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- [00:00]
Alan Cross
Hey, it's Alan and I just wanted to let you know that you can now listen to the ongoing history of new music. Early and ad free on Amazon. Music included with Prime.
- [00:10]
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- [00:40]
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- [01:09]
Alan Cross
There are plenty of thankless jobs out there. Think about the people who have to work outside in all kinds of weather line workers for power companies, garbage collectors, construction workers. Same goes for prison officers, nurses, teachers and first responders of all types. I could go on, but you get the idea. So much needs to go on behind the scenes for us to be able to live our lives. In a civil society. There are dirty jobs, but someone's got to do them. For the most part, they do their jobs so well that we don't even think about them. But if not for these people, society just wouldn't function. Now let's look at the music industry. The performers get all the glory, but we'd know nothing of them if it wasn't for the massive support they get from people in in the background. That includes support staff at record labels and management companies, publicists, assistants, and thousands of other positions that help make the music happen. One of the most important positions is, paradoxically, both visible and invisible. If they do their jobs well, they're ghosts. But if they don't, things don't go so well. In fact, they may not go at all. I'm talking about roadies, members of the road crew, the people who enlist in the army that's necessary to put an act on tour. Without their expertise, long hours and willingness to make sure that everything always goes smooth, there would be no live music experience. They say that if there ain't no audience, there ain't no show. But if there ain't no road crew, then there ain't nothing at all. This is a history of the men and women who make live shows happen. It's the story of roadies. This is the ongoing history of new music podcast with Alan Cross.
- [03:01]
Song Lyrics
Another town I'm left behind Another dream completely blind Another hotel I can't find Another backstage bus for you Another tube of super glue Another border to get.
- [03:14]
Motorhead
Through.
- [03:17]
Alan Cross
Motorhead from their Ace of Spades album. And We Are the Road Crew, one of the few songs honoring the men and women who keep bands on tour. But Lemmy is uniquely sympathetic to road crews because he himself used to hump gear for Jimi Hendrix before he moved on to performing. When we go to a show, we sometimes see people scurrying around the venue on stage, going to and from backstage, up in the rafters, at the back, by the sound and lighting boards. Their jobs are essential to the music business. Hello again, I'm Alan Cross. Roadies move gear, set it up, make sure it's working properly, run the show, tear it all down, and then it's on to the next city. If they're lucky, their days will run only 20 hours partying backstage after the show. No way. There's no time. Gotta tear it down, load up, and move out. It's a job that's tough on personal relationships, and you have to deal with a lot of stupid people, some of whom are the musicians who employ you to make them look good every single night. This is hard work, and it's monotonous work that can be unbearably repetitive. Long hours, bad foods, weeks and months spent away from home, sleeping in less than ideal circumstances. But without roadies, there would be no shows. This episode is a tribute to those folks who make sure we civilians get our fix of live music and that everything runs smoothly night after night, town after town, and sometimes country after country, and always, always on time. All right, so what exactly is a roadie? Well, that is an umbrella term for support personnel. Some roadies are generalists who can do everything. Others are specialists who have expertise in a certain area. They are highly skilled. The best of all, roadies work at a level that maybe, I don't know, a hundred other people can match. We have guitar techs, drum techs, bass techs, keyboard techs, people who design, set up, maintain, and operate sound systems and lighting rigs and special Effects and pyro. A roadie might be a tour manager, a production manager or stage manager. There are bodyguards and security personnel. The people who look after Merch are technically roadies. Truck and van drivers and bus drivers, medical personnel, caterers. They all get to see the things that we don't. Talk to any roadie and you will get some crazy stories that will never appear in print or online. Some roadies travel with an act. Others are hired locally on an as needed basis. Some are gig workers taking whatever jobs come their way. A few are permanent long term employees of a specific act or management company. And while some may travel the world, there's precious little time to take in the local sights. The show takes precedence over everything. And do they get the credit they deserve? Never. Well, almost never. Let's check in with Tenacious D and.
