Marc Maron on Podcast Grifters, Fascism & His Legacy

Summary

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Podcast Summary: On with Kara Swisher

Episode: Marc Maron on Podcast Grifters, Fascism & His Legacy
Date: June 11, 2026
Host: Kara Swisher
Guest: Marc Maron

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Episode Overview

Kara Swisher sits down with legendary comedian and original podcaster Marc Maron live at the Tribeca Film Festival, following the premiere of his new movie In Memoriam. Their spirited conversation ranges from the evolution and pitfalls of podcasting, the darkness and humor of legacy, the state of comedy and politics, to the challenges of maintaining empathy in a time of rising authoritarianism and tech dominance. They also speak candidly about anxiety, personal growth, public vulnerability, Maron's career arc, and the future of both comedy and media.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Anxiety, Urgency, and Personality

• Anxiety as a driver:
  Maron reflects on living with “panic and dread” and how that infuses his sense of urgency, both personally and professionally.
  • “Everything starts in a panic and moves through in a panic. I wake up in a mild panic.” (Marc Maron, 04:47)
  • Kara jokingly claims not to suffer anxiety, attributing it to being a lesbian and contrasting it to her anxious Jewish wife. (Kara Swisher, 06:58)
• Choosing standup as an anxious person:
  Maron muses on the paradox of picking such a vulnerable art form, seeing standup as almost “sacred space” for quick, poetic deconstruction of fears.
  • "I always thought that standups were able to make sense of the world... And also give you new ways of looking at things. So I thought standups were just wizards.” (Marc Maron, 08:41)
• Early influences:
  Recounts the comics and TV moments that first inspired him, from Jay Leno on Merv Griffin to Carlin and Pryor. (09:32–10:51)

2. ‘In Memoriam’ — Art, Legacy & Playing a Narcissist

• Premise and character:
  Maron’s latest film features him as Langston Stanfield—a washed-up, narcissistic actor facing terminal cancer who becomes consumed by getting into the Oscars’ ‘In Memoriam’ tribute.
• Connecting the role to real life:
  Maron draws parallels between his character’s emotional arc and his own issues with validation, performance, and personal relationships.
  • “At this point in my life, my emergency contact is my manager… So, you know, I'm living that to a degree.” (Marc Maron, 17:10)
• Parasocial relationships:
  Discussion of how comedians often connect more freely with strangers (audiences) than with loved ones—a theme in both his life and the movie.
• Acting process:
  Emphasizes the importance of “being present for what’s on the page” and rooting the character in emotional truth rather than broad comedy.
  • “If something is well written, the answers to how to perform are on the page.” (Marc Maron, 12:50)
• Navigating dark humor and sadness:
  Talks about balancing comedy with pathos, particularly through emotional scenes with his movie daughter (Talia Ryder) using acting exercises like the Sanford Meisner repetition.
  • “That exercise, if anyone does it, will push you to the limit.” (Marc Maron, 21:09)

3. On Legacy, Loss, and What It Means Today

• Reflections after loss:
  Maron addresses the aftermath of losing partner Lynn Shelton, public grieving, and the ambiguous nature of artistic legacy.
  • “What does a legacy really mean?… You know, my girlfriend died. And what happens is…a handful of people are like, ‘well what are we going to do with all this shit?’” (Marc Maron, 22:39)
• Impact of podcasting:
  Maron wonders if his years of podcast interviews (1,700 episodes) still resonate in a world obsessed with short clips and algorithmic churn.
  • “If any of these conversations…can still provide a service for people…then, great. That’s a great legacy to have.” (Marc Maron, 24:08)
• Institutional decay:
  Laments how even brilliant movies/shows can vanish overnight in the current media ecosystem—a state he calls “the Wild West.”
  • “We live in a world where genius actors and brilliant writers and great directors do amazing things—no one sees.” (Marc Maron, 25:19)

4. Ending WTF, Podcasting Culture, and the Rise of Grifters

• Life after WTF:
  Maron is surprised to find himself undisturbed (sometimes relieved) by the podcast’s end—after exhausting his curiosity and list of desired guests.
  • “I really talked to everyone I want to talk to…How many more people?” (Marc Maron, 35:45)
• The podcast gold rush:
  He is critical of how podcasting, once intimate and unique, is now overrun by what he calls “grifters, entrepreneurs, and businessmen.” (40:11)
• Lowered standards—a ‘graveyard’ of failed podcasts:
  “There is a graveyard of four episodes of someone’s dream podcast. Thousands of them. Since 2008, there’s got to be like a million…” (Marc Maron, 40:54)
• Parasociality and audience laziness:
  Maron bemoans the rise of video podcasts featuring “three idiots” on Zoom, blaming their popularity on loneliness, laziness, and a desire for one-sided relationships.
  • “People are lazy and they’ll adapt to anything and they're fucking lonely and they want to have parasocial relationships with people…” (Marc Maron, 42:48) He considers himself partly responsible (“Sure. But a lot of them didn’t go away.” - Marc Maron, 41:19).

5. State of Comedy, Manosphere, and Political Grievances

• Satirizing the manosphere:
  Maron’s HBO special ‘Panic’ targets the “manosphere” podcast crowd. Notable line:
  • “If Hitler were alive today, he’d probably appear on Theo Vaughn’s podcast. He'd probably have a podcast anyway.” (Kara quoting Maron, 47:01)
• Frustration with comic grifters and right-wing bootlicking:
  Criticizes podcast hosts for platforming fascists and undermining liberal democracy, labeling many as “pawns” or “suckers.”
  • “My issue was…they were sucking up to fascists and promoting the end of liberal democracy…” (Marc Maron, 48:56)
• Faux ‘anti-woke’ comedy:
  Maron and Swisher agree that ‘anti-woke’ jokes are “pure hack,” serving as crude tools for political attacks rather than true satire.
  • “It was never a freedom of speech issue…you could say whatever you want, but you have to shoulder the burden of consequences.” (Marc Maron, 52:12)
• Political responsibility & changing climate:
  Maron notes that some prominent podcasters are edging back from extremes as tides change, but questions their sincerity or forethought. (50:16-50:39)

6. Empathy, Left Politics, and the Fate of Liberalism

• On empathy vs. reactionary politics:
  Swisher invokes a quote from Elon Musk and others disparaging empathy as a flaw; Maron defends empathy and self-awareness as central to democracy and humane politics.
  • “These are just tenets of fascism and making it work. So how do you fight that?” (Marc Maron, 61:46)
  • “Empathy’s for suckers…You have to protect yourself…to maintain a righteous anger and…be of service to others.” (Marc Maron, 62:05)
• Cultural atomization:
  Maron describes daily life as shaped (and cheapened) by tech addiction and phone-based isolation, analogizing phone use to drug addiction and warning of a citizenship in decline.
  • “If you just go on the subway…it’s insane that nobody is looking at anybody. Sadly, the way it ends is everyone just disappears into whatever the other side of that is.” (Marc Maron, 65:17)
  • “It’s a full spectrum dopamine jerk off…you are addicted if you’ve tried to quit and failed.” (Marc Maron, 67:25)

7. Memorable Exchanges & Notable Quotes

• The legacy question:
  • “People say…you should archive your letters and notes…put them at a university. I’m like, for what?” (Marc Maron, 23:49)
• On podcast oversaturation:
  • “94% of podcasts…grifters, entrepreneurs, and businessmen.” (Marc Maron, 40:11)
• Comedy “with teeth” as civic duty:
  • “The gumption is really—what it comes down to is this anger that’s popped up a couple of times tonight.” (Marc Maron, 57:29)
• Empathy’s necessary complexity:
  • “I feel these things. And it’s not just a fight…that makes, for me, the passion about my point of view deeper…I’ve learned from experience and from people talking to me.” (Marc Maron, 57:29)
• On phone addiction:
  • “It’s a full spectrum dopamine jerk off.” (Marc Maron, 67:25)
  • “There’s one other industry where they call users. Drugs.” (Kara Swisher, 68:28)

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Expert Segment: Tig Notaro’s “Gumption” Question

[54:58–55:49]
Comedian Tig Notaro praises Maron's courage for holding principled, progressive positions in standup, asking:
“Where do you get your gumption?”
Maron responds that his drive to “poke” and prod is about curiosity, learned empathy, and having made his own share of mistakes. He stresses having learned from experience and dialogue, not posturing for approval, and accepting that taking a stand means not everyone (including peers) will like you. (57:29–59:44)

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Final Segments: What’s Next for Maron

• Current projects:
  • Developing new standup material with an eye toward another special. (69:02)
  • Season two of Apple TV’s Stick (November release).
  • Planning to direct a film adaptation of novel by Sam Lipsyte. (69:24)
• Farewell to podcasting:
  • Maron is content having left podcasting, wryly wishes “everyone would stop.” Swisher gives him credit as one of the very best to ever do it. (69:29–69:38)

