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Parents Are Hard To Raise
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Bereavement and Social Isolation Dr. Lina Aldana #138
Mar 14, 202000:36:02Tap to summarizeBereavement and Social Isolation with Dr. Lina Aldana Listen to this episode… just click play on the player below Here Are Some Handy Links To The People, Products, Books, Services and Resources Discussed On This Episode Take Diane with you... and listen whenever you want, wherever you want, and how often you want, on your smartphone or tablet. It's easy... Just click any of the links below Listen with the iHeart Radio App iPhone Users Click This Link Android Phone Users Click This Link Follow Diane on Social Media Click the Links Below Show Transcript Parents Are Hard To Raise® S04 Episode 138 Transcript Alexa 0:00 The world's becoming a dangerous place for us women. Lipstick bodyguard looks just like an innocent little lipstick, but it'll instantly drop any attacker to his knees so you can get away unharmed. Lipstick bodyguard fear no evil. Get yours today only at lipstickbodyguard.com. Announcer 0:37 This week on Parents Are Hard To Raise psychologist Dr. Lina Aldana helps us pick up the pieces and begin moving forward again. Join 180 million monthly subscribers who can now listen to Parents Are Hard To Raise on Spotify. Diane Berardi 1:05 Welcome to Parents Are Hard To Raise, helping families grow older together without losing their minds. I'm elder care expert Diane Berardi. There's one thing I've come to learn about hosting a national radio show, your life plays out in the open for all to see. For people like me who are naturally shy, that can be a bit uncomfortable. But the benefits of having an extended family in 169 countries to help you over life's rough spots... That's something I'm so grateful for every day. Thank you all so much for your support. The last time our guest expert was here with us, it was just after my mom was diagnosed with pancreatic cancer. As longtime listeners know, my mom passed away this past September, and the outpouring of love and support I got from listeners around the world overwhelmed me. I'm so fortunate to have you guys as my extended family. I know that there are so many of you who are going through what my family is going through now. My mom and I were very close. We spoke every day, sometimes even more than that. Her passing has left a pretty big hole in my life. As is the case with just about every family caregiver I've ever known. There's no right or wrong way to feel when someone you love dies. Most people just go numb inside, and then day by day they move through the stages of grieving and return to daily life. But for caregivers, it's different. They often grief twice. It's common for caregivers to go through what's called anticipatory grief. Unlike the grief and mourning that happens after someone has passed, this anticipatory grief begins even before the person has died. When someone we care for has a terminal disease, an injury or condition that permanently changes their personality, like Alzheimer's disease, the grief caregivers feel may come even before their loved one is gone. Caregivers often suffer anxiety, dread or sadness as they wait for their loved one to pass. Many also feel a sense of guilt, anger, bitterness, even resentment, as we're forced to come to terms with the fact that we can't change the outcome. Grief is a natural, universal emotion. It's part of what makes us human. Because grief is intense and uncomfortable, we often try to find ways to avoid the immensity of the emotion through distraction and busyness. And getting back to life as usual, is often a good way to heal the pain of loss. But for caregivers, the sense of loss is so profound caregiving was part of normal life. Now the abrupt change in roles is confounding and many caregivers feel as if they've lost their identity. Often caregivers were forced to make changes in their own lives, changing where to live, the added financial concerns, altering of relationships. Now all that is changed, leaving them confronted with the fear of not knowing what lies ahead. Maybe that's why caregiver grief lasts such a long time. Recent research has shown caregiver grieving can last a year or more. And it's why I've asked our resident psychologist, Dr. Lena Aldana to help walk us through one of life's toughest times. Dr. Rodin is a licensed psychologist and clinical director at Pirelli clinical and forensic psychology, and is our go to expert for issues like these. Lina, welcome back to Parents Are Hard To Raise. Dr Lina Aldana 4:49 Thank you for having me. I really appreciate that. And, and I'm very sorry to hear about your mom. I spoke to you a little while ago and I neglected to ask you, so I'm sorry. Diane Berardi 5:01 Oh no, that's okay. You know, I, as many caregivers, I did go through that anticipatory grief, you know, dreading what was going to happen and then trying my best to try to figure out how to avoid it happening, and now that it has happened, you know people will say, Well, how are you? And I can't say. I can't put my finger on how I am. You know, your emotions are up and down. They're all over the place. Is that normal? Dr Lina Aldana 5:39 Yes. And and it's that time of year on top of everything else. Yeah. Last year. She was getting sick and this is the holidays. So you have all these anniversaries happening. So absolutely normal to not know how you feel or to feel a bunch of different feelings. It's part of the process. When you lose a loved one, it's very hard to come to terms with that, even if you knew it was coming. Diane Berardi 6:04 Yeah, it's... and you know, you were prepared. I mean, in the fact that you knew, you know, it was coming, but there isn't anything that prepares you, Really. Dr Lina Aldana 6:17 Absolutely. And it's a loss. And it leaves a gap. And then you have to deal with that. So it's a reality that we all confront at some point, but we're never really ready for, even if we know this is what's going to happen. And this is what I'm going to do next and is going to handle it. Your emotions are your emotions and they're tied to that person, to tie to your memories to your environment. There's so many things that are going to affect the way you feel when you are losing a loved one and when you do lose a loved one. Diane Berardi 6:51 Yeah, and I think part of me now... You know, my brother and sister are not in the same state, so... And I said to my dad, and you know, of course now my caregiving continues, because I have my dad and so I kind of didn't have a break. And, you know, I had said to him, you know, it's a little... Not that my brother and sister didn't lose their mom, but they, they've weren't through that day to day stuff, you know, or as close to the situation. And part of me gets mad at them and I'm saying Why Am I mad at them, but I am there, I guess cuz they can... I mean, they have to feel the grief. Right? But they're going on with their lives. Dr Lina Aldana 7:44 Yeah. And it's different and it's different for them is and you know, even if you live nearby, or everybody's gonna have a different experience. You know, how when you talk to your siblings, and they remember things, the same event differently. Because you take in the moment differently? Your relationships with the people that you love, with your parents, with your children, they're also going to be different even if you're in the same unit. And now with you and your mom and your sibs, you know, they were or they are away, so it's even more different. And in many ways, they were protected from the more difficult things because you were carrying that weight. So yes, of course, you can feel upset about that. You're entitled. Diane Berardi 8:27 I know. And then I feel guilty, cuz I'm like, why do I... Dr Lina Aldana 8:30 Yeah! That too. [laughing] that does come along with that. Diane Berardi 8:35 And then I think they kind of... And I don't know if I read into it. And I'm like, I think they feel guilty because then they kind of... I'm not the type I really, you know, I kind of keep things in and I'm not the type to complain. But then I get to a certain point where... and it's so hard with my dad because he's, he's lost, you know. But he wants to remain in the home and, you know, he doesn't see, you know, he has very bad... he's legally blind. So and he's very bad rheumatoid arthritis and he, the poor guy can't walk, you know, he just walks very slow. And he but he wants to be by himself, you know, take care of himself. Dr Lina Aldana 9:22 Independent. Diane Berardi 9:22 Yeah. And you know, and I'm like, Ahhh! Dr Lina Aldana 9:30 But you're not sharing and it's funny, you said that I was going to ask you, you know, sometimes we feel all those feelings and have all these thoughts that can sometimes be resentful, and that's where the anger is in the guilt and it'll get it gets bunched in together. But if we're not talking about it, it's a hard topic to talk about, you know, it's hard to say to your sibling, hey, I wish you were here. You know, I'm like, really carry this and I need assistance. But sometimes it's harder... it's easier I mean, for things to go unsaid, but that it creates this atmosphere that at some point, you know, will have to be confronted because it doesn't go away. Diane Berardi 10:12 Yeah, and then I think if I do say anything, I kind of say, Oh gosh, you know, my dad he, for some reason he'll... and my dad says, I'll say dad you have you know, you we wanted to him to come live with me or live with one of my siblings. "No, no, I can do my..." You know, we said well, what about the laundry? What about washing dishes? You know, clothes and... "I can do it. I can do it." And he says he can but he doesn't. [laughing] So, there's the thing. And if we say, "But you're not doing it." "Well, I can." You know He's of sound mind. I mean, you know, I mean, he's a little forgetful, but so I can't, you know, it's a tough situation and I find and I think especially now because I guess the holidays and everybody's busy and I find if I say things to my brother and sister like I get there and there's a sink full of dishes like every fork and knife is in the sick you know. And he'll say to me, "I meant to do those dishes. But I guess I didn't." You know, and if I say that to my brother and sister, they're like, they I think they feel I sense they might feel guilty and so they kind of... "Well, what can I do?" That type of thing. "He's gonna have to, we're gonna have he's gonna have to get someone to live with him. You know what I mean? Dr Lina Aldana 11:47 So it's like, let's fix it. Somebody has to fix it. Diane Berardi 11:51 Yeah. So I don't know. How do we go on from here, this grieving? Is this all part of grieving? Dr Lina Aldana 12:00 You know, grieving is such a complicated process and everybody goes through it. And you know, there are many similarities, but there are also a lot of differences because everybody is different. And there are many experiences, but their are the stages, right, the regular stages that most people go through, which is, you know, initially you're denying once you know, when you first hear about it, or when you know, it's going to happen. There's the anger, the bargaining, the depression, and eventually the acceptance. Right? And there's so much turmoil that goes with all of that. But, um, any last lot, it doesn't, it can be prolonged, and I think with grief, grief and bereavement. The issue really is where the question really is. How well can you function with it? How long is it lasting? And is it interfering with your ability to manage your day to day. Diane Berardi 12:58 Huh, yeah. Dr Lina Aldana 12:59 So you know, yes, it is stressful. Yes, it is very sad. It can be very depressing. You can find yourself feeling truly angry one moment because you thought of something and then a little while later you're crying because you remember something else. And that's normal. But then how long is that period? And then is this interfering with your ability to focus, with your ability to think with your ability to do your job, with your sleep, with your ability to take care of yourself, you know, how, where is it happening in your life? And you know, initially it may interfere with some things because it is very shocking, even when you know, it's coming. But when a long time has passed, and it's not quite away. Yeah. And it's, it's getting in the way of things is getting in the way of self care, getting in the way of eating you're disheveled and your mood is low and then is turning into something else, right and then we're looking at is it becoming depression, or is it a depression already? You know that... So those are the things Things that sort of need to be teased out. For you it's been very recent. Diane Berardi 14:06 Yeah. Dr Lina Aldana 14:06 You knew it was coming. But it's also been very recent. So you, and I think you have a lot of support. So it's, it's all okay. If anything, I would say, you know, and with your dad is the question for him would be, Was he able to do the dishes before? Was he able to take better care of himself in the home before? Or no. You know, is that behavior normal? Or is it abnormal at this point? So those are the things to look out for. Diane Berardi 14:37 Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, you know, and it's so hard because my mom did everything. And, you know, you don't realize it because, you know, they they were the two of them and they were going on now when she couldn't do anything when she got sick, and then she couldn't do anything. He was doing stuff. And, but she would prompt him to do things, you know. So he was still doing them. But now I think he kind of, if he doesn't have to go anywhere, you know if he doesn't have a doctor's appointment or anything, he doesn't get dressed. You know, he just kind of sits and he'll say, "Oh, I didn't get to that, or Oh, yeah, I didn't get to. I have all this paperwork to do." And he'll have, you know, a lot of it's junk mail, but he has his paperwork. [laughing] But he kind of just yeah, and sometimes, you know, I'm there and I'm, I'm like, I have to I say, "Dad, next time I come... because I, he, he does... Initially he didn't want to go to the store with me. He would just say you go, you know, I'd help them with a list, but now he wants to go to get out, which is a good, good, yes. But then he'll say Oh, it's Because he doesn't walk well, you know, he'll say, "oh, it was too much for me." Like it takes him a long time. You know, for me maybe shopping for him would take an hour, it takes maybe three with him. [laughing] Dr Lina Aldana 16:13 Because he can't ambulate Diane Berardi 16:13 Yeah, he can't and he holds on... you know, I have a carriage. I say hold on to the carriage because he doesn't want to use a cane. You know, it's like, "I don't need a cane." And but then I spend more time apologizing. He's banging into everybody. [laughing] But, uh, yeah, so... and then I try to always be cheerful for him. So and then I get mad because I'm like, "I can't even be sad." [laughing] Dr Lina Aldana 16:17 You know, it's funny because we try to protect the people that we love. And here's the other part of the topic, the loneliness piece. I think that sometimes if I ourselves lonely or, or socially isolated. Because it especially when you're the caregiver because it feels like other people don't get it. They haven't done this, you know, kind of like with your siblings, they don't understand or they haven't been here and I'm carrying this burden. But the other part of it is because you also want to protect people, right? Diane Berardi 16:54 Yeah. Dr Lina Aldana 17:21 Um, you don't want to say something that will upset them further because you know, you're upset. So you want to be you try to be mindful of that. But to be frank, sometimes if you kind of validate or acknowledge the experience, it can be so free for both you and the other person. Because I'm sure your dad is feeling lost. Diane Berardi 17:48 Yeah. Dr Lina Aldana 17:48 And lonely and scared. He's just lost his partner. That's not easy. You just lost your mom. That is not easy. And sometimes things go unsaid because We're afraid to say it out loud. Now it's real. Right? But, but sometimes we need each other. And, and, and it's hard to reach out. It's scary. I don't know why we're humans are funny sometimes. But, but we need it. And he might not engage. He may say, "No, no, I'm okay." You know, I'm the tough guy. But, you know, a good embrace, "Dad, I know you're strong. But guess what, I miss her." You know, that might just be enough. Yeah, they don't acknowledge it. Because it's hard. Diane Berardi 18:37 You know, she was on hospice for a very short time. And the chaplain, you know, I had the chaplain call him because I thought maybe he would open up, you know, to, you know, it's a man and, you know, he might feel more comfortable than opening up to me, you know, or because I think he feels he might have to be strong for me. You know, so but he said, "Oh no, I don't need that." You know, because and I understand the chaplain had a call and say Is it okay if I come? You know, I guess we can't just show up, Cuz I'm like, "Just show up." [laughing] I'm like it's... Don't call him because he's gonna say no, just show up. But they can't do that you know? And he said, First he said, "Oh, I told him I'm fine." And I don't know my father was telling him all kinds of stories and then he said to me, "How do I know it was the really the chaplain?" [laughing] It's just crazy. But we're going to continue talking with Dr. Lina Aldana. But first, if you're a woman, or there's a woman in your life, there's something you absolutely need to know. 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Inside this innocent looking lipstick is the same powerful stuff used by police and the military to disarm even the most powerful, armed aggressor. In fact, National Park rangers used the very same formula that's inside this little lipstick to stop two-thousand pound vicious grizzly bears dead in their tracks. It's like carrying a personal bodyguard with you in your purse or your pocket. Darkness brings danger. Murderers and rapists use darkness to their advantage. We all know what it's like to be walking at night and hear footsteps coming at us from behind. Who's there? If it's somebody bad, will you be protected? Your life may depend on it. My friend Katie's close call needs to be a wake up call for all of us. Myself included. Pick up a Lipstick Bodyguard and keep it with you always. Announcer 21:58 You're listening to Parents Are Hard To Raise. Now, thanks to you. The number one eldercare talk show on planet earth. Listen to this and other episodes on demand using the iHeart Radio app, iPhone users to listen on Apple podcasts and Android users on Google podcasts. Want a great new way to listen to the show? Just say, "Alexa. Play, Parents Are Hard To Raise podcast." Alexa 22:25 Getting the latest episode of Parents Are Hard To Raise. Here it is from iHeart Radio. Announcer 22:30 It's as simple as that. Diane Berardi 22:32 You're right Dolly. There's so many really cool new ways to listen to our show. It's hard to keep track. You can join the 180 million listeners on Spotify. You can listen in your car at the gym, or pretty much anywhere on your smartphone with Apple podcasts and Google podcasts. You can get us on Apple TV, direct tv, Roku. And like Dolly said, you can even ask Alexa to play the show for you. It's great because you don't have to be tied to a radio anymore. You can listen when you want where you want for as long as you want. And if you're listening to the show one of these new ways, please do me a big favor, share this new technology and help someone else learn about the show and show them a new way to listen. So Lina... you were talking about loneliness. What do we do? How do we... you find that you don't want to be around other people, but then you should. Right? [Laughing] Dr Lina Aldana 23:37 Yeah. [laughing] Or I mean, you don't. You obviously you need time alone. You need space. You need to be able to think and you know, remember, and we need privacy for that. But if you find yourself isolating, avoiding people, alone most of the time and feeling pretty down or miserable. And, and not seeking help not talking about your feelings or your thoughts. That may be a time when the light bulb should go off and say okay, maybe I need to talk to somebody, maybe a friend or talk to my husband or call my daughter, whoever, just to say, "Hey, I was just thinking about this or remember when..." and sort of start that conversation. Because it's hard, it can be a very lonely road, and you can get stuck in your thoughts. And then it creates it can create a lot of negativity, a lot of sadness. And, and you don't know all the details. And I'm kind of putting you on the spot again, but you mentioned your siblings, and you said, I think they may feel this way or I think this may be going on and they probably feel the same way or they probably think the same way but you're not sure, because you're not talking about it. You're just guessing, you're you're making assumptions. And and you're feeling left out. Diane Berardi 25:09 Oh, yeah. And I get I kind of, you know, I'm like geeze they can kind of keep going on with their lives. But I'm not. You know, I mean I am but I still have my dad. You know, it's like it's a you know in they're home and it's different. You know and then I say, "Well they're not here so how could you get mad at them?" but you. Dr Lina Aldana 25:40 Of course you can and here's the other reality, and I think sometimes we don't also want to talk about this. We also get mad at the person who passed away, because they left. Because maybe you know when it sudden, it's sudden or when it's something like an illness that is prolonged, it's different, but when you feel like, "Well, you didn't take care of herself well enough. Now I'm alone." Now, and you can become angry at them. And that's also normal. Diane Berardi 26:12 Yeah, yeah. I think my dad, I, you know, I think, you know, my dad kept saying he, because my mom had pancreatic cancer and she couldn't eat, you know, she, she just couldn't and he kept. My dad kept saying if she would only eat, you know, and he kept and then he kept saying they starved her. You know, she was on hospice, but she couldn't eat, you know, and there was a point she couldn't swallow. And he kept saying, we have to feed her. And he could because Dr Lina Aldana 26:43 That would solve everything. That would be so much simpler. Right? That's the wish. Diane Berardi 26:47 Yes. And I, you know, I told him, you know, Dad this is part of this is the body the body knows, you know, it's not hungry. It's can't eat. I said, She can't choke. You know, we can't. As I said, she's not hungry. "Well, we can try soup." [laughing] Yeah, so it's I don't know it. Yeah, It's so tough for people and I find that I have no and I'm usually a very easygoing, calm kind of person. And I usually I'm the middle child, so I usually try to have everything run smoothly. And, and, but I noticed even I'm very I have no patience for anyone for anything or anyone and then I'm saying, that's not like me. Dr Lina Aldana 27:46 But there's resons to be irritable. You're going through a huge change, right? loss is a huge change. It's a big adjustment. There's an empty space that you're dealing with. Diane Berardi 27:59 Yeah. Dr Lina Aldana 27:59 Not easy. Diane Berardi 28:01 No. And the holidays, it makes it tough. Yeah, Dr Lina Aldana 28:04 Absolutely. It's, you it is never a good time. But it's this time of year is just going to bring up a lot of this stuff. Diane Berardi 28:13 It does. Yeah. And it makes it hard to, you know, there, there's that empty chair, you know, and, and it's no fun. Yeah. It's my mother. And you know, you don't realize, I guess because, you know, you're you're living your life and, you know, you're with your mother and father, but we did. I didn't realize how much my mother really I guess she equal, you know, equalized my dad. I don't know how to, you know, humanized him more. I don't know how to say that. You know what I mean? [laughing] Dr Lina Aldana 28:52 Yeah... [laughing] Diane Berardi 28:56 I guess, I mean, when I look at him now, you know, I'll say Dad You know, we go to the store, say, dad, well, what do you feel like eating this week? "I don't know." And I, and then I think and I'm like, you know, my mom, she went shopping, she cooked, she made whatever, she put it in front of hem, he ate it.. He didn't have to make any decisions. And now he kind of, you know, and then, you know, and everyone says to me, well, you have to make the decisions for him. Well, you know, it's just, it's hard. Yeah, I guess it's hard for people to because if you have another, you know, first of all, you're dealing with the loss of one parent. And then if you have another one, and then you kind of feel like you don't have the time yourself to... Dr Lina Aldana 29:45 To feel. To think about it. Yeah, to get through it. Because you're so busy still taking care of someone else. And yeah. And so this is this is when finding People who, you know your own time and people who or one person who you can talk to, and express those feelings that will be important. This is why support groups exist for grief. Here in where I live, where I have "Good Grief," which is for families, and especially is geared towards them, especially children whose parents or ones, but it also provides a lot of support for the families, like a big, big thing, I think in Morristown, I think is based out of there. But um, but it's very good. Because it has programs, it has the group component, it has all sorts of things where you can socialize with people who've been there. And it's helpful. and it's not easy, right? Then you meet someone or you hear a story and you're like, Oh, I can relate to that. Diane Berardi 30:54 Yeah. How would you have any ideas on getting like, for instance, My dad, I think maybe he would benefit from that. But how do I how do you get him to agree to that? Or? [laughing] Dr Lina Aldana 31:11 [lasughing] That is tricky. Because even if you take him and say, hey, let's go sit down for a chat together like as a family because you know, you there are support groups like that where you can go with another family member. And maybe that he doesn't join. May be the he just kind of sits and listens, or he refuses. But sometimes you don't have to actively participate to get something out of it. Diane Berardi 31:35 Right. He could just listen. Dr Lina Aldana 31:37 But if he refuses to listen, or walks out, and that's that. Diane Berardi 31:42 Yeah. You know, I don't know, maybe if I said, Yeah, I'll go with you. You know, maybe we could go together. I don't know. I could, because he can't. He can't drive himself. So... yeah. I would have to take a more Yeah, so I guess I guess we each have to, you know, it's kind of an individual thing. We each have to figure out what would help you know, what would help me, you know, who can I talk to or find a solution that, you know, if I'm, if I was down before something that may be helped me? Dr Lina Aldana 32:27 Yes. And I guess, you know, grief is normal. Right? Not pathologize degrees, not yet, right? Because it's still very fresh. It becomes, quote, pathological and problematic, right? And then we're looking, like I said before is to depression, when time has passed, and it hasn't gotten better or it's getting worse. And it's not interfering with your ability to function in several areas of your life. Right? Diane Berardi 32:57 Yeah. Dr Lina Aldana 32:57 It's not become something else. You're not getting over it. But all the things that you're talking about their normal, and they do get better over time and the fact that you are mindful and aware, it's a very good thing. Because you are paying attention and you're noticing the differences, and you're being thoughtful. And as time passes you and you often just conversational, so I think you'll maybe think about what can I do differently? Is there something that I used to enjoy, maybe I can go back and do that. You know, remember we're entering the winter so it's going to be darker. It's Bleaker. It's already depressing right? So that doesn't help. Right The holidays are coming. It's going your first set of holidays without her, right? So you know, there's going to be things that are going to activate all those feelings that are the feel so bad, but they are normal. And next year even if you are feeling better next year, you're gonna have your first anniversary of this so then you're gonna sort of, you know, have a wave of that. But as time passes, you are going to continue to have anniversaries, but it won't feel as bad because now you know that she's not going to be sitting in that chair. You can remember her but now it's not so painful. It's not so fresh. Right? Time does heal. But when it doesn't when three years have passed and you are feeling just as badly as day one, then that's something else. Diane Berardi 34:22 Okay, yeah. Lina How can people reach you? Dr Lina Aldana 34:29 Reach me directly? Diane Berardi 34:30 Yeah. Dr Lina Aldana 34:31 I guess the best way would be our website. Let's see if I remember it. [laughing] correctly. And not give it all wrong. I believe w w w. g p i r e l I i. com. Diane Berardi 34:52 That's fine. And we will have that on our website, as well. So we'll have that. Thank you. So much Lina. Thank you. Parents Are Hard To Raise family. I love getting your emails and questions so please keep sending them You can reach me at Diana Parents Are Hard To Raise.org or just click the green button on our homepage. Parents Are Hard To Raise as a counter sync media production. The music used in this broadcast was managed by Cosmo music, New York, New York. Our New York producer is Joshua Green, our broadcast engineer is Well Gambino, and from our London studios, the melodic voice of our announcer, Miss Dolly D. Thank you so much for listening. Till next time, may you forget everything you don't want to remember. And remember everything you don't want to forget. And Valentine's Day is coming. LipstickBodyguards make a great gift. See you again next week. Downloadable PDF of the Show Transcript Parents-Are-Hard-To-Raise-S04-Episode-138_otter.ai_ Listen to this episode... just click play on the player below
Transcribe →Hidden Legal Pitfalls in Medicare 2020 Amos Goodall, Esq. #137
Nov 26, 201900:29:12Tap to summarizeHidden Legal Pitfalls in Medicare 2020 Listen to this episode… just click play on the player below Here Are Some Handy Links To The People, Products, Books, Services and Resources Discussed On This Episode Take Diane with you… and listen whenever you want, wherever you want, and how often you want, on your smartphone or tablet. It’s easy… Just click any of the links below Listen with the iHeart Radio App iPhone Users Click This Link Android Phone Users Click This Link Follow Diane on Social Media Click the Links Below Show Transcript Parents Are Hard To Raise® S03 Episode 137 Transcript Announcer 0:00 The world’s becoming a dangerous place for us women. Lipstick bodyguard looks just like an innocent little lipstick, but it’ll instantly drop any attacker to his knees so you can get away unharmed. Lipstick bodyguard fear no evil. Get yours today only at lipstickbodyguard.com. Announcer 0:37 Can the simple act of smiling, even when you don’t mean it, reduce physical pain, relieve stress and impact our overall health? Find out this week as Diane has an eye opening conversation with smiles expert, Dr. Sarah Pressman. Join 180 million monthly subscribers who can now listen to parents are hard raised on Spotify. Diane Berardi 1:13 Welcome to Parents Are Hard To Raise, helping families grow older together without losing their minds. I’m elder care expert Diane Berardi. Diane Berardi 1:23 Longtime listeners will recognize my next guest as our go to expert on all matters elder law. If I were to list all of his credentials there’d be no time left in the show. So let me just say he’s a certified elder law attorney practicing in center County, Pennsylvania with the firm Steinbacher, Goodall and Yurchak. Philadelphia magazine named him a Super lawyer in elder law as they have every year since the category was created. He’s a fellow of the National Academy of elder law attorneys and currently serves as president of the National Elder Law foundation. Attorney Amos Goodall, Welcome to Parents Are Hard To Raise. Amos Goodall, Esq. 1:59 Thanks Diane. Announcer 2:01 So you’re going to talk to us about Medicare. Could you kind of refresh our audience about what is Medicare and how it works? Amos Goodall, Esq. 2:12 I will be happy to Diane. And I’d like to start with a quote that I think really summarizes it. It’s a court case. And it really summarizes this area of the law. This was a quote by Judge Friendly who was a circuit court judge in New York in 1976. He says, there has been developed a degree of complexity in the Social Security Act, and particularly the regulations, which makes them almost unintelligible to the uninitiated. Such on intelligibility is definitely unfortunate in the case of a statute, dealing or the rights of poor people, and I would add your old people. And that’s, that’s really what we’re talking about today is is a law that is as complex as any law that I know of. In fact, when I turned 65 I write a book on, I’m the author of a chapter of a book on elder law. And one of my chapter one of my chapters is Medicare. And I still had trouble determining what to do for myself. Diane Berardi 3:15 Oh my gosh. Amos Goodall, Esq. 3:17 So it is a, an area that is complicated and it is. We need to, we need to understand as much as we can going into it because we’re going to make decisions that are going to be with us for a while. Diane Berardi 3:33 Right. Amos Goodall, Esq. 3:34 So, Medicare is basically health insurance, health insurance program for folks who are age 65 and older, as well as some younger people who have disabilities. And it’s like any other insurance, you’ve got to pay the premium to acquire it and it has various components. There are four main components of Medicare as it stands today. Amos Goodall, Esq. 3:59 There’s something called it Part A, something called Part B, something called Part C, which is a hybrid of a and b and possibly Medicare Part D, which is private health insurance for prescriptive drugs. So those are the components of Medicare. And I’d like to give you a little bit more detail. Amos Goodall, Esq. 4:19 Part A deals with inpatient health services, I’m sorry, inpatient hospital services, some hospital extended care services, and some home health services and hospice services. So if you go into the hospital, the hospital bill goes to Medicare Part A. Amos Goodall, Esq. 4:37 The doctor who treats you is going to be covered by Part B, and I’ll talk about Part V in just a second. But what you what you need to do to get Part A is you need to be either over 65 and be fully insured under the retirement program. In other words, have a sufficient number of quarters of work, that you’re entitled to Social Security retirement. Typically when you reach full retirement age… Here it starts to get complicated. But yeah, for me for retirement age of 66. For other people, it might be 67. For our parents, it probably was 65. And whatever our full retirement age is, Medicare kicks in at the age of 65. So if you are 65 years of age, you are entitled to Medicare part and fully insured, you’re entitled to Medicare Part A. You are if you’re under 65, and you’ve been receiving Social Security disability benefits for 24 months, you’re entitled to Medicare Part A. And if you are over 65, and you’re not fully insured, then you have you can buy in but apart from that people who are qualified for Medicare do not have to pay for Medicare Part A. Diane Berardi 5:48 Okay Amos Goodall, Esq. 5:49 Now I’m going to go to part B. Part Part A is the hospital Part B is the doctor. Medically necessary services, preventive services like physician services, supplies, diagnostic tests, etc. Those are all part B. And what do you have to do to get Part B will you have to be entitled A Medicare Part A, You have to be a citizen and resident the United States are and certain non residents who have been lawfully admitted for permanent residents and whoever retired here, whoever resided here for at least five years. And there is a premium for Part B, there’s a base rate premium, and then there is a an additional charge based upon your income two years ago. Diane Berardi 6:35 Really, okay. Unknown Speaker 6:36 The premium varies year by year. In 1976, for example, the premium was $121. Now it’s somewhat higher. The additions to the premium cost based upon income raised the cost several up to several hundred dollars a month. So you’re admitted to the hospital where the hospital bill goes to part And the doctors bill goes to part B. Medicare Part B has a number of deductibles and co insurance and it has a number of things that it does not cover. For example, that there’s a part of the deductible that is so much a year, there’s a part of the Co-insurance that is 20% of whatever the amount Medicare approves for the bill. And then there are some coverage limits on things like psychological and occupational therapy and things like that. So people, if they are planning ahead, will purchase at the same time they qualify for Medicare Part B, they will purchase something called Medicare Supplement