Second Drink: Performance Review with Larry Wilmore

Summary

Podcast Summary: Office Ladies – "Second Drink: Performance Review with Larry Wilmore"

Episode Overview

In the episode titled "Performance Review," released on February 3, 2025, Jenna Fischer and Angela Kinsey, beloved co-stars from The Office, embark on a comprehensive breakdown of the episode "Performance Review." This episode, penned by writer Larry Wilmore, offers listeners an in-depth exploration of Michael Scott's unconventional performance reviews, enriched with exclusive behind-the-scenes anecdotes and insightful discussions about the show's creative process.

Introduction and Episode Breakdown

The hosts open the episode with excitement about having Larry Wilmore as their guest, noting his dual role as a writer and performer on The Office. They introduce the central theme of "Performance Review," highlighting its fan-favorite cold open where Dwight Schrute abandons his desk chair for a fitness orb (02:11). Angela shares the playful brainstorming process behind naming the fitness orb, revealing various draft names like "fitness orb" and "yoga orb" before settling on "fitness orb" (03:01).

Behind-the-Scenes Stories and Deleted Scenes

Angela and Jenna delve into several behind-the-scenes stories, emphasizing the collaborative nature of the writers' room. Larry Wilmore discusses the use of index cards to develop episode ideas, citing the "Thursday Friday" concept as an example of how multiple ideas were merged to create memorable moments (04:31). They also explore deleted scenes, such as Oscar's performance review where Michael underestimates Oscar's concerns, leading to humorous yet poignant interactions (06:14).

Notably, Angela shares an amusing anecdote about an accidental blooper during the cold open where the fitness orb unexpectedly popped, adding a layer of authenticity to the scene. Larry explains his decision to include this blooper in the final cut, highlighting the balance between scripted content and spontaneous humor (22:58).

Interview with Larry Wilmore

The heart of the episode is an engaging interview with Larry Wilmore. He recounts his journey from writing and producing shows like The Bernie Mac Show to becoming an integral part of The Office. Larry reflects on the initial skepticism surrounding the American adaptation of the show and how the writers' room fostered a creative sanctuary where ideas flourished freely (27:08).

Larry emphasizes the democratic nature of the writers' room, where ideas from index cards were collaboratively developed into full episodes. He shares his fondness for moments where characters like Dwight and Creed delivered standout performances, blending scripted lines with improvisational flair to enhance the show's realism (30:36). Larry also touches on the romantic core of The Office, particularly the Jim-Pam relationship, describing it as the show's emotional backbone that elevated its comedic elements (34:21).

Notable Quotes

• Angela Kinsey at 03:01: "The writers were trying to figure out what to call it as well, because I found candy bag alts for it."
• Larry Wilmore at 04:31: "We put like two or three cards together and that would be an episode."
• Oscar Nunez at 06:14: "Michael says, 'So good. Something to work on. Being here more.'"
• Larry Wilmore at 31:52: "Greg's philosophy was just write it as if we're gonna go off the air, so write ourselves in the corner."
• Angela Kinsey at 63:00: "There are six cards in the suggestion box."

Production Insights

The hosts discuss technical aspects of production, such as the meticulous planning behind camera placements to capture intimate moments without intruding. They highlight how the suggestion box scene was carefully scripted to maintain comedic rhythm, ensuring that each card Dwight pulls aligns with the episode's narrative flow (36:17).

Jenna shares insights into performing while ill, detailing how she memorized her lines despite battling a sinus infection. This dedication was commended by Greg Daniels, who praised her outstanding performance under challenging circumstances (16:27). Angela remarks on Rainn Wilson's love for props, specifically the fitness orb, which required multiple takes to achieve the perfect slow deflation effect without prematurely popping (20:13).

Actor Experiences and On-Set Dynamics

Jenna and Angela reminisce about their experiences filming "Performance Review," highlighting moments of camaraderie and spontaneous humor. They recount scenes where accidental touches and improvised lines added depth and laughter to the episodes. Larry Wilmore praises the cast's ability to blend scripted dialogue with genuine interactions, creating a natural and relatable workplace environment (38:02).

Character Development and Storytelling

The discussion delves into character arcs, particularly focusing on Michael Scott's misguided performance reviews and Dwight Schrute's overzealous dedication to his role. They explore how these interactions contribute to the show's overarching themes of workplace dynamics and personal growth. Angela points out subtle cues, such as Dwight’s thoughtful looks and interactions, that hint at deeper storylines and character relationships (50:28).

Closing Thoughts

As the episode concludes, Jenna and Angela express their gratitude to Larry Wilmore for his invaluable contributions and candid reflections on his time with The Office. They tease upcoming episodes featuring special guests like Ken Jeong, promising more exclusive insights and nostalgic moments for fans (75:24).

Conclusion

"Performance Review" serves as a rich, detailed exploration of one of The Office's standout episodes, offering listeners a blend of nostalgic reflection and fresh insights. Jenna Fischer and Angela Kinsey's chemistry and deep understanding of the show's creative process provide an engaging and informative experience, making this episode a must-listen for fans seeking a deeper appreciation of the beloved series.

Transcript

[Angela Kinsey]

One of my favorite things to do with my family is to go on a road trip. We are road trippers. Josh and I love to pack up the car and hit the road with our kids. And I just love the sense of adventure, of exploring new places. And we love to use Airbnb. We love staying in a home. We love having a kitchen, having some type of backyard, our patio to sit on at night. I love the privacy of it. And also it just feels like you're still at home even though you're on this adventure because you make your own home. And you know, Airbnb is just so great for families because you can really pick a place that suits your whole group. You know, we did that one year with my family. We all met up in the mountains and picked this great Airbnb and all stayed in it together. Cousins and nieces and nephews and aunts and uncles. It was so much fun and it was so cozy. And Airbnb really made that family memory special. So use Airbnb for your next adventure.

[Jenna Fischer]

It's the sweetest time of year. That's right. Valentine's Day is approaching and Macy's has the best of the best gifts for your loved ones. This Valentine's Day, let Macy's be your guide to gifting. I love shopping on Macy's dot com. They really, really do have everything and their gift guide is amazing. I've gotten so many good ideas from the Macy's gift guide. I did probably two thirds of my Christmas shopping on Macy's.com this year with my kids. We do a gift for Valentine's Day, a small gift instead of candy. We don't do a lot of candy. There's been enough candy with Halloween and the Christmas stocking and all of that. So when we get to Valentine's Day, I like to wrap up a little something for them. Macy's has got you covered for the adult loved one in your life and the kid loved one in your life. Shop Macy's Gift Guides for the perfect hand picked items for everyone on your list this Valentine's Day, let Macy's be your guide to gifting. Shop in store or online@macy's.com giftguide.

[Angela Kinsey]

Welcome to Second Drink Performance Review. Oh man. I found some fun new stuff for this one.

[Jenna Fischer]

I can't wait to hear. Angela. This episode is really great. We have writer Larry Wilmore on with us to share about his time writing on the Office and also playing Mr. Brown.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah, Larry was our very first writer from the show as a guest on our podcast I know.

[Jenna Fischer]

I love that.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, Jenna, are you ready for some fun new tidbits?

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

Performance review has a fan favorite, Cold open. It's when Dwight has decided to ditch having a desk chair and instead he gets a fitness thingy. Yeah, yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

The ball thing.

[Angela Kinsey]

What do you call it? The ball thing.

[Jenna Fischer]

I mean, it's like a. What's that thing? A medicine ball. But no, medicine balls are the small, heavy ones.

[Angela Kinsey]

Big, heavy ones.

[Jenna Fischer]

I don't know what I call it.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, I think the writers were trying to figure out what to call it as well, because I found candy bag alts for it.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh.

[Angela Kinsey]

In the shooting draft, Jim had this little bit of extra dialogue. He would look at Dwight sitting on the ball thing, and then Dwight would look at him and say, do you know what this is? And Jim would say, it's a hippity hop. The good ones have handles. And then they had a series of candy bag alts for what to call it. First, Dwight says it's a fitness ball. It changed my life.

[Jenna Fischer]

Fitness ball. I think that's what I would call it.

[Angela Kinsey]

The next candy bag alt, Dwight says it's a yoga orb. Oh, now we're in the orb world. Okay, the next one, Dwight says it's a fitness orb.

[Jenna Fischer]

Isn't that the one we settled on?

[Angela Kinsey]

That's the one they settled on. I did an Internet search and could not find it being called an orb anywhere.

[Jenna Fischer]

What was it called in your Internet search?

[Angela Kinsey]

Exercise ball, balance, Ball, stability, Ball.

[Jenna Fischer]

A lot of balls.

[Angela Kinsey]

A lot of balls. No orbs.

[Jenna Fischer]

That's what she said.

[Angela Kinsey]

I think our writers room was having some fun there. Guess what else?

[Jenna Fischer]

What?

[Angela Kinsey]

There was a DVD commentary for this.

[Jenna Fischer]

Episode that we never talked about? No.

[Angela Kinsey]

It features Rainnnn Wilson, Oscar Nunez, Paul Lieberstein, Melora Hardin, Larry Wilmore, Paul Feig, and me.

[Jenna Fischer]

You were on a commentary and you didn't even mention it?

[Angela Kinsey]

No, I didn't. Oh, man. Well, it's got a ton of fun stuff, but I thought I'd share two things.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay.

[Angela Kinsey]

First of all, when we interviewed Larry for this episode, he shared about the index cards on the writer's room wall. We talk about that in this breakdown, but I learned from the commentary that this episode was partly inspired by one of the cards on the wall. Here's what Larry had to say on the DVD commentary.