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Important Timestamps

• [04:47] – Maron on anxiety and urgency
• [08:41] – Standup as sacred, transformative space
• [11:26] – Role in In Memoriam explores narcissism and legacy
• [16:56] – On being admired by strangers vs. loved by those close
• [22:39] – Grieving Lynn Shelton & pondering artistic legacy
• [35:45] – Leaving podcasting and its personal effect
• [40:54] – The “graveyard” of abandoned and failed podcasts
• [47:01] – Manosphere critique & satirical reference to Hitler as a podcaster
• [52:12] – The dangers and dishonesty of “anti-woke” hack comedy
• [61:46] – Empathy and self-awareness as bastions against fascism
• [67:25] – On phone addiction and societal atomization
• [69:24] – Maron’s current and upcoming creative projects

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Additional Memorable Moments

• Maron and Swisher’s banter about anxiety, parenting, and Jewish/lesbian dynamics: Both play up and subvert typecast roles.
• On validation and approval:
  “Withholding is just a test. If you pass the test, lucky you. You get me.” (Marc Maron, 19:48)
• On social media and addictiveness:
  “An indicator that you are addicted to something is if you’ve tried to quit and you failed. I’ve had many times where I’m scrolling… I just said, ‘dude, put the fuckin’ phone down.’ And some other part of my brain is like, ‘why?’” (Marc Maron, 68:20)
• Swisher’s device for disrupting phone zombies:
  • “When I’m walking down the street and someone’s staring at their phone, I go very close behind them and I go, ‘look up.’ And everybody does it… Snap me out of it.” (Kara Swisher, 65:59)

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Tone & Style

• Candid, irreverent, and self-deprecating: Both Maron and Swisher fuse biting humor with moments of vulnerability and introspection.
• Philosophical yet grounded: Reflections on media, politics, and legacy are peppered with concrete anecdotes and lived experience.
• Unafraid to critique their own industry: Both are critical of the directions podcasting, comedy, and technology have taken.

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Concluding Takeaways

Marc Maron, having closed out his trailblazing podcast, offers a pained but insightful post-mortem of media, comedy, and the pursuit (and pitfalls) of legacy. He insists on the importance of genuine connection, political clarity, empathy, and art that challenges rather than placates. The conversation is both an elegy for a vanishing media landscape and a call—to authentic creation, to humor with teeth, to resisting the numbing atomization of technology.

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Summary prepared for listeners and non-listeners seeking a detailed, faithful account of the episode’s major themes, key moments, and resonant quotes.

Transcript

[Kara Swisher]

I'm not anxious at all, actually.

[Marc Maron]

Do you know that you're not anxious at all?

[Kara Swisher]

No. I'm a lesbian, so I'm not anxious.

[Marc Maron]

So you've moved through anxiety?

[Kara Swisher]

I never had it.

[Marc Maron]

Never had it?

[Kara Swisher]

No.

[Marc Maron]

It's on.

[Kara Swisher]

Hi, everyone.

[Narrator/Producer]

From New York Magazine and the Vox Media Podcast Network, this is on with Kara Swisher. And I'm Kara Swisher. My guest today is stand up comedian and actor Marc Maron. You probably know Mark as the host of the podcast WTF, which just ended its run last fall after 16 years and nearly 1,700 episodes. On it, he interviewed everyone from President Barack Obama and Keith Richards to Carol Burnett and Robin Williams. In addition to the podcast and his critically acclaimed standup comedy specials, Mark has starred in a number of TV shows and films, including the Netflix series Glow, the Apple TV golf comedy Stick, and the Bruce Springst biopic Deliver Me From Nowhere. Now Mark is the star and producer of a new film called In Memoriam from writer and director Rob Burnett. Mark plays Langston Stanfield, a talented, narcissistic and arrogant actor who receives a terminal cancer diagnosis. He becomes obsessed with making it into the Oscars In Memoriam montage and cementing his legacy as an artist and is forced to confront failed relationships and many missteps in his personal life along the way. I want to talk to Mark because he's the OG podcaster. I love all his other stuff and I think he's an amazing standup. But he was here early during the podcast days. He was even earlier than I was, and I've been here a long time, and I just think he's really been brilliant out. He's a great interviewer and I love his standup. I love his attacks of the tech oligarchs. And so there's a lot for us to talk to. So let's get into the conversation with Marc Maron. I interviewed him earlier this week after the world premiere of In Memoriam at the Tribeca Film Festival. Our expert question today comes from comedian Tig Notaro.

[Kara Swisher]

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[Narrator/Producer]

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[Kara Swisher]

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[Narrator/Producer]

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[Narrator/Producer]

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[Marc Maron]

Hey Meta, where's the nearest Metro stor station?

[Kara Swisher]

Closest metro to you is Union Square about three blocks away.

[Marc Maron]

Hey Meta, text mom. I'm getting on the train now.

[Kara Swisher]

Sending message.

[Narrator/Producer]

Juggle your itinerary. Take calls and listen to music with open ear audio. No digging for your phone, no stopping for a map. Just you and your glasses. Ray Ban Meta Iconic style meets Meta AI. Available at Walmart and other authorized retailers.

[Marc Maron]

It is over.

[Kara Swisher]

Mark, thanks for joining me on opening night of the Tribeca Film Festival podcast stage for a live taping of on with Kara Swisher. So let's start talking about your careers. You spent decades working in standup before your podcast WTF took off. Now you're doing some of your best acting work. You've said at your core you're an urgent person. So talk about urgency.

[Marc Maron]

Urgency in a TED talk way or just personal?

[Kara Swisher]

Personal. You can TED talk it if you want.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. The reason urgency is so important to

[Kara Swisher]

us now do an NPR voice.

[Marc Maron]

I'm urgent and I think about it a lot.

[Kara Swisher]

Okay, that sounds like you're going to the bathroom.

[Marc Maron]

That sounds like npr. Yeah, I guess I'm an urgent person because I'm filled with anxiety and dread most of the time. So everything starts in a panic and moves through in a panic. I wake up in a mild panic. I don't know why I'm trying to resolve that. But everything is urgent because even things that I want to do when I know I have to do them, when I remember I have to do them, it's always like, oh, fuck, I have to. And that's not really a great way to enter something you want to do. I don't know if it's urgent as much as it is anxious. Anxious, but not in a nervous way. I'm just, you know.

[Kara Swisher]

And what causes this anxiety from your perspective?

[Marc Maron]

You know, I Don't know what it is exactly. I think it is just, you know, dread of the unknown. Yeah. So. And really, almost anything is unknown. I just. I always. Anything I have to do just feels like, not a chore, but, like, I'm trying to give you an example. Like, okay, so if someone, like, said, why don't you take a vacation and go spend a week in Spain, in about 40 seconds, my brain would be like, well, where do you park? So it's just the way my brain works that sort of.

[Kara Swisher]

That is dread of the known. But go ahead, go ahead. Not the unknown.

[Marc Maron]

I just don't. I don't know why, like, I wasn't anxious about this. I don't mind talking. I don't mind being in front of people. I'm not afraid of performing. But I think when I just have time and I have to do things or things are happening, I just. So I guess it's urgent. It's more FOMO than it is urgent.

[Kara Swisher]

Right. So parking in Spain is an issue, obviously.

[Marc Maron]

Well, yeah, because what if there's not a space? So that's sort of.

[Kara Swisher]

Why do you have a car in Spain?

[Marc Maron]

Well, I figured I'd rent one, and then we gotta talk about, can I drive with the license I have, or do I have to get an international license temporarily? Which side of the street do you drive on in Spain?

[Kara Swisher]

Same.

[Marc Maron]

See, now I'm canceling my trip. My trip canceled.

[Kara Swisher]

All right.

[Marc Maron]

I'm not going.

[Narrator/Producer]

Okay.

[Kara Swisher]

It's a lovely country. It's a lovely country.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, I know, but, like, it just seems like a hassle.

[Kara Swisher]

Okay.

[Marc Maron]

All right.

[Kara Swisher]

I'm not anxious at all, actually.

[Marc Maron]

Do you know that you're not anxious?

[Kara Swisher]

No, I'm a lesbian, so I'm not anxious.

[Marc Maron]

So you've moved through anxiety?

[Kara Swisher]

I never had it.

[Marc Maron]

Never had it?

[Kara Swisher]

No. My wife is Jewish. She's very upset by this situation.

[Marc Maron]

And she's anxious.

[Kara Swisher]

Yes.

[Marc Maron]

Because you make her anxious, probably. Right. You're not helping her in any way.

[Kara Swisher]

No, not at all. No. But I'm like, why are you so anxious?

[Marc Maron]

So you're not. You're the opposite of anxious. You, like, thrive on other people's. In discomfort.

[Kara Swisher]

Yes, that's what I do. That's actually been my career. And it's been an excellent and lucrative.

[Marc Maron]

Well, I'm glad you made a career out of it. I also made my career out of anxiety.

[Kara Swisher]

Good. Well, this is good. Okay.

[Narrator/Producer]

We're moving down.

[Kara Swisher]

Bad area, so. But are you anxious when you think of your career or when you do it, or what? Propels you.

[Marc Maron]

It's not really anxiety like that. I think I've moved through a certain amount of anger and a certain amount of anxiety. I don't have any anxiety really about my career. Like when I have to do something that's new, that's when I get very anxious. I don't feel insanely confident as an actor. So when I have to act, I get anxious. I've been playing a lot of music lately. I get very anxious about that. But I also know that that kind of fear is fine until you figure out, you know, how to do something right. Yeah. To do things at any point in your life, if they're new, those things aren't new. But for me to do them publicly and to really work on them, you know, you're going to suck for a while. And you got to just, you got to take that, you got to, you know, deal with that. But I learned from, from, you know, stand up. And also from my, you know, early acting jobs. Like it, it's okay to suck, you know, and either you'll get through it or you'll just keep sucking and you'll stop because it's not good for you.

