaker during his life, because people just didn't take horror all that seriously. But now they do.

[D]

Now they do. Yeah.

[F]

If he could see how people talk about him now, I would be really curious to know if that changes how he feels about his filmography.

[D]

That's Ashley Cullens. Her book is your favorite scary movie, how the Scream Films Rewrote the Rules of Horror. Thank you so much for speaking with us.

[F]

Thanks for having me.

[C]

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[A]

Today, movies have to compete with social media in the attention economy, but back in 1949, when the movie Sunset Boulevard came out, the big scary competition for the film industry was television. Writer David Lubin talks about this in his new book, Ready for My Close up the Making of Sunset Boulevard and the Dark side of the Hollywood dream. Here's NPR's Elsa Chang.

[G]

Just a few weeks ago, I rewatched the 1950 classic film Sunset Boulevard for the first time in years, and I was struck by how well the film had aged. I mean, sure, some of the dialogue seems straight out of a time capsule, like this repartee between Norma Desmond, the aging film star played by Gloria Swanson, and her much younger lover, Joe Gillis, played by William Holden.

[E]

You're Norma Desmond. Used to be in silent pictures. Used to be big.

[G]

I am big. It's the pictures that got small. I love that line. Even if some parts of the film sound dated, so many of the themes feel current today. The way we worship and ridicule Hollywood, the quest for fame and the struggle to hang on to it, the cruelty of aging. As Sunset Boulevard celebrates its 75th anniversary, David Lubin is out with a new book about how the stories of the fictional characters and the real life people behind those characters converged during this film's making. It's called Ready for My Closeup, the Making of Sunset Boulevard and the Dark side of the Hollywood Dream. David Lubin joins us now. Welcome.

[E]

Well, I'm glad to be here.

[G]

So great to have you. So you're a film professor, an art historian, and I can think of all kinds of academic reasons why you would want to write a book about Sunset Boulevard. But tell me what it was like when you first saw this film. Just as a regular human Being. What were you immediately captured by?

[E]

Well, I think the first time I saw movie in my. Probably my 20s, it seems so bizarre. And that was part of what attracted me to it. And it seems so genre jumping. And that really attracted me that it was a mystery and a horror film and a comedy and a romance and a psychological thriller all wrapped up into one. It has a kind of contemporary feeling to it that most movies that are 75 years old don't have. Right.

[G]

So much of this story that you tell about this movie is. Is focused on comebacks, right? Like, not just for the on screen characters, but especially for the off screen characters. Like, these were real life people who themselves feared becoming irrelevant. And I want to start with writer and director Billy Wilder. What did he need this film to be at that particular time in his career?

[E]

Well, he had made a couple highly acclaimed films. Double Indemnity, which some people consider the first film noir, and a searing drama about alcoholism called the Lost Weekend, for which he won Academy Awards. Then the next two films he made were duds, right? They weren't utter flops, but they just didn't have any of the pizzazz of his earlier two films. And so he felt that he needed to make a comeback. He needed to make a strong statement.

[G]

And when it comes to film comebacks, this film was a comeback for actress Gloria Swanson as well, who played Norma Desmond. I mean, she had been the queen of silent film peaking in the 1920s, and then she faded from filmmaking. I was curious, when Swanson accepts this role after both Mae west and Mary Pickford, two legends, turn it down, how much do you think Swanson saw herself in Norma Desmond?

[E]

Well, Swanson was very pragmatic person, and she was nothing like Norma Desmond. But she understood the pains and agonies of being an overlooked star from her own experience and also having friends in the business who had been put on the back shelf, right. So the whole thought of obsolescence or. Or being irrelevant was a very powerful draw to her. And she thought she was just having a small part in the movie. She didn't really know what the movie was about. And Billy Wilder insisted that she do a screen test. And she was going, what? I'm Gloria Swanson. I don't do screen tests.

[G]

I don't do screen tests.

[E]

But Swanson's good friend George Cukor, the film director, said to her, if you don't take this role, I'm gonna shoot you. This is the best role you're ever gonna find. So she said, okay, I'll do the screen Test. And she went out to Hollywood to do the screen test.

[G]

And from that very moment, that first scre, she added layers and textures to the role that even Wilder and Brackett had not imagined. On the page, right?

[E]

Yeah. So the clip you played of I am Big, it's the pictures that got small. She just seemed so radiant and so powerful and also like a gorgon. She was monstrous.

[G]

I also want to play a cut of this outstanding speech that Swanson gives in this film talking to William Holden's Joe Gillis. Let's take a listen.

[E]

Still wonderful, isn't it?

[G]

And no dialogue. We didn't need dialogue. We had faces. There just aren't any faces like that anymore. Maybe one Garbo. Those idiot producers, those imbeciles.

[E]

Haven't they got any eyes? Have they forgotten what a star looks like? I'll show them.

[G]

I'll be up there again, so help me. David, you write that this is one of the top speeches ever delivered on film. Tell us why.

[E]

Oh, I got chills listening to it just now. Swanson is an anachronism within the film. She acts in silent film rhetoric. Nothing like the style of Hollywood at that time, which was to be more quiet and introspective and more self contained. She just explodes that. And that's part of what the movie is about, is this clash between the silent period and the sound period and the transformation or degradation as she would see it, from the silence to the talkies.

[G]

Yeah. There's also in this film the larger comeback question for the film industry itself. During the mid 20th century, right. The studio system was disintegrating, TV was rising, anti communists were targeting Hollywood. How do you think that larger context further shaped the story in Sunset Boulevard?

[E]

That context of the blacklisting and the competition, the rivalry with television and the financial problems the film industry was having are all reflected in the film. In fact, in 1946, Hollywood sold more tickets per capita than at any time in its history. But by 1949, when Sunset Boulevard was shot, people wanted to stay home and watch tv. They didn't have to pay for babysitters when they went out. So the film is on the precipice. They know something is going to happen, something's got to change, but they don't really know which direction it's going to fall in.

[G]

It makes me think that this story about Hollywood upheaval, it just keeps on repeating, Right? Like today, the destabilizing forces are streaming and AI. Yeah.

[E]

That's another reason why the movie has jumped into our attention again because it is about those transformations in personal lives and technological lives that is occurring right now and leaving us sort of afraid because we don't know where we're going. We don't know what's going to happen next. So there's a suspense that we all as a society are feeling right now that is mirrored in the film.

[G]

Absolutely. David Lubin's new book is called Ready for My Close up the Making of Sunset Boulevard and the Dark side of the Hollywood Dream. Thank you so much, David.

[E]

Oh, it's been a pleasure, Elsa. Thank you.

[A]

That's it for this week on NPR's Book of the Day. If you want more, you can sign up for our [e-mail] Newsletter Books I'm Andrew Limbong. The podcast is produced by Chloe Weiner and edited by Megan Sullivan. Our founding editor is Patra Maher. The show elements for this week were produced and edited by Justine Kennan, Erica Ryan, Samantha Balaban, Gable Connor, Melissa Gray, Courtney Dorning, Alaina Burnett, Jacob Fenston, Dave Mistish, Danny Hensel, Ed McNulty and Mark Rivers. Yolanda Sanguini is our executive producer. Thanks for listening.

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