Second Drink: Customer Survey with Stephen Merchant

Summary

Office Ladies — Second Drink: "Customer Survey" with Stephen Merchant

Podcast: Office Ladies
Hosts: Jenna Fischer & Angela Kinsey
Guest: Stephen Merchant
Date: April 27, 2026
Episode: Second Drink: Customer Survey

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Overview

In this special “Second Drink” episode, Jenna Fischer and Angela Kinsey revisit "Customer Survey," a fan-favorite season 5 episode of The Office, with exclusive insights from director and British Office co-creator Stephen Merchant. The episode is packed with behind-the-scenes stories about Merchant’s experience directing, the iconic “Butlicker” scene, deep Office lore, and fun observations that only true insiders (and a superfan audience) can fully appreciate.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Stephen Merchant Joins the Podcast

[02:14–17:00]

• Excitement and Context: Jenna and Angela are thrilled to host Stephen Merchant, co-creator of the UK Office and director of this memorable U.S. episode.
• Homage to Both Shows: Merchant appears on video wearing a Wernham Hogg cap (UK) and drinking from a Dunder Mifflin mug (US) as a nod to both series.

Memorable Quote:

"I am wearing my Wernham Hog baseball cap, which is the Dunder Mifflin of the UK, but I have my Dunder Mifflin mug... I'm just trying to pay homage to both sides of the Atlantic in both shows."
—Stephen Merchant [16:38]

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2. The Origin of Stephen and Ricky’s Collaboration

[17:05–22:12]

• How They Met: Merchant recounts interviewing for a job as Ricky Gervais’s assistant at a London radio station, which led to their creative partnership.
• Complementary Styles: Merchant was the structured, ambitious one; Gervais, the untapped comedic talent. Their partnership reflected the balance of spontaneity and structure.
• Working Relationship: Found common ground over humor, music, and culture, leading to the creation of the British Office.

Notable Exchange:

"He said, 'If you do all the work, I'll make sure you have fun.' And I, in need of a job, thought that sounds like a fair deal."
—Stephen Merchant [18:06]

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3. Office Set Histories: UK vs US

[11:26–14:41]

• Real Offices: Both versions of The Office were initially filmed in actual office spaces rather than soundstages, enhancing authenticity.
• Set Trivia: The British building (Slough’s Crossbow House) was torn down, but the U.S. exterior is still at Chandler Valley Studios in Van Nuys, CA.
• Cross-pollination: Dunder Mifflin's fictional address, 1725 Slough Avenue, is a tribute to the British series.

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4. Directing “Customer Survey”

[31:05–33:07]

• Why This Episode: Merchant explains he loved writers’ rooms in the U.S.—a far cry from the two-person writing process in the UK.
• Involvement: Arrived weeks early to absorb the American process and contribute to rewrites.
• Collaborative Energy: Found the writers’ room "buzzy" and appreciated the collaborative idea refinement.

Memorable Quote:

"You’re just with a lot of very talented, very smart people. Ideas are sort of pinging around and it's a very different experience to the British experience."
—Stephen Merchant [31:40]

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5. Behind the Iconic “Butlicker” Scene

[33:07–35:43]

• Inspiration: Based on Merchant’s own call center training days, where mock calls would spiral into absurdity.
• Room Contribution: Writers spun his anecdote into the now-legendary Jim-Michael-Dwight roleplay scene.
• Performance: Impressed by the extended, escalating bit with Carell, Krasinski, and Wilson.

Key Quote:

"There was a version we shot where either Steve or…I think it was Steve at the end just said, 'We got the Buttlicker account,' which I don't think we could ever squeeze into the finished cut."
—Stephen Merchant [35:23]

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6. The Rehearsal Process: UK vs US

[36:21–38:08]

• Emphasis on Realism: Merchant valued rehearsal for authenticity, a holdover from the British approach.
• US Cast “Well-Oiled Machine”: The cast was so comfortable with characters by season 5 that rehearsal wasn’t as essential, but it “grounded” everyone and renewed the show’s authentic mockumentary feel.

Angela’s Reflection:

"When we did rehearse with you, it grounded us back down and got us back into character...We’re here to do this really cool show that’s a mockumentary."
—Angela Kinsey [38:08]

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7. Alternate Endings for the Jim/Pam/Alex Plot

[39:42–44:50]

• Pam’s Art School Scene: Several script alternates had Alex (her New York friend) either profess unrequited love or simply champion her art dreams.
• Behind-the-Scenes Discomfort: Both Merchant and the actors found an explicit love confession artificial; the final edit went with the art-support version.
• Deleted Line: At one point, Jim (via Bluetooth) was to say, "Cough if you still love me"—a joke that didn’t make the cut.

Merchant’s Take:

"The idea that your parents might get a divorce…it makes me sad, the kind of threat to the relationship…So the idea, I don’t know, I was worried that it was a sort of artificial jeopardy."
—Stephen Merchant [42:07]

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8. Notable Directorial/Editing Tricks

[48:12–49:53]

• Merchant reveals a “whip pan” shot from Michael’s office to Jim at his desk was filmed on two separate days—a trick invisible in the final cut.
• The whip pan allowed for smooth editing despite cast availability challenges.

Quote:

"I was watching it again, I was suddenly reminded that those were shot on two different days...it looks like it’s happening in real time. Hopefully only me and the editor know that."
—Stephen Merchant [49:13]

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9. The Show’s Global Legacy

[26:07–29:33]

• International Adaptations: The Office has had versions in France, French Canada, Israel, India, and South America.
• Press Reactions: Initial skepticism in the UK turned into high praise for the U.S. show, to the point where even the British press now prefer the American version.

Quote:

"Now very much the American version is kind of the much loved version, even by the British press. And Ricky and I are seen as kind of, 'Oh, those guys.'"
—Stephen Merchant [29:05]

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10. A Tribute to Lester Lewis

[50:16–50:48]

• Merchant honors Lester Lewis, writer of the episode, who passed away a few years later, recalling him as a “lovely man” and associating this episode with bittersweet memories.

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11. The Episode Breakdown: Jokes, Trivia, and Office Lore

[58:57–61:17, 61:18–88:44]

• Cold Open: Michael’s hilarious, increasingly absurd fake proposal story (deleted scene expanded). His “Mom” is voiced by Oscar-nominated actress June Squibb.
  [61:17]
• Customer Surveys: Kelly sabotages Jim and Dwight’s survey reviews in revenge for them missing her “America’s Got Talent” viewing party, revealed via the party favor mugs she had custom made.
• Bluetooth Plot: Jim and Pam use fictitious wireless earpieces to stay connected. These "Mitsuwashi B400" earpieces did not exist; the scenes were technically tricky to film, and the entire Bluetooth storyline was a BJ Novak idea.
• Andy/Angela/Dwight Wedding Farce: Andy wants a two-story tent for the wedding, Angela fixates on it being “hand-plowed” field after a tongue-tied struggle with the scripted line (backed up by Lester Lewis’s on-set support).
• Iconic Line Alert: “All righty, Dwighty!” is set to become Angela’s new personal catchphrase.
• Realism vs Comedy: Ongoing conversation about how character decisions (Jim’s secret house purchase, Pam’s art school arc) create real drama, frustration, and humor.
• Directorial Details: Steve Zissis (later of Togetherness) provides a voice cameo; background actors’ mugs, deleted improv, and writers’ clever plotting are highlighted.
• Running Gags: Angela brings in her actual star mug; “The bear is the book” is used as a motivational mantra referencing The Edge.

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12. Stephen Merchant’s New Project

[52:30–54:18]

• Merchant discusses his current work, The Offenders, a BBC/Amazon Prime dark comedy drama about people in community service, sharing “DNA with The Office” in its ensemble misfit dynamic.
• Jenna also plugs Merchant’s 2019 film Fighting With My Family.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• "We got the buttlicker account." [35:23 – On unused alternate lines]
• “You don’t have to do much to convey emotion… Jim knows, that’s that dude thing: ‘Oh, he’s into you.’" — Angela, on the Alex/Pam scene [45:31]
• “All righty, Dwighty!” — Angela's proposed new catchphrase [66:40]
• “Can you say hand, until, field, hand, until…” — Angela’s tongue-twister meltdown [75:46]
• “The bear is the book. The bear is whatever you need to conquer in the day!” — Jenna [72:35]

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Fan Questions & Deep Dives

• Background Gags: Eagle-eyed fans spot Rainn Wilson nearly breaking during the “Butlicker” scene ([03:52], [04:21]), and inconsistencies in Michael’s CPR knowledge pointing to episode production order.
• Props and Production: Many props (like the mugs) used real or repurposed publicity photos; star actors like June Squibb and Steve Zissis played even the smallest parts.
• Deleted/Alternate Scenes: Multiple alternates were shot for Pam’s art school “temptation,” and for the “Butlicker” roleplay scene.
• Show “Blips”: Sharp listeners (ex: Dylan Q. on CPR) catch minor continuity errors; Jenna and Angela celebrate such attention to detail from superfans.

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Timestamps — Segment Highlights

| Segment | Timestamp (MM:SS) | |-----------------------------------------------|-----------------------------| | Opening: Intro and Stephen Merchant Arrives | 02:14–17:00 | | Origin Story: Merchant & Gervais Meet | 17:05–22:12 | | Set & Series Trivia: UK and US Offices | 11:26–14:41 | | Directing “Customer Survey” | 31:05–33:07 | | “Butlicker” Scene Genesis | 33:07–35:43 | | The Rehearsal/Realism Approach | 36:21–38:08 | | Jim/Pam/Alex Final Showdown & Alts | 39:42–44:50 | | Global Office Adaptations | 26:07–29:33 | | Directorial Editing Tricks (“Whip Pan”) | 48:12–49:53 | | Tributes: Lester Lewis | 50:16–50:48 | | Main Episode Breakdown | 58:57–88:44 | | Stephen Merchant’s New Project | 52:30–54:18 |

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Closing Thoughts

• Jenna and Angela express deep gratitude to Merchant for his foundational role in The Office’s existence and evolution, both as a show and a global phenomenon.
• The episode closes with teases for next week (“Business Trip”), hints at future guest appearances, and Jenna and Angela’s signature blend of humor, nostalgia, and heart.

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Summary

This episode is a must-listen for Office fans interested in the intersection of British and American comedy, the inner workings of sitcom production, and the creative minds that shaped an international sensation. It’s warm, funny, revealing, and full of moments that deepen fans’ appreciation for the show's legacy—and for the friendships behind it.

Transcript

[Jenna Fischer]

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[Angela Kinsey]

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[Jenna Fischer]

They have these wipes and these like to go pouches and they're great for travel because you can use them to soothe sunburn. You can use them for bug bites. Like if you throw those in your bag and you're at the park and you're just like sticky and itchy. This is what we're talking about. These things are great. You can find them. Shop on tndickinson's.com.

[Angela Kinsey]

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[Jenna Fischer]

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[Angela Kinsey]

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[Jenna Fischer]

So the next time you've got an idea and you need to make it real, think Canva. Canva, the thing that makes anything a thing.

[Angela Kinsey]

Start designing [e-mail] welcome to our second drink of customer survey. And not to toot our own horn, but here I go. Toot, toot, toot, toot. This is a fantastic episode, lady.

[Jenna Fischer]

It is. It really actually is. Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

Stephen Merchant joins us on the podcast. It's such a fun interview. He shares how we met Ricky Gervais and then how he they came to co create the UK version of the Office and then we, of course, ask him all about directing this hilarious episode, and he shares the inspiration for that amazing buttlicker scene.