Insurance or Medigap. Diane Berardi 7:42 Okay. Amos Goodall, Esq. 7:43 Those are policies that pay for things that Medicare Part B doesn’t cover. There actually are basically nine plans and there are 10 features that different plans cover and you may choose the plan that best meets your needs and best meets your wallet, frankly, when you are purchasing that insurance. Amos Goodall, Esq. 8:08 Social Security administration maintains a website where you can compare Medigap plans and to prepare for this conference today I went on the site and looked and there are 40 plans in center County. Diane Berardi 8:20 Oh my gosh. Amos Goodall, Esq. 8:21 Are that one can choose from. And you look at the plans that they’re all required to have the same coverage in the same area. So if a plan is going to offer Part B coverage for part B, coinsurance, or co payment, all the plans in that category will offer that coverage and you have to decide well, which of the coverages of the extra coverages do I want to pay for? So for example, if I don’t ever plan to travel abroad, I probably won’t buy a plan that includes coverage or if I’m outside the country, Diane Berardi 8:52 Right. Okay, makes sense. Unknown Speaker 8:54 If I’m deciding on things I may or may not choose a coverage that pays for the cost of blood transfer. So you look at the Medigap insurance policies you purchase the policy that you best think fits your needs. Now, that’s part in Part B. Amos Goodall, Esq. 9:10 Part C or Medicare Advantage is a private insurance program that’s been around now for about I’m going to say the last 15 years that basically covers your medical expenses, same things that traditional Medicare Part A and Part B cover, okay, and it must cover one more thing, at least one more thing that’s not covered. For example, it may have dental coverage, it may have vision coverage. Around here in Center County, many of the Medicare Advantage programs include gym memberships, because they want people to work out and of course, stay healthy longer. So it’s more of a managed care plan. It’s the government pays the company that administers the plan certain amount of money per person, and then they administer The insurance program. There are some advantages to Medicare Advantage. There are some disadvantages. One of them is you’re dealing with a private insurance company. And so your ability to challenge things. It’s not based upon federal law, but it’s based upon the insurance contract. Diane Berardi 10:16 Hmm. Okay. Unknown Speaker 10:18 So you have, you have Part A and B or you have Part C. And the cost for Part C is sometimes is as little as nothing more than the part cost of Parts A and B because they’re relying on on the, what they’re getting from the federal government. Clearly, if you have a more expensive plan, you’re going to get more coverage. And the CMS has a website Social Security Administration has a website that will allow you to compare the coverages of various plans. Amos Goodall, Esq. 10:50 By the way, my website is Goodall.org and after we finished this conversation, I’m going to post on the website, a couple of PowerPoint presentations that discuss this, as well as the links to the comparison tools that I’m talking about. Diane Berardi 11:09 Perfect. That’s wonderful. Unknown Speaker 11:11 So you look at what insurance you want to buy you, you decide on do I want Medicare Part A and be traditional or do I want Medicare Advantage? And then you have to think about drugs. And, you know, might you might say this kind of drives you to drugs, but I’m not talking recreational drugs, I’m talking about prescription drugs. [laughing] Diane Berardi 11:31 Oh, my God. [laughing] Unknown Speaker 11:32 So, the Part D program, the Medicare prescription drug program is incredibly complicated and I hope I can do justice and explaining it. Each provider each insurance company has made a list of the drugs that it covers. So if you take a particular drug, you can look to see whether that that drug is covered the particular plan that you are considering buying, and again, there’s a website that will let you compare these things. So is your drug on that list that’s called a formulary. And it’s the list of drugs that the company will provide coverage for. And then you haven’t finished because the next thing you have to do is figure out where in their tier of drugs does the drug you need fit. And you may need a drug that is called a tier one drug or which is basically generic drugs. They pay more of the cost of that than if you had a tier five drug which is the highest tier drug which is perhaps an experimental drug, in which case they made it they may or may not pay. I analyze it will a Senate Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs listed the 20 most prescribed brand name drugs for seniors, and I analyzed for center County, the 31 prescription drug plans That covered those 20 items. And the cost of the plans ranged from $13 a month to $168 a month. And although probably no one takes all 20 of those brand name drugs, the annual costs with additional out of pocket expense is roughly $15,000 a year. Announcer 13:22 And we’re going to continue talking with Amos Goodall. But first, if you are a woman or there’s a woman in your life, there’s something you absolutely need to know. Diane Berardi 13:32 I want to tell you about my friend Katie. Katie is a nurse and she was attacked on her way home from work. She was totally taken by surprise. And although Katie is only 5 feet tall and 106 pounds she was easily able to drop her 6 foot 4, 250-pound attacker to his knees and get away unharmed. Katie wasn’t just lucky that day. She was prepared. In her pocketbook, a harmless looking lipstick, which really contained a powerful man stopping aerosol propellant. It’s not like it was in our grandmother’s day. Today just going to and from work or to the mall can have tragic consequences. The FBI says a violent crime is committed every 15 seconds in the United States. And a forcible rape happens every five minutes. And chances are when something happens, no one will be around to help. It looks just like a lipstick. So no one will suspect a thing. Which is important since experts say, getting the jump on your attacker is all about the element of surprise. Inside this innocent looking lipstick is the same powerful stuff used by police and the military to disarm even the most powerful, armed aggressor. In fact, National Park rangers used the very same formula that’s inside this little lipstick to stop two-thousand pound vicious grizzly bears dead in their tracks. It’s like carrying a personal bodyguard with you in your purse or your pocket. Darkness brings danger. Murderers and rapists use darkness to their advantage. We all know what it’s like to be walking at night and hear footsteps coming at us from behind. Who’s there? If it’s somebody bad, will you be protected? Your life may depend on it. My friend Katie’s close call needs to be a wake up call for all of us. Myself included. Pick up a Lipstick Bodyguard and keep it with you always. Announcer 15:35 You’re listening to Parents Are Hard To Raise. Now, thanks to you. The number one eldercare talk show on planet earth. Listen to this and other episodes on demand using the iHeart Radio app, iPhone users to listen on Apple podcasts and Android users on Google podcasts. Want a great new way to listen to the show? Just say, “Alexa. Play, Parents Are Hard To Raise podcast.” Alexa Getting the latest episode is parents so hard to raise. Here it is from my heart radio. Announcer It’s as simple as that. Diane Berardi 16:10 You’re right Dolly. There’s so many really cool new ways to listen to our show. It’s hard to keep track. You can join the 180 million listeners on Spotify. You can listen in your car at the gym, or pretty much anywhere on your smartphone with Apple podcasts and Google podcasts. You can get us on Apple TV, direct tv, Roku. And like Dolly said, you can even ask Alexa to play the show for you. It’s great because you don’t have to be tied to a radio anymore. You can listen when you want where you want for as long as you want. And if you’re listening to the show one of these new ways, please do me a big favor, share this new technology and help someone else learn about the show and show them a new way to listen. Diane Berardi 16:55 So Amos, we were talking about the Medicare drug coverage. region the tears. Unknown Speaker 17:01 Yes. And I apologize to your listeners. That was a very dry presentation. But I think I needed to present that information in order to set the stage for what I really wanted to talk to you about today and that’s that we are presently in what is called an open enrollment period. It’s a time when people can change their coverages. So, let me give you one more piece of dry information and then we’ll get going on the open enrollment. Diane Berardi 17:30 good. The juice, right? The juicy stuff. Okay, go ahead. Amos Goodall, Esq. 17:34 Okay, so when you turn 65, you’re supposed to enroll in Medicare. That’s called the initial enrollment period it begins. It’s a seven month period beginning three months before you turn 65 and ending four months afterwards. Amos Goodall, Esq. 17:50 Now, you should enroll at the beginning of the period. Because if you wait until you’re 65, or you wait until you’re a few days after 65 There will be a gap in your coverage, your old coverage will not cover you. And the new Medicare coverage won’t kick in. So if you but if you enrolled at the very beginning of the open enrollment period, or the initial enrollment period, you can make sure you don’t have any lapse in coverage. Amos Goodall, Esq. 18:16 If you have not done that, if you fail to enroll when you’re supposed to enroll, you can still enroll later, you can enroll in something called a general enrollment period, but that’s only between January 1 and March 31 of each year. And the sanction is, first of all, that you have to enroll during that period. Secondly, that you don’t get coverage until July. And third of all, you’re going to have to pay a penalty. Amos Goodall, Esq. 18:41 Oh my gosh. Amos Goodall, Esq. 18:42 And the penalty for part B, Part A if you’re not going to have to pay for part A there’s no penalty for that. But Part B is 10% for each full year of delay for lifetime. So if you’re five years late, that means you’re going to be 50% more For the rest of your life. Diane Berardi 19:01 Geeze! Amos Goodall, Esq. 19:02 It’s it’s important that folks enroll in Medicare whenever they first can. Now some folks have something called comparable coverage or and that’s coverage, for example through an employer. And if they have that coverage, they can delay enrolling in Medicare as long as that coverages and force when that coverage ends, then their initial enrollment period would begin, or else they would have something called a special enrollment period, which is effectively the same thing. Amos Goodall, Esq. 19:31 Now I want to caution your listeners that Cobra, many folks have heard of Cobra when I lose your job, you can keep your health insurance for several years after that if you pay privately, that is not comparable coverage. And if you have that, you turn 65 and you’re relying on Cobra, you’re going to suffer a penalty later. Amos Goodall, Esq. 19:52 So if you’re enrolled in Medicare when you’re supposed to enroll it during your initial enrollment period or whatever. Amos Goodall, Esq. 19:59 But what’s going on now? What’s going on now is that you’re in the open enrollment period when you’re allowed to change, you can change without penalty. So if you’re in traditional Medicare and you think, well, maybe I want to change my coverage and enroll in Medicare Advantage, and maybe not have to pay for my Medigap insurance anymore. This is the time to do it. This is the time to go on the website and compare the various plans and determine whether a plan that is Medicare Advantage would meet your needs at a better cost or whether you should you feel better staying with a traditional plan. And you can make your decision at that time. In a sense, Medicare Advantage is often like a sometimes like an HMO or sometimes like a preferred provider plan that if you go outside the network, you’re going to have penalties or you’re going to have to pay more. Whereas if you’re in traditional Medicare, you go to any doctor who’s enrolled in the Medicare program and you’re going to have the same benefits as you would anywhere else. So this is the time that you have that you can check to determine whether Should I stay with Medicare? Should I go to Medicare Advantage? Do I want to stay with the Medigap company I have one and maybe consider another Medicare. Amos Goodall, Esq. 21:19 The open enrollment period is now through December the seventh and it’s for coverage which begins January the first so it’s there’s some time constraints. Amos Goodall, Esq. 21:32 The other thing you need to consider is whether you want to change your prescription drug program. You’re going to have to go through that same horrible comparison analysis that I described a few minutes ago to determine whether some other drug program might better suit your needs. After all, your drug program if you have a particular drug that you’re taking. This is the time often that companies prescription companies change their formulary and they may say, Well, we’re not going to offer that drug anymore, or we’re going to move it into a higher tier so that it’s going to be more expensive. And you may, this would be the time when you can change companies without any penalty. Amos Goodall, Esq. 22:14 I’m saying that there is no penalty there is unfortunately one penalty and that’s this. If you go from traditional Medicare the part A and B where you your program is through the government to Medicare Advantage. That’s smooth and seamless. Amos Goodall, Esq. 22:29 If you go the other way, however, that’s also smooth and seamless as far as the medical insurance coverage is concerned, however, for the Medigap for the program that pays for the deductibles and the other things that you want to have some relief from having to pay. They in most that’s regulated by the states and in most states, there are four exceptions, but in most states, there’s a waiting period for the new coverage. If you are, you’re in the hospital and you thought your patient paid portion of the hospital bill was going to be covered by your Medicare Supplement Insurance Company. And it’s within that waiting period, it’s not going to be covered. So there is some disadvantage to transferring between Medicare between Medicare Advantage and going back to traditional Medicare. So I guess the rule would be if you know, you’re going to be sick. I not want to change plans. [laughing] Amos Goodall, Esq. 23:31 Oh my gosh. So, are there a lot of changes coming, you know, down the pike for next year? Unknown Speaker 23:39 Well, there are not a lot of changes for Medicare, the traditional Medicare and traditional Medicare Part A and B, those programs are going to be the same. The only thing that might change is that the cost if you’re being hit with a premium, because you have a summit high income, okay? That cost is going to be going up That seems to be always going up. And they, changed the brackets a little bit. But for most people that cost is at least going to be the same and maybe go up just a little bit. Unknown Speaker 24:12 There are some special help that’s available to folks who are have limited income to pay some of those deductibles. That’s really not what we were going to be talking about today. But in the PowerPoints that I’m going to post on my website, it discusses programs like specified low income beneficiaries, and qualified beneficiaries and some other ones. And those are all some help that people have been paying some of those deductibles. Unknown Speaker 24:39 But as far as Medicare Advantage goes, I’m not aware of any systemic, substantial systemic changes to Medicare Advantage at this time, although companies, their private insurances, right companies have the right to change anything about their plans that they can get past the state insurance commissioners. I believe that there’s a push now to allow the government to negotiate for the cost of prescription drugs. And I’m understanding that that cost savings may be used to provide additional coverage, possibly vision possibly dental under traditional Medicare plans, but I will believe that frankly, when I see it. Diane Berardi 25:24 [laughing] yeah, okay, sure. So this is really overwhelming, right? How does someone know what to do? Unknown Speaker 25:34 Well, there are there are, of course, insurance agents can help with the products that they sell you if you’re when you’re turning 65, your mailbox is going to be filled with advertisements from people wanting you to buy their Medicare Advantage plan. But most the but most states have a statewide office which will help you evaluate those people. plans in Pennsylvania it’s called Aprize. And I’ve I know some of the folks who man the telephones in that office. And they, they are very knowledgeable about the various programs available in Pennsylvania and while they won’t play favorites, that can help you analyze what your needs are, and point you to some of the some of the programs which seem at first blush to fill those needs. I believe that CMS also contains information rating the various companies as far as surveys as to satisfaction so you can take a look at if you’re going to buy from Company A, is it are people happy with it? Or is it is it better? Might you better go to Company B. So there is help available. Of course, I plug for my profession, certified elder lawyers, people who have the CELA credential have been trained and are experienced in advising seniors who were in entering this phase in their lives, and would certainly be a great resource. Diane Berardi 27:05 Definitely, because this is tough. You know, this seems very tough to do on your own knowing what to do. Amos Goodall, Esq. 27:11 It is. I mean, it’s the you have to answer basic questions. Do I want to go with a government program? Do I want to go with a private insurance? Yeah. Once you’ve done that, then which are the private insurance programs and if I’m going to use the government program, which are the Medigap policies, do I want to buy. Getting old is not for people who are faint of heart. That’s for darn sure. Diane Berardi 27:31 Yeah, you’re not kidding. Oh, my gosh. And Amos, if you give us your website again, please. Unknown Speaker 27:38 My website is goodall.org, and there’s a one line in it there are a thing at the top called resources in that in that if you if your readers or listeners will click on that, that button, it will take them to a list of a number of items that I have list have put up there, one of which will be the PowerPoints discussing this Medicare program. I know there will be a discussion of the open enrollment period. And finally, I will have the links that I’ve talked about that allow you to compare plans and determine exactly what’s available in your area. Enter your zip code and there you are. Diane Berardi 28:21 Thank you so much], Amos, for all this information. Oh my gosh. Diane Berardi 28:27 And Parents Are Hard To Raise family. I love getting your emails and questions so please keep sending them You can reach me at Diana Parents Are Hard To Raise.org or just click the green button on our homepage. Parents Are Hard To Raise as a counter sync media production. The music used in this broadcast was managed by Cosmo music, New York, New York. Our New York producer is Joshua Green, our broadcast engineer is Well Gambino, and from our London studios, the melodic voice of our announcer, Miss Dolly D. Till next time, May you forget everything you don’t want to remember and remember everything you don’t want to forget. Thank you so much for listening and Happy Thanksgiving! Downloadable PDF of the Show Transcript Parents-Are-Hard-To-Raise-S03-Episode-137 Listen to this episode… just click play on the player below
Transcribe →Should Doctors Care If We Are Happy? Dr. Sarah Pressman #136
Nov 19, 201900:31:52Tap to summarizeDr. Sarah (Smile) Pressman Listen to this episode… just click play on the player below Here Are Some Handy Links To The People, Products, Books, Services and Resources Discussed On This Episode Dr. Pressman’s TED Talk Take Diane with you... and listen whenever you want, wherever you want, and how often you want, on your smartphone or tablet. It's easy... Just click any of the links below Listen with the iHeart Radio App iPhone Users Click This Link Android Phone Users Click This Link Follow Diane on Social Media Click the Links Below Show Transcript Parents Are Hard To Raise® S03 Episode 128 Transcript Announcer 0:00 The world's becoming a dangerous place for us women. Lipstick bodyguard looks just like an innocent little lipstick, but it'll instantly drop any attacker to his knees so you can get away unharmed. Lipstick bodyguard fear no evil. Get yours today only at lipstickbodyguard.com. Announcer 0:37 Can the simple act of smiling, even when you don't mean it, reduce physical pain, relieve stress and impact our overall health? Find out this week as Diane has an eye opening conversation with smiles expert, Dr. Sarah Pressman. Join 180 million monthly subscribers who can now listen to parents are hard raised on Spotify. Diane Berardi 1:13 Welcome to parents are hard to raise, helping families grow older together without losing their minds. I'm elder care expert Diane Berardi. Diane Berardi 1:23 Should doctors care about our happiness? Scientists call it PA or positive aspect and its effect on our bodies and physical health is nothing short of amazing. My special guest expert this week is here to tell us why. Diane Berardi 1:40 Dr. Sarah Pressman is an associate professor of psychology and social behavior at the University of California Irvine. Her work examines how positive emotions are beneficial for physical health and how they can protect us from the harmful effects of stress in the face of adversity. Dr. Preston's research findings have been published in top psychology journals and featured in media outlets like the New York Times, The Wall Street Journal, and the Colbert Report. Dr. Sarah Pressman, welcome to parents are hard to raise. Dr Sarah Pressman 2:13 Thank you so much for having me. Diane Berardi 2:15 You know, I'm thinking about any doctor that I've ever been gone to. No one ever asked me how happy are you? Right? And I think they would be scared if I said, I'm not. Dr Sarah Pressman 2:31 Well, I mean, I think if you say you're not, the initial thing, they'll do is assume you're depressed, right? Which is a whole different question. Diane Berardi 2:38 Yeah. So why should doctors care about our happiness? Dr Sarah Pressman 2:43 Well, as your introduction so eloquently stated, I mean, I've been doing this work for almost 20 years and many people have been doing it for longer than me. And you know, the connection between feeling more positive, feeling more excited, feeling more happy, and our physical health, it's unquestionable. You know, there's dozens and dozens of studies showing that people who are more positive live, you know, potentially years longer than people who don't. And beyond that, that there's a host of other health benefits, you know, they experience less pain, if we expose them to a cold virus there, you know, 30% less likely to get sick. You know, even things like, Yeah, not even if you put a droplet of cold virus in their nose or flu virus and their nose, they're less likely then they're less happy counterparts to get sick. And, you know, even things like your likelihood of tripping and falling is related to your positive emotions. And so it seems to have a very broad effect on a lot of health in a very real way. Diane Berardi 3:45 So tripping and fulfilling, huh? Dr Sarah Pressman 3:49 Which is definitely relevant to you know, the older listeners are people with older parents. Yeah. And there have been studies done in older samples for precisely that reason. You know, looking at what, you know, what are you know, it's kind of surprising you assume that people took from fall because, you know, it's an accident. But you know how much of that is, you know, their lack of energy or, you know, maybe something about how they view the world around them as they're being conscientious that they're paying attention. And those things may very well be related to positive emotions. Diane Berardi 4:22 Now, why don't doctors relate to this? Dr Sarah Pressman 4:27 It's a great question. And it's something I struggle with. And I go and I try, I've spoken at many medical conferences, to try that talk to them about it. And I think there's a few reasons. I mean, I think first off, a lot of them don't know this literature. You know, I've been in the fields of psychoneuroimmunology for, you know, decades, but they might not even know that that field exists. And so medical curriculum is so overloaded with the biological aspects that they have to learn that there just isn't time to fit these kinds of topics into the curriculum and you know, my own experience having taken some medical school classes is, you know, you might get a couple of points thrown in like, Oh, yeah, stress damages the immune system or disrupts the immune system or depression is related to, you know, your likelihood of surviving heart disease or something like that. But you know, it's even not work is very rarely discussed in the medical curriculum. And then on top of that, you know, the thing that that really happens when I talked to doctors about this is they're like, Well, so what do I do? So I asked my patient, if they're happy, and they tell me that they're not, but they're not depressed? You know, what do I do? And there's no prescription that they can hand out that says, Go be happy? Diane Berardi 5:38 Yeah. Right. Unknown Speaker 5:40 You know, and, you know, there's no pill that they can take that makes them happy. An antidepressant doesn't make you happy. Right? And so I think that's the biggest picture, or the biggest piece that's missing with why they won't care about it is, you know, they don't have a next step to do. Diane Berardi 5:53 And, yeah, we need a next step. Dr Sarah Pressman 5:57 Yeah. And I mean, I think there are companies working on this. Right? So there's a lot of happiness Apps now. And and they're trying to kind of fill that gap, I think where you know, the same way that there's a lot of mindfulness apps right now where they're trying to beep you every day and encourage you to take a moment of calm in a moment of being thoughtful and peaceful. You know, there are happiness apps that do the same thing that try to encourage you to, you know, take a moment and reflect on what you're grateful for. Yeah, take a moment and, you know, try to think about, you know, your goals and strive towards them. So there is there is some movement, but it's that peace between medicine and those apps is lacking, you know, and certainly, there's not a lot of research out there to suggest that using that app has a downstream benefit on how long you live or something. So that piece is definitely missing as well. Diane Berardi 6:46 And I guess, physicians, they separate the mind from the body. Dr Sarah Pressman 6:51 Absolutely. Diane Berardi 6:53 And so they just look at, you know, the external factors of the disease. They don't look at the mind at all. So this is what we have to... gear them [laughing], I know we have to. There's so many, so many shows we've done in so many things, you know, I guess I guess it's the training, right? Dr Sarah Pressman 7:11 It's the training. Unknown Speaker 7:12 I think that's where it has to start. And, you know, there is some movement to try to get doctors. I'm in a society called the American Psychosomatic Society, which is really a group of both psychologists and MDs who do this kind of mind body work. And, you know, they're trying to give medical schools, you know, support and resources to have journal clubs to teach medical students about this and to bring medical students for free. So these kinds of conferences because I think patients want their doctors to know this work and they want them to... You know, when you go to your doctor, and you're convinced that you have an illness, or you're overwhelmingly stressed and you think it's affecting your health and they deny you that you know, and they say, No, no, there's nothing wrong. You know, I think that's very upsetting as a patient and i think that i think Again, I mean, it's that doctors aren't trained about all of the interconnections between mind and body that the psychologists are doing research on. And so it's, it's just a gap in their knowledge and it's affecting patient care. And so I think training is really where it would have to start. But you know, is that the trick is what do you take out to put this in? Or do we make medical training longer? So it's definitely a difficult question. Diane Berardi 8:22 You know, when I think about, you know, the caregiver, you know, with their parents and going to the doctor, and you can just look at them and say, Oh, my gosh, every time they come in, you know, you can see they have things going on that they're deteriorating physically. And so doctors don't ask, you know, Well, at home, what's the situation? or you know, What else what other responsibilities you have or different things like that? I guess they don't realize there's so many things that play into a person's well being Dr Sarah Pressman 9:04 For the caregiver, you mean? Diane Berardi 9:05 Yes. Dr Sarah Pressman 9:06 Absolutely. And I mean, caregivers for psychologists who studies stress, you know, caregivers are one of our go to population to study chronic stress, because, you know, it's just, it affects every single part of your life when you know, your entire world revolves around taking care of this person who is deteriorating, and, you know, we know that, you know, their immune systems don't function as well, they're more likely to have all sorts of health problems because of this chronic stress. But yeah, we don't do that much for them to help make them more resilient. And, you know, it's a it's a very interesting question of whether or not some positive psychology types of interventions would help this population, you know, to help them find those moments of joy, or at least moments of peace while they're facing this chronic stressor. And I would expect it would be really helpful because one of the things that positive emotion seems to do best is help undo the negative effects of stress, you know, so yeah, you know, it's not that it's this magic, you know thing but you know, what it does do and I think this is very intuitive to a lot of people is it's very hard to be extremely stressed and extremely happy at the same time. Diane Berardi 10:11 Right. Dr Sarah Pressman 10:11 You know, one is gonna win. And so what research has shown is that it helps our bodies kind of undo the stress a little bit, you know, to have our heart rates drop to have our stress hormones drop, and that's exactly what caregivers need. I think we'd have to be sensitive to... I mean, this is kind of a trick with a lot of positive psychology researches. You know, I think a lot of people assume that it's “happyology” and we're just telling you to be happy all the time and of course, that's not at all what we're saying, you know, negative emotions are very functional. And certainly, in the in the situation of a caregiver who has chronic stress, we would never expect them to be happy all the time. But if you can just break up some of the negative effects of stress just for to give him a break. You can imagine that that gives their body a chance to kind of go back into homeostasis and you know, do the things that supposed to do you know, positive emotion. For example, has been shown to be really effective at helping you sleep better at night Diane Berardi 11:03 Really? Dr Sarah Pressman 11:05 You know, and it Yeah, in my own work, you know it helps people have higher quality sleep, fall asleep faster, stay asleep longer. And that's exactly what a caregiver needs, right they need yes useful sleep that's undisturbed by all the thoughts of this sort of hassles that are going on in their life. Diane Berardi 11:21 You know, I think of myself when my mom first got sick, and I was, you know, taking her to doctors and I was going up going, I'm like two hours away and running up every weekend and I kept getting sick, I kept getting a cold. And I'm saying why is that? But I guess you know, I mean, when you think about it, and now that she passed now I'm doing the same for my dad. I mean, my dad is not, you know, he's not suffering you know from cancer, but he has his own problems. And so my journey continues as so many caregivers. You know, there's just a never ending... There's no break. And I think I sit there and you know, the middle of the night you don't sleep and you think, Oh my gosh, you know, how do you live your life? And how do you find that peace or that happiness or that relaxation? You know? This would help so many caregivers. And, and happiness, I guess, you know, what is it? It's subjective. Dr Sarah Pressman 12:30 It's highly subjective. And it doesn't have to be haphazard, right? Dr Sarah Pressman 12:33 I mean, there's a lot of different positive emotions. And I think that's something that a lot of people also get confused about when they think you know, when we're saying you have to be happy. We're using happy, you know, more colloquially as a way of talking about positive emotions more broadly, a positive emotions that are good for us can include feeling active and vigorous. That can include feeling excited, it could include feeling peaceful and calm. It can include feeling content, it doesn't have to be slap a smiley face sticker on it. And, um, you know, there's a lot to be said for Eudemonic well being, which is also a big area that's growing in the health literature, which is, you know, having life purpose, or having life meaning, you know, those aren't things that again are like the typical happy face. I mean, you could be you could have one of the hardest, most difficult jobs, but it's giving your life meaning. Diane Berardi 13:22 Yeah. Diane Berardi 13:23 And that's tied to a lot of health benefits as well. And so a lot of the, you know, positive psychology interventions out there are targeted at things like that, you know, it's, you know, trying to help people find meaning in their lives are trying to help them find purpose in their lives or align their goals to, you know, or their their activities to meet their long term goals, which again, does give you that sort of sense of purpose and achievement, that can be related to positive emotions like happiness as well. Diane Berardi 13:53 We're going to continue talking with Dr. Sarah Pressman. But first if you're a woman, or there's a woman in your life, there Something you absolutely need to know. Diane Berardi 14:12 I want to tell you about my friend Katie. Katie is a nurse and she was attacked on her way home from work. She was totally taken by surprise. And although Katie is only 5 feet tall and 106 pounds she was easily able to drop her 6 foot 4, 250-pound attacker to his knees and get away unharmed. Katie wasn't just lucky that day. She was prepared. In her pocketbook, a harmless looking lipstick, which really contained a powerful man stopping aerosol propellant. It's not like it was in our grandmother's day. Today just going to and from work or to the mall can have tragic consequences. The FBI says a violent crime is committed every 15 seconds in the United States. And a forcible rape happens every five minutes. And chances are when something happens, no one will be around to help. 