[Kara Swisher]

Which is interesting. You picked a career where you really have to put yourself out there.

[Marc Maron]

And I don't know why I chose that.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Harry Shearer once said. Yeah. The reason we make people laugh is to try to control why they laugh at us. Which I think is very funny and very smart. I don't know why it was stand up, but it was always stand up. Since I was a kid, I always wanted to be a stand up. I always thought that stand ups were able to make sense of the world in a very specific way, in a very quick way, in a very poetic way. And they were able to disarm, you know, fears in a very quick way, in a very poetic way, and also give you new ways of looking at things. So I thought standups were just wizards and geniuses. And I always thought it was the most. It's a singular stage and it's a very sacred space to me. And it doesn't seem to be, you know, that sacred anymore, generally speaking to

[Kara Swisher]

me, in talking about Dandenez, although sometimes it is actually. Is there someone that was the first person you noticed in that regard?

[Marc Maron]

Well, I think my earliest memories really are of watching, you know, TV in the afternoon, watching Merv Griffin probably. You know, I still, you know, I see Jay Leno around now. Cause he's sort of back and doing standup. And like, I remember he did on, like the Merv Griffin Show. Like, it stuck with me my whole life.

[Kara Swisher]

Do you remember the joke?

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. He was just sitting. Not in a chair like this.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And I'm pretty sure it was Merv. But the host goes, we're going to go away for a break. And Jay goes, is the chair going to fold into the wall now? You know, like on a game show where it just disappears or goes. And I thought it was so fucking funny. But comics always sort of made an impression on me. I listened to a lot of Cheech and Chong, a lot of George Carlin when I was a kid. When I saw Richard Pryor's first MOV when I was in high school, the first Live in concert, that was a big deal. My parents took me to see Jackie Vernon when I was like 11 years old at the Hilton Inn in Albuquerque, New Mexico, in the lounge chair. Because I love Jackie Vernon because I'd see him on talk shows and it was kind of weird. I was a little kid in a dark lounge and there was a sweaty old guy who was probably near the end of his career. And we were like, second row. And he looked terrible. He looked like he was gonna have a heart attack any second. And some part of me was like, I want to be him.

[Kara Swisher]

Ye. What was your drink order? No, I don't want to answer that. So let's move to the film first. We're gonna get back to comedy in a second. But the film In Memoriam, you play Langston Stanfield, a 60 year old, narcissistic, arrogant actor who receives a terminal cancer diagnosis and becomes bent on getting in the Oscars. In Memoriam montage, which is quite a premise. He tells his manager if he's not in and he didn't exist. Essentially, yes, it's an absurd obsession, but at the same time. Well, it is in a way, but it isn't. And so I talk a lot about death. I just did a whole series about death for cnn.

[Narrator/Producer]

Yes.

[Marc Maron]

What'd you come up with? Figure out a way out of it.

[Kara Swisher]

No, no, I'm gonna die. But it's called Kara Swisher Wants to Live Forever. She doesn't. But talk about this, how it came about and how you thought about the role. You were really a jerk in the role at the beginning, like, so much so that I had to turn it off for a second.

[Marc Maron]

Did you?

[Kara Swisher]

Yes. You do a great job playing an inner narcissistic.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, well, you know, I was brought up by wild narcissists.

[Kara Swisher]

Me too.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. So you kind of. You know how to lock in. And at some point, you realize, well, maybe I have some of those things that they have. But if it's not truly pathological, you can sort of temper it or get rid of it or control it. But you do know how to do the narcissistic thing. When I got the role, you know, Rob Burnett, the writer. Writer, wrote a great script, directed the movie, offered me this role through my management. And I said to my manager, like, well, how many people turned it down? Because that's the way I think.

[Kara Swisher]

You need to know that.

[Marc Maron]

What number am I, you know, which other funny fellas have not wanted to do this? So. And then over time, they convince you that you're the only one they wanted, right? And you go and you believe it. And so I took the job.

[Kara Swisher]

It's your first lead role, right?

[Marc Maron]

It is my first lead role, yeah. And I think Rob wanted me because I don't know really who else could have done this role in the way that I did it. Not in an arrogant way, but, like, you know, it's a weird role, but the process was, you know, I read the script, I thought it was great, and I thought the premise was great. And then it just becomes about, you know, being present for what's on the page. I think, you know, as a person who's acting, I relate to the guy. I know I'm not the guy, but I'm close enough to the guy to play the guy, I believe. So I find the part of myself that fits this guy and the parts of me that don't fit it, I try to shut off. I really think that if something is well written, that the answers to your questions on how to perform it, and I'm no lifetime actor. It's all on the page. If you're present for what's going on on the page and present for. For the actors around you, what made

[Kara Swisher]

you like this premise? I mean, you called it emotionally charged and very human. What was the thing that attracted crazy funny?

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, it's crazy dark funny. Whenever I told people what this movie was about, they were like. They laughed because it's funny, but it's not that outside of reality. A guy who was a big actor when he was younger had big shots in show business, and it kind of all faded away. And as he got older, you know, who knows what he did, but he ended up on a sitcom for five years for the money. But in his heart, he was always a big actor, and he kind of failed there. So now he's dying, and the only Thing that'll give his wife meaning is to get into this In Memoriam montage. But he doesn't know if he has the resume for it.

[Kara Swisher]

He doesn't know if he can make the In Memoriam. Right.

[Marc Maron]

So then it's sort of like, well, we got to figure out an angle. So he's going to forego chemo. So he makes the cut now. So only half the room's laughing because the other half is sort of like, this sounds like a sad movie. And then I have no use for those people, right? Because like, they're the ones who are ruining everything. This is a funny concept, you know, just like triggered babies. Like that sounds like a sad film. It is. So what? That doesn't mean it's not funny. I don't know why I'm angry at you now, but. But yeah, so I thought it was very funny. But oddly, as I played it, and as you know, the foundational relationship in the movie is with me and my estranged daughter, played by Talia Ryder, who was great. And I didn't play it in a broad way, and Rob and I have talked about it, there are some bits of comedy in there that they're not broad, but they could have been played differently. But I played it very real because I don't really know how to do broad that well. I have to approach it like it's real. But. But once the relationship with Talia started to happen, this is to sort of explore the sadness element. It does get sad, but I think that because the guy is such an asshole and you kind of don't like him for a while, and then as he sort of breaks down a little bit in the relationship with Lily, Gladstone as the therapist sort of softens him to a degree, it becomes a little more weighty because I was talking about this with Talia, the woman who played my daughter yesterday. You know the scene where they. Well, I don't want to ruin the movie for anybody, but there's a scene, you know, where there's a cake involved and it's a horrendous bit of comedy. It really pushes the envelope of like, of what you can emotionally take as a funny premise. And at that point it does change to sadness, but not until that point.

[Kara Swisher]

No.

[Marc Maron]

So I thought that was all very challenging and it was very.

[Kara Swisher]

As you said, he's a self described asshole who realizes he doesn't have any friends. He has four to six ex wives and the longest relationship was with a manager. How did you prepare for the person who cares more about being admired by strangers than loved by the people in his life.

[Marc Maron]

Well, I can relate to that. You know, it's a sad situation, you know, in the sense of. And like, even as you read that, I realized that at this point in my life, my emergency contact is my manager.

[Kara Swisher]

Oh, wow.

[Marc Maron]

So, you know, I'm living that to a degree.

[Kara Swisher]

Okay.

[Marc Maron]

But it's not so much about the people in my life, but I've always felt like I could be more candid and more open, you know, in this room, like, with these people. And they're your people and I don't even know em.

[Kara Swisher]

Okay.

[Marc Maron]

But I'm sure some of them are mine. But. But there is something about making myself emotionally available on a stage that is. It's. It's where it happens mostly for me, the connection.

[Kara Swisher]

It's a parasocial relationship.

[Marc Maron]

For who? Them? It's a parasocial.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah. Parasocial meaning.

[Marc Maron]

I'm not having parasocial relationships.

[Kara Swisher]

No, you're not. You're you. They know you, but you don't know them well.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, that can become problematic. Cause very easy access to all of us, you know, so. But to address the thing, it's like, I don't know what that is. Like, you know, some performers, they say they're looking for love or they need

[Kara Swisher]

the love or the affirmation.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. But I don't know if I need that. It's like, I'm not even sure, you know, I like the laugh, but I think there's something about being seen and being present in yourself and being acknowledged for that. I don't know. Like, I'm very odd with. With how I feel about audiences. I used to do a joke about it. I used to say, you know, like, I'll do a joke that, like, only lands with half the audience. And I'll say, like, you know, that's what I like to do with an audience. I like to push you away, see if I can get you back and push you away and get you back. And that's a little dynamic I call dad, so. And there's something to the, you know, the parents connection. I've done a lot of thinking about this.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

But I don't like that. I'm so needy of validation. I don't like it.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

It's almost like an addiction.

[Kara Swisher]

Do you do the flip side, the withholding part?

