Best Friends Day

Summary

Podcast Summary: Office Ladies Episode – "Best Friends Day"

Episode Details:

• Title: Best Friends Day
• Hosts: Jenna Fischer and Angela Kinsey
• Release Date: June 4, 2025
• Description: Jenna Fischer and Angela Kinsey, co-stars from The Office and best friends themselves, embark on a heartfelt episode celebrating Best Friends Day. They delve into listener-submitted friendship stories, share personal anecdotes, and explore the dynamics of friendships both within and outside the beloved TV show.

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1. Introduction to Best Friends Day (02:23 – 04:44)

Jenna and Angela kick off the episode by announcing a special celebration in honor of National Best Friends Day on June 8th. They express their excitement about sharing listener-submitted letters that highlight the beauty and diversity of friendships.

Notable Quote:

• Jenna Fischer (02:51): "National Best Friends Day is this Sunday, June 8th. And we thought it would be fun to celebrate."

They provide interesting statistics, clarifying that there are both national and international Best Friends Days, explaining the origins and significance of each.

Notable Quotes:

• Angela Kinsey (03:22): "Did you know there are actually two best friend days?"
• Jenna Fischer (04:03): "They wanted to honor the bonds of friendship and recognize the positive impact that friends have on our lives."

2. Celebrating Friendships (04:44 – 07:00)

The hosts discuss various ways to celebrate Best Friends Day, including reading a curated list of friendship-themed novels recommended by the New York Public Library. They emphasize how friendships can range from lighthearted to deeply transformative.

Notable Quote:

• Cassie Jerkins (05:00): "That sounds awesome."

They transition into exploring friendships within The Office, listing and ranking the top 10 on-screen friendships, and providing their own insights and disagreements with popular opinions.

Notable Quotes:

• Angela Kinsey (05:53): "Ready?"
• Jenna Fischer (06:05): "Oh, yes."

3. Listener Letters: Stories of Friendship (09:17 – 35:25)

Jenna and Angela share heartfelt letters from listeners, highlighting diverse and enduring friendships. These stories range from childhood best friends who have stood the test of time to frenemies who became close companions.

Selected Listener Stories:

• Allison S. from Edmonton, Canada (09:17 – 10:03): Allison narrates her transition from rivalry to deep friendship with Lauren, marked by shared experiences like dyeing their hair and supporting each other through major life events.

  Notable Quote:

  • Allison S. (09:17): "We had splotchy hair color for weeks. And our connection solidified when we took a work trip to Disney World."

• Alana D. from Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania (25:41 – 27:05): Alana shares an enduring friendship with Cassie, emphasizing unwavering support during her breast cancer diagnosis and recovery.

  Notable Quote:

  • Alana D. (25:35): "We are soulmates and I know we can face anything that life brings together."

• Carly B. from Newark, Texas (27:52 – 28:35): Carly describes her friendship with London, highlighting their complementary personalities and the joy they find in each other's quirks.

  Notable Quote:

  • Carly B. (27:52): "We are incredibly different people with incredibly different opinions on literally everything, but we are also the exact same person."

4. Personal Stories: The Hosts' Friendship Journey (35:27 – 43:25)

Jenna and Angela delve into their own friendship origins, sharing intimate moments and milestones that have solidified their bond over the years. They reminisce about their first best friends, the impact of moving away, and the significance of their proximity at work.

Notable Quote:

• Angela Kinsey (43:00): "Putting on my glasses. Back from lunch. Jen and I ate in her trailer. It's my favorite."

Jenna recounts the heartfelt moment she bought her first best friend necklace for Angela, symbolizing their deep connection.

Notable Quote:

• Jenna Fischer (63:45): "I was standing in that Claire's and being like, do I buy it? What if I give it to her? ... But I bought it and I gave it to you. And you were like, I love it."

5. Deep Dive: Friendship Research (43:45 – 59:11)

The hosts explore academic and societal perspectives on friendship, referencing Snapchat's 2011 Friendship Report. They discuss the challenges of maintaining friendships in adulthood, common stressors leading to friendship dissolution, and strategies to forge new connections.

Key Insights:

• Common Stressors:

  1. New romantic relationships
  2. Parenthood
  3. Employment changes
  4. Loss of a loved one
  5. Relocation

• Strategies for Making Friends:

  • Assume People Like You: Research shows that believing in your likability can make you more approachable and positive.

    Notable Quote:

    • Jenna Fischer (50:03): "When strangers interacted with each other... people routinely underestimate their likability."

  • Take Initiative: Don't wait for friendships to happen naturally; actively seek out connections through shared interests and group activities.

    Notable Quote:

    • Angela Kinsey (54:21): "I blocked her bike with my body."

  • Pursue Group Hobbies: Engaging in activities like yoga classes, book clubs, or sports can help meet like-minded individuals.

    Notable Quote:

    • Jenna Fischer (54:44): "Here are some suggestions. Take a yoga class. Libraries have book clubs. Pickleball..."

6. Sam's Heartfelt Tribute (65:23 – 71:08)

In a poignant segment, Sam Kiefer, the podcast's audio engineer, delivers an emotional tribute to Jenna, Angela, and Cassie. He shares his journey of sobriety, expressing immense gratitude for the support and positive influence the hosts and their team have had on his life.

Notable Quotes:

• Sam Kiefer (65:36): "Everything that I am better for from having known you three comes from you guys overcoming your own battles in life."
• Jenna Fischer (70:02): "I am so glad that you are giving yourself the care that you deserve, because you deserve it."

The hosts respond with heartfelt affirmations, emphasizing the importance of their community and the transformative power of genuine friendships.

7. Conclusion and Final Thoughts (71:08 – End)

The episode wraps up with Jenna and Angela reflecting on the profound impact of their own friendship, the joy of sharing listener stories, and the enduring legacy of The Office in fostering connections among fans. They express their gratitude to listeners for participating in this special celebration and reaffirm the podcast's commitment to exploring the intricacies of friendships.

Notable Quote:

• Angela Kinsey (65:18): "This was so wonderful. I love that our show brings people together."

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Key Takeaways:

• Friendship Dynamics: Friendships evolve over time, influenced by life changes such as relocation, career shifts, and personal growth.
• Active Effort: Building and maintaining friendships require proactive efforts, understanding, and mutual support.
• Impact of Media: The Office serves as a backdrop for exploring real-life friendships, illustrating how media can influence and reflect our personal relationships.

Final Thoughts: Jenna Fischer and Angela Kinsey deliver a heartwarming episode that not only celebrates the essence of friendship but also provides insightful perspectives on nurturing and sustaining meaningful relationships. Through shared stories and personal reflections, listeners are reminded of the invaluable role friends play in our lives.

Transcript

[Jenna Fischer]

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[Angela Kinsey]

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[Jenna Fischer]

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[Angela Kinsey]

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[Jenna Fischer]

Lady, you know that I love horror movies.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah, I know.

[Jenna Fischer]

And there's a very popular part of the horror movie where like the person is home alone and they're just like locking up their house. They're turning off the lights, they're heading to bed and you know something's gonna go down.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

Do you know what would throw a huge monkey wrench into this horror movie that I'm describing?

[Angela Kinsey]

If the character in the movie is smart, they would have gotten Simplisafe like I did.

[Jenna Fischer]

That's right. The movie would be over. Nothing would happen to them.

[Angela Kinsey]

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[Jenna Fischer]

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[Angela Kinsey]

That's simplisafe.com officeladies. There's no safe like SimpliSafe.

[Jenna Fischer]

I'm Jenna Fisher.

[Angela Kinsey]

And I'm Angela Kinsey.

[Jenna Fischer]

We were on the Office together and we're best friends. And now we're doing the ultimate office lovers podcast just for you.

[Angela Kinsey]

Each week we will dive deeper into the world of the Office with exclusive interviews, behind the scenes details, and lots of BFF stories.

[Jenna Fischer]

We're the Office Ladies 6.0. Hello.

[Angela Kinsey]

Hi, there. Welcome to Office Ladies 6.0. Today we have a really special episode. I know we say that a lot, but I love this one. We've always wanted to do an episode around Best Friendship. And this is in honor of Best Friends day. That is June 8th.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. National Best Friends Day is this Sunday, June 8th. And we thought it would be fun to celebrate. So we asked you all to write in about your best friends, and we're gonna share some of your letters. They were so wonderful to read if you wanna be in a good mood.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

They should put together a book of just people sharing a story about their best friend.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

Because it made me so happy. And also, Angela did a little deep dive on office friendships, But I thought I could kick things off with some stats about Best Friends Day.