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Announcer 16:08 You're listening to Parents Are Hard To Raise. Now, thanks to you. The number one eldercare talk show on planet earth. Listen to this and other episodes on demand using the iHeart Radio app, iPhone users to listen on Apple podcasts and Android users on Google podcasts. Announcer Want a great new way to listen to the show? Just say, "Alexa. Play, Parents Are Hard To Raise podcast." Alexa Getting the latest episode is parents so hard to raise. Here it is from my heart radio. Announcer It's as simple as that. Diane Berardi 16:42 You're right Dolly. There's so many really cool new ways to listen to our show. It's hard to keep track. You can join the 180 million listeners on Spotify. You can listen in your car at the gym, or pretty much anywhere on your smartphone with Apple podcasts and Google podcasts. You can get us on Apple TV, direct tv, Roku. And like Dolly said, you can even ask Alexa to play the show for you. It's great because you don't have to be tied to a radio anymore. You can listen when you want where you want for as long as you want. And if you're listening to the show one of these new ways, please do me a big favor, share this new technology and help someone else learn about the show and show them a new way to listen. And Parents Are Hard to Raise audience, you know I love getting your feedback and your emails. And I just wanted to thank several of our listeners here. Angela from Marlton, New Jersey… Love, love, love the Senior Bullying show! Actually, I have the show transcript in front of me on my desk, and just had to write you. I am so happy I found you! Keep up the great work! And that senior bullying show was Back in Season 2 Episode #83 in our show archives. Melanie Decker- Director of the Howell Senior Center in Howell Township NJ. Did that show with us. And Molly from Kronoberg, Sweden really got a lot of great information from our show on Parkinson’s with Dr. Neil Hammond and Sarah Jones, and would like to hear more on the subject. And “Dr. George” from Wellington, New Zealand couldn’t say enough great things about the episodes from the Change Foundation in Canada. So thank you so much for sending these emails to us. Diane Berardi 18:41 So, you are the smiles expert. [laughing] Talk to us about you know, Can, the simple act of smiling... Dr Sarah Pressman 18:53 Yeah, and I gotta say that one of the one of the times I was on a radio interview talking about that work they played the song, Sarah Smile. And I couldn't stop laughing for the 10 minutes of the interview. So thank you for not doing that. Diane Berardi 19:06 I'm surprised they did not do that. Dr Sarah Pressman 19:11 And there was no warning and it Yeah, it was it was pretty funny. Dr Sarah Pressman 19:15 Yeah, so smiling is an interesting area. And it's something that I think a lot of people have a hard time believing and it's even a little bit of a controversial area in psychology, believe it or not, but there's Long, long standing beliefs, long, long standing research, that our facial expressions aren't just an outward expression of how we're feeling, but it actually changes how we feel. So this literally dates back to Darwin. Dr Sarah Pressman 19:41 So Darwin said things like, you know, if we, if we conjure up an expression that it changes how we feel, and this work has been done by psychologists for a long time where they do these clever research studies where people think they're doing something else for the research project, you know, they think they are multitasking or they think they're trying out You know, new device with their mouth but what we're actually doing is is tricking them into making some kind of expression you know sometimes that's not smiling. smiling we typically put something in their mouth. there's actually a device now called the smile stick that you put in your mouth to make yourself smile and but then we might also do something like Dr Sarah Pressman 20:19 you know, have you hold a what's it called this thing that you put a golf ball on the little stick Diane Berardi 20:26 The tee? Dr Sarah Pressman 20:27 The tee. You put it between your your your eyes and have you tried to hold it and that activates negative emotion related muscles in your face? Or we study people who have had Botox for the opposite reason because, you know, they can't move certain muscles in their face and not might also affect how they feel. And what we see is that the term you know, the the kind of colloquial thing like fake make it, fake it fake it and you'll feel it. Yeah, you know, fake it till you make it or you know, those kinds of you know, fake it till you feel it expressions, that those are true and that if you have someone you know, actually activating a smile, even if they don't know that they're smiling, that it changes their behavior, it changes their perception, it changes how they feel in a positive way. And vice versa. You know, if we block your ability to, you know, for example, scowl by blocking that muscle that in between your eyebrows that you use, kind of it's called the Currugator muscle, it's your frown muscle, you know, if you block that with Botox, that those people don't actually perceive negative emotions in the same way and don't respond to negative emotions the same way so there's actually a lot of clinical trials going on right now using that as a potential treatment for depression. So this research is you know, long standing it's a huge area and you know, my my perspective on it, my interest in it has really been in not so much the emotion side of you know, I don't really believe that. Well, maybe I mean, there's a if you ever heard that this is dating me, but I used to watch Ally McBeal and they used to talk about like smile therapy and like Ally would have to walk around with a smile on her face all day. You know, I don't think there's any good evidence that that would work. And you know, we know that when people are in customer service jobs where they are forced to smile all day that can actually lead to like the opposite effect on your mood. But what I do think it can be useful for is the same thing that we were talking about before with the caregivers and the positive emotions kind of breaking a negative emotion giving you a break from it, giving you kind of a rest from your stress. I feel like smiling is kind of ideally suited in that situation where, you know, if we're sitting in traffic and we're scowling, or we're sitting over some really hard work and just really angry about it, and then we like take a break for a minute and just like put on a really cheesy, big smile. That is we're going to look and same to our friends especially if we're in an open office space. You know, for the people driving next to us on the highway. But you know it what we've seen in our lab is that something about doing that is sending a message back to your brain and back to your body. You're actually happy you're not stressed. And so we don't need to have those high levels of heart rate activity and high blood pressure, we can kind of reduce that because you're not actually in danger, you're not actually under threat. And so, you know, in our work, what we've done is we've shown that if you have your hand in a bucket of ice water, which is a very painful task, if you're doing like a really difficult dexterity task that's impossible and frustrating, or even if you're getting a needle, that if we just make you smile, even if you don't know that you're smiling, that we can improve how quickly you recover from that pain. And we can actually or that stress, and we can actually make needles hurt about 40% less by having you simply smile while you're doing it. Diane Berardi 23:45 It's amazing. Dr Sarah Pressman 23:47 I will say not all smiles are made equally. So there are actually lots and lots of different kinds of smiles, you know, their smiles of pain and discomfort and embarrassment, right? So the smiles that are most Effective or what we call Duchenne smiles named after one of the earliest researchers on this topic, but essentially it's when you smile when someone smiles at you and you can really tell it sincere is when their eyes are activated as well. So you get like the crow's feet around your eyes and kind of around your eyes. That plus the you know, typical, you know, teeth, cheek raised kind of, you know, smile, that that's how you can tell it sincere as if their eyes are involved in it. You know, it's not this Starbucks barista kind of smile, where it's just their mouth. They're like, Yeah, get out of here. You're you're holding up the line kind of smile. Diane Berardi 24:35 Wow. Yeah. When you think about it, yeah, you that is a great way to tell and we're would you get those smile sticks? [laughing] Dr Sarah Pressman 24:46 Google it, you'll find it. They have a website for it. Dr Sarah Pressman 24:49 So yeah, we actually did a research study with a smile stick company. You know, their hope was to kind of, you know, in our research studies, what we, what we commonly use is just like an old pen or a pair of chopsticks like it's not the most sanitary, you know thing to do. I mean, obviously, we throw away the chopsticks and get a new pair [laughing] But, you know, it's not like the kind of thing where it's like, you're going to give this to your mom and be like, Hey, hold these. But if you had a device that said smile stick and you said, Hey, hold this in your mouth while you get a needle. Like that seems a little bit more appealing and so and the smile stick absolutely works just as well as you know, chopsticks or pens or whatever. Diane Berardi 25:23 I would like to give them out this Christmas. [laughing] to spme people Actually, Announcer 25:30 Excellent. [laughing] We'll get it on Oprah's must, must buy gift list this year. Diane Berardi 25:37 That's right. Oh my gosh. I guess there's a company that invented them. Right? Now what about if you go to your doctor and you know, let's say then you see the nurse first and she's smiling. You know, talking to you, taking down information. Is that... would a person tend to be more relaxed and smile? Because, you know, that other person is doing that. And it's... Dr Sarah Pressman 26:13 Whether or not smiles are contagious? Diane Berardi 26:15 Yeah. Dr Sarah Pressman 26:15 Absolutely they are. I mean, it's one of the most fundamental human reflexes, right? I mean, the one so when we study emotion and in psychology, you know, a lot of the time we're kind of thinking in the back of our heads. Okay, well, what is the evolutionary function for this? You know, why would smiling? Why would we smile, right? Like, right, what's the point of it? And so the the best guesss, I mean, it's hard to prove any evolutionary theory. But the best guess, is that smiling is something that is easy to see from far away, to tell another person that you're not a threat, you know, and then it would be adaptive if we had this kind of contagious ability for us to kind of signal from far away. Oh, you know, this is someone who I can gather with, potentially mate with I mean, who knows, right? Diane Berardi 27:00 Right. [laughing] Dr Sarah Pressman 27:01 And so you know, to have that, you know, both be easy to see, and to have it be contagious so that we do it back with each other. And then on top of that, to also have that concomitant sort of reduction in our arousal so that we're calm and we're not, you know, about to attack this person, right? smiling is having this relaxing effect on the body. It's enabling us to make these social connections that were essential to human survival. And so, you know, that's why you do see that most of the time. I mean, obviously, there's huge cultural variation and smiling. Yeah, you know, some countries are actually very smile averse, very happiness averse. There's actually a fear of happiness scale, where certain countries see it as kind of a sign of foolishness or a sign of, you know, sinfulness or something like that. And so they they really don't like smiling and I think the really interesting unanswered question is, so if they smile, would we see the same stress effects for example, you know, if even if they hate smiling, And so we don't really know the answer to that. Yeah. But fortunately, you know, smiling is, you know, there's lots of cross cultural research around the world that shows that is this universal expression of positive emotion. And to that, to the extent that that's true, we would expect that it would be helpful, you know, and and, you know, stress reducing for everyone. Diane Berardi 28:19 Yeah, I think about you know, caregivers whether, you know, you're taking care of your parent or you work, you know, as a caregiver and thinking, you know, if you smile and approaching a patient, you know, how that would relax them and maybe help them smile, you know. Dr Sarah Pressman 28:42 Absoutely. Yeah. I mean, to make, you know, I mean, the doctor patient relationship, the caregiver patient relationship to that extent to I mean, it's so important, right? And, you know, often it's just kind of rushed, and professional and there is it time to be nice, and that's something that takes no time at all. And absolutely, I think That, you know, having, you know, even just having doctors trained to kind of smile at people more could potentially reduce a little bit of stress in the medical establishment. I mean, we know that people get white coat hypertension. Diane Berardi 29:11 Right, yeah. Dr Sarah Pressman 29:12 You know, where their blood pressure goes up just by seeing a doctor. And, you know, maybe if the doctor was more positive and more smiley, and friendly that they would, you know, reduce that. And I think, you know, honestly, I think nurses get this a lot, you know, because they're the ones who spend more time with the patients. I think they're doing it intuitively, to a great degree, you know, even without necessarily knowing the research just because they see that it helps. And, you know, from the perspective of caregiving as well, I mean, my own experience, my grandmother had very serious dementia, and, you know, didn't know who I was right? If I smiled at her, she would smile back, you know, and she got that positive emotion and that contagion of emotion was still there, even to the end. And so, I feel like that is such a simple, positive behavior that actually can have a physiological benefit and an emotional benefit. Diane Berardi 29:57 Oh, most definitely. Yeah. Now how can people find out about your research? Dr Sarah Pressman 30:04 They can Google me and I have a TED talk on why doctors should care about happiness. And I have a website as well. You know, again, if they just google Sarah Pressman at https://sarahpressman.wixsite.com and they can read a lot of my papers you know for free there and learn a little bit about it and see the link to the the TED talk as well. And also I looked it up just so that you have it for your Christmas list or your Hanukkah list or whatever. list It's thepowerofsmiling.com is where you buy smile sticks. [lauging] Diane Berardi 30:41 [laughing] This is great... Thank you so much! [laughing] Dr Sarah Pressman 30:44 I don't wanna I don't want you to miss out on that opportunity. Because I think that's like it sounds like a great idea. Diane Berardi 30:49 It is a great idea. I know. Thank you so much, Sarah, for being here today. Diane Berardi 30:55 Absolutely. And I also just wanted to say it's national or international random act of kindness day so go out and do some nice things for other people and that'll raise their positive emotions. Diane Berardi 31:05 Oh, that's wonderful. Diane Berardi 31:07 And parents are hard to raise family. I love getting your emails and questions so please keep sending them You can reach me at Diana parents are hard to raise.org or just click the green button on our homepage. Parents are hard to raise as a counter sync media production. The music used in this broadcast was managed by Cosmo music, New York, New York. Our New York producer is Joshua Green, our broadcast engineer is Well Gambino, and from our London studios, the melodic voice of our announcer, Miss Dolly D. Diane Berardi 31:34 Thank you so much for listening. Till next time, may you forget everything you don't want to remember. And remember everything you don't want to forget. See you again next week. Downloadable PDF of the Show Transcript Parents-Are-Hard-To-Raise-S03-Episode-128 Listen to this episode... just click play on the player below
Transcribe →What you don’t know about Parkinson’s Disease Early Detection- Neil Hermanowicz, MD and Sarah Jones #130
Nov 5, 201900:30:31Tap to summarizeWhat You Don’t Know About Parkinson’s Disease Early Detection Listen to this episode… just click play on the player below Here Are Some Handy Links To The People, Products, Books, Services and Resources Discussed On This Episode Take Diane with you... and listen whenever you want, wherever you want, and how often you want, on your smartphone or tablet. It's easy... Just click any of the links below Listen with the iHeart Radio App iPhone Users Click This Link Android Phone Users Click This Link Follow Diane on Social Media Click the Links Below Show Transcript Parents Are Hard To Raise® S03 Episode 135 Transcript Announcer 0:00 The world's becoming a dangerous place for us women. Lipstick bodyguard looks just like an innocent little lipstick, but it'll instantly drop any attacker to his knees so you can get away unharmed. Lipstick bodyguard fear no evil Get yours today only at LipstickBodyguard.com. Announcer 0:37 This week on Parents Are Hard To Raise. Diane discusses Parkinson's disease with two renowned experts from the University of California Irvine, Dr. Neil Hermanowicz of University of California, Irvine And Sarah Jones, director of the Parkinson's and Movement Disorder Alliance here in the US. Announcer 0:57 Join 180 million monthly subscribers. He can now listen to Parents Are Hard To Raise on Spotify. Diane Berardi 1:15 Welcome to Parents Are Hard To Raise, helping families grow older together without losing their minds. I'm elder care expert Diane Berardi. Diane Berardi 1:24 For over three seasons now I've made it a point to ask you, our Parents Are Hard To Raise worldwide family, for input on what topics you would like to hear covered on the show. And nearing the very top of the list for some time has been Parkinson's disease, which is why I'm so pleased to have with us this week, two of the most preeminent experts on the subject, Dr. Neil Hermanowicz and Sarah Jones. Diane Berardi 1:50 Dr. Hermanowicz...[laughing] they're laughing at me already because I got your name pronounced right. Dr. Neil Hermanowicz 1:56 You got it right. Sarah Jones 1:58 You win the Bet Diane Berardi 1:58 I do. Diane Berardi 2:00 Dr. Hermanowicz is a professor of neurology, director of the movement disorders program and Vice Chair of the Department of Neurology at the University of California, Irvine. He earned his medical degree at Temple University School of Medicine, and has spent his time split between patient care, clinical research and education, which is likely why he has been recognized as one of the best doctors in America by US News. Sarah Jones is the chief executive officer of the Parkinson's and movement disorder Alliance based here in the US. Under Sarah's direction, the Alliance just published the findings of an extensive caregivers survey on the negative impact of non-mobility related symptoms on the lives of family caregivers, the findings of which I'm hoping to learn more about. Neil and Sarah, welcome to Parents Are Hard To Raise. Dr. Neil Hermanowicz 2:56 Thank you very much. Happy to be here. Sarah Jones 2:58 Thank you. Unknown Speaker 2:59 So When people hear Parkinson's disease, most are familiar with the physical symptoms, the tremors, the rigidity, the moving slow. But what many people may not be aware of are the many non movement symptoms. Could you describe what some of those are? Dr. Neil Hermanowicz 3:21 Sure. I'll go first, Sarah and you can great jump in if you like at anytime. So, the the non motor or non mobility symptoms are unfortunately pretty common. And may in fact be some of the earliest symptoms that people experienced. And that's been documented, studied and has given us a window on and looking at how Parkinson's may begin, and some people how and how it can evolve over time. So some of the earliest non motor symptoms can include sleep disturbance, something called REM sleep behavior disorder where people act out their dreams. Dr. Neil Hermanowicz 3:54 Normally when we're asleep and dreaming our brains are disconnected from most of our muscles but in people with Parkinson's disease or early Parkinson's, that disconnects which may not work and people will be swinging their arms or screaming and they're asleep for example. Dr. Neil Hermanowicz 4:09 Other, another non motor symptom could be gastrointestinal dysfunction. People may have constipation or less frequent bowel movements. There's something called gastroparesis. Dr. Neil Hermanowicz 4:21 Another one which people sometimes describe or when asked is impaired sense of smell. Loss or impair sense of smell, which can proceed the appearance of the motor things that you described by a decade or more. Dr. Neil Hermanowicz 4:36 So long list of other things that my patients described to me that are well known to people with Parkinson's disease including cognitive changes, memory difficulties, sometimes occasionally, hallucinations, for example, or delusional thoughts, bladder problems bowel problems can also occur, even skin problems. People often don't recognize that that could be common manifestation of Parkinson's as well. Skin rashes and even a nasty skin cancer called malignant melanoma. Diane Berardi 5:12 So if you know if you're a child of an aging parent, you know, in your, maybe your mom or dad, I guess wake up, you know, swinging their arms or, you know, having these cognitive changes I you wouldn't imagine Parkinson's? Dr. Neil Hermanowicz 5:32 That's correct. Dr. Neil Hermanowicz 5:34 That doesn't occur to people and I think it may be bewildering and people think it may be just a normal process. Yeah, Dr. Neil Hermanowicz 5:42 it is actually it was studied some years ago, initially by a group in Minneapolis, Carlos shake and his colleagues they followed people who made this entity called REM sleep behavior disorder and follow men primarily over time and increase percentage of these people who had this sleep behavior showed signs of Parkinson ism. So I'm not saying that everybody who has is will get Parkinson's disease but it has gotten attention as a possible early indicator that something is brewing. Unknown Speaker 6:16 This these symptoms, what impact would they have on you know, the poor person and their caregiver? Unknown Speaker 6:25 That's a good point. Because there have been instances where people they awaken their bed partner, for example, by their, by their motions or by their vocalizing. I've had patients or the spouses of patients tell me and I'm afraid the neighbors are going to call the police because people are screaming in their dreams. And there have been examples of bed partners being injured by the person you're sleeping beside. Somebody swinging a fist and unintentionally punching somebody in the nose. For example, that has been known to occur. Dr. Neil Hermanowicz 7:06 One of my patients some years ago, took a solo for he took a flight from California to New York City to for family events. And he went by himself, which was probably not a great idea. And on that flight he fell asleep was awakened to find a group of people standing around him as his seat because apparently he had been screaming in his sleep while he was on the plane. Sarah Jones 7:34 Yeah, and if they don't have if they don't have a movement disorder specialist, a neurologist who has advanced training, in Parkinson disease or movement disorders, this may not even come up in a conversation with a physician. And it's one of those places that, you know, people are embarrassed to ask questions, they don't understand what's happening. And so, you know, to Dr. Hermanowicz point this is a high Risk place for care partners and spouses but not necessarily something that comes to the surface until, you know, pretty far into the disease which is what's great to have the awareness out there so people can bring it up to their physicians. Diane Berardi 8:16 Oh, yeah, definitely. Dr. Neil Hermanowicz 8:17 And moreover it's treatable there are things that can be done to to reduce the likelihood or be completely eliminated are things that are used sometimes even something as simple as melatonin there's a medication called clonazepam, Klonopin, which is often a pretty effective in reducing the sleep emerging behaviors. Unknown Speaker 8:40 So someone having you know, the symptoms. I would imagine they probably would just go to their regular physician they wouldn't you know... Dr. Neil Hermanowicz 8:52 Well, that's another good point. Unknown Speaker 8:55 First I it's hard to find these people who are having this this isolated with called REM sleep behaviors. So they don't usually find their way to me. Every once in a great while they do. And I have such a person in my practice right now, who was referred to me by a sleep specialist which has occurred in the past, also. Recognizing how they've got REM sleep behavior disorder, perhaps they've had a formal sleep study, and it was identified and confirmed that they've got REM sleep behavior disorder. So some physicians and this patient was actually referred by the I believe the director of our sleep program here at the university because she knows that that connection between REM sleep behavior disorder and Parkinson's disease. Now that person who I who was referred to me does not have any motor manifestations of Parkinson's disease, that the patient is well informed it by reading on the internet, there's a lot of information that one can get access to. Although there are the diagnosis Parkinson's at this time is really largely dependent on motor findings which this person does not have. Dr. Neil Hermanowicz 10:06 Another interesting point though, so when this patient came to see me, I did a formal test for his sense of smell. As I mentioned, that also can be very early, non motor manifestations of Parkinson's disease. And the formal test, which is called the University of Pennsylvania smell identification test are UPSIT. He did not perform well actually, I think his I recall, he was below the 10th percentile, for somebody of his gender, a man of his age. So there were a couple of things. Now they're raising some concern, but still not a confirmation or consistencies. Sarah Jones 10:45 But, you know, thinking about raising your, you know, Parents Are Hard To Raise, thinking about parents. I mean, these are the kinds of things that I think for adult children to know to be able to ask those questions. If you just do something that's maybe a little odd like to even recognize it. What What is it Dr. Hermanowicz, about 25% of people don't have any tremor? Dr. Neil Hermanowicz 11:06 That's right. Sarah Jones 11:07 Yeah, so it's significant. But if you ask the questions, you know, you might surface the REM sleep disorder or hallucinations or delusions, some of the other things that people just don't talk about before they are there. They're physically risky, and they're also just exhausting for people living with this. Diane Berardi 11:27 Sure. How aware are physicians about... Dr. Neil Hermanowicz 11:31 About these connections? Diane Berardi 11:32 Yeah, about these connections? Dr. Neil Hermanowicz 11:34 I think it's getting better. Dr. Neil Hermanowicz 11:37 I think in patients, also they will, they will sometimes bring these things up. Because if there's been some question about what's walking has changed, and maybe they do have a tremor perhaps not. But they're having symptoms of maybe some subtle slowness, then people are on the internet and exploring these things may be going to Sarah site and finally information then. So more and more. Certainly compared to early in my career, which was when I started prior to the existence of the internet and access to all this information, more and more people, patients themselves are becoming aware and I think with them physicians, including primary care physicians as well. Sarah Jones 12:21 Yep. And, and I think to that point, too people are beginning to understand that there's treatments for it, right. I mean, there's, the treatments are relatively new in the last few years for some of these, some of these complications for Parkinson's and some of the challenging symptoms and it's nice to be able to have people recognize that there is some hope out there and they address some even if there's not a cure for the disease. There are some ways to potentially mitigate some of these symptoms. Dr. Neil Hermanowicz 12:53 I think Sarah makes a good point because sometimes we know that in the past people would, it's been published has been studied, People would be visiting a variety of doctors for on average, two years with symptoms that they couldn't... that were troubling to them, but they didn't quite understand what they were coming from. But as as the knowledge about early manifestations of Parkinson's and these non motor things are increasingly identified, I think people arriving at an answer, I hope, I suspect they're arriving at an answer to what's going on what it isn't that Parkinson disease earlier than they used to, which is a good thing. I mean, it's not good. It's not happy news to hear that one has Parkinson’s disease, but I'm thinking of a patient who I still see and she was relieved to learn that she had Parkinson's because she thought she had something called ALS or Lou Gehrig's disease which is much worse. So just knowing what it is that one is dealing with can at least bring some peace of mind, although again, it's not a happy diagnosis to hear.. Sarah Jones 13:55 Yeah. Diane Berardi 13:57 Is the patient aware if they are having delusions or hallucinations? Dr. Neil Hermanowicz 14:04 Sometimes they are. I've been hearing these kinds of symptoms pretty much throughout my career they've been getting increasing attention in more recent years. They're mentioning that there was a more specific medication developed for exactly for those symptoms. Dr. Neil Hermanowicz 14:24 When they first occur, people may realize so that that cat that I see in the corner is not actually there or the child that I think is sitting on the sofa doesn't really make sense. So there can be insight, retained and for some time that people realize that that's not really true. Really, people have a sense of there might be somebody standing beside them and they look at as there's nobody there. So, when people are having delusions, I should say hallucinations. hallucinations are usually visual that they may be auditory or other senses involved as well, typically at the onset. They're their visual. People do know, at least for a while, this is not correct. But as time goes by that insight can oftentimes not be present and people start thinking, well, there actually is a stranger in my bathroom at night. Sarah Jones 15:21 They don't always tell their care partner or their loved ones, either. Diane Berardi 15:23 Right. I was gonna say they probably don't. Diane Berardi 15:28 We're going to continue talking with Dr. Neil and Sarah Jones. But first, if you're a woman, or there's a woman in your life, there's something you absolutely need to know. Diane Berardi 15:48 I want to tell you about my friend Katie. Katie is a nurse and she was attacked on her way home from work. She was totally taken by surprise. 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Just say, "Alexa. Play, Parents Are Hard To Raise podcast." Alexa 18:20 Getting the latest episode of parents so hard to raise. Here it is from iHeart Radio. Announcer 18:25 It's as simple as that. Diane Berardi 18:27 You're right Dolly. There are so many really cool new ways to listen to our show. It's hard to keep track. You can join the one hundred and eighty million listener is on Spotify. You can listen in your car, at the gym, or pretty much anywhere on your smartphone with Apple podcasts and Google podcasts. You can get us an Apple TV, DirecTV, Roku. And like Dolly said, you can even ask Alexa to play the show for you. It's great, because you don't have to be tied to a radio anymore. You can listen when you want, where you want, for as long as you want. And if you're listening to the show one of these new ways, please do me a big favor... Share this new technology. Help someone else learn about the show and show them a new way to listen. Diane Berardi 19:11 So, Sarah, where can our listeners learn more about this study and the results? Sarah Jones 19:19 You know, we have, if you visit our website www.PMDAlliance.org, we have a page that has all the information about this study, and a link to the actual research findings, as well as some additional information that people might want to read about to learn more about the different things we've been talking about, whether it's hallucinations or delusions or sleep disorders. And then we also have a link to our YouTube channel which has extensive video. I think we have about 70 educational videos on there with different physicians like that. Dr. Hermanowicz and Yep, so any of those, and then also, specifically for adult children, we have a private Facebook group, just for adult children of people with Parkinson's and other movement disorders so that they can have conversations about the different challenges they're having, navigating, supporting, you know, the parent who's the care partner as well as the person with the disease. Diane Berardi 20:26 Right? Okay. That's wonderful. Because I can't even imagine you know, day to day life and the quality of life for the people with the disorder and their caregivers. Sarah Jones 20:43 Yeah, we like to say, you know, it's really we say it's an equal opportunity disease that everyone in the family has Parkinson's. Nobody really gets to escape it. Everybody just has a different manifestation of it. So if you're this the care partner you're living with it too. It's just a little bit different. And as an adult child, and I think you're, you're navigating that too. My father in law had Parkinson's and, boy, we kept trying to help and support navigating, you know, that journey and understanding what was going on and has a different way that this shows up. I mean, boy, Dr. Hermanowicz, there's got to be, there's dozens of symptoms. And so no two people have exactly the same way that this shows up in life. Dr. Neil Hermanowicz 21:37 That's one of the challenges of both making diagnosis in the first place because different forms as Sarah mentioned, not everybody has tremor with Parkinson's disease. So it can be tricky, including for people who focus on this. It's not a simple diagnosis, to be confident of, in all cases. And in the course, how it may change over time, and the kind of symptoms that people developed a little can vary greatly from one person to another. As the hallucination example, it's pretty common and there's some studies indicate that 50% of more people Parkinson's may have it at some point, but you know, 50% or so don't. Some people may have other issues like very troubling GI symptoms or problems with your bladder or sleep issues that other people don't go through. So it does have a wide variety of this presentation of how it can be troubling to people. Diane Berardi 22:35 I had a client who was diagnosed with Parkinson's disease, but you know, when I think about it, she also had intestinal problems. She had constipation all the time. And she had some cognitive changes. And I remember her caregiver saying to me at one time, she said, she looked at me it was kind of like she was just staring but she wasn't there. And she said to me, you're the devil, you know. And, and... but she was going to all kinds of different doctors, you know. And I don't believe they were kind of connecting some of those symptoms to be part of the Parkinson's disorder. Dr. Neil Hermanowicz 23:24 I think it wasn't so much recognized some years past but I think increasingly, again, thanks to educational efforts like Sarah's organization, people understand this is not something unusual necessarily with Parkinson's disease. This is something that can occur and as Sarah mentioned, to this day, unfortunately people the person who has Parkinson's disease or care partner, they may not bring it up when they come to see their provider, physician, nurse practitioner, etc. And unfortunately, the physician or their provider may not ask about it. I think that behavior is changing. I certainly hope it that this is because if it's not recognize that can be troubling. In years past I had patients who called the police even not that long ago, somebody just saw recently had a few years ago called the police when his wife was, was gone for a while, thinking that somebody was trying to break in and harm him. So that it's not recognized that dealt with these kinds of symptoms can be very troubling. Diane Berardi 24:27 Yeah. Well, we reach millions in 169 countries and physicians around the world. We want to make them aware as well as caregivers, and patients themselves. So what's the best way and what kind of support can we give people with Parkinson's and their families? Dr. Neil Hermanowicz 24:54 Sarah, go ahead. Sarah Jones 24:55 Well, I you know, I'm thinking about one of the most important things is actually seeing a doctor who has expertise in this. So movement disorder specialist, which is like what Dr. Hermanowicz is, that's a specific practice. And it's actually a neurologist with advanced training and movement disorders. So it's, it's a specialist of a specialist. And, you know, that's something that people don't even know it's out there. Diane Berardi 25:19 Right. And we have, you know, we're not just in the US, we have 169 countries, so that might be... Sarah Jones 25:28 And there's movement disorder physicians all over the world. And, you know, actually on our website, we have a link to the movement disorder society which has an up to date listing of all of the movements sort of specialists across the world to address that. And there's something interesting about this disease and I don't know if it's synchronicity or the fact that people tend when they're diagnosed I'm not sure what the reason is, but we find people who will not always seek out the [specialist]. And that's important. Even if it's once a year. We tell people you're not cheating on your doctor to go see a specialist. Diane Berardi 26:04 Right. Yeah. You find people, people do fear that. Yeah, I don't know what it is. Sarah Jones 26:12 Yeah. And I think too, sometimes we don't think about, you know, I'm curious what you think about this Dr. Hermanowicz that sometimes adult children or care partners might see something that the person with Parkinson's may or may not see just because of perhaps where they're at in their disease process. Sarah Jones 26:31 But you can always share that information with a doctor even if they can't reply back to you they least have that information from you. Information can always go the one way. Correct? Dr. Neil Hermanowicz 26:42 Correct and what as you bring them up, one example of that I almost hate to mention, but it's important one is driving. people with Parkinson's disease has been studied and published in medical journals do have an increased risk of having an accident. And I have very, very few people in my practice people who are coping with Parkinson's disease who themselves and said, You know, I recognize my driving is not what it should be. I'm just going to stop. Family members may recognize that and often do but have some reluctance about intervening in something that's regarded as so important in terms of one's independence and identity. But, it is something that's the kind of information it's another topic. That's, that's not pleasant to touch on. But I do it on a regular basis in my practice, because the stakes are just so high. I mean, even in short trips close to home, people could get into something serious, it could have lasting repercussions. So it's, it's, it's good to have. Dr. Neil Hermanowicz 27:45 I'm always disappointed it's so one of my patients shows up without anybody with him, a spouse or family member that can help share, you know, the visit. And understand what's being the information that's being exchanged. And it also provides an outside and somebody providing additional information about how things were going. Diane Berardi 28:05 Yeah, sure. Dr. Neil Hermanowicz 28:05 I want to go want to go back to one something that Sarah had touched on or that was brought up about in terms of how does one cope with these things that we want to see a movement sort of specialist which they're hard to find in some parts of the world even some parts of California Southern California, it's not easy that access despite the density of physicians here. but I think another way that people learn how to deal with this diagnosis is attending educational programs. I've gone to several that Sarah's organization has sponsored and there was always a good turnout and these are opportunities for people to exchange information who are not just from whoever speaking but also from one another and you know coping methods or do you do you do do have you experienced this was this happened to you? And also learning about the developments in the field. It's going through these programs and sharing information among other people. I was involved with a program in of all places Iceland, which is my wife's home country. And the turnout was immense. I mean it was there was such an eagerness for knowledge and that relatively small country but it came over very well. And I'm hoping that this continuing in Iceland with the with a specialist were there. Diane Berardi 29:27 Well, the work you you're both doing, you know, I'm bringing this to light bringing all this information, the studies and again, Sarah, your website, www.PMDAlliance.org. Diane Berardi 29:44 Thank you so much for listening. Parents Are Hard To Raise family, I love getting your emails and questions so please keep sending them. You can reach me at Diane at ParentsAreHardToRaise.org or just click the green button on our homepage. Parents Are Hard To Raise is a CounterThink Media production. The Music used in this broadcast was managed by Cosmo Music, New York, New York. Our New York producer is Joshua green. Our broadcast engineer is Well Gambino. And from our London studios, the melodic voice of our announcer Miss Dolly D. Thank you so much for listening. Till next time, may you forget everything you don't want to remember, And remember everything you don't want to forget. See you again next week. Downloadable PDF of the Show Transcript Parents-Are-Hard-To-Raise-S03-Episode-135 Listen to this episode... just click play on the player below
