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Angela Kinsey
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Jenna Fischer
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Angela Kinsey
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Jenna Fischer
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Angela Kinsey
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Jenna Fischer
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Angela Kinsey
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Jenna Fischer
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Angela Kinsey
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Jenna Fischer
Go to wherefigs.com that's 20% off during Nurses Week at wearfigs.com hello everyone, and welcome to your second drink of business trip. This is the episode where Michael goes on a business trip with Oscar and Andy to Winnipeg. He meets concierge Marie, one of my favorite characters. Andy drunk dials Angela, one of my favorite scenes. And Pam finds out she's failed art school and has to stay another 12 weeks if she wants to really graduate. Ugh. And we got to interview Rich Sommer for this episode, all about his arc as Pam's art school friend in quotes. Friend.
Angela Kinsey
Mm. Mm.
Jenna Fischer
And listen, we also recently did an interview with Wendy McLendon Covey about her time as concierge Marie. It's episode 259, if you want to check it out.
Angela Kinsey
She's delightful.
Jenna Fischer
Yes.
Angela Kinsey
Well, I mentioned in our breakdown of this episode that there were some awesome deleted scenes specifically between Oscar and Andy. I talked all about Oscar being the fun stopper on the airplane, and I played a little clip. Well, you guys, all of the Oscar and Andy stuff from the plane has been added back to the superfan version, including more that isn't even on the DVDs.
Jenna Fischer
I watched it. It's really great. And it really sets up the scene in the bar later, because it's actually on the plane that Andy decides he's gonna be Oscar's wingman.
Angela Kinsey
Yeah.
Jenna Fischer
In fact, there's this whole scene on the plane where he tries to set him up with the guy sitting in the window seat of their row.
Angela Kinsey
Yes.
Jenna Fischer
And speaking of this storyline, when we asked people their favorite moment from this episode, we got this letter from Carrie J. In Omaha, who said, one of my favorite scenes from the whole series is Oscar in the bar with Andy trying to be his wingman. I love how Oscar plays the part. Like, absolute perfect acting by Oscar and everyone. The scene is also the scene with the drunk dialed. Angela, I really think we need to hear it.
Rich Sommer
If you don't mind me asking. Anything. You can ask me anything.
Jenna Fischer
Okay.
Rich Sommer
I'm your wingman.
Jenna Fischer
It's just that I've sat next to
Rich Sommer
Angela for a very long, very long time. I do. How could anyone understand that woman? What?
Jenna Fischer
What do you see in her? What do you see in Angela?
Rich Sommer
What do you see in Angela?
Jenna Fischer
I want to know.
Rich Sommer
I see through a hard exterior to a little jelly in the middle. She is teaching me to be a better person, and she's working really hard on that. And she has the softest skin I've ever seen, and I can't wait to have sex with her.
Angela Kinsey
You haven't had sex?
Jenna Fischer
No. Are you guys ready to get married or.
Rich Sommer
Honestly, I don't know what we're waiting for.
Jenna Fischer
Andy, something is wrong with that woman.
Rich Sommer
What is wrong with her?
Jenna Fischer
I'd like to know.
Rich Sommer
You should call her and ask her.
Jenna Fischer
I'd like to know what's wrong with her.
Rich Sommer
I should call her and ask her. What is wrong with her.
Jenna Fischer
Do it. It's a caller.
Rich Sommer
Oh, my God.
Jenna Fischer
Don't call her.
Rich Sommer
Don't Call her. Too late. Too late. It's silent now it's ringing.
Angela Kinsey
Hello?
Jenna Fischer
Hello?
Rich Sommer
What is wrong with you?
Jenna Fischer
Why would you do Andy?
Wendy McLendon-Covey
What?
Rich Sommer
That's Oscar, and he wants to know why you won't do me. And I think it's a valid question.
Jenna Fischer
Are you drunk?
Rich Sommer
This is Andy Bernard.
Angela Kinsey
I know who this is.
Rich Sommer
I want to take you to sex school.
Jenna Fischer
What? Who is that, monkey?
Rich Sommer
Is somebody there?
Angela Kinsey
Are you drunk?
Rich Sommer
I have needs.
Angela Kinsey
We will discuss this later.
Rich Sommer
Naked.
Angela Kinsey
What?
Rich Sommer
We'll discuss it later. Naked. I want to see you naked.
Jenna Fischer
It is such the perfect drunk dial. It really is.
Angela Kinsey
Uh huh.
Jenna Fischer
And the two of them together, it's delicious. It's chef's kiss. I agree with you, Carrie J.
Angela Kinsey
It's fantastic. And he ed played that moment so great because, you know, being drunk isn't easy to play. And I loved it when he was like, it's Andy Bernard. Just like, I know who it is.
Jenna Fischer
I also love it when, you know, Oscar blurts out, andy wants to know why you won't do him. And you're like, what? And you think maybe Andy is gonna, like, cover then, right? Like he's gonna be like. No, no, no, no. He meant he nothing. He just repeats it. So good.
Angela Kinsey
Yeah.
Jenna Fischer
Well, listen, there were so many great things added back to the superfan version of this episode, including this very funny scene where Michael, before they go to Winnipeg, he's at the airport and he's changing money at one of those kiosks. You have to hear it. What is the heart of the Canadian economy?
Wendy McLendon-Covey
Money.
Jenna Fischer
And I am getting some,
Wendy McLendon-Covey
thank you very much.
Jenna Fischer
Hold on. Michael, how much money did you change?
Angela Kinsey
Two grand, baby.
Jenna Fischer
Oh, no, we're only there for one night.
Angela Kinsey
Look at the commission rate and there's a handling fee. Okay, all right, all right.
Jenna Fischer
Chill out. Quick fix.
Angela Kinsey
Excuse me.
Jenna Fischer
Change it back.
Rich Sommer
Yes, yes, yes, yes. Get as much as you can. Strippers do not take credit cards.
Jenna Fischer
Change it back. Change it back. Why are you still changing money, Michael? You don't need cash. You get a better rate on the credit card. You only need cash for the cab ride.
Rich Sommer
Do you understand?
Jenna Fischer
I'll see you at the gate. Change it back.
Angela Kinsey
Change it back. This is.
Jenna Fischer
This is a smaller pile that.
Wendy McLendon-Covey
Okay, Now I have eighteen hundred dollars.
Jenna Fischer
It's amazing.
Angela Kinsey
He's lost money before. They've even, like, done anything.
Jenna Fischer
He just stood there and just paid $200 to change his money back and forth.
Angela Kinsey
I know, so good. And the person that plays the attendant is so put out with him. It's really funny.
Jenna Fischer
Yes. They're Very funny.
Angela Kinsey
There was also a little bit of an old tech alert in there too, because now everyone pays in a cab with, like, their credit card.
Jenna Fischer
Oh, this is true. There's no, like, cash transaction cabs anymore.
Angela Kinsey
No, you just use your credit card or Venmo or whatever.
Jenna Fischer
It's so true.
Angela Kinsey
Well, we also got this letter from Caroline K. From Dublin, and it really made me chuckle. Caroline says, hi, ladies. Hope you are both keeping well. Just an observation. Michael brought two huge empty suitcases to fill with souvenirs, but no sign of them on the way back. Maybe they had checked them in already. It reminded me of when I worked for a dessert company and once had to travel from Dublin to Edinburgh with some frozen dessert samples. The little case was full on the way over. We had our meeting and presented the samples to the client. And then the suitcases were empty. Coming home, I got stopped at security because they thought it was suspicious to be traveling with an empty case. I could only laugh trying to explain my situation. They were grand about it in the end.
Jenna Fischer
So this was reminding me of how whenever we go on, like a big, long family trip, we never anticipate that we're going to buy anything on that trip. And we pack our suitcases totally full and then we're scrambling and we have to buy like, some duffel bag or something.
Angela Kinsey
Yeah, some random bag to bring your. Your souvenirs back. Yes.
Jenna Fischer
So I think it was very smart of Michael to bring the two empty suitcases. Well, I wanted to round out this second drink with this letter from Soyeon from South Korea, who writes us all the time. I know.
Angela Kinsey
Soyeon, you're lovely. Thank you.
Jenna Fischer
Lovely. And I really especially loved this letter, and it has to do with this episode. Here's what Soyeon had to say. I've wanted to write this message for a long time because I loved that Pam gave up on art school. I know some people might say that decision wasn't very feminist, but honestly, it has given me tremendous comfort. In most sitcoms or dramas, when a protagonist makes a big career decision, everything works out in the end and they become very successful. But the Office is different. It let Pam fail. And that's okay. Life goes on anyway. Even when you fail in your work, it's okay. What matters is remembering that you tried. It's not your fault, and you are still loved by your friends and family. Right now, I'm pursuing my own dream, and it's a tough road. At the end of it, I might fail, but that's okay. I believe I will still Find meaning and joy in my life one way or the other. Just like Pam did. Love you, ladies.
Angela Kinsey
That is fantastic.
Jenna Fischer
Isn't that great?
Angela Kinsey
It's just so great and so true.
Jenna Fischer
So true. I mean, how many things did we fail at before we got on the Office Lady?
Angela Kinsey
So many.
Jenna Fischer
And all of those things were worthwhile. They always led to a new friendship or maybe like just enough money to pay the rent that month or something. Like everything I've tried in my life has not been a huge success. But there's value in the trying. Isn't it great? I loved that letter. I loved that point of view for this episode.
Angela Kinsey
Same. Well, you guys, thank you so much for writing in. And now please enjoy our second drink of business trip.
Jenna Fischer
I'm Jenna Fisher.
Angela Kinsey
And I'm Angela Kinsey.
Jenna Fischer
We were on the office together and we're best friends. And now we're doing the ultimate office rewatch podcast just for you.
Angela Kinsey
Each week we will break down an episode of the Office and give exclusive behind the scenes stories that only two people who were there can tell you.
Jenna Fischer
We're the office ladies.
Angela Kinsey
Hello. Hi, you guys.
Jenna Fischer
All right, today we're talking about business trip.
Angela Kinsey
But first we have a fantastic interview for you.
Jenna Fischer
Yes, we are going to be talking with Rich Summer who played Alex.
Angela Kinsey
Art school Alex.
Jenna Fischer
I know. We love Rich. We're good friends with Rich in real life.
Angela Kinsey
Yes. My stepson and Rich's daughter B are in a book club. You guys. They meet every week.
Jenna Fischer
It's the cutest thing.
