Marcus East has spent his career inside some of the world’s most recognized organizations, including Apple, Google, IBM, National Geographic, and Marks & Spencer. In this episode of Partnering Leadership, he joins Mahan Tavakoli to discuss the ideas behind his book, Working with Dinosaurs: How to Lead Technological Evolution from the C-Suite. The conversation goes far beyond technology. It gets to the heart of why successful organizations often struggle to adapt even when smart leaders can clearly see change coming.

Marcus shares lessons from leading large-scale transformations across both technology-native companies and legacy institutions. Drawing on experiences ranging from National Geographic’s digital reinvention to the resistance he encountered at Marks & Spencer, he explains why organizational inertia is rarely caused by a lack of intelligence or strategy. More often, the barriers come from success itself. The systems, incentives, habits, and leadership behaviors that once created growth can quietly become the very things preventing change.

The discussion also challenges much of the current AI hype. Marcus argues that AI will not magically fix broken organizations. In fact, organizations with weak data foundations, fragmented operating models, and outdated leadership structures may find their problems exposed even faster. The conversation explores why some companies accelerate through disruption while others become trapped defending processes, structures, and metrics that no longer fit the future they are entering.

Mahan and Marcus also explore the human side of transformation. They discuss why executives often resist the very changes they publicly support, how “legacy thinking” shapes decision making, and why many transformation efforts fail between the CEO’s vision and frontline execution. Marcus offers a candid look at what distinguishes organizations that adapt successfully, including the operating models, collaboration patterns, and leadership mindsets he observed inside companies like Apple and Google.

For CEOs and senior executives facing pressure to modernize while still delivering results today, this episode offers practical insight into the realities of organizational change, leadership alignment, and technological evolution. It is a thoughtful conversation about how leaders can avoid becoming trapped by the systems and successes of the past while preparing their organizations for what comes next.

Actionable Takeaways:

• You’ll learn why some of the biggest barriers to transformation come from leaders who were highly successful under the previous model.

• Hear why Marcus believes many AI investments will fail and what separates organizations that will actually benefit from AI adoption.

• You’ll hear the striking contrast between how National Geographic approached innovation versus the resistance Marcus encountered at Marks & Spencer.

• Learn why many organizations struggle not because the CEO lacks vision, but because execution breaks down deep inside the organization.

• Hear how legacy systems become emotional and political issues, not just technology problems.

• You’ll discover why leaders cannot take everyone along on a transformation journey and what it means to build a “coalition of the willing.”

• Learn the difference between organizations obsessed with process and those obsessed with customer outcomes.

• Hear why companies like Apple and Google organize engineers, designers, marketers, and business leaders differently from most traditional organizations.

• You’ll learn why many leadership teams measure activ

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