Transcribe →The Dirty Little Secret Probate Courts Hope you Never Find Out- Investigative reporter Gretchen Hammond – Episode #134
Oct 29, 201900:32:41Tap to summarizeListen to this episode… just click play on the player below Here Are Some Handy Links To The People, Products, Books, Services and Resources Discussed On This Episode Take Diane with you... and listen whenever you want, wherever you want, and how often you want, on your smartphone or tablet. It's easy... Just click any of the links below Listen with the iHeart Radio App iPhone Users Click This Link Android Phone Users Click This Link Follow Diane on Social Media Click the Links Below Show Transcript Parents Are Hard To Raise® S03 Episode 134 Transcript The world's becoming a dangerous place for us women. Lipstick bodyguard looks just like an innocent little lipstick, but it'll instantly drop any attacker to his knees so you can get away unharmed. Lipstick bodyguard. Fear no evil. Get yours today only at lipstickbodyguard.com. Announcer 0:00 This week on Parents Are Hard To Raise. Diane's special guest, award winning investigative reporter, Gretchen Hammond, pulls back the curtain to reveal the grisly truth about a shady practice the court systems don't want you to know about and how your parents are at risk of losing everything. Join 180 million monthly subscribers you can now listen to Parents Are Hard To Raise on Spotify. Diane Berardi 1:15 Welcome to Parents Are Hard To Raise, helping families grow older together without losing their minds. I'm elder care expert, Diane Berardi. It's been called a civil death for those who fall prey to it. The proper name is guardianship. It's an arcane system rooted in medieval English law. And it's running amok in modern day America. When a person, say your aging parent, is unable to manage his or her own affairs, he or she may be deemed incompetent by a judge, who by the way, doesn't even have to meet your aging parent face to face or even inform them or you that a judgment is taking place. When this happens, the court often applies points a professional Guardian, a perfect stranger to take control over every aspect of their life, effectively stripping your parent of their identity and their property. Instantly your parent now deemed a legally incapacitated Ward becomes a non person. As a result, they lose control over every decision and aspect of their life. Meaning they can now be told where they will live, where they may or may not go, who they are and are not allowed to see and what they are are not allowed to eat, access to their homes, mail, bank accounts, retirement and Social Security income, Life and Health Insurance, wills trusts property, even their passports, driver's licenses, and voter registration cards are all taken away and put into the control of their court appointed guardian. In as little as a year you're aging parent could be rendered completely indigent; their homes are gone, as are their savings and investment accounts, cars, personal belongings, keepsakes, heirlooms, jewelry, and even their clothing. How can this possibly happen in 21st century America? Here to tell us is award winning investigative reporter Gretchen Hammond, who wrote an amazingly candid five part expose' series entitled "The Fortress," which ripped the top of America's closely guarded probate system, revealing the shocking truths inside. Gretchen Hammond, welcome to Parents Are Hard To Raise Gretchen Hammond 3:39 It's a pleasure to be here. Diane, thanks very much for inviting me on. Diane Berardi 3:44 You know, I want to ask you, how can this possibly happen in 21st century America? Gretchen Hammond 3:50 You've got me. I tell you, when I first heard of this, I had never heard of guardianship before. And I was writing for a Jewish publication at the time. And there was a book written by a Jewish author by name of Dr. Sam sugar. And I read it and I was just doing a feature on it. And I was reading it. I'm just reading it absolutely. My God struck. I mean, my mouth dropping open. This doesn't happen in the United States, what people taken from their homes, I mean, no constitutional rights, all the constitutional rights strip, this does not happen. And, you know, I went ahead and wrote the 700-word feature on it, and I sent it off to my editor, he was the same way he goes, this doesn't happen. This is this is nonsense. It's absolute nonsense. He can go back and find me some examples if you're absolutely sure that this is real. And it's not some sort of, you know, conspiracy theory. And so I went back and I found some contacts now, and the first one I found was her son in Michigan, a woman named Mimi Brown, whose mother had been taken from her and placed on the guardianship because of the past you Bill owed to a nursing facility, and she was stripped of all his civil rights. She was virtually imprisoned inside of this now. facility isolated from her daughter and it took her daughter two years to free her and goodness knows how much in court costs and emotional damage and financial damage. And after I published a story in June of 2018, I got calls from all across Michigan. This was this happened in the Oakland County Probate Court, which is a suburb of Detroit. You know, it's another court, one of the wealthiest suburbs in Detroit, but it's sort of a mixed bag of areas where the probate court is located is one of the poorest areas in Pontiac, Michigan. But I got calls from across the state but mostly focused in Oakland County saying, you know, you should have heard my story you should have heard my story. So it led me to believe that that obviously something systemic was happening there. And so, in July of 2018, I set out on a self funded investigation to figure out whether anything systemic was happening there, and eventually I was able to bring on 300 researchers from Wayne State University as well as Tim Mulholland, who is a certified fraud examiner, and he was based in Chicago. And between all of us, we dug into 2278 separate cases. All of them filed I should know by outside agencies that is Adult Protective Services, social workers in hospitals, attorneys from hospitals, even cases filed by accounts receivables managers from nursing homes, like I mean, all these bizarre petitions for guardianship. And we were seeing reasons that were just I mean, outrageous Diane and things like bipolar, altered mental state, I have no idea what that what that means. [laughing] They will be placed on the guardianship. We found families that have been placed under guardianship, husbands and wives who've been placed on the guardianship at the same time. Sisters. Durable power of attorney, medical powers of attorney. They tell you in the United States, you know you've got to get those forms right settled as part of your estate planning and people would do that. And then these judges were just routinely tossing them out for no reason whatsoever. These petitions were being filed with no medical evidence, absolutely no medical evidence at all. They were being filed for bizarre reasons, reasons that you couldn't even verify. One of my favorites was fell down in the parking lot of Costco. And you know, yeah, absolutely. What was on the on the on the seat? And you know, and then they would send out a guardian ad litem who is a person who's supposed to advocate on behalf of the proposed ward. These individuals, by the way, were elderly and developmentally disabled individuals, all races, religions, anywhere from 19 to 98, was about the oldest that we saw. And these Guardian ad litem would go out and visit them and say, you know, they don't make recommendations for guardianship an adult say, well, the ward waves their presence of the hearing. But when we actually got talking to the wards and their families, they said what the guardian ad litem never came to visit us. And all the Guardian ad Litem did come to visit us and said, Well, we didn't need to be at the hearing that they would take care of everything. And of course, they were just as naive as I was when it came to guardianship. And so you know, these people were placed. Sometimes they would have emergency petitions. So the ward wasn't even told that they were going to be placed on the guardianship. It just happened. And we basically all these cases were presided over by four Oakland County probate court judges, and they belong to four Oakland County Public administrators. Now what those individuals are, Diane, are people under under Michigan statute, what they're supposed to be is they're supposed to just take over deceased estates when there were no living heirs, so if you were to pass on without any as then they'd appoint a public administrator to distribute your assets. But what these guys were doing was they were acting as guardians and conservatives outside of the public administrators job description. So they were doing it as private attorneys. And between them, they had well over 1700 open cases at the time that we started the investigation. Some of them had four to 500 wards each. And there is just no way that one person with maybe two or three assistants can handle that many people. What we were seeing is that these individuals, yes, they were stripped of all the civil rights. They were removed from their homes, all them is uniformly about 98% of the time, within a month of guardianship being initiated and being handed over to one of these public administrators. They were being removed from their homes and placed in either long term care, assisted living or was called an adult foster care facility, but some of them were unlicensed. In other words, they hadn't been inspected by the state. They hadn't been looked at for staffing for safety. And these places were just, I mean, they were horrific. They were utterly horrific. One of the things I will never forget is that we went to a group of unlicensed nursing homes over Thanksgiving weekend, 2018 and one of them. We appeared on the Saturday evening. And the we went in and we saw a refrigerator and it's actually in the article a picture of it padlock the obviously the owners of the nursing home before they had left had wrapped a chain around the handles the refrigerator padlocking it shot. And there were three women in that home, who had nothing to eat except for McDonald's, which luckily one of the one of their sons was able to bring in once every once every day. Otherwise, they would have totally starved. And one of the woman her name like Carolyn, she's done the guardianship for two years. And I said, What do you have to tell the world? She said, "Get me the hell out of here." And yeah, she came in, she was sobbing and this that, you know, it was just, it was so hard to say sort of remain emotionally detached. And what do you say to that? You know, I could say I could do my best, you know. We went out actually and then when got them some Food and some slippers, just something. So tied them over to when these people are gone because they've been fruitless since this day. Diane Berardi 11:09 How do you leave them? Right? Gretchen Hammond 11:12 I couldn't. It was so difficult. It was so difficult. We had to move on. And then you know, the other thing we started finding what these homes, all of these wards homes, you know, they had real estate they was sold within Oh, I would say, again, two to three months. A lot of these sales had been you know, they didn't even that home have only been on the market for a week before it was sold. It was always sold for under market value. We looked about 59 homes, and they were sold for a total of about $2 million under market value to local investors. There were a group of investors who are attorneys, there were a group of investors from the Ukraine who also owned some unlicensed nursing facilities, and they were buying up these probate homes and then flipping them inside of three to four months for full price and then everything else would be for the home. was sold that the garden would go in, they do a walkthrough and then the next thing you know, they're getting someone to come in and totally clean it out. Everything gets tossed in the trash, memorabilia, clothing. I mean anything that's not a value. And then you know, the things that were a value. We looked at the guardians accounts, and there was no accounting for it. So we didn't know how much how many dollars in jewelry, or how many how much in cash was found. And there was over billing massive over billing and we found money that was missing somewhere in the region of four or $500,000. In one case, and you know, it was impossible to add it all out because you're looking at 2278 cases, and a lot of it was money that it just disappeared. And also these were people this was the most heartbreaking thing. There were people who were veterans, there were veterans who were fought in World War Two, and had been placed on the guardianship and just disposed off, literally disposed off as if they were human trash. And one of the most heartbreaking cases was that a Billy Garner, who was World War Two Navy that he was placed on the god issue of a gentleman named John Manga. And he was dead within two years from scabies mites. And then nothing happened he was placed in and every penny of his $128,000 by the time he died had been spent, he has nothing left. So it was gone inside of two years. And that was the most bizarre thing. These individuals have literally rendered completely impoverished depending on how much money they have when they go into guardianship. By the time they were done two to three years Max, they were thrown onto social services like Medicaid, and social security. They had nothing left in the bank. So all that planning, they're done all that estate planning. You know, the 401k is the things that you are told in this country you're supposed to do. What totally worthless. And that was one of the most heartbreaking things and the families who were trying to push back would end up you know, being punished by these judges by being isolated from the last month almost routinely. You know, the Guardian would come in and given ex parte order, which means in order where the other party isn't present and the families aren't present to isolate these individuals from their loved ones, so they couldn't see them. And there weren't very many attorneys who would take on their cases because as one attorney told us, you know, I can't fight these judicial appointees, we get punished for it. We get sanctioned. Diane Berardi 14:19 Oh my gosh. Gretchen Hammond 14:23 One attorney who spoke to me on the record was the gentleman who had fought for the estate of Rosa Parks, the famous she was a famous woman who, you know, was one of the famous women for civil rights, and her estate was literally depleted by two attorneys. And one of the attorney that spoke up about it, he ended up getting hold up in front of the Michigan board of accountability board or the attorney board and discipline board. And he got he ended up almost losing his license over it. Just to speaking out. So that's the kind of thing that these attorneys were facing. And, you know, so there really wasn't any way out for these folks. Diane Berardi 15:06 Right. Gretchen Hammond 15:08 You know, it really was a life sentence. Diane Berardi 15:13 It's like legal abuse and thievery. It makes absolutely no sense. And, and for us as children, we do powers of attorney, you know, we do what we're told to do, or the proper paperwork. So it doesn't seem possible that all this can happen. Gretchen Hammond 15:35 No, know. And, and and I don't I, you know, I don't entirely think it is legal. I think what they're doing is beyond the bounds of Michigan statute, obviously, you know, taking money from these individuals and under selling their homes is not what they're supposed to be doing an audience and yet they were doing it almost routinely, and I could tell that something Was definitively wrong with what they were doing. And they knew it. Because when I would walk into that courtroom and I always used to say, I'm just a girl with a press badge, and I would walk into that courtroom and most of the time, you know, when you're an investigative journalist that you know, you tend to see this kind of stuff like nothing to see here kind of expression, you know, it's sort of like you're taking down, you're going up the garden path, there's nothing here there's nothing, nothing, nothing going on. Nothing wrong. But when I went into this probate court to watch a case or to monitor a case or even to go to the computer, so look at the court files. I mean, I felt like it was Eliot Ness busting into a speakeasy. I mean, there was a palpable reaction, from everyone in that court and then included the sheriff's, the Oakland County Sheriff's who were who was sort of monitoring the three entrances and kind of like really received nasty TSA agents. Terrible, terrible. They would just I mean, they would singled me out for stripped sir is literally they would take me into another room and start taking off my clothes. So the same Yeah, they would absolutely. I'm saying they were looking for recording devices. One of them. One of them I used to call Kojack is a friendly colon Kojack because I didn't even know what his real name is never let me get close enough to his badge, but he's to trail me around with this gruff, nasty looking expression on his face. And he was constantly asked him he wanted to bust me for something. One day, for example, it was raining outside, I brought in an umbrella. And I put it in the X ray scanner and this guy. Kojak starts taking it apart and said we're doing it's a cheap umbrella. He says, there's a recording device in here. I'm like, there's no recording device in in here. "Q" didn't give it to me before I left. It wasn't an MI5 Sanctioned recording device in an umbrella. Tough luck Kojak. Sometimes the umbrella is just an umbrella. I'm, you know, I'm this guy with you know, follow me around glowering and stuff like that. I mean, it was it was trying to intimidate me as much as they could. Diane Berardi 17:56 We're going to continue talking with Gretchen Hammond, but first, If you're a woman or there's a woman in your life, there's something you absolutely need to know. I want to tell you about my friend Katie. Katie is a nurse and she was attacked on her way home from work. She was totally taken by surprise. And although Katie is only five feet tall, and 106 pounds, she was easily able to drop her six foot four 250 pound attacker to his knees and get away unharmed. Katie wasn't just lucky that day, she was prepared. In her pocketbook, a harmless looking lipstick, which really contained a powerful man stopping aerosol propellant. It's not like it was in our grandmother's day. Today just going to and from work or to the mall can have tragic consequences. The FBI says a violent crimes committed every 15 seconds in the United States. And a forcible rape happens every five minutes. And chances are when something happens, no one will be around to help. It looks just like a lipstick. So no one will suspect the thing. Which is important since experts say getting the jump on your attacker is all about the element of surprise. Inside this innocent looking lipstick is the same powerful stuff used by police in the military to disarm even the most powerful armed aggressor. In fact, national park rangers use the very same formula that's inside this little lipstick to stop 2000 pound vicious grizzly bears dead in their tracks. It's like carrying a personal bodyguard with you in your purse or your pocket. Darkness brings danger, murderers and rapists use darkness to their advantage. We all know what it's like to be walking at night and hear footsteps coming at us from behind. Who's there? If it's somebody bad, will you be protected? Your life may depend on it. My friend Katie's close call needs to be a wake up call for all of us, myself included. Pick up a lipstick body guard and keep it with you. Always Announcer 20:10 You're listening to Parents Are Hard To Raise. Now. Thanks to you the number one elder care talk show on planet Earth. Listen to this and other episodes on demand using the iHeart Radio app. iPhone users can listen on Apple podcasts and Android users on Google podcast. Wants a great new way to listen to the show? Diane Berardi 20:32 Just say Alexa... Announcer 20:34 play Parents Are Hard To Raise podcast, Alexa 20:37 Getting the latest episode of Parents Are Hard To Raise. Here it is from iHeart Radio. Announcer 20:43 It's as simple as that. Diane Berardi 20:44 You're right Dolly. There are so many really cool new ways to listen to our show. It's hard to keep track. You can join the 180 million listeners on Spotify. You can listen in your car, at the gym, or pretty much anywhere on your smartphone with apple podcasts and Google podcasts, you can get us an Apple TV, DirecTV, Roku. And like Dolly said, you can even ask Alexa to play the show for you. It's great because you don't have to be tied to a radio anymore. You can listen when you want, where you want for as long as you want. And if you're listening to the show, and one of these new ways, please do me a big favor, share this new technology, help someone else learn about the show and show them a new way to listen. So Gretchen, Iam wondering how do people become professional guardians? Gretchen Hammond 21:39 Well, the folks that we looked at in in Michigan, they were all attorneys, so they were all probate attorneys or Estate Attorneys or elder law attorneys. Majority were probate attorneys. But what I could see from, you know, across the United States, you know, as these sort of expanding research is that anyone can pretty much become a guardian. You know, mean even they just had a case in Pennsylvania right now where the person with a criminal record was appointed the guardian and of course found out that they they'd stolen money from their wards. I mean, so again, it seems like anyone can become a guardian. And there's very, very little oversight and there certainly isn't in Michigan in 30 years. We trace this back 30 years in Michigan, and there hadn't been one single arrest of a professional guardian or any cases brought against any professional guardians. And this goes back from multiple government administration's multiple Attorney General. And here's what here's what here's what happened. And this, to me is one of the most bizarre aspects of the story. The new Attorney General and your attorney general had been elected during the course of the investigation. Her name is Dana Nestle, and she was elected in November of 2018. She took office in January 2019. Promising to speak up for those who could not speak for themselves and to seek justice for the vulnerable and So we reached out to her in early March and said, you know, we have you know, dug into all these cases, we'd like to give you some of the evidence and what we found and get some comment. And on March the 12th, we met with the Attorney General Staff of about eight or nine people, presented them with evidence of all these cases, all the unlicensed nursing homes, this the theft, all that sort of stuff. And they did nothing. As a matter of fact, she announced an elder abuse Task Force on March 25, and denied me access to that press conference because they knew I would ask questions about Oakland County, how's it they didn't want me asking any questions about Oakland County. Ever since then, she's been totally dancing around the topic, has been talking about reforms, but absolutely no consequences for those who break the law, whether they be judges or attorneys. And the families themselves have been getting incredibly frustrated, because there's been no action taken from her office whatsoever. She has literally told them things like, well, I can't really do anything. Unless you file a grievance with the attorney discipline board, which is a licensing agency, that will be like, it would be like me, mugging you, in the middle of time in the middle of Detroit and you going to the Attorney General and saying, you know, well, Gretchen just mugged me. She took off with $50. And the Attorney General saying, well, I can't do anything and file a complaint with the, with the Society of Professional Journalists first. I mean, it's the most bizarre, ridiculous statement that anyone can make. The other thing she's told the families is, well, I could arrest these people. What What good would that do? Diane Berardi 24:32 Oh, my God. Gretchen Hammond 24:34 She said that. She's absolutely said that and it's these famalies looking at me. What good would it do? Because without consequences, these people are just going to carry on breaking and all of them, Diane Berardi 24:45 right. Gretchen Hammond 24:45 The only thing she has done, Diane, the only thing she's done is she's fired them as public administrators, which is basically because it's just a job title that has nothing to do with guardianship a conservatorship. It has it's basically a Telling the Duke of Edinburgh you can no longer be a Duke. And that's all it is. That's all she's done. She has fired them and the best still going around taking guardianship and conservatorship cases this business at normal at that court, and that court is the most devastating place. I'll tell you I'm I started likening it to the Marston house in Salem's lot. There's a quote from that book. It's the house of brooded over the town, like a Ruined King. And that's what that court does. It is physically an exhausting place. Everything about it is misery, utter misery, you would hear the screams of families who have been torn apart while you in that court, you would watch court cases and see families begging to be put back together. And these judges just throwing it out. And and throwing these families out or bringing in the sheriff's and arresting them. It was just absolutely horrific. Diane Berardi 25:50 Yeah, I mean, in this day and age, you can't you can't imagine. It's just ridiculous. Gretchen Hammond 25:57 Yeah. And it's going on of course, nationwide. In Florida Of course right now they've just found out a guardian by the name of was executing Do Not Resuscitate orders on her wards without their knowledge or permission. She did so on one word by the name of Stephen Stryker and he ended up choking to death actually executed a DNR capped off his feeding tube. And that started a full investigation even the governor of that state Ron DeSantis said look, this has got to stop. He said you know without consequences this is just going to go on and he's the only one who has actually said that. And there is currently a criminal investigation going on to Rebecca Fierle, but in Michigan that is not happening. And these families and these wards and these you know, such vulnerable wonderful people. No no reason for them to be a guardianship. Not incapacitated. You know, these guardian ad litem, they go in they ask them three questions; What's the President's name, you know, what's your birthday was the day of the week? And if they can't answer one of those questions, they said boom, youre incapacitated. But that's not the case. Lot of these people could remember everything. Everything about the guardianship their entire history, some one of them asked me her name was Nancy, how did she goes? Where's my house? I and I'd already I knew I had been sold from under her to a Russian to a Russian ambassador. And I said, I don't know how to tell you this. Your house has been sold. And she just looked devastated. And she said, you put that man she says, Do what you have to do. Gretchen you put that man in jail. Yeah, I know. Yeah, I know. And it's real. And people talk to me. You tell people this? And they say No, that can't this cannot be happening in the United States of America. There's no way that someone who is perfectly innocent can get their civil rights stripped from them and then get, you know, be placed inside something that's akin to being a imprisoned felon, if not worse, and you say no, it's true. It's absolutely real, and it does happen on a daily basis. Diane Berardi 27:58 What can we do? What can our audience do? How can we help? Gretchen Hammond 28:02 Well, I think raising awareness is one of the big things. I've spoken to a number of groups and unfortunately the rather like the Catholic priest abuse survivors back in the 70s 80s and 90s, you know, they were very marginalized. There was no one really believed them until the Boston Globe article came out in 2002 really kind of blew the lid off it. I think people really need to start listening to folks who say they are suffering from probate court, guardianship abuse, and elevating their stories and helping to spread them around and share them around and demanding accountability. That's the main thing, right? These people will continue to do what they are doing unless someone steps up and arrests them, investigates them, arrest them, and says that there are consequences. You can put all the legislation in the world out there, but it isn't doing any good because the judges are not obeying the law. And neither are the guardians. And until that happens, and that's what people need to do. They need to start demanding it. They need to stop demanding investigations and the safety of these vulnerable people and I am Also in America, there has to be a sea change in attitude towards the album. America is a very ageist place, I've noticed that the, you know, you see this sort of disconnect between the millennials and the baby boomers and and that has to change, because these are your parents, or grandparents, these will be me, I'm Generation X. So I'm some of next in line, you know, and, you know, you have to start thinking about this in the in terms of the future and saying, Okay, we got to put a stop to this right now. Because you know, someone, a total stranger can come in, based on the fact that you're bipolar and take everything that you've ever owned or saved or had or earned it. I mean, it's there's no way that that should be allowed. And I think people need to start pushing this. I mean, I think people need to start pushing, pushing that on and pushing it and pushing it forward. The conversation, the dialogue. Diane Berardi 29:51 I mean, an outstanding nursing home bill, and it just it boggles our mind. Gretchen Hammond 29:58 There is no There is there is no Michigan statute which says that someone should be put on the guardianship as a collection agency. There's nothing in there that says bad at all. So these guys that disobeying the law, it's tough to stop. Diane Berardi 30:13 Gretchen, thank you so much for what you're doing. And thank you so much for being a guest and we love to have you back. Gretchen Hammond 30:21 Oh, thank you, Diane. It's been an absolute honor. Diane Berardi 30:24 Before we go, I just want to tell you all something. As many of you know, my mom passed away in mid September. And I just wanted to thank everyone for your notes and your emails and your cards and letters. It's been a rough road, but my mom lived a great life, and we're sad and we miss her dearly, but she lived her life the way she wanted and she was always happy and had great sense of humor and was always meeting people and would talk to anyone and help anyone and she just enjoyed her life. And that's what we try to keep close to our heart. And I just want to thank all of you for reaching out to me and my family and it means so much to us. And you are my family, my Parents Are Hard To Raise family and my mom, she loved being on the show, and I wanted to try to get her back for one more show, but she was just too weak to do it. But she, she would be so happy that you remembered her and I just can't thank you enough. Thanks again. Parents Are Hard To Raise as a CounterThink Media production. The music used in this broadcast was managed by Cosmo Music, New York, New York. Our New York producer is Joshua Green. Our broadcast engineer is Well Gambino. And from our London studios, the melodic voice of our announcer, Miss Dolly D. Thank you so much for listening. Till next time, may you forget everything you don't want to remember and remember everything you don't want to forget. See you again next week. Downloadable PDF of the Show Transcript Episode-134-Transcript Listen to this episode... just click play on the player below
Transcribe →Why Doctors Should Care About Our Attitude? Dr. Sarah Pressman #128
