What Would Heather Dubrow Do: Digital Parenting Edition

Summary

Podcast Summary: Parenting in a Tech World

Episode: What Would Heather Dubrow Do: Digital Parenting Edition
Host: Bark CMO Titania Jordan
Guest: Heather Dubrow (mom of four, Real Housewives of Orange County)
Date: January 22, 2026

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Episode Overview

This episode welcomes Heather Dubrow, a mom of four with unique firsthand experience raising kids through the fast-paced evolution of the digital age. Host Titania Jordan and Heather dive deeply into the challenges and strategies of digital parenting: from screen time and tech boundaries to social media, inclusivity, and the importance of keeping communication open. The conversation is candid, insightful, and filled with practical wisdom both for parents just starting the tech journey with their children and those navigating the turbulent teen years.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Parenting Across the Tech Evolution

[01:17 - 04:15]

• Heather reflects on raising her children ages 22 to 14, witnessing enormous change in tech.
• Parenting styles shifted between her first and last children, partly because of the rapid tech evolution.
• Early parenting involved classic toys and games: "We had wiki sticks, we had crayons, we had puzzles…[that] evolved, obviously, as technology evolved." – Heather Dubrow [01:46]
• Her youngest had more access to tech sooner, partly because of older siblings and his own maturity.

Individual Readiness Over Blanket Rules

[04:15 - 04:44]

• Not every child is ready for a smartphone or social media at the same age; emotional maturity varies.
• Blanket bans or policies don’t fit all kids; parental awareness is key.

Quote:
"Not every child is ready for a smartphone at the same age or social media at the same age... We can't just have a blanket age statement for certain things." – Titania Jordan [04:15]

Making Tech the Forbidden Fruit

[04:44 - 05:27]

• Drawing a parallel to "forbidden" foods: making something strictly off-limits can backfire, leading to overindulgence or secrecy.
• Heather worries about 100% "hands off" tech bans resulting in kids wanting it more.

Quote:
"If you make something verboten...what does that make someone want to do? Everything they can to get that thing." – Heather Dubrow [05:19]

Global Policy—The Australia Example

[05:40 - 08:03]

• Discussion of Australia’s under-16 social media ban: initial approval, then second thoughts.
• Concerns about kids missing out on positive aspects of tech and AI in education.
• Advocates for a monitored, planned introduction of tech rather than total prohibition.
• Need for societal and parental consensus on core safety principles.

Quote:
"You don't just hand a kid a device, you got to give them a plan." – Heather Dubrow [06:44]

Tech Companies & Regulatory Gaps

[08:03 - 12:18]

• Platforms' conflicting priorities: safety vs. engagement and profit.
• Frustration with slow, inconsistent regulation and lack of accountability for tech giants.
• Titania cites the outdated nature of internet laws protecting children (last updated 1998).
• The need for data transparency from platforms about online harms to children.

Quote:
"It's like traffic laws before cars were invented." – Heather Dubrow on outdated tech laws [10:19]

Parental Strategies: Openness & Digital Footprint

[12:33 - 14:48]

• Heather always more concerned with kids’ permanent digital footprint rather than stranger danger—"What are you putting out in the world that's gonna be there forever?" [13:20]
• Early on, parents and kids learned social media together; concerns evolved over time.

Memorable Story:
Heather’s wake-up call when a stranger interacted with her youngest on Roblox—prompted a reset of settings and renewed vigilance.

Content Creation, Privacy, and Boundaries

[15:53 - 18:22]

• As a public figure, Heather deliberates what to share about her family.
• She avoids sharing her kids’ stories without consent: "I never want to tell my kids stories for them. Those are their stories to tell." [17:22]
• Sometimes negotiates with her kids for photos; emphasizes respecting their privacy.

Social Media Pitfalls & Modeling Healthy Behavior

[18:22 - 20:58]

• Even adults get caught in the trap of unhealthy comparisons on Instagram.
• Host and guest both reflect on needing to pull back from content that negatively impacts self-image.
• "Comparison is the thief of joy." – Heather Dubrow [19:19]

Parenting Approach: Trust, Communication, & Limits

[21:18 - 23:09]

• Heather prioritizes open communication and trust, deploying more or less "leash" as warranted.
• Her approach: trust first, intervene if lines are crossed: "I'm gonna give you as much leash as you can handle. And when I feel like you can't, I'm gonna pull it back." [22:01]
• Not searching kids’ phones regularly; relies on dialogue and support systems.

Tech Tools: Support & Outsourcing the “Bad Guy”

[23:09 - 24:27]

• Heather appreciates Bark’s role as a "friend" for parents—tech can be the monitor so parents don't have to be adversarial.

Quote:
"You guys get to be the bad guy for us. If you guys had been around 15 years ago, that would have been very helpful." – Heather Dubrow [23:35]

Lessons Learned & What Parents Would Do Differently

[25:35 - 29:24]

• Titania admits she would've delayed smart devices, limited social media longer, and chosen safer tech for her child.
• Heather notes the pandemic complicated everything for her youngest; she would have been stricter otherwise.
• Both encourage parents to be kind to themselves: "We gotta give ourselves a break here." – Heather Dubrow [28:20]

The Importance of Allowing Kids to Learn Boundaries

[28:25 - 30:55]

• If kids are sheltered completely, they may struggle with independence.
• Need a "happy medium"—monitor for true dangers but allow some autonomy and mistakes.