[Angela Kinsey]

You know, I love a stat.

[Jenna Fischer]

Did you know there are actually two best friend days?

[Angela Kinsey]

No.

[Jenna Fischer]

One is national and one is international.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay, that's always a little confusing. You know, if you're on the social media and you do the hashtag and you see people doing National Best Friends Day or whatever it is. National Cat Day. You did international, and then you're like, oh, crap, which one is it?

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, I'll tell you now.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay.

[Jenna Fischer]

This Sunday, June 8, is National Best Friends Day. And that was established in 1935 by our United States Congress.

[Angela Kinsey]

How about that?

[Jenna Fischer]

I didn't even know that they were the ones who did that.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

They wanted to honor the bonds of friendship and recognize the positive impact that friends have on our lives. And they chose June 8th because it is generally a time of good weather across the whole country, making it a pleasant time of year to spend time outdoors with your friends. So I think they're wanting you to.

[Angela Kinsey]

Get outside everybody and do something with your BFF.

[Jenna Fischer]

Exactly. Then in 2011, the United nations declared July 30 as international friendship Day. And this was to recognize the importance of friendships in promoting peace and understanding among communities and nations.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, I like both of those.

[Jenna Fischer]

And then, you know, there's a lot of ways you can celebrate Best Friends Day this Sunday. But, Cassie, I think you would like this way. The New York Public Library made a list of 15 novels about friendship to read with your bestie.

[Cassie Jerkins]

That sounds awesome.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. They said these novels feature a range of friendship stories, from lighthearted and affirming to explorations of how friendships can break apart and come back together. So we can put a link to them in stories?

[Cassie Jerkins]

Yes, please.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, you know, it's My belief that one of the reasons the Office was such a huge success and continues to be is because at its core, it's centered around friendships. I mean, I think maybe Michael said it best. The people that you work with are just, when you get down to it.

[Jenna Fischer]

You are very best friends.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, I know. And, you know, according to the Internet, and there are a lot, A lot of articles about the friendships that are on the Office, but here is one that lists the 10 best friendships in their opinion.

[Jenna Fischer]

Ready?

[Angela Kinsey]

Number 10, Aaron and Phyllis.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah, they were very sweet. Number nine is the only threesome. Oscar, Angela and Kevin. Best friends.

[Jenna Fischer]

Sure.

[Angela Kinsey]

Number eight, Jim and Michael. Number seven, Erin and Nellie. Number six, Jim and Pam. They did start as good friends.

[Jenna Fischer]

Sure.

[Angela Kinsey]

Number five, Phyllis and Stanley. I mean, come on.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah, right.

[Angela Kinsey]

Number four, Phyllis and Angela were listed as friends. Yes.

[Jenna Fischer]

Huh.

[Angela Kinsey]

I know. Maybe more like frenemies for those two a little bit. Number three, Dwight and Pam, which I love. Dwight calls Pam his best friend.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

Number two, Michael and Dwight. And I would say yes. I mean, that's who Dwight wanted to be his best man.

[Jenna Fischer]

Exactly.

[Angela Kinsey]

Number one on the list of best friends at the Office. Any guesses?

[Jenna Fischer]

No. Who's left?

[Cassie Jerkins]

Is it Kelly and Ryan?

[Jenna Fischer]

That's the only person I could think of.

[Angela Kinsey]

No.

[Cassie Jerkins]

It's such a strange thing.

[Angela Kinsey]

This is. Everyone unanimously online said the number one best friendship on the Office, Michael and Holly. No, but that's good, Sam. That's really good. Jim and Dwight. I know that's what they said. They had their ups and downs, but in the end, you know, Jim says, oh, my gosh. Remember that line? He's like, I can't believe I'm saying this. I miss Dwight. I mean, they sort of had this weird dude on and off again, friendship. But this is up for discussion because I feel like they left a few really big ones off the list. I think Andy and Darryl became good friends. Pam and Michael. Yes, Pam and Michael.

[Jenna Fischer]

Thank you.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes. And then, you know, I do like that they say Angela, Oscar and Kevin. But I think Angela and Oscar had their own true friendship.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes, I agree.

[Angela Kinsey]

And then I would say they left off one if they're gonna put Phyllis and Angela on there. I think there's a frenemies category for Angela and Pam. But see what I mean? There's so many friendships that grow over the years of this show, and people watch that and they feel it. And I think it's so wonderful that one of the biggest takeaways from watching the Office are these friendships that people.

[Jenna Fischer]

Connect to and the friendships represent the very wide range of friendships.

[Angela Kinsey]

This is true.

[Jenna Fischer]

Which includes, I think, the catego frenemies. Or it includes like, you're sort of like, how did this person become my friend? But they are, you know, like, it. It kind of covers all the different categories.

[Angela Kinsey]

Are the friend that drives you crazy and you prank, but you end up planning their bachelor party.

[Jenna Fischer]

Exactly. Well, we got a letter speaking of frenemies that I wanted to read. It's from Allison S. In Edmonton, Canada, who said, my best friend is named Lauren. We worked together as dance teachers. When she was first hired, I did not like her. She was given some classes I wanted to be teaching, and I felt an instant rivalry. Luckily, with time, her charm cleared away any thoughts of rivalry and forced me to admit she was awesome. And I was thrilled when it seemed we could instead become friends. Our friendship took off when we helped each other box dye our hair in her bathtub and realized we both did a terrible job.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, my gosh.

[Jenna Fischer]

We had splotchy hair color for weeks. And our connection solidified when we took a work trip to Disney World and were paired together for everything from rides to sharing a bed. When she got married in a small family only ceremony, I was asked to be there as the photographer. I have zero photography experience and felt so lucky to be included in the day. Her husband agreed that there was no way I could miss it. They've moved to Seattle now, and while the distance is so hard, we used to live across the street from each other. We're still best friends and have video chats and voice memos to tide us over in between visits. She's changed my life forever. We both love Office Ladies and have frequently compared our friendship to Jenna and Angela.

[Angela Kinsey]

Aw.

[Jenna Fischer]

I love that they started kind of as frenemies.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

I love their whole story about the dyeing their hair and it being all patchy. Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

I also love that they stay in touch with voice memos and video chat because there's been many times in our lives in our friendship when we weren't in the same city. And we did that. And I knew your whole life because we were so dedicated to sharing and keeping each other in the loop. And that's so special.

[Jenna Fischer]

So cool. I loved it.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, up next, I have a fun thing for us to do, and you guys can do this with us. I'll put a link in stories and. But buzzfeed did an online quiz to determine, quote, who would be your best friend at the office if you worked at Dunder Mifflin. Oh. So all Right.

[Jenna Fischer]

How do we do it?

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, everyone go to their phones. I am texting you a link. We all have to do it individually and then we have to share our answer.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay.

[Angela Kinsey]

I'm going to read the questions that we're all going to do out loud so people will know.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay.

[Angela Kinsey]

First one. What do you do in your free time? The choices are self defense lessons, hang out with friends, doodle at a cafe, illegal stuff, Cook. Perfect. My comedy routine. Shop or yoga class.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay, I did it.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay, next one. Ready? How would you describe yourself? Talented. Above average. Relaxed. Inspirational. Cool. Resourceful. Sweet. Smart.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay.

[Angela Kinsey]

All right. What is your place in the office? Are you the moral support? The queen? The best. The boss? The prankster? The snacker? The comedian? The glue.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay, Angela, I need to know what you're pressing.

[Angela Kinsey]

Why?

[Jenna Fischer]

Because I just need to know the answer. I need to know your assessment of yourself on this question.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay. I would say I'm the glue.

[Jenna Fischer]

Sam, Cassie, how do we feel about her answer?

[Sam Kiefer]

I put I'm the glue.

[Cassie Jerkins]

I put I'm the glue.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, my gosh. I'm the queen. But Angela, I had you as the snacker.

[Cassie Jerkins]

Oh, you could have probably put you for moral support.

[Angela Kinsey]

Thank you.

[Jenna Fischer]

I would have thought of you as moral support or the snacker. But I've decided to be the queen.

[Angela Kinsey]

That's good.

[Sam Kiefer]

Well, the queen and three glues is perfect.

[Jenna Fischer]

Is that how we do office ladies?

[Angela Kinsey]

That keeps us. That keeps us all going. Okay, what's your dream job? Model, Actor. Multimillionaire, Athlete, CEO, Painter, Entrepreneur or vocalist?

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay, I put entrepreneur.

[Angela Kinsey]

Are we sharing now? Why not? Okay.