[Jenna Fischer]

And when we asked you all what your favorite scene was from this episode, so many of you wrote in to say that it was the buttlicker scene. For example, Miranda D. From Australia said, ladies, my favorite moment from this episode is the bit where Dwight, Michael, and Jim are in the conference room doing the mock phone call. It is so hilarious seeing Michael and Dwight get so lost in the bit, especially because Michael is showing his love of improv.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes. And Rena E. From Los Angeles says, office, ladies, I have been a listener since the beginning, and I love everything about the show. Thank you, Rena. And she goes on to say, I finally decided to go back to the first drinks. Is that a thing of the show? So I could submit all the questions I'm always thinking of when I listen. I have been waiting for this episode to get to second drink so I could tell you this. My husband and I find the line butt liquor. Our prices have never been lower. So funny. So you know how sometimes a dog will just decide to lick their butt at the most inappropriate time? Every time our dog does this, we say to him, rusty, have your price has never been lower. Very confusing to anyone who doesn't get the reference, but hilarious to us every time. Love, love, love the podcast and your incredible camaraderie with one another.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, Rebecca L. From Maryland wrote in to say that, first of all, Rebecca also loved the scene. But Rebecca has a background catch. Rebecca said, ladies, did you catch Rain almost breaking in this scene? I can see him start to laugh at 8 minutes, 44 seconds in the original version. It is right after he has to yell that the prices have never been lower. Lady, I went and rewatched it and I totally saw it.

[Angela Kinsey]

Rain is so clearly about to laugh and he's trying to hide his smile. He sort of covers his mouth by, like, leaning onto his fist on the table.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. He's doing the Mindy. That's the Mindy move.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, everyone, we pulled a clip of the moment where Rain almost breaks. We didn't play this in our first breakdown, and it's just so hilarious, we thought we should hear it.

[Stephen Merchant]

Hello? Hello, this is Dwight Schrute from the Dunder Mifflin Paper Company. Well, that's great, because I need paper. Excellent.

[Angela Kinsey]

Then you are in luck because we

[Stephen Merchant]

are having a limited time offer only on everything. Wow, this is my lucky day. Ask him his name. What is your name, sir? I am Bill Butlicker. Really?

[Jenna Fischer]

That's your real name?

[Stephen Merchant]

How dare you? My family built this country, by the way. Be respectful, Dwight, please.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes, Michael.

[Stephen Merchant]

Would you hold on one second?

[Jenna Fischer]

That's my other line. What?

[Stephen Merchant]

No, but I. Hello? Yeah, no, I'm just on the phone with this stupid salesman. He's so dumb. Probably just gonna keep him on the line forever and not buy anything.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay, it's up to you to change his mind.

[Stephen Merchant]

Sorry, that was a family emergency. Oh, no.

[Jenna Fischer]

What's wrong?

[Stephen Merchant]

You know what? That's private. Boundaries.

[Jenna Fischer]

Twice.

[Angela Kinsey]

Come on.

[Stephen Merchant]

I'm sorry, Mr. Buttlicker. As I was saying, we're having a limited.

[Jenna Fischer]

A little bit louder.

[Stephen Merchant]

I'm hard of hearing.

[Angela Kinsey]

He's hard if he's an old man.

[Stephen Merchant]

Okay, as I was saying, right now

[Jenna Fischer]

we are talking louder, okay?

[Stephen Merchant]

Our prices have never been lower. Son, you have to talk louder. Never been lower. Louder, son. Buttnacker. Our prices have never been lowered.

[Jenna Fischer]

Stop.

[Stephen Merchant]

Pete, that is totally inappropriate.

[Angela Kinsey]

You should never yell at the client.

[Stephen Merchant]

You're right. Now you listen to me, sir.

[Angela Kinsey]

It's so good.

[Jenna Fischer]

So good.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, Rebecca, we love that background catch and the journey it took us on. And I have another background catch, but this one is actually from the Cold Open scene. You know, when everyone gathers around to ask Michael how he proposed to Holly. And then Michael spins this crazy yarn. Yes, we actually played the clip in our breakdown because it's so funny. But Dylan Q. From Annapolis, Maryland, pointed out something really interesting. Quote, in the Cold Open, Michael says that he gave his girlfriend the Heimlich maneuver because he's CPR trained. But a few episodes later, the whole office receives CPR training, and Michael clearly has no idea how this training works. Was this because Customer survey was supposed to come after stress relief, or do you ladies think it was just a mistake? I've been listening since day one. Your breakdowns used to make me feel like I was watching the Office while I was at work.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, first of all, Dylan, this is a very, very good catch. Like a plus catch. Yeah, I went back, I looked at the dates on our shooting drafts for both Customer survey and stress relief. For Customer survey, it was September 10th. For stress relief, it was December 17th. So the answer is no. Stress relief was never going to come out before Customer survey.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah, I think it was just a blip. You know, they just missed it.

[Jenna Fischer]

They missed it. But Dylan didn't miss it. Dylan's paying attention.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, thanks, you guys so much for writing in. We really love this episode, and we think you will, too. So here's our breakdown of Customer Survey with Stephen Merchant.

[Jenna Fischer]

I'm Jenna Fisher.

[Angela Kinsey]

And I'm Angela Kinsey.

[Jenna Fischer]

We were on the Office together and we're best friends. And now we're doing the ultimate Office Rewatch podcast just for you.

[Angela Kinsey]

Each week we will break down an episode of the Office and give exclusive behind the scenes stories that only two people who were there can tell you.

[Jenna Fischer]

We're the Office Ladies.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh boy.

[Jenna Fischer]

This is a good episode of Office Ladies today.

[Angela Kinsey]

I'm so excited for you guys to hear it. I'm excited to listen to it.

[Jenna Fischer]

I'm going to listen to it over and over and over again.

[Angela Kinsey]

We're listening to ourselves right now.

[Jenna Fischer]

Today we're going to be talking about Customer Survey. It is season five, episode seven. It was written by Lester Lewis and directed by Stephen Merchant.

[Angela Kinsey]

The Stephen Merchant. Come on, you guys listening? You know who Stephen Merchant is?

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. Creator of the British Office. Come on, we got to talk to him. You guys. I was supposed to wait until fast fact two, but I can't wait. I can't wait.

[Angela Kinsey]

We tried really hard to keep it together.

[Jenna Fischer]

We couldn't do it.

[Angela Kinsey]

We couldn't do it.

[Jenna Fischer]

All right, we'll still go through the motions. Summary. Jim and Dwight received poor customer surveys and they joined forces to uncover why. Were they really bad? Is something going on?

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah, a little bit of a whodunit.

[Jenna Fischer]

Whodunnit. Meanwhile, Pam and Jim communicate all day long via teeny tiny bluetooth earpieces. And Andy and Angela make some wedding plan decisions.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, yes, they do. They get the best tin test in all the land.

[Jenna Fischer]

They do. I loved that so much. We got them. We got them.

[Angela Kinsey]

We got them.

[Jenna Fischer]

Alright, fast fact number one. We shot this episode the week of September 8, 2008. It was our 79th episode overall and I got curious, like, how many episodes of Office Ladies have we done?

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh my gosh, how many have we done?

[Jenna Fischer]

This is our 83rd.

[Angela Kinsey]

You're kidding.

[Jenna Fischer]

That's bonkers, right? Wow, we're like zeroing in on the big 100 in both cases.

[Angela Kinsey]

Can we have a party?

[Jenna Fischer]

I think we can.

[Angela Kinsey]

Sam, can we have a party?

[Stephen Merchant]

We sure can.

[Angela Kinsey]

Thank you. You can be head of the PPC for Office Ladies.

[Stephen Merchant]

This has become a task for me.

[Angela Kinsey]

I mean, you got the coolest Christmas tree this year. Come on.

[Stephen Merchant]

That is very true.

[Angela Kinsey]

You're head of the ppc.

[Jenna Fischer]

You had to ask Sam if we could have a party because he's like the one person who's gonna come. We don't have very many people that work on Office Ladies. If Sam's not down. Then we don't have much of a party.

[Angela Kinsey]

Pretty much. It's Sam and Cassie. Cody, will you stop by? Maybe. Colin?

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah, we gotta get Iliana in.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, and Marissa. Yeah, those are our peeps. And we still need to have Take youe Kid to Work Day because my kids really want to come in the studio.

[Jenna Fischer]

We were just talking about it on the drive to school today, about how they want to come because summer break.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, let's get them in here.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay. Wait, this is a big episode. We'll chitty chat later.

[Jenna Fischer]

All right, we'll figure that out later. Fast. Fact number two. Stephen Merchant directed this episode. So he and Ricky Gervais created the British Office. It ran on BBC2 for two seasons. They were six episodes each. And then they did a two part Christmas special. They wrote and directed all of the episodes themselves.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes. They would sit together with a Dictaphone. Right. And they would talk out scenes and then transcribe them. They wrote the whole series, just the two of them.

[Jenna Fischer]

And then they let us make an American version. And then Stephen directed this episode and then he agreed to come on our podcast.

[Angela Kinsey]

Ladies.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, my goodness. I mean, wow. To prep us before we listen to the interview, I thought we should go over a few facts about the British office and the American office.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, I like it.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay, so the British office was set at a paper company called Wernham Hogg, and it was located in Slough. The building that they used for the exterior of their show, it was located on Slough Trading Estate, and it was called the Crossbow House. But they tore it down in 2013.

[Angela Kinsey]

Aww.

[Jenna Fischer]

So you can't visit it when we

[Angela Kinsey]

do our England tour of Office locations.

[Jenna Fischer]

We're not going to be able to see that one.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, we might just have to go to the spot. Yeah, we'll point to the spot.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay. It'll be a great photo.

[Angela Kinsey]

You know what? I'll put it in our scrapbook.

[Jenna Fischer]

Dunder Mifflin, on the other hand, was located in Scranton. And the exterior of our building was and still is located at Chandler Valley Studios on Saddoquoia street in Van Nuys, California. You can take a picture with that one.

[Angela Kinsey]

You can.

[Jenna Fischer]

But as a nod to the British series, the address of Dunder Mifflin is listed as 1725 Slough Avenue.

[Angela Kinsey]

I know. I always love that.

[Jenna Fischer]

It's so sweet.

[Angela Kinsey]

So sweet. It's even on, like, the fakey business cards.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, yeah, yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

Like Michael Scott had business cards. I might have taken one. I might have stolen one. It has that address.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, we will talk more about these two companies when we speak with Steven.

[Angela Kinsey]

Should we get to it?

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, I have one more fast fact.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, my Lord.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay, let's do it. I know, I know.

[Angela Kinsey]

I'm so excited.

[Jenna Fischer]

Fast fact number three. This episode was written by Lester Lewis.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, yes.

[Jenna Fischer]

And I found an interview with Lester where he talked a little bit about what it was like knowing that an episode he had written was gonna be directed by Stephen Merchant.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, I love it. Can I hear it?

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. So he said that the story for this episode was already in place before Steven was attached to direct. So as he was writing it, luckily, he had no idea that, like, one of them. Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

I wouldn't want that in my head. I would just want to, like, write what I was going to write without any pressure.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. But then he was so nervous when he found out because, you know, the writer gets to walk around with the director for the whole week.

[Angela Kinsey]

They're together the whole time.

[Jenna Fischer]

It's like a very close relationship.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

I mean, I would be pooping my pants.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah, a little bit.

[Jenna Fischer]

But he said any nervousness that he felt totally disappeared when he met Stephen and that Stephen participated in the final rewrites of the script. He wished that Stephen Merchant could be with us for every single episode.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, that's so sweet.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, I couldn't agree more with that.

[Angela Kinsey]

I know, I know.

[Jenna Fischer]

His energy is just fantastic.