Angela Kinsey
It's the cutest thing.
Jenna Fischer
You might know Rich Sommer because he played Harry Crane on all seven seasons of Mad Men. And at that same time, he was doing his arc on the Office as Pam's art school friend.
Angela Kinsey
Friend. Question mark. And Jenna and Rich spent a ton of time together filming all those scenes and became really good friends.
Jenna Fischer
We did. We just had to talk to him. We wanted to hear his side of the story of film. Filming that crazy scene with the little bluetooth earpieces from customer survey. We talked about it last week with Stephen Merchant.
Angela Kinsey
Yeah. We needed Rich's take on that.
Jenna Fischer
We really did.
Angela Kinsey
And we talk all things the office for Alex. And here is that interview.
Jenna Fischer
Rich Sommer. Welcome to office ladies.
Angela Kinsey
Hi, Rich.
Rich Sommer
Thank you. Hi, Angela and Jenna.
Jenna Fischer
Oh, my gosh. When we post the photo from this interview, Rich looks so professional.
Rich Sommer
I can't believe you're saying that. I am in a teeny tiny box. I just have a wide angle camera. It makes it look cool.
Angela Kinsey
I know, but you have the stuff that looks like Egg carton. You know what I mean? You have the real deal sound stuff.
Rich Sommer
That's $10 at a foam place in Burbank that I went to.
Angela Kinsey
Probably.
Rich Sommer
Some of the old toys are usually.
Jenna Fischer
We probably should have maybe gone there.
Angela Kinsey
Gone there.
Jenna Fischer
Will you text us about it later when we get done?
Rich Sommer
Yes, I will.
Jenna Fischer
I also want to share that as we were setting up this zoom, my microphone broke. So I'm using a backup microphone. So I probably sound the worst of all of us. Rich is going to sound the best. You look the most professional.
Angela Kinsey
Rich is what matters. You're what matters. Rich. We're here for you. We're excited to talk to you.
Jenna Fischer
We are, Rich.
Angela Kinsey
We always ask everyone on the show how they got their job on the Office. Did you audition for the part? Do you have a story? We have heard that Mindy was lobbying very hard for you. Did you know Mindy?
Rich Sommer
To my recollection, Mindy and I met at the SAG Awards when you guys and the Mad Men cast were nominated. And Mindy was a fan of Mad Men and came up to me and I was so excited to. And we had chatted maybe a couple of times, but she came up to me and said, hey, I'm writing a part with you in mind on the show. Would that be okay if I. Oh, my God. I was like, yes. Because, you know, like everybody else, the Office was one of my favorite shows on tv. So it was a really exciting thing to have, you know, an actor, writer, producer from another show. Any show say that to you. But to have it be one of your. Your favorite shows that you are so excited to even step into that world, it was incredibly special. Yes.
Angela Kinsey
That is so cool.
Jenna Fischer
So is that what happened? They just offered you the role after she had written it?
Rich Sommer
Yeah, they reached out and offered it. And I had a friend of mine who I hadn't told him yet about that, and he said, oh, I just auditioned for the Office. And I was like, oh, that's awesome. I'm hoping to audition for them as well. And he said, yeah, it's for this part, I guess. Pam goes to art school and she's gonna meet some guy at art school. And I was like, uh huh. Oh, good, good, good. And in my head, I knew what Mindy had said and we hadn't finalized anything yet. And you know how these things work in the business. They'll keep auditioning. Even if they have an offer out to someone or in conversation with someone, they'll keep auditioning other people. I'm usually on the Auditioning. End of that, where I'm throwing an audition down a hole rather than, you know, being the one that's actually being considered. But this was one of those rare times. So as soon as the offer came through officially, I. I was. I accepted immediately. But, yes, it was. I. I did audition for the Office a time or two with Allison Jones, but I didn't get those roles. And then this came through, and it was just an offer.
Jenna Fischer
Well, Rich, you mentioned that you met Mindy at a SAG Awards party. Something people should know, I guess, is just that the cast of the Office and the cast of Mad Men, we kind of glommed onto each other. We were on the rise at the same time, and we were kind of experiencing the same thing of being both casts that were basically unknown actors suddenly on these really popular shows. And so we would go around to all of these events together, and we all became really good friends.
Rich Sommer
It was a really sort of spectacular, odd marriage between the shows because we ended up, like you say, our groups. Because the way the SAG Awards work in particular is the entire cast of each show is seated together at one or two tables, depending on the size of the group. And then at the party, there's usually. There's this corner for Mad Men and this area for the Office, and this. Every show sort of has an area, and areas often ended up being near each other and at least ended up being sort of shared real estate. It was a very. It was a very cool relationship between the groups.
Jenna Fischer
Yeah. Some of my favorite memories from that time are our casts hanging together. It was really cool.
Angela Kinsey
I remember people watching at the Mad Men party, there was a Mad Men, like, after party, and Oscar Nunez and I sat on a couch, and we were sitting sidebarring as everyone walked by. We're like, look at this guy. Oh, check that guy out.
Rich Sommer
Those Mad Men after parties, sometimes. I mean, every show has sort of the people that you're always like, I can't believe they watch our show. And I know you guys had that, too. It was very strange times.
Jenna Fischer
I'm curious, what were you told about the role of Alex before you came in? Did you get anything to read? And were you told specifically that you were an art school friend or you were a possible love interest? How was this role pitched to you?
Rich Sommer
Well, this is. This is gonna be. This is. This is the meaty part of the conversation. I suppose the way it was pitched to me was, you know, this was the beginning of season five, obviously. And the way it was pitched to me was that it would be now. I should also clarify, especially if Mindy is listening. I'm not saying that Mindy pitched me anything. It was conversational. It was just sort of like, we think this is a character who's gonna be throughout this season. We think it's a character that's gonna be kind of like Rasheeda's character was, where it might be a little bit of another road bump for Jim and Pam. So when it started, that was definitely what was in my mind. But we filmed scenes that didn't make it into the show. And I started to kind of put together that the. The response from the audience were. So because your show. How. How long in advance did you guys shoot and then air?
Jenna Fischer
I would say only three to four weeks maybe. There was a pretty tight turnaround.
Angela Kinsey
About a month. Yeah.
Rich Sommer
Yeah. It was enough time or a short enough time. I should say that the audience response to my first appearance had landed before I was filming customer survey. And they were not pleased.
Angela Kinsey
They were not pleased. They did not want to see Pam with anyone but Jim. Oh, man.
Rich Sommer
No. And who could blame them? After what they had been through for four seasons, who could blame them?
Jenna Fischer
Well, you have very kind of flirty eyes in your first scenes at art school. You're very flirty. And you're right. Those scenes aired and all of a sudden Tiki Barr is on the cutting room floor. Right.
Angela Kinsey
There is a whole Alex storyline with Pam. Actually, the whole Pam art storyline is in deleted scenes. I watch the deleted scenes for the podcast, and every week I'm like, Jenna, oh, my gosh. There's this scene and this scene and one in the hallway and at a bar and here. And she's like, I know.
Jenna Fischer
How did it feel to watch those scenes get cut week to week? Did anyone warn you as far as how it felt?
Rich Sommer
Look, I am very. I consider myself fortunate that I have a fairly, I don't know, comfortable ability to see where things fit in story wise. And I could feel from the moment we were the second anybody said, this feels weird. This is too much consternation for Jim and Pam. I agreed. I mean, again, I was a fan from the beginning. Now, I would have loved to have gotten to be around more, but I also wasn't gonna be greedy. I remained delighted that I had the parts that I had. I do think it's a funny part of office lore, because it seems clear to me, at least, that this was a sort of aborted storyline that they kind of cut bait when they could. And that was, I don't know, I just think it's how I feel about it, is that it's a very funny, interesting way to have been a part of the Office legacy.
Angela Kinsey
Well, I was bummed that you never came to the actual set. Cause we never got to hang out on set. And you and Jenna would have stories, and we were missing Jenna. You know, Jenna was who I had lunch with every day. And I was like, gosh, why can't Alex just show up with Pam at work one day? Of course, that would have completely, like, blown up the storyline. But we were sad you were never in the actual bullpen.
Jenna Fischer
Should we talk about this insane scene that we filmed for Customer survey with Stephen Merchant? First of all, did you crap your pants when you found out Stephen Merchant was directing? Because I did. I did poop myself.
Rich Sommer
Yep, yep. Yes. Yeah, it was upsetting. I mean, it was 10% exciting, 90% upsetting.
Angela Kinsey
I had no idea, Rich, how many different ways you guys did this scene. You know, we got the scripts and all the alts from James Carey, and I could not believe it. Jenna told me. How many different versions were there? Jenna?
Jenna Fischer
I think there were something like 10.
Angela Kinsey
Good night.
Rich Sommer
Now, I wasn't privy to all of those versions because as a guest actor, I was really only given the script on the day. This is how I remember it. And I've listened to you guys talk about it with Steven, and my memory's slightly different, but I don't know where it goes off. I've certainly mulled over this aspect of the story a thousand times, so it's probably gotten altered as I've gone. But here was my problem. My problem was that I had an inside. I had a mole on the inside. And I don't know if I've ever even told you guys about this. And I. Wait, I won't name it on the podcast.
Angela Kinsey
You had a mole on the set of the Office.
Rich Sommer
I won't name this person on the podcast, but this was a person who was not an actor who worked in the production. And this person sent me the script. He said, oh, you've got some great stuff in this upcoming episode.
Angela Kinsey
It's a guy.
Rich Sommer
Oh, my God, I'd love to. Yeah, okay, fine. Yes, it's a guy. So this person sent me the script, and I was in that version. Alex professed his love to Pam, and I thought, oh, wow. And as a. It left it open. Is this a send off for my character or is this something that we may see him later on? I showed up on the day, I was handed the sides and those Sides were, as you guys know, wildly different. That they had taken out any profession of love at all, made it purely about her sort of artistic sensibilities, and changed how that was gonna go. So when we were filming, I will admit this is a fault of mine as an actor, I couldn't get it out of my head because, again, everything we had been playing so far was that Alex had a crush on Pam. And like you guys said with Steven, what Alex ends up saying is enough. It didn't need to be this on the nose sort of profession of love. It's implied. It's intrinsic. As Jim says, you know, this guy's into you. I mean, it's clearly there. But in the moment, I couldn't find the right level of demonstrative that Steven wanted. And the level that Steven wanted was zero. The level that I was continually pumping out was more in the neighborhood of, like, 75% demonstrative. I couldn't reel it in. And in fact, Jenna, to your question of pooping my pants, when I found out it was Stephen Merchant, that was just a little. That was just like a little jitter compared to how I felt when Steven.