Oct 17, 201900:31:52Tap to summarizeWhy Should Doctors Care About our Attitude? Listen to this episode… just click play on the player below Here Are Some Handy Links To The People, Products, Books, Services and Resources Discussed On This Episode Dr. Pressman’s TED Talk Take Diane with you... and listen whenever you want, wherever you want, and how often you want, on your smartphone or tablet. It's easy... Just click any of the links below Listen with the iHeart Radio App iPhone Users Click This Link Android Phone Users Click This Link Follow Diane on Social Media Click the Links Below Show Transcript Parents Are Hard To Raise® S03 Episode 128 Transcript Announcer 0:00 The world's becoming a dangerous place for us women. Lipstick bodyguard looks just like an innocent little lipstick, but it'll instantly drop any attacker to his knees so you can get away unharmed. Lipstick bodyguard fear no evil. Get yours today only at lipstickbodyguard.com. Announcer 0:37 Can the simple act of smiling, even when you don't mean it, reduce physical pain, relieve stress and impact our overall health? Find out this week as Diane has an eye opening conversation with smiles expert, Dr. Sarah Pressman. Join 180 million monthly subscribers who can now listen to parents are hard raised on Spotify. Diane Berardi 1:13 Welcome to parents are hard to raise, helping families grow older together without losing their minds. I'm elder care expert Diane Berardi. Diane Berardi 1:23 Should doctors care about our happiness? Scientists call it PA or positive aspect and its effect on our bodies and physical health is nothing short of amazing. My special guest expert this week is here to tell us why. Diane Berardi 1:40 Dr. Sarah Pressman is an associate professor of psychology and social behavior at the University of California Irvine. Her work examines how positive emotions are beneficial for physical health and how they can protect us from the harmful effects of stress in the face of adversity. Dr. Preston's research findings have been published in top psychology journals and featured in media outlets like the New York Times, The Wall Street Journal, and the Colbert Report. Dr. Sarah Pressman, welcome to parents are hard to raise. Dr Sarah Pressman 2:13 Thank you so much for having me. Diane Berardi 2:15 You know, I'm thinking about any doctor that I've ever been gone to. No one ever asked me how happy are you? Right? And I think they would be scared if I said, I'm not. Dr Sarah Pressman 2:31 Well, I mean, I think if you say you're not, the initial thing, they'll do is assume you're depressed, right? Which is a whole different question. Diane Berardi 2:38 Yeah. So why should doctors care about our happiness? Dr Sarah Pressman 2:43 Well, as your introduction so eloquently stated, I mean, I've been doing this work for almost 20 years and many people have been doing it for longer than me. And you know, the connection between feeling more positive, feeling more excited, feeling more happy, and our physical health, it's unquestionable. You know, there's dozens and dozens of studies showing that people who are more positive live, you know, potentially years longer than people who don't. And beyond that, that there's a host of other health benefits, you know, they experience less pain, if we expose them to a cold virus there, you know, 30% less likely to get sick. You know, even things like, Yeah, not even if you put a droplet of cold virus in their nose or flu virus and their nose, they're less likely then they're less happy counterparts to get sick. And, you know, even things like your likelihood of tripping and falling is related to your positive emotions. And so it seems to have a very broad effect on a lot of health in a very real way. Diane Berardi 3:45 So tripping and fulfilling, huh? Dr Sarah Pressman 3:49 Which is definitely relevant to you know, the older listeners are people with older parents. Yeah. And there have been studies done in older samples for precisely that reason. You know, looking at what, you know, what are you know, it's kind of surprising you assume that people took from fall because, you know, it's an accident. But you know how much of that is, you know, their lack of energy or, you know, maybe something about how they view the world around them as they're being conscientious that they're paying attention. And those things may very well be related to positive emotions. Diane Berardi 4:22 Now, why don't doctors relate to this? Dr Sarah Pressman 4:27 It's a great question. And it's something I struggle with. And I go and I try, I've spoken at many medical conferences, to try that talk to them about it. And I think there's a few reasons. I mean, I think first off, a lot of them don't know this literature. You know, I've been in the fields of psychoneuroimmunology for, you know, decades, but they might not even know that that field exists. And so medical curriculum is so overloaded with the biological aspects that they have to learn that there just isn't time to fit these kinds of topics into the curriculum and you know, my own experience having taken some medical school classes is, you know, you might get a couple of points thrown in like, Oh, yeah, stress damages the immune system or disrupts the immune system or depression is related to, you know, your likelihood of surviving heart disease or something like that. But you know, it's even not work is very rarely discussed in the medical curriculum. And then on top of that, you know, the thing that that really happens when I talked to doctors about this is they're like, Well, so what do I do? So I asked my patient, if they're happy, and they tell me that they're not, but they're not depressed? You know, what do I do? And there's no prescription that they can hand out that says, Go be happy? Diane Berardi 5:38 Yeah. Right. Unknown Speaker 5:40 You know, and, you know, there's no pill that they can take that makes them happy. An antidepressant doesn't make you happy. Right? And so I think that's the biggest picture, or the biggest piece that's missing with why they won't care about it is, you know, they don't have a next step to do. Diane Berardi 5:53 And, yeah, we need a next step. Dr Sarah Pressman 5:57 Yeah. And I mean, I think there are companies working on this. Right? So there's a lot of happiness Apps now. And and they're trying to kind of fill that gap, I think where you know, the same way that there's a lot of mindfulness apps right now where they're trying to beep you every day and encourage you to take a moment of calm in a moment of being thoughtful and peaceful. You know, there are happiness apps that do the same thing that try to encourage you to, you know, take a moment and reflect on what you're grateful for. Yeah, take a moment and, you know, try to think about, you know, your goals and strive towards them. So there is there is some movement, but it's that peace between medicine and those apps is lacking, you know, and certainly, there's not a lot of research out there to suggest that using that app has a downstream benefit on how long you live or something. So that piece is definitely missing as well. Diane Berardi 6:46 And I guess, physicians, they separate the mind from the body. Dr Sarah Pressman 6:51 Absolutely. Diane Berardi 6:53 And so they just look at, you know, the external factors of the disease. They don't look at the mind at all. So this is what we have to... gear them [laughing], I know we have to. There's so many, so many shows we've done in so many things, you know, I guess I guess it's the training, right? Dr Sarah Pressman 7:11 It's the training. Unknown Speaker 7:12 I think that's where it has to start. And, you know, there is some movement to try to get doctors. I'm in a society called the American Psychosomatic Society, which is really a group of both psychologists and MDs who do this kind of mind body work. And, you know, they're trying to give medical schools, you know, support and resources to have journal clubs to teach medical students about this and to bring medical students for free. So these kinds of conferences because I think patients want their doctors to know this work and they want them to... You know, when you go to your doctor, and you're convinced that you have an illness, or you're overwhelmingly stressed and you think it's affecting your health and they deny you that you know, and they say, No, no, there's nothing wrong. You know, I think that's very upsetting as a patient and i think that i think Again, I mean, it's that doctors aren't trained about all of the interconnections between mind and body that the psychologists are doing research on. And so it's, it's just a gap in their knowledge and it's affecting patient care. And so I think training is really where it would have to start. But you know, is that the trick is what do you take out to put this in? Or do we make medical training longer? So it's definitely a difficult question. Diane Berardi 8:22 You know, when I think about, you know, the caregiver, you know, with their parents and going to the doctor, and you can just look at them and say, Oh, my gosh, every time they come in, you know, you can see they have things going on that they're deteriorating physically. And so doctors don't ask, you know, Well, at home, what's the situation? or you know, What else what other responsibilities you have or different things like that? I guess they don't realize there's so many things that play into a person's well being Dr Sarah Pressman 9:04 For the caregiver, you mean? Diane Berardi 9:05 Yes. Dr Sarah Pressman 9:06 Absolutely. And I mean, caregivers for psychologists who studies stress, you know, caregivers are one of our go to population to study chronic stress, because, you know, it's just, it affects every single part of your life when you know, your entire world revolves around taking care of this person who is deteriorating, and, you know, we know that, you know, their immune systems don't function as well, they're more likely to have all sorts of health problems because of this chronic stress. But yeah, we don't do that much for them to help make them more resilient. And, you know, it's a it's a very interesting question of whether or not some positive psychology types of interventions would help this population, you know, to help them find those moments of joy, or at least moments of peace while they're facing this chronic stressor. And I would expect it would be really helpful because one of the things that positive emotion seems to do best is help undo the negative effects of stress, you know, so yeah, you know, it's not that it's this magic, you know thing but you know, what it does do and I think this is very intuitive to a lot of people is it's very hard to be extremely stressed and extremely happy at the same time. Diane Berardi 10:11 Right. Dr Sarah Pressman 10:11 You know, one is gonna win. And so what research has shown is that it helps our bodies kind of undo the stress a little bit, you know, to have our heart rates drop to have our stress hormones drop, and that's exactly what caregivers need. I think we'd have to be sensitive to... I mean, this is kind of a trick with a lot of positive psychology researches. You know, I think a lot of people assume that it's “happyology” and we're just telling you to be happy all the time and of course, that's not at all what we're saying, you know, negative emotions are very functional. And certainly, in the in the situation of a caregiver who has chronic stress, we would never expect them to be happy all the time. But if you can just break up some of the negative effects of stress just for to give him a break. You can imagine that that gives their body a chance to kind of go back into homeostasis and you know, do the things that supposed to do you know, positive emotion. For example, has been shown to be really effective at helping you sleep better at night Diane Berardi 11:03 Really? Dr Sarah Pressman 11:05 You know, and it Yeah, in my own work, you know it helps people have higher quality sleep, fall asleep faster, stay asleep longer. And that's exactly what a caregiver needs, right they need yes useful sleep that's undisturbed by all the thoughts of this sort of hassles that are going on in their life. Diane Berardi 11:21 You know, I think of myself when my mom first got sick, and I was, you know, taking her to doctors and I was going up going, I'm like two hours away and running up every weekend and I kept getting sick, I kept getting a cold. And I'm saying why is that? But I guess you know, I mean, when you think about it, and now that she passed now I'm doing the same for my dad. I mean, my dad is not, you know, he's not suffering you know from cancer, but he has his own problems. And so my journey continues as so many caregivers. You know, there's just a never ending... There's no break. And I think I sit there and you know, the middle of the night you don't sleep and you think, Oh my gosh, you know, how do you live your life? And how do you find that peace or that happiness or that relaxation? You know? This would help so many caregivers. And, and happiness, I guess, you know, what is it? It's subjective. Dr Sarah Pressman 12:30 It's highly subjective. And it doesn't have to be haphazard, right? Dr Sarah Pressman 12:33 I mean, there's a lot of different positive emotions. And I think that's something that a lot of people also get confused about when they think you know, when we're saying you have to be happy. We're using happy, you know, more colloquially as a way of talking about positive emotions more broadly, a positive emotions that are good for us can include feeling active and vigorous. That can include feeling excited, it could include feeling peaceful and calm. It can include feeling content, it doesn't have to be slap a smiley face sticker on it. And, um, you know, there's a lot to be said for Eudemonic well being, which is also a big area that's growing in the health literature, which is, you know, having life purpose, or having life meaning, you know, those aren't things that again are like the typical happy face. I mean, you could be you could have one of the hardest, most difficult jobs, but it's giving your life meaning. Diane Berardi 13:22 Yeah. Diane Berardi 13:23 And that's tied to a lot of health benefits as well. And so a lot of the, you know, positive psychology interventions out there are targeted at things like that, you know, it's, you know, trying to help people find meaning in their lives are trying to help them find purpose in their lives or align their goals to, you know, or their their activities to meet their long term goals, which again, does give you that sort of sense of purpose and achievement, that can be related to positive emotions like happiness as well. Diane Berardi 13:53 We're going to continue talking with Dr. Sarah Pressman. But first if you're a woman, or there's a woman in your life, there Something you absolutely need to know. Diane Berardi 14:12 I want to tell you about my friend Katie. Katie is a nurse and she was attacked on her way home from work. She was totally taken by surprise. And although Katie is only 5 feet tall and 106 pounds she was easily able to drop her 6 foot 4, 250-pound attacker to his knees and get away unharmed. Katie wasn't just lucky that day. She was prepared. In her pocketbook, a harmless looking lipstick, which really contained a powerful man stopping aerosol propellant. It's not like it was in our grandmother's day. Today just going to and from work or to the mall can have tragic consequences. The FBI says a violent crime is committed every 15 seconds in the United States. And a forcible rape happens every five minutes. And chances are when something happens, no one will be around to help. It looks just like a lipstick. So no one will suspect a thing. Which is important since experts say, getting the jump on your attacker is all about the element of surprise. Inside this innocent looking lipstick is the same powerful stuff used by police and the military to disarm even the most powerful, armed aggressor. In fact, National Park rangers used the very same formula that's inside this little lipstick to stop two-thousand pound vicious grizzly bears dead in their tracks. It's like carrying a personal bodyguard with you in your purse or your pocket. Darkness brings danger. Murderers and rapists use darkness to their advantage. We all know what it's like to be walking at night and hear footsteps coming at us from behind. Who's there? If it's somebody bad, will you be protected? Your life may depend on it. My friend Katie's close call needs to be a wake up call for all of us. Myself included. Pick up a Lipstick Bodyguard and keep it with you always. Announcer 16:08 You're listening to Parents Are Hard To Raise. Now, thanks to you. The number one eldercare talk show on planet earth. Listen to this and other episodes on demand using the iHeart Radio app, iPhone users to listen on Apple podcasts and Android users on Google podcasts. Announcer Want a great new way to listen to the show? Just say, "Alexa. Play, Parents Are Hard To Raise podcast." Alexa Getting the latest episode is parents so hard to raise. Here it is from my heart radio. Announcer It's as simple as that. Diane Berardi 16:42 You're right Dolly. There's so many really cool new ways to listen to our show. It's hard to keep track. You can join the 180 million listeners on Spotify. You can listen in your car at the gym, or pretty much anywhere on your smartphone with Apple podcasts and Google podcasts. You can get us on Apple TV, direct tv, Roku. And like Dolly said, you can even ask Alexa to play the show for you. It's great because you don't have to be tied to a radio anymore. You can listen when you want where you want for as long as you want. And if you're listening to the show one of these new ways, please do me a big favor, share this new technology and help someone else learn about the show and show them a new way to listen. And Parents Are Hard to Raise audience, you know I love getting your feedback and your emails. And I just wanted to thank several of our listeners here. Angela from Marlton, New Jersey… Love, love, love the Senior Bullying show! Actually, I have the show transcript in front of me on my desk, and just had to write you. I am so happy I found you! Keep up the great work! And that senior bullying show was Back in Season 2 Episode #83 in our show archives. Melanie Decker- Director of the Howell Senior Center in Howell Township NJ. Did that show with us. And Molly from Kronoberg, Sweden really got a lot of great information from our show on Parkinson’s with Dr. Neil Hammond and Sarah Jones, and would like to hear more on the subject. And “Dr. George” from Wellington, New Zealand couldn’t say enough great things about the episodes from the Change Foundation in Canada. So thank you so much for sending these emails to us. Diane Berardi 18:41 So, you are the smiles expert. [laughing] Talk to us about you know, Can, the simple act of smiling... Dr Sarah Pressman 18:53 Yeah, and I gotta say that one of the one of the times I was on a radio interview talking about that work they played the song, Sarah Smile. And I couldn't stop laughing for the 10 minutes of the interview. So thank you for not doing that. Diane Berardi 19:06 I'm surprised they did not do that. Dr Sarah Pressman 19:11 And there was no warning and it Yeah, it was it was pretty funny. Dr Sarah Pressman 19:15 Yeah, so smiling is an interesting area. And it's something that I think a lot of people have a hard time believing and it's even a little bit of a controversial area in psychology, believe it or not, but there's Long, long standing beliefs, long, long standing research, that our facial expressions aren't just an outward expression of how we're feeling, but it actually changes how we feel. So this literally dates back to Darwin. Dr Sarah Pressman 19:41 So Darwin said things like, you know, if we, if we conjure up an expression that it changes how we feel, and this work has been done by psychologists for a long time where they do these clever research studies where people think they're doing something else for the research project, you know, they think they are multitasking or they think they're trying out You know, new device with their mouth but what we're actually doing is is tricking them into making some kind of expression you know sometimes that's not smiling. smiling we typically put something in their mouth. there's actually a device now called the smile stick that you put in your mouth to make yourself smile and but then we might also do something like Dr Sarah Pressman 20:19 you know, have you hold a what's it called this thing that you put a golf ball on the little stick Diane Berardi 20:26 The tee? Dr Sarah Pressman 20:27 The tee. You put it between your your your eyes and have you tried to hold it and that activates negative emotion related muscles in your face? Or we study people who have had Botox for the opposite reason because, you know, they can't move certain muscles in their face and not might also affect how they feel. And what we see is that the term you know, the the kind of colloquial thing like fake make it, fake it fake it and you'll feel it. Yeah, you know, fake it till you make it or you know, those kinds of you know, fake it till you feel it expressions, that those are true and that if you have someone you know, actually activating a smile, even if they don't know that they're smiling, that it changes their behavior, it changes their perception, it changes how they feel in a positive way. And vice versa. You know, if we block your ability to, you know, for example, scowl by blocking that muscle that in between your eyebrows that you use, kind of it's called the Currugator muscle, it's your frown muscle, you know, if you block that with Botox, that those people don't actually perceive negative emotions in the same way and don't respond to negative emotions the same way so there's actually a lot of clinical trials going on right now using that as a potential treatment for depression. So this research is you know, long standing it's a huge area and you know, my my perspective on it, my interest in it has really been in not so much the emotion side of you know, I don't really believe that. Well, maybe I mean, there's a if you ever heard that this is dating me, but I used to watch Ally McBeal and they used to talk about like smile therapy and like Ally would have to walk around with a smile on her face all day. You know, I don't think there's any good evidence that that would work. And you know, we know that when people are in customer service jobs where they are forced to smile all day that can actually lead to like the opposite effect on your mood. But what I do think it can be useful for is the same thing that we were talking about before with the caregivers and the positive emotions kind of breaking a negative emotion giving you a break from it, giving you kind of a rest from your stress. I feel like smiling is kind of ideally suited in that situation where, you know, if we're sitting in traffic and we're scowling, or we're sitting over some really hard work and just really angry about it, and then we like take a break for a minute and just like put on a really cheesy, big smile. That is we're going to look and same to our friends especially if we're in an open office space. You know, for the people driving next to us on the highway. But you know it what we've seen in our lab is that something about doing that is sending a message back to your brain and back to your body. You're actually happy you're not stressed. And so we don't need to have those high levels of heart rate activity and high blood pressure, we can kind of reduce that because you're not actually in danger, you're not actually under threat. And so, you know, in our work, what we've done is we've shown that if you have your hand in a bucket of ice water, which is a very painful task, if you're doing like a really difficult dexterity task that's impossible and frustrating, or even if you're getting a needle, that if we just make you smile, even if you don't know that you're smiling, that we can improve how quickly you recover from that pain. And we can actually or that stress, and we can actually make needles hurt about 40% less by having you simply smile while you're doing it. Diane Berardi 23:45 It's amazing. Dr Sarah Pressman 23:47 I will say not all smiles are made equally. So there are actually lots and lots of different kinds of smiles, you know, their smiles of pain and discomfort and embarrassment, right? So the smiles that are most Effective or what we call Duchenne smiles named after one of the earliest researchers on this topic, but essentially it's when you smile when someone smiles at you and you can really tell it sincere is when their eyes are activated as well. So you get like the crow's feet around your eyes and kind of around your eyes. That plus the you know, typical, you know, teeth, cheek raised kind of, you know, smile, that that's how you can tell it sincere as if their eyes are involved in it. You know, it's not this Starbucks barista kind of smile, where it's just their mouth. They're like, Yeah, get out of here. You're you're holding up the line kind of smile. Diane Berardi 24:35 Wow. Yeah. When you think about it, yeah, you that is a great way to tell and we're would you get those smile sticks? [laughing] Dr Sarah Pressman 24:46 Google it, you'll find it. They have a website for it. Dr Sarah Pressman 24:49 So yeah, we actually did a research study with a smile stick company. You know, their hope was to kind of, you know, in our research studies, what we, what we commonly use is just like an old pen or a pair of chopsticks like it's not the most sanitary, you know thing to do. I mean, obviously, we throw away the chopsticks and get a new pair [laughing] But, you know, it's not like the kind of thing where it's like, you're going to give this to your mom and be like, Hey, hold these. But if you had a device that said smile stick and you said, Hey, hold this in your mouth while you get a needle. Like that seems a little bit more appealing and so and the smile stick absolutely works just as well as you know, chopsticks or pens or whatever. Diane Berardi 25:23 I would like to give them out this Christmas. [laughing] to spme people Actually, Announcer 25:30 Excellent. [laughing] We'll get it on Oprah's must, must buy gift list this year. Diane Berardi 25:37 That's right. Oh my gosh. I guess there's a company that invented them. Right? Now what about if you go to your doctor and you know, let's say then you see the nurse first and she's smiling. You know, talking to you, taking down information. Is that... would a person tend to be more relaxed and smile? Because, you know, that other person is doing that. And it's... Dr Sarah Pressman 26:13 Whether or not smiles are contagious? Diane Berardi 26:15 Yeah. Dr Sarah Pressman 26:15 Absolutely they are. I mean, it's one of the most fundamental human reflexes, right? I mean, the one so when we study emotion and in psychology, you know, a lot of the time we're kind of thinking in the back of our heads. Okay, well, what is the evolutionary function for this? You know, why would smiling? Why would we smile, right? Like, right, what's the point of it? And so the the best guesss, I mean, it's hard to prove any evolutionary theory. But the best guess, is that smiling is something that is easy to see from far away, to tell another person that you're not a threat, you know, and then it would be adaptive if we had this kind of contagious ability for us to kind of signal from far away. Oh, you know, this is someone who I can gather with, potentially mate with I mean, who knows, right? Diane Berardi 27:00 Right. [laughing] Dr Sarah Pressman 27:01 And so you know, to have that, you know, both be easy to see, and to have it be contagious so that we do it back with each other. And then on top of that, to also have that concomitant sort of reduction in our arousal so that we're calm and we're not, you know, about to attack this person, right? smiling is having this relaxing effect on the body. It's enabling us to make these social connections that were essential to human survival. And so, you know, that's why you do see that most of the time. I mean, obviously, there's huge cultural variation and smiling. Yeah, you know, some countries are actually very smile averse, very happiness averse. There's actually a fear of happiness scale, where certain countries see it as kind of a sign of foolishness or a sign of, you know, sinfulness or something like that. And so they they really don't like smiling and I think the really interesting unanswered question is, so if they smile, would we see the same stress effects for example, you know, if even if they hate smiling, And so we don't really know the answer to that. Yeah. But fortunately, you know, smiling is, you know, there's lots of cross cultural research around the world that shows that is this universal expression of positive emotion. And to that, to the extent that that's true, we would expect that it would be helpful, you know, and and, you know, stress reducing for everyone. Diane Berardi 28:19 Yeah, I think about you know, caregivers whether, you know, you're taking care of your parent or you work, you know, as a caregiver and thinking, you know, if you smile and approaching a patient, you know, how that would relax them and maybe help them smile, you know. Dr Sarah Pressman 28:42 Absoutely. Yeah. I mean, to make, you know, I mean, the doctor patient relationship, the caregiver patient relationship to that extent to I mean, it's so important, right? And, you know, often it's just kind of rushed, and professional and there is it time to be nice, and that's something that takes no time at all. And absolutely, I think That, you know, having, you know, even just having doctors trained to kind of smile at people more could potentially reduce a little bit of stress in the medical establishment. I mean, we know that people get white coat hypertension. Diane Berardi 29:11 Right, yeah. Dr Sarah Pressman 29:12 You know, where their blood pressure goes up just by seeing a doctor. And, you know, maybe if the doctor was more positive and more smiley, and friendly that they would, you know, reduce that. And I think, you know, honestly, I think nurses get this a lot, you know, because they're the ones who spend more time with the patients. I think they're doing it intuitively, to a great degree, you know, even without necessarily knowing the research just because they see that it helps. And, you know, from the perspective of caregiving as well, I mean, my own experience, my grandmother had very serious dementia, and, you know, didn't know who I was right? If I smiled at her, she would smile back, you know, and she got that positive emotion and that contagion of emotion was still there, even to the end. And so, I feel like that is such a simple, positive behavior that actually can have a physiological benefit and an emotional benefit. Diane Berardi 29:57 Oh, most definitely. Yeah. Now how can people find out about your research? Dr Sarah Pressman 30:04 They can Google me and I have a TED talk on why doctors should care about happiness. And I have a website as well. You know, again, if they just google Sarah Pressman at https://sarahpressman.wixsite.com and they can read a lot of my papers you know for free there and learn a little bit about it and see the link to the the TED talk as well. And also I looked it up just so that you have it for your Christmas list or your Hanukkah list or whatever. list It's thepowerofsmiling.com is where you buy smile sticks. [lauging] Diane Berardi 30:41 [laughing] This is great... Thank you so much! [laughing] Dr Sarah Pressman 30:44 I don't wanna I don't want you to miss out on that opportunity. Because I think that's like it sounds like a great idea. Diane Berardi 30:49 It is a great idea. I know. Thank you so much, Sarah, for being here today. Diane Berardi 30:55 Absolutely. And I also just wanted to say it's national or international random act of kindness day so go out and do some nice things for other people and that'll raise their positive emotions. Diane Berardi 31:05 Oh, that's wonderful. Diane Berardi 31:07 And parents are hard to raise family. I love getting your emails and questions so please keep sending them You can reach me at Diana parents are hard to raise.org or just click the green button on our homepage. Parents are hard to raise as a counter sync media production. The music used in this broadcast was managed by Cosmo music, New York, New York. Our New York producer is Joshua Green, our broadcast engineer is Well Gambino, and from our London studios, the melodic voice of our announcer, Miss Dolly D. Diane Berardi 31:34 Thank you so much for listening. Till next time, may you forget everything you don't want to remember. And remember everything you don't want to forget. See you again next week. Downloadable PDF of the Show Transcript Parents-Are-Hard-To-Raise-S03-Episode-128 Listen to this episode... just click play on the player below
Transcribe →The Sun: friend or Foe? What You Don’t Know Might Cure You. Felice L. Gersh, MD – Episode #129
Sep 24, 201900:30:27Tap to summarizeDid you know? Listen to this episode… just click play on the player below Here Are Some Handy Links To The People, Products, Books, Services and Resources Discussed On This Episode Take Diane with you… and listen whenever you want, wherever you want, and how often you want, on your smartphone or tablet. It’s easy… Just click any of the links below Listen with the iHeart Radio App iPhone Users Click This Link Android Phone Users Click This Link Follow Diane on Social Media Click the Links Below Show Transcript Parents Are Hard To Raise® S03 Episode 129 Transcript [00:00:00] The world’s becoming a dangerous place for us women. Lipstick Bodyguard looks just like an innocent little lipstick but it will instantly drop any attacker to his knees so you can get away unharmed. Lipstick Bodyguard fear no evil. Get yours today only at LipstickBodyguard.com. [00:00:37] This week on Parents Are Hard To Raise health and wellness expert, Dr. Felice Gersh, is back with more great advice to keep our aging parents and us living our lives to the fullest. [00:00:50] Join 180 million monthly subscribers who can now listen to Parents Are Hard To Raise on Spotify. Diane Berardi [00:01:08] Welcome to Parents Are Hard To Raise… Helping families grow old together without losing their minds. I’m elder care expert, Diane Berardi. [00:01:17] Longtime listeners will recognize my next guest. Mostly because she’s among my favorite guests medical experts. Dr. Felice Gersh is a true pioneer in her field. A rare combination of an award winning physician, double board certified both in OBGYN an integrative medicine, and a tireless champion of women’s health. She holds degrees from Princeton University, the University of Southern California School of Medicine and the University of Arizona School of Medicine. Dr. Gersh serves as medical director of the integrative medical group of Irvine California. She also writes and speaks internationally on integrative medicine and women’s health. You can hear her weekly broadcast, A Healthy Perspective on care on KR L.A. radio AM 870 in Los Angeles. [00:02:08] Felice, welcome back to Parents Are Hard To Raise. Felice Gersh, MD [00:02:11] Oh, it’s great to be back. Diane Berardi [00:02:13] We’re so happy to have you and you’re always an amazing wealth of cutting edge information. So tell us, what you have for us this week? Felice Gersh, MD [00:02:22] Oh it’s an amazing therapy that is just not utilized anywhere near enough. It’s called The Sun. Our beautiful sun is really medicine and it’s it’s so sad as people get old even you know of course young people often don’t get out. They wake up in the dark, they turn on a fluorescent type of a light bulb and then they spend their day indoors. You hardly get to be outside and now we know that there’s tremendous medical health benefits from being exposed to sunlight. Diane Berardi [00:02:59] Wow. I love the sun. I always feel better in the sun. Felice Gersh, MD [00:03:04] Exactly. And it’s so unfortunate that, I know well-meaning dermatologists all over the country have said, avoid the sun. And if you do go out make sure you cover up every bit of skin… Diane Berardi [00:03:17] Yes! [laughing]. Felice Gersh, MD [00:03:17] Wear sunglasses and put on sunscreen everywhere you possibly can. And we now know that there are actually children that are developing rickets which is amazing. That’s severe deprivation deficiency of vitamin D. And they’re actually of soft bones because their parents are trying to do the right thing. [00:03:39] But now we know that we need to expose our eyes, that we have special receptors for light in our eyes, that actually help to set our circadian master clock that sits atop the optic nerve in our brain. And that when sunlight hits our skin it’s like magic. And it really now has been found to be related to a whole host of medical issues that can be either ameliorated or even prevented by having sunlight. Diane Berardi [00:04:09] Really? I know because that’s all you hear. You know stay out of the sun…stay out of the sun. Felice Gersh, MD [00:04:15] So I’m saying go out and see the sun. But don’t get a burn. So we’re not advocating that I go out and you know get toasted. But the the data, and I can go through with just a few of things. We can start with just mood, because you said right off the top you said I feel better… Diane Berardi [00:04:35] Yes. Felice Gersh, MD [00:04:36] When I’m out in the sun. And there is so much published data on the sun and the sunlight actually improving mood. And it’s not just the people who live in the very dark climate, the dark parts of the world, you know where the sun doesn’t rise until the middle of the day. Diane Berardi [00:04:53] Right. Felice Gersh, MD [00:04:54] And that’s seasonal affective disorder. That particular group is known, like for example, people who live in the northern part of Europe like in Sweden and Norway, where they see the beautiful lights at night in the winter but they don’t see any sunlight. Diane Berardi [00:05:09] Right. Right. Felice Gersh, MD [00:05:10] That they have a very, very high incidence of Seasonal Affective Disorder because they just don’t get enough sunlight. And that is actually not related to vitamin D that’s a whole different ball of wax. And that’s actually the Sun going into the receptors in our eye actually helps our, like I mentioned, our circadian rhythm. It actually helps to produce the “feel good” neurotransmitter serotonin. Diane Berardi [00:05:38] Okay. Felice Gersh, MD [00:05:39] So we actually we get sunlight, and this is of course not just in that area of the world, but all over it, because people are living in the dark. You know they because they close their blinds or they wear sunglasses every time they go out. Diane Berardi [00:05:52] Right. Felice Gersh, MD [00:05:52] And they actually don’t get the sun going into their eyes. So we don’t want to always wear