[Angela Kinsey]

So smart, so funny, and so kind.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, Jenna, later, when we break down the episode, I have a little story I want to share about Lester because he rescued me in a scene. Oh, he really did. But now we're going to take a break, and when we come back, Stephen Merchant. Merchant.

[Jenna Fischer]

I can't believe it.

[Angela Kinsey]

I can't believe that. So if you work in healthcare, you probably already know this, but in case you don't, you. It's Nurses Week this week, and it's kind of a big deal. It's a time to celebrate the people who play such a big hand in keeping us healthy while also managing to be your favorite person in the room.

[Jenna Fischer]

They're funny, knowledgeable, kind, compassionate. Nurses are just the best. And to celebrate, figs just dropped. New limited edition colors and styles that are seriously so cute.

[Angela Kinsey]

But there's even more good News. Everything is 20% off during nurses Week. From scrubs to outerwear to footwear and beyond, Figs is the healthcare apparel brand.

[Jenna Fischer]

They truly get what healthcare professionals need to look sharp, feel good, and take on just about anything.

[Angela Kinsey]

So if you're in healthcare or you Know someone who is. Don't miss out on 20% off for Nurses Week happening May 6 through May 12.

[Jenna Fischer]

Go to WearFigs.com that's 20% off during Nurses Week at WearFigs.com having the right

[Angela Kinsey]

people in your corner, it just makes

[Jenna Fischer]

all the difference, lady. Having you in my corner.

[Stephen Merchant]

Aw.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, right back at you. Well, we are working with State Farm and one of the things I like about State Farm is knowing that you have that support. Because like a good neighbor, State Farm is there. Whether you need coverage for your car or your home, you can choose the right amount of coverage for you.

[Jenna Fischer]

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[Angela Kinsey]

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[Jenna Fischer]

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[Angela Kinsey]

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[Jenna Fischer]

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[Jenna Fischer]

Steven. Hello.

[Stephen Merchant]

Hi. Well, I should. I feel like I should say hello, office ladies.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, hi.

[Jenna Fischer]

Thank you.

[Angela Kinsey]

I love that.

[Stephen Merchant]

I don't know if you've noticed, in honour of both the British and the UK versions of the Office, I am wearing my Wernham Hog baseball cap, which is the Dunder Mifflin of the uk, But I have my Dunder Mifflin mug, which I believe was a crew gift for my cup of tea. So, you know, I'm just trying to pay homage to both sides of the Atlantic in both shows.

[Jenna Fischer]

You're awesome. You are so awesome.

[Angela Kinsey]

We love that so much.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, let's see. To kick things off, I thought that. And I'm sure you've been asked this a million times, Steven, about meeting Ricky for the first time, but the reason I bring it up is because you mentioned Angela and I, we're rocking a duo. You're part of this duo with Ricky, but there are these people who when we meet them, they just change the course of our lives. I think back to, you know, Lennon meets McCartney. Right? Like, what is that?

[Stephen Merchant]

Wow. I'm already an amazing company. This is exciting.

[Angela Kinsey]

Jenna, as you said that, I'M like, I'm sorry. I'm sorry.

[Jenna Fischer]

Wow.

[Angela Kinsey]

When we sat next to each other in the basketball episode, I didn't realize the impact I was gonna have.

[Jenna Fischer]

That was our Lennon McCartney moment.

[Angela Kinsey]

Angela. Oh, wow.

[Jenna Fischer]

So, Steven, I know that you went in to interview for a job to be Ricky's assistant at a radio station. You walk in the door, you meet this man. Did you feel it?

[Angela Kinsey]

Was there a spark?

[Jenna Fischer]

Was there a shift in the universe?

[Stephen Merchant]

Well, it was interesting because, as you say, I did indeed go into a building to meet him. But he very quickly said, let's go to the pub for a pint of beer.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, my God. Oh, my God.

[Stephen Merchant]

There aren't many bosses that do that. He was hiring me for the job, so I was immediately charmed by that. I thought that sort of seemed like the right approach. And we went down the road and had a pint and we got chatting and we seemed to have a lot of sort of common loves of things like music and comedy and stuff. So we hit it off in that regard. But then he said something to me which I think was revealing. He said, listen, I. This was a radio station where we were both going to work. And he said, listen, I don't know anything about radio. I've sweet talked my way into this job. I don't know what I'm doing. And you seem to have had a little radio experience. If you do all the work, I'll make sure you have fun. And I, in need of a job, thought, that sounds like a fair deal. And so I joined the station with Ricky as essentially my boss. And true to his word, he did not know what he was doing. But we managed to find a sort of working relationship. And after a little while, we were behind the scenes guys. But after a little while, they realized that our better asset was being on the radio. And once we went on the radio and we started talking and being. And being kind of presenters, kind of like you guys, that was where, I think, where it all started to make more sense. And I think that was where our, if you like, our sense of humor and our relationship with each other and our rapport. I think that's where it really began to develop sort of on the radio. And then from then it was sort of, you know, it was plain sailing, really, you know, and we just. And so much of what we are experiencing, so much of sort of getting to know someone that you end up working with in that way is, I think, just as I'm sure you guys discovered, it's just finding all the Things you have in common and I suppose the things you don't like, you know, and sort of deciding that these are the movies we like, these are the comedy we like, this is what we don't. And I think that so much of the initial sort of partnering was that, was finding that stuff, that common ground.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh man, that is such a great story.

[Jenna Fischer]

And also I feel like something Angela and I have discovered in working together is like our strengths and weaknesses and how they. And our differences in our work. We both have strong work ethics, but we work differently. What do you think were some of those things that made you and Ricky a good duo?

[Stephen Merchant]

Well, I think I was a little younger than Ricky and so I had a sort of youthful ambition and a kind of get up and go sort of dynamism. I mean, at the time we were working at this radio show and then I would go off and do stand up comedy in the evenings and things, whereas Ricky would sort of be home eating cheese with his girlfriend by sort of, you know, 6:00pm And I think, you know, he was older and he'd sort of settled into a certain groove. And I think I had this kind of eagerness to sort of make my stamp on the world and I think. But at the same time, I think what Ricky had was just a sort of untapped, kind of explosive brilliance that was just sort of waiting to be, to be sort of mined, you know. And I think I had this slightly more kind of structured, slightly more rigid approach to things. And I think it was his sort of, his wild spontaneity and my kind of slightly more, you know, by the book approach. I think kind of bringing those two things together sort of worked well, you know, and I was able to kind of chaperone him through some of the more boring bits of writing, if you like, the working of the plots and all those sort of things. Whereas. But at the same time, he had a kind of. He was just sort of smart, he was just wise about people and about, you know, he was just older. And so there was a big brother quality to him that he could bring to it as well. So it was just a really interesting dynamic. We sort of supported each other and we kind of, I think, sparked each other's creativity in different ways. It was just a very exhilarating sort of time in both our lives, I think.

[Angela Kinsey]

Steven, you're my Jenna. You're my Jenna.

[Stephen Merchant]

Well, there you go.

[Jenna Fischer]

That's what I was gonna say. I'm you, Steven. I'm the structure and the tasks and the. And Angela's the ba boom boom.

[Angela Kinsey]

I'm like, let's go grab a pint. Let's bounce some ideas off.

[Jenna Fischer]

And I'm like, I'll get a pint with you, but I'm bringing a notebook.

[Stephen Merchant]

Yeah, right, exactly. Yeah, exactly.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, I remember meeting you for the first time when you came to the set of the Office. Early, Early Jenna.

[Angela Kinsey]

Where was that? Where did you guys meet? Was it the original Culver City set?

[Jenna Fischer]

Wasn't it, Steven, do you remember?

[Stephen Merchant]

I definitely think it was a season one.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. And we weren't on those sound stages yet. Right.

[Angela Kinsey]

We were in an actual thing.

[Stephen Merchant]

That's right. It was a real office above a real factory. Is that right? Or a real warehouse.

[Jenna Fischer]

Above a real warehouse, yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

And didn't you guys. Stephen, when you filmed the BBC version, weren't you in an actual office building as well? Weren't they like people working on the other side of the wall?

[Stephen Merchant]

That's very. That's absolutely true. Although, bizarrely, we were within a studio complex, a small British TV studio, but we were not in the studio. We were in an actual office in the studio complex. And yes, as you say, there were sort of who were kind of annoyed by the noise we were making and were trying to get on with a job of work and we were there kind of, you know, running around and making noise and doing funny dances and whatever else. So, yeah, so it was definitely very much a real office. And it had all of the pros and cons of that, I suppose that it was. It felt real and we wanted it to feel very lived in and we wanted it to. We always wanted our version of the Office to feel like a documentary that had sort of been made and then everyone forgot about it and it was just on a shelf somewhere at the BBC for like 10 years, and someone dusted it off and was like, put this on tv. So we wanted the whole thing to feel tired. The Office should feel tired. The people, the clothes. We always were very excited when the plants that we had on the set were slightly dying. We liked that idea. You know, it was the British. That British approach. You know, you reflect the weather by just making shows that are depressing. And that was what that office had. It had a slightly tired feel because it had been a real place. And it's somehow slightly harder to create that artificially. When you build a set, you know, you're always striving for that. So it had that nice, lived in quality, but obviously also restrictive to shoot in and a little bit difficult and, you know, not much Elbow room. And, you know, so it was pros and cons.

[Angela Kinsey]

Right. Our camera guys have talked about that. Where we filmed the original, you know, set in Culver City was an actual office, so no walls moved and you couldn't pop anything out. And that really just added to the authenticity. But that's where you guys met. You guys met for the pilot, maybe Jenna or the table read.

[Jenna Fischer]

I remember doing a reading for you guys. Gosh. I mean, and then I remember we ordered some food and had some lunch and just.

[Stephen Merchant]

Yes, but I think you were maybe shooting by then, weren't we? We were maybe shooting. I have a photo from that time which feels like you're on the set and everybody's kind of. I'm sure you're maybe working. And we were up and running by the time we actually visited. I felt like a lot of what we did initially was remote. I know that Greg Daniels came and visited us in England, and we sat with him for a couple of days and we sort of chewed the fat and tried to talk about how, you know, tried to give him a better insight into why we had chosen certain things for the British version and how they might translate to America and what the versions, what the equivalents would be in America. And it was fascinating to me because there were things which we assumed would be the same all over the world. For instance, the idea of an office, a group of people in office going to a pub quiz is quite a traditional idea. Here you'd go to a trivia night as a group, and that. I remember at the time, it felt like Greg. That wasn't as familiar to Greg, the idea of kind of the trivia night or the quiz night. And I guess maybe they are more common now, but I don't know that that was as. And it's interesting because when they did a version in France, it turns out that apparently on Friday night, at the end of the working day, on a Friday, the champagne comes out in an office.

[Angela Kinsey]

What?

[Stephen Merchant]

You know, where. I guess in France. I think champagne is just water in France, it's just everywhere. And I just thought it was fun, you know, just these interesting variations.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. How many different countries is the office in now?

[Stephen Merchant]

There was a French version. There was a French Canadian version. There was an Israeli version. There was, I believe, a. I think there might have been an Indian version.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, my gosh.

[Stephen Merchant]

And I think there's a South American version, but I forget where exactly in South America. But it was frustrating because they would send us copies of these, but of course, none of them had Subtitles. So it was just speaking in their local languages. And I have no idea whether it was good or bad.

[Angela Kinsey]

It's gotta just be so amazing, Stephen, when you take a moment and sit in that. That you went and grabbed a pint with this guy, and all these years later, this idea that the two of you had is everywhere. It's everywhere. It's gotta be just so.

[Stephen Merchant]

It's like COVID 19.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, no. Yeah.