Angela Kinsey
Oh, no.
Rich Sommer
Came up to me after a take and said these words, the words that have haunted me as an actor forever. He came up to me and said, I don't know why you're not getting this. Oh, no.
Jenna Fischer
Ah,
Angela Kinsey
it was awful. Oh, my God.
Rich Sommer
So he was, by the way, 100% right. I just couldn't do it. So, you know, looking at Jenna Fisher standing across from me, John Krasinski is crumpled up into a ball under the table in that room, reading his lines for the Bluetooth.
Angela Kinsey
He was there. John was there.
Jenna Fischer
I remember he was there, but I didn't remember. He was hiding under the table.
Angela Kinsey
Oh, my God. Through all the takes, there was nowhere
Rich Sommer
for him to hide in the room because it was a small, like, conference room. And the cameras, as you guys know, were moving all the time, everywhere. There was no safe space, so he just hid under the desk.
Angela Kinsey
Six foot three, John Krasinski was curled up under the desk.
Jenna Fischer
Yes.
Rich Sommer
And I'm just, like, mortified. Like, this is the. Well, this is it. I'm never acting again, obviously, because Steven Merchant's never gonna cast me in anything. Jenna and John think I'm absolutely out of my mind. I could. It was. It was a stressful day. It's all great now, but it was a stressful day.
Jenna Fischer
Oh, my gosh, Rich, I think you're being too hard on yourself and taking on too much of the responsibility because I was also told that Alex might be a possible love interest for Pam. Not that Pam would have feelings for Alex, but that she might have to manage his feelings for her. And by the way, I want to say I only respected Rich in that moment. And so much so that we went on to do a movie together. We did the Giant Mechanical Man. You played my brother in law and you were so funny.
Rich Sommer
That's right.
Angela Kinsey
Giant Mechanical man is a great movie, by the way. Great. And you guys are fantastic in it.
Rich Sommer
I love that movie. And believe me, when I. In the month or so following my final day at the office and we had exchanged information because it was clear we were going to be friends, my recollection is when you and Lee reached out to ask if I would come and do a table read for this movie that you guys were working on, it was both so exciting, but also such a relief that you had not written me off after that day because it was just such a stressful. You know, you've had those days on a set where you feel like, this is my last day on a set. I'm never acting again. Obviously, I'm garbage. I don't know why I did this. And usually I don't leave a day feeling that way. It's usually somewhere closer to the middle. But that day I left and I was just like, oh, that, that is. That. That was that. I hope Mad Men goes forever because this door has been closed. So it was such a relief.
Angela Kinsey
No one felt like that. Everybody thought that you crushed it. Really and truly, I thought I was rooting for Alex and I know I wasn't rooting here. No, listen, listen now. So I don't get hate mail. I wasn't rooting for Jim and Pam to break up, but I became like, I thought Alex was so endearing that I just. I want Alex to have a good life. I became that person. Like, I hope Alex finds his person because he's so sweet and kind and. I don't know.
Jenna Fischer
Rich, I have to ask. How did the set of the Office and the way we shot and the way things worked differ from the way you guys made Mad Men?
Rich Sommer
I mean, the ways we are similar is a very short list. The Mad Men set filming style was entirely different. First off, for the first three, maybe four seasons of Mad Men, we were still shooting on film. So at this time, when I was doing the Office, we were definitely shooting on film. And that, you know, for anyone who's been on a set where they're filming with film, it's a whole other process. It adds a remarkable amount of time when you're even just changing a film mag, you know, the cartridge of film, it has to be sort of taken to a dark place and dealt with so that it can be sent off for processing. And the turnarounds on scenes, you know, moving the camera around takes, I don't know, not twice as long, but a lot longer. So the fact that on the Office they would hit roll and almost never stop until they were out of tape, as I recall. Right. I mean, it just. It felt like we were always rolling.
Angela Kinsey
Yes, it did feel that way. Yeah.
Rich Sommer
You could kind of stop mid scene if you needed to and adjust something. Whereas on Mad Men, it was more. If we're filming, everything has to be in order. And if we cut, then everybody can breathe again. It was just a very different type of precision that they were doing on Mad Men. Because it was. Obviously, the look is not handheld. The look on Mad Men was very carefully and intentionally composed. Not that shots weren't composed on the Office, but it was just composed in a different way. It was much more fluid. We're watching the show now with our daughter. She's 13, and she's never seen it. And we're probably three quarters of the way through season two now. She knows just because it's in the zeitgeist that Pam and Jim end up together. It is driving her bananas, like. And I haven't even thought to say, if you think this is tough, wait till Rashida Jones shows up. Because she's just frustrated that, you know, Roy set a date for the wedding and Jim was sad and Bea was like, this is terrible. When do they get together? I can't stand it.
Angela Kinsey
I was like, buckle in.
Rich Sommer
I got news for you. It's gonna be a minute.
Jenna Fischer
Yeah, Rich, she's gonna hate you when she gets to your part.
Rich Sommer
Oh, yeah.
Angela Kinsey
Oh, yeah.
Jenna Fischer
What's that gonna. What's breakfast gonna be like at your house?
Rich Sommer
Well, she has been with me when I have been recognized from the Office.
Angela Kinsey
Yeah. We were gonna ask, do you get recognized as Alex?
Rich Sommer
I do. And it is amazing to me how often. Cause sometimes, you know, as actors, we get different. People recognize us from different things. And truly, it's gotta be half the time it's the Office. I mean, I'm on screen for two episodes of the Office, so its reach was just sort of. Sort of astounding to me. But I did. My favorite one is when Beatrice was a baby, she. I don't even think was a year old. We Went to visit my family in Ohio, and we were getting on a connecting flight in Cincinnati. I'm walking my tiny, beautiful little baby girl down the aisle, and this guy leans into the aisle, and he goes, hey, hey. And I sort of start and look at him like, yeah, this stranger says, don't f. With Pam and Jim.
Jenna Fischer
Oh, my God.
Rich Sommer
And he meant it, by the way. So I think people. It was in those kinds of moments where I went, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. This is. It's better that Alex goes quietly into the night and they go back to their thing so that I don't, you know, get kidnapped or anything.
Angela Kinsey
Oh, Rich. Well, you know, maybe Alex had to go away, but we're glad you got to stay in our lives.
Jenna Fischer
Yes. And, Rich, thank you so much for coming on the podcast today. It was so great to see you.
Rich Sommer
Yeah, thank you. Thank you so much for letting me be a part of this.
Jenna Fischer
Oh, my gosh. I'm excited that we got to have you on the show. I'm excited we got to take that trip down memory lane. Hopefully this has been healing.
Angela Kinsey
I hope it's been healing.
Jenna Fischer
Yes, Yes.
Rich Sommer
I promise.
Angela Kinsey
I hope it has.
Jenna Fischer
Thank you so much, Rich. We love you.
Angela Kinsey
Love you, Rich.
Rich Sommer
Thank you. Love you, too. And thanks again for having me.
Angela Kinsey
Before we get back to the show, let's take a quick break from all the shoulds. The emails you should answer, the laundry. You should fold. This is your permission to pause.
Jenna Fischer
And honestly, nothing pairs better with a little escape than Snapple. Why don't we have some fun with a few Snapple Real facts?
Angela Kinsey
Let's do it.
Jenna Fischer
Real fact number 705. Every ton of recycled paper saves about 17 trees.
Angela Kinsey
Ooh, I like that. Snapple real fact 253. The first TV remote control introduced in 1950, was called Lazy Bones.
Jenna Fischer
Amazing. How about this? Real fact number 2033Americans consume 150 million hot dogs on July 4th.
Angela Kinsey
What? I'm going to give you this fact, lady. Real fact 855. Oregon has more ghost towns than any other US state.
Jenna Fischer
All right, our break is over. But in the best way. If you need more facts, grab a Snapple on your next break.
Angela Kinsey
This podcast is sponsored by Squarespace. Jenna, guess what I'm doing right now.
Jenna Fischer
What?
Angela Kinsey
I am looking@our officeladies.com website. It looks so great. We have a new banner now where people can submit questions. We have all these different folders with different topic ideas. We have our Shop Dropdown menu. I'm just loving our website.
Jenna Fischer
Squarespace has been great. We've been using them from the very beginning and it's just given us everything we need all in one place.
Angela Kinsey
And they have all of these cutting edge design tools so you can really make your website fit your brand or business. They have a blueprint AI that's an enhanced website builder to get a fully custom website in just a few steps using basic information about whatever your industry or goals are. We love Squarespace. We think you will too. Go to squarespace.com officeladies for a free trial and when you're ready to Launch, use code OfficeLadies to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain. That was so great. Thank you so much, Rich Summer. And now Jenna.
Jenna Fischer
It's time to break down Business Trip. It is Season 5, Episode 8 Listen to this dream team, written by Brent Forrester and directed by Randall Einhorn.
Angela Kinsey
Office ladies. Folks, are you ready to go to
Wendy McLendon-Covey
the international business trip?
Jenna Fischer
Where are you going to? Kannada.
Angela Kinsey
Kannada.
Jenna Fischer
Kannada.
Angela Kinsey
It's time to go get your passport.
Jenna Fischer
International traveler.
Angela Kinsey
Yes.
Jenna Fischer
Let me give you a summary, please. Michael is ecstatic when David Wallace sends him on an international business trip to Winnipeg, Canada. He brings Oscar and Andy along. While on the trip, Michael romances the concierge and Oscar and Andy bond. Meanwhile, Jim and the rest of the office count down the days until Pam's return, only to be disappointed when she has to stay in New York for another 12 weeks to retake a course that she failed. Also, Kelly and Ryan get back together.
Angela Kinsey
Yes, they do. The deleted scenes on this one are delicious. I'll be sharing some of those fast.
Jenna Fischer
Fact number one. We have an awesome guest star alert.
Angela Kinsey
Yes, we do.
Jenna Fischer
It is Wendy McLendon Covey as concierge Marie. Concierge Marie. How do I love thee?
Angela Kinsey
She was perfection.
Jenna Fischer
You guys might know Wendy. She is the star of the TV show the Goldbergs.
Angela Kinsey
Yes. She plays Beverly.