[Jenna Fischer]

It makes it more interesting, I think.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay. Sam, what did you put?

[Sam Kiefer]

Athlete.

[Angela Kinsey]

Cassie, Athlete. I put athlete.

[Jenna Fischer]

Who am I? I am the outlier of this group.

[Angela Kinsey]

Favorite subject? Drama, Robotics, physical education, Art, after school, clubs, school, question mark, band and lunch.

[Jenna Fischer]

I'm going to put drama.

[Angela Kinsey]

I put drama as well.

[Sam Kiefer]

Art.

[Cassie Jerkins]

I put drama.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay. I like it. Pick a hobby. Internet trolling. Comedy. Competitive eating, Running, Programming. Debate. Volunteering. Yoga.

[Jenna Fischer]

I put Internet trolling. Oh, Jenna, I'm kidding. I put yoga.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, my gosh.

[Jenna Fischer]

I found out who I am.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, my God. I found out who I am.

[Sam Kiefer]

I found out who I am.

[Cassie Jerkins]

Okay, I kind of already knew who I was gonna be paired with and it makes complete sense.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay. Go, Sam.

[Sam Kiefer]

I am with Pam. Me and Pam could take art lessons together. We're both kind and have a great sense of humor.

[Jenna Fischer]

I like that.

[E]

Sure.

[Jenna Fischer]

Cassie, who are you?

[Cassie Jerkins]

Michael. You and Michael probably met at an improv class, which you both failed. You Love to make people laugh.

[Sam Kiefer]

You both failed.

[Cassie Jerkins]

We definitely did.

[Angela Kinsey]

Mike. Doesn't make any sense to me.

[Jenna Fischer]

Who?

[Angela Kinsey]

Really? Maybe I hit a wrong button. Jim.

[Jenna Fischer]

You're Jim.

[Angela Kinsey]

It says you and Jim would be best buddies. You love to prank your co workers. I do not.

[Jenna Fischer]

You hate pranks.

[Angela Kinsey]

I hate pranks. And you like to relax with your family at the end of the day. That part's true.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well. And you are the likable everyman of the office ladies group, Angela. Well, okay, so that tracks. Guess who I'm friends with.

[Angela Kinsey]

Wait, wait.

[Cassie Jerkins]

Ryan. Entrepreneur.

[Jenna Fischer]

I'm with Jan. I'll take it. I'll take it.

[Angela Kinsey]

That's a good one.

[Sam Kiefer]

Buy one of your candles.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, my goodness. That was so fun. Okay, I'll put the quiz in our stories, too.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, listen, before we go to break, I wanted to share something. This is a personal share. I wanna share that I am on the COVID of USA Today's and Media Planet's Future of Cancer Care campaign. It's like a little magazine, you know, that they put inside the newspapers. I'm on the COVID Wow. It's in honor of National Cancer Survivors Day, which was this past Sunday, June 1st. And I spoke about my journey, and I do that really just in hopes that it might bring comfort to others. And they asked me for a photo for the COVID And I. I didn't know what to give because I haven't, like, done a photo shoot since my hair fell out and it started growing back. I did a picture that Josh took of me when I announced, but I didn't have any other pictures. But then I remembered I did have this one picture that I took. It was when I was doing my campaign for screening time off. I pulled the photographer aside and I said, I'm getting my port out in two weeks. And I have not taking a picture with it because it's like a thing. Like, I feel conflicted about it. I had this very, like, love hate relationship with this port. It's visible. Yeah. And it's not gruesome.

[Angela Kinsey]

It's not gruesome, but it's definitely, you know that there's something there. And you. Your shirt's covered it, but.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

But it would be visible to the eye.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. It's like a bump under the skin.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes.

[Jenna Fischer]

And so I showed it and he took a photo of me. And that's the picture that I shared with them. And it was an important thing for me to have. And then it became kind of an important thing for me to share. I think. I hope that anyone who is going through that will just maybe, I don't know, find something in that picture.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. You know, I was with you when you had it removed. And that was emotional day for you. That was such a book into such a journey you had been on.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

And I think that's wonderful that you shared that, Jenna.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. I mean, that's a nice share and honor of Best Friends Day. Lee was away shooting his movie in Oklahoma, but they said they could schedule me to get my port out. And, Angela, I said to you, I said, well, I guess I'm gonna have to put this off for, like, two months. I'm gonna have to have this port in me because Lee's not home. And you said, oh, no, sweetie, no.

[Angela Kinsey]

We'Re getting that done.

[Jenna Fischer]

She's like, I've listened to you for one year about this thing. I will get you to the hospital. And I had other moms who each took my kids after school and let them spend the night so that I could recover. And it was just, you know, again, friends coming together.

[Angela Kinsey]

The community of friendship. Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

Who made that happen for me? And now it's out. And I have this. I have a scar, which I knew I would have, and I assumed that it wouldn't bother me. I thought, I don't care. I have tons of scars from my surgery, from under my arm, you know, around my breasts. I have scars, and none of them bother me. So I just assumed that the port scar wouldn't bother me. And I don't like it.

[Angela Kinsey]

You don't like it?

[Jenna Fischer]

I don't. And some people will get, like, a tattoo over it.

[Angela Kinsey]

Have you considered getting a tattoo?

[Jenna Fischer]

I don't want a tattoo over it. I feel like that's just going to make me see it more somehow. Like it.

[Angela Kinsey]

And you did consider getting a tattoo?

[Jenna Fischer]

I did consider getting a tattoo.

[Angela Kinsey]

Just not there, but just to sort.

[Jenna Fischer]

Of, like, in honor of this experience.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes.

[Jenna Fischer]

But then I got a fake tattoo for Lee's movie, and I didn't like my fake tattoo. Like, I liked it, but I didn't like that there was, like, something that kept catching my eye.

[Sam Kiefer]

What was your tattoo gonna be?

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, I thought that I might wanna get a little drawing of the antique bell that I rang after I finished chemo.

[Sam Kiefer]

Okay. I like that.

[Jenna Fischer]

Y. Yeah. Or a butterfly. These were my two options, but I'm getting neither, as it turns out. And I'm also not getting a tattoo over my port scar. But, yeah, it's just that, like, all the other scars, I can avoid them somehow, visually. Like, I don't see them but this one, every time I get out of the shower, there's Portiscar. And then, like, I wanted to wear a sundress when we went to Hawaii and it's like, there it is. And I just let it hang out. Like, I'm not gonna, like, change how I dress or change anything because it's there. But it bumps me and I. I don't know, maybe that'll go away eventually. And I know that a lot of people try to pump me up and they're like, it's your battle scar. You're a warrior. And I'm trying to frame it that way in my head.

[Angela Kinsey]

You know, I just think it's new and you don't love change and, like, why? You need a little bit of time, I guess. And you'll have time with it and it'll be fine. Yes, you'll get used to it.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, anyway, you can look for the magazine inside of USA Today. It came out in Chicago this past weekend. It's going nationwide this coming weekend. But you can also find it online. We'll put a link to the article in our show notes. And Angela, will you swipe it up in our stories?

[Angela Kinsey]

Of course.

[Jenna Fischer]

I also have it linked in my bio on Instagram, so if you have someone going through a cancer journey, maybe it'll be of service to them.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, I just love all of that. And you know what? We're going to take a break and when we come back, we are going to share our very first friendship stories.

[Jenna Fischer]

And some of yours.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes.

[Jenna Fischer]

Hello, everyone. And hello, all of you HR pros.

[Angela Kinsey]

It's Jenna Fisher here, and it's Angela Kinzie. We are so excited to be part of SHRM25, the Society for Human Resource Management's biggest annual conference where over 22,000 HR professionals from all over the world come together.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah, it is happening in San Diego this year. And guess what? Me and Angela are going. We will be on the main stage. That's right, the main stage, alongside some amazing thought leaders like Brad Rencher, the CEO of BambooHR.

[Angela Kinsey]

So, you know, I have been to a SHRM conference. I went in 2023 when it was in Florida. I had the best time.

[Jenna Fischer]

You told me you had so much fun. I mean, that's kind of the reason we're going together.

[Angela Kinsey]

I met so many wonderful people. There were great conversations. And I want you to know SHRM25 is the ultimate HR experience. You're going to explore the latest trends in AI data compliance, leadership development, management, and how to actually Attract and retain your top talent.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay, so this is like, it's a.

[Angela Kinsey]

Bunch of Toby's but really fun Tobys.

[Jenna Fischer]

But here's the thing. Toby is great. He's just when Michael doesn't like Toby. But Toby is actually terrific. Terrific.