[Larry Wilmore]

This is the start of the Thursday Friday. The Thursday Friday idea, which I remember that when this episode was put together, there were about four different ideas that were just scrunched together to make an episode. And Thursday Friday was Just on the board on a card. And I said, what's Thursday? Friday? Oh, yeah, that's when Dwight thinks it's Friday, but it's Thursday. I said, oh, that'd be great in this episode. So it just became part of this episode. Like, it just seemed like a real funny thing to.

[Jenna Fischer]

It is.

[Oscar Nunez]

I love that.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, Thursday, Friday.

[Angela Kinsey]

Just a card on the wall. Thursday, Friday. Larry also said there was a runner with Ryan where he purposely puts himself on a treasure hunt to escape the suggestion box meeting. It's in deleted scenes. It starts in the conference room. Michael takes a note from the suggestion box that says, look on the supply shelf. And then Michael asks Ryan to go and look. Then Ryan yells from outside the conference room in the bullpen, oh, hey, there's another note. It says, look on the windshield. Dwight says, which windshield? And Ryan says, it doesn't say, but I'll look on all of them. And he's basically. Now he's out. He's in the parking lot. He's out of the office for the day.

[Jenna Fischer]

Do you think this was because they needed BJ in the writers room?

[Angela Kinsey]

Probably.

[Jenna Fischer]

This was a construct to get him out of all of the background work, I bet.

[Angela Kinsey]

I think so. And then lastly, Jenna, you mentioned in our initial breakdown that there were some great deleted scenes for this episode.

[Jenna Fischer]

I remember there were so many.

[Angela Kinsey]

Almost 11 minutes of deleted scenes. And, you know, in talking to Dave Rogers, we know a lot of these deleted scenes end up in the Superfan episodes, but I think we need to hear a few of them.

[Jenna Fischer]

Great.

[Angela Kinsey]

First, Oscar has a talking head about why he is worried about his performance review. It's really funny. Let's hear it.

[Oscar Nunez]

Oscar, I'm ready for you. Today's performance review day, Company Wide, and.

[Larry Wilmore]

I'm a little concerned about my review. I exceeded my sick days and my.

[Oscar Nunez]

Personal days because I just couldn't take it.

[Larry Wilmore]

And I don't have a good answer.

[Jenna Fischer]

For him when he asks me, amazing, Amazing.

[Angela Kinsey]

He just couldn't take it. That's why he didn't come in. And so now he goes into the conference room to have his performance review. And he's prepared for Michael to have a reaction to the fact that he's missed so many days. And here's what Michael says. Michael says, so. And Oscar goes, michael, I don't know what to say. And Michael goes, you're in accounting. Oscar says, yes. Yes, I am. I'm sorry about the extra days. I know it's past my limit. Michael says, so good. Something to work on. Being here More. And then he looks around and says, I've always been a believer in people being here more. Oscar looks at him for a beat, then looks to camera and subtly shrugs.

[Jenna Fischer]

I mean, does Oscar not know Michael? I wouldn't have worried. I don't think Michael's tracking anything outside of his own interests.

[Angela Kinsey]

I know. Next up, in deleted scenes, Jim asks Michael about his date with Jan. Oh. In baseball terms. And Jim is clearly messing with Michael. I went to the shooting draft and part of this is scripted, part of it is improvised. Let's hear it.

[Larry Wilmore]

Oh, that's. That's great. Yes, it is. Yeah. Do you have fun? Yes, I did. Do you go to first base? Hell yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah. Second. What? Second.

[Oscar Nunez]

Kind of. Yeah. Over the shirt. My elbow.

[Larry Wilmore]

Okay, so close call in second. Was there an infield fly?

[Oscar Nunez]

Yep. Wait, yes.

[Larry Wilmore]

Pop up. No.

[Oscar Nunez]

Later. There was.

[Larry Wilmore]

Really?

[Oscar Nunez]

Yes.

[Larry Wilmore]

So you got the signal from the third base coach. You know what I'm saying? Like if there was a, you know, fly out to deep, right, you know that runner on second, he tagged up, didn't he?

[Oscar Nunez]

I didn't. You know, it was. It was dark for one thing.

[Angela Kinsey]

In the shooting draft, this scene ends with Michael saying, you know, I'm more of a hockey person.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, I like that.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. And then lady Michael makes a phone call that you will not believe. I don't even want to say more than that. You just have to hear who he calls.

[Oscar Nunez]

Okay, yeah, that got a little out of control. Jan's taking a break, which is fine. I'm doing the same. Just chilling. Get my mind off of us. She's right. I need to be more professional at the office when I'm at work. I need to focus on work. I should call her ex husband. Hello, Is this our Gould? Hi there. My name is Michael Scott. I work at Dunder Mifflin. I believe I work with your ex wife, Jan. Yeah, that's right. Yes. I was wondering if I could ask a personal question about her. Mm, okay. Well, could I ask anyway? Uh huh. Well, I'm just gonna ask. When you guys were dating, was she sort of easy to get and then really hard to get? Yeah. That Gould is a real interesting guy, Gem.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. And then it goes on and Michael's like, well, if that phone call is any indication, that guy is not a nice guy. Like any wonder it didn't work out. It is really funny.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh my gosh.

[Angela Kinsey]

All right, finally, we need to wrap up this second drink with a Michael talking head from deleted scenes. I would describe it, but I don't want to ruin it.

[Jenna Fischer]

Another one.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes. Yes.

[Oscar Nunez]

What is an office? Is it a group of people? Maybe? Is it an idea? Of course, yes. Is it a living organism? Exactly. Yes. And any single cell organism has to have a spine, and that's me. But the spine is always controlled by a brain, and that is Jan. But the brain needs a heart, and that is me. Again, so ironic. You know what? The heart is smarter than the brain. But the brain is so effing hot.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay, I am pretty certain I was there when he did that talking head because I am having like a flood of memories come in of being around the monitor, watching that and loving it so very much. Oh, I'm so glad that exists somewhere now.

[Angela Kinsey]

Isn't that so great? But the brain is so effing hot.

[Jenna Fischer]

So effing hot.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, that was my second drink. This is such a great episode.

[Jenna Fischer]

Thank you so much for those, Angela. And now, everyone, here is our breakdown of performance review with Larry Wilmore. I'm Jenna Fisher.

[Angela Kinsey]

And I'm Angela Kinsey.

[Jenna Fischer]

We were on the Office together and we're best friends. And now we're doing the ultimate Office Rewatch podcast just for you.

[Angela Kinsey]

Each week we will break down an episode of the Office and give exclusive behind the scenes stories that only two people who were there can tell you.

[Jenna Fischer]

We're the Office ladies. That's us.

[Angela Kinsey]

Happy New Year.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. This is our first episode that we recorded after our two week Christmas and holiday break.

[Angela Kinsey]

We are back, guys. We're what? I don't know.

[Jenna Fischer]

You didn't have an end to that sentence?

[Angela Kinsey]

I didn't. I was going to say we're back. We're freezing our butts off.

[Jenna Fischer]

It's cold in here. And I just had to wait like five. It felt like almost a full 10 minutes for Angela to lay all her cards on the desk. It is such a. I'm sorry, did.

[Angela Kinsey]

You say, did you say allow all her cards on the desk?

[Jenna Fischer]

I said lay out all. Lay it all.

[Angela Kinsey]

Lay it all. Is that St. Louis?

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, you're just mad because of Waffle Ball and chunk it.

[Angela Kinsey]

Hey, you know what? People in Texas say chunk it. Here I was being like all self conscious because you said, no, it's chuck it. Then I'm talking to my mom over the holidays and we're talking about going through the garage and she goes, ah, just chunk it. It's a Texas thing, lady.

[Jenna Fischer]

It is. I will admit it, because I came home that day and I was telling my husband Lee, who grew up in Texas, all about the chunk it thing. And how much it made me laugh. And he said to me, jenna, I moved to Texas in middle school. And I had that same conversation. Someone said, just chunk it. And I said, what? Chunk it. He's like, they say it. They do. It's like pop and soda.

[Angela Kinsey]

Thank you.

[Jenna Fischer]

Right?

[Angela Kinsey]

Thank you. And I guess, sorry, Texas, don't be sorry. Just chunk it. And I guess in St. Louis, they say, I'm not. Lay out on the table.

[Jenna Fischer]

No, lay out all your cards.

[Angela Kinsey]

Lay out all your cards.

[Jenna Fischer]

Shall we begin?

[Angela Kinsey]

Let's begin.

[Jenna Fischer]

All right. Performance review Season 2, Episode 8 written by Larry Wilmore and directed by Paul Feig. I'm going to give you a summary. In this episode, Michael is supposed to be conducting performance reviews of his staff. But instead, he calls everyone into his office one by one to help him decipher a voicemail from Jan. Because if you remember, in the previous episode, he and Jan hooked up.

[Angela Kinsey]

They did. They smooched in the parking lot, maybe played some grabby games back at her place.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. And he is convinced now that they are boyfriend and girlfriend. Even though it's clear that Jan has said this is a one time thing, please make nothing of it, Michael is determined to read between the lines. Also in this episode, Pam and Jim prank Dwight by convincing him that it is Friday instead of Thursday. The end of the summary summary is done.

[Angela Kinsey]

Jenna, that was a fantastic summary.

[Jenna Fischer]

Thank you.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well done.

[Jenna Fischer]

Thank you so much. All right, you want fast fact number one?

[Angela Kinsey]

I do.

[Jenna Fischer]

Fast fact number one, I said. This is written by Larry Wilmore. You guys, I hope you remember he played Mr. Brown in our Diversity Day episode.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes. Larry was a writer and producer and an amazing performer.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. And we are going to speak with Larry today. Larry is so great. I have such fond memories of working with him. You know, he created the Bernie Mac show. He has been a correspondent on the Daily Show. We've talked a little bit about this super talented guy.

[Angela Kinsey]

I'm really excited to talk to him. Cause he was just. He's so smart and funny. I think that was one of the things about our writers room is like how fricking smart they were. They were really smart.

