Kyle Kulinski Gets It Wrong

Summary

Detailed Summary of "Kyle Kulinski Gets It Wrong" Episode

Podcast Information:

• Title: Part Of The Problem
• Host/Author: GaS Digital Network
• Episode: Kyle Kulinski Gets It Wrong
• Release Date: December 17, 2024
• Description: Dave Smith delves into current events, government affairs, foreign policy, and Libertarian ideologies, aiming to educate listeners about the prospects of a truly free nation.

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1. Introduction

The episode begins with Dave Smith welcoming listeners to a new episode of "Part of the Problem," alongside his co-host, Robbie Bernstein. They briefly discuss upcoming events and projects, including Robbie's committee meeting in New Jersey aimed at addressing a perceived drone crisis.

Notable Quote:

• Dave Smith [01:05]: "Hello, hello. What's up everybody? Welcome to a brand new episode of Part of the Problem."

2. Discussion on the Drone Crisis

Dave and Robbie transition to discussing an emerging drone situation in New Jersey. They express skepticism about official statements downplaying the presence of drones, suggesting instead that these might be government-operated drones conducting tests or surveillance.

Notable Quotes:

• Dave Smith [03:54]: "These are 100% drones. These are not planes."
• Dave Smith [06:00]: "If these were enemy drones or private drones, you would see them being shot down, and that's not happening."

3. Kyle Kulinski's Critique of Joe Rogan

The core segment of the episode revolves around responding to a critique by Kyle Kulinski, who accuses Joe Rogan of not being truly independent media. Kyle argues that Rogan selectively engages with guests, leading to a right-leaning echo chamber.

Kyle Kulinski's Points:

• Claims Rogan is not independent media due to his consistent support of right-wing viewpoints.
• Suggests that Rogan's interactions with various guests undermine his independence.
• Accuses Rogan of "holding had like a toddler," implying Rogan is overly accommodating.

Notable Quote:

• Kyle Kulinski [18:26]: "You're not independent media and you're clearly just a vibes based voter."

4. Hosts' Defense of Joe Rogan

Dave and Robbie vehemently defend Joe Rogan's independence and open-mindedness. They argue that Rogan's willingness to engage with a diverse range of guests demonstrates his commitment to unbiased discourse rather than bias itself.

Key Points:

• Dave Smith [22:00]: Rogan's interactions with both left and right-leaning guests show his open-mindedness.
• Robbie Bernstein [23:40]: Challenges Kyle’s notion of "vibe based voters" and the logic behind linking this to non-independence.

Notable Quotes:

• Dave Smith [24:45]: "What the thing to take away from this, what's the, what's the story is here. It doesn't make anything gay out of that."
• Robbie Bernstein [34:36]: "Well, like this is a very peculiar way to describe an event as right wing."

5. Analyzing the Validity of Kyle's Arguments

The hosts dissect Kyle's criticisms, pointing out logical inconsistencies and lack of concrete evidence in his claims against Rogan. They compare Kyle's arguments to those made by other public figures, emphasizing their own credibility and experiences in defending Rogan.

Key Points:

• Dave Smith [26:32]: Criticizes the circular reasoning in Kyle's arguments.
• Robbie Bernstein [38:13]: Labels Kyle's approach as self-serving and lacking in substantive critique.

Notable Quotes:

• Dave Smith [39:34]: "You don't fire me. I quit. Sir, you don't have a job here."
• Dave Smith [46:58]: "This is a very convenient excuse to say, oh, because at the time I believed I could do this."

6. The Impact of COVID-19 on Media and Public Figures

The discussion shifts to the influence of COVID-19 on media narratives and public perceptions. Dave recounts his experiences on Rogan's show during the pandemic, highlighting how certain viewpoints were marginalized or attacked despite later being validated.

Key Points:

• Dave Smith [34:47]: Critiques how Joe Rogan was portrayed in media during COVID-19.
• Robbie Bernstein [55:21]: Suggests the need for private discourse rather than public complaints to effect change.

Notable Quotes:

• Dave Smith [50:31]: "They were starved for that, who wanted voices that were standing up against the insane totalitarianism."
• Robbie Bernstein [61:07]: "We're losing the story on some of the most important issues, such as the need for this style of wealth redistribution."

7. Concluding Remarks and Final Defense

In concluding the episode, Dave and Robbie summarize their stance on Kyle's criticisms, reiterating their support for Joe Rogan and criticizing the motives behind Kyle's arguments. They emphasize the importance of open dialogue and maintaining independent media voices.

Key Points:

• Reaffirmation of Joe Rogan's integrity and independence.
• Critique of progressive narratives that undermine independent media.
• Call to action for listeners to support unbiased media.

Notable Quote:

• Dave Smith [67:04]: "It's a very convenient excuse to say, oh, because at the time I believed I could do this."

8. Closing

The hosts wrap up the episode by dismissing the critiques from Kyle as unfounded and self-serving, reinforcing their commitment to independent journalism and informed discourse.

Notable Quote:

• Dave Smith [67:59]: "That's not. Turns out long-term effects not so great from Diddy parties."

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Key Takeaways:

• Defense of Joe Rogan: Dave and Robbie argue that Joe Rogan exemplifies independent media through his diverse guest interactions and willingness to entertain multiple viewpoints.
• Critique of Kyle Kulinski: They find Kyle's arguments against Rogan unsubstantiated and based on flawed logic, branding them as self-serving.
• Media and COVID-19: The episode highlights the perceived bias in mainstream media narratives during the COVID-19 pandemic and celebrates independent voices that challenged prevailing narratives.
• Call for Open Dialogue: Emphasis on the necessity for open, unbiased conversations in media to foster a truly free society.

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Conclusion

In "Kyle Kulinski Gets It Wrong," Dave Smith and Robbie Bernstein provide a robust defense of Joe Rogan against Kyle Kulinski's criticisms. They dissect the arguments presented by Kyle, highlight the importance of independent media, and express frustration with what they perceive as biased mainstream narratives. The hosts advocate for continued support of unbiased media platforms to ensure a well-informed and free society.

Transcript

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[Dave Smith]

Hello, hello. What's up everybody? Welcome to a brand new episode of Part of the Problem. I am Dave Smith. He is Robbie the Fire Bernstein. How you feeling, brother?

[Robbie Bernstein]

I'm doing well. And this Thursday in New Jersey, I have a committee coming together to solve the drone crisis, so.

[Dave Smith]

Very good.

[Robbie Bernstein]

Bring your guns and get ready for my commission to deal with this.

[Dave Smith]

Yes, that's right. Whereas while other people are fleeing, we are bringing people to the area. You come here, they can't scare us off. It is by the way, I will.

[Robbie Bernstein]

Learn anything from COVID It's no time to hide in your homes. It's time to band together, gather your arms, bring your pitchforks and hear my pitch for what we can do to address this.

[Dave Smith]

Very good, very good. Come on out to Rob shows. Of course, Rob's comedy special. His debut special is also up for free on YouTube. If you have not checked it out out already, please do. It's excellent.

[Robbie Bernstein]

And San Antonio, Texas on Saturday.

[Dave Smith]

Whoo. Look at that. And then of course me and Rob are we will be on the road in 2025. Coming to a city near you.

[Robbie Bernstein]

Oh, that's better. That's an improvement, hopefully.

[Dave Smith]

What?

[Robbie Bernstein]

Coming to a city near you.