[Angela Kinsey]

Really good at his job.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. So shrm25 is where HR leadership meets real world solution. We'll make sure that you have a little fun and some laughs, too. We really can't wait to be a part of it.

[Angela Kinsey]

So go get your ticket and get.

[Jenna Fischer]

Ready because SHRM25 is happening in San Diego June 29th through July 2nd. It is the world's largest HR conference for HR professionals.

[Angela Kinsey]

And you're going to meet a lot of your peers. You can network, you're going to get a little bit of entertainment, some fantastic conversations. Head to shrm.orgofficeladies to register.

[Jenna Fischer]

That's shrm.orgofficeladies and we'll see you there.

[Angela Kinsey]

We sure will.

[Jenna Fischer]

If you live in California and you're looking to buy a home, let's face it, buying a home in California can feel like a lot. It is overwhelming. But with a realtor, it doesn't have to be.

[Angela Kinsey]

Everything's easier with a trusted advisor by your side, someone who knows California real estate inside and out. I'm talking about your realtor.

[Jenna Fischer]

We love our realtor.

[Angela Kinsey]

We love our realtors.

[Jenna Fischer]

Like love, love. Still in touch with him.

[Angela Kinsey]

One of my best friends has become one of my best friends. Walked my sisters down the aisle at my wedding.

[Jenna Fischer]

A great realtor knows your neighborhood because they're your neighbors.

[Angela Kinsey]

If you're worried about how to make an offer, how much to put down contingencies, let your realtor do the worrying for you.

[Jenna Fischer]

Let your realtor focus on all that paperwork, all the hassle and the headaches. You can just focus on making your new home the place of your dreams.

[Angela Kinsey]

Whether you're deep in the search or just daydreaming of your forever home, you don't have to go at it alone. Learn what your realtor can do for [e-mail] well, we're back and I'm going to go first. I'm going to talk about my very first best friend. She's still a dear friend of mine to this day. Her name is Karinsa and her mom, Karina and my mom were best friends in Indonesia. They played tennis together and we were always at each other's houses. She has a big family with lots of older siblings and there was just always so much like hubbub in her house, and I just loved it. And her mom, Karina, is Dutch, and she introduced me to my favorite thing, which is mayonnaise with french fries. Oh, do you guys eat mayonnaise on your French fries?

[Sam Kiefer]

Yeah, absolutely.

[Cassie Jerkins]

I do. Ranch.

[Angela Kinsey]

Ranch. Well, yeah. Okay.

[Cassie Jerkins]

Pretty close.

[Angela Kinsey]

But she. Anyway, isn't that just such a funny thing that I remember? Like, she'd probably be like, angela, I introduced you to so many foods, but you remember mayonnaise and French fries. And Krince's dad is American. He was working overseas like my dad. And we were so tiny when we met. I was a toddler, and Karinsa's two years younger than me. She was just like a little thing in, like, diapers. And I don't have a memory of my childhood that doesn't include her in that time. Wow. It was like she was just always part of my life. Cause I met her when I was so little.

[Jenna Fischer]

Was she in Indonesia the whole time you were, or did one of you who moved away first?

[Angela Kinsey]

I moved away first.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. And we're so good friends to this day. We check in with each other a lot. We text each other. She is a librarian, and she's been a librarian for over 20 years now at a middle school in Austin, Texas. She is so smart and so funny and just an amazing person. And I'm so thankful that I have this childhood friend from such a special time in my life that I'm still in touch with, you know, because when I started middle school, we moved around a lot, and I really just hold close those friendships from back then. So shout out to Corinth.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, a lot of the letters we got were from people whose first best friend is still their best friend.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah, you know what? I want to read one from Alana D. In Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. She wrote in and said, my best friend Cassie and I met when we were three. And she says, I remember the day. I was new to daycare and always sad. When my mother left, Cassie started after me. And I remember her first day. I knew then that it would all be okay. We've weathered so much all over the world. We've noticed how our conversations and how we care for one another have changed over the years. In our teens, we vetted each other's crushes. In our 20s, we nursed hangovers and traveling bugs. In our 30s and 40s, we took mom getaways and talked about our aches and pains as we were aging. Most recently, Cassie came to Pittsburgh from Boston after I was diagnosed with breast cancer. To be with me for the first whirlwind day of appointments, her presence and us still being able to be us turned a potentially terrible day into something beautiful. She later came to help me recover after my bilateral mastectomy and spent days caring for me. Her family and boss okayed this time away. And I am grateful for how others also honor and give space for our friendship. We are soulmates and I know we can face anything that life brings together. Today was my last round of chemotherapy and we are already planning our next adventure.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, my gosh.

[Angela Kinsey]

That's so sweet. Yes. Oh, Alana, thank you so much for sharing that. What a wonderful friendship.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, I love that letter. I love their friendship. I actually pulled a letter from Carly B. In Newark, Texas, and it is again about a friendship that started when they were very young. Here's what Carly said. Carly said. My best friend London and I have been besties since we were seven years old. We are now both in our 30s and living 800 miles apart, but are still bonded together as if we live right down the road from each other. My husband has my caller ID as light of my life and he has London's caller ID as light of my wife.

[Angela Kinsey]

That's really cute.

[Jenna Fischer]

We are incredibly different people with incredibly different opinions on literally everything, but we are also the exact same person. Somehow it makes sense. We have this bit that's been running for so many years now, and it's hilarious every time it happens. I am a notoriously clumsy person and will drop food on myself at least once a day if we're together. London will see that I've dropped food on myself and immediately smudge a bite of her food on her clothing in solidarity with me. And we laugh until we can't breathe every time it happens. We talk all the time about the similarities between our friendship and Yalls. We love y' all and the podcast so much. Thanks for all you ladies do.

[Angela Kinsey]

I love that she smudges food on her. I know.

[Jenna Fischer]

Isn't that so fun?

[Angela Kinsey]

That is so fun. Well, Jenna, do you have a share about your very first best friend?

[Jenna Fischer]

I do. And you know, I lost touch with my very first best friend. I don't know her anymore, but her name was Beth and she lived up the street from me. We just lived in the same cul de sac.

[Angela Kinsey]

Sure.

[Jenna Fischer]

And we were inseparable. And I loved going over to her house. Her mom would not let her eat sugar stuff like sugar snacks or junk food, but she had this bowl of sugar free candy lozenges and I thought they were like the best thing on the planet.

[Angela Kinsey]

Isn't it funny the little things you remember?

[Jenna Fischer]

Mm, yes. But we would just, you know, we would ride bikes and do things in the neighborhood, and I loved her so much. And then her family moved, and I didn't get an address for her. It was sort of very sudden.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes. I mean, this is sort of part of our generation, is that there weren't ways to stay in touch the same way there are now. And I think because my mom and Corinth's mom were such good friends, that that was the bridge for us because we were little. We were young. I didn't. There was no social media. There was no cell phones. You know, you moved, you got a new phone number. You know, all those things.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, this was unfortunately, like, a common theme for me in that I would bond with someone, and then their family would move. So Beth was my friend, and we were. I don't know, like. I feel like we were, like, 6, 7, 8 years old. And then I just, like, didn't have a great friend for years. And then I became friends with this gal, Lauren, who also lived a little further in my neighborhood, but who I met at school, and we became besties, like, inseparable. I was so excited to have a friend again.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

And then she moved away. Oh, no. But at least this time, we were older. We were in middle school when she moved away, and I just was devastated. My mom recognized it. I did a trip where I went to see by myself to see her in Boston, and she flew out to see me in Missouri once. But then again, like, kind of after that, we sort of lost touch when we were in high school. And so, you know, I've had kind of throughout my life, I've had these people who kind of, like, come and go. And now that I'm talking about it, I'm like, wow, I wonder how that affected me. But I did have a very best friend in high school and then one in college, and I sort of, like, get a best friend for each season of my life. But, Ange, you're the one that stuck. I mean, I'm still friends with my high school and college best friends, but, like, you know. Yeah. I've also gone through periods of my life where I didn't really have a best friend. Like, a true, like, tell you everything, best friend. Yeah, I've had both.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, I think we just met at our perfect time in our life for each other, you know?

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

And now we're older, and we are in charge of, like, all of our life, you know? And we're not being moved by someone else, and we can stay in touch. And I'm so proud of our friendship. And I tell this to people all the time that ask me about our friendship. Is that, you know, like any other relationship in your life, to be a good friend, you have to put the time in and even if distance happens or life happens, be like, all right, we have a phone date to catch up and you just, like, you work for the friendship.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, both people, Alana and Carly, in both of their friendships, there was a move.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

You know?