Jenna Fischer
She was in bridesmaids. So funny. Reno911. She is a member of the Groundlings. Improv. And she's just an all around amazing human being.
Angela Kinsey
She is. And she was so delightful. We slid into her DMs.
Jenna Fischer
We did.
Angela Kinsey
And I was like, Wendy, we have some questions. She was like, of course. And she sent us fantastic audio clips.
Jenna Fischer
Of course. We had to ask her how she got her role in the Office. I was not expecting this response.
Angela Kinsey
You know me either.
Wendy McLendon-Covey
Hello, Jenna and Angela. Office ladies. Gorgeous office ladies. So my audition process, actually, I did not have to audition for the Office, but it came to me in an interesting way. First of all, I had Been in Michigan for not even 24 hours before I had been flying. Fired off of a movie because one of the money guys thought I was too ugly. So my ugly ass was put on a plane back to lax. And when I got off the plane, there was a message from my agent saying, oh, they want you for the office tomorrow. So I was thrilled. You know, I'd been crying for, I don't know, five hours on a plane. And then I get this news and it's like, yes, I'm so glad I got four. So when I got to the set the next day, I was a little raw from being told how ugly I was. And I was in my dressing room, my trailer, and one of the PAs came and said, oh, something to the effect of, yeah, you don't look as bad as we thought you were going to, so we don't need to see you right away in the makeup chair. I swear it was something like that. It was like, oh, we're delighted that you don't look like Shrek type of thing.
Jenna Fischer
Oh, Wende.
Angela Kinsey
I mean, we've all had moments like that. That is something about show business where people can get real tacky.
Jenna Fischer
Oh, yeah. Well, you know my story where they said I couldn't be on Alias because I wasn't hot enough. But then the very next week, I auditioned for a different pilot and they said I was too good looking for the role. So I was like, well, I don't know what I am then. I don't know. Well, I can't change my face.
Angela Kinsey
I had an agent say to me, you're not Hollywood glamorous. Okay. And I said, I know that. I was like, yeah, I know that. Can I be Hollywood dorky, though?
Jenna Fischer
You can.
Angela Kinsey
Thank you.
Jenna Fischer
You did it.
Angela Kinsey
And I did it.
Jenna Fischer
Oh, no. Gosh. And I've been fired. I was fired from a pilot that I did with Matt LeBlanc. I played his wife. It's on the air still. Man with a plan. I was his wife. That was my part.
Angela Kinsey
Well, I know this story. And you shared it in your book.
Jenna Fischer
I did, yeah. I got hired. I shot the pilot While I was there, the network said they wanted more scenes with me. Oh. I was like, I am nailing it.
Angela Kinsey
Right.
Jenna Fischer
More scenes means you're doing a good job. Well, I guess after we finished it, they showed it to focus groups.
Angela Kinsey
And they didn't like you?
Jenna Fischer
No, they liked me, but they said, this is a literal quote. They said, I don't believe Pam would marry Joey. The chemistry doesn't work between these two. That was the feedback they got.
Angela Kinsey
They could only see you as Pam and Joey.
Jenna Fischer
Yeah. So it wasn't working for them that we got married and had a family and. You know, the show's called man with a Plan. It's starring Matt LeBlanc. It's his show.
Angela Kinsey
Yeah, I haven't seen it.
Jenna Fischer
Okay, well, guess who they can't fire? The man with the Plan. So out the door I went, I.
Angela Kinsey
Revenge. Didn't watch.
Jenna Fischer
Thank you. I appreciate it. As your bff, that's what you're supposed to do.
Angela Kinsey
That's right. You fire my bff, I'm not going to watch your show.
Jenna Fischer
But here's the crazy part, Lainey. The crazy part is that I didn't know I was fired until literally, like, two days before they were going to announce it at the big press junket in New York. I had packed a suitcase.
Angela Kinsey
Tacky.
Jenna Fischer
Because everyone was like, it's going. It's gonna go. It's a sure thing. I had hired hair and makeup to get me ready for all the press. And then I get this call and everyone's on the phone. All my agents, my manager, publicist.
Angela Kinsey
Listen, when there's 15 people on the phone, it's either great news or real, real bad.
Jenna Fischer
Yeah. And the first thing I said was, is it not getting picked up? And they said, it's worse than that, hon. And I was like, what's worse than that? They said, it's getting picked up, but without you. And I was like, wow. I guess I'll unpack my suitcase.
Angela Kinsey
Dang.
Jenna Fischer
Yeah. I almost cut bangs in my hair that day. I remember you stopped me.
Angela Kinsey
I didn't want you to cut your hair that day. I said, you know what? Let's pick a different day. Let's pick a different day to change your whole look. You did send me a picture, though, of you jumping in the air, flipping off the world.
Jenna Fischer
I did.
Angela Kinsey
I said, that's better. Go jump around. Flip off anyone you want in the air. Do not cut your hair today.
Jenna Fischer
You were a good friend to me
Angela Kinsey
that day, and I will never watch that show.
Jenna Fischer
Sorry.
Angela Kinsey
Matt LeBlanc. I actually love you and I love Joey, but I'm sorry.
Jenna Fischer
I liked Matt LeBlanc, too. He was very nice.
Angela Kinsey
Anyway.
Jenna Fischer
All right, well, Wendy, I am sorry you got fired, because you are a talent and a force, and I love you.
Angela Kinsey
Yes. And thank you for texting me, emailing me.
Jenna Fischer
Let's see, fast fact number two. Michael goes on his business trip to Winnipeg in this episode, and we got a lot of questions from People, why Winnipeg? How did they choose this location? Well, like I said before, this episode was written by Brent Forrester, and he did an interview.
Angela Kinsey
You mean to the cbc, Jenna?
Jenna Fischer
That's the one, Ang. Did you find it as well?
Angela Kinsey
It's the.
Jenna Fischer
Did we both Google real good this episode?
Angela Kinsey
We Googled real good. CBC is the Canadian broadcast company.
Jenna Fischer
Yes.
Angela Kinsey
I'm, like, so proud that I know what CBC stands for.
Jenna Fischer
Well, they asked him why Winnipeg? They did some good journalism. He explained that they knew they wanted this to be an international business trip, that they tossed around the idea of Montreal or Vancouver, but in the end, they chose Winnipeg because it seemed to strike the right balance between, quote, exotic and obscure.
Angela Kinsey
Yes. And you know what else I loved in this interview? Brent shared that Phil Shea, our prop master, reached out to the Winnipeg Tourism Promotion Agency.
Rich Sommer
And.
Angela Kinsey
And they sent along all kinds of stuff, like airport baggage tags, shopping bags from the bay, old Dutch potato chips, which was founded in Winnipeg in 1954,
Jenna Fischer
and you're gonna see those on the bar.
Angela Kinsey
I became obsessed, maybe because I watched this episode while I was hungry. I will have some old Dutch potato chip tracking and also flavors to share with you.
Jenna Fischer
I'm there for it.
Angela Kinsey
And also they sent some Fort Garry Brewing Company paraphernalia and all kinds of other stuff.
Jenna Fischer
Yes. Because we did not go to Winnipeg. We shot this whole episode in Los Angeles. Yes. So we had to just make it look as Canada as possible.
Angela Kinsey
Fakie Canada.
Jenna Fischer
Yes. Fast fact number three, even though we didn't go to Winnipeg, I have some fun facts about Winnipeg. And these were all sent in by fans. Oh, I love it. Office ladies. Listeners who are from Winnipeg wanted us to know these things.
Angela Kinsey
Okay?
Jenna Fischer
So first, from Leah Patterson, Winnie the Pooh was named after the city of Winnipeg.
Angela Kinsey
Get out.
Jenna Fischer
I didn't know that.
Angela Kinsey
I didn't know that.
Jenna Fischer
Yeah, a lot of people know that the writer of Winnie the Pooh had a son named Christopher Robin, and his son, Christopher Robin, had a little stuffed bear named Winnie, and that's where he got the idea for the characters. But do you know why his son named his bear Winnie?
Angela Kinsey
I do.
Jenna Fischer
Why?
Angela Kinsey
I don't know. Oh, I'm just messing with you. I have no idea. There's probably a small number of people that know this, right?
Jenna Fischer
Well, I don't know. Leah Patterson knows.
Angela Kinsey
Okay, Leah, why?
Jenna Fischer
Because in 1915, a black bear was rescued by a cavalry veterinarian who named the bear Winnie after his hometown of Winnipeg. And then he gave the bear to the London Zoo. And that's where the real Christopher Robin saw the bear, loved the bear, and. And then named his little stuffed bear after Winnie.
Angela Kinsey
Oh, so it's a little roundabout.
Jenna Fischer
It's hard to explain. I'm sorry if I took you on a real circle there, but the bottom line is, yes, Winnie the Pooh is named after the city of Winnipeg.
Angela Kinsey
Well, Leah, I love knowing that. What else you got?
Jenna Fischer
More from Leah.
Angela Kinsey
More from Leah.
Jenna Fischer
Yes.
Angela Kinsey
Okay.
Jenna Fischer
Winnipeg has been the Slurpee capital of the world for almost 20 years.
Angela Kinsey
Wait, like Slurpee like you get at 7:11?
Jenna Fischer
That's right. They literally sell the most Slurpees every.
Angela Kinsey
Come on.
Jenna Fischer
Yep.
Angela Kinsey
My kids love a Slurpee.
Jenna Fischer
I looked it up. It's true.
Angela Kinsey
Gotta go to Winnipeg.
Jenna Fischer
More from Leah. Okay, Leah, you are a treasure trove of information about Winnipeg. Where do you work?
Angela Kinsey
Do you work at the tourism board agency?
Jenna Fischer
You should. Winnipeg was also the first city in North America to use 91 1.
Angela Kinsey
They invented 911.
Jenna Fischer
I don't know. They were the first city to use it. It happened in 1959.
Rich Sommer
Wow.
Jenna Fischer
This one from Taylor Nacorado. Winnipeg can get to close to negative 30 degrees Celsius in the winter. And we have actually broken a record for being colder than the planet Mars in 2019.
Angela Kinsey
This is a tough sell for Winnipeg.
Jenna Fischer
On New Year's Eve, the Mars Curiosity rover posted a temperature of -29 degrees Celsius. Now that's actually very warm for Mars.
Angela Kinsey
Yeah.
Jenna Fischer
If you are interested, the average temperature on Mars is about minus 55 degrees Celsius, but it can get as cold as negative 150 degrees Celsius at the poles. But on this warm day on Mars, it was negative 29. And on that same day in Winnipeg, it was colder than Mars by a few degrees.