[Jenna Fischer]

I think people underestimate how smart you have to be to be a great writer.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

Like they really go hand in hand, I think. I don't know. Sometimes I wonder, have we wasted all these minds? Should they be off making scientific discoveries? Because some of them were some just like the most brilliant people I've ever met. And they're just sitting writing great jokes.

[Angela Kinsey]

But then without them, we Wouldn't have the fitness orb fast.

[Jenna Fischer]

Fact number two, I was really sick in this episode.

[Angela Kinsey]

You were so sick.

[Jenna Fischer]

Do you remember that?

[Angela Kinsey]

Not only do I remember that you were sick, but I wrote down a quote that I read online. It says.

[Jenna Fischer]

Where did you read this?

[Angela Kinsey]

On Wikipedia. On the office performance review. Wikipedia, it says, jenna Fisher came down with a cold. Instead of postponing, however, Fisher memorized and performed all her lines, resulting in fellow cast member Angela Kinsey calling her a trooper. You were in this episode because you were really, really sick. But that's one thing I think you guys. I don't know if you guys know this, but when you're on a set and you get sick, you don't go home.

[Jenna Fischer]

No.

[Angela Kinsey]

They literally prop you up because so many people, like, what, 300 people, their whole day revolves around that day's filming.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

And so it's.

[Jenna Fischer]

They can't shut down the filming just because you don't feel good.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. So a doctor will show up, give you a shot. You stay at work.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, yeah. I mean, I've seen them tape people. They're like, oh, have you stopped vomiting for 30 minutes? Let's get you on set and see what we can grab. Oh, yeah, like, that happens. So I was really sick. This was my first time ever having to perform this ill. I took tons of Sudafed. I had a sinus infection.

[Angela Kinsey]

You were a little loopy.

[Jenna Fischer]

I was super loopy. Here's what's crazy. At the end of the week, Greg Daniels called my manager about my performance in this episode, and my manager called me. I get this message. Jenna, please call me. Greg Daniels has called about your performance in this week's episode, and I want to speak with you about it.

[Angela Kinsey]

Shiitake mushrooms.

[Jenna Fischer]

I thought I was being fired.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

I thought, oh, my gosh. This is it.

[Angela Kinsey]

That's it.

[Jenna Fischer]

I don't know. Why did you. I. As an actor, especially in the early days and on early shows, I always felt like I could be fired at any moment.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh. Me and Brian and Oscar were always like, accounting's totally replaceable. We could be fired at any time.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, that's not true. But yes. You have this feeling like I'm failing constantly.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

So my manager says, jenna, we got this phone call, and she got all my agents on the phone too. Which you're like, oh, my gosh. They only do that if it's great.

[Angela Kinsey]

News or horrible news or really bad news. Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

So I'm like. And she's like, we received a phone call from Greg Daniels because he Wanted all of us to know how outstanding you were in this episode, that it was some of your best work, and to please say whatever it is you did to prepare for this episode. Keep it up, Sudafed. I was like, well, I don't know what to do with this compliment. Clearly, I'm a fantastic actress on Sudafed.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. Well, okay.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay. Should I move on to fast fact number three?

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes.

[Jenna Fischer]

All right. Fast fact number three is also a belated fast fact. I realized I missed something a couple of episodes back in the fight.

[Angela Kinsey]

What?

[Jenna Fischer]

Which applies to all the episodes moving forward. Talking about cold opens, do you want.

[Angela Kinsey]

To tell folks what a cold open is?

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. So in a script, scripts usually have, like, a three act structure where you tell the story right in, like, a little mini three act.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, we started doing this thing that we called the cold open, and it's before the credits, and it's a little joke or almost like a standalone moment that might apply later to the episode, but also might not.

[Angela Kinsey]

Might not. It's just like its own little moment.

[Jenna Fischer]

So that was something that our show did. We had these little cold opens, and then we're also gonna start adding tags soon.

[Angela Kinsey]

Ooh, tags are fun. Tags were at the end.

[Jenna Fischer]

At the very end. We would come back from a commercial break and you'd get, like, a seven second tag. They were very short.

[Angela Kinsey]

Really short.

[Jenna Fischer]

Another little joke.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah, they were always really short. Like maybe just one page, three lines, Just something really tiny.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. In this episode, we have a cold open that is one of our most famous cold opens. The fitness orb.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes.

[Jenna Fischer]

Which is so great. And we had a ton of fan questions about this. Probably our most frequently asked moment about this episode.

[Angela Kinsey]

For sure.

[Jenna Fischer]

Definitely. For example, Fernanda Fuentes and Derek Ford both asked, how many times did you have to film the cold open with Dwight's fitness ball? And David Nicholas asked, how many fitness orbs did you go through before it popped just right? Well, everyone, it was not meant to pop.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh. First of all, Jenna, you look really excited. Are you sitting on some info?

[Jenna Fischer]

I'm sitting on some info. I traded messages with Phil Shea. Phil Shea, props master. Yes. He told me all about the fitness orbs. So first of all, he bought 17.

[Angela Kinsey]

Seventeen fitness orbs?

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. And he practiced with John using three of them.

[Angela Kinsey]

Phil Shea sat on them and John, like, hit.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

Phil Shea was. Talk about a trooper. Phil Shea.

[Jenna Fischer]

He's amazing. So the idea was that John would stick the scissors into the fitness orb, and it would deflate very slowly, and the camera would be in Front of Dwight's desk, and you would just see him very slowly melt to the floor as Jim very smugly looks on. Yes. That was what was in the script. So they practiced three times. It worked perfectly. And they had 14 left for the scene. And Phil said to John, as long as you don't hit the seam of the ball with the scissors, which would be like a 1 in million chance that you could do it, the ball will slowly deflate and it will work as planned.

[Angela Kinsey]

So it's also very hard to see the seam.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, yeah, Yeah. I mean, yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

You would have to hit it just right.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. It would be basically impossible to do.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

So they did 13 takes, and it worked just right, and everyone was happy. And they were about to move on. And Phil said, I have one more ball.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

So Paul Feig said, oh, what the heck? Let's just do one more.

[Angela Kinsey]

And in all the 13 takes, you guys Rain, as Dwight slowly sunk to the ground, like, yeah, right.

[Jenna Fischer]

And it was perfect. So they have an extra ball. They're like, we'll just do one more.

[Angela Kinsey]

Let's do it.

[Jenna Fischer]

On that last take, John hit the seam by accident. And you can see the shock on Rain's face when he. It exploded and he fell to the floor. We were all completely shocked. We were like, oh, my God. And you can totally see John break. You can see his shoulders. And he very quickly. Oh, he's such a pro. He turns his back and his camera.

[Angela Kinsey]

He dies out of the scene.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. He just, like, leaves.

[Angela Kinsey]

Phyllis was really surprised, too.

[Jenna Fischer]

I swear, you can hear somebody say, what? Like, either Jon or Rain is like, what is happening? And they were gonna cut that out. They were like, oh, my gosh, we're so sorry, Rain, Are you all right? We were laughing so hard. And when they went in to edit the episode, they put in what was scripted. They put in the slow deflate. And it was Larry Wilmore, the writer, who said, you have to put the blooper one in. You have to put the fast pop in.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah, he fought for that.

[Jenna Fischer]

He fought for that, and he was right. That is an amazing moment that is an example of just a perfect cold open. And now I think we should take a little break, and we'll come back with our interview with Larry.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes. We're gonna come back and talk to Larry Wilmore, writer of this episode. This podcast is sponsored by Squarespace. We love Squarespace. We have talked about it for years. So here's the thing. Squarespace is an all in one website platform for entrepreneurs to stand out and succeed online. I was just talking to a friend who's about to start a business. She wants a website. I was like, go to Squarespace. They have all these different templates. You can design it just for what you need and it's easy to use. Depending on what your business is, Squarespace can help you set up email campaigns. They can also help you with your analytics so you know when people are coming to your site, what they're looking at. It gives you all the details. Squarespace also has Fluid Engine. Fluid Engine is a next generation website editor. It's never been easier for anyone to unlock unbreakable creativity. So you choose your website starting point and you customize every design detail and you can reimagine it. You can drag and drop technology for your desktop or mobile. What we love about Squarespace is as our company has grown, our website needs have changed. And Squarespace has everything you need to adapt and make the website look exactly the way you want it and fit your needs. We love Squarespace. Head over to squarespace.com for a free trial. And when you're ready to Launch, go to squarespace.com to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain.

[Jenna Fischer]

I can't be the only person who feels like I'm constantly running out to an event like a dinner or a school function in the same four outfits, because I basically just have fallen into this pattern of re wearing the same few pieces that I've owned for years. But thanks to Daily look, it's easier than ever to refresh your wardrobe and get event ready. It is the number one highest rated premium personal styling service for women. Dailylook provides you with a dedicated personal stylist. Hello. Thank you. Who curates a box of clothes just for you. Each box is tailored to your body shape, to your preferences, to your lifestyle. Hello. Drawstring pants. And it's delivered right to your door, so you can enjoy the ease of trying everything on at home. Thank you. And you save time and effort. Whatever you don't like, you just send it back. There's free shipping included. Plus you get real personal stylists, not just algorithms, so you get a personalized experience each time. Elevate your style by signing [e-mail] today. Take your style [e-mail] and get 50% off your first styling fee when you use Code Officeladies at checkout.

[Angela Kinsey]

So if you're a renter and you haven't heard of Bilt, we're going to tell you about it here's.

[Jenna Fischer]

What you can do. You use BILT to pay your rental bill every month, and then you get points. You can use those points toward flights, hotel stays, fitness classes. You can even apply the points to your next rent payment.

[Angela Kinsey]

There's no cost to join bilt, and as a member, you'll earn valuable points on rent and on your everyday spending.