[Dave Smith]

Was that better? Okay. Oh, that way. You can't make anything gay out of that.

[Robbie Bernstein]

You still can.

[Dave Smith]

You probably can if you really want to. But Bozeman, Montana, limited seats still available for that one in and then we'll be doing Louisville, Kentucky, Fort Wayne, Indiana, Key West, Boston, Rosemont, Chicago, San Diego, San Diego, Appleton, Cleveland. Just added Tacoma, Spokane, Tampa, Florida. Whole bunch of stuff I think there's some more dates that still aren't on the website yet, but we will be all over the place, try to make that gay couple of dudes hitting the road together. What's gay about that? All right. Anyway, I guess we could just real quickly. We talked a little bit about it on the Members Only stream the other day. Of course, a lot of you haven't seen that because it's for members only, but if you do want to get the fourth show every week, if you want to support this podcast, if you want to be part of our community, please go over to partoftheproblem.com and become a supporting listener. We very much appreciate those people who already have, and we would appreciate others if they joined as well. So we talked a little bit about this. This drone situation. I. For people who don't know, I know our schedule is a little messed up. I was on a family vacation last week. I saw them. I saw a couple of them. I guess this was two nights ago now. And then last night, Rob. I mean, they were just all over the place.

[Robbie Bernstein]

They're fornicating.

[Dave Smith]

Yeah. I mean, they seem to be like.

[Robbie Bernstein]

Rodents of the skies. You let them in your apartment, you try and ignore them, and next thing you know, you got an infestation.

[Dave Smith]

Well, I will say it was pretty creepy. I mean, me, after we got the kids to bed, me and my wife literally went out on our deck, and we're just watching it, like, they're all over the place. I. I will say to the people who are. Because there still are. Obviously there was. What's his name? I want to say. Kissinger. Is that his name? The former congressman? Yeah. He was out saying, like, oh, there's no such thing. These are all just planes. I still did see some people on Twitter even today saying that, like, there no drones. And. And I'm just saying I've seen them with my own eyes. They are 100% drones. These are not planes. So if most people seem to have accepted that, but if anybody is still hanging on to that line, I'm telling you with 100% certainty, I saw a bunch of them. We took some videos of them. They are not planes. They are clearly drones. They are flying. Unless you've got planes that can fly incredibly low and move in zigzag patterns that don't look like planes, we're looking at drones. It seems very clear to me that the government is lying. These are government drones. You know, the government is lying. Because if this was not. If this was not either the government or something the government knowns of Kiss Kissinger. Yes, there you go. Kinzing jar. I always say that wrong. Adam Kinzinger was the one who said that, as well as some other government officials there. If these were just. If these were enemy drones, which I don't think there are any drones capable of actually, like, crossing the Atlantic Ocean or something like that, but if these were enemy drones or if these were private drones, you know, you would see them being shot down and you would see government officials threatening prosecution and, you know, just threatening the crap out of the people who were flying them. They're not doing that at all. So I think it's pretty reasonable to say it's the. The government who's doing this, or at the very least, the government knows what's going on and won't tell us. But I would. I would venture to guess that it's. It's dod. The. I essentially think my guess, like, gun to my head, if I had to put money on it. I don't know. I'm speculating. I would guess that this is some type of test. They're testing their capabilities to detect radiation or to detect dirty bombs or whatever. That. That's my guess. And then I think part of that test is also a test on us. Like, what if we did this and gave the public no information about it? How, you know, how would they react to that? That's. That is my guess. I know there's a lot of people speculating that a nuke has somehow made its way to the New York City area. I don't really see any evidence or any reason to believe that that is the case. But I don't know, Rob, you can give on the main show here now whatever you want to be on the record of how you feel about the drones.

[Robbie Bernstein]

I think we summarized. Our best estimate is that it's probably. Probably the government. The only thing that you didn't mention that we mentioned in the private episode is that maybe it's literally just testing our response and nothing else.

[Dave Smith]

Yeah, it's quite possible. There was one of the things I did think was interesting. By the way, I know there are people out there, a lot of people are pointing to this one video of some guy. Again, this is like the level that people go through to build some of these theories. But there's a video of one guy who says he knows a guy who told him that it was a nuke, that he had put his hands on this nuke and it was on its way to America.

[Robbie Bernstein]

Was that Chris Farley driving a Bus.

[Dave Smith]

Yeah. The problem with this, of course, is that there is just. No, this isn't evidence of any kind. The guy, he didn't say how he knows the guy, how he knows that this is credible. Does he know the guy well? Is it just some random person who told him this? He says he put his hands on a nuke. How did he know it was going to America? The logistics of sneaking a nuke into the United States of America and then detonating a nuclear weapon, it's a pretty far fetched idea. I would, I would caution against that type of panic and believing that seems much more likely to me that this is just some type of, some type of test. Like, like, you know, testing us, testing their capabilities, maybe both. Anyway, let's go to the Donald Trump video because I did find this kind of interesting. Donald Trump gave a press conference where he was asked about these drones and this was his response. And there was a classic, classic Trumpian moment. Let's, let's play that. Can you comment on the drones that are flying around New Jersey ports? It seems like the American people have a big disc.

[Donald Trump]

The govern. The government knows what is happening. Look, our military knows where they took off from. If it's a garage, they can go right into that garage. They know where it came from and where it went. And for some reason they don't want to comment. And I think they'd be better off saying what it is. Our military knows and our President knows and for some reason they want to keep people in suspense. I can't imagine it's the enemy because it was the enemy that blasted out. Even if they were late, they'd blast it. Something strange is going on. For some reason they don't want to tell the people and they should because the people are really, I mean, they happen to be over Bedminster. They're very close to Bedminster. I think maybe I won't spend the weekend in Bedminster. I've decided to cancel my trip.

[Unknown]

Have you received an intelligence briefing on the drones?

[Donald Trump]

I don't want to comment on that.

[Dave Smith]

Have you been there? Isn't it, isn't it just so Trump? I swear this is one of the reasons why they are so freaked out by Donald Trump and why the powers that be hate him so much is that he just, it's like he has no other speed than stream of consciousness. And he just. One of the things that I just love about Donald Trump is that he will say the thing that everybody is thinking. It's just so bizarre to see it come from a President's mouth. You know what I mean? Like, it's just. They go for. Everybody is thinking they know what this is. They're not telling us. They don't want to create panic. They don't want whatever. That Donald Trump just comes out and says it and then jokes about how he'll be avoiding his vacation out here. It's like, dude, like, that's the whole thing that any president wouldn't say, because they're like, no, the thing we're concerned about here is this. And let me at least get in and see what's really going on before it. But Donald Trump just doesn't have that speed. So it's just right out to like, yeah, they don't know. They know what's going on, but they won't say. They won't tell people. But they know. Let me tell you. They know we could follow him anywhere, that we could follow him to the garage. We won't. You know, it's.

[Robbie Bernstein]

Maybe this is the next assassination attempt is one accidentally falls on him, one that falls from the sky, just lands right on Donald Trump.

[Dave Smith]

Well, look, I mean, I will say I don't like it. I don't like drones flying all around fairly close to my house.

[Robbie Bernstein]

Maybe they just want new drone regulation. They just want us all furious about drones so that they can enact some. Some stricter regulations about who can own them, private ownership of drones. And then we'll find out in 20 years that these are all just government drones. Just need a couple of them to crash into each other and fall on a president.

[Dave Smith]

It's. And then, yeah, two birds with one stone. You take out the guy you were trying to assassinate and you get some drone regulation in there.