- [06:18]
Song Lyrics
When the crowd roars brings a teardrop to the roadie's eye Eyes tears of pride because it brought you the show but you will never know he's changing the street.
- [06:39]
Alan Cross
Let's go through some stories about roadies and by the time we're done, I hope that you will have a new appreciation for these men and women. Let's start at the very beginning. Who was the very first roadie of the modern era? Those who study the history of road crews tend to point to Ben Dorsey, who also went by the name Lovey because he had a really big heart and tended to call people he liked lovey. Dorsey was from San Antonio, Texas, and he began his career in show business by working for the Ice Capades. After a stint in the Navy, he found himself in California where he was everything from a gardener to John Wayne chauffeur. On Halloween night 1950, he started a new job with Hank Thompson, a honky tonk western performer traveling with him to help him set up his gear. And that became his gig for the next six decades. After working with Hank Thompson, Dorsey worked for a young Elvis Presley. Then he moved on to Johnny Cash, Patsy Cline, Kris Kristofferson, Merle Haggard and Willie Nelson. And Willie was the guy who gave him the title of World's first roadie. Waylon Jennings wrote a song about him entitled Ode to Ben Dorsey. Red Sauvign has a song called Ben Dorsey iii. Kinky Friedman wrote a novel called Roadkill, which is set aboard Willie Nelson's tour bus. Dorsey's there. There was a 1980 movie called Rhody starring Meat Loaf in a role inspired by Dorsey. And Dorsey was the subject of a documentary called King of the roadies. Plus there's an event every February 22nd at the John T Floor Country Store outside of San Antonio in commemoration of the day Ben met both Hank Thompson and Willie Nelson for the first time. And in 2009, Ben Dorsey was the first person to be inducted into the Roadie hall of Fame in Nashville. Yes, there is a Roadie hall of Fame. Makes sense. Why wouldn't there be? Ben Dorsey died on September 17, 2017 at the age of 92. Not only was he the first roadie, but he was also the oldest working one. As the live and recorded music era progressed, more behind the scenes people were required. Penns equipment became bigger and more complex. Lighting for shows got more complicated. Support staff was needed for security and wardrobe and catering. Drivers were needed. And where are you going to get all the drivers for the trucks and buses? And the bigger rock got. So did the opportunities for those wanting to jump into this way of life. Maybe somebody who worked at a bar was extra helpful to axe loading in and loading out. That could have resulted in a roadie gig. Maybe the person was part of a student union that booked a lot of bands into colleges and universities. Maybe they ingratiated themselves into a gig. Could be that a person graduated from working at a music store to helping out a keyboardist customer on tour. And maybe a dude was just good at making T shirts that got him a merch gig. Or maybe it was just a recommendation from a friend. Specialties were developed, reputations were established and the roadie vocation exploded. I love this. Would you believe that Harrison Ford worked as a roadie for the Doors before he got into acting? Here's another Roadie story. In 1984, U2 went to Australia and New Zealand for the first time on their Unforgettable Fire tour. When they arrived, Bono, completely out of sorts because of the time changes, went for a tour of Auckland and with him was a guy named Greg Carroll. He was a local roadie hired to help out with their production. He was so good that U2 manager Paul McGinnis hired Greg to be with U2 for the remainder of the tour. Carol became friends with Bono, his wife Allie, the rest of the band and the rest of the crew. Everybody loved this guy. But then on July 3, 1986, Greg was sent off on a courier run on his motorcycle in Dublin. A car cut in front of him and because of rain slicked streets, he was unable to stop in time. Carol T boned the car and was killed instantly. His death had a profound effect on Everybody in the U2 organization. Carol's body was flown back to New Zealand. Members of U2 went to the funeral. Bono sang Let It Be and Knocking on Heaven's Door at the ceremony. When everyone returned to Ireland, Bono, who was working on lyrics for songs for what would become the Joshua Tree album, remembered that tour of Auckland that he got from Carol. He'd taken Bono to an old volcano called Mongo Kiki, a sacred site for the Maori people. The English name for that site is One Tree Hill. With Bono's lyrics, the Edge's guitar parts, and contributions from three Toronto musicians at Grant Avenue Studios in Hamilton, the song was finished. Both One Tree Hill and the Joshua Tree are dedicated to the memory of Rhodey Greg Carroll See you again as.