Connection & Community—Tech’s Double-Edged Sword

[29:24 - 31:09]

• Tech connects marginalized kids (e.g., LGBTQ+ youth) who may not find support at home.
• Critical to distinguish between dangerous and normal online exploration.

Family Rituals & Off-Screen Time

[33:03 - 35:08]

• Family dinners (screen-free!) are powerful for healthy development.
• Heather’s tip: Taking children out to dinner for "captive" quality time if home routines are challenging.
• Tradition and togetherness—family trips, holidays, and shared rituals—matter for long-term bonds.

Being Present as the Ultimate Parenting Tool

[37:17 - 38:40]

• Most important parental task: being present and engaged.
• Set phone aside when children want to talk; model digital boundaries.

Quote:
"You just have to be there." – Heather Dubrow [37:17]
"If you're on your phone and your kid walks in and starts talking to you...put it down. It can wait." – Heather Dubrow [38:02]

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• "[Tech is] like the wild, wild west." – Heather Dubrow [08:03]
• "I thought about permanence...that was what I was worried about originally." – Heather Dubrow on digital footprints [13:20]
• "It's everyone's highlight reel." – Heather Dubrow on social media comparison [19:27]
• "We teach people how to treat us." – Heather Dubrow [38:30]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• 00:00–01:46 – Introduction & Heather’s family context
• 02:20–04:15 – Tech evolution across Heather’s kids
• 04:15–04:44 – Individual tech/social media readiness
• 05:40–08:15 – Australia’s under-16 social media ban discussion
• 08:03–12:18 – Tech companies, responsibility, and regulatory lag
• 12:33–14:48 – Digital footprint & first social media wake-up call
• 15:53–18:22 – Balancing public life, content privacy, and kids’ boundaries
• 18:22–21:00 – Social media and parental self-awareness
• 22:01–23:36 – Tech tools and outsourcing digital discipline (Bark)
• 25:35–29:24 – Reflections on what the host and guest would do differently
• 33:03–35:08 – The role and logistics of family rituals
• 37:17–38:40 – Closing advice: just be present

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Episode Takeaways

• Digital parenting is not one-size-fits-all: know your child, their maturity, and vulnerabilities.
• Balance tech boundaries—avoid total bans but implement strong guardrails and education.
• Open communication, trust, and modeling healthy habits are more effective than surveillance.
• Presence—not perfection—is what children need most from parents in a tech-saturated world.
• Leverage tools like Bark to support, not replace, the parent-child relationship.

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For parents navigating the wild, wild west of digital childhood, Heather Dubrow’s candid stories and strategies are both a comfort and a call to action: Stay involved, stay honest, and always keep the communication line open—as well as your own device closed at dinnertime.

Transcript

[Interviewer]

You may know her from the Real Housewives of Orange county, but Heather Dubrow is also a mom of four who's raised kids through every stage of the digital age. Today, she's sharing what she's learned about everything from inclusivity to screen time. This is a conversation packed with perspective, honesty, and real life wisdom. Heather Debro.

[Heather Dubrow]

Hi.

[Interviewer]

Oh, my gosh. Not only am I stoked to be with you in real life and have this conversation with you, but our co host and just person that does all the things at Bark Sam off camera is probably the biggest. Like, Bravo. Real Housewives.

[Heather Dubrow]

Really? I'll give you all the tea after.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, she needs the tea offline. The photo.

[Heather Dubrow]

Got it done.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. She's so, like, this is a big deal for all of us here.

[Heather Dubrow]

Thank you.

[Interviewer]

No, thank you. You have four kids. You have four kids. So just. I just have one. How have you changed any element of your parenting as technology has evolved?

[Heather Dubrow]

I mean, that's like a three hour answer. I know, but I mean, I'd like to kind of go back to the beginning, I think, because, you know, when I. My kids range in ages, the oldest is 22 and the youngest is 14. So in those seven years, he's almost. He's gonna be 15 tomorrow. But in those seven years, technology completely changed.

[Interviewer]

That's an understatement. Which is why I'm so interested. Because you have that span.

[Heather Dubrow]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

Right. And they're all so unique and like. Yeah, spill it.

[Heather Dubrow]

Yeah. So when it started, like, I remember the twins, like, so. All right, so when you start with two, I had never even held a baby before. So starting with 2 is like starting with 10. It was crazy. And so, you know, I wanted to take them everywhere. I'm someone that goes and does. I couldn't sit in the house. We were at classes, doing all the things, going out for dinner. I had those twins at the Ivy. I mean, we went everywhere. But I was also loaded with a bag of tricks. We had wiki sticks, we had crayons, we had puzzles. We had brain games. We had flashcards, we had, you know, all kinds of things.

[Interviewer]

Rattles.