[Marc Maron]

The withholding from who?

[Kara Swisher]

Anyone?

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, yeah, I do. I do. I do that. But it's hard for me now. I've gotten worse at it, you know. Was I withholding with my Last relationship? Not really. I find that if people kind of instinctively know me, they can get past that pretty quickly, you know, because I'm pretty sensitive and kind of like, you know, I'm a pretty soft guy, you know, but whatever, you know, I've built another thing. I've. What was that line I wrote? The monster I created to protect the child inside me is hard to control sometimes.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

So it's a great line, but. But no, people who know me can get right through it.

[Kara Swisher]

Can I reference.

[Marc Maron]

Withholding's just a test.

[Kara Swisher]

Yes. Is it?

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, it's just a test. And if you pass the test, lucky you. You get me.

[Kara Swisher]

It's hard to do with children. And speaking of which, I don't have any children. I have four, so I have them

[Narrator/Producer]

for all of us.

[Marc Maron]

You have four?

[Kara Swisher]

Yes, I do.

[Marc Maron]

Wow.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah. You can't be withholding. Well, you can, but.

[Marc Maron]

Ugh.

[Kara Swisher]

Ugh? What do you mean, ugh? Did you just ugh my four children?

[Marc Maron]

I did.

[Kara Swisher]

They're fantastic.

[Marc Maron]

How are you not gonna think that?

[Kara Swisher]

They just are. It's factual.

[Marc Maron]

Of course they are.

[Kara Swisher]

No, it's factual. It's actually factual.

[Marc Maron]

Whatever you say.

[Kara Swisher]

Okay. Well, I'm just telling you they're great. Anyway, in any case, you have a fake daughter in this movie, Maura. And they're getting to know each other. And he's teaching her the Sanford Meisner repetition exercise, which was very striking, where he tells her, don't think, feel, and you both get very emotional. I'd like you to talk about that

[Marc Maron]

scene the first time we did it on the park bench. Well, we really did it. I mean, oddly, if you do that exercise, it will get you. And I'm not sure what it was with me and Talia, but it really worked pretty quickly. Again, because the script is so good and it's all there that we were able to emotionally connect in that sadness. We both engaged in something. But that exercise, if anyone does, it

[Kara Swisher]

will push you to the listening and repetition.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. It'll push you to a limit. And given that it was loaded, that was me trying to get to know this daughter whose life I wasn't present in. That was loaded. So it started to happen very quickly. And that the exercise of me sort of admiring her and then also realizing in that moment that she is my daughter and that I'm having this. Whatever emotions that I never engaged with because I wasn't in her life. Yeah, it was overwhelming. So in the first time we did it, we were crying. I would imagine that given the number of takes we did. With some of these things, it's hard to know which ones they use, but, you know, you don't want to cry. And then, you know, have to do it too many more times because, you know, then you're forcing it.

[Kara Swisher]

How many times did you do that scene?

[Marc Maron]

We didn't have a lot of time. I think we shot that movie in, like, 20 days, so we had to get it in one or two, maybe three takes.

[Kara Swisher]

So you grieved the death of your partner, Lynn Shelton, very publicly, and you helped shape her legacy through your reflections. Now you're starring in a film that deals with legacy and what an artist leaves behind. I'm just curious. Talk about how the experiences have affected thinking of your own legacy or what that will look like. Did you think about it, doing this?

[Marc Maron]

No, I didn't. I don't.

[Kara Swisher]

Would you like to try now?

[Marc Maron]

I'm gonna try.

[Kara Swisher]

Okay.

[Marc Maron]

You know, I don't.

[Kara Swisher]

Don't think. Feel.

[Marc Maron]

I am feeling. I am feeling, you know, like, I think about Lynn Shelton. I think about, you know, in this world of, you know, no context and everything all the time, and no real sense of history or what anything means in relation to it, you know, what does a legacy really mean? I don't know. So, like, yeah, I mean, like, I've done a lot of stuff. And also, you know, the mindset around, you know, the difference between, you know, content and art and, you know, churning out content. And then, you know, everything we once knew is something amazing is just broken down into clips. You know, everything just churns away on our phone. None of us really think anymore. We just react to our phone. So, you know, what. What is legacy? You know, what does it mean to me? I don't know. You know, my girlfriend died. And what happens is when anyone dies is, you know, a handful of people are like, well, what are we going to do with all this shit? So that's just the reality of it. You know, people say to me, you know, you should archive, you know, your letters and your notes and get them, you know, put at a university. I'm like, for what? So I don't know why this anger comes out sometimes.

[Kara Swisher]

That's right.

[Marc Maron]

But, like, even when I think of the podcast, you know, 1700 episodes of fairly rare and singular interviews with a lot of people.

[Kara Swisher]

Absolutely.

[Marc Maron]

And a lot of them are very deep, and a lot of them are very revealing. They were moving for me. They exist in the world and, you know, and I hope that people can go back to those. I was just walking down the street Today. And some woman walks out of a doorway and she goes, oh, my God, I was just listening to you and Nick Kroll this morning. Now, what's interesting about that is either of those Nick Kroll episodes or at least one's a decade old or 15 years, and the other is at least a year or two, and I'm like, all right, well, that means something. If any of these conversations I've had or if any of my comedy bits can still provide a service for people in terms of doing for people what they did for me when I was a kid, making sense of the world, looking at something in a different way, elevating something, making someone feel less alone, making someone laugh at something that was, you know, stuck in their heart, then, great. That's a great legacy to have, and. And I hope that happens.

[Kara Swisher]

Well, that is legacy.

[Marc Maron]

Right, right, right.

[Kara Swisher]

Final question about this movie. How do you expect it's going to be received? I'm just curious. Do you think about that at all? Where does it belong?

[Marc Maron]

I try not to think about that,

[Kara Swisher]

because in moviel where does it belong?

[Marc Maron]

In movieland?

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

I don't know. You know, it's like, I. I don't. The great thing about this movie is, you know, I'm just an actor and, you know, let Rob worry about that shit. Like, he texted me the other day, he's like, this is going to be a wild ride. It's going to be a lot of ups and downs. I just don't want you to feel, you know, freaked out about it. I'm like, I'm not stressing at all. You're the director. You take it. You know what I mean? I'm really not. You just hope with this thing, as he does, in terms of where anything fits in or how something is sold anymore, or we live in a world where genius actors and brilliant writers and great directors do amazing things that no one sees. That is the world we're living in. Why? Because everything's broken open. Everything is like. It's just the Wild west out there. There are no gatekeepers, and the ones that do exist are greedy and basing everything on an algorithm of that could be, you know, fucking morons.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, so now you're speaking my language, but go ahead.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, no, I mean, I get it, you know, so. So I think the hope is that the movie lands somewhere where it is seen by as many people as possible. You know, how, you know, one markets it or. Or how, you know, nothing, you know, if. If you go on Netflix, you know, I've had Specials on Netflix. You know, it's on the front page for a day. And then this thing you worked three years on, people were like, you know, I don't know. I saw it yesterday and now it's gone.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah. And then Charlie Theron is. Who the hell knows what's in Prey or something.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. I don't understand it, but I do know that I probably watch the menu of Netflix more than I watch things on Netflix.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, that's fair. It's a very good menu. It's a really good.

[Marc Maron]

It's just like, you're getting a lot done. It's the same thing as scrolling reels. You're like, I don't know about that movie. You watch a trailer and why. Why can't you turn the trailers off?

[Kara Swisher]

I don't know.

[Marc Maron]

That is the only thing.

[Kara Swisher]

For a reason.

[Marc Maron]

I know it's for a reason, but it's annoying because the Apple remotes are too small.

[Kara Swisher]

Okay, all right, all right. Okay. So, okay. Do you think you'll make the In Memoriam at the Oscars when you die?

[Marc Maron]

No.

[Kara Swisher]

Okay.

[Narrator/Producer]

Why not?

[Kara Swisher]

Sure you will.

[Marc Maron]

I've done two movies.

[Kara Swisher]

I know, but still, they bring in other people now. They bring in other people now.

[Marc Maron]

I think it's. I don't know how they choose that. I definitely won't make it. No, no. That probably won't even make it.

[Kara Swisher]

Well, it depends on who dies that year, probably.

[Marc Maron]

Well, that's in the movie. Yeah, but it's always going to be more than me. Like, there's going to be, you know, there's going to be a gaffer that's done 90 movies.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, yeah.

[Marc Maron]

He's going to be in it. Maybe they're going to be like, Marc Maron did four movies. Well, Joe's the real deal, you know, like, so.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

I don't know. Like, I don't. Look, I don't win prizes, and I don't. I, like, I. It's. It's because, like, another validation. But it's not true. You know, it's actually not true anymore, you know, because I think I don't know what people want, but I know that I'm not always giving it to them.

[Kara Swisher]

Withholding. Yeah, withholding.

[Marc Maron]

And I know that.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

It's not withholding. It's aggressive. It's the opposite. Like, because, like, in my specials. But I will, you know, toot my own horn here. I did my special. This one that's up now. Panicked won the WGA Award. Run. The Writers Guild Award, and it was up against SNL. 50. The Conan at the Mark Twain Center.