- [11:29]
Song Lyrics
The stars fall from the sky and the moon has turned red over One Tree Hill we run like a river.
- [11:42]
Alan Cross
One Tree Hill from the Joshua Tree album, inspired by Greg Carroll, a U2 roadie who was killed in a motorcycle accident while working for the band. More stories coming up.
- [11:53]
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- [12:23]
State Farm Advertiser
This episode is brought to you by State Farm. You might say all kinds of stuff when things go wrong, but these are the words you really need to remember. Like a good neighbo, State Farm is there. They've got options to fit your unique insurance needs, meaning you can talk to your agent to choose the coverage you need. Have coverage options to protect the things you value most, file a claim right on the State Farm mobile app, and even reach a real person when you need to talk to someone. Like a good neighbor. State Farm is there.
- [12:53]
Alan Cross
A good roadie is always there when you need them. They're especially vital in cases of extreme emergency. And Here is another U2 story and it was definitely an extreme emergency. They were on tour in Australia in 1993 on the Zoo TV tour. Bass player Adam Clayton was not doing well. He'd just broken up with model Naomi Campbell over the phone and was not in good shape. So he went on a three day bender. Later he says it started with just two glasses of wine, but after that he doesn't remember a thing. He just woke up three days later. And that was a problem on a lot of levels. On November 26, U2 was supposed to play the first of two nights at Sydney Football Stadium. The first night was supposed to be a rehearsal for the big second night, which was to be recorded and also broadcast to the world. But Adam was way too drunk to be on stage. It was up to a roadie, Adam's bass tech, Stuart Morgan, to fill in. Now, that first show went off just fine. Adam sobered up and until Larry Mullen was unable to perform at the Sphere due to his back problems that night, November 26, 1993 was the only time when U2 performed with a man down. There are plenty of occasions where roadies have saved the day this way. John Marshall is the guitar tech for Metallica's James Hetfield. He filled in twice for Hetfield, once after Hetfield broke his arm while skateboarding, and another time when he was badly singed by some ill timed pyro. And then there's the case of Depeche Mode's andy Fletcher. In 1989, he started suffering from a lot of anxiety and he was diagnosed with depression and ocd. He sought treatment and generally had things under control. But then came the 1994 exotic tour in support of the Songs of Faith and Devotion album. This road trip has gone down in history as one of the most debauched in the history of rock. Drugs, alcohol, bad behavior. It was not good. Fletch survived two months before he had a breakdown and needed to go home. His place was taken by Darrell Bamonte, who had been working as part of Depeche Mode's road crew since the early days. Bamonte covered the entire second leg of the tour for Andy Fletcher, along with six dates in South America. Without him, Depeche Mode would not have been able to finish one of the biggest tours of their career.
- [15:19]
Song Lyrics
Condemnation.