[Jenna Fischer]

There are over 500 airlines and 700,000 hotels and properties around the world where you can redeem your points.

[Angela Kinsey]

Points can also be redeemed towards a future rent payment and unique experiences that only BILT members can access.

[Jenna Fischer]

Start earning points. Points on rent you're already paying by going to joinbuilt.com officeladies that's J-O-I-N-B-I-L-T.com officeladies make sure to use our URL so they know we sent you. Join bilt.com officeladies to start earning points on your rent payments today.

[Angela Kinsey]

All right, Sam, let's give Larry a call.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah, let's call. Call him up.

[Larry Wilmore]

Hey, how's it going?

[Angela Kinsey]

Hi, Larry.

[Larry Wilmore]

It's so nice to hear you guys.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, my gosh. Same. We're so happy this worked out.

[Larry Wilmore]

Congrats on the pod, guys. What a great idea, too.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, thank you, thank you. We're loving it.

[Angela Kinsey]

I mean, you know, Larry, we're just two chatty BFFs that get to talk about our favorite job ever.

[Larry Wilmore]

From the beginning. From the beginning.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay. Well, Larry, thank you so much for joining us. Do you know you are our first writer as a guest.

[Larry Wilmore]

Wow. Woo hoo.

[Angela Kinsey]

Woo hoo. And so one of the questions we're asking everyone that comes on is how did it come about that you became part of the Office?

[Larry Wilmore]

God, I have so many fond memories of that time. Mine is a little bit more complicated, I guess, than everybody else. I had just started a deal with NBC at that time. I had just done the Bernie Mac show. And I knew Greg from before. I had done a show called the PJs and he was on King of the Hill. And we used to see each other all the time. Greg was a buddy of mine and he had never done a single camera show before. And NBC wanted to know if I wanted to consult on that while I was developing, you know, just to be another voice in there, you know. Of course I thought it was great because I had actually seen the Office years before when I went to England to do this sitcom seminar type thing or whatever, and people were screening their sitcoms and I was screening the pilot of The Bernie Mac Show. And Ash Itala, who was a producer in the original Office, was screening the Comic Relief episode, I think, of the Office, the one where they wear the red noses. And I had never seen the Office before. And it was great, of course, you know, and we were all, like, congratulating each other afterwards. And I remember he came to me and says, larry, can you promise me one thing? I said, sure. He says, please don't let them take this to America and ruin it. I go, of course not. I said, by the way, if it ever goes to America, I won't have anything to do with it. Smash cut. Here I am working on the American version of the Office. And it's funny in the beginning. This is something I don't know if you guys how much you realize in the beginning of what was going on that there was a lot of negativity in showbiz about our show. We were kind of sequestered from it because, remember, we were shooting in that old warehouse in mid LA that first five episodes, you know.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, yeah.

[Larry Wilmore]

And people thought we were going to ruin the Office. Like, I would talk to writers around town, and they were real snotty about it. They said, so what are you working on? I said, oh, I'm working on the Office. They go, oh, okay. I'm like, what? It's good, guys. It's going to be good. And Greg, you know, as you guys know, so brilliant. I feel Greg's philosophy was just write it as if we're gonna go off the air, you know, so write ourselves in the corner, especially with Pam and Jim and all that kind of stuff, and just, you know, just have as much fun as possible. So there was such a great feeling in the writers room that we could just do whatever we wanted. Cause, you know, who cared? We might be off the air. We may as well just go for it.

[Jenna Fischer]

That's such a good insight, because I felt that way, too. I felt like we were making the show in a bubble or making it for our own amusement sometimes.

[Angela Kinsey]

Do you remember our table reads in the beginning? They weren't around a table. We would just sit on the set. We'd all pull up our desk chairs and we'd sit in a circle. And then during our hiatus, I did a guest star and I went in for the table read, and it was like a big deal. There was a big table and everyone sat around it, and you had, like, a little placard with your name and, like, your lines had been highlighted, and there was network people there. And I just Remember that first season of the Office? We really were just sort of like on our own.

[Larry Wilmore]

It felt like, yeah, we were the little engine that could.

[Jenna Fischer]

What was it like in the writers room?

[Larry Wilmore]

The way the writers room went on the Office, especially in the early days, was whatever idea we had would go in a little index card and would be slapped on the walls. You know, after a while, we had all these ideas that were just slapped on the wall that were just really funny comic ideas of what could happen. And in many instances, the way we created episode was we put like two or three cards together and that would be an episode, you know, and that's how ideas were generally generated. Us just making each other laugh. And whoever came up with the idea didn't necessarily write the show, by the way. It was very democratic in that way. Greg would just hand it out to whoever and you would just write that episode. So everybody had a hand in all the episodes. You know, even though we each went out and wrote a draft, we all contributed to the episode before it went out, of course, when it came back in, you know, and that was a lot of fun. My one regret was in the second season, I came up with that Halloween episode idea and I really wanted to write that one. I was like, I was kind of salty that I didn't get to write it. But, you know, you didn't care. You got over it. It was still fun. But that idea, just from me thinking it would be very funny if Michael had to fire somebody while they were in costume, it just came from that simple joke, you know, like they fire somebody during Halloween. And the ride episodes just started from just a central joke like that, and it would expand out to an episode.

[Angela Kinsey]

We so enjoyed your performance in Diversity Day. I mean, we knew you as a writer. We knew you as our, you know, our writer, producer. But then when you got to perform, you were so fantastic. And then I had just such a new appreciation for it. I remember thinking you were amazing when we were filming it, but then watching it, you were so perfect as Mr. Brown.

[Larry Wilmore]

Oh, thank you, Evangel. It's so nice of you. Ken I had a relationship with as well. He directed the pilot of the Bernie Mac show. And I knew Ken very well. Ken Kwapas, who was the director. And at the time, I was kind of going through a transition in my career. My evil plan had always been to create a show for myself. I was starting my career as a performer as well as a stand up and an actor and all that kind of stuff. And I started writing and producing in Television because I felt like Hollywood couldn't find me. It was better for me to create a space for myself. I was just. The kind of comedy that I did was just a little different. And I really enjoyed writing and producing once I started doing it. And after the whole Bernie Mac show debacle, I thought, well, now maybe time to start thinking about this other gear. And when I was on the Office, I remember reading. I think I read that part at the table, but I didn't have an intention of playing it just because I was real busy. And I really believe that we should hire actors, give actors a shot to do this. Even though Greg's philosophy on the show was he really wanted the writers to perform, too, which was really fantastic. And people like Mindy and BJ and even Paul Lieberstein, who, by the way, I had hired on the Bringing Mac Show. I had no idea Paul. I would have hired him on my show. He was so great. And it gave it such an interesting feel, you know, to have writers being a part of it and to have, you know, people who were in the background, like Angela, some of the ad libs you guys started doing in the life, the way you guys brought those characters to life with not really a lot of material in the beginning was fantastic. You know, just even the looks you guys gave and all that stuff really gave this organic feel to it, you know. But in the beginning, I really didn't want to play that part. And Ken kind of talked me into it. You know, I just wasn't thinking about it. I just thought, yeah, we should be bringing in actors. But then I realized that's kind of what we're doing on the show, is we're all kind of, like, pitching into this thing. So once I embraced it, I just ended up just having a lot of fun. And by the way, I saved some of those outtakes from it. And Steve Carell was so hilarious, as you remember, when he was doing the whole Chris Rock thing. It was just so funny. I was just crying, laughing. Which we probably couldn't even do that episode today, you know, because it was so inappropriate in so many glorious ways, you know.

[Jenna Fischer]

Do people approach you and call you Mr. Brown all the time?

[Larry Wilmore]

It's crazy. People say, like, I have all these different, I guess, identities to people. Like, some people know me from the Nightly show or the Daily Show. Some people just know me from the office and from that role, you know, and from other things that I do. But it's amazing. And they don't say Larry Wilmore. They say Mr. Brown that's what they say, and that's it done. That's who I am in their minds. It's not gonna change, but I consider it an honor, I think. How many times, guys, do you get to play a part where I was on screen for what, a minute and a half, two minutes? And people remember that years later, the character's name. I mean, that's an honor to do that, you know.

[Jenna Fischer]

So the biggest thing people wanna know about this episode, Angela, you went through the questions.

[Angela Kinsey]

It's about the suggestion box. They all wanna know what was written, what was improvised. I know I got one line improvised in there that. But they were wondering, like, what were ones that didn't get read. Like, you guys must have pitched all kinds of things for that suggestion box.

[Larry Wilmore]

Not as much as people would think. I think pretty much my first draft made it through, I think to the floor on that one. The way that when I wrote that, remember the old Johnny Carson show where his psychic was Ed McMahon and Johnny would do this bit called Carnac where he would read something and Ed would repeat it. The. The fur from a camo and it would go. The fur from a camo? Yes. You know, and he would do this thing and it was so ridiculous. And I thought it would be very funny to put Dwight in that position where he had to repeat these things with Michael. And that's kind of how I constructed it comedically. But it was, you know, the way that it was constructed was very careful to lead, you know, to the way that it did, you know. So I don't remember there being a lot in the suggestion box. My recollection of it is that those things were chosen very carefully to go down a certain path, you know, rather than have a lot of things that were in there. That's kind of how I remember it.

[Jenna Fischer]

That makes total sense to me.

[Angela Kinsey]

It makes total sense. And also, if you think about it like that, when you watch it, there are camera movements that look very deliberate, you know, because you're panning to the people that have something to say.