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

Sam, Cassie, do you have, like, very first best friends that you remember from growing up?

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Cassie Jerkins]

My best friend's name was Amber, and we would play in this canyon behind her house, and we were just totally like animal lovers and bonded over just being out in the woods. She meant a lot to me.

[Angela Kinsey]

I love that.

[Jenna Fischer]

Are you still in touch with her?

[Cassie Jerkins]

Kind of like on Instagram. But I moved to a different town when I was like, 11, and when we came back, we were just totally different people at that point. Yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Sam Kiefer]

My childhood best friend, his name was Jared, this is in Watertown, Wisconsin. Used to ride our bikes around until the street lights came out. Then it was time to come home.

[Jenna Fischer]

Sure.

[Sam Kiefer]

I lost Tuck of him. He went into the military around September 11th and isn't really online, but I should look him up.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. I mean, that's the thing, too. I feel like it might be easier to find people now. I have a very dear friend, Kate, that was my middle school buddy that we stayed in touch for years. I went to Australia to see her. She came to the US to see me. And then one day the card I sent her came back and I, like, haven't been able to find her. So I love this idea of finding people that meant something to us and reconnecting.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, we had another category of letters that we got from people. A lot of people sent in stories of how the Office brought them together into their friendship. I really loved this one from Becca M. In Edmonds, Washington, who said, I like the both of you, have the most amazing best friend. Her name is Lisa and we have been BFFs for 15 years. We met in college and pretty quickly became inseparable. She has been a supportive and loving person that I can always turn to. She even supported me in my own breast cancer scare with love and laughter. We both have loved the Office since day one in college. We watched episodes together and totally fangirled over the romance of Jim and Pam, Angela and Dwight. And in my Opinion couples goals. Phyllis and Bob Vance Vance Refrigeration. And then she goes on to explain that for her bachelorette party, her best friend threw her an office themed girls weekend. They got an Airbnb.

[Angela Kinsey]

Uh huh.

[Jenna Fischer]

And she decorated with a sign that said it is your bachelorette party with half blown up balloons. They had fake tattoos that said that's what she said. And also the face of Prison Mike. And then she just said, I couldn't think of a better prompt to email about because I love the friendship between you two. I always feel like I'm hearing a conversation between Lisa and myself when I tune in for the next installment of Office Ladies. And I hope everyone out there has their own Lisa because she's pretty effing amazing. Thanks for giving me an excuse to brag about my bestie.

[Angela Kinsey]

Aw, I love that. I love it when people have office themed parties. It just delights me. They have office themed baby showers, bachelorette weddings, and of course, birthdays.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

Isn't that so fun?

[Jenna Fischer]

It's so adorable.

[Angela Kinsey]

Jenna and I gave Sam and Cassie each a birthday card that had the Office Ladies party planning committee on the front. And we cut out little pictures of their faces and put them on top on Phyllis. We found a picture where they were both leaning the same way Phyllis was leaning. Anyway, it just tickles me. And I love that the show still brings people together. Our next section is about best friendships in movies. I looked up the top 15 best friendship movies and Jenna in the top 15. By the way, this made top 15 top 10 of several lists like this online.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay.

[Angela Kinsey]

Is a movie that you and I went and saw in the theater together on a BFF date.

[Jenna Fischer]

We did?

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, oh, wait, I think I know. It's the. It's the one with the pants.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes.

[Jenna Fischer]

Sisterhood of the Traveling Pants.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes. Directed by our very own Ken Kwapas. We went to the theater to support the movie.

[Jenna Fischer]

I remember.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, it was so good. And it's such a good BFF movie.

[Angela Kinsey]

I know. And can you believe that movie date of ours was 20 years ago?

[Jenna Fischer]

What?

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes, lady, I looked it up. Sisterhood of the Traveling Pants is having its 20th year anniversary this year.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh my God.

[Angela Kinsey]

I know, it's crazy. It's also out on digital. Maybe we should watch it together again.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

20 years of friendship.

[Jenna Fischer]

20 years of friendship of those pants. Just traveling away.

[Angela Kinsey]

Traveling the world.

[Jenna Fischer]

Lady. I have my blow up movie screen. We could do like an outdoor summer movie night and watch Sisterhood of the Traveling Pants.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, that would be so fun. We Would have to take a picture together and send it to Ken.

[Jenna Fischer]

We would.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay, so that one made almost all of the lists. But we were also curious to hear from everyone about what their best friendship movies are.

[Jenna Fischer]

I have two favorite best friendship movies.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay.

[Jenna Fischer]

My second favorite that used to be my first favorite is Thelma and Louise. I love the friendship between these two women in this movie that was number.

[Angela Kinsey]

One on this top best friendship movie list.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, I believe it, because I remember seeing it when it came out, and it was kind of the first time I had seen female friendship portrayed that way in a movie. And it was like, very. It hit me. It definitely. She has this speech at the end of the movie, Geena Davis character, where she just says to Susan Sarandon, she's like, hey, I just want you to know, like, I can't go back to my old life. Like, something has shifted in me. And Susan Sarandon is like, oh, honey, I know. And it's just like. It gives me chills. It's just like this journey they go on and they are changed forever. And I felt like when I saw the movie, it kind of changed something in me about women supporting women. It was just so beautiful.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

And then my favorite best friendship movie, though, is Muriel's Wedding.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

I love it so much. And it's similar. It's similar. It's just like a movie about best friends and they're so great and they have each other's back, and I just love it so much.

[Angela Kinsey]

Sam, Cassie, do you have a favorite best friendship movie?

[Cassie Jerkins]

I've talked about this movie before, but Bottoms is just so good about, like, queer women and being gross and, you know, just stumbling through high school together, but coming together. I think it's just really beautiful.

[Jenna Fischer]

Their comedic comedy together in that movie is so infectious. Like, I could watch four hours of them.

[Cassie Jerkins]

Same.

[Angela Kinsey]

I have to put that on my list. I haven't seen it.

[Jenna Fischer]

It's so good.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay.

[Sam Kiefer]

I would say either in Bruges, if you've seen them. I love Ferrell and Brendan Gleeson.

[Angela Kinsey]

That's a great one.

[Sam Kiefer]

Or there's this movie, it's about four really good friends. One of them has to return a ring and his three friends help him. It takes, like, nine hours. But it's really, really good.

[Angela Kinsey]

It's really, really good. And they have multiple goodbyes.

[Sam Kiefer]

Oh, they do. If you love friends.

[Jenna Fischer]

I'll have to check that out.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, one of my favorite friendship movies, and I didn't think about that one, Sam, but that's right up there. But mine is actually Jane Austen's Pride and Prejudice.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay?

[Angela Kinsey]

It just had its 20 year anniversary and it was re released in the theaters. And I went with my friend and it was so great. I have a friend that every year we meet and watch Pride and Prejudice. Her name is Tess. I just. I love this tradition that we have. But in the movie, there is a friendship I love. It's between the characters Charlotte Lucas and Elizabeth Bennet. And, you know, they're these young girls and they've grown up together. Now they're having to figure out the next chapter of their life, marriage, all of that. And they can laugh and be silly, but then they can also get very real with one another. And I think that is true friendship, when you just have to be real and be honest and you work through it and you get to the other side. And Charlotte has a speech that I love. She has just accepted the hand in marriage from Mr. Collins, who, you know, everyone thinks Mr. Collins is a bit of an idiot. And she goes to tell Elizabeth this. I saw Joe Wright interviewed about this speech and how it came about, and it's so interesting. I loved it so much. I want you to hear it.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, okay. Off with Charlotte Lucas. She's considered like the ultimate millennial in.

[Angela Kinsey]

An attitude because of her line, I'm 27 years old, I've no money and no prospects. I'm already a burden to my parents. And I'm frightened.

[E]

I've been told that. And it reminds me of the, you know, of that, of that scene being written. Deborah Margaret wrote the screenplay and did an amazing, amazing job. And then we asked Emma Thompson to help with a little bit of the dialogue. And I went round to her house, very nervous, with my little briefcase, and we walked up onto Hampstead Heath and she said, sit down, take out your notebook and take notes. So as she improvised scenes, I wrote them down. And that was one of the scenes that she improvised on that hill on Hampstead Heath. And I remember her just coming out with those lines and me scribbling them down. And then her ending with, don't judge me, Lizzie. Don't you dare judge me.