sunglasses. We want to have at least 15- 30 minutes every day of just bright light going into our eyes. [00:06:06] I don’t mean like you staring at the sun. [laughing] [00:06:07] Right. [laughing] Felice Gersh, MD [00:06:08] We’re not we’re not trying to destroy our Optic Nerve, either. But we want to just be outside and let the sunlight naturally come into our eyes. Just by doing things, by walking outside and that is amazing. By increasing our serotonin. And serotonin is the precursor of melatonin. [00:06:27] So I’m sure you’ve had this experience. I know I have. When you go out and you spend the day at the beach, you know in the sun, or you’re going out, like here I’m in Disneyland or you go out you know you you go off to Jones Beach or something. Right? Diane Berardi [00:06:40] Right. Felice Gersh, MD [00:06:41] And at the end of the day you just want to fall asleep. Diane Berardi [00:06:43] Yes. Felice Gersh, MD [00:06:44] You haven’t done anything particularly exertional but you just, and you sleep like a baby. Diane Berardi [00:06:49] Yes. Felice Gersh, MD [00:06:49] That’s because you made all that serotonin during the day and at night is converted into melatonin. And you get wonderful, restorative sleep. [00:07:00] So when you get out in the sun you’ll sleep so much better at night. And look what happens to elderly people. They have mood disorders, right? [00:07:09] They have sleep disorders and most of them really don’t get out much in the sun. Diane Berardi [00:07:14] No. You’re right. [00:07:15] Yeah. And the family and the caregivers they don’t realize what they’re doing. [00:07:19] You know by keeping them indoors and not really getting them out in the sun. Or if they do go out they put on a giant hat and sunglasses. [laughing]. Diane Berardi [00:07:28] We cover them up! [laughing] Felice Gersh, MD [00:07:29] I know. Exactly [laughing] [00:07:31] I took a walk this morning and I took it you know by the beach and some people are so covered up. Felice Gersh, MD [00:07:39] Yeah. Diane Berardi [00:07:40] Yes. They have these hats on that look like they’re on the desert or you know in Saudi Arabia. Felice Gersh, MD [00:07:45] Right, right. They’re covered up completely. Diane Berardi [00:07:48] Completely. And I’m thinking, Oh my gosh! [00:07:50] But there’s not even any… Their eyes or… Everything is covered. [laughing] Felice Gersh, MD [00:07:55] It’s very sad. [00:07:56] And then the other like link. Serotonin is also linked to cognition. [00:08:02] Oh my goodness. So… [00:08:04] Actually going to be smarter if we get out in the sun. And it lowers dementia. It actually is significantly beneficial for cognitive health. Diane Berardi [00:08:16] Wow. And we don’t. We don’t bring our parents. We don’t have them come out. Come sit outside. We just don’t do that. [00:08:25] Well hopefully this is the day it’s going to start for everyone. For yourselves, for your kids, for your parents, you know. And then when you walk around you’re going to be like me. Like I always say, Get that soda out of your hands! You know I want to say that. I have to restrain myself. [00:08:40] And now I want to say, “Take off that hat.!” You know, c’mon. [laughing] “Put away that sunblock.” It’s not really good anyway it’s full of toxins. [00:08:50] So… You know, be reasonable. You know, right? And recognize for example, we all have different ethnic backgrounds and different types of skin. So the amount of time that you can spend in the sun is variable depending on on your skin type. So if you have very dark skin in order to actually burn you would need to be out a lot longer than somebody who is extremely fair skin. So you know you have to use judgment. That’s why you can’t like say, I can’t give a prescription like.. “You, whoever you are out there, you know, you can be out in the sun for this many minutes.” But if you start to turn a little bit pink it’s time to cover up. Diane Berardi [00:09:28] Right. Right. Felice Gersh, MD [00:09:28] Just a little bit of pink color and it’s time to stop. And so we know that there’s light going into the brain creating serotonin it’s going to make you happier, sleep better and smarter. [00:09:42] It’s actually going to also lower your blood pressure, when you get out in the sun, in a very good way. Now it does make you hypotensive, that you pass out. Diane Berardi [00:09:50] Right. Felice Gersh, MD [00:09:51] It makes you have normalized blood pressure. Because it actually, when the sunlight hits your skin, it actually increases the production of a very critical, sort of a transmitter. It’s made out of gas. It’s called nitric oxide. And nitric oxide causes blood vessels to stay healthy and dilated rather than constricted, which is obviously you don’t want your blood vessels all constricted all the time. Diane Berardi [00:10:16] Right. Felice Gersh, MD [00:10:16] So, going out and getting sun on your skin is actually a treatment for hypertension. How wonderful is that? Diane Berardi [00:10:23] Yeah. I had no idea. Felice Gersh, MD [00:10:25] Yeah. And nitric oxide actually helps with the health of the heart. So it’s actually good for heart health. So that’s like… It’s amazing. It truly is medicine. And we have forgotten all about it. We evolved on planet Earth to be out in the sun. And we just have become you know covered up, indoor creatures. And look our health has suffered. [00:10:49] And it actually also increases energy and stamina. So when people go out in the sun on a regular basis they actually have more energy. [00:10:58] And let’s think about all the elderly people in our lives and all the problems they have. They almost all of them have hypertension. Diane Berardi [00:11:05] Right. Felice Gersh, MD [00:11:05] By age 75, 85 percent of women have hypertension. Blood pressure is high and they need to be on medications all of which have some associated problem. So you know. [00:11:20] And just think, maybe some of that many people are on three or four drugs or a blood pressure they don’t even realize it because they put all the drugs in one pill, the “polypill” they think they’re taking one thing, they’re actually taking three or four. [00:11:33] But just getting out in the sun is going to help with their energy and elderly people have low energy. It’s going to help with their mood, which is such a problem. Their cognitive function goes down and you know just everything. There’s sleep, which is so problematic. So it’s amazing. And there’s even more to talk about because sunlight is just magic. Diane Berardi [00:11:59] Yes. And you know it’s true. Every Sunday I try to just sit outside you know in the sun with a book and just try to clear my head and just relax. And then I always sleep really well. And I always say, Oh the sun must make me very tired. Felice Gersh, MD [00:12:17] Well it makes you make all that delicious melatonin that you need. [00:12:23] And so many people are taking melatonin. Diane Berardi [00:12:25] Right. As a supplement. Felice Gersh, MD [00:12:26] And I’m not against that per say but let’s try. You know I’m all about trying to enable the body to do what it’s naturally designed to do, to optimize health. And even taking herbs and vitamins and that’s a hormone. You know if you have to you have to. But… Why don’t we try everything first to have the body get everything the way it’s naturally designed. Like get your nutrients, as much as possible, by eating incredibly healthy food you know. Diane Berardi [00:12:55] Right. Felice Gersh, MD [00:12:56] You know get all the different things that you need by getting outside, getting the melatonin, the serotonin and so forth. So it’s it’s really such amazing medicine. [00:13:07] And it’s been really interesting as well, because people talk about all the incidence of skin cancer is increasing. And actually you know skin cancer is the number one cancer. It’s the most common cancer. Fortunately most types of skin cancer are not fatal. The really serious one that is a killer is is the melanomas. But the thing that’s so shocking is that the incidence in the increased use of sunscreens correlates with the increased incidence of malignant melanomas. Diane Berardi [00:13:42] Wow! Felice Gersh, MD [00:13:42] You would think, Oh my goodness we probably have all these skin cancers because we’re out in the sun. Actually we have a lot of skin cancers because we’re not in the sun. Melanomas often happen in areas that never ever see the sun. Diane Berardi [00:13:56] Oh my gosh. We’re going to continue talking with Dr. Felice Gersh. [00:14:00] But first, if you’re a woman or there’s a woman in your life there’s something you absolutely need to know. [00:14:06] I want to tell you about my friend Katie. Katie is a nurse and she was attacked on her way home from work. She was totally taken by surprise. And although Katie is only 5 feet tall and 106 pounds she was easily able to drop her 6 foot 4, 250-pound attacker to his knees and get away unharmed. Katie wasn’t just lucky that day. She was prepared. In her pocketbook, a harmless looking lipstick, which really contained a powerful man stopping aerosol propellant. It’s not like it was in our grandmother’s day. Today just going to and from work or to the mall can have tragic consequences. The FBI says a violent crime is committed every 15 seconds in the United States. And a forcible rape happens every five minutes. And chances are when something happens, no one will be around to help. It looks just like a lipstick. So no one will suspect a thing. Which is important since experts say, getting the jump on your attacker is all about the element of surprise. Inside this innocent looking lipstick is the same powerful stuff used by police and the military to disarm even the most powerful, armed aggressor. In fact, National Park rangers used the very same formula that’s inside this little lipstick to stop two-thousand pound vicious grizzly bears dead in their tracks. It’s like carrying a personal bodyguard with you in your purse or your pocket. Darkness brings danger. Murderers and rapists use darkness to their advantage. We all know what it’s like to be walking at night and hear footsteps coming at us from behind. Who’s there? If it’s somebody bad, will you be protected? Your life may depend on it. My friend Katie’s close call needs to be a wake up call for all of us. Myself included. Pick up a Lipstick Bodyguard and keep it with you always. Announcer [00:16:01] You’re listening to Parents Are Hard To Raise. Now thanks to you, The number one eldercare talk show on planet Earth. Listen to this and other episodes on demand using the iHeart Radio app. iPhone users can listen on Apple podcasts and Android users on Google podcasts. [00:16:22] Want a great new way to listen to the show? Just say, Alexa, play Parents Are Hard To Raise podcast. Alexa [00:16:30] Getting the latest episode of Parents Are Hard To Raise here it is from my heart radio. Announcer [00:16:35] It’s as simple as that. Diane Berardi [00:16:37] You’re right Dolly. There are so many really cool new ways to listen to our show. It’s hard to keep track. You can join the 180 million listeners on Spotify. You can listen in your car, at the gym, or pretty much anywhere on your smartphone with Apple podcasts and Google podcasts. You can get us an Apple TV, Direct TV, Roku. And like Dolly said, you can even ask Alexa to play the show for you. It’s great because you don’t have to be tied to a radio anymore. You can listen when you want, where you want, for as long as you want. And if you’re listening to the show on one of these new ways please do me a big favor. Share this new technology. Help someone else learn about the show and show them a new way to listen. [00:17:20] So Felice, you were talking about sunscreen. Felice Gersh, MD [00:17:24] Right. That what happens is when the sun hits the skin it’s like magical processes occur. And we know that the sun is is very critical for the production in our bodies of vitamin D, which is like a pre hormone and it’s a very potent like antioxidant it’s involved in bone health which we can talk about because we certainly know that we need healthy bones. But it’s involved in just about everything relating to the immune system. [00:17:52] Well malignant melanoma of course is a cancer and you need to have a healthy immune system to not get a cancer. Well Vitamin D, low levels of vitamin D, when people don’t get out in the sun, has been associated with increased risk of a whole host of cancers. And having adequate vitamin D in the body has been associated with reduced incidence of colon cancer, Hodgkin’s lymphoma, ovarian cancer, pancreatic cancer, prostate cancer. [00:18:21] So, I know and… And so when people stay out of the sun they say, I’m not going to get skin cancer like melanoma. They don’t realize that they’re actually impairing their immune systems. [00:18:33] And in addition, when you hit the skin with that beautiful sunlight it makes other antioxidants as well. It’s not just Vitamin D it’s way more complex. You get a whole host of these wonderful antioxidants that circulate through the body by helping to prevent oxidative stress free radicals that can lead to DNA breakage and cancer. So sunlight is anti-cancer and that’s why we get more melanomas when we’re out of the sun. [00:19:03] But we don’t want get burned. But we have to be… We’ve gone from one extreme to the other, and we have to get back to where the science is. And that is that you do need to get sunlight to have a healthy immune system. That you make all these antioxidants along with vitamin D. [00:19:20] And bones now are suffering tremendously as well. Because most people do know you need vitamin D for healthy bones, you need calcium and magnesium and you need proper protein and so forth. And of course exercise. Well, you need it all. You need it all. You can’t like, well like, we’ll make this incredible recipe but we’ll leave out just one critical ingredient. [00:19:40] It doesn’t it matter. Well it does matter. [00:19:41] And if you don’t get enough vitamin D then you’re not going to have healthy bones. And even like young people, they’re checking. Oh, I have osteopenia. Yeah. You’re you’re like 40. You’re not supposed to have osteopenia. You just never, you didn’t lose bone, you’re not in menopause. You are you’re not elderly. You just didn’t make enough. And so we really, really need to get our children out in the sun and stop covering them with sunblock, but just preventing burns. [00:20:09] So it’s all that using good due diligence and using your commonsense about you know getting too much out. We know in terms of the immune system, that when people, and this is particularly women, but men also but fewer you know in terms of percentages, multiple sclerosis. [00:20:28] Though multiple sclerosis has been heavily associated with low levels of vitamin D. And they’ve actually shown that there’s more incidents in northern climates where they don’t get enough sun. [00:20:39] And now it doesn’t matter where you live. Because you could live where I am in sunny Southern California but you don’t go out outside. [laughing] You know, or when you go, you’re totally covered up any way. [00:20:48] And now people in their work often are in cubicles and elderly people are in homes or assisted living facilities where they don’t really get a lot of sun. [00:20:59] And it’s really amazing. There were actually studies that after surgery if you take the patient and you put them on the side of the hospital, where you have a good sized windows and you get the sun light. So the sunny side of the hospital. They need less pain medication. [00:21:18] It’s been proven. You have less pain. Look how many elderly people suffer from chronic pain. Yes sunlight is magic for pain. And now they of course they have devices you can go out and buy devices or pay to have devices used on you with light you know the light emitting diode devices L.E.D lights. And they come, and you can pay money that be under the lights. Well, you can also go out in the sun. [00:21:44] [laughing] [00:21:44] But you know but they actually now have studies showing that you can use light emitting devices to reduce pain and inflammation because of course pain and inflammation are really one and the same thing. [00:21:57] So just think what we could do for our elderly beloved relatives. Get them out in the sun. They’ll recover faster if they have surgery. They’ll have less pain. She’ll be happier. Les depression. Sleep better. They’ll think straighter. [00:22:12] And also they found that after someone has a heart attack if they’re in a sunny part of the hospital, they get out and they have maybe a sunroom or something like that. Some hospitals now have sunrooms. [00:22:23] Yes. [00:22:24] They’re usually empty or it used as storage. Diane Berardi [00:22:26] Right. You’re right. No that’s true. Felice Gersh, MD [00:22:27] But if they get out in that sunny area they actually recover faster from a heart attack. Diane Berardi [00:22:32] Wow. And something simple and natural as the sun. Just going outside. Felice Gersh, MD [00:22:40] It is. And we were talking a little bit on the break about New York City. A lot of people live in very populous areas with big buildings. And there actually is a term for people who live in those big urban areas. It’s called Global Dimming. And it’s people who live in big cities where the buildings are blocking the sun right. [00:23:01] And in creating this sort of greyness they actually have a reduced exposure to the sun. So you really have to make an effort to find open spaces. Like in New York you know get to Central Park. Where there are areas where there aren’t as many big buildings or if you can do an excursion out to Long Island or to the Jersey Shore or something. Diane Berardi [00:23:20] Right. Felice Gersh, MD [00:23:20] You know to get or wherever you live go to where there’s some open space where there aren’t just big buildings blocking the sun. I mean because global dimming is causing global badness you know in the mood and all aspects of health. [00:23:36] So and think about children who live in areas where they you know even when they go outside there the sun is blocked by the big buildings. Diane Berardi [00:23:43] Right. Felice Gersh, MD [00:23:43] So we have to think about these things when we do urban planning of course you know like don’t make it so that the sun can’t get to the street. Diane Berardi [00:23:52] Right. Exactly. Yeah. Oh my gosh. I know,. Felice Gersh, MD [00:23:56] It’s amazing. Diane Berardi [00:23:56] It is amazing. You know and that’s interesting because my mom tends to… She just sits in the dark. She just wants to be in the dark. She just you know, and I’m thinking, wow… Felice Gersh, MD [00:24:11] You know there are people that they eat junk food and it’s all they crave. You know sometimes the body just gets into a bad rut. Diane Berardi [00:24:18] Right. Felice Gersh, MD [00:24:19] You just have to just put someone in a wheelchair and just get out. So I have a mother in law. She’s amazing. She’s over a hundred. Diane Berardi [00:24:27] Oh my Gosh! Felice Gersh, MD [00:24:28] She’s heading towards… I know! It’s really, isn’t that amazing. Diane Berardi [00:24:31] Yes. Felice Gersh, MD [00:24:31] She is. And we take her out to restaurants every weekend. And my husband takes her out every weekend. And we have a beautiful lake here where I live in Irvine. It’s pretty. It’s a man made, but It’s really pretty. We have all these ducks. And he takes her on it. She can’t walk all around it. She can walk but not that far. So, she’s in a wheelchair and he will tour all around in the sunlight. You know and without the hat and without the sunglasses, and just wheels her around and looks at the ducks. And it’s out in the bright sun. It’s like a half an hour. So, and then puts on the hat again and puts on the sunglasses again. But I’ll tell you it just is so mood lifting and it’s just it’s just amazing. I mean of course she’s unique. How many people get to be over 100? Diane Berardi [00:25:20] That’s wonderful. Felice Gersh, MD [00:25:21] She has one tiny dose of a blood pressure pill. That’s it. And but we do try to get her out my. Who lived to 98. He took a walk out in the sun every day of his life. [00:25:33] Oh my Gosh. [00:25:36] He took his constitutional walk out in the sun and he didn’t really know why it was good for him. He just knew it felt good. Diane Berardi [00:25:43] I was going to say, he felt better. Felice Gersh, MD [00:25:44] Always. Always. He didn’t feel good if he missed his daily walk out in the sun or if it was a rainy day or something and he couldn’t do it. He was like, Oh. Gives you the blues you know. Diane Berardi [00:25:53] Sure. Yeah. [00:25:56] And so it’s so, so important you know for so many aspects of health. [00:26:01] And if people have certain skin conditions that can actually be helpful. People who have psoriasis or acne, if they get a little bit of sun it actually improves. It reduces the inflammatory state of the skin and it actually can help clear the skin. So we just have to recognize that there’s just magic in our sun and we have to use it that way as is true medicine. [00:26:24] We now talk about we’re going back to where we were from 2000 years ago with Hippocrates, that food is medicine. Diane Berardi [00:26:31] Yeah. Felice Gersh, MD [00:26:31] Now we have to actually spread the word that sunlight is medicine. Diane Berardi [00:26:38] Oh my gosh, such a basic thing. I remember being a kid, we were always outside. You know, playing in the sun and I don’t remember… We didn’t put sunscreen on all the time. Felice Gersh, MD [00:26:48] Well I can tell you that when I was a kid we didn’t have sunscreen. [laughing] [00:26:52] And then I remember they came out with the first one which I think was like Coppertone Eight. You know number eight or something. You know now they have one hundred. Right? for sunscreen. Diane Berardi [00:27:04] Right. I remember… Felice Gersh, MD [00:27:06] Not one bit can get it. Diane Berardi [00:27:07] Yeah. I remember my sister with baby oil. [laughing] Felice Gersh, MD [00:27:13] Oh well you know what I’ll tell you… When I was a kid, having a tan was considered like, like, “the thing.” Diane Berardi [00:27:20] Yes. Right. Felice Gersh, MD [00:27:21] Oh my gosh. If you had a tan you were “Somebody.” So I would go out in my backyard with a sun reflector. [laughing] Don’t ask. [laughing] I know. [00:27:30] Do not do that! [laughing] You do not follow that habit. Yeah. Because I wanted to accelerate the process. I got a few really nasty burns, which I’ve lived to regret, but so that is not the way to do it. [laughing]. Diane Berardi [00:27:43] Right. Yeah. [laughing]. Felice Gersh, MD [00:27:45] There’s the right way, and there is no wrong way. [laughing] [00:27:46] But now look at kids. [00:27:48] They come home from school and they go on social media. Diane Berardi [00:27:50] Right. Felice Gersh, MD [00:27:51] They’re in playing on their computers. Diane Berardi [00:27:52] Yup. Exactly. Felice Gersh, MD [00:27:53] So, all you parents out there who have their elderly parents. They may have grandkids or their own kids. Right? They need to get out in the sun. Kids are not out playing enough. You know the parents are so afraid of everything now and we have to let kids go out and play. When I was a kid. I would just go home and then my mom, you know no cell phones, she didn’t know where I was. [laughing] Diane Berardi [00:28:13] Right. Felice Gersh, MD [00:28:14] She didn’t like worry. She’d just say OK. Go out and play. Come home by dinner. Diane Berardi [00:28:18] Right. And that’s what we did. Felice Gersh, MD [00:28:19] And I’d go off on my bike. I know, it was a different world. And we would go and we would just play, and we play kickball in the street, and we just would you know just explore and be outside. And you know now, the incidence of autoimmune disease in kids is just astronomical, of course at all ages. [00:28:39] And we know that there is a correlation as I said with the immune system and sunlight. And not getting enough sun can actually increase your risk of so many immune related problems, not just cancers, but autoimmune. Like we said, multiple sclerosis. That’s on the tip of the iceberg. Diane Berardi [00:28:55] Yeah. Felice Gersh, MD [00:28:55] So we need to just realize that it’s just part of who we are. If we took animals and stuck them in a dark cave for their whole lives we would think that was cruelty to animals. Let’s not do that to ourselves. Diane Berardi [00:29:09] You’re right. Oh my gosh. Felice thank you so much. Felice Gersh, MD [00:29:13] My pleasure. Diane Berardi [00:29:13] And how can we reach you? How can our listeners reach you? Felice Gersh, MD [00:29:18] Well I have a medical practice, a brick and mortar practice, in Irvine California. I do see people from all over the country and the world. And my Web site is IntegrativeMGI.com. Diane Berardi [00:29:33] Thank you so much. [00:29:34] And Parents Are Hard To Raise family… I love getting your e-mails and questions, so please keep sending them. You can reach me at Diane at Parents Are Hard To Raise dot org or just click the green button on our home page. [00:29:45] Parents Are Hard To Raise is a CounterThink media production. The music used in this broadcast was managed by Cosmo Music, New York, New York. Our New York producer is Joshua Green. Our broadcast engineer is Well Gambino. And from our London studios, the melodic voice of our announcer, Miss Dolly D. [00:30:01] We love our parents but they sure are hard to raise. [00:30:06] Thank you so much for listening. [00:30:07] Till next time… May you forget everything you don’t want to remember and remember everything you don’t want to forget. [00:30:13] Now I want everyone to go out and sit in the sun. [laughing] [00:30:17] See you again next week! Downloadable PDF of the Show Transcript Parents_Are_Hard_To_Raise_S03_Episode_129 Listen to this episode… just click play on the player below
Transcribe →Youth Caregivers… The Shocking Truth Christa Haanstra and Dr. Connie Siskowski Episode #127
Sep 10, 201900:29:29Tap to summarizeListen to this episode… just click play on the player below Youth Caregivers…The Shocking Truth When you hear the phrase “Family Caregiver” hardly anyone pictures an eight year old, but it’s estimated there are millions of caregivers ages 8-18 in the United States alone. And they are all but invisible. But thankfully that’s changing. This week on Parents Are Hard To Raise, Dr. Connie Siskowski- founder of the American Association of Caregiving Youth and Christa Haanstra, of the Change Foundation in Ontario, Canada join Diane for an eye-opening discussion you don’t want to miss. Here Are Some Handy Links To The People, Products, Books, Services and Resources Discussed On This Episode Take Diane with you… and listen whenever you want, wherever you want, and how often you want, on your smartphone or tablet. It’s easy… Just click any of the links below Listen with the iHeart Radio App iPhone Users Click This Link Android Phone Users Click This Link Follow Diane on Social Media Click the Links Below Show Transcript Parents Are Hard To Raise® S03 Episode 127 Transcript [00:00:00] The world is becoming a dangerous place for us women. Lipstick Bodyguard looks just like an innocent little lipstick but it will instantly drop any attacker to his knees so you can get away unharmed. Lipstick Bodyguard fear no evil. Get yours today only at LipstickBodyguard.com. [00:00:37] When you hear the phrase family caregiver hardly anyone pictures an 8-year old, but it’s estimated there are millions of caregivers ages 8 to 18 in the United States alone and they are all but invisible. But thankfully that’s changing. This week on Parents Are Hard To Raise, Dr. Connie Siskowski founder of the American Association of Caregiving Youth and Christa Haanstra of the Change Foundation in Ontario, Canada join Diane for an eye opening discussion you don’t want to miss. [00:01:08] Join 180 million monthly subscribers who can now listen to Parents Are Hard To Raise on Spotify. Diane Berardi [00:01:28] Welcome to Parents Are Hard To Raise… Helping families grow older together without losing their minds. I’m elder care expert Diane Berardi. [00:01:37] What’s it like to take care of multiple family members at age 15? Due to an ever growing need, the lack of professional caregivers and limited financial resources family caregivers have become important members of the health care team. When we think of caregivers we typically picture adult family members or close friends. However surprisingly, today’s caregivers can also be children as young as eight years old. In the absence of available adults more and more children are being asked to sacrifice their education, health, well-being and childhood to provide care to a loved one. After discovering that one in four middle and high school students in Palm Beach County were academically impacted by caregiving, Dr. Connie Siskowski decided it was time to do something about it. She founded the American Association of Caregiving Youth based in Boca Raton, Florida, here in the U.S.. Dr. Siskowski is here along with Christa Haanstra of the Change Foundation in Ontario, Canada to talk about the role of the youth caregiver. Connie, welcome to Parents Are Hard To Raise. And Christa, Welcome back. Dr. Connie Siskowski [00:02:53] Thank you. Christa Haanstra [00:02:53] Thank You. Diane Berardi [00:02:55] We’re so happy that you’re here and Parents Are Hard To Raise family you’ll remember Christa from episode 111 where she introduced us to the amazing work going on at the Change Foundation. And to our new listeners… Be sure to listen to that episode in our archives. [00:03:11] So Connie, tell me what happened that led you to the work you guys are doing in Florida. Dr. Connie Siskowski [00:03:18] Well when I was in middle school I took care of my grandfather as his health declined and I was the one who found him no longer breathing when I went to give him his medication at 2 o’clock in the morning. Diane Berardi [00:03:32] My gosh. Dr. Connie Siskowski [00:03:33] And it was… No one really you know talk about trauma and children at that time. Years ago. Diane Berardi [00:03:41] Sure. Dr. Connie Siskowski [00:03:41] And so it really impacted my life later. [00:03:46] And that’s one of the things that we see that the trauma that the kids experience today may come up in a year or two years or even more. So when I was remarried and went back to school to get my PhD. this was my research project. I didn’t really intend it to be, but once we learned the data I just had this overwhelming feeling of being compelled to do something about it. Diane Berardi [00:04:19] It’s unbelievable when I learned the statistics we just are not aware of youth caregivers. Dr. Connie Siskowski [00:04:28] Well the work that they do is really behind closed doors. So you know why would you be aware? It’s nothing. We’re supposed to be taking care of children they’re not supposed to be taking care of us. Diane Berardi [00:04:39] That’s right. It’s so true. And I suppose their parents, grandparents everyone’s living longer. I mean it’s just… It’s just kind of a domino effect. Dr. Connie Siskowski [00:04:49] Right. And because we have more grandparents raising grandchildren because of the opioid issues as well as more single parent households. And what happens when that single parent gets sick? And you know also with the mobility of families you don’t have that cultural support that we used to have. Diane Berardi [00:05:12] Yeah. Christa Haanstra [00:05:15] In Ontario what we also see is that the siblings of those with developmental disabilities. [00:05:22] Because again of the medical advances some of those people who may have not lived as long as they do now. The siblings are having to step in and provide that care when their parents no longer can or have passed on themselves. And so that’s also a piece of the young career puzzle. Dr. Connie Siskowski [00:05:40] It’s complex. Diane Berardi [00:05:42] Yeah. It boggles my mind. I mean you know trying to piece this all together. How do you define a youth caregiver? [00:05:51] Well it’s any child ages 8 to 18 although the population we deal with primarily starts at 11 years. And they can be providing a variety of activities of daily living including personal care or instrumental activities of daily living. And they do some things such as administering and managing medications that even in our country home health aides are not permitted to do. Diane Berardi [00:06:21] You’re right. It’s unbelievable. Do you find it the same in Canada, Christa. Christa Haanstra [00:06:27] Yeah, we use a similar definition and we actually call them “young carers” here in Canada, drawing from the term that they use in the U.K.. And we see them as young as five and we certainly find young carers as up to 24. So the idea that when they’re transitioning into adulthood that still a young age to be providing that kind of care and support. [00:06:52] And one of the trends we see in Ontario with young carers is that a lot of them in addition to what Connie mentioned is they play a translation role within the health care system for their parents. So if there new immigrants or they don’t, or English isn’t the first language of the person they’re caring for. It’s sort of a default role for young carers. And although we see that across all caregivers the number of young carers who do that is higher than amongst the general caregiving population. Diane Berardi [00:07:22] And you were saying five years old. Christa Haanstra [00:07:25] Yes. Five years old. And to talk about the complexity one when we talk about that some of the care as Connie said is behind closed doors, but right there’s also fear around talking about the role of caregiving in youth because of the possibility for child protection services to be questioning that or whether that could be interpreted as inappropriate. And so it is a complex situation because it’s invisible but also there is fear about talking about it publicly as well. Diane Berardi [00:08:00] I can imagine because the parent for instance or the child will be afraid they’ll be removed from the home. Christa Haanstra [00:08:06] That’s right. There is that fear. Dr. Connie Siskowski [00:08:07] Yeah exactly. There’s that fear and at least in the US there’s also that immigration fear. So and but so many people just don’t understand. So that’s why this program is so important. [00:08:20] We met with one congress person in our office to try and educate him and he said, Well children shouldn’t be doing this. You know they should be in foster care. [00:08:30] And it’s just out of ignorance and not understanding that with support they can do so well. And that children we work with are in the highest what we call levels of responsibility. So they spend at least 20 hours a week and typically do one activity of daily living in their work. Diane Berardi [00:08:54] I can’t even imagine you know getting up. You know they have to get up so much earlier go to school. I mean they probably can’t do sports or after school activities and come home. And they probably, while they’re in school they’re worried about what’s going on at home. Dr. Connie Siskowski [00:09:10] Exactly. And there is a commercial that said… It was for a security system and it said, you know when you’re worried about what’s going on at home it’s impossible to learn or think about anything else. And I said, That’s our kids. Diane Berardi [00:09:23] Oh my gosh such a burden. I can’t even imagine. I mean what you’re doing is remarkable for these kids because they had to feel isolated. Christa Haanstra [00:09:36] One of the interesting stories we have here in Ontario is a young girl who told her story in the media. And it ended up getting quite prominent coverage in our national paper. And her art teacher at school read the story and said to her, Oh is this why you don’t come to our after school art club because I know you love art. And this young girl said, Absolutely I can’t go after school I have to go home. And so that teacher switched the art club to Fridays at lunch and something as simple as that allows her to be involved in art as her passion with other kids, when she couldn’t before. And there are things that are as simple as that, that can make such a big difference. And of course there are fundamental policy and awareness and understanding issues that need to be tackled as well. But it’s not all… It’s across a continuum of things that can happen to make a real difference for these young carers. Diane Berardi [00:10:35] Oh yeah. [00:10:38] Connie… What do we know about the numbers of youth caregivers in the US? Dr. Connie Siskowski [00:10:43] Well I wish we knew more. The only national data we have that showed that there were at least one point three million children was released in 2005. And then there was a study funded by the Gates Foundation called “the silent epidemic,” released in 2006 and it showed that among young adults who dropped out of school 22 percent said it was to care for a family member. [00:11:06] So not only is academic underachievement or dropout a concern within grades up through high school but also it’s a factor in college incompletion. So with Christa you going up to age 25 you can perhaps help in that population. Christa Haanstra [00:11:33] In Ontario which is one province within Canada, we have three point three million family caregivers and of those 17 are between the 17 percent or between the ages of 15 and 24. So that’s the stats we have. But as we just talked about a number of the stories we’ve