[Robbie Bernstein]

Yeah. And then you race. You arrest one idiot out of his garage and go, look at this guy who is flying drones up in the sky. And you know what's fun about the government not telling us anything is that you can concoct whatever story you'd like. They're tracking Bigfoot in the hills of. Of. Of New Jersey. It just come up with any story. No one fucking knows. It might as well just tell us.

[Dave Smith]

It's. You know, you wonder, because there are other possibilities that you just kind of get to. It's like, oh, is this kind of a setup? Are they trying to create some type of crisis? Who knows? We shall see.

[Robbie Bernstein]

I for 100 Biden art exhibit. It's a really. He. He's playing with new colors out in space.

[Dave Smith]

Maybe. Maybe that's it, man. I mean, these days, who Knows, but it does. You know, I. I was joking around with my wife about it the other night, but it is just like these weird times that we're living, and we're like, can we just get a little break from, like, these weird freaking things happening? I mean, Jesus, over the last four years, there's just been so many things as Covid and the. You know, all the craziness that was associated with that. The, you know, these things like the Ministry of Truth and all the crazy, ridiculous hype about January 6th and just. All. Just the wildfires in Canada. It just seems like every other week, there's, like, something that you're like, are you trying to convince me end times are near or something? All the ufo, you know, stuff that would be coming out of the Pentagon. It's just a lot. It's a lot.

[Robbie Bernstein]

Anyway, I'll take the other side on that one.

[Dave Smith]

Sure.

[Robbie Bernstein]

And say that it's only because we hear about these things that they don't just happen. And so in other times, in other media landscapes, they might have just enacted a truth panel. You know what I mean? Like, we just wouldn't have had the information on these things. You might not have had daily footage on Twitter of drones in the sky. So you'd hear one scattered story from one guy in New Jersey, and they could run tests forever. So I just think. I think we're just more aware of things because it actually gets reported to us, and if anything, that kind of keeps the government a little bit in check.

[Dave Smith]

Yeah, I think probably it's a mix of the two. I mean, there is definitely some truth to that. I also do think that some weird things have been happening over the last four years that hadn't really been happening. And the drones are also a fairly new technology. But I do know that, you know, they've been. Drones have been a big part of the war in Ukraine, and drones are kind of the future of warfare in general and the future of government surveillance and the future of a lot of different things. And so it's. There's many reasons why they might want to be testing things out.

[Robbie Bernstein]

I think we have to scare the aliens back into the ocean. It's because we let so many Mexicans pour over the border that we've let people show how weak we are as a country. And now the aliens are testing the waters.

[Dave Smith]

Well, maybe the Biden administration, maybe all of them are really good guys, you know, and there is just some stuff that they know that we don't. And maybe sending all the Mexicans in was to take care of the alien problem. It's kind of like, you know, you send in the bears to get rid of the bees and then we'll deal with the problem with bears next. But for now, this is the issue we have. I don't know, I'm. We're all just speculating. Let's speculate something fun, you know, why not? All right, guys, let's take a moment and thank our sponsor for today's show, which is Proton Pass. Proton Pass is more than a password manager. It's an identity manager. This means that it does all the basics of a password manager. It securely generates and stores your logins, it makes it easy to securely share passwords with anyone and makes your online experience more convenient and efficient by auto filling passwords and forms for you. But in addition to that, it also alerts you about weak or reused passwords and as well as accounts where two factor authentication is inactive to help you take action and improve your online security. Essentially, this is going to be your password manager that goes above and beyond to make sure that your privacy is secure, it's easy to use and user friendly design is accessible to all users, even those who are not tech savvy. And I say that as somebody in that category myself. It's available on all your devices and you can trust their security and end to end encryption. It's open source and independently audited so anyone can review and verify their encryption. You don't just have to take their word for it. In 2024, you need this type of protection on your online activity. This is why more than 100 million users use Proton already. Go check out Proton Pass. You can click the link in the episode description to learn more. All right, let's get back into the show. Okay, so I did want to spend some time on the show today responding to a clip that's been been going around of Kyle Kalinsky criticizing Joe Rogan.

[Robbie Bernstein]

And showing off a new hair color.

[Dave Smith]

And well, I think he's, I think he's had that for a while at this point. Let me say, I guess before we get into this because I kind of like to disclose these things just because I feel like that's the responsible thing to do to like be like, okay, well look, here's where I'm coming from and I am not, I'm certainly not without my bias when it comes to this topic. You know, obviously I'm friends with, with Joe and I've been on his show many times. I. But full disclosure, I also don't have anything against Kyle Kalinsky, me and you have, I think a time or two in the past done segments like responding to viral videos that he's been on where like, I think economic stuff where we thought he got it all wrong. But I never like had a beef or anything personal against Kyle. And he has, he's made I think a couple videos of me over the years where it's like stuff we agree on war for the most part, where he's just like been like, ah, Dave Smith, you know, shreds this guy or whatever. And we've been cool. I did his show with his podcast that he hosts with Crystal Ball, who I like very much. And I enjoyed our conversation. So it's not like I'm not coming at this like I have anything against Kyle, but I did think that this warranted a response from us. So let's, let's get into this clip a little bit. Let's start it off and we'll, we'll give our thoughts.

[Kyle Kalinsky]

Then. You're a fake independent. You're not real independent media. And I'm now going to war because what we saw is a lot of these people like Joe Rogan. You know, I was there, I was on his show four or five times. He would sit there and not in agreement when I would make anti Trump arguments and arguments in favor of a left wing worldview. Then three weeks later, Ben Shapiro would come on and say the exact opposite of me on every issue and he would nod along in agreement.

[Dave Smith]

Right.

[Kyle Kalinsky]

And so at some point you got to call spade a spade. You're not independent media and you're clearly just a vibes based voter. Right. You cocooned yourself in this right wing echo chamber where you got right leaning UFC people and right leaning comedians and Dana White.

[Dave Smith]