[Angela Kinsey]

Don't judge me, Lizzie. Don't you dare judge me. Wow. Isn't that brilliant? Emma Thompson improvised that speech. Anyway, I'm such a fan of hers. But I just loved that creative collaboration that Joe Wright brought into this movie. But I loved that moment in Charlotte and Lizzie's friendship. And then they got through it, you know, and they were there for each other as their lives were changing. And so much of it was beyond their control, and they were still there for each other anyway. I just. I love that movie. I love that friendship.

[Jenna Fischer]

I've never seen that movie.

[Angela Kinsey]

What? What? It's my favorite movie. I rewatch it all the time. Like, if I can't sleep, I put on Pride and Prejudice.

[Jenna Fischer]

It's your edge. It's. You're the edge.

[Angela Kinsey]

It is. I can't believe you've never seen it.

[Jenna Fischer]

I've never seen it. I should see it, I guess. Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes, you should.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay.

[Angela Kinsey]

In fact, I need it for our friendship. Okay, here's my call to action.

[Jenna Fischer]

All right?

[Angela Kinsey]

To know me is to know how much I love this movie.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay.

[Angela Kinsey]

I need you to see it.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay.

[Jenna Fischer]

Done.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay.

[Jenna Fischer]

I will watch it this year.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, that would make me so happy.

[Jenna Fischer]

I can't wait.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay. Don't watch it when you're distracted. Put some alone time there.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay. So not while, like, on a lunch break, like I did with Lord of the Rings, and you guys all gave me trouble for it.

[Angela Kinsey]

I will be wounded.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay? I will not.

[Angela Kinsey]

Let's. Like, when we were gonna watch the Edge, you're like, ang, you can't make fun of it. It means too much to me.

[Jenna Fischer]

I did.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay?

[Jenna Fischer]

I said that. All right. Okay, deal. Well, listen, why don't we take a break, and then when we come back, I did do a deep dive on friendship. There's. People have studied it, and I found some stuff that was interesting to me.

[Angela Kinsey]

Fantastic.

[Jenna Fischer]

I'll share it. All right. Oh, office ladies, listeners. We did a little detective work, and do we have the scoop for you. So what is it, you ask? It's that Discover is accepted in 99% of places that take credit cards nationwide.

[Angela Kinsey]

We put on our sleuthing hats and confirmed that's a whole lot of places and a whole lot of acceptance. So, yeah, sometimes it pays to be.

[Jenna Fischer]

A detective, but it always pays to Discover. Based on the February 2025 Nielsen report.

[Angela Kinsey]

Learn more at discover.com credit card. You know how it goes, getting super into something that can lead to watching it, listening to it, reading about it, maybe even picking up something to go with it. That's where prime comes in.

[Jenna Fischer]

Amazon prime isn't just fast, free delivery, though to be honest, that's a lifesaver. It's also prime video, Amazon music, and so much more.

[Angela Kinsey]

Whatever the interest, it's on Prime.

[Jenna Fischer]

Lately, there's been a dive into new recipes, catching up on lifestyle documentaries, and building the perfect playlist to match. And prime has been part of it all.

[Angela Kinsey]

It's like a one Stop shop for any passion, whether it's fashion, food, family, or discovering the next favorite show.

[Jenna Fischer]

So for anyone always exploring something new or rediscovering something meaningful, prime is right there.

[Angela Kinsey]

Whatever you're into, it's on Prime.

[Jenna Fischer]

From streaming to shopping, it's on Prime.

[Angela Kinsey]

Visit Amazon.comprime to get more out of whatever you're into.

[Jenna Fischer]

Amazon.comprime this podcast is brought to you by Squarespace and it makes sense that it's brought to you by squarespace because the officeladies.com webpage is thanks to Squarespace.

[Angela Kinsey]

That's right.

[Jenna Fischer]

That is what we use to set it up and that is what we use to keep it going for years now. Years.

[Angela Kinsey]

We are loyal Squarespace users.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. You know, every dream needs a domain and Squarespace domains make it easy to find the best name for your business at one fair, all inclusive price. There's no hidden fees or add ons required.

[Angela Kinsey]

Squarespace also has a collection of cutting edge design tools. Anyone can build an online presence that perfectly fits their brand or business, just like we did. You can start with the Blueprint AI or Squarespace's AI Enhanced Website Builder. You will get a fully custom website in just a few steps.

[Jenna Fischer]

They also have built in email campaigns with marketing tools so you can connect with your community. You can inspire people to support your cause.

[Angela Kinsey]

Head to squarespace.com officeladies for a free trial and when you're ready to Launch, go to squarespace.com officeladies to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain. Well, we're back and I'm very excited for your friendship. Deep dive.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, lady, I love anecdotes, I love studies, I love research projects.

[Angela Kinsey]

This is true.

[Jenna Fischer]

And I was googling and I found that in 2011, Snapchat did a research project called the Friendship Report. And their goal was to examine the state and nature of friendships around the world.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay, so I read the report.

[Jenna Fischer]

It was very lengthy.

[Angela Kinsey]

I was gonna say, how long is it?

[Jenna Fischer]

It's very long.

[Angela Kinsey]

And you read the whole thing?

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

Wow.

[Jenna Fischer]

I mean, I love this for my free time, I love to read a lengthy research report. It just gives me joy. And this is probably why I'm Jan. I'll just mention a few of the things that really struck me in reading the report. It showed how people were really good at making friends when they were younger. However, in our 30s and 40s, friendships became both harder to make and harder to maintain. And then they listed the most common stressors to a friendship. These are the most common Reasons why a friendship ended.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay.

[Jenna Fischer]

And most commonly in your 30s and 40s. Number one was a new love. Like, one of the friends got a new love.

[Angela Kinsey]

Right.

[Jenna Fischer]

Number two was parenthood. Someone became a parent. Number three was employment. So something having to do with getting busy at work or changing jobs or something. Number four was loss of a loved one. And number five was relocation. In fact, I actually read these in no particular order, because relocation was the top reason people lost touch with a friend. Physical distance. I was looking at that list, and I have lost a friend for all five of those reasons. You know, I shared that. My first two best friends, I lost over relocation.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes.

[Jenna Fischer]

But, yeah, all those things.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

But then I also made friends in those categories. So, like, when I fell in love with Lee, he brought new friendships into my life.

[Angela Kinsey]

Right.

[Jenna Fischer]

And when I became a parent, I became friends with new people from that category.

[Angela Kinsey]

Right.

[Jenna Fischer]

You know, so, yeah. Kind of interesting.

[Angela Kinsey]

I think it's right on. I mean, I can check a few of those boxes as well.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, they also, in this report, had suggestions for how to make friends.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay.

[Jenna Fischer]

And this one really stood out to me. Their first piece of advice for making new friends is to assume people like you. Just assume.

[Angela Kinsey]

Can that be a little dangerous? Cause, like, isn't that a slippery slope? Cause, like, you're like, yeah, they like me. And they're like, no, no.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, here's what they said. Researchers found that when people were told that they would be accepted into a group, even when it wasn't true, like, they would take a group of people who were already associated with themselves and introduce a new person, and they would tell this person, hey, this group is excited to meet you. They've already accepted you as their friend. And then they did it where they didn't tell that person.

[Angela Kinsey]

And so you entered the group with different confidence. Yes. Is that right? And confidence. People are attracted to confidence.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, what they said was, the people who were told that they would be accepted, those people let their guard down more, they shared more, they disagreed less, and were just overall more positive. Researchers also discovered something called the liking gap.

[Angela Kinsey]

What is the liking gap?

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay. When strangers interact, you're smiling. I love anecdotes, you guys.

[Angela Kinsey]

I can't wait to tell me what the liking gap is.

[Jenna Fischer]

I live for this.

[Angela Kinsey]

You also look really cute today.

[Jenna Fischer]

Hey, thanks.

[Angela Kinsey]

I mean, Sam and I were talking about it. We love your hair. It's got a little swoop.

[Jenna Fischer]

It's.

[Angela Kinsey]

It's longer.

[Sam Kiefer]

It looks really nice today.

[Angela Kinsey]

Right.

[Jenna Fischer]

It's starting to finally turn.

[Angela Kinsey]

And then for A while it was.

[Jenna Fischer]

Just growing up and out. Now it is starting to bend.

[Angela Kinsey]

Starting to lay down a little bit.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

And then I love your top and your pants.

[Jenna Fischer]

Thank you so much.

[Angela Kinsey]

Anyway, whatever. Head to toe, cute outfit. Back to the liking gap.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, my goodness. Well, here's the liking gap. When strangers interacted with each other, they were asked later to estimate how liked they thought they were by the other person. And people routinely underestimate their likability. Like, their interpretation of if the other person liked them was not in sync with the reality that the person did like them. So they were using that as an example to say, like, you can assume that people will like you. Like, you are good enough. You are likable. Carry that into the room with you, everybody.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay.