[Heather Dubrow]

Yeah. As one does as they're growing up. And of course, this is before smartphones, but as that all evolved, obviously what happened with my kids evolved too. I would tell you that parenting the first two versus the last two, very, very different. And, you know, it's funny because they'll tell you, people will make jokes. Like, with the first one I did, everything was sanitized and da, da, da. And with the Last one. You let them juggle knives. I think, I think that for me in general, I've always been as a controlling person as I am and known to be. I think I've always been pretty relaxed with the kids. I've never been a huge germaphobe. I would sanitize things, but I wasn't crazy. I mean, you know, when you have a child, when you go through potty training, you have to not be a germaphobe or else you're just gonna lose your mind. But I think with technology, sort of the same, I think with the first. Because it wasn't around. It wasn't around. And then by the time we started giving it to them, it started out being more like, you know, they had the Nintendo Switch and they had electronics that weren't phones that they could play with and do things on and watch little videos and things. And then that started evolving too. But by the time I had my last child, you know, that one got sucked into. You know, the older ones were like real teenagers by that point. So my youngest one was a allowed to do things really way in advance of the first two and third also. And he's also my youngest, much more mature and emotionally ready for certain things than the older ones. So it's really, you know, when you talk about parenting and electronics and devices and technology, it's such like a multi layered answer and question because there's what's going on in technology? What's available to them? And who is that child?

[Interviewer]

Yes, that's the big important, like exclamation mark I want to interject here is that not every child is ready for a smartphone at the same age or social media at the same age, or a variety of platforms. Right. Some children might be more predisposed to mental health issues or disordered eating, related content, or just more sensitive to violent, you know, content that they might see online. So every child is different. And I'm really glad you brought that up because we can't just have a blanket age statement for certain things.

[Heather Dubrow]

Yeah. And then there's also that idea of, I think about it, like food, you know. Cause I remember like in my house, like there was, we had snacks, you know, there were ho hos, ring dings, you know, whatever you call em. On which coast do you live?

[Interviewer]

We had none of that.

[Heather Dubrow]

No, we had some of that, but we didn't have 100 sugar cereals. But we had some stuff. Right. But I remember there were kids that I knew that had nothing. Literally. No, you were that kid. It was so stupid. So did you go crazy when you.

[Interviewer]

I did.

[Heather Dubrow]

Right.

[Interviewer]

But that's still. Yeah. My relationship with sugar is like, like I'm talking to a therapist about it still. Because it's like.

[Heather Dubrow]

Because you were deprived of it.

[Interviewer]

I was deprived.

[Heather Dubrow]

So that's the thing. If you make something verboten, if you take something and you say this is off limits and this is bad, what does that make someone want to do?

[Interviewer]

Right.

[Heather Dubrow]

Everything they can to get that thing. And so that's what makes me a little nervous about saying there's a Hands off, 100% no policy. And it's funny because you saw what happened in Australia.

[Interviewer]

Yes, we were just talking about that.

[Heather Dubrow]

So they have said, I don't know if it passed yet or it's something they're trying to pass. Did it pass?

[Interviewer]

It passed. And as like middle of this week, it's like kids will going into effect and it's like, where'd my Snapchat go?

[Heather Dubrow]

Yeah. So kids under the age of 16 cannot have social media now. At first I went good for them and then I started thinking about it and I thought, okay, but what about like ChatGPT? So in the pandemic, I mean, I think a lot of kids were cheating it. You know, everyone was online and ChatGPT had become a big thing and all the AI and everything. But there's certain aspects to AI. I mean, bark uses it as well in such a beautiful, meaningful way that I think that I wonder if those kids are missing out on something. I don't know what the answer is, but every in, in everything in moderation kind of way, like we're talking about food, Is there some kind of hybrid where it's monitored and taught and given a plan? Because in my opinion, you don't just hand a kid a device, you got to give them a plan.

[Interviewer]

You know, I got to set this down because I'm like, oh boy. Gotta like prep for this because I'm like so passionate about what you just said. In an ideal world, the social media platforms would prioritize, essentially a duty of care to do no harm and they would work with third party solutions like Bark and others to actually make age appropriate, safer experiences. Because tech is not the problem. Tech is a tool.

[Heather Dubrow]

It's the humans using it, it's the

[Interviewer]

humans using it and it's the dangers that these platforms know are there and are turning a blind eye to and not addressing them because it would risk them losing engagement, which translates to dollars.

[Heather Dubrow]

Right.

[Interviewer]

So it's really, really, this is a Tough spot for us all to be in. But what we know is that for so long we've given kids access to everything and we've seen the mental health and physical health deteriorate. So then we've got to swing so far to the other side of things of like, well, just cut everything off and then maybe try to introduce, you know, a little bit here and there with education and more guardrails and more parental controls and age appropriate experiences. But it's. This is an unprecedented landscape. It's like, it's www but it's the wild, wild west.