already talked about the youth are younger than 15 and we do not have statistics for those under 15 for multiple reasons but we know that this is a huge underestimate of the number of youth who are involved in some kind of caregiving. Diane Berardi [00:12:07] Yeah. Dr. Connie Siskowski [00:12:09] And thankfully in the United States finally the military is taking a look at children as caregivers of military families. So they’re looking at some data. So we’ll have better estimates. And also in Florida there is a study that is called the “Youth Risk Behavior Survey,” that’s really under the I guess the motherhood of CDC. And that was administered in the spring of this year so to middle and high school students. So we’ll have a better estimate of prevalence at least in Florida which can then hopefully be extrapolated to other states in the United States. Diane Berardi [00:12:55] Tell us about the work you’re doing in Florida with the caregiving youth in schools. Dr. Connie Siskowski [00:13:01] So we identify the kids beginning in sixth grade. They take in an eligibility screening and then we meet with them individually once we determine that they’re in the top three of five levels of responsibility, so that we can use our limited resources wisely. And then we do skills building groups. We have a curriculum that we’ve copyrighted that goes from sixth grade through high school as well as we do “Lunch and Learn” sessions so that each month we use a different topic according to the top diagnosis of the care receivers to provide not only the children in our program but others and school staff with information that they need. Because you know you can imagine that if a family has issues with substance misuse that they’re not as likely to get parental consent to for their children to participate. And so in addition to working with the schools we also do a home visit with families that will allow us to and look for ways that we can help the family relieve stress and therefore relieve stress on the child. And we provide fun activities so we have an overnight camp then either fun and educational things so that the kids have time to be a kid because they miss out on that, as we had said, many become isolated. Diane Berardi [00:14:34] Yeah. [00:14:37] We’re going to continue talking with Christa Haanstra of the Change Foundation and Dr. Connie Siskowski of the American Association of Caregiving Youth. But first, if you’re a woman or there’s a woman in your life there’s something you absolutely need to know. [00:14:52] I want to tell you about my friend Katie. Katie is a nurse and she was attacked on her way home from work. She was totally taken by surprise. And although Katie is only 5 feet tall and 106 pounds she was easily able to drop her 6 foot 4, 250-pound attacker to his knees and get away unharmed. Katie wasn’t just lucky that day. She was prepared. In her pocketbook, a harmless looking lipstick, which really contained a powerful man stopping aerosol propellant. It’s not like it was in our grandmother’s day. Today just going to and from work or to the mall can have tragic consequences. The FBI says a violent crime is committed every 15 seconds in the United States. And a forcible rape happens every five minutes. And chances are when something happens, no one will be around to help. It looks just like a lipstick. So no one will suspect a thing. Which is important since experts say, getting the jump on your attacker is all about the element of surprise. Inside this innocent looking lipstick is the same powerful stuff used by police and the military to disarm even the most powerful, armed aggressor. In fact, National Park rangers used the very same formula that’s inside this little lipstick to stop two-thousand pound vicious grizzly bears dead in their tracks. It’s like carrying a personal bodyguard with you in your purse or your pocket. Darkness brings danger. Murderers and rapists use darkness to their advantage. We all know what it’s like to be walking at night and hear footsteps coming at us from behind. Who’s there? If it’s somebody bad, will you be protected? Your life may depend on it. My friend Katie’s close call needs to be a wake up call for all of us. Myself included. Pick up a Lipstick Bodyguard and keep it with you always. Announcer [00:16:50] You’re listening to Parents Are Hard To Raise. Now… Thanks to you, the number one eldercare talk show on planet Earth. Listen to this and other episodes on demand using the iHeart Radio app. iPhone users can listen on Apple podcasts and Android users on Google podcasts. [00:17:11] Waht a great new way to listen to the show? Have an Amazon Echo or Dot? Just say, Alexa play Parents Are Hard To Raise podcast. Alexa [00:17:21] Getting the latest episode of Parents Are Hard To Raise. Here it is from my heart radio. Announcer [00:17:26] It’s as simple as that. Diane Berardi [00:17:28] You’re right Dolly. There are so many really cool new ways to listen to our show. It’s hard to keep track. [00:17:34] You can join the one hundred and eighty million listeners on Spotify. You can listen in your car, at the gym or pretty much anywhere in your smartphone with Apple podcasts and Google podcasts. You can get us an Apple TV, Direct TV, Roku. And like Dolly said, you can even ask Alexa to play the show for you. It’s great because you don’t have to be tied to a radio anymore. [00:17:56] You can listen when you want, where you want, for as long as you want. And if you’re listening to the show one of these new ways please do me a big favor. Share this new technology. Help someone else learn about the show and show them a new way to listen. [00:18:12] Connie I was wondering… Obviously this is not just a problem in Florida. Are there are any other states doing work like you were doing? Dr. Connie Siskowski [00:18:22] Ah, Yes. They’re beginning to. As we began and started sharing some of the information, people from other states had reached in. And so we formed an affiliate network. And that network is growing. [00:18:36] One of our more recent affiliates is in Philadelphia at Temple University where they’re expanding the services of their Intergenerational center. Diane Berardi [00:18:47] OK. Dr. Connie Siskowski [00:18:49] We also began the Caregiving Youth Institute. And through that we have a caregiving youth research collaborative and it’s under the leadership of Dr. Betsy Olson of UNC, Chapel Hill and myself. And her program down there is called “Book and Caregiving” and it’s about children caring for older adults. Arizona and other places are getting on board. Diane Berardi [00:19:13] Anything in New Jersey? Dr. Connie Siskowski [00:19:16] Yes, actually. There’s a couple of things. One is called “Hope loves company” and that’s a disease specific organization. That’s why we work with looking at children caring for a family member with ALS, and the “Family Caregiver Resource Network.” So they’ve had a couple of conferences as has Brookdale foundation that helps with the Respite. So kids need respite too. Diane Berardi [00:19:43] I was going to ask that. [00:19:45] Yeah I was going to say because I know there’s respite for adults taking care of maybe their parents or whatever so there is a kind of respect for children. Dr. Connie Siskowski [00:19:57] Well, we provide respite. And it depends… See one of the issues in our country is that all of the National Family Caregiver Support Program dollars flows… It was attached to the Older Americans Act signed by President Clinton in 2000. So those dollars are funneled through the Department of Elder Affairs. And you know so that the tsunami of adult family caregivers kind of outweighs the children. So we really need to raise their children’s voices and get legislation to support them. [00:20:32] And there is a congressman from Pennsylvania who is interested in working with to write our bill on behalf of teen caregivers. Diane Berardi [00:20:43] That’s wonderful. I guess I can see that. Dr. Connie Siskowski [00:20:47] And I understand it. But children are important to invest in. Not only are they our future but we need health care workers in the future. And if these children are supported properly in their role, then a lot of them want to go into health care, and it makes total sense. Diane Berardi [00:21:07] Oh definitely. Dr. Connie Siskowski [00:21:08] So there’s a workforce development component, also. Diane Berardi [00:21:11] What kind of work is being done in Canada to support the young caregivers. Christa Haanstra [00:21:18] Yeah. So we have also have kind of a variety of programs across our province but they’re very sporadic so they don’t certainly don’t cover all of the province. And we kind of have a flagship program in our Niagara region which borders right on the US, where they provide similar services to what Connie talked about in terms of camps and resilience building programs and skills building programs and just an opportunity for kids to be kids. And most importantly that peer support, so being able to be in a room of other kids where they don’t have to explain anything, why they can’t go to social activities or why they don’t have the same kind of experiences as other youth or don’t go into extracurricular sports or whatever. And so that program has been around for more than 10 years and it’s really the flagship program here in our province. But it reaches only within that specific region. And so we’ve been doing work in this area for the last couple of years and I feel like the tide is shifting in that the awareness is growing around the need to support young caregivers in a variety of ways. And so I feel like I’m hopeful for the future and what that might hold for young carers but there’s certainly a lot of work to be done. Dr. Connie Siskowski [00:22:38] And you know it’s so exciting for the children so once they meet other kids in their own circle, it there could even be somebody from across the street because you know they don’t go to school and say hey guess what I did for grandma this morning. Diane Berardi [00:22:49] Right. Dr. Connie Siskowski [00:22:50] And so then they learn they’re not alone in their school. And then with activities with kids from other schools they make such strong bonds between them. And they keep in touch with each other so that’s really pretty remarkable. Diane Berardi [00:23:04] You know when you finally you meet someone else going through the same thing as a kid you have that bond, that has to be so… such a relief to them. Dr. Connie Siskowski [00:23:15] It is. Diane Berardi [00:23:15] You know and holding hands with another person, with another kid, and you don’t feel so awkward or so… You know, no one knows what I’m going through and isolated. Dr. Connie Siskowski [00:23:29] These are such good kids and they’re compassionate and empathetic. You know they’re really amazing with support and without it they can get frustrated and quit. And you know sometimes siblings don’t feel like you know maybe an older sibling has left home and we’ve had this experience where that his younger sister was caring for his mom who was blinded and he got upset with her that she wasn’t doing enough. Diane Berardi [00:23:55] Oh, my Gosh. Dr. Connie Siskowski [00:23:56] We had to get the police involved. There’s so many nuances. Diane Berardi [00:24:02] Yeah. You don’t think about you know… Dr. Connie Siskowski [00:24:06] And the health care system is unaware, so. Diane Berardi [00:24:09] Right. Dr. Connie Siskowski [00:24:09] One day we did a home visit and a grandmother was discharged from the hospital in a wheelchair. And they lived in a mobile home. So our manufactured home and those stoops are high. And so in order for her to get to the doctor or into a vehicle for transportation they had to lift her in and out and show you know part of the discharge planning and awareness in the health care system just really needs to be raised up so that these things are in place for families so that they can succeed and not become isolated and get the services that they need. Diane Berardi [00:24:47] Yeah that isolation is just, it’s heartbreaking. Christa Haanstra [00:24:52] I think the kids who need us the most are the hardest to find. They’re often the ones who are doing the heaviest load of caregiving and they might be in a single parent home. They might be living in a rural region where the only time they would you know kind of have other interaction is at school. And in Canada, at the moment, we don’t have a lot of awareness in our schools and so they really do go unseen. And that can be very very worrisome. Dr. Connie Siskowski [00:25:23] That’s why we hope to work with Christa and develop a platform of connectivity so that kids from a distance can really work to support each other. Christa Haanstra [00:25:33] Diane you should know that this interview together is going to be the start of a good partnership between the two organizations so I’m really excited about that. Diane Berardi [00:25:42] Oh I’m so glad. You guys are doing such great work and I’m so happy to be you know a help in getting the word out because so many people just don’t know you know they don’t know. I mean you can look at an adult and not even know what’s going on with them. You know someone who maybe can’t go out for a drink after work or do things but you maybe have no idea what’s going on at home. I can’t even imagine for a child. [00:26:14] I think about Diane or sorry Connie was talking about the school programs and those are incredibly important because I think everything we’ve talked about in Ontario, our focus tends to be on the interaction in the health care system, but for young carers we know that they show up mostly in the education system and that’s the easiest and the best place to interact with them. [00:26:37] But the other point the other stories we’ve heard are things like a child who is living in a single family home where the mom has a chronic illness and has had an acute episode of some kind and has called 9 1 1 and the E.M.S. has arrived and they can’t bring the child with them in the back of the ambulance. So the child’s left at home alone, because there’s a policy that you can’t have that other person in the back in. And they were too young and yet it was OK to leave them at home alone. [00:27:06] So you know there’s some real awareness building that needs to start. [00:27:11] And then once we get to a certain level of awareness then it’s about building understanding and services and supports to make sure that we’re providing the youth carers with the support they need so that they can thrive in the future. Because there is a flip side to the young carers coin which is if you meet these young people you will be absolutely blown away by their maturity, their compassion and their ability to handle crisis and challenges. [00:27:43] And we want to we want those youth to be our future leaders. So we definitely need to support them. Dr. Connie Siskowski [00:27:50] And we also need to recognize the trauma that they go through so that as adults that they don’t have you know trauma events that could be otherwise prevented and suffering and poor decisions. So the counseling for them and dealing with the issues they face is so important. Diane Berardi [00:28:09] It definitely is. Thank you so much. On our Web site Parents Are Hard To Raise family’s search for the Change Foundation. [00:28:17] This is Episode 7 in a series. Listen to them all. The incredible work they are doing. This can help all of us, from anywhere in the world. And special thanks to Jocelyn Healy who coordinated all of our special guests from the Change Foundation. [00:28:37] I hope you got something out of this episode. I know I certainly did. Thank you so much for being on the show. Connie and Christa. Christa Haanstra [00:28:46] Thank you. Dr. Connie Siskowski [00:28:48] Thank you so much. Diane Berardi [00:28:49] Parents Are Hard To Raise family I love getting your e-mails and questions. Please keep sending them. You can reach me at Diane at Parents Are Hard To Raise dot org. Or just click the green button on our home page Parents Are Hard To Raise is a CounterThink Media production. The music used on this broadcast was managed by Cosmo Music New York. New York. [00:29:07] Our New York producer is Joshua Green. Our Broadcast engineer is Well Gambino. And from our London studios the melodic voice of our announcer Miss Dolly D. [00:29:17] Thank you so much for listening. Till next time… May you forget everything you don’t want to remember and remember everything you don’t want to forget. [00:29:26] See you again next week! Downloadable PDF of the Show Transcript Parents_Are_Hard_To_Raise_S03_Episode_127 Listen to this episode… just click play on the player below
Transcribe →Eliminating the “Downer” in Downsizing Your Parents- Mary Kay Buysse NASMM Episode #126
Sep 3, 201900:29:04Tap to summarizeListen to this episode… just click play on the player below Senior Move Managers: Who are they & Why are they becoming so Popular with Boomers? Moving our aging parents and sorting through a lifetime full of memories can be quite a daunting task. That’s where a Certified Senior Move Managers can help. This week on Parents Are Hard To Raise Diane’s special guest expert, Mary Kay Buysse, executive director of the National Association of Senior Move Managers tells us how to ease the pain of downsizing the family home. Here Are Some Handy Links To The People, Products, Books, Services and Resources Discussed On This Episode Take Diane with you... and listen whenever you want, wherever you want, and how often you want, on your smartphone or tablet. It's easy... Just click any of the links below Listen with the iHeart Radio App iPhone Users Click This Link Android Phone Users Click This Link Follow Diane on Social Media Click the Links Below Show Transcript Parents Are Hard To Raise® S03 Episode 126 Transcript [00:00:00] The world's becoming a dangerous place for us women. Lipstick Bodyguard looks just like an innocent little lipstick but it will instantly drop any attacker to his knees so you can get away unharmed. Lipstick Bodyguard, fear no evil. Get yours today only at LipstickBodyguard.com. [00:00:37] Moving our aging parents and sorting through a lifetime full of memories can be quite a daunting task. That's where a Certified Senior Move Managers can help. This week on Parents Are Hard To Raise Diane's special guest expert, Mary Kay Buysse, executive director of the National Association of Senior Move Managers tells us how to ease the pain of downsizing the family home. Join 180 million monthly subscribers who can now listen to Parents Are Hard To Raise on Spotify. Diane Berardi [00:01:20] Welcome to Parents Are Hard To Raise. Helping families grow older together without losing their minds. I'm elder care expert Diane Berardi. [00:01:30] Moving is one of the top stressors that a person can experience in a lifetime, right along with divorce loss of a job or loss of a loved one. Whether you move frequently or almost never, moving is an intensely emotional experience. The burdens of the physical move combined with the underlying psychological issues: loss, anxiety, fear, can be overwhelming for any of us. But when you then pile on the additional stressors of having to condense a lifetime full of cherished possessions into a few small boxes and then leave your familiar surroundings behind, along with your friends and neighbors and it's... Well, let's just say it can sap any joy out of what could otherwise be a very exciting new adventure and stage of your life. [00:02:22] Now imagine you're having to go through all of this as an 80-something in frail health and the thought is just unimaginable. Thank goodness there are professionals trained to help. [00:02:34] My guest expert this week has been helping seniors move to their next stage of life for two decades now, and as a gerontologist herself, she understands the special needs of seniors. [00:02:45] Mary Kay Buysse is the executive director of the National Association of Senior Move Managers a consortium of over 1000 professional Senior Move Managers in the US Canada the UK and Australia. Mary Kay, welcome to Parents Are Hard To Raise. Mary Kay Buysse [00:03:04] Thank you Diane. Diane Berardi [00:03:06] We're so glad to have you and my top question for you is what exactly is Senior Move management? [00:03:14] Well, senior room management is a professional field that helps older adults particularly, thus the word senior, to downsize and move in later life. They are the general contractor, the project manager, of what's really a significant task. Taking a home of 30, 40 or 50 years and then or 2000 square feet 20 five hundred square feet a typical American home and downsizing to perhaps 400 square feet in a typical assisted living apartment in the United States today. Diane Berardi [00:03:54] Where do you begin? [laughing] Mary Kay Buysse [00:03:56] Right right. [00:03:57] Well, you begin at the beginning. And the one thing I guess I really would like to make clear is that you really work alongside the older adult and they're interested family members. You are the project manager for sure. [00:04:15] But there's no doubt that the older adult in the family are leading the charge here, so nothing is being done that's not you know being guided by those people. So really the senior move manager does all the hard stuff. They do all the space planning. They do all the connecting with other providers, the moving company, the estate planning company... I'm sorry, the state sales company. All of those individuals. So they do the packing. They do the unpacking. They all of those tasks the physical tasks. And the emotional tasks, they work with the older adults make sure that only the things that they want to go, go. But they also help them sort of, sort through their things. You know, what's really a memento or what's something that can go. They really talk to them about you know, What's have you use this? Or, Let's just identify the key pieces you keep with you. So those are all those kinds of things and it's a long process and it it can be challenging for families to do this on their own. Diane Berardi [00:05:31] Oh gosh yeah. How long does it take you think from start to finish? My gosh, I guess depending on the size of the house. Mary Kay Buysse [00:05:39] Exactly. Exactly. And it you know it depends on the individual who's moving. What are their capacities at their time, what's their stamina? This is not something you know that you can do in two days. Diane Berardi [00:05:55] Right. Mary Kay Buysse [00:05:56] Don't forget, this took this family, this older adult, you know 30 40 50 years to build this home, and it is a home, it's not just a house. It's a home. Diane Berardi [00:06:08] Right. Mary Kay Buysse [00:06:08] It took them that long to build it. So to honor all that went on in that home, it can't be downsized and de-cluttered and moved in to three or four days. It is... It is a process. [00:06:24] And I guess you look at every item you talk to them and say... Because what do you do with the stuff that maybe the family doesn't want and the person does right take with them? That's... Mary Kay Buysse [00:06:34] Well, one of the things that's been really helpful in this digital age is, our senior move managers will take an inventory of the entire contents of the home. Diane Berardi [00:06:43] Okay. Mary Kay Buysse [00:06:46] And for families that are spread out around the country, Senior Move Managers can even put that online so that family members can go to a secure Web site or somewhere else... you know, that a password protected you know site, where the family members can go on there and look and see what they might want and what they may not want. Here's the deal though. Most people don't want our stuff. [00:07:11] Even the people who we have loved and cherish and they love and cherish us. Nobody wants our stuff. Diane Berardi [00:07:17] It's true. [laughing]. Mary Kay Buysse [00:07:18] Yeah, it's true. And you know they love us but they don't love our stuff. And you know it's just... That's just the way it is. So the biggest challenge Senior Move Managers Face in this time and place is where does the stuff go that people don't want? Because even charities are brimming are overflowing. [00:07:39] Goodwill, Salvation Army and you know all of these other charities local charities they're just they're packed to the gills. And so that's an ongoing challenge for everyone. Diane Berardi [00:07:51] Yeah I would imagine. I remember moving an office and I tried to donate to churches. Mary Kay Buysse [00:08:00] Yes. Exactly! [00:08:00] Right. I mean, schools... You know, and I'm like, Oh my gosh! Yeah. But yeah, everybody has this stuff. Mary Kay Buysse [00:08:11] Well, it's hard for us you know to reckon with that. Something we've held dear, whether it's a piano or a vase, a porcelain figurine, a set of china. Any of those things that were dear to our hearts. You know we have to understand both our parents who are in their 80s and 90s and boomers ourselves, us in our 50s and 60s, that our children, the Millennials, don't want this. And they don't want our parents Depression era stuff. [00:08:40] It's just a different world. You know younger people now can outfit a whole home through Target and IKEA. [00:08:51] They don't want their Lenox China. You're not even registering for this stuff anymore when they get married. And you know it's just... It's, it's a different world. Amazon, you know Prime Day was yesterday. Guess what. People outfitted a whole apartment. Right? Diane Berardi [00:09:07] Right. Right. Mary Kay Buysse [00:09:08] So, yeah. So it's not like past times when we built up our home over time we saved for whatever it is that we wanted. You know, pianos that were a centerpiece of life in the 50s, 60s and even the 70s. Nobody wants your piano. Diane Berardi [00:09:29] Really? Mary Kay Buysse [00:09:30] Not even the preschool down the street. No they don't. They just take up too much space. They need a lot of maintenance with tuning, whatever. Unless it's a Steinway or a Baldwin nobody wants it. You can't give it away. So... But tell that to Mrs. Jones who'd spent you know four years in the 1960s making monthly payments on that piano for 20 dollars a month. You know it's something very dear to her. But... [00:10:01] So these are all hard questions. And the senior movie manager is trained to go through the House in a loving, compassionate way where they're honoring this home that was you know, people lived in and grew up in and cherish to this day. [00:10:19] But you know this is difficult work. Going into senior move manager is not for the faint of heart. You are not only dealing with someone's lifetime of possessions, but as you said earlier, you are dealing with people at a very fragile time in their lives. And these are older people, often who as you said, the move is precipitated by a loss of a spouse or some declining health in their own life. So these are all very you know it's a difficult time to enter a family's life. Diane Berardi [00:10:54] Yes. Mary Kay Buysse [00:10:57] And so that's why we're so proud of our Senior Move Managers. They really just do an excellent job. And most of them have come to this through a very personal experience with their own parents or grandparents and saw just how daunting it was. Diane Berardi [00:11:10] Yeah. I was going to ask you, How did this whole senior move management start? Because you know why do we need need you now, and we didn't need you 20 years ago? Mary Kay Buysse [00:11:23] Right. Right. Well, you know so many factors. You know for one thing, we're just not having as many children. So there aren't these families of a kids helping out you know. The other thing is, there's more single people. There are 47 percent of the U.S. population is single right now, whereas in 1960 it was 25 percent. Diane Berardi [00:11:50] Wow. Mary Kay Buysse [00:11:50] So you know the other thing is we are aging along... This for the first time in the history of the world, two generations are aging simultaneously. Diane Berardi [00:12:02] Yes. Mary Kay Buysse [00:12:02] So you're seeing a 92 year mom or dad alongside a 65 year old son or daughter. Diane Berardi [00:12:11] Right. Mary Kay Buysse [00:12:12] So all of these reasons you know kind of made a perfect storm of a why we need outside professional help. Can a family do it themselves? Yes. They can do it. It's being done day in and day out at you know everywhere. Diane Berardi [00:12:28] Right. Mary Kay Buysse [00:12:29] But. For those families who need the help, Senior Move Managers are here. And what we're concerned about is that when families say they can do it themselves, what are they doing? Do they just hire a dumpster and back it up into the driveway? Yeah. And buy, you know go to Costco and buy two dozen boxes of black garbage bags. That's really not how this should be done at this particular time in someone's life, because if you do hire a senior move manager and you go through it thoughtfully, compassionately, methodically, there is so much less regret. So many families tell us that when they didn't use a senior move manager at an earlier time for a different relative, there was profound regret and remorse with how hasty the downsizing and the move went. Diane Berardi [00:13:24] I was going to say, I would imagine it's a decision and you just... You're trying to pack things and it's just so crazy. All right. Yeah. Right. [00:13:35] Because you know the people who are doing it are boomers. They know get a couple weeks of vacation. Do they honestly want to spend their two weeks of vacation in their parents basement going through stuff that no one has looked at for 30 years? You know they want to go on a trip with their own kids. Right? Diane Berardi [00:13:53] You're right. Mary Kay Buysse [00:13:53] So why not look to somebody who's doing this day in day out who knows all the ins and outs of it? We hire professionals for everything else in our lives. Diane Berardi [00:14:07] You're right. Mary Kay Buysse [00:14:07] Why would we leave this to a dumpster and two dozen garbage bags. I just don't know. Diane Berardi [00:14:13] You're absolutely right. And we're going to continue talking with Mary Kay Buysse, executive director of the National Association of Senior Move Managers. But first, if you're a woman, or there's a woman in your life there's something you absolutely need to know. [00:14:29] I want to tell you about my friend Katie. Katie is a nurse and she was attacked on her way home from work. She was totally taken by surprise. And although Katie is only 5 feet tall and 106 pounds she was easily able to drop her 6 foot 4, 250-pound attacker to his knees and get away unharmed. Katie wasn't just lucky that day. She was prepared. In her pocketbook, a harmless looking lipstick, which really contained a powerful man stopping aerosol propellant. It's not like it was in our grandmother's day. Today just going to and from work or to the mall can have tragic consequences. The FBI says a violent crime is committed every 15 seconds in the United States. And a forcible rape happens every five minutes. And chances are when something happens, no one will be around to help. It looks just like a lipstick. So no one will suspect a thing. Which is important since experts say, getting the jump on your attacker is all about the element of surprise. Inside this innocent looking lipstick is the same powerful stuff used by police and the military to disarm even the most powerful, armed aggressor. In fact, National Park rangers used the very same formula that's inside this little lipstick to stop two-thousand pound vicious grizzly bears dead in their tracks. It's like carrying a personal bodyguard with you in your purse or your pocket. Darkness brings danger. Murderers and rapists use darkness to their advantage. We all know what it's like to be walking at night and hear footsteps coming at us from behind. Who's there? If it's somebody bad, will you be protected? Your life may depend on it. My friend Katie's close call needs to be a wake up call for all of us. Myself included. Pick up a Lipstick Bodyguard and keep it with you always. Announcer [00:16:27] You're listening to Parents Are Hard To Raise. Now... Thanks to you, the number one eldercare talk show on planet Earth. Listen to this and other episodes on demand using the iHeart Radio app. iPhone users can listen on Apple podcasts and Android users on Google podcasts. [00:16:48] Want a great new way to listen to the show? Have an Amazon Echo or Dot? Just say, Alexa, play Parents Are Hard To Raise podcast. Alexa [00:16:58] Getting the latest episode of Parents Are Hard To Raise. Here it is from iHeart Radio. Announcer [00:17:04] It's as simple as that. [00:17:05] You're right Dolly. There are so many really cool new ways to listen to our show. It's hard to keep track. You can join the 180 million listeners on Spotify. You can listen in your car, at the gym, or pretty much anywhere on your smartphone with Apple podcasts and Google podcasts. You can get us an Apple TV, Direct TV, Roku. And like Dolly said, you can even ask Alexa to play the show for you. It's great because you don't have to be tied to a radio anymore. You can listen when you want, where you want, for as long as you want. And if you're listening to the show on one of these new ways please do me a big favor. Share this new technology. Help someone else learn about the show and show them a new way to listen. [00:17:48] So Mary Kay, it kind of sounds like this might be expensive. How much do senior move management services cost? Mary Kay Buysse [00:17:58] Well, that's a really great question Diane. Most Senior Move Managers will charge by the hour and they will give you a written estimate based on an initial interview and a walk through your home. So that's you know that's for sure, at least a NASMM member will. That's part of our code of ethics. How expensive are they? Well how much do you want them to do? A lot of families say, I can do this, this and this, and my brother can do this, this, and this. But we really need help with this. Can we hire you for this one piece? Absolutely. You can go to the senior move manager and say this is the amount of money we have. And she'll tell you what she can do or he can do with that money. [00:18:46] Yeah, they'll take on the hardest jobs and let the family do something else. What happens is 90 percent of the time, the family sees how efficient and how expert the senior move manager is, very quickly, and often then will hand off the whole job to the senior move manager. So that's why they also charged by the hour. Because often the job will expand once the family... Because they're not sure. This is something that's new to a lot of people. So once they you know can see for their own you know with their own eyes what's going on and how the senior move manager works and their team comes in, and it's very efficient, and they're just wonderful. So we can work with any budget. Diane Berardi [00:19:35] OK. Mary Kay Buysse [00:19:36] Bottom line. Diane Berardi [00:19:37] And you could do everything or just pieces of it, like you said. Mary Kay Buysse [00:19:40] Exactly. Exactly. And it's you know there's a lot involved. There's a lot of moving parts to a move shall we say. Yes. Many more than people realize. Once you start making a list of all right things that need to be done. Boy it can... It can be challenging. Diane Berardi [00:19:59] Yeah, I mean, first of all we don't even realize how much we've accumulated. Mary Kay Buysse [00:20:04] Exactly. Exactly, because we're around it all the time. The other thing that I would like to mention is that Senior Move Managers, just like a moving company will pick up the boxes in one place and put them in another. Right? Diane Berardi [00:20:18] Right. Mary Kay Buysse [00:20:18] The senior move manager works with the older adult in the family the weeks before the move. And guess what, they also work with them after the move. They don't leave you know the day of the move and say Ok have a nice life Mrs. Jones. Diane Berardi [00:20:33] Right. Mary Kay Buysse [00:20:33] They will work with the family for those weeks that follow, to make sure that everything was done the way they all intended it to be done. So if the TV was set up on the wall and a part of the assisted living apartment that you know just doesn't work for Mrs. Jones anymore, they'll come back in and redo it. [00:20:55] And now, the other thing is our Senior Move Managers have really close relationships with all of the senior living communities in the U.S. and Canada. So they have those floor plans. They have them already in their database of floor plans on their computers and they know exactly what can fit where. [00:21:17] And just picture this... They're going through Mrs. Jones's kitchen and what they'll do is they'll take painter's tape, blue painter's tape, and they will cordoned off the two or three cabinets that will be in assisted living. Mrs. Jones might have 12 cabinets in her in her kitchen of 20 or 30 years. But guess what. There's three in... So Mrs. Jones can visualize. The other thing is a lot of our Senior Move Managers, they will use a magnetic space planning system on the coffee table or at the kitchen table of Mrs. Jones's house even though they've maybe got the computer version of their apartment at you know Sunny Acres assisted living. They also will work with her at her kitchen table and let her see why that sofa can't go along that wall or whatever. And a lot of times you know if the older adult has dementia and can't be part of their process, certainly