[Stephen Merchant]

No, it's. No, I know what you mean, but I think. Yes, But I think also what's exciting about that, and I think, particularly when you guys began your version, was that, you know, we always were a fan of our show, but we could never watch it as an audience watches it. Cause we were too immersed in it. We were there, we'd written it, and we were just too involved and we couldn't get any distance from it. Whereas I remember when they would send the seasons of your show, the episodes of your show, I could watch it like a fan. It was like. I was like, I'm just enjoying it as a fan and not as a creator in the same way. You know what I mean? It's very, very pleasurable. It was like you get to design your ideal show and then go off and have talented people make it and send it to you. You know what I mean? It's like sort of a weird. Like an amazing. Kind of like you won a competition, you design a show, and then talented people make it for many, many years.

[Jenna Fischer]

One of my favorite experiences was after we filmed the pilot, I was in London, and you and Ricky grabbed drinks with me at. Is it called the Groucho Club?

[Stephen Merchant]

That's right. Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay. And that was just so exciting. But then I was on the tube and I picked up what was like your version of TV Guide. And I looked in there and there was an article about how America was going to ruin the Office. And there was a little picture of my face in a bubble comparing me to Lucy Davis. And there were bubbles of all our faces talking about how we specifically outlining how we were each going to ruin the show. Yeah, I saw that. I put it in a scrapbook.

[Stephen Merchant]

Let me tell you right now, Jenna, what really happened was Ricky and I had that manufactured specially placed on the tube, planted on the tube, in order to really make you buck up your ideas and do a good job. But it's funny you should say that, because I remember that when it was first being discussed, as you say, there were a lot of things about, oh, America gonna ruin the show. And then there Was when your show started airing in the uk, it was kind of, oh, it's not as good as the British version. And then over time, it's become, the American version is far superior to the British version. This is the British. This is the way we do things here. You know what I mean? We're like, we kind of build you up and then we knock you down. And so, yeah, now very much the American version is kind of the much loved version, even by the British press. And Ricky and I are seen as kind of, oh, those guys. We're tired of the. No, no, it's amazing. It's amazing. Maybe it'll come full circle.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, I remember meeting you guys on the new set when we moved, you know, way deep in the Valley, Chandler Valley Studios. And I'll never forget because you guys were coming for lunch and we were all super excited. And I think by now the supporting cast, we were actually. We had real contracts. So I think I was a little braver to, like, come up and say hi because maybe no one would fire me now because I was locked in. And you guys, we were going through the food line and the assistant director came up to me and said, angela, you're the first talking head up after lunch and Ricky and Steven will be here. And I just went like. I was like, oh, no, no. I just got the courage to say hi, please don't make me do a talking head in front of them. And Ricky said, oh, don't worry, I don't tisk too loudly. And he did his finger. And I was like, ahah. And then sort of broke into a cold sweat. But it was.

[Stephen Merchant]

I hope, though, that we. I hope ultimately, you know, I think we always ultimately tried to be supportive when we could. We were kind of aware that it was like there was this. I think just because we had British accents and we'd come from a long way away, it was like the queen had come to visit.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes.

[Stephen Merchant]

And we were aware of that and I think trying to kind of, you know, make sure people realized we weren't here to judge or be mean.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, no, you guys were great. We were just abuzz about having you guys on the set. And then when you came, I guess, you know, we're talking about customer survey this week. When you came to the set, I read that you were in the writers room for weeks before we actually shot.

[Stephen Merchant]

Yes, yes, absolutely.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. And we always ask people how they got their job on the Office. I think we know you started by creating, but how did you end up directing this particular episode? Do you remember?

[Stephen Merchant]

Well, I think whenever I had visited. Cause I used to kind of visit whenever I was in la, sometimes with Ricky and sometimes without. And I tried to come, you know, once a season and stop by. And I was always very. I just loved being in the writers room because you got to remember in the uk, you know, Ricky and I wrote the show together and it was just us and we didn't do a lot of episodes, but, you know, it felt like a lot of hard work and it was, you know, it was just the two of us in this sort of cold London, little tiny office. And Whereas when you come to an American writing room, you know, there's so many people and it's just a really buzzy, exciting atmosphere. You're just with a lot of very talented, very smart people. Ideas are sort of pinging around and it's a very different experience to the British experience. And I always loved that. I was just always a fan of being in that environment. And so I think there have been conversations with Greg about sort of directing an episode and it just never worked out schedule wise or I was always doing something with Ricky or I was doing something else in the uk and for whatever reason I had that little window of time. And I think. So I think in a sense that particular episode was the one that was up and when I could slot it in. But I had those few weeks ahead of it and I just wanted. I just thought, well, I really. I love being in the writing room. I love being in that. That sort of environment. Let me come over and just absorb that. And I'm sort of really glad I did because I felt like I was able to contribute to the script of that episode. And again, like I say, just. I just really had a blast just seeing how it worked and seeing the ideas you're bouncing around the room and seeing how one idea becomes another and how jokes are improved and like I say, not something I'd really experienced in the uk. So it was a learning curve for me as much as it was. As much as it was a job, if you like.

[Jenna Fischer]

And do you remember any pitches from the room? I know there's one scene, the Mr. Butlicker scene, right.

[Angela Kinsey]

That was loosely based off a situation you had at a job where you had to do the train up.

[Jenna Fischer]

Right?

[Stephen Merchant]

That's right. That's right. I was working at a call center, answering phones, and we had to have training for a week beforehand. And one of the things we had to do was one person went in one room and called another trainee and one was the customer and one was the person working at the call center. And I figured that in order to maximize this and kind of get the most out of it, I thought it would be useful to be sort of a challenging customer, a little bit difficult or ask difficult questions or go quiet sometimes, just because that's what I wanted to learn. Because it's figured, you know, you're never going to be able to just follow a script, that someone always is going to be kind of difficult. So I started playing difficult customers for the other trainee. So I would be a little angry or whatever it would be, and eventually the guy in charge of the training took me aside and said, I can't have you do this anymore because you're upsetting the other trainees with your characters and with your questions and with your attitude. And. Anyway, so I'd always been very amused by that idea that in the course of that sort of training, you'd get so into the role that you'd sort of. It would overtake the training. So I raised that as an idea, and it just seemed like a funny idea to have Jim kind of deliberately needling Dwight in that way. And some of the writers went off and kind of came back with that scene. And I really was so happy with that. I thought it was absolutely fantastic. I thought it was a really funny spin on that idea. I thought that when we shot it, I thought the three guys were just fantastic. I loved the fact that it was sort of longer than a lot of scenes are traditionally in the show, that we could just sit in that moment. And I think it's. In a way, it sort of escalates and. And I just. I thought everyone kind of knocked out the park. And I'm sure there was a version of that that we shot where either Steve or. I forget. I think it was Steve at the end just said, we got the butt licker account, which I don't think we could ever squeeze into the finished cut. But there was a lot of sort of fun little improvs around the edges. And, yeah, I just think when there's a sort of. When there's three great performers and a really funny idea like that sort of given free reign, it. It's so thrilling to be there as a director and watch it happen. And I just thought. I was so satisfied with that scene.

[Angela Kinsey]

It's so great. It's so great.

[Jenna Fischer]

It's so good.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, Jenna, do you remember. I remember, Stephen, when you were on set, we did rehearse scenes, and we had sort of been rehearsing for technical, for camera. But I felt like when you were there, we rehearsed really sort of the meat of the scene and walked through the scene and I loved it. I had a few scenes with Andy and I had that scene with Dwight, you know, where basically we're going to get married on Schrute Farms and I'm so happy and we're flirting and it's very weird, but we rehearsed, and I wish that we had done more of that. And was that part of your routine when you guys filmed in England? Were you rehearsing scenes before you shot them?

[Stephen Merchant]

We were. And I think also what I think I probably brought with me, which was perhaps a bit unnecessary, was I. I think I was still slightly hung up with this obsession with the kind of realism of what we tried to do. And not that your show wasn't realistic, but I think Ricky and I became very obsessed about realism and naturalism and what was real and what might happen and what might not happen. And I think actually it was a sort of unnecessary obsession because in the end, it's a TV show and, you know, it's just. You just do what's the funniest and smartest thing to do. And so I guess I was bringing with me this sort of. This. We must. We must get to the truth of it, you know, and it's kind of like, wait a minute, aren't they wearing tiny little Bluetooth headsets that don't exist? Like, why am I so hung up on the realism of this? You know? And so I think I was probably bringing an unnecessary obsession with that, which I transposed from our version. And it's funny because even when I look back at our version, it's not realistic. There's lots of completely absurd moments, but for whatever reason, we got that in our head. So I think probably I was bringing a bit of that to it. And I think what I hadn't anticipated is just that you guys were so in a groove by that point that you didn't need rehearsal, you didn't need directing. You know, you could do it just standing on your head. You knew the characters way better than me, and you were just. You could just slip in and out of it so kind of effortlessly that you just didn't need that. That sort of. That. That rehearsal or that kind of, you know, attention to detail, whatever it is, you know, you could just. I could have just left you to do it and come back after lunch, you know. So I think it was just like I say it was again. I think it's just slight naivety in a way about having not done, you know, American shows, particularly long running shows where at some point the cast are just so in sync with the show and the characters, they don't really need directing.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, I don't. I agree with you that we were sort of like we were a machine at this time, season five. But for me and Jenna and I and the cast have talked about this, when we did rehearse with you, it sort of grounded us back down and got us back into character. And not that we would step out of character. Cause we could, like you said, we could go right to Angela Martin. I know her. Right. But I don't know, for us as actors, we got really into it because it allowed us to, you know, like, not to sound too actory, but have the moment. That's the craft. Right. And feel like you're really part of a production and kind of remind ourselves, oh yeah, we're here to, to do this really cool show that's a mockumentary. And I don't know, I geeked out about it, Jenna.

[Jenna Fischer]

No, I agree with you, Angela, because by this time it was season five and you know, at a certain point it can feel like a comedy factory, a comedy TV show factory. And we never wanted that. And we did always try to come back to that place of authenticity. And. And when you came in in this season and really reminded us of that, I thought there was such value in it. And then also I was so grateful that you directed this episode, Steven, because it ends with this big Jim, Pam, Alex, art school guy scene. You talked about the tiny Bluetooths that actually did not work.

[Angela Kinsey]

They didn't exist at the time. They were like completely made up. Right.

[Jenna Fischer]

Y.

[Stephen Merchant]

Isn't it now? Because, you know, now with the AirPods and these other things, you know, they're kind of standard issue, aren't they really? But at the time, that just seemed such a. Kind of crazy. That was probably something I was probably hung up on at the time. I was like, what is this? Is this a thing?

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah.

[Stephen Merchant]

Can these exist?

[Angela Kinsey]

And not only that, they probably would have been really expensive because no one.

[Jenna Fischer]

No one had them. Yes. And so we would be shooting these scenes and it would either be like an ad reading the line, so you'd be shooting John's side and I'm either off camera saying my lines so he can hear me, or it was an ad reading the lines. But in that last scene in particular, when Alex comes in to Pam at corporate and Jim can hear him giving her this pitch that she should not leave New York. I, I, we spent hours on that. I mean, it felt like a whole day we spent on that. And the, the script had, like seven alternates to that scene. It was bonkers.

[Angela Kinsey]

Didn't, didn't one all. Jenna, wasn't he, like, professing that he actually wanted to be in a relationship with you? Didn't. Wasn't, like, there a huge spectrum of, like, what Alex was going to say to you?

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes, it was that either the plea was he actually had a line where he said, it's always been you, Pam. I mean, that's heavy. And then there was this whole other version where he had no feelings for me. He was just really invested in my artistic life. And we were just.