[Heather Dubrow]

You are exactly right. And I think Australia's on the right path. But I agree with you. But everyone has to be on the same team and the same side because then you're setting yourselves up for failure in your community.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Heather Dubrow]

Because when your next door neighbor has this plan and you're down the street has this plan and the kid at soccer has that plan, it is very confusing. Now, not everyone's gonna agree on everything always. Look, we all come from different background, we all come from maybe different religions and different upbringings, and that's all okay. But there has to be a moment where we say, okay, what can we agree on? I think we can all agree that kids need to stay safe.

[Interviewer]

Right? Right.

[Heather Dubrow]

Okay. So if we could agree on that, let's all agree on what are the safety factors that we can all adhere to to keep them safe. And I agree it also needs to start with the parents standing up for the kids and also taking these companies, you know, making them accountable.

[Interviewer]

Like you are just, you're speaking truth and common sense and it's like, yeah, that's why. How would anybody, you know, argue with that? For example, can we all agree that we shouldn't be surfacing known predators as suggestions for children to connect with on, on social media? Right? Yeah, we can do that, but that's still happening.

[Heather Dubrow]

So how do we fix that?

[Interviewer]

Right. And you know, you and I can't really do much about it. Right. But the engineers at Meta and Snap and other platforms can.

[Heather Dubrow]

Right.

[Interviewer]

And because they can, then it's a question of, well, why hasn't that been prioritized over some AI avatar or new emoji pack? Right. So it's, where do your priorities lie? What are your shareholders asking of you? What are your growth plans and how do you balance all of that?

[Heather Dubrow]

So how do you think we do this?

[Interviewer]

Well, I'm glad you asked.

[Heather Dubrow]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

The Kids Online Safety act right now has been, you know, in and out, in and out, variety of reasons why it hasn't passed yet. But essentially the laws meant to protect consumers online, especially children, have been updated since 1998, which is crazy, right? So we need updated laws because right now these platforms cannot be held liable.

[Heather Dubrow]

No, it's like traffic laws before cars were invented.

[Interviewer]

Exactly. So laws and it's awareness first and foremost at Bark, we help to analyze social media, email, text, all kinds of things. And because of that, we know the rate at which children are being harmed by tech online, and we publish that report every year. Snap, TikTok, Instagram, Discord, YouTube, Apple, they all have this data too. And they have not publicly disclosed the rate at which children are being harmed on their platforms. So I think we have the right as humans to know the data. Like how many children received unwanted, solicited, unsolicited nudes. Right. How many children searched for how to die by suicide or how to lose 30 pounds in a month or whatever. Like, let's be real with each other about the data. But they don't want to, they don't want to disclose it. Right. It's going to look bad for them. So opportunities to really be candid about what's really happening with kids online. Meaningful legislation and education in the school systems. Digital curriculum is so varied. Right. Public school, private school, homeschool, and the parents and the teachers that are tasked with educating, they don't even have all of the information. Right. Our kids are so far ahead of us, so there's a lot. And then maybe finally I might think of something else. But our pediatricians, our therapists, our psychologists, our child behavioral health experts, our ER physicians that are seeing a rise in children being admitted to their ERs because of either successful or unsuccessful suicide attempts, they all need to come together as well and demand change. For example, the US Surgeon General last year, Dr. Vivek Murty said that social media needs a warning label on it, just like cigarettes. And that still hasn't happened. So there's a lot that needs to happen. We can make tech safer for kids. Yeah, it's not that hard.

[Heather Dubrow]

Well, it's amazing that, you know, look, I think it's great that people are worried about the die in our fruit Loops. Like I am too. I totally get it. That's bad. Nobody wants cancer, right? But we should be prioritizing this 100%.

[Interviewer]

I want to know if, if you can recall, was there like a turning point or an inflection point between your older children and your younger children where you're like, wow, this, this landscape has changed. Like I didn't realize that they could just talk to anybody on that game. Or I didn't realize that their feed maybe looked different than mine. Like, any sort of anecdotes.

[Heather Dubrow]

Yeah, well, you know what's crazy is we were learning social media sort of at the same time as them. Right. Because it was all brand new. And with the older kids, I just thought it was funny and silly. And I never. When I thought about even texting and emails, I never worried about predators. I worried about permanence. Because this is how I grew up. Right.

[Interviewer]

100%. And in the public eye, you and your husband are both public figures.

[Heather Dubrow]

Digital footprint, but yes, all of that. But honestly, even more like. Like, my parents were very 1950s. Like, everything swept under the rug. We don't talk about things. I'm so the polar opposite. But what always did stick with me is, what are you putting out in the world that's gonna be there forever? And I remember one of the kids saying to me, oh, I erased it. It's okay. And I had to have that conversation about how just because you erase it doesn't mean it's gone. And there's always a footprint and things are recoverable screenshots and stuff like that. So I thought about permanence. You know, what is a future college counselor going to think? Or if you go to apply for a job and they see these photos of you or, you know, always be situationally aware. Totally aware. So that was what I was worried about originally. But then my youngest son, again, he's the one that's allowed to juggle knives. He would play Roblox.

[Interviewer]

Yes.