[Kara Swisher]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

And Jordan Klepper, Daily Show. Like massive staffs of writers. You know, 15 guys on each. On each staff. And then just me, you know, Marc Maron panicked. So I was like, there's no way I'm gonna win that thing. And I did. And it felt good. Because like, that one I think has some. There's honor in that. The Writers Award.

[Kara Swisher]

Single.

[Marc Maron]

Well, no, the writers.

[Kara Swisher]

The award itself.

[Marc Maron]

The award itself.

[Kara Swisher]

Really like that.

[Marc Maron]

It's not like a. Yeah, Golden Globe that someone paid for.

[Kara Swisher]

Paid for that.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. Right. Or, or like, or like, you know, SAG Awards are fine, but like, I know actors and there's so many shows. Like, you know, what happens is you're going through.

[Kara Swisher]

Still back on that Netflix menu. You are.

[Marc Maron]

Okay, well, no, you're going through the nominees and there's like 50 in each category and you only saw one of the things. So what you're voting is like, oh, I know her. And that's it. You didn't even see what they did. But you know them.

[Kara Swisher]

That's how we do political voting now.

[Marc Maron]

Sure.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Narrator/Producer]

We'll be back in a minute.

[Marc Maron]

Foreign.

[Narrator/Producer]

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[Kara Swisher]

Pieces that just look and feel good

[Narrator/Producer]

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[Kara Swisher]

on one of their lightweight cotton sweaters when I go on this trip. I'm about to go on.

[Narrator/Producer]

Plus, everything at quints is priced 50 to 80% less than similar brands. They work directly with ethical factories and cut out the middleman. So you're paying for quality, not brand markup.

[Kara Swisher]

Besides the shirt and the T shirt and sweater I'm wearing, I brought a whole bunch of stuff for this trip.

[Narrator/Producer]

A lot of soft pants that I got from there.

[Kara Swisher]

I use a lot of Quints products.

[Narrator/Producer]

Elevate your summer wardrobe. Go to quince.com cara for free shipping on your order. And 365 day returns now available in Canada too. That's Q-U-I-N-C-E.com Kara for free shipping and 365 day returns quince.com Kara support for this show comes from Rippling. As a business owner, you know how in demand top talent can be, and that means retaining your best employees is something that you should always keep at the top of your mind. That's where Rippling comes in. Rippling is built on your live global workforce data, giving you full visibility into your business and the ability to stay ahead of the curve. Say you want to retain top talent? Just ask. Ask Rippling AI who are my top performers this year? And instantly receive a workforce report highlighting your top employees with supporting data like recent performance reviews and engagement metrics. But it doesn't stop there. Rippling can turn these insights into a proposed retention strategy, including a recommended 10% spot bonus for top performers. All you have to do is tap, confirm and the spot bonus is added to next month's pay run. So don't settle for AI. That's all talk. Head to Rippling AI Cara to get AI that turns insight into action. That's R I P P L I N G A I Kara K A R A Sign up for exclusive access today. Support for this show comes from Cohere. As AI advances, one thing matters more than ever. Staying in control. Most AI comes with strings attached, like sharing your data and infrastructure or compromising your independence. With Cohere, you don't have to give control to gain capability. You can have both.

[Kara Swisher]

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[Narrator/Producer]

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[Kara Swisher]

I'm going to shift to WTF and your life since ending the podcast. As you're winding on the show, you Talked about the anxiety again. You felt about not having it in your life in part because it helped you meet people. You said, quote, I live for connection. I live for it because I need to know I exist. So eight months. How's it going?

[Marc Maron]

I exist most days. Has it been eight months?

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

What is going on with time?

[Kara Swisher]

I don't know. I don't know.

[Marc Maron]

How did that happen?

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Did Covid fuck up time?

[Kara Swisher]

Yes.

[Marc Maron]

And then now the phones fuck up time too. It eats your time. Oh my God. Anyway, yeah, it's up and down with the time.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Because you have to realize, you know, half of my life I spent as a comic trying to be a comic.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah. And you weren't hinged to the idea of being funny. You'd have a.

[Marc Maron]

Well, no, but I mean, you just have time, right? Like if you're not. Like if you're just being a comic and you're getting by early in your career as a comic on, you know, whatever, a few hundred bucks a week and living on the lower east side, running around doing one nighters and stuff. I mean, outside of the drive to the gig and the half hour or hour you do, you've got another 22 hours that you wander around high with a notebook, you know, so I've been, I've had time before.

[Kara Swisher]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

Okay. Now I'm not high and I have money, so it's a different kind of time.

[Kara Swisher]

Right. So how's it going?

[Marc Maron]

It's okay.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah?

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. I mean, well, I was surprised, you know, like, because I thought like after the podcast, like, you know, do I gotta stay. How am I going to stay relevant? You know, maybe I'll get on Instagram, you know, know, do the live thing, you know. But then like after like a few weeks, I'm like, I, I don't, I don't want to do any of it. And I don't miss it. The, the sort of drive to, to generate. I mean, look, I, I know a lot of people love the podcast and it was an important part of my life and I did it for 16 years. But to be honest with you, I really talk to everyone I want to talk to.

[Kara Swisher]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

There's like 1700 people. How, how many more people?

[Kara Swisher]

Was there one? Was there one you?

[Marc Maron]

Well, some people didn't want to do it. I can't make people do it. You know, people were like, you should get Dylan. I'm like, all right, call him. What do you want from me?

[Kara Swisher]

Right?

[Marc Maron]

So. And I don't even think he'd be that great. An interview that's hit or miss with that guy.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, yeah.

[Marc Maron]

So. But no, literally, what started to happen was, you know, I would get opportunities to talk to people, and then I'd have to decide, like, you know, what. What do I care about their work? Do I know their work? If I don't know their work, but I am interested, can I get into their work? You know, which is just part of the gig. But then it gets to a point where it's like, do you want that job?

[Kara Swisher]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

Like, if something that you love to do or that, you know, sort of, you know, serviced a lot of different things in your life becomes a job, everything becomes a job. No, it does. You're saying it doesn't.

[Kara Swisher]

I say it doesn't. I love what I do.

[Marc Maron]

Oh, well, okay. Well, good for you.

[Kara Swisher]

But I'm not anxious. Like, you.

[Marc Maron]

Well, I'm not that anxious, but, like, I know that. Feeding the monster, like, if, you know, there's one thing I get, you're not anxious, but, you know, where does ambition play into it?

[Kara Swisher]

Right. You know, maybe you just liked it. I mean, one of the things you said it was freeing at one point because you could. You could.

[Marc Maron]

Of course I loved it. I'm not saying that. I'm saying that, like, there comes a point, you know, my producer and I worked together, and for years, and it was just the two of us. We were not part of a network, which is great. We were not, you know, gunners. It was never designed to be for money. When we started the podcast, there was no way to make money. We never made it video because we believed in audio as a format and the intimacy of audio. It was never an idea to really make it video. And I think because of these principles or what happened, how it became a business. I've been in modern podcasting since day one, so I saw the business grow and build and how it all worked out for everybody. So ultimately, it's a miracle that it gave me everything it gave me, and I love doing it. But after 16 years, a new show every Monday and Thursday, we were kind of fried. And also, like, because of the way the business has grown around us, there is nothing special about almost any of it. That the bar has been lowered to such a degree that people prefer parasocial relationships with mildly charismatic, fundamental, untalented people than being engaged by anything provocative or truly interesting that someone made out of their imagination and heart. So, you know, I don't need to be a part of that anymore.

[Kara Swisher]

Right, right. I see that. I see that. Wow. Did you Think of yourself as an interviewer, or you just were like, I don't like this shit's happening anymore. I don't like how it's evolved.

[Marc Maron]

No, I just, like, I needed to connect with people because I thought when I started that podcast, you know, I thought I was an outsider. I thought I'd pissed a lot of people off, and a lot of it wasn't exactly true. But I mean, the first. The way I developed whatever my style of conversation was, you know, I would have people over in my world, they were comics, and I would say, like, you know, are we good? Are you mad at me about that thing? And nine times out of 10, they'd be like, I don't even remember what you're talking about. And, you know, I'd been carrying around my whole life, right, so. So, But. But through that, you know, some sort of drive happened in terms of my curiosity. My need to connect was always a big part of it, but also just like, you know, not just connecting, but hearing how people work and hearing how people, you know, exist in those moments. Because I didn't. I never really had questions. You know, I would do some research, but like, the whole thing hinged on those.

[Kara Swisher]

First, on your curiosity, right? On your curiosity.

[Marc Maron]

Sure, it was curiosity, but was also like, yeah, I had to be interested. Yeah, it's bad if I'm not interested.

[Kara Swisher]

Right. But just for people to know. It was 2009, which is very early, and you said it helped, quote, unleash an exciting type of delivery system for pure self expression, the Bonoise. But also unleashing format that can be used for dubious means, propaganda and pure evil.

[Marc Maron]

Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. This is the monster of the monster.

[Kara Swisher]

So how did you feel about.

[Narrator/Producer]

You ushered it in of all the

[Kara Swisher]

people, I can think of one of a couple among the beginning. The OG people, probably.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah.

[Kara Swisher]

I mean, you're on the list.

