Podcast Summary: "The Best (and Worst) Books of 2024" on On with Kara Swisher

Release Date: December 23, 2024
Host: Kara Swisher
Guests: Becca Rothfeld (Washington Post) and Dwight Garner (New York Times)

Introduction

In the year-end episode of On with Kara Swisher, award-winning journalist Kara Swisher engages in a comprehensive discussion with esteemed book critics Becca Rothfeld from the Washington Post and Dwight Garner from the New York Times. The conversation delves into the literary landscape of 2024, exploring the best and worst books of the year, the evolving role of literary criticism, the state of the publishing industry, and ongoing challenges such as book bans.

Reading Habits and Preferences

Kara begins by sharing her personal foray back into reading, balancing between physical books, e-books, and audiobooks. She emphasizes the importance of discussing books, especially in light of recent book bannings and the surprising resilience of the book industry.

Notable Quote:
Kara: "I have started reading books in book form, although I do read on my screen a lot too." [00:00]

Becca and Dwight discuss their reading habits, highlighting a preference for print books to facilitate note-taking and deeper engagement. Becca avoids reading on screens to maintain focus, while Dwight balances digital and physical reading depending on the material.

Notable Quotes:
Dwight: "I read all my magazines there and newspapers and book reviews on my phone. But when it comes to books, I read print." [05:17]
Becca: "I try my hardest to read as little on screens as possible because I find it just changes the quality of my attention." [05:56]

The Best Books of 2024

Dwight Garner's Top Picks:

1. Percival Everett's James
   Garner declares it the "defining book of the year," praising its ability to straddle both literary acclaim and commercial success. He highlights Everett's wit and humanity, which resonate deeply in the current cultural climate.
   Quote: "Percival Everett's novel, James, is just... the defining book of the year." [07:34]

2. Salman Rushdie's Knife
   A memoir recounting Rushdie's 2022 attack by an Islamic militant. Garner commends Rushdie's use of humor to navigate traumatic experiences, offering solace and wit.
   Quote: "Rushdie's book is filled with observations like... that help keep us sane." [09:28]

3. Rachel Kushner's Creation Lake
   A novel about a female spy for hire in rural France, praised for its intricate narrative and character development.
   Quote: "Rachel Kushner's Creation Lake is about a female spy for hire in rural France. That's probably my third favorite." [10:19]

Becca Rothfeld's Top Picks:

1. Garth Greenwell's Small Rain
   Rothfeld values the book’s exploration of medical ordeals, resonating with her personal experiences recovering from thyroid cancer. She appreciates its meditative and hypnotic qualities.
   Quote: "Small Rain is a really great exploration of... undergoing medical procedures." [07:58]

2. Mark Haber’s Lesser Ruins
   A novel featuring a man struggling to write an essay, serving as a distraction from existential despair. Rothfeld praises its long, meditative sentences and comic elements.
   Quote: "Mark Haber's Lesser Ruins is an absolutely fabulous book... an old mode of writing." [07:58]

3. Adam Schatz’s The Rebels Clinic
   A biography of philosopher and activist Frantz Fanon, lauded for its accessibility and gripping narrative.
   Quote: "Adam Schatz’s The Rebels Clinic is a really engrossing book and a really good example of public intellectualism." [07:58]

The Worst Books of 2024

Dwight Garner's Critiques:

1. Garth Greenwell's Small Rain
   Contrary to Becca's praise, Garner finds the book prosaic and dull, lacking humor and smart observations.
   Quote: "Garth Greenwell’s Small Rain... it gives me no pleasure to find so little pulse." [30:11]

2. Critically Reviewed Biographies:
   Garner criticizes recent biographies on Carson McCullers and Randy Newman for their underwhelming execution.
   Quote: "Biographies about Carson McCullers and Randy Newman... the titles were the sad, happy life of Carson McCullers." [23:46]

Becca Rothfeld's Critiques:

1. Salman Rushdie's Knife
   While Garner appreciates the memoir, Rothfeld dismisses it as meandering and trite, questioning its merit despite its recognition.
   Quote: "I did not like Knife. It got a lot of good attention, but I think it didn’t deserve the National Book Award." [12:45]

2. Leslie Jamison's Splinters
   Rothfeld finds the memoir gimmicky and believes it lacks substantive engagement beyond personal therapy sessions.
   Quote: "Leslie Jamison’s Splinters... it's an experimental nonfiction book that felt gimmicky." [13:11]

3. Sheila Hetti’s Alphabetical Diaries
   An experimental nonfiction book where sentences from diaries are alphabetized, which Rothfeld criticizes for removing the author's voice and appearing mechanical.
   Quote: "Sheila Hetti’s Alphabetical Diaries... it was a bit gimmicky and she kind of edited her voice out." [15:06]

Changing Roles of Literary Critics

Kara explores how Becca and Dwight approach book criticism, especially when their reviews diverge. They emphasize the importance of providing thoughtful, reasoned critiques rather than mere opinions.