Rich Sommer
Dang.
Jenna Fischer
Very cold. Taylor N would like you to know that Winnipeg is a very diverse multicultural city and they host something called Folklorama. It's one of the largest and longest running multicultural festivals in the world. It has over 40 pavilions where they embrace cultures of different countries. And you can watch singing and dancing and sample different foods from that country.
Angela Kinsey
I would go to that.
Jenna Fischer
That sounds so fun.
Angela Kinsey
I would love to love that. Well, listen, I think we should take a break.
Jenna Fischer
I think that's a good idea.
Angela Kinsey
We'll get an iced tea. We're gonna come back and I'm excited to break down business trip.
Jenna Fischer
Let's do it, Lady. I recently went on a beachy vacay. And you know what I brought with me, which I love and I'm using like every day now is the Jones Road Beauty Miracle Balm. It's really great. It's really versatile.
Angela Kinsey
Oh, my gosh. Their foundation stick is the best. I keep it in my tennis bag. It's so easy to apply. That's what I love. And it's not too matte. It's not heavy. You know, it goes on super smooth. And it literally is available in like 30 different shades. It's just great. And it's just so functional.
Jenna Fischer
That's what I love about Jones Road Beauty. Modern day makeup that's clean, strategic, and multifunctional for effortless routines for a limited time. Our listeners get a free gift on their first purchase when they use Code Office Ladies at checkout.
Angela Kinsey
Just head to Jonesroadbeauty.com and use code officeladies at checkout.
Jenna Fischer
After you purchase, they will ask you where you heard about them. Please support our show and tell them our show sent you. Okay, lady. I did it. I did it. And you were right. I now also own a pair of Archies art support flip flops.
Angela Kinsey
I have been wearing them, like so faithfully for years. I have the flip flops, I have the slides because, you know, I have high arches and my feet hurt until I started wearing these.
Jenna Fischer
I mean, I am now wearing them constantly.
Angela Kinsey
They really make a big difference. And, you know, summer's coming, you want to run errands, you want a cute pair of flip flops, you're not going to lose that arch support with Archies, y'. All.
Jenna Fischer
I also found out that they were designed by a physical therapist and the goal was to find something that felt great but still looked good. And they have achieved their goal.
Angela Kinsey
You can really feel the difference. So take it from us. You guys are going to love them. Shop archiesfootwear.com did you know that you
Jenna Fischer
can buy your car completely online on Autotrader? Really?
Angela Kinsey
Just visit autotrader.com, filter and search through dealer listings for the car you want. Make, model, color, and all the features that matter to you. Go ahead, get picky.
Jenna Fischer
Whether you're into subcompacts with heated cup holders, crossovers with all wheel drive pickups with kicking sound systems, or SUVs that can survive whatever chaos your kids unleash, just drop in your info and you'll only see cars in your budget.
Angela Kinsey
Really? Once you find your one and only, you can do the whole deal online and have the car delivered to your driveway. Or you can pick it up at the dealership and drive your new ride right off the lot. Really?
Jenna Fischer
AutoTrader makes it easy to buy your car online because the whole process is designed around your wants and must haves.
Angela Kinsey
Autotrader. Buy your car online. Really? All right, you guys, we are back. We are in the conference room. Michael is teaching the group about various cultures and how to travel to those cultures.
Jenna Fischer
International behaviors.
Angela Kinsey
Yes. Jenna, background catch. At eight seconds, you can see Kate staring at me, but I can tell it's Kate and not Meredith. She's kind of looking at me like. And then very quickly in the corner, you can see me futzing with my microphone.
Jenna Fischer
Oh, was she trying to tell you we could see your microphone?
Angela Kinsey
I think something happened. Either my microphone dropped and I was trying to fix it, and Kate was trying to be like, camera's coming. Something. There's a moment here, but you can see me. It's very quick. I'm, like, futzing with my collar doing something.
Jenna Fischer
Yeah.
Angela Kinsey
Anyway.
Jenna Fischer
Oh, that's a good catch.
Angela Kinsey
It tickled me.
Jenna Fischer
Well, the reason for this conference room scene is so that Michael can explain to us that he is being sent to woo an international client. Right.
Angela Kinsey
This whole meeting could have been an email.
Jenna Fischer
Yeah.
Angela Kinsey
Yeah.
Jenna Fischer
The other thing that's happening is we learn that Pam is coming home in 6.5 days.
Angela Kinsey
Yes. And the office is very excited for Jim. Everyone at Dunder Mifflin. Kevin smacks his butt. Creed gives him a kind of a creepy shoulder rub. Phyllis smiles and says, one more week. When Phyllis smiles and says, one more week, please look at her desk. It is covered with tissues. I don't know what was happening.
Jenna Fischer
Oh, she must have had a cold.
Angela Kinsey
Something. I just love the fact that we didn't bother to tidy the desk.
Jenna Fischer
No, it's real life.
Angela Kinsey
It's real life mixed with fake life. Stanley gives Jim a look and goes, eh, Eh. And in a deleted scene, Jenna Kelly helps Jim make a sign saying, welcome back, and she's really annoyed because he needs to use more glitter.
Jenna Fischer
Oh, yeah. We had a fan question from Chris S. About this scene with Jim. Chris said, I would like to know the specific stage direction Creed was given when he massages Jim's shoulders as he comforts him. He really liked this moment. I looked it up in the script.
Angela Kinsey
What did it say?
Jenna Fischer
In the script? It actually said this quote, Creed passes Jim. He punches Jim's shoulder and then musses Jim's hair. So this massage, they must have found it on the day, because in the script, he was supposed to give him a punch and a hair muss.
Angela Kinsey
Well, I think it's funnier because Kevin's already smacked his butt.
Jenna Fischer
Yeah.
Angela Kinsey
So it's like a smack and a punch. I think this is way funnier. Also, John Krasinski's reactions to everyone. It's what makes it.
Jenna Fischer
Yeah.
Angela Kinsey
His face when Creed comes up behind him is so good.
Jenna Fischer
So now Michael is on the phone with David Wallace. He's got his passport, Airport ready. He's got his per diem.
Angela Kinsey
50 bucks. He's gonna buy a sweater. He is.
Jenna Fischer
He'll use other money for food.
Angela Kinsey
Yeah. And he has a plane ticket.
Jenna Fischer
He does. On Butte Airlines.
Angela Kinsey
B U T T E Butt Airlines. Well, I think it's probably Butte.
Jenna Fischer
I looked it up.
Angela Kinsey
I did, too.
Jenna Fischer
I found nothing.
Angela Kinsey
I found zilch.
Jenna Fischer
Not an airline.
Angela Kinsey
Not real fakie airline.
Jenna Fischer
I want to know more, though, why
Angela Kinsey
they settled on Butte.
Jenna Fischer
I think it was. But.
Angela Kinsey
Oh, come on. Really?
Jenna Fischer
I don't know. Why would you call it Butte Airline?
Angela Kinsey
I don't know.
Jenna Fischer
We don't know. We're sorry.
Angela Kinsey
Sorry, guys. It could be beaut or butt, but it's a fakey airline.
Jenna Fischer
Oh, here's something. Michael is going to bring two extra giant suitcases for souvenirs.
Angela Kinsey
Empty.
Jenna Fischer
Empty.
Angela Kinsey
They're empty.
Jenna Fischer
Do you do that? Do you bring an extra empty bag? Do you leave room as you're packing? Do you consider, I can't pack this totally full because I know I'm going to purchase something? Or are you the person who gets to your vacation and it's time to go home, and then you have to go buy, like, an extra canvas bag to get all your stuff home?
Angela Kinsey
Ding, ding, ding, ding, ding. Yeah, that's me.
Jenna Fischer
Yeah.
Angela Kinsey
That's why I have a plethora of real rando bags.
Jenna Fischer
Yeah.
Angela Kinsey
Because usually you're in a tight spot. Yep. You don't have a lot of options. Yeah. I once had a travel bag that looked like a zebra because I had to buy it at the airport to fit my souvenirs because my suitcase was starting to, like.
Jenna Fischer
Yeah.
Angela Kinsey
Start to, like, look like it was gonna tear. And for a long time we had the zebra suitcase.
Jenna Fischer
Yeah.
Angela Kinsey
Yeah.
Jenna Fischer
Guess which one I am.
Angela Kinsey
You're the first one.
Jenna Fischer
I leave the room.
Angela Kinsey
You leave the room.
Jenna Fischer
I anticipate my souvenir purchases.
Angela Kinsey
You're not walking through an airport with a zebra bag.
Jenna Fischer
No rando bags.
Angela Kinsey
For I'm a rando bag.
Jenna Fischer
Listen, rando bag happened to me once, Never again. You know what I'm saying?
Angela Kinsey
Yeah. Like, I have a random suitcase from Scotland. I still love it. It looks like a travel trunk from, like, Joe Versus the Volcano.
Jenna Fischer
This is the problem. Sometimes you Get a real find when you're in a bind.
Angela Kinsey
I know.
Jenna Fischer
Ooh, I rhymed it.
Angela Kinsey
You did.
Jenna Fischer
I'm still rhyming.
Angela Kinsey
You are? Stop it. If you can pause on rhyming, I want to tell you one other thing that's happening in this scene.
Jenna Fischer
I can.
Angela Kinsey
Can you?
Jenna Fischer
I can try.
Angela Kinsey
Okay.
Jenna Fischer
I was gonna try to rhyme, but
Angela Kinsey
I couldn't think of anything. I know. I was trying to set you up. Anyway, while this whole suitcase business is happening, lady in the background, I am telling you, Pam's puffer coat is hanging on the coat rack.
Jenna Fischer
It's not Pam's coat.
Angela Kinsey
Come on.
Jenna Fischer
It's not her coat.
Angela Kinsey
How do you know?
Jenna Fischer
Because somebody wrote in about it, and I zoomed in on it. It's not my coat.
Angela Kinsey
It sure looks like your coat.
Jenna Fischer
It's not mine.
Angela Kinsey
Who wrote in? It was me.
Jenna Fischer
Angela K. Wrote in. Yeah, I think several times more male than anyone.
Angela Kinsey
I zoomed in, too, and it sure looks like that puffer coat you used to wear.
Jenna Fischer
I know it looks like it, but it's not my puffer coat. I think it might be Meredith's. Meredith had a similar puffer coat.
Angela Kinsey
Okay, well, there you go.