[Larry Wilmore]

The thing what's great about the Office is things that feel like. By the way, of course, it was a very talented cast and your guys ability to improvise was great. But the opposite was. We were lucky to have on that too, is that we also created moments that looked very real and that sort of thing. And that was kind of the magic of the shows. We have both of those elements in the show. And so that scene, you know, I remember very carefully writing that scene because I knew the Rhythm was important in it, the comedic rhythm, you know, and so I think that's why there wasn't a lot of rewriting on it, because it had that certain rhythm to it that we wanted to kind of, kind of keep intact in it.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, I think something you. You were mentioning that people often don't realize how written the Office is, that people think it's mostly improvised, which it's not. It's mostly scripted. But you guys would even script some of those looks. You would. In the script, it would say camera pans to catch Angela looking judgy by her desk. Like you started to write in those moments.

[Larry Wilmore]

Yeah. And it is that combination of thing. It's the combination of us seeing what you guys were doing and then writing towards it. So it's the push and pull of that, you know, especially like that's why those first five episodes are so important. Because all the stuff that, you know, you guys were doing, we noticed all of those things because, remember, during those early days, I think all the writers were on the set the whole time, you know, I think we were all there, you know, watching it, you know, and just learning, you know, from what you guys were doing and trying to write towards it and that kind of stuff to help develop it and everything.

[Angela Kinsey]

So it did feel like a real creative collaboration. I always felt that way. And it's something it really was. I miss when we go to other shows now and work on other things, like, you really notice I felt the.

[Larry Wilmore]

Same, you know, and kudos to Greg Daniels, you know, who just wanted to do it differently, you know, wanted to do this collaborative process, you know, with both the writers and, and the actors and performers. And I don't. No one felt threatened by it. And look, think about Steve Carell, who's the star of the show, never felt threatened by any of this stuff and just was so collaborative and just funny and just love for other people to shine. Because we've been in business long enough, we know how that can be the opposite. Who's this person getting all these laughs? Why am I not getting these laughs? The show had something else that was really special. As you remember, Steve Merchant was also the co creator of the show with Ricky Gervais. And they would come by sometimes and I remember talking to Steve about it, of what he felt the show really was and from Steve Merchant always said that for him the show was a romantic comedy and it was his idea. The show was really about Jim and Pam, you know, Tim and Don was the show to him, Jim and Pam and to have that as part of our show, guys. It gave it this great, gorgeous center that was always something great to go to. It really made, like the harsh humor or the outrageous humor. It gave it a center that was special because we really wanted to root for these people. We hadn't quite seen something like that, and I never forgot that. I was like, wow. Sometimes in our minds, we're thinking of funny jokes and outrageous things. Yeah, diversity day. Those things are funny. But when you have that romantic story inside of it, man, it just raised it to that next level. To me, it was really what made. Especially in those early years, you know, when we didn't know what was gonna happen with them, you know, what's going on here? Is this guy getting his heart broken? Does Pam know what she's doing? You know, all those questions, even when we didn't quite answer them, they were always lurking in there. And things like that really enrich your story. You know, it really makes it a joy to write that type of thing. Even to this day, I'm still trying to figure out a romantic comedy to do on television. I think it's kind of underserved, you know?

[Angela Kinsey]

Larry, thank you so much for coming to be on our podcast. I know you're. You're super busy. You have a ton in development. You're producing so many things.

[Larry Wilmore]

You know, one of my goals always has been representation, trying to put stuff on television, whether it's people we don't get a chance to see or stories we don't get a chance to see, always as much as possible. So that's always in the back of my mind.

[Jenna Fischer]

And you have a podcast.

[Larry Wilmore]

Yeah. Larry Wilmore, Black on the Air. People can catch on the ringer networks, too.

[Jenna Fischer]

Thank you so much for coming on. This is amazing.

[Larry Wilmore]

Thanks for having me, guys. I remain big fans of both of you. Congrats on all your great success. So you guys have to come on my podcast now, now that I did yours.

[Angela Kinsey]

Ok, Deal. It's a date.

[Larry Wilmore]

Okay, you got it. Sounds great.

[Angela Kinsey]

All right, Larry, thank you so much.

[Jenna Fischer]

Thank you, Larry. We love you. Aw, that was so great.

[Angela Kinsey]

He's so smart and funny.

[Jenna Fischer]

Why do I get so emotional every time we just hear the voices of the people we worked with? Because we were a family.

[Angela Kinsey]

We were a family.

[Jenna Fischer]

All right, well, we're gonna take a break so I can be emotional. I'll pull myself together and we'll be back to break down the episode. This is a message from our sponsor, Intuit TurboTax. Now taxes is 100% free. When you file in the TurboTax app if you're a first time filer or didn't file with TurboTax last year. That's right. Just do your own taxes in the TurboTax app by February 18th. Had a few jobs last year. It's free. Have a lot of forms. Yep, still free. Have a bunch of new invisible crypto coins. Heads up, it's still free. Convinced you saw Bigfoot. Even if your friends don't believe you. That has absolutely nothing to do with taxes. But you better believe it. It's still absolutely free. Just download and do your own taxes in the TurboTax app by February 18th. All tax forms all 100% free. Now this is taxes. See if you qualify in the TurboTax app excludes TurboTax Live must start and file in app by February 18th.

[Angela Kinsey]

Is your schedule crazy? Just want some me time? We could all use a sanctuary from stress. Why not turn your bedroom into the space to decompress with our selection of comfortable beds, pillows, decor, mood lighting and so much more Every time you step in there, it's nothing but no me time. I mean you time. Sounds like a dream, right? We are here to make your me time dreams come true. Visit us in store or at ikea-usa.com sleep to create a comfy, blissful bedroom today. You know we're all driven by the search for better. But when it comes to hiring, the best way to search for a candidate isn't to search at all. Don't search match with individual Indeed when you're hiring, it feels amazing to finally close out a job search. But what if you could get rid of the search and just match you can with Indeed. Indeed is your matching and hiring platform with over 350 million global monthly visitors according to Indeed Data and a matching engine that helps you find quality candidates fast. You know, thinking back to all the different companies I worked at as I was struggling actor man, we could have used Indeed when we were looking for new people to hire. Indeed's matching engine is constantly learning from your preferences. So the more you use Indeed the better it gets and listeners of this show will get a $75 sponsored job credit to get your jobs more visibility at indeed.com officeladies just go to indeed.com officeladies right now and support our show by saying you heard about Indeed on this podcast. Indeed.com officeladies Terms and conditions apply. Need to hire you need Indeed. Larry is fantastic.

[Jenna Fischer]

That was great.

[Angela Kinsey]

That was so fun to talk to you.

[Jenna Fischer]

We're so lucky.

[Angela Kinsey]

We're so lucky. All right, should we get into the episode?

[Jenna Fischer]

Let's get into performance review. I know we covered a little bit of the stunt aspect of the fitness orbital, but we have not discussed the other elements of the cold open, the romance.

[Angela Kinsey]

You mean the look to camera that DWight gave at 50 seconds?

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

When Jim is like, you're not having sex, he's like, mm. What does that look about?

[Jenna Fischer]

I think we're gonna find out.

[Angela Kinsey]

I think we might.

[Jenna Fischer]

All right, so in the first scene, Oscar is walking out of Michael's office. He's just completed his performance review, and Michael calls Pam into his office. I think you can tell in my talking head there that I'm very sick. I don't know. I think I sound very nasally.

[Angela Kinsey]

I mean, if you can't tell, you're literally like, here's the Farbit review. And I know.

[Jenna Fischer]

So in that office, when Michael makes Pam listen to the voicemail from Jan. That was my sickest day. That was the day I was most sick. And I think you can see me a little bit nodding off, like, not nodding off. I think you can see me drifting from the Sudafed like, I'm a little.

[Angela Kinsey]

Like, your eyes are a little glassy, A little dilated. They're a little glassy. But it has one of my favorite scenes, Jenna. It made me laugh so hard. You and Steve were so great, and I just loved when he's like, pam, you're trustworthy. Wait, can we. Let's act it out here. Do it. All right, I'll be Michael. You be yourself. Ready?

[Jenna Fischer]

All right.

[Angela Kinsey]

Pam, you're trustworthy.

[Jenna Fischer]

Thank you.

[Angela Kinsey]

And a woman.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, no.

[Angela Kinsey]

It made me laugh so hard. I know.

[Jenna Fischer]

She just knows where that's going, and it's not good news. So we had a fan question about this from Luke J. Was the scene with you talking to Michael about Jan's voicemails improvised? No, it wasn't. But here's an interesting fact. We weren't listening to a recording. That was actually Melora, who plays Jan on the phone, saying that voicemail in the exact same way over and over again.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. And I.

[Jenna Fischer]

He would hit that button.

[Angela Kinsey]

He would hit that button, and she would be cued to say it. I think she was right in the conference room. I think she was right around the corner.

[Jenna Fischer]

She was. She was on set talking through the.

[Angela Kinsey]

Phone, and I feel like our second AD would cue her. And whenever Michael hit the button, she might could have even have seen him, actually, depending where she was standing. That was so funny.

[Jenna Fischer]

So good. And there's deleted scenes. And if you look at it, there's one deleted scene where Steve keeps pressing the button like 12 times. And she just had to keep saying.

[Angela Kinsey]

I guess I missed you.

[Jenna Fischer]

I guess I missed you. I guess I missed you.

[Angela Kinsey]

I guess I missed you. Until she starts laughing.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. Because it was like insane. Okay, at 2 minutes and 51 seconds, there is a flashback to the exterior of the Chili's, and you get a wide shot of that Chili's from the previous episode that we talked about and you see them kissing outside. I really scrutinize this shot of the Chili's.

[Angela Kinsey]

Angela, I wanna hear it.

[Jenna Fischer]

Remember in the last episode we said, was this the same Chili's that we shot the Dundees?

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, yeah, you were obsessed with that.

[Jenna Fischer]

Now, I think it was not really based on the exterior in the parking lot. Yes. This shot is different than any shot we got in the Client. This is a wide shot, and I think it looks like a different parking lot and a different exterior than the one that Pam comes out of the Dundees screaming, woohoo.