a son or a daughter is or or a grandchild or whatever. And so there's just those kinds of things. [00:22:30] Another example that comes to mind why a senior movie manager works and... We had a client recently who, one of our members had a client on East Coast recently who was an executive wife, and traveled the world with her CEO husband. She was now in her early 90s, her husband had passed away a few years before. And she collected miniature teapots throughout her world travels. You know 40 years with her husband's employment. And she knew she couldn't take them all but she loved them all. So the Senior Move manager made digital photos of each of the little miniature teapots and then had them made into a poster. Had it framed and had it hung over her little Dinette set in her senior living apartment, so that she could look at them every day, all day. But they literally didn't take up an inch of space because they were in a poster, on the wall. Like, would we think of that? Probably not. Diane Berardi [00:23:34] No. Right. Mary Kay Buysse [00:23:35] But for someone who's doing senior moves all day, every day, that's just par for the course. That's what they do. Diane Berardi [00:23:43] Do you find most people take their furniture? Mary Kay Buysse [00:23:46] What people take their furniture? Diane Berardi [00:23:48] You know, seniors... Mary Kay Buysse [00:23:49] Oh, they want to take a... Yeah, they usually they will take a couple of you know cherished pieces. Yeah you know... Walk down the center hall of any assisted living or independent living and you'll see that armoire that is just delightful, you know. So we do want those key pieces. Because they are important to them. But it's just we can't take everything. [00:24:15] Yes. Very rarely you know do you walk in and see a completely newly outfitted senior living apartment. But that you know these assisted living facilities they encourage that. They want them to be surrounded by the things they like. Diane Berardi [00:24:32] Yes. Sure. And I would imagine we as adult children, we're busy and you know you're right, a two week vacation we will be rushing in probably wouldn't have the patience that a senior move manager would have. I could just see my mom... My dad saves everything. It would be, you know... I go there and say, You know Dad we got to get rid of some of the stuff. [00:25:01] "Well, I never know, I could use that." You know he has five lawn mowers, that don't work, but he might need a part one day. [laughing]. Mary Kay Buysse [00:25:08] You know that's a great point, Diane. Because one of the other really valuable pieces about hiring a senior move manager is it allows the adult children to be you know the partners in this process with their parent. They don't have to be the bad guy or you know the person who says no, that won't fit. No, you have five lawn mowers. No you can't take. You can't... [00:25:35] So a lot of times, just in general, individuals will take advice from a third party much better than they will from someone close to them. You know there's a lot of baggage between parents and children, even when the parents are 90 and the children are 70 or 65. [00:25:57] In fact there's more baggage, you know. [00:25:59] So we leave their baggage at the front door when you hire a senior move manager. And the other thing is because they're doing this all the time, they can tell your dad you know what has worked for them in the past. He's much more open to probably hearing that, you know, than he is from your opinion, frankly. Diane Berardi [00:26:18] Right. Right. Mary Kay Buysse [00:26:18] He knows this is not what you do and you know to defer to people who are experts. [00:26:26] We do it in every other part of our lives. Diane Berardi [00:26:27] Right. You're right. And I always say on this show, Go to an expert. Because that's what you need to do. Mary Kay Buysse [00:26:36] Right. And I think boomers you know the oldest baby boomer is 73 and I think we are going to be a little different from the Greatest Generation, the silent generation, people in their 80s 90s now, because we have outsourced. We were the first generation that did daycare for our children. You know we are used to outsourcing landscaping services, and taking our clothes to the dry cleaners. Don't forget none of that was done by those prior generations. So I do think we are going to see some more open minds about hiring a service at this point in someone's life. Diane Berardi [00:27:19] And now for our listeners, Mary Kay, how do they go about finding a senior move manager in their area? Mary Kay Buysse [00:27:25] Oh that's a great question. So our Web site is NASMM.org and we have a find a senior move manager function right on our Web site. The first thing you see when you open up the Web site and you click on the map whether you know it's United States, Canada Europe, whatever. And you can put in a zip code and everybody who serves your area pops up with all their contact information. We try to make it as seamless and easy as possible. [00:27:58] Thank you so much, Mary Kay, for being here. Mary Kay Buysse [00:27:59] Thanks for having us. Diane. Diane Berardi [00:28:01] This was great. Very interesting information. And I know everyone knows someone who has to move their parents. So this was excellent opportunity to them information. [00:28:14] Parents Are Hard To Raise family, I love getting your e-mails and questions, so please keep sending them. You can reach me at Diane at Parents Are Hard To Raise dot org. Or just click the green button on our home page. [00:28:25] Parents Are Hard To Raise is a CounterThink Media production. The music used in this broadcast was managed by Cosmo Music, New York, New York. Our New York producer is Joshua Green. [00:28:35] Our broadcast engineer is Well Gambino. And from our London studios, the melodic voice of our announcer Miss Dolly D. [00:28:42] We love our parents but parents sure are hard to raise. [00:28:45] Thank you so much for listening. Till next time, may you forget everything you don't want to remember and remember everything you don't want to forget. [00:28:53] See you again next week! Downloadable PDF of the Show Transcript Parents_Are_Hard_To_Raise_S03_Episode_126 Listen to this episode... just click play on the player below
Transcribe →“I am a Caregiver,” The Power of a simple Idea to bring Welcome Change for Caregivers Jennifer Ridgway- The Change Foundation- Episode #125
Aug 27, 201900:28:57Tap to summarizeListen to this episode… just click play on the player below The Power of a simple idea… Recognizing that families and caregivers are an integral part of the collaborative care team is a great idea. Implementing that idea in a system known for bureaucratic logjams and interdepartmental turf wars is another matter altogether. Diane’s special guest this week is part of an innovative team who made it past all the obstacles and implemented a simple idea that is paying off big benefits for family caregivers, providers and patients alike. And she’s here to tell us how they are doing it. Jennifer Ridgeway has been working in the field of therapeutic recreation for the past 19 years in both hospital and community settings. She is currently the program co-lead for the Cultivating Change project at Sinai Health System in partnership with Wood Green Community Services, which is funded by the Change Foundation in Ontario, Canada. If you’re a caregiver or healthcare pro looking for a way to bring caregivers and practitioners together and improve the health care experience, you don’t want to miss this episode. The Change Foundation has a Caregiver ID Toolkit available online at: https://www.changefoundation.ca/the-caregiver-identification-id-program-and-family-presence-policy/ Here Are Some Handy Links To The People, Products, Books, Services and Resources Discussed On This Episode Take Diane with you… and listen whenever you want, wherever you want, and how often you want, on your smartphone or tablet. It’s easy… Just click any of the links below Listen with the iHeart Radio App iPhone Users Click This Link Android Phone Users Click This Link Follow Diane on Social Media Click the Links Below Show Transcript Parents Are Hard To Raise® S03 Episode 125 Transcript [00:00:00] The world’s becoming a dangerous place for us women. Lipstick Bodyguard looks just like an innocent little lipstick but it will instantly drop any attacker to his knees so you can get away unharmed. Lipstick Bodyguard fear no evil. Get yours today only at LipstickBodyguard.com. [00:00:37] This week on Parents Are Hard To Raise Diane’s special guest expert, Jennifer Ridgway of the Sinai Health System in Ontario, Canada pulls back the curtain to reveal how a simple idea can result in so many benefits. [00:00:53] Join 180 million monthly subscribers who can now listen to a Parents Are Hard To Raise on Spotify. Diane Berardi [00:01:12] Welcome to Parents Are Hard To Raise… Helping families grow older together without losing their minds. I’m elder care expert, Diane Berardi. [00:01:21] Recognizing that families and caregivers are an integral part of the collaborative care team is a great idea. Implementing that idea in a system known for bureaucratic logjams and interdepartmental turf wars is another matter altogether. My guest this week is part of an innovative team who made it past all the obstacles and implemented a simple idea that is paying off big benefits for family caregivers, providers and patients alike. And she’s here to tell us how they are doing it. Jennifer Ridgeway has been working in the field of therapeutic recreation for the past 19 years in both hospital and community settings. She is currently the program co-lead for the cultivating Change project at Sinai Health System in partnership with Wood Green Community Services, which is funded by the Change Foundation in Ontario, Canada. Jennifer Ridgway welcome to Parents Are Hard To Raise. Jennifer Ridgway [00:02:22] Thank you so much for having me. It’s my pleasure. Diane Berardi [00:02:24] We’re so happy to have you here. But my first question is could you tell our listeners, What is therapeutic recreation? Jennifer Ridgway [00:02:35] Certainly. Therapeutic Recreation is a field where recreation therapists assess patients to look at what strengths that they have, what’s meaningful to them and what brings them joy. So when someone’s had an illness or an accident and they’re no longer able to participate in leisure the way they used to a recreation therapist looks for ways to adapt, and through equipment or a different approach, for them to still be able to engage and have those social connections to others. And Therapeutic Recreation also has been instrumental in helping people transition back into the community after their rehab stay, because life could look very different for them. And not only for themselves but also their family, if they have other kind of care needs that they didn’t have previously. It’s an adjustment not just for the patients but for everyone who’s in their support system. Diane Berardi [00:03:27] Is this a fairly new field? Jennifer Ridgway [00:03:30] It’s not as common as occupational therapy and physiotherapy. But, yeah. So Therapeutic Recreation has probably been around since I’d say the 80s, when they started their first kind of formal education programs. So recreation therapists often work in both community settings and hospital settings. Diane Berardi [00:03:50] That’s a great field and there’s a great need. Jennifer Ridgway [00:03:54] Yes and there’s also some current work happening not only with our our senior population but also within the school board because it’s really a strengths based approach that looks at building skills in a variety of cognitive, emotional, physical and social capacities. Diane Berardi [00:04:12] Right. I love that social capacity, because getting people back into social settings. Jennifer Ridgway [00:04:21] Exactly. Social isolation is such a huge concern for especially our seniors population. Diane Berardi [00:04:26] Right. Yeah. So tell us about the programs you’ve implemented. Jennifer Ridgway [00:04:33] So we have implemented many programs across the Sinai site and also with our community partner, which is Woodgreen, which is a community service organization. And I know that we wanted today focus on our caregiver I.D. component. But just to let you know besides the caregiver I.D., We also really leverage technology such as we have in Ontario, a telemedicine network which we’re utilizing to allow family caregivers to, it’s like Skyping into family meetings or rounds, medical rounds. But it’s on a secured network. Diane Berardi [00:05:08] Wow. Jennifer Ridgway [00:05:08] Yes. Many people have barriers to being able to get to meetings whether it be distance or having to return to work or other care needs for other family members. So looking at how we can break down as many barriers as possible to have caregivers successfully integrate into the care teams. Diane Berardi [00:05:29] Yeah, that’s a great idea. Jennifer Ridgway [00:05:32] Yes. Oh there’s a lot of interest in scaling and spreading that idea to other areas as well. So this project is looking at support, education, recognizing caregivers, which is what we’re going to talk about today more and really about education and support as well. Diane Berardi [00:05:49] Right. Right. I was just telling Jen before we came on air about my mom and dad. And I could use your program with this guy tomorrow. [laughing] Right? Jennifer Ridgway [00:06:00] Right. [laughing] Diane Berardi [00:06:01] Because my mom felt she couldn’t get to her chemo appointment and she wanted to talk to the doctor. And she’s just so tired, and she’s not able to walk or you know we’re having… It’s a struggle. And so the doctor said, Don’t worry about it. We can do a phone conference. [00:06:22] So I thought OK. And you know I’m two hours away so it’d be like four hours for 10 minutes. And I thought, OK let me try to see if we can have a conference call. But, I just had my dad… You know I wanted to just get him to adjust the volume, that was just the first step, you know on my mom’s cell phone. Four hours go by, and then he finally calls me back. And then he’s like, I don’t know how to even turn on the phone. [laughing]. [00:06:53] I’m like, You don’t know what her password is? [00:06:57] “No.”. [00:06:58] I’m like, Oh my gosh. So I don’t know. Yeah. It’s just… But this would be perfect. Jennifer Ridgway [00:07:04] Yes, I think that definitely a lot of the other project teams are very interested in this particular initiative. And so I can really see it spreading to other organizations. Diane Berardi [00:07:13] So now what is the caregiver I.D.? Jennifer Ridgway [00:07:17] Yes. So the caregiver I.D. is actually a physical I.D. card. It looks very similar to a staff badge and it’s really about recognizing the caregiver as an important member of the patient’s care team. And what’s really important about the caregiver I.D. tag is it’s not just giving someone this tag, this card, but it’s actually linked to access. So there is utility with the card and it was really a part of launching our family policy here at the Bridge Point site. So that family presence policy replaced our previous visiting hours. So, before June 5th of 2018, we used to have an announcement that would come on at about 8 o’clock letting people know that visiting hours are now over. Diane Berardi [00:07:59] Right. Jennifer Ridgway [00:08:00] We no longer do that. So caregivers, which could be family, friends, the neighbor, anyone who supports that patient are always welcome in our facility. And what we’ve done is we developed a process where a patient identifies who they would like their caregiver to be. Diane Berardi [00:08:17] OK. Jennifer Ridgway [00:08:17] That information is entered into our electronic medical record where the caregiver then goes down to our security office, and the security checks the caregiver information in the computer in our system against a photo I.D. of the caregiver. And then the card is presented. And then the card itself allows them to scan-in the elevator. So at 10:00 o’clock in the evening till 7:00 in the morning our elevators are shut down to general access, and only someone with that card on staff or caregiver can scan and they can go to the unit where they are supporting someone. Diane Berardi [00:08:53] Oh wow. Jennifer Ridgway [00:08:54] Yeah. So it’s really taking away that barrier of tryingto get there at a certain time, and having to it permission to be there, if they want to be there past 10:00. Diane Berardi [00:09:04] Right. Right. Yeah, I know. Because you get that announcement in all the hospitals here. Visiting hours are closed and you feel horrible leaving your parent. Jennifer Ridgway [00:09:17] Yes. And sometimes you know different people’s working schedules, if someone works until 5:00 and gets home or just gets to the hospital you might only be able to have a very short visit before that 8:00 announcement. And people work different shifts as well. The world is moving all the time and not everyone has the same schedule. Diane Berardi [00:09:34] Right. So this is great. You know really looking at the caregiver and saying, OK how can we help in that way? Because you’re right, everybody has different work schedules and by the time you find a parking space, sometimes [laughing] or something like that. Yeah. [00:09:52] I do remember though having to go be a patient in Florida, at Celebration Hospital, which is a Disney hospital. And they, now that I think about it, they did give my husband a card and he had access to the whole hospital, could come come and go at any time with this card. Now that I think about it… But not many places took on that and thought about that. Jennifer Ridgway [00:10:22] Yeah and hopefully more will. There’s been some work done in Ontario with Ontario Hospital Association. They really set out a document. They have the principles for the family present policies. And then the Canadian Foundation for Healthcare Improvement developed, “Better Together pledge,” which is all about partnering with family caregivers and recognizing that they help in care and they help support the patient and just that the quality of the experience is so much greater when we don’t put those barriers in place. Diane Berardi [00:10:52] You know going through this whole experience with my mom, you really can appreciate all the frustrations you can feel and it’s not intentional by any means on the part of the hospital, whatever. It’s just that no one thinks about it. And, how do we make the lives easier? Jennifer Ridgway [00:11:10] And another component of the back bench itself too was that when we first were doing the discussions and reviewing our policy in 2017 and we engaged with patients and staff and caregivers some of the concerns were regarding staff working in the evening and not wanting just kind of as open up and unlocked the hospital and not knowing who would be here in the hospital and a feeling of safety. So not only for staff but also patients and other family members really like the fact that caregivers are getting this card from security. So even if they’re not visiting themselves at night they know that the hospital is not just open and that their loved one is safe within are within our walls. Diane Berardi [00:11:46] Right. Can you have more than one caregiver or is it… Jennifer Ridgway [00:11:50] That’s a great question. [00:11:51] So we allow people to identify. We ask them to identify two caregivers. And we ask just one stay overnight at a time with the exception of our palliative care and our palliative care unit, we don’t put any restrictions whatsoever. Diane Berardi [00:12:06] OK. Yeah. Jennifer Ridgway [00:12:08] And we’re really fortunate though our palliative of care is only single rooms. So we moved to a beautiful new building about five years ago. And so it would be difficult or maybe we may have more considerations that people were sharing rooms, but in palliative care it is one patient per room. So we’re not interrupting anyone else’s rest or sleep pattern. Diane Berardi [00:12:28] Yeah. That is really good. Yeah. Because I was thinking if you have you know two siblings or if and they take turns could it be two different people but that’s… Yeah. And not having any barriers with palliative care is really important. [00:12:45] We are going to continue talking with Jennifer Ridgeway. But first if you’re a woman or there’s a woman in your life there’s something you absolutely need to know. [00:12:56] I want to tell you about my friend Katie. Katie is a nurse and she was attacked on her way home from work. She was totally taken by surprise. And although Katie is only 5 feet tall and 106 pounds she was easily able to drop her 6 foot 4, 250-pound attacker to his knees and get away unharmed. Katie wasn’t just lucky that day. She was prepared. In her pocketbook, a harmless looking lipstick, which really contained a powerful man stopping aerosol propellant. It’s not like it was in our grandmother’s day. Today just going to and from work or to the mall can have tragic consequences. The FBI says a violent crime is committed every 15 seconds in the United States. And a forcible rape happens every five minutes. And chances are when something happens, no one will be around to help. It looks just like a lipstick. So no one will suspect a thing. Which is important since experts say, getting the jump on your attacker is all about the element of surprise. Inside this innocent looking lipstick is the same powerful stuff used by police and the military to disarm even the most powerful, armed aggressor. In fact, National Park rangers used the very same formula that’s inside this little lipstick to stop two-thousand pound vicious grizzly bears dead in their tracks. It’s like carrying a personal bodyguard with you in your purse or your pocket. Darkness brings danger. Murderers and rapists use darkness to their advantage. We all know what it’s like to be walking at night and hear footsteps coming at us from behind. Who’s there? If it’s somebody bad, will you be protected? Your life may depend on it. My friend Katie’s close call needs to be a wake up call for all of us. Myself included. Pick up a Lipstick Bodyguard and keep it with you always. Announcer [00:14:50] You’re listening to Parents Are Hard To Raise, now thanks to you… The number one eldercare talk show on planet Earth. Listen to this and other episodes on demand using the iHeart Radio app. iPhone users can listen on Apple podcasts and Android users on Google podcasts. [00:15:09] Want a great new way to listen to the show? Just say, Alexa, play Parents Are Hard To Raise podcast. Alexa [00:15:19] Getting the latest episode of Parents Are Hard To Raise. Here it is for my iHeart Radio. Announcer [00:15:24] It’s as simple as that. Diane Berardi [00:15:26] You’re right Dolly. There are so many really cool new ways to listen to our show. It’s hard to keep track. You can join the 180 million listeners on Spotify. You can listen in your car, at the gym, or pretty much anywhere on your smartphone with Apple podcasts and Google podcasts. You can get us an Apple TV. Direct TV. Roku. And like Dolly said, you can even ask Alexa to play the show for you. It’s great because you don’t have to be tied to a radio anymore. You can listen when you want, where you want, for as long as you want. And if you’re listening to the show on one of these new ways please do me a big favor. Share this new technology. Helps someone else learn about the show and show them a new way to listen. [00:16:12] So Jenn… When you implemented this program, the caregiver I.D., did you face any challenges? Jennifer Ridgway [00:16:21] Yeah I think we definitely had a lot of innocent people feel uncomfortable or had some concern and it was especially with the nurses back to work in the evening because in the evening there there’s no other health disciplines, there’s no physiotherapist or unit manager, so there’s just less traffic of other employees. So we really had a lot of conversations. [00:16:41] We actually went to every unit, and did council meetings. We had a breakfast event held at shift change, so we could kind of catch the oncoming and exiting nurses. So through having the conversations and really talking about, OK what is your concern? What do you think may happen? And then talk about that, What would we do if… Kind of a conversation. And we had security present as well. And they were really wonderful at saying, Listen, if something happens and you’re uncomfortable with the situation, call in Security. Like, you’re not alone. So I think having those conversations is really helpful. [00:17:15] One nurse in particular who I had actually worked on a unit with and have a lot of respect for her was really concerned about the policy. And she had worked at a different facility where they had a family presence policy and it hadn’t gone as well. And so she brought with her that experience and was very vocal. And so you know it’s good to sometimes have individuals who aren’t the early adopter, in order to understand where they’re coming from, and those concerns. [00:17:42] And so when we went live or soon after that we got together with caregivers and providers to create an expectations document and I asked her to join that group and at the end of it she actually apologized to me, which she didn’t owe me an apology, but just saying, you know I was really concerned and though all these things could happen. And she said, You know what… Having the caregivers here in the evening has actually been so helpful. And having their knowledge and their skills and those contributions have really improved patient care. [00:18:12] So I just think about that example. And you know it’s OK that they’re not everyone’s on board right away. It was the right thing to do. And you just really have to socialize the idea. And be open to feedback. Diane Berardi [00:18:27] You know, and I would think for a mom having her daughter there, she would be calmer. Jennifer Ridgway [00:18:33] Absolutely. Diane Berardi [00:18:33] Right? Maybe not require the nurse to come in, or it would give the staff leeway to do their, you know, what else they have to do. I would imagine. But, I can kind of see where the staff would be hesitant at first. Jennifer Ridgway [00:18:50] Another way that’s really been helpful, and you mentioned you know a child helping support a parent, is some of our patients sometimes English is not their first language. So having someone there who can also help interpret on the spot, you know when someone needs to receive care or you know they want to check vitals and things like that it can be frightening for someone who sure understand what’s going on. Diane Berardi [00:19:11] Yeah. Yeah you’re right. I mean I didn’t even think about that. But absolutely. Jennifer Ridgway [00:19:16] For sure. I was just going to say a couple of things kind of came out when you mentioned, What were the challenges. One of the things were we didn’t think about right away perhaps, was that once we took we control the access to the elevators we had to think about our patients who like to go out in the evenings. So some of our patients are quite early risers or stay out a bit later. So we had to actually provide them with cards as well so that they could get back to the unit. [00:19:46] [laughing] So… Yeah. [00:19:48] And the same consideration for agency staff. So once in a while when we don’t have enough of our own care team we need to invite in agency staff to work in the evening which would be when the elevators are not… [00:20:01] Yeah, you’re locked. [00:20:02] Yeah. So just a couple of things that did come up and you keep doing your PDSA cycles your, plan, do, study and act and you just keep the quality improvement going on. Diane Berardi [00:20:13] Things are going to come up. Right? Yeah. You don’t know about. And so, OK. We do it. We go live and we try it. Jennifer Ridgway [00:20:19] That’s right. And you know like for one of the other things we have to purchase, too were more recliner chairs, because people were saying and they obviously needed somewhere to sleep. Yeah. And we didn’t want to purchase them ahead of time because we weren’t sure how many individuals would be staying over so we kind of you know launch the family presence policy and then really closely monitored, Where were people staying over night? And, How many people were staying overnight? Before purchasing, making that large purchase for the facility. Diane Berardi [00:20:45] And how did the caregivers react? Jennifer Ridgway [00:20:48] The caregivers have been really really impressed by being identified and being included. And one of the caregiver stories that I really enjoy is that I had a caregiver come down and I was doing an information session about a resource center that we’re building for caregivers. But during the session she had come by and she brought her I.D. badge down to get her flu shot. So in our hospital in Toronto every staffer that gets a flu shot gets a sticker on their badge. And so I’m not sure if that’s a common practice but it just identifies that you’ve had your flu shot should there be an outbreak. Yeah. And so she brought her caregiver badge down and she wanted her sticker on her badge similar to an employee. And I thought that’s great, because we do want to be recognizing you. And also I was so impressed because it’s the first year we provided flu shots to caregivers. And I thought, you know why not do one thing that we can take it off their list and they don’t have to go to their doctor or make that appointment when they’re so busy trying with someone in hospital. So I feel like it’s that culture change to being more inclusive into recognizing caregivers. Diane Berardi [00:21:53] Oh definitely. I’m sure you’ve seen huge benefits as a result of this. Jennifer Ridgway [00:21:59] They have. And we’re really also part of the dashboard template that we’re using to evaluate is looking at 10 questions that are in the patient satisfaction survey, the patient family survey, which is sent out. So we’re really looking also to track satisfaction, content, to know has this change in how we’re inviting caregivers and partnering with caregivers, Is it changing their feeling towards how that is changing their experience in a positive way? And would it help. Would it make you want to recommend this hospital to your friends and family? And did you feel included? And did you feel that you were treated with courtesy and respect? So these are all numbers that we want to always be improving on and want to accomplish in close to 100 percent as possible. And I think this policy definitely is a driver for that change. Diane Berardi [00:22:48] Oh definitely. There’s just so many positive reasons to do it. Jennifer Ridgway [00:22:55] Yeah. And you know what was interesting or you know tracking some of the numbers is that not everyone who has the caregiver I.D. badge actually stays overnight which is OK. What we found was that some of the caregivers and patients just felt that it lessened their anxiety just to know. Yeah. That if they wanted to if I was feeling unwell one evening and I called somebody I know they could come and they could be there and it was just a reassurance for both the caregiver and the patient staying in hospital, that they have that welcoming connection to have the person at their bedside. Diane Berardi [00:23:28] Right. They just know that they can if they need it. Jennifer Ridgway [00:23:32] Exactly. Diane Berardi [00:23:33] Or they could call them and say, Geez, you know, can you come back? [00:23:38] Exactly. Like I’m having a difficult night. Yeah. Yeah. Diane Berardi [00:23:44] Because a lot of our parents. They wake up at 2:00 a.m. You know and… And then you wake up and you’re in a, you know you’re in a hospital, you’re in a strange environment. And you get scared. Jennifer Ridgway [00:23:57] Yeah. And you know we’ve heard from. Also we have a fantastic volunteer who actually is now on our steering committee for for the project who was a caregiver to an individual on our stroke unit. And you know she she said You know I’ve been I’ve been married for more than 40 years. And so being a part this is a long as I’ve ever been apart from my husband in this hospital. Yes. So having that card and that that again to remain at bedside was really important to them. Diane Berardi [00:24:25] Yeah. You don’t think about you know they’ve been together for all these years. [00:24:29] Sure. And they rely on each other. Jennifer Ridgway [00:24:33] Absolutely. Diane Berardi [00:24:35] We have a huge audience of family caregivers and health care professionals listening from around the world. What advice do you have for others who might want to implement something like this in their area? Jennifer Ridgway [00:24:48] I think my advice would be to definitely give yourself time in your implementation. Plan to have the conversations and not just have them from a leadership lens but have frontline providers involved. Have caregivers involved, and security. And someone from your quality team. Because I think it’s really important that people who work on the floor are talking about this policy because sometimes in health care we have a tendency when we’re front line and someone kind of swoops in to make a change we get our backs up and we say things like, Well they don’t know what it’s like to be on the floor. So I think you definitely need leadership support but it can’t be a top down. There’s got to be conversations that happen where it’s meaningful engagement and people have an opportunity to express what their concerns are. And you have time to address them before your go-live date. So, I’m just gonna say a lot of support is necessary to have this shift in culture, the shift in how we include caregivers. So I think that was the main thing was having a lot of conversation. Having posters in the parking garage and the elevators. Spending the time to teach the staff how to implement the caregiver information into the electronic medical record. So we want to make sure everything works for that Go-live date. And we wanted to we actually registered caregivers ahead of time discerning sure that wouldn’t have this huge lineup that would be frustrating for caregivers. Diane Berardi [00:26:15] Right. Jennifer Ridgway [00:26:16] Yeah, just being really thoughtful in what will this looks like day one and how we’re going to support the team in implementing this change as well as educating the caregivers and patients that this opportunity is available. Diane Berardi [00:26:27] And how did you let the caregivers know? [00:26:31] We had some unit champions who actually went that were nursing staff on the unit that went room to room to speak to caregivers and patients to let them know and answer any questions that they might have. Diane Berardi [00:26:44] Perfect. Thank you so much Jennifer. You’ve been here today. Jennifer Ridgway [00:26:47] Thank you so much for having me. Diane Berardi [00:26:50] And thank you for everything you’re doing. Jennifer Ridgway [00:26:52] Oh you know what. This has been such a fantastic opportunity. And this project been so exciting to actually have the opportunity to work with the caregivers and frontline providers and truly partner. So it’s amazing instead of just like kind of that check box that you did engagement but to really have people at the table together, and working together. [00:27:13] It’s been fantastic. Diane Berardi [00:27:14] And it’s great because I’m so happy for the professionals that are listening to hear this. Jennifer Ridgway [00:27:19] Yes. Diane Berardi [00:27:19] Because we need to implement this everywhere. Jennifer Ridgway [00:27:23] Yeah. And you know what you can do it. Like I think people think it’s overwhelming but really you know you can do it. Like you can change that… Don’t make that announcement at 8:00 anymore and you can you can either do a phased approach, or we did the whole hospital. We just went live one day, just like flicking a switch like, This is the way we’re doing business, now. Diane Berardi [00:27:41] Right. Right. No, it’s fantastic. And I wish you all the luck in the world and your continued success. Jennifer Ridgway [00:27:48] And I hope that your appointment goes well [laughing] Diane Berardi [00:27:53] Oh, my gosh. I know. I have I have to call them back. I’m like, Oh no! I know but… It’s just part of it. Right? [laughing]. Jennifer Ridgway [00:28:04] Well, they’re lucky to have you. Diane Berardi [00:28:06] Oh, thank you. Thank you and you take care. [00:28:10] Parents Are Hard To Raise family I love getting your e-mails and questions so please keep sending them. You can reach me at Diane at Parents Are Hard To Raise dot org or just click the green button on our home page. [00:28:20] Parents Are Hard To Raise is a CounterThink Media production. The music used in this broadcast was managed by Cosmo Music New York, New York. Our New York producers Joshua Green. Our broadcast engineer is Well Gambino. And from our London studios, the melodic voice of our announcer, “Miss Dolly D.” [00:28:37] We love our parents, but parents sure our hard to raise. [00:28:41] Thank you so much for listening. [00:28:42] Till next time… May you forget everything you don’t want to remember and remember everything you don’t want to forget. [00:28:47] See you again next week! Downloadable PDF of the Show Transcript Parents_Are_Hard_To_Raise_S03_Episode_125 Listen to this episode… just click play on the player below
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