[Stephen Merchant]

But did we shoot different versions? I can't, because I remember the discussion about that, and I feel like I was. It seemed odd to me, the kind of big declaration of love. For some reason, I was uncomfortable with that. But what you gotta remember as well is I wasn't entirely up to speed on what had already been being built within the season because obviously I'd only come in for that one episode, so. But I just. There was something for me that disquieted me about the declaration of love. I think partly because I think there was something. Whenever the kind of Jim and Pam relationship is threatened, particularly once you've got together, I kind of. It just makes me uncomfortable. It's like knowing that it's like your parents kind of the idea that your parents might get a divorce, it's sort of. I'm not. I just, it makes me sad. The kind of threat, the threat to the relationship just makes me sad. And so the idea, I don't know, I was worried that it was a sort of artificial jeopardy. Like, it didn't really count because there was no way that you were going to leave Jim. And so therefore we were sort of creating a phony drama. But that might be my mis. Memory. I don't remember. I don't. Was it, was it, was it, Was it nailed down by the time we filmed it? Do you remember?

[Jenna Fischer]

I do remember. The version where he professes his love was in the script. And John and I felt like you did. We thought, where is this coming from? We don't need this obstacle. And the one that appears in the show was an alternate. And so when we got to set, we were so excited that you were on our side. And we could be like, guys, Stephen Merchant, creator of the whole thing, thinks we're right. But it was still like this discussion. And I feel like for a while we tried to do this Frankenstein version where there was a little bit of his feelings and a little bit of art school. But ultimately, I'm so glad that we picked the one that was picked.

[Stephen Merchant]

But having watched the show again in anticipation of this, it's a little odd that he declares, like you say, he's so invested in your art school, because it feels like when he comes into the office. That's right. He comes into your. Wherever you're working in order to kind of have a word with you. And that definitely feels like he's gonna declare his love, because probably we filmed it thinking that was what was gonna happen. And then by the time he gets into the little side room with you, he's like, man, you gotta stick with that art. And it's kind of. Yeah, so it's a little art. It's still probably a little Frankenstein y.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, it's also slightly out of the blue because we ended up cutting so much of my art school, which, at the time when we filmed this, we didn't know that scenes with Alix. And, you know, he had given me a couple of art pep talks already, but they never made it. So it is a little jarring. But it sets up a really nice story for Pam and Jim, which is that, you know, what does the art really mean to her? What did this New York experience mean to her? And, you know, and this is gonna kind of haunt her for a while. And that part I like about the scene.

[Stephen Merchant]

Yeah, you're right. And you agree. And I think, yes, it's that idea of, do you pursue a particular dream or do you be with the person you love? And the two things pulling at each other is an interesting idea.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, I watched this episode again last night with my tweens, my 13 year olds. And just when Alex says, hey, can I talk to you? Just that, like the fact that he went to Dunder Mifflin corporate and sought her out to have a private conversation. They were like, whoa. So to me, it was a reminder that you don't have to do much to really convey emotion. And yes, Alex is saying, you've got to give your art a shot. You can't do New York in three months. But it's clearly about so much more. And Jim can hear that. Jim knows it's that dude thing where when he's like, oh, he's into you. And so for me, it was everything we needed. We didn't need anything more.

[Jenna Fischer]

There was something in the script that didn't make it in. That made me laugh, which is that while Alex is talking, Jim says, cough if you still love me. And I cough.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, that would have been great.

[Stephen Merchant]

Again, I don't want to take credit for things that weren't mine, but I feel like maybe I'm wrong about this. But my instinct is that the little sort of tag on that when Dwight recognizes the brand of Bluetooth in Jim's ear, I feel like I had some contribution to that because I felt like the scene originally maybe just ended with the sort of. The kind of dot, dot, dot and the drama of it. And I felt like it needed a little conclusion or something to just kind of take away from the. From the sort of emotion of it or the drama of it or something. And also sort of slightly resolve the Bluetooth idea.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. That wasn't in the script, Steven.

[Stephen Merchant]

Oh, it wasn't. Maybe it wasn't.

[Jenna Fischer]

It was not. So that was clearly like an on the day thing. Yeah, the pitch.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. I also loved the reveal of the coffee mugs and how in fact they had not gone to Kelly's party and how this had built within the episode. And you talked a little bit on the DVD commentary, how you were so invested in shooting this coffee mug reveal.

[Stephen Merchant]

I was quite excited because there was a sort of. There was a sort of mystery element and I quite like that. It's funny, the project I'm working on at the moment has a sort of thrillery element to it. It's the first time I've done that. And that little taster on the Office of just sort of Jim as the detective kind of piecing things together was very pleasing to me. And sort of. And sort of seeing the Columbo, you know, seeing the evidence in the kind of the mind working. I don't know why. I find that very, very fun. And sort of sort of seeding the cups early on and then the kind of. The sort of when Jim looks around the room and he sees the mugs on the different desks and then he rushes to the off. You know, just the idea of it having a little bit of a sort of, you know, like a kind of little bit of a sort of thrillery NCIS quality to it. Whatever. I just find that that was fun. It was a kind of nice. It was a different kind of energy, which I found very pleasing to do.

[Angela Kinsey]

I remember I took my mug. I have it smart.

[Stephen Merchant]

Why not? I would hope that you've got all of your memorabilia from the show and it's just in a giant warehouse somewhere.

[Jenna Fischer]

I didn't get a mug. I was at art school.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah, you were at art school.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, well, Stephen, this was so great to reminisce about this episode with you and just reminisce with you in general. Is there anything else that you would want to share?

[Stephen Merchant]

Well, the only thing that occurred to me as I was watching it the other night, the thing that I was suddenly reminded of, and I'm sure this was a trick that was used a great deal in your show, and certainly we'd used it in our version, but I remembered there's a moment where Michael calls Jim in for his kind of customer survey appraisal, and the camera kind of whips from Jim at his desk to Michael in his office doorway, and then it whips back again to Jim at his desk. And I remembered watching it again, I was suddenly reminded that those were shot on two different days and that Steve had to leave for whatever reason and we didn't have him for that following day. And so we shot him in the doorway and we whipped the camera off him. And then the following day, we whipped back onto John at his desk and then tied the two together in the. In the editing room so it looks like it's happening in real time. And I was just watching it kind of, and I was very pleased at how effective it was when I watched it again, because I realized hopefully only me and the editor know that's what happened there.

[Jenna Fischer]

I would have no idea.

[Stephen Merchant]

Yeah, yeah. It was a very satisfying little trick.

[Jenna Fischer]

I remember Randall talking about the whip cut, that this was their trick because of. You couldn't. So much of our footage is like a oner docu style camera work. It was really hard to cut, but if you did a whip, you could cut in a whip. And that was the way that they would be able to use two versions of a scene or something.

[Stephen Merchant]

That's right. Absolutely right. And it's very satisfying to do because it's sort of somehow you're playing a little trick on the audience and they don't realize. I don't know why that's so satisfying.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, I was just gonna say, over the course of the whole series, you were such a champion for Jim and Pam, and I remember that so much. You know, we talked about how that was true in this episode, but all way to the end, you were always so invested in them. And I just say thank you because your voice in the writer's room was really meaningful. So thank you.

[Stephen Merchant]

Well, thank you and thank you for such an amazing job and congratulations with your podcast and also, I wouldn't mind just saying a final thought, which was just about Lester, who wrote that episode. Who? Lester Lewis, who so tragically died a few years after that. And I only, you know, knew him for that, for that one episode. And that was the only time I'd work with him. But he was such a lovely man. And I just, you know, and that sort of, whenever I think of that episode, it's kind of tinged with that bit of sweet, you know, that bittersweet aftertaste, if you like. So, yeah, a little reminder to him.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. We loved so much.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, Steven, I just want to say thank you. I mean, I feel like everyone in our cast was just, like, humbled that we got this job. We all felt like we won the lottery ticket, and you gave us that lottery ticket, you know, you and Ricky, and you forever changed our lives. Like, I'm. Like, I'm the person that's quick to laugh and quick to tear up, and what you gave us and how you changed our lives and our families just from having this idea. I don't know. I will never be able to say thank you enough. So thank you.

[Stephen Merchant]

Well, that's very sweet of you. But again, I think Ricky and I feel very proud of our version, but also of the American version. I think, for me, I grew up watching and loving American shows, and I was hooked on MASH and then Cheers and then Roseanne and then the idea of having my fingerprints on a show like yours, which stands in the lineage of those shows and is now as beloved by audiences as that as those shows, it's just incredible. And that's a testament to you guys and all the cast and all the crew and all the writers. It's gone way beyond what Ricky and I did. It's like you mentioned about Frankenstein earlier, but to us, we've always thought of the Office as. It's like Frankenstein's monster. And we kind of created this thing in the lab, and it went off and rampaged around the world on its own, you know, without us. And the idea that the show is having this kind of. This sort of whole second life and, you know, audiences finding it again, I just think it's such a thrill and an honor to be associated with it. So thank you.

[Jenna Fischer]

And will you tell us a little bit about the show that you're working on now, the Offenders?

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Stephen Merchant]

No, no. Goodbye.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, dear.

[Angela Kinsey]

Come on.

[Stephen Merchant]

Well, it's interesting. Cause it's a show that is about people doing community service. You know, when you get, like, a DUI or some Minor crime. And instead of sending you to jail, they give you 120 hours of picking up garbage at the side of the road or whatever. And my parents used to be. My parents didn't. They did not do DOIs. They were people that were in charge of. Of offenders that did these. Did these days. And I just thought it was always an interesting idea, a good way of bringing a completely disparate group of people together. And interestingly, it has parallels with the Office in that regard. Because, you know, like, with an Office, those people only know each other because they work in that same environment and they fall in love and they hate each other and they fight and argue. And it's the only thing that kind of keeps them together is because of that job and those four walls. And this was sort of a similar idea in a way, is that although it has a bit more of a dramatic thriller y spine. The jumping off point is, again, how do you bring an interesting bunch of characters together that wouldn't otherwise meet and sort of watch the sparks fly? And so it shares some DNA with the Office in that regard. But, yes, we're sort of in the middle of filming it and hopefully it'll be out later in the year.

[Angela Kinsey]

And where can we find it? BBC and Amazon Studios. Is that right?

[Stephen Merchant]

Amazon prime and BBC. Yes, that's right. And its name may change at some point. Who knows, Maybe its cast will change, I don't know. But at the moment it's called the Offenders and. Yeah, and it's shaping up really nicely. I'm excited.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, I want to throw something out there, too, because I'm a big fan of your film, Fighting With My Family.

[Stephen Merchant]

Thank you.

[Jenna Fischer]

It came out in 2019. I discovered it during the Pandemic. It is so, so good. You wrote and directed it. So while you're waiting for the Offenders, check out Fighting With My Family.

[Stephen Merchant]

Thank you so much. I'm very proud of that film. I think it turned out really nicely, so I appreciate it.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, Stephen, this was just a joy.

[Angela Kinsey]

Thank you.

[Stephen Merchant]

It was wonderful. It's so great to reminisce. It's really nice to talk about it. If I hadn't rewatched it, I realized I just completely forgotten so much of that and so much of the fun of shooting it. It was really pleasing to kind of go back and look at it again.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, thank you so much, Steven. Thank you so much for today.

[Stephen Merchant]

Thank you, guys. Thanks so much.

[Angela Kinsey]

Lady. Have you ever invested in something that seemed really amazing at first, but then did not live up to the hype

[Jenna Fischer]

I once got this kind of fancy jacket that looked amazing in the store, but then I wore it out once and I realized it was not comfortable and now it just lives in my closet collecting dust.

[Angela Kinsey]

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[Jenna Fischer]

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[Angela Kinsey]

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[Jenna Fischer]

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[Angela Kinsey]

If you've been listening for a while, you'll know how much goes into making this show run smoothly. And if I had to hire someone tomorrow, I'd want someone who understands our workflow, knows the tools we use, and can jump in without missing a beat.