[Jenna Fischer]

I don't know. I thought that could be helpful.

[Angela Kinsey]

No, I think it is helpful.

[Jenna Fischer]

All right, Here was their other suggestion for making friends.

[Angela Kinsey]

I am on board with this.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay, good. Okay, good. Here's their other suggestion for making friends, which is don't wait for friendships to happen organically. Studies show that friendships take effort and initiative. And one of the suggestions was, you know, in the same way that when you're looking for love, you'll kind of do one of the, like, online matching things that, like, actually finding a friend online is a good place to, like, take initiative and, you know, find someone who you might want to be friends with. Yes. And we actually got a letter from Sani y in sunny Finland, who met her friend that way, who said, so basically, I met my best friend online. I think it was somewhere in the early 2010s. I'm Finnish and she's Hungarian. English isn't even our first language. And yet we still somehow became really close really fast. Our long distance friendship is very cool. And we have even met twice, once in Hungary and once in Finland. Even if we won't see each other in years, we still connect. We FaceTime, text and call, send each other silly reels and laugh together through the phone. I know it's not an ideal friendship, but it's special for both of us. We always have a friend in our pocket.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, I love that. That is something we did not have growing up. We did not have this online option. But, you know, as you were saying all of that, Jenna, it made me think of a family story that my sister tells. I hadn't thought about it in a long time, but as you were reading that, I was visiting my sister in the summer. You know, my sister's much older than me and she was married, and my Parents had some work, travel, and so I went and stayed with her for two or three weeks one summer. And I was, I don't know, maybe like 13 years old. Anyway, I got bored really quickly with just my sister and her husband. And, you know, I would just sit around. I was real bored. And so my sister was like, well, there had been this girl. Every day we'd see her ride her bike down the street. And my sister was like, well, why don't you make friends with her? You know? And I finally was like, just bored enough that I had the courage. And I walked outside one day, and my sister said, as she rode her bike by, I stuck my foot out in front of her bike and I said, hey, you want to be friends?

[Jenna Fischer]

Did it work?

[Angela Kinsey]

She was like, okay. And then I borrowed a bike and we'd go ride bikes together for, like, a few weeks. We hung out. But it is kind of funny to me. I hadn't thought about that in a long time.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, you did it. You took some initiative. You did not wait for that. That is definitely not a friendship that started organically. No, that was initiative based.

[Angela Kinsey]

I blocked her bike with my body.

[Jenna Fischer]

Here was their third suggestion for how to make friend. Pursue a group hobby.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

This is 100% how I made friends when I first came to Los Angeles.

[Angela Kinsey]

100%.

[Jenna Fischer]

Here are some suggestions. Take a yoga class. Libraries have book clubs. Pickleball. Join a pickup hockey game. Lee has made so many friends. He plays pickup hockey. He used to play soccer. He was on, like, a softball team. Like, sports is a great. Sports is great, right?

[Angela Kinsey]

Is improv like, improv class on there?

[Jenna Fischer]

It wasn't, but it could be.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. Take an improv class. You'll meet lots of people from all over.

[Jenna Fischer]

You will.

[Angela Kinsey]

What are you looking at me like that? Some people.

[Jenna Fischer]

People in improv classes are weird.

[Angela Kinsey]

That's how I made all of my friends.

[Jenna Fischer]

I know, but you will meet a Michael Scott in your improv class.

[Angela Kinsey]

You will. And I have collected a random assortment of people in my life.

[Jenna Fischer]

It's true. Okay, Sorry. Improv classes, they are a good place to meet people.

[Angela Kinsey]

They are.

[Jenna Fischer]

Sam, I wanted to throw it over to you because I know that you have been on a journey this past year. It is a sobriety journey. And you have shared about this in other places on your Instagram and a little bit here on Office Ladies. But part of that journey is. Has involved you having to make new friendships and connections.

[Sam Kiefer]

It has, yes.

[Jenna Fischer]

Can you share a little bit about what that has meant for you?

[Sam Kiefer]

I would Love to. Yeah. Making new friends this year has been weird and difficult. Making friends over 40 is difficult in general. And I just way overestimated how simple it would be. But it has been new this year, taking classes, taking so many classes. Took a fencing class this Sunday and cello lessons and sign language classes and kickball classes and bowling classes. So, yeah, this year has just been an interesting experiment in meeting new people, meeting new sober people.

[Jenna Fischer]

Have any of those things that you've joined in your, like, effort to connect with new sober people, has it worked?

[Sam Kiefer]

Yeah, it has. Yeah. I've made a bunch of new friends that I wouldn't have met any other places outside of 12 step programs. It's been really, really nice.

[Angela Kinsey]

That's so great.

[Sam Kiefer]

Yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

You know, my sister, years ago, she'd gone through a divorce and moved and was kind of starting over. And she had a student that year that she took it upon herself to learn sign language to help communicate with her students, parents, and she just started taking more and more classes and she found a community that she absolutely adored and she's dear friends with now. And even this week, she's here to visit me from Texas and she's going to meet up with two of her friends she met.

[Sam Kiefer]

Oh, I love that.

[Angela Kinsey]

In this online sign language class. Yeah.

[Sam Kiefer]

Yeah, that's awesome.

[Angela Kinsey]

So I just love that, Sam, I think that is showing great initiative about how do I meet people and have a shared interest on this new journey that I'm on.

[Sam Kiefer]

Thank you. It's been really, really weird and very lonely, but in a good way.

[Jenna Fischer]

I mean, how many times have you had to step into a room of strangers this last year? I mean, that is not easy to.

[Sam Kiefer]

Do about once a week for this last year.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, Sam, that is courage. And are you assuming people like you?

[Sam Kiefer]

Oh, okay, here's the thing. No. And I made a mental note when you came across that thing earlier. I'm just not wired that way naturally. I'm naturally hardwired to not like myself. It's like a thing I'm dealing with in therapy and all this stuff so that I like, threw my hands up when you got to that point, as if it's just a decision to like yourself. That is crazy to me.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, Sam, I can relate. I mean, this is the root of all of my social anxiety is my incredibly loud self. Critic.

[Sam Kiefer]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

And so that's why that stood out to me, this idea that I could just assume people will like me. I'm like, what does that feel like?

[Sam Kiefer]

I will say all 52 times that I've walked into a room of new people this year. I've absolutely had that emotional hangover they call it on the way home where you're going through stuff you said and you're like, oh, why did I say this? No one likes you. Everything was fine, by the way, but it's just replaying the night.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, Sam, you know that I know exactly what you're talking about. I spiral often, so I definitely, definitely have had that experience. And you know what? Just thank you so much for sharing all that, because friendship is something that does elude people at various times in their life. It is not effortless and it's not easy. So thank you for sharing.

[Sam Kiefer]

Thank you for having me.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, Angela, this whole episode got me reflecting on the circumstances that led to our friendship. If I had to, like, name the main thing that led to our friendship, I'm talking, like, origin moment. Yes. I would have to say it was as simple as location. Proximity.

[Angela Kinsey]

I was gonna say proximity.

[Jenna Fischer]

We worked at the same place, but not just that. Our desks were right next to each other.

[Angela Kinsey]

Our desks backed each other up. You were the closest lady.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

Gal. Next to me. Yep.

[Jenna Fischer]

And we got a fan letter that reminded me of the two of us. It is from Kristen R. In Buffalo, New York, who said, my best friend Corey and I met in the office. We had just finished college and she just had a baby, but we were two peas in a pod from day one. We were assigned desks that connected.

[Angela Kinsey]

Hey.

[Jenna Fischer]

And boy, did that come in handy. We used a headphone jack splitter to listen to music and podcasts together. One year for Halloween, we dressed as the SNL ladies from the Delicious Dish. She left the office after a few years to raise her kids. But I still work for the company almost 14 years later. I've had six promotions. She's had three more kids. They call me Auntie. We're practically family. And I'm forever grateful for our office.

[Angela Kinsey]

I love that. You know, I'm so thankful for the proximity of our desks. But also, it was the first time we talked. There was just a familiarity about you. I just felt an instant comfort around you.