I guess I'd be in the category of right leaning comedians in Kyle's estimation. So it's a weird, the criticism that he's calling Rogan out that you're not really independent media. What exactly does Kyle mean by that? Because it's not clear. And like, what are you saying? You're saying that like, because Rogan would have conversations with people on the left and the right and be agreeable with them, that they are for you're not really independent media. Well, I don't think Joe has ever really branded himself as independent media. I don't think that's what he's claiming to be. I think he is a comedian who does a show where he has conversations with people that he finds interesting. And the fact that he's agreed with lots of views on the left and then agreed with lots of views on the right. Seems to me my conclusion from that wouldn't be that they are for you're not independent media. My conclusion would be, oh, you're a regular person. That, that is, it is very typical for regular people to agree with some things that are considered left wing views and some things that are considered right wing views. And it's also not completely, it's not that odd. You know, I think sometimes people who are in this world, it's almost like we get lost a little bit in what we view importance of this world. I think it's quite, it's not actually that peculiar for somebody to like hear a left winger make an argument for universal health care and go, okay, that makes sense, I see what you're saying. And then hear a right winger make an argument against universal health care and go, ah, all right, you do make a point too. Like that that in itself doesn't, isn't really a gotcha. It doesn't like, it doesn't prove anything. In fact, what it seems to indicate to me is that Joe's a pretty open minded guy who's willing to hear out arguments from both sides. And to say again that Joe is, you know, he's, he's cocooned himself with right wingers or something like that. Now of course, Rob, I guess we're, we're supposed to pretend that Elon Musk and Bobby Kennedy are right wingers now. Tulsi Gabbard's a right winger or something like that, which seems pretty ridiculous to me, particularly when, no, none of them, all of them would have been categorized as liberals just a few years ago. And none of them have really changed their fundamental views. They're all still saying the same thing they were saying back then. So it doesn't really seem like he's cocooned himself amongst right wingers. I, you know, I think a lot of times left wingers almost there's this atrophy that developed over the years where like, okay, so I remember one time, Rob, when Anthony Jeselnik was, he was trashing Legion of Skanks. And in the. I only saw this because, you know, I was involved. So that's the extent of why I cared about what Anthony Jeselnik was saying. But he said at one point he, he talked about how Ann Coulter used to come hang at the Comedy Cellar. I don't know if you remember this, Rob. This might have been a little bit before you started stand up. But Ann Coulter used to come to the Comedy Cellar. That was like a known thing. She would come and she would hang out. She was friends with some of the comedians. And Jeselnik was talking about how disgusted he was that Ann Coulter was like hanging out with the comedians. And I remember when I saw it, just thinking to myself, it's like this is the kind of the unseen, like this is progressive privilege that they don't even recognize. Because if you're not a progressive, that's every single day in New York City. Every single day there's some progressive hanging out there. It's just you're upset by the one time that there was actually like a conservative who was there. Your expectation, in other words, is that those people should never exist. So it seems to me that one of the things that I think Kyle doesn't like about Rogan is that he'll also talk to the right wingers. That's really kind of your beef that he's not exclusively talking to left wingers. I don't know. Do you have any, any thoughts on, on this, Rob?

[Robbie Bernstein]

Well, my autism was somewhat focused on his concept of vibe based voters. And firstly, he doesn't really classic clarify what a vibe based voter is or what exactly would be the problem with being a vibe based voter? I'm pretty sure that's just called voting. And I also don't understand how being if there was a category of vibe based voters which is different than other voters, I don't understand how being a vibe based voter makes you not independent media. Which then brings me to your point of what exactly is the, what exactly is independent media? And how is what Rogan's doing not independent media? Which is just my autism of me saying, what the fuck are. What's your point, dude? What point? Like in other words, you seem to have like, it seems like you're trying to make a point of that he's actually secretly conservative or secretly as a gender, secretly is working for someone. But your actual evidence of this is that he's a vibe based voter. And as a vibe based voter, you can't be independent media. I don't understand the logic to that at all.

[Dave Smith]

Well, also, you know, if you just think about like what conclusion you would draw from the information that Kyle's given where he'll go like, hey, look, Rogan regularly had me on his show and I would make arguments and he would kind of nod and go, okay, I get your argument. And then he'd have some other guy on his show make some other argument and he'd nod and say, oh, I get your argument. And now it seems like he's hanging out with those other guys and not with me. Because my conclusion from that would be like, I guess you lost that argument. I guess he was more persuaded by what they had to say than what you had to say. I don't know. I, like, that's been my attitude, not just with Joe, but with everyone. I don't. You know, I remember going on Rogan's podcast last year at some point and being very, very critical of Israel. And then after that he had several pro Israel guests on. And my thinking on that was always just like, oh, I got to like, I gotta really make sure I'm persuasive on this next time I'm on. You know what I mean? Like, I wouldn't say, like, oh, therefore it proves that you're the bad guy because you talk to these other people after you talk to me. It's like, I don't know. There's also just so. And, and maybe I'm like, guilty of this to some degree, but I also just kind of think there, there's something where it's like, I don't know, Kyle, so he had you on four times or whatever he said on the biggest show. On the biggest show there is. He gave you the biggest platform to let you make the argument to as many people as you could. And if ultimately you didn't persuade his audience and his audience then went in a different direction, how is that not on you? That would be my attitude.

[Robbie Bernstein]

It's a little bit like Peter Hotez. If he then goes back on CNN and says, hey, he's only having on anti vaccine people. And it's like, well, you kind of went on there and weren't all that honest or persuasive and refused to debate anybody. So you're not really a very credible personality anymore.

[Dave Smith]

Yeah, I mean, like, if I. Let's just say, for example, because. Because Joe will have. He has me on pretty regularly and he also has Mike Baker on pretty regularly now. Mike Baker, I think, I think me and Mike Baker have about as diametrically opposed foreign policy beliefs as. As two people could have. But if we both went on the show and then like, let's say there was a poll of all of Joe Rogan's audience and 90% of them agreed with Mike Baker, my conclusion from that would be like, shit, I'm just not doing a good job. I'm not making the case very well. What am I missing? My conclusion wouldn't be like, this is why Joe Rogan and Mike Baker aren't really independent media or something. Mike Baker is independent media. But you get my point. It wouldn't be like to deride them. I think I would take that as a, like, shit, I got to step my game up. You know, what's. What's so persuasive about what he had to say? Seems reasonable to me. All right, let's keep playing.

[Kyle Kalinsky]

His boss is super right wing and loves maga. He put himself in this echo chamber. Covid helped to break his brain, and then look at that. He goes full maga. And you know what that makes me?

[Dave Smith]