Jenna Fischer
Guess who else gets to come on
Angela Kinsey
this trip besides the money belt and the two empty suitcases?
Jenna Fischer
Yeah. Andy is going to join him as his translator. He will be translating all of the French that they don't speak in Winnipeg.
Angela Kinsey
Well, we did learn in a deleted scene in Dinner Party, Angela said that Andy learned French during his semester in France.
Jenna Fischer
So this is kind of a callback.
Angela Kinsey
Kind of a callback.
Jenna Fischer
Then Andy speaks some not great French.
Angela Kinsey
Oh, a lot of not great French mixed in with some Spanish. Oscar is also going on the trip. I don't really know Oscar's role. Why would he be going?
Jenna Fischer
Something to do with crunching numbers?
Angela Kinsey
Maybe. Maybe. I'm so glad that Oscar went because, Jenna, there are so many fantastic deleted Oscar scenes and Oscar and Andy scenes. If you have the DVDs. And you guys, Oscar does that thing in these deleted scenes, like what he did with Holly in Employee Transfer. I have a new term for Oscar. He's the office fun stopper. Oh, you might think it's Angela Barton, but kind of like Debbie Downer on snl. Yeah, Oscar is always going to have that sidebar comment that's a little too honest for the moment.
Jenna Fischer
Takes the wind out of your sails.
Angela Kinsey
Takes the wind out of your sails.
Jenna Fischer
All right, so now they're on the plane. Michael is up in business class. He's got a mimosa he Has a moist hand towel that's still wet. We got a lot of fan questions from Kyle T, Sarah M, Steph Hernandez, and Madison C. Did you guys film on an actual airplane? If so, which airport and airline were used for this episode?
Angela Kinsey
Well, we have some information for you.
Jenna Fischer
Yes, we do. Thanks to Randy Cordray, who was our line producer, who took over for Kent Zabornak. He gave us the lowdown. The interior airplane scenes were filmed at a place called Air Hollywood in Pacoima, California. And at the time, this company was, I guess, like the go to location for all things airline related.
Angela Kinsey
Yeah, it was like a set, but for airplanes.
Jenna Fischer
Yeah.
Angela Kinsey
So if you needed a plane to film, they were ready for you. Yeah.
Jenna Fischer
He said they had all these sound stages. They had various aircraft, various airport related props. They even had like interior airport kind of stuff. So we used the interior of a jet for Michael in business class and Andy and Oscar in Coach. He explained that these airplanes can be split down the middle.
Angela Kinsey
Yeah. Well, Michael is going to introduce Oscar and Andy, you know, before they go back to coach, to Beth, who he says is his personal valet, flight attendant, and she's gonna be helping him this morning.
Jenna Fischer
I love Beth.
Angela Kinsey
I love Beth.
Jenna Fischer
When I watched it, it reminded me of the woman who played the transcriber in the deposition.
Angela Kinsey
Just. No, nonsense.
Jenna Fischer
Just. Did we hire an actual flight attendant to play this role?
Angela Kinsey
She's so like, over Michael and the camera.
Jenna Fischer
We did not. This is an actress. Her name is Deb Height. She has been on the Good Place, Barry, Curb youb Enthusiasm, Veep Baskets, Arrested Development, Parks and Recreation. She's a writer. She has written plays. She has written award winning pilots, award winning short films. And she wrote a comedy book about the rivalry between the Alabama Auburn college football teams called When Mommy Loves Bama and Daddy Loves Auburn. You can find it on Amazon. It's really cute.
Angela Kinsey
We were so lucky. We say this every week. Oh, my gosh. We say it every week. But seriously, every single person hired on this show always crushed it and was amazing.
Jenna Fischer
My favorite moment is when she slams Michael's leg with the cart.
Angela Kinsey
I know, it's. It's Steve's reaction. Steve's reaction. That was like amazing.
Jenna Fischer
It's too good.
Angela Kinsey
While Michael's getting his foot run over with the beverage card, Andy is really trying to bond with Oscar back in Coach. This is a deleted scene. It is amazing. It's Oscar the fun stopper.
Rich Sommer
Guys, honey roasted peanuts. Am I right?
Jenna Fischer
I don't understand the question. Yes, you're holding a bag of peanuts.
Rich Sommer
And save that for later.
Angela Kinsey
That just made me laugh so hard because Andy's like, trying to bond. He's like honey roasted peas.
Jenna Fischer
But what are you supposed to say to that? I know, but I'm with Oscar.
Angela Kinsey
I know, but this is my point. Yes, you're holding peanuts, but Oscar cannot edit. Like, I think other people would be like, I know they're really good, you know, or something, but Oscar's just like, I don't understand what you're saying to me.
Jenna Fischer
I have to say, I actually really love a honey roasted peanut on an airplane. So I. I would probably respond. I might actually be Andy in this scenario.
Angela Kinsey
I just thought that was really good. Oscar, the fun stopper. But, you know, if Oscar's not going to be fun, at least Andy has his DVD player and he's going to watch Harry and the Hendersons.
Jenna Fischer
Yeah.
Angela Kinsey
I think we should talk about what's happening over at Dunder Mifflin.
Jenna Fischer
Oh, yeah. Pam's coming back, which means Ryan is going to have to move into Kelly's Nook. And he's looking for a place he might be able to do his push ups.
Angela Kinsey
He needs space to do push ups.
Jenna Fischer
He does.
Angela Kinsey
It's kind of tight and cramped over there, but he's going to try.
Jenna Fischer
He's going to find a way. We had a fan question. How many push ups did BJ have to do in this episode? He must have been so sore.
Angela Kinsey
I want to hear this because I, as Jenna knows, I texted BJ last night and I said, by the way, I just watched you do a one arm push up in the business trip. Dang, bj.
Jenna Fischer
Well, I texted with BJ about his push ups as well, and he said he doesn't remember how many takes they did, but he said that Mindy definitely wrote this scene. He said there was a period of time when all the writers were doing push up contests and that might have inspired it. But also at the same time, he was in training because he was prepping to do the Tarantino movie Inglourious Basterd.
Angela Kinsey
Oh, yeah. He was getting in really good shape for that. Cause he was gonna be a soldier.
Jenna Fischer
Yeah. So he was doing push ups in the writer's room all the time. He had to literally find room to do push ups at work. So Mindy might have been going off of that as well. But also maybe she just wanted to make BJ have to do a bunch of push ups in a scene and
Angela Kinsey
then a one arm push up.
Jenna Fischer
Yeah, See, that's a moment where if I'm bj I'm like, I'm so glad I got that on camera. That I did it in that I could do it. Yeah. I'll always have that. Well, listen, Kelly is claiming she's not impressed. Ryan has hurt her too much. It is not gonna happen. No. She is in a healthy relationship with Daryl. That door is closed.
Angela Kinsey
Cut to
Jenna Fischer
major make out kissy sounds. Yeah, I could tell.
Angela Kinsey
Oh, you could. Okay.
Jenna Fischer
You did it. Back in Winnipeg, the guys are arriving at the hotel.
Angela Kinsey
It's so beautiful. Michael says he could live there.
Jenna Fischer
We had a fan catch from Tori, Mary and Katie who said Michael left Dunder Mifflin with multiple suitcases. But he shows up at the hotel with only his carry on. What happened to his souvenir suitcases? Well, guys, I'll tell you, they're there. You have to look deep in the background. At 6 minutes, 37 seconds, you can see the bellman loading the suitcases onto a trolley. Oh. As Michael goes up, snap the escalator.
Angela Kinsey
Nice.
Jenna Fischer
So don't worry, he has them. And he's gonna get those souvenirs.
Angela Kinsey
Yeah, they're gonna put him in his room. Jenna, this hotel has something sort of magical about it. Fantastical. It's called a concierge.
Jenna Fischer
Oh, yeah?
Angela Kinsey
Mm. I don't know if you've ever heard of it.
Jenna Fischer
Oh, yeah.
Angela Kinsey
You know, they help you with the fine art of fanciness and pleasure. Mm.
Jenna Fischer
These guys are gonna try it out. They're gonna go over and they're gonna ask her a bunch of questions. And guess what?
Angela Kinsey
What?
Jenna Fischer
Almost nothing she says is true.
Angela Kinsey
But I just love how completely blown away Michael is that she knows restaurants and their street address and the best way to get there. This is mind blowing to him.
Jenna Fischer
This is such a real concierge interaction. When she pulls out the map.
Angela Kinsey
The map and circles it and then tells them two different routes and two different means of transportation.
Jenna Fischer
Perfection.
Angela Kinsey
Perfection.
Jenna Fischer
But we did have a lot of fans from Winnipeg who wrote in again, Kimberly K. Said, did the writers know that everything concierge Marie said about Winnipeg is inaccurate? Was this on purpose? Oh, Natalie V. Said, the number 17 bus is real, but it runs a lot later than 9pm it goes till almost 1am it wouldn't be the only bus to the exchange district which does not exist. I think they meant the financial district. And then Leah P. Said, we also don't have an astro cleaners or the
Angela Kinsey
restaurants or the bar.
Jenna Fischer
No, the Huntsman is not a real
Angela Kinsey
bar and neither is the sushi place.
Jenna Fischer
Yes. Well, Angela, we have another story happening in this episode, it's Pam, right?
Angela Kinsey
It's a big story.
Jenna Fischer
Well, she's supposed to be coming home from art school, but we're gonna have a phone call between her and Jim and they're gonna find out some news. She's failing her flash class.
Angela Kinsey
Yeah. She's going to have to take it again.
Jenna Fischer
If she wants to pass art school, she does. That means she has to stay another 12 weeks.
Angela Kinsey
Is this art school like, just digital art? Does she get to do any of the art that she's actually really good at?
Jenna Fischer
I don't know. It seems like this was mostly a graphic design program. Yeah, well, I had to cry in this scene. It was in the script that I'm holding back tears. And there's a lot that is coming down on Pam right now. She's dealing with the fact that she didn't complete this course and the idea of being away from gym even longer. But I had something else that I was playing. We'll get to it.
Angela Kinsey
Okay. Well, I thought it was a very moving scene, and it just reminds me of those moments, you guys, when life happens, even though everything around you just keeps moving on. So Pam is sitting down. It's like a busy stairwell. People are going up and down, and she's having a life moment. Yeah, I thought that was very relatable. Well, Jenna, back in Winnipeg, the fellows are going to arrive at Huntsman Bar.