[Jenna Fischer]

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[Angela Kinsey]

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[Jenna Fischer]

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[Angela Kinsey]

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[Jenna Fischer]

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[Angela Kinsey]

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[Jenna Fischer]

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[Angela Kinsey]

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[Jenna Fischer]

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[Angela Kinsey]

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[Jenna Fischer]

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[Angela Kinsey]

use code OfficeLadies50 at Checkout. Where do we go from there? That was so.

[Jenna Fischer]

I don't know, Angela, but I have to tell you, I was on a high for days after we did that interview. I know. Here's all you need to know about Stephen Merchant, by the way. Just the warmth and heart of this man. He really was the champion of Tim and Don on the British show and of Jim and Pam on our show. And if you need an example of that, just look at how he wore his wornham hog hat.

[Angela Kinsey]

I know.

[Jenna Fischer]

For a podcast.

[Angela Kinsey]

And brought his coffee mug, his Dunder

[Jenna Fischer]

Mifflin coffee mug that he had tea in.

[Angela Kinsey]

We need to send him some office ladies like merch.

[Jenna Fischer]

We have to.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay. All right. Well, should we break down this episode?

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes. Let's get to it.

[Jenna Fischer]

This episode opens with a very funny cold open. Dwight bursts into Michael's office to congratulate him on his engagement. Congratulations, Michael.

[Angela Kinsey]

And, like, punches him hard.

[Jenna Fischer]

I know.

[Angela Kinsey]

I feel like this is how my kids would congratulate you. Be like you aced your test. Pow. Like, Dwight is such a kid.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. No, it's true. Daryl has a talking head. He just wants to make sure we all know that what we saw last week was true. That Michael is definitely not engaged.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. No. In fact, he would help support his therapy.

[Jenna Fischer]

Might need a little help.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah, Michael. Yeah, he's a little worried about him. Well, there is a deleted scene where the gang asks Michael to tell him about the proposal moment.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh.

[Angela Kinsey]

And Michael just starts doing that thing, Jenna, where he just gets deeper and deeper into, like, a ridiculous lie. And it's so funny. Sam, can you play it? You wasted. How did I propose? Let me see.

[Stephen Merchant]

Well, I drove her up to Nashua

[Angela Kinsey]

and I had the ring. Big 10 carat diamond. It was beautiful.

[Jenna Fischer]

And I got down on my hands

[Angela Kinsey]

and knees and shooting star crossed overhead and it just lit up the diamond

[Stephen Merchant]

like a shooting star. And we were in a restaurant And I put the diamond into a cheeseburger

[Angela Kinsey]

and she took a bite, started to choke.

[Stephen Merchant]

So what do I do?

[Jenna Fischer]

I CPR training, go around, start doing the Heimlich.

[Angela Kinsey]

Perfect.

[Stephen Merchant]

The ring, 10 carat diamond pops out

[Jenna Fischer]

of her mouth, hits her shrimp cocktail

[Angela Kinsey]

right on to her finger.

[Jenna Fischer]

Million to one shot, all of the Greek people in the restaurant start screaming,

[Stephen Merchant]

which means congratulations. So

[Jenna Fischer]

what is this restaurant where they have ordered a cheeseburger and shrimp cocktail

[Angela Kinsey]

and they're outside with a shooting star.

[Jenna Fischer]

And it's Greek.

[Angela Kinsey]

And it's Greek.

[Jenna Fischer]

You know that famous Greek shrimp cocktail

[Angela Kinsey]

out under the shooting stars with a great cheeseburger. I mean, I just. You could just, if you get a chance, watch this deleted scene. Because you see him being like, yeah. And then this happened. And you know, 10 carat diamond. Yeah, I know.

[Jenna Fischer]

Wow.

[Angela Kinsey]

Wowzers.

[Jenna Fischer]

What was left in the episode is that everyone makes him call his mom and tell her the news.

[Angela Kinsey]

And she's like, she thinks he's lying again. And he's like, why, Mom? Come on.

[Jenna Fischer]

A couple of things. I don't know if you noticed. The entire time he's on the phone with his mom, Mindy is hiding behind Phyllis's shoulder. You can only see her forehead. This is totally because Mindy was laughing.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah, she's laughing.

[Jenna Fischer]

Exactly. We also had some fan questions from Sabrina, Hannah, and Paul, who would like to know who voiced Michael's mom in the Cold Open. This was June Squibb, who is an amazing character actress. She was actually nominated for an Academy Award for best supporting actress in 2014 for her role in the movie Nebraska.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, my gosh.

[Jenna Fischer]

She also played Jack Nicholson's wife in the movie about Schmidt.

[Angela Kinsey]

She's so good.

[Jenna Fischer]

So good.

[Angela Kinsey]

She's so good.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, we were so lucky.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. That's Michael's mom.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, now we're getting into the episode. It's customer survey time.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

Kelly brings Michael all the customer survey files and also a receipt to her bridesmaids dress that she had bought. That whole bit made me laugh so hard.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, he'll take care of it. Oh, yeah, he's got it. He just crumples it up and throws it in the stove.

[Angela Kinsey]

It's in the trash. So the whole premise of the story is that Dwight, Jim, all the salespeople, they have these customer surveys, and if they do well, then they get bonuses and things like that.

[Jenna Fischer]

Right, Right.

[Angela Kinsey]

So stakes are high. Jen, I have a question for you.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay.

[Angela Kinsey]

Do you do the customer surveys? Like, if you get a prompt on an app or an email or a Receipt. Or if someone calls you because you've purchased something, do you do the customer surveys?

[Jenna Fischer]

Very rarely, but occasionally, if I have a really great interaction with a salesperson, I want to give them like a kudos. So I will actually go home with my receipt. You know, they usually circle it.

[Angela Kinsey]

Right.

[Jenna Fischer]

And then I go take the survey and I say how great they were.

[Angela Kinsey]

This is totally why we're BFFs, because I do that. I do the surveys, you guys. Every time I try to. It's very time consuming.

[Jenna Fischer]

It really is.

[Angela Kinsey]

I was once on the phone with this guy. We had gotten an appliance delivery, and then they do the setup, and then they called to see how you liked their service.

[Jenna Fischer]

Right.

[Angela Kinsey]

I was on the phone with a guy for 45 minutes.

[Jenna Fischer]

Saying what?

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, I did his survey and then we just had a heart to heart. Josh came in and was like, are you still on the phone with the dishwasher guy? I said, I am. I did the survey. And he told me a lot of people don't do them. Sometimes they hang up on him, or sometimes they yell at him. Are. Sometimes they get very offended by the questions he asks. And they're just sort of standard questions. And I said he was really nice guy. I talked to him. You know, he'd had a tough few months. And like, this is.

[Jenna Fischer]

So you let me say I do the customer surveys that are online. Oh, yeah. So I don't do, like, a phone call customer survey.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, I love a phone call customer survey.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah, that's you.

[Angela Kinsey]

I want to get to know you. And anyway, this whole episode made me think about that, and I was like, I wonder if Jenna does them too.

[Jenna Fischer]

I do, because I worked in that line of work, and I know how, like, a good review boosts you up the ladder.

[Angela Kinsey]

It does. And I did as well. And so I think about that.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, the other storyline going on here, Jim's gonna have a talking head where it is revealed that he and Pam are wearing teeny, tiny Bluetooth earpieces.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. And this technology did not exist.

[Jenna Fischer]

No. The Mitsuwashi B400 is not a real thing.

[Angela Kinsey]

This is a fakie tech alert.

[Jenna Fischer]

Faky tech alert. Yeah. We talked a little bit about this with Steven, how they were totally fake. So the way we did this was we shot John's side of these conversations first. And I would be off camera reading my lines. And then at the end of the week, we went to the corporate set and we shot my side of it. And then John was off camera and. And Veda, our Script supervisor would have to take diligent notes because if there was an improvisation that we did, she would have to write it down so that we could remember to shoot my half of it when we moved over to corporate.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, man.

[Jenna Fischer]

So it was really complicated. It wasn't like there was a camera on him and a camera on me.

[Angela Kinsey]

Right.

[Jenna Fischer]

So that's how we did it. And by the way, I found out that this whole Bluetooth storyline was pitched by BJ Novak.

[Angela Kinsey]

Hmm. I of course had to Google what is actually the smallest headphone ever made.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

According to the Internet, you guys. And I don't know why I find this stuff interesting. This is like what's happened with us with office ladies. We talk about it, we see something, we're like, I want to know what is the smallest headphone according to the Internet? Swedish headphone maker Ear in kicked off its Consumer electronics show in 2021 by revealing the A3 true wireless earbuds. And according to Ear in, they are the smallest and lightest headphones ever made. Sorry, Apple.

[Jenna Fischer]

Are they expensive? Do you know?

[Angela Kinsey]

I looked it up, it was like 190 bucks. What?

[Jenna Fischer]

For the smallest?

[Angela Kinsey]

For the smallest.

[Jenna Fischer]

But are they the best?

[Angela Kinsey]

Don't know that. Don't know that. Guys. Just telling you. Erin claims to have the smallest.

[Jenna Fischer]

Now it's time for Dwight to find out how he did on his survey.

[Angela Kinsey]

And I have what I'd like to call a new catchphrase alert.

[Jenna Fischer]

What is it, Sam?

[Angela Kinsey]

Can you play it?

[Jenna Fischer]

All righty, Dwighty.

[Angela Kinsey]

All righty, Dwighty. It's my new catchphrase. I love it. I'm gonna say it. Alrighty, Dwighty. What you got, Jenna?

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, I'll tell you, Dwight doesn't do well on his survey.

[Angela Kinsey]

No.

[Jenna Fischer]

And Michael's not joking.

[Angela Kinsey]

Even though Dwight has that queasy feeling that he gets when he sometimes is hearing a joke.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. But he's not laughing. He can't be sure because he can't see himself. But yeah, it's very upsetting. But guess who else doesn't get a good review? Jim. That's right.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

He is arrogant. And smudge.

[Angela Kinsey]

Lot of smudgeness.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. Now Jim turns off his little Bluetooth.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. Pam's like, what?

[Jenna Fischer]

What?

[Angela Kinsey]

What's happening?

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. And then he has a talking head where he reveals some pretty big news that he was counting on this bonus because he's gonna buy his parents house. Pam doesn't know this. And also clearly it's gonna put him in debt. Cause he says, you know, he's gonna Buy something he can't really afford.

[Angela Kinsey]

But he's also retiring his parents.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah, I guess they need the money from the house sale to retire.

[Angela Kinsey]

Mm.

[Jenna Fischer]

Then he gets on the phone with Pam. He tells her about the bad review,

[Angela Kinsey]

but not about the house.

[Jenna Fischer]

How do we feel about that? Am I opening a can of worms?

[Angela Kinsey]

I mean, you have that look on your face where you know exactly how you feel about it. I don't know why you're asking me. You just turned red.

[Jenna Fischer]

I know, I know. Because this is gonna play out and,

[Angela Kinsey]

well, you feel like a home purchase is a two hander, not a one hander.

[Jenna Fischer]

It's a big life moment, and not just because they're gonna live in it together. And I think that people should pick out their living space if they're gonna live in it, but also because it's a financial burden. Jim has just revealed this is going to burden him. And then also Pam and I think that something of that gravity you should speak about with your partner before you do it. I personally don't find large financial purchases that I then have to live in to be a romantic gesture.

[Angela Kinsey]

I probably shouldn't have bought you that rv.

[Jenna Fischer]

I do love the rv, Angela. I wouldn't have had the table be exactly where it is, but I can live with it. I loved it. Thank you.