Okay, so, first of all, I mean, I guess there's some technical truth to it, but it's a little disingenuous to refer to Dana White as Joe Rogan's boss. It's just a much more complicated relationship than that. Joe Rogan, I believe, worked for free for many years for the ufc. Joe Rogan was always, for those years, much bigger than the ufc. Was he. He was the one who lent credibility to the ufc, not the other way around. It was like, oh, the host of Fear Factor is hosting this UFC stuff. And yes, the sport has blown up to the point where as big as Joe Rogan is, yeah, I guess now it's debatable. Like, who's bigger? But the. Let's be real. The UFC is a passion project because Joe Rogan loves martial arts. It's not as if, like, and in the context of talking about his. His status as independent media, Dana White is not his boss. The biggest thing Joe Rogan does is his podcast and his comedy, and Dana White is not his boss in those fields that you're talking about. So again, it's just to say, like, oh, his boss likes this. I don't think that. I'm not saying Dana White doesn't have any influence over Rogan. I think they are very good friends. But. But it's not. I just think there's something a little misleading about describing it that way. But here's really where we get to the heart of this. It's, oh, over. Covid broke his brain. So there's just a whole lot that's kind of snuck into there. And that is, again, as progressives have a nasty habit of doing, you are presuming the conclusion of your argument without actually making the argument. It's circular logic. There's. You can't just say, it's like, wait, no, no, no, no, wait, what happened during COVID What happened again? So. Because obviously, if you're talking about what has moved Joe Rogan Politically, over the years. And you know this. I'm not giving away any inside information here. Anyone who watches this show would know this. But obviously, yes, Covid had a huge impact on him. Now, you can say that it broke his brain. But the thing that's. I guess the thing that's just infuriating to me, infuriating to me about this is that. Well, look, Rob, you know the dynamic, right? Joe Rogan says something at the height of COVID this thing is now becomes a huge controversy, one of the biggest controversies in the country. Everybody in the corporate media world is slandering Joe Rogan, labeling. I mean, literally at a cartoonish level. They're changing his skin tone to be green when he's. You know what I mean? Like, they're. They're. I mean, I've been on episodes with Rogan during COVID where Foushee and Biden responded to the episode. Okay. It's a kind of surreal feeling to be in that situation. And what ended up happening was that objectively, Rogan was proven right and they were proven wrong. But then. Then the years go by, and then you just go, yeah. Remember that whole thing? Yeah. Remember, it was like a controversy. It broke his brain. Wait, what? No, look, again, as we've mentioned before on the show, but the. The. The one video that was the one I'm referring to, that both. And if you could imagine, right at the height of COVID both Anthony Fauci and President Joe Biden responded. Because what Joe said in the clip, what he said to me as the guy who was there having this conversation, he said, I wouldn't really, like, personally recommend that, like, young, healthy people get the vaccine. I would just say, like, be as healthy as you can. Exercise, eat really good, get lots of sunlight. If you can't get sunlight, take vitamin D. That'd be my recommendation to young people. If you do that, I don't think you have much to worry about with COVID And in Foushee's response to that, he said, what Joe doesn't understand is that you don't get the vaccine to protect yourself. You get the vaccine because if you get it, then you can't spread Covid to anyone else. I'm sorry, whose brain was broken. Does anybody. Does anybody, including Dr. Foushee, would anybody be willing to defend that his position was closer to the truth than Rogan's position? So what are you talking about exactly? No. What happened is that during the rise of sweeping totalitarianism, Joe Rogan, told the truth, was viciously attacked for Telling the truth turned out to be 100% correct to the point that literally. Look, man, when I was. When I. When I was debating Chris Cuomo, what can any of them even say that Rogan was wrong about that? No, cuz Cuomo saying the same thing that Joe Rogan was saying then. Now. Now saying the exact same thing about Ivermectin. Now that Rogan was saying then that got him in all this trouble. The same thing that Chris Cuomo mocked Rogan for at the time he himself is now saying. And as I raked him over the coals for without an apology, without an acknowledgement that. That he was right and you were wrong. But so to. To sit here and say, like, again, it does late, like you said before, Rob, what you go, if Hotez were to say, oh, he only has vaccine skeptics on. It's like, yeah, but you're not willing to. I remember when, again, this is another thing that. That progressives have this nasty tendency to do. But. So after Louis CK Got canceled, I remember one of his first or his first comedy set in America, I believe, was at our festival when he came back. And I remember reading like a bunch of these articles that were written by progressives and they said, oh, Louis CK Because Louis CK Was a very liberal guy and used to be loved by liberals and progressives. They said, oh, Louis CK Is courting a right wing audience now. But you'd be like, wait a minute. But what do you even mean by that? Because first of all, the audience at Skangfest is not right wing. I mean, it's a. It's so ridiculous to describe Skang Fest as right wing to anybody who knows what right wing means and has ever been to this festival. That is just not the first term that would come to mind.

[Robbie Bernstein]

Okay, like, we have the abortion stage.

[Dave Smith]

Yeah, I mean, like, there's. There's a whole lot of debauchery going on there for a right wing event. Um, but anyway. But I go like, well, nobody Ari.

[Robbie Bernstein]

Shafir shit splatter art.

[Dave Smith]

Yes. That's so right wing. Truly a conservative right wing event if ever I've seen one. Um, but it, again, it would be this, like this circular reasoning where you'd go, hey, what do you mean Louis CK Is courting a right wing audience? What makes them right wing? And then you realize, oh, what makes them right wing is that they still like Louis CK So, so then by definition, any audience that he performs in front of is now right wing to you. But Louis didn't go. Louis didn't go, hey, I'm going, I don't want a left wing audience now. I want a right wing audience now. Louie just wants to tell his jokes. And. And if the entire left wing is going, oh, my God, you're a monster, and the right wing is going, hey, we sure did like your jokes. The fact that he's performing, again, even if you were going to call them right wing, which in this case they're not, but even you'd go, yeah, that's. That's a little bit different. There's a little bit more to the story here. So if you had, let's say the, you know, because there were some left wingers who were good on this, and I don't wish to, like, smear them or lump them in with those who were bad, but if you'd say, like the broadly speaking, let's say the liberal world was viciously attacking Joe Rogan for telling the truth, and broadly speaking, what you consider the right wing world was. Was lauding him as a hero for telling the truth, why would you be so shocked that, like, oh, yeah, he probably found those people to be more reasonable. He probably was nudged in their direction a little bit. Right? I mean, am I missing something here? Doesn't that seem like kind of the obvious answer? And if you're not going to address that and sweep it all under the rug is just. He lost his mind during COVID I don't think that you're being very honest with yourself or with your. Your listeners. All right, guys, let's take a moment and thank our sponsor for today's show, which is Crowd Health, longtime sponsor of the show and an incredible company. Let's just ask a rhetorical question. Does anybody love their insurance carrier? Have you ever met anybody who just loves their insurance carrier? Does anyone ever tell you, you know, the thing about health insurance. You know what I love about the health insurance market in the United States of America? It's just so efficient. It just does such a great job of delivering a quality product at a reasonable price, and you can really trust them. I know there's no corruption in that industry. Right. You've never met that person because that person doesn't exist. Now, a lot of people who you probably have met think that there's no other options, that you're stuck in the health insurance system, but that's not true. Crowd health is a decentralized health care payment system that frees you from the tyranny of health insurance. You can go to whatever doctor you'd like. There are no networks it's significantly less expensive than health insurance. And the reason for that is that they rip out the bureaucracy and the middlemen. Singles can sign up for $185 a month. A family of four can get it for $605 a month. And if you use the promo code POTP right now, you can get 90 dol $9 a month per person for the first three months. Crowd health is not health insurance. It's a totally new way of paying for health care. Terms and conditions may apply. Go check them out@joincrowd health.com joincrowdhealth.com to escape the broken health insurance system. All right, let's get back into the show. Anything you want to add before we jump back in?

[Robbie Bernstein]

Rob sounds like a big old whiny pants.

[Dave Smith]

Let's keep playing. And Natalie, just do me a favor. Just bring it back a few seconds in case there was anything we missed there.

[Kyle Kalinsky]

Covid helped to break his brain. And then look at that. He goes full maga. And you know what? That makes me look like a jackass, because I was the one going in there, taking him at face value, acting kind, holding his hand and walking him through it like he was a toddler on these topics. And then, wow, in retrospect, would you look at that?

[Dave Smith]

You completely flip. No, no, Kyle, it makes you look bad because it makes you look like you lost the argument. It makes you look like maybe you were wrong about a lot of that stuff. And I'm sorry, but, like, did the.

[Robbie Bernstein]

Universe such a favor by going on Rogan?

[Dave Smith]

Yeah, right, right, right. Yes. You, you went on there and held his hand like a toddler and walked him through these topics. In other words, you got invited on the biggest fucking show and you went on to take advantage of that opportunity where Joe was open and gave you a platform and listened to what you had to say. And you said, because I've seen some of his episodes on there, you said a bunch of standard boilerplate left wing things. That's what you did.

[Robbie Bernstein]

You don't fire me. I quit. Sir, you don't have a job here.