[Angela Kinsey]

All right, I'm gonna have to go back and look at that. Okay, Way to go, lady.

[Jenna Fischer]

Also, maybe no one cares, but we all care.

[Angela Kinsey]

I have a card from five minutes. Is that jumping too far ahead for you?

[Jenna Fischer]

Who knows?

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay. Who knows? I don't write time codes. I have a card for five minutes, five seconds. It's just me commenting, you guys. As a fan, I just thought John's reaction when he is. Jim realizes that Dwight thinks it's the wrong date. His performance in that little moment is so brilliant because it's really letting you in on that. He's figuring something out, and it's subtle and it's perfect. And John, you crushed it.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. Those are the ways that John just, like, he's amazing.

[Angela Kinsey]

He's so good. John, you're so good. I'm like. I'm just like. I've always been a fan and I think I'm just, like, becoming a bigger fan as I rewatch.

[Jenna Fischer]

Here's something about that same scene. I don't know if you noticed, but in the background over John's shoulder, Michael's door is closed. Here's a little tidbit. When you see scenes between Jim and Dwight and Michael's doors closed, that meant that Steve didn't have to sit in there.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, good for Steve.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. He would get a break from having to do the background work because when the door was open, you could see him at his desk. But when the door is closed, you can't Guess what?

[Angela Kinsey]

None of the rest of us had doors.

[Jenna Fischer]

Nope. None of the rest of us had doors.

[Angela Kinsey]

Unless you're in the annex.

[Jenna Fischer]

So Steve got out of the background for that couple of hours that we shot that scene.

[Angela Kinsey]

I have a card for seven minutes, 50 seconds, you guys. It's a scene and accounting. So here's the thing. When Brian and Oscar and I got to have a scene that was solely in accounting, we would get just giddy. We would get so excited, and, like, we would come up with all of these bits, and they would always be like, guys, we don't have time for all of that. We used to joke, you know, Like, I would say, like, guys, it's not our show. It's not called the Accountants. So we were really excited. But when I was watching this, I thought, oh, my God, Kevin is such a gossip.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

So gossipy when he's like, they made out, you know, and had sex. Like, he's being so gross. And then, of course, what the heck does my comment mean when I say office romances are nobody's business but the people involved. What's happening between Dwight's look and that line?

[Jenna Fischer]

I know.

[Angela Kinsey]

Mm.

[Jenna Fischer]

We're weaving something together here.

[Angela Kinsey]

Something's happening.

[Jenna Fischer]

I wanna talk about Stanley's meeting with Michael.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, gosh. You know what?

[Jenna Fischer]

I. Leslie David Baker is so brilliant in this scene.

[Angela Kinsey]

I actually wanted to call Leslie. Dang it. Okay, Leslie, we're gonna call you. You've gotta come in. But I wrote on a card. Just read what I wrote on the ghetto. On the ghetto.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, that was a fan question. Drew's Fire asked about Stanley saying on the ghetto instead of in the ghetto. Was this intentional? It was. It was not improvised.

[Angela Kinsey]

It was written.

[Jenna Fischer]

Paul Lieberstein wrote the line on the ghetto, and there was a debate in the writers room about which was funnier for Stanley to say, in the ghetto or on the ghetto. On the ghetto 1. Leslie David Baker delivered it perfectly. I just love how he is working Michael so hard in this scene.

[Angela Kinsey]

I loved watching Pam work Michael and then Stanley and be like, oh, my gosh, they're all doing it. They're all giving him relationship advice to get a good performance review.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes, well, that's what you have to do. I also love the scene in the kitchen with Jim and Pam where it's a really quick scene where Pam's just walking to the bathroom and they just quickly download each other on the day. Oh, by the way, Dwight thinks it's Friday instead of Thursday. And then Pam says her little tidbit to Jim and they move on. That totally reminded me of me and my husband.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

Sometimes that's all you get. You just between packing lunches and doing laundry and pickup and drop off and all the things that keep the house running, you gotta just. You'll get like two sentences out before someone needs something from you.

[Angela Kinsey]

And sometimes it's like a big reveal. Cause, like, you walked by and you're like, they definitely hooked up. He's like, oh, yeah. Dwight thinks it's Thursday or Friday. Oh, great.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. Big news.

[Angela Kinsey]

Big news. But you don't have a ton of time.

[Jenna Fischer]

Exactly. And I feel like Leigh and I download one another sometimes, you know, with stuff like that. Big stuff.

[Angela Kinsey]

Scenes like that make our show so special, I think, because they don't feel like a scene. You really feel like you're just watching someone live their life. And I think it's super unique to our show.

[Jenna Fischer]

Like, you're just capturing a moment in time. And I also think it's such a great way to write the romance between Jim and Pam. Like, I think that's intimacy. Right. Like, that's why it made me think of me and my husband, because they have to grab this moment of intimacy wherever they can on the fly. Yeah. And so it really makes them feel like a couple, because you can do that with someone you're really close with.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yep.

[Jenna Fischer]

You can download big info in two seconds.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yokkan. I don't know why I said it like that. Yo, Khan, I have a card. 9 minutes, 2 seconds. Kelly's hair is up. What? Kelly Kapoor.

[Jenna Fischer]

Hold on.

[Angela Kinsey]

Her hair is in a bun or an updo this whole episode.

[Jenna Fischer]

What is happening?

[Angela Kinsey]

I don't know.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, yes. I have that too. Michael tells everybody about the suggestion box meeting, and Kelly's hair is back up in a twist with a paisley shirt. But I did think that Mindy was acting more Mindyish.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes.

[Jenna Fischer]

So her performance is evolved, even though her hair is fussy.

[Angela Kinsey]

Her hair is fussy, but she's becoming more like Mindy.

[Jenna Fischer]

Angela, I have to go back, though.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, what? What?

[Jenna Fischer]

We have to discuss your youth beauty pageant.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, yes. Okay.

[Jenna Fischer]

And your love of being judged. Jake Peters asked, what was Angela's talent when she was on the pageant circuit? Angela, what do you think her talent would be?

[Angela Kinsey]

I mean, there was a prop photo of me twirling a baton. I don't know if it ever made it in an episode.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, I remember that.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. So I don't know if I was a baton twirler. You know, what if I Got to pick what Angela's beauty pageant talent would be. It would be that she would play the crystal glasses. She would have a table of glasses and be like. And she'd play, like, maybe like some old gospel tune.

[Jenna Fischer]

I feel like either that or the Bells. Oh, the bells.

[Angela Kinsey]

And she'd have gloves on.

[Jenna Fischer]

Gloves on.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes, yes.

[Jenna Fischer]

Those two things. Okay, I have something. At 9 minutes, 16 seconds, there's another scene between Jim and Dwight at their desks. This is when Jim is on the phone, and you can see that Michael's door is open and Steve is in the background.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay.

[Jenna Fischer]

So he did not get out of that one.

[Angela Kinsey]

I like it. I like how, like, I would track, like, who was sitting with Oscar in his booth at the Dundees. This is your. This is like, Steve's door's open. Steve's door's closed.

[Jenna Fischer]

This is gonna be my thing. Yeah, I'm just gonna be like, you're.

[Angela Kinsey]

In charge of the door, lady.

[Jenna Fischer]

I'm. Okay, great.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay.

[Jenna Fischer]

I'll be door. I'm on door.

[Angela Kinsey]

Hordor. Oh, you don't watch Game of Thrones?

[Jenna Fischer]

I don't. What is it? What?

[Angela Kinsey]

Door. Hordor.

[Larry Wilmore]

Whore.

[Jenna Fischer]

Door whore.

[Angela Kinsey]

No, like a. Is that home door? Oh, sorry, I said it wrong. Hodor. It's Hodor.

[Jenna Fischer]

Hodor.

[Angela Kinsey]

Hodor.

[Jenna Fischer]

It's sort of the same. What happens? I mean, all that's coming to mind for me is prostitution.

[Angela Kinsey]

No.

[Jenna Fischer]

What is this door.

[Angela Kinsey]

Don't listen to my Southern accent. Hoardor. It's Hodor.

[Jenna Fischer]

Even Ho. Hodor.

[Angela Kinsey]

Jenna, it's not.

[Jenna Fischer]

What happens with the door? Just tell me.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, it's not about prostitutes. Okay, well, what is it? It's a person. Hodor is a person.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, it's not a door.

[Angela Kinsey]

No, but adore is involved later. I don't want to ruin it for you. It's my hope that someday you'll watch Game of Thrones.

[Jenna Fischer]

I'm never going to watch it, Angela. I'm sorry to tell you.

[Angela Kinsey]

Hodor.

[Jenna Fischer]

It's not my genre.

[Angela Kinsey]

What?

[Jenna Fischer]

Fantasy is not my genre.

[Angela Kinsey]

So you don't like Lord of the Rings?

[Jenna Fischer]

I've never seen it.

[Angela Kinsey]

I'm out. I'm out.

[Jenna Fischer]

She's leaving. She took off her headphones. No. You know this about me.

[Angela Kinsey]

I mean, I sort of knew it, but come on. Lord of the Rings?

[Jenna Fischer]

It's just. You know what it is? I'm not a fan of having to learn all new rules about different new planets. Or, wait, mythical creatures and their powers.

[Angela Kinsey]

Hold up.

[Jenna Fischer]

What?

[Angela Kinsey]

I don't. I can't even I almost can't say this out loud.

[Jenna Fischer]

What? What?

[Angela Kinsey]

Do you not like Star Wars? No. No.

[Jenna Fischer]

I'm afraid to speak right now.

[Angela Kinsey]

No, Jenna, are you kidding? You don't like Star Wars?

[Jenna Fischer]

I have not ever. What, seen?

[Angela Kinsey]

No.

[Jenna Fischer]

The Star wars movies?

[Angela Kinsey]

No.

[Jenna Fischer]

Except I think, as a child, I saw the Empire Strikes Back.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, my God.

[Jenna Fischer]

I have an appreciation for Star wars as a cultural phenomenon.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, my God. You sound. You sound like this. Sounds like you're a politician. Oh, my God.

[Jenna Fischer]

When I was a child, I went to Star wars, and I fell asleep during it. And then as an adult, I thought, what is wrong with me? I need to see Star Wars.

[Angela Kinsey]

And then you were like, but then I have to learn rules about a new planet.

[Jenna Fischer]

No, I fell asleep again.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, my God.

[Jenna Fischer]

And then I thought, that's a sign. I mean, in multiple generations of myself or like, in different decades. Here's the thing, though. I was obsessed with Princess Leia. Like, as a kid, I wore the buns and I did the lightsaber fighting.

[Angela Kinsey]

Know why?

[Jenna Fischer]

No, I don't know any of the thing. I don't know where Chewbacca is from. But then. Likewise. I love your Baby Yoda. You have a knitted Baby Yoda?

[Angela Kinsey]

I do.

[Jenna Fischer]

In your she Shed office. And I love it. I want one, but. So I guess I'm attracted to parts of Star wars but not the actual story or any of the rules.

[Angela Kinsey]

Wow. Whew.

[Jenna Fischer]

I am afraid that I've said this. I am afraid.

[Angela Kinsey]

No, don't be afraid.

[Jenna Fischer]

I am afraid to have admitted this. This feels like a little bit like I'm telling a secret.

[Angela Kinsey]

It is. No, it's. You know what?

[Jenna Fischer]

But listen, we went to Disneyland, and we rode that Millennium Falcon ride. I loved the whole Disneyland, Star wars world. Like, I didn't want to leave. It was amazing. It was so well done. And then, like, the ride blew my mind. Like, I've seen so much of the imagery from the movie that I was giddy.

[Angela Kinsey]

I think, Jenna, that in 2020, I think you need to revisit the Star Wars. I think you have to, maybe. Okay, Angela, The Mandalorian. It's.

[Jenna Fischer]

What is that?

[Angela Kinsey]

It's on Disney. It's. Oh, God. It's got Baby Yoda in it.

[Jenna Fischer]

I. Please don't make me watch all these fantasy shows.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, God. What if I bought.

[Jenna Fischer]

Like, this would be, like, if I said to you, Angela, in 2020, I'm gonna make you watch all my favorite horror movies.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, I do hate horror movies. See, I hate them.

[Jenna Fischer]

I love horror movies, and I love, in particular, survivalist horror movies.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, I hate those. Okay, fine. Okay, fine. You can keep your survivalist movies, and I'll keep Star Wars. Although I do feel like there might be a night sometime to me.

[Jenna Fischer]

Listen to me. Will you come to my house with me this year and watch my annual viewing of the Edge? And in exchange, I'll watch something of your fantasy stuff?

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes, but if I have to watch a man fight a bear, like the bear's eating him and he's fighting him off, I'm gonna need a glass of wine.

[Jenna Fischer]

You can have a glass of wine.

[Angela Kinsey]

It's gonna stress me the hell out.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, Angela, what one man has done, another can do.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, my God. There it is. Okay, fine. I have spoken. Yes. Yes, Mandalorian. Yes.

[Jenna Fischer]

I don't know what that reference is.

[Angela Kinsey]

I know, I know.

[Jenna Fischer]

Let's get back to the episode. If anyone is still willing to listen to me after that confession. The scene with Jan and Michael greeting one another where he accidentally touches her boob.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes, I know.

[Jenna Fischer]

Do you remember on the day we rehearsed that scene? Cause it was a little tricky. There was a big camera movement of Michael watching the door, waiting for Jan, and then he comes out of his office. So it was a little complicated. We had to really rehearse that with the cameras. And during the rehearsal, Steve accidentally touched her boob. Yes. And we all laughed so hard.

[Angela Kinsey]

Melura was cracking up. Melora said, you have to do that in a take. And Steve was like, no, no, no. And she's like, no. It was so funny and awkward. You have to.

[Jenna Fischer]

And so then that became a bit in the scene. Then they had to try to do it where it still looked like an accident, which is a really hard thing to do, actually.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

Cause he was to recreate that.

[Angela Kinsey]

I think Steve was just trying to pat her shoulder and missed.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. She sort of moved a little bit, and he accidentally patted her boo.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. She turned into him as he went to pat her shoulder.

[Jenna Fischer]

So funny.

[Angela Kinsey]

So funny.

[Jenna Fischer]

So funny. That was a complete accident, that bit that just happened on the fly. I also want to say that then when Jan goes into Michael's office. I love that the cameras are outside of the office during this scene between Michael and Jan. So Paul Feig talked about his decision to keep the cameras outside the office for these scenes. He thought that Michael might want Jan alone so that he could ask her about the relationship. And so the camera.

[Angela Kinsey]

And Jan would not want the cameras there anyway.

[Jenna Fischer]

No, probably not. And so they had to get it as a spy shot. But then later, after the suggestion box meeting, you'll notice that the camera is inside the room with them. And Paul said that his logic was that in Michael's mind, if he let the cameras in the office with him, maybe Jan couldn't yell at him as much for what happened in the conference room.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, yes.

[Jenna Fischer]

So Michael would be able to use the camera as a buffer, as protection. I just love the thoughtfulness that goes into the planning of where the camera is or where the camera isn't. I mean, that's just. Paul is so smart.

[Angela Kinsey]

He's so smart. Well, I loved the line that Jan had when she said, please don't smell me, Michael.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

He's like, what are you wearing? It smells sexy.

[Jenna Fischer]

She's like, oh, God, please don't smell me, Michael. That reminds me so much of Pam's line, please don't throw garbage at me.

[Angela Kinsey]

Me too. It reminded me of the same thing. Hey, guys, just a little fun background thing to catch. There is a British flag on Michael's desk. You see it throughout the episode whenever you go into his office. I like to think it's a little nod to our BBC roots.

[Jenna Fischer]

It must be, right? I think so, yeah. They would do stuff like that.

[Angela Kinsey]

I know. So I don't know if you guys noticed it, but I noticed it right away in the conference room. 12 minutes, 26 seconds. We are opening up the suggestion box.

[Jenna Fischer]

We had a fan question from realbrandonb16. What was the hardest scene for you to film for this episode? This one, we laughed so much. So hard. I laughed so hard at every one of Steve's reactions.

[Angela Kinsey]

Everything was so. And also like rain as Dwight. Like, repeating all the ridiculous things.

[Jenna Fischer]

So good. Also, I think in this scene, there's some Toby sass.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, I wrote. Did you see Major Toby sass? Okay, so wait, first of all, can we just briefly talk about how many cards are in the suggestion box?

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes, please.

[Angela Kinsey]

There are six. Okay, number one, what should we do to prepare for Y2K?

[Jenna Fischer]

Amazing.

[Angela Kinsey]

Number two, we need better outreach for employees fighting depression. Okay, that was Tom. Number three, you need to do something about your bo. This is when we have Major Toby sass.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

Because he's like, michael, aren't these about you? And he's like, I mean, I can't believe. First of all, I can't believe Michael didn't kick him out of the conference room. Yeah, right.

[Jenna Fischer]

I think he only didn't kick him out because Jan was there.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes, good call. Also, can we all just take a minute to witness the fact that Creed, like, schooled Michael. And the difference between inferring and implying.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

Like what? Creed.

[Jenna Fischer]

I love when Creed suddenly lays down real wisdom.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. And we're like, what?

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. He mostly says gibberish. And then you're like, oh, okay, take note.

[Angela Kinsey]

Inferring and implying are two different things. What? Number four, you need to do something about your coffee breath. Which was clearly my character's card.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

Number five, a piece of gum. Number six, don't sleep with your boss.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

I personally never came back from the gum when he opens up the piece of gum. And Steve's reaction to the gum. Yeah, I. I don't think I ever got it together after that because it was so amazing. Also, watch Mindy. At 15 minutes, 10 seconds, she puts her hand over her mouth, but her eyes get really wide. Like she's totally. It's a total giveaway. She's laughing.

[Angela Kinsey]

That's what Mindy does when she laughs. She covers her mouth with her hand.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

That's her tell.

[Jenna Fischer]

All right, so now we're gonna move out to the stairwell and the scene where Dwight is pumping himself up for.

[Angela Kinsey]

His performance review to the song Wildside by Motley Crue.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. So that is the stairwell to the writers offices. The bottom of the stairs is the hallway where our editors would sit. That's where the editing bays were. And upstairs was the writers. And Rain has said in interviews that this was one of his favorite scenes to film. And I happened to be over in the writers room that day that they were filming it, and I sat at the top of the stairs and I watched him film the scene. Yes. And it was so great. And a lot of the stuff that he is saying there was improvised.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes. As his. Also, people were like, did he improvise playing the air guitar? That's all rain.

[Jenna Fischer]

That's all rain. And there was something funny about that. So usually when you have music in a scene, they don't actually play the music on set. In fact, there'll be, like, a big dance scene or a club scene, like, let's say you're shooting a wedding. They'll play a few seconds of the music so that you can get the beat, and then they turn it off, and you have to dance.

[Angela Kinsey]

With no music.

[Jenna Fischer]

With no music, and say your dialogue, and then they add the music later in editing. And that's so they can get your dialogue clean and so that they can cut between different takes. And you don't want this song in the background. Well, for this scene, they actually played the Music on the boombox. And it made for a bit of a challenge in the editing room. But Greg felt like it provided so much to Rains performance.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

For him to have that music blaring. And also, it's documentary, so you wouldn't have this, like, clean track of the music playing later.

[Angela Kinsey]

Although we did in Cafe Disco. We all had the dance for that. Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

In Michael's. In the little Michael Scott paper company thing. All right, so now we move into Michael's office, and Dwight is going to give his pitch for why he deserves a raise.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay, this scene happens at around 17 minutes, 14 seconds. I just have to tell you guys, I did a lot of scenes with Rainn Wilson, and here's something you have to know about him. The man loves a prop. He loves a prop, guys. Oh, my gosh. So it was no surprise to me when he held up that binder. I have a feeling him and Phil Shea talked a lot about that binder and what would go in it. But Rain loves a prop.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, you can see at 18 minutes, 12 seconds. Speaking of props, there is a sign, and it never gets referred to in the scene because it got deleted. Dwight has made a sign of himself where he breaks down his name.

[Angela Kinsey]

I wrote it all down.

[Jenna Fischer]

I did, too. Okay, say it again.

[Angela Kinsey]

Let's take turns. You do the first one. Well, let's go back and forth.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay.

[Angela Kinsey]

Dwight's acronym for his name.

[Jenna Fischer]

Determined worker, Intense, Good worker, Hard worker, Terrific. You. Actually, I have to advise people to go back and watch the deleted scenes from this, because there is a whole scene where he explains this. He first he explains it to Jim at their desks, and then he makes suggestions for what Jim's acronym could be.

[Angela Kinsey]

He does.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. And it's really good. And then. And then they also show, like, the scene from Michael's office. So it's good stuff.

[Angela Kinsey]

It is interesting to me that the two characters that were the most excited about their performance review were Dwight and Angela. I mean, Dwight put so much effort into his. And then all Michael said was, he's adequate. And then my character's like, I love to be judged. I think I hold up even to the most severe scrutiny. I'm so excited for this. And then he just slams the door in my face and says, you're satisfactory.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, I know. It's so sad. The two people who really wanted a performance review don't get it.

[Angela Kinsey]

So around 18 minutes, Jan is fed up. She's like, you know what? I need a minute. I'm gonna step out. I'm gonna Collect my thoughts. And she goes into the hallway, and we see the sign for the building. And here's what's in the building that we see. W.B. jones Heating and Air. That's in Office 110. Available. 1400.

[Jenna Fischer]

It's available space.

[Angela Kinsey]

And then the number is 120. What? Then we have Dunder Mifflin Inc. Suite 200. And then we have Vance Refrigeration, Suite 210.

[Jenna Fischer]

So here's something that's interesting. We haven't done that episode where we meet all the people in the business park yet, but they had to make that prop.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

So I want to ask. That would actually be set deck. I want to ask Michael Gallenberg, did he just randomly make up that JB Whatever. The wb. And did he make up Vance Refrigeration?

[Angela Kinsey]

WB Jones. I mean, Vance Refrigeration is put there so far before we ever deal with it. I wonder, like, what that was. Who came up with that?

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah, we need to talk to Michael about all of those little things because they will come to figure so prominently in upcoming episodes.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, my gosh.

[Jenna Fischer]

Bob Vance.

[Angela Kinsey]

Bob Vance. Vance Refrigeration.

[Jenna Fischer]

Then we have the scene with Jim and Pam in the break room.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes. They're talking about Michael and Jan. And Pam says, how do you come back from that? And Jim so clearly takes it to heart. Cause he's thinking, how would they come back if him and Pam hooked up and it didn't work out? How would they come back? How would he come back from that? It's so clear to me that that's what he's thinking. And he's like, yeah, you know, I don't know how you do come back from that, especially if you work together. And then Pam goes, no, I mean, how do you come back from hooking up with Michael?

[Jenna Fischer]

Right.

[Angela Kinsey]

And he's like, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, Michael. But you see, the whole time, I feel like Jim sort of went deep, and I feel like Pam kind of stayed surface.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. I don't think Pam's thinking any of that stuff at all. She's really thinking, Jan hooked up with Michael.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. Michael.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. She's not thinking office romances, but it's.

[Angela Kinsey]

Just a little moment for me that kind of broke my heart. And it's kind of like what Larry is talking about that at the heart, it's a romantic comedy, you know, And Jim is thinking about Pam. And so when he realizes Pam hasn't even clocked that, you know, that he's thinking about them in a way that she's not Even thinking about in that.

[Jenna Fischer]

Moment, Jan then says she is heading back to New York, and there's this big scene where Michael chases her to the elevator.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, Jenna. Before we get into that scene, I just have one little comment about something in the background. What is it at 19 minutes, 8 seconds, you guys. As Jan is leaving the building and Michael's chasing after her, you really get a great look at the Dunder Mifflin sign.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

Here's the thing. You probably think that sign is, like, made of something hard and sturdy, right? Doesn't it look like plastic or something composite? It's foam board.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. Sometimes. Almost like a craft project.

[Angela Kinsey]

It's almost like a poster you would make for your kid's third grade project. I remember we would have scenes where we'd have to line up up and come in and out of the office, and we'd be stuck back there in that little corner off camera, and you could just push on it. It was just like, foam board.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, I used to remember being worried for it because it did feel very precarious, like if you. Your elbow might go right through it.

[Angela Kinsey]

I remember one time, Oscar was leaning on it, and I was like, oscar, the. The D is getting, like, all, like, bent. Stop. Like.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

Anyway, I'm just saying, that sign, guys, you know, it's Hollywood smoke and mirrors. It's just foam board. You could have made it for your third grade project.

[Jenna Fischer]

I love that tidbit. I think that's a good tidbit.

[Angela Kinsey]

It's a good tidbit. I would sometimes walk past it and just push on a letter.

[Jenna Fischer]

Angela.

[Angela Kinsey]

What?

[Jenna Fischer]

That's so, like, devious.

[Angela Kinsey]

I. It felt.

[Jenna Fischer]

Was that, like, your character just getting out a little tension.

[Angela Kinsey]

I don't know. But sometimes I'd walk past it and go.

[Jenna Fischer]

So Jan gives this big speech at the elevator, which is amazing.

[Angela Kinsey]

It's amazing.

[Jenna Fischer]

Melora is amazing.

[Angela Kinsey]

Amazing.

[Jenna Fischer]

And it cuts back and forth between them. At the elevator and all of us in the office, we had a fan question from Molly. Smiley face. When Jan is leaving and her and Michael are arguing, could you guys actually hear it, or did you just act like you could? We could hear them.

[Angela Kinsey]

We could hear them.

[Jenna Fischer]

They had a camera on us, and we could hear them. And it was as much fun to listen to as you would imagine in real life. It would be fun to listen to that.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, yeah. We had a camera on us the whole time they did their scene. And so I think what people don't realize, too, is the space from reception to that elevator wasn't Very far. No, it really wasn't. So we were in fairly close proximity. It just doesn't look like it the way we would always film.

[Jenna Fischer]

And also, the walls aren't really real thick walls. Yeah, you can hear.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah, they're just very slowly.

[Jenna Fischer]

And also, the elevator is obviously not a real elevator. It is a box with a door with, like, a guy with a pulley with a cable.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. He would, like, pull the doors open.

[Jenna Fischer]

And shut, and he would have to try to time it to look real. But something I love in this scene is that the timing of Michael saying. So what you're saying is it had nothing to do with my looks like that. That's his takeaway from that speech, is that she doesn't find him unattractive. And she just goes. And then the doors close.

[Angela Kinsey]

That's perfect.

[Jenna Fischer]

I mean, amazing.

[Angela Kinsey]

And then this is, you know, a little background tidbit that I love. At 19 minutes, 14 seconds, while Melora, as Jan is having this speech, we see the door to Vance Refrigeration.

[Jenna Fischer]

There it is.

[Angela Kinsey]

There it is. That's where they are. They're right on the other side. So you can see that Phyllis and her fella weren't very far apart.

[Jenna Fischer]

They weren't. I wonder where did they meet? In the elevator, maybe? The elevator.

[Angela Kinsey]

Or did they know each other before?

[Jenna Fischer]

We all have a lot of questions. We learn about that romance in the Christmas episode, which is coming up. All right, so here we go. We talked about cold opens. This episode has a tag.

[Angela Kinsey]

A tag.

[Jenna Fischer]

The little tidbit at the end. It's the next day. Where is Dwight? If you re. Watch this, this is one long tracking shot, which is just a great shot. It's kind of amazing how we timed it out. You see everybody working. And then we go to the window. You see Dwight down at the window getting out of his car. It's really terrific. The prank worked. He doesn't get to work until, like, noon or something.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. He comes barreling out of his car all frantic. And of course, you see the really cute Jim and Pam that they do a little, like, actors bow to each other, like, well done.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes, yes. And that is performance review.

[Angela Kinsey]

That's performance review. We would love to thank Larry Wilmore for coming on today and you guys for tuning in.

[Jenna Fischer]

And we will be back next week with email surveillance.

[Angela Kinsey]

And guess who's going to be in the booth with us? Ken Jeong.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. And Angela. This is going to be a big episode for you.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, yeah, it is.

[Jenna Fischer]

Wyatt and Angela. Dwayne. Angela is born officially Bumpin Birkenstocks. All right, we'll see you then. Thank you for listening to Office Ladies. Second Drink.

[Angela Kinsey]

This episode was initially created in collaboration with Earwolf.

[Jenna Fischer]

Office Ladies is a presentation of Odyssey and is produced by Jenna Fisher and Angela Kinsey.

[Angela Kinsey]

Our executive producer is Cassie Jerkins, and our audio engineer and associate producer is Demi Silva.

[Jenna Fischer]

Odyssey's executive producers are Jenna Wise Berman and Leah Reese. Dennis.

[Angela Kinsey]

Office Ladies is mixed and mastered by Chris Basel.

[Jenna Fischer]

Our theme song is Rubber Tree by Creed Bratton.