[Heather Dubrow]

Okay. And so. Which is a great game and super fun, but they have these people that are characters. And I assumed that he was playing with all these kids from school, and he was, except there was one character that was not from school. To this day, I really don't know who this individual was. But we figured that out, got rid of this character, and then changed the settings. But that was the only time that I. That was the first time where I went, oh, wait a minute. This is not okay. I don't know who you are.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, it's chilling. I remember walking into my son's room, which. Side note, we bought our son a PlayStation 5 for Christmas one year and let him keep it in his room. Which is like. Because I didn't want to, like, see the wires. They were messy in the living room.

[Heather Dubrow]

I get it. Like, hideous. Yeah. Yes. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

You don't see that. But it doesn't belong in his Room, first and foremost. But I heard, like, a man, like a grown man's voice talking to him. Terrifying gaming. And I was like, we have just let a stranger into his bedroom. It was the worst feeling ever. It was my fault. It's not his fault. It was my fault. But let's shift a little bit, because you and your husband have amazing content that you're putting out there on social media. And he's also a doctor and so has a health mindset. How do you balance content creation, your public Persona, your own social media consumption with what you think is just best for you and your family?

[Heather Dubrow]

I mean, there's a line that we have to walk, obviously, you know, especially when it comes to kids. When I started Housewives, now I've been on TV since I was, like, 22, which is so cool, right? So I was an actress and. And all these things, and then I had four kids in seven years. And at that time, there wasn't social media. There wasn't, you know, streamers. You couldn't make your own content. So I, like, took a few minutes, took a beat away, and when I came back, started on this reality television journey, which was so crazy and putting yourself out there. But when I started the show, my youngest child was nine months old, and he's turning 15 tomorrow.

[Interviewer]

Oh, my gosh.

[Heather Dubrow]

Which is insane. But if you think about social media and how it's evolved over those last however many, you know, 14 years, whatever. How old is he? 15. 15 years. 14 years that we've been doing this, it's really been crazy. When they were little, oh, they were cute. They'd run in, they'd say hi on camera, they'd run out. There was no stories about them. And when they got to sort of that awkward age where they cared about things, we left the show. And when we came back, when they asked us to come back, I, like, laughed at first. I was like, oh, please, why would we do that again? And then I thought, you know what? Maybe I can use this platform for good. Maybe I can, you know, show our very normal family with four kids, different genders and different sexualities, and show what our normal family looks like and start conversations in other people's families.

[Interviewer]

Yes.

[Heather Dubrow]

Now, having said that, and to answer your question, what do you do with social. What are you putting out? Not just on television, but on Twitter and on Instagram and snap and all. I can't do snap. Honestly, my brain doesn't work that fast. But I tried. But the answer is, it's difficult. And I never want to Tell my kids stories for them. Those are their stories to tell, whether they decide to or not. So I try to be very respectful of them. You'll see, like many holidays, there's no picture. And I'll joke about it online. I'll be like, there was no sanctioned photo, so we will not be posting a Thanksgiving photo this year. However, we had a great time, you know, and I'll talk about it on my podcast and whatever, but I really do, and sometimes I beg them, can I please post a picture? It's my birthday and I love you guys so much. So sometimes I beg, but in general, I really just try to let them do their own things.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Have you. I had to have kind of a reckoning with myself about my use of it. You know, I would. I would excuse my consumption for work. Like, well, I need to stay on top of things. I need to, like, you know, I need to. I need to know all these things, right? And I've realized, especially this year, that it wasn't healthy for me. You know, if you go to my search page on Instagram right now, it's a lot of content around women, 45 who are trying to lose weight and get fit because menopause, metabolism, et cetera. And it's not healthy for me. And, like, they're. No, no knock to them because their bodies look amazing and they're great, and good job. If you can, like, lift weights for three hours a day and just eat cottage cheese and hit your 100 grams of protein, like, that's so awesome. But it was not healthy for me to just be consuming all of that.

[Heather Dubrow]

It's not healthy for anyone. I mean, look, that Instagram thing. What's the. What's the quote? Comparison is the thief of joy.

[Interviewer]

It literally is.

[Heather Dubrow]

It literally is. And even for, I'm going women like us who are successful and confident, I mean, I can get sucked into that so easily. And, oh, look how great she looks, or look how young or look how thin or look how toned or she has no cellulite or, yeah, all that stuff, or she's so successful or whatever, and you can go down a rabbit hole like that, I don't think it's good for anything but anyone. But I think that if you can take a step back and understand that this is everyone's highlight reel, and sometimes that's easier said than done, understandably, but it is everyone's highlight reel. I mean, I try to be very honest and authentic and tell stories of fails and stuff like that on my podcast. And you Know on social, when it happens. But even still, you know, we're making content. We're doing funny reels. This is like, you know, Terri and I are so cute on TikTok.

[Interviewer]

You really are.

[Heather Dubrow]

And I love my husband, and We've been together 29 years, but I promise you, we'll bicker, you know, an hour later and that. And that's totally normal. Am I putting that on Instagram?

[Interviewer]

No.

[Heather Dubrow]

No, I am not.

[Interviewer]

No.