[Dave Smith]

Yeah, like, you did not hold his hand like a toddler. Come on, dude. You had a conversation with him where you said many standard things. I'll. I'll be honest. Some of the things you said, I liked. I liked some of his stuff where he would talk about, like, his anti war positions. He never really demonstrated much of a depth of knowledge of them. Like, he didn't really get into detail and that. But he would say, like, I don't like Obama's drone wars and stuff like that. And good for you. And then you made some arguments for why you believed in like universal healthcare or things like that. Okay, you ultimately, I guess he wasn't persuaded by you. Like what, what do you want me to say? That you, that's the only reason why you look bad? You don't look bad in hindsight because you went on the show. But isn't it convenient, Kyle? Right, like you're going to say, okay, so when you got invited on the biggest show in the world, you were happy to go. When you say you held his hand like a toddler, that's certainly not what you were saying at the time. You certainly didn't say that. You certainly didn't come back on your show the day after. You certainly didn't say on the Joe Rogan experience, hey man, it kind of feels like I'm holding your hand like a toddler here, you know? No, you said, thank you so much for having me on. You're the man, Joe Rogan. Thank you for letting me get on the biggest show in the world and, and give my ideas and, and get more fans and get more exposure. So you said, thank you. You came back again. You came back again after that. You came back again after that. And every single time, you never said, hey, man, it really feels like I have to hold you. You didn't say anything like that. Right? Okay, so you took it when it was advantageous to you. Now that Donald, now that Joe Rogan ended up supporting Donald Trump and has become like, you know, it's been acknowledged that he is at the center of this ecosystem of information, whether you want to call him independent news or not. I don't really give a fuck what you call him. He has the biggest show. Now that maybe it kind of hurts you personally to have this, you know, attachment to Rogan or to have this, this thing where you're connected to him or known as someone who went on his show several times. Now you're gonna turn around and say, I held his hand like a toddler. It seems like the common denominator here is what's self serving for you. Not so much any argument or principle that you got right that he then got wrong. Maybe I'm missing something, but that seems more to be what the, the story is here. All right, let's keep playing.

[Kyle Kalinsky]

I mean, we were defending him, unfortunately, way too late, right when people were already on to, I don't know, man, you're saying a little bit more right wing things here. And he would be like, well, no, look, here's a compilation of all the times Joe Rogan said base things. He argued for universal health care, he argued for free college. He argued for higher minimum wage and this good thing. And I would show, show that compilation. Go see. I don't know what you guys are talking about, but guess what? When you decide I'm gonna endorse Donald Trump, after he lied to your face relentlessly for the entire podcast, telling brazen lies, then I'm sorry, all the charity is gone, all the sympathy is gone. And I have to come to a different conclusion now.

[Dave Smith]

My conclusion goes, I'm sorry, but now that I've taken all the help you can give me and it's only hurting me to be associated with you, the charity is gone. Now it's time to take off the gloves. And what is he guilty of? He's saying, I defended him when he was saying some right wing things, and then he ended up supporting Donald Trump, and that's the cardinal sin. Well, okay, look, Joe has always said some right wing things. You never seem to have a problem with that when you were getting invited on the biggest show. Now that you're not getting invited on that show, you have a different attitude. I mean, I'm just, by the way, I'm just saying, like, maybe I'm wrong about this, but like, okay, Joe texted me and asked me to come on on the podcast on November 6, the day after the election. Now, I was really honored by that. I was like, oh, that's really cool that he wanted me to be the guy the day after this, this historic election to come, you know, discuss it with him. I, I could be wrong about this. I have a really tough time believing that if Kyle got that invite, he wouldn't have taken it. Right? That he wouldn't have taken it and he wouldn't have just taken the opportunity to go talk about these things. And I don't think he would have claimed that he's holding Joe's hand like a toddler. And I don't think he would have called him out on all this stuff. I think he would have tried to be like, okay, there's a big opportunity for me. I'm going to go do that. The. If you are going to say, again, this is what I mean by the circular logic. You can't just say that he's wrong because he said right wing things or he's wrong because he supports Donald Trump. He's always said lots of right wing things and he's been very clear about why he supported Donald Trump. So why don't you take on that? Take on his right wing positions or take on the reason why he supported Donald Trump. Why do you think he's getting it wrong? Because there's a really strong argument to supporting Donald Trump in this last election. And there's. And look, by the way, he still says lots of left wing things. When I was on the podcast with. With Rogan last time, he went off on a whole thing about how he doesn't think, like, how he's pro choice. And I disagree with him on that, but we didn't really particularly argue about it. But he, you know, he still has some more left views. But yeah, he supported Donald Trump. And I think what everybody knows is that again, while you could sit here and spin Covid about how it broke Joe Rogan's brain, which, you know, by the way, we. I just want to say, like, we've made this argument a bunch, Rob. Right. That there were people whose brains were broken by Covid. Explain to me in what way Joe Rogan qualifies for that. Joe Rogan is not out there doing what Sam Harris is doing. Joe Rogan is not. Like, it's like when someone says that, like, Trump broke Sam Harris's brain. We're saying like, dude, you're on camera saying that if they found children's corpses in Joe Biden's basement, you'd still vote for Joe Biden. That's not an exaggeration. That's what Sam Harris said. That's when you go, like, dude, Trump broke your brain. Dude, like, you are not thinking anymore. If you say, I wouldn't care if this candidate murdered kids, you've lost the plot. Okay? If you're making the argument that, like, change the variables of the vaccine and then I'm right and you're wrong or something like that, you. Rogan's brain's been. Believe me, I go down to Austin several times a year. I hang out with Joe. Every time I'm down there. He's thriving. He has not been broken by this whole situation.

[Robbie Bernstein]

By broken brain, I think you might mean woken up.

[Dave Smith]

Yeah, right, right.

[Robbie Bernstein]

And I also love this concept of that. I'm now removing my endorsement for Joe Rogan. Okay, I don't think. What audience do you think your command that all of a sudden you going out publicly and going, I now have to remove my liberal endorsement for this show. First, he's not a politician. Secondly, I don't think anyone cares.

[Dave Smith]

I think Joe's gonna be just fine. No, it's like at the beginning when he goes, he goes, that's it. I'm going to war now. And you're like, you're, you're going to war with Joe Rogan in the same way a 3 year old is going to war with me. I also, it's just not going to have much of an impact. All right, guys, let's take a moment and thank our sponsor for today's show, which is paint your life. Get your holiday shopping done early this year because you want to give something that's not just a gift, but a memory that lasts a lifetime. Listen, we all struggle with coming up with a great gift, especially for family members who you have to buy gifts for every year for their birthday, every year for the holidays. And sometimes it'll be hard to think of, like, what's a great thing to get them this year. Well, I've got you covered. Picture this, a hand painted portrait of your best friend, a lost relative, your entire family together. Anything that you have a photo of, you can now turn into a beautiful hand painted portrait. So you can give a gift that will be meaningful, that will always be remembered. I have already gotten my wife this for her Christmas present this year. Please do not tell her if you listen to this ad read because I want it to be a surprise, but it's beautiful and I'm really excited to give it to her. Get started with your holiday shopping early this season and give the most meaningful gift you have ever given from paint your life.com and there's no risk. If you don't love the final painting, your money is refunded, guaranteed. Order now. To get paint your life's early bird holiday offer. 20% off your painting. That's right. For a limited time, get 20% off and free shipping. To get this special offer, all you have to do is text the word problem to 87204. Paint your life. Celebrate the moments that matter most. Message and data rates may apply. See terms for details. Okay, let's get back into the show.