- [15:35]
Alan Cross
Sometimes it's possible to graduate from being a roadie to being in a band of your own. And this has happened more than you may think. Way back in the mid-1960s, David Gilmore roadied for a young band called Pink Floyd. It was drummer Nick Mason who invited him into the band as a guitarist. Back in 1976, the Doobie Brothers noticed lighting roadie Bobby Lakhind messing around with some congas on stage. You're pretty good, they said. You want to help out in the studio? He did, and that worked out so well that in 1979 he was made a full member of the band. Tupac Shakur was a roadie, dancer and backup singer for Digital Underground, and that got him started on his journey to a solo career. Henry Rollins humped gear for the band Minor Threat before he ended up in Black Flag. Richey Edwards roadied for the Manic Street Preachers before he ended up as a full fledged member. Keith Levine was a roadie for yes before he hooked up with Johnny Lydon in Public Image limited. Perry Bamonte, the brother of the aforementioned Darryl Bamante, who bailed out depeche mode in 1994, started as a guitar tech for the Cure. But when Roger O'Donnell left the cure just before the final leg of the disintegration tour in 1991, Perry Bamonte became the band's keyboardist and after that he played guitar on the next four albums. Two roadies eventually became full time members of Megadeth. There's a band called Knives, featuring three guys who used to move gear for Slipknot, and it was a real close family. In the pre grunge era in Seattle, Kurt Cobain worked as a roadie for the Melvins. So did Krist Novoselic and later Ben Shepard roadied for Nirvana before he got his gig with Soundgarden. Time for something from the Melvins, then. Sometimes a roadie uses their training and experience to form their own band. Billy Howardale was a guitar tech for Tool. When they weren't doing anything, he played in a Perfect Circle featuring Toole, singer Maynard James Keenan. Jello Biafra roadied for a band called the Ravers before he and East Bay Ray formed the Dead Kennedys. But the best of these stories involves Noel Gallagher. In the mid-80s, he was leading a very dull working class life in Manchester. He was bored while working for a gas company, he dropped a heavy piece of pipe on his foot, which had him reassigned to a job behind a parts counter. He wasn't very busy most of the time, so he brought his guitar to work and strummed away whenever he had a moment. And he apparently had a lot of moments. Then in 1988, he met Graham Lambert at a Stone Roses show. Graham was the guitarist in a local band called the Inspiral Carpets. They became friends and Noel started showing up at carpets gigs. Then he saw what might be a big break. Vocalist Steve Holt was leaving the band. Noel thought, I could do that and auditioned for the gig. That, however, didn't work out. But because he was such a solid carpets fan, they gave him a job as a guitar roadie. Now, by his own admission, he had no idea what it took to become a roadie. So he just made it up as he went along. And for the next two years, some of the best years of the Inspiral Carpets career, Noel toured the world with them, looking after the guitars. He also learned how to deal with customs, airports, hotels, life on the road, how to handle crowds and how to deal with the various aspects of being in a well known band. He also didn't work terribly hard. I was the laziest roadie in history. I'd fix guitars, but only if I had to. He also made friends with Mark Coyle, the carpet sound man. They spend hours talking about the Beatles and songwriting and their respective ambitions. Mark also made it easier for Noel to mess around on stage before and after sound checks, just like he'd done at the gas company. Noel continued to write songs during his downtime and he was also in charge of hiding the band's drugs in their road cases. Clint Boone, the keyboardist for the Carpets, remembered, noel was always writing songs. Even then he had a swagger. We all knew he wasn't going to be a roadie forever. Noel knew this too. Watching them from the wings, he said, I thought, I can do better than this. In 1991, Noel returned from an American tour with the Carpets to learn that his little brother Liam had become the singer in a band called Rain, and Noel wasn't very impressed. Liam suggested that Noel manage the Rain and Noel said, nah, screw it, I will take control of the band and become its only songwriter. Take it or leave it. Well, the Rain took it and were renamed Oasis and within two years they were performing this song to thousands of people. And it was a song written behind the parts counter at a gas company. When we come back we'll look at some of the most famous full time professional roadies in history.