[Heather Dubrow]

No, I'm not. Although you've seen us fight on Housewives, but, you know, which is normal. That's. You know, that's couples. And we're not. Apparently, George Clooney and Amal don't fight.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, I don't know about that.

[Heather Dubrow]

I find that odd. I'm just gonna say it. Sometimes you need an argument. Feels good.

[Interviewer]

Even like a fake one.

[Heather Dubrow]

Yeah. Gotta irritate them.

[Interviewer]

Sometimes it turns into a real one.

[Heather Dubrow]

Poke them a little bit.

[Interviewer]

What. What are some of the maybe pitfalls that you or your children, if you can share their stories, have experienced on social media? And. And how did you address it?

[Heather Dubrow]

Well, I mean, I think with the kids, I. The way I parent is really the way I parent across the board, and that has been including technology. And I will tell you very frankly that if I was starting my parenting journey now, it would have looked way different. Because I was telling you before, I grew up in a very tight household, and so I never wanted that. I wanted a very communicative relationship with my kids. And my feeling was that I trust you. And I think I've done a pretty good job parenting you, so I'm gonna give you as much leash as you can handle. And when I feel like you can't, I'm gonna pull it back.

[Interviewer]

Okay?

[Heather Dubrow]

And that's really how I parented them across the board and continue to. And it served me, but it also. They're good kids. And did we have moments? Yes, but they always came to me. I mean, look, I realize this could have gone way south. It could have been so much different. So much different. But they. These particular kids in this particular period of time, and I don't know if it's. Cause the pandemic happened in the middle of it and reset everyone, you know, or what, but it worked out for me. And I go, phew, thank goodness. Because I know that was by hook or crook or luck or all those things mixed together, because, you know, I'm not a helicopter parent. But as a parent, you can't. I don't care how involved you are, and I'M a very involved parent and I know everything my kids are doing. But am I searching their phones? No.

[Interviewer]

Right.

[Heather Dubrow]

I'm not. I probably should have. Didn't. But what I will tell you is this is why I love bark. It's because we parents, we need a friend.

[Interviewer]

Yes.

[Heather Dubrow]

And we need a friend so that the kids aren't yelling at us. And so if we can agree, hey, listen. And we've used. Before Bart came along, we've used other kinds of surface, not necessarily social media, but tracking kind of apps, limits. Yeah, things like that for sure. But what I think is so cool about what you guys have done is you get to be the bad guy for us 100%.

[Interviewer]

We are happy to be the bad guy.

[Heather Dubrow]

I mean, if you guys had been around 15 years ago, that would have been very helpful. So I got away and my kids got away unscathed, thankfully. But the power of what you guys do is really incredible. And I think that that kind of co parenting for the rest of us is just very necessary.

[Interviewer]

Well, thank you. Yeah, I mean, bark stands out for a lot of reasons. It was created by parents for parents, you know, having that unique lens of like, if we're gonna build tech for our own kids, what does that look like? And then to be able to go out and build it is amazing and truly a blessing and just to be able to do it. Right. You know, we want to help build that parent child relationship, not cause, you know, further friction in it.

[Heather Dubrow]

Right.

[Interviewer]

Which is why we don't give parents full access to everything and all the things. Right. We're just alerting to things that parents need to know about, like real dangers. You know, it breaks my heart to know that suicide is the second leading cause of death in children in this nation. It's crazy, it's horrific. But, you know, every single day we're sending between 85 and 100 severe self harm and suicidal ideation alerts to parents. And those are lives that are being saved, children's lives.

[Heather Dubrow]

Well, it's amazing. I mean, when I watched the movie adolescence, it was like so, I mean, crazy and so eye opening because it actually could happen.

[Interviewer]

It could actually happen.

[Heather Dubrow]

But I think that what was an interesting take home message to me was, you know, this very nice family, very nice parents. Just assuming it's that normal, you know, 14 year old phase that they all go through, which they do where they're moody and they're in their rooms and they're acting out and you think you know what's going on. But do you?

[Interviewer]

Yeah. So if you could go back in time, let's say you have eight year old quadruplets.

[Heather Dubrow]

Kill me.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, yeah, Kill me now. Would you do anything different? I guess let's start with, you know, would you maybe wait to a certain age to even allow a smartphone? Would you, would you allow social media to certain age or maybe not allow certain apps? Just what would you do? Let me try that again. What would you do different, if anything? And I will tell you what I would do different. Give me some time to think about your answers.

[Heather Dubrow]

I'd love to hear that.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. So, you know, you know, I've got an only child. He's almost 17 now and is he a junior? Yeah, yeah, yeah. My sweet boy, my sweet young man. I would not have let him have a gaming console in his bedroom. A. I would have stood my ground. I think if you ask people who know me, they say I'm a little too nice. And I was too nice. I defaulted to trying to being his friend. I didn't want him to be mad at me or not like me when I needed to be confident and do what was best for his physical and mental health despite whatever pushback, and I'll put that lightly, I received. Yeah, he was in fifth, sixth and seventh grade during the pandemic and unfortunately that was around the time where I was like, sure, you can have Snapchat and TikTok, you know, so you can talk with friends.