[Robbie Bernstein]

I, I watched the, I had this thought the other day. I watched Chris Rock's monologue on snl, which, I mean, he's a great comedian. I thought it was kind of weak. I'll just say it. All right, fair enough. I hate shitting on comics, but there you go. And he had a line which I done this on the podcast years ago, that basically the people who were upset with Donald Trump and all the claims of the dignity of office are basically just saying that they'd like a more dignified rapist. He had a similar joke. But then I was thinking about this. What's funny is I think actually the reason that people did not vote for Kamala Harris is with as big of a potty mouth as Donald Trump is. People were like, she's just too retarded, and I can't have someone that stupid being the president. And I think Rogan has said something along those lines, that there was just something too offensive about her as a candidate. I don't know that he specifically articulated that. It was her lack of intelligence. I think it was more. I forgot specifically the dishonesty on some issues. But going back to what you were saying of not really contending why people might have voted for Donald Trump over Kamala Harris, it's that Kamala Harris was a terrible candidate. It's what we were talking about on the last show, which might have been the subscriber one with. Who's that? The black dude from CNN he used to work with.

[Dave Smith]

Oh, yeah, Van Jones. Yeah.

[Robbie Bernstein]

Where they're calling Trump such a genius for going on podcasts. It's like, no, it's just your candidate was too stupid that you couldn't put her on podcasts. And so you're not really contending with why that Kamala Harris was so unlikable. That admits the two. Even classic liberals might prefer freedom right now. Might not like an open border, might not like the wars, and just have gone with Donald Trump because he was the better of the two options.

[Dave Smith]

Yeah, and. And look, I mean, for. For the times that, you know, the stuff that I know Kyle agrees with us on, and I know that he's, you know, like, he's. As I said, he's made, like, videos with clips of me being like, Dave, like, eviscerates these war hawks, takes this guy down, eviscerates this pro Israel, you know, idiot. All this stuff, it's like. I mean, you gotta. Look, I'm not saying Donald Trump is perfect. I think I've been a pretty fierce critic of Donald Trump over the last eight years, and I would argue a much more effective critic of Donald Trump than a lot of the progressives who don't seem almost incapable of actually understanding him and taking on what his flaws are. But for all of those flaws aside, like, which are all very real and worth talking about, which is why we talk about them all the time. But it's like, Kyle, come on. I mean, you. You sit here and you hate the establishment too. I mean, you hate the war machine and you hate Big Pharma and The big banks and all of this stuff. And do you not kind of see that Kamala Harris was the establishment's pick? Like, maybe that's a huge part of this too. I mean, I think you're right. A huge part of it is that she was just so awful. I mean, it was like, it was like two. It was like people who supported the Democrats in this last election, they played two full rounds of the Emperor's New Clothes, they played a full round with Joe Biden pretending that he wasn't senile. And then they played a full round with Kamala Harris pretending that she had anything to say and was not just like the worst candidate imaginable. I mean, she would do an interview and you, you'd just be like, my God, was this. First she'd avoid doing an interview. She wouldn't do one for six weeks. Then she'd finally go, fine, I'm going to do an 18 minute interview and just, just do terrible. Fall flat on her face, have nothing to say. Like, somehow you got through an interview without demonstrating an understanding of one topic. Like, it would just be unbelievable. And so, like, yeah, okay, so here you have this moron who is completely backed up by the establishment, who Joe Rogan. I think much like a huge percentage of Americans woke up to during COVID how corrupt and evil they were. And I mean, that's. Again, that's what you say. Like, you could talk about what, that it broke Joe Rogan's brain. Again, tell me what he got wrong and then let's measure it, let's compare it. Let's compare it to Foushee or Hotez or one of the establishment guys. Uh, let's compare him to Chris Cuomo, see, who had a worse track record. Let's compare him. By the way, and I'm saying this not knowing at all what Kyle Kalinsky's position was on this. Let's compare him to you. How were you during COVID Kyle? You know, like, I don't know, but like, let's, let's compare Rogan's track record to yours. I'll certainly compare mine to yours or Rob's to yours. But like, one of the themes throughout Covid for many people now, I think me and you perhaps don't even fully appreciate this because we were already red pilled on how corrupt this whole thing is. But one of the major themes was people realizing like, my God, this is so like every inch from every inch of COVID from the fact that while they were, while the mask mandates were at their absolute heights, we would have pictures of Nancy Pelosi and Dianne Feinstein and AOC going maskless while their servants were wearing masks. The amount of money that was stolen by corporations out of the big spending bills in 2020, the just the sheer amount of corruption of the big pharmaceutical companies just lying their asses off about their product. You know, this was something people woke up to. And Donald Trump is at least somewhat of an outsider, is certainly hated by that establishment and had a lot of these outsider people around him. That alone already explains why people would be more drawn toward him in this. In this cycle.

[Robbie Bernstein]

I think people needed to learn how to complain in private. I mean, the way to have this conversation is, hey, it's a shame that the left has gone so batshit crazy that we seem to have lost even Joe Rogan, who aligns more with the right now because of some of the mistakes that we've made. And here's what we have to clean up, or here's the new media strategy for how we need to have more compelling content so that we can get more of our talking points across. Hey, we're losing the story on some of the most important issues, such as the need for this style of wealth redistribution, but you're just complaining in public.

[Dave Smith]

Yeah. Yep. Well, I mean, look, it's even. I remember me and you, if you remember, this is kind of a forgotten chapter in history. But there was one podcast a couple months before the election, or I guess it was several months before the election, where Donald Trump. I mean, excuse me, Joe Rogan, he didn't endorse Bobby Kennedy, but someone asked him who he's voting for, and he was like, I don't know. I really like Bobby Kennedy. This is before Bobby dropped out and then Trump attacked Rogan and me, and you were both sitting here going like, oh, how stupid is this Of Donald Trump to do. This is the dumbest way to handle this. I mean, like, you want to try to win that guy back over, not attack him for saying he likes Bobby Kennedy. And then I remember going on Twitter and getting in a war with people who were doing. Who were doing exactly that, Trump supporters who are attacking him. And if, let's say as a result of now, Rogan ended up coming back and supporting Donald Trump, but let's say he didn't. Let's say he didn't support Donald Trump after that. And Rogan was like, you know what? Fuck that guy. I walked away. What would anyone. What would any of our view be on that? Be like, yep, that's why it was pretty stupid to attack him like that. You probably shouldn't have done that. You don't sit there and go like, oh, what a disappointment it is that he didn't come back. The fact is that Joe Rogan was not viciously smeared by the right wing over the last few years, and he was viciously smeared by the establishment and by liberals and leftists. He was smeared by left wingers for saying he had a problem with a man cage fighting a woman that got him attacked. So just that alone, let's say, hey, here we had this guy with the biggest show in the world, and he was really open to talking to left wingers and really open to talking to right wingers. And then we viciously attacked him for the crime of saying, I don't think a man should be cage fighting a woman. That right there, you'd go, oh, it was our fault, Kyle. I'm not saying Kyle attacked him. He doesn't have to take responsibility for that. But his reaction to that should be, hey, you idiots. You know, left wingers. What are you doing? You're attacking someone for having a totally reasonable. Not only reasonable, for having the only sane opinion on the topic. I'm sorry, the only sane opinion about whether men should be allowed to cage fight women is, no, they shouldn't. That's the only sane opinion on that. And so he gets attacked for having the sane opinion, the correct opinion. I mean, and this is just one example. I'm not even. And forget all the COVID shit. And not for nothing, but like how when Joe Rogan was telling the truth through Covid, and I don't know where Kyle was on Covid, but all I know is that in this clip he's saying Joe Rogan's brain broke during COVID So it kind of tells you something. People like me and you were what? Adamantly defending Joe? Adamantly defending him for telling the truth and getting smeared for it. Because that's the right thing to do when someone tells the truth and gets viciously attacked for it. So we were defending him. Were you guys defending him when CNN was trying to cancel him? When. When Spotify was under all that pressure to get rid of him, were you guys standing up for him? Were you not? You know, because it. You would kind of understand where if somebody is really under attack and under attack unfairly for something, they did nothing wrong, just telling the truth. They're under attack. Yeah, the people who have their back are probably going to have their ear more in the future than the people who don't. That's just human nature. All right, let's keep playing.