- [20:47]
Song Lyrics
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- [21:18]
Alan Cross
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- [21:32]
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- [22:02]
Alan Cross
We don't hear much about them, but within the touring music industry there are roadies who are legends. There's Henry the Horse Smith, who humped gear for the Yardbirds, Led Zeppelin and Aerosmith. Why was he called the Horse? Because he could carry huge speaker cabinets like they weighed nothing. John Marshall was a guitarist for the band Metal Church before he was picked to be Kirk Hammett's guitar tech in Metallica. Yeah, that's the same guy we already mentioned when he was drafted into cover for James Hetfield a couple of times. Ever hear of Dallas Shoe? He's worked as a guitar tech for Bruce Springsteen, the Eagles, the Police, Pearl Jam, Prince, and U2. He's from Lexington, Kentucky and has been part of the U2 road crew since the second leg of the Joshua Tree tour. There are those in the business who consider him to be the goat of guitar techs. Still with U2, there's Willie Williams. He got bit by the road bug early when he started doing lights for punk gigs in London, and over the years he's worked with rem, David Bowie, the Rolling Stones, George Michael, and of course, U2. Willie has designed all of U2's tours since 1983. The Joshua Tree stage, Zoo TV, Popmart, 360. All of them. There was a guy named Dave Matthews who worked for Kiss for 30 years, and his main job was to look after the band's wigs. Sometimes he'd be called upon to douse Gene Simmons with a wet towel when the hairspray he used on his wig caught fire. But most roadies are completely anonymous. Occasionally, though, they are given a little extra visibility. Take Peter Gabriel, for instance. On some of his tours he'd have his roadies outfitted in coordinated orange jumpsuits. Eddie Vedder sometimes had his roadies decked out in lab coats. While we still see crew members in cargo shorts and old band T shirts with a ring of keys on their belt, it's not always that way anymore. Hey, look at Jack White. If you've ever been to a white striped show or a gig by his band, the Raconteurs. You may have noticed that all the stage roadies are dressed in black suits with white shirts, black ties and black fedoras. Jack believes that the roadie uniform can be part of the overall visual spectacle of a gig. That just sewed Jack right. Oh, and there's more to it than just the suits and ties. If a roadie has a yellow feather stuck in the brim of his hat, he's working for the Raconteurs. And I seem to remember that a White Stripes roadie got a white feather.
- [24:28]
Song Lyrics
Here we go. Well, here we go again. You found yourself a friend that knows you well.
- [24:42]
Alan Cross
You may have noticed that in this discussion of roadies, everyone we've talked about has been white and male. And yes, this profession is very much skewed in that direction. I saw some stats out of the US that said out of 1,350 live music professionals surveyed, 67% were male and 85% were white. Only 2% were black and a little more than 3% were Hispanic. However, work is being done to diversify things. If you're familiar with the workings of pop and R and B acts when it comes to touring, you might know Casey Jackson. He's been on the road with Justin Bieber, Prince, Destiny's Child and many others. He's one of the few black roadies in the business and he is also the co founder of Roadies of Color United, an organization formed in 2009 to help people of color interested in the live touring business. Women are disproportionately involved in areas like the road production, office, catering and wardrobe. Noel Skaggs, the co leader of Fits in the Tantrums, founded a group called Diversify the Stage, which is dedicated to opening up new opportunities for women, people of color, LGBTQ people, and female identifying and gender non conforming individuals. And she is block herself. And then there are people like Janine Anderson. She's the tour manager for Soul Asylum, one of the few people in that position. Marty Hom is Asian. He's a veteran tour manager who's been hired by Fleetwood Mac and Barbra Streisand. And then there's Jerome Cooks, he's black and he's the tour manager for Tool. And the industry is going to need more people. Touring has never been a bigger business and a lot of the old guard is retiring. You could actually go to school to learn to be a roadie. For example, the Academy of Contemporary Music in London, England will teach you everything you need to know. Metalworks Institute in Mississauga, Ontario has a diploma course in live music and concert production, as well as a course in live sound production. And here's the thing about being a modern roadie. You're not just hauling road cases, moving instruments around and pointing spotlights. You need to be a specialized technician. With today's gear, you have to know math, physics, electronics, acoustics and more. If