Jenna Fischer
Yes. We shot these scenes at the Seven Grand Bar and Grill in Los Angeles.
Angela Kinsey
Did you notice at 9 minutes, 20 seconds what the chalkboard says at the Huntsman?
Jenna Fischer
No.
Angela Kinsey
This is what it says. Welcome to the Huntsman. Enjoy quote pub hour all night night. Sunday and Monday, 5 to 7pm no creeps allowed. Oh, wow.
Jenna Fischer
Get out, creeps.
Angela Kinsey
Get out, creeps. And I have a background. Catch. Again. I was hungry as I watched this episode.
Jenna Fischer
The chips.
Angela Kinsey
The chips, you guys.
Jenna Fischer
The chips that Phil Shea got are at the bar.
Angela Kinsey
Yes. And I think I can see the ketchup flavored chips. They're in a red ketchup flavor. Oh, yes, lady, why did I do that with my voice?
Jenna Fischer
Have you eaten them?
Angela Kinsey
Yes.
Jenna Fischer
I've never heard of this item.
Angela Kinsey
Well, I worked in Canada for a bit, you know, and I have had these ketchup chips. Jenna, they're so good. Listen to how they're described on the Internet. They are the perfect balance of a delightful old Dutch chip layered with that lovely ketchup flavor you desire.
Jenna Fischer
But I don't desire ketchup flavor on my potato chips.
Angela Kinsey
It might change your mind.
Jenna Fischer
I'm just Telling you, maybe I will chip people. Old Dutch chip people. Will you send me a ketchup chip?
Angela Kinsey
Oh, my gosh. Get ready. But listen, make sure some come my way.
Jenna Fischer
You got it.
Angela Kinsey
They're tangy. They're delicious.
Jenna Fischer
Okay. Guess who else is at the bar? Concierge Marie. Yeah. Michael is, how you say, so excited to see her.
Angela Kinsey
Yeah.
Jenna Fischer
How do you say it?
Angela Kinsey
How do you say it? Andy's going to bring him two glasses of wine.
Jenna Fischer
Mm. He's going to get things started.
Angela Kinsey
Yeah.
Jenna Fischer
He's also going to try to get things started for Oscar and a couple of gentlemen sitting at a table nearby.
Angela Kinsey
That's right. He says to the bartender, mademoiselle, bear me dos Long Island Iced Teas. Si vous play. Bad decision in a glass it is
Jenna Fischer
a bad decision in a glass it is.
Angela Kinsey
Horrible decision.
Jenna Fischer
You know how you've had a volcano and you did the splits?
Angela Kinsey
Yes.
Jenna Fischer
I had some Long Island Iced teas.
Angela Kinsey
Where?
Jenna Fischer
In the Bahamas on spring break with my friends. I never had one before. I wasn't 21 yet, but in the Bahamas, you can drink when you're 18. We went to the casino, and they just give them to you free if you sit at the slot machines. All of this was like, what is happening?
Angela Kinsey
I have not had a Long Island Iced Tea. I've had the volcano. But it's just the same thing. They just dump a bunch of booze in it.
Jenna Fischer
Right. It's like seven or eight different liquors. Tasty. Went down easy. Well, yeah, Then a lot of vomiting.
Angela Kinsey
A lot of vomiting.
Jenna Fischer
Well, we got a fan question about this scene from Evan L. At 11 minutes, 14 seconds, Andy says, you will thank me when they spank thee. And he wants to know who came up with that line.
Angela Kinsey
Can I guess?
Jenna Fischer
Sure.
Angela Kinsey
Lee or Jean.
Jenna Fischer
That's a good guess. It's in the script. And I asked Brent Forrester about it, and he said he is the author of the thank me Spank the line. He said there are few things more fun than writing a rhyming punchline for the Andy character. He said he got a little bit too into writing rhyming punchlines for Ed that season. He said that one day in the writer's room, he pitched a line where Andy refers to his, quote, backup snack pack backpack. And he said at that point, the writers forbid him from writing any more rhyming punchlines for the rest of the year.
Angela Kinsey
I wonder if he wrote nifty gifties he might have. Oh, Brent, that's so good.
Jenna Fischer
Well, guess what? They're not gonna spank him.
Angela Kinsey
They're not.
Jenna Fischer
They turn him down.
Angela Kinsey
And Oscar and Andy now drink the Long island iced teas, which is gonna lead to some trouble, some real trouble,
Jenna Fischer
because Oscar says to Andy, what do you see in Angela?
Angela Kinsey
And again, I was hungry as I watched this. So at 12 minutes, 17 seconds, I can see another bag of old Dutch potato chips sitting next to Oscar's arm on the bar. They're the green and white bag. You know what that means?
Jenna Fischer
Sour cream and onion.
Angela Kinsey
They are the dill pickle chips. What? Yep. Described on the Internet.
Jenna Fischer
Do they make any regular flavors?
Angela Kinsey
They do. I'm telling you. These chips are so good.
Jenna Fischer
You've had the dill pickle ones?
Angela Kinsey
I have sampled. You know, like, on set, we would have a whole bunch of bags of chips. They're real salty, and I like them.
Jenna Fischer
I guess I'm a chip traditionalist.
Angela Kinsey
You know what? You need to be a chip traveler.
Jenna Fischer
All right?
Angela Kinsey
You need to try some international chips.
Jenna Fischer
I'll try them.
Angela Kinsey
Well, the dill ones are real salty.
Jenna Fischer
I do like a pickle.
Angela Kinsey
I know. But anyway, Andy drunk dials Angela. This is a huge mistake.
Jenna Fischer
Oh, my goodness.
Angela Kinsey
He says, you know what? We're going to discuss this. We will discuss this naked.
Jenna Fischer
But then there's a voice in the background. I mean, she's with Dwight.
Angela Kinsey
Of course she is.
Jenna Fischer
Yeah. But somehow Andy doesn't totally register it.
Angela Kinsey
He's had a Long island iced tea.
Jenna Fischer
Several, I think, at this point.
Angela Kinsey
Yeah. And guess what? Michael and Concierge Marie, they're clicking. They're gonna leave. They're gonna smooch outside in the alley. And we asked Wendy about this, about kissing Steve, and here's what she had to say.
Wendy McLendon-Covey
I was super nervous to kiss Steve Carell. I was so nervous that I was practically going into convulsions. But I did it, and it was great, and I highly recommend it.
Jenna Fischer
She highly recommends. Oh, well, they're not just going to kiss outside the hotel. All right, we are going to cut to Michael being sort of shoved out of her room.
Angela Kinsey
887.
Jenna Fischer
Yeah. Without his shoes.
Angela Kinsey
Barefoot, he's shuffling down the hall.
Jenna Fischer
I know.
Angela Kinsey
And then she's like, wait, you forgot your shoes. Only she says nothing. She just sets them out and quickly shuts the door.
Jenna Fischer
Well, that kind of wraps up Concierge Marie. We had to ask Wendy if she ever gets recognized for being on the show. And here's what she said.
Angela Kinsey
Yes.
Jenna Fischer
So many times.
Wendy McLendon-Covey
I'm so surprised at that, because I was, you know, barely in it. But, you know, that just speaks to the reach and the popularity of the office.
Jenna Fischer
I read a fun fact about Wendy.
Angela Kinsey
Yes, you did. Share it, Jenna. It's so good.
Jenna Fischer
Okay. Wendy was the editor for California State University's academic journal of Social Work. This was her day job before she hit it big as an actress. But even after she was working all the time. She kept her job until 2012. Bridesmaids came out in 2011. So even after Bridesmaids, she was still editing this journal of social work, and we had to ask her about it. Here's what she said.
Wendy McLendon-Covey
It is true that while I was building my acting career and, you know, doing pretty well, that I kept my side job at Cal State Long Beach. I was an assistant editor for a social work journal. I did that for 12 years, all through Reno911, all through, you know, all these movies that I did, Rules of Engagement and right up until the Goldbergs. And the only reason I'm not doing it anymore is because the journal folded. It went out of business. But it was a great job. It was, like, not even 20 hours a week. I could do it from wherever I was. And it was all about, you know, people in the social work profession. And let's be honest, those people deserve a lot of credit for what they do. They don't get recognized enough. Yeah, it was great. And I loved doing it. I loved my original boss who used to come and see my shows at the Groundlings. Like, she was just so super supportive that she said, please don't ever quit. So I kept my word and I stayed until the very end.
Jenna Fischer
See what I was saying about amazing human being?
Angela Kinsey
I love her. You know, that was so moving to me when I heard it. My niece is a social worker. I'm just always. You know, honestly, guys, I'm lifting her up in prayer all the time because it's not an easy job. And I'm thankful that we have people that have a passion for helping others in that way. Yeah.
Jenna Fischer
It's not an easy job because sometimes you have to see and confront real hard things.
Angela Kinsey
Yes.
Jenna Fischer
And then you have to hold that.
Angela Kinsey
Yeah.
Jenna Fischer
Yeah. Well, as if you needed another reason to love Wende, I would also like to share that in 2009, 2010, and 2011, she rang in the new year, performing at military bases in Iraq and Kuwait. And she went to the smaller bases that a lot of people didn't go to that kind of rarely get entertainment.
Angela Kinsey
Love that.
Jenna Fischer
Love you, Wendy.
Angela Kinsey
Thank you so much. It was so great to reconnect with you.
Jenna Fischer
Thanks for sharing your memories of the
Angela Kinsey
office you guys, you can find Wendy in so many places. She's so talented. She has a podcast called Generation Ripe. It is for teenagers over 40. It's described as a Generation Ripe. Listener is someone who thinks of their age as an asset, not a liability. We are older people with young souls. Are younger people with old souls. Of course. She's on the Goldbergs. They're about to start season nine. She's on a Marvel series on Hulu called Modak. And just tons of other things, you guys. And you can find her on instagram @Wendy McClendon Covey.
Jenna Fischer
Yes. Let's see. Where should we go? It's the next day.
Angela Kinsey
Oh, people are hungover.
Jenna Fischer
Very hungover. Andy does not remember calling Angela.
Angela Kinsey
I know.
Jenna Fischer
Oh, no.
Angela Kinsey
Oh.
Jenna Fischer
Michael is very melancholy.
Angela Kinsey
Yeah.
Jenna Fischer
And he has to go sell paper at Catalyst Paper, which I looked it up.
Angela Kinsey
Yeah.