[Kyle Kalinsky]

Gone. All the sympathy is gone. And I have to come to a different conclusion now. My conclusion of, of you could hold these people's hands and walk them through it and talk to them like they're reasonable and work it out. It just didn't work. It just didn't work. And that's why you see a much more bold, aggressive style out of me where I'm like these people and the horse they rode in on. Because if what I did before didn't work, okay, I got to try a different approach now. So let's just call these people the frauds they are. Well then guess what? We're going to call them the frauds that they are.

[Unknown]

But, but don't be like hard.

[Dave Smith]

Let's pause it here. Okay, so I tried the approach of winning the argument. That didn't work. So I guess I'll have to just throw a temper tantrum and call everybody names. I, I mean, okay, that is one conclusion to come to. The other one would be that you need to sharpen up your arguments that you are losing the argument and you might need better ones or at least you need to improve on the argument that you have for, for the response to be, hey, I tried it that way. I tried going on Rogan show and making my case and then someone else would come on and make their case and people went in the other direction. Well, I guess I got a name call. That's one, that's one lesson to take from this, Kyle. I don't think it's the correct one. All right, let's keep playing.

[Unknown]

Run yourself in that way. I mean, Bernie Sanders did the same thing where he was trying to go there. And I thought at a point Rogan could be reasoned with in that way and his audience, it was important to try to communicate with them like the pro. The thing is, is like go on all these platforms. It's like why I went on Tim Pool. But I'm gonna go there in a way where I'm not, I'm not gon to get invited back. Like I'm going to go there and right. Adversarial communicate at this point specifically with explicitly right wing outlets. You got to go in there and you've got to eat their lunch. Because the only time that leftists get reinvited to these places is if you validate everything that they say. And then that creates a perverse incentive for those leftist communicators as well because there's so much more money on that side of the. Of the equation, man.

[Dave Smith]

All right, let me just. Okay, that's the end of the clip. So let me just say this. I mean, I. Again, I do just find this. I find it infuriating because it's very. I feel like it's insulting to me personally to just be like, oh, almost. The only way you can do it is just go in there and validate everything Rogan says, which I. I don't know. You know, I've been on Joe's show a lot of times. I think I've. I think I've done it 12 times by myself and three times with Jay and Lewis, something like that. Anybody who follows me who listens to this show, so I assume the people I'm speaking to right now fall into that category. Would you say I just go on there and validate what Joe believes, or would you say I go on that show and talk about the things that I. I want to talk about the things that are my priorities, my issues that I know the most about. I go on there and I'm like, dude, Joe, I got to tell you about this. Let me say. Let me tell you this about that, okay? And, I mean, there are certainly things that he says that I validate when I think they're correct. But the idea that it's like, oh, you know, like, I went on there and failed, and therefore, you know, it's like. It's like when a standup comic bombs, and then it's like, you know, it's all the crowd's fault. It's all, this is. And then some other comic goes up and kills, and you're like, oh, man, you just had a bad set, dude. Like, to say that you went on there and the thing failed, and therefore, the conclusion is that the only way you can succeed is if you go on there and just validate anything they're saying. Again, there's another option there, which is that what you had to say wasn't that compelling. And I will say I really do resent the thing at the end where it's like, oh, but there's just more money in that. That. There's just more money in that. As if these guys aren't making good money, as if Kyle Kalinsky isn't making good money and hasn't been for quite a while. It's just dishonest. There's no money in the. And particularly, you know, I remember this was a thing. It was part of the reason why I was so vicious in the Chris Cuomo debate was because he said Something along those lines. To me, like, he said, I made some point early on in the debate if you go watch it. And he said something like, he goes, yeah, this is good for clicks on the Internet. But, you know, and it's like the implication, not even implicit, pretty explicit, is like, yeah, you make money from doing this. You know, and there was something so infuriating about Chris Cuomo telling me that I make money from this, even though, like, on the surface level, look, there's no question, Rob. Right. Me and you did. Our profile rose a lot during COVID and the fact that we were like such outspoken critics of the lockdowns and the mandates and the vaccine and all this stuff. Yeah, there were a lot of. There were people out there who were starved for that, who wanted voices that were standing up against the insane totalitarianism, and particularly voices who would arm them with really good arguments against it or a really good understanding of what was happening here. But to turn around and say, because a lot of us have become successful, that, oh, yeah, there's just money in that. Where. Especially getting it from someone like Chris Cuomo, where you're like, motherfucker, you made 10 times the fucking money any of us are making. And the whole time you were cashing those CNN checks, you never said one thing that would upset cnn. You never said one thing that would go against the establishment. Now you may hear him now saying, ivermectin is actually a really great drug. Show me the clip of them saying that on cnn. Show me the clip of them saying that schools should be reopened or that the lockdowns are causing all of this devastation. Show me that. That. Show me the clip. Show me the clip of Chris Cuomo on CNN saying the most obvious thing that would have gone against the network, that would have gone against the establishment. Something like, you know, I don't really think a 22 year old who had Covid last month should be forced to get a booster. Did he ever say that once on CNN's airwaves? No, not once. Okay, so, yeah, so don't turn around and tell me, like, we're just motivated by the money. Especially when like, like we were taking real risk by having these opinions. Yes, in hindsight, we get the benefit of we told the truth when it mattered, but there was real risk to doing that. Like there. Meanwhile, you guys are taking positions that are completely risk free and. And then saying, like, oh, there's just money in that. Look, man, if you want to say, oh, I'll go on these, these platforms and be adversarial okay. There's lots of platforms where you can be adversarial. There's lots of things where you can have debates. You could go on Rogan and be adversarial. Like, okay, but why didn't you do that? This is a very convenient excuse to say, oh, because at the time I believed I could do this. But hey, like, again, like Kyle, I think he said he went on four times, right? Like I said before, if you had to hold his hand like a toddler, well, how come you didn't mention that the first time? How come you didn't mention that the second time? Or the third time or the fourth time? Okay, so you're gonna say, oh, because I thought this method of being nice would work, but now I realize I have to be adversarial. Okay. It's just very convenient to say that. It's like, maybe it wouldn't go that good for you. Maybe if you went on there and you were adversarial, you'd end up getting fucked up. Just saying. I mean, like, I. I'm very confident that if you went on Rogan's show and told Joe, you know, Covid broke your brain, I think he'd eat your lunch. I think he'd fuck you up. Like, I think. I don't mean physically, obviously. I'm saying, like, I think he would just like destroy you because you'd be like, whose brain was broken, Dude, There are. There are people out there who were scared to leave their home. You know whose brain was broken during COVID Howard Stern. Howard Stern's brain was broken. He lived like a germaphobe and still is, I believe to this day.

[Robbie Bernstein]

That's someone whose brain was broken, huh? Either that or having attended a diddy party that might.

[Dave Smith]

It's not. Turns out long term health effects not so great from Diddy parties. All right, we're gonna. We're gonna wrap on that. Catch you guys next time. Peace.

[Al]

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