you think you can get a job just to pick stuff up and put it down, forget it. Those jobs are for humpers, the unskilled members of a road crew. There are fewer and fewer of those each year, and most of them are hired locally. It's to the point now where some road crew professions consider the term roadie to be derogatory because they do so much more. Techs or technicians are much preferred terms. It's a hard job with a lot of uncertainty. Even when you're gainfully employed for one tour, you have to worry about where your next job is going to come from. And when Covid hit man, that was a problem. With no live touring, there were no jobs. Untold hundreds, maybe thousands of techs and roadies left the business forever because there was no work for those two years. Techs and roadies make the world of live music work. Taylor Swift knows this as a way to thank her crew for her ERAS tour. She handed out millions of dollars in bonuses to her people. You think they're grateful and loyal? You bet. Like I said at the beginning, there aren't that many songs written about road crews, and there should be. So hats off to super chunk. In 2013, they released an album entitled I Hate Music and it featured a song called foh, which stands for front of house. That's where the sound person sits and makes sure that the band sounds as good as possible. Roadies, the unsung heroes of music. Unless you consider songs like that, of course. I'm looking at a typical show day schedule. After driving all night from the last gig, the first people at the next venue arrive at around 10 to suss things out. Within 20 minutes, riggers and techs are working on the stage. The sound and lighting boards go in and the stage lights are hung within 40 minutes. The drum kits are almost in place and adjustments begin with the PA and lighting gear. Sound starts coming out of the speakers within about an hour and a half. Amps and instruments then appear on stage. Tests begin. Merge tables are ready to go by 3pm Sound checks for the band start sometime around 4. Catering begins around 5. While the tour manager and the production manager catch up on paperwork emails and errands. The opening act starts their set around 8, and then the headliner goes on between 8:45 and 9. By 10:30, the show is over. And as the crowd files out, the crew is already taking everything apart. And by 11, 11:30 at the latest, everything is packed away and it's off to the next gig. Now imagine doing this day after day through different cities, different countries, different venues, different kinds of weather for months and months at a time, partying with the band. There's no time for that. You are the road crew. You have got a job to do and the job ain't over until the tour is. And then you find another tour and start it up all over again. If you are in the roadie business and no one has said it to you before, let me do it. Thank you. There are hundreds of ongoing history shows available on demand as podcasts. They're all free and you can download them wherever you get your podcasts. And while you're there, grab a few episodes of Crime and Mayhem in the Music industry. That's my Music meets true Crime podcast. Let me know what you think. We can connect on most of the social media networks, I'm always updating my website with music news and information. You can find that@ajournalofmusicalthings.com it comes with a free newsletter that you should get and you can always email me about anything. I'm available through allenlancross.ca Technical production is by Rob Johnston. Which kind of sort of makes him my roadie, doesn't it? Hmm. Anyway, I'm Ellen Cross.
- [30:40]
Motorhead
Welcome to the Bad Parents Podcast, the parenting podcast, where we're just as confused as you are. We have no idea what we're doing, but we're doing it loudly.
- [30:50]
Bad Parents Podcast Hosts
I mean, parenting is basically just keeping tiny humans alive while trying not to lose your mind, right?
- [30:56]
Motorhead
Exactly. So if you've ever hid in the bathroom for five minutes a piece, or accidentally eaten your kid's last piece of.
- [31:02]
Bad Parents Podcast Hosts
Halloween candy, or just wondered how the heck other parents have it all together.
- [31:06]
Motorhead
While you're covered in applesauce, you're in the right place. I'm Johnny.
- [31:10]
Bad Parents Podcast Hosts
I'm Shauna.
- [31:11]
Motorhead
And I'm Ryan. Each week week, we'll share hilarious parenting fails, survival tips, and moments that remind us why we haven't run away to a deserted island yet.
- [31:19]
Bad Parents Podcast Hosts
So grab your coffee, your wine, or whatever's in that sippy cup and join us for some laughs, some advice, and a whole lot of you're not alone.
- [31:27]
Motorhead
This is Bad Parents, where parenting is messy loud and somehow still the best thing ever. Join us for a new episode of Bad Parents every Wednesday on Apple Podcasts, Amazon, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcast. And now you can also Watch us on YouTube.