[Angela Kinsey]

I put the title in your name. How are those payments? We're kidding. I didn't buy her an rv. I didn't buy her an rv. But, yeah, I think this kind of moment is what we call the two hander guys. It's a two hander life moment.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. And I think this sort of speaks a little bit to where, you know, Pam was so heavily criticized for Alex's attention on her that she never reciprocated. Right. In this art school story. But there's not a lot of criticism of, like, how Jim is partnering. And that's sort of where, I don't know, he gets a pass maybe because he's so, like, charming and it's seen as, like, romantic.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, some people might see it as romantic that he's gonna provide a home, but I think.

[Jenna Fischer]

But he's not really. Because it's a financial burden.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, I said but. I had a but coming. Which is also that, you know, when you're partnering with someone in life, the word is partner, right?

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

It's not soloing. I'm not soloing with you. I'm partnering with you. And Pam might have said, you know what, why don't we live in one of our apartments? And save money for a bit.

[Jenna Fischer]

Or she might have said, listen, I get it. I love your parents. I want your parents to be able to retire. I agree. To take on this financial burden to provide your parents with a great retirement. I'm in.

[Angela Kinsey]

That's right.

[Jenna Fischer]

But she wasn't given the opportunity.

[Angela Kinsey]

She never got the chance because there was some soloing and not some partnering.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. Yeah. Let's talk about what Andy's up to. He goes to get some coffee, but he can't find his mug because Jim's using it.

[Angela Kinsey]

It's his face.

[Jenna Fischer]

But is it. I mean, smile. Smile. Like the mug.

[Angela Kinsey]

That was so funny. That made me laugh so hard. Jenna, what do I have here in

[Jenna Fischer]

my hand, you guys? Angela has her mug with the star in her little severe face.

[Angela Kinsey]

I took it at the end of the week. Am I like the office klepto? I full on took it. It has sat on my desk at home for 15 years, and I keep my pencils and stuff in it, and I washed it out and brought it here today so I could drink out of it.

[Jenna Fischer]

So cool.

[Angela Kinsey]

In honor of the episode, Sam, do you. You're head of the ppc. You need to clock things like this.

[Stephen Merchant]

It's wonderful.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay, thank you.

[Jenna Fischer]

I don't have one.

[Angela Kinsey]

You don't have one.

[Stephen Merchant]

That is not wonderful.

[Jenna Fischer]

Thank you.

[Angela Kinsey]

You do have a mug, though, with the edge on it.

[Jenna Fischer]

I do have that, thanks to you, Angela. I don't think we talked about that on the pod.

[Angela Kinsey]

We haven't.

[Jenna Fischer]

All right, I'll share. Angela got me a mug from the edge. My favorite movie.

[Angela Kinsey]

I made it, guys. I went on a website, and I made it.

[Jenna Fischer]

It took you months. It has a picture of Anthony Hopkins and Alec Baldwin, and then it has a picture of the bear, and then it has the quote, what one man can do, another can do.

[Angela Kinsey]

Mm. And I gave it to her as a birthday gift.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. And that is the actual quote from the movie. Even though I say what one man has done, another can do, I looked it up.

[Angela Kinsey]

I got it right.

[Jenna Fischer]

No, you got it right. You got it right.

[Angela Kinsey]

And now Jenna can drink her mug with either the bear facing her or. Or Anthony Hopkins and Alec Baldwin. Alec Baldwin.

[Jenna Fischer]

And I use it on days when I need to get fired up, you know, like when we're writing our book. And I know, like, I have a tough day of writing ahead, and maybe I just. I'm not. Ugh. I just can't get into it. I'll get that mug, Angela, and I'll pour coffee in it, and I'll look at that bear and I'll be like, I'm gonna slay this bear today. You know the quote from the movie is, we're gonna kill a mother bear today.

[Angela Kinsey]

The bear is the book.

[Jenna Fischer]

The bear is the book. The bear is whatever you need to conquer in the day.

[Angela Kinsey]

Not today.

[Jenna Fischer]

And it stares at me. Not today, bear.

[Angela Kinsey]

Not today bear.

[Jenna Fischer]

I love my mug.

[Angela Kinsey]

Or not today. Anthony.

[Jenna Fischer]

Who's Anthony?

[Angela Kinsey]

Anthony Hopkins. Charles Charles. You mean Charles Charles. Well, Jim says, why don't you use the Snoopy mug? And Pam's like, no, that's my mug.

[Jenna Fischer]

But it's not even her mug. Her mug is the pink mug.

[Angela Kinsey]

I know. So I wrote here in my notes. Wait, did Pam bring her pink mug to art school?

[Jenna Fischer]

Maybe Pam brought her pink mug to art school.

[Angela Kinsey]

Snoopy is her backup mug.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah, I buy that.

[Angela Kinsey]

This is more mug talk than you ever thought you might hear.

[Jenna Fischer]

There's gonna be more too, so just buckle in for that later. Also, Andy would like you to know about landing the greatest tentist for the wedding.

[Angela Kinsey]

Do you mean the Shangri La tent to celebrate your wedding with excellence? I screen grabbed it. That's what the website says. And let me just tell you a little bit about this tent, you guys. It's two stories and heated and it has a bridal suite for his bridal suite. It's really simple and tasteful. A two story tent.

[Jenna Fischer]

You know, it's the same tentus that Giuliani used for his first and third weddings.

[Angela Kinsey]

But Nana Mimi can't be in canvas that long. Angela's not having it.

[Jenna Fischer]

No, no, no, no, no.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, I have to share with you guys the scene between Angela and Andy. I couldn't do it. I literally couldn't do it. It's at 10 minutes, 10 seconds. Angela Martin has to say to Andy, you can have your tent, but only if it's in a field. A hand teeled field.

[Jenna Fischer]

You still can't say it.

[Angela Kinsey]

I tried my hardest.

[Jenna Fischer]

Just now you said hand tealed field.

[Angela Kinsey]

No, I didn't. I was trying so hard.

[Jenna Fischer]

You said tealed.

[Angela Kinsey]

Did I say tealed?

[Jenna Fischer]

Like tealed like the color. Okay, well, it's supposed to be tilled. Hand tilled field.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay, so here, this is what Angela

[Jenna Fischer]

could not do on the day.

[Angela Kinsey]

What I just read to you guys was what was exactly in the script, right? And if you watch the show, you know that's not what I say because I think we did like 13 takes. My Southern kryptonite is a vowel in front of an L. You might remember Filthy emails. Couldn't say those. So I kept saying, a hand healed, field, hand tailed, field. So many times that Lester came over to me, who's so sweet, and he said, angela, it's hand tulled, filled, tilled, tilled, hand tailed, tilled, till, like until hand, tilde. I can't say what happens to me. I cannot say this word. And I said. And I looked at him and I looked at his lips as he said it. I was trying so hard. Steven Merchant is the director. I'm sweating bullets here. So I was like, okay, okay, I got it, I got it. Hand held feld. And so I said, you can have your tent, but only if it's in a field. A hand held feld. Hand held, hand held. And it was like a disaster. Lester came over. I'll never forget. He sort of crouched down by my desk and whispered to me, angela, why don't you just say a hand plowed field? And I said, oh, Lester, thank you. Thank you so much. And that's what made it in the episode. Because I can't say hand tailed, field.

[Jenna Fischer]

You can't do it.

[Angela Kinsey]

I can't do it.

[Jenna Fischer]

Can you say hand, until, field, hand, until.

[Angela Kinsey]

Anyway, that is how Lester rescued me in this scene.

[Jenna Fischer]

That's beautiful.

[Angela Kinsey]

I know. He saved me with hand plowed. Bless his heart. He did.

[Jenna Fischer]

We need to talk about the scene which we did talk about with Steven, the roleplay scene.

[Angela Kinsey]

William Butlicker.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. We basically covered this with Steven, but we did have a fan question from Danielle, Allison, Stella and Allison, who wanted to know how much of this scene was improv and how much was scripted. So I went and looked in the script.

[Angela Kinsey]

Thank you, jamesapedia.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes, thank you, jamesapedia. The scene is entirely scripted.

[Angela Kinsey]

It's amazing.

[Jenna Fischer]

That is such good writing.

[Angela Kinsey]

It is such good writing.

[Jenna Fischer]

I was sure that Steve's little asides were improvised. His delivery is so spontaneous. Like when he says, it's up to you to change his mind.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes. I thought that was an improv too scripted. Beautiful.

[Jenna Fischer]

So, so good. What wasn't in the script was. I am irate right now. That was not in the script. And there were a couple of other little lines, but they were always just like a play on what was already there.

[Angela Kinsey]

Right.

[Jenna Fischer]

But yeah, that scene is just beautiful. Next is a scene that we didn't talk about with Steven and I wish we had. It's that moment when Dwight peels his car out and tells Jim to get in.

[Angela Kinsey]

Jenna. I know. I meant to ask him about it. So he talked about it in the DVD commentary that he loved how absurd it was that Dwight was like, get in and then peels out. And you really think they're gonna just tear out of the parking lot and

[Jenna Fischer]

go somewhere and then they go nowhere.

[Angela Kinsey]

And then he wanted him to make, like a hard left and just go into his parking spot. And Jim's like, what? And Steven said he wanted it to be even bigger. He was like, can we do an even bigger peel out? But there just wasn't the space.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, I found this interview with Lester where he said that originally they were just going to have them meet, that Dwight was just going to have him meet down in the parking lot and they were going to have this conversation. And that Steven pitched, oh, guys, let's make it more interesting and do this crazy car maneuver.

[Angela Kinsey]

It's so funny.

[Jenna Fischer]

So, so, so funny. I did get a fan catch from Madeline R. She is pretty sure that Pam's car is in the parking lot. Oh, that's a good catch in this scene. So I looked for it and it's so fast I couldn't register it. But I bet, you know, they just would leave our cars there.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

So I think there's a good chance it's there.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, for sure. I bet. Well, you know, one of the things I loved about this scene was Dwight is, you know, convinced someone might be listening into their conversation. So he plays Jay Giles Band the song centerfold.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

Really loud. It just took me back. I'm like, where are my roller skates? I went and listened to the album last night. And you guys, if you haven't watched music videos from this time, go back.

[Jenna Fischer]

They're pretty special.

[Angela Kinsey]

They're real special. They're delightful. My kids were like, what are they doing? I'm like, you guys, this is a music video.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, my gosh. I remember watching music videos on MTV. And then do you remember the VH1 pop up thing?

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

Where they would pop up little facts on the screen.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah, I loved those.

[Jenna Fischer]

Me too.

[Angela Kinsey]

Our whole generation grew up watching music videos. Mm. It's wild.

[Jenna Fischer]

So now we're back in the office and Dwight is on a sales call, but he becomes increasingly convinced that someone is listening to him. He's talking to a guy on the phone who, by the way, I found out, was played by actor Steve Zissis, who, if you don't know who he is, he is amazing. He is one of the stars of the movie Baghead, which he made with the Duplass Brothers. Then he went on to create the TV comedy togetherness with them. And he has a story by credit on the new film Cruella. I mean, he's part of that whole, like, mumblecore movement.

[Angela Kinsey]

We got the best actors just to be voices on the phone.

[Jenna Fischer]

What the hell?

[Angela Kinsey]

What the heck? Dwight is positive it's Kelly. And he charges back there, right?

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

And he finds her on the phone and she's like, you can't just come into my nook and call me stupid. Get out of my nook.

[Jenna Fischer]

And then Pam over at the corporate offices goes, that's what she said. That's what she said. Okay, that was an improvised pitch by John Krasinski.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, cute.

[Jenna Fischer]

So I'm there and John is like, oh, my gosh. It should be a. That's what she said. That's what she said. And so we did it. We saved it. And then when I went to the corporate offices, we shot my side of it.