Notable Quotes:
Dwight: "Criticism is not just delivering an opinion. It’s describing why you have that opinion." [24:50]
Becca: "If a book is just bad, but it's not representative of any important cultural tendency, there's no reason to single it out." [25:43]

Book Bans and Free Speech

Addressing the alarming rise in book bans—over 10,000 instances reported by Pen America—Kara probes the guests on their concerns and actions against these restrictions.

Dwight's Perspective:
Dwight is astonished by the focus on banning books amidst the plethora of other distractions affecting youth reading habits. He suggests that banning might even drive interest in certain books among younger generations.
Quote: "Banning books just seems like an insane reaction to me." [48:58]

Becca's Concerns:
Becca shares deep concerns about escalating book bans and emphasizes the limited impact critics can have. She advocates for promoting banned books to ensure they remain accessible despite restrictions.
Quote: "One thing that one can do as a critic is try to kind of promote the kind of books that are being banned." [50:42]

The Future of the Book Industry

The discussion touches on the vitality of the book industry, with contrasting views on its current state and future prospects.

Becca's Optimism vs. Pessimism:
Becca oscillates between pessimism, influenced by cultural anti-intellectualism and public disdain for reading, and an unwavering faith in the enduring appeal of literature.
Quote: "Great books will always find their readers." [41:26]

Dwight's Optimism:
Dwight remains hopeful, believing that the human need for literary engagement persists despite challenges like attention deficits. He anticipates that novels will continue to offer solace and introspection in tumultuous times.
Quote: "The novel is the best delivery device we have in our culture for just news of the self and what it means to be alive." [58:52]

Book Recommendations for Younger Readers

Kara asks the guests for suggestions on books suitable for children aged five to fifteen, aiming to foster a love for reading among the younger generation.

Becca's Recommendations:

1. Dolair's Greek Myths
   An illustrated collection that captivates young minds with classic mythology.
   Quote: "The Politics of Cultural Despair by Fritz Stern." [51:19]

2. Diana Wynne Jones' Howl's Moving Castle
   A beautifully written fantasy that offers depth and enchantment beyond typical children’s literature.
   Quote: "For a slightly older child... Diana Wynne Jones." [57:36]

Dwight's Recommendations:

1. Kurt Vonnegut’s Works
   Dwight humorously suggests introducing children to Vonnegut's literature to nurture deep thinking from a young age.
   Quote: "Are they ready for Kurt Vonnegut, do you think?" [56:16]

2. Classic Children's Literature
   Dwight reminisces about handing down favorite children's books to his own children, emphasizing timeless classics.
   Quote: "I can't remember what some of the best ones are... Eden Ross Lipson gave me many of her favorites." [56:32]

Final Thoughts and Future Outlook

Concluding the episode, Becca and Dwight reaffirm their optimism about the persistence and importance of literature. They believe that books will continue to offer introspection and understanding, especially in times of societal and political upheaval.

Becca's Final Words:
"The appetite for literature is inextinguishable... literature will never die." [59:08]

Dwight's Final Words:
"More people are going to turn to longer forms... the novel has lost a lot of its centrality to our culture, but it matters more than almost anything that humans do." [58:52]

Conclusion

Kara Swisher's engaging conversation with Becca Rothfeld and Dwight Garner provides a nuanced exploration of the literary world in 2024. From celebrating standout works and critiquing underwhelming ones to discussing the challenges of book bans and the evolving role of critics, the episode offers deep insights for literary enthusiasts and casual readers alike. The guests' passionate discourse underscores the enduring significance of books and the critical role of thoughtful literary criticism in fostering a vibrant reading culture.

Notable Quotes with Timestamps:

• Kara Swisher: "Books? No, no, they love books. No, no, they love books." [00:00]
• Dwight Garner: "I read all my magazines there and newspapers and book reviews on my phone. But when it comes to books, I read print." [05:17]
• Becca Rothfeld: "I try my hardest to read as little on screens as possible because I find it just changes the quality of my attention." [05:56]
• Dwight Garner: "Percival Everett's novel, James, is just... the defining book of the year." [07:34]
• Becca Rothfeld: "Salman Rushdie’s Knife got a lot of good attention, but I think it didn’t deserve the National Book Award." [12:45]
• Dwight Garner: "Criticism is not just delivering an opinion. It’s describing why you have that opinion." [24:50]
• Becca Rothfeld: "One thing that one can do as a critic is try to kind of promote the kind of books that are being banned." [50:42]
• Dwight Garner: "The novel is the best delivery device we have in our culture for just news of the self and what it means to be alive." [58:52]
• Becca Rothfeld: "Great books will always find their readers." [41:26]