[Jenna Fischer]

You felt like home to me.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

You felt like here I was in the middle of Hollywood on a TV set. But you felt like a friend I would make back home.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. And it was just really simple, day to day life. Things that we talked about, you know, and those are the things and the moments that get you through life. You know, big things come and go and swirl around you, but it's the day to day. I feel like that builds lasting friendships. And I went to my office early days journal and I have a little entry. And it's nothing flashy. It's just a simple entry, but I think it says everything about who we were then and why I love it so much. Are you ready?

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay. Putting on my glasses. Back from lunch. Jen and I ate in her trailer. It's my favorite. She brought arm weights to keep in her trailer. And after we ate, she did some arm exercises while I talked. I showed her the push up thing I do on the counter. You know what I'm talking about?

[Jenna Fischer]

I do. Of course.

[Angela Kinsey]

It's this, like, lame pushup I do just leaning on a counter. Then I go on to say, maybe I'll get some weights too. Sitting at my desk now it's so cold on set. I scooch my seat as far under my desk as it can go so the camera won't see my uggs. Jenna likes my hair today. It's a half up, half down look. I want her to come see the two hydrangeas I planted in my backyard. They are finally starting to bloom. I had them in pots and waited to plant them until I figured out which part of the yard got the most shade. It's riveting stuff here, guys. I go on to say, jenna and I don't work tomorrow, so we are going to the Beverly center to shop and have lunch in the food court. Wow, that's the shopping mall here.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

I go on and say, I'm so excited. We never get days off together during the week. Parking is annoying. So I said we should carpool. Yay. Alrighty. I better run.

[Jenna Fischer]

I love this journal entry.

[Angela Kinsey]

Isn't it just so simple?

[Jenna Fischer]

But that is it, lady. Like you saying, will you come see my hydrangea that I planted? Which, by the way, I remember doing, is why we're friends. Because I couldn't wait to see them. I was like, yes, I'd love to come see those.

[Angela Kinsey]

And I just remember just us being in your trailer and our lunches there. It's no surprise to me that I wrote it's my favorite thing because it's really. You know, being on set was so fun and acting on the office was so fun, but where I felt most like me was on our lunches in your trailer where we just got to chit chat.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, I remember a big swing that I took in our friendship and I was so nervous. Like, I was like sweaty palms. My, like, heart was like beating out of my Chest.

[Angela Kinsey]

I literally don't know what you're about to say.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay. I had been at the mall, and I had gone by Claire's, and I saw that cheesy, like, best friend necklace where, like, one side says be fry and the other side says Saint Ends, but if you put them together, it says best friends. And I just had this instinct. I was like, oh, my gosh, I'm gonna get that for me and Angela. And then I realized we had never called each other best friends, but I knew you were my best friend. I did not have another best friend. I didn't even have another close friend at the time. And I remember standing in that Claire's and being like, do I buy it? What if I give it to her? And she's like, oh, thanks. Or is it too much, too soon? But I bought it and I gave it to you. And you were like, I love it. I love it. BFFs. And it was a little bit like saying, I love you for the first time in a relationship. And I was like, yes, we're besties.

[Angela Kinsey]

We're besties. You know, I loved it. I had just made us matching sweatshirts with our character names on them.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. Well, everyone, thank you so much for joining us in this celebration of friendship and Best Friends Day.

[Angela Kinsey]

This was so wonderful. I love that our show brings people together. I love that our job brought us together. And I love hearing people's friendship stories.

[Sam Kiefer]

Actually, sorry, before we go, I brought in something from my journal today, if that's all right. Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

Wait, what?

[Angela Kinsey]

Sam.

[Sam Kiefer]

Sorry, do we have time?

[Angela Kinsey]

We do. This is a curve ball.

[Sam Kiefer]

All right, I'll try and keep this short. There's just something I wanted to express to the three of you on air. In case something happens to me, I'd like these thoughts permanently recorded forever in clear posterity.

[Jenna Fischer]

Sam, your brain is hilarious.

[Sam Kiefer]

It's gonna start rough, but it'll perk up by the end, I promise.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay.

[Sam Kiefer]

This last year was a doozy for me. I got sober shortly after being let go from Sirius xm. Although it never affected my work in studio, the last decade of my life has been fairly controlled by drugs and alcohol behind the scenes. When I was let go from Sirius xm, I realized that the unlimited time and severance package would most assuredly result in an overdose if I didn't get help. And I did. I joined a 12 step program, got a sponsor, and dove in with full conviction. But as I'm learning is the case with most addicts, the real struggle is dealing with what lies Underneath the character defects and trauma that I needed and numb with drugs and alcohol, this is the part where it gets good. I promise. Over the last five years I've been doing this podcast. The three of you have systematically dismantled large parts of my brain that have been causing me pain. And like I said earlier, I just want it recorded in clear posterity the following. Angela, you have this kindness, this deep well of empathy seemingly with no bottom. Your ability to love and care about people you've never met as well as those you have is truly inspiring. The way you listen to Jenna, truly listen and feel her pain when she's in pain, or remember things people have said for gifts later, or the way you check in on people who are going through a rough time, truly humbles me. Every time I interact with you, it fills my battery up to full.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, see?

[Sam Kiefer]

Which I realize must be draining to you, so I want to say thank you for that. You have too much love and empathy to be trapped in a candy jar. Jenna, there's an old joke slash meme that goes, why do weak men date strong women? And the answer is because someone has to tell our server, I ordered a dike coke and not a regular one and it's not going to be me. I have learned so much about self respect from you. From the way you don't allow yourself to be spoken down to, from the way you are clear about what you want out of life. And much like Angela, the way you don't allow your friends to be spoken to disrespectfully either. And also, much like Angela, I have modeled so much in my life this last year after you. I recognize that you don't get to be that strong without the world trying to give you some. So I want to say thank you for persevering in your own life. Your ability to overcome obstacles without letting it affect your worldview is extremely inspired. Cassie, you saved my life. When you started here, I was drowning in work. Your dedication to this podcast was immediately noticed and much like Jenna and Angela, you've changed my life just by being you. There is a quiet confidence to you. You seem to have such a clear vision of who you are. You genuinely seem to like yourself. And as is a theme with this speech, I've modeled much of my daily sober life around you. Your work life, balance, music playing and basketball has inspired me to take up the cello again and sign up for several classes to make my own sober life as enjoyable day to day as possible. I could go on and on about the ways that you three have changed my life. But I'll wrap it up here and just say this. Everything that I am better for from having known you three comes from you guys overcoming your own battles in life. You all have done so much inner work that it spills over and affects those around you. I just want to say that I see you and the work you've done. For the first time in a long time, I'm optimistic about my birthday and my life and my future because the three of you have taught me gratitude. That was the missing piece of my life. I live slower now seeing and appreciating all that I have. And I have so much thanks to you three. There's a phrase that I hate from years of working in food service, and that phrase is we are a family. Normally, when you hear that somebody's about to ask you to work on a Saturday when you took the day off, but Jenna and Angela, I really hope that you guys are proud of yourselves. You've achieved something so rare in the performance space. You have truly created a family. I know your fans feel the same way as they are part of that family, too. Thank you for letting me be a part of this show. And your family and I love you.

[Angela Kinsey]

We love you so much. We love you so much, Sam. Office Ladies is not Office Ladies without you. Sam.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah, Sam. I mean, this is why we needed you back. Sam, I'm unprepared with how to explain what you bring to us as well. But this. You're not left out of the magic that happens here. But also, Sam, I have watched the grit and strength and resolve that you have gone into this sober living with, and it is also truly inspirational. I have watched you do silks.

[Sam Kiefer]

That's right.

[Jenna Fischer]

Cirque du Soleil silks. And I know that when you're doing that, I know the courage and vulnerability that it took for you to show up somewhere where you didn't know people to do an activity that was aiding your sobriety. And I just. I am so glad that you are giving yourself the care that you deserve, because you deserve it. And we're just so happy that you're with us.

[Sam Kiefer]

Well, here's to another year, guys.

[Jenna Fischer]

Here's to another year.

[Angela Kinsey]

Here's to another year. Sam.

[Jenna Fischer]

Love you.

[Angela Kinsey]

We love you so much.

[Jenna Fischer]

Thank you for listening to Office Ladies.

[Angela Kinsey]

Office Ladies is a presentation of Odyssey and is produced by Jenna Fisher and Angela Kinsey.

[Jenna Fischer]

Our executive producer is Cassie Jerkins, our audio engineer is Sam Kiefer, and our associate producer is Ainslie Bubbico.

[Angela Kinsey]

Odyssey's executive producer is Leah Reese.

[Jenna Fischer]

Dennis Office Ladies was mixed and mastered by Bill Schultz.

[Angela Kinsey]

Our theme song is Repertory by Creed Bratton.