Jenna Fischer
It's a real Canadian paper company. But it looks like its headquarters is based in Richmond, British Columbia, which is over on the west coast. I could not find a Winnipeg branch.
Angela Kinsey
I mean, if you couldn't, I doubt it's there.
Jenna Fischer
David Wallace calls to congratulate Michael because he did it. He got the sale. Michael is mad.
Angela Kinsey
Yeah. Because he's realized that this trip was a band aid to try to help his feelings about Holly being transferred.
Jenna Fischer
He's upset and he tells him off.
Angela Kinsey
Yeah.
Jenna Fischer
I have a location breakdown.
Angela Kinsey
Why do you say it like that?
Jenna Fischer
I don't know.
Angela Kinsey
You said it like sad sack. You said it like this. I have a location breakdown.
Jenna Fischer
Well, I'm sad with Michael.
Angela Kinsey
Aw.
Jenna Fischer
Yeah. For the Winnipeg airport, for these scenes, we used terminal number two at lax. Randy let me know that there was an area that was out of service at that time and that our location manager, Kyle Alexander, was able to get an agreement from the LAX airport to let us film there.
Angela Kinsey
That's, like, unheard of. Well, LAX does not let you film like they are hardcore.
Jenna Fischer
Well, especially after 9 11, they had incredibly strict airport security, so we were only allowed a very small number of cast and crew and extras. Everybody had to submit credentials very far in advance and they had to be screened. Yeah. So he said they had to create what they called a micro unit. That's how small it was. He said that the airplanes outside the window were not Air Canada planes. They had to paint over the logos using visual effects during post production. And so they put the red maple leaf on the tail of one of the planes. We could only afford to do one plane. If you look over Michael's shoulder, it's on the left.
Angela Kinsey
Yeah. I saw it.
Jenna Fischer
Well, before we get to this big business with Jim and Pam, we should probably let you know that Kelly is gonna break up with Darryl.
Angela Kinsey
I mean, Ryan has a text ready to go. They just have to hit send together. And I think, what does Ryan want? Does he want Daryl to come upstairs and make a scene? What does Ryan want? He wants to be the other guy.
Jenna Fischer
Yeah. He wants a reaction out of Daryl. Daryl seems relieved. He's whistling as he walks to his car.
Angela Kinsey
He responds immediately, okay, cool. And then literally is like, doing a dance to his pickup truck.
Jenna Fischer
Yeah.
Angela Kinsey
He's like, whoo. Thank you, Ryan.
Jenna Fischer
And that then, of course, immediately makes Ryan less interested in this relationship.
Angela Kinsey
And here we go. And we're back.
Jenna Fischer
Here we go. All right. Jim is going to leave.
Angela Kinsey
And again, you guys have this Jim and Pam scene. At that golden hour, your hair is sparkling with sunshine. It's like that sunset scene in the parking lot. You couldn't look cuter.
Jenna Fischer
I know.
Angela Kinsey
I thought this scene was really sweet.
Jenna Fischer
Yeah. Pam is standing in the parking lot, and Jim says, what are you doing here? Because he had told her on the phone, when you come back, you're going to come back the right way.
Angela Kinsey
Right. And he's supportive. If she wants to take the class again, they'll get through it.
Jenna Fischer
Yes. That the right way to come back is for her to come back having graduated from art school. So Pam's standing there and she says, I'm coming back the wrong way.
Angela Kinsey
But she's okay with it. She's happy about it. She missed Scranton. She missed Jim. She actually hated the graphic design school.
Jenna Fischer
Yeah. She tells Jim, this isn't really what I wanted to do, but she had
Angela Kinsey
to go to find that out.
Jenna Fischer
She did. You know, we had a question from Evan L. Why did the writers have Pam fail art school?
Angela Kinsey
Well, that's a good question, Evan.
Jenna Fischer
I asked Brent Forrester about it. He said that the story of Pam failing art school and coming back, quote, the wrong way was a pitch from Jen Salata. Brent said, I have a daughter. And he said, I'm a big fat feminist. That's a quote. And the idea that Pam would give up on her dreams to be with a man really rubbed him the wrong way. But that Gen Salata absolutely insisted that the romantic power of this gesture outweighed any politics. And also that the truth for Pam was not that she was giving up on her dreams for Jim, but that she was distinguishing what her real dreams were. And I really liked that, because I think what Pam did here in going to Graphic Design school was that she was taking her real dream of being a creative artist, and she was doing what a lot of artists, and she was trying to find a practical application.
Angela Kinsey
Right. How can I sort of do art but make a living?
Jenna Fischer
Yeah, right. Yes, exactly. But, you know, I mean, people go into graphic design when they're passionate about graphic design. It's not some backup job. Right. And the truth is, is that Pam discovered she does not have a passion for graphic design. And that's sort of what I had in my head when I was doing that scene on the phone with Jim. And Pam's crying. Pam is realizing that even if she did pass the course, this isn't for her. But she's also embarrassed that she failed. But what she definitely does not want to do is spend 12 more weeks studying something she doesn't love.
Angela Kinsey
For me, in that moment, I just saw Pam stating her truth, and I always think that's so powerful.
Jenna Fischer
Yeah.
Angela Kinsey
There is a very sweet deleted scene, you guys, with Jim and Pam. It's in the break room. And you know what? I'm titling it.
Jenna Fischer
What?
Angela Kinsey
Love in the break room.
Jenna Fischer
What is it?
Angela Kinsey
Pam is showing Jim her art assignment. She has this portfolio, and she's showing him the piece that she got an F on.
Jenna Fischer
Oh, I remember shooting this now.
Angela Kinsey
Yes, yes.
Jenna Fischer
Oh, I remember it.
Angela Kinsey
It's really sweet. And as he goes through her art assignments, in the back, tucked in the binder, is a sketchpad. And he's like, what is this? And she said, oh, you know, just sketches of things I would see in New York. And when you look at them, Jenna. And I'll put it in stories. It's like people sitting at a cafe, things she might have seen on her walk. And they're really good. And this is such a wonderful moment. I wish it had stayed in. Sam, can you play the clip?
Jenna Fischer
This is my project.
Rich Sommer
Before we start, how did you fail?
Jenna Fischer
You're good at art. See? Yeah. We had to make a logo for a coffee company. Well, that's nice. This is the one that got an A. The teacher handed it out. And this is mine. That's cool. I couldn't get it to print out right, So I got an F. I
Rich Sommer
would have given you a D. That's only because you were sleeping with the professor. These are cool.
Jenna Fischer
What's this? That's my school sketchbook. It's just, you know, stuff I saw in New York. People on the subway. Whoa. This is great.
Rich Sommer
So much different than your other work. Wow, Pam, that is awesome.
Jenna Fischer
Yeah.
Rich Sommer
Yeah.
Jenna Fischer
Oh, I wish that had stayed in.
Angela Kinsey
It's a really sweet scene and I feel like it just shows what Pam did get out of New York and I really wish it had been in the episode.
Jenna Fischer
I agree. Because I don't think Pam. Pam's art story is over yet. You know, she did not have the benefit of, I think, parents or role models who encouraged her to follow this piece of herself. And she only finally does now have that person in Jim. So she's gonna have to take her art journey at the same time as her romantic journey.
Angela Kinsey
Well, I'm going to put that scene in stories because it's really sweet.
Jenna Fischer
I loved it.
Angela Kinsey
I did too.
Jenna Fischer
Well, that kind of wraps up this episode. Yeah. Thank you to everyone who helped us make this episode. Brent Forrester, Randy Cordray, Wendy McClendon, Covey and Rich Sommer. Thanks for coming on for an interview. It takes a village.
Angela Kinsey
It does. And thank you to you guys for sending in awesome questions and Winnipeg trivia. Yes, some last parting advice. According to Andy, Long island iced teas are way stronger in Canada. So be careful the next time you order one of those.
Jenna Fischer
Yes.
Angela Kinsey
All right, you guys. Well, that was business trip and we will be seeing you next week.
Jenna Fischer
Yeah. See you next week. Thank you for listening to Office Lady's
Angela Kinsey
second drink this episode. This episode was initially created in collaboration with Earwolf.
Jenna Fischer
Office Ladies is a presentation of Odyssey and is produced by Jenna Fisher and Angela Kinsey. Our senior producer is Matt Beagle.
Angela Kinsey
Our second drinks episodes are produced by Molly Nugent.
Jenna Fischer
Our audio engineer is Sam Kiefer.
Angela Kinsey
Odyssey's executive producer is Leah Reese.
Jenna Fischer
Dennis. Office Ladies was mixed and mastered by Bill Schultz.
Angela Kinsey
Our theme song is Rubber Tree by Creed Bratton. So if you've got a few people to shop for this Mother's Day. I do. I have three sisters and my mom and my niece. And you want a great gift, but you also need to have a budget. Let me just tell you guys, Macy's has everything you need.
Jenna Fischer
They have got a whole lineup of gifts that are $50 and under. So whether you're shopping for a friend, your, your mother in law, anyone else you want to celebrate, you can mix and match meaningful gifts without watching your total skyrocket.
Angela Kinsey
And right now, Macy's bouquet of deals is happening with new deals dropping every day on really great giftable items from brands like Kitchenaid, Lancome, Lego Prada Hotel collection and more. It's so worth checking out.
Jenna Fischer
Lady. I love to check the website for the bouquet of deals, but also, do not skip Macy's backstage. It has all of these fun extra gifts that are all under $25. So whether you're shopping for one person or a whole list, Macy's makes it easy to keep it thoughtful and budget friendly. Shop now@macy's.com or in store.
Original Air Date: May 4, 2026
Podcast Hosts: Jenna Fischer, Angela Kinsey
Special Guests: Rich Sommer, Wendy McLendon-Covey
This lively “Second Drink” episode has Jenna Fischer and Angela Kinsey taking a deep-dive into “Business Trip” from The Office (S5E8). They unpack fresh stories about deleted scenes, share behind-the-scenes memories, and welcome Rich Sommer (a.k.a. Pam’s art school friend, Alex) for a candid interview about his short but memorable arc. They also include audio messages from Wendy McLendon-Covey (Concierge Marie), explore the Winnipeg setting, and reflect meaningfully on Pam’s art school storyline. As always, the episode is brimming with humor, warmth, and best-friend energy.
(12:14 – 34:30)
(38:02 – 41:03, 74:31 – 77:15)
(82:48 – 87:18)
Summary prepared to reflect all major topics, themes, quotes, and inside stories from the “Second Drink: Business Trip” episode.