[Heather Dubrow]

Right.

[Interviewer]

Because you don't have siblings. Really bad idea. And I still, if, despite the disconnect that he had from his peers, I would have gone back and not allowed that all over again because of the harms that it caused. I just, I would have delayed so many more things. I would have had more confidence and conviction to wait. I would have had more conversations. I would have gone with a safer smartphone. I gave him an iPhone. And now that I know what I know about Apple and their policies around privacy over child safety, I wouldn't have done that. But to be fair, the bark phone and the bark watch weren't out yet. Right.

[Heather Dubrow]

So anyway, the options were limited.

[Interviewer]

They were limited. Yeah. So what about you? Would you have done anything different?

[Heather Dubrow]

It's such a tough question because during the pandemic, like you were saying, you know, my youngest was younger and there were no kids on our street and there was no way to communicate. And I think honestly that the gaming is what saved his sanity. Truly.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Heather Dubrow]

And I know that sounds crazy, but also I feel like I got off lucky with the ages they were when they started. I would tell you that what I would go back and do over would be to limit my youngest if it weren't for the pandemic.

[Interviewer]

Right. We were all handed a very bad deck of cards.

[Heather Dubrow]

That was a lot. And I feel like we gotta give ourselves a break here.

[Interviewer]

Yes, we do. Let's also.

[Heather Dubrow]

We only have. And I always say, you know, it's like we have today and tomorrow. This is all we have. And I don't believe that things are irreversible. And there are still lessons to learn and especially for your son before he goes to college, because there's different ages and stages that we really have to pay attention to. Yes, there's that very young. They need to be outside and not on the devices all the time. Then there's the. They get a middle school, which is disgusting, cesspool of hormones, awful for anyone. And, you know, then we need to teach them how to be on these devices and whatnot. And then high school, we're really preparing them to be on their own. And so one of the things back to our food conversation is if we limit them so much and we don't allow them to make mistakes which they're gonna make, and we control them so much when they're on their own, they may not know how to handle it.

[Interviewer]

That's a good point.

[Heather Dubrow]

So what I would say is, I think there's a happy medium. I like the very. When there's something very dangerous going on. Look, I work with the Trevor project a lot, and their statistics are devastating. Every 45 seconds, a queer child tries to commit suicide. And that is. I mean, add that to your. Your. Your numbers that you were saying before. It's really, really scary. But for some of these kids, the only way they have a community is to reach out to people online. Think about living in a home where there is no support.

[Interviewer]

Right? Right.

[Heather Dubrow]

There is no community, and they don't have parents that accept them, and they have no connection to the outside world.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Heather Dubrow]

So that's kind of scary, too. That's why I feel like I really like putting in place very dangerous markers. There's suicide markers. There's eating disorders. There's predators. There's all kinds of things that we should be aware. Very, very aware and alerted to. Yeah, but like, we used to go to the library, right. Go through the Dewey decimal, look things up and look things up and do. They don't have that. They have these smart devices, and that's how they figure things out. And I think. Although I want to know if something really bad is going on, we need to know.

[Interviewer]

Right.

[Heather Dubrow]

And we should be required to know as legal guardians. Right. That should be a law. Yeah. That something bad is going on. But searching up random things, they should be able to do that.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. There's a, there's a balance, especially when it comes to age appropriate sexual curiosity, which is totally normal.

[Heather Dubrow]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

But then there's also the other side of, you know, who are you talking to about it? Right. And pornography has been shown to negatively impact your ability to have a healthy, consensual relationship with someone when it's time.

[Heather Dubrow]

You know, my brain didn't even go to porn.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's, it's, it's so sad to hear. Especially freshman boys in college, you know, are going to their doctors and saying like, I, like, I can't perform with this girl because, you know, and the doctor's like, well, do you watch porn? And like, they have to like take a year detox from that because what they've been experiencing and achieving climax from online doesn't represent real life.

[Heather Dubrow]

Right.

[Interviewer]

They're seeing, you know, violence or just things that aren't real. And that's sad because sex is such a beautiful thing. None of us would be here without it if our parents hadn't done that, you know, and so it's like, there's just, there's just, it's just so much. There's so much. And thankfully that's also true of all

[Heather Dubrow]

social because you think about how not just social, but movies and television. I tried to show my kids, like the Breakfast Club and it was too slow.

[Interviewer]

I know, I know.

[Heather Dubrow]

They can't. I mean, these things don't hold up because they're used to the world moving so much faster. So in the same way, it's funny, I was joking, but like, I didn't think about porn because I just wouldn't. Yeah, but yeah, it's like not just that, but all. Everything that they watch. There has to be a balance of. There needs sports and there needs to be cultural events and you know what I mean? Like all kinds of other things that engage the mind and move at different speeds.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, 100%.

[Heather Dubrow]

And that's why this sounds so silly, but it's not. But that's why family dinners are very important.

[Interviewer]

Yes. Oh my gosh. Yes. One of the number one predictors of healthy children is a screen free family dinner at least once a week.

[Heather Dubrow]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

And everybody can do that. It's a free thing. You can eat together once a week with no screens.