[Angela Kinsey]

That is so cute. I love that. Well, they're about to really uncover some details here in this little mystery because Jim has a conversation with Kelly and she doesn't have anything to say. He literally asks her about Daryl. Like, normally she'd be chatty and Pam is like, wait a second. Yeah, why isn't she talking your ear off?

[Jenna Fischer]

You know, it's a good thing that Pam was in Jim's ear this day, because he may have never figured this out without her. Truly. You know what I mean?

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, the next scene really cracked me up because Jim goes to Ryan. Ryan's got to know what's up with Kelly, right? And Ryan. I fell in love with Ryan in this episode.

[Jenna Fischer]

Jenna, you're with me now.

[Angela Kinsey]

I'm with you because Ryan said this made me laugh. He says, I don't play the politics game anymore. Jim, can I tell you something? I played it full on in New York. I played it high stakes for keeps, made it to the top. Like, who is this guy?

[Jenna Fischer]

And my favorite thing is he's like, can I tell you what I learned? As he takes a sip of coffee so we never end up finding out what he learned. I'm so sad. I would love to know his lessons.

[Angela Kinsey]

But Jim sees the coffee mug.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

This is the Columbo starting to piece it together like Steven talked about.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. He also has a coffee mug with his face and the little star. And that's when it becomes clear that Jim and Dwight did not attend Kelly's America's Got Talent viewing party. These were the party favors.

[Angela Kinsey]

These were the party favors. And somewhere in her house, Kelly has a mug with Dwight's face on it. And Jim's. She probably smashed them.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, I didn't even think about that. Oh, yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

She bought everyone mugs.

[Jenna Fischer]

And so these leftover mugs are sitting there just making her so angry every day.

[Angela Kinsey]

Mm.

[Jenna Fischer]

And she's finally.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh.

[Jenna Fischer]

Revenge is a dish best served cold. Kelly, well done.

[Angela Kinsey]

I know.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, I want you to know Jim figures it out. He rushes over to Dwight and says, dwight, you were right. And I loved this scene so much. Dwight is finally right about a conspiracy.

[Angela Kinsey]

And then like a 10 year old boy, he's like, let's go get her. And Jim's like, wait.

[Jenna Fischer]

But first he does that crazy air kick at Phyllis.

[Angela Kinsey]

I know.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, also in that interview with Lester, he said that Rayn improvised that air kick. He only did it one time, but it was so brilliant. That's the take they used.

[Angela Kinsey]

Of course he did. Because if you guys watch the show, Dwight does that air kick whenever he gets real excited. He's done it in the stairwell before. A big sales call.

[Jenna Fischer]

It's the happy air kick. Yeah, I'm gonna start using it.

[Angela Kinsey]

Pump it up. Air kick.

[Jenna Fischer]

Also in that interview with Lester, he said he was really proud of this mug idea. And he said that ultimately the writers knew that Kelly was going to sabotage the customer surveys because Dwight and Jim skipped her viewing party. But they couldn't figure out how the guys would realize this fact. They had originally talked about maybe having Dwight tap Kelly's phone and overhear something, or maybe they would find like a secret recording device or something. But that's when Lester got the party favor mug idea. And it's really so genius. And then paired with the way Steven directed it is just so great.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

Two great people working together, making a great moment.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

We also got a fan question about this scene from Evan L. Did the cast do a photo shoot for the mugs? And if so, did they ask you guys to make weird faces? Because Oscar looks really bored on his.

[Angela Kinsey]

I don't remember a special photo shoot. We had done a publicity photo shoot, so maybe they used those images. But I'm looking at my face on the mug right now. And it's also possible that Phil just walked around and snapped pictures of us.

[Jenna Fischer]

It kind of looks like one of your publicity photos that maybe they color enhanced.

[Angela Kinsey]

I still have my publicity photo. Do you want me to do a side by side in stories?

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

We'll vote. Guys, do you think it's the same picture or do you think Phil just took my picture at my desk one day? Cause they did do that sometimes.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, they would.

[Angela Kinsey]

They Would walk around, and you'd just be sitting there, and they'd snap a picture of you for something.

[Jenna Fischer]

We'll get to the bottom of it.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, Jenna Kelly's gonna get called into Michael's office, and she's busted now.

[Jenna Fischer]

She is.

[Angela Kinsey]

Dwight wants her fired.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

And Michael asks them to leave the office. You know, he's like, this is serious. I need you to leave the office. And then Michael says this, and I loved it so much. Michael says, I have an enormous amount of trouble trying to get people to come to my place, and I hate it. I can't tell you how much leftover guacamole I have ended up eating over the years. I don't even know why I make it in such great quantities. And then he says, listen, just sit there and pretend to cry. Right? Can you do that?

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

And then they both end up laughing. And it's a really sweet moment.

[Jenna Fischer]

It really is. And we got a bunch of people writing in to ask if that laugh after Kelly fake cries, if that was like, a fake laugh or if Mindy broke. No, that was scripted. It's scripted that her fake crying made them laugh.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, I'll say this. In rewatching this episode, like, three times, right before today, I could hear Mindy's fake laugh and then her real laugh.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

So if you watch it, she fake cries, she fake laughs, then Steve laughs as Michael, and then Mindy laughs as herself.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. Her real laugh definitely comes out.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

So now we're at this scene at corporate, which we talked about a lot with Steven. This scene where Alex comes to Pam's work. He's gonna kidnap her. Wants to see this.

[Angela Kinsey]

He said wine and cheese. Okay. That's all you gotta hear. If someone says, midday, there's an exhibit with wine and cheese, that's not being friends.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. Well, thanks to jamesapedia, I saw all of the candy bag for this.

[Angela Kinsey]

How Many were there?

[Jenna Fischer]

10.

[Angela Kinsey]

10 alts for this scene?

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, my word.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. I wanted to count because we kind of talked about it, and it was 10. 10 alternate scenes. And I swear, we shot so many. So many versions of it. And I remember doing these scenes with Rich. It was so grueling, and we really bonded. Like, Rich and I are great friends today, I think because we went through this moment together.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. You were in the trenches of trying to find this scene.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, we should have Rich on and talk about it.

[Jenna Fischer]

We need to hear his side of things shooting this crazy scene.

[Angela Kinsey]

Let's call them Rich. Come on.

[Jenna Fischer]

So I feel like we really covered this. But we did have a fan write in. And I'm so sorry I didn't write down your name because I thought this was a really good observation. They were saying, wasn't Pam's art program three months long? And she went at the beginning of the summer. How was she there for Halloween? And how is she still there? Isn't it November now?

[Angela Kinsey]

Art school is a mystery. It's a mystery.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. Yeah, that's a good catch.

[Angela Kinsey]

I still want to know if she has parking. You know, these are things we're going to wonder about. Art school.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, she's having to go into Manhattan for her corporate job because Pratt's out in Brooklyn.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. Well, we end this episode with Andy, Angela, and Dwight.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

Because Andy has found the perfect place for them to get married. And it's Schrute Farms.

[Jenna Fischer]

It ticks all of the boxes. Angela gave them a list of what the wedding location had to include.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. And Dwight tells them he thinks they should have the Excalibur package. It's going to have everything they need. Angela is clearly delighted. Andy is relieved. And Jenna. All I could think of when I watched this scene was Jim and Pam planned Pam's wedding to Roy, and now Angela and Dwight are going to plan her wedding to Andy.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, yeah, right. Yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

It's sort of a callback. It is.

[Jenna Fischer]

You know, there's another little weird callback in this scene. A lot of people wrote in with this fan. Catch that. The funeral home's director in Job Fair.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes. He's in the album.

[Jenna Fischer]

He's in the album. He got married at Schrute Farms.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, Lester said in his interview that they loved this guy and they used him twice. And they also thought it worked because the shrutes get married in their own graves. So he felt that he would know about Schrute Farms.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. That's a great catch. Well, all righty, Dwighty.

[Jenna Fischer]

That was customer survey. Thank you so much, James Carey, for sending me those scripts. I also got in touch with Randy Cordray on this one because I couldn't remember if the Bluetooths were real. I was so convinced. So I wrote Randy, and I was like, they weren't real.

[Angela Kinsey]

No, they weren't real. They don't talked about it quite a bit on the DVD commentary. And, of course, a humongous thank you to Stephen Merchant.

[Jenna Fischer]

We love you.

[Angela Kinsey]

We love you. Please come back.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. And next week, we have business trip. Michael's going to Canada, y'. All.

[Angela Kinsey]

And Rich, we're gonna call you.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes, Rich, you will be in business trip an episode that your character does not appear.

[Angela Kinsey]

But we have questions for you.

[Jenna Fischer]

We do. And this is our podcast. So we can do.

[Angela Kinsey]

That's right. All righty, Dwighty. You guys have a good week.

[Jenna Fischer]

You are really loving that phrase.

[Angela Kinsey]

I said it one time too many, didn't I?

[Jenna Fischer]

Maybe. But I like that when you attach to something, you go for it.

[Angela Kinsey]

Thank you.

[Jenna Fischer]

All right, we'll see you next week. That was your extra long goodbye. Thank you for listening to Office Ladies.

[Angela Kinsey]

Second this episode was initially created in collaboration with Earwolf.

[Jenna Fischer]

Office Ladies is a presentation of Odyssey and is produced by Jenna Fisher and Angela Kinsey. Our senior producer is Matt Beagle.

[Angela Kinsey]

Our second drinks episodes are produced by Molly Nugent.

[Jenna Fischer]

Our audio engineer is Sam Piefer.

[Angela Kinsey]

Odyssey's executive producer is Leah Reese. Dennis.

[Jenna Fischer]

Office Ladies was mixed and mastered by Bill Schultz.

[Angela Kinsey]

Our theme song is Rubber Tree. By creating Bratton. I don't know how to do hair. I'm not good at it, but I'm really trying to make a little bit more of an effort. So I do want to talk to you guys about something. I want to give a shout out to l'. Ange. You guys, they have so many great, like different types of tools to do your hair. I got the two in one. Titanium brush dryer. You know when you get a fancy blowout at a hair salon? Yes, I can do that now at home.

[Jenna Fischer]

Lady, you sent me a picture after you did your hair with that thing and I thought you had a professional blowout.

[Angela Kinsey]

My next thing is I'm getting one of those fancy curling wands.

[Jenna Fischer]

Lady, you can't be stopped. Thanks to l'. Ange.

[Angela Kinsey]

And it is true. And if I can do this, you can.

[Jenna Fischer]

They also have a lot of really great hair products. They have other styling tools. Go to l'angehair.com and use code officeladies to get 20% off your first order. That's L A N G E h a I r.com and use code officeladies to get 20% off your first order.

[Angela Kinsey]

Who says you have to wait for someone else to splurge on you for Mother's Day? Because sometimes the best gifts are the ones you pick out yourself. Maybe it's been a busy season. Maybe you've been showing up for everyone else. Or maybe you just want something that feels a little extra special.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, consider this your sign to go for it. Macy's has so many splurge worthy options across every category, so you really can treat yourself your way. Maybe you want to upgrade your beauty routine with some great new products from Miu Miu. Or maybe you're like Angela and you're going to treat yourself to some timeless jewelry.

[Angela Kinsey]

And how about refreshing your wardrobe?

[Jenna Fischer]

And if you want help styling, Macy's personal stylists are there to make it easy. You can book a free session and get help putting together the perfect look for Mother's Day brunch or any other plans you might have coming up. And you'll even get 20% off your purchase when you shop with them.

[Angela Kinsey]

So go ahead, make this the year you treat yourself.

[Jenna Fischer]

Shop now@macy's.com or in store.