[Marc Maron]

But the thing was is that I think. What? Look, yeah, I'm not. I'm not a businessman, I'm not an entrepreneur, and I'm not a grifter. Okay, so, you know, those weren't on my menu, but I would say that's 94% of podcasts. So whatever I was doing at the beginning, you know, I didn't invent interviewing. I don't know why some people can live on these mics and connect and why some people can't. But what happened was that because of my success and a few other people, everyone decided that anyone could do it and they can.

[Kara Swisher]

Can, right?

[Marc Maron]

But go. There is a graveyard of four episodes of someone's dream podcast. Thousands of them. Thousands. Since 2008, there's got to be like a million, you know, three to four episodes of someone who has entered it going like, this is going to be great. And by week four, they're like nine people listened.

[Kara Swisher]

So do you feel responsible for that?

[Narrator/Producer]

Great.

[Marc Maron]

I. Sure. But, like, I'm just. A lot of them didn't go away.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, yeah, they didn't. Now, last month, for example, the businesses evolved, as you said. You said grifters, entrepreneurs and what was the third one?

[Marc Maron]

Grifters, entrepreneurs and businessmen.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, businessmen. Okay.

[Marc Maron]

Propagandists. There's a lot. There's a lot of things going on.

[Kara Swisher]

Last month, Spotify and Netflix acquired the video rights to distribute Jay Shetty's On Purpose podcast in a deal reportedly where Jay Shetty.

[Marc Maron]

I don't know who that is. Maybe I'm out of the loop.

[Kara Swisher]

Well, he got $100 million. It's part of Netflix. Broader push into podcasts, an effort to compete with YouTube. Did you. Do you think about that? And staying. Do you think about.

[Marc Maron]

Oh, I know when I saw, you know, podcasts on the menu of Netflix, I'm like, it's fucking over. Yeah. You know, you know, no one gives a shit about it.

[Narrator/Producer]

Explain yourself.

[Marc Maron]

But the bar has been lowered to such a degree. Degree that people will sit at home and watch people on zoom with half their fucking face covered up by a sure SM7. It's like, what. What is wrong with fucking people? Like, do they not have any friends? Do they. Are they not curious about anything? Do they not use their brain anymore? They can't think. They gotta have three idiots who were talking about the last time they shit themselves as adults, you know, entertain them. I mean, it's like. It's like a fucking. A world of drive time radio. It's the worst.

[Kara Swisher]

Right? So why do you think it's popular?

[Marc Maron]

Huh?

[Kara Swisher]

Why do you think it's popular?

[Marc Maron]

Because people are lazy and they'll adapt to anything and they're fucking lonely and they want to have parasocial relationships with people. They feel that they're like. Which means usually fucking amateurs.

[Kara Swisher]

Right? Right. Okay. All right, then I think that's it. Well, a lot of them, I don't know, keep going.

[Marc Maron]

I don't know what's going on with me.

[Kara Swisher]

Okay. I like it. I like it. I like it a lot, actually. Actually, a lot of people you're referring to in your.

[Marc Maron]

This is the. Because I don't have the podcast anymore. Yeah, you have to, like, the anger's right there. Again, I don't know what to do about that.

[Kara Swisher]

It's good.

[Marc Maron]

Keep it on stage. You know, I think it's better for the stage, like, because I was worried after the podcast, like, you know, people aren't going to know my dates. But I think people like, miss me because the tickets are so ingrained.

[Kara Swisher]

Great.

[Marc Maron]

Like, I just use Instagram to promote stuff, you know, put clips up. But, but I think the, the not doing the podcast has made some people sort of like, well, I got to see what, what the cats are up to.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, it's. How can they miss you if you won't go away?

[Narrator/Producer]

We'll be back in a minute.

[Kara Swisher]

Hi, I'm Maria Sharapova, host of the Pretty Tough podcast. Each episode I sit down with high achieving women to discuss the pursuit of excellence without apology. This week, model Sports Illustrated covergirl and entrepreneur Ashley Graham talks about the time she almost quit.

[Tig Notaro]

I called my mom and I said, mom, I just, I'm not going to do this anymore. And she told me, no, you are going to stick this out. Your body is going to change someone's life. Every decade you're gonna go through something different. So be really happy with who you are right now because things change.

[Kara Swisher]

Check out Pretty tough new episodes on Wednesdays. You can watch it on YouTube or listen in your favorite podcast app.

[Scott Galloway]

Big news this week for all my Gordon Geckos, my Robin Hooders, my Claude squad, Anthropic, which is newly the most valuable AI company in Svorld, announced it would be going public. That news follows reporting that OpenAI plans to go public as soon as September and that that news follows reporting that SpaceX, which also considers itself an AI company, will be going public in maybe just a few weeks from now. Welcome to the era of the Omega ipo. We are about to see millionaires, billionaires, and yes, probably even the world's first trillionaire created overnight. And yet, yes, it's that guy.

[Kara Swisher]

This is the chainsaw for bureaucracy. Chainsaw.

[Scott Galloway]

But all the tech bros who are going to make all the money, they need our money way more than we need their products. And we're going to remind you why on today. Explain from VOX.

[Political Commentator]

So the 2026 midterms is shaping up to be an all out brawl. But the biggest fight may not be between Democrats and Republicans, but over the congressional match maps itself.

[Kara Swisher]

Gerrymandering is not a good thing.

[Narrator/Producer]

We don't like it.

[Kara Swisher]

And then all of a sudden we're going out and telling people, vote for

[Political Commentator]

this so I'm in Ashland, Virginia, a small town just outside of Richmond, which calls itself the center of the universe. And that checks out because it's the center of the political universe, at least when it comes to the 2026 midterms. That's because Ashland sits in Virginia's 1st congressional district, which is one of only about 35 or so that are actually competitive. That makes Virginia particularly important when it comes to the question of gerrymandering.

[Scott Galloway]

The gerrymandering is a major problem, but it's not like Democrats drew first blood with this one. Donald Trump doesn't think he should be held accountable by anybody, so he's trying to change the rules because he doesn't like the game.

[Kara Swisher]

We've shown what we're capable of. Now let's keep up the push through the midterms.

[Political Commentator]

America actually will be in your feeds and on YouTube every Saturday with an interesting interview in politics or call culture.

[Kara Swisher]

One of the groups you, in your latest HBO special panic you criticized were the manosphere. Podcasts are full of this. And one notable line was, if Hitler were alive today, he'd probably appear on Theo Vaughn's podcast. He'd probably have a podcast anyway.

[Marc Maron]

That's true.

[Kara Swisher]

Talk about what's happening here with these guys.

[Marc Maron]

Well, look, you know, like, I had a really deliberate. Or delegate or what's the word I want. I had to think about that bit, you know, because I know these guys. I've known them my whole life. I knew them before there was a manosphere. I knew them as comics. You know, I knew Rogan when he started in Boston. I've known these guys. We are somewhat of a weird tribe and a community. So, like, it gets to a point where, look, my politics are what they are. You know, I'm, I'm team left. You know, I'm not going to make all the games.

[Kara Swisher]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

But, but I'm team left left, you know, going downtown to fight the. Oh, yeah, not today, I think, but, you know, good, you know, fight. Good luck with it. And I'll look on, I'll keep following you on the reels, you know, so, but, but I've always been that way.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

You know, that's always been my politics. And, you know, I believe in, you know, liberal democracy. I believe in it. So. But like, with the Theo Vaughn thing, I, I, that's a joke, and it's a good joke.

[Kara Swisher]

Joke. Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

You know, to do Theo interviewing Hitler is hilarious.

[Kara Swisher]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

And I eventually got to a place with that joke where I'm like, how, how Could Theo get mad at me for this?

[Kara Swisher]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

It's funny, right? But they're sensitive, though.

[Kara Swisher]

They get mad at you.

[Marc Maron]

Well, Joe said he got mad. I don't know. Yeah, yeah, I think they're, they're, they get hurt.

[Kara Swisher]

You know, they're very delicate flowers.

[Marc Maron]

They are a little bit.

[Kara Swisher]

Bit, yeah, maybe they are.

[Marc Maron]

I don't know why.

[Kara Swisher]

Plus billionaires are like that. I get so many calls like, you're so mean to me and I go, go buy a France. Go yourself.

[Marc Maron]

You know, but like, my, my issue was, and I think that many of them. Look, I don't want to be diplomatic about this, you know, please don't. And, and I've, I've talked about this a lot.

[Narrator/Producer]

You talked about anti war in the special.

[Marc Maron]

And I talked about it when I was promoting. My problem with those guys is that they were sucking up to fascists and they were promoting the end of liberal democracy and the beginning of authoritarianism. To me, that was plain and clear to see. So my issue with them was because of that, it was political and it was like they were bootlickers and they were pawns. But I also think they were suckers. And I also think that some of them are grifters. Is that some of these guys, it's like they're gonna go to where the money is and the audiences they built, you know, like, like even be. Even before I made these comments, like, you know, would I ever go on Joe's show because he's sort of a, you know, a star maker or, or Tony show? It's like, no, I wouldn't because what am I gonna do with that audience?

[Kara Swisher]

Right, Right.