[Heather Dubrow]

Oh, 100%.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Heather Dubrow]

Now what's funny is, like, it's not funny, but, you know, as our kids are going off to college now we have three in college and one left at home. I know. And so I said to my son, I go, we're not having dinner enough, you know, because he's got volleyball and he's got this and he's got. He tutors students and he gets tutored and all, you know, whatever. He's busy. He's got like all these things and he's like, mom, I can't take. You guys have dinner for like two and a half hours. I go, okay, what if, you know, we. You eat, we'll watch you, and then we'll, you know what I mean? Like, could we just, you know. And so we have been trying to redefine what that looks like, but I think going back to the basics of that and setting ground rules for spending time together. Right. We go out to dinner and I find personally that I do better and my kids all do better when we're out to dinner as opposed to home. Cause when we're home, they can be excused totally. But when you take them out, you have them captive.

[Interviewer]

They're stuck.

[Heather Dubrow]

Yeah. And now that might just be for my kids, but that's what I have found works really well. I also, you know, as they get older, and this is sad, but, like, how many family vacations do you have left? I know, but, you know, your family changes and eventually, hopefully they find someone that they fall in love with and want to be with and maybe marry and maybe have families of their own. And so you have to really make sure you're planning things, make sure your holidays are good and engaged and that you continue traditions from when they're little. Not just because you do them, but because it's important and it's connectivity. And those are all non screen things.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Our colleague Matt McKee, who's no longer on this planet, but I firmly believe is thriving and happy in heaven, said a few years ago that your job as a parent is to parent in a way that when your children have the ability to leave the house, they don't wanna. They wanna come back.

[Heather Dubrow]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

And I feel like you and Dr. Dubrow have. Have done that.

[Heather Dubrow]

We're very lucky. They're such cool kids. And I have to say, as they get older, I mean, they all go through kind of this douchey phase, like 12 to 14, you know what I'm talking about? It's the worst, but it's the worst. But it's also the scariest because of what we're talking about. So you have to, like, you're so scared of them. And I. And I do believe that that is why we tend to go, okay, just put the thing in your room. It's fine, it's fine, it's fine, it's fine. Just be happy. Yeah, please, like me. And that's what happens. But, yeah, you know, they go through all these stages, but when they come back to you, if you've kept your lines of communication open, then they're so cool and they're so fun to be with. And, you know, I said to them, this year, we're taking a little trip together. And two of them were like, I don't wanna. And I go, listen, here's where we're going. Dad and I are going for these six days. You have to come for three. You can leave. That's totally fine. But everyone's coming for three. And I go, and you can pick a friend. And they all went, okay, great. And most of them are staying the whole time now, which is great. One of them's coming home because they have a significant other, but everyone else is staying, and I couldn't be happier about it.

[Interviewer]

That makes sense. My mom heart, so happy.

[Heather Dubrow]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. I. I look forward to the day when I don't have to ask my son to hang out with me and he asks me if I want to hang out with him.

[Heather Dubrow]

It's so cute. My oldest son, he just. He did his last final this morning, and so he came home and he was like, I'm back.

[Interviewer]

Okay, party time. Wow. Heather, what have we not covered today in terms of parenting? Parenting in a tech world, Parenting your four very beautiful and very individual children.

[Heather Dubrow]

Well, I mean, I think the most important thing about parenting is just being present. You don't have to be the best parent. You don't have to be the smartest. You don't have to be the most fun. You really don't. You just have to be there.

[Interviewer]

Parenting and being present doesn't mean this. If I was doing this interview and looking at this every five minutes, she'd be like, I'm out of here. This is so disrespectful.

[Heather Dubrow]

You have to be engaged.

[Interviewer]

You have to be present.

[Heather Dubrow]

Listen, if you're on your phone and your kid walks in and starts talking to you, unless literally you're in the middle of a business thing and you're like, wait a minute, pause. Do not go anywhere. I just have to finish this one thing and then put it down. But if you can just go, oh, you want to talk to me? Cool. Put it down.

[Interviewer]

Yes.

[Heather Dubrow]

It can wait.

[Interviewer]

Yes. You. You, child, are way more important to me than anything that is happening on this.

[Heather Dubrow]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

And if for some reason, I am taken away by this, maybe it's my boss, maybe it's my mom, you know, grandma, like it is, has to be an emergency.

[Heather Dubrow]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

For this to take priority. And if we want our kids to be okay, it starts by modeling healthy, appropriate tech behavior. I'm so glad you brought us back to that.

[Heather Dubrow]

Yeah. And we teach people how to treat us.

[Interviewer]

Yes.

[Heather Dubrow]

Right.

[Interviewer]

Mic drop.

[Heather Dubrow]

So let's do that on both sides.

[Interviewer]

Yes. Heather, thank you so much for coming here today for the wisdom, for the candor, for the humor that you put out online. It's just such a joy to be able to watch you, you know, from afar and now to have met you in person and feel your warmth and just. Thank you. Thank you so much. And I wish you and your family all the best in the coming year.

[Heather Dubrow]

Oh, same to you. Thank you.