[Marc Maron]

Do you know, I've got my audience. They're delicate, you know, angry, creative, middle aged people, but they're my people, you know, so. And there's enough of them, you know, and I, I think we need to speak up. And in that special, I was, you know, I took, I balanced that special. It was a delicate thing to sort of take the hits at the lefties in a way that they could handle it. So. And I did that. But really, my. And it does seem that the tide is turning, you know, like, you know, Dylan and Schultz and Rogan have become

[Kara Swisher]

critical, seeing what's happening.

[Marc Maron]

Right. But you know what that means, though?

[Kara Swisher]

It's over and they need to get back.

[Marc Maron]

Well, right. They. Maybe they don't know where it's dragging them, but I think really that a lot of these guys and people in general, they don't have a worldview. They're Reacting like, I don't, you know, I don't think they, they think it through.

[Kara Swisher]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

You know, a couple guys got mad at me for the, the Riyadh joke and these are jokes I'm doing. Everything on that special was a joke and all the stuff that I was doing promoting the special, taking them to task a bit was, you know, it was done in the spirit of comedy, you know, but these are jokes, right? But they have some teeth to them and they're, they're not their teeth. Right. I just got to the point where it's like if, you know, lefties or comics that are progressive, it's difficult to talk about politics and it's difficult to talk about left leaning politics without, you know, seeming strident and, you know, annoying. And so those two things are not great for funny.

[Kara Swisher]

But you've been outspoken against the sort of so called anti woke angle in comedy as pure hack. And it is, it's just, it is.

[Marc Maron]

Well, it's become hack.

[Kara Swisher]

It's like a boob joke to me. It's like a boob joke to me.

[Marc Maron]

A boob joke.

[Kara Swisher]

Boob jokes are funnier, but you know what I mean? It's like the easiest joke to do.

[Marc Maron]

Look, a good dick joke is always great.

[Kara Swisher]

Listen, hello, I'm with Scott Galloway all the fucking time. So I'm aware of the situation.

[Marc Maron]

So, but, but the, the thing that bothered me about that is like they were, whether they knew it or not, in the beginning of, of anti. Wokeness that, that was always like the, you know, the Republican, you know, what the Republicans and the right have always wanted for the last three or four decades was the dismantled, you know, liberal democracy. Yeah, yeah. I mean, some of them are still pissed off about the New Deal deal.

[Kara Swisher]

So, you know, and women's vote.

[Marc Maron]

That's right, all of that stuff. And, and this has been brewing for so long that, you know, when comics get duped into this idea that because they can't say tranny or, or worse words that somehow or another that the left is infringing upon their, their freedom of speech. It's so shallow and stupid. And, and because they fought for it, they just became part of the party line of dismantling, saying liberal democracy, which was never a, it was never a freedom of speech issue, it was never a constitutional issue, never. You could say whatever you want and you're just going to have to shoulder the burden of consequences. Yeah, of the consequences. But ultimately what happened? Because they were used as cudgels to dismantle the entire infrastructure of dei and everything else. Right. So now, like, they don't have to shoulder anything because now they can say those words with impunity and the left have no traction to, to counter it because we're living in two separate worlds. But I, I hold them responsible for, for, for being the front line of

[Kara Swisher]

being the dupe and the cudgel.

[Marc Maron]

Yes.

[Kara Swisher]

Stup. The stupid hammer.

[Marc Maron]

That's right.

[Kara Swisher]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, I think that's true. And so for me, it was always a big picture thing.

[Kara Swisher]

Right?

[Marc Maron]

And now, like, some of them, I don't know if they know that, but they know. They, they, you know, that it's.

[Kara Swisher]

I think they're understanding. They're suckers at this point. I think they're getting. The penny is dropping.

[Marc Maron]

I, I think so. You know, and it's just like, you know, what do you know? It's weird. Like, I've been working on this bit, you know, on stage, just about how, like, that there's going to be people now, maga. People that are going to be like, oh, man, I think I screwed up, you know, and you're probably going to come in contact with them. And I think the instinct of a progressive or a left leaning person is to be like, yeah, you fucking idiot. You broke the world, you dumb shit.

[Kara Swisher]

Right?

[Marc Maron]

What the fuck is wrong with you? Stupid. But I think really the play is to not say anything. But. And I'm talking about without the face. None of this, you know, none of that. Just, you know, just don't say anything. Let them sit with it.

[Kara Swisher]

Do that face again, please.

[Marc Maron]

Just let them sit with it and go, look, you know, we always loved you, dad, and.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, good idea. All right. Every episode. We only have a little bit. We were gonna run over a little bit. Every episode we get a question from.

[Marc Maron]

Run over. You can go as long as you want podcast.

[Kara Swisher]

Fantastic. Fantastic. Okay. Every episode we get a question from an outside expert. Here is yours.

[Tig Notaro]

Hi, I'm Tig Notaro, comedian, podcaster, actor, mother, wife, friend, and certified gay person. My big question for Marc Maron is, where do you get your gumption? I've told you many times the deep appreciation I have for your continued strong, steady, outspoken, bold views that really should not be bold views, but they are views that do not line up with the majority of your peers that you came up with. I, I feel like you're truly fighting the good fight and I do not take your voice for granted. You're so important to so many. Where do you get your gumption? I really want to know way back when and where it comes from. Thank you, sir.

[Marc Maron]

Oh, I love Tig. You know, there's a period there. I've known her for a long time. Many years. Like, before she was Tig, kind of. Yeah. There was a period there where we were dressing almost identically.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, I can see it. Yeah. You've got a lesbian vibe. Sure do.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, I do. I do. I know, I know.

[Kara Swisher]

Even the facial hair.

[Marc Maron]

Oh, yeah. I'm a little bit.

[Kara Swisher]

You're hirsute. You'd be a hirsute lesbian.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. It was just very funny because we'd go to festivals or we'd work together, and we'd look at each other. I'm like, what is happening? Where do I get my gumption? Look, I'm a guy that's, like.

[Kara Swisher]

It's a great word.

[Marc Maron]

Well, I think I'm. I like to poke, and I think that's part of my comedy and also part of the way that, you know, I interact with people, that it's the opposite of withholding. It's the poking to see if you can get a rise out of people. And I think I've always sort of done that to see if maybe I'd get yelled at or maybe I wouldn't. You know, I don't know what that exactly is about, but I'm also somebody who. I've said all the things you can say on stage in my career, in my life. I've made. I wouldn't call them mistakes, but, you know, in different times, I've done dubious jokes. I'm not saying I said the N word. I'm not saying I hurt people. But, you know, I. I know I've learned from experience and from people talking to me about what is hurtful, what is wrong. You know, maybe you should think about this a different way. Like, I used to do a joke many, many years ago about. About transgender, the idea of it, but I. You know, and I. It was something to do with, like, becoming a mythological, you know, entity. And to me, I thought it was a celebration, but someone said to me, no, it's not correct. You know, I used to try to frame the R word in a way. I always knew it was kind of bad, but there was, like, in my mind, you know, maybe if we explored it. But then someone said to me, like, you know, if you have someone you know in your family or your son or your daughter, and they're challenged like that, it's incredibly hurtful. So I've made a lot of mistakes, personally, in all different ways, and I've learned from those Things. And that makes for me, the passion about my point of view deeper. I'm not just reacting. It's not coming from. I'm not posturing. I feel these things. And it's not just a fight. So the gumption is really. And really what it comes down to is this anger that's popped up a couple of times tonight. Like that happened on the Howie Mandel show because he was like, like it's harder when you're with somebody. Like if you're sitting with somebody that you disagree with. Like, you know, if I see Theo, like, you know, when I'm gonna. It's amazing that I haven't.

[Kara Swisher]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

You know what happens then? You know, if I see Joe or if I see Tony, all these guys who have.

[Kara Swisher]

Will there be a fist fight?

[Marc Maron]

No, no, no. There will be a fist fight. But I think what, eventually what will happen is unlike, not unlike, I guess, everyone talks about this time when we could put our politics aside and still be people with each other. I assume that is probably what will happen. Do you know what I mean? I assume that if I see Theo or Tony or the guys that have spoken who have responded to me. Yeah. Which is. It's fine, you know, it's, it's a lot. I don't love that. You know, that's the other thing about wanting approval or validation is that, you know, when you're going to speak up, you've got to realize, well, you're not going to get it from any everybody, you know, and you've got to live with that.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Even if they're your peers.

[Kara Swisher]

What does that encounter look like?

[Marc Maron]

Well, I imagine it would be like, what's up? You know, and they're like, nay. So what are we, Are we, are we good or what are we doing? Yeah, I'm all right. All right. Okay. Well, good to see you. Hope you're well. Yeah, yeah. And then maybe it'd be like, they'd be like, oh, you're so right.

[Kara Swisher]

I don't think so. I don't think so. It would be nice. That was the case. You know, it's interesting, but as you say, you don't like it. I mean, I, I, unfortunately, the people who insult me, one of them is about to become a trillionaire, so I'm totally fucked. Who said I had a heart?

[Marc Maron]

Why is he just gonna crush you with his money?

[Kara Swisher]

Yes, he will throw money on top of me. I'll say, please keep throwing it. It'll be one of those.

[Marc Maron]

But it's rigged, cuz he's gonna kill you with the money.

[Kara Swisher]

Yes, but he can try. He can try. I don't think he'll be successful. Speaking of Elon Musk, last year Elon

[Marc Maron]

Musk went on, oh, that guy.

[Kara Swisher]

That guy, Trust me, went on Rogan and said, quote, the fundamental weakness of Western civilization is empathy. Conservative writer Helen Andrews says that demographic feminization that values empathy over rationality has led to wokeness. Essentially, women are empathetic and that leads to bad politics. I want you to kind of make the case for empathy because I think you are very empathetic. At the same time, as you've noted, how do you counter that? If you're on the left or progressive, are you doomed to nuance and verbosity or what is the way to counter that idea?

[Marc Maron]

I don't, you know, like, I had to become better at empathy. You know, I had to become a better listener. I think that certain things help me with, with that one. I have to give a lot of credit to recovery, the process of listening and, you know, hearing somebody's story and what they've gone through. Through. So. But I do think that this stuff, the battle against empathy and the battle against self awareness, which is the other one.

[Kara Swisher]

Lack of expertise as a plus.

[Marc Maron]

Yes. I mean, these are just tenets of fascism and making it work. So how do you fight that? I mean, obviously I used to do this line, like what they're basically saying is, empathy's for suckers.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And, you know, how you calibrate your empathy and how you use it and how you don't get drained by your own empathy or whether your empathy is real or you're really just in some sort of, you know, victim mode that is only feeling exhausted by the moral injustice of every day in this country right now. I think you have to protect yourself on some level to maintain, you know, a righteous anger and, and figure out really how you can use it and how you can best be of service to other people. But I think a lot of it, you know, and I'm guilty of this, is like, how much are you really getting out and doing anything?

[Kara Swisher]

Right?

[Marc Maron]

You know, I mean, you have. You may feel a certain way and you may believe something is wrong and, you know, you may post a post or.

[Kara Swisher]

Right.

[Marc Maron]

Send a chance.

[Kara Swisher]

Check hashtagivism, I think.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, yeah, whatever that is. You know, but are you present to, to really be of service and really help and, and, and then when you get into that zone, if you are a sensitive person or, or a person who is full of empathy or broken in A certain way, then you can start beating yourself up for, you know, not being more involved, not doing enough. And then, you know, you don't think

[Kara Swisher]

you're doing stuff that's really. You are. I mean, you obviously have transformed lives through your podcast. I don't know. I don't think you recognize.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah, no, I. I don't. I'm not saying this about me. You know, I feel like I'm always surprised that. That making a difference on an individual level. If somebody says to me, you know, I, you know, I was, you know, depressed or, you know, many people, you know, I've helped get sober or the way I've processed stuff or. Or. Or speaking out, you know, like. Like Tig says, does do something, you know, you. I think you can do things without putting yourself in harm's way.

[Kara Swisher]

How does this era end, when you think about it? Because, you know, I've had to deal with all the tech oligarchs who have just seem to have sucked up every bit of oxygen and all the juicy bits in our society. How does this end from your perspective?

[Marc Maron]

What, the world?

[Kara Swisher]

No, no. Probably in a blast. But how do you think about this time ending where this doesn't seem where we. I mean, I think it's on the march, because Elon, for example, is a good example of this. Has turned into a villain when he wasn't necessarily, but has become that at the same time. He's also about to become the world's richest person ever in history. How does it end? And Trump is sort of rotting away in front of our eyes.

[Marc Maron]

I don't know how it ends because I don't know if the agenda was to kill the spirit of the 60s. Yeah. And kill the progress that was made on a human level in relatively democratic format, and the power of technology and the access that everyone has to your brain, to your life, and then the people in power. You know more about that stuff than I do, but I think. I think. I don't know how it ends, but we've got to stop, you know, volunteering for the. The brain fucking.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And.

[Kara Swisher]

Good way of putting it. And it's not a good fuck. It's not a good fuck.

[Marc Maron]

No, no. It's. It's. It's. It's. It's just. Okay.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

But, you know, if you really think about, like, you know, today, because I think about it all the time, and it's all relative to the monster that. That you spend your day looking at, that your phone. It's all relative to that. I mean, that's everyone's point of access. And if you just go on the subway and it's insane that nobody is looking at anybody. So I think sadly, the way it ends is everyone just disappears into whatever the other side of that is.

[Kara Swisher]

Chatbots and avatars and everything, whatever. That said, when I. Something I do a lot, I think you should do it. I think it would be excellent. Is when I'm walking down the street and someone's staring at their phone, I go very close behind them and I go, look up. And everybody does it for a second. No, they do it. They're like, ugh, I suck.

[Marc Maron]

Snap me out of it. Yeah, I tried to.

[Kara Swisher]

It's interesting. They go, I suck. And then at some point someone's going to turn around and shoot me. But I feel so far I haven't been shot.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. I tried to do a joke about like Denver seems to really land as a joke though about how like, you know, in an authoritarian country, what they really want is for you to, you know, keep your mouth shut and keep your head down. And it's so much easier with the phone.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah. That's a great joke.

[Marc Maron]

It always lands as a sort of like never. Not a big laugh.

[Kara Swisher]

Maybe if you include brain in there, it's. It might work.

[Marc Maron]

Well, I do a lot of bits about that because I do think I'm sort of. I'm just, I'm working out this stuff.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

You know, for myself because like today, like, you just being on the train here culturally is. Is kind of awesome to be on a subway.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

The people you're surrounded.

[Narrator/Producer]

Amazing.

[Marc Maron]

It's. It's. This is like, this is a great example of, of democracy and on a

[Kara Swisher]

social level, each other. Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Well, yeah, just people like, you know, you got someone sitting on your lap.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

And you're sort of like, all right, okay. You know, like. And I just, you know, I'm trying. You got the phone. It's an addiction because it's a full spectrum dopamine jerk off. Right. So. And you can spend. And I know it. And I just share this as an addict in a room full of addicts, you know that an indicator that you are addicted to something is if you've tried to quit and you failed. And the number of times you've done that would indicate whether or not your life is unmanageable or you're powerless over a substance. And I've had many times where I've been sitting with my phone scrolling. I don't know why they call it doom scrolling. It's fun. So, like, where I've been doing it and I've just said, dude, put the fucking phone in down. And some other part of my brain is like, why?

[Kara Swisher]

Well, you know, there's no other industry where they call. There's one other industry where they call users.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. Drugs.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah.

[Marc Maron]

Yeah. Think about it.

[Kara Swisher]

Ah, good one. Thank you. You can.

[Marc Maron]

Is that yours?

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, it is. You can.

[Marc Maron]

I like it.

[Kara Swisher]

Okay. Borrow it, take it, steal it, whatever you want. What are you doing next? What's your next thing? Hey, you. No, that lady.

[Marc Maron]

I thought you were just. General audience question. What you doing? Where's everyone going? Because we want.

[Kara Swisher]

I'm going to watch the videos on my phone of Trump getting booed at. That will be a satisfying time with my phone.

[Marc Maron]

Well, I'm working on a new hour of Stand Up. It's coming along good. We're probably going to be moving towards a special in that area. I just shot the second season of Stick with Owen Wilson that should be coming out in November, and I'm trying to put together a movie to direct based on my friend Sam Lipsite's novel. No one left to come looking for your.

[Kara Swisher]

Well, fantastic. I'm looking forward. I wish you were still in podcasting. You really were fantastic at it.

[Marc Maron]

Well, I appreciate that and I wish that everyone would stop.

[Kara Swisher]

I know. And yet. And yet, you were really good at it.

[Marc Maron]

Thank you very much.

[Kara Swisher]

All right. Thank you, Mark Merritt.

[Marc Maron]

Thank you.

[Narrator/Producer]

Today's show is produced by Christian Castor, Roselle, Michelle Eloy, Katherine Milsop, Madeline LaPlante, Dubie and Kalyn Lynch. Nishat Korwa is Vox Media's executive producer and podcast. Special thanks to Julia Sharp Levine, Max Levine and Bradley Sylvester. Our engineers are Fernando Aruda and Rick Kwan and our theme music is by Trackademics. If you're only following the show, you'll be immortalized in the Oscars montage. If not, maybe they can squeeze you into the Daytime Emmys. Go wherever you listen to podcast, search for on with Kara Swisher and hit follow. Thanks for listening to on with Kara Swisher from Podium Media, New York Magazine, the Vox Media podcast network, and us. We'll be back on Monday with more. Support for this show comes from Netsuite. The AI revolution is here and every business is looking to wrap their arms around it. And while the possibilities are endless, so are the risks. But there's no time to twist and turn about the decision because your competitors are already making their move. Thankfully, Netsuite by Oracle can put AI to work today. NetSuite is a top rated AI Cloud ERP trusted by over 43,000 businesses.

[Kara Swisher]

Businesses.

[Narrator/Producer]

It's a unified suite that brings your financials, inventory, commerce, HR and CRM into a single source of truth. That connected data is what makes your AI smarter. It knows how to intelligently automate routine tasks, how to deliver actionable insights, and can help you cut costs and make fast AI powered decisions with confidence, giving you total flexibility. From software and IT services to healthcare equipment, manufacturing, financial services and many other great American industries, NetSuite delivers a customized solution for your business. If your revenues are at least in the seven figures, get our free business guide demystifying AI at netsuite.com on the guide is free to you at